They let us very close: the work of calculating the Pantsir-C1 ZRPK against UAVs in Libya is shown

In the network appeared footage of the work of calculating ZRPK "Shell-C1" of the Libyan National Army. This is a complex that was previously delivered to Libya from the United Arab Emirates. According to some reports, the instructor from the UAE was also included in the calculation.

The frames show that the “Shell-C1” found a relatively low speed target. This is an unmanned aerial vehicle. ZRPK conducts target tracking. Then comes the launch of an anti-aircraft missile, which hits the target, after which you can hear the joyful exclamations of the calculation of the anti-aircraft missile-gun complex.

With all the success of striking an UAV, questions arise.

The aircraft was hit at the moment when it was at a distance of about 4 km (this can be seen from the information displayed on the monitor of the complex) from the complex. If it was a strike drone, then there was a high risk that he could launch a missile on the Shell, first. It turns out that either the drone was not a strike, or the calculation allowed itself unacceptable risks of waiting for the UAV to arrive at a relatively close distance. TTX complex allows you to hit aerial targets at significantly greater than 4 km distances.

It is quite possible that it is precisely the attempts to "let the drones closer" often led to the fact that the troops of Marshal Khalifa Haftar lost such an effective weapon as ZRPK "Shell-C1".

Comments

[swnvaleria]

they’ll graze lamb, organize camel races, sell figs, not aircraft to track and accompany, they’re too complicated a technique for them, but I think they’ll learn quickly, they have such a situation

[Vol4ara]

Is it they who act in combat so? Do you take video clips? And this is against the background of reports of many lost complexes ... Is it either training on training targets or they are fools, even if it’s a scout, nothing will prevent you from covering you with artillery

[Slon1978]

Messages about multiple lost complexes? Still, I would not rely on the message, but on the video, as reliable evidence. During the operation of shock drones, video shooting of target destruction, as I understand it, is carried out automatically. I personally saw photos and videos of two different shells struck, one of which was struck in some kind of hangar, where it was possible to park or maintain. The very fact of their destruction is pointless to deny, but judging the quantity is still worth taking into account the propaganda component in the Turks' messages.

[Vol4ara]

Quote: Slon1978

Messages about multiple lost complexes? Still, I would not rely on the message, but on the video, as reliable evidence. During the operation of shock drones, video shooting of target destruction, as I understand it, is carried out automatically. I personally saw photos and videos of two different shells struck, one of which was struck in some kind of hangar, where it was possible to park or maintain. The very fact of their destruction is pointless to deny, but judging the quantity is still worth taking into account the propaganda component in the Turks' messages.

Well, together with the Syrian from the Jews and Turks, + Libyan it is already about 10 pieces so accurately typed

[Sergey10789]

It seems to me 10 units with a rather intensive use of aviation is not such a big figure!)

[Alekseev]

Video proof ...
But also to some extent. What is struck in this video? Real air defense system or layout? When onl removed, for what purpose was on the network?
All evidence can only be reliably evaluated by a specialist, and in the aggregate, both video, and audio, etc.
But what about us?
The surest thing is the result of hostilities. Dominance in the air is won or not and how it was reflected on the earth.
If, for example, Erdogan went to Moscow, and not Putin to Istanbul, then Armor and others are wow, they reflect attacks on the Khmeinim base, by the way. And if Havtar came to Egypt for help, then his warriors aren’t smart enough to cope with the PNS reinforced by the Turks, because money and weapons of the OPE and others gave him enough.

[Vol4ara]

Quote: Alekseev

If, for example, Erdogan went to Moscow, and not Putin to Istanbul, then Armor and others. Wow

No, with regard to shells this does not mean anything. Victory can be achieved by filling up the enemy with your corpses and losing dozens of pieces of equipment, and this victory will in no way judge the effectiveness of your infantry and equipment.

Quote: Alekseev

All evidence can only be reliably evaluated by a specialist, and in the aggregate, both video, and audio, etc.

Do you really need special education to become a specialist and to distinguish an inflatable rubber model from a real technique?

[Andrey Ostroushko]

The second was destroyed during transportation by trawl.

[EnGenius]

Do you also hear joyful Russian speech on video? What do you want to get from these warriors) They look at this technique as a shaitan machine and use it as an arba.

