Military Review

“Bombing the Stone Age” - 55th Anniversary of the American Operation Thunderclap

121
“Bombing the Stone Age” - 55th Anniversary of the American Operation Thunderclap

Начавшаяся 2 марта 1965 года ВВС армии США операция «Раскаты грома» знаменательна не только тем, что стала наиболее масштабной бомбардировкой, проводившейся ими со времен окончания Второй мировой войны. Эта, длившаяся более трех с половиной лет серия авиаударов ознаменовала собой роковой шаг Соединенных Штатов во вьетнамской авантюре, в конечном итоге приведшей и американские вооруженные силы, и государство в целом к небывалому в их stories military disgrace. And also - it became a model of Washington’s strategy in the destruction of the “wrong”, rebellious countries. The very strategy that continues to be applied to this day - with no less scope and cynicism.


For starters, a little background. The fact that the United States, seeing the complete futility of its own attempts to break North Vietnam, limiting itself only to the supply of weapons, the training of Viet Cong soldiers and officers and the small contingent of its own troops, will "get into" this conflict, which is called, by ears, it became clear already in 1964. The two incidents that followed one after the other in the Gulf of Tonkin, which were obvious provocations (the second of them, according to many historians, was at all pure staging), the desire of the “hawks” surrounding President Lyndon Johnson on all sides to arrange a “small victorious war” - Everything led to that.

The United States really wanted to get revenge for the extremely painful defeat a decade ago in Korea - naturally, not so much from local partisans as from the Soviet Union and communist China. Washington’s belligerent ambitions were also greatly fueled by the fact that since the death of Stalin, whose falcons in the Korean sky were scattering whole squadrons of American vultures, more than 10 years have passed. Analysts from the State Department and the Pentagon believed that Khrushchev, who replaced him, would not intervene in the new mess in Southeast Asia, and most likely would prefer to leave the small and brave Vietnam to his tragic fate.

Официальным поводом для нанесения первых ударов в рамках «Раскатов грома» стала серия удачных операций местных партизан по расквартированным во Вьетнаме военным объектам армии США – вертолетной базе, школе подготовки сержантского состава, осуществленных в феврале 1965 года. Каждый раз американская aviation inflicted single strikes as “retaliation”, but in Washington they decided that all this was not enough and set to work on a true scale. The head of the White House, who signed the directive on the start of “Thunder Rumbles,” with utter cynicism, called it “a series of air raids on selective targets, extremely balanced and limited.”

Согласитесь, крайне сложно применить эту характеристику к ливню из бомб, сыпавшемуся на головы вьетнамцев на протяжении, как уже было сказано трех с половиной лет! При этом ни о какой «избирательности» речь не шла в принципе – целями для нанесения ударов становились, по большей части, объекты, к военной инфраструктуре Северного Вьетнама ни малейшего отношения не имевшие - жилые кварталы, больницы, дамбы. Американские бомбардировщики методично стирали с земли целые деревни, буквально выжигали не только скрывавшие партизан джунгли, но и рисовые поля, совершенно осознано стремясь вызвать в стране голод.

As a matter of fact, subsequently quite high-ranking officials from the political "establishment" of Washington directly acknowledged that the goals of the monstrous in its scope and cruelty bombing were not the achievement of a certain strategic military superiority, but the desire to break the will of the entire Vietnamese people to resist. Thus, the leaders of the tiny country who didn’t want to give up were planned to be “seated at the negotiating table” so that they signed a “peace” on American terms — that is, complete and unconditional surrender.

Широко известное всем и достаточно часто цитируемое сегодня в качестве определения одной из ведущих «внешнеполитических стратегий» Вашингтона выражение «вбомбить в каменный век» - никакая не «выдумка кремлевских пропагандистов», а самое что ни на есть доподлинное высказывание одного из вдохновителей описываемого мной колоссального варварства ХХ века. Изрек эти жуткие слова никто иной, как генерал ВВС США Кёртис Лемей, пребывая в твердой уверенности, что вьетнамцы должны «втянуть свои рога» и сдаться. В противном случае, как он был уверен, «лучшим рецептом решения проблемы будет вбомбить их в каменный век». Именно это год за годом и делалось.

Понятное дело, что не обошлось и без кровной заинтересованности высших чинов Пентагона и воротил военно-промышленного комплекса США. За время авиаударов американская армия испытала множество (по некоторым данным – более тысячи) новых видов вооружения и боеприпасов, от авиабомб до боевых самолетов. Именно в процессе «Раскатов грома» были впервые применены новые машины ВВС США - F-4 и F-111. Первый – многоцелевой истребитель-бомбардировщик, второй – тактический бомбардировщик дальнего действия. А уж сколько миллионов было заработано военными заводами Соединенных Штатов, которые, как заведенные штамповали смертоносный груз для этих стервятников – вряд ли вообще поддается учету.

Трагедия Вьетнама стала, по сути дела, лишь логическим продолжением и «творческим развитием» изуверской, человеконенавистнической и откровенно подлой тактики «бесконтактной войны», выработанной Соединенными Штатами и их главным союзником, Великобританией еще в годы Второй мировой. Каково было военно-стратегическое значение уничтожения Дрездена и десятков других немецких населенных пунктов, размером поменьше, совершенное авиацией союзников 13-15 февраля 1945 года? Зачем был стерт с лица земли, сожжен безо всяких атомных бомб Токио, где только во время авианалетов 26 февраля и 10 марта 1945 года американские вояки уничтожили более 100 тысяч человек? Эти военные преступления стали «фирменным знаком» ведения войны по-американски, первыми звеньями в цепи чудовищных массовых убийств, протянувшейся затем через годы в Югославию, Ирак, Ливию, Сирию...

По разным оценкам во время проведения «Раскатов грома» погибло от 50 с лишним тысяч до 200 тысяч мирных жителей Вьетнама. Может ли быть у такого деяния срок давности? Впрочем, и легкой прогулки для американских летчиков тоже не получилось. Расчет на то, что Советский Союз останется в стороне, оказался грубейшей ошибкой Вашингтона. Хрущева сместили с поста Генсека в 1964 году. Договор о взаимопомощи, в том числе и военной, был заключен между нашей страной и Вьетнамом в 1965-м. И уже 24 июля того же года первый американский воздушный налетчик был сбит советским ЗРК С-75 «Десна». Бойцы наших ПВО стали ужасом пилотов ВВС США – точно так же, как это было во время войны в Корее, за которую они так хотели поквитаться.

