Military Review

FFG (X) Frigate Design and Construction Program for the US Navy

86

The expected appearance of future FFG (X). US Navy Graphics


After the not-so-successful LCS program, the US Navy decided to launch a new project, the purpose of which again is to create warships for the coastal and marine zones. Recently, as part of the new FFG (X) program, the competitive phase has ended, and the Navy has chosen a developer. In addition, the timing of the appearance of the new frigate and its technical features are already known.

Five projects


The FFG (X) program was launched exactly three years ago - in July 2017. Its goal was to create a promising frigate capable of replacing unsuccessful ships of two LCS series in the future. The Navy plans to build up to 20 new ships by the fortieth years.

FFG (X) presented a number of requirements of various kinds. First of all, the fleet noted the need to create a new frigate based on an existing project - to reduce the cost and terms of development and construction. The minimum necessary set of equipment and weapons was also set to solve the assigned range of tasks.

By February 2018, the circle of program participants was determined. Five companies and associations with various projects have joined FFG (X). They received contracts worth $ 15 million for the development of preliminary designs, which were then planned to compare and choose the best.

Austal USA proposed a frigate trimaran based on the existing LCS Independence-class project. General Dynamics in collaboration with Bath Iron Works and Navantia (Spain) has developed a modification of the F100 project. Huntington Ingalls Industries Offers Upgraded National Guard Cutter Coast Guard Boat The American company Marinette Marine, together with Lockheed Martin, created the LCS Freedom variant of the ship, and together with Fincantieri - a modification of the "European" frigate FREMM.

In May 2019, the association of Lockheed Martin and Marinette Marine left the FFG (X) program. Shortly after this, the customer specified the requirements and received the final versions of preliminary designs. In September, the designers determined the price of their ships, after which the process of analysis and selection of the winner began.

Victory and Continuation


In early April, the Minister of the Navy spoke about the possible name of the ships of the new series. The head office can get the name USS Agility (FFG-80) - “Dexterous”; accordingly, the entire project will be called Agility-class. Then the Intrepid, Endeavor, and Dauntless ships may appear (The Valiant, Swift, and Fearless). However, such names for ships are not yet approved and may change.

On April 30, 2020, the U.S. Navy announced the winner of the competitive stage. It was a project from Fincantieri / Marinette Marine based on the frigate FREMM. They signed a contract with companies to develop a technical project and build the first ship - more than $ 795 million was allocated for this. It is curious that weapons and other equipment are not included in this amount, the fleet will order them separately. With all of these expenses, the parent FFG (X) will build $ 1,28 billion.


The main features of the future frigate. US Naval Institute Graphics

Under the terms of the contract, it will take about two years to complete the design and prepare for construction. The laying of the head FFG (X) will take place no later than April 2022. The delivery of the ship to the customer is scheduled for mid-2026, and it will reach initial operational readiness only in 2030.

In 2021, the Navy plans to order the construction of the first production frigate. They are going to accept him at the end of 2026 with the beginning of full service at the turn of the decade. In 2022, the first contract for two ships should appear immediately. Such contracts are going to be signed annually, up to 2030. As mass production is established, the cost of ships will decrease. So, the first serial will cost a little more than 1 billion, and the second (third in the series) will not be more expensive than 900-920 million.

The last of the 20 ships of the FFG (X) Agility-class will be completed in the second half of the thirties, and then they will enter service. The total cost of construction, taking into account design work and the purchase of equipment, will exceed $ 19,8 billion at current prices. The current contract and option involves spending $ 5,58 billion.

Technical features


FFG (X) from Fincantieri and Marinette Marine is a revised version of the frigate FREMM in the version for the Italian Navy. This will be a ship with a length of 151 m, a width of 19,8 m with a normal draft of less than 8 m. Displacement - 6,7 thousand tons. A multi-tier superstructure with a characteristic profile is placed on the case of traditional contours. On it are located both a mast with antenna devices, and part of the weapons.

The use of a CODLAG type power plant is reported, but its composition is not specified. The Italian FREMM uses 4 diesel generators of 2,15 or 2,8 MW each (on different ships of the series), as well as a pair of 2,5 megawatt electric motors. There is also a 32 MW gas turbine engine. Perhaps the American FFG (X) will keep such a power plant. With its help, it will be possible to obtain a speed of more than 30 knots and a range of 6800 nautical miles.

At the request of the customer, FFG (X) receives the combat information and control system COMBATSS-21 - a derivative of the serial Aegis CIUS. The main means of the electronic complex will be the radar AN / SPY-6 (V) 3 EASR with three AFARs on the superstructure, designed to search for targets and control weapons. Navigation radar - AN / SPS-73 (V) 18 NGSSR. Requires the installation of a set of sonar systems in different designs.

On the deck in front of the superstructure is the Mk 110 gun mount with a 57 mm cannon. Around the perimeter of the deck, machine guns of large and normal caliber can be mounted to protect against small surface objects.

Before the superstructure is placed the universal vertical launcher Mk 41 with 32 cells. It will be complemented by the Mk 49 launcher with 21 RIM-116 RAM anti-aircraft missiles. On the superstructure, it is proposed to mount one or two NSM anti-ship missile launchers. The frigate’s ammunition will include a variety of missile weapons, but it will be based on missiles.


Frigate Carlo Bergamini F590 - FREMM lead ship for the Italian Navy. Wikimedia Commons Photos

FFG (X) will be able to carry one MH-60R helicopter and / or unmanned aerial vehicles such as the MQ-8C. It also provides for the transportation of a pair of inflatable boats.

