Military Review

The extinction of the Romanoviches and the division of their heritage

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The extinction of the Romanoviches and the division of their heritage

Signet of Yuri Lvovich


They say that nature rests on children. Yuri Lvovich, the only son and heir of Lev Danilovich, who headed the Galicia-Volyn state after the abdication of his father in 1300, was a clear illustration of this. From an early age, he began to show outstanding talents to fail all the tasks that he was entrusted with, or to arrange problems for his father from scratch. For example, during the Russian-Tatar campaign on Gorodno, thanks to his skillful command, the siege failed, although shortly before this, his father even managed to take Slonim and Novogrudok with little effort. In 1287, under the same conditions, with complete superiority in power, he lost the siege of Lublin. And the following year, when his father was under siege of Telebughi in Lviv, he made a real mess because of the inheritance of his relative, Vladimir Vasilkovich. According to his testament, all of his possessions were transferred to Mstislav Danilovich, uncle Yuri, but the prince decided to challenge this, and even while alive Vladimir captured Berestye, including him in his domain. Yes, he was finally able to take at least some city! True, the father had to apologize strongly for this to the khan, who patronized Mstislav, and return the inheritance to his younger brother, with whom at that time he had far from ideal relations. I think there is no need to explain that at that time Leo, due to the actions of Yuri, was one step away from a large-scale conflict with the Horde with the support of his younger brother. In general, well done son!

And they say that fools are lucky. After the death of Nogai, the defeat of his army and the abdication of Leo Danilovich, Yuri had to wait in Lviv when the horde of Tohta invaded his lands. The khan could demand anything, up to the dismemberment of the Romanovich state, he could throw Yuri himself in prison with his disowned father-monk, he could ruin the territory of the principality so much that it would not be possible to recover later. Given Yuri’s military talents, there was no hope of winning an open battle. And then a miracle happened! Tokhta decided to leave the Romanovichs for later, paying more attention to the Balkan possessions of Nogai, where, among other things, one of his sons ruled. After that, Tokhta had to go to their eastern borders, and fight with other steppes in the next strife between the fragments of the Mongol Empire. As a result, “for later” turned into “never,” the Horde simply forgot about its great western vassal for a while. To the joy of this, Yuri immediately hastened to be crowned as the king of Russia, and, apparently, refused to pay tribute to the Horde. Quite unexpectedly for everyone, the Galicia-Volyn state again became independent.

Board of Yuri I


Of course, positive events occurred during the reign of Yuri I. So, after a long preparation that had begun under Leo, a new Orthodox metropolis was founded in Galich. Its Byzantine name - Little Russia - later will serve as the basis for the Russian name of all the southwestern territories of the empire, i.e. Little Russia. The capital was moved from Lviv to Vladimir-Volynsky. Old cities were actively expanding and new ones were being built, new churches were appearing. Urban development in general has reached significant proportions, which have been repeatedly marked by future generations. The population was growing rapidly due to both natural growth and a significant influx of immigrants from Western Europe - primarily Germans and Flemings. Trade continued to develop, mainly along the Baltic-Black Sea trade route, which will flourish for many centuries. The coin minting began - however, due to the lack of deposits of precious metals in the country, foreign samples had to be imported and smoked. The prestige of the Romanovici rose quite high, and the royal court was quite rich and famous by the standards of Eastern Europe. Since not much is known about the reign of this king, there could well have been other positive aspects that did not appear in the annals. A number of historians, even on the basis of all this inner well-being, declare the successful rule of Yuri I, but to the author of the cycle such an assessment seems doubtful.

At the same time, King Yuri was very weak. The power under him actually belonged to the boyars, who greatly strengthened their influence, and began to redistribute state revenues and places of “feeding” in their favor. In addition, the rule of Yuri was marked by peace - or rather, by its likeness. The king did not pursue an overly active foreign policy, did not start aggressive wars, and generally seems to have forgotten about the war machine that his father and grandfather created for years. Savings began on training and equipping troops, as a result of which the Galician-Volyn army began to lose its strength. First of all, it seems that this affected the infantry, the maintenance of which required constant expenditures and fees - if earlier it was continued to be prepared and actively used if necessary, then from this moment there are no any hints that the Galician-Volyn infantry either showed itself significantly on the battlefield, and by the middle of the XIV century it would finally turn into an average European infantry, suitable only for auxiliary purposes. Following this, fortification fell - the construction of new fortresses almost stopped, the old ones were practically not repaired and slowly deteriorated. About throwing artillery completely forgotten. Only the cavalry, recruited on a feudal basis, somehow retained their fighting qualities, but this, in fact, was the merit of the boyars, and not of Yuri Lvovich himself.

Due to this, or simply because the king turned out to be the usual laying between the throne and the crown, the Russian kingdom began to quickly lose territory. Already in the years 1301-1302, Lublin with its environs was lost. The circumstances of this loss are also very indicative as an illustration of the talents of Yuri Lvovich - if Lev Danilovich skillfully maneuvered between the Poles and the Czechs, and only indirectly supported Vladislav Lokotka, then Yuri intervened in the war to the fullest, directly supporting the Poles and lost the conflict, losing Lublin. In 1307-1310, under unclear circumstances, Hungary regained all of Transcarpathia. The reason for this loss could be the same as Lublin - in the war between the applicants for the Hungarian crown, Yuri Lvovich supported Otto III of Bavaria (a similar loser), who was arrested in 1307 by another applicant for Hungary, Karl Robert Anzhuisky, and was forced renounce your claims. Apparently, after this there was military action against the Galicia-Volyn state, during which Transcarpathia was lost, or Yuri lost it to Karl Robert in exchange for friendly relations. Under unknown circumstances, the northern cities of Slonim and Novogrudok were lost - although everything is so unclear with them that they could have been lost even under Lev Danilovich (many historians adhere to this point of view, but there is extremely little information on this subject to argue with confidence).

There was no sharp reaction of the king to this: as a pacifist or simply complete insignificance, he did not try to fight for his father’s legacy, and allowed to gradually take away what his predecessors had created with such difficulty. Yuri did not even try to return the lost Kiev principality, which, after the departure of Tohta, was in the hands of the small Olgovichs, and could not provide any serious resistance. In Vladimir-Volynsky, under the crown sat a very weak ruler who found himself at the head of a strong state. The problem was aggravated due to the fact that the Galicia-Volyn principality was created as quite centralized, dependent on the figure of its prince. While Roman, Daniil and Leo were in power, this principality flourished, even during periods of fragmentation and war for unification. With mediocrity as a sovereign, the state itself sank sharply and weakened as an independent entity, and Yuri was not just mediocrity - almost all of his foreign policy could be called a colossal failure. In such a situation, it remained only to wait for the barbarians at the gate, so that everything would collapse at once. And these barbarians were already right there ....

The end is a bit predictable.


Relations with Lithuania began to deteriorate gradually from the moment of the murder of Voishelk by Lev Danilovich, although from time to time there was a thaw. This great principality still did not exist a hundred years ago, and in the early years of the XIV century it successfully withstood the onslaught of the Teutonic knights, and even managed to expand due to the Russian principalities, which became "no man's land" after the weakening of the Horde's influence. The question of time was the large-scale invasion of the Lithuanians into the Romanovich state, and it was difficult to predict who would win in such a war. Yuri I made it easier for the Lithuanians to start the conflict by declaring war on them in 1311–1312 according to an alliance agreement with the Teutonic Order. The Lithuanian prince Vitien in response began to prepare for a great campaign to the south, which promised considerable success.

