Military Review

What do historians say?

436

Shot from the movie Caligula. His life is also историяHowever, at school it is not possible to introduce anyone to her. So then the feeling arises that history is kutsaya, and historians are “not saying anything”. And how do you finish it - fifth graders?


Historical science against pseudoscience. Not so long ago, a discussion on pseudo-historical topics flared up again in the pages of VO, and accusations were again heard that mischievous historians had conspired with and hidden from the poor Russian citizens certain "secrets and mysteries" of history that were extremely important to them. That, well, they say, that's why we don’t know her. Although, in fact, the reason is different, namely the inability to learn and intellectual laziness.

The latter, however, is not so much fault as the misfortune of many of our citizens. Probably, many of those who visit the VO traveled in reserved seats. Pay attention to what people are doing on the trip. They eat, look at mobile phones and even read. But how? Many people still have their lips moving, that is, they pronounce the readable text to themselves. Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophonic reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%. But in our schools they do not teach speed reading, especially in classes where there are many people from the "southern countries", it’s hard for them to read anyway. Advertisers are well aware that a layman forgets 90% of what they read in 90 days. Hence the formula “90 + 1” - and everything can start from the beginning. As a rule, only a trademark remains in the mind, except perhaps the name of the person they are talking about. That's why there is no advertising better than a scandal!

That is, it is clear that people with a poor vocabulary and primitive reading technology may be interested only in something completely sensational: the Egyptians who invented a helicopter and a light bulb, the Maya Indians flying on jet planes, the Russian-Tartarian nuclear war, which went from 1780 to 1816. Here you can strain the gray matter of your brain, even remember something, and then “tell the peasants” so that they, these very peasants, then tell someone else. Read dozens of volumes of PSRL "bad dumb", and it is clear that they are all faked ...

That is, it’s difficult to interest people in this story, but it’s easy to do all sorts of nonsense. There is one more reason. The reason is how we teach history at school.

Recall that the history of the Ancient World is taught to us in the 5th grade. And she ... scumbag. And therefore not very interesting. But the other, she simply CAN’T BE. Do you know why? Because at this age, children, our Russian children in the first place, are simply not ready to learn all that is the same ancient culture and history.

What do historians say?
God Atum. The lady Nestarut is brought to him by the god Thoth. The louvre museum

Well, for example, when in the fifth grade we studied the history of Ancient Egypt, we were told about some beast-headed gods and the first myths about the creation of the world. But they didn’t tell us, and this is not even in the textbook, that among the Egyptian gods there was such a god - Atum. This god was bisexual and held his “female part” in his hand. He created the world by pouring his seed into his own mouth, and then spitting out the cat goddess Tefnut and her husband Shu. According to the Egyptians, this is how the Universe appeared.


Tomb of Horemheb. Gods Atum, Osiris and Ptah. Dynasty XVIII, reign. Saqqara, Egypt

Or, for example, the story of the goddess Aphrodite. It seems that everyone knows that she was born from sea foam, right? In fact, the story of Aphrodite begins with the moment when her father Uranus was sprinkled by his own son Kronos for the fact that only Cyclops monsters were born from Uranus from Uranus. Kronos threw his father’s genitals into the sea, and when the genital organ of Uranus fell into the depths of the sea, the “white foam” just formed, and from it the goddess of love Aphrodite was born.


Saracen stone (foreground) and Aphrodite's stone (background). View of the birthplace of Aphrodite from a hill - Aphrodite's Bay in Paphos. Cyprus, distant boulders

But, of course, the strangest myth comes all from the same Egypt. And it’s clear why fifth graders don’t talk about him, and you won’t find him in textbooks. The fact is that after the son of Osiris Gore took the throne, the evil Set did not accept his defeat and decided to regain power. But the Egyptians believed that anyone who, so to speak, was "used as a woman," cannot be a god. So Seth, having conceived the evil, came to the Mountain at night, and in order to make his claim to the throne baseless, reclined with him as with a woman. Izida, learning what happened with her son, asked her to fill the pot with her sperm and poured it into Seth's salad. Without suspecting anything, he ate the salad and became pregnant. So Horus managed to save his throne. Very funny story, right? Now imagine that the teacher tells all this to five-year-old children, and your daughter got to write an essay on the battle of Horus and Seth in all its details! ..


