Donchanin: We were sure that after the Crimea Donbass would become Russian


As a Donetsk citizen, I have a special attitude to the events of the Crimean Spring. In the Donbass, probably better than in Russia or even in the Crimea, they understand the essence of what happened in 2014.


The protest rise in Crimea against the Maidan, the right-wing radicals and the unrest that they organized in Kiev was not much different from what was happening at the same time in Donetsk, Lugansk, Mariupol, Odessa or Kharkov.

In Donetsk, it was understood that it was hard for us to compete against the forces that staged a coup in Kiev. We did not want here to begin the same thing that was happening on the Maidan. Actually, then, at the beginning of 2014, no one understood what was happening in the country. One thing was clear that it lies under the West, but at the same time it never becomes part of the Western world. It was clear that this was a deception that neo-Nazis use to come to power. And neo-Nazis, in turn, use structures that seek to gain access to new opportunities and complete control over Ukraine. In general, all this did not bode well.

Nationalists are armed, organized, and well-funded. When they say that there was a spontaneous protest, do not believe it. Maidan fighters were there for a long time at full security. They could afford to protest continuously for months, without fear of losing their jobs and depriving the family of a piece of bread.


At the same time, Donetsk anti-Maidan activists went to rallies in their free time, that is, on weekends. And when they came to protest rallies in Kiev, they didn’t always even manage to leave the cars, because on the platform they were met by armed and equipped thugs.

The first signal for the Donbass was the reunification of Crimea with Russia. We decided that this is our way too. The second signal was the events in Odessa on May 2, where dozens of people were burned alive with the complete inaction of law enforcement. And then it became completely clear that the country in which we lived before that is no more and never will be. Then, in Donetsk, they realized that fascism had come to Ukraine, and this new country and I are not on the way.

Crimea became an example to follow. Although in the Donbass there was no Black Sea fleet and the military base in Sevastopol, people hoped that Moscow would help us, because we are no different from the Crimea, we, like the Crimeans, have been drawn to Russia all our lives. Donbass, like Crimea, held a referendum, where the vast majority spoke out for life separately from Ukraine. Moreover, mind you, the security of our referendum, unlike the Crimea, we provided independently, without any support from Russia.

The Donetsk residents were sure that several months would pass, and the Donbass would become Russian, as it was in the Crimea. Moreover, Donetsk did not need anything for this but the political will of the Kremlin. But, apparently, the Russian leadership then had its own vision of the issue.

Of course, I believe that in 2014, the annexation of Crimea to Russia was the right and only right step. If he had not become Russian, he would have been waiting for almost the same as what is happening in the Donbass. It would be even worse, since, apart from Ukrainian nationalists, the Crimean Tatar would also be operating there. Perhaps foreign Islamists would have joined.

Of course, today, Crimeans are not going smoothly, there are enough difficulties, but they must understand that, having voted in 2014, they made the right choice. At that moment, if Crimea had remained a part of Ukraine, the lives of many of its inhabitants would have been threatened by a very real and imminent danger, and they successfully avoided it.


But the Donbass is still managing its problems on its own, building its own states, of course, not without Russian help.

Just a hundred years ago, shortly before they decided to transfer the Donbass to Ukraine, the Donetsk land was called the heart of Russia.

But such words about the significance of Donbass for Soviet Russia, Lenin said:

Donbass is not a random district, but this is a district without which socialist construction would remain a simple, kind wish.

These words can still be read today on the stele, standing next to the monument to Ilyich in the main square of Donetsk. Apparently, Lenin understood that he could not do without these people and enterprises. He said his winged words and soon transferred these lands to Ukraine. Now, probably, it is time for Donbass to return home, to Russia.
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Facebook / Donetsk City Administration
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  1. barin 5 May 2020 06: 56 New
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    in the Donbass and there was no Black Sea Fleet and military base in Sevastopol

    All right. If not for the Black Sea Fleet in Crimea, then there would be no “Crimean events”. Already even built a naval base in Novorossiysk and were preparing after 2017 to withdraw the Black Sea Fleet from the Crimea.
    1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 07: 09 New
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      Quote: barin
      Donchanin: We were sure that after the Crimea Donbass would become Russian
      Today, 06: 46

      Donchanin: We were sure that after the Crimea Donbass would become Russian

      To be honest, after the start of the ATO, it became clear that the way of Donbass to Russia would not be as easy as that of Crimea.

      But they did not think that he would be so thorny ...
      1. Stas157 5 May 2020 07: 21 New
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        The Donetsk residents were sure that several months would pass, and the Donbass would become Russian, as it was in the Crimea. Moreover, Donetsk did not need anything for this but the political will of the Kremlin. But, apparently, the Russian leadership then had its own vision of the issue.

        His vision of the issue happened after the arrival of the Swiss Burkhalter.

        The Donetsk people were simply betrayed. And instead of the Russian region, there is now an unrecognized gray zone, regular shelling and poverty. That was not what people wanted at all, rising to resistance and counting on Moscow.
        1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 07: 31 New
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          Quote: Stas157
          His vision of the issue happened after the arrival of the Swiss Burkhalter.

          The Donetsk people were simply betrayed. And instead of the Russian region, there is an unrecognized gray zone and regular shelling, poverty. This is not what people wanted, relying on Moscow.

          "Betray, surrender, merge", The Kremlin cannot at least out of a sense of self-preservation.

          I would talk about a “pause”, “time-out”, “freezing” of the process, due to the indecision and misunderstanding by official Moscow of what to do with the “rest of Ukraine” and fears of a “Western reaction”, and not about betrayal.
          1. Stas157 5 May 2020 07: 35 New
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            Quote: Insurgent
            “Betray, surrender, merge,” the Kremlin cannot at least proceed out of a sense of self-preservation.

            Yah! There they can even carry out pension "reform", rob their own population. And in order not to rely on feelings (of their own preservation), they organized the Russian Guard.
            1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 07: 38 New
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              Quote: Stas157
              Yah! There they can even carry out pension "reform", rob their own population.

              Do not you think that the surrender of the Donbass, just overflowing the cup of patience, complete including the notorious "pension-genocidal reform"?
              1. Stas157 5 May 2020 07: 56 New
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                Quote: Insurgent
                Do not you think that the surrender of the Donbass will simply overflow with a cup of patience, complete including the notorious "pension-genocidal reform"?

                The donation of Donbass has already taken place by signing the Minsk agreements. This means that Donbass is officially recognized as the territory of Ukraine.
                The plan for the final inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine is detailed in the agreements.

                Minsk - no alternative. This has been repeatedly stated by the leadership! And to take Donbass to their native harbor, respectively - there are not even plans.
                1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 08: 03 New
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                  Quote: Stas157
                  The donation of Donbass has already taken place by signing the Minsk agreements. This means that Donbass is officially recognized as the territory of Ukraine.
                  The plan for the final inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine is detailed in the agreements. And “Minsk” has no alternative. This has been repeatedly stated by the leadership! And to take Donbass to their native harbor, respectively - there are not even plans.

                  This is purely YOUR PERSONAL, but a third-party opinion that you can accept / not accept, but I write as a resident of Donbass, and as a direct participant in some events ...
                  And some ongoing processes that I cannot write about openly indicate that Russia, although it is not yet ready to aggravate the conflict with the West, also does not intend to refuse from the Donbass ...
                  While at the support level ...
                  1. Stas157 5 May 2020 08: 14 New
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                    Quote: Insurgent
                    This is purely your personal, but third-party opinion

                    Minsk agreements are not my personal opinion, this is the will of our leadership.

                    This is the plan for the phased inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine. There is no other in these agreements. To fulfill or not to fulfill agreements is the business of Ukraine.

                    There is a plan for the inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine, but no plan for the inclusion of Donbass in Russia. These are the facts. Rest thoughts.
                    1. Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 08: 30 New
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                      Watch closely. Close. A certification. not?
                      1. Stas157 5 May 2020 10: 08 New
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                        Quote: Alex Nevs
                        A certification

                        Well, these are, as usual, half measures that will probably at least somehow make life easier for the local population (or maybe not). But they do not solve anything radically. By the way, regarding the passportization - were they all able to get passports?
                      2. Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 14: 06 New
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                        Does everyone need it? To whom it was necessary, already. To whom it will be necessary, they will receive. Now, after the cancellation of 3500 rubles, there will be even more.
                      3. Insurgent 5 May 2020 14: 35 New
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                        Quote: Stas157
                        Did everyone manage to get passports?

                        My fellow countryman has already answered you, but I’ll add from myself that I, for example, did not manage to get a passport before the “coronavirus”, I will receive it later.
                        And the wife and children, so those in general, will receive documents almost for free, with the exception of some paper and bureaucratic expenses ...
                    2. New Year day 5 May 2020 14: 50 New
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                      Quote: Alex Nevs
                      A certification. not?

                      what is the% who received a Russian passport, tell me ...
                    3. Insurgent 5 May 2020 15: 34 New
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                      Quote: Silvestr
                      what is the% who received a Russian passport, tell me ...

                      You know ... I can only give subjective data "from the people", since official data do not flow to me, and I do not track them, but at the household level, the feeling is that at least one in five already has a Russian passport .. .

                      I repeat, this is not statistics or official data ...
                    4. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 41 New
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                      Quote: Insurgent
                      at least one in five already has a Russian passport ...

                      agree, little
                    5. Insurgent 5 May 2020 15: 46 New
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                      Quote: Silvestr
                      agree, little

                      So there is no way for the Russian side to “instantly digest” such a mass of people.
                      Of course, if passport offices worked in the territories of the republics so that there was no need to travel to the Russian Federation to receive a document, things would go soon.
                      The tax amount recently canceled by the Russian Federation also restrained it, now (after quarantine), I'm sure the process will go even more fun ...
                2. ccsr 5 May 2020 19: 32 New
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                  Quote: Silvestr
                  what is the% who received a Russian passport, tell me ...

                  You wouldn’t be smart, but rather tell us how many wise Crimeans saved their Ukrainian passports and travel with them to Ukraine. I know this since the nineties, when Ukrainians were issued new passports, and they used Soviet passports to live in Russia, until in the early XNUMXs they closed this shop. Or say that it was not? So now they are issuing Russian passports to a resident of Donbass, and no one really knows how many of them Ukrainian passports are kept in zashashniks. So whose citizens are they?
                3. bayard 6 May 2020 07: 07 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  So now they are issuing Russian passports to a resident of Donbass, and no one really knows how many of them Ukrainian passports are kept in zashashniks. So whose citizens are they?

                  Well, don’t have to chop like that. Russian passports are issued to citizens of the DPR. That is, a DNR passport is required. So, our citizens have decided on their citizenship. Who wanted to - went to Ukraine, who stayed - survived all that was and what kind of country it is now, it understands without an interpreter. In recent months, shelling has not stopped, yesterday, the day before yesterday the children were injured ... And the fact that pensioners go for pensions, so they have no other choice - you can’t live on local pensions.
                  Nobody wants to go to Ukraine. That Ukraine, which was, has been gone for six years. There is a territory occupied by fascists.
                  We do not have Crimea, we have Donbass - we’ve been fighting for six years.
                4. ccsr 6 May 2020 11: 06 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  Well, don’t have to chop like that. Russian passports are issued to citizens of the DPR. That is, a DNR passport is required. So, our citizens have decided on their citizenship.

                  You misinterpret the situation - Ukrainian passports are not taken from them, and they can use them on the territory of Ukraine. So only a part of the citizens was determined who would certainly never go to Ukraine, if only because they could be arrested there. And the fact that many hid Ukrainian passports, I have no doubt - they just hide it.

                  Quote: bayard
                  Nobody wants to go to Ukraine.

                  I completely agree with this - after the incident, when it became clear what the Ukrainian authorities were and only the madman would want to return to Ukraine. But on the other hand, the Donetsk team participated in all sabotage against the leaders of Donbass - this fact also cannot be ignored.
                  Quote: bayard
                  We do not have Crimea, we have Donbass

                  By and large, you did not want to be milked for the benefit of the backward regions of Ukraine, and this was your main goal of protests before the Maidan. Well, after the Maidan, when they showed you Kuzkin’s mother, you naturally realized that you either had to blame Ukraine, or you would be forced to flee from it, that's how I see it all. By the way, they didn’t think about why the Kharkovites still haven’t supported you, and the Russians live there, as if they have no problems with the Russian language.
                5. bayard 6 May 2020 20: 11 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  By the way, they didn’t think about why the Kharkiv people still haven’t supported you,

                  The uprising in Kharkov began earlier than in Donetsk and they were more organized. See the chronicle of events. But they were crushed. The captured administration building was stormed by Jaguar at night - a group of police special forces, Avakov personally supervised. And the guys in the administration for the night left a hundred people with sticks and went home for the night. And at night they were all bandaged - both in the administration and in many houses. Some came to us right after that.
                  And in Odessa, the movement was strong, and muzzles were beaten on the Maidan. But they were taken individually (cities) collecting all the forces of the Maidan in one city and suppressing resistance.
                  The authorities in Ukraine did not become legal then, the security forces were at a loss, especially after the betrayal of Yanukovych (signing the agreement with the coup and escape), armed militants from the Maidan filled the cities ...
                  Donetsk was just lucky that it was farthest from the center and activists and a part of the security forces from the crushed cities of the rest of Ukraine got there. And if it weren’t for them ... and not for us (I’m also not from Donetsk, though from Donbass, Zapadny), then the same thing could happen. But it turned out differently. A lot of nonresident (and from the region too) gathered in the regional administration building and it turned into a huge barracks. About 2000 people were there at a time (in the afternoon there were much more). The special forces did not dare to storm the barricades with such a garrison - there are too many people ...
                  I was there in the month of April.
                  Precisely because all the anti-fascists from Ukraine gathered in Donetsk (even if not all, but many from ALL of Ukraine, even the western one), Donetsk has stood and still stands. It is not Donetsk residents who are fighting alone. And people didn’t rise beyond Donetsk, they just needed a gathering point. There should have been Kharkov ... but it turned out in Donetsk and Lugansk.
                  People rose for New Russia.
                  Which Surkov banned.

                  Quote: ccsr
                  And the fact that many hid Ukrainian passports, I have no doubt - they just hide it.

                  But why hide them, no one seized them. It’s just that you can only go to Russia with a DNR passport, and even that is not known for how long. DNR passports are received by those who have already expired Ukrainian photographs and to get a normal Russian one.
                  If Russia were handing out their passports as they had done in the Crimea, to everyone and immediately after the proclamation ... then they would probably have refused the Ukrainian ones. But no one wants to remain completely without documents (who are interested in the passport of an unrecognized republic outside) - this is life, and no one is condemned for this.
                  I don’t have a Ukrainian passport - they were taken away during the arrest of the SBU and were not returned at the exchange ... I was completely without documents. Now I have two passports - Russian and DPR. And if they had returned the seized, then I would have had four of them now - besides Ukrainian, also Soviet. yes
                  Our Ukrainian passports are not a sign of loyalty, but simply a solid document, at least until you receive a Russian one. But even when receiving Russian (and this happens in the Rostov region), Ukrainians do not seize.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  But on the other hand, the Donetsk team participated in all sabotage against the leaders of Donbass - this fact also cannot be ignored.

                  We have a civil war - the citizens of one state are fighting before, everything is more complicated, but there are enough geeks everywhere.
                  The gang of Abelmas is also from the Donbass, but even such Sumerians were hidden behind bars.
                6. ccsr 7 May 2020 11: 21 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  The uprising in Kharkov began earlier than in Donetsk and they were more organized. See the chronicle of events. But they were crushed.

                  We had Chechnya, and even teenagers spoiled our military equipment there, and the millionaire could not defeat the poorly managed and heterogeneous (for example, the Crimean Golden Eagle) special forces of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Ukraine - I do not believe in this. Maybe the Kharkovites simply realized that it is better to sit out in troubled times, and still do so.
                  Quote: bayard
                  Which Surkov banned.

                  Yes, Surkov directly decided all Ukrainian affairs - he couldn’t solve something of the two Chechen wars, but here he distinguished himself. He is just an official and an executor of Putin’s will, and no more.
                  Quote: bayard
                  If Russia were handing out their passports as they had done in the Crimea, to everyone and immediately after the proclamation ... then they would probably have refused the Ukrainian ones.

                  You may believe in it, but I do not.
                  Quote: bayard
                  I don’t have a Ukrainian passport - they were taken away during the arrest of the SBU and were not returned at the exchange ... I was completely without documents. Now I have two passports - Russian and DPR.

                  Your loss of a Ukrainian passport is not caused by a voluntary refusal, but by the seizure of it from you. And other such situations did not exist, so do not assume that they all refused a Ukrainian passport, especially since visa-free travel can be used.
                7. bayard 7 May 2020 19: 20 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  Maybe the Kharkovites simply realized that it is better to sit out in troubled times, and still do so.

                  No, they just went underground or came to us and fought. Do not forget that all people have families, children - they are vulnerable. The parents of my deceased companion, the right-wingers, burned the house, and my father was badly burned. This is not a situation where all your relatives are in the rear, and you are at the forefront, here it is quite the opposite.
                  Many from that side were ready to fight with us, but they have children, elderly parents, who cares about them? If they hadn’t stopped us and the movement continued, many would have risen — with a counter-fall, but in this situation they have one way out - to wait. And hope.
                  And the Kharkov partisans in 2014-2015 acted quite actively and successfully. By the way, the Donetsk "Oplot" in March-April 2014 was created precisely as a branch of Kharkov and its leader - Zakharchenko later became the head of the republic.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Quote: bayard
                  Which Surkov banned.

                  Yes, Surkov directly decided all Ukrainian affairs - he couldn’t solve something of the two Chechen wars, but here he distinguished himself. He is just an official and an executor of Putin’s will, and no more.

