US will not show satellite photo of rocket launch on MH17

US will not show satellite photo of rocket launch on MH17

The United States refused to provide satellite prosecutors in the Netherlands with data on the launch of a rocket that shot down a passenger airliner performing flight MH2014 in 17. Then the plane Boeing-777 "Malaysian Airlines" was shot down by an unknown missile over the territory of Donetsk region.


Representatives of the Dutch court said today that the documents would not be declassified or attached to the case.

In 2014, the Netherlands prosecutor made a request to the US authorities. Amsterdam then asked the Americans to provide images from space, in which you can see the moment of the launch of the rocket that shot down a passenger plane in the Donbass. In response, the United States submitted a memorandum according to which the Dutch national counterterrorism attorney reviewed classified satellite photographs in confidentiality. From the series "We have photos, but we will not show them to you, since they are secret." By and large, this is an amazing precedent for investigating - to declare the presence of evidence without providing them, and at the same time rely on what their court will take as a basis.

And already this year, the Netherlands requested the photographs themselves, but was refused, as the presiding judge informed the participants in the court session.

It is difficult to understand that the secret may be in space images of Ukrainian territory six years ago. The only plausible answer is on the surface: such secrecy is connected with the US’s reluctance to disclose information about the true culprits of the tragedy, and instead blame Russia and the Donbass militia for the death of a passenger liner with civilians on board.
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  1. Hto tama 8 June 2020 15: 43 New
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    If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago. yes Yes, and in general I have the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story
    1. credo 8 June 2020 15: 57 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago. yes Yes, and in general I have the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story

      Well, don't be so naive. So far, this method of "evidence" has never left the US sideways, so why will it not pass now? Firstly, there is the famous Anglo-Saxon - “Highly Likeley”, and secondly, the USA can always say in court, especially in the European one, which is distinguished by surprising selectivity, that they, the USA, consider that the culprit is (read Russia) did not prove his innocence, he will be considered guilty and point.
      1. military_cat 8 June 2020 16: 06 New
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        Fred Westerbeck previously directly confirmed that the investigation has satellite images from the United States.

        - The JIT report mentions satellite images, which also confirm the shooting of the Buk from the Snezhnoye area. Is it about US satellite imagery? Did you manage to get them?

        - Yes, we have them. An employee of my office with access to intelligence labeled “top secret” and “state secret” saw and studied satellite data that the United States has.


        It is not yet known whether they will be declassified in court, but the news that the Dutch were supposedly denied access to the pictures is rather dubious.
        1. credo 8 June 2020 16: 12 New
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          Quote: military_cat
          Fred Westerbeck previously directly confirmed that the investigation has satellite images from the United States.

          - The JIT report mentions satellite images, which also confirm the shooting of the Buk from the Snezhnoye area. Is it about US satellite imagery? Did you manage to get them?

          - Yes, we have them. An employee of my office with access to intelligence labeled “top secret” and “state secret” saw and studied satellite data that the United States has.


          It is not yet known whether they will be declassified in court, but the news that the Dutch were supposedly denied access to the pictures is rather dubious.

          They were, but lost. Well, that happens.
        2. Operator 8 June 2020 16: 28 New
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          Like - we don’t have any pictures and never will, but one of my subordinates saw them and he swears by his mother that everything was as the Americans say laughing
          1. Raven 95 8 June 2020 22: 45 New
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            Gentlemen take the word ...
            belay
            ... And here, ladies and gentlemen, I hit the map!
            wassat
          2. Russian jacket 9 June 2020 04: 03 New
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            We need to ask in this case, is he an orphan for an hour? wassat
        3. Krasnoyarsk 8 June 2020 17: 04 New
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          Quote: military_cat


          - Yes, we have them. An employee of my office with access to intelligence labeled “top secret” and “state secret” saw and studied satellite data that the United States has.

          Did he “study” them alone?
          Quote: military_cat

          An employee of my office with access to intelligence classified as “top secret” and

          This does not mean that he is able to "study the pictures", and where is the guarantee that he was given the exact "pictures"?
          1. military_cat 8 June 2020 17: 11 New
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            where is the guarantee that he was given exactly those "pictures"?

            But how can such a guarantee be obtained in principle?
            1. Krasnoyarsk 8 June 2020 20: 43 New
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              Quote: military_cat
              where is the guarantee that he was given exactly those "pictures"?

              But how can such a guarantee be obtained in principle?

              Can. If these pictures will be decrypted by specialists.
              You realize that these pictures are not at all like a regular photo.
      2. Smolin 8 June 2020 16: 44 New
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        It is noted that satellite images, which show the launch of the Buk missile on the MH17 Boeing, were shown to the Danish special services. Despite this, data belonging to the United States will not be declassified and attached to the case. Instead, there will be a memorandum in which the details of the tragedy are described.
        A representative of the Netherlands prosecutor’s office was shown a photograph and allowed to compare it with the information set out in the memorandum. According to him, everything is described correctly

        The United States showed these pictures to special services and the representative of the Netherlands prosecutor's office and their findings will be attached to the case.
        These pictures will not be shown only to couch experts.
        1. Pavel73 8 June 2020 17: 58 New
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          These images should not be shown to sofa experts, but to the whole world. And not only pictures, but also a detailed report on everything that the Americans managed to dig. If not shown, this will be one hundred percent proof that they and / or their Ukrainian jackals are guilty of this disaster.
          1. Smolin 8 June 2020 20: 44 New
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            "This is probably about images from secret military satellites of the United States. The United States does not want to share their source data, as this will reveal the technical capabilities of such satellites. Therefore, the Americans shared the data that these satellites collected through employees of the Dutch security agencies who personally saw the weekend information and will be able to verify their authenticity "
            In addition, I think that the Netherlands over the years has collected more than enough evidence to prove the guilt of the accused.
            1. Pavel73 9 June 2020 05: 15 New
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              But I don’t think so. Call it what you want, but it's hiding evidence. And showing them only to "their" means a criminal conspiracy.
            2. SOF
              SOF 9 June 2020 10: 08 New
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              Quote: Smolin
              In addition, I think that the Netherlands over the years has collected more than enough evidence to prove the guilt of the accused.