The crew will include 140 people. The crew for the Agility-class is likely to be permanent and independent of tasks or staff aviation groups - unlike the Italian frigates FREMM.

Goals and objectives


According to the plans of the US Navy, promising frigates FFG (X) will have to work independently and in ship groups, in coastal and marine areas. Due to the availability of a wide range of artillery and missile weapons, they will be able to perform various functions and provide both protection of the warrant and defeat of the assigned targets.

It is assumed that the main tasks of the FFG (X) will be to participate in the air defense and anti-aircraft defense of a ship group, for which there are appropriate weapons and equipment on board. In this case, the frigate will work in a single information-control loops and exchange data with other ships. Also, the specific composition of cannon-machine gun weapons will allow you to effectively deal with small surface targets - boats and boats, including with a massive attack.

In terms of characteristics and capabilities, the Agility-class project compares favorably with the unsuccessful LCS ships for which it was created. At one time, it was argued that LCS, having a modular architecture, can receive any necessary equipment and weapons. However, it was not possible to fully reveal such a potential due to a number of problems.

FREMM-based FFG (X) is initially a “normal” surface ship without any revolutionary ideas and solutions, but equipped with all the necessary systems. In addition, the basis of the new American project is a well-mastered ship in the series and in operation. The Italian Navy already has eight such frigates, and new ones are expected.

A matter of time


In general, the FFG (X) program and the project from Fincantieri and Marinette Marine at the moment look interesting and promising. The result of this work will be the appearance of a successful and massive ship with sufficient characteristics and capabilities, but without overly bold decisions. Against the background of existing LCS, this will be a real success.

However, cash ship replacement will take place only in the distant future. The FREMM modernization project to the requirements of the U.S. Navy is still being developed, the laying of the head frigate will take place next year, and the initial operational readiness will be achieved only in 2030. Accordingly, the entire series of ships will turn into a combat-ready force in 15-20 years.

Until the fleet in the coastal zone, one will have to rely on existing and under construction LCS ships - despite all claims to them. To date, two dozen such military units have received the Navy, and their total number will reach 35 in the future. Thus, the real effect of the FFG (X) program is being delayed for a long time, and the criticized LCS project is still relevant.
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  1. svp67
    svp67 15 July 2020 18: 19 New
    +2
    Before the superstructure is placed the universal vertical launcher Mk 41 with 32 cells. It will be complemented by the Mk 49 launcher with 21 RIM-116 RAM anti-aircraft missiles.
    Missile weapons are powerful enough, but artillery, so-so. For such a ship, a 57-mm gun mount has, as it’s not enough
    1. Grazdanin
      Grazdanin 15 July 2020 18: 26 New
      +4
      There will also be launchers for rgm-184 in the picture 16 pcs.
      About artillery I agree 100 mm would have looked better.
      1. svp67
        svp67 15 July 2020 18: 27 New
        +2
        Quote: Grazdanin
        About artillery I agree 100 mm would have looked better.

        Yes, at least 76 mm
      2. Cyril G ...
        Cyril G ... 15 July 2020 21: 55 New
        +3
        We took a 57 mm AU from the Legend type BOCHR cutters, it is also placed on the LCS. That is, there is a production line working.

        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 16 July 2020 12: 08 New
          +1
          Quote: Cyril G ...
          We took a 57 mm AU from the Legend type BOCHR cutters, it is also placed on the LCS. That is, there is a production line working.

          And why did the good old OTO Melara 76-mm not please them? Moreover, there are now serial anti-aircraft projectiles with an adjustable trajectory for it.
          1. Cyril G ...
            Cyril G ... 16 July 2020 12: 29 New
            0
            And the hell knows why - IMHO the tread-inch is more versatile, and you can roll well along the shore ...
            1. Grazdanin
              Grazdanin 16 July 2020 23: 53 New
              -1
              Quote: Cyril G ...
              And the hell knows why

              A place for a laser is needed.
              1. Cyril G ...
                Cyril G ... 17 July 2020 08: 20 New
                0
                Cannon will not be changed to Laser.
                1. Grazdanin
                  Grazdanin 17 July 2020 08: 50 New
                  0
                  He will additionally be put there, that is, a 57 mm cannon and a 150 kW laser on the nose. the condition of the contract was the reservation of power and space for the installation of a 150kW laser.
    2. Observer2014
      Observer2014 15 July 2020 18: 44 New
      +3
      Quote: svp67
      Before the superstructure is placed the universal vertical launcher Mk 41 with 32 cells. It will be complemented by the Mk 49 launcher with 21 RIM-116 RAM anti-aircraft missiles.
      Missile weapons are powerful enough, but artillery, so-so. For such a ship, a 57-mm gun mount has, as it’s not enough

      Sergei hi With their number of pennants then. Yes, they rivet them like hot cakes. With what they want. And how much they want. And cover their ships with other capabilities of their fleet with a bang. Do not compare their ships with ours. This is useless. But the very purpose of the fleet is different in principle .
      1. svp67
        svp67 15 July 2020 18: 51 New
        +2
        hi
        Quote: Observer2014
        With their number of pennants then
        Yes, they have a lot of pennants, but there is a problem with the walking ones ... remember how they could not provide a reliable escort to their aircraft carrier and how they were forced to retreat during the onslaught of Chinese ships, and in the reports on the exercises they were the same "names" of ships sound
        Quote: Observer2014
        And cover their ships with other capabilities of their fleet with a bang.

