Project 20380 corvettes for the Black Sea Fleet: the first in a few months


The conclusion of the "Zealous" from the boathouse. Severnaya Verf Shipyard, December 25, 2019


From 2008 to 2018, the Russian Navy received six corvettes, pr. 20380 "Steregushchiy". These ships were distributed between the Baltic and the Pacific fleets. The construction of the Guardians is ongoing, and this year it is possible to surrender one or two new corvettes. In particular, the Black Sea Fleet can get its first ship, pr. 20380 - the “Retivy" has already been launched and after completion it will go for testing.

Construction time


The Retivy is the sixth serial ship of pr. 20380 and the first to be built in the interests of KChF. The laying of the corvette took place on February 20, 2015 at the Severnaya Verf shipyard in St. Petersburg. Construction took about five years. The ship was taken out of the boathouse on December 25, 2019 and launched on March 12 this year, after which it was sent to the wall for completion. To date, a crew has also been formed. He has already arrived in St. Petersburg to undergo training.

On May 18, Izvestia published actual plans for the Zealous. With reference to sources in the command of the KChF and Navy, it is reported that the corvette can be completed, tested and delivered to the customer this year. However, it is not yet ruled out that the work will be delayed, and the ship will be handed over only in 2021.

The Zealous will become the first ship of its type in the Black Sea Fleet, and new ones will follow. Plans for the construction of two more similar corvettes are reported. One of them, “Strict”, was launched last June and is being completed at the wall. It is expected to be tested.

Technical features


At its core, the corvette, pr. 20380 is a multi-purpose patrol ship near and far sea zone. He is able to strike at ground and coastal targets, to carry out anti-aircraft and anti-submarine defense - both independently and as part of a naval group. A number of design features and the composition of the equipment provide high performance characteristics that meet modern requirements.


Launching. March 12, 2020

The ship with a total displacement of 2250 tons and a maximum length of 104,5 m is built on the basis of the original hull with improved characteristics. Its underwater part is characterized by reduced resistance, which allows to optimize the power plant with a simultaneous increase in driving performance. The surface part of the structure is made using stealth technologies and reduces visibility by about three times in comparison with ships of similar sizes.

General contours and design features contribute to reduced visibility. So, the superstructure and some units on the deck are covered with bulwarks. Non-metallic materials with a low level of reflection of radio signals are widely used in the design of the surface of the ship. Also used modern electronic warfare equipment.

The corvette has a two-shaft power plant based on diesel-diesel units DDA12000 with a total capacity of 24 thousand hp It consists of noise reduction solutions borrowed from submarines. The ship is capable of speeds of 27 knots; economic - 14 knots. Cruising range - 4 nautical miles. The ship also uses four 000 kW diesel generators.

Etc. 20380 provides for the use of a developed electronic complex. It includes the Sigma-20380 combat information and control system, the Puma-02 armament control complex, Pal-N, Furke-2 and Monument-A radar for various purposes, and the Zarya- sonar sonar stations 2 "," Minotaur-M "and" Anapa-M ", as well as other systems and tools.


"Stereguschiy" - the head corvette, pr. 20380

As the main strike weapons used missile system "Uranus" with an ammunition of 8 missiles. There is a Redut air defense system with 12 missiles. Also used in air defense are those carried on board the Igla MANPADS. The artillery includes the A-190 installation with a 100 mm gun and two AK-630M six-barrel assault rifles. The installation of heavy machine guns and anti-sabotage grenade launchers is provided. Along the sides of the hull are mounted two four-tube apparatus "Package-NK" for torpedoes and anti-torpedoes. There is a helipad at the stern, and a hangar is made in front of it in the superstructure.

The crew of the ship includes 100 people, including 14 officers. Autonomy on stocks - 15 days.

New opportunities


Corvettes, etc. 20380, incl. the newest “Retive”, are multifunctional combat units capable of solving a wide range of combat missions within the near and far sea zone. At the same time, due to their limited size and displacement, the “Guardians” are relatively simple and cheap.

By the combination of technical and economic parameters, the ships of Project 20380 are of great interest to the Russian Navy, which has already led to the emergence of several orders and the deployment of mass construction. Six ships were built, four more are on the slipways or at the walls. The construction of modernized corvettes of new projects 20385 and 20386 is also underway.

Of the six corvettes built, pr. 20380, four went to serve as part of the Red Banner Baltic Fleet. The remaining two went to the Pacific Ocean. Now we are talking about the transfer of new ships to the KChF. In 2020-21. Black Sea sailors will receive two such combat units, and in the distant future a third is expected.


Corvettes of the Pacific Fleet. Soon the same "grouping" will receive the Black Sea

At present, the surface forces of the KChF include one missile cruiser and six guard frigates, as well as ships for the protection of the water area, small missile and anti-submarine ships. Corvette guard ships are not yet available. Thus, the transfer of corvettes pr. 20380 should significantly change the appearance and capabilities of the Black Sea Fleet. The Flying and the next two ships will occupy an important niche and will take on some of the tasks that are being assigned to other ships.

Desired Future


According to the results of the current construction, KChF will receive a grouping of six patrol ships of two classes. Three frigates, pr. 11356, capable of operating in the distant sea and ocean zones, already exist and are serving. Corvettes under construction, pr. 20380 will complement them. At the same time, the appearance of new ships of smaller displacement, having similar capabilities, will make it possible to some extent compensate for the disruption of the construction of larger frigates.

Ship groups, including new corvettes, will be able to work in the Black and Mediterranean Seas. The task of the ships of pr. 20380 will be the search and detection of all the main targets with the possibility of their destruction by appropriate weapons. At the same time, depending on the combat mission, the corvette can take on the main or auxiliary role.

The Russian Navy has extensive experience in operating corvettes, pr. 20380, and the industry over the past years has managed to correct all of the existing design flaws. The Black Sea Fleet will receive full-fledged warships with wide capabilities, capable of becoming a good addition to the existing surface forces. Joint operation of ships of different classes with different equipment and weapons will give the desired results.

The introduction of any new ships into the KChF increases the overall potential of the armed forces in the strategic south-west direction. Over the next few years, three new corvettes will be such a contribution to defense. Already this year, the first of them will be tested. And in the absence of significant difficulties, at the end of the year he will be handed over to the fleet, and at the beginning of 2021 he will enter the combat force.
Author:
Photos used:
Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, USC
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  1. Mavrikiy 19 May 2020 05: 07 New
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    Corvettes of the Pacific Fleet. Soon the same "grouping" will receive the Black Sea
    "Not that you sculpt Kolya." (film) It's time to start the Mediterranean squadron them. F. Ushakova. repeat World Cup - dead end, appendix. Why did they take Crimea? We’ll get the adversary from him.
    1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 08: 12 New
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      The Mediterranean Squadron named after St. Nicholas of Tsusimsky sounds better wink
      1. Bear040 20 May 2020 11: 33 New
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        Get St. Nicholas Khal-Khin-Golsky!
    2. Kalmar 19 May 2020 08: 54 New
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      Quote: Mavrikiy
      It's time to start a Mediterranean squadron

      Atlantic then, why stop there halfway?
      1. Alex777 19 May 2020 11: 51 New
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        At present, the KChF surface forces include one missile cruiser and six frigate guard patrols.

        Well, there are no 6 frigates. 3 of them in total:
        Three frigates, pr. 11356, capable of operating in the distant sea and ocean zones, already exist and are serving.

        Early to the Atlantic. request
        1. alexmach 19 May 2020 12: 56 New
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          Well, there are no 6 frigates. 3 of them in total

          + 2 guard
          + 1 new museum
          1. Alex777 19 May 2020 15: 31 New
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            Old men will pull on corvettes.
            Of their peers, frigates are 1155. And then after modernization.
            The frigates and 11356 are barely pulling: 20386 will surpass them in all respects.
            Well, my post to which you answered consists of citations of the article. hi
            1. alexmach 19 May 2020 16: 40 New
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              20386 will surpass them in all respects

              Provided that it will be completed at all ...
              1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 17: 03 New
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                It is doubtful. And apparently at the top they realized and stirred, judging by the hearing of the resumption of a series of pr.20380
            2. venik 19 May 2020 17: 47 New
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              Quote: Alex777
              The frigates and 11356 are barely pulling: 20386 will surpass them in all respects.

              ==========
              And can you clarify which ones ("articles")? By range, autonomy, firepower? request
              1. Alex777 19 May 2020 20: 48 New
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                You have listed everything correctly. bully
                Of course, I know that in VO there are many opponents of this project.
                I presume that the re-laying in the presence of the president alludes to 2 UKKS.
                1. alexmach 19 May 2020 22: 52 New
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                  I presume that the re-laying in the presence of the president hints at 2 UKKS

                  A very strange assumption, but if he also invited Medvedev for the company, would this hint at 3 UKKS? And in addition to the whole composition of the government + with the patriarch, maybe all 4 would fit in?
                  1. Alex777 19 May 2020 23: 50 New
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                    Very strange assumption

                    Not at all. A photo of the layout which was demonstrated last year was given below. Link to the article, too. You might be interested.
                    You are a serious gentleman. Do not remember the Patriarch in vain. hi
                    1. alexmach 20 May 2020 09: 18 New
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                      Link to the article, too.

                      Indeed, there was information about reprofiling him into a "small frigate." Well, let's see what happens. It has been built for too long, and too expensive, and many controversial decisions have been applied in it. Like that deck deck for a helicopter and the incomprehensible placement of the radar.

                      And what about the argument that cobal of greater displacement is needed for the northern seas - it’s either finished like that, only the Albatrosses somehow serve in the Northern Fleet after all? Probably 20380 could serve. And as far as I understand, the weather conditions in the Barintsev Sea and the Sea of ​​Okhotsk are not very different. Although yes, the argument that in addition to the Barents Sea there is an NSR, and the ship needs more autonomy for operations at a distance from the bases is also logical.
                      1. timokhin-aa 20 May 2020 09: 40 New
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                        There is a serious shortage of power for an economical vehicle. At 20380, the dimensions of the body part immersed in water are smaller, and the power of the economic vehicle is higher.