                  Well, then that was Putin’s will. request We generally have the name Surkov - common noun.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  so do not assume that they all refused a Ukrainian passport, especially since visa-free travel can be used.

                  And why should they refuse the only legitimate document?
                  Ordinary people?
                  They have their own lives, relatives, children study abroad, business ... eventually go on vacation. That's life . And no one condemns us for a Ukrainian passport. And Zakharchenko had such a passport.
                  What are you talking about?
                  Our people didn’t receive these (Ukrainian passports), they had them and have them for granted. Since then, when Ukraine was still a normal state. Before condemning the very fact of their presence in people, we still have not thought of a single "bright" head. But getting a DNR passport is akin to a feat for many - if something happens, they will not be spared by the punitive. But people go out for pensions and visit relatives, someone in business is not all in politics and war.
                  War does not feed.
                  Many of us who won several years ago, went to Russia to earn money - we need to feed our families. And many of them still have Ukrainian passports - not all even Russian services and officials normally accept DNR passports. But there are no problems with Ukrainian ones.
                  And how do you explain this?
                  To the people who fought for the right to be with Russia?
                  These people are Russia.
                  And those officials are not.
                  They are officials of the Russian Federation ... whose jurisdiction extends to ... the sea shelf. lol
                  A joke of humor from the Constitution of the Russian Federation. hi
                8. ccsr 8 May 2020 10: 33 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  What are you talking about?

                  The fact that too wise people live in Ukraine to open their arms to mindlessly drag them all to Russia. Cook yourself with your Bandera, for almost thirty years, silently watched as they instilled hatred of the Russians. I have no desire to unite with this people, even if they are ethnic Russians — too many of them have rotted over the years of independence.
                9. bayard 8 May 2020 19: 03 New
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                  request Then you urgently need to disconnect with Moscow, in it there is no less a rotten, corrupt and liberal mass. And in ethnic terms, Russians there are probably less than half left. And out of hatred in Russians, half of Moscow there (with migrant workers) is boiling and pouring out with bile ... But Moscow, by population, is more than half the population of the rest of Ukraine ...
                  But do not want to abandon Chechnya or the entire Caucasus? There the war went on longer ... and more complicated. And grief Russia from that war sipped much more, recall only the attacks ...
                  What is the difference between Donetsk and Rostov?
                  Kharkov from Belgorod?
                  Krasnodar Territory with Novorossiysk from the Ekaterinoslav province, whose capital was also named Novorossiysk before?
                  The fact that in Ukraine, Zhidobandera?
                  So there will be no less of them in Moscow alone, one bohemian, business, government apparatus ... the "intelligentsia" is worth it.
                  If they had success after Bolotnaya, in the Mother See and could have been worse. In confirmation - October 1993, but it would be much worse.
                  Little Russia, New Russia, Slobozhanshchina - these are all our land of condo, our united people.
                  And who believes otherwise is the enemy of my People.
                  After the coup, more than one Donbass revolted, the whole of the South-East revolted, just Donetsk and Lugansk became an assembly place. But people from all over the former Ukraine fought and are fighting here. And volunteers came from all over the world (and some stayed), sometimes in whole groups - from Europe, the USA, Latin America ... all who understood the significance of the fascist coup in Ukraine.
                  And their comrades who remained in the occupied part of it (what is now called Ukraine) were discouraged from rebellion, because they could not support from here, and separately (cities, regions) they were doomed to death.
                  With difficulty persuaded. But we were told - STOP.
                  The Minsk agreements, the OSCE in white cars and ... constant shelling and provocation.
                  And the former Ukraine was no different from any Russian region, either in ethnic composition or mentality. And abroad, Ukrainians were always called Russians, and they explained to those who foolishly tried to correct - "you are just the wrong Russians", even in UN missions abroad (cases from the participants).
                  Now they want to divide Russia, as before the USSR. And the enemies of the colabarants who already shout “we are not Russians, we are Urals” (Siberians, Cossacks, Tatars, we Vodskaya Pyatina ... add what is needed) find.
                  Russia is not so rich as to scatter its territories, people and assets. It is time to restore the state within its historical borders.
                  Or for you and the land of the Urals and Semirechensky troops, are no longer Russian?
                  Because, in terms of historical conflict, did some kind of Kazakhstan form?
                  Or because you and the Kazakhs do not like something?
                  Maybe Yakutia is "nafig her"?
                  Are there any Yakuts there? ...
                  This is our earth.
                  This is our country.
                  These are our people and peoples.
                  hi
                10. ccsr 9 May 2020 13: 01 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  Then you urgently need to disconnect with Moscow

                  Why, even if the leaders of New Russia understand that all matters are decided not in the Rostov or Belgorod regions, but in Moscow.
                  Quote: bayard
                  What is the difference between Donetsk and Rostov?
                  Kharkov from Belgorod?

                  The fact that in the Russian regions Bandera has never been considered heroes, but on the Ukrainian lands they erect monuments to them. Or is the monument to the Holodomor facing Russia not in Kharkov worth it?

                  Quote: bayard
                  Now they want to divide Russia, as before the USSR

                  Now this is no longer possible - our people have also seen their sight, judging by the ratings in the elections.
                  Quote: bayard
                  It is time to restore the state within its historical borders.

                  But the national suburbs do not need this - why did you get the idea that Ukrainian kings dream of uniting with us? What should we master Kazakhstan again in the spirit of Ermak? No, thank you, we already ate our former "brothers", it's time to think about ourselves.

                  Quote: bayard
                  Or because you and the Kazakhs do not like something?

                  These are people alien to us and even the language does not unite us with them - they refused it. Why should we open our arms - can you explain?
                  Quote: bayard
                  This is our earth.
                  This is our country.
                  These are our people and peoples.

                  I don’t know what you mean by that, but I don’t believe that our people live outside of Russia, although there are still many ethnic Russians there, and we are waiting for them in our historical Motherland.
                11. bayard 9 May 2020 14: 02 New
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                  Everything is clear - "my hut from the edge."
                  Quote: ccsr
                  The fact that in the Russian regions Bandera has never been considered heroes,

                  But they erected monuments and memorial plaques to Kolchak and Manerheim. Kolchak swore an oath to the English crown and received a “blessing” from US bankers ... although he had previously been a brave admiral, he ended up as an enemy of Russia - he himself admitted this to his wife in letters ... And Manerheim? Thanks for the blockade of Leningrad?
                  And there were enough guardians for Vlasov. If Bolotnaya had won or the coup of conditional Medvedev had been successful, they would have definitely piled a monument.
                  Doubt it?
                  In vain.
                  The rules are set by the winner.
                  Or didn’t you see what May 9 processions in the cities of occupied Ukraine were?
                  Despite all the threats and reprisals.
                  Or are you just watching TV?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  But the national suburbs do not need this - why did you get the idea that the Ukrainian kings dream of uniting with us?

                  Are they "Ukrainian"? You can’t tell by nationality. lol And it’s not the “tsars” who should be asked, but the people. In 2014, after the annexation of Crimea, the majority decided that "Well, FINALLY! Now we will all be together." . But Moscow had enough of Crimea, and agreed with the "kings".
                  So who in this situation is a TRAITOR?
                  Those who suddenly find themselves under occupation but are fighting? Or hid, but not broken? And he continues to hope that liberation and reunion are still possible?
                  Or a betrayer?
                  Which has a "hut with the edge"?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  No, thank you, we already ate our former "brothers", it's time to think about ourselves.

                  Well, what do you think today is especially clearly visible.
                  About myself .
                  But it’s not about the people who were driven under house arrest, they deprived of income and means of subsistence, but no support ... the authorities and banks are thinking ABOUT themselves. Beloved ones.
                  Is not it so ?
                  So what to boast about?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Quote: bayard
                  Or because you and the Kazakhs do not like something?

                  These are people alien to us and even the language does not unite us with them - they refused it. Why should we open our arms - can you explain?

                  The Kazakhs themselves - yes, they are immigrants from East Turkestan, they are not even Kyrgyz, who are at least distant to us, but relatives.
                  And the EARTH?
                  There were no Kazakhs in these lands spawning. This is the land of the Regions of the Troops of the Ural, Orenburg and Semirechensk Cossacks. And just do not have to object to this, I'm still from the South Urals, from the ancestral village of the hereditary chieftain of the Ural and Orenburg Troops - Khanzhin. And those lands were called the Cossack Stan for centuries. In 1935, Kaganovich renamed.
                  Or isn’t it?
                  And if so, then the hugs should not be opened not to the Kazakhs who came there, but to KAZAKH and RUSSIAN PEOPLE on their HISTORICAL LAND.
                  Do you understand the concept of historical lands?
                  Have you read the "Word about Igor's Regiment"?
                  I advise you to re-read carefully, still a historical document, albeit a work of art.
                  Russian people and Russian lands must be together!
                  As part of ONE state.
                  Sooner or later, but - must.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Quote: bayard
                  This is our earth.
                  This is our country.
                  These are our people and peoples.

                  I don’t know what you mean by that, but I don’t believe that our people live outside of Russia, although there are still many ethnic Russians there, and we are waiting for them in our historical Motherland.

                  A man without a clan and tribe, how to judge the homeland?
                  I was born in the Urals, grew up in Ukraine, studied in the Baltic states, served in the Caucasus ... worked in Moscow ... and again in Ukraine, and now in the Donbass. THIS IS ALL - MY HOMELAND. My Great Country, which was torn to shreds on New Year's Eve 1992 by three conspirators.
                  Three criminals.
                  What is your “historical homeland” for you, I don’t know ... for some it is Israel, for some it is the city or village where it was born ...
                  Is Chechnya a historical homeland for you?
                  And why did they fight for it as part of Russia?
                  Because the borders of the RSFSR was?
                  Kazakstan was also part of the RSFSR (before 1935). And was withdrawn from the composition without any referendum.
                  Don't you feel cognitive dissonance?
                  In your position?
                  Sure - NO.
                  Therefore, it takes you from the historical names of the Russian condo lands - New Russia, Little Russia, Slobozhanshchina ...
                  This is sad.
                  Especially on such a day.
                  In Donetsk we have rain.
                12. ccsr 9 May 2020 17: 00 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  Everything is clear - "my hut from the edge."

                  Not from your edge - it will be more accurate.
                  Quote: bayard
                  But they erected monuments and memorial plaques to Kolchak and Manerheim.

                  So they didn’t set out of a big mind - there were scoundrels who forgot about their “exploits” against their people. There are no monuments to Mannerheim, and the board did not stand even a month.
                  Quote: bayard
                  And if so, then the hugs should not be opened not to the Kazakhs who came there, but to KAZAKH and RUSSIAN PEOPLE on their HISTORICAL LAND.

                  Unfortunately, it is already impossible to return the USSR to fix the borders of the Kazakh SSR, and now hardly anyone wants to fight for these lands in Russia. So, based on the situation, it is easier for Russian people to return to Russia, or let them wait for a new Stalin, and the return of these lands as it was in 1939-1940.
                  Quote: bayard
                  Is Chechnya a historical homeland for you?
                  And why did they fight for it as part of Russia?
                  Because the borders of the RSFSR was?

                  Yes, that's what they fought for. Do not be this, what for we need shepherds in Russia - there is little sense from them, and stink to a fig.
                  Quote: bayard
                  Don't you feel cognitive dissonance?

                  Decided to be smart? Not worth it - I no longer respond to different verbiage. Essentially have something to say?
                  Quote: bayard
                  Therefore, it takes you from the historical names of the Russian condo lands - New Russia, Little Russia, Slobozhanshchina ...

                  I am saddened by the fact that the USSR is gone, and your small-town habits were not of much interest to me even then.
                13. bayard 9 May 2020 18: 35 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  It makes me sad that the USSR is gone

                  And what is the question? The project of the Eurasian Union than you do not like? But he could be wider than the Soviet.
                  And from the beginning we didn’t smell of a small-town spirit - we went up to New Russia, and wore chevrons with its flag on their sleeves. Surkov brought the small-town spirit, which abolished the Novorossiya project and insisted on two separate republics. And after all, we had representatives of the Kharkov, Odessa and other "republics." There was generally a draft of the Federal State of Russia, on the site of the former Ukraine, so that neither the flag nor the anthem of the past would smell ...
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Decided to be smart?

                  What we have is not parting with.
                  Listen to the song of Sani (Alexander) Kuvshinov "Saur-Mogila" on 2016 on YouTube, it was filmed by our scouts. So dial. Let him not get through, so at least listen to a good song ... Today you can.
                  hi
                14. ccsr 10 May 2020 10: 36 New
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                  Quote: bayard
                  And what is the question? The project of the Eurasian Union than you do not like?

                  I do not believe in this. The example of Lukashenko and the union state has already shown what came of it.
                  Quote: bayard
                  And after all, we had representatives of the Kharkov, Odessa and other "republics."

                  There were only representatives, but the people of these regions did not follow you.
                  Quote: bayard
                  Listen to the song on YouTube

                  I have enough Cossack choirs of various stripes - I am not particularly interested in folklore, so this is not for me, I believe in matters.
  • Golovan Jack 5 May 2020 08: 31 New
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    Quote: Stas157
    This is the plan for the phased inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine. There is no other in these agreements.

    Um ... dear, have you ever heard the word "federalization"? So, all of a sudden - “Minsk” means precisely the federalization of Ukraine. Moreover, LDNR, being formally part of Ukraine, receives a lot of rights and opportunities that it does not even have now. This is if these agreements are suddenly fulfilled.

    Quote: Stas157
    To fulfill or not to fulfill agreements is the business of Ukraine

    Say - politicians from Ukraine. They are absolutely not in the mood to do this, realizing that this is the end - both for themselves and for Ukraine in its current form.

    That's something like yes
    1. Leshy1975 5 May 2020 11: 44 New
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      Quote: Golovan Jack
      Quote: Stas157
      This is the plan for the phased inclusion of Donbass in Ukraine. There is no other in these agreements.

      Um ... dear, have you ever heard the word "federalization"? So, all of a sudden - “Minsk” means precisely the federalization of Ukraine. Moreover, LDNR, being formally part of Ukraine, receives a lot of rights and opportunities that it does not even have now. This is if these agreements are suddenly fulfilled.

      Quote: Stas157
      To fulfill or not to fulfill agreements is the business of Ukraine

      Say - politicians from Ukraine. They are absolutely not in the mood to do this, realizing that this is the end - both for themselves and for Ukraine in its current form.

      That's something like yes

      Well, let's get back to the topic of your beloved Minsk agreements that you so much praised. The other day you even made your own analysis and assessment of the Minsk agreements

      1. - partially completed. Cant in Ukraine.
      2. - Completed completely. Hailstones, Hurricanes and other heavy things are not in business.
      3. - whether completed or not. Anyway - cant on the OSCE.
      4 - 8. - not completed. Cant in Ukraine.
      9. - not completed and will not be executed until 4 and 11 are completed.
      10 - 13. - not completed. Cant in Ukraine.

      What's wrong, what's bad? A "hot", real war has been translated into something sluggish, responsible for Ukraine - its guarantors, Germany and France... what, goblin, isn’t it, in your opinion?

      So, Golovan. What you evaluate there is an assessment of a spherical horse in a vacuum.
      Because on a piece of paper it is, but in reality not.
      The Minsk agreements are not intelligible because it is only in the most hopeless situation that you can shift responsibility to your opponent and rely on his will. Where are the Minsk agreements spelling out the ability of the Russian Federation to influence performance? Except for Donbass itself.
      You write, these are schools of Ukraine and the OSCE. Those. control over the implementation of the wonderful (in your opinion) Minsk agreements lies with the OSCE. So I remind you how exactly the OSCE behaved when Yugoslavia collapsed. Can you recall on whose side actually and in whose favor the OSCE acted?
      Well, and in what "bright" head did the idea come to lay control over the implementation of the wonderful (in your opinion) Minsk agreements on the OSCE?
      About the schools and the guilt of Ukraine, it’s even funny that you wrote it. And who will ask her, OSCE? Oh yes, Germany and France will probably ask her handmaids? So why not ask? Maybe forget to ask?
      For the extension of sanctions against the Russian Federation, they do not forget something. Or maybe Ukraine behaves the way true puppeteers in the West need?
      So, the price of all these wonderful (in your opinion) Minsk agreements is the following -
      Returning to London, Chamberlain showed the public a document and said: "I brought you peace for a whole generation."

      PS In general, the Minsk agreements are very wonderful and written correctly in them, it’s only a pity that the price is not more than the paper on which they were written.
    2. Golovan Jack 5 May 2020 11: 50 New
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      Quote: Leshy1975
      Leshy1975

      He came, saw ... flooded. Well done. Take a pie from the shelf, and drive them into the cloves.

      I won’t answer you - they don’t pay me for teaching goblin, and it’s hopeless, as experience shows, it’s a matter of teaching goblin request
  • 210ox 5 May 2020 17: 26 New
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    About the "mass of rights and opportunities" completely disagree. In Kiev, cheaters and debris from Galician caches. And about reluctance (and complete) to fulfill the agreement, you are right.
  • Golovan Jack 5 May 2020 17: 30 New
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    Quote: 210ox
    About the "mass of rights and opportunities" completely disagree

    Highlighted in blue:

    Quote: Golovan Jack
    So, all of a sudden - “Minsk” means precisely the federalization of Ukraine. Moreover, LDNR, being formally part of Ukraine, receives a lot of rights and opportunities that it does not even have now. That is, if these agreements are suddenly fulfilled
  • Odin 8 May 2020 22: 26 New
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    I wonder what such opportunities will get Ordlo?
  • bayard 6 May 2020 06: 44 New
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    Quote: Stas157

    The Minsk agreements are not my personal opinion, this is the will of our leadership.