Seth and Horus crown Ramses II. Small Temple in Abu Simbel

But you can tell them about how the Romans worshiped the winged phallus (by the way, many children then learn what it is, otherwise they know the other names of this thing, but this is not!), And how Scandinavian the god Loki was to laugh at the daughter of the giant Skadi, and did this by tying a rope on his testicles, and tying it to the goat with the other end, which he also whipped with a twig. About how the penis of the same Osiris was eaten by fish, and Isis, his wife, fashioned a new one for him from clay, and, having become pregnant from him, gave birth to a son Horus.


A fragment of the figure, perhaps mourning the husband of Isis. XVIII dynasty. The louvre museum

The fact that Emperor Caligula opened a brothel, in which you can get one of his three sisters for 30 thousand sisters, and Emperor Heliogabal, speaking on the stage, "did this and that," and besides, he also " did, ”it’s also hardly worth telling in the fifth grade, as well as in the sixth ... But after reaching 18 years it seems to be possible, but the Ancient World at this age no longer passes, and if they pass, then only at universities on special historical departments.


And he looked like a very decent young man, this Heliogabal ...

But let alone disgrace and turn to the military theme. Wasn’t we informed just recently, moreover, in a textbook for 4th grade that the knights drowned in the Battle of the Ice? But the fact that their water is a "flood" is reported in the text of the annals, which is older than the earliest reports about it by as much as 100 years. What, new eyewitnesses during this time appeared, as well as the "seer" who saw there "God's regiment in the air"?


But this is a variation of Osiris in Roman: the god Priapus. Pompeii, House of Vettias

Read on. Textbook 7th grade. "The knights moved in a" pig ", in the middle there was a heavily armed infantry in iron shells and with axes ...". Where did this nonsense come from and how did it get into the school textbook? Where, in what annals did these authors “dig up” these axes? The miracle was there in the allies of the knight brothers. Alright! "People from the forest" for whom such weapon, like a knife and a knife, were the ultimate dream. Just don’t have to think about how 99% of our citizens think about it, that stag beetle is a wooden double-toothed fork for tedding hay. No, this spear is such, with an iron tip and a crossbeam behind it, so that it does not penetrate far into the flesh.

Let us recall the explanation found again in textbooks, because because Bobrok Volynets did not enter the battle on Kulikovo Field, because ... he was waiting for the south wind. And the south wind blew, carried the dust into the eyes of the Tatars, and then he led them into the attack. But how could this even happen, because it was the Tatars in the south, and the Russians in the north! How many teachers asked, no one could explain. And all because, although the teacher must learn all his life, really our teachers do not want to do this. That is, they did not read Danilevsky I. N., and therefore do not know how this is explained to him. And it is explained logically.


Boleslav the Brave and Svyatopolk at the Golden Gate of Kiev (painting by Jan Matejko)

Or here is another good example of what literally in history, including the annals, cannot be perceived and considerable intelligence is needed to understand many sources correctly. So, “The Tale of Bygone Years” reports that Prince Svyatopolk the Cursed “died between Poles and Chakhs”, in the desert ... And there were historians who even began to search for this place. But philologists pointed out that “between the Poles and the Chakhs” at that time it made sense “not know where,” but not at all a specific place on the Czech-Polish border. And now, not knowing many such trifles, one can make many completely unbelievable “discoveries”, including finding the place of his death!


Loki. Sculpture by Malcolm Lidbury for the LGBT project "History and Art 2016". Cornwall, UK

And you always need to remember that there were and will always be more than three graduate students who graduated from higher educational institutions than excellent students and good students. And where are they all, these three-year-olds from the "pedyushnikov", gone? From my 1977 issue, for example, did everyone go where? To school! And all the excellent students went to work where? To university! One wants to exclaim: “Poor school!”, But so far it has not been possible to do otherwise. Threes went to work in school and in the USSR, and now they go there. There were exceptions (oh, yes!), Of course, there were, and in the USSR, and today they also exist, but they are few. As always, everything fits into the standard scheme: 80 and 20. 80% of mediocrity go to work in school, and 20 ... also go there often, but then leave from there.