        The task of these boats is, in particular, to ensure amphibious operations, and here the gun mount is not unnecessary.
        1. Observer2014
          Observer2014 15 July 2020 19: 03 New
          0
          Yes, they have a lot of pennants, but there is a problem with the bachelors ... remember how they couldn’t provide a reliable escort to their aircraft carrier and how they were forced to retreat during the onslaught of Chinese ships, and in the reports on the exercises they were the same the same "names" of ships sound
          Well, that’s what they call their own Faberge. We have a limited area of ​​responsibility for our fleet for obvious economic reasons and hence naval surface capabilities.
          The task of these boats is, in particular, to ensure amphibious operations, and here the gun mount is not unnecessary.
          It's okay for them. They will still support the aircraft. And the mass attack "Tomahawk" With a bunch of different carriers.
          Do not compare their ships with ours. Until this is uselessswim wink hi
        2. Ryusey
          Ryusey 26 August 2020 12: 12 New
          -1
          Are you sure that they could not, but did not provoke that situation?
  2. Niko
    Niko 15 July 2020 18: 26 New
    +2
    Yes, they live on a grand scale. Even a little enviably
  3. Grazdanin
    Grazdanin 15 July 2020 19: 02 New
    +1
    It looks like this project was adopted with the words: Enough @ go!
  4. alma
    alma 15 July 2020 20: 12 New
    18
    In the States, they decided to act reasonably. We have such news should cause concern - the opponent will strengthen his fleet without investing astronomical amounts in dubious innovations.
  5. arkadiyssk
    arkadiyssk 15 July 2020 20: 31 New
    +6
    I would like to add - the condition of the contract was the reservation of power and space for the installation of a 150kW laser. However, this is a standard naval condition, Arly Burke has been going for the last 7 years already ready for its installation, both in power and in place. As soon as there is a breakthrough in laser technology, the Americans will equip them with at least 30 ships in a year.
  6. Avior
    Avior 15 July 2020 22: 20 New
    -8
    For such a large and expensive ship, it is very weakly armed
    Both the weak weapon and the MK41 cells are few.
    At a minimum, you need to add 8 MK41 cells in the self-defense version under 32 essm, this will significantly enhance air defense and PLO capabilities, and preferably 16, and replace the gun with 127 mm. I hope that at least we reserved a place for the cells.
    There is no problem putting a 127 mm gun on such a large ship, at least 76, but its purpose is debatable.
    What is the point of putting an expensive bus and radar if there is nothing to shoot?
    They want the crew to see in detail who will drown them?
    1. Liam
      Liam 15 July 2020 22: 52 New
      +4
      Quote: Avior
      replace the gun with 127 mm

      406 mm would have looked more solid
      1. Avior
        Avior 16 July 2020 06: 45 New
        -3
        No, the gun generally needs to be removed and more machine guns mounted on the sides
    2. Grazdanin
      Grazdanin 15 July 2020 23: 45 New
      +3
      Yes, he has a normal amount of weapons. If you increase falls autonomy and seaworthiness. Our ships are overloaded with weapons and therefore cannot go far from ports. Their ships should be able to go around the world. That is the difference of concepts. They have enough weapons, the United States and NATO countries have a huge number of ships and aircraft, and interaction and situational awareness are more important for them. As part of the fleet, they will be able to repel any attack of probable opponents. The situation when the ship will be alone is not considered, even in this case, armament is more than enough. An interesting point noted:
      Quote: arkadiyssk
      the condition of the contract was the reservation of power and installation space for a 150kW laser
      1. Liam
        Liam 15 July 2020 23: 48 New
        -1
        The article is superficial. The ship is crammed with many chips.
        https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aresdifesa.it/2020/05/03/ecco-come-saranno-le-fremm-per-la-us-navy-armamento-e-sensori/amp/
        1. Grazdanin
          Grazdanin 16 July 2020 00: 02 New
          0
          Thanks, more informative article.
          1. Liam
            Liam 16 July 2020 00: 04 New
            +5
            It's my pleasure hi
            The ship is stuffed with all kinds of advanced electronics and systems. But the public is not enough mm guns. Likely for a squadron battle with a T-shaped cross.
            And the fact that a rather useless secondary system like a gun of a larger caliber will take place, for example, for UVP, it somehow passes by attention
            1. Grazdanin
              Grazdanin 16 July 2020 00: 13 New
              +1
              Yeah, in this case, for the laser, if you put 127 mm, there is clearly not enough space for it. People look that the nose is empty and wonder why. I also initially thought. At VO often such important points are missed, so it is better to read the original.
            2. Grazdanin
              Grazdanin 16 July 2020 00: 20 New
              +3
              The ship is gorgeous. Extremely balanced, it is not clear why they did not start ordering before, played with new technologies. We would like these, it’s perfectly ideal for us, having several different options for such a ship, we can cover all the fleet’s needs for surface ships.
              1. Alexey RA
                Alexey RA 16 July 2020 12: 16 New
                -1
                Quote: Grazdanin
                Extremely balanced, it is not clear why they did not start ordering before, played with new technologies.

                Because before, at first, there were hopes that the LCS would be able to perform the functions of the FR.
                And then the fleet got into an awkward situation when it was necessary to somehow explain to the politicians that the concept had changed, and in addition to the LCS, it would still have to order additional ships of the FR class. The same class that the Navy recently buried.
                This concept floundering and additional costs are not easy to explain. smile
                1. Cyril G ...
                  Cyril G ... 16 July 2020 12: 33 New
                  -1
                  ElTsES was made for a completely different reality where purely police functions fell out on the fleet and the most dangerous thing that could attack was a group of boats with cannons and a rifle, some ancient miraculously flying IS, a pair of anti-ship missiles of the P-15 type, howitzers artillery battery, etc. etc. And in such a situation, LCS was what the doctor ordered ....
                  Well, something went wrong. (from.)
                  1. Alexey RA
                    Alexey RA 16 July 2020 13: 44 New
                    0
                    Quote: Cyril G ...
                    ElceeS was made for a completely different reality where purely police functions fell on the fleet and the most dangerous thing that could attack was a group of boats with guns and a gunner, some kind of an ancient flying miracle, a pair of anti-ship missiles of the P-15 type, howitzer artillery battery, etc. etc.