              ...... how interesting .... enough collected? ...... and the data on the rocket body will also be shared or have everyone forgotten about the rocket? ..... wink
              1. Siberian54 10 June 2020 10: 49 New
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                Engine parts with this number from the material evidence were removed. Somewhere in October last year, information from the investigator’s press secretary slipped .. So briefly and without noise ..
          2. major147 10 June 2020 11: 21 New
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            Quote: Pavel73
            Ukrainian jackals are guilty of this disaster.

            The Ukrainian authorities did not provide international investigators conducting an investigation into the crash of flight MH17 with primary data from radars. The experts have only secondary information at their disposal, said Dutch prosecutor Theis Berger.

            They have it in this day radar did not work! Wow, what a coincidence!
            1. Pavel73 10 June 2020 11: 28 New
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              Little of. It is a lie that Ukraine has no primary data. They had everything. The Dutch report shows the negotiations between air traffic controllers of Ukrainian Dnepropetrovsk and Russian Rostov-on-Don. Both controllers saw the mark MH17, and both began to fall apart. So both had primary radars, and they worked.
              1. major147 10 June 2020 12: 04 New
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                Quote: Pavel73
                This is a lie

                This is clear. If I’m not mistaken (I’m not an expert), then the primary radar data (transmitted by Russia) cannot be processed.
        2. opus 8 June 2020 18: 04 New
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          Quote: Smolin
          These pictures will not be shown only to couch experts.

          You see in justice (Netherlands) you do not understand well
          Article 121 reads:
          Three fair trial guarantees:
          -first that the hearings are open.
          Secondly, decisions must indicate considerations and the grounds on which they are based.
          Thirdly, that any decision should be made in public places.
          Any exception to these principles can only be made by formal law;
          The bottom line: evidence must be SHOWN and ANYONE WHO WISHES CAN SEE THEM.
          One grandmother said no ride
          An example where there are a lot of photos, labels and backs: everything personally. I don’t know if they tried vodka.
          The Netherlands Court of Appeal confirmed the right of the Russian state-owned company Soyuzplodoimport to use the Stolichnaya brand of vodka, Reuters reports. The court ruled that the Luxembourg-registered company Spirits International (part of the SPI group of Yuri Shefler) should stop selling vodka under the brand of the same name.

          In March 2015, a court ordered the SPI group of companies to transfer to Soyuzplodoimport the rights to vodka trademarks Stolichnaya and Moskovskaya in the Netherlands, Belgium and Luxembourg. Brand ownership litigation took about 12 years.

          Spirits International changed the labeling of the bottles from Stolichnaya to Stoli, however, the Hague court ruled that the rights of Soyuzplodoimport were violated and introduced a ban on the commercialization of the Stoli brand. In January 2016, the Stolichnaya brand rights case was resumed in the United States.
          1. Sanichsan 8 June 2020 20: 22 New
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            hi
            Quote: opus
            You see in justice (Netherlands) you do not understand well
            Article 121 states: ...

            but then all that is happening in the Netherlands now is, it seems, a farce anticipating the closure of the case without results. request when the investigation has evidence of dubious bloggers based on photos and videos from the Internet, some of which have already been exposed as counterfeit, a piece of a rocket that turned out to be Ukrainian and recording conversations that have an extremely indirect relation to events, everything indicates an attempt to hush up and forget. but that, of course, if you are right. we both know that the Hague tribunal for Kosovo dispensed with sentiment about the rule of law and objectivity.
            1. opus 8 June 2020 20: 29 New
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              Quote: SanichSan
              but then all that is happening in the Netherlands now is, it seems, a farce anticipating the closure of the case without results

              You judge by the Russian press.
              1.Not a booth
              2. Victims will not accept the "booth"
              Quote: SanichSan
              the Hague tribunal for Kosovo dispensed with sentiment about the rule of law and objectivity.

              There is something else.
              The ICTY was established by resolution of the UN Security Council.
              There is no Dutch law in force
              1. Sanichsan 8 June 2020 20: 44 New
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                Quote: opus
                You judge by the Russian press.
                1.Not a booth
                2. Victims will not accept the "booth"

                hmmm ... but they have been taking the “investigation” of the bilingcat as evidence for 6 years now. Again, the same American tales that "we have evidence but we will not show them to you" are swallowed beautifully. I think they also eat the closure of the case.
                I don’t believe that someone will ask questions about what the investigation was doing for 6 years ...
                Quote: opus
                There is something else.

                right. I cited this example as the opposite.
                1. opus 8 June 2020 21: 14 New
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                  Quote: SanichSan
                  but they have been taking it for 6 years

                  Victims? (accept)
                  Quote: SanichSan
                  "we have evidence but we will not show it to you" are swallowed perfectly.

                  not swallowed. I advise you to read not only the Russian press.
                  1. Sanichsan 8 June 2020 21: 21 New
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                    Quote: opus
                    not swallowed. I advise you to read not only the Russian press.

                    more specifically. what do you mean?
                    from foreign sources, I know, in fact, the commission’s reports building an evidence base on the basis of presentations in the super point and the requirement for Russia to plead guilty (of course, without evidence).
                    if you have any sources other than this, then please share.
                    1. The comment was deleted.
                      1. Sanichsan 9 June 2020 12: 12 New
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                        I am begging you laughing
                        against the background of Western media, our sample of honesty and credibility yes it’s better to read ours than Western nonsense about interfering in American elections or the attempt on the Skripals, or a wiki in English with a thousand-year history of Ukrainians and racism in Russia and tatarophobia belay wassat
                        it seems that the Western press writes for people who have completely lost the ability to think with their heads ... request
              2. Evgeny Schulepov 9 June 2020 20: 30 New
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                According to the Russian press?
                Is the air traffic controller interrogated? Why was the plane sent to the battle zone?
                The President of Ukraine and other persons were interrogated on the question: Why was the sky above the battlefield not closed to civil aviation?
                Have Almaz_Antey arguments been considered? Including the fact that in Russia such missiles have long been decommissioned and disposed of?
                And also that judging by the damage on the wreckage of the plane, the rocket flew in from the other side?
                The Russian press is not perfect. But the western one is absolutely monstrous!
          2. pmkemcity 9 June 2020 06: 19 New
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            Quote: opus
            You see in justice (Netherlands) you do not understand well
            Article 121 reads:
            Three fair trial guarantees:
            -first that the hearings are open.
            Secondly, decisions must indicate considerations and the grounds on which they are based.
            Thirdly, that any decision should be made in public places.
            Any exception to these principles can only be made by formal law;
            The bottom line: evidence must be SHOWN and ANYONE WHO WISHES CAN SEE THEM.
            One grandmother said no ride