                        In the case of 20386 the ship is larger, the power on the economy. Less. How it was possible to compensate for the "revolutionary" gadgets is an open question.

                        There is such an option that the miracle ship will ALWAYS have to go under the turbines. And then there will be no question of any long range there.
                      2. Alex777 21 May 2020 13: 36 New
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                        It has been built for too long, and too expensive, and many controversial decisions have been applied in it.

                        The solutions on it are the most advanced. And it is clear that time will be required.
                        This is so for everyone. Even for hegemons. Do you know?
                        But without overcoming these difficulties, we will not reach a qualitatively new level in shipbuilding. And you have to go out.
                        Like that deck deck for a helicopter and the incomprehensible placement of the radar.

                        The Yankees made a ship of 14 tons inconspicuous. But it also took the money accordingly. On the third Zamvolte they had to install a simplified steel superstructure instead of composite / wooden.
                        To build an "invisibility" in 3500 tons IMHO is the right decision.
                        In terms of pure fantasy, imagine: "Petrel" flew, where to place it?
                        I would put in this same deck hangar, far from prying eyes. To the "invisible", low-noise ship. wink
                        Of course, this is only possible on the SF or Pacific Fleet. At the Black Sea Fleet - no way.
                        Mercury is here past the box office ... hi
                        I wrote all this to the fact that we are not aware of the tasks for which the ship was designed, and then redesigned.
                        Open sources do not provide reliable information.
                        On Wikipedia, for example, it is still written that the main drawback of the Uran-based missile system is its inability to hit ground targets.
                        But this is not so for a long time. bully
                      3. alexmach 21 May 2020 13: 49 New
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                        In terms of pure fantasy, imagine: "Petrel" flew, where to place it?

                        Well .. for example in the position areas of the Strategic Missile Forces?
                      4. Alex777 21 May 2020 16: 30 New
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                        Well .. for example in the position areas of the Strategic Missile Forces?

                        These areas are already under the sights of the strategic nuclear forces "partners".
                        Nuclear triads create the same for greater stability.
                        SSBNs go to the database to provide a guaranteed response.
                        It’s easier to defend a ship at sea from terrorists (cheaper).
                        B-k's flight speed is low.
                        Dimensions allow discreet placement.
                        Just 4 is normal on one corvette. wink
                        It is better to have it closer to the goal. All IMHO of course.
                        And to find such a ship in the sea to the enemy is a separate problem.
                        For me, a pair of 22350M + 20386 is preferable to a pair of 22350 + 20380. The range of tasks is wider and they are solved better. hi
            3. venik 20 May 2020 12: 40 New
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              Quote: Alex777
              Of course, I know that in VO there are many opponents of this project.

              ========
              I can’t say that the opponent of this project (20380), but I don’t feel any special enthusiasm regarding it! The corvette turned out to be "so-so" .... About the same as many of its "classmates" (in something a little better, in something a little worse .... But in general - quite a "level" (modern corvettes ), but no more! Compare, at least with Turkish corvettes like "Hell" - almost the same, except that the air defense is more impressive ....
              Here 20385 is another matter! These - precisely approach the frigates, with the possible exception of only range, autonomy and seaworthiness. True, they were considered too expensive, so they continue to rivet 20380 ...... A pity!
              -----------
              Quote: Alex777
              I presume that the re-laying in the presence of the president alludes to 2 UKKS.

              =========
              Yes, it doesn’t hint at anything, Alexander! There even 1x8 UKKS 3S14 was hardly shoved (by 20385)! And you say TWO! They simply won’t fit in there! Not to mention the mass!
              1. Alex777 20 May 2020 17: 47 New
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                Yes, it doesn’t hint at anything, Alexander! There even 1x8 UKKS 3S14 was hardly shoved (by 20385)! And you say TWO! They simply won’t fit in there! Not to mention the mass!

                Vladimir!
                Take a look at the photo below. Quite fit.
                Recently, detailed information has become noticeably less.
                Therefore, how much the VI has grown is not clear. hi
                1. venik 21 May 2020 10: 03 New
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                  Quote: Alex777
                  Vladimir! Take a look at the photo below. Quite fit.

                  =========
                  Alexander! What is depicted in FIGURE to which you refer:

                  first: This is not project 20380, but its further development - 20386 (of which you certainly know!).
                  Second: This is just a FIGURE (and no more!), And as we can all see, Not everyone drawings and even models are consistent with what ultimately coming off the slipway!
                  The third: what you take for UKSK 3S14, in fact - UVP SAM Poliment-Redut! UKKS, if it’s ever been “implanted” there (so far, only the Uran missile launcher located inside the superstructure is provided for under construction at Derzkom), it will have to be placed side by side, in the building behind the superstructure (in the vicinity of the helipad), and such a placement raises a number of questions .... In addition, it is unlikely to be UKS 3C14, but rather a “container version” of the “Club-K” type, which exist only in the form layouts! At least there was no data about their shooting tests - NEVER!

                  Fourth: Project 20386 itself turned out to be EXPENSIVE (almost twice as expensive as 20380/20385 and much more expensive than frigates 11356) and much more difficult to manufacture! In fact, in terms of cost and construction time, it is approaching the "Pots" 22350, which are significantly inferior in ALL parameters! Therefore, only one “Daring” is being built, and the plan for the next series is not announced. It can be assumed that this will become clear only AFTER comprehensive tests of the “Daring”. And with a high degree of probability it can be assumed that he will either remain in a single copy, or the greatly simplified version will go into the series, even though some members of the Navy are intensively lobbying this project (including the head of the shipbuilding and weapons department and the operation of the Navy Vladimir Tryapichnikov, to the interview with which you refer).
                  1. Alex777 21 May 2020 12: 57 New
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                    Alexander! What is shown in the FIGURE to which you refer:

                    Vladimir!
                    The picture you brought and the one I suggested you look at (but you didn’t look) are corny different. Absolutely. wink
                    First: This is not project 20380, but its further development - 20386 (which you certainly know about!).

                    Everything that I wrote related exclusively to 20386.
                    About 20380 there was nothing. You read inattentively again. wink
                    Second: This is just a FIGURE (and no more!), And as we all can see, not all drawings and even models correspond to what ultimately comes off the slipway!

                    It's like that. I am sure that there will be pleasant surprises for us in the Mercury project.
                    Third: what you take for UKSK 3S14, in fact - UVP SAM Poliment-Redut! ...

                    I not only brought a photo from UKKS, but also gave a link where these photos are a certain amount.
                    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3901977.html
                    Do not be lazy, look. And then there will be no need to write nonsense. wink
                    A little lower I wrote directly:
                    Look carefully: 2 UKKS for AC.
                    And 2 obscure VPU before.
                    The Commander-in-Chief of the Navy presenting the GDP project said that there are 4 VPU on the ship.

                    Fourth: Project 20386 itself turned out to be EXPENSIVE (almost twice as expensive as 20380/20385 and much more expensive than frigates 11356) and much more complicated to manufacture!

                    I came across cost estimates that disprove your confidence. Exact data is not available to any of us. Secret
                    As for the difficulties in production - this is normal for a brand new ship.
                    And Zamvolt, and littoral ships, and Ford are vivid examples of this.
                    Therefore, only one “Daring” is being built

                    You overslept a bit. The impudent has not been built for a year now. wink
                    The project is reloaded. Build Mercury.
                    Therefore, your further assumptions do not make sense to comment.
                    ... a greatly simplified version will go into the series, even despite the fact that some members of the Navy are vigorously lobbying for this project (including the head of the department of shipbuilding, armament and operation of the Navy Vladimir Tryapichnikov, to whom you refer to an interview) .

                    I am sure that it will be exactly the opposite. Wait and see. hi
                  2. Alex777 21 May 2020 13: 12 New
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                    what you take for UKSK 3S14, in fact - UVP SAM "Poliment-Redut"!

                    Where, on any of the projects 20386, did you see the Poliment radar? bully
                    On the “Insolent" was Redoubt. At the "Marine" forum they even calculated the length of the missiles that could get into these VPU. wink
        2. Vlad Malkin 19 May 2020 18: 35 New
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          Quote: Alekh777
          The frigates and 11356 are barely pulling: 20386 will surpass them in all respects.


          And you did not forget about the displacement and seaworthiness? 2500 tons for 20386 and 4050 tons for 11356! And about the living conditions on a long trip?
          1. Alex777 19 May 2020 21: 16 New
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            I did not forget anything. hi
            This is the initial Daring project:
            Crew - 80 people (14 officers)
            Length - 109 m, Width - 15 m, Draft - 4,3 m
            Full displacement - 3400 t
            Full speed - 30 knots
            Cruising range on an economic course - 5000 miles.
            https://dfnc.ru/katalog-vooruzhenij/boevye-korabli-vmf/proekt-20386/
            This is what 20386 of the future looks like:

            https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3901977.html
            1. Vlad Malkin 19 May 2020 21: 32 New
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              I agree, I made a mistake, but still less! So seaworthiness is 11356 higher. And on strike weapons: how can you compare Caliber with Uranus? And the price is 20386? And in general, is it possible to compare a frigate with a corvette, even a large one?
              1. Alex777 19 May 2020 21: 43 New
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                Look carefully: 2 UKKS for AC.
                And 2 obscure VPU before.
                The Commander-in-Chief of the Navy presenting the GDP project said that there are 4 VPU on the ship.
                I did not find any details, but I am sure that despite the fact that the add-in has become shorter (removed the place for Uranus), the VI has grown slightly.
                There is information that in UKKS it is already possible to put 9M96 packages.
                And what is inferior to the new 20386 11356?
                Therefore, there was such a statement:
                That 20386 will completely replace 11356.
                https://flotprom.ru/2019/%D0%92%D0%BC%D1%8412/
                1. Vlad Malkin 19 May 2020 22: 03 New
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                  So there is none! And it will not be soon, since there are no turbines or electric motors to it! And the money was spent! During this time, 20380 could be riveted. The technology is worked out! But there seems to be a problem with diesels! And before AU - this is most likely 2 VPU Reduta.
                  1. Alex777 19 May 2020 22: 44 New
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                    Yes, no yet. At 2022 promise.
                    And the 20350M is not there either. But there will be.
                    The Commander-in-Chief of the Navy just said about 4 VPU?
                    In fact, we have 2 options:
                    1) Before the gun 2 PU Reduta. It is unlikely that they will put 9M96 there. So it will be as much as 64x9M100. Like on 1155. Not bad for self defense.
                    2) Before the cannon 2 shortened UKKS. 9M96 there will be more than 32.
                    Both options are better than 24 Calm-1 missiles. IMHO.
                    There is a package for 20386. Subtle. Electric movement.
                    And that which we still have no idea hi
                  2. Vlad Malkin 19 May 2020 22: 53 New
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                    It makes no sense to spend money on 20386, when 22350 are already being built on the sly! And 20386 is not yet in sight. Only brochures and layouts!
                  3. timokhin-aa 20 May 2020 10: 51 New
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                    People do not know about one more little dirty trick from TsMKB Almaz.