                    Well yes, drive wild zusuls. Moreover, judging by the composition and range of the weapon systems that they planned to put on littoralniks, the P-15 did not smell at the probable opponents specified in the ToR, the customer relied only on cast iron.
                    Quote: Cyril G ...
                    Well, something went wrong. (from.)

                    However, during the journey, zusuls were able to grow. smile If coastal SCRC appeared in such a backwater as Yemen ...
            3. Avior
              Avior 16 July 2020 06: 48 New
              -6
              On Berks there is just this secondary system - 127 mm
              The ship should be balanced - the number of electronic chips, as you write, should be in proportion to the weapon of the ship.
              And he has a clear imbalance
              1. Liam
                Liam 16 July 2020 07: 18 New
                +3
                Quote: Avior
                On the Berks

                Berk has VI-10K tons. But you’ll find it difficult to tell why a frigate created for a convoy in a DMZ and operations in a BMZ cannon of large caliber. Linkor in a squadron battle he does not need to sink, and for Iranian boats and 57 mm is enough.
                Only you see the imbalance. This is not a strike destroyer. It is created for Aaw (Anti-Air Warfare) and the near-field zone, Asuw (Anti-Surface Warfare) and anti-ship missiles are bigger than on Burke e Asw (Anti-Submarine Warfare) and with it the same order, as well as Emw (Electro-Magnetic Warfare) and for this it is stuffed with these very chips and a powerful electric group. Well, and a place under the laser is reserved. Instead of guns)
                1. Avior
                  Avior 16 July 2020 07: 56 New
                  -6
                  The imbalance between electronic and conventional weapons is striking.
                  For Iranian boats, a ship with a displacement of 6,7 thousand tons?
                  For Iranian boats, if littoral frigates, they are fast and are excellent for this purpose.
                  States urgently need a project against China's growing fleet
                  Harpoons in Americans are auxiliary in nature.
                  In the displacement and with the electronics that are, it was possible to make an excellent multi-purpose frigate without problems by means of Minimum financial costs, which for most applications was at the Berkov level at half the price.
                  1. Octopus
                    Octopus 16 July 2020 08: 18 New
                    +3
                    Quote: Avior
                    an excellent multi-purpose frigate, which for most applications was at the Burke level at half the price.

                    This is what they did.
                    Quote: Avior
                    For Iranian boats if littoral frigates

                    Just the littoral frigates have nothing to do there.
                    Quote: Avior
                    the presence of PLUR and anti-aircraft missiles. And he has a problem with that.

                    With anti-aircraft there are no questions, only you have little frigate with an air defense system like that of Peter. As for the ASROK, you can put 4 pieces, if necessary, the MAPL is a potential enemy who is not rich, frankly, but in general there is a helicopter.
                    1. Avior
                      Avior 16 July 2020 12: 26 New
                      -1
                      Why distort? There is a good air defense system with small ammunition
                      1. Octopus
                        Octopus 16 July 2020 12: 45 New
                        +1
                        Quote: Avior
                        There is a good air defense system with small ammunition

                        Who, the Americans? 32 cells with American missiles - not that far from the air defense of Peter at least.

                        I understand your thought "it would be nice to stick in another unit of the UVP", whether it is reasonable or not to say, but I'm not going to make a tragedy out of 32 cells. By the way, if the Americans have 16 inclined launchers, then the total number of cells will be the same as the Spaniard.
                      2. Avior
                        Avior 18 July 2020 10: 37 New
                        0
                        Total and universal cells are not the same
                        Matter in concept
                        In my opinion, the United States lacks a versatile, inexpensive frigate in tandem with Burke; there are three options for half the price, capable of reinforcing or replacing Berks in terms of tasks
                        The ability to strengthen the fleet without increasing costs
                        And this is a completely different ship
                    2. Octopus
                      Octopus 18 July 2020 10: 21 New
                      +1
                      Have fun at your leisure.

                      MK41 is below deck installation, you can't just stick it in.
                      Hispanic

                      Originally designed for 48 cells in the nose. This is quite noticeable.
                      In the Horizon

                      They shoved 6x8, but for this they used a typically French perversion with guns.
                      Italian

                      Originally designed much calmer (by the way, your big gun), but the French on their

                      Changed the big gun for 16 additional short cells of UVP.

                      More, most likely, does not fit into the contours. Only if the cannon is removed at all, as on the Horizon. The Americans, apparently, are not ready to design the ship anew, new ships have already got them, they want old ones.
                    3. Avior
                      Avior 18 July 2020 10: 39 New
                      0
                      MK41 there are different sizes in depth
                      On a ship of 6,7 thousand tons, sticking a minimal so-called self-defense, under 32 essm, is not a big problem.
                    4. Octopus
                      Octopus 18 July 2020 11: 00 New
                      +1
                      Quote: Avior
                      MK41 there are different sizes in depth

                      Short (self-defense) - 5,3 meters, 12,2 tons empty. Long (strike) 7,7 meters, 15 tons.
                      Quote: Avior
                      under 32 essm, there is no big problem.

                      Actually, I just attached pictures, which is a big deal of problems. No, you can remove the gun, remove the helipad, or even take another ship, the same Spaniard, which they were offered... But the Americans believe that this option is better.
                      The British on a similar ship raised part of the deck.

