The construction of two BDK project 11711 is behind schedule

The construction of a pair of large landing ships (BDK) "Vasily Trushin" and "Vladimir Andreev" of the modernized project 11711 is behind schedule. This was reported by TASS with reference to a source in the shipbuilding industry.

The construction of two BDKs of the modernized project 11711 at the Yantar Baltic Shipyard is behind schedule. The reason for the lag is the untimely transfer of design documentation to the ships. At the same time, the lag behind the schedule is not specified.

The delay in construction was due to the untimely provision of working design documentation by the designer

- said the source of the agency, adding that at present both BDKs "are working on the formation of buildings."

The press service of Yantar declined to comment on this information.

Recall that the third and fourth BDK "Vasily Trushin" and "Vladimir Andreev" increased to 6-7 thousand tons of project 11711 displacement laid on April 23, 2019. Russian President Vladimir Putin attended the bookmarking ceremony via videoconference. During the laying of the ships, Putin said that he expects that the planned construction time for newly laid ships in the Russian Federation will be met, since this is of great importance for the country's defense.

Meanwhile, the press service of "Yantar" explained the situation with the BDK "Peter Morgunov" returned to the enterprise. According to the press service, the ship returned to Yantar due to the successful completion of the next stage of sea trials and to "close several mooring certificates." After their end, the BDK will return to the sea again. It was previously reported that the BDK interrupted sea trials for an unknown reason and returned to the CVD.

Comments

[Lord of the Sith]

It's okay, the main thing is that they generally build.

[Bashkirkhan]

They want to send this project for export in the future. Helicopter hangar and 2 more on deck + docking chamber for 6 landing boats like the Chamois.

[Nikolay Ivanov_5]

A stripped-down alternative to the Mistral helicopter carrier.

[Lord of the Sith]

Although I am a hunter, I know the difference between a helicopter carrier and a BDK.
What and you want.

[Nikolay Ivanov_5]

Universal landing ships of the Mistral type - (French Mistral) - the family (UDC) of universal landing helicopter carrier ships. They cut the UDC "Mistral" and received the BDK project 11711.

[Lord of the Sith]

In fact, different classes of ships. Nobody cut anything there. Trite, a different class.

[Nikolay Ivanov_5]

The difference between UDC and BDK is a change in the balance between flying and floating vehicles (machines).

[Avior]

what color is red?
it's like green only red

[Nikolay Ivanov_5]

And their goal is the same - it’s landing delivery.

[PSih2097]

Quote: Nikolay Ivanov_5

They cut the UDC "Mistral" and received the BDK project 11711.

in general, the "Mistralka" is not a pure UDC, but its subclass is DVKD.

[Nikolay Ivanov_5]

All these flowers: roses, peonies, gladioli, carnations, violets, dahlias, tulips, asters, daffodils, daisies, chrysanthemums, etc.

[Vadim777]

At least 16 of these ships are needed by the fleet yesterday ...

[Pirogov]

Quote: Vadim777

At least 16 of these ships are needed by the fleet yesterday ...

We need it, then we need it. But if we have already begun to increase tonnage, it means that they do not suit sailors in everything ....

[Mavrikiy]

Ndya-ya-ya. Who would have thought that the BDK is very relevant for a country with a defensive doctrine. Syria, everything turned upside down, moreover, they will still be required for the Pacific Fleet.

[Grandfather]

The construction of two BDK project 11711 is behind schedule
Today, 18: 14

and what is ahead of schedule? just keep quiet ...

[flicker]

and what is ahead of schedule?

Crimean bridge - was built ahead of schedule for six months.

[orionvitt]

The first time I hear that the problems are not with the economic component (materials, components, financing), but with the documentation. Just a designer, they don’t have time for something there. But still, for some, you need to sneak a ride on the topic. Not like that without it.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: orionvitt

The first time I hear that the problems are not with the economic component (materials, components, financing), but with the documentation.

Come on. Recently, there was a dispute between "Zvezda" and KMZ over the manufacture of diesel engines: "Zvezda" ordered the products, but did not submit the documentation for them on time. Well, in the end I got a shish with butter and a trial.
In general, untimely transfer of CD - This is one of the favorite arguments in the dispute between KB, factories and the Customer. True, it sometimes turns out that the Design Bureau delayed the design agreement because the Customer had seven TK per week.
However, a late transmission is nothing. Vaughn, on ICE "Viktor Cheromyrdin" the CD was delivered on time, they had already begun to build ... and then it turned out that the CD did not correspond to the TOR, the displacement was exceeded by 2,5 thousand tons, and small changes could not fix it.

[Simargl]

Quote: Mavrikiy

Who would have thought that the BDK is very relevant for a country with a defensive doctrine.

Those. to defend their interests anywhere in the globe - is this incomprehensible to the mind?
The BDK may not be relevant for a country with an isolationist policy ... well, for Mongolia ...

[Stirbjorn]

Quote: Mavrikiy

Ndya-ya-ya. Who would have thought that the BDK is very relevant for a country with a defensive doctrine. Syria, everything turned upside down, moreover, they will still be required for the Pacific Fleet.