Even before the Lithuanian offensive, disasters fell on Russia. Due to the very cold and long winter of 1314-1315, a crop failure occurred, and famine began in the country, followed by epidemics that wiped out a great many people. The command of the weakened warriors turned out to be disgusting, as a result of which Gedimin, the son of Viteniy (or grandson, depending on the point of view), taking advantage of the opportunity, in 1315 easily and naturally took Dorogochin and Berestye, tearing off the northern territories of the Romanovichi state. Without stopping, he invaded the very heart of Volhynia, and a massive battle took place between the walls of Vladimir-Volynsky between the Galician-Volyn and Lithuanian armies. The royal troops were commanded by Yuri I himself, and the most savvy of the boyars could not help but guess about his outcome ....

As it turned out, 15 years of saving on troops, coupled with famine and epidemics, turned the once large and strong army into one complete joke. The cavalry remained more or less combat-ready, but the mediocre king commanded it personally, therefore he managed to ruin the whole thing. To make it clear how sad everything was under the walls of Vladimir-Volynsky, it’s enough to give one example: the Lithuanian infantry (!) On the offensive (!!) overturned the Russian cavalry (!!!). After this, Roman, Daniel, and Leo spun in coffins at the speed of a jet turbine .... However, King Yuri I did not have time to find out about this: in the same battle he himself died. To the strange, such an inglorious end seemed to be appropriate for such an inglorious king. It is difficult even to determine whether his death was a blessing or a tragedy for the Romanovich state, since Yuri managed to show his inability to rule, and complete mediocrity in the affairs of the military - which, if his reign was preserved, would mean the speedy death of the state under the pressure of the Lithuanians. On the other hand, given the general scarcity of the Romanovichs, the premature death of each of them brought a dynastic crisis closer to which the state was especially sensitive due to the significant centralization by its standards ....

By the way, most sources date Yuri’s death in 1308, but the source of this date is the chronicles of Jan Dlugosh, who, most likely, are very wrong in this case. At least modern experts on the topic believe that Yuri died in 1315, as this is confirmed by various Lithuanian, Russian and Lithuanian-Russian sources during cross-comparison. On the other hand, if he nevertheless died in 1308, then 7 years actually “fall out” of stories kingdom of Russia, which seems extremely unlikely. This situation is quite indicative - if chronicles were still being kept in the Romanovich state itself, and when foreign chronicles were connected, it was possible to compose any integral picture of what was happening then, with the accession of Yuri I, the situation began to change rapidly. Own chronicles were essentially no longer kept, and foreign chronicles were more focused on their own affairs - for which serious reasons appeared.

The beginning of the XIV century turned out to be associated with decline only in the Galicia-Volyn principality, while all the sedentary neighbors - Poland, Hungary and Lithuania - entered an era of rapid growth and boom. In Hungary, the Anjou dynasty gradually ended the chaos of the feudal civil war, due to which the kingdom was almost disintegrated, and prepared the basis for a new, last flourishing of the state. In Poland, Vladislav Lokotok gradually united the state under his leadership, and was preparing to transfer power to his son, Casimir, who was destined to become perhaps the most outstanding ruler of Poland in its history. Well, in Lithuania Gediminas acted with might and main - first as the son (or grandson) of Witten, and then as an independent ruler, the founder of the Gediminovich dynasty and the architect of the future power of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania. Moreover, even under Lev Danilovich, this gain was not visible - the Lithuanians could hardly withstand the onslaught of the crusaders, half of Poland was captured by the Czechs, and Hungary was on the verge of complete disintegration. And here - over several decades, all three states are abruptly moving ahead! Under the circumstances, even a strong ruler of the Galicia-Volyn state would have been difficult. Meanwhile, things took such a turn that the rulers completely ended. The dynastic crisis and the suppression of the dynasty were approaching, which inevitably led to losses, or even the death of the state in the face of suddenly intensified neighbors.

The end of the Romanovichi



Prince Andrey Yuryevich

After the death of Yuri I, power passed into the hands of his sons, Andrei and Leo, who became co-rulers. It seems that they turned out to be much more skilled commanders and organizers, or the Polish allies helped them a lot - already in 1315 they managed to stop the Lithuanian invasion and at the cost of abandoning Berestye and Podlasie (which were lost under Yuri I), for some time stopping the onslaught from the north. In 1316, the princes fought with their uncle, Vladislav Lokotk, with the Magdeburg Margraves. There is little information about their rule, but on the whole it seems that the kingdom of Russia has begun to gradually recover from the crisis where it slipped under Yuri Lvovich. Even the loss of the northern outskirts did not become critical for the survival of the country - Berestye and Podlasie were still not the most populated territories, and therefore not the most valuable for the state militarily and economically. Apparently, Andrei and Leo were able to partially restore the combat effectiveness of the army and deal with the aftermath of the famine and epidemics of the past.

That's just the Horde as it left South-West Russia, and returned. After the crisis of reign under Toht in 1313, Uzbek became the khan of the Golden Horde, one of its most powerful rulers in history. Under him, the state of the steppes began to experience a new heyday, and by itself he remembered the rebellious Romanovichs, who owed him a tribute. This would inevitably lead to war, as Andrei and Leo intended to fight to the end. Alas, the exact information, unfortunately, has not been preserved about what happened in 1323. Some specific information is provided only by Vladislav Lokotok in correspondence with the Pope, indicating that both of his nephews (i.e., Andrei and Lev Yuryevich) died during the battle with the Tatars. There is another version - that both rulers died in the war with the Lithuanians, but this seems unlikely, since the war with Lithuania had already been completed by that time.

Andrei had only one daughter, who would later become the wife of the Lithuanian prince Lubart, but Leo had a son, Vladimir, who received the state in his own hands. He was deprived of any talents, and was simply deposed by the boyars. Perhaps the reason was precisely the lack of talent, or maybe it was done to make room for a more politically beneficial ruler. Be that as it may, Vladimir remained to live in the Galicia-Volyn state, and in 1340 died, protecting Lviv from the army of the Polish king Casimir III. With his death, the Romanovich dynasty on the male side was finally interrupted.

True, there is one problem: the existence of Vladimir is generally weakly provable, and it is possible that such a ruler did not exist in principle. It may well be that he was invented only in order to somehow fill the vacuum of power formed between 1323 and 1325. It is possible that he did not really exist, and after the death of Andrei and Leo, the kingdom and boyar rule established for some time in the country, while negotiations were underway with possible candidates for the royal throne. Then it is these two co-rulers who died in the same year in the war with the Tatars who turn out to be the last representatives of the male Romanovich dynasty. The author of the current cycle adheres to this particular version, since the story about Vladimir Lvovich is poorly justified and looks like a fiction.

The history of the Romanovichs as a result, taking into account the life and rule of Roman Mstislavich, took about 150 years, and spanned only 5 generations (with an unproven sixth). This did not prevent the family from becoming one of the most prominent representatives of the Rurikovich in Russia, and to strengthen South-Western Russia as much as it was possible at all in those conditions of constant upheaval, war and a change in the layout of alliances. And the end of their offspring was nearing the end of their brainchild - a vacuum of power was formed in a fairly centralized state, and this, I recall, in the conditions of the rapid strengthening of all the main settled neighbors. In such circumstances, the problems that swept South-West Russia threatened to bury it in the coming years.