До конца войны СССР поставил Вьетнаму около сотни таких комплексов, тысячи ракет к ним. Авиация вьетнамцев исчислялась уже не единицами, а, опять-таки сотнями истребителей, среди которых стремительно росло число пугавших американцев до икоты МиГ-21. «Раскаты грома» обошлись военной авиации Соединенных Штатов в более тысячи убитых, покалеченных и пленных пилотов. Также в ее ходе было сбито более 900 американских боевых самолета. Сломить патриотизм и мужество вьетнамского народа так и не удалось – дело закончилось скандальными сенатскими слушаниями, приведшими к громкой отставке тогдашнего главы Пентагона. Его обвинили в «напрасной трате ресурсов», а никак не в массовом истреблении мирного населения, но «Раскаты грома» свернули.

The Americans, as everyone remembers, ultimately lost the war miserably. That's just a pity - this defeat did not discourage them from trying to drive whole countries and peoples into the Stone Age ...
Author:
121 comment
Ad

Subscribe to our Telegram channel, regularly additional information about the special operation in Ukraine, a large amount of information, videos, something that does not fall on the site: https://t.me/topwar_official

Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Krasnodar
    Krasnodar April 2 2020 18: 21
    -30
    What a shame in Vietnam? laughing The Americans did not lose a single important battle, they simply waged a war in half measures - they didn’t attack North Vietnam, because they were afraid of repeating the Korean scenario - China’s intervention - already nuclear, and the Korean Bloody Draw - keeping Korea South plus or minus on the same borders with which Kim Il Sen tried to conquer the entire peninsula. As a result, under pressure from public opinion, Ho Chi Minh was forced to leave South Vietnam in their own country, but there was no military defeat as such
    1. knn54
      knn54 April 2 2020 19: 01
      +15
      Я то помню то время,когда Моххамед Али отказался от призыва,Люди,которые рвали повестки,становились героями.Участников войны считали чуть ли не преступниками Это разве не позор для страны?
      South Vietnam collapsed. Vietnam remained socialist. Even youth still hate the United States. Isn't that a defeat?
      1. Free wind
        Free wind April 2 2020 19: 21
        -23
        Какая молодежь, чья, где? Во вьетнаме давным давно с амереканцами мир, дружба , жевачка. В корее война шла под эгидой ООН, войну начала сев.корея. Могли в принципе получить толпу обозленных голодных корейцев, вечно тыривших у нас рыбу. Северный вьетнам первым войну начал.
        1. knn54
          knn54 April 2 2020 19: 28
          +18
          Александр,я то с вьетнамцами разных поколений давно общаюсь.Благо в Харькове их не мало.
          And the SRV leadership considers the USA ONLY as a counterweight to the PRC, no more.
          Да ,еще раз ВНИМАТЕЛЬНО про инцидент в Тонкинском заливе почитайте.
      2. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 20: 31
        -15
        Quote: knn54
        Я то помню то время,когда Моххамед Али отказался от призыва,Люди,которые рвали повестки,становились героями.Участников войны считали чуть ли не преступниками Это разве не позор для страны?
        South Vietnam collapsed. Vietnam remained socialist. Even youth still hate the United States. Isn't that a defeat?

        Political - of course. But there was no close military defeat there - the Americans beat both Viet Cong and the North Vietnamese with a balance of losses far from in favor of the local
        1. 16329
          16329 April 2 2020 21: 35
          +14
          War is not a game and the ratio of losses is not the main issue
          Вьетнам (ДРВ и Вьетконг) посчитал для себя возможным заплатить такую Высокую цену за свою свободу и независимость, а США не смогли найти способ противостоять этой решимости
          North Vietnam won a complete victory, achieved all its goals, and the United States was defeated and thrown out of Indochina.
          Какой смысл считать потери, США потерпели поражения именно от Вьетнама (ДРВ и Вьетконг) (помощь Вьетнаму со сторонЫ СССР и КНР, это важный фактор, безусловно, но победу одержали именно Вьетнамцы,)
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 24
            -8
            He held, achieved, but did not defeat the Americans and did not throw them out of the country. hi Let's just say that, with their heroic resistance, the Vietnamese people inclined US public opinion in favor of withdrawing troops from the country.
            1. 16329
              16329 April 2 2020 22: 34
              +10
              According to the Paris Agreement between the DRV, USA and SE, the main contingents of American troops were withdrawn in 1973, advisers remained in SE, then the ceasefire was interrupted, hostilities resumed and DRV troops captured Saigon, American advisers and diplomats, as well as Vietnamese refugees, were evacuated - the complete defeat and liquidation of the American presence in Indochina, the rest is just words
              1. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 39
                -6
                According to the Paris Agreement between the DRV, USA and SE, in 1973 the main contingents of American troops were withdrawn.

                That's it
                American advisers and diplomats, as well as Vietnamese refugees evacuated

                Правильно - но при присутствии американских контингентов никакого Сайгона не захватили бы - и Вы это прекрасно понимаете
                the complete defeat and liquidation of the American presence in Indochina, the rest is just words

                Well, what a rout? laughing
            2. pmkemcity
              pmkemcity April 3 2020 05: 54
              -1
              Quote: Krasnodar
              U.S. public opinion

              What are you talking about?
              1. Sergey Sfiedu
                Sergey Sfiedu 14 May 2020 19: 50
                -1
                Победа Вьетнама - это не только героизм вьетнамского народа. Это и -, во первых, победа СССР и Китая, и, во вторых - победа американского либерального общественного мнения над официозом. Надо отдать должное американцам - сейчас американское общественное мнение, даже т.н. либеральное, стало почти на 100% "патриотическим" .
        2. Marine engineer
          Marine engineer April 2 2020 22: 04
          +13
          "But there was no close military defeat ..."