                    The fact is that the 6RP gearbox for 20386 is a further development of the P055 gearbox from 22350, the main differences lie in the between-gear transmission.
                    All the wheels and gears and body parts there are very similar, made by the same contractor - “Reducer Star” on the same machines and stands.

                    So “ZR” cannot simultaneously do both P055 and 6RP, there are not enough capacities. And in fact, the country will have to choose between 20386 and 22350, industry will not extend both series.

                    With M90FRU turbines, a similar situation.

                    20386 can easily kill 22350. And this is exactly what Diamond is seeking.
                  4. Alex777 20 May 2020 18: 10 New
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                    Alexander!
                    You smoothly got to what kind of ships, in the future, the fleet needs. And this is the main question.
                    KMK fleet will complete the first and second pair of 22350 and will stop there.
                    It would be my will, I built another 4. Although the range of his course is small and air defense is not bad to strengthen.
                    And then the fleet (from 2022, if I’m not mistaken) is going to build 22350M. In which everything should be as it should. smile
                    In my humble opinion, 20386 - can be a very good addition to this ship.
                    20386 can easily kill 22350.

                    No and no again. 22350 can only kill 22350M.
                    Everything is clear with our plans. Timing is sure to creep.
                    And further decisions, apparently, will be made according to the situation.
                    But we can’t do anything here.
                    By the way, the new Euro-corvette will also have 3500 tons of VI.
                    And their frigates - 6000 - 8000 tons. hi
                  5. timokhin-aa 21 May 2020 10: 35 New
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                    And then the fleet (from 2022, if I’m not mistaken) is going to build 22350M. In which everything should be as it should.


                    Do not even rely on:

                    Bookmark such a ship earlier than 2024
                    The construction of such a ship 2029

                    And before that, what will we build?
                  6. Volder 22 May 2020 01: 23 New
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                    Prior to this, we will lay and build 22350 without the letter M, but with 24 launchers for shock missiles.
                  7. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 01: 26 New
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                    This is only if Diamond does not push 20386 or its development. Then on 22350 there will not be enough reducers.
                  8. Volder 22 May 2020 01: 36 New
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                    22350 - a long-standing project, a lot of effort and time was spent on its creation, bringing to mind, a lot of money was invested with an eye on the series. Therefore, the Ministry of Defense will not allow the folding of this frigate for the sake of an adventurous under-frigate-redraw with a narrow modular specialization. The highest ranks in the Defense Ministry, which make the final decision on the shipbuilding program, are unlikely to risk bribing to lobby for the interests of Diamond. Although, corruption at the very top is also possible ...
                  9. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 02: 01 New
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                    Well, so the fleet grabbed onto 22350 and rightly so. the question is that Diamond has a roof in the military-industrial commission, and this level is, as it were, not higher than the ministerial one.
                    the second point in the trick is to simply shove the 20386 series and then explicitly put the MO and Navy in front of the fact that there are not enough gearboxes for all the ships, and at least they need to be given to the units laid down. We are not able to cut useless ships on stelps, unlike the USSR, so ...
                  10. Volder 22 May 2020 23: 27 New
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                    Frigates and corvettes are built for at least 5 years. Is it really impossible to make a couple of gearboxes during this time ?? Is it really impossible to modernize and increase production capacities? Why not build another workshop? And so on ... We fly into space, damn it, but here we cannot solve the problem with gearboxes. All this is strange.
                  11. timokhin-aa 23 May 2020 13: 36 New
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                    I personally think that there are several very high-level agents of influence engaged in sabotage in the military-industrial commission and the MPT.
                    I personally personally suspect one senior executive.
                    But I won’t write about it, Klimov in 2015 hinted about this person, moreover, simply on a corruption topic, and not on the subject of where he really has an employer, he arranged an order immediately, rebounded by a miracle due to the then connections.
                    And I do not have such connections.
                    Let the FSB work they pay money for it.
                  12. Volder 25 May 2020 08: 56 New
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                    But for the FSB you need to give a tip ...
                  13. timokhin-aa 25 May 2020 14: 18 New
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                    Everything is very complicated there.
  • Vlad Malkin 19 May 2020 22: 28 New
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    In general, to replace frigate 11356 there is already frigate 22350! And you need a lot of cheap PLO corvettes, and not the single expensive 20386 super corvettes!
    1. Alex777 19 May 2020 23: 06 New
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      And you need a lot of cheap PLO corvettes

      This is an outdated opinion IMHO.
      Cheap corvettes will not find modern submarines with VNEU.
      And nobody builds other submarines except us. hi
    2. timokhin-aa 19 May 2020 23: 19 New
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      Cheap corvettes will not find modern submarines with VNEU.


      But why?
    3. Alex777 19 May 2020 23: 42 New
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      Alexander!
      I like your articles.
      For
      But why?
      I can only say that the submarines with VNEU Arly Burke is not found. wink
      The example of “Gotland” is, of course, known to you. And how puzzled US NAVY is, you also know.
      And our cheap corvettes will help where Burke failed? request
      https://topwar.ru/33474-iz-varyag-v-amerikancy-zachem-ssha-vzyali-v-lizing-shvedskuyu-submarinu.html
    4. timokhin-aa 20 May 2020 00: 08 New
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      The example of “Gotland” is, of course, known to you. And how US NAVY puzzled you, too, you know


      Are you up to date on the ratio of successful and unsuccessful Gottland attacks? There was something about 1/35 in favor of the Americans, if my memory serves me.
      An important point - after this year of training, the Americans limited themselves to changes in their tactics in the fight against submarines, and not very dramatically. They did not need any new equipment, and freaks like Roger Thompson developed the panic in the press, most likely as part of a cover action.
      Basically, Gottland was catching a parcel from the GAS of an atomic submarine in the hull, and that was all.
      Burke dieseluha is being driven to death like the NPL with VNEU, the only thing that can prevent him is the poor anti-submarine training of the crew, which is now still the place to be.
      Do you have any other arguments?
    5. Alex777 20 May 2020 18: 31 New
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      Why then did they rent it for 2 years? bully
      Burke dizeluhu drives to death like NPL with VNEU,

      Do you believe in it or are there any examples? wink

      First of all, “Gotland” tracked down and conditionally “destroyed” the nuclear submarine - the only one who was a real threat to the Swedes. Multipurpose PLA was to ensure the safety of AUG from attacks from under the water and cover the "dead sector" under the heads of cruisers and destroyers. For which she died first.
      https://flot.com/blog/katastrofa/7830.php?print=Y

      Of course, I was not there. I read what people write.
      I give sources. You set out as a witness to events. wink
    6. timokhin-aa 21 May 2020 10: 33 New
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      I spoke with the Americans on this topic.
      Gottland by the way, our Halibut tracked in the Baltic, this is not the quietest boat.
    7. Alex777 21 May 2020 16: 45 New
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      I understand you correctly that the "cheap corvette" will find submarines with VNEU?
      And that 11356 has a state-of-the-art HAK, which allows such submarines and nuclear submarines to successfully detect Virginia, and its armament allows them to be destroyed?
    8. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 01: 23 New
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      I understand you correctly that the "cheap corvette" will find submarines with VNEU?


      Yes. With the right tactics and group application, or if the submarine does not evade detection.

      And that 11356 has a modern hack


      No, but this is due to the fact that we have saved on them. For India, these same ships came with a good towed ASU.
      If we drive our 11356 through an upgrade with the Bugas installation, which has a low-frequency illumination mode, then, firstly, the acoustic illuminated area around such a ship will grow by orders of magnitude in size, and secondly, its bulb-type GAS will “see” very far when illuminated. If we finalize the ship's CIUS and bring the UKKS to the “full-format” version instead of the trimmed one, this ship will be able to use PLUR.

      In general, to you here -
      Time.
      https://topwar.ru/169164-protivolodochnaja-oborona-korabli-protiv-podlodok-chast-1-gidroakustika.html
      Two.
      https://topwar.ru/169478-protivolodochnaja-oborona-korabli-protiv-podlodok-oruzhie-i-taktika.html
    9. Alex777 22 May 2020 17: 50 New
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      Yes. With the right tactics and group application, or if the submarine does not evade detection.

      Group - how much?
      How much will this group cost? More corvette? wink
      Doesn't the submarine evade detection? Why would she do this? Tired of living?
      If we drive our 11356 through an upgrade with the Bugas installation, which has a low-frequency illumination mode, then, firstly, the acoustic illuminated area around such a ship will grow by orders of magnitude in size, and secondly, its bulb-type GAS will “see” very far when illuminated. If we finalize the ship's CIUS and bring the UKKS to the “full-format” version instead of the trimmed one, this ship will be able to use PLUR.