The last years of the Galicia-Volyn state


In 1325, for one reason or another, the princes of Mazovia, Boleslav Troydenovich, who was the nephew of Andrei and Leo, who died two years earlier, were invited to rule in Lviv. To receive the crown, he had to go to Orthodoxy, as a result of which he became known as Yuri II Boleslav. Contrary to the views of Polish historians, there is no information that Yuri recognized himself as a satellite of the Polish king, and information that the childless king of Russia appointed King Casimir III as his heir is at least unreliable. The princes of Mazovia were always distinguished by their willfulness within Poland, they were quite hostile to the Krakow Piasts (i.e., Vladislav Lokotka and Casimir the Great), Mazovia itself remained for a long time its isolation among other Polish principalities, and therefore it is not surprising that Yuri II began to conduct independent public policy. Claims for his prowess are mainly based on subsequent events after his death and affiliation with the Piast dynasty. In the end, Casimir III later needed to somehow substantiate his claims to Galicia-Volhynia, and all the means were good - especially considering how cynical and quirky this great Polish monarch was.

The beginning of the reign of Yuri II was generally successful. Recognizing the supremacy of the Horde, he got rid of the threat of raids from the steppe, and even received military support, not out of place in his position. Having married Gedimin’s daughter, Yuri established good relations with the Lithuanians, and all his life he kept an alliance with them. As a rule, he had peaceful relations with other neighbors, which did not prevent him from invading Hungary in 1332 with the aim of either upsetting the Polish-Hungarian alliance or returning the lands of Transcarpathia lost under Yuri I. In addition, he and the Tatars carried out an invasion of Poland in 1337, as its king, Casimir III, too openly began to claim the Galicia-Volyn state. However, this venture turned out to be a failure - the Poles defeated the allied army, Casimir was not going to give up claims - painfully tempting prey was his weakened eastern neighbor.

Alas, over time, various kinds of contradictions began to accumulate. There are two likely pictures of what is happening that will have one or another justification, but at the same time they will retain certain weaknesses and a share of unreliability. According to the first version, Yuri began a conflict with the boyars over power, and instead of the Orthodox elite, the king relied on the Catholic - good, in the cities there were already quite a lot of foreign migrants. The administration of the kingdom became completely Catholic, the persecution of the Orthodox began, the forced planting of the Roman rite. The second version is much simpler - part of the nobility was corny bought by Hungarians and Poles, who had already prepared in absentia for the division of the Galicia-Volyn principality, and sought to accelerate the fall of its ruler. Given, again, the peculiarities of the character and current policies of the Polish king, this option looks almost the most plausible. It should be understood that Casimir’s claims to Galicia-Volyn were so obvious, and the Russian boyars traditionally loved the Poles only at a distance, resisting the assertion of Polish dominion over themselves that the likelihood of any widespread opposition to Yuri Boleslav was low enough. Any actions against Yuri Boleslav were in the hands of the Polish king, and the boyars could not understand this, because of which the whole story becomes even more vague and ambiguous.

Be that as it may, in 1340, Yuri II Boleslav was poisoned, and his wife was drowned in an ice hole during the ensuing riots. The riots themselves in a number of sources are described as religious, anti-Catholic, but the murder of the Orthodox Lithuanian does not fit into this canvas, and the sudden inter-confessional crisis does not have sufficient justification - such a pronounced conflict between Catholics and Orthodox is not confirmed by sources either after the specified events. A new vacuum of power was formed, and Dmitry Detko, an influential boyar of the Galician land, who had considerable political weight during the life of Yuri II and, apparently, was part of his government, became the new prince. In fact, he led the boyar-oligarchic party, which began to play an important role in the life of the state since the reign of Yuri I Lvovich, and acted as the main force interested in maintaining the state. However, Dmitry Detok no longer had a chance to keep him - from the west, Polish regiments invaded Russia.

The war for the Galician-Volyn inheritance



Dmitry Detko. The last ruler of the Principality of Galicia, already vassal first to Poland and then to Lithuania

The murder of Yuri Boleslav took advantage of Casimir III, who planned to expand his possessions at the expense of the Galicia-Volyn state. His troops invaded the principality and quickly captured the main cities. The key to success was decisive action and the large number of the Polish army - so large that it would take a lot of time to collect it. Given that Kazimir made the campaign almost immediately after the news of the death of Yuri Boleslav, the participation of the Polish monarch in the murder of the last Galician-Volyn prince seems even more likely. Against Casimir, who was in alliance with the Hungarians, the Lithuanians and Tatars came out, who in every possible way interfered with the assertion of Polish power over South-Western Russia. The Tatars justified their interference with the vassal status of Galicia-Volhynia, and the Lithuanians had very specific claims on the Romanovich’s legacy - Prince Lyubart was married to the last representative of this dynasty, the daughter of Andrei Yuryevich, and he, and especially his children, were now the most legitimate heirs of the Romanovich state. The Poles’ claims to Galicia and Volhynia were illusory, but Casimir III made every effort to inflate from them a complete justification of his actions, which led to the emergence of a number of myths about the will of Yuri Boleslav, which exist today.

In 1340, the Polish king invaded the Galicia-Volyn state, taking advantage of the situation, and quickly occupied all its main cities, which were not ready for Polish aggression, and could not organize effective resistance. The boyars also did not have time to gather their army, and therefore their defeat in this lightning war was inevitable. Dmitry Children Kazimir forced to recognize himself a vassal of Poland. At the same time, the Poles behaved like conquerors, and arranged a large-scale export to Krakow of all the valuable that could be found in the Principality of Galicia, including Christian shrines. The loot included a cross and an icon that Anna Angelina, the wife of Roman Mstislavich, brought to Russia. Nevertheless, the Galician boyars did not put up with submission, and already in 1341 they made a trip to Poland with the support of Lithuanians and Tatars, trying to overthrow the Polish rule. The child actually recognized himself as a vassal of the Lithuanian prince Lubart, who, after 1340, bore the title of Grand Duke of Galicia-Volyn. Formally, the unity of South-Western Russia was restored, although the Principality of Galicia now existed a little apart, while Volyn Lyubart ruled directly. Dmitry Detko died around 1349, after which a new round of Polish-Lithuanian confrontation started. Thus began the war for the Galicia-Volyn inheritance, full of chaos, intrigue and the change of alliances in an effort to share the inheritance of the already dying Romanovichs.

Together with the Child and the Lithuanians, a significant part of the Orthodox boyars fought, who did not want to see a sufficiently authoritarian and ambitious Pole above themselves. For this, Casimir did not spare them and the Russian cities - for example, Przemysl, one of the strongholds of the opposition, was destroyed by Polish troops, and the local boyars (to whom Detko belonged) were either betrayed by the sword or expelled. The city restored later had almost nothing in common with the old, Russian-Orthodox Przemysl. This or similar was repeated wherever the Poles met resistance. During the subsequent events, many boyars swore allegiance to Lithuania, and many will go into exile, looking for good luck and a new home in the east, in North-Eastern Russia. South-Western Russia will quickly become a harsh, unfriendly home for those boyars who tried to maintain the old order and resisted the assertion of Polish rule. Over time, the list of reasons for their dissatisfaction was supplemented by a series of strife that began in Lithuania, which only interfered with the fulfillment of the main tasks, among which was the restoration of the Galicia-Volyn state, even if it was part of the Gediminids' state. Among such emigrants will be Bobrok Volynsky, who left his native lands in the 1360s and played an important role in the Battle of Kulikovo.