    Compliance with the Minsk agreements and the requirement of their implementation is the will and plan of action of the leadership. You apparently forgot, or maybe you didn’t know, that the same meeting in Minsk was at the “tear request of Poroshenko” through Lukashenko’s mediation. At night (sooner in the morning) from September 2 to 3, Poroshenko called Minsk and tearfully begged Lukashenko to arrange a meeting with Putin. He was very frightened - the front collapsed, the "North Wind" came in, and US military engineers began to mine hydraulic structures (dams, locks, bridges) on the river. Dnieper, preparing along it the line of defense \ front of NATO with Russia. If the dams were blown up, then all cities along the Dnieper would be washed away by the stream - millions of victims.
    This is not a fantasy. I know this very reliably, for I myself took part in those events.
    So Poroshenko had something to panic about, especially since he was additionally very frightened by future prospects.
    It really was very serious. And for Europe too. They were really afraid of the war - the war with Russia, the real one.
    That is why no Americans and British were allowed into Minsk, the initiative came from Poroshenko, the President of France and the Chancellor of Germany.
    And that is precisely why Poroshenko, albeit with long bickering, but signed the Minsk Agreement. And then he made excuses to his own that there was no other way ... I even know with whose words he made excuses.
    We then really, literally "on the eyebrows" parted from a big, real, nuclear war. Europe got scared and broke Poroshenko.
    And for Russia and the Donbass, this meant a certain timeout, a respite.
    Small.
    Then there was a phase (January-February) of the Debaltsev operation, when the military machine of Ukraine was simply broken. The fighting around the perimeter of Donetsk and at the bow with the Luhansk region were terrible. I still remember that cononade and pillars of black smoke to the sky in the frosty sky from burning equipment ... to the entire horizon ...
    Debaltsevsky cauldron and again Poroshenko ran to Merkel and Oland with a plea for a “new Minsk”.
    So Minsk-2 was signed.
    More than five years have passed since then (from Minsk-2) and the conflict is still considered frozen. Although the shelling never stopped, as did sporadic battles of local importance.
    Everyone then had a choice - a good war, or a bad world. The USA and England wanted war, Europe wanted peace, Ukraine was torn in its own contradictions ... Russia agreed with Europe.
    Since then, presidents have changed in the United States, France and Ukraine. Russia carried out the rearmament and modernization of its Army (who is not happy with what it is, look at what it was), strengthened its status in the international arena ... 2020 came when the term for unwritten agreements and commitments ended ... And the world started to change.
    The truth is too stormy, hysterical and even inadequate ... but the alignment of world forces today is completely different than in 2014. Maybe that’s why the enemy has desperate for a biological war ... which seems to be getting out of his control.
    But the enemy is not ready for war.
    As it turned out, even with S. Korea.
    The enemy begins to curtail its presence in the world ... first in Africa ... He simply is not able to maintain all his military infrastructure ... He begins to maneuver and is looking for a way to agree ...
    And Ukraine has already played a card.
    No, for the last suicidal spurt it could still be used, but ... who said that this time will be Minsk-3?
    On the contrary, Ukraine was made clear that there would be no more Minsk.
    What will happen?
    We will return to this issue after coronovirus and constitutional reform. I hope to take part in the vote, because I am again a citizen of my country - Russia.
    And the final solution to the Ukrainian question may not be so foggy and far ... wink
    1. EvilLion 6 May 2020 08: 44 New
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      Already on the whole horizon ... I love to read eyewitnesses, no one is lying like them.
    2. rotkiv04 6 May 2020 16: 50 New
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      You would be a science fiction, an eyewitness
    3. bayard 6 May 2020 18: 57 New
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      I am not only an eyewitness. And I watched those events from the highest point of the city - the best view. From the top floor of the regional administration (the Government House was then called, although almost no services were already there, the name has been since the proclamation of the Republic). I was only after the exchange of prisoners (the night of December 25, 2014) and was there for some time, recovering. In principle, the whole company to Minsk-2.

      And the view from there is gorgeous - the city at a glance, and even the surroundings.
      In the winter frosty air, the oily smoke from the burning equipment goes high with a vertical column - you can see from afar where the equipment is burning. And there were many such pillars.
      And how the city artillery and the Grads worked in full urban development packages, I remember. For some reason, “Tornadoes” and “Hurricanes” worked mainly with cluster munitions, apparently high-explosive ones were already disposed of by that time (meaning the planned disposal of expired ammunition at the PCP).
      I still live in Donetsk today.
      We have almost everything here - eyewitnesses.
      And the participants.
      Just do not forget this - winter company 2015. Immediately after the New Year began. And it’s good that the city was almost empty - most of them left at the beginning of summer ... at least play football on the roads - there are almost no cars. When ever, a "sweet couple" defiles - a tank (T-72) and an infantry fighting vehicle with the touching name "Bitch" on board ...
      ... And I especially remembered about that panorama ... I then spoke with my other colleague who was on Skype, and then the arrival of Gradov.
      He is "What is this?" , I say "City in the city, a complete package." He is the "Show".
      Well, I turned the camera out the window, and there the whole city was in full view and clouds of dust from the explosions rose above the houses. Well, I moved the camera so that the whole picture was visible. And there, about a dozen black pillars stretch toward the sky, and even a drone burning above the field unfolds. A large drone, maybe even a "Flight", although not sure. In general, you root in Engels oh ... a little. And then we were already used to everything.
      Yes, we now honor every day (or night) dill fun.
      But I haven’t seen flying saucers over Donetsk, so I’ll wait a little with fiction.
  • Sniper Amateur 6 May 2020 23: 15 New
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    And Ukraine has already played a card.
    No, for the last suicidal spurt it could still be used, but ... who said that this time will be Minsk-3?
    On the contrary, Ukraine was made clear that there would be no more Minsk

    But with this really interesting it looks like it will turn out. I’m almost sure that if Ze doesn’t manage to solve the “Donbass issue” by an acceptable compromise (and he doesn’t succeed in 99,9), the next President of Ukraine will be a person who will promise voters (and will have to keep his promise) to try to solve the “Donbass question "by the method of" the final solution of the "Donbass question. We will see ...
  • bayard 6 May 2020 23: 48 New
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    Well, while you pray for the receiver Ze, only it seems to me that this same Ze may even be the last president of Ukraine.
    Your fate is not decided in Kiev, and alas, not in Donetsk. And there are very big doubts that at least one of your new owners (USA, EU, England) will want to fit in for you.
    Everything is not so clear.
    The world is changing . The alignment of forces in the world is changing. Even the hegemon, and that ... is changing (the hegemon itself is changing, but it is ready to replace it, and this is competition).
    Quote: Sniper Amateur
    the next President of Ukraine will be a person who promises voters (and will have to keep his promise) to try to solve the "Donbass issue" by the method of "finally resolving the" Donbass issue ".

    He can try, only the result will be much worse ... and even worse for the one who tried.
    Ukraine is a failed state. Dull, funny and scary at the same time. About ..... winding such an (!!!) legacy from the Ukrainian SSR yes it must be able to.
    The fact that your state still exists is the artificial maintenance of life.
    Poland will take from you everything that it considers to be its own.
    Hungary and Romania too.
    I do not think that Russia will object.
    Russia will return its Novorossiysk and Little Russian provinces.
    And of course Slobozhanshchina, which has never been Ukraine.
    And restore its integrity.
    What integrity can there be if under occupation the Mother of Russian cities.
    Whose prince was Vladimir Krasnoy Solnyshko?
    And Yaroslav, the one that the Wise, called the first written law?
    Whose Truth Is It?
    Russian!
    It was .
    It will be so.
    Your future has already been determined ... Not yet announced.
    Well, yes, everything has its time. bully yes

    Everything will burn out, rot, crush - manure will be from Bandera’s dreams.
    The Wehrmacht will not come to the rescue.
    Synchronization will not save.
    ... Most likely, the people on the pitchfork will simply take you out.
    We will not even intervene. smile
  • Sniper Amateur 7 May 2020 01: 35 New
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    Your future has already been determined ... Not yet announced.
    Well, yes, everything has its time.

    Plus! good laughing
    Exactly the same thing applies to your future. With the amendment, that they gradually begin to voice it louder and at more and more official levels. Let's just say - you could not prove urbi et orbi neither your usefulness, nor even - just elementary acceptability. So that...
  • bayard 7 May 2020 01: 54 New
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    We just have a front and a frontal zone. This is all our usefulness and there is nothing to prove here. The situation is frozen.
    To avoid the worst.
    For you .
    Verney for the territory and people of Little Russia and New Russia.
    Until the time.
    And the hour is getting closer.
    He has almost come.
    At best, you have no more than a year.
    Quote: bayard
    Everything will burn out, rot, crush - manure will be from Bandera’s dreams.
    The Wehrmacht will not come to the rescue.
    Synchronization will not save.
    ... Most likely, the people on the pitchfork will simply take you out.
    We will not even intervene.
  • Sniper Amateur 7 May 2020 03: 12 New
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    When I said "refers to your future" - I had the whole "Russian world". Together with Russia.
    Well and - I added to favorites. After 13 months (to guarantee + the number is my favorite), remind you of your "prophecy." And when the next steps will happen - I will also remind. laughing
  • bayard 7 May 2020 05: 57 New
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    Quote: Sniper Amateur
    - I mattered the whole "Russian world". Together with Russia.

    You have been wandering with such a dream for 6 years. Not tired? lol
    And 13 months you still need to live.
    It is not simple . yes
    In modern conditions, it is not at all easy for you.
    .... coronovirus mows the chosen ones ...
  • Sniper Amateur 7 May 2020 06: 26 New
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    Not - not are tired. smile The Sentence of History - when it comes to entire Countries and Nations - overnight not done. And even in a year or two it does not happen.
    Well, Crown 19 is just death maximum. We will all die sometime. So - do not care. In the Corps and UkrDobrArmii - there are still many Marxwomen. Change me - if that.
    Our "grandfathers" in the Corps - had the following saying: "Are you a soldier - or a footcloth?" I have only the most general idea - what is a footcloth? (we didn’t have this at all already) - but I’m sure not footcloth.
  • Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 08: 30 New
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    Yes, there are already so many citizens of the Russian Federation. We would like to pass, would not do certification. This is the analyzer minusers.
    1. 210ox 5 May 2020 18: 19 New
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      In March, I went with my family on vacation to Yalta. I noticed that many residents of Crimea drive cars with Ukrainian license plates and have Ukrainian passports. And what can you do, an employee of the hotel-relatives told me there and I want to go on a visa-free basis. Something like this.
  • Doccor18 5 May 2020 10: 59 New
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    That's interesting ...
    Crimea returned, quickly and clearly
    have worked. To all outsiders
    opinions put ... Took on
    sanctions themselves. It was assumed that
    the screech will be oh-oh ...
    What about Donbas? Why him
    also decisively
    return to the bosom of historical
    homeland. Are we afraid of more sanctions? The referendum would be held
    and hello two new areas of the Russian Federation.
  • 210ox 5 May 2020 17: 23 New
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    This “so far” will continue indefinitely, given the Kremlin’s manipulation (though even complete neglect) of Russian public opinion, and the current economic situation in the country.
  • RusKosTen 5 May 2020 08: 09 New
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    "Minsk" is uncontested. All right. If only because “Minsk”, completed to the end on all counts, will reformat Ukraine into a more or less sovereign, friendly Russia, where autonomous LDNR will set the tone, not Galicia.
    Donbass did not want to join Yeltsin in Russia. He wants Putin in Russia. So we do not want Ukraine Bandera. We want Ukraine Kovpak. You can’t put an end to the rest of Ukraine. You have to fight for it, you yourself know with whom.
    1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 08: 33 New
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      Quote: RusKosTen
      "Minsk" is uncontested. All right. If only because “Minsk”, completed to the end on all counts, will reformat Ukraine into a more or less sovereign, friendly Russia, where autonomous LDNR will set the tone, not Galicia.

      But only one trouble - the outskirts do not want to perform "Minsk" ...

      And to fulfill its obligations, to force, while no one ...
      1. RusKosTen 5 May 2020 12: 31 New
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        The main thing - there is a lever for the application of force. But forces are not enough. So we are marking time.
    2. Sling cutter 5 May 2020 12: 22 New
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      Quote: RusKosTen
      He wants Putin in Russia.

      Who told you such nonsense? Donbass wanted a semblance of the USSR, hence the first name LDNR-Narodnaya, then they divided their mask into two and threw them both safely.
      Tales of some kind of selfless help left for children in night pajamas.
      First and foremost, the Donbass is beneficial to both sides, as a point of destabilization, it can be attributed to a lot, brainwashing on both sides of the border.

      Threat. you can find out the details from the deep Surkov if Che.
    3. 210ox 5 May 2020 17: 28 New
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      You can reformat it there in one way - bury. About Ukraine Kovpak (Kozhedub, Paton and many, many ..) Yes, I would like to see. But this is already in the past, the local society has acquired a certain color over thirty years. The color of Down Syndrome.
  • ccsr 5 May 2020 12: 16 New
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    Quote: Stas157
    The donation of Donbass has already taken place by signing the Minsk agreements. This means that Donbass is officially recognized as the territory of Ukraine.

    This is demagogy - the Minsk agreements were first of all signed as a tactical concession to the Kiev authorities in order to stop hostilities in the Donbass, in order to save people and gain time. Any sane person understands that in the strategic plan this region will go over to Russia, but the price of the issue when making hasty decisions is too high. Let me remind you that Abkhazia and South Ossetia, as well as Transnistria, have still not entered Russia, so why Donbass should have been in a privileged position, despite the fact that a significant part of the inhabitants of this region does not want to be part of our country. In such matters, haste can only do much harm - let me remind you that even now in Crimea there are still people who whine that they were better off living as part of Ukraine, and they don’t even hide it. Well, as a historical fact, I recall the Brest world of the Bolsheviks, whom our current government loves to kick. The world would be obscene, but nevertheless, Stalin returned everything to the borders that belonged to the Russian Empire, as soon as we got to our feet. And it will be the same with the Donbass - all the more so as time plays on us.
    Quote: Stas157
    And to take Donbass to their native harbor, respectively - there are not even plans.

    How do you know that? With what joy would humanitarian assistance be rendered to the inhabitants of this region, armed their army and began to give them Russian passports?
    1. Mordvin 3 5 May 2020 23: 50 New
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      Quote: ccsr
      How do you know that? With what joy would humanitarian assistance be rendered to the inhabitants of this region, armed their army and began to give them Russian passports?

      After the announcement of Little Russia, a representative of Putin rode to Zakharchenko and ordered everything to be put back.
      1. ccsr 6 May 2020 10: 55 New
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        Quote: mordvin xnumx
        After the announcement of Little Russia, a representative of Putin rode to Zakharchenko and ordered everything to be put back.

        What are you talking about - even in the Donbas they cannot unite the two regions with each other in order to oppose the Bandera people on a united front. And you want us to include them in Russia, still not figuring out how many people really want to live in our country as citizens, and not as owners of several passports, with the possibility of using visa-free travel.
        1. Mordvin 3 6 May 2020 17: 55 New
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          Quote: ccsr
          What are you talking about - even in the Donbas they cannot unite the two regions with each other in order to oppose the Bandera people on a united front.

          That is precisely Little Russia with the capital - Donetsk, and there was such an association.
        2. ccsr 7 May 2020 11: 08 New
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          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          That is precisely Little Russia with the capital - Donetsk, and there was such an association.

          I have not heard that the Donbass acts as a single independent entity - all the two republics negotiate independently.
        3. Mordvin 3 7 May 2020 18: 39 New
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          July 18 2017

          Representatives of the DNR, LC and 19 regions of Ukraine today announced the creation of the state of Little Russia. The constitutional act of the new state was read at the meeting of delegates in Donetsk by the Acting Deputy Chairman of the Council of Ministers of the DPR Alexander Timofeev.

          https://topwar.ru/120751-zaharchenko-obyavil-o-sozdanii-gosudarstva-malorossiya.html
        4. ccsr 7 May 2020 18: 47 New
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          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          Representatives of the DPR, LPR and 19 regions of Ukraine announced today the creation of the state of Little Russia.

          Why then on behalf of one state they do not negotiate?
        5. Mordvin 3 7 May 2020 18: 49 New
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          Quote: ccsr
          Why then on behalf of one state they do not negotiate?

          I already wrote above.
          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          After the announcement of Little Russia, a representative of Putin rode to Zakharchenko and ordered everything to be put back.

          Our rulers do not need Little Russia.
        6. ccsr 7 May 2020 18: 54 New
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          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          I already wrote above.

          But did not read it? There everything is predicted correctly.
          What will end the story with the creation of "Little Russia"
          https://donbass-info.com/content/view/36284/36295/
        7. Mordvin 3 7 May 2020 19: 07 New
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          Quote: ccsr
          There everything is predicted correctly.

          I looked fluently. Well, keep from Prilepin.
          “The one watching from Moscow is in front of me,” I realized. There was no great mind to guess.

          - We must disavow everything. Within half an hour, ”he said in a low, dull voice.

          I have never seen Zakharchenko so silent. Having run up a little and carefully looking for the right minute word, the correct intonation - he is the Head of the republic, and he will speak like the Head - but ... somewhere there is an emperor.

          - Who transmitted this? - asked the Head.

          “He conveyed whoever is needed,” it is routine, and as if already tired of the conversation, the beholder said; and repeated again: - We must disavow. Otherwise, there will be trouble. Everyone has.
        8. ccsr 8 May 2020 10: 28 New
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          Quote: mordvin xnumx
          I looked fluently. Well, keep from Prilepin.

