Marker complexes: in Russia robotic tanks teach to understand human orders

Russian robotic Tanks learn to understand the orders that a person gives. However, they are designed to Robots helped the soldiers solve combat missions.

This is written by David Ax in an article for Forbes magazine.

The Russian Advanced Research Foundation (FPI) is closely engaged in testing artificial intelligence systems for Marker ground-based robotic systems, which can respond to commanders' orders in the same way as ordinary soldiers.

Oleg Martyanov, Head of the National Center for the Development of Technologies and Basic Elements of Robotics of the Advanced Research Foundation, interview TASS told the news agency that it was originally intended to control robotic tanks using tablets, but then decided to explore the possibility of setting tasks using voice commands.

The first attempt to use ground-based unmanned aerial vehicles was the Uran-9 complex, which is a 12-ton vehicle armed with a cannon and missiles. True, his practical tests in Syria showed that he is not reliable enough and has limited capabilities.

The Marker is larger than its predecessor. When it was created, the flaws that existed at the Uran-9 complex were taken into account and corrected.

It is difficult to call this battle robot a full-fledged unmanned tank, but in the Western media they call it that.

According to American analyst Samuel Bendett of the Center for Naval Analysis, such systems will not replace soldiers. They simply can help the military in combat operations, reconnaissance, evacuation, as well as in solving other tasks.

Comments

[Theodore]

Mat is desirable! So that no reptile could not understand!

[CAT BAIYUN]

Mat is desirable! So that no reptile could not understand!

In-in ... With language removed.
But is it really a problem - how without Russian spoken language in a combat situation? Well, no way!
So the idiomatic dictionary must be embedded in the software. Otherwise, the equipment will not work fully.

[NEXUS]

Quote: KOT BYUN

Otherwise, the equipment will not work fully.

I am very interested in the question - how will they contact robots? After all, a robot compound is a full-fledged combat group, and in this regard, how the robots will "understand" the commander, in the question to whom does he address? Or will each robot be tied to a specific fighter-operator?
In general, there are more questions than answers. We will see ...

[Blackmokona]

There will be just an indicator at the beginning of the order.
Like
Uranus-8, 280 target fire!
Uranus-5, a departure of 100 meters!

[poquello]

Quote: BlackMokona

There will be just an indicator at the beginning of the order.
Like
Uranus-8, 280 target fire!
Uranus-5, a departure of 100 meters!

and when will the robot fight with such teams? "flashing, not flashing, flashing, not flashing"

[Eragon]

Quote: poquello

Quote: BlackMokona

There will be just an indicator at the beginning of the order.
Like
Uranus-8, 280 target fire!
Uranus-5, a departure of 100 meters!

and when will the robot fight with such teams? "flashing, not flashing, flashing, not flashing"

Do you think it will be faster to poke a finger into the tablet? And if the tablet crashes, they will not command from the office chair, how do you order to manage?

[poquello]

Quote: Eragon

Do you think it will be faster to poke a finger into the tablet?

thinker? talking about the form of voice commands

[Eragon]

Quote: poquello

Quote: Eragon

Do you think it will be faster to poke a finger into the tablet?

thinker? talking about the form of voice commands

Then it is generally not clear what confuses you. Just like commands are given to people. You can simply voice, or better with duplication over communication channels. Having previously laid in memory samples of the votes of those who have the right to command. And even such concepts as, for example, "a little more", "faster", etc. not a problem for correct interpretation by modern computers. It is imperative to lay down profanity - in battle there is no time for fine literature.

[poquello]

Quote: Eragon

Then it’s not at all clear what bothers you.

with such simple commands, the operator or commander will fight instead, while the robot is able to operate minimal tactical operations

[Eragon]

Quote: poquello

Quote: Eragon

Then it’s not at all clear what bothers you.

with such simple commands, the operator or commander will fight instead, while the robot is able to operate minimal tactical operations

I gave simple commands as an example, as additional. And about the complexity ... chat, for example, with Alice. I sometimes "communicate" with her for fun. She already had the "mind" to "take offense" at the fact that I insistently called her a stupid robot and promise to go somewhere there. That is, even a toy already responds quite adequately to not monosyllabic and simple commands at all.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Eragon

Having previously laid in memory samples of votes of those who have the right to command

It is immediately clear that you did not participate in the BV and have no idea how this all happens. I will explain to you so that you understand ...
With a particularly fast intensity of the battle, not a single adequate commander will speak literary-to the left, to the right, Uranus-8-fire on target, etc. ... of the literary words there will mainly be only prepositions and interjections. It has always been this way, both under Alexander Nevsky and under Peter.
The lokanism of the order, its energy and emotional component and clarity are important. In battle, no commander will speak with you in the language of Pushkin, for as long as he adds to you, Lukomory thinks green ... they will kill you a hundred times.
But when the fighter is motivated through E, NA and B, then the private soldier has a chance to return home alive, and carry out the combat mission.