And where is Syria? There, BDKs are used from despair - in the absence of the required number of military transports

[bukhach]

It is unclear what surprised you ... Given the length of our sea borders and a bunch of islands ... Look at Japan, what a peace-loving defensive doctrine.

[Marconi41]

Quote: Mavrikiy

Ndya-ya-ya. Who would have thought that the BDK is very relevant for a country with a defensive doctrine.

If you talk like that, then the Marine Corps is also not needed? Whatever defensive doctrine we have, but situations like Syria have always been kept in mind since the days of the USSR.

[Dmitry Ivanov_6]

who would have thought ... there never was such a thing and here again

[Andrey Mikhaylov]

For some reason, I’m not even surprised. The reason for the lag is the untimely transfer of design documentation to ships, this is already the norm, the delay in documents, and not the first case.

[stalki]

Well, all the kaput, the end, the meaning of life is lost. Send a drink of bitter. Why this news just do not understand.

[knn54]

Is there any connection here with the return of the large landing craft "Pyotr Morgunov", most likely for finishing work?
I think that this is not a matter of the main documentation, but of the notice (s) to this documentation. It is possible according to the test results of the above-mentioned same-type ship.

[donavi49]

They are different. Absolutely. Morgunov has a unique assembly of DRRA3700, these ones will have a corvette DDA12000 with minor changes. They have different displacement. Different body contours. Different capacity.

[Marconi41]

Quote: donavi49

Different body contours.

The contours of the hull are the same, otherwise it would be a ship of another project.

[cniza]

The reason for the lag is the untimely transfer of design documentation to the ships.

Here's what to call it? I think fraud, someone is covering his fifth point ...

[Grandfather]

Quote: cniza

Here's what to call it? I think fraud, someone is covering his fifth point ...

no ! need to be treated with understanding! no time for buildup! therefore, do not swing!

[g1v2]

Still easier. Although they have the same code as Gren and Morgunov, they are completely different ships. And their project is not yet fully prepared - therefore, it is impossible to convey what is not yet ready. The calculation showed that while the box was being made, the project would be finished. In general, this should be a transitional project from BDK to UDK. Especially quickly these ships will not be exactly built, and even after construction, they will be chased for a long time during trials.

[Grigory_45]

Construction of two large landing ships of the modernized project 11711 at the Yantar Baltic shipyard is behind schedule

Yes, who would doubt it. At least one Russian warship surrendered on time ???

The reason for the lag is the untimely transfer of design documentation to the ships.

and then there is no doubt! .. We have high naval ranks and industry the scapegoat always tries to make the design bureau. And it doesn't matter that the admirals don't really know what ships they want to receive (and whether they want to at all), they make endless adjustments and amendments to the technical specification, causing numerous alterations of the documentation. And the industry has a convenient cover for its jambs due to the failure to meet the deadlines - "and this is all the designer's fault! They didn't give us a CD! And we can't work without a piece of paper"

[Vadim777]

... And we cannot work without a piece of paper. "

A ship, this is not a shed, sorry, you can’t build it without a project ...

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Vadim777

The ship, it's sorry do not barn, it is without a project, you can’t build it by eye

I know that very well. Only the meaning of the comment was completely different

Py Sy KD can be transferred in parts. As a rule, they work like that. Do they somehow erect buildings?

[Vadim777]

I can be mistaken, but an error detected at the design stage costs 10% of the project cost, and at the implementation stage it can reach up to 80%, so rush here is not appropriate

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Vadim777

so the rush here is not appropriate

Haste is only relevant when catching fleas.

What we have? The bookmark deadline is defined, reported - everything is ready. Cannot be transferred. There is no CD in full (including because the admirals constantly asked for something and demanded to redo it, or the subcontractors said (and at the very last moment) - the gun will weigh not 15 tons, but 35, you’ll please redo it there .... And so on. I myself worked as a designer (I didn’t ship only), so I’m painfully familiar with it. They all lay down according to the partially issued CD. etc. That is, production flaws .. But there is someone to blame for - the main design bureau, because everyone knows that the design documentation has been issued but was partially (i.e. not on time)

What is the point? What you need to understand this damn whirlpool, where everyone blames the other, but in the end they overwhelm the common cause. And severely punish the guilty. We build ships for 10-15 years .. Not a crime? Not a shame?

PS (if you wait for 100% CD and TD on such complex objects as an airplane, tank, ship - you will never build a single one!)

[Vadim777]

There is such a wonderful thing, CAD CCI, if you do not use it, then it begins, "let's build" and then, let's rebuild the almost finished product.,.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Vadim777

There is such a wonderful thing, CAD CCI

when at a meeting with the General the uncles are sitting in stripes with their Wishlist, everyone doesn’t give a damn about CAD
I'm not talking about the lower classes, about the tops. Fish, she, you know what, yes?

[Dart2027]

Quote: Vadim777

There is such a wonderful thing, CAD CCI

In theory. In practice, it turns out that when they begin to perform prototyping, it turns out that it doesn’t fit in there, it’s not enough, etc. And at the same time, during installation, some garbage can come out again.