                      To cram in more cells. And they got ... The same 24 long cells, + vertical installations for 48 Kratal rockets, lighter than ЕССМ, in non-universal cells (half of them in front, half in the middle of the hull, in place of the American inclined launchers). That is, in terms of UVP, there are 36 cells, of which 12 are hard-packed with medium-radius missiles and nothing else.

                      The capabilities of the American (32 UVP, 16 inclined) are sharply higher.
                    5. Octopus
                      Octopus 18 July 2020 11: 33 New
                      +1
                      PS.
                      Like this

                      Initially, it looked like the proposal of the Italians. The Americans added weapons to the project just with a slide, it looks more like a Russian ship than a bourgeois one. So what, what, but there are no questions about the under-equipping of the ship.
                2. Octopus
                  Octopus 18 July 2020 10: 39 New
                  +1
                  What else is important to understand.

                  The Americans, in order to add strike capabilities to the ship, put up 4x4 inclined NSM / JSM launchers. But this easy rocket, it weighs only 400 kg, and its slant launcher weighs only 5,5 tons along with the missiles. Even the tactical Mk41 weighs 12,2 tons, while the ESSM weighs 300 kg each.
                  If you replace inclined launchers with UVP, then you will not get more than 8 cells, even tactical ones. It is unlikely that this will strengthen the ship. Even the simplest UVP Mk-48 Mod.3

                  (red caps).
                  With 12 missiles, the ECCM weighs 12 tons, that is, the exchange with the NSM will go 8 shock for 12 anti-aircraft.
                  Perhaps in the future the Americans will be able to cram a pair of Mk-48 Mod.3 or, say, Mod.1 somewhere.

                  Then, respectively, 24 (23 tons) or 32 (26 tons) ECCM cells will unload the UVP for other tasks. Including NSM are taught to fly with UVP, but if there is an opportunity to shove a Tomahawk, why not shove it, you need to put them somewhere.

                  But the Americans do not like ships of the limiting layout, by the way, they are completely right. From this point of view, everything is just amazingly good and powerful.
                3. Avior
                  Avior 18 July 2020 18: 28 New
                  -1
                  If arly Burke is not the ultimate layout, then even talking about it is not serious

                  Fremm was originally made spacious. To reconfigure a ship with a series of 10-20 pieces in the project, even dramatically, is also not a problem.
                  European frigates are not an example even once, they don’t have close tasks like the States in China, for example
                  And to say that you can’t add 6700 tons of weapons to a ship of 20 tons is just nonsense
                  Turks without problems added essm to Perry.

                  But in this case, the problem is wider - we are talking about the chosen concept of the ship.
                  What to discuss cells for essm, if it does not have a full PLO.
                  This is a completely different ship.
                  Although the displacement could completely replace Burke in 90 percent of cases at half price.
                  But the modern US fleet can save money and use it rationally. As it was done in due time, moving from Tiki to Burke according to the concept of three-quarters of the possibilities for half the price, it seems not in a hurry
                4. Octopus
                  Octopus 18 July 2020 19: 19 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Avior
                  Arly Burke - and this is not the ultimate layout,

                  Of course not.
                  Quote: Avior
                  And to say that you can’t add 6700 tons of weapons to a ship of 20 tons is just nonsense

                  It is very likely that some details of the equipment of the new frigates may undergo changes. For example, the Navy is currently discussing whether the number of vertical launcher cells should be increased to 48 to increase the combat power of the ship. The implementation of this proposal is unlikely. In May, US Navy experts determined that such a step would require changes to pre-fabricated designs, which would lead to an undesirable delay in development and procurement.

                  Quote: Avior
                  if it does not have a full PLO.

                  integrated into the GAS AN / SQS-62;
                  towing sonar TB-37;
                  ASW control system AN / SQQ-89;
                  anti-torpedo protection system ADC;
                  long-range anti-submarine weapons (such as ASROC) in vertical launchers;
                  deck-mounted torpedo tubes (perspective).

                  Quote: Avior
                  Although the displacement could completely replace Burke in 90 percent of cases at half price.

                  Ogums
        2. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 16 July 2020 12: 21 New
          +2
          Quote: Avior
          For Iranian boats, if littoral frigates, they are fast and are excellent for this purpose.

          And which require EM URO to cover - when operating in potentially hostile waters. smile The Yankees themselves (more precisely, the Chief of Naval Operations) assessed the LCS as ships capable of only patrolling, fighting pirates or displaying a flag without cover.
          1. Avior
            Avior 16 July 2020 12: 28 New
            -3
            Now in foreign waters and this one needs to be covered
  7. Narak-zempo
    Narak-zempo 16 July 2020 17: 31 New
    0
    Yes, yes, just put a “stick over T” to the wake column of the enemy’s linear forces laughing
  • Octopus
    Octopus 16 July 2020 07: 12 New
    +2
    Quote: Liam
    https://www.google

    Thank you.

    Honestly, I would expect the Americans to join the 26th project of the British. But, apparently, the LKS with Zumvolt and Ford brought them to such a boil that they categorically did not want to buy another cat in a poke.
    1. Grazdanin
      Grazdanin 16 July 2020 11: 18 New
      0
      It seems like that. If necessary, this frigate can be massively built, at all allied shipyards, a symmetrical response to China
  • Avior
    Avior 16 July 2020 06: 43 New
    -6
    Please look at the ship with which the frigate will need to interact in a pair - Arly Burke. One of the most toothy ships in the world. Remember, two-thirds of the possibilities at half the price of Tiki.
    And here is the fourth part of the opportunity at half the price of Burke.
    1. Octopus
      Octopus 16 July 2020 07: 08 New
      +3
      Quote: Avior
      And here is the fourth part of the opportunity at half the price of Burke.