[Eragon]

Quote: NEXUS

Quote: Eragon

Having previously laid in memory samples of votes of those who have the right to command

The lokanism of the order, its energy and emotional component and clarity are important. In battle, no commander will speak with you in the language of Pushkin, for as long as he adds to you, Lukomory thinks green ... they will kill you a hundred times.
But when the fighter is motivated through E, NA and B, then the private soldier has a chance to return home alive, and carry out the combat mission.

Quote: Eragon

Be sure to lay profanity - in battle is not up to elegant literature.

And why are you repeating me to me, only more expanded ???
PS I did not participate in the BV, but was under fire.

[venik]

Quote: poquello

Quote: BlackMokona

There will be just an indicator at the beginning of the order.
Like
Uranus-8, 280 target fire!
Uranus-5, a departure of 100 meters!

and when will the robot fight with such teams? "flashing, not flashing, flashing, not flashing"

===========
And he will not: after the very first such command - he will think for a long time .... and then "mz ears" smoke will go .... And that's all - a Sabbath! Change your brains!
Well, but seriously, no bullshit: the question is daunting! The statement of the problem should be very clear, absolutely unambiguous and not allowing double (or other) interpretation. Here's an example: "Uranus-5, retreat 100 meters!" A person will understand, but a machine will NOT! She clearly needs to indicate where, in what direction, how quickly, etc. etc.
In the laboratory, this is possible, but in the conditions real battle - doubtful .....
So, what is thought - all this is a question of a very distant future .....

[poquello]

Quote: venik

the question is archy difficult! The statement of the problem should be very clear, absolutely unambiguous and not allowing a double (or other) interpretation.

mmm, double interpretation of the machine is possible only with a programmer error or with a high level of machine intelligence. Those. the primitive interface is built on the recognition of the phrase as an event and the execution of the program taking into account this event, those are the level of commands to dogs. Therefore, the easiest way to implement combat capability is not on voice commands, but on the principle of a "companion-in-arms", such as sculpting a visor on the fighter's eye, due to the adapter, the machine maintains a position somewhere nearby and looks for a target 1-5m to the left, or attacks a single target, "face", "fu", etc., even with a voice, even with buttons, even with gestures.

Quote: venik

a departure of 100 meters!

for this team, the car must position itself before this, the remaining difficulties are the difficulties of implementing terrain and collision adapters

[Crash]

Handset 15, scope 120! Battery, fire !!!

[venik]

Quote: BlackMokona

Uranus-5, a departure of 100 meters!

=======
Aha! And in response to you: "Clown! Where do I go then - right, left, back? You first figure it out, then command!" ..... And after all, you won't send him to an extraordinary outfit and you won't put him on the "lip" ! The task !!!
---------

Quote: BlackMokona

Uranus-8, 280 target fire!

=======
And in response: "What does" 280 "mean ???"
From a "bearded" anecdote ("Bach inspired ..."):
- Pilot: "Navigator! Instruments!"
- Navigator: "130!"
- Pilot: "What do you mean 130?"
- Navigator: "What do you mean by" instruments "?

[NIKN]

Quote: NEXUS

In general, there are more questions than answers. We will see ...

Initially, I did not understand what they want from robots? To understand speech or, for example, to recognize a less detailed task, or something else .. In general, nothing is clear.

[swnvaleria]

Yeah, for sure, nothing is clear, but very interesting!