[EvilLion]

"With a" watering can "and a notebook
And even with a machine gun "

[NEXUS]

Quote: swnvaleria

they’ll graze lamb, organize camel races, sell figs, not aircraft to track and accompany, they’re too complicated a technique for them, but I think they’ll learn quickly, they have such a situation

If you give a fool a crystal male reproductive organ, he will either break it or cut it.

[Comrade Michael]

They have quality advisers.

[Black Colonel]

Nobody canceled natural selection, as in military affairs too.

[Fedorov]

If we already took such risks, then we could still let them in and beat them out of the guns. Why spend expensive ammunition like a rocket |?

[swnvaleria]

the Most High will give rockets

[Threaded screw]

the Most High will give rockets

And the Arabs, and complexes ...

[neri73-r]

It is not so easy to hit a small target from a cannon. The shells go in a "cloud", they may not touch.

[loki565]

It is unclear why they were directed around the ECO when it is possible to visit with radar for 30 km. And here the target was captured for 10km and launched the rocket only at 4.5km. As for the guns, getting on the drone is fantastic.

[Victorio]

Quote: Fedorov

If we already took such risks, we could have let a little more lop out of guns. Why spend expensive ammunition like a rocket |?

===
guns - this is the last chance already when there are no missiles of your own or there are a lot of other missiles

[steelmaker]

This indicates insufficient qualifications of the service personnel. Now the military is doing everything to avoid getting into the air defense engagement zone. This video is proof of the mistake of the people, and not of the Russian weapons destroyed by the Pantsir.

[V1er]

It is quite possible that it was the attempts to "let the drones come closer" that often led to the fact that the troops of Marshal Khalifa Haftar lost such an effective weapon as the Pantsir-S1 air defense missile system.

This explains a lot.

[Maximilian37]

They gave the monkey a shaitan toy. It can be seen that they do not understand how to use the equipment.

[Demagogue]

I just wrote yesterday that the shell-s1 bairaktar will find only closer than 7 km. Well, I even flattered the shell.
What kind of nonsense with "letting in" closer? We could have knocked down further, would have knocked down.
Those posts bots earnestly minus all night)))

[Volodin]

Quote: Demagogue

I just wrote yesterday that the shell-s1 bairaktar will find only closer than 7 km

Specify from now on: Shell-C1 or its Libyan calculation?

At a distance of "closer than 7 km" (with a wingspan of 12 m) it is already possible to "detect" it visually with a clear Libyan sky ...

[Avior]

There is a nuance, but what are his wings made of? Is there metal there? If not, but a solid composite, then for the radar they are a problem.

[K-612-O]

On the Shell and the OLS stands, and so in Syria they cope with Grad missiles, the size there is smaller. There is no nuance. Yes, and Wasps only with OLS ur shot down. Here it is necessary to make claims to the hands and level of training.

[SovAr238A]

Quote: K-612-O

On the Shell and the OLS stands, and so in Syria they cope with Grad missiles, the size there is smaller. There is no nuance. Yes, and Wasps only with OLS ur shot down. Here it is necessary to make claims to the hands and level of training.

And does OLS have a foreshortening? Automatic?
Further thought yourself continue? or not?

[kjhg]

Quote: Demagogue

I just wrote yesterday that the shell-s1 bairaktar will find only closer than 7 km. Well, I even flattered the shell.

There is information that the Emirate’s carapace has a radar of all-round visibility, but there is no illumination and guidance radar. Aiming missiles at the target is carried out using the ECO (Optoelectronic Station), the capabilities of which are sharply reduced in the dark and in adverse weather conditions. Hence the reason for letting targets so close.
Here are other weaknesses of the Shell-C1.