            Rodchenkov’s lawyer on the case of Russian biathletes: “Be sure the testimony is his own. He affirmed every word under oath. ”
            https://news.sportbox.ru/Vidy_sporta/Biatlon/spbnews_NI1166269_Advokat_Rodchenkova__o_dele_rossijskih_biatlonistok_Budte_uvereny_pokazanija__jego_sobstvennyje_On_podtverdil_kazhdoje_slovo_pod_prisagoj
        3. Lekz 9 June 2020 23: 03 New
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          Well, special services, it’s their hobby to look at pictures. And the representative of the prosecutor’s office will declare in court: “I swear by Mom!”.
    2. figwam 8 June 2020 16: 00 New
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      And already this year, the Netherlands requested the photographs themselves, but was refused, as the presiding judge informed the participants in the court session.

    3. iouris 8 June 2020 16: 41 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      states have long lost interest in this story

      On the contrary, by not providing data, they contribute to the prolongation of the "process". Most likely, the plane was blown up: there was a bomb on board.
      1. Oyo Sarkazmi 8 June 2020 17: 49 New
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        Quote: iouris
        Most likely, the plane was blown up: there was a bomb on board.

        The situation is much worse - because of the bicolor on board, taken as a tricolor, an American plane rocketed a plane, taking off from Poland, two AWACS from the Czech Republic and Romania directed the rocket.
        The case of the investigation team is to destroy evidence, extend the case for a decade, and close after the statute of limitations.
        After all, Voloshin said on landing: It's a pity the wrong plane. And the “that” plane with Putin with a tricolor on board landed 40 minutes later in Rostov-on-Don.
        1. iouris 8 June 2020 18: 59 New
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          History is imprisoned for changing the political regime in Moscow. Subsequent events confirm this. If the plan works, then the version of the “investigation” will never be refuted. Therefore, they pull and will pull the rubber.
          Tricolor on half of the aircraft in Europe. The likelihood that a Su-25 would be sent to bring down the liner is minimal, and besides, the Su-25 is practically not capable of hitting the liner exactly in the cockpit. For guaranteed shooting down of the airliner in those conditions, most likely, explosives and the Buk missile elements or the Su-27 fighter were used. But the fighter is too noticeable, it would be detected with high probability.
          The authorities of Ukraine are puppet. Voloshin was most likely used “blindly” or framed (“consumables”) to cover up the organizers of the attack. Perhaps he was approaching the liner to visually "control the process." He was even awarded (posthumously).
          1. Oyo Sarkazmi 8 June 2020 19: 54 New
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            Voloshin was only supposed to identify the plane. Voloshin did not know the coloring of the plane of the Russian President, and took the red-blue stripes on a white background for a tricolor. After that, the MN-17 was taken 4 km north of the corridor. In order to avoid interference with blind (from a warhead) guidance. F-22, received a command, supersonic got closer to the aircraft and launched, from a distance of 100 km. The missile went on top of the plane, and exploded in front of the windshield.
            Then, drawings of the striking elements were received from Russia, and three years after the disaster, suitable ones were shown as evidence. Some. They were probably bought from lovers of rummaging around the landfills.
            1. Eug
              Eug 9 June 2020 10: 42 New
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              And what, Ross. satellites did not detect it? And if you spotted it, why didn’t you use it to lift very painful sanctions?
              1. mark2 9 June 2020 15: 26 New
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                But how can they detect. Everyone knows that only Musk can launch satellites. It’s cheaper. He launches them 60 at a time. But the Russian cosmos, backward and in general, its existence is highly questionable. And whether he was already being questioned on the open spaces of the entire Internet and on this site in particular. smile
              2. Oyo Sarkazmi 9 June 2020 17: 35 New
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                The sanctions will be lifted only when in the Crimea torturers will issue 1000 corpses per year. And before this period - the United States will portray a strict democrat and rob money from wealthy Russians.
                As for the satellites, the Russian Defense Ministry has few of them, they can only monitor once every 5 hours. But the Americans at this time, the territory scanned 12 reconnaissance and 18 satellites of obscure purpose. Among 12 were with side-scan locators, infrared, optical, radio interceptors. That is, Americans are aware of what happened up to the 6D format, with a quarter-second storyboard.
              3. Siberian54 10 June 2020 11: 02 New
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                No one in the Russian Federation was preparing for this war, so the outskirts as a former member of the alliance simply looked along the way with the eastern part of NATO and there were windows, and here the outskirts "beech" arrived 65 km from the launch point and the radars on the outskirts attack aircraft highlighting the goal and reason, it was urgent to break up the BRICS alliance, which turned out ... BTW: M1 Rocket Warhead has 5000 Armaturins and 2000 I-rods Found One Two-Shots and One Struggles XNUMX-Searches!
    4. Nyrobsky 8 June 2020 16: 41 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      Anyway, I get the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story

      The states are still interested, since they are the main customers in this business, and dill performers, in other words, are “air killers,” and don’t go to the grandmother here.
      1. Hto tama 8 June 2020 17: 19 New
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        Quote: Nyrobsky
        Quote: hto tama
        Anyway, I get the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story

        The states are still interested, since they are the main customers in this business, and dill performers, in other words, are “air killers,” and don’t go to the grandmother here.

        Well, the deed has been done, the instructions have been distributed, and therefore it’s not interesting to them, as they say: and then laughing
    5. Bykov. 8 June 2020 17: 14 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago. yes Yes, and in general I have the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story

      It would be necessary to attract them - for concealing evidence.
    6. RUSS 8 June 2020 17: 23 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago.

      Perhaps hold a trump card for a more passing moment. Great policy.
      1. Hto tama 8 June 2020 17: 30 New
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        Quote: RUSS
        Quote: hto tama
        If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago.