Russian Orthodox boyars suffered heavy losses, and at a rapid pace began to lose its influence and significance in society. After several centuries, it will completely disappear, succumbing to polonization or emigrating to Lithuania or Moscow. It was such a tough, forceful policy that allowed the Poles to consolidate this region and to significantly separate it from the rest of Russia. This will have the greatest effect on the territory of the former Galician principality, somewhat less on Volhynia, but the fact remains: it was the Poles who dealt a mortal blow to the Russian boyars of South-Western Russia, forcing him to flee, die or merge with the Polish gentry. It was the Polish king, Casimir III, who became the chief architect of the death of the state itself, extremely skillfully and efficiently taking advantage of the situation that prevailed for him with the suppression of the Romanovichs and the approval of Piast as head of the Galicia-Volyn principality.

The war for the Galicia-Volyn inheritance was either gaining momentum or subsiding for 52 years, until 1392. Its final result was the partition of the Romanovic state between Poland, which went to Galicia, and Lithuania, which occupied Volyn. Hungary, which for some time claimed the whole region, was forced back into the Carpathians, although during the existence of the Polish-Hungarian Union under Lajos I the Great, it was still able to take possession of Galicia for a short while. As a single state, the Galician-Volyn principality ceased to exist, having briefly survived the dynasty of its creators. In the future, these lands experienced many more vicissitudes of fate, change of borders, invasions of the enemy armies and uprisings, and the people of the region had to significantly change their appearance both culturally and religiously, undergoing large-scale colonization and polonization, on which the Poles had already managed to fill hands in their own state. However, this is a completely different story, and the story of South-Western Russia, the Galicia-Volyn state and Romanovichi ends here.

End of cycle
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  1. Korsar4
    Korsar4 2 July 2020 05: 46 New
    +3
    What only for a century and a half did not happen. Border principalities have special fates.

    And I am more and more inclined to the idea that the city is a more stable entity than the state.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 2 July 2020 06: 53 New
      +4
      Quote: Korsar4
      What only for a century and a half did not happen. Border principalities have special fates.

      And I am more and more inclined to the idea that the city is a more stable entity than the state.

      Hello, Sergey!
      The most sustainable education is the rural community, which runs a subsistence economy! With the cataclysms of our time, the policy will not be able to feed itself.
      In the case of South-West Russia, the banal crisis of power - “Ships rarely land aground if the helm is not”!
      According to the proverb mentioned by Artem, "Nature rests on children"! Similar trends can be traced in the Moscow Princely House and the Romanov Dynasty!
      In the latter case, one can only wonder how much safety the Russian Empire had in the era of palace coups! As it turned out, little was needed during the reign of Nicholas II!
      Unexpectedly for myself, I come to the conclusion that large states have a much serious margin of safety. For example, Rome! Five centuries in the role of hegemon! Any small country would have been bent over the 10th anniversary of a number of rulers who had put on purple toga. This also applies to the late Republic of Rome! As an alternative story, it is possible if Rome were not divided into eastern and western! The agony of the Empire could last another century with a ponytail!
      Regards, Vlad!
      1. Korsar4
        Korsar4 2 July 2020 07: 38 New
        +4
        A city without the countryside attached to it is not quite a city.
        A large formation can fall into smaller ones.
        There is already a question of stability of borders, internal integrity.
        And, this system is open, the perception of the human stream.

        Although a ton of various examples can be found in history for all versions.
        How stable are melting boilers?
      2. Molot1979
        Molot1979 2 July 2020 08: 32 New
        +1
        Well. the Russian Empire no longer had such enemies as the Galicia-Volyn land. There was no one to use the fruits of the era of coups. But in the Moscow kingdom, a similar dynastic crisis caused confusion, which almost put an end to its history. At the same time, the same Troubles, in its character and even in facts, did not differ much from the time of troubles in Galich. It was also preceded by several years of severe hunger, riots, uprisings, boyar opposition, suppression of the dynasty and foreign intervention. However, where Southwest Russia fell, Northeast Russia survived.
      3. Kronos
        Kronos 2 July 2020 18: 55 New
        -1
        The Russian Empire, like any empire, was held by force of arms, the center weakened, and many with joy left it like Poland or Finland
  2. Kote Pan Kokhanka
    Kote Pan Kokhanka 2 July 2020 06: 03 New
    +4
    Artyom thanks!
    We will wait when you find the time for the next creative research on the pages of VO!
    Regards, Vlad!
  3. Olgovich
    Olgovich 2 July 2020 06: 59 New
    -3
    They say that nature rests on children

    Interesting note: i.e. after Adam and Eve, humanity is becoming ... dumber?

    Or, in relation to this story, Daniel is dumber than Roman, Leo is dumber than Daniel, Yuri is dumber than Leo, and Roman is also a son ....
    Even before the Lithuanian offensive, disasters fell on Russia.

    The trouble began when Daniel took the royal title from the Vatican, for which he vehemently honored modern Bandera.

    a successful state, which, allegedly, was this so-called the "kingdom" and about the extraordinary achievements of which the author spoke, does not disappear so catastrophically and in such a short period ...
    1. Free wind
      Free wind 2 July 2020 07: 17 New
      +3
      On the children of geniuses, nature rests. There is such a statement.
  4. Jünger
    Jünger 2 July 2020 09: 46 New
    +4
    One gets the impression that the GVK by that time already ceases to be a Russian state entity in full. Hence the possibility of coming to power of princes not of the Rurik family, tolerance for Catholicism.
    Mass migrations of a foreign population, constant friendly graters with Poles, Hungarians, Germans, etc. blurred the former identity.
    The sad ending is logical. And so it will be with everyone.
    Even if the descendants of Daniel and Leo were geniuses without exception, then with such a vector of development, the GVK would end up with what it ended up with.
    1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
      Kote Pan Kokhanka 2 July 2020 13: 31 New
      -1
      Quote: Junger
      One gets the impression that the GVK by that time already ceases to be a Russian state entity in full.

      Dear Junger, when discussing with you, you can catch a bunch of minuses from Internet hamsters, but I will risk my health.
      If you look objectively, then similar processes in the period under review can be traced on all the outskirts of the Russian principalities. And the hedgehog does not know what is worse than “Europeanization” of South-Western Russia, “Lithuanization” of North-West or “Tatarization” of the rest !!!
      Hence the possibility of coming to power of princes not of the Rurik family, tolerance for Catholicism.

      Here you go a little too far! Before the reign of Uzbek khan in Sarai, GVK plays the role of an equal partner of the Eastern European hegemons (Hungary, Lithuania, Poland). Recognizing themselves as Kings, having achieved their metropolis, the catholic wife and pagan religion married Russian princes and adopted Orthodoxy. “Boleslavovich” acts in a similar way, accepting Orthodoxy at the beginning of his reign! In your thesis about Rurikovich, I will say only one thing - Pskov Prince Davmont.
      Mass migrations of a foreign population, constant friendly graters with Poles, Hungarians, Germans, etc. blurred the former identity.

      I do not think that the Tatars would give an opportunity to fool the princes of the GVK on the territory of Chernihiv, Novgorod-Seversky and Kiev reigns! But as vassals in Hungary, Poland and Lithuania! We ask for favors, we will also help. Hence the logical western vector of the policy of the South Russian princes! Even in the brief period of “independence”, Yuri Lvovich tried to not tarnish. God forbid Khan will remember the lost tributary !!!
      The sad ending is logical. And so it will be with everyone.
      Even if the descendants of Daniel and Leo were geniuses without exception, then with such a vector of development, the GVK would end up with what it ended up with.

      With this thesis, I agree, there was no time for collecting Russian lands. Now, if the crisis of power had passed a little! Perhaps there was no Lithuanian triumph! And the Moscow principality of requisitions Tver met with a powerful and centralized GVK !!!
      1. Jünger
        Jünger 2 July 2020 14: 07 New
        +6
        Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
        then similar processes during the period under consideration can be traced on all the outskirts of the Russian principalities.