      1. Burke 3 series costs more than 2 yards.
      2. On the contrary, the ship turned out to be surprisingly strong. A full-fledged Burke, in fact, with the exception of opportunities that are not currently in demand.

      You are too fixated on the amount of weapons. The new frigate does not need to repel a Tu-22 division raid.
      1. Avior
        Avior 16 July 2020 07: 24 New
        -4
        And what is they doing it strictly for momentary needs? How is 22160? When the building was finished, it turned out the pirates ended
        There is a growing Chinese fleet, and obviously, such a large frigate may well serve as an inexpensive good addition to the Berks.
        As a vodochny task, when dear Berks will need to drive on trifles in detail, so as part of a group with a berk. If he has against the enemy will not only machine guns.
        Count it loading rockets.
        At best, 16 cm-6, capable of realizing the capabilities of very expensive radars and bius.
        If you put expensive electronics, provide it with weapons. 8 short MK41 cells would slightly increase the cost of the ship, but at times increased combat capabilities
        I hope the place is reserved.
        1. Octopus
          Octopus 16 July 2020 08: 01 New
          +3
          Quote: Avior
          When the building was finished, it turned out the pirates ended

          This happened with LKS just. The frigate is much better balanced.
          Quote: Avior
          a large frigate may well serve as an inexpensive good addition to the Berks.

          If the frigate is in the area of ​​its AWAC, no 52D will do anything to him. If it is outside the zone, on the contrary, it is impossible to protect the ship from a strong enemy, be it even Petya.
          Quote: Avior
          Count it loading rockets.

          16 RCC / KR, 16 Standard-6, 4 Standard-3, 48 ESSM. What else do you need?
          1. Avior
            Avior 16 July 2020 10: 34 New
            -3
            RCC harpoon - auxiliary. Kr in those launchers will not
            8 cells - 32 ЕССМ, 8 Asrok cells, 4 lrasm, and only 12 cm-6, maximum 16 if you cut the PLO.
            About 70 cells can be used to realize Aegis’s capabilities in air defense on Berke, here 12
            About cm-3 you need to separately understand whether it is possible to let them out of here, if possible, then only 8-12 air defense missiles to realize the capabilities of the expensive Aegis
            And what do you call normally armed?
            1. Octopus
              Octopus 16 July 2020 11: 10 New
              +2
              Quote: Avior
              8 cells - 32 ЕССМ, 8 Asrok cells, 4 lrasm, and only 12 cm-6, maximum 16 if you cut the PLO.

              Throw out LRASM, under the anti-ship missiles you have inclined launchers. ASROK in such a quantity is only in the submarine set, and that is not a fact, the times of wolf packs are over, but in the submarine set so much air defense is not needed.
              Quote: Avior
              8-12 air defense missiles to realize the capabilities of expensive Aegis

              How many MRBMs / ICBMs do you plan to shoot down simultaneously? But I really didn't see about CM3, like yes, but like no.
              Quote: Avior
              And what do you call normally armed?

              This is not "normally armed", it is "drop dead armed". Look at the weapons of other European frigates, there are no such opportunities there.
              1. Avior
                Avior 16 July 2020 12: 12 New
                -5
                Throw out lrsm - reduce the ship's combat effectiveness and readiness for unexpected situations. This is an important addition to simple and inexpensive harpoons.
                Pro and plo often go together, it's hard to separate
                Sm-6 is an air defense missile, not a pro.
                In rezutat on 2-3 air attacks the ammunition will run out
                How does a European frigate sail with an Aegis?
                Like this
                https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Фрегаты_типа_«Альваро_де_Базан»
                Less in displacement, but better armed
                1. Octopus
                  Octopus 16 July 2020 12: 39 New
                  +4
                  Quote: Avior
                  Throw out lrsm - reduce combat effectiveness

                  They have 8 or 16 inclined cells of the anti-ship missile system, what won't you have enough for? The Open Sea Fleet?
                  Quote: Avior
                  In rezutate on 2-3 air attack

                  How many aviation attacks must be repelled frigate?
                  Quote: Avior
                  How does a European frigate sail with an Aegis?
                  Like this

                  You will laugh, but this ship also participated in the competition. He was not chosen.
                  1. Avior
                    Avior 16 July 2020 16: 49 New
                    -2
                    The reason is obvious - the admirals came up with their next concept for some reason.
                    The problem of an inexpensive ship, universal in purpose as Burke, but cheaper, had long been ripened.
                    Burke for many tasks is simply redundant, and a simpler ship would allow the fleet to be strengthened inexpensively, and in working with Burke show no less characteristics than Burke, given the network capabilities
                    But admirals are like artists, they see so.
                2. Oleg83
                  Oleg83 16 July 2020 12: 57 New
                  0
                  There will be no SM-3, SM-6 and ASROC on this frigate.
                  32 Mark 41 cells will occupy SM-2 and ESSM, Mk 49 with 21 RIM-116 RAM missiles, 16 JSM anti-ship missiles in inclined launchers (NSM modification, created by Lockheed Martin and Norwegian Kongsberg Defense & Aerospace, 280 km range) Aegis will also be truncated . I read somewhere that 10 frigates will definitely be with 32 cells, then they will consider the possibility of increasing them to 48 later
                  In fact, this is a frigate with anti-ship missiles, similar to what Oliver Hazard Perry frigates used to be
                  There are no torpedoes, but there are some sonars, perhaps they are installed if necessary. Antisubmarine functions will apparently be performed by the SH-60 Seahawk
                  1. Octopus
                    Octopus 16 July 2020 14: 35 New
                    0
                    Quote: oleg83
                    There will be no SM-3, SM-6 and ASROC on this frigate.