          I respect the opinion of Prilepin and Zakharchenko, but understand correctly that there are situations when you need to really assess your strengths and not require others to make decisions that they cannot make for various reasons. Emotions are not the best adviser in such situations, especially since we already had big problems with the Crimea.
          But in fact, the creation of a united Little Russia did not take place, especially since some regions of Ukraine, in addition to the Donbass, ended up there - I hope you agree with this.
  • mole 5 May 2020 07: 57 New
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    Pension reform has affected everyone, and the Donbass is somewhere far away, unfortunately for most citizens of our country. So it’s unlikely to overflow.
  • for
    for 5 May 2020 10: 33 New
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    +5
    Quote: Insurgent
    what is the surrender of the Donbass

    And who merged you, you wanted independence. If Moscow wanted to see you initially in its composition, there would be other questions. You were originally a bargaining chip.
    1. RusKosTen 5 May 2020 12: 27 New
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      To join one state, you must first disconnect from another. Those. recognize independence, and then enter. So it was with the Crimea, which was originally autonomy.
      1. New Year day 5 May 2020 14: 56 New
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        Quote: RusKosTen
        So it was with the Crimea, which was originally autonomy.

        And what kind of autonomy did Donbass have? When did the Donbass state arise?
        Crimea therefore slipped through because there was something semi-independent - autonomy. Dobnass did not have this.
        Donbass, obviously, was like a distraction for the legitimization of Crimea
    2. Insurgent 5 May 2020 15: 03 New
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      Quote: for
      And who merged you, you wanted independence. If Moscow wanted to see you initially in its composition, there would be other questions.

      Questions in the newsletters? So anyone here will tell you that it was originally planned to introduce two questions in them:

      1) On independence from Ukraine (as a necessary condition for survival)
      2) On joining the Russian Federation,as a prospect.

      But the “push” of Moscow made everyone “replay” and those questions that you demonstrate as “proof” were introduced into the newsletter.

      Just proof of what?
      1. for
        for 5 May 2020 16: 01 New
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        Quote: Insurgent
        Just proof of what?

        I don’t prove anything.
        But the "push" of Moscow made everything "replay"

        That says it all. Moscow needed a lightning rod, not you.
        1. Insurgent 5 May 2020 16: 02 New
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          Quote: for
          Moscow needed a lightning rod, not you.

          Let's see yes Not yet evening...
          1. for
            for 5 May 2020 16: 27 New
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            Quote: Insurgent
            We’ll take a look It's not yet evening

            Good luck In the fight!
  • Leshy1975 5 May 2020 11: 10 New
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    Quote: Insurgent
    Quote: Stas157
    Yah! There they can even carry out pension "reform", rob their own population.

    Do not you think that the surrender of the Donbass, just overflowing the cup of patience, complete including the notorious "pension-genocidal reform"?

    Donbass for the Russian Federation at the moment has turned into a "suitcase without a handle." And I agree with you that they cannot merge it like that, it will look like a clear loss. Even despite all the efforts of the propagandists. They can’t just merge it like that, they can try to exchange it for something else that seems more valuable.
    As I understand it, after the initial plan of accession (not without reason the same Strelkov after Crimea turned up in the Donbas and there was permission to use troops) and the subsequent pressure from the West (here I agree with Stas157 (Stas), when it became clear that Crimea would have to bear the costs and an alternative HPP appeared.
    In which the Donbass was already considered either as a Trojan horse in Ukraine or as a bargaining chip for the Crimea. However, one does not contradict the other.
    Yes, the trouble for the Kremlin is that all this KhPP in the West was also well understood from the very beginning. And therefore, they did everything to make responsible and shift the content of the Donbass to the Russian Federation both economically and politically. No one in the West (and Ukraine) is going to exchange money - return Donbass, forgive the Crimea. There the position is more rigid - return both Donbass and Crimea.
    So the Kremlin got into a situation - you cannot return it.

    PS Unfortunately, the Donbass has become a bargaining chip in politics. Only some in this game risk their economic and political capital, while others pay with their lives. hi
  • KCA
    KCA 5 May 2020 07: 53 New
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    It was precisely what they organized, but did not create, that the Rosgvardia removed from the Ministry of Internal Affairs of the Ministry of Internal Affairs, non-departmental security, a permit system and several other units, all of them carry out exactly the same functions as in the Ministry of Internal Affairs, even a little less, the protection of, for example, drunk he doesn’t collect on the street anymore, they don’t require more and more protocols from the soldiers, they don’t stand near the FSO at the Kremlin, retaining power
  • Hlavaty 5 May 2020 09: 53 New
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    Quote: Insurgent
    I would talk about a "pause", "timeout", "freezing" of the process

    And put the lives of Donetsk on a “pause”?
    Let them neither be born, nor marry, nor die ... until Putin decides what to take off?
    Judging by the article, people took up arms for the sake of another LIFE. But they received not life, but existence in a gray and fired zone.
    1. New Year day 5 May 2020 14: 59 New
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      Quote: Hlavaty
      until Putin comes up with what to take off?

      what to think? - To attach or not to attach - "the bolivar of two cannot stand it"
    2. Insurgent 5 May 2020 15: 57 New
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      Quote: Hlavaty
      And put the lives of Donetsk on a “pause”?

      And my life, as it were, is inseparable from the republic, because I live here ... And I don’t really whine, although it’s hard, sometimes even harder than in the trench ...
  • Private89 5 May 2020 10: 05 New
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    “Spruce covered with fluffy snow,
    Donbass in touch: "Bro, don’t get sour!
    Now we ate enough
    Stories how important our lives are.
    We are officers, but pawns came out,
    Invoices have long been broken,
    They have both eagles and tails in their hands
    We have crosses and granite slabs.

    And I replied that I watched yesterday
    Beautiful movie about the Russian Crimea.
    "It’s parallel to everyone that you’re firing,
    You are neither needed by the first nor the second ... "
    Those who played on our feelings
    That gave us trouble again
    May they who have maintained neutrality,
    Leave the best places in hell "

    All just in power are the bourgeois who do not have a homeland, for them the homeland is where it is profitable. And such always betray surrender, would be a suitable price.
  • Kronos 5 May 2020 12: 40 New
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    This is the very freeze of a thousand broken lives and killed. One plus, just now, many have understood the price of helping Russia and are no longer being deceived
  • Maki Avellevich 6 May 2020 17: 39 New
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    Quote: Insurgent
    “Betray, surrender, merge,” the Kremlin cannot at least out of a sense of self-preservation.

    I would talk about a “pause”, “time-out”, “freezing” of the process, due to the indecision and misunderstanding by official Moscow of what to do with the “rest of Ukraine” and fears of a “Western reaction”, and not about betrayal.

    When you start a serious project, you need to understand how you will start and how you will finish. It is also important to know what you want to achieve in general.
    the story of Ukraine is like a slightly planned impromptu.
  • carstorm 11 5 May 2020 08: 08 New
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    you can betray only if something was promised. Has anyone ever said such a thing? or Russia does not help there than is possible?
  • Svarog 5 May 2020 09: 27 New
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    Quote: Stas157
    Donetsk simply betrayed

    Namely .. and in another way it does not explain. Betrayed by those who were afraid to lose the overpriced. There is no Sberbank in Crimea .. look how Gref explains it .. and Mikhalkov, commenting on Gref’s explanations, says that Gref and others like them are afraid of personal revenge on the part of the United States. And I think so.
    1. CSKA 5 May 2020 14: 15 New
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      Quote: Svarog
      Namely .. and in another way it does not explain.

      Do not carry nonsense. If they betrayed, they would not help with money and weapons, and passports would not be handed out.
      1. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 00 New
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        Quote: CSKA
        If they betrayed, they would not help with money and weapons, and passports would not be handed out.

        where is the result?
        1. CSKA 6 May 2020 12: 55 New
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          Quote: Silvestr
          where is the result?

          Firstly, the conversation is not about the result, but about the drain. Secondly, the result is that LDNR is actually under the protectorate of the Russian Federation. Thirdly, only cockroaches quickly reproduce, and geopolitical problems are not solved. LDNR method of pressure on dill. Abkhazia and South Ossetia were also not recognized for a long time, and after the well-known events of 2008, they were recognized.
          1. New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 57 New
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            Quote: CSKA
            Firstly, the conversation is not about the result, but about the drain.

            and if there is no result, then what is it?
            Quote: CSKA
            LDNR method of pressure on dill.

            Well, how did you put pressure? People are dying, but we are all crushing and crushing. And they die further
            1. CSKA 12 May 2020 17: 50 New
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              Quote: Silvestr
              and if there is no result, then what is it?

              Again. You wrote about betrayal at the beginning. But betrayal and outcome are two different things.
              Result on the face. LDNR exists, and people get Russian passports there. This was also the case in Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Result 2008.
              Quote: Silvestr
              Well, how did you put pressure? People are dying, but we are all crushing and crushing. And they die further

              Have you been a long time sylvester from the front? Were there at all? And I participated and I am no less than your sorry for my fellow countrymen, but this is politics, it was and will be like that. Through LDNR it is very easy to influence domestic policy in dill. Any exacerbation is the glow and gnawing inside. A striking example of this is the fact that Kolomoisky was wailing. The opposition is gaining more percent. The clown already loses interest and it is not known whether they will be able to find another such one in the next election. Of course, I would like the Russian Federation to send troops and deploy and defeat the banderlogs, but if in the West many people and politicians can still explain why the Crimea had the right to enter the Russian Federation, then there’s no simple way to explain the direct invasion and war with dill.
  • CSKA 5 May 2020 13: 29 New
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    Quote: Stas157
    His vision of the issue happened after the arrival of the Swiss Burkhalter.

    This is not vision - this is nonsense. I already wrote to you in a previous article that we need to look at the dates. On May 6, 2014, Burkhalter, as the OSCE Chairperson-in-Office, visited Moscow to discuss the situation in Ukraine with Vladimir Putin. And in the summer of the Russian Federation began to actively help.
  • EvilLion 6 May 2020 08: 41 New
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    "The political instructor is lying, you are being treated well in German captivity."
  • rotkiv04 6 May 2020 16: 46 New
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    Not "betrayed", but betrayed and you know who it is. Hundreds of volunteers from Russia were killed in the Donbass and this man betrayed them too, he turned out to be a balabol
  • itis 9 May 2020 16: 40 New
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    Of course, there are plans to return as much as possible from present-day Ukraine, and this cannot be done without political parties supported by Donbass voters. This is a plan for decades (no matter how bitter it may be) and Brzezinski should turn over in his grave.
  • knn54 5 May 2020 08: 20 New
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    It is much easier with the Crimea, after all, an autonomous republic. A referendum was held.
    It was legally done right, as if the West were not indignant.
    With LDNR it will be more difficult.
    1. Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 08: 32 New
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      And longer. And harder. But WILL. skipping rope let them train the jumping muscles, this is just the beginning.
  • antivirus 5 May 2020 11: 51 New
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    I am tormented by "small spoons" and the rejection of 100 thousand tons of a / nose - and GREATNESS OF GOS-VA AND ITS ARE NOT IN 7 X100 THOUSAND T / NOS AND 30000 ROCKETS, AND OPPORTUNITIES TO DO WHAT IT IS NECESSARY TO EXTERNAL AND INSIDE POLICY- - Brookhalder (?) came from Schwitzaria and asked not to disclose bank secrecy, and ours agreed to curtail the Russian spring.

    would help us in politics on the outskirts of Donbass aircraft carriers 100000 tons of explosives?
    Oderipaska and others do not want to leave Switzerland - a reason for failure on the outskirts.

    personal experience:
    antivirus 2 June 19, 2017 10:20 | Crimean border: 168 kilometers of torment arc
    As for the Crimeans, for them a visit to Ukraine is a difficult and sometimes very dangerous quest. Those who at one time renounced Ukrainian citizenship officially and handed in a “passport with a trident” have no options in principle.
    ON APRIL 16 D arrived 2 PEOPLE from Dzhankoy. BUY A MACHINE (ENGINE OVERHEATED)
    -what did before the referendum. how did you live?
    - nothing. any hunting cartridges bought
    300 km short, min-up to the border 39 g
    1. Sling cutter 5 May 2020 12: 14 New
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      Quote: antivirus
      As for the Crimeans, for them a visit to Ukraine is a difficult and sometimes very dangerous quest.

      Crimeans are generally hostages to the situation, they can’t go anywhere except the territory of the Russian Federation with a residence permit, so they spin and try to have two passports, the second is clear which country.
      1. Zmeelov 5 May 2020 12: 19 New
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        Quote: Stroporez
        Crimeans are generally hostages to the situation, they can’t go anywhere except the territory of the Russian Federation with a residence permit, so they spin and try to have two passports, the second is clear which country.

        Are you one of them with two or three passports ..? Why do you speak for everyone? No need to be angry and envious .. Of these yellow-block ones? So remove the "Private Airborne", and better write "Fur Seal and stuff" .. Do not disgrace .. I have the honor! soldier
        1. Sling cutter 5 May 2020 12: 44 New
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          Quote: Zmeelov
          Why do you speak for everyone?

          And where did I write for everyone ??? I'm talking about the fact that Crimea is very heterogeneous in mood and if you tell me that Sevastopol residents are happy with the appearance of barbed wire on the beach or donated territory near the city, you are a liar!
          Russian tariffs and prices, too, did not delight Crimeans., As well as tourists.
          Maybe you will talk about how Maskvastan buys (squeezes) the Crimean coastline in a businesslike way?
          Tell your colleagues about the 6 meter fence along the Simferopol-Yalta highway and to whom it belongs.
          About the palace, the “cottage” of Medvedchuk, part-time Kum and the gray cardinal of Ukraine, in the Crimea’s protected area, too, tell me, do not be shy!
          Quote: Zmeelov
          so remove the "Private Airborne", and better write "Fur Seal and stuff" .. Do not disgrace .. I have the honor!

          So when you truthfully describe the situation and moods in the Crimea, then we’ll talk about your honor, but for now there’s nothing to talk about! soldier
          1. AAK
            AAK 5 May 2020 18: 49 New
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            That's right, colleague. And a 6-meter fence with surveillance cameras every 15m and several types of burglar alarms on a very solid section along the Yalta-Sevastopol highway stands (the residences of the former second-largest man and first-largest woman), and the prices are most Moscow goods and products, and about the coastline, and about the announcement from 2016-2017 of "illegally obtained" land in many country cooperatives in "good" places, and about the "high intellectual and moral level" of a very significant number of mainland Sonala, designed to educate the Crimean "integrals" of the wisdom of Russian law and the principles of managing in different industries ... and much, much, much left overboard comments ...
            1. Sling cutter 5 May 2020 19: 55 New
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              Quote: AAK
              That's right, colleague.

              Thank you Kamrad! soldier It is gratifying to understand that we have more sensible people than those who look at the world through the crooked mirror of Putin’s propaganda.
        2. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 14 New
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          Quote: Zmeelov
          Are you one of them with two or three passports ..? Why do you speak for everyone?

          Here is the representative of EP in Sevastopol caught on this. In total, according to various estimates, Ukrainian passports received about 130 thousand Crimeans.

          Federal Law of May 31.05.2002, 62 N 26.07.2019-FZ (as amended on July 17.10.2019, XNUMX) "On Citizenship of the Russian Federation" (as amended and supplemented; entered into force on October XNUMX, XNUMX)
          Article 6. Double citizenship
          2. Acquisition of another citizenship by a citizen of the Russian Federation does not entail the termination of the citizenship of the Russian Federation.
          What questions do Crimeans have, especially since their first passport is Ukrainian.
          “Residents of the Crimean peninsula, permanently residing as of March 18, 2014 in the Crimea and Sevastopol, were recognized as Russian citizens. At the same time, they were given the opportunity to retain their other citizenship or to remain stateless. "- FMS
          The procedure for depriving Ukrainian citizenship is provided for by the corresponding order of the President of Ukraine on the deprivation of citizenship. So even the first persons of Crimea - the head of the republic Sergey Aksyonov and the chairman of the State Council of the republic Vladimir Konstantinov - are still citizens of Ukraine, because there was no decree of the President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko on the deprivation of their citizenship.
      2. antivirus 5 May 2020 15: 23 New
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        my acquaintances from Dzhankoy made a choice with cartridges in February 14 and now- "they will not let us in. closed." spoke out a word and stood up with arms.
  • Nemchinov Vl 5 May 2020 21: 13 New
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    Quote: Insurgent
    To be honest, after the start of the ATO, it became clear that the way of Donbass to Russia would not be as easy as that of Crimea.

    But they did not think that he would be so thorny ...
    not yet evening. Hold on there. God willing "the line of Portnova, Lukash, Vasiltsa, Sharia, Kotsaba, Syomchenko ...." as water will stone the stone .... and other citizens "wake up charter" ... "Black lines" - cannot be eternal.
  • Aviator_ 5 May 2020 11: 05 New
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    If not for the Black Sea Fleet in Crimea, then there would be no “Crimean events”

    There would be "Crimean events", but much more terrible than in the Donbass, if Moscow had withdrawn.
  • ALARI 5 May 2020 11: 16 New
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    The conclusion from the article is simple, people for the current government are secondary. Primary geopolitical, economic, military interests, but not people as individuals. They took what was needed and what was not needed a little support and are now trying to forget like a nightmare.
  • Vend 5 May 2020 11: 29 New
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    Quote: barin
    in the Donbass and there was no Black Sea Fleet and military base in Sevastopol

    All right. If not for the Black Sea Fleet in Crimea, then there would be no “Crimean events”. Already even built a naval base in Novorossiysk and were preparing after 2017 to withdraw the Black Sea Fleet from the Crimea.

    I would like to remind those who forgot. At the beginning of Ukrainian events, Crimea was immediately for leaving Ukraine and joining Russia. And Donbass at the beginning advocated federalization and the status of the Russian language as a second state. And no way out of Ukraine and joining Russia. They started talking about joining when a party began on the part of the Ukrainian authorities and nationalists. The moment of secession from Ukraine has already been missed. The war has begun.
    1. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 11: 50 New
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      "I would like to remind"
      about New Russia and the Russians do not abandon their.
      1. Vend 5 May 2020 12: 01 New
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        Quote: Edward Vashchenko
        "I would like to remind"
        about New Russia and the Russians do not abandon their.