[VO3A]

Robots do not fight in battle formations among people, they replace them .... To use robots, you need information multi-duplicated communication channels in real time, starting from satellite and simple ones from UAVs, and maybe even ordinary video cameras and other day and night devices .. We do not have this .. What kind of robots can we talk about then? There is no need to be clowns with tambourines in the form of AI ... They shove this AI anywhere, and even the primary conditions for its implementation are not ... Our ARMY does not have systems of reconnaissance, information collection and target designation in real time, but talk about the destruction of targets and control over this in real time is not a dream ... Well-oiled, well-tested, and simply working such systems are NOT ... Where are they ?? Where is the ESU TK "Constellation M", which Gerasimov personally accepted? There in ... KARAGANDA "!! Instead of systems for collecting information about the enemy in real time, they make an automated system for accounting and control of their troops and transmitting orders to them? !! How will this help to win, help save the lives of soldiers ?? NO !!! Fools ...

[Grazdanin]

There is a good term for such IDB projects - Imitation of violent activity

[venik]

Quote: VO3A

Robots do not fight in battle formations among people, they replace them ....

========
Yes?
Quote: ".... Fighting robot" Uran-9 "is a remotely controlled tracked vehicle that belongs to the category of ground combat unmanned vehicles. It is designed to conduct engineering reconnaissance of the terrain and fire support of intelligence and advanced units combined-arms tactical formations. ..... "
Quote: "...In December 2015, it was reported that during the Syrian offensive with the help of Russian specialists to a height of 754,5 in Latakia province, 10 combat robots (6 Platform-M and 4 Argo Platform) that interacted with self-propelled howitzers participated in the attack "Acacia" and Syrian troops. ..."

[venik]

Quote: NEXUS

I’m very interested in the question - how will they turn to robots?

=========
How how? Of course: "Comrades robots!" (Well, do not call them "Gentlemen"!).

[VO3A]

The first attempt to use ground-based unmanned aerial vehicles was the Uran-9 complex, which is a 12-ton vehicle armed with a cannon and missiles. True, his practical tests in Syria showed that he is not reliable enough and has limited capabilities.

The chaos in the head of the military leads to useless developments, which waste money and time ... We do not have a concept for using robots, we do not have tasks for their development, or maybe they are not needed at all, those tasks are not achievable at our level ... The parade of idiocy is flourishing, instead of real problems that they have not been able to solve for decades, creative idiocy is flourishing along with a real cut of money ... We are at the level of 41 in terms of the methods of conducting combined arms combat, with the same consequences, and only a "nuclear club" brightens up the result a little. We have a stagnation in the leadership of the army, they are preparing to fight in a modern war, like in World War II, but with new weapons ... Once we have already gone through this ..., the second time I don’t want to ... And Syria clearly showed the creativity of these senile ... Like Finnish at one time ...

[Grazdanin]

Quote: VO3A

The idiotic parade is flourishing, instead of the real tasks that they have not been able to solve for decades, creative idiocy is flourishing along with a real cut of money.

Absolutely.

[tikhonov66]

So the idiomatic dictionary must be embedded in the software. Otherwise, the equipment will not work fully

- and trying to interpret this rubbish will take 99% of the "intelligence" - and without any hope of success ...
- here it is dada not only to recognize the word, but also the intonation of that "word" - and to INTERPRET THE SUMMARY OF MEANINGS - in the context of the history of the development of relations in the team and their current interpretation by the commander in the personnel ...
8-))

[Thrifty]

Theodore so that for the supers, the roof was demolished from the results of the decryption of the interception of teams

[Thrifty]

So, if Uranus 9 is unreliable and limited to use, can it be re-qualified as a security complex? Failures are inevitable, but you need to clearly decide whether it makes sense to modify the Uranus platform.

[Starover_Z]

Quote: Thrifty

if Uranus 9 is unreliable and limited for use, can it be re-qualified as a security complex?

Well this is disposable I think. It’s just that the complex will become more expensive due to a more powerful digital hardware filling and, accordingly, more powerful software that will need to be coupled with more sensitive external sensors. And this also has time for revision and testing.

[tikhonov66]

more powerful software

- "more powerful" does not mean at all - "more reliable".
Our need for COMPLEX systems - is far ahead of our need for these COMPLEX systems - TO UNDERSTAND ...
8-))
- because the amount of testing a COMPLEX system - depends on its "complexity" - EXPONENTIALLY ...
and this is a sentence.
8 - (((

[poquello]

Quote: Thrifty

So if Uranus 9 unreliable and limited to usecan re-qualify him in a security complex? Failures are inevitable, but you need to clearly decide whether it makes sense to modify the Uranus platform.

and where was it written? and how did it suddenly transform from?

defects were taken into account and corrected

[Thrifty]

poguello-The phrase "it is not reliable enough" you deliberately did not notice? ???