          In any war, the opposing parties set themselves the goal they want to achieve.
          If the goal is achieved, victory; if not, defeat.
          Vietnam achieved its goal, but the United States did not.
          Conclusion: Vietnam won, the United States was defeated.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 25
            -6
            I agree - but the Americans did not fail on the battlefield. hi
            1. 16329
              16329 April 2 2020 23: 26
              +1
              The fights were different and there were many fights, military success is changeable and only the end result is important
              One of my senior colleagues (a German) who worked in a Saudi Arabia power plant with an American veteran of that war told me a bike about the “lonely Charlie” who climbed a tree almost every evening at a field airfield and shot at helicopters and AK planes that were landing , sometimes successfully, long enough and could not be caught
            2. WapentakeLokki
              WapentakeLokki April 3 2020 18: 13
              +3
              .. I don’t remember the name .. seem Dien Bien Fu but the name of the film with Mel Gibson (..We were soldiers ..) I remembered immediately .. and how do you think it’s NOT A DECEASE ??? ... the Yankees with fanfare arrived, landed , and dristanuli back .. having lost the N-th number of G-Ai ... no, of course, you can, according to their usual custom, say the goal of the operation is achieved, the troops are withdrawn to the RPM .. but really merged ... and it's just offhand ..
              1. The comment was deleted.
        3. gsev
          gsev April 2 2020 22: 20
          +3
          Quote: Krasnodar
          But there was no military defeat there

          Солдат и техники было больше у США и их сателлитов, однако Северный Вьетнам всегда имел инициативу и навязывал волю противнику. Правительство США сделало большую глупость приняв решение поддержать гнилой режим юга, американское общественное мнение сделало многое, чтобы исправить ошибку Кеннеди, Джонсона и Никсона. Кроме того США уже тогда считали, что необходимо сдерживать Вьетнам, независимо от того будут во главе его коммунисты или прагматичные националисты. Вначале целью США было ослабить как Север, так и Юг в братоубийственной войне. Мы наблюдаем переговоры КНДР и США. Сейчас к северным корейцам США выдвигают такие требования, словно корейцы у них в концлагерях безоружные за колючей проволокой.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 43
            -7
            Yes, I agree. Once again - the mistake of the Americans was to abandon the invasion of North Vietnam. The states became close to China in the late 60s, they could do it right after the quarrel between Mao and Khrushchev and launch an attack on Hanoi without fear of repeating the Korean version.
            1. gsev
              gsev April 2 2020 22: 48
              +4
              Quote: Krasnodar
              Once again - the mistake of the Americans was to abandon the invasion of North Vietnam.

              В этом случае американцы бы встретились во Вьетнаме с китайскими танкистами, а не с пехотинцами как в Корее. Во время войны во Вьетнаме КНР был для СССР и Вьетнама ценнее, чем вся коммунистическая Центральная Европа.
              1. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 50
                -8
                Here, the Chinese tankers there would be butchered for one or two. )))
                In general, I wrote that friendship with China had to start not in the 69th, but earlier, then go to Hanoi hi
                1. gsev
                  gsev April 3 2020 00: 16
                  +4
                  Quote: Krasnodar
                  Here, the Chinese tankers there would be butchered for one or two.

                  In Korea, 15 years earlier it didn’t work. Only in 1949 did the Chinese artillery gunners force the English ships to leave the Yanzi water area. Therefore, the Chinese did not want to see the European troops in Hanoi for any carriages.
            2. hohol95
              hohol95 April 3 2020 15: 35
              0
              Do you have a firm belief that Mao would go for a rapprochement of the United States at that moment?
    2. Moskovit
      Moskovit April 2 2020 19: 16
      +12
      Of course, this is a victory, running sparkling with heels from Vietnam.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 20: 35
        -14
        Quote: Moskovit
        Of course, this is a victory, running sparkling with heels from Vietnam.

        Which one to run? laughing Их вывели из-за громадных массовых демонстраций в Вашингтоне перед Белым Домом - с военной точки зрения американцы побеждали в абсолютном большинстве боев благодаря хорошей координации между пехотой, артиллерией и штурмовой авиацией:
        1. Moskovit
          Moskovit April 2 2020 21: 53
          +10
          Well, why were these demonstrations? Not because of the loss of the Americans? Not because of the barbaric methods of warfare, because the ordinary did not help?
          В сухом остатке - гораздо менее развитая во всех отношениях держава заставила уйти США и забрать с собой своих союзников.
          By the way, after the war, about 20 thousand Vietnam war veterans committed suicide. Winners, what there.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 35
            -8
            1) There were losses there from the first days of the war
            2) The methods of warfare were the same as in WWII, except for nuclear weapons
            3) Made - because public opinion in the States themselves found this war unnecessary
            4) Well, here you can add that Vietnam in recent years has become the first in terms of the number of American investments in Southeast Asia in general ... so that the Vietnamese are handsome on all sides laughing
            1. Sugar Honeyovich
              Sugar Honeyovich April 3 2020 04: 53
              +2
              Quote: Krasnodar
              public opinion in the States themselves found this war unnecessary

              Not just unnecessary - dirty, shameful.
          2. Nosgoth
            Nosgoth April 4 2020 12: 43
            0
            Why are you trying to explain something to the troll? In his comments, he clearly shields the United States and its sixes, even when the facts suggest otherwise. His principle is "not to reflect, but to spread", a typical pro-Western troll. Just don't chat with him. His main purpose of being on the site is to shield pendos and co, and denigrate everything Russian.

            ps My principle is simple: "I saw a message from Krasnodar - put a dislike on all his comments."
        2. gsev
          gsev April 2 2020 22: 26
          +3
          Quote: Krasnodar
          from a military point of view, the Americans won the vast majority of battles

          Дедушка с Коптевского рынка рассказывал как он через месяц марша через Лаос подвел свой танк ПТ к позициям США и каждый день делал по одному выстрелу. Затраты США в моточасах авиации и боеприпасах в попытке уничтожить эту огневую точку за день боев видимо перекрывали стоимость техники и подготовки танкового батальона. Можно ли считать выстрелы этого танка ежедневной победой Вьетнама. Думаю, что можно.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 46
            -5
            Count the size of the economies of two countries - maybe a defeat laughing
            1. gsev
              gsev April 3 2020 00: 33
              +2
              Quote: Krasnodar
              Count the size of the economies of two countries - maybe a defeat

              Under Japanese occupation in 1944, there was a famine in Vietnam in which the Vietnamese death toll roughly matched that of the war with the Americans. For Vietnam, the war was no more difficult than the colonial yoke. In general, the colonial world collapsed when the Comintern began to arm the Sik partisans. The fight against them made the British more liberal towards the INC, and then the fight against the INC made the exploitation of India unprofitable. The 10-year war in Indochina tied up US resources and made it difficult for them to fight pro-Chinese guerrillas in Malaya and the Philippines and the underground in Indonesia. China used the Vietnam War for its influence in Southeast Asia. China's friendship with the United States became possible only after the US left Vietnam.
    3. Sergey Averchenkov
      Sergey Averchenkov April 2 2020 19: 26
      +1
      I wanted to poop on your reasoning about victory. Search for "napalm girl".
    4. svp67
      svp67 April 2 2020 19: 32
      +5
      Quote: Krasnodar
      The Americans did not lose a single important battle, they simply waged a war in half measures

      But isn’t you going to lose?
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 20: 37
        -8
        Quote: svp67
        Quote: Krasnodar
        The Americans did not lose a single important battle, they simply waged a war in half measures

        But isn’t you going to lose?