        Perhaps hold a trump card for a more passing moment. Great policy.

        It is hard to believe if they would have shown right away, there would have been a good reason for pressure, I do not dispute the pictures they only have to show them is not beneficial otherwise all the accusations will simply fall apart hi
    7. knn54 8 June 2020 19: 43 New
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      - declare the availability of evidence without providing them, and at the same time rely on what their court will take as a basis.

      Once Vasily Ivanovich went to England and returned a week later. Petka, who met the commander, froze in surprise: Chapaev was in an expensive suit and with a bunch of bags, of which large bills were sticking out.
      Coming out of a luxurious limousine, Chapaev blinked blissfully and lit a pipe. Petya, who did not understand anything, approached the commander and asked:
      - Vasily Ivanovich, but where did all this come from? We’ve been saving money for the whole division for ten years, so you can visit England!
      - Yes, nonsense, Petka, I just won the cards! - Chapaev answered casually.
      - Wow! But how?
      - Well, I came to England, and I was invited to the club. There all the men sat, drank and played cards. I took a closer look - it turned out they were playing "twenty-one"! I joined one company and began to play, looked at the cards, it turned out that I had 17. And the one sitting opposite said: “Gentlemen, I have 21!” I told him: "And show me!" And he replied: “Sir, we are in England, all gentlemen are here, and true gentlemen believe each other's word!” Here, Petka, I got so hurt, so hurt!
    8. Pete mitchell 8 June 2020 21: 44 New
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      Quote: hto tama
      If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago.

      Almost immediately after the catastrophe, your idea was voiced by usveterans.com, a sort of interconnected former Amer dark masters - the idea was expressed there: that if the authorities do not publish the claimed pictures, then they contradict the position of the authorities. Simple and explains everything.
      It is very interesting what they will do with the Dutchman, whom they allegedly introduced
    9. fider 9 June 2020 09: 24 New
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      Hto tama
      "If the states had something ..."
      Or maybe the states have more important secrets than to confirm the guilt of Russia?
  2. Alexga 8 June 2020 15: 53 New
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    How can one show what is not.
    1. svp67 8 June 2020 15: 57 New
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      Quote: AlexGa
      How can one show what is not.

      The availability of snapshots of the tragedy was announced by no one, but at that time the US President Barack Obama ... No one pulled him for his tongue or for other parts of his body, he said this himself without external pressure from Russia. Now let them explain, THEY, and NOT WE ...
      1. Infinity 8 June 2020 16: 01 New
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        Most likely, there are pictures. But the launch point is not quite where Western prosecutors would like laughing
        1. svp67 8 June 2020 16: 06 New
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          Quote: Infinity
          Most likely, there are pictures.

          99,99% sure that there is. Immediately, and importantly, the Buka missile leaves a clear powder trail in the sky, which can then hang for a long time, up to a dozen minutes, in the sky, as well as the trace from the operation of the warhead of this missile. That is, it was possible to provide images of this trace here, in addition, the satellites had infrared equipment, it had to detect the launch of the propulsion system and all its operation on the flight path ... A reconnaissance satellite can deliver this data in high resolution in a timely manner to your command post in real time and with precise reference to the area where all this is recorded and recorded
          1. bk316 8 June 2020 16: 12 New
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            99,99% sure that there is.

            Well, that is, it was like that.
            Obama when everything happened asked the warrior

            - Do you have pictures with the launch of a Russian rocket?
            -Of course have .

            Well, Obama joyfully trumpeted everyone ...
            And the warriors

            -you only understand the rocket flew from the APU .....

            It happens when you really want and in a hurry laughing
          2. Avior 8 June 2020 16: 20 New
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            Information about the capabilities of reconnaissance satellites is secret, show the image for general access means to reveal the capabilities of satellites
            1. svp67 8 June 2020 16: 24 New
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              Quote: Avior
              Information about the capabilities of reconnaissance satellites is secret, show the image for general access means to reveal the capabilities of satellites

              I beg you ... For the press, they are deliberately rude and, but at the negotiations between the parties, these pictures show in all their glory, as an argument in disputes ... and nothing. Moreover, the satellite delivers a bunch of other information that is understandable only to specialists, right away we are talking about PHOTOS, which Israel is very successful in delivering to the market.
              1. Avior 8 June 2020 16: 30 New
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                This is so, only these photos are needed for the court, and not for the press, so there must be originals, otherwise any examination will immediately determine the photo as a fake
                They showed the Dutch the original, but not in the public domain
                And on the originals, the capabilities of their equipment will immediately emerge, as you understand
                1. poquello 8 June 2020 16: 57 New
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                  Quote: Avior
                  This is so, only these photos are needed for the court, and not for the press, so there must be originals, otherwise any examination will immediately determine the photo as a fake
                  They showed the Dutch the original, but not in the public domain
                  And on the originals, the capabilities of their equipment will immediately emerge, as you understand

                  yah? and where are the copies in the public domain? that's when they say about copies (and they won’t say the code appears) that the fake then the original is needed as evidence
                2. K-612-O 8 June 2020 17: 12 New
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                  Why is Israel not afraid of this? In Syria, Americans used to stamp pictures of both UAVs and satellites almost every day, but right now they worry about the capabilities of the equipment. Funny as that
                3. bk316 9 June 2020 14: 16 New
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                  This is so, only these photos are needed for the court, and not for the press, so there must be originals,

                  Write garbage, it seems they have never encountered a trial behind closed doors.
                  First, at a public meeting, lawyers are provided with copies that do not have a neck (in this case, a rough photo). In some cases, the non-distribution of these copies is stipulated, then for publication a completely corrected version or description is submitted under the signature of the lawyers. HERE THAT WOULD FULLY APPROACH BECAUSE IT IS VISIBLE FROM WHERE THE Rocket was flying.
                  Then, in a closed session, the originals are presented, lawyers and experts can study them, but not make or copy them. In addition, a non-disclosure subscription is given.
                  1. Avior 9 June 2020 14: 49 New
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                    Maybe the Americans would have done that for an American court.
                    Only the court is not in the States and they have nothing to do with it, the Dutch need to transfer the photo, that is, to withdraw from the country.
                    The Dutch want to present them publicly.
                    Or maybe they will do it again if lawyers and experts have access, although I can’t imagine how the Dutch lawyer will have access to the United States, except that through NATO, they showed them to the Dutch representative with access.
                    But there is another option - an expert with admission will look at the photo in the States, come to court and confirm with oath that the launch was there and there as an expert or witness, which is likely to happen.
                    Do not forget that the Dutch stated that they have several witnesses of the launch, so this photo is not an obligatory element of evidence.
                    1. bk316 9 June 2020 15: 03 New
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                      But there is another option - an expert with a look will see a photo in the States,