[poquello]

Quote: Thrifty

poguello-The phrase "it is not reliable enough" you deliberately did not notice? ???

yes indeed, af-fluorine transformed

[Well done]

Voice? Maybe all the same on the radio? The armor in the microphones is somehow dumb. Yes, preferably with a voice of ensign, well, to an extreme, sergeant.

[NEXUS]

The main thing is that the signal emanating from our fighters to robots is not intercepted by the enemy. And here the issue of countering electronic warfare is very acute.

[VO3A]

Yes, this is not the problem, Andrei ... There are not only radio channels, there are optical ones ... yes even a simple wire .. The problem is, where does the robot get target designation from, it cannot cope with it, it must be a cell of the system ... And there is NO system ... So ROBOT is not needed, it’s too early ... The Chinese have their own UAV on their TERMINATOR, 2 kamikaze drones and a bunch of missiles ... And this is just one small independent cell of the system ...

[Sanichsan]

Quote: VO3A

The problem is, where does the robot get target designation from?

that is, modern MSAs of Russia, the USA, Israel, find, identify targets, allow you to give and receive target designations, but the robot does not .. can’t at all

Quote: VO3A

And there are NO systems ...

who? in Ukraine? Well, Che say .. sympathize ... what are we doing with it?

[Sanichsan]

Quote: VO3A

The beautiful verbiage of the verbiage TROLA .... The answer is not accepted as your complete public self-deception ....

complex "Andromeda".
PS
your rudeness confirms your low level of education and nationality ...

[VO3A]

Andromeda-D is a mobile-stationary, multi-level automated system that can provide automated control of formations, military units and airborne units, interaction with military units of the RF Armed Forces and other power ministries and departments. As previously reported by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, Andromeda-D provides closed telephone communications, encrypted data transmission and video conferencing. The system covers all levels of control - from the command of the airborne forces to a single soldier. Andromeda-D provides multi-user access to information about the situation with its application on an electronic digital map of the area. Rapid data exchange in close to real time ensures the continuity of command and control.
Source: http://nevskii-bastion.ru/andromeda-d/ MTC "NEVSKY BASTION" AVKarpenko

Not convincing ... The process took place ... TTX you do not have ... Streamline ..
Learn the materiel ...
https://niissu.ru/products/andromeda_d

[Sanichsan]

Andrameda provides control. for example, Pine knows how to conduct a goal;
it makes no sense to offer you a wrap from your natural habitat

[VO3A]

For people like you ... This is not a circus branch ...
https://niissu.ru/products/andromeda_d

[Grazdanin]

The article is something between fantasy and delirium. Only the last paragraph is adequate.

[A. Privalov]

Quote: Grazdanin

The article is something between fantasy and delirium. Only the last paragraph is adequate.

The last paragraph is only half what Bendett said.
Further, like this: (Google translation)

Experiments with voice commands from person to robot do not necessarily indicate the current state of Russian robotics. The Kremlin may want its combat robots to be autonomous enough to require very little human leadership. According to Bendett, the Marker trials are by no means the ultimate determinant of where Russian military autonomy is now located.

Source:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2020/06/30/dont-panic-but-russia-is-training-its-robot-tanks-to-understand-human-speech/#1b63f0d714f2

[Grazdanin]

After reading the translations of articles here, you must read the source. You learn a lot.

[tikhonov66]

The article is something between fantasy and delirium. Adequate only last paragraph

- in the post "Grazdanin" - only the first sentence is adequate.
and then in relation not to the article, but to his own post.
8-)

[rocket757]

As a means of enhancing the firepower of units, assault groups.
Characteristically, these products, this manufacturer MAY DO IT if the order for the products is ... unlike the Baltic lego-collectors about whom they wrote earlier.

[VO3A]

As a means of enhancing the firepower of units, assault groups.

Which units, which assault groups? Stop raving about the stupid things of the past! This is the first ..
And even if these assault groups were not only in your sick imagination, you asked them if they needed this fashionable useless burden ...? Can you imagine how they fight in a modern war without the use of nuclear weapons? Do you need robots in this war? ..Yes, they can perform secondary tasks, such as mine clearance, transportation of equipment .... but it’s far in ... behind ...