        Once again - in political terms, they certainly lost. In the military - no))
        1. svp67
          svp67 April 2 2020 20: 48
          +5
          Quote: Krasnodar
          Once again - in political terms, they certainly lost. In the military - no))

          War is politics, by other means ...
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 21: 19
            -6
            We are talking about net fighting.
        2. Fat
          Fat April 2 2020 21: 26
          +4
          Quote: Krasnodar
          Quote: svp67
          Quote: Krasnodar
          The Americans did not lose a single important battle, they simply waged a war in half measures

          But isn’t you going to lose?

          Once again - in political terms, they certainly lost. In the military - no))

          What is the point of tactical and even operational success if the strategy is a complete failure? For what sacrifice? For the development of the military-industrial complex? So yes, success on the face, as it were. But the Americans had to reform the principles of recruiting the armed forces from ji ai to contract professionals. No one wanted to die for democracy for free.
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 53
            -1
            I agree. The result was the creation of a contract army, as nobody wanted to participate in colonial wars as conscripts for free
        3. 16329
          16329 April 2 2020 21: 37
          +3
          Look at the footage of the evacuation of the US embassy from Saigon.
          And draw conclusions about who won the war
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 54
            -2
            Counselors and diplomats were evacuated - if there were American military contingents - nothing would happen laughing You yourself understand everything ..
      2. The comment was deleted.
    5. Andrey VOV
      Andrey VOV April 2 2020 21: 05
      0
      Just why do you and people like you scream at the mouth that the USSR lost the war in Afghanistan?
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 21: 20
        +2
        I? laughing You do not find at least one of my arguments about the results of the war in Afghanistan, then talk about "me and others like me."
    6. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 2 2020 22: 21
      +1
      M, yes ?, 60 thousand corpses, it’s absolutely nothing, huh ?, you got 200 thousand from the trampoline, garbage, maybe more ...
      They lost and begged the USSR to let go out to save face, or having lost 31 strategists in a short space, is this your nonsense too? ...
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 56
        -4
        60 thousand corpses is a lot - yes. They implored the USSR about it - they never met anywhere, so that the Americans would even ask the Union for Vietnam. For amerskoy economy 41 strategist - acceptable losses
        1. Fat
          Fat April 2 2020 23: 50
          0
          Quote: Krasnodar
          60 thousand corpses is a lot - yes. They implored the USSR about it - they never met anywhere, so that the Americans would even ask the Union for Vietnam. For amerskoy economy 41 strategist - acceptable losses

          On an operational scale ... Yes bullshit))))
          So not Asilili, pachemushto
    7. Red Alert
      Red Alert April 2 2020 22: 55
      +2
      With their capabilities, they should have simply crushed Vietnam in a couple of years. Young people began to mow down from the army because in that war the Americans often died. After the Vietnam War, the United States switched from a conscript army to a mercenary.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 58
        -7
        I write - their mistake was to refuse to attack North Vietnam
        1. Red Alert
          Red Alert April 2 2020 23: 01
          +1
          Спорно, в Камбоджу они вторглись, но результата это не дало. В Северном Вьетнаме могла начаться партизанская война. Я думаю планы вторжения в Северный Вьетнам
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 23: 53
            -6
            I believe that they needed to take Hanoi, establish the southerners regime there and swell the loot into the country's infrastructure, gradually withdrawing the army from there - it would be both cheaper and more efficient. Partisanism - yes, it would be their headache, but as investments increase and American relations with China improve, it would come to naught
            1. Alexey RA
              Alexey RA April 3 2020 12: 33
              +5
              Quote: Krasnodar
              I think they should have taken Hanoi, establish there the southerners regime and swell the loot into the country's infrastructure

              Highlighted are mutually exclusive statements. smile
              Southerners and in the south mastered the loot allocated for the development of the country with the screech of a circular saw. And as if they were deployed in the North ... in short, theft, corruption, terror, occupation - welcome back, Vietnam. smile
              Quote: Krasnodar
              Partisanism - yes, it would be their headache, but as investments increase and American relations with China improve, it would come to naught

              This is China. Even now they can calmly cooperate with the official authorities of the country with one hand, and with the other - support the "freedom fighters" in it.
              1. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar April 5 2020 00: 37
                0
                It’s also true, though ....
            2. Moskovit
              Moskovit April 4 2020 12: 49
              +1
              They did it very well in South Vietnam. It was not a country, but a picture.
        2. Fat
          Fat April 2 2020 23: 56
          +3
          Quote: Krasnodar
          I write - their mistake was to refuse to attack North Vietnam

          The mistake was to generally intervene!
      2. andrey-ivanov
        andrey-ivanov April 4 2020 10: 36
        -1
        Young people began to mow down from the army because in that war the Americans often died.

        Young people began to actively mow when students of universities and colleges began to wool, and this is the middle class and above. While raking in guys from the working outskirts and blacks there were no special protests.
    8. Shuttle
      Shuttle April 3 2020 08: 35
      +2
      Quote: Krasnodar
      What a shame in Vietnam? laughing The Americans have not lost a single important fight,

      I am ashamed of the deeply respected by me personally cubanoids in your face if you really are from Krasnodar.
      In terms of the number of Americans killed, the Vietnam War is in fourth place after the Civil, World War II and World War I. Do you even know?

      Quote: Krasnodar
      just waged war in half measures - did not attack

      And in the air they defended your way? You know, you can’t play so much in Battlefield.
    9. Viktor Sergeev
      Viktor Sergeev April 14 2020 08: 54
      0
      Чучело, войну они проиграли и с треском. Кутузов не выиграв ни одного сражения (Бородино спорно) выиграл войну, грамотно использовав погоду, условия войны, логистику и дух. Вьетнамцы разгромили США по полной, причинив им огромные потери которых американцы ой как не любят, предпочитая бесконтактную войнушку. Война это не дуэль двух рыцарей, война это сражения, снабжение, моральный дух и проигрывает тот кто слабее, США оказались слабее.
    10. gsev
      gsev 13 June 2020 19: 04
      0
      Quote: Krasnodar
      but there was no military defeat as such