      You understand that no one will do this?
      And you understand that if all this is done 11356 will lose the main advantage - their notorious "cheapness"? bully
    10. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 19: 38 New
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      Group - how much?
      How much will this group cost? More corvette?


      Typical KPUG 3-4 ship.

      How much will this group cost? More corvette?


      I have a feeling that you only saw warships in the pictures, but you have an Opinion.
      A group of corvettes. Why a group? Because there are always groups against modern submarines, in our terminology - ship search and strike.

      Doesn't the submarine evade detection? Why would she do this? Tired of living?


      The task will be to force narrowness and exit into the combat use area behind it and will have to break through, rather than evade.
      On this insoluble problem of submarines is based the very possibility of creating the boundaries of PLO. And this is one of the reasons why anti-submarine ships exist - to create such lines.

      You understand that no one will do this?


      It depends on how you shake.
    11. Alex777 24 May 2020 16: 18 New
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      Good answer. Meaningful. Thank you hi
  • Vlad Malkin 20 May 2020 11: 54 New
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    I will add to my comment yesterday: But for the Northern Fleet, not PLO corvettes are needed, but inexpensive PLO frigates. All the same, the conditions are harsh, the corvettes will not cope, they will be small. And on diesels or turbines - this is up to specialists.
  • Alex777 20 May 2020 20: 23 New
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    The only thing that surprises me is that the first 20386 will go not to the Northern Fleet, but to the Black Sea Fleet. Something has changed a lot. What exactly - wait and see.
  • Bear040 20 May 2020 11: 36 New
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    20386 is generally a utopia, since it was designed for turbines that are not enough for frigates and, in fact, is not a universal ship, since it cannot take ALL its modules aboard, and without them it is inferior to any universal ship!
  • Alex777 21 May 2020 16: 14 New
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    Scows full of mullet ...
    And how do you rate HAC at 11356?
    How do you like obsolete TA?
    How many targets can this ship fire at a time?
    What is the maximum speed of air targets?
    These parameters for a warship are just as important as the VI. hi
    As for living on a long hike - compare crew 20386 and 11356.
    Questions themselves will disappear. bully
    1. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 01: 24 New
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      As for living on a long hike - compare crew 20386 and 11356.


      And who will lead the struggle for survivability at 20386, if that?
      1. Alex777 22 May 2020 21: 36 New
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        This is not a submarine with a metalwork. smile
        1. timokhin-aa 22 May 2020 21: 39 New
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          Who cares. A small crew means there may not be enough people for the emergency parties, they will have to remove them from military posts, shift.
          1. Alex777 23 May 2020 14: 52 New
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            IMHO, of course, but on armadillos the struggle for survivability mattered.
            The pace of hostilities was very low.
            How many full-scale combat operations will a modern ship survive?
            How many crew members do you need for a frigate? hi
          2. timokhin-aa 23 May 2020 15: 10 New
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            I will not answer in principle.

            In the 80s, there were enough combat examples of missile ships struck by missiles or sea mines that were lost due to the poorly conducted struggle for survivability and saved thanks to a well-established struggle for survivability.

            A person who makes such self-confident statements regarding this matter as you are making should be able to list them even when he is raised at night.

            And if you really be careful, you can pick up an atomic submarine struck by depth charges up to laying on the ground, the crew of which was able to see the sky overhead thanks to skills in the struggle for survivability.

            Although this is already permissible not to know, but rubbish about armadillos takes you beyond people who deserve to be explained to them ..
          3. Alex777 23 May 2020 15: 29 New
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            And if you really be careful, you can pick up an atomic submarine

            I deliberately withdrew the submarines from our discussion even earlier. You know that.
            A surface ship is a slightly different topic.
            Although this is already permissible not to know, but rubbish about armadillos takes you beyond people who deserve to be explained to them ..

            Armadillos are not rubbish, but exaggeration. wink
            Question: what kind of crew is necessary for a successful struggle for survivability on a frigate, really difficult for you. Here it is necessary either to answer or to merge.
            And your statement that the crew of 80 people is insufficient is becoming unfounded.
            However, I never insisted on our communication. hi
  • Cyril G ... 22 May 2020 21: 16 New
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    The 386th should not be compared with pr.11356 at all.

    It must be compared with either frigate pr.22350, to which pr.20386 is rapidly trying to compare with the price.
    Or you need to compare with pr.20380 / 20385.
    And in both cases, Cheeky Mercury will look extremely pale
    1. Alex777 23 May 2020 15: 17 New
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      The 386th should not be compared with pr.11356 at all.

      The leadership of the Navy was going to change 11356 to 20386. Therefore, we compare them.
      It must be compared with either frigate pr.22350, to which pr.20386 is rapidly trying to compare with the price.

      The postulate of equal price is not proven. I saw calculations proving the opposite. It will be necessary - you will also find. And keep in mind that this is the price of the first, innovative ship.
      For some reason, the Yankees cost Ford at times higher than the cost of Nimitz with a comparable VI and nothing. wink
      Or you need to compare with pr.20380 / 20385.

      What is there to compare? Autonomy? Seaworthiness? Range bully
      Do you, or someone else, have reliable information about the composition of REO 20386?
      And in both cases, Cheeky Mercury will look extremely pale

      You have the right to your opinion. I'm on my own. And the future will put everything in its place.
      But I expect that re-laying in the presence of GDP will lead to the appearance of version 20386 with 2 UKKS after the gun and 2 VPU in front of it. As in the photograph I brought.
      Such a corvette 20386 and frigate 22350M - these are the ships behind which the future of our fleet. IMHO. hi
      1. Cyril G ... 23 May 2020 16: 57 New
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        GDP will lead to the appearance of version 20386 with 2 UKKS after the gun and 2 VPU in front of it.

        At a price even higher than pr.22350?
        Such a corvette 20386 and frigate 22350M - these are the ships behind which the future of our fleet. IMHO.

        Such a ship as the 386th is the way to the next Tsushima
        The postulate of equal price is not proven. I saw calculations proving the opposite. It will be necessary - you will also find. And keep in mind that this is the price of the first, innovative ship.

        We have OCD and R&D paid separately, so yes, 2 times more expensive than a serial corvette ....
        The leadership of the Navy was going to change 11356 to 20386.

        nonsense, officially announced that this is a new corvette, it changes in a series of pr.20380, bookmarks of a series of pr.20380 stopped. Do you think no one remembers what happened 3-4 years ago?
        1. Alex777 23 May 2020 17: 05 New
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          nonsense, officially announced that this is a new corvette, it changes in the series pr.20380

          Everyone read it except you:
          https://flotprom.ru/2019/%D0%92%D0%BC%D1%8412/
          bully
        2. Cyril G ... 23 May 2020 17: 42 New
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          Clearly, we are not friends with logic. And why didn’t you try to think about changing the 11356 project? It will have to be changed in 30 years. Now the money spent on surface ships in the fleet is not on the OVR (that is, on corvettes on Project 20380 and minesweepers), and not on DMZ ships Project 22350 are equivalent to the act of state treason .....
          Your reference is, by the way, 3 years after the bookmark of Daring about which they screamed that THIS is instead of corvettes, so the right is not worth it. By the way, since when are we on you?
        3. Alex777 23 May 2020 20: 12 New
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          By the way, since when are we on you?

          I do not like? Then do not write to adults, strangers: "nonsense."
          And why didn’t you try to think about changing the 11356 project?

          Do you belong to the category of wiseacres who believe that the fleet’s leadership is a crap? It's not me who said about the replacement? bully
          At one time, the Yankees cut many fresh ships.
          Including atomic cruisers.
          The goal was one - to reduce the cost of ownership by maximizing unification.
          Simplify logistics. Simplify training, etc., etc.
          My IMHO - when they can build the right amount of 20386 (and the Yankees are impudent and demand not to strengthen the Black Sea Fleet), I would send 11356 to the Hawks to the BF. They have a lot in common. But the cost of such a relocation, of course, is not known to me.
          which cried that IT instead of corvettes

          Tempting again to "you"? wink
          Let us leave aside who said what when the INF Treaty was alive.
          Do you, at least a little, understand how much the situation has changed over these 3 years?
          And thank God that there is a reaction to these changes and a project with UKKS has appeared.
          Although I carefully monitored this topic from the very beginning and in all authoritative sources there was a mention of UKKS at 203856.
          And yes, I thought and I think that the corvette should be in 3500 VI and with 2 (+1/2) UKKS.
          A frigate should be in 8000 tons and with 6 UKKS. And that’s all. hi
        4. Cyril G ... 23 May 2020 20: 48 New
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          the corvette should be in 3500 VI and with 2 (+1/2) UKKS.

          It is trash and pointless. Corvette is primarily a PLO ship, to ensure the deployment of strategic nuclear forces and general operations. They need a lot. An attempt to ram the frigate’s armament into a BMZ ship is simply ridiculous. At the price he will undoubtedly surpass pr.22350, but he will frankly fuck. We need at sea as many ASH carriers as possible and this runs counter to the price and complexity of the 386th ..
          The minimum need of the fleet is 24 ships, then we can at least be ready for KPUG to the fleet. In the North and Pacific Fleet, two .....
          when they can build the right amount 20386

          Hopefully not build. To this day, blocks that are not docked will be dismantled for metal, losses will be blamed on the initiators.
          What fleet management coots sit?

          And that too. Although to a lesser extent. For the most part, there is something completely different.
          "nonsense."

          This is a fact that you rushed to refute. It didn’t work out. Be careful with judgment.
          of all authoritative sources was a mention of UKKS at 203856.

          Are you about 385th, or about 386 ??? If it’s about the 386th, why do you, uh, mislead the people, it was originally said that the Caliber would be taken in containers and no UKKS there smelled.