 Show / Hide text

The report notes the following shortcomings of the complex, identified as a result of real shooting at the firing range:
1) Poor air defense missile defense capabilities are shown for firing targets maneuvering and flying with a heading parameter of more than 2-3 km;
2) The possibility of firing at targets flying at speeds of more than 400 m / s has not been confirmed, although a speed of 1000 m / s is given in the performance characteristics of the complex;
3) The maximum firing range of 20 km is provided for aerial targets flying at a speed of no more than 80 m / s (on the E-95 target), since the available overloads of missiles at this range do not exceed 5 units.
4) The main disadvantage of a bicaliber missile (model not specified) is the lack of an engine in the march stage of the missile launcher, as a result of which within the declared damage range the missile will move with negative acceleration of the order of 50-30 m / sq. Sec, which leads to the appearance of such non-linearities in the input signal of the missile control loop, which lead to an increase in errors of its guidance on the actively maneuvering target.
5) The capabilities of the complex to defeat tactical ballistic missiles, OTP, as well as their warheads when using a hypersonic missile with a warhead weighing 4 kg have not been confirmed.
6) The presence of only two guidance methods for SAM (the model is not specified) - the three-point method and the half-straightening method - which limits the capabilities of the air defense system to defeat various types of air-defense systems in difficult conditions (maneuver, interference, NLC, a hovering helicopter, UAV, etc. .d.).
7) The control system for the detonation of the warhead of a hypersonic missile, operating on a signal from the anti-aircraft missile system in accordance with the established distance difference between the target and the missile, can only be effective when aiming the missile defense system (model not indicated) by the method of full straightening, and when aiming the missile defense system using the "three-point method "and half straightening is triggered only when the target moves directly to the firing ZPRK combat vehicle.
8) In the aforementioned last case, the effectiveness of hitting a target may turn out to be low due to the phenomenon of rebounding of the striking elements of the combat chat, since in this case their vector of their speed will be directed at a small angle to the surface of the target.
9) The effective coordination of missile defense missile equipment (the area of ​​operation of the non-contact target sensor, the NDC and the strike area of ​​the striking elements of the warheads), as well as the prevention of the operation of the NDC of the SAMs (model not specified) from the underlying surface when firing at the NLC, is not ensured.
10) The influence of meteorological conditions (rain, fog, hydrometeors) on a decrease in the target detection range for the developed radar SCR of the millimeter wave range is 10-50 times stronger than for the version of the ZPRK with a radar of the centimeter wave range, and this disadvantage cannot be compensated for by the presence in the ZPRK "Patsir-S1" optoelectronic channel for tracking the VC, due to the strong dependence of the quality of the latter on weather conditions.
11) The large overall dimensions of the ZRPK combat vehicle on a wheelbase, especially in height (in the firing position of 5,65 m), as well as the lack of armor protection of the complex and the equipment compartment (SOC, SSSR, SUO) do not allow the use of front-line air defense systems in combat and pre-battle orders of the covered forces.
12) The dimensions of the ZPRK combat vehicle in the stowed position on the wheelbase (4,374 m) do not allow it to be transported by rail, since the permissible loading height (1T) is 3,8 m, while dismantling the equipment compartment and loading it onto the platform for transportation with the help of a special crane is 3 hours for one BM, and also requires the presence of a special crane and equipment. Unloading and installation of the equipment compartment during railway transportation require the same labor costs (3 hours) and the presence of a special crane.
13) The dimensions of the combat vehicle increase the labor costs for the engineering equipment of the launch position in comparison with other air defense systems of military air defense.
14) The time for transferring the complex from the traveling position to the combat position when using the "OES Mode" (with a thermal imager) exceeds the declared 5 minutes (actually 8-9 minutes).
15) The loading time of a full ammunition load using TZM is quite long and is 25-30 minutes.

Here you can read the whole article http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-558.html

[brace]

It is no secret that military equipment is sold on the side with underestimated parameters.
Therefore, our needs are knocked down and delivered to partners not always.

[loki565]

Trim the performance characteristics of the radar and put without a radar are two different things))) The shell, in principle, was developed for the emirates, it is doubtful that they would buy such a trimmed version

[Don]

Quote: loki565

it is doubtful that they would buy such a stripped down version

However, this is a fact. The first shipments were delivered to the UAE without a backlight radar. If the video was such a complex, then everything is clear. If he was at this complex, then things are bad. This may mean that the surveillance radar sees the target, but the guidance radar cannot aim due to the low visibility of the UAV. It is for such cases that an OLS and a thermal imager are installed on the Shell. But they also have their weaknesses, which is what the Turks and Israelis use.

[Vita vko]

Quote: kjhg

Read the full article here.

In the near future, there will not be and will not be an anti-aircraft missile system capable of fulfilling tasks for the entire air defense system! Let me remind you that the air defense system should include radio-electronic and electronic reconnaissance systems, electronic warfare systems, an automated control and communication system, short-range, medium and long-range air defense systems, fighter aircraft with guidance points.
Ignorance or deliberate concealment of the facts and requirements of the real organization of anti-aircraft operations leads to the fact that numerous "experts of Bandera origin" sponsored by the United States suck out the shortcomings, and then stupidly reprint them.