[Vadim777]

This only speaks of poor preparation of designers and work on #### b

[Dart2027]

Quote: Vadim777

It only speaks of

that real life is not a computer game.

[Vadim777]

Sorry, but you are extremely far from normal modern production

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Gregory_45

Py Sy KD can be transferred in parts.

Uh-huh ... and then it suddenly turns out that the previously transmitted part does not match the later transmitted - due to changes made to the "delayed" parts. And after comparing the volumes, it turns out that at one point the duct, the pipeline and the cable line, passing through each other, converge. Or that the hatch goes through a bulkhead when opened.

At one of our facilities, taxiways were changed a couple of weeks before the arrival of the equipment already ordered. And these were not cosmetic changes - architects suddenly, without declaring war increased the floor distance by one and a half meters.

[petrol cutter]

Perfectly in the hole.
Then it turns out that she does not fit ... And on the changes to the drawings, we must wait for the change. And sections and blocks are already collected and paid.
Then changes come to changes ... Who will pay the shipbuilding? Nobody. We will write a "service". Which is worth nothing for the money. And in time to remake, go nuts.
And the shipbuilder is standing and

[petrol cutter]

"The reason for the lag is the untimely transfer of design documentation to the ships. At the same time, the timing of the lag behind the schedule is not specified."
In fact, to put it mildly, archi is bad!
What is the untimely transfer of design documentation?!. This is nonsense !. This is the end ... What the hell can the schedule be?
The factory declined to comment because of an understanding of the full priest.
I will explain. We have encountered such a booty on more than one order.
According to the mind, it is necessary to start building the steamer precisely from obtaining the design documentation in full. How else?!. Well it is necessary to do the slipway, to lay out the patterns for what?! .. it’s dear to her. The documentation is something.
But she just has not been transferred .... This is a turn! How much metal to order, how will it look at all? ... This mystery is great.
There are still a lot of questions, but it will hardly be interesting to a wide circle of readers.

[donavi49]

Yes, it’s easier and usual. CD in work. But the bookmark date is approved, VIPs will arrive. They knock down the mortgage section (if it’s an adult, but you can do without it by the way) - they cut, cook, assemble, hold a ceremony, roll it off so that it does not interfere.

Further, various options are possible, which are reduced:
- to the phased entry of the CA and the formation of sections, as the budget is revised and funding approved.
- to the downtime of the order until you receive a full set of CA, probable corrections to the estimates and approval of additional financing.

[petrol cutter]

Unfortunately, you are reporting ideal scenarios. Revisions to estimates ?! They will certainly be reviewed. But not in my favor, of course. To my deep regret, I observe real ones.
Where is the key word, no. There is no money, there is no tool, there are no consumables, we will think about PPE. Such is the mudflow in fact.

[IC]

For many years I have been reading materials on the construction of new BDKs. I cannot find out specifically where the problems of this long-term construction are. Even nuclear icebreakers and submarines are building faster.

[Undecim]

for "closing several mooring certificates"
Mooring certificates do not exist in nature. There are mooring trials that begin after the completion of work provided by construction certificates. That construction certificates are closed after the execution of the specified scope of work and execution of the acceptance certificate.

[Dart2027]

Quote: Undecim

That construction certificates are closed after the execution of the specified scope of work and execution of the acceptance certificate.

I also noticed.

[petrol cutter]

Mooring tests. Colleague. Let me notice.

[Undecim]

Yes, I agree, I was mistaken.

[Radical]

Construction of two large landing ships of the modernized project 11711 at the Yantar Baltic shipyard is behind schedule.

Strange, and what ships then were going to build at the Zaliv plant in Kerch?

[Dart2027]

They want to build UDC there.

[petrol cutter]

UDC started up there. Do not confuse with BDK ...

[Radical]

Quote: Dart2027

They want to build UDC there.

This I know, and what project?

[PSih2097]

Quote: Radikal

Quote: Dart2027

They want to build UDC there.

This I know, and what project?

the project "Russian mistralka" - "Surf".

[Alexey from Perm]

no wonder

[Radical]

Quote: PSih2097

Quote: Radikal

Quote: Dart2027

They want to build UDC there.

This I know, and what project?

the project "Russian mistralka" - "Surf".

You can keep the Mistralka for the time being, for the pool at your dacha, but in the Crimea they were going to build parts of the hulls of Project 11711 ships.

[PSih2097]

Quote: Radikal

to build parts of the hulls of ships of the project 11711.

you can read about the difference between UDC and BDK project 11711 "Gren" above ...
https://topwar.ru/166694-vmf-opredelilsja-s-nazvanijami-pervyh-dvuh-udk-planiruemyh-k-zakladke-v-kerchi.html

[Radical]

Quote: PSih2097

Quote: Radikal

to build parts of the hulls of ships of the project 11711.

you can read about the difference between UDC and BDK project 11711 "Gren" above ...
https://topwar.ru/166694-vmf-opredelilsja-s-nazvanijami-pervyh-dvuh-udk-planiruemyh-k-zakladke-v-kerchi.html

In the know, so what?