          How do you find on the images available Daring UKKSK lighthouse, okay? 2 UKKS is already on the continuation of a scam called Mercury.
          In the pictures in the nose of PU Redoubt by the way
          By the way, a cool scam

          How do you find the word rewritten on the board, say, okay?

          The tale is a lie, but a hint in it, by the way for some reason I believe it is easy. For I haven’t seen such a thing in my own fleet either.
        5. Cyril G ... 23 May 2020 21: 48 New
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          We must proceed from the fact that CORVETTE, the BMZ ship should do.
          Regarding PLO:
          - search and destruction of submarines, for which he must have a low-frequency hack Minotaur with GPBA + sap
          - destruction of submarines. PLUR with Dstr 25-35 km, 330 mm torpedoes and anti-torpedoes for self-defense and protection of guarded ships, possibly RBU.
          2x4 330 mm Package-NK, better in option - light TA, 2x4 UPU Uranus / Answer-Short, RBU-6000 (optional) ...
          Regarding air defense, the most minimal option:
          - at least 4 shooting channels are needed, which the AK-176MA, Duet, SAM Posna can provide at a minimum
          - RES - Puma, Positive
          Shock - 2x4 UPU Uranus and Answer-Short, without Monolith, purely for firing with an external control unit
          Runway - (optional tank for 5 tons TS-1), without a permanent hangar, optionally - a small "hangar" for storing 1-2 UAVs
          Autonomy 2 weeks, GEM - a couple of Kolomna diesels, in / and not more than 1800-2100 tons, stroke up to 27 knots
        6. Alex777 24 May 2020 19: 58 New
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          Kirill!
          You took the time and detailed your point of view. Thank you
          I’ll make a reservation right away - I don’t know anything about those who invented 20386.
          In no way am I their supporter or defender.
          I will try to answer your 2 posts right away.
          Corvette is primarily a PLO ship, to ensure the deployment of strategic nuclear forces and general operations. They need a lot. An attempt to ram the frigate’s armament into a BMZ ship is simply ridiculous.

          Armament corvette is it?
          Regarding PLO:
          - search and destruction of submarines, for which he must have a low-frequency hack Minotaur with GPBA + sap
          - destruction of submarines. PLUR with Dstr 25-35 km, 330 mm torpedoes and anti-torpedoes for self-defense and protection of guarded ships, possibly RBU.
          2x4 330 mm Package-NK, better in option - light TA, 2x4 UPU Uranus / Answer-Short, RBU-6000 (optional) ...

          It seems to me pointless to build ships with such weapons and 2 weeks of autonomy (20385).
          The cost of the ship's hull is approximately 15%. The rest is the cost of weapons and REO.
          Therefore, the VI with such weapons should be larger. What is there in mind?
          In addition to 20386 with 2 UKKS another project that suits your requirements for armaments and mine to VI, I just do not see. To and PLUR, and Package, and strike weapons.
          We need at sea as many carriers of the SAC as possible and this runs counter to the price and complexity of the 386th.

          Huck carriers - yes, they are needed. Maybe not expensive.
          But then someone must destroy this discovered submarine.
          And the helicopter from it should be able to take off not 2-3 times.

          Let's get back to my statements.
          When there was no 2019 model yet. but there were those pictures of Derzky that you were not too lazy to bring (I have several times more in my archive), I came across information about UKKS on 20386. And I, like you, could not understand where they would come from.
          On various resources, this has been discussed in detail.
          The appearance of a new model last year brought some understanding.
          Today I read reviews about the launching of Admiral Golovko.
          The main question is there a GEM on it or not? Sad hi
  • timokhin-aa 19 May 2020 22: 38 New
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    20386 will surpass them in all respects.


    For example, for what?
    1. Alex777 19 May 2020 23: 04 New
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      Alexander!
      You wrote an article on VO:
      "Worse than a crime. Building the corvettes of project 20386 is a mistake."
      Your arguments are clear to me. I do not agree with them.
      Thank you for paying attention to my post. hi
      The future will judge us. wink
      1. timokhin-aa 19 May 2020 23: 18 New
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        But I still wonder what you mean.
        1. Alex777 19 May 2020 23: 45 New
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          Thank you again for your attention. drinks
          If interest persists until tomorrow, we will return to this topic.
          1. timokhin-aa 20 May 2020 00: 13 New
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            Well, that is, it’s just blind faith and that’s it.
            Okay.
        2. bayard 20 May 2020 00: 57 New
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          He just likes him. Aesthetically ... Similar to Zamvolt.
          Well, also because it’s expensive, which means it’s very good.
          The concept of efficiency: price, quality, quantity (possible on the existing budget).
          It was suggested that 20386 are designed for the SF - with increased autonomy. request But I’m still closer to the idea of ​​a light frigate PLO and IPC in a new guise - specialized specifically for PLO.
          And no one has yet been able to argue their commitment to 20386 ... why corvette at the price of frigate 22350?
          1. Alex777 20 May 2020 18: 20 New
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            He just likes him. Aesthetically ...
            Well, also because it’s expensive, which means it’s very good.

            You’re talking about Mercedes. wink
            At my age and with my experience, external is not critical. hi
            I managed to make such projects (on a national scale) in my life that no one has yet been able to at least repeat them. Although there have been attempts. bully
            1. bayard 20 May 2020 20: 08 New
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              hi At my age, there is also something to remember.
              Including "state scale".
              In 1992, one of my programs saved an entire industry (leading in the modern Russian economy) from collapse. bully The truth was realized under a different name, but I'm not offended. smile
            2. Alex777 20 May 2020 20: 25 New
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              Then we can only: drinks
              My achievements by the year 2000 relate.
              However, I'm still in business.
              Therefore, there is no time to argue. hi
        3. Cyril G ... 22 May 2020 21: 18 New
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          And no one has yet been able to argue their commitment to 20386 ... why corvette at the price of frigate 22350?

          +100500. And really why !!!!?
    2. Cyril G ... 22 May 2020 21: 17 New
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      Actually, Comrade Timkhin was extremely seasoned and accurate with estimates .....
  • Mavrikiy 20 May 2020 06: 04 New
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    Quote: Kalmar
    Atlantic then, why stop there halfway?

    Based in New York? fool The quieter you go, the further you'll get.
  • Serg65 19 May 2020 12: 29 New
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    Quote: Mavrikiy
    World Cup - dead end, appendix

    Behind the squadron them. Ushakov, whom do you appoint, Comrade Admiral?
  • svp67 19 May 2020 05: 08 New
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    I’m looking at the photos of these new corvettes and I don’t understand why they have so much rust on the body, and everyone has it. They, that for the sake of economy they didn’t even cover with a manic?
    1. Sergey_G_M 19 May 2020 06: 06 New
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      Do not worry! This is such a steampunk Pankavian style: rust, Kuzya smokes like a volcano, this is normal, it was planned! )))
      But seriously, all ships with rust if these are not advertising retouched photos.

      Arly burke
    2. Serg65 19 May 2020 12: 31 New
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      Quote: svp67
      and why they have so much rust on the body

      Because stupid people put them in the water laughing
      1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 12: 42 New
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        Like traces of a meerk and mistaken for traces of rust. And in the corvettes 20380-20385, the superstructure does not rot at all, it is composite. Corvette project 20380 "Retivy" on completion. Fresh photo for April 2020.

        1. Serg65 19 May 2020 12: 55 New
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          Quote: Bashkirkhan
          Like traces of a meerk and mistaken for traces of rust

          In an aggressive environment, and sea water does not distill at all, rust will manifest itself in a month ... even if only standing at the wall ..
          1. svp67 19 May 2020 14: 49 New
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            Quote: Serg65
            In an aggressive environment, and sea water does not distill at all, rust will manifest itself in a month ... even if only standing at the wall ..

            Yes, yes ... only the boatswain in such greenhouse conditions drove his kids, gave them paint and brushes in their teeth and forth, on arbors and rafts, to eliminate defects ...



            1. Serg65 20 May 2020 08: 46 New
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              Quote: svp67
              .but only the boatswain in such greenhouse conditions drove his kids

              The namesake, in the first place, it is not always possible to expose the gazebo and raft, and secondly ... in Soviet times, no one took into account the redhead and ball paint laughing
        2. svp67 19 May 2020 14: 48 New
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          Quote: Bashkirkhan
          . And in the corvettes 20380-20385, the superstructure does not rot at all, it is composite.

          And the corps ...? Rust then massively peers at them ...
          1. Serg65 20 May 2020 09: 07 New
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            +2

            Sergey, here are the ships at the Mine Wall of Sevastopol ... quite decent

            In the background, the ships of the most flawed fleet, popularly called the OVSiGA, on Telephon, are also quite decent except for Istra (the nose sticks between the SR-568 and the Stvor GS) and PK 12050 (but these life mates are like that laughing )
            The namesake, we don’t know where they were and what the ships were doing before the photo shoot .. recourse do not judge strictly..
  • 7,62h54 19 May 2020 05: 17 New
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    Head around the future possibilities of the Black Sea Fleet. The words "can", "give", "receive", etc. are used in the article 17 times.
    1. antivirus 19 May 2020 08: 06 New
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      "deflection is counted" and so fall into the tops of world information resources. MO will celebrate VO. I'm still waiting for the critical ones - and they are only about "no 100 thousand tons." then the characters are perfect.
      All enemy ports should be locked onto the chain when our frigate corvettes are approaching!
      as it was: "Achtung, Achtung in the sky Pokryshkin"
    2. Nemchinov Vl 19 May 2020 19: 37 New
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      Quote: 7,62x54
      The words "can", "give", "receive", etc. are used in the article. 17 times.
      well-uh-such-her .... Kirill has his corporate identity, at least. Usually 37 times to swap words (and paragraphs) is not a problem (!). He can !!
  • NEXUS 19 May 2020 06: 02 New
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    Construction took about five years.

    A long, very long time! Corvette class ships should be built in one and a half to two years.
    1. Serg65 19 May 2020 12: 33 New
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      Quote: NEXUS
      Corvette class ships should be built in one and a half to two years.