        But only Daniel managed to take the patronage of the pope from princes of such a level. An original move that speaks of either genius or stupidity. Time has shown that it’s definitely not about genius. smile He put a mine on the remaining time and began to merge with Western European partners. And such fusions lead to amputation of the head.
        Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
        Before the reign of Uzbek khan in Sarai, GVK plays the role of an equal partner of the Eastern European hegemons (Hungary, Lithuania, Poland).

        That's it, that "before." The addict also for the time being looks healthy and beautiful. But it all naturally ends.
        Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
        In your thesis about Rurikovich, I will say only one thing - Pskov Prince Davmont.

        I agree. Pskov also made a feint with ears and a successful feint. But Pskov is still a republic with special concepts. In GVK, however, everything is more neglected, even if the boyars made their way to the princes. And with it more than once. This suggests that something there was damaged by the comrades, since time and time again they discarded all-Russian customs.
        GVK was surrounded by young growing predators whose resources exceeded the resources of the principality many times over. There was no chance to get out and keep the identity. Would gobble up in any case.
        1. Kote Pan Kokhanka
          Kote Pan Kokhanka 2 July 2020 14: 22 New
          +1
          Danil "gave slack" and then as I think because of an external threat. By the way, he is not the first and last to call Poles or Hungarians for help! The very first one was Svyatopolk the Cursed! Similarly, other Russian princes, with such a "reticence", were breaking into the headquarters of the khans of a large and later golden horde! If the last was not Vasily the Dark, who lived in the 15th century!
          The death of GVK is inextricably linked with the involvement of North-West Russia in Lithuania! The Polotsk, Kiev, Staro-Dubsk and Smolensk principalities were steadily involved in this whirlpool! GVK had good starting conditions to lead this process, but it did not grow together!
          1. Trilobite Master
            Trilobite Master 2 July 2020 16: 39 New
            +6
            Allow, colleagues, to insert a few words. smile hi
            Quote: Junger
            One gets the impression that the GVK by that time already ceases to be a Russian state entity in full.

            Quote: Kote Pan Kokhanka
            If you look objectively, then similar processes in the period under review can be traced on all the outskirts of the Russian principalities.

            For me, both of you are somewhat correct.
            If we are talking about the beginning of the fourteenth century, then this period for Russia can be considered completely critical when its very continued existence was called into question. Will any of you be able to calculate the number of principalities in Russia during this period? I tried and lost on the third ten. no In north-eastern Russia alone, there are at least fifteen of them and at least half of them (!) Were practically sovereign.
            The western outskirts of Russia, throughout their entire length, are exposed to all kinds of influences from their neighbors, from the Hungarians in the south to the Swedes in the north. Piece by piece disappears from Russia, even before Gedemin, Polotsk fell under Lithuanian rule, Smolensk was even captured for a while, the Germans captured Yuryev and almost the entire Baltic states, for some time they even sat in Pskov, built a fortress in Koporye, the Swedes - western Karelia, from Gulf of Bothnia to the Karelian Isthmus.
            Dovmont was not Rurik, but he was not the only one from Lithuania who sat on Russian lands. In Novgorod at this time, Rurikovich, starting with the children of Nevsky, we can assume that there weren’t - the Novgorodians themselves resolved absolutely all issues of both foreign and domestic politics, paying off the princes of Vladimir with a monetary reward, which you still have to receive. Pskov during the XIII - XIV centuries. all the time he tried to break away from Novgorod and make friends with the Germans against Lithuania, and Novgorod himself, on the contrary, gravitated towards the ON, trying to balance between him and Vladimir (later Moscow).
            Against this background, the GVK does not look at all completely unique. And it was hardly less “Russian” than Novgorod, Pskov or Smolensk, which were under the rule of the Rurikovich, Vitebsk or Polotsk, which was controlled by the Grand Duchy of Lithuania.
            Was it more integrated into Europe than Pskov, which since the beginning of the XIII century. I was idolizing with the Germans as best we could - remember the princes Vladimir Mstislavich and his son Yaroslav, their family ties with the Buksgevdens, Tverdilo Ivankovich, who surrendered Pskov to the Germans in 1240? And from the middle of the same century, under Dovmont, Pskov kissed the gums with Lithuania.
            I ask myself the question - why did GVK still not resist? The confluence of circumstances referred to by Artem does not convince me, even in a complex. After all, the rest of the Russian neighbors of the GVK had to deal with the same opponents, except that instead of the Poles, you can put the Germans, Danes and Swedes, but the question is who is more dangerous, in any case, in the lands that the Germans took away from Russia with the Swedes with the Russian spirit and not it smells. Many states faced much more serious problems, even lost their independence, were under the rule of the invaders for hundreds of years, but then they returned it anyway, preserving their identity - there are many examples. Little Pskov resisted the Teutonic Order and the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, Smolensk fell under the rule of Lithuania only under Vytautas after two hundred years of resistance, and the GVK ended so quickly and this despite the fact that its starting position after Daniil Galitsky was much stronger.
            What is the reason for such a rapid decline? I see two factors that significantly distinguish GVK from other Russian lands.
            The first is its isolation from the rest of Russia. Smolensk and Novgorod helped to resist all of Russia. Neither one nor the other land interrupted communication with Vladimir or Moscow. And when Vasily Dmitrievich decided to de facto cede Smolensk to Vitovt, instead of him ON (alone!) Oleg Ivanovich Ryazansky spoke and for some time (while Oleg was still alive) Smolensk still remained independent. Why the GVK did not receive help from the rest of the Russian princes is a question for the foreign policy of its leaders. And the main direction of this policy was set by Daniil Romanovich.
            The second factor is religious. Russian lands were united not only by one dynasty, but also by one metropolis. A separate metropolis for the GVK played a cruel joke with him. The clergyman of Constantinople had low social responsibility, showing no fundamental principles in matters of upholding his faith, appointing to the post of the Western Russian metropolitans not ascetics, but politicians, compromisers, who were ready to bargain and cede - to please the secular masters, of course. And those who are accustomed to selling faith are always ready to sell it again for the sake of momentary political gain. There was no solid ideological component, there was no "commissar", "political leader" who would rise first and proclaim - "For Holy Russia, for Orthodox Faith, for the prince ..." well, there may be options Yes, even Dmtiria (Lyubart) Gedeminovich. And when this cry would be heard from all the pulpits and porches in all villages and towns, things could have gone completely different.
            1. arturpraetor
              2 July 2020 16: 59 New
              +4
              Quote: Trilobite Master
              After all, the rest of the Russian neighbors of the GVK had to deal with the same opponents, except that instead of the Poles, you can put the Germans, Danes and Swedes, but the question is who is more dangerous, in any case, in the lands that the Germans took away from Russia with the Swedes with the Russian spirit and not it smells.

              With all the significance of the Swedes and Danes, they did not even close together reach at least the level of Hungary. And with Poland, Casimir the Great (who was the main author of the GVK cut) had to conduct business in the first and last stage of the GVK. After this, the Russian principalities faced the Poles much later, and then at the head of Poland there were no longer such cynical, capable and ambitious rulers.
              Quote: Trilobite Master
              Why the GVK did not receive help from the rest of the Russian princes is a question for the foreign policy of its leaders.

              And who do you think could help GVK during the indicated period withstand the onslaught of Lithuania, Poland and Hungary? No seriously smile Even Tatar help as a result did not help against the claims of Poland, which took the Principality of Galicia. What would help the weakened and fragmented Russian principalities?
              Quote: Trilobite Master
              The second factor is religious.