                      Only an expert should be on the side of the accused laughing
                      And if the United States would not show anything to anyone, they would be silent in a rag.
                      And they already got it from the very top of the president, "we have SUCH, we have SUCH, that we won’t even tell you what it is"
                      1. Avior 9 June 2020 15: 23 New
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                        if the US will not show anything to anyone

                        they have already shown
                        In response, the United States submitted a memorandum according to which the Dutch national counterterrorism attorney reviewed classified satellite photos in confidentiality.

                        as I understand it, they can show an expert with the appropriate clearance, and he will speak at the trial.
                      2. bk316 9 June 2020 15: 26 New
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                        they have already shown

                        Do you understand anything in legal proceedings?
                        It’s pointless to show one side something, which, according to our laws, is American.
                      3. Avior 9 June 2020 15: 35 New
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                        understand.
                        that means they will not show, the prosecution will have to do without this evidence.
                        or will be shown to a neutral expert appointed by the court and not representing either the prosecution or the accused.
                        He will appear in court, for example, as a neutral expert or as a witness, even if they cross-examine him.
                        Are you a specialist in Dutch law that argues so categorically?
                        American laws have nothing to do with this; they have nothing to do with the process.
                      4. bk316 9 June 2020 16: 06 New
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                        you are a specialist in Dutch law

                        In the Dutch no. But these are fundamental principles of Roman law. Access to evidence from both sides and evidence of evidence. Acts even in England with their case law.
                        If it is correct, then even the application itself can be considered as pressure on the court.
                        So for fun read something about criminal trials in the USA.
                        Still, although I do not like them, in legal procedures they are ahead of the rest.
                      5. Avior 9 June 2020 17: 25 New
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                        I read.
                        I also wonder what they will do in this situation.
                        But, according to their statements that they have more than one start-up witness, they may find this photo optional.
                        Especially if there will be no witnesses of launch from other places.
                        So far I have not heard of them.
                    2. Liam 9 June 2020 17: 38 New
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                      Quote: Avior
                      He will appear in court, for example, as a neutral expert or as a witness, even if they cross-examine him.

                      Optional. Affidavit
                    3. Avior 9 June 2020 18: 08 New
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                      There must be a reason why he cannot go to court.
                      The Dutch want the most public process, so I don’t think so.
                      But let's see.
                    4. Liam 9 June 2020 18: 10 New
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                      In all courts of all countries there are special procedures when it comes to state secrets, secret data, etc.
  • Vladimir Mashkov 8 June 2020 16: 25 New
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    What about instantly providing a snapshot about Tehran? Is there no secret? laughing
    1. Avior 8 June 2020 16: 32 New
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      Do not know
      And what kind of picture is about Tehran, throw the link, the Iranians admitted why the picture?
      1. Vladimir Mashkov 8 June 2020 17: 08 New
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        You are an interesting person: I see here, I don’t see here, prove that I’m not a camel, run imagining help ... Look for yourself!
        1. Avior 8 June 2020 17: 32 New
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          Help me yours unnecessarily, just throw a link about what you write, so that you can understand
  • Junior Private 8 June 2020 16: 08 New
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    That’s the whole point of democracy.
  • Alexga 8 June 2020 16: 03 New
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    Obama at that moment made the political statement needed at that moment, and this is not always true. In any case, this does not seem plausible to me. For 6 years, at least some information would have come out. IMHO
    1. svp67 8 June 2020 16: 07 New
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      Quote: AlexGa
      For 6 years, at least some information would have come out.

      And how many years have passed since the death of Kennedy, how with the information is that a lot of "got out?"
  • credo 8 June 2020 16: 14 New
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    Quote: svp67
    Quote: AlexGa
    How can one show what is not.

    The availability of snapshots of the tragedy was announced by no one, but at that time the US President Barack Obama ... No one pulled him for his tongue or for other parts of his body, he said this himself without external pressure from Russia. Now let them explain, THEY, and NOT WE ...

    In such a case, there is already a long-worked-out excuse phrase - "I was misunderstood" or "The translation was incorrect."
  • avg
    avg 8 June 2020 16: 24 New
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    Quote: svp67
    The availability of snapshots of the tragedy was announced, no matter who, but at that time the US President - Barack Obama ...

    There Colin Powell even caught in a lie and that .... Even S. Hussein did not help.
  • forpost 8 June 2020 15: 58 New
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    Balabol, no options.
  • Karaul73 8 June 2020 15: 58 New
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    Quote: hto tama
    If the states had something that could confirm Russia's guilt, they would have done it a long time ago. yes Yes, and in general I have the impression that the states have long lost interest in this story

    The states have already achieved their goal. There are sanctions and they don’t think about removing them yet. And it seems that they cannot get the most out of this story.
    1. cniza 8 June 2020 16: 08 New
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      Yes, it’s not a problem for them to find a sanction, if they show the pictures, then the string will lead to Washington, where the customers of this tragedy are.
  • Kurare 8 June 2020 16: 04 New
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    Maybe lawyers should do the same: pictures from the secret satellite of the state of Limpo-po (according to the American version there is such a state) unequivocally show that they shot down from a karamultuk (sarcasm). And to be honest - this is no longer getting ridiculous.

    It will be even more “not funny” when this case becomes a precedent in jurisprudence. Then it will be like in that joke about "believing gentlemen": "and then Vasily Ivanovich got a card on it."
  • cniza 8 June 2020 16: 07 New
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    By and large, this is an amazing precedent for investigating - to declare the presence of evidence without providing them, and at the same time rely on what their court will take as a basis.