Fragment of the Book of the Dead by Hunfer, depicting the court of Osiris. OK. 1310 BC e. British museum. Beautiful picture, right? And maybe one of our school teachers will even say that this is the “Court of Osiris”. But that’s all. Because he never saw her live, since he hadn’t been to the British Museum

In a word, this is a long-standing problem, from the time when it was somehow decided that people without university diplomas were quite capable of creating a better society than that run by the graduates of Oxford and Yale. And something even they did. But only later, however, they still outplayed these “comrades”. But the conviction that deep knowledge in the humanitarian fields, by and large, is not so necessary, remains. And this is not true! If you, even if you have no special education, are interested in something in the same historical field, then you need to start with the simplest thing, that is, take and simply sequentially accumulate information. To begin self-education not from reading “revealing books” in bright covers, but from the historiography of any issue. From the source. That is, lay a certain foundation of knowledge. And then, standing on it, move somewhere in breadth and inland. And only then make statements that historians are not saying anything there. Threesomes do not say anything because they themselves do not know. But there are also good specialists, and it is necessary to look at them and their published works, moreover, printed in reputable publications and always with reviews by the RAS or relevant institutes. Theses, master's and doctoral, are also a great source of information, moreover, all of them are posted on the Internet today.
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Articles from this series:
Great Flood: Doggerland and Sturegga
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  1. Catfish
    Catfish April 5 2020 05: 30 New
    +8
    Hello everyone and best wishes! Thanks to Olegovich for the new article. smile
    1. Alexander Suvorov
      Alexander Suvorov April 5 2020 06: 10 New
      96
      Well, yes, it’s funny to read about falsification of history from the falsifier of history itself. No, I can’t say anything bad about the cycles of the author’s articles about knights or samurai, sensible articles, although not without flaws. But here are the author’s articles about his unhappy soviet childhood or about the Soviet period in general, this is complete falsification and manipulation of facts. So it’s not for this author to talk about distortions in history. negative
      1. Snail N9
        Snail N9 April 5 2020 06: 54 New
        43
        The author needs to read Japanese history textbooks for schoolchildren — that is, there he would generally go crazy from the “wonderful discoveries”. The Japanese “history” is generally something, for the Japanese in general, there is no history of either Egypt, Greece or other countries, it’s mentioned that there were supposedly “backward countries” and “states” and that’s all, a little mention is made of China, the states of the Korean Peninsula, but the history of Japan itself is studied thoroughly to the smallest event, to the last "nail" ..
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 07: 27 New
          12
          Quote: Snail N9
          The author needs to read Japanese history textbooks for schoolchildren — that is, there he would generally go crazy from the “wonderful discoveries”.

          Unfortunately, I have not read it. But if you read, and own this topic, it would be interesting to receive from you an article for VO in the amount of 8000 characters.
          1. YOUR
            YOUR April 5 2020 07: 59 New
            31
            Quote: kalibr
            And you always need to remember that there were and will always be more than three graduate students who graduated from higher educational institutions than excellent students and good students. And where are they all, these three-year-olds from the "pedyushnikov", gone? From my 1977 issue, for example, did everyone go where? To school!