      The true US goals in Vietnam are hard to understand. In my opinion, the United States sought to have a weak obedient Vietnam. I'm not sure that the US feared the victories of the northerner communists more than the victories of the southern nationalists. They failed to defeat the communists in Vietnam, although they won in Bolivia, Malaya, Indonesia, the Philippines and Thailand. That is, there was no military victory. There was a military draw in Korea, but this draw was a political defeat for the United States. The DPRK remained in antagonistic positions to the United States, Vietnam, defeating the separatists in the South, expelling the New Zealand, South Korean, Thai and state occupiers now has normal relations with the United States. If the United States had not gotten involved in a "dirty war" they would have normalized relations with Vietnam much earlier.
  2. Threaded screw
    Threaded screw April 2 2020 18: 23
    +7
    The assumption that the Soviet Union would remain aloof was Washington's gross mistake

  3. Free wind
    Free wind April 2 2020 19: 27
    -8
    Вообще не понимаю этих стонов про немецкие и японские города. Они получили по заслугам, они это знают. Получи немцы атомную бомбу в 42-45 годах , они применили бы ее не задумываясь. У нас патриотики плачут ой какие немчики да япончики несчастные, ой какие подлые американцы. Надо было эклеры сбрасывать.
    1. knn54
      knn54 April 2 2020 20: 07
      +2
      А чем тогда американцы и англичане отличаются от нацистов,варварски бомбивших Гернику,Белград?
      WHY they did not bombard the oil fields of Romania and Hungary. factories in the Ruhr. Then the war would end much earlier.
      А бомбежка Хиросимы и Нагасаки больше предназначалась для запугивания СССР,т.к японцы продолжали сражаться вплоть до вступления в войну СССР.
      1. Krasnodar
        Krasnodar April 2 2020 20: 43
        0
        Quote: knn54
        А чем тогда американцы и англичане отличаются от нацистов,варварски бомбивших Гернику,Белград?
        WHY they did not bombard the oil fields of Romania and Hungary. factories in the Ruhr. Then the war would end much earlier.
        А бомбежка Хиросимы и Нагасаки больше предназначалась для запугивания СССР,т.к японцы продолжали сражаться вплоть до вступления в войну СССР.

        The factories in the Ruhr were bombed in full - Cologne was smashed into dust, as were Düsseldorf with Duisburg and Essen. Tokyo, Hiroshima and Nagasaki - and to intimidate the USSR and drive Japanese industry into the Stone Age.
        1. Avior
          Avior April 2 2020 21: 05
          +3
          Emperor Hirohito was definitely intimidated.
          He directly explained to the people the reason for consent to surrender in his speech
          ... the enemy has at his disposal a new terrible weapon that can take many innocent lives and inflict immeasurable material damage. If we continue to fight, this will not only lead to the collapse and destruction of the Japanese nation, but also to the complete disappearance of human civilization.

          In such a situation, how can we save millions of our subjects or justify ourselves before the sacred spirit of our ancestors? For this reason, we ordered that the terms of the joint declaration of our opponents be accepted.

          But the Soviet Union-not really scared ....
          1. Krasnodar
            Krasnodar April 2 2020 21: 32
            -3
            Greetings! hi I think that for him the atomic bombing was a good excuse for surrender - in Japan, mentality and culture consider surrender unthinkable - bushido, etc.
            Why do I think so:
            1) Prior to the entry of the USSR into the war, Hiroshima counted on Stalin's mediation at the beginning of negotiations with the Allies on a peace treaty more or less settled for the Japanese
            2) The Japanese were counting on the unacceptable losses of the Americans when landing on the islands, which would be an additional factor in forcing the Allies into peace negotiations
            3) The Union’s entry into the war made this impossible - the Soviet troops, regardless of the losses, would have taken Hirohita and hanged - he remembered the fate of the Russian royal family
            4) Therefore, two nuclear bombings became an excellent excuse for him - the pope emperor saving his children - subjects
            1. Liam
              Liam April 2 2020 21: 47
              +3
              Quote: Krasnodar
              would take hirohita