[Dmitry Vyazmenskiy]

It depends on the flight altitude.

[loki565]

This is not a radar, but the ECO is mainly guided by surface and ground targets, and even then it captured a small target at a distance of 10 km

[rocket757]

The aircraft was hit at the moment when it was at a distance of about 4 km

Well, sho say ... again, remember the dilemma "ram - gate"! how else to evaluate it?

[pmkemcity]

Quote: V1er

This explains a lot.

I think that the "shaitan-arba" worked automatically.

[KVU-NSVD]

Maybe they don’t know how to shoot down with radar, but only with an optical sight? Ps just do not kick much right away ..

[Nikolaevich I]

In general, we have to admit that for the "Papuans" of all national "varieties" and regions, "robotic" complexes are urgently needed! So that the SAM itself: found, "removed the parameters", suggested an action, fired a rocket, aimed, determined the result, "curled up", went into cover ...!

[KVU-NSVD]

Quote: Nikolaevich I

In general, we have to admit that for the "Papuans" of all national "varieties" and regions, "robotic" complexes are urgently needed

Why only for the Papuans? This is a general direction for almost all weapons - to leave a person the right only to a decision .. and then not always ..

[Nikolaevich I]

Well, I meant that Russia will still be able to somehow get out "by hand", not relying too much on "robots" ... but "Papuans" are not!

[alexmach]

Maybe they don’t know how to shoot down with radar, but only with an optical sight? Ps just do not kick much right away ..

And in the video, in my opinion, you can see the shooting at the OLS. And one more interesting thing is to look at the radar, one mark clearly shines there, in its place after the hit, in my opinion, a "light" is visible. At the same time, a few more marks either appear or disappear, or even imitate the rapid approach of something to the complex. Interference?

[KVU-NSVD]

Quote: alexmach

And in the video, in my opinion, you can see the shooting on the OLS

On this basis, I wrote the previous comment.

. Interference?

It may well be that the Turks have electronic warfare ...

[Maximilian37]

No matter how it later turned out that they shot down their (friendly fire) drone, the Chinese seem a couple of days ago.

[yfast]

A good toy for desert warriors. Did they consider the drone number, were afraid to bring down their own?
In a good way, they should have shouted at 10km.

[knn54]

If only not his own.

[north 2]

SAM shell is used as it should be done, in Syrian Latakia, Russian troops to guard their facilities. And the effectiveness of the Carapace there is even very encouraging. That is, the Carapace performs such air protection functions that they, as the last link in defense, determined by the designers. And the crews are also adequately trained. After all, it was for such protection that Shells were created for the ground forces. And what functions does the Shell perform in the hands of Libyans and the like, where there is no talk of any sort of layered air defense, no one is destroying BLP camera posts, there is no help from electronic warfare systems, etc. And the teams and crews of those Shells grazed goats yesterday and drove the camels ... Such weapons as the Shells are not the same as a heavy machine gun in the back of a jeep. There should be a system for the use of such weapons, and training in the use of such weapons.

[alexmach]

And what functions does the Shell perform in the hands of Libyans and the like?

Military air defense, what else.

[PSih2097]

Quote: alexmach

Military air defense, what else.

not typical for it because of the too long deployment time (compared to the short-range air defense missile system / air defense system). His (shell) business is to stand still, buried in the cockpit, and not to portray "Tunguska" / "Thor" ...

[Viktor Sergeev]

Do not tell me, why then does the Shell have wheels and the ability to shoot on the go, unlike the Thors?

[bk0010]

Wheels - to change position. He can shoot on the move only on a caterpillar base, the wheeled one can tip over when firing from cannons, there he has special retractable shooting devices (he forgot the name):

[loki565]

Thor may well shoot on the move, the shell when moving on a level road can be rockets, cannons will be a big scatter.

[neri73-r]

An interesting proposal, most likely worked out by the designers, apparently does not fit.

[PSih2097]

Quote: Hydrogen

This complex can not protect itself offline?

Only in conjunction with the CP and nothing else ...

[Viktor Sergeev]

The shell can work in automatic mode (it is difficult to say about the one in Libya), but KAZ can damage its own troops and neighboring unplanned installations. A missile flying into a shell is usually a little slave faster than an ATGM, as a result of which fragments will destroy the Shell radar at a distance of several meters, plus the faster the target the more difficult and more expensive KAZ. In addition, the Shell has guns that are better than KAZ (they hit further, further destroy the target).