            He worked with one interesting man. In the past, a teacher of physics and mathematics. Such masterpieces were given by Mama Do not Cry. At first I thought I was kidding. For example, you can’t open the microwave door because harmful waves still run there, reflected from the walls. Or another masterpiece. Two antennas on the receiver are a sign of stereo reception. On each antenna it catches its own channel, which are already superimposed on each other in the receiver and stereo sound is obtained. The question of what is the Hertz dipole caused a stupor. He told how he handed over the session. This is generally prohibitive, I sat quietly and was dying, I retook one session 8 times.
            Such teachers here sometimes leave institutions. Naturally, not all and such a minimum, but they are.
            1. YOUR
              YOUR April 5 2020 08: 03 New
              21
              Not having finished sending. I ask why I left school. The answer is a masterpiece. Well, these of them are sitting dumb as traffic jams. And they pay little.
              1. Lipchanin
                Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 49 New
                31
                "I explain to them I explain, I already understood it myself, but they are still in no way" laughing
              2. antivirus
                antivirus April 7 2020 13: 05 New
                0
                I'm all about spoons and cons ... however
                I also wrote that, with complete illiteracy, - REPRESENT A LEVEL OF KNOWLEDGE (COMPETENCIES) AND THE POSITION OF THINGS AND COUNTRIES (former EMPIRE) -120 MILLION LITERATURE, AROUND 50 YEARS WHERE WENT TO JARMEN WATER LOSS WITHOUT ) as well as aviation, it’s necessary to recruit several hundred thousand technical pilots (not 300 planes as in WWI), and the teachers themselves + university professors, + +++, + officials (Brezhnev was at the forefront with the technical school) 7 cl education, and in morgues who opened? and all this went to the IVS, if there was Trotsky?
                ran 100 years in 10, erased heels to blood
            2. Astra wild
              Astra wild April 5 2020 10: 13 New
              +8
              Your colleague, Vyacheslav Olegovich once, and he did not say, but you, what do you propose to do with mediocre teachers? Maybe a stone around the neck and with twists? But here comes the first question: who will determine the teacher’s abilities? Second question: where do mediocre teachers come from?
              1. Arthur 85
                Arthur 85 April 5 2020 11: 52 New
                +2
                From there, that people are basically stupid. This is how evolution has ordered, we are not to blame. We still need to finish up the artificial intelligence, which “downloads the school curriculum in 10 minutes”, finds logical inconsistencies in it, turns to the primary sources, calms down ... But it’s time for us to leave the stage.
                1. evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru
                  evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru April 6 2020 14: 48 New
                  0
                  Not so, dear Arthur 85. We can’t go anywhere. This is - and, unfortunately, and, fortunately,. So to speak, they are doomed, ... to deal with these and other questions of being.
                  The paramount task is to remain PEOPLE.
                  Two varieties of homo sapiens are people and nonhumans. Moreover, the second with each century more and more conveniently located on the neck of the first. That's the whole, intrigue, of the historical process!
                  Here our ancestors managed to throw, brown, non-humans from their neck during the Second World War. And earlier they threw off the whites. Which are now sitting on the neck? I'll tell you ... U and x is in fashion now a rainbow flag ... By the way, about n and in this matter behave like ordinary helmets, or bugs, or leeches ... Assign decent characters to PEOPLE. Earlier, these guys called themselves “blue”. Blue is the color of the Mother of God. Domes of Russian churches have been painted this color for centuries. Oh, and to this color ,, from which side ,,? Or now ... A rainbow is a symbol of the covenant of the Creator and creation. That there will be no more world-class floods. Oh and here, why and why? Rainbow and sodomites - nothing in common. Heaven refers to them with HATE. Examples? Sodom, Gomorrah, Pompeii ...
                  PEOPLE don't need an ugly story. What for? No need, blackness, for the sake of, the truth,. People and nonhumans, truths, are different. By the way, the Nazis in the occupied territory published their newspaper, True, and even mailed the font of the headline.
                  PEOPLE love God and people. In this - ,, the secret of mastery ,,. If you love the Creator, why do you need to repeat the nonsense of the pagans about ,, foam ,,,, genitals ,, and so on? Moreover, to load, with this rubbish the heads of Russian children whose Motherland was baptized more than 1000 years ago?
                  1. Icelord
                    Icelord April 20 2020 10: 11 New
                    -1
                    From damn it, people mixed up in a bunch of horses, they themselves understood what you want?
              2. YOUR
                YOUR April 5 2020 14: 03 New
                +7
                Where do they come from? They come from paid faculties. Paid and stood in a 5-year turn for a diploma.
              3. yriuv62
                yriuv62 April 5 2020 14: 55 New
                +2
                And their excellent students and good students who go to college teach.
                1. aakvit
                  aakvit April 7 2020 13: 37 New
                  0
                  If a person does not need knowledge, just a diploma or a slope from the army, - teach him, do not teach, he will NOT learn! negative When the goal is at least some kind of diploma, and there we will mow the dibs, then the sage will not teach anything like that! hi
            3. Rusfaner
              Rusfaner April 5 2020 14: 34 New
              23
              "... one interesting little man. In the past, a teacher of physics and mathematics. Mother didn’t worry about such masterpieces ..." (c)
              What a "one"! There are thousands of them!
              When my daughter began to bring such pearls about radio and radio waves from school, I boiled and went to see what kind of “physicist” there was ?! Found a 45-year-old aunt, tortured by life, talked. It turned out to be rare honesty: she said that she had already married at the university and passed the sessions “automatically”, like a maternity / young mother, etc. But, well done, I asked to come to her to read a couple of lectures in the 10th grade, at least for career guidance. We talked about salaries and it was a pity for the teachers - good or bad, they still go to work for that kind of money.
              I'm afraid to misinterpret, but, in my opinion, Bismarck said that a school teacher and a parish priest helped him create a united Germany. Teacher - that’s whose status and financial situation should cause white envy! Then the above 20% of the best university graduates will remain at this job, and the three-year-olds will go to the national economy because of the lack of demand at school. IMHO.
              1. Albert1988
                Albert1988 April 5 2020 19: 50 New
                +3
                Quote: Rusfaner
                I'm afraid to misinterpret, but, in my opinion, Bismarck said that a school teacher and a parish priest helped him create a united Germany.