    In the "fun" time we live, everything is turned upside down.
  • Avior 8 June 2020 16: 10 New
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    It’s hard to understand what the secret may be in images from space

    top-secret is information about the resolving power of the equipment of observation satellites
    1. cniza 8 June 2020 17: 21 New
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      Enlighten, I'm not ironic, but what's the secret?
      1. Avior 8 June 2020 18: 05 New
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        The capabilities of intelligence equipment are always and everywhere secret
        After all, the enemy is always interested in what details from outer space you, in principle, can consider, and which are not.
        Will, for example, misinformation with false technology pass, or vice versa, do you have sufficient means of camouflage or the enemy will not be deceived.
        1. cniza 8 June 2020 18: 29 New
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          And I thought that we had already passed this stage and that from space you can read the manufacturer’s factory on a matchbox.
          1. Avior 8 June 2020 19: 50 New
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            I have not seen such photos, although I heard similar stories too.
            It is probably important at what height they were still filming.
            1. cniza 8 June 2020 20: 56 New
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              Height certainly matters, but spies try lower, I think so ...
              1. Avior 8 June 2020 21: 13 New
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                you're right, of course they are trying, the lower the better the shooting conditions. the smaller the angle of the lens, the smaller the surface area it captures and the higher the resolution of the image.
                but what is the likelihood that at the moment of launching the rocket the lens will be directed precisely at this point and the satellite will fly here?
                If we are talking about commercial shooting, this is not a problem, you ordered, they told you, okay, tomorrow at 16:00 the satellite will fly to the point you need, we will take it off.
                But here we were talking about a small area, because the satellite does not hang in place (except for geostationary ones at an altitude of 36000 km, it’s not the most convenient altitude for detailed shooting, if it’s not mass launches of ICBMs, of course)
                The lower the satellite and the narrower the field of view of the lens, the faster the desired point will fly by, but at the same time the highest resolution.
                and vice versa.
                Do you think that such information about the capabilities of the enemy is needed and will it be secret?
                1. cniza 8 June 2020 21: 17 New
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                  Do you think that such information about the capabilities of the enemy is needed and will it be secret?


                  I mean that everyone knows this, it all depends on the equipment, if there is equipment and there are satellites, you can do it, if not then not, I can’t see what you shot and where.
                  1. Avior 8 June 2020 21: 36 New
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                    details of the capabilities of surveillance tools when working in various modes - secret information, otherwise it cannot be.
                    presenting a snapshot of such a system will give specialists a lot.
                    I’m sure that you will not find such information anywhere on existing satellites.
                    hi
  • Zaurbek 8 June 2020 16: 14 New
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    The evidence is secret ... the witnesses too .... the evidence of the Russian Federation does not apply to the case ....
    What else did I forget? Do they take an example from our ships?
  • Ham
    Ham 8 June 2020 16: 18 New
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    "if you drink with thieves - beware of your wallet"
    nautilus pompilius
    if they HAD any reinforced concrete evidence - they would have presented them a long time ago ...
    another question is that all Dutch courts do not need evidence in principle
  • mag nit 8 June 2020 16: 19 New
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    There is no court.
  • Prisoner 8 June 2020 16: 22 New
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    laughing And what? Did you fail to take photoshop? They’ve gotten really bad, their hands are not growing from the right place?
  • ANDREY MIKHAILOV_2 8 June 2020 16: 25 New
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    From the series "We have photos, but we won’t show them to you, because they are secret. The end of the performance, please gentlemen. That they show that the Ukrainian side shot down the plane, so they became secret.
  • Igor Polovodov 8 June 2020 16: 27 New
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    as you might expect from the Omerians ..
  • Piramidon 8 June 2020 16: 36 New
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    From the series "We have photos, but we will not show them to you, since they are secret."

    Something very familiar reminds.
    1. ximkim 8 June 2020 17: 30 New
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      Court in Prostokvashino lol
  • IGOR GORDEEV 8 June 2020 16: 36 New
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    I remembered the story of how one technician in NASA dropped a cabinet with films on the lunar program and that now there are no films. Most likely fake, but for some reason I remembered. Inspired)
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • Vladimir Mashkov 8 June 2020 16: 46 New
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    The US refusal to provide a satellite image indicates one thing: the image does NOT confirm the downing of the Boeing by Russian Buk. Remember the downed Ukrainian plane near Tehran, then the United States instantly (and did not drag out 6 years) presented a picture! But in vain, many think that there, in the American image, there is confirmation of the downing of the Boeing by the Ukrainian Buk. In this sense, the picture is clear: there are no traces of ANY “Buk” (although their batteries should be visible nearby ON THE EARTH). But Voloshin’s plane is clearly visible in the picture, which shot down the Malaysian Boeing! I wrote about all this in an article which the editor DOES NOT MISSED IN, and, referring to the decision of the editorial board, AT ALL forbade me to publish in VO. Why? I do not know. A military secret! Conspirology ... lol
  • ximkim 8 June 2020 16: 54 New
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    [/ quote] And already this year, the Netherlands requested the photos themselves, but were refused, which was announced by the presiding judge. [quote]

    It can be seen in the United States: they cannot develop a new version of Photoshop, find such a photoshop (so as not to blush and stutter), the leading Hollywood film studios cannot make such decorations for a space photo, One is insulting, they died (I believe that they were killed) in nothing innocent people because of the dirty ambitions of the redistributed circle of politicians.
    1. RUSS 8 June 2020 17: 28 New
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      Quote: ximkim
      It is visible in the USA they cannot: develop a new version of Photoshop, find such a photoshop

      They can find a photo shooter at our Ministry of Defense, I remember our general staff painted and the photo showed how a Boeing over Donbass allegedly shot down Ukrainian SU-25.
      1. ximkim 8 June 2020 17: 38 New
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        Quote: RUSS
        Quote: ximkim
        It is visible in the USA they cannot: develop a new version of Photoshop, find such a photoshop

        They can find a photo shooter at our Ministry of Defense, I remember our general staff painted and the photo showed how a Boeing over Donbass allegedly shot down Ukrainian SU-25.