              Did the USSR have a fleet to land and supply the millionth army to the Japanese islands?
              1. Avior
                Avior April 2 2020 22: 13
                +3
                The Americans had a fleet, and if necessary, they would have thrown Soviet allies.
                It was for this that in Yalta they agreed on the entry into the war of the USSR
              2. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 13
                -5
                Buna syare, nurok! hi How is your situation there? The Americans would give to do this with Russian hands. There are many options ..
                1. Liam
                  Liam April 2 2020 22: 25
                  0
                  Yes, like the light at the end of the tunnel. We hope that this is not the headlight of the train). By the middle of the month, if trends continue, the most severe restrictions will end, and by May we will roll up our sleeves and begin to restore the economy.
                  Well, who allowed the distribution of elephants. I think the lawyers will add wealthy clients)
                  The Americans would not have given anything. They decided in Yalta). Without a fleet, long-range aviation, with no infrastructure on the Far East, the landing on the islands is not even in the realm of fantasy. Moreover, the history of the landing even on miserable, incomparable scales in the framework of the Second World War is continuous sad results
                  1. Krasnodar
                    Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 30
                    -2
                    Well, the landing on Malaya Zemlya was quite successful ... Americans could throw long-range aviation, who, in principle, insisted on the USSR joining the war against Japan ... would give watercraft too.
                  2. Avior
                    Avior April 2 2020 22: 54
                    +2
                    Why would they not give?
                    They invited the USSR to participate precisely for military operations directly in Japan, because of possible large losses, if not for this, they would not have invited, Japan was already isolated and it had no chance
                    1. Liam
                      Liam April 2 2020 23: 02
                      0
                      Do you have information that somewhere, at least in theory, such plans were worked out?
                      1. Avior
                        Avior April 2 2020 23: 24
                        0
                        It just didn't get to that.
                        At the time the USSR entered the war, the Americans already had nuclear weapons ready for use. Therefore, they began plan B.
                      2. Liam
                        Liam April 2 2020 23: 51
                        +1
                        Планы,сроки, цели,ТВД и дележ добычи -все было определено еще в Ялте и неукоснительно соблюдалось участниками и в реальности.Основная территория Японии-это исключительно дело англо-американцев.Не за тем они 4 года выковыривали японцев по всему ТО и ЮВА что бы пустить туда тов.Сталина.Дали ему территорий(и ТВД) за счет Китая в основном.Чем и заложили основу для горячей дружбы между СССР и Китаем на много десятилетий вперед)
                      3. Avior
                        Avior April 3 2020 00: 08
                        0
                        Whatever happened on the continent, the position of Japan could not change, since Japan had no connection with the mainland.
                        There was no sense in inviting the USSR to the Americans without a plan to use the USSR in an invasion
                      4. Liam
                        Liam April 3 2020 00: 24
                        +1
                        We seem to be saying the same thing. The Americans did not see the need for the Red Army in Japan, did not want to, and never made any plans for this. Therefore, no fleets and aircraft can be borrowed for hypothetical invasions. This is an altistory
                      5. Avior
                        Avior April 3 2020 00: 34
                        +1
                        But there was no really accepted plan at all.
                        Early Downfall assumed a purely American invasion, but it was abandoned after calculating the loss
                        Later, they began to develop the Olympic, which was supposed to use the forces of the allies in the Pacific, but it was not brought to the end, the atomic bombings were earlier.
                        The fact is that the US military simply did not know about the development of atomic bombs
                  3. hohol95
                    hohol95 April 5 2020 23: 58
                    0
                    So you think that the landing in the Far East in 1945 was unsuccessful?
            2. Avior
              Avior April 2 2020 22: 11
              +2
              Actually, there is another explanation.
              The Americans might not have invaded Japan, but simply bombed and burned out their wooden cities with paper windows, as they did with Tokyo and Germany before, and the Japanese understood that the Americans could well do it. Moreover, at that time there were no conventions prohibiting this, on the contrary, the Hague conventions quite allowed such a method of warfare as bombing cities to force surrender, for the 19th and early 20th centuries this was commonplace.
              But there was a nuance.
              Due to the peculiarities of the air masses over Japan, mass raids, as in Germany, were difficult, so the Japanese believed that the Americans did not succeed in systematically destroying Japan until they forget about all resistance, and they did not fear mass raids.
              But the advent of nuclear weapons radically changed the situation.
              The Japanese did not know how many Americans had such bombs, firstly, and secondly, in order to kill Hirohito they did not need to invade the country now, it was enough to use atomic bombs for this, and Hirohito understood this very well, and understood that he - One of the first targets after warning bombing.
              Therefore, to hide behind the care of the nation, he hid himself, but he did not forget that these bombs are also waiting for him in the first place. Somehow the samurai spirit misfired and there was no desire to demonstrate seppuku.
              1. Krasnodar
                Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 17
                -1
                A refuge in the mountains was being prepared for him - but not the point. Conventional bombing of Japan claimed more lives than atomic ones, and the Japanese could resist outside the cities - bamboo spears and old guns were distributed to the civilian population, the resistance would be total. Well this is my personal view, built on reading books of many Western historians.
                1. Avior
                  Avior April 2 2020 23: 10
                  +2
                  The atomic bombings were shocking
                  Nobody knew their real capabilities and scope.
                  No one counted any shelters against such weapons
                  Yes, the bombing of Tokyo claimed more Japanese than Hiroshima, but there was only one in Hiroshima - the only bomb, the Japanese did not know that they had a piece of the Americans, they imagined that they would sprinkle these bombs on them, as in conventional bombing.
                  As soon as the emperor realized what kind of weapon was used, he immediately spoke of surrender in shock from the bombing
                  After all, he could explain the surrender and the entry of the USSR into the war, which he later did, but in that first, shocking speech, he spoke specifically about bombs
            3. fk7777777
              fk7777777 April 2 2020 22: 29
              0
              It was just that the USSR deprived them of their resources, surrounding the entire Kwantung army in 6 days. It was a shock for both the Yapis and the Allies, but there was really nothing to fight, the dumb Japanese hand-to-hand tactics of rushing at American machine guns did not work and what could they do?
              1. Avior
                Avior April 2 2020 23: 03
                +1
                The Kwantung army was isolated on the mainland and the defense of Japan could not help
                At that time, Japan was in complete sea blockade, it was impossible to leave or get there
                1. gsev
                  gsev April 3 2020 00: 47
                  0
                  Quote: Avior
                  The Kwantung army was isolated on the mainland and the defense of Japan could not help

                  Подлодки США смогли прорваться в Японское море только в 1945 году, получив на вооружение прибор, позволяющий пеленговать и обходить морские мины. Была вроде проведена только одна массированная операция подлодок в Японском море.. Япония тешила себя надеждой, что СССР вступит с ней в союз, чтобы обезопаситься от гегемонии США.
              2. Alexey RA
                Alexey RA April 3 2020 13: 18
                +2
                Quote: fk7777777
                It was just that the USSR deprived them of their resources, surrounding the entire Kwantung army in 6 days. It was a shock for the Yapis and for the Allies, but there was really nothing to fight

                In August 1945, the Kwantung Army had already surrendered the most combat-ready units to the Metropolis. And the main arms production was in the Metropolis.
      2. Avior
        Avior April 2 2020 20: 51
        +5
        More like bombed

        Repeatedly
        Operation Tidal wave, for example, in the photo
      3. Fat
        Fat April 3 2020 00: 03
        0
        Well, everything is normal! The blood of war is oil!
      4. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA April 3 2020 12: 41
        +2
        Quote: knn54
        WHY they did not bombard the oil fields of Romania and Hungary. factories in the Ruhr. Then the war would end much earlier.

        Ploiesti Yankees bombed. And as for the factories ... do you know why the Germans at the end of 1943, instead of the good old "shtugs", had to fence absurd self-propelled guns on the chassis of a "four" (instead of producing linear tanks on these chassis) and engage in the ersatz "Hetzer"? Because in November, the main site of the Alkett plant, the main manufacturer of ACS, dropped out of the production chain. The RAF tried first, and then the USAAF.
    2. akims
      akims April 2 2020 20: 07
      0
      Of course, they would apply, but on what objects?
    3. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar April 2 2020 20: 40
      0
      Quote: Free Wind
      Вообще не понимаю этих стонов про немецкие и японские города. Они получили по заслугам, они это знают. Получи немцы атомную бомбу в 42-45 годах , они применили бы ее не задумываясь. У нас патриотики плачут ой какие немчики да япончики несчастные, ой какие подлые американцы. Надо было эклеры сбрасывать.

      They forget about the bombing of Stalingrad and about the unfortunate Japanese - in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, 30 Korean slaves died along with them, raped for a soldier of the imperial army, killed and ... eat a Korean or Polynesian woman for hello!
      1. Fat
        Fat April 2 2020 21: 42
        -4
        Quote: Krasnodar
        for a soldier of the imperial army to rape, kill and ... eat a Korean or Polynesian was for hello!

        Give up. Cut cut. Eat squeamish.
        1. Krasnodar
          Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 18
          0
          On the islands, even local specialists were fattened to eat. Check out Hings and Beaver.
          1. Fat
            Fat April 2 2020 22: 29
            -4
            Yeah. I’m generally American sources, after the sailor Papay, I only perceive bullshit.
            More spinach?
            1. Krasnodar
              Krasnodar April 2 2020 22: 32
              0
              Then read the memoirs of the Japanese, Koreans, Chinese ..))
              1. Fat
                Fat April 2 2020 22: 56
                0
                Quote: Krasnodar
                Then read the memoirs of the Japanese, Koreans, Chinese ..))