                Among other things, he said that "a German teacher won the Franco-Prussian war"
              2. Alex Nevs
                Alex Nevs April 6 2020 09: 18 New
                +1
                And then how to manage the state and do business? After all, almost ALL will become smart. laughing And here is capitalism. With this, it will not work. Under socialism under construction, it was a BLOW on "to study. Study and study." Now - this is the future hemorrhoids for businessssaa.
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 April 6 2020 12: 40 New
                  0
                  Quote: Alex Nevs
                  And here is capitalism. With this, it will not work. Under socialism under construction, it was a BLOW on "to study. Study and study." Now - this is the future hemorrhoids for businessssaa.

                  What should I do? What is being done is the systemic artificial degradation of the education system, carried out successively by the leadership of our country, and the transformation of education from universal law into a paid service, or even a privilege! What kind of task is it? So it is written in the law on education today - "educate a competent consumer"
              3. E_V_N
                E_V_N April 8 2020 20: 29 New
                0
                Quote: Rusfaner
                Then the above 20% of the best university graduates will remain at this job, and the three-year-olds will go to the national economy because of the lack of demand at school. IMHO.

                And why do triplets in the national economy? So that more planes fall and houses with bridges collapse? So that the phones do not ring and the cars do not drive?
                Only the "too smart" leadership is not needed, they will start asking questions, expressing dissatisfaction with stupid orders, otherwise God forbid the boss will sit.
                Yes you are a revolutionary, my friend tongue
              4. your1970
                your1970 16 May 2020 21: 19 New
                -1
                Quote: Rusfaner
                Teacher - that’s whose status and financial situation should cause white envy! Then, the above 20% of the best graduates of universities will remain at this job, and the three-year-olds will go to the national economy because of the lack of demand for school. IMHO.
                -absolutely agree!!!
                Quote: Alex Nevs
                Under socialism under construction, it was a BLOW on "to study. Study and study."
                -ag "will not study at school - you go to ped studies !!" USSR, 70th ..
                And remember - there were practically no men in the Soviet school. Why? And they paid a penny, of course, the men did not go there to work at all.
                There were NVPshniki retired (who had already received a military pension), physical education from former athletes who had completed their careers (and who did not have another specialty), and Trudoviks drinks
                Other teachers of men - a global rarity was ....
            4. Dimy4
              Dimy4 April 8 2020 12: 54 New
              0
              Or another masterpiece. Two antennas on the receiver are a sign of stereo reception. On each antenna it catches its own channel, which are already superimposed on each other in the receiver and stereo sound is obtained.

              I almost fell out of my chair with laughter! drinks Here is the real stereo! wink
          2. Altona
            Altona April 6 2020 09: 52 New
            +1
            Quote: kalibr
            Unfortunately, I have not read it. But if you read, and own this topic, it would be interesting to receive from you an article for VO in the amount of 8000 characters.

            ---------------------
            Vyacheslav, if there are electronic sources, please provide links. I love to worship ancient myths, all these ancient goddesses, demigoddesses, nymphs and gods.
        2. vindigo
          vindigo April 5 2020 17: 17 New
          +1
          Maybe they are highly specialized guys and believe that it’s enough for the Japanese to know their history, and let the inhabitants of other countries study their own. laughing
          1. Albert1988
            Albert1988 April 5 2020 19: 51 New
            0
            Quote: vindigo
            Maybe they are highly specialized guys and believe that it’s enough for the Japanese to know their history, and let the inhabitants of other countries study their own.

            In general, there is nothing at all surprising - as in most countries of the world - they only learn their history and history, briefly, of their closest neighbors, and who is a little farther away, yes, more ancient - yes, joking with him ...
        3. Tavrik
          Tavrik April 5 2020 22: 04 New
          +2
          For Japan, the history of Egypt and Greece exists to the same extent as for us the history of Japan.
        4. carstorm 11
          carstorm 11 April 5 2020 23: 21 New
          +2
          Well, firstly it's a lie. at what very childish. history in general in Asia is taught, of course, differing from the world, but nevertheless one does not have to write nonsense about the Japanese ignorance of world history. The modern system of public education in Japan includes primary (duration of study 6 years), incomplete secondary (3 years) and full secondary (3 years) schools, while the first and second levels are compulsory. The teaching of history in