      Of course they should ... why aren't they being built?
    2. arkadiyssk 19 May 2020 20: 03 New
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      Is it possible to equal China? What are one and a half to two years? China built its series of corvettes 056A from 2012 to 2020 - 72 pieces, i.e. 1.5 MONTHS for the construction of a corvette !!! But to dream of a year and a half for construction with us, in comparison with a month and a half, is it completely embarrassing for them?
  • Nice painted perspective. We are waiting for the end of the year.
    1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 08: 15 New
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      Two years later, the corvette may come to the Black Sea Fleet. Not earlier. Look at the timelines of how much the “Loud” corvette of project 20385 was built and are testing. And he has not yet tested his own air defense system with a new mast in Ladoga.
      1. Kalmar 19 May 2020 08: 57 New
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        Quote: Bashkirkhan
        Look at the timing of how much they built and are experiencing the “Loud” corvette of project 20385

        So there is another project. And 20380, sort of, is somehow mastered. Perhaps quickly bring to full readiness.
        1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 09: 25 New
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          I am impressed by your optimism, but let's rely on the facts:
          Corvette “Thundering” - launched on 30.06.17/21.04.19/XNUMX - went to the ZHI XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX
          Corvette “Resistant” - launched on 30.05.12/25.12.13/XNUMX - went to the ZHI on XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX
          Corvette "Boyky" - launched on 15.04.11/27.09.12/XNUMX - went to the ZHI XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX
          1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 10: 52 New
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            Sealed, Corvette "Thundering" project 20385. Corvette "Loud" project 20380.
          2. Serg65 19 May 2020 12: 50 New
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            Quote: Bashkirkhan
            let's rely on the facts

            The facts show that before the Crimean events, corvettes were built faster, although with imperfections! And after the Crimea, construction has stalled .. here and all your facts!
            1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 12: 57 New
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              In the Amur NW, the construction of project 20380 corvettes after the Crimea, by the way, was significantly accelerated.
              1. Serg65 19 May 2020 13: 11 New
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                Quote: Bashkirkhan
                In the Amur NW, the construction of project 20380 corvettes after the Crimea, by the way, was significantly accelerated.

                Because Kolomna diesel engines were the first to go there, and then to the North Shipyard!
                1. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 13: 15 New
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                  The North Shipyard has more orders than it can digest. Often, a full-fledged construction of an order begins a year later, or even more after its official laying.
                  1. Serg65 19 May 2020 13: 40 New
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                    Guardian 2001-2008
                    Savvy 2003-2011
                    Lively 2005-2013
                    Persistent 2006-2014
                    Zealous 2015's
                    Strict 2015s
                    Thundering 2012-2020
                    Agile 2013's
                    Mercury (Impudent) 2016s
                    And there are 9 frigates of which 4 have a delay due to the propulsion system, which does not affect the pace and load of the shipyard. The 9th corvette is generally in doubt, and again not because of the workload of the shipyard. Well, regarding Boyky, the delay in commissioning this corvette concerned the imperfection of the art system!
  • Engineer 19 May 2020 07: 16 New
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    Lord of the moroman,
    Why is this device without a bulb? Gus, all things. Corvette
    1. Sergey_G_M 19 May 2020 07: 56 New
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      Take a closer look at the first photo, there you can see the place for the installation of the boule (the boule itself is not installed) and the contours of the body show that the boule is quite large.
      1. Engineer 19 May 2020 10: 23 New
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        Thank you all for the clarification.
        Overlooked a long "groove" in the nose.
        "I didn’t notice the elephant"
    2. Bashkirkhan 19 May 2020 08: 15 New
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      Quote: Engineer
      Lord of the moroman,
      Why is this device without a bulb? Gus, all things. Corvette

      Bulb installed in a floating dock before the descent. The corvette was rolled out onto the slipway without it.
    3. Avior 19 May 2020 08: 27 New
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      Huck Zarya-M
      Intrilocular

  • Angry 19 May 2020 07: 48 New
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    I see ... gratifying. So quick to the museum, inquisitive and Okay on the needles. Well then, we all are getting old, and ships too. Will wait. But since, in my opinion, these are today our best anti-submarine ships, although also not without flaws, they should be sent to the SSBN to be guarded in the SF and in the Pacific Fleet ... We have trouble everywhere with BMZ PLO! Well, maybe with the exception of the BF.
    1. Volder 25 May 2020 22: 28 New
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      Quote: Angry
      So quick to the museum, inquisitive and Okay on the needles.
      Not certainly in that way. The completely new marching engines of Ukrainian production with the BPC “Kerch” were rearranged to the LAD. As a result, the "Ladny" will serve another 10 years. But on the "Inquisitive" turbines have almost exhausted their resources and there is nothing to replace them with. Overhaul of the Inquisitive is not planned.
  • Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 08: 08 New
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    Why did the author get that destination Black Sea Fleet? Is everything fine with the PLO in the North? And there is the base of the SSBN! If anything!
    - and what about the bookmarks of the new corvettes? They need at least a division for the fleet. The mini. Generally to the North and Pacific Fleet in 2 divisions ....
    1. alexmach 19 May 2020 08: 45 New
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      Why did the author get that destination Black Sea Fleet?

      The author referred to the source actually.
      And this is not the first message that two ships under construction will go to the Black Sea Fleet. It is interesting that, judging by the article, it is planned to lay new ships.
    2. Vladimir1155 19 May 2020 08: 47 New
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      I agree that saturation with surface and other ships of sea waters is pointless, especially in the Baltic and Caspian regions. In the Black Sea Fleet, and so already a sufficient group for a closed water area, it makes sense to add corvettes there only if you transfer frigates to the oceans, where sea forces are not enough for the important tasks of securing the exit and return of nuclear submarines . Moreover, the best way to fill the BS with corvettes would be to transfer there an unnecessary pair from the Caspian
      1. Volder 25 May 2020 22: 36 New
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        Quote: vladimir1155
        At the Black Sea Fleet, and so already a sufficient group for a closed water area, it makes sense to add corvettes there only if you transfer frigates to the oceans, where naval forces are not enough for the important tasks of securing the exit and return of nuclear submarines.
        The Black Sea Fleet operates not only in the Black Sea, but also in the Mediterranean Sea. We have a naval base in Tartus. Frigates and corvettes will be driven there, while a detachment of RTOs like "Buyanov" and "Karakurt", meanwhile, will cover our Crimean shores.
  • alexmach 19 May 2020 08: 43 New
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    Plans to build two more similar corvettes reported

    Very interesting news. So they will still lay 20380.
    1. Vladimir1155 19 May 2020 08: 51 New
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      will be mortgaged, but only on the Amur
      1. alexmach 19 May 2020 08: 53 New
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        It is doubtful to be honest. On the Amur still build-and build for the Pacific Fleet, plus on the SF in general, "the horse did not roll"
        1. Vladimir1155 19 May 2020 17: 06 New
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          for the SF they are small and weak, frigates are needed there (for example, translate 11356 from the Black Sea Fleet), but on the cupid nothing else can be obtained except karakurt and corvettes, the river is small
  • Foxnova 19 May 2020 12: 14 New
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    Zoo at the Black Sea Fleet is another beast

    1164.11356.1135.22160 now 20380 more projects to the god of projects

    About the trifle, I generally keep quiet
    1. alexmach 19 May 2020 12: 29 New
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      IMHO the most appropriate solution.
      1164.11356.1135.22160 now another 20380

      Well yes, let's build another 1135 .. oh no 11356? or maybe 1164?

      The most reasonable thing that can be done to combat the widespread zoo is to just build 20380 and 22350 with a maximum series and saturate the fleets with them.
      1. Foxnova 19 May 2020 13: 03 New
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        I'm talking about a sequence of thoughts ... Instead of building 20380, 11356 began to be made .. 22160 and 20386

        Instead of oblique pu for gauges / onyx, on the old parachutes, 21631 and 22800 began to be made.

        Inclined pu for plur and no

        "Light" and 324 caliber can only be recharged at the factory thanks to the powder start

        SV grabbed onto 20350 and 20380 (yes, I know about Azz) and there’s no one who doesn’t give it to him; nearby stands underloaded Amber and Pella which is clamped with all his might. Now an 800-ton trough was thrown from the bay by kata through the whole country back and forth. Ingenious

        We saw orange a lot of us and he alone
        1. alexmach 19 May 2020 13: 12 New
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          To argue about what has been done in my opinion is useless - this can not be changed in any way.
          11356 - in my opinion, the normal decision was in the condition of a shortage of crew and unavailability of 20380 and 22350.
          22160 - yes, it looks like some kind of scam.
          1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 13: 47 New
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            This had to be done instead of Project 20380. Immediately after the completion of the construction of the first series of Indian Project 11356, taking advantage of the fact that the Shipyard was stirred up, and most importantly suppliers of components ...
          2. Nemchinov Vl 19 May 2020 19: 56 New
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            Quote: alexmach
            To argue about what has been done in my opinion is useless - this can not be changed in any way.
            can not argue with that yes
            1. alexmach 19 May 2020 22: 12 New
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              Fox greatly supplemented the comment to which I replied. Now it’s hard to disagree with him.
        2. Alexey RA 19 May 2020 18: 05 New
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          Quote: FoxNova
          I'm talking about a sequence of thoughts ... Instead of building 20380, they began to do 11356