                Do not believe me, I read, especially jap ha English. Easy: the enemy is a cannibal, beat him until everyone was caught. Actually Teishintai Toyubatsu Kogegi Tai ... Absolutely cannibal kooky
                . But not to the conquered Koreans and Chinese, to themselves meat, but in the colony vaasche ..
                1. Krasnodar
                  Krasnodar April 2 2020 23: 01
                  -2
                  I read the memories of one - the three girls were raped by a three, chopped off their head, dismembered and eaten ... tin ...
                  1. Fat
                    Fat April 2 2020 23: 18
                    -1
                    Quote: Krasnodar
                    I read the memories of one - the three girls were raped by a three, chopped off their head, dismembered and eaten ... tin ...

                    Where did you read it? When? North Koreans generally survived on positions solely thanks to the help of the UN ... South Koreans. This conflict is generally outside the UN.
                    ПС Эта Жесть от морячка Папай...
                    "Кози дринь- дринь, капишь? " (С) Горький А.М.
          2. Fat
            Fat April 3 2020 20: 23
            0
            Абалдеть. Хижинса с бисером. Я прочитал другое. Не менее важное, прекрасно знаю, что творили джапы на занятых территориях....
            Uh ... NOT ate
        2. gsev
          gsev April 2 2020 22: 34
          +3
          Quote: Thick
          Give up. Cut cut. Eat squeamish.

          Unfortunately, they raped and ate. A lot of Korean soldiers were eaten, which were used to build fortifications on the Pacific islands blocked at the end of the war. Check out any Korean historical site.
          1. Fat
            Fat April 2 2020 23: 01
            0
            I don’t read Krerenian. I’ll go ... Success double zero
            1. gsev
              gsev April 3 2020 00: 38
              0
              Quote: Thick
              I do not read Krerenski

              Любую ссылку типа Коре серам(Человек из Кореи). В России корейцы разговаривают и пишут по-русски. Некоторые страницы даже русской истории там освещены более подробно, чем на русских российских.
        3. WapentakeLokki
          WapentakeLokki April 3 2020 18: 21
          0
          ..ну баб - точно брезговали..а вот сбитых амеровских пилотов - запросто...Бушу -старшему сбитому у берегов метрополии дико повезло,его подобрали подводники а вот его товарищей сбитых и попавших в плен - тупо убили (..испытывая катану ''ударом ласточки'' - печень врага полагалось съесть ещё тёплой..) и это летом 45-го...ну самураи..ну отморозки..
    4. Shuttle
      Shuttle April 3 2020 11: 23
      +1
      Quote: Free Wind
      Вообще не понимаю этих стонов про немецкие и японские города. Они получили по заслугам, они это знают. Получи немцы атомную бомбу в 42-45 годах , они применили бы ее не задумываясь. У нас патриотики плачут ой какие немчики да япончики несчастные, ой какие подлые американцы. Надо было эклеры сбрасывать.

      These are not groans, this is regret for completely in vain since achieve our goals of war of human sacrifice. The USSR had the opportunity to obliterate Berlin from the face of the Earth as Stalingrad had been erased before. There was an opportunity sooner or later to destroy the Kurland group of Germans at the end of the war. The Red Army could exterminate some German or Hungarian city. But the Red Army fought a war with tasks very far from business, profit, and establishing control over profitable territories. For her, it was a war for freedom of labor, for the life of not only her people, but also for peace on the planet in the end. Therefore, the Red Army was not going to intimidate anyone - there was no such purpose. Best of all, this idea is expressed by the words of her Supreme Commander-in-Chief said on 23.02.42 in the order of NPO No. 55:

      ... Sometimes they talk in a foreign press that the Red Army has as its goal the extermination of the German people and the destruction of the German state. This, of course, is stupid nonsense and stupid slander against the Red Army. The Red Army does not and cannot have such idiotic goals. The Red Army aims to expel the German occupiers from our country and liberate Soviet land from Nazi invaders. It is very likely that the war for the liberation of Soviet land will lead to the expulsion or destruction of the Hitler clique. We would welcome a similar outcome. But it would be ridiculous to identify Hitler’s clique with the German people, with the German state. The experience of history says that the Hitlers come and go, but the German people, and the German state - remains ....

      I.V. Stalin.
      1. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA April 3 2020 17: 39
        +3
        Quote: Shuttle
        These are not groans, this is regret for completely in vain since achieve our goals of war of human sacrifice. The USSR had the opportunity to obliterate Berlin from the face of the Earth as Stalingrad had been erased before. There was an opportunity sooner or later to destroy the Kurland group of Germans at the end of the war. The Red Army could exterminate some German or Hungarian city.

        From the point of view of the post-war world, the victims were not in vain. We have gained a strong and loyal ally

        But, unfortunately, they themselves passed it.
        1. Shuttle
          Shuttle April 4 2020 07: 37
          0
          Quote: Alexey RA

          From the point of view of the post-war world, the victims were not in vain. We have gained a strong and loyal ally

          But, unfortunately, they themselves passed it.

          That's right. In vain, I consider such victims as the victims of the bombing of Dresden. This inhuman action, as I believe, had no other purpose than to demonstrate by the Allies their military capabilities before the advancing Red Army. Dresden was of no particular military value. Even the railway junction was not in the city itself. Speaking about the futility of the victims, I meant the civilian population of Dresden. And yes, you are absolutely right that, thanks not only to the policies of the Soviet leadership, but also to the heroism and sacrifice of Soviet soldiers, even defeated Germans could become a faithful and powerful ally for the USSR. The very example when in reality the class, real brotherhood of the working people is manifested.
  4. Undecim
    Undecim April 2 2020 20: 05
    +7
    Also during its course, more than 900 American combat aircraft were shot down.
    919 aircraft were shot down during 310 sorties. That is, for one flight, the Americans lost 000 aircraft or 0,003 aircraft per 3 sorties.
    1. Fat
      Fat April 2 2020 21: 54
      -1
      Quote: Undecim
      Also during its course, more than 900 American combat aircraft were shot down.
      919 aircraft were shot down during 310 sorties. That is, for one flight, the Americans lost 000 aircraft or 0,003 aircraft per 3 sorties.