              Dear colleague, you have painted the terrible religious layouts for the umpteenth time, but do not provide any evidence for this. So sorry, but not convincing. Please, specific information that what you described here and earlier had a place to be in GVK. It is desirable, with a detailed comparison, that the highest church hierarchs in the Moscow metropolis were all saints, and in the Galician metropolis sinners, criminals and merchants of faith smile For now, I see only a bare IMHO, based on the most general theories.
              1. Jünger
                Jünger 2 July 2020 17: 24 New
                +3
                To summarize thesis, then, in my humble opinion, the reasons for the fall of GVK are obvious and are as follows:
                1. For all its successes, it is small and weak compared to its European neighbors.
                2. Ideologically loose. There was no rod at all smile
                3. Possessed a diverse population and, as a consequence, the lack of internal cohesion.
                4. Separated from the rest of Russia. No one would have harnessed for the GVK in any situation.
                5. Stupid policy towards the Mongols. They would hold on to the Golden Horde, like a dad, then maybe they would stretch out longer. But not by much, of course.
                Leo Danilych had to crawl on his knees to Tokhta, it would be better for everyone - even if the khan had decided it, he might have forgiven his sons.
                1. arturpraetor
                  2 July 2020 17: 34 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Junger
                  For all its successes, it is small and weak compared to its European neighbors.

                  Not so small and weak so that at all. In terms of potential - no less than Sweden or Denmark. The Moscow state also had a smaller population at one time than Lithuania or the Commonwealth, but here you are, it has survived.
                  Quote: Junger
                  Ideologically loose. There was no rod at all

                  "Where are the proofs, Billy? We need proofs!" Not to mention the fact that ideology and the fourteenth century are not very connected concepts.
                  Quote: Junger
                  It had a diverse population and, as a result, the lack of internal cohesion.

                  This is where it was directly the same diverse? And most importantly, why didn’t this prevent the Commonwealth, the Moscow state, the state of the Habsburgs and other truly multinational states? smile
                  Quote: Junger
                  Separated from the rest of Russia. No one would have harnessed for the GVK in any situation.

                  Nobody harnessed to the Moscow state later, either, half of Russia was part of hostile states, but here you go ...
                  Quote: Junger
                  Stupid policy towards the Mongols. Would hold on to the Gold Horde, as for the dad, then maybe they would have held out longer.

                  Maybe yes maybe no. On the one hand, together with the steppes, Lev Danilovich managed well with the rest of the players in the region, on the other hand, the Golden Horde was already beginning to slowly fever - now and there, then syudy ... And already in the 1340s, Lithuanians helped more than the Tatars. So it is possible, though not reliably for sure.
                  1. Jünger
                    Jünger 2 July 2020 17: 55 New
                    +3
                    Quote: arturpraetor
                    The Moscow state also had a smaller population at one time than Lithuania or the Commonwealth, but here you are, it has survived.

                    The Principality of Moscow is a relative periphery. Predators ate those who are closer. Lucky Moscow, including due to the GVK lucky.
                    Quote: arturpraetor
                    "Where are the proofs, Billy? We need proofs!" Not to mention the fact that ideology and the fourteenth century are not very connected concepts.

                    I have nothing to say here, since it is obvious to me that in Europe from Constantine the Great to the Reformation and even further there is one continuous religious ideology.
                    Quote: arturpraetor
                    This is where it was directly the same diverse?

                    You yourself wrote about the Flemings, Germans, and other Moldovans, with whom the Romanovichs actively populated territories. Yes, and Romanovichs themselves were damned blood who knows.
                    Quote: arturpraetor
                    And most importantly, why didn’t this prevent the Commonwealth, the Moscow state, the state of the Habsburgs and other truly multinational states?

                    It prevented and very much. The Commonwealth is not a multinational state at all. I do not consider Poles, Ruthenians and Lithuanians to be fundamentally different. Religious disagreements certainly interfered and greatly contributed to the mess and the collapse of the 17th century.
                    Moscow State - nationally and religiously monolithic.
                    The state of the Habsburgs was shaking like a sticky whole period of its existence.
                    Quote: arturpraetor
                    Nobody harnessed to the Moscow state later, either, half of Russia was part of hostile states, but here you go ...

                    Periphery, sensible princes, maintaining good relations with the Tatars, the influx of Slavic population from troubled principalities. Religious cohesion. As a result, bingo, the stars came together as it should.
                    1. arturpraetor
                      2 July 2020 18: 07 New
                      +3
                      Quote: Junger
                      The Principality of Moscow is a relative periphery. Predators ate those who are closer. Lucky Moscow.

                      Googled approximate estimates of the population (in fact, the main measure of state power at that time) - Poland about 2 million people in 1370 (that is, taking into account the GVK already partially conquered), Hungary 2 million in 1200. The population of Lithuania was clearly noticeably smaller. The population of the GVK is about 1,5 million in the middle of the XNUMXth century. Of course, this is less than in Poland and Hungary, but still the potential of the states was not so radically different. Another thing is that it was no longer possible to realize the potential of GVK by the middle of the XIV century, and the neighbors had a qualitative growth.
                      Quote: Junger
                      I have nothing to say here, since it is obvious to me that in Europe from Constantine the Great to the Reformation and even further there is one continuous religious ideology.

                      But to reduce everything to one religion is not very true. Already described in comments to previous articles, what were the relations between Catholics and Orthodox on the borderlands - quite tolerant. This applied to Hungary, Poland, Lithuania, and GVK to the same extent.
                      Quote: Junger
                      Well, you yourself wrote about the Flemings, Germans and other Moldovans, with whom the Romanovic populated the territories.

                      And what proportion of the population did they make up, can you say? And the fact that different prisoners of war Polovtsy and others were used regularly for settlement in Russia and before that, did not know? Inosemtsev in the settlement in the GVK was in the worst case about 1/10 of the total population. This does not allow us to state that the country's population was directly diverse. Diverse - this is when many different ethnic groups of approximately the same number. If the titular population prevails by a significant margin - no.
                      Quote: Junger
                      Yes, and Romanovichs themselves were damned blood who knows.

                      And how is this to be understood? Do Catholics have some kind of bad blood? You can get married with Polovtsy, you can’t marry Magyars? :)
                      Quote: Junger
                      The Commonwealth is not a multinational state at all.

                      Do you even understand what you're talking about? GVK - multinational, the Commonwealth in which the GVK was - not multinational? request Do you know the history of the Commonwealth? About the pressure of migrants from Europe, including the same Flemings. Germans and others? And about the Tatars who settled in Lithuania?
                      Quote: Junger
                      Moscow State - nationally and religiously monolithic.

                      Especially after the start of the absorption of various Tatars, Finno-Ugric peoples and others :)
                      1. Jünger
                        Jünger 2 July 2020 18: 16 New
                        +1
                        Quote: arturpraetor
                        Inosemtsev in the settlement in the GVK was in the worst case about 1/10 of the total population

                        I did not know, thanks for enlightening. Then we throw out this item.
                        Quote: arturpraetor
                        And how is this to be understood? Do Catholics have some kind of bad blood? You can get married with Polovtsy, you can’t marry Magyars? :)

                        I think that with those and others - haram laughing I agree.
                        Quote: arturpraetor
                        The Commonwealth speech, which included the GVK - is not multinational? Do you know the history of the Commonwealth? About the pressure of migrants from Europe, including the same Flemings. Germans and others? And about the Tatars who settled in Lithuania?