[rocket757]

Sometimes you need to exit the comp. shooters and see where and how they are fighting now, a little tomorrow ... and by tomorrow it is necessary to prepare seriously. What and how is being done in our country for later ... yes FIG knows, no one will say it, and certainly they will not ask us.
Purely from practice .... by then, in many respects, we are never ready NEVER! however, a lot of people, the degree of unavailability, is about the same.

[Reserve buildbat]

Well, I don't even know ... It's hard to imagine our soldier, clearly articulating the phrases of controlling the robot in battle. Usually there is such "slang" that even a civilian person will not understand anything, even though Russian. So a really difficult task is facing our scientists. Especially when you consider that one word, depending on the situation, can have dozens of meanings, and taking into account cognate words ... Not every philologist can figure it out. Without a bottle, then. And robots do not drink

[Cat]

And robots do not drink

That's it. And now what to do with the deputies for working with l / s?

Another question: how will the robot identify the commander who has the right to give orders, but what if it was a commander's parrot?

[Reserve buildbat]

Re-qualify as robot operators!
The main thing is that they are not poured, as a rule!

[Cat]

Re-qualify as robot operators!

No, too chatty - their teams will be perceived as spam. Actually, as living soldiers perceive them.

[Reserve buildbat]

Not all. In our battalion, the normal was a political commander. Young and not talkative. But when he left, a pre-pensioner was sent in his place, here he is - a terrible infection
So you need qualified selection.

[Marconi41]

Quote: Gato

That's it. And now what to do with the deputies for working with l / s?

Don’t worry about them! This sect will also survive us for a hundred years.

[Cat]

This sect will also survive us for a hundred years.

Yeah. Planet Govorilka - populated by political leaders.

[NEXUS]

Quote: Stroibat stock

It’s hard to imagine our soldier clearly speaking robot control phrases in battle

Given the intense intensity of the battle, it is generally not clear how the commander will coordinate the actions of drugs and support robots.
And if the commander is killed, then what?
Okay, in a clean field where everything is visible and you can visually determine what and where ... but in urban areas, how?
Suppose each robot is attached to a specific fighter who mirrors the commander’s commands ... and if the fighter was killed, then the robot is lost ...
In general, everything is complicated. The effectiveness of such systems in real combat will be when the robot itself will be able to make decisions, like any fighter, being a full-fledged combat unit.
Well, no matter how funny it may look, but ... sorry, in real battle, the commanders in literary Russian do not speak the syllables of Pushkin and Lermontov. That is, it turns out that the robot will really need to recognize and understand not only the words themselves, but intonation, since the same word spoken by the mat can mean completely opposite things, depending on the situation.

[Cat]

I don’t know what tasks the robot will be assigned, but here the main task of the escort accompanied by it will in every way protect and protect the expensive car - if they like it, the commander will not unsubscribe.

[Izotovp]

Assistant robot. A sample scenario is the book Guardian Angel 320.

[Pandiurin]

Now for iron and most likely there is no problem to make an autonomous system revealing and destroying targets.
There is simply an international ban on deciding on the destruction of AI. The decision must be made by the person. But they will soon put it on.

The second problem is the implementation of reliable recognition of people according to the principle of their own alien or, alternatively, not yet a combatant.
You can only implement an order like "kill ALL People".

[tikhonov66]

There is simply an international ban on deciding on the destruction of AI. The decision must be made by the person. But they will soon put it on.

- that "put" ALREADY LONG!
Mousetrap, I hope - have you heard?
- it's scary to say, but in this "cyber-system" - the decision "to destroy" - is taken by the AI ​​!!!
- and where do they only look "forbidding international" ?!
8-))

[Alexey from Perm]

and if the enemy commands?

[Sanichsan]

Is voice identification prohibited by the Geneva Convention?

[Alexey from Perm]

in conditions of stress or injury, the timbre can change))) In general, this is hardly a good idea.

[Sanichsan]

Quote: Alexey from Perm

in conditions of stress or injury, the timbre may vary)))

read about face recognition programs. do you think that you cannot reach the same level with your voice? in addition, commands are given over a secure channel you understand that in the army they’re not talking on a mobile phone ..

[Hort]

obscene verbs must first understand

[makasan34]

so soon not people will order robots but vice versa