        Such a snapshot from our MO is not suitable. And maybe there is a registration of the place of the event at our MO, but maybe they still hold it ?! But they ate and so, why? request
  • fn34440 8 June 2020 17: 07 New
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    By type of work, I am calling to ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organization), where not a single expert could answer him why the MH-17 case was transferred to the Dutch paramilitary organization, and not to the Malaysian authorities. It is likely that this is precisely the stumbling block of the case - that the investigation is carried out by those who are comfortable doing this. Why unnecessary? Here's the thing.

    I am sure that the crash of a Boeing over Ukraine is the embodiment of the Northwoods plan, presented in 1962 by Secretary of Defense Robert McNamert for consideration by John F. Kennedy. Its essence was that the American secret services had to liquidate a civilian liner over the United States, accusing the Cubans of the tragedy. This was necessary for the Americans as an excuse for a military invasion of Cuba.

    What if the United States really implemented a long-forgotten plan, but already in Ukraine? After all, it was precisely after the crash of the Boeing with all the ensuing consequences that the United States so eagerly started talking about anti-Russian sanctions and finally stopped any contacts with Russia.

    The theory is very interesting for discussion. Why invent new sabotage plans? Everything was invented before them (SBU with curators).
    1. Avior 8 June 2020 21: 44 New
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      no expert could answer him why the MN-17 case was transferred to the Dutch paramilitary organization, and not to the Malaysian authorities.

      one can only guess why they did not tell you about Appendix 13 to the Convention on Civil Aviation.
      http://www.6pl.ru/asmap/Annexes//an13_cons_ru.pdf
      Chapter 5.
      5.1 The State of the scene of the event shall initiate an investigation into the circumstances of the accident and
      is responsible for conducting such an investigation, however, it may transfer in whole or in part
      conducting this investigation to another state or regional investigation organization
      accidents by mutual agreement and agreement.

      Note that there is no indication to whom the investigation can be specifically transferred.
      And in this case, the Netherlands was transferred to the investigation with the consent of, including Malaysia and with its participation.
      hi
  • Mountain shooter 8 June 2020 17: 14 New
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    I believe that if the photo at least EXTREMELY denounced Russia, they would have glued ALL the posts on the street and all YOU TUBE. And so-this is practically a confession ukrovermahta ... am
  • Vladimir61 8 June 2020 17: 15 New
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    Do not show? Do they have them?
    Maybe there is, they just will not show it, because then everyone will understand that the provocation was planned by them, with the participation of the country 404. Not for nothing, the satellite was at a given time, in a given place.
  • Cristall 8 June 2020 17: 15 New
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    In response, the United States submitted a memorandum according to which the Dutch National Counter-Terrorism Attorney reviewed confidential satellite photographs in confidentiality.

    They showed the prosecutor. Open sources do not publish.
    1. ximkim 8 June 2020 17: 24 New
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      Or maybe it's a fake? Like, the prosecutor saw the photos, take his word for it. They’ll fall into this version, clap their hands, and that's it, the trial is over.
      1. Cristall 8 June 2020 20: 11 New
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        Quote: ximkim
        Or maybe it's a fake? Like, the prosecutor saw the photos, take his word for it. They’ll fall into this version, clap their hands, and that's it, the trial is over.

        according to the author
        In response, the United States submitted a memorandum according to which the Dutch national counterterrorism attorney reviewed classified satellite photographs. subject to confidentiality

        he cannot provide anything. Officially, he has nothing.
  • kriten 8 June 2020 17: 17 New
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    The best evidence is that the investigation of 5 years was engaged in falsification, adjusting a set of fakes to the version necessary for the owners.
  • Torak 8 June 2020 17: 22 New
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    They will not show, because they are not there. The board was shot down by plane, and most interestingly, a Turkish missile.
  • Pvi1206 8 June 2020 17: 27 New
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    and after that the USA has the audacity to demand something from other states ...
    every time in this case they have to be poked in the face in this use case ...
  • lego2 8 June 2020 17: 52 New
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    with these pictures, they will hold any Ukrainian authorities by their balls.
    1. Roman_vh 8 June 2020 18: 44 New
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      It’s hard to keep for what is not. The image of a soldering iron in a famous place is more suitable. And they hold the plug near the outlet.
  • rocket757 8 June 2020 18: 33 New
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    Something to discuss, crush wasted water in a mortar.
  • I AM BELARUSIAN 8 June 2020 18: 41 New
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    Yes, because there is NOTHING to show!
  • Sibguest 8 June 2020 19: 11 New
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    (a parody of the episode from the movie "Kill the Dragon"):
    Does the US have secret pictures with the launch of the BUK?
    Is.
    But not secret.
    And not in the USA
    And not with the launch of BEECH.
    ... and in general - not pictures.
  • akinfeeffr 8 June 2020 19: 39 New
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    Yes, we know this story, again the cleaning lady accidentally threw lol
  • Lord of the Sith 8 June 2020 19: 59 New
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    Of course, the Yankees will not show a satellite photo of a rocket launch on MH17.
    It is not beneficial for them to show the truth.

    And others try not to see anything, blindfold their eyes with dollar bills, without forgetting to blame Russia for all sins.
  • Ingenegr 8 June 2020 20: 22 New
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    Quote: svp67
    Now let them explain, THEY, and NOT WE ...

    What is the problem? Make, let them explain.
  • polikutin.e 8 June 2020 20: 35 New
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    Adobe PhotoShop will launch and show. What you will not do if you really need to. And so they still said the satellite was looking the other way and there was no photo, but now that the satellite has come to its senses and it turns out there is a photo, then all the same Adobe helps
  • APASUS 8 June 2020 20: 53 New
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    If the Americans owned the info that the MN-17 had been shot down from Russian Buk, we would be killed by sanctions like Iran and Korea.
  • revnagan 8 June 2020 20: 57 New
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    Having pictures taken from a spy satellite at a specific time in a particular place, you can calculate the orbit and trajectory of this satellite with all the results, to understand what, where and when this same satellite saw or can see. Of course, this information is "not for outsiders." The judge saw, and enough. Yes, by the way, why Russia will not show its pictures? It will immediately be seen where the launch was from request .
    1. Motorist 8 June 2020 21: 37 New
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      it is possible to calculate the orbit and trajectory of this satellite