                        The point is in percentage. If there is a donkey of a dozen other thousand Tatars, then this does not make the state multinational. Multinational - this is the Czech Republic with the dominance of the Germans. Or Austria-Hungary with 40 percent of the German state-forming people, against 60 percent do not understand anyone.
                        In Poland, as far as I know, the percentage of Poles (Litvin, Rusyns) was overwhelming. But with religion there was a kaleidoscope.
                        Quote: arturpraetor
                        Especially after the start of the absorption of various Tatars, Finno-Ugric peoples and others :)

                        Again, the point is in percentage, forcible Russification, baptism and restriction of rights.
                        Today they are Tatars, tomorrow they are baptized, and the day after tomorrow they are dancing in sundresses. There were Tatars, but Russians became. It is clear that not all.
                      2. arturpraetor
                        2 July 2020 18: 27 New
                        +2
                        Quote: Junger
                        In Poland, as far as I know, the percentage of Poles was overwhelming. But with religion there was a kaleidoscope.

                        In Poland ... Let's just say that there were some statistics. Not everyone who was considered a Pole was in fact a fact. In the once completely Polish Silesia, for example, in just a few centuries of German migration, the proportion of Poles in some places fell to 1/3 by the middle of the XIV century, although mostly Poles still prevailed - but not by much. In other parts of Poland, it was simpler, but in general there was a tremendous pressure of migrants from the 2th century, which gradually spread to both the GVK and Lithuania, but the bulk of those who came there remained closer - i.e. in Poland. Therefore, the Poles have many German surnames and words of German origin in everyday life. At the same time, in many regions of Poland the comers quickly assimilated and turned into Poles (as in the GVK after 3-XNUMX generations, the Polovtsy, Transcarpathian Magyars and others no longer associated themselves with their ancestors). So there "is not so simple."
                        Quote: Junger
                        Today they are Tatars, tomorrow they are baptized, and the day after tomorrow they are dancing in sundresses.

                        So it in all cases works. Of the European migrants in Eastern Europe nat. identity was mainly maintained by the townspeople, while the rural population quickly mixed with the indigenous people, and after 50-100 years of their former connection with other peoples, at best, only the names of the settlements remained. Somewhere near Voitovich I saw a detailed analysis of such cities on the territory of the GVK, which, apparently, were populated by a motley recruitment of migrants and prisoners of war of various nationalities, but by the time of the accession of the Galician principality to Poland, there was no separate nation. the identity of these settlements was out of the question.
            2. Trilobite Master
              Trilobite Master 2 July 2020 22: 29 New
              +4
              Quote: arturpraetor
              With all the significance of the Swedes and Danes, they did not even close together reach at least the level of Hungary.

              Compare a whale with an elephant? Each was effective in its place. Denmark and Sweden in the north of Europe were very serious players.
              Quote: arturpraetor
              And with Poland, Casimir the Great (who was the main author of the GVK cut) had to conduct business in the first and last stage of the GVK.

              Oh oh By the time Casimir was engaged in Galician affairs from the GVK, there was only a shadow of past greatness and he dealt more with Lithuania than with the GVK.
              Quote: arturpraetor
              And who do you think could help GVK during the indicated period withstand the onslaught of Lithuania, Poland and Hungary?

              Well, they somehow coped before ... But Lithuania and Poland, but Poland did not fight Hungary? Only with GVK? And Smolensk with Lithuania? And Lithuania with the Order? With Novgorod? And the Order with Novgorod? Artem, everyone fought with everyone. and Lithuania, perhaps the most. And together they attacked only the weak - to finish off the half-dead. GVK actually died by the time the war for his inheritance began.
              Quote: arturpraetor
              What would help the weakened and fragmented Russian principalities?

              Against the Germans, Novgorod was helped, both weakened and fragmented. They helped against the Swedes. Smolensk was helped against Lithuania. But GVK - no. As there were none.
              Quote: arturpraetor
              Dear colleague, you have painted the terrible religious layouts for the umpteenth time, but do not provide any evidence for this.

              Artem, I’m painting not horrors, but the real situation. You yourself speak of indifference, "tolerance" in religious terms in the GVK - this is the absence of religious bonds. Look at the Galicia Metropolis - it existed exactly as long as it took to destroy the GVK. Metropolitan Peter, appointed by Leo Danilovich, escaped from Leo to Moscow, as Cyril had earlier from Daniel to Vladimir.
              Theognostus tried to somehow lead the religious activities in the GVK, but was sent away.
              Quote: arturpraetor
              It is desirable, with a detailed comparison, that the highest church hierarchs in the Moscow metropolis were all saints, and in the Galicia metropolis sinners, criminals and merchants of faith

              But this I did not say, do not distort.
              And in general, it seems to me that you are completely in vain so painfully and sharply react to my comments. I don’t really like to support the discussion in such a tone, especially with people who are nice to me, but if you insist, I can use the irony of all the other tricks that are more likely to be used for “acute polemics without rules”, however, I didn’t want to would be.
              1. arturpraetor
                2 July 2020 22: 51 New
                +2
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Compare a whale with an elephant?

                Of course, you yourself suggested it smile
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Oh?

                Of the Russian principalities - no doubt.
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Well, they used to somehow manage ...

                When Hungary was weakened by feudal strife, Poland was divided into specific principalities and partially subordinated to the Czechs, and the Lithuanians were noticeably weaker and bogged down in the war with the crusaders. To understand the situation at the beginning of the XNUMXth century, one must at least in general outline know the history of the states neighboring the GVK. And there, as in the pattern, there is a lightning-fast amplification of all three main neighbors. Therefore, even Hungary, Poland and Lithuania of the mid-end of the XIII century cannot be compared with the same countries of the beginning of the XIV century, these are absolutely different values ​​in terms of capabilities and strength.
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Artem, I’m painting not horrors, but the real situation.

                Real, according to your ideas, which you confirm do not rush smile With all due respect, colleague, but now you are doing the same thing for which you scolded me earlier - on the basis of some ideas and general theories, you are trying to build specificity and approve it as it was.
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                Look at the Galicia Metropolis - it existed exactly as long as it took to destroy the GVK.

                Following this logic, did the Kiev metropolis destroy Lithuania? wassat
                Quote: Trilobite Master
                And in general, it seems to me that you are completely in vain so painfully and sharply react to my comments.

                Dear colleague, I’m just used to the fact that you use sufficiently extensive material to confirm your theses, and give concrete evidence, and if there are none, you don’t rely on your point of view as the most correct. But with the reasons for the death of the GVK, you constantly focus on the religious question, while not providing any specifics in evidence, but building one long theory after another - the people do not like the Queen Catholic, then tolerance means the absence of bonds and the death of the state, then something else something like that. I still wildly apologize, but the whole borderland was in terms of religion in plus or minus the same conditions, Poland was tolerant in that era, Orthodox (initially) Lithuania also actively used Catholic settlers and did not persecute it - it also bent because of the lack of bonds ? request Or maybe all the same it is not necessary to exaggerate the religious question to such an extent? In this case, I see a completely different approach from the usual one from you, and not for the better, and this causes surprise and a rather sharp reaction. And for the last I sincerely apologize - I just do not want to swear with you. Therefore, I propose simply to disperse on this topic, each remaining with their own opinion.
          2. Engineer
            Engineer 2 July 2020 17: 12 New
            +2
            After all, the rest of the Russian neighbors of the GVK had to deal with the same opponents, except that instead of the Poles, you can put the Germans, Danes and Swedes, but the question is who is more dangerous, in any case, in the lands that the Germans took away from Russia with the Swedes with the Russian spirit and not it smells. Many states faced much more serious problems, even lost their independence, were under the rule of the invaders for hundreds of years, but then they returned it anyway, preserving their identity - there are many examples. Little Pskov resisted the Teutonic Order and the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, Smolensk fell under the rule of Lithuania only under Vitovt after two hundred years of resistance,

            Everything is simple in my opinion
            The Germans threatened primarily the Lithuanians. Lithuanians fought with the Germans and crushed the south and southeast of Russia. Swedes are generally not serious. From the Poles GVK was just a buffer.
            Vladimir-Suzdal Russia, Tver and Novgorod were in a fundamentally better position
            There was no solid ideological component, there was no "commissar", "political leader" who would rise first and proclaim - "For Holy Russia, for Orthodox Faith, for the prince ..."