        Novorossia died under the USSR, in the modern realities of Novorossiya, as a designation of the territory is reviving. And no one gave up what you got. Humanitarian aid, and Voentorg works.
        1. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 12: 09 New
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          why do you think so.

          I didn’t take anything, I simply quoted the telly and officials of that time.
          It was about one thing, and now supporters of the "cunning plan" are telling fairy tales in the style of lieutenant from the "White Sun": "Yes, he has the wrong grenade system."
          1. Vend 5 May 2020 12: 28 New
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            Quote: Edward Vashchenko
            why do you think so.

            I didn’t take anything, I simply quoted the telly and officials of that time.
            It was about one thing, and now supporters of the "cunning plan" are telling fairy tales in the style of lieutenant from the "White Sun": "Yes, he has the wrong grenade system."

            I repeat, no one left anyone. The situation is changing and it is necessary to act in accordance with new circumstances. This is what everyone does from an ordinary citizen to the heads of state.
            1. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 12: 29 New
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              I repeat, no one left anyone.

              Tell it in Odessa or Kharkov
              1. Vend 5 May 2020 14: 29 New
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                Quote: Edward Vashchenko
                I repeat, no one left anyone.

                Tell it in Odessa or Kharkov

                Do you think that Russia should have gone to war in another state when the Nazis killed in Odessa? Then you do not have to live in this country, but in the USA, so they have not written international law. They remember and will not forget about what happened in Odessa, the time will come and everyone will answer.
                1. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 15: 00 New
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                  Then you do not have to live in this country, but in the USA, so they have not written international law.
                  good good good
                  And this is perhaps an iron argument, where are the children of our rulers and their business interests?
                  1. Vend 5 May 2020 15: 35 New
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                    Quote: Edward Vashchenko
                    Then you do not have to live in this country, but in the USA, so they have not written international law.
                    good good good
                    And this is perhaps an iron argument, where are the children of our rulers and their business interests?

                    That is why amendments to the constitution are being made so that as a result such children are denied access to power in Russia. The West acted quite cleverly when it hooked businessmen and those in power into accounts and real estate abroad. Now these can be manipulated. However, all the squeaks of Novalny and Co. that our rulers, as you put it, have business interests there broken for a long time. Do not repeat them. Think about one thing that Putin, West, can offer, for example, when Vladimir Vladimirovich leads the largest and richest country in the world? The answer is simple, NOTHING.
                    1. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 15: 43 New
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                      That is why amendments to the constitution are being made so that as a result such children are denied access to power in Russia.

                      Something reminds of a non-commissioned officer widow who carved herself.
                      And then without these amendments, well, nothing
                    2. Vend 5 May 2020 15: 47 New
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                      Quote: Edward Vashchenko
                      That is why amendments to the constitution are being made so that as a result such children are denied access to power in Russia.

                      Something reminds of a non-commissioned officer widow who carved herself.
                      And then without these amendments, well, nothing

                      This is a misconception, just now the moment has come when it can be done and the anti-Russian element, generously sponsored by the West and ideological ones, will not be able to create a situation that will lead to the collapse of the country. And you yourself can refuse to increase financial well-being?
                    3. Edward Vashchenko 5 May 2020 18: 12 New
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                      I would not refuse.
                      I think we have a dispute about nothing.
                      hi
                    4. Vend 6 May 2020 10: 00 New
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                      Quote: Edward Vashchenko
                      I would not refuse.
                      I think we have a dispute about nothing.
                      hi

                      So you answered your own question. But the argument is really nothing.
                    5. Edward Vashchenko 6 May 2020 10: 31 New
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                      It is only extremely naive, if not rude, to think that by making changes to the inactive Document, something will change.
                      The Constitution already has everything, but there is not a single mechanism to comply with it. It is state. authorities, champions violating the Constitution, do not fully comply with it, as there were no sanctions, and no, for its violation.
                      The legal situation around the Pandemic - why not a brilliant confirmation of the grossest violation of the Constitution, I will rephrase A. Lincoln: if this is not evil, then there is no evil at all.
                      All constitutional fuss - that Putin would be in power forever - we will speak as is, the rest is just a wrapper for simpletons.
                    6. Vend 6 May 2020 10: 38 New
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                      Quote: Edward Vashchenko

                      All constitutional fuss - that Putin would be in power forever - we will speak as is, the rest is just a wrapper for simpletons.

                      They couldn’t come up with anything more stupid laughing
                    7. Edward Vashchenko 6 May 2020 14: 06 New
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                      Be ignorant.
                      On this I take my leave.
                    8. Vend 7 May 2020 10: 41 New
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                      Quote: Edward Vashchenko
                      Be ignorant.
                      On this I take my leave.

                      What do you work in the presidential team to know his actions? laughing Or to the Western intelligence agencies that you receive data on wiretapping of negotiations in the presidential team? laughing So, don’t have to catch the fog, it causes only laughter laughing laughing
  • ccsr 5 May 2020 12: 27 New
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    Quote: Wend
    And Donbass at the beginning advocated federalization and the status of the Russian language as a second state. And no way out of Ukraine and joining Russia.

    Many local exposers suddenly "forget" this and believe that the Crimea and the Donbass are completely identical in their perception of Ukraine, although this is fundamentally not so. It is enough to simply compare the mentality of the inhabitants of Crimea and Donbass and one who knows the subtleties of life in these regions will immediately understand why Crimea was part of Russia unconditionally, but they thought about it with Donbass and whether they want to go to Russia, where the economic life is very different. .
    Quote: Wend
    They started talking about joining when a party began on the part of the Ukrainian authorities and nationalists.

    When their Banderaites began to spread rot in full, then they wanted to go to Russia - this is a natural reaction. But if they were given what they asked, they would demand accession to Russia - this is the cornerstone of our relationship.
    Quote: Wend
    The moment of secession from Ukraine has already been missed. The war has begun.

    Yes, that’s exactly what happened, and if they would raise the Russian flags on February 25, and in early March hold a referendum on joining Russia, then perhaps the current situation was not
    1. Kronos 5 May 2020 12: 45 New
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      Liar Putin officially just asked the referendum not to hold
      1. ccsr 5 May 2020 12: 54 New
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        Quote: Kronos
        Liar Putin officially just asked the referendum not to hold

        But didn’t they have their own intelligence or courage to finally break with Ukraine in March 2014?
        1. Kronos 5 May 2020 13: 17 New
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          There wasn’t such bitterness and spilled blood in March
          1. Zmeelov 5 May 2020 13: 23 New
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            Quote: Kronos
            There wasn’t such bitterness and spilled blood in March

            That's right (photo documents are available) And Donbass is ours, it’s just a matter of time of the state structure there has already been formed and for a long time .. We need Kiev, without Bandera and other gosdepovskoy racket ...
            You can kick, but everything goes to this .. Then I’m silent hi
            1. Kronos 5 May 2020 13: 24 New
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              No, everything is going exactly the opposite. Bendera just strengthened and grow new generations of their supporters.
          2. ccsr 5 May 2020 13: 31 New
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            Quote: Kronos
            There wasn’t such bitterness and spilled blood in March

            But they did not recognize the essence of Ukrainian nationalism in more than twenty years? Or didn’t they look into the textbooks of their children and did not look at their media?
            I do not believe in their naivety - they were too sure that Ukraine always fed Russia, that they didn’t want to live in the same country with us, and therefore this was their choice.
          3. ccsr 5 May 2020 19: 23 New
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            Quote: Kronos
            There wasn’t such bitterness and spilled blood in March

            So I say that no one was particularly eager to go to Russia, unlike the Crimeans.
            1. Kronos 5 May 2020 19: 38 New
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              Tales about the fact that the Crimeans wanted to be right, but don’t leave the Donbass to the children. The case is purely in the database of Sevastopol
              1. ccsr 6 May 2020 10: 19 New
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                Quote: Kronos
                Tales about the fact that the Crimeans wanted to be right, but don’t leave the Donbass to the children. The case is purely in the database of Sevastopol

                You probably don’t remember how Crimeans rebelled against the Americans landing for exercises long before 2014. Donbass also revolted then, did the riots start there or how was it? I do not deny about Sevastopol - it was a primordially Russian city, and no one denies its importance as a base for the Black Sea Fleet.
              2. New Year day 6 May 2020 12: 38 New
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                Quote: Kronos
                The case is purely in the database of Sevastopol

                That's it! I wanted to spit GDP on Crimeans, as well as on Russians. It's all about Sevastopol base. Everything else is pathetic babble
        2. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 27 New
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          Quote: ccsr
          But didn’t they have their own intelligence or courage to finally break with Ukraine in March 2014?

          how, tell me? laughing Not blah blah, but real steps. Very interesting
          1. ccsr 5 May 2020 19: 28 New
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            Quote: Silvestr
            how, tell me?

            And how did the Crimea organize a confrontation with an incoming train with Bandera and hold a referendum on secession from Ukraine?
            1. New Year day 5 May 2020 23: 46 New
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              Quote: ccsr
              And how did the Crimea organize a confrontation with an incoming train with Bandera and hold a referendum on secession from Ukraine?

              are you okay with your head?
              Then compare the incomparable

              1. ccsr 6 May 2020 10: 45 New
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                Quote: Silvestr
                are you okay with your head?
                Then compare the incomparable

                Do not cheat - these pictures are shared by years, and in March 2014 the situation in the Donbass was the same as in the Crimea. By the way, in Kharkov and the Russian region no less lives than in the Donbass, but they were silent there when the monument to the Holodomor was erected on the ring road and turned it towards Russia. Or have you already forgotten about it? In Kerch, they also tried to impose the same, but the people expressed their opinion, and they renamed it a monument to the Chernobyl victims, although it is obvious that the composition itself has nothing to do with the Chernobyl disaster:
                https://www.shukach.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/node-gallery-display/post_images/208/_1110204-182584.jpg
                1. New Year day 6 May 2020 11: 09 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  Don’t cheat - these pictures are shared by years

                  what is the scam? Peaceful appearances were everywhere. Then they began to shoot in the Donbass. Everything is logical. What did your question sound like?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  And how did the Crimea organize a confrontation with an incoming train with Bandera and hold a referendum on secession from Ukraine?

                  Or do you not know about peaceful performances in the Donbass? Shame!
                  1. ccsr 6 May 2020 11: 55 New
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                    Quote: Silvestr
                    Or do you not know about peaceful performances in the Donbass? Shame!

                    What are the speeches when their leader was arrested, and the people did not go to release him and overthrow the government. And some leaders of the DPR were, to put it mildly, their own affairs:
                    the real reason was that the former head of the DNR Security Council, Khodakovsky, for his subordinates, obtained the key posts in the economic unit of the DNR leadership, deputy prime minister for economics and the minister of income, with the call signs “San Sanych” (Alexander Semenov) and “Horvat” (Petr Savchenko) and fees. But both were involved in military operations, and did not even enter their offices. “In this situation, Boroday made the“ Solomon decision ”: not to collect taxes at all,” explains Manekin. - This decision by Boroday provoked field commanders to tax the business on their own. As a result, there was - and could not be - not a single boss or leader who would not have had a hand in the bacchanalia of total wringing in 2014 ”.

                    I admit that there may be an exaggeration, but the essence of the processes of spring 2014 is described correctly.
                  2. New Year day 6 May 2020 12: 00 New
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                    Quote: ccsr
                    What are the speeches when their leader was arrested, and the people did not go to release him and overthrow the government.

                    Well then look ...


                    By the way, in the Crimea was the overthrow of power?
                  3. ccsr 6 May 2020 12: 33 New
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                    Quote: Silvestr
                    By the way, in the Crimea was the overthrow of power?

                    There, the authorities immediately took the side of joining Russia and organized a referendum.
                    Quote: Silvestr
                    Well then look ...

                    It was necessary to free the leader, and not to hold a meeting - then everything could have turned out differently. By the way, where is Gubarev now? Everything is clear with the Crimean leaders, but where is this person, since he was the leader?
      2. Kronos 5 May 2020 19: 39 New
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        Apparently they had to go with their bare hands on the armed Maidanites. That's only when they did it turned out the house of trade unions
        1. ccsr 6 May 2020 11: 13 New
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          Quote: Kronos
          Apparently they had to go with their bare hands on the armed Maidanites

          I don’t know how it should have been, but the inhabitants of Odessa showed that they have heroes, and the dead unarmed Crimeans, who were beaten by Bandera when they returned from the protest rally, immediately united all Crimeans against the Kiev authorities. And Donbass mined all coal - so it was more convenient for everyone ...
  • Vend 5 May 2020 14: 30 New
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    Quote: ccsr
    Quote: Wend
    And Donbass at the beginning advocated federalization and the status of the Russian language as a second state. And no way out of Ukraine and joining Russia.

    Many local exposers suddenly "forget" this and believe that the Crimea and the Donbass are completely identical in their perception of Ukraine, although this is fundamentally not so. It is enough to simply compare the mentality of the inhabitants of Crimea and Donbass and one who knows the subtleties of life in these regions will immediately understand why Crimea was part of Russia unconditionally, but they thought about it with Donbass and whether they want to go to Russia, where the economic life is very different. .
    Quote: Wend
    They started talking about joining when a party began on the part of the Ukrainian authorities and nationalists.

    When their Banderaites began to spread rot in full, then they wanted to go to Russia - this is a natural reaction. But if they were given what they asked, they would demand accession to Russia - this is the cornerstone of our relationship.
    Quote: Wend
    The moment of secession from Ukraine has already been missed. The war has begun.

    Yes, that’s exactly what happened, and if they would raise the Russian flags on February 25, and in early March hold a referendum on joining Russia, then perhaps the current situation was not

    And there is hi
  • New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 26 New
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    Quote: ccsr
    Just compare the mentality of the inhabitants of Crimea and Donbass

    tell me about the Crimean mentality, I want to know fellow countrymen and, especially, about ..
    Quote: ccsr
    subtleties of life in these regions

    Quote: ccsr
    if they raised Russian flags on February 25

    Do not write nonsense. On March 1, in Lugansk, a rally against the new government was designated as the "People’s Council". The slogans "Russians - help !!!", "Rada = junta", "Glory to the Golden Eagle". The flag of Russia is raised on the flagpole of the regional administration.
    On March 1, Russky Blok, which advocated actions exclusively in the state’s legal field, organized a rally on Lenin Square in Donetsk. Crowd to the cries of "Ros-si-I!" raises the flag of the Russian Federation on a flagpole.
    The referendum in Crimea was March 16
    1. ccsr 5 May 2020 19: 50 New
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      Quote: Silvestr
      tell me about the Crimean mentality,

      What can I tell you if I grew up there before 2014 and all my close relatives were in another state until the unification took place? Do you think that you will give me some nonsense about the mentality of Crimeans if I saw with my own eyes how they listened with open mouths in 90-91 to emissaries of Westerners who were promised them golden mountains, only if the USSR collapses and how they will heal well under Kiev authorities. This is only after the Crimeans were thrown to the fullest and began to spread rot and rob them openly, they "suddenly" realized that they had to rush back to Russia. So do not tell me about life in the Crimea - I know how people lived there and why they did not want to be part of Ukraine. It’s good that they thought better of it in time, although even now there are whiners among the Crimeans dofig.
      1. New Year day 5 May 2020 23: 41 New
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        Quote: ccsr
        What can I tell you if I grew up there before 2014 and all my close relatives were in another state until the unification took place? .

        How interesting. He lived in Crimea for 60 years and I see a "prophet!" Where in Saki "float" and DKH? If he lived in Saki, then he should know this recreation.
        Quote: ccsr
        This is only after the Crimeans were thrown to the fullest and began to spread rot and rob them openly, they "suddenly" realized that they had to rush back to Russia.

        Nobody before Maidan rotted anyone. And after the Maidan, the people were simply afraid, since the Crimean Tatars began to host openly. Nobody wanted to die, that's the whole secret.
        Quote: ccsr
        although now whiners among the Crimeans dofiga.

        And how did Putin say? - "Crimeans should not get worse!" So ask your relatives, is the promise fulfilled?
        1. ccsr 6 May 2020 10: 43 New
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          Quote: Silvestr
          If he lived in Saki, then he should know this recreation.

          I didn’t live in Saki — I once had a rest in the well-known sanatorium of the Moscow Region, where the first cosmonauts rested.
          Quote: Silvestr
          Nobody before Maidan rotted anyone.

          Just don’t tell me this - every summer I met with my classmates, and I still keep in touch with them until now, not to mention relatives. And so I saw everything that happened in Crimea with my own eyes. You have only the Crimean Pravda newspaper there all year objectively wrote about Russia, and most Crimean media poured shit on us, looking for the negative from the lives of our citizens. Or wasn’t that?
          Quote: Silvestr
          And after the Maidan, the people were simply afraid, since the Crimean Tatars began to host openly.

          Why are you so fearful people? I saw how the chief doctor of the city hospital was kicked out in Kerch, despite the fact that he was a Tatar, but for some reason this happened after the merger - the question is of course interesting.
          Quote: Silvestr
          "The life of Crimeans should not get worse!" So ask your relatives, is the promise fulfilled?

          Done - at the expense of the rest of Russia. When you are going to repay the debt, don’t forget, I hope that it is red by payment, or, like Svidomo’s, just row for yourself and don’t give anything to the state?
          1. New Year day 6 May 2020 11: 18 New
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            Quote: ccsr
            I didn’t live in Saki — I once had a rest in the well-known sanatorium of the Moscow Region, where the first cosmonauts rested.

            clear, the guest performer! Then do not speak for the locals
            Quote: ccsr
            Just don’t tell me this - every summer I met with my classmates, and I still keep in touch with them until now, not to mention relatives.