          Just for 11356 at the time of his order, everything was already ready - the project, allies, the plant. Thanks to the Indians.
          That's just the result, it turned out the other way around - now the vacant seats of the second three frigates 11356 are plugged with 20380 corvettes.
          1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 19: 35 New
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            I repeat 11356 had to be built instead of 20380. To build a series, to stir up a promo and, taking into account experience, to build corvettes for OVR. Then destroyers pr.22350M with a / in 7500-8500 tons.
          2. Nemchinov Vl 19 May 2020 20: 14 New
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            Quote: Alexey RA
            That's just the result, it turned out the other way around - now the vacant seats of the second three frigates 11356 are plugged with 20380 corvettes.
            Well, for now, let's logically (as the most developed project for today), to complete these two for the Black Sea Fleet, and you can still make a couple, but no more !! Well, he is too expensive, for his thrust-weight ratio, it must be changed (!), or at 11664 (on the same GEM, but only it with already 16 cells of the UKKS, i.e., obviously more multipurpose (!), with the same small VI 1900-2000 tons). Or, it’s even better to find a modern one (responsible as Beria L, P watching, with broad powers), and under his supervision urgently bring work on 16SD500 (10000 hp), for a year or two, and creating from them the same "quadruple like DDA-12000 GEM", put on stream, under frigates hybridized toward pr.12441" Thunder "(in VI 2500/2900 tons), increase in size, modern 11664, - proposed by Zelenodolsky design bureau. Only under the two-shaft scheme (and not on one line as originally planned by Thunder !!). And this would be the most promising way out, both for the KChF and for the Pacific Fleet !! winked GEM in 40000 hp, the corvette 11664, which has grown by 1000-1200 tons (towards the Thunder 12441) will be dragged like a seed (!).... And no "Daring-Mercury", do not need to be wise, with their sky-high price !! Moreover, the 6RP gearbox, for its power plant, is also not nearly ready ... It’s not easy to hurt.
        3. alexmach 19 May 2020 18: 13 New
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          The comment above has changed after my answer, it is difficult to disagree with the written one.
        4. Volder 25 May 2020 23: 00 New
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          Quote: FoxNova
          Instead of building 20380 they began to do 11356 .. 22160 and 20386
          All projects are built at different plants:
          20380 - at the Northern Shipyard and NEA
          11356Р - at the Yantar Shipyard
          22160 - at JSC Zelenodolsky Shipyard
          In Zelenodolsk, it is impossible to build ships with too much draft and a displacement of more than 1700 tons.
          Shipyard "Yantar" loaded with BDK 11711 and frigate 11356 for India. 11711 - five-year unfinished construction. You cannot upload even more Amber.
  • g1v2 19 May 2020 13: 25 New
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    I’m more interested in whether there will be a big contract for Pacific Fleet on them? It was said about as many as 10 pieces, we’ll see. Well, so for the corvettes 20380 for good, you need to change all the MPCs to BF, Pacific Fleet and Black Sea Fleet. Including a couple of dozen, you can definitely contract.
    1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 13: 50 New
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      I agree at least 20 dozen, but the main thing should not be about Cheeky Mercury... very expensive and not spectacularly serial. It is necessary to build mastered project 20380. The only thing for him is to refine the air defense and it is necessary to start the PLUR from an inclined PU
      1. g1v2 19 May 2020 16: 50 New
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        For SF just 20386 is better. It is necessary to protect the NSR completely different autonomy than that of 20380. But on the other fleets, 20380 is normal. BF and Black Sea Fleet - closed TVD, 20380 corvettes are needed in the Pacific Fleet first of all. to protect the Bastion in the Sea of ​​Okhotsk. Tch there too will fit. Well, modernization is a constant thing. And by the way, first of all, we need an enhanced modernization of the Ka27 or even a new model of an anti-submarine helicopter. Given that there are no turntables on the IPC, a corvette with them will be more useful.
        1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 17: 01 New
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          The 86th was laid as Daring without a power plant and plainly without a technical project. Three years later, it was reloaded as Mercury. The hull is not formed ... There are no advancements in the GEM, Probably the ship, as it were, would not be twice as expensive as Project 20380. At a price close to almost pr.22350. Sense in such a corvette? There are enough seaworthiness pr.20380 for the North ....
          1. g1v2 19 May 2020 17: 54 New
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            Gorshkov was also laid. Tch is not new. The ship is much more technologically advanced than 20380, plus any new project is always more expensive. The price is not the point here. 20380 unfortunately farther than the Barents Sea will not be able to patrol, and SMP must be protected until the very Chukotka. Again, the more lively shipping by SMP will be, the more forces will be required to protect it. One supertanker or gas carrier is already a tasty target for an enemy submarine or aircraft. Again, island bases must be equipped, the northern delivery also must be protected.
            1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 19: 31 New
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              You do not understand? Corvettes need a lot yesterday. At least on the basis of KPUG, to have 4 naval personnel with a modern hull in Primorye, Kamchatka, the Baltic, the Black Sea, and at least 2 KPUG in the North. Total mini need 24 ships. And every ruble flying past a series is a crime. In formation 7, under construction 5. The mini still needs to be laid 12. Cheeky Mercury from the fact that it was declared conceptually wretched and incredibly expensive. Our fleet does not need a ship at the military base and price that is matched to frigate pr.22350. At the same time, there is no UKKS on it, the storage of the helicopter is made poorly. By the way, I generally question the need for a corvette hangar. No runway, runway and tank needed. You can do without a hangar. Based on the concept that a helicopter can always fly on call. Further, the air defense on it is simply wretched, does not correspond to price and size. Well and most importantly, the gas turbine engine in the series to this day is not there, the required electric motors too. That is, let's think about 4 years have passed since the bookmark. GEM is not. We needed corvettes yesterday. And the price of the corvette is just an essential point. The number of sensors (HAC) in the sea plays a significant role in the organization of a PLO ... Well, do not forget the ship is still more than seaworthy. Do not forget corvettes already went to the Red Sea. Remember the destroyers of World War II with a displacement of 1.5-3 thousand tons calmly plowed the oceans. And for the Barents Sea, pr.20380 is quite good. No wonder his daddy, Albatross went from Vladik to Kamran, and even to Chukotka.
              1. g1v2 19 May 2020 22: 03 New
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                Do you represent the Arctic? And what will happen to a turntable without a heated hangar in the Arctic Ocean with its winds? Have you ever made repairs even at minus 20 cars on the street? Here try and the need for a heated hangar will cease to seem a whim. And the pinwheel will not fly from Gadzhievo if you pass the Tiksi thread somewhere. And the NSR is not only the Barents Sea. which does not freeze and warms up by the Gulf Stream.
                The problem is not money. There is enough money. The problem is in the stocks, resources, working arms and capabilities of the production of mass series of ships. At the same time, about 100 ships, ships and submarines are under construction for the Navy. All at once will not be built. 20386 no one has yet seen the final look, so far there are more speculation than real information. The question "why do we need 20386, if there is 20380" from the category "why do we need su57. If there is su30cm." If the motor is not ready yet, this does not mean that it does not need to be created. In the future, it will be possible to put it on other ships and vessels.
                1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 22: 23 New
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                  Do you represent the Arctic?


                  Of course. I served a quarter century beyond the Arctic Circle

                  And what will happen to a turntable without a heated hangar in the Arctic Ocean with its winds? Have you ever made repairs even at minus 20 cars on the street?


                  Once again, the helicopters are quite kept there on the street. I took part in the repair of the all-terrain vehicle at minus 30. There were two of us. The finger on the caterpillar burst ... This is for example.

                  why do we need 20386


                  20386 is not an analogue of the Su-57, from the appearance it is a complete squalor.
                  If the motor is not ready yet, this does not mean that it does not need to be created.


                  I wouldn’t say a word if I hadn’t immediately slammed the series of pr.20380.
                  It's the fifth year. How's Cheeky Mercury doing ?:
                  However, for five years there have been no bookmarks and pr.20380. All Albatrosses exceeded the thirties if cho.
                  There is enough money.


                  Come on...