[Hydrogen]

And why in general, while the complex is operating, they shy away nearby, ideally, there is nothing for the operators to do there, control should be remotely, it is easy to destroy such a complex, and the crew must learn a long time, so why endanger it.

[Viktor Sergeev]

A man is a man, automation can also fail, not all situations can be hammered into the program.

[Tuzik]

Lepota, car crews can be calculated by the accumulation of cellular in one place.

[Dikson]

Why did they let the target come so close ..? Maybe "Shell" doesn't see further? Interference, electronic warfare equipment on the drone?

[Viktor Sergeev]

On a small drone? EW is complicated, expensive, massive enough. The farther the launch, the greater the likelihood of a miss due to the target leaving the affected area, and the Libyans have few missiles, and they understand what they are dealing with, so they are sure to beat.

[Pvi1206]

winners are not judged ... the calculation was wrong ... then he died ... but you want to live ...

[Vlad7600]

Quote: kjhg

Quote: Demagogue

I just wrote yesterday that the shell-s1 bairaktar will find only closer than 7 km. Well, I even flattered the shell.

There is information that the Emirate’s carapace has a radar of all-round visibility, but there is no illumination and guidance radar. Aiming missiles at the target is carried out using the ECO (Optoelectronic Station), the capabilities of which are sharply reduced in the dark and in adverse weather conditions. Hence the reason for letting targets so close.
Here are other weaknesses of the Shell-C1.

 Show / Hide text

The report notes the following shortcomings of the complex, identified as a result of real shooting at the firing range:
1) Poor air defense missile defense capabilities are shown for firing targets maneuvering and flying with a heading parameter of more than 2-3 km;
2) The possibility of firing at targets flying at speeds of more than 400 m / s has not been confirmed, although a speed of 1000 m / s is given in the performance characteristics of the complex;
3) The maximum firing range of 20 km is provided for aerial targets flying at a speed of no more than 80 m / s (on the E-95 target), since the available overloads of missiles at this range do not exceed 5 units.
4) The main disadvantage of a bicaliber missile (model not specified) is the lack of an engine in the march stage of the missile launcher, as a result of which within the declared damage range the missile will move with negative acceleration of the order of 50-30 m / sq. Sec, which leads to the appearance of such non-linearities in the input signal of the missile control loop, which lead to an increase in errors of its guidance on the actively maneuvering target.
5) The capabilities of the complex to defeat tactical ballistic missiles, OTP, as well as their warheads when using a hypersonic missile with a warhead weighing 4 kg have not been confirmed.
6) The presence of only two guidance methods for SAM (the model is not specified) - the three-point method and the half-straightening method - which limits the capabilities of the air defense system to defeat various types of air-defense systems in difficult conditions (maneuver, interference, NLC, a hovering helicopter, UAV, etc. .d.).
7) The control system for the detonation of the warhead of a hypersonic missile, operating on a signal from the anti-aircraft missile system in accordance with the established distance difference between the target and the missile, can only be effective when aiming the missile defense system (model not indicated) by the method of full straightening, and when aiming the missile defense system using the "three-point method "and half straightening is triggered only when the target moves directly to the firing ZPRK combat vehicle.
8) In the aforementioned last case, the effectiveness of hitting a target may turn out to be low due to the phenomenon of rebounding of the striking elements of the combat chat, since in this case their vector of their speed will be directed at a small angle to the surface of the target.
9) The effective coordination of missile defense missile equipment (the area of ​​operation of the non-contact target sensor, the NDC and the strike area of ​​the striking elements of the warheads), as well as the prevention of the operation of the NDC of the SAMs (model not specified) from the underlying surface when firing at the NLC, is not ensured.
10) The influence of meteorological conditions (rain, fog, hydrometeors) on a decrease in the target detection range for the developed radar SCR of the millimeter wave range is 10-50 times stronger than for the version of the ZPRK with a radar of the centimeter wave range, and this disadvantage cannot be compensated for by the presence in the ZPRK "Patsir-S1" optoelectronic channel for tracking the VC, due to the strong dependence of the quality of the latter on weather conditions.
11) The large overall dimensions of the ZRPK combat vehicle on a wheelbase, especially in height (in the firing position of 5,65 m), as well as the lack of armor protection of the complex and the equipment compartment (SOC, SSSR, SUO) do not allow the use of front-line air defense systems in combat and pre-battle orders of the covered forces.
12) The dimensions of the ZPRK combat vehicle in the stowed position on the wheelbase (4,374 m) do not allow it to be transported by rail, since the permissible loading height (1T) is 3,8 m, while dismantling the equipment compartment and loading it onto the platform for transportation with the help of a special crane is 3 hours for one BM, and also requires the presence of a special crane and equipment. Unloading and installation of the equipment compartment during railway transportation require the same labor costs (3 hours) and the presence of a special crane.
13) The dimensions of the combat vehicle increase the labor costs for the engineering equipment of the launch position in comparison with other air defense systems of military air defense.
14) The time for transferring the complex from the traveling position to the combat position when using the "OES Mode" (with a thermal imager) exceeds the declared 5 minutes (actually 8-9 minutes).
15) The loading time of a full ammunition load using TZM is quite long and is 25-30 minutes.