                    Hmm, maybe you're right, I misunderstood. Wait and see.
                  2. Avior
                    Avior 16 July 2020 17: 14 New
                    -2
                    If you're right, then it's still sadder hi
          2. Alexey RA
            Alexey RA 16 July 2020 12: 59 New
            +1
            Quote: Octopus
            This happened with LKS just.

            The LCS, rather, did not end the pirates, but the coastal SCRC began. And the whole concept "zusul strikes due to the radius of their coastal defense"flew to hell. Moreover, with constructive protection and survivability, littoralniks are very bad. And with air defense too.
            1. Oleg83
              Oleg83 16 July 2020 13: 12 New
              0
              The only thing that can be done with LCS is to throw helicopters out of them and put weapons
        2. Cyril G ...
          Cyril G ... 16 July 2020 14: 37 New
          +1
          So because shta pr.22160 is just a stupid brazen cut ...

          And if the multi-star dudes really wanted to solve the problem - this should have been done wrong. It was necessary to find 4-5 ships of the BATM class with in / out from 4 to 5 thousand tons. Carry out minimal repairs there, install communications, organize a runway for helicopters, it’s good if you come up with a telescopic hangar / or just shelter for a helicopter and paint it in a ball color.
          Weapons to establish from the availability.
          Well, if it comes out to put AK-176 + Bagira
          And so be sure to pair PU Grad
          Bending
          3-4 ZU-23
          2 KPVT
          A couple of ATGMs of the Chrysanthemum type
          Mandatory 4 RIB ///

          Example pancake before your eyes!
        3. 5-9
          5-9 16 July 2020 16: 37 New
          0
          About SM-6 in the picture, not a word, only SM-2. Yes, and they are only 800 pieces for the entire cycle are going to produce, because expensive, only enough for Berke ...
    2. Liam
      Liam 16 July 2020 07: 19 New
      0
      Quote: Avior
      Please look at the ship with which the frigate will need to interact in pairs - Arly Burke

      You will greatly surprise the American admirals. This frigate will work in conjunction with the LCS and not with the Berks.
      1. Avior
        Avior 16 July 2020 07: 58 New
        -4
        So I say, the third experiment
        LKS and Zamvolta was not enough
        Rake Run Continues
        1. Liam
          Liam 16 July 2020 18: 10 New
          +1
          I am aware that our Voshny pdmirali have long sunk both Zumvolty and LCS. Well, also the F-35. They are better than Americans what they and how to build.)
          You want a frigate armed like Burke, but at half the price of a berk and a VI, it’s 30% less. Such miracles happen only with local admirals. In reality, to get like Burke, you need to build a Burke and not a frigate. But an American needs a frigate and not a destroyer. Burke as one is basking.
          And yet. As for the "busting" of electronics. You will be surprised, but this has long been a trend and not only in the Navy. The more and better the electronics, the fewer missiles of bombs and shells are needed to complete the task
  • Grazdanin
    Grazdanin 16 July 2020 00: 09 New
    +1
    Quote: Avior
    No problem putting a 127 mm gun on such a large ship, at least 76

    There are FREMM options with 127 mm, in a universal design. The United States ordered a modification against anti-aircraft defense and air defense. Mk 110 with a 57-mm cannon rather for air defense 220 rounds per minute, programmable shells. It’s more than enough to bombard a mine or a boat at a distance of 17 km. True, it is useless to support the landing, but there was no such task.
    And so a gorgeous ship. He will still have laser weapons.
    1. Avior
      Avior 16 July 2020 06: 51 New
      -5
      The ship should take into account the growing capabilities of the Chinese Navy
      Inexpensive frigate, capable of paired with the Berks significantly enhance the capabilities of the fleet.
      And here they put machine guns and a 57 mm cannon. Oh, the Chinese are scared!
      1. Grazdanin
        Grazdanin 16 July 2020 11: 39 New
        0
        Quote: Avior
        The ship should take into account the growing capabilities of the Chinese Navy

        They take into account that there is nothing close to the capabilities of the US fleet and not close. If necessary, these frigates will be ordered in other configurations. Now FREMM has 3 frigates. Many can build them, although the crews still need to be assembled.
      2. Grazdanin
        Grazdanin 16 July 2020 12: 29 New
        0
        Take the Chinese destroyer type 052D

        Main characteristics
        Displacement 7500 t (full)
        Length 156 m
        Width 18 m
        Precipitation 6,5 m
        Engines
        CODOG
        2 gas turbines
        2 Shaanxi diesels
        Power 2x28 megawatt / 2x6 megawatt
        Speed ​​30 knots
        Crew 280

        weaponry
        Radar weapons
        Type 517M ​​Radar
        Artillery
        1 × 130 mm AU H / PJ-38
        Flak
        1 × ZAK Type 730
        Missile weapons
        64 × SAM HQ-9, PLUR or KR (2 × 32 UVP)
        1 x 8 PU SAM FL3000N (24 missiles)
        Mine torpedo armament
        2 × 3 TA YU-7
        Aviation Group
        1 helicopter