            и
            Quote: ccsr
            And so I saw everything that happened in Crimea with my own eyes.

            do you have hallucinations? Think about what you’ve written yourself- I didn’t live, I wasn’t, but I saw everything laughing
            Quote: ccsr
            Why are you so fearful people?

            not shy. Again you don’t know anything about the locals. Then study the issue of clashes between local and NATO, Ukrainian nationalists. Broaden your horizons
            Quote: ccsr
            Done - at the expense of the rest of Russia. When you are going to repay the debt, don’t forget, I hope that it is red by payment, or, like Svidomo’s, just row for yourself and don’t give anything to the state?

            cool! So you acknowledge that you bought Crimea! By the way, for the Crimean lands, airfields and naval forces in the Crimea, do not want to pay?
            This is an argument to your next stupidity! Russia in Crimea received INCORRECTLY more, but there are no achievements, except for the Tauris highway and 2 power plants. Ask how visitors destroyed local health care.
            1. ccsr 6 May 2020 12: 10 New
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              Quote: Silvestr
              clear, the guest performer! Then do not speak for the locals

              You understand that you will not hang noodles on my ears, talking about the motives of the Crimeans. By the way, I served in the army, but you were warming your belly at that time and waiting for manna to sprinkle from the sky. True, I waited, I was not even surprised, especially considering how much I invested my personal funds in Ukrainian Crimea so that Russian people could survive there at that time.
              Quote: Silvestr
              He didn’t live, he was not, but he saw everything

              I have been there more than once every year, and sometimes lived for more than a month, so I studied the press and watched Ukrainian television, especially since I speak Ukrainian. Do not confuse me with those who came for a couple of weeks to swim and did not know what was going on.
              Quote: Silvestr
              So you acknowledge that you bought Crimea!

              And for a big fee, all of Russia pays for this step. Only we do not regret it, as you already understood - we have moral principles, which is why we immediately supported the Crimeans, but would never have joined the Bandera region, where Russian-speaking citizens also live.
              Quote: Silvestr
              By the way, for the Crimean lands, airfields and naval forces in the Crimea, do not want to pay?

              So my parents built and maintained them - why on earth should I pay you? For the fact that the Crimeans stole the plates from the Bagerovsky airfield, or because the Ukrainian authorities destroyed the economic potential of the Crimea? We are now paying, by the way, you just did not understand what this is, or you turned on the fool specifically.
              Quote: Silvestr
              Ask how visitors destroyed local health care.

              Why should I be interested in newcomers, if you and I always have a mess with the local people - they cannot find a single decent official, either a bribe taker or a mediocrity.
              1. New Year day 6 May 2020 13: 06 New
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                Quote: ccsr
                By the way, I served in the army, but you belly warmed at this time

                immediately one and in CA. and in the navy. and in the air force? Well done!
                Quote: ccsr
                I invested my personal funds in the Ukrainian Crimea so that Russian people could survive there at that time.

                in fairness, tell me how much Soviet Ukraine invested in Crimea and how much do you personally?

                Quote: ccsr
                So my parents built and maintained them - why on earth should I pay you?

                those. my mother, who started working at 16, my father, who started working at 18 and having a pension of 11 thousand and disability, does not count? Or are your parents better than mine?
                My total experience of 37 years and still work, pay all taxes. And you contain me? Is everything all right with your head or is there megalomania?
                Quote: ccsr
                Why should I be interested in newcomers, if you and I always have a mess with the local people - they cannot find a single decent official, either a bribe taker or a mediocrity.

                it is yes! Crimea is not lucky with this matter! Whom they do not send - immediately steal. Take the governors of Sevastopol, at least. And with regards to the Simferopol, so rightly noticed! The organized crime group "Selem" came to power. I hope you heard about these? Well, you know Crimea from the inside! And do you know Goblin?

                Quote: ccsr
                you just didn’t understand what this is, or you turned on the fool specifically.

                as I understand with whom I’m conducting a dialogue, corresponding to the opponent request
                1. ccsr 6 May 2020 13: 20 New
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                  Quote: Silvestr
                  immediately one and in CA. and in the navy. and in the air force? Well done!

                  I served in one of the structures from the Ministry of Defense - you are simply not in the subject.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  how much Soviet Ukraine invested in Crimea and how much do you personally?

                  I don’t know about the whole of Ukraine, but I’ll be attracted to a decent business-class foreign car.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  Or are your parents better than mine?

                  Mine are no longer alive, but I constantly helped them, because it was difficult for them to live on a Ukrainian pension. The Russian pension was much larger.

                  Quote: Silvestr
                  My total experience of 37 years and still work, pay all taxes.

                  I have more, I still work and also pay taxes. What is so surprising about this?
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  Well, you know Crimea from the inside! And do you know Goblin?

                  I know Crimea, but I don’t really have your kings, they change them very quickly, but I remember Rook.
                2. New Year day 6 May 2020 14: 03 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  I have more, I still work and also pay taxes. What is so surprising about this?

                  so feed me or not?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Mine are no longer alive, but I constantly helped them, because it was difficult for them to live on a Ukrainian pension.

                  those. my parents are guilty of being alive, and you keep them?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  I served in one of the structures from the Ministry of Defense - you are simply not in the subject.

                  to me on the drum who and where served. As a result of the work, surplus value is created, which develops society. What surplus value have you personally created? The army always and everywhere lives on the money earned by the worker, collective farmer, farmer, i.e. in the field of material production. You do not belong to it, therefore, you really did not spend anything on the Crimea and on Crimeans. Where your income tax has gone, look for yourself.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  I know Crimea, but I don’t really have your kings, they change them very quickly, but I remember Rook.

                  find the contradiction in what you wrote
                3. ccsr 6 May 2020 17: 29 New
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                  Quote: Silvestr
                  so feed me or not?

                  Not directly, but indirectly - you still do not pay property taxes, and the rest of the country pays. Yes, and many of your Ukrainian pensioners (those who retired before unification) receive such pensions that they did not even dream of in Russia, but you are silently cunning about this, that such a freebie has broken off. For what merits to Russia do we provide them with such pensions?
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  those. my parents are guilty of being alive, and you keep them?

                  Let your parents worry you, I am interested in a question, why do you think that they live worse than other Russian pensioners? Our employee recently retired - 9 thousand pensions, although she worked all her life. True, they gave her a surcharge in Moscow, but not all of Russia has such payments.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  What surplus value have you personally created?

                  Everything is in order with your head - what surplus value can a public sector employee, a doctor of a city clinic, for example give?
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  You do not belong to it, therefore, you really did not spend anything on the Crimea and on Crimeans.

                  If you knew how much personal money I left in Crimea, and didn’t take them to Turkey or Egypt, then you might have great respect for people like me, who cared more about Russian people in Crimea, letting them earn money on vacationers.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  find the contradiction in what you wrote

                  Are you also a great linguist? Come on, something without kookies, ask ...
                4. New Year day 6 May 2020 23: 40 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  Not directly, but indirectly - you still do not pay property taxes, and the rest of the country pays.

                  this is a temporary phenomenon
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Yes, and many of your Ukrainian pensioners (those who retired before unification) receive such pensions that they did not even dream of in Russia, but you are silently cunning about this, that such a freebie has broken off. For what merits to Russia do we provide them with such pensions?

                  So you are a Bandera! You need territories without people!
                  As of January 1, 2019, 586 pensioners live in Crimea, which is slightly more than 629% of the total population of the republic. Many retired under the USSR.
                  Why didn’t you personally shoot them? Envious eyes, raking hands!
                  Read the law and the size of pensions in the Crimea:
                  Federal Law of July 21.07.2014, 208 N 02.08.2019-ФЗ (as amended on August XNUMX, XNUMX) "On the Pension Peculiarities of Citizens of the Russian Federation Living in the Territory of the Republic of Crimea and the City of Federal Significance of Sevastopol"
                  Key figures:
                  minimum payments for a pensioner - 8370 rubles, and in Sevastopol - 8842;
                  allowance due to the loss of a breadwinner 5035 rubles;
                  disabled people are given 2145 rubles per month;
                  social is 5035 rubles;
                  about 5034 rubles go to the military;
                  retirees who continue to work will receive 8145 rubles.
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Let your parents worry you, I am interested in a question, why do you think that they live worse than other Russian pensioners?

                  what is better?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  Everything is in order with your head - what surplus value can a public sector employee, a doctor of a city clinic, for example give?

                  And what kind of surplus value do doctors create by saving patients from covid-19? Do you think it yourself or is it lacking?
                  Quote: ccsr
                  If you knew how much personal money I left in Crimea, and didn’t take them to Turkey or Egypt, then maybe you would respect people like me with great respect

                  do not go! Such arrogant boors in the Crimea have always been beaten in the first place. Snobbery - a thing harmful to health.
                  In conclusion: do not like the population of Crimea, shoot him. "Bachili och, schu kupuly, izhte - wants to ruin." laughing
                5. ccsr 7 May 2020 11: 39 New
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                  Quote: Silvestr
                  this is a temporary phenomenon

                  Lasting six years?
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  So you are a Bandera! You need territories without people!

                  No, I need the equality of all citizens of the country, and not a situation where the well-being of some has to be provided at the expense of others.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  Read the law and the size of pensions in the Crimea:

                  Get comfortable, verbiage - I know the pensions of all my friends and relatives, and I know how they threw some of them when they recounted Ukrainian pensions in 2014, so don't hang on my ears. Ukrainian officials received awesome pensions in excess of 25-40 thousand rubles, and my classmate and my brother, for example, hanging around the seas all their lives, barely gained 9-11 thousand. So do not whistle me about Crimean pensions - I know very well how real they are for those who worked in the USSR.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  And what kind of surplus value do doctors create by saving patients from covid-19?

                  So you began to weave about my surplus value - so you justify.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  Such arrogant boors in the Crimea have always been beaten in the first place. Snobbery - a thing harmful to health.

                  You see, the truth immediately began to cut my eyes - I realized that you won’t be able to rub Crimeans about my life, and immediately started screaming. Yes, without people like me, you would have lived even worse during the times of Kiev’s government — you don’t want to see this point blank.
                  Quote: Silvestr
                  In conclusion: do not like the population of Crimea, shoot him. "Bachili och, schu kupuly, izhte - wants to ruin."

                  Do not hysteria like a pregnant schoolgirl - learn to listen to the truth from those who see through your wisdom through. Crimea was Russian, and it will remain. So do not rely on privileges, but rather try to get more benefit from you.
  • Aleksandr21 6 May 2020 09: 46 New
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    Quote: ccsr
    Many local exposers suddenly "forget" this and believe that the Crimea and the Donbass are completely identical in their perception of Ukraine, although this is fundamentally not so. It is enough to simply compare the mentality of the inhabitants of Crimea and Donbass and anyone who knows the subtleties of life in these regions will immediately understand why Crimea was incorporated into Russia unconditionally, but they thought about Donbass


    Those who wanted to be with Ukraine have already left for other areas. And there were other subtleties here: new sanctions, huge expenses for the restoration of the region (building infrastructure, investing in industry, etc.), social expenses (pensions, benefits, etc.) and all this would result in a huge amount, not counting new lawsuits in international courts, so the current business / political elite of Russia did not go to break all ties with the West. After all, there are Gazprom, Rosneft, Sberbank and other companies that had and still have property in the EU, subsidiaries, various financial investments, real estate and others ... and in the event of a complete break, all this would be arrested, Gazprom and Rosneft would impose such sanctions that they generally would not be able to sell resources in the West, so that our business circles had something to lose. A striking example is Sberbank, which is still not in the Crimea.
  • Aleksandr21 6 May 2020 09: 29 New
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    Quote: Wend
    I would like to remind those who forgot. At the beginning of Ukrainian events, Crimea was immediately for leaving Ukraine and joining Russia. And Donbass at the beginning advocated federalization and the status of the Russian language as a second state. And no way out of Ukraine and joining Russia.


    Do you recall the events of 2014? Donbass initially really wanted to follow the path of Crimea, when the Donchans saw a story happening before their eyes and Crimea returned to Russia, many had the hope that they could return home as well, they were also Russians and were no different from Crimeans, but when Putin called not to hold a referendum, and from Moscow curators began to call the new authorities (at that time) of Donetsk / Lugansk so that the issue of joining Russia was not included in the ballots, since no one was waiting for them, they all replayed and Donbass began to advocate for federalization and status P sskogo language, but a referendum held due to the fact that the situation has gone too far, and the blood was on the hands of the Kiev authorities in this endeavor ... Donbass? to Transnistria? No, he sought to become part of Russia, at least such hopes were now among the inhabitants of the LDNR republics, but they were thrown. They froze the situation and are now trying to shove it back into Ukraine, and it is resisting, because then the sanctions against Russia will be lifted, and even restore the destroyed region + social welfare pay, but there is no money (s)
  • Xnumx vis 5 May 2020 13: 22 New
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    Yes, the fleet was in Sevastopol, is and will be ... And I recall how Sevastopol came to the rally on February 23! Then Simferopol and the rest of Crimea ... The self-defenders and the Berkuts who returned to Sevastopol set up a block of posts around Sevastopol, ordinary citizens (Sevastopol) went to Simferopol under the Supreme Council of Crimea ... Crimean Tatar nationalists prevailed there ... Together with Simferopol they moved them ... Golden eagles and former soldiers (Sevastopol!) Went, advanced to Chongar and Perekop. Blocked, blocked the entrance to the Crimea. ...... And the rest of Ukraine was watching outside what was going to happen .... And we were waiting for Odessa, Kharkiv, Donetsk, Lugank, Kherson, Nikolaev, Zaporozhye, Dnepropetrovsk to rise with us at the same time ... They didn’t wait, they were afraid ....... We looked pretended .. It turns out there was not the most important Unity in action. This is the main reason for the future ... Russia all this time also watched and waited ... So, do not shake the air with empty talk. hi
  • beeper 5 May 2020 15: 50 New
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    Quote: barin
    in the Donbass and there was no Black Sea Fleet and military base in Sevastopol

    All right. If not for the Black Sea Fleet in Crimea, then there would be no “Crimean events”. Already even built a naval base in Novorossiysk and were preparing after 2017 to withdraw the Black Sea Fleet from the Crimea.

    hi Yes that's right! So then it looked like the Russian authorities were preparing to shamefully wipe themselves off and after 2017 quietly get out of the Crimea quietly into the inconvenience and fierce seasonal “burs” of the Novorossiysk base under construction, under the triumphant hooting of banderlogs with Turkoman! request
    And the supposedly “pro-Russian” then-rulers of Ukraine, the Judomazepins Yanukovych-Azarov and their Western minions in the Zrada (in translation from “der.movy” “zrada” is “betrayal”, and as one of the “parents” of this synonymous “cain stamp” in the Ukrainian segment of the Internet, I’ll explain to our Russian colleagues why we started writing about Verkhovna Rad-Vrada at the beginning of the “tenth years” - precisely because of the vile betrayal of our voters, the majority of the Ukrainian population, who advocated full cooperation with the countries of the Commonwealth of Independent States D and the Customs Union, Common Economic Space with Russia, Belarus and Kazakhstan, for the equal state status of our Russian language of interethnic communication, for denazification-debanderization, against complicity with NATO, mercantile hypocrites Yanukovych-Azarov and their quasi-pro-Russian "bourgeois" party of regions ", immediately after coming to power peremptorily declaring their “firm course” on “non-alternative European integration”, refusal to give our mother tongue a state status on the same level with Ukrainian and started “love games” with the Banderonists, bringing frank neo-Nazis directly to the Verkhovna Rada of the legislative branch, which he did not dare to do even the "hands-free" the Maidanopresik Dioxin !!! And now these are the main accomplices of the Bandera-Nazis, the preparation and conduct of the pro-American Maidan coup d'état, along with them, and even more, dribbling Ukraine, closing Russian schools at a snappy pace even in the most Russian-speaking, most industrialized, Southeastern regions and surrendering the entire humanitarian sphere our multinational republics in the clutches of the vile zapadensky banderlog-pharions and vakarchuk modestly sit out in Russia and even wrap something there, with their "back mind", on air, under Russian protection, fleeing from the reprisals of their own young accomplices, mortally offended by the "partregional" mafia Family with the “sharing of stolen goods” and “shrinking living with the weather” ??!) they would have helped in this in every possible way and would have waved “goodbye goodbye!” to the goodbye with a pen and say goodbye! yes

    Washington hucksters are the "honest guardians" of the multi-billion-dollar thieves' assets "stolen from our working people, intimidating the Vorishe" ukropolitikum "with a demonstrative" legal seizure (of course, the thief stole a purse from a thief in the US budget, under the pretext of an alleged "fight with corruption and dirty money laundering "!)", from an escaped to the USA (therefore "already learned" megacleptomaniaans, and, according to them, also latent Russophobes, Yanek-Azarov, with an "overworked work" taken with them, fled to a good-natured , not remembering evil, Russia, oh where for such rich quasi “pro-Russian” subchiks “there is no extradition” —never the same for the sometimes donated directly to the “ISBUSHKI” dungeons, Donetsk volunteers fleeing to Russia, risking their lives in defense against the Bandera-Nazi murderers of the peaceful Russian population of our Southeast! ) an accomplice of Kuchman, the former ukrokleptopremier Lazarenko, and de facto received full control over these thievish dribberschikov and, in turn, led by them "uncovered derzhava"!
    1. beeper 5 May 2020 15: 50 New
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      Therefore, in anticipation of the planned expulsion of the Black Sea Fleet from Crimea, the Americans, already in the summer of 2013, under the guise of a "humanitarian action", began repairing their buildings for the priority deployment of their special services in Sevastopol!
      No resistance to the outcome of the “rental of Crimean bases and infrastructure facilities and navigational support for the fleet” by the Russian authorities was predicted by American military intelligence analysts — they admitted this without hesitation! yes