                  But the main thing is not in this pr.20386 is not a replacement for pr.20380, he moved to the category of full-fledged frigates for displacement of course ...
                2. Nemchinov Vl 20 May 2020 00: 11 New
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                  Quote: g1v2
                  The problem is not money
                  ?!
                  Quote: g1v2
                  There is enough money.
                  I’m embarrassed to ask to whom and for what ?! But probably not everyone ... And if they are 30-36 billion each, spend on 20386 instead of 22350, then of course they will not be enough !! this is the first.
                  Quote: g1v2
                  Do you represent the Arctic?
                  very mediocre, but when I read ...
                  Quote: g1v2
                  What will happen to a spinner without a heated hangar in the Arctic Ocean with its winds?
                  , and thought about mechanized hangar / elevator for a helicopter (inside 20386), in the cold of -40 degrees., I thought about it .... Is such mechanics reasonable in the northern latitudes ?! Is it better than a stationary hangar ?! It is justified, reasonably priced, and will not fail in wet frost ....?! this is the second
                  Quote: g1v2
                  If the motor is not ready yet, this does not mean that it does not need to be created.
                  You can agree. moreover, the matter is not so much in gas turbine engines as in electric turbines and, most importantly, 6RP gearbox (!),
                  Quote: g1v2
                  In the future, it will be possible to put it on other ships and vessels.
                  but if they appear, .... but isn’t it better to try this GEM to test at 11356 R / M (!).... It is much better refined (tested by the Petrel for years), and at a cost of 9-13 billion more economical (for each unit), and in terms of power, this power plant (planned for 20386) is almost identical to power plant 11356 R / M (there is a difference of about 2000 hp Total)?! Well, they’d try (!)if they give birth to 6RP .... It’s already that for the same period of time, “Yantar” would have given them 4 units to the mountain (instead of 3x with the same funds, 20386 by the North Shipyard), or even faster and cheaper , I think that he doesn’t need an explanation at all ... There is experience over 11356 R, enough ... !! this is the third (!) hi
                  Is it necessary to give birth to a monster in agony and slowly, for the sake of the pursuit of innovation, in the absence of workers / basic units of NK for DMZ ....?! Who needs such “childbirth in agony” ?! request
        2. Vladimir1155 19 May 2020 17: 14 New
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          in the Baltic Fleet and the Caspian Sea, there’s no need for a lot of ships at all, and it’s too much, Dozens of frigates and corvettes are not foreseen even in promises, so replace the old ships with corvettes on the Black Sea Fleet, and strengthen the ocean fleets with frigates, take them all from the Black Sea Fleet and the Baltic Fleet, and Generally, minesweepers and coastal aviation
      2. unknown 19 May 2020 20: 47 New
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        "Bear"?
        1. Cyril G ... 19 May 2020 20: 53 New
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          It is theoretically possible to make a shortened version of the Response / 91P PLUR by cutting the firing distance to 25-30 km, and adding it for an inclined launch from the Uranus launcher.
          1. Angry 22 May 2020 14: 33 New
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            I don’t understand it either, because, well, there is a Uran missile launcher with a flight range of more than 250 km, well, instead of a warhead weighing 145 kg, it’s twice as heavy to load a small-sized torpedo as
            let it fly 50 km. Is that not enough? And put it on your "", you want RCC, you want PLUR. Is that hard to do? Hey!!! Where are you there ???? Uncle Vova, it’s time to wet someone again!
            1. Cyril G ... 22 May 2020 14: 34 New
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              30-35 km is real enough. more than.
    2. Volder 25 May 2020 23: 07 New
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      Quote: g1v2
      Well, so for the corvettes 20380 for good, you need to change all the MPCs to BF, Pacific Fleet and Black Sea Fleet.
      IPC will begin to be made from project 22800 Karakurt, such a decision has already been made: https://vpk.name/news/343019_gluboko_slezhu_karakurtov_prevratyat_v_ohotnikov_za_submarinami.html
      1. timokhin-aa 25 May 2020 23: 27 New
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        Yes, this is a repost of the next delirium of Izvestia. Old Bayan.
  • timokhin-aa 19 May 2020 22: 40 New
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    Izvestia is an extremely unreliable source of information, while there is no evidence that the ships will really go to the Black Sea Fleet.
    That is, they can go, but they can not go.
    Caution is necessary with unambiguous statements.
    1. Kestrel 20 May 2020 19: 17 New
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      You are right that everything can change based on the operational situation, but so far, ships are actually being built for the Black Sea Fleet. Not only Izvestia is writing about this today, but also Wikipedia (the latter has long been)
      1. timokhin-aa 21 May 2020 10: 37 New
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        Well, Wikipedia refers to the press, and the press also refers to someone.
        I don’t argue, maybe at the Black Sea Fleet, it’s just that one cannot approach Lime with blind trust, these guys mess more than the whole country.
    2. Volder 25 May 2020 23: 23 New
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      Quote: timokhin-aa
      Izvestia is an extremely unreliable source of information, while there is no evidence that the ships will really go to the Black Sea Fleet.
      And in Izvestia it was recently written that 6 Karakurt (pr. 22800) will be part of the Black Sea Fleet, and they won’t get to the Northern Fleet at all. To believe or not to believe?
      1. g1v2 26 May 2020 15: 37 New
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        This is just logical, but doing IPC based on Karakurt is not. In general, the need for IPC without turntables is under very great doubt.
  • Kestrel 20 May 2020 19: 15 New
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    Good news. A new multi-purpose ship, for the glorious Black Sea Fleet of Russia, which punished the rabid dogs of Saakashvili and returned to Russia the Crimea stolen from her by DROPS!
  • Angry 20 May 2020 23: 22 New
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    In general, TAM understood the whole BSF weakness from the underwater threat. So far, there is not a single modern anti-submarine ship at the Black Sea Fleet. All BNKs are blind. 4-10 km detection of DPL, this is suicide. Since the DPL can hear the frigate for 50 km, and "get" with its torpedoes .... it seems the best in the world. And there are quite a lot of NATO submarines in SM, in addition they are all low-noise .. And the best of them are probably Israeli submarines. And we have some misunderstandings with him in Syria ... But one of the admirals told us that non-subsonic anti-ship missiles are dangerous for us, we will find and knock them down for at least 30 km ... but we will find long-range torpedoes just 2 km from our side .... In addition, in which case, torpedoes will not spare us, they can hit 4-6 torpedoes in full salvos. And the corvette will not be beaten off by its MTK "Package-NK" ... So the casket just opens, we have nothing to detect at the Black Sea Fleet modern submarines and probably nuclear submarines of France, England and the USA in SM .... Therefore, we even went for the fact that corvettes send not the SSBN to guard, but at Tartus they will be on duty. By and large, corvettes in fleets are now more important than frigates. It seems only on the BF this problem is closed? Quickly close. Four corvettes is the very minimum. And in all the other fleets we have .... OPA! What comes next? Since we don’t understand what the corvettes pr 22160 are capable of, most likely they will be made by sonar reconnaissance ships, such as the American ship for long-range sonar observation, Stalworth, landing the Ka-27 on it and installing the GPBA and it would be nice if the Packet-NK missile complex. By the way, for a scam with MTK "Package-NK", it would be necessary to "send" the entire collectif to Solovki. And another team, even if based on it, will make a TA, like all normal fleets, with reloading on the ship and firing with compressed air. And with the opportunity at sea, to receive torpedoes from supply ships, and reload TA.
    1. timokhin-aa 21 May 2020 14: 18 New
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      In general, TAM understood the whole BSF weakness from the underwater threat.


      I want to believe that, firstly, they really understood, and secondly, that not only about the Black Sea Fleet.
      We have it everywhere, this threat.
      1. Angry 22 May 2020 14: 26 New
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        Alas ... as always, I agree with you. The only consolation is that we are too young a country
        - Capitalist Russia .. Let's wait!
    2. Volder 25 May 2020 23: 32 New
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      Quote: Angry
      Since we don’t understand what the corvettes pr 22160 are capable of, most likely they will be made by sonar reconnaissance ships, such as the American ship of long-range sonar observation, Stalworth, putting Ka-27 on it and installing the GPBA and it would be nice if the Packet-NK MTK.
      Do not place too high hopes on project 22160. The maximum that is planned for him in the framework of anti-submarine defense is the container sonar station Minotaur-ISPN-M.2, the tests of which are currently underway: https://iz.ru/719118/nikolai -surkov-aleksei-ramm-evgenii-dmitriev / sistemu-obnaruzheniia-submarin-spriatali-v-obychnyi-konteiner
  • Cyril G ... 22 May 2020 14: 38 New
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    Quote: Angry
    pr 22160, most likely they will be made by sonar reconnaissance ships,


    Do you think Vitya was dying? He so diligently shoved the meaningless "patrol vessels", he already took the haste.
    - I’m afraid that everything is not just there with the installation of a new GAS, despite the fact that there are no PLO weapons on them. From the word in general.
    1. Angry 22 May 2020 15: 02 New
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      You know, of course, "it's good to be smart like my wife afterwards." When Vysotsky was with the fleet, if not the most beautiful opa, then half was safe. There were plans to renew the fleet, they even believed in them, like all of us, but we have no diarrhea, so scrofula. That is, these ships considered separately from all the tasks of the fleet is probably still wrong. The Aviso messenger class was always there, it’s clear that in our time with the development of satellite intelligence they have become less in demand, but you can’t even look at each palm from the satellite. In addition, in our fleet this is a completely new type of “weaponry”, there is no experience with it, what was planned during the construction turned out to be just a theory, so they hung in unclear what? Where, when? and why? Although of course they can be both light missiles and the forces of SD and PDO, it’s clear that they are looking for a good general military school as well .... Now their construction seems to be a mistake when they built they waited for UKKS or something similar on the next 3 hulls .... Generally there are ships, but questions remain. Something they certainly load ... wait. Maybe they will be good ships, in some quality, unfamiliar to us ...
    2. asr55 26 May 2020 23: 13 New
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      Quote: Cyril G ...
      Quote: Angry
      pr 22160, most likely they will be made by sonar reconnaissance ships,


      Do you think Vitya was dying? He so diligently shoved the meaningless "patrol vessels", he already took the haste.
      - I’m afraid that everything is not just there with the installation of a new GAS, despite the fact that there are no PLO weapons on them. From the word in general.

      Why don’t you like project 22160 ?! It’s great when a patrol (I emphasize a patrol) ship has the ability to change weapons using modules depending on the task. I hope you don’t think that one 1 × 76,2 mm AU AK-176MA remains there ?! One should write ships of "sonar reconnaissance" like this. Amazing people, you would all ship on a mace.
      1. Cyril G ... 27 May 2020 06: 23 New
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        Why don’t you like project 22160 ?!

        Everything from the shape of the bow, ending with inadequate weapons.
        It’s great when a patrol (I emphasize a patrol) ship has the ability to change weapons using modules, depending on the task.

        As you will see, the normally working module will continue, and ask how they have it.
        I hope you do not think that there will remain one 1 × 76,2 mm AU AK-176MA there ?!

        That's exactly what I think
        One should write ships of "sonar reconnaissance" like this.

        To do this, you must have a CEO.

        Well, and most importantly, the money spent on different stuff, at that moment when we will soon die off the entire IWS and we will have nothing to implement anti-submarine support for the deployment of strategic nuclear forces and the release of large ships from bases, this is a crime ..
  • asr55 26 May 2020 22: 53 New
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    Surprisingly, 16 x-35 missiles, or even more, are clearly placed. Even the project 1234 Gadfly MRC is equipped with 16 x-35 missiles. But they have a length of 59 m. Against 92 m.
  • Alexey Petrovichev 28 May 2020 21: 25 New
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    Do you need it there? let it be better to put out the ocean into the ocean.
  • 072
    072 2 July 2020 20: 50 New
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    380 project for more than 20 years. Reducers for it makes the Star. And the D-49 diesel engine is completely obstructed. Since 14, the main customer of the D-49 is Russian Railways. Bryansk produces more than 200 sections of 2te 25 diesel locomotives per year. In addition, they are installed on 2te10mk diesel-powered engines. Lyudinovo is forced to switch to the production of 2 diesel tem-14 with the Urals diesels instead of tem -7 Transition to electric movement is an attempt to get away from scarce gearboxes.