      Look at the alignment in time, when the losses began to grow exponentially, it came and butt in the operation.
      1. Undecim
        Undecim April 2 2020 22: 42
        +7
        These losses relate only to the Rolling Thunder, which began in 1965 and ended in 1968, and not at all because of the losses, since the intensity of flights after that only increased.
        Общие потери самолетов США за все время значительно больше (0,4 на 1000 вылетов), но расти они стали уже после 1968 года.
        1. Fat
          Fat April 2 2020 23: 36
          -2
          So who brought the US to the "eggs"? Holy Spirit? Or c75?
          1. Undecim
            Undecim April 2 2020 23: 38
            +3
            Did someone bring the USA to your eggs? I do not envy you.
  5. Living7111972
    Living7111972 April 2 2020 20: 41
    +4
    A friend of mine, being an officer of the USSR Air Defense, shot down American planes. But this is not about that, he has bullet wounds, the question of where - the Americans launched tactical assault forces on missile batteries. Not one of which was successful. According to the words - the Vietnamese covered our rocketers with bodies, they died, they stood to death, but at any cost they did not give the enemy any chance. As I remembered ... And his wounded man in his arms, women, like children as tall, dragged into some kind of ambulance for several kilometers.
    1. Avior
      Avior April 2 2020 22: 27
      +4
      Against the radar in Vietnam, the Americans used the Shriiki with a high-explosive fragmentation warhead, each with 20000 striking elements, and ball bombs to strike at the radar and launch positions
      And electronic warfare massively used
    2. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 2 2020 22: 31
      +3
      The Vietnamese are really terminators, very hardy.
  6. NordUral
    NordUral April 2 2020 22: 34
    +1
    States - a country where gangsters are in power.
  7. Santa Fe
    Santa Fe April 2 2020 22: 50
    +3
    limited only to the supply of weapons, the training of soldiers and officers of the Viet Cong

    Вьетконг - противник Сша
  8. Shuttle
    Shuttle April 3 2020 07: 59
    0
    For starters, a little background. That the United States, seeing the complete futility of its own attempts to break North Vietnam, limited to only arms supplies, training Vietcong soldiers and officers and a small contingent of their own troops, "fit" into this conflict, which is called, head over heels, it became clear already in 1964.

    A mistake. the Viet Cong was the name of the l / s of the armed forces of North Vietnam. This is a pejorative for the American enemy allusion to the name of the fantastic action movie about a huge monkey "King Kong". The Americans never called South Vietnamese soldiers and officers the Viet Cong, only the communists of the northerners.
    1. Bongo
      Bongo April 3 2020 15: 02
      +3
      Quote: Shuttle
      A mistake. the Viet Cong was the name of the l / s of the armed forces of North Vietnam. This is a pejorative for the American enemy allusion to the name of the fantastic action movie about a huge monkey "King Kong". The Americans never called South Vietnamese soldiers and officers the Viet Cong, only the communists of the northerners.

      Название «Вьетконг» (сокращение от Việt Nam Cộng Sản — «вьетнамский коммунист») появилось ещё во второй половине 50-х годов. С конца 60-х этот термин американцы использовали в отношении всех вьетнамских коммунистов.
      1. Shuttle
        Shuttle April 4 2020 07: 28
        +2
        Quote: Bongo
        Quote: Shuttle
        A mistake. the Viet Cong was the name of the l / s of the armed forces of North Vietnam. This is a pejorative for the American enemy allusion to the name of the fantastic action movie about a huge monkey "King Kong". The Americans never called South Vietnamese soldiers and officers the Viet Cong, only the communists of the northerners.

        Название «Вьетконг» (сокращение от Việt Nam Cộng Sản — «вьетнамский коммунист») появилось ещё во второй половине 50-х годов. С конца 60-х этот термин американцы использовали в отношении всех вьетнамских коммунистов.

        Yes, that's right. I was mistaken too. But in any case, the US did not call the officers and soldiers whom they themselves trained as the Viet Cong.
    2. Valery56
      Valery56 30 June 2020 12: 21
      +1
      Dear Dmitry, I agree with you. I read the article exactly to this place. Read more lost interest. Viet Cong is a military-political organization (Vietnamese communist) of South Vietnam. Later, this is a collective image of the partisans of South Vietnam and the regular troops of the DRV who took part in the liberation of Vietnam. It is not very comfortable to read what amateurs write.
  9. Bongo
    Bongo April 3 2020 14: 57
    +4
    The article is simply "about nothing" and is very reminiscent of similar publications by "Krasnaya Zvezda" of Soviet times. Biting, ideologically consistent phrases with a minimum of content wassat
    Moreover, the author has very little idea of ​​what he writes:
    And already on July 24 of that year, the first American air raider was shot down by the Soviet S-75 Desna air defense system.

    In Vietnam, the S-75 Desna air defense missile system did not shoot down "American air raiders." No. В ДРВ в 60-е годы поставлялись только ЗРК СА-75М "Двина", со станцией наведения работающей в 10-см частотном диапазоне. Этот комплекс имел ряд существенных отличий от 6-см ЗРК С-75 «Десна».
    1. sivuch
      sivuch April 4 2020 12: 55
      +2
      I was always sure that I don’t have to answer right away - there is someone who will do it for you wink
  10. The comment was deleted.
  11. Old26
    Old26 April 19 2020 17: 40
    +1
    Quote: Marine engineer
    "But there was no close military defeat ..."

    In any war, the opposing parties set themselves the goal they want to achieve.
    If the goal is achieved, victory; if not, defeat.
    Vietnam achieved its goal, but the United States did not.
    Conclusion: Vietnam won, the United States was defeated.

    Well then, we had a defeat in Afghanistan. The goal of creating a satellite of the USSR was not achieved. Like South Vietnam after the departure of the Americans lasted some time, so Najibula-after the withdrawal of the Soviet continent
    In one case and in another, there was no military defeat for the countries (USSR and USA)
  12. Shteffan
    Shteffan 3 May 2020 05: 59
    0
    Not an Article, but one continuous propaganda. It remained to insert a couple of phrases - "the great party of Lenin," "Glory to the Communist Party," the world-peace "and everything will fall into place. Where is the analysis, where are the numbers, statistics? Disagree, there will be no kin.
  13. Petrik66
    Petrik66 10 June 2020 09: 12
    -1
    "среди которых стремительно росло число пугавших американцев до икоты МиГ-21" - Вы это серьезно? "Бойцы наших ПВО стали ужасом пилотов ВВС США – точно так же, как это было во время войны в Корее"- О как. опять агитка достойная боевого листка строительного батальона.