      Only completely “cornered”, put in a hopeless and inevitably shameful stalemate with the main naval base and the loss of military control over the entire Black Sea region, the Russian leadership miraculously (still very little and indecisive Kremlin “chitroplanovye” powerlessly bit elbows ", but, still spradavna, is noticed even by our fierce enemiesGod is always on the side of the Russians and our multinational Russian Community! God, the World Mind, and this time the Russians, and others like us, did not betray the enemy, and the Ameronazi "pig did not eat"! yes ) Perked up from its pernicious “Olympic dream of reason” —could save itself from self-destructive (for its image and, in general, for the development of the socio-political situation in the then Russia itself, with its growing “contradictions between labor and capital”!) Disgrace saved from the Bandera and Turkoman neo-Nazis of our rebellious Crimean fellow citizens with all their “station” - an “unsinkable aircraft carrier” (the American military in 2013 tentatively estimated this land potential as a fleet of ten of its aircraft carriers d) "Crimea (which would inevitably undergo a" creeping "Turkish-American occupation, in which, thinned out and schooled by the occupiers, the Bandera-Nazis and Turkoman would perform the same role of the" auxiliary police "as under the Nazis, they would strangle and kill their fellow citizens , forcing obedience to the Phashington "civilizers"!)!
  • Civil 5 May 2020 19: 34 New
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    Donetsk and Donbass. Part of the team is part of the ship.
  • Basil50 5 May 2020 07: 03 New
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    And I remember not only 2014. I remember what they said and what the inhabitants of the outskirts and Donbass sought in the nineties and at the beginning of a new century. Do not want to remember? Do you want to remember what rushed from the outskirts in connection with the Chechen wars and the 08.08.08 war.?
    You do not want? NO?
    Donetsk in these statements was no different from the rest of the outskirts.
    Donetsk, among other things, fed Bandera, and was offended only when it became a * feed base * for zapadentsev, having lost the opportunity to influence the rest of the outskirts.
    Help is of course necessary, but in no case do not resist Bandera INSTEAD of the inhabitants of the outskirts.
    1. Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 08: 34 New
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      Nonsense wrote. After the torn constitution by the roller-coaster (and the bjolar also tore), the country has thrilled, and now without two regions ..... The ruble has already turned into a trifle. And the bombing of Lugansk is a democracy of mattresses. No need for such a mattress democracy.
    2. Alt 22 5 May 2020 08: 49 New
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      Do not invent, in the nineties there were practically no Bandera in Ukraine, they sat quietly under the key. Donbass never fed Bandera - he paid money to the budget of Ukraine, like all other regions.
      1. Vend 5 May 2020 12: 04 New
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        Quote: Alt22
        Do not invent, in the nineties there were practically no Bandera in Ukraine, they sat quietly under the key. Donbass never fed Bandera - he paid money to the budget of Ukraine, like all other regions.

        Come on. Have you been in Lviv at least in the 90s? There was restrained patience towards the Russians (through gnashing of teeth), and open hatred towards Ukrainians from the east. I personally observed it.
        1. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 31 New
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          Quote: Wend
          Have you been in Lviv at least in the 90s?

          and you were in the Crimea in the 90s? Bandera was neither heard nor seen
          1. ccsr 5 May 2020 19: 56 New
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            Quote: Silvestr
            and you were in the Crimea in the 90s? Bandera was neither heard nor seen

            Tell this to someone else - I was just resting in Saki at that time and saw pasted leaflets and Bandera people who were spinning around the city and especially near the market, telling how Ukraine would flourish if it did not feed Russia.
            1. New Year day 5 May 2020 23: 31 New
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              Quote: ccsr
              I then just had a rest in Saki and saw pasted leaflets and Bandera

              not zvizdy- I live there. There were leaflets, but the result?
              1. ccsr 6 May 2020 10: 30 New
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                Quote: Silvestr
                not zvizdy- I live there. There were leaflets, but the result?

                You whistle on the forum, and I saw it not only in Saki, but also in Yevpatoria and other cities of Crimea. So I don’t know about your cunningness from anyone’s words - I know you as flaky ones, and I’m still aware of all your complaints about Russia.
                Regarding the result, you always wanted a special autonomous status both during the USSR and after its collapse, but the bummer came out. And when they realized that as part of Ukraine, you would never become the second Donbass in economics, you immediately realized that you had to bring Russia to it from there. Moreover, you clearly saw the life of Russians coming to rest for you, and even the children of many Crimeans generally dumped them in Russia forever, just to not stay in Crimea.
                So you are calling here - and I know why, because I have always been and are a statesman in thinking, and I don’t think that you should have any privileges, but you must work like a whole country, and not just in the holiday season.
                1. New Year day 6 May 2020 11: 26 New
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                  Quote: ccsr
                  and I saw this not only in Saki, but also in Yevpatoria and other cities of Crimea.

                  they also write one word on the fence, only after that the fence does not change its function.
                  For general development ..

                  Quote: ccsr
                  And when they realized that as part of Ukraine, you would never become the second Donbass in economics, you immediately realized that you had to bring Russia to it from there.

                  this is a clinic, comprehend your own nonsense
                  Quote: ccsr
                  that you should have some privileges, but you must work hard like the whole country, and not just in the holiday season.

                  create jobs! Put adequate in power! Who is stopping doing?
                  In the meantime, enlighten
                  Quote: ccsr
                  .. state man
                  - who rules the Crimea laughing
                  1. ccsr 6 May 2020 12: 21 New
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                    Quote: Silvestr
                    they also write one word on the fence, only after that the fence does not change its function.
                    For general development ..

                    Started to distort again? I told you about the events of the early nineties and the behavior of the Crimeans then told me, and you palm off the video of 2014 when you were in shit, so you went out to protest, because the Maidan took place in Kiev. But if there hadn’t been a coup and Yanukovych had been in power, would you have acted like that too? I do not believe.
                    Quote: Silvestr
                    this is a clinic, comprehend your own nonsense

                    Just don’t tell me how the inhabitants of Crimea lived during the Soviet era, even in comparison with the inhabitants of the Moscow Region - I saw it with my own eyes and can compare it. And what I saw in other regions of Russia at that time generally seemed a wretched life compared to the life of Crimeans. That's why you howled when the Kiev authorities began to milk you and did not give anything in return - this explains your unanimous desire to return to Russia.
                    Quote: Silvestr
                    create jobs!

                    How many Crimeans were there in the construction of the bridge, can you say? I saw Armenians from Armenia there, but no one from the Crimeans wanted to go there.
                    1. New Year day 6 May 2020 12: 36 New
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                      Quote: ccsr
                      I told you about the events of the early nineties, and then the Crimeans spoke

                      and what did they do so badly? By the way, what good did people do in the 90s in Russia?
                      Quote: ccsr
                      how Crimeans lived during Soviet times, even in comparison with residents of the Moscow Region - I saw it with my own eyes and can compare it.

                      well lived, no doubt. Is this still a personal contribution of people or a policy of the authorities?
                      Quote: ccsr
                      That's why you howled when the Kiev authorities began to milk you and gave nothing in return

                      do not carry nonsense. Without living in the Crimea, to say such a thing is simply stupid. If they started milking, now
                      Quote: ccsr
                      How many Crimeans were there in the construction of the bridge, can you say? I saw Armenians from Armenia there, but no one from the Crimeans wanted to go there.

                      A neighbor from the 1st floor worked. Who else, I don’t know. And why did the Armenians work, as they worked as Tajiks, read how they threw them with money. You will be surprised
                      1. ccsr 6 May 2020 12: 50 New
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                        Quote: Silvestr
                        Without living in the Crimea, to say such a thing is simply stupid. If they started milking, now

                        I visited Kiev all the time and saw how they live there, and since I traveled to the Crimea by car, I saw how Crimeans live and Crimeans, and there was nothing to compare, especially by the state of the roads.
                        I wonder who is milking you right now?
                        Quote: Silvestr
                        And why did the Armenians work, as they worked as Tajiks, read how they threw them with money.

                        In fact, they worked as drivers and rented apartments, and I did not hear anyone throwing them there.
                        Quote: Silvestr
                        Be surprised

                        What is surprising - a bridge near my house was being built, and workers lived from the bridge in my school. So I know more than many Crimeans how the construction really went on all these years.
                      2. New Year day 6 May 2020 12: 53 New
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                        Quote: ccsr
                        So I know more than many Crimeans how the construction really went on all these years.

                        we all know a place in government. Everyone knows for sure, there’s no result
        2. Vend 6 May 2020 10: 01 New
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          Quote: Silvestr
          Quote: Wend
          Have you been in Lviv at least in the 90s?

          and you were in the Crimea in the 90s? Bandera was neither heard nor seen

          And it’s not about Crimea, but Donbass, you have lost the line of discussion.
          1. New Year day 6 May 2020 12: 55 New
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            Quote: Wend
            And it’s not about Crimea, but Donbass, you have lost the line of discussion.

            I have not lost. Just Crimeans accused of inferiority and commercialism
            Quote: ccsr
            That's why you howled when the Kiev authorities began to milk you and did not give anything in return - this explains your unanimous desire to return to Russia.

            Quote: ccsr
            And when they realized that as part of Ukraine, you would never become the second Donbass in economics, you immediately realized that you had to bring Russia to it from there.

            etc. etc.
      2. New Year day 5 May 2020 15: 32 New
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        Quote: Wend
        Have you been in Lviv at least in the 90s? There was restrained patience towards the Russians (through gnashing of teeth), and open hatred towards Ukrainians from the east.

        everything was within Western Ukraine.
        1. Vend 6 May 2020 10: 04 New
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          Quote: Silvestr
          Quote: Wend
          Have you been in Lviv at least in the 90s? There was restrained patience towards the Russians (through gnashing of teeth), and open hatred towards Ukrainians from the east.

          everything was within Western Ukraine.

          Yes, it was mainly within Western Ukraine.
          1. New Year day 6 May 2020 11: 19 New
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            Quote: Wend
            Yes, it was mainly within Western Ukraine.

            Been there, collided. Although in the Carpathians, it was a little easier.
      3. Alt 22 6 May 2020 07: 43 New
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        Bingo! I am in Lviv and live, imagine. And even here - in the nineties, Bandera was practically absent, and those that were were sitting quietly. And in the rest of Ukraine, they were generally looked upon as clowns. And then they practically did not influence the political life of the country. “Rukh” was a more serious party than any Bandera movement, about which they had not heard anything then. It was only later, grants from the West went to the bandera, they got stronger, gained strength - and even then, their ideas did not find support from the majority. And then - it was near-zero size.
        Well, what about the hatred of the Russians - Ukrainians generally treat Russians normally, Galicians - yes, they mostly hate Russians, especially if they are opponents of Bandera - I myself am Russian, aware of all this ...
  • Basil50 5 May 2020 11: 52 New
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    When I was assigned to the Cherkasy region of the Ukrainian SSR as a young specialist, back in the distant eighties of the last century, I SAW these Bendera men. They were teachers at school, and in the city administration they were not cleaners. Of course, they didn’t run with machine guns, but feeling the support of the policemen they liked to fight, and much more to do when they were going to the flock.
  • ccsr 5 May 2020 12: 34 New
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    Quote: Vasily50
    Do you want to remember what rushed from the outskirts in connection with the Chechen wars and the 08.08.08 war.?
    You do not want? NO?

    The memory of some of the current accusers is short - they do not want to remember this, because then you need to think about why Bandera propaganda was perceived by all residents of Ukraine as something harmless and kind of childish prank. So all the inhabitants of Ukraine got what they deserved as a result of the betrayal of common ideals, and even if they pay for it in full, I do not feel sorry for them.
  • Zmeelov 5 May 2020 13: 26 New
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    Quote: Vasily50
    And I remember not only 2014.

    Why are you silent here 4 years ago! I would sit in turtles with the professor .. ..Put out of the caches and so many !!!! Mom do not cry how many more of them men are here?
  • CSKA 5 May 2020 14: 17 New
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    Quote: Vasily50
    Donetsk in these statements was no different from the rest of the outskirts.

    Donbass had a foreign ministry in the 90s and 2008, could it make any statements? What nonsense are you talking about ?!
  • Thrifty 5 May 2020 07: 13 New
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    It is high time that the Russians living in the homeland of those 40 thousand nationalists are gone, and return with all Russian lands to Russia forever! For me, Odessa, Mariupol, Kharkov, and many other quasi-Roin-Russian cities are in fact illegal given for the mythical political benefit of the country's elite to the non-state of uk-roin, which should go to the dustbin of history!
  • Ros 56 5 May 2020 07: 33 New
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    Honestly, we in Russia also thought that Novorossia would become the southwestern federal district of the Russian Federation. Alas, it did not happen and the responsibility nevertheless rests with our leadership, including for Odessa on May 2.
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  • Oleg133 5 May 2020 07: 56 New
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    The first line that I read is “Crimean spring”. Although she was a "Russian spring."
    Now, essentially, Russia (1) is against the Russians. There is not a single Russian state entity on planet Earth.

    (1) state, mechanism, management apparatus
    1. Alt 22 5 May 2020 08: 47 New
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      I did not believe this until the Russian Federation gave Elena Boyko to Bandera. Then - I extradited to the enemies of the Russians in Kazakhstan the Russian militia Yevgeny Shcherbak, who fought for the Russians and Russia's interests in the Donbass - I can not name this other than betrayal.
      The authorities of the Russian Federation are really against the Russian people ... They refuse to recognize him, respectively, and are not going to help the Russians.
  • Oleg133 5 May 2020 07: 59 New
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    Quote: Thrifty
    It’s time to sweep away those 40 thousand nationalists living with Russians living in Ukraine

    I would not advise Russian to do this. The Russian Federation issues Russians to Ukraine.
    1. Alex Nevs 5 May 2020 08: 36 New
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      They eat and eat themselves.
  • Oleg133 5 May 2020 08: 03 New
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    These are the words about the significance of Donbass for Soviet Russia, Lenin said:

    In fact, it was Lenin and Stalin who formed the state of Ukraine. All that is happening there now is their merit.
    1. Stas157 5 May 2020 09: 56 New
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      Quote: Oleg133
      In fact, it was Lenin and Stalin who formed the state of Ukraine. All that is happening there now is their merit.

      This is called blaming everything from a sore head to a healthy one. Under Lenin and Stalin, there was no such problem., as it is now in Ukraine, it could not be.

      But there were problems a thousand times more complicated, which they successfully solved. When faced with problems, the current leaders prefer to blame everything (on mines) - the Soviet leadership, instead of solving these problems themselves.
      1. CSKA 5 May 2020 14: 29 New
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        Quote: Stas157
        This is called blaming everything from a sore head to a healthy one. Under Lenin and Stalin there was no such problem, as it could not be in Ukraine now.

        It was Lenin who was to blame for this problem by creating the Ukrainian SSR. It was under them that Ukrainization was carried out.
        Quote: Stas157
        But there were problems a thousand times more complicated, which they successfully solved.

        very decided. Do not tell me how they solved the problem with Bendera so wonderfully that they drew themselves sharply in the 90s? Know not very decided.
  • Bagatur 5 May 2020 08: 48 New
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    And Russia, I mean the Russian ruling elite Donbas needed? Destroyed to the ground, for the restoration of the need for billions of dollars .... In a situation of growing economic crisis in Russia itself? Donbas and its people need Russia precisely in Ukraine, as the impact of domestic policy on it! If in Kiev UTB understand and go to renounce Donbas? They want to go to Russia, they say go empty! Then it will become clear to everyone that Putin lost Ukraine to Russia once and for all!
    1. Avior 5 May 2020 09: 05 New
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      . If in Kiev UTB understand and go to renounce Donbas?

      Strongly doubt.
      The current situation suits everyone, although for various reasons.
      Except, perhaps, the residents of Donbass themselves
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 09: 03 New
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    Quote: Stas157

    The donation of Donbass has already taken place by signing the Minsk agreements. This means that Donbass is officially recognized as the territory of Ukraine.

    You would like it so much. The territory of Ukraine with Russian residents (this is about certification) so do not rush to rejoice gently
  • Karaul20 5 May 2020 09: 07 New
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    It was not just that under the USSR they transferred the Donbass to Ukraine and in general allocated such a republic as the Ukrainian SSR, if it was supposedly an “artificial formation”, but all of them are actually Russians. Yes, most of the residents of large cities of Left-Bank Ukraine are Russian-speaking (more precisely, the Ukrainian version of Russian), because this part was part of Russia from the time of the Pereyaslav Rada of Khmelnitsky and was Russified, but they did not stop being Ukrainians from this. And even now, the inhabitants of Donbass in their dialect are markedly different from the Russians, and they can also freely understand the Ukrainian language. The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia.
    Crimea is historically not Ukraine, but it had to be clarified at the collapse of the USSR, not recognized. But it turned out that at first they recognized, but now they have violated international law and, as a result, the whole world does not recognize Crimea as Russian.
    1. Tagan 5 May 2020 09: 41 New
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      And even now, the inhabitants of Donbass in their dialect are markedly different from the Russians, and they can also freely understand the Ukrainian language. The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia.

      What are you talking about?
      Well, take the dialect of the inhabitants of the Rostov region. It does not look like Moscow, but it looks like a dialect of the inhabitants of Donbass. And then what? At the expense of "they can freely understand the Ukrainian language." So he was studied at school, at least.
      But this conclusion "The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia" it’s even difficult to comment)))

      Donbass was for some time a part of Ukraine, but it was never Ukrainian.
      1. Karaul20 5 May 2020 11: 56 New
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        Quote: Tagan
        What are you talking about?
        Well, take the dialect of the inhabitants of the Rostov region. It does not look like Moscow, but it looks like a dialect of the inhabitants of Donbass. And then what?