        Let's compare missile armament:
        Mk 41 with 32 cells, Mk 49 with 21 anti-aircraft missiles RIM-116 RAM, 16 launchers for rgm-184
        Parity in quantity, quality, USA is 2 heads higher.
        Artillery in favor of the Chinese, but this is a different class, torpedoes Only from the Chinese, are they generally relevant?
        Only American will have laser weapons.
        In terms of detection, surveillance, electromagnetic suppression and protection, automation, etc., FFG is absolutely superior to 052D.
        In the event of a sudden duel situation, the Chinese will have no chance. And 130 mm will definitely not help him.
        1. Avior
          Avior 16 July 2020 12: 44 New
          -3
          Great you think
          Ukititsa 2 times more than universal cells for distant air defense systems and guns
          And kvass is single-stranded
          Oh well
          1. Grazdanin
            Grazdanin 16 July 2020 13: 16 New
            0
            The difference in the universal cells is leveled by the rest of the missile weapons. The Chinese will not be allowed to approach the artillery range.
            You ignore the purpose of this ship is air defense and anti-aircraft defense. For air defense, a 57 mm quick-fire gun with programmable shells, a combat laser, and various missiles are more important. But this frigate is comparable to the strike URO destroyers. Naturally, the FFG may be in the modification of the frigate’s URO, but the US Navy simply does not need it. Ships will destroy other means of the Navy.
            If you put a 127 mm gun, there simply will not be room for a laser. Current lasers rip off a huge space.
            Ships are created depending on the theater of war, the necessary purpose of the fleet, and capabilities. And not cramming weapons larger and larger.

            The main tasks of the FFG (X) will be to participate in the air defense and anti-aircraft defense of a ship’s group, for which there are appropriate weapons and equipment on board. In this case, the frigate will work in a single information-control loops and exchange data with other ships. Also, the specific composition of cannon-machine gun weapons will allow you to effectively deal with small surface targets - boats and boats, including with a massive attack.
        2. 5-9
          5-9 16 July 2020 16: 45 New
          -1
          Cool ... 32 equals 64 .... and this one, Omerian rockets, with low missile defense speed (due to which a large muzzle distance with low weight is obtained), the probability of shooting down an ultra-fast and / or maneuverable target is not high ... So I b put on the Chinese .. And 22350 in a duel situation ФФГ (Х) will work
          1. Grazdanin
            Grazdanin 16 July 2020 17: 15 New
            0
            Quote: 5-9
            So I would put on the Chinese.

            Yeah, because 280 people are more than 140?)) 2 times! And the gun is bigger! Also 2 times! The American has no chance laughing
    2. Avior
      Avior 16 July 2020 07: 27 New
      -4
      He has a syram at the stern, it is a universal launcher, picked up guided or homing missiles for the same purposes - it would be much easier.
      And would find a place for 30 mm, in addition to the 127 mm main
      1. Grazdanin
        Grazdanin 16 July 2020 11: 32 New
        -1
        Quote: Avior
        And would find a place for 30 mm, in addition to the 127 mm main

        Where to put the laser after that?
  • Octopus
    Octopus 16 July 2020 06: 58 New
    +2
    Quote: Avior
    Mk41 cells are few.

    Lot. EMNIP European version has only 16 cells.
    Quote: Avior
    ore weak

    The gun is strong, its target is shahid boats and drones. Battleships from didvoyale were not ordered.
    Quote: Avior
    PLO features

    He has Burke’s power.
    Quote: Avior
    What is the point of putting an expensive bus and radar if there is nothing to shoot?

    If spelled correctly, then this thing can also shoot down satellites.
    1. Liam
      Liam 16 July 2020 07: 27 New
      0
      Quote: Octopus
      Lot. EMNIP European version has only 16 cells

      And a place was reserved for another 16. In the American version, this stock was used.
    2. Avior
      Avior 16 July 2020 08: 06 New
      -4
      PLO and air defense capabilities suggest the presence of PLUR and anti-aircraft missiles. And he has a problem with that.
  • mvg
    mvg 15 July 2020 23: 52 New
    0
    The Italian FREMM uses 4 diesel generators with a power of 2,15 or 2,8 MW each (on different ships of the series), as well as a pair of 2,5-megawatt running electric motors. There is also a 32 MW gas turbine engine.

    Again, the author does not read “his” article ... I criticize the site for rejecting the “cons” of the article
    1. Liam
      Liam 16 July 2020 00: 12 New
      +1
      Unlike what the author writes on this GTU frigate there will be two, not one. General Electric LM2500.
  • moreman78
    moreman78 16 July 2020 09: 35 New
    0
    Quote: svp67

    The task of these boats is, in particular, to ensure amphibious operations, and here the gun mount is not unnecessary.

    And how will the 76 mm AU help in this case? Especially one.
    But the choice of the 57mm caliber AU (with guided ammunition) is quite correct and seems to be dictated by the desire to have an air defense system from drones, as well as a means of dealing with small-sized high-speed boats and boats.
    It’s no coincidence that ours is developing the “Derivation-Air Defense” and the promising 57-mm combat module on an infantry fighting vehicle, and it is possible that in the future a similar AU will also go to the fleet.
    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 16 July 2020 13: 51 New
      +1
      Quote: moreman78
      But the choice of the 57mm caliber AU (with guided ammunition) is quite correct and seems to be dictated by the desire to have an air defense system from drones, as well as a means of dealing with small-sized high-speed boats and boats.

      In the 76-mm caliber, for five years there has been a serial ammunition with an adjustable trajectory - DART. And the serial artillery system with SUAO - DAVIDE.
      The Italians put them on FREMM in the version of PLO.
  • Kuz
    Kuz 18 July 2020 23: 37 New
    +8
    For Americans, such ships are cheap and cheerful.
    1. Serpet
      Serpet 19 July 2020 15: 39 New
      +5
      The budget for Burke is apparently not enough.