Here you can read the whole article http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/topic-558.html

Yes and no. The carapace is not for the front line and before the battle formations, but for object air defense. For the front line there is military air defense, tunguska, wasp, arrow, torus. Therefore, both the size is larger and the engineering preparation for stationary placement is longer. And yet, yes, I used to read in various sources that there is a simplified and cheaper version of “Shell-C1” for export, which contains only an optoelectronic fire control system. But how it really is, only the developer knows.

[Ros 56]

These Arab crews of the Carapace must be chased as sidor goats until they lose consciousness, so that everything works automatically, then there will be some sense from them.

[Klingon]

Before launching a rocket, you must read a prayer. No other way. By the way, we also don’t fly missiles without blessing (not about air defense)

[Viktor Sergeev]

I always said that any technique in the hands of the Arabs is a pile of scrap metal. Well, they can’t fight, therefore, the bits are mercilessly Jews in numerous wars. To justify their clumsiness, they always scolded Soviet (Russian) weapons. Our came and showed how to fight. It was the same with the Koreans.

[RAA]

Or "friendly fire" in its own way.

[chingachguc]

-Shoot, Ivan Vasilievich!
-Early, Petka. Let’s get closer.
-Shoot them, shoot!
-Early Petka, early.
-And now you can, Ivan Vasilievich?
-And now it's late, Petyunya ...

[Dmitry Leontiev]

Why is there a rocket at such distances? It would be much cheaper to use guns. Here are just a quick-fire gun at long distances at accuracy lame by definition. I would conceptually propose to solve this problem by replacing one rapid-firing gun with two to three (or several, depending on the importance of the guarded object) computerized single-fire sniper guns located on more than one machine (so as not to interfere with each other's recoil when shooting and to hit them one hit was impossible). Their computer should simply be able to determine the point at which the target will be based on the parameters of its flight, and accurately release the projectile at this point, having received a command to destroy this target. Such guns can be combined into one system (in terms of target tracking and attack) - so that the operator only needs to indicate the target of this computerized battery, and the computer of each gun fires itself, based on its own tracking and aiming system (which can combine several different systems target tracking: location, optics, thermal imager, laser range finder, etc.).

[Redfox3k]

Something is complicated. 3 complexes in coordination for working with guns? Somehow a rocket is easier from one complex.

[Dmitry Leontiev]

Missile, of course, is easier. That's just the cost of the rocket can not be compared with the cost of simple kinetic shells, precisely fired for the purpose of an advanced computer fire system. To teach such a system to effectively hit any air targets that appear within reach is cheaper than shooting down each with missiles.
The downed Armor's weak link was the human factor - a slow reaction, unskilled personnel actions. This means that the human factor should be excluded from the process as much as possible so that the machine does everything. For example, there are two modes of operation: normal and emergency. In the usual way, the system notifies about a target that does not respond to the request "friend or foe", and waits for a command to shoot down; in an emergency - nothing is waiting, but immediately knocks down itself.

[Cottodraton]

They clearly noticed him for another 12 km, but they pulled him up to 4 km. And it was like breaking guidance ...
I am not surprised why there are such losses on the shells .... this is not a bad complex, but hands growing out of a task ...

[Redfox3k]

Like the Arabs always. Then Ohr to the whole world: the Ryuish Oryuzhi is a bastard. The Saudis are fighting like American weapons. Not far from the rest have gone. But they do not yell at the whole world that the American guns are bad. Paradox.

[remal]

2S38 "Derivation-Air Defense" - larger caliber and guided shells.