        Quote: Tagan
        But this conclusion "The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia" it’s even difficult to comment)))

        They answered their own question. So they are these historical lands and transitional territories where the dialect is still similar to Ukrainian. At the beginning, the USSR and the RSFSR even had territorial disputes, and in the USSR in Belgorod, the newspaper Belgorodskaya Pravda even once appeared in two languages ​​- Ukrainian and Russian. Again, it was not for nothing that the UPR once claimed for those lands.

        Quote: Tagan
        Donbass was for some time a part of Ukraine, but it was never Ukrainian.
        The fact that part of Ukraine was part of the Russian Empire does not mean that it was not there. Kazan, too, is already a part of Russia, but Tatarstan cannot be called Russian?
    2. monah 5 May 2020 09: 57 New
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      Quote: Karaul20
      It was not just that under the USSR they transferred the Donbass to Ukraine and in general allocated such a republic as the Ukrainian SSR, if it was supposedly an “artificial formation”, but all of them are actually Russians. Yes, most of the residents of large cities of Left-Bank Ukraine are Russian-speaking (more precisely, the Ukrainian version of Russian), because this part was part of Russia from the time of the Pereyaslav Rada of Khmelnitsky and was Russified, but they did not stop being Ukrainians from this. And even now, the inhabitants of Donbass in their dialect are markedly different from the Russians, and they can also freely understand the Ukrainian language. The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia.
      Crimea is historically not Ukraine, but it had to be clarified at the collapse of the USSR, not recognized. But it turned out that at first they recognized, but now they have violated international law and, as a result, the whole world does not recognize Crimea as Russian.

      The storyteller you however! Tell me more that Kharkov joined Khmelnitsky to Russia!
      1. Karaul20 5 May 2020 12: 23 New
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        Quote: monah
        The storyteller you however! Tell me more that Kharkov joined Khmelnitsky to Russia!
        There, the year of foundation and Pereyaslavskaya Rada approximately coincide in date +/-. Again, the same Sloboda Cossack regiment, in fact, consisted of Ukrainians.
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  • 7,62h54 5 May 2020 09: 16 New
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    Kremlin people in raguli still see the brothers. And even closer than the Donetsk miners. And all because the people in the Donbas are right, just a little, maybe they can give them their teeth. Such relatives are useless.
  • Pvi1206 5 May 2020 09: 24 New
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    The events in Ukraine are another trip of the West to Russia .... they managed to tear it away from Russia ... but not everything went as smoothly as they wanted ... as a result, sanctions ... this is also in the interests of the West .. .round treason, betrayal and cowardice of power ...
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 09: 51 New
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    Quote: Alt22
    I did not believe this until the Russian Federation gave Elena Boyko to Bandera. Then - I extradited to the enemies of the Russians in Kazakhstan the Russian militia Yevgeny Shcherbak, who fought for the Russians and Russia's interests in the Donbass - I can not name this other than betrayal.
    The authorities of the Russian Federation are really against the Russian people ... They refuse to recognize him, respectively, and are not going to help the Russians.

    Elena Boyko, speak? ...
    "why was Elena Boyko deported to Ukraine, why to Kharkov? Answer: because she decided so. She was offered the opportunity to choose any city of Ukraine for deportation, including (formally still Ukrainian) Donetsk and Lugansk - but she herself did opt for Kharkov. "
    The main occupation of Elena in Russia was activities in the interests of the SBU: collecting information on the activities of Ukrainian political emigration, the personal data of activists, the place and time of the actions they organized in Russia and Ukraine, as well as on the socio-political situation in the Russian Federation.
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 09: 54 New
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    Quote: Oleg133
    Quote: Thrifty
    It’s time to sweep away those 40 thousand nationalists living with Russians living in Ukraine

    I would not advise Russian to do this. The Russian Federation issues Russians to Ukraine.

    For example, Elena Boyko? )))
  • veritas 5 May 2020 09: 57 New
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    Donchanin: We were sure that after the Crimea Donbass would become Russian

    We let the brothers down. Not beautifully turned out.
  • U-58 5 May 2020 10: 25 New
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    The whole article is riddled with promises: everyone hoped, everyone calculated ...
    But no one did anything.
    In this case, one has to admit that Putin was right, who said that the Donbass had a “different” situation compared to Crimea.
    And then: too many hatskraynikov appeared in the cities. And even now it is ABSOLUTELY the village, whose power will be Kiev, Moscow, Montevideo or Shepetovka. If only they were satisfying and calm.
    I have no doubt that if in 30 minutes Russian tanks enter the streets of Odessa and Kiev, there will be no limit to the glee of the people.
    Fall asleep with flowers, loaves and bottles with vodka.
    But in order to do something yourself, I'm sorry, move in.
    1. ALARI 5 May 2020 11: 26 New
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      Revolutions, coups, riots are always made by a very small part of the population of the territory, the rest are watching from the edge. It was the same with us in 91 and 93. And you belong to what category?
      1. U-58 5 May 2020 11: 49 New
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        Where? Yes to the liability, of course!
        90th year. Tobacco riot. The rally at the regional administration. I go out to speak. I say: people! You are being used to enter power. Think about it, look at the tricolor flags of the instigators - I personally do not want to have anything in common with the flag of hucksters and speculators.
        The people do not heed, the KGB in the PAZ periodically writes everything on video ...
        91st year, September. Sobchak is betrayed on the radio about how culture and art will rise when the city is renamed to St. Petersburg. I criticize, I convince people. Does not reach. At the bus station we are waiting for the bus. They pass from the Congress of Deputies about the abolition of the Union.
        I'm trying to predict - the loss of social guarantees, rising prices and poverty, the rich. The people stupidly (sorry, elementary) do not believe.
        I call Yeltsin a careerist, an elephant in a china shop, and a politician without a grain. They begin to look at me with suspicion and promise to pass "where necessary."
        That’s the fucking revolutionary of me
        1. ALARI 5 May 2020 11: 59 New
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          No offense, you are more likely not a bad revolutionary, and not a successful reactionary (tried to prevent the revolution), but at least you tried.
        2. Malyuta 5 May 2020 16: 04 New
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          Quote: U-58
          That’s the fucking revolutionary of me

          Then people did not understand what would happen next.
          Thank you for your active life position!
    2. Kronos 5 May 2020 12: 51 New
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      Is it lies and meanness or have you forgotten co-activists in Odessa and other cities? No less than in the Crimea
      1. U-58 5 May 2020 13: 14 New
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        Or did you forget?
        2014 year. Everyone on the lips of Slyavyansk. You call him Slavinsk.
        He is being defended. And not only him.
        In each village, "local self-defense."
        We protect our home and our street.
        And absolutely us .. oh, I don’t give a damn what happens on the neighboring street. In the neighboring village.
        Alas, such as Russian people in the Donbass are infected with the Khokhlyatsk small-town mentality.
        It took more than a year (!!!!!) to create any centralized defense with the command.
        And what, right before the unity of forces there was no way to finish it?
        Or everything was completely conscious: I protect only OWN? !!!
        And again, hope for cash Russia
        But it’s weak for you there to gather journalists from different countries for a briefing and to announce under cameras: Fso, we are not Ukraine. We are announcing the full sovereignty of New Russia.
        Or
        Turning to the peoples of Russia with a request for admission to the state.
        Even there is no such ....
        And, characteristically, Moscow will not allow you this.
        Well, rebel! Make statements!
        And you all guess and hope ..
        1. Kronos 5 May 2020 13: 16 New
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          The usual situation of a civil war where there is no strong leadership capable of making a solid rear. Characteristic of any country in the civil war in Russia, several% of the population also participated; the rest observed
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 10: 43 New
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    Quote: Alt22
    Do not invent, in the nineties there were practically no Bandera in Ukraine, they sat quietly under the key. Donbass never fed Bandera - he paid money to the budget of Ukraine, like all other regions.

    But there were those who are now called radicals or nationalists. And that was even in the 80s. As greyhound as they are now, of course they did not behave.
  • prior 5 May 2020 11: 31 New
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    Donbass is not Crimea.
    Well, right, which of the moneybags and officials will build cottages and summer cottages on waste heaps?
    Coal is not fashionable today. Now, if they found oil there ......
  • Shadow041 5 May 2020 12: 07 New
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    It’s just that after the return of Crimea to the Russian Federation, Vova was afraid of himself, how could the partners be offended ... And if he walked less along the banks of the Yeltsin swamp and thought more about Russia, both Donbass and Kharkov would be Russian today !!!
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 12: 12 New
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    Quote: Karaul20
    Quote: Tagan
    What are you talking about?
    Well, take the dialect of the inhabitants of the Rostov region. It does not look like Moscow, but it looks like a dialect of the inhabitants of Donbass. And then what?

    Quote: Tagan
    But this conclusion "The historical Ukrainian lands themselves even go a little beyond the borders of Donbass and Ukraine, so Donbass is definitely not Russia" it’s even difficult to comment)))

    They answered their own question. So they are these historical lands and transitional territories where the dialect is still similar to Ukrainian. At the beginning, the USSR and the RSFSR even had territorial disputes, and in the USSR in Belgorod, the newspaper Belgorodskaya Pravda even once appeared in two languages ​​- Ukrainian and Russian. Again, it was not for nothing that the UPR once claimed for those lands.

    Quote: Tagan
    Donbass was for some time a part of Ukraine, but it was never Ukrainian.
    The fact that part of Ukraine was part of the Russian Empire does not mean that it was not there. Kazan, too, is already a part of Russia, but Tatarstan cannot be called Russian?

    You somehow get confused in relations. And also part of Ukraine was under Poland. And part of the current Rostov region was occupied by the Turks. So what? Well go on. Tatarstan is not that Russian, it is Russian. Can’t you tell the difference?
    1. Zmeelov 5 May 2020 13: 29 New
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      Quote: Tagan
      You somehow get confused in relations. And also part of Ukraine was under Poland. And part of the current Rostov region was occupied by the Turks. So what? Well go on. Tatarstan is not that Russian, it is Russian. Can’t you tell the difference?

      Well done Tagan! Looks like you burst from a long silence .. You write well, and then here we are already trampled, to the fullest .. Do you know who and why! hi
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 12: 16 New
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    Quote: prior
    Donbass is not Crimea.
    Well, right, which of the moneybags and officials will build cottages and summer cottages on waste heaps?
    Coal is not fashionable today. Now, if they found oil there ......

    Well, actually heaps of recycle, in fairness. True, this does not happen immediately, of course.
  • _Ugene_ 5 May 2020 12: 47 New
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    Donbass is not Crimea at all, our leadership as a part of Russia does not need it in principle
  • Tagan 5 May 2020 13: 47 New
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    Quote: Zmeelov
    Quote: Tagan
    You somehow get confused in relations. And also part of Ukraine was under Poland. And part of the current Rostov region was occupied by the Turks. So what? Well go on. Tatarstan is not that Russian, it is Russian. Can’t you tell the difference?

    Well done Tagan! Looks like you burst from a long silence .. You write well, and then here we are already trampled, to the fullest .. Do you know who and why! hi

    Yes, I see, they sensed the freemen.)))
    Weekend, you know. And do not go fishing. So I decided to warm up a little here.
  • iouris 5 May 2020 14: 13 New
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    Life is not so much beautiful as amazing ...
  • Karaul73 5 May 2020 14: 22 New
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    Quote: Insurgent
    Quote: Stas157
    His vision of the issue happened after the arrival of the Swiss Burkhalter.

    The Donetsk people were simply betrayed. And instead of the Russian region, there is an unrecognized gray zone and regular shelling, poverty. This is not what people wanted, relying on Moscow.

    "Betray, surrender, merge", The Kremlin cannot at least out of a sense of self-preservation.

    I would talk about a “pause”, “time-out”, “freezing” of the process, due to the indecision and misunderstanding by official Moscow of what to do with the “rest of Ukraine” and fears of a “Western reaction”, and not about betrayal.

    Is the pause too long? The Kremlin simply realized that Donbass could no longer be pulled economically. And the partners made it clear that without a war, Ukraine couldn’t take the region. It turned out what happened. Slavic states have pitted and rejoice.
  • pereselenec 5 May 2020 14: 38 New
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    Donchanin: We were sure that after the Crimea Donbass would become Russian

    He became. Russia, you understand, is not only a leaf picture from a box and nightingale trills on the channel of the same name. Russia is also African poverty, lawlessness, the need for gracious permission of the master to collect deadwood in the forest and survival of 150 dollars a month. You have become part of this second, not shown on the TV box, but more numerous Russia.
  • A ray of light 5 May 2020 17: 38 New
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    Crimea had autonomy status !!! But Donbass did not have such a status and Ukraine does not agree to a special status, because it is afraid that Donbass will leave legally ...
  • DONETSK WANTED INDEPENDENCE FROM UKRAINE AND RUSSIA. THEY WOULD LIKE TO BE A LITTLE FRANCE BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN ADOPTED TO MANAGE WHAT UNDER KUCHM AND UNDER YANUKOVICH. DONBASS OF RUSSIA IS NOT NEEDED.
  • lis-ik 5 May 2020 18: 40 New
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    Now, probably, it is time for Donbass to return home, to Russia.

    I would like, but so far in power raw neo-feudal lords and other animals are from the realm of fantasy.
  • EvilLion 6 May 2020 08: 41 New
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    The same Kharkov region could not even rise. And there were no 20 thousand Russian soldiers in the Donbass, and they could not be entered without starting a real war. And it was clear to all literate people back then.
    1. Kronos 6 May 2020 10: 08 New
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      No, just dissent suppressed everywhere except Donbass
    2. ccsr 6 May 2020 11: 26 New
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      Quote: EvilLion
      The same Kharkov region could not even rise.

      This is really a paradox - a huge region lives as if there is no war in the Donbass, the citizens of Ukraine do not die there, they do not oppose the Kiev authorities, the monuments are demolished. Apparently they are expecting that Russia, and after Donbass, will attach them to itself - and therefore they are not worried. Normally it turns out-based on the logic of cunning Ukrainians ....
      1. Kronos 6 May 2020 13: 01 New
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        They don’t have any kind of paradox and live in a gray zone like the DPR without prospects
  • regdan 6 May 2020 10: 26 New
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    Follow only can betray.
  • Serge Koval 6 May 2020 13: 17 New
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    Donbass was a cover. Now it is leaked.
  • hhhhhhh 6 May 2020 15: 36 New
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    "The first signal for the Donbass was the reunification of Crimea with Russia." - when the Russian forbade you still nothing signaled. when Bandera in schools performed.
  • King3214 6 May 2020 16: 19 New
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    And why exactly to Russia?
    New Russia asks in the world as an independent state.
    1. Fishery 10 May 2020 14: 02 New
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      with such territory it is difficult to be an independent state)
  • vavilon 6 May 2020 16: 26 New
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    There was no need to make any cease-fire and for a long time it would all be over
    Indeed, at that time events unfolded in such a way that the pig and his thugs were already packing their bags and then suddenly a truce
    And in another scenario, if Donetsk had been defeated, then no one in the west would have lifted a finger
    And so we played to the tune of the West, and that's the result
  • Valentin spagis 6 May 2020 23: 28 New
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    If in Crimea there was an absolute unity of the population. Almost all Ukrainian security forces, etc., went over to the side of Russia. then in the Donbass this was not. The population of Donbass did not want to go to Russia, but was against the Maidan. Therefore, the events went differently.
  • Virus-free crown 8 May 2020 01: 16 New
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    Well, I completely agree with the author of the article that the Russian authorities betrayed them am
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  • vektor333 11 May 2020 21: 53 New
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    There was no betrayal. Stupidly provocation ...
    Vova provoked the Donetsk people to act with his appearances on TV ... because they wouldn’t be bought for Girkin alone. When the situation changed, he outplayed everything.
    And in order to somehow gloss over the situation, they threw in "humcon convoys" led by all the same people (a typical example - Plotnitsky), therefore the most interesting things were stupidly stolen and sold there.
    Well, they made promises, all kinds of programs and some kind of cooperation on top ...
    In the end - just a beautiful provocation and all.
    One would think that Vova created by his actions some kind of political leverage that can be used in one way or another. But, as further showed, there is no leverage ... well, or it is there, but it is so invisible that how it is used is not clear to anyone, even to the author of the project.

    On the issue of Crimea, it is still more entertaining. It is clear that the US base near the base of the Russian Navy is clearly beyond the permissible. But, at the time of 2014, Yanukovych was guarded by all the same people from the Moscow security company, which, in my humble opinion, was a cover for the work of military intelligence (SVR, GRU, FSB - it didn’t matter who was in charge). Why, instead of systematic work, the leadership of the Russian Federation, having such control over Yanyk who concentrated a lot of power in one hand, chose to arrange a grandiose driban of Ukraine, bring everything to conflict and drag Crimea to itself in such a thorny way ... all this remains beyond my understanding, for any person familiar with the essence of the matter knows that everything is done wrong, much easier and in all this nonsense there was no a priori sense.

    Nevertheless, we have such a completely absurd situation. Instead of uniting fraternal, formerly Soviet, peoples, the policy of separation and fragmentation continues. For instead of two subjects of the USSR - Ukraine and the Russian Federation, we now have Ukraine, the Russian Federation, LDNR and Crimea. And the latter, due to his non-recognition by the leading Western countries of the Russian Federation, with full recognition by the political elite of the Russian Federation of leadership over these same Western countries, it can hardly be considered a settled issue, or until the next change in the status of the territory .... or until the change of the political elite of the Russian Federation, and here the third is not given.

    You can start throwing stones, already used to it. But I write as it is.
    His correct last name should probably begin with the letter "M". For it really is - he wound up a fan of such that it is still unknown when all this will be raked and how.
  • Mikle2000 11 May 2020 23: 49 New
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    Surprisingly, the option of Kharkov or the Dnieper (Petrovsk) is not even considered? Or Crimea with a muddy status, where there is neither McDonolts nor anything funnier than the Sberbank of Russia or a very terrible version of the Donbass. What zashorennost (((