            And we had it before Dmitry Donskoy ??
            Nevsky not to offer

            Threat. Michael, welcome)))
            1. arturpraetor
              2 July 2020 17: 21 New
              +2
              Quote: Engineer
              The Germans threatened primarily the Lithuanians. Lithuanians fought with the Germans and crushed the south and southeast of Russia. Swedes are generally not serious. From the Poles GVK was just a buffer.
              Vladimir-Suzdal Russia, Tver and Novgorod were in a fundamentally better position

              Sobsno, PPKS. Briefly and succinctly about what I usually paint text walls hi
              1. Engineer
                Engineer 2 July 2020 18: 39 New
                +3
                Artyom, thanks for the cycle
                I have this question
                Where do you think the tipping point in relations between GVK and Lithuania? It seems like it is obvious that Midovg and Daniil have parity, rather with the advantage of the second, but under Gediminas Lithuania is already stronger.
                1. arturpraetor
                  2 July 2020 18: 46 New
                  +3
                  You can take a long time to paint the process of how Lithuania strengthened in comparison with the GVK, but in fact the turning point is the war of 1312-1315. The northern outskirts of Volyn itself were finally separated from the Romanovich state, his army was defeated, the king was killed (although the title of Yuri Lvovich was a separate topic, he kind of called himself king, but there were reservations, and not the fact that he was crowned at all). From this moment, Lithuania is on horseback, and GVK survives. Although the reign of Yuri Lvovich is generally a turning point before the GVK. Before him, the state held on quite confidently and even went on the offensive, after which it became prey in the hands of its suddenly intensified neighbors.
                  1. Engineer
                    Engineer 2 July 2020 18: 54 New
                    +2
                    thank you for your opinion
  • Trilobite Master
    Trilobite Master 2 July 2020 11: 09 New
    +9
    Greetings, colleagues.
    Artyom, unfortunately, recently I have not had so many opportunities to comment objectively and thoughtfully on articles or to debate in VO, however, today I can not resist some comments.
    In the first lines I want to thank you as an author. Reading was interesting and informative, especially in that part that relates to the history of Central European states. Somehow it is so invested that we know the history of medieval France, England more or less, but Hungary, Poland for many, including for me, a dark forest.
    I would like to note your passion for the topic. On the one hand, this is good, but on the other, it seems to me that it affects the objectivity of the study. As a result, the general emotional background of the cycle has steadily shifted to the polemic side instead of objective and impartial research. As a result, it seems to me that the reasons for the imminent and unvariant death of such a powerful state formation as the Galician-Volyn principality under Daniil Romanovich were practically not revealed. The dynastic crisis, which you think is perhaps the main and only reason for this sad outcome, is not, in my opinion, only a part of a huge iceberg, consisting of a complex of social, economic and political factors. I expected that these factors will be considered in detail in the article.
    After the collapse of the Old Russian state, the isolated Russian lands each went their own way, in a certain sense unique. These paths converged and diverged, again converged and again diverged, and it seems to me that it would be worth considering the fate of the Galicia-Volyn lands precisely in the context of the fate of other Russian lands - what are their similarities, what is unique, what is the greatness and tragedy of the Russian people, these lands resident.
    The ending of the cycle seems nevertheless to me blurry. It is necessary, in my opinion, several more paragraphs of a generalizing nature, or even another article - the final one, explaining why it was all written, with generalizations and conclusions.
    Well, thanks a lot!
    We will wait for new interesting works from under your pen. smile hi
    1. arturpraetor
      2 July 2020 14: 40 New
      +2
      Quote: Trilobite Master
      The dynastic crisis, which you think is perhaps the main and only reason for this sad outcome, is not, in my opinion, only a part of a huge iceberg, consisting of a set of social, economic and political factors. I expected that these factors will be considered in detail in the article.

      Perhaps this is the author’s standard omission when everything is so clear to him that he forgets to indicate this. Or maybe I just explained poorly - but I consider the dynastic crisis not the only reason for the liquidation of the GVK. For such complex events in principle there are no simple prerequisites; as a rule, a complex of conditions develops that individually may not greatly influence the situation, but together they turn out to be destructive. Actually, that’s why I am against protruding the role of “flirting with the Catholics” - not only can the destructive influence of this be traced, it’s also the one and only reason for the death of the state. In my experience working with the stories of different states - it just doesn’t happen that way. For GVK, two major reasons can be distinguished - a power crisis, and the coincidence in time of this crisis with a sharp and significant increase in absolutely all serious neighboring players. Imagine that during the Time of Troubles, the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth is not on the verge of decline, but is experiencing something similar to the rise of Poland under Casimir the Great, when in several decades the state has strengthened several, if not an order of magnitude. In this case, will Russia survive the Troubles? It's hard to say. And what if, in addition to the Commonwealth, two more neighbors sharply strengthened, who also want to participate in the celebration of life? In addition, there were reasons for a smaller scale - the strengthening after the death of Lev Danilovich, the role of boyars, famine and epidemics under Yuri Lvovich, which weakened the state before the invasion of the Lithuanians and the war with the Tatars, the transfer of legitimate rights to the GVK into the hands of the Lithuanians, etc. Separately, all this can be experienced. Together, reinforcing each other, they led to the fact that the state disappeared from the map of Europe.

      And all these reasons, I somehow voiced in the article.

      I plan to talk about this in the next article, devoted to a comprehensive analysis of the causes of the decline of the Commonwealth. It will consider all the reasons for the prospect of their formation and development, starting from the XIV century, just about the events described in this article. And again, everything will remind GVK - individually, as it were, the problems are solved, but all together - a death sentence.
      1. Red Dragon
        Red Dragon 2 July 2020 16: 30 New
        +1
        Thank you for a very interesting cycle on the history of GVK. wink And finally, I want to know your opinion: the rise of Lviv in Western Ukraine in the Middle Ages is more the legacy of Lev Danilovich, or the Polish kings who joined the Galician principality?
        1. arturpraetor
          2 July 2020 16: 39 New
          +3
          The rise of Lviv is the result of its favorable location on the Baltic-Black Sea trade route. On the same trade route, Galich instantly grew and grew stronger and Lvov essentially became his heir - the more the second developed, the faster the first weakened. Plus, from the point of view of even the Principality itself, Lviv was favorably located, a very good place for the capital. So I would not highlight the role of Leo Danilovich or the Poles. Lev Danilovich contributed to the rapid formation, the Poles did not ruin the city and reduce it to a medieval town, but Lviv became an important regional center for other reasons.
      2. Trilobite Master
        Trilobite Master 2 July 2020 16: 41 New
        +2
        Artem, there’s a discussion thread up there, I decided to write there. The bottom line is, why produce extra branches ... smile
  • 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave 2 July 2020 16: 17 New
    +5
    Artyom! Thank you so much for the work done !!! It was incredibly interesting to read!