      No. The orbits of which satellites are needed are known to anyone. Our knew about this satellite (s) - re-read (-see) the news of that time.
  • dgonni 8 June 2020 21: 07 New
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    It is difficult to understand that the secret may be in space images of Ukrainian territory six years ago.
    For the author! The secret may not be the picture itself or the pictures. The angle and the range from which and in which it is filmed may be secret. It may suddenly turn out that a thread is a scientific companion of nass who should look into the wilds of the cosmos. He calmly looks at the earth and can see in certain radiation ranges something that no one even guesses about.
    There are no doubts that there are pictures.
    1. Moskovit 8 June 2020 23: 00 New
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      Is it possible that a powerful technological power, a world leader and a hegemon in everything, cannot make a civilian version of the picture? It is simply ridiculous to listen to some ridiculous explanations of the US refusal to provide the public with evidence of 100% guilt of the militia in this resonant case. How can a purely civilian person, a layman, a judge, distinguish real photos from fakes? And it will turn out as with the recent documents of mercenaries from Russia with female names ...
  • Jambal Green 8 June 2020 22: 04 New
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    It would be better if material evidence of Joseph Resch's investigation, which the police seized from his bank safe, were returned to material evidence. To hell with them with these pictures, especially since there is no launch from them on the ground but only a fighter and its rocket.
  • Ura Karbovnichiy 8 June 2020 22: 34 New
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    Concealment of evidence in all countries of the world is considered as complicity.
    That the Golan court does not know the basics of jurisprudence.
  • tolmachiev51 9 June 2020 05: 00 New
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    Why did the Malaysian plane become the “victim”!? - Everything in this matter is thought out to the smallest detail, and therefore the “court” is proceeding like this. The prosecutor saw the pictures, scratched his turnips and two "secret" witnesses appeared right there. . The principle of "high-likly" works, Teresa May went down in the history of the most lying swindlers and "international law" in their understanding. Works ..
  • Ros 56 9 June 2020 05: 36 New
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    This is a golem farce, not a court, such as the Skripals case. Striped will not provide anything, otherwise you will have to judge Giblets and his gopkompak. So do not care about this thing and forget.
  • Non liberoid Russian 9 June 2020 08: 01 New
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    if everything was against Russia there, they would have shown long ago ... and since they cover their lackeys
  • Alt 22 9 June 2020 08: 11 New
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    So probably there was no photo?
  • PValery53 9 June 2020 09: 10 New
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    America shamelessly "sculpts a hunchback", accusing Russia of everything and everything. Russia needs to shake off this nonsense and, if possible, punish this rude "hegemon" for such a hoax.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  • Dmitriy Zadorozhniy 9 June 2020 17: 21 New
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    I remember when a Boeing exploded over the Hudson. The congressman also screamed that he was hit by the military, and he has all the evidence, but he will not show it. As a result, it turned out that the wiring in the central bank was short. Famous case.
  • trahterist 9 June 2020 20: 13 New
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    Quote: Smolin
    It is noted that satellite images, which show the launch of the Buk missile on the MH17 Boeing, were shown to the Danish special services. Despite this, data belonging to the United States will not be declassified and attached to the case. Instead, there will be a memorandum in which the details of the tragedy are described.
    A representative of the Netherlands prosecutor’s office was shown a photograph and allowed to compare it with the information set out in the memorandum. According to him, everything is described correctly

    The United States showed these pictures to special services and the representative of the Netherlands prosecutor's office and their findings will be attached to the case.
    These pictures will not be shown only to couch experts.

    No need to hysteria in bold type, dear.
    Until these pictures are shown to the whole world, such "evidence" is worthless.
  • trahterist 9 June 2020 20: 20 New
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    Quote: opus
    Quote: SanichSan
    but they have been taking it for 6 years

    Victims? (accept)
    Quote: SanichSan
    "we have evidence but we will not show it to you" are swallowed perfectly.

    not swallowed. I advise you to read not only the Russian press.

    My dear, for example, I read the English press and news portals of the .co.uk domain (your blunders with the .en domain so be forgiven, because you are clearly not in the subject of the British Internet), simply because I live on a lot of islands time already, and there murkiness and unfounded accusations (highlie lykli) against Russia, a dime a dozen.
    But there is progress, not the most stubborn British themselves with irony perceive such news and laugh at such a clumsy information war.
    So I don’t need to sing fables here about the Russian press, yeah.
    Z. S. In general, it is amusing when the sufferers and truth-seekers from Russia talk about European countries.
    We then, on the ground, it is not so clearly visible, right? lol
  • Alex 9 June 2020 21: 28 New
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    "The United States informed the Netherlands prosecutor that they would not be able to provide declassified satellite images that allegedly capture the time the Buk missile launched on the Malaysian Boeing (flight MH17 in the sky over Donbass in July 2014), said presiding judge Hendrick Steenheis during the meeting on this case.

    “The court asked whether it is possible to add classified satellite images to the case, which recorded the launch of the rocket, which were transmitted to the secret services of the Netherlands, and thus, declassify them. The prosecutor’s office replied that the request was sent to the United States back in 2014, a memorandum was received in response “The Dutch national counter-terrorism prosecutor was able to verify the validity of this memorandum,” the judge said.

    "The prosecutor concluded that the memorandum was supported by other sources with which he consulted. He also requested that his findings be appended to the dossier. US authorities informed that they could not provide additional data regarding the launch of the rocket in addition to this memorandum. Thus, additional information on the launch of the rocket was not attached to the dossier, "summed up the presiding judge.

    According to Steenheys, in this way, the prosecutor was able to review classified documents in confidence. But in fact, during an interview with Fred Westerbeck, it turned out that the Dutch did not have access to American satellite imagery, but could only get acquainted with the report supposedly based on these imagery! "

    Christelle Néant (Agoravox, France)
  • Miron 10 June 2020 06: 38 New
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    US will not show satellite photo of rocket launch on MH17
    ***
    There is no such picture. Because it cannot be.
    The United States has a snapshot of a missile launch on another plane. On a military aircraft APU with the American CIA mercenaries. This is not a satellite image. And it is dangerous both for the US spy who made it, and for the investigation under MH17, since it disavows the whole process, like a screen for American military intervention in the affairs of Ukraine.
  • NF68 10 June 2020 16: 15 New
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    Have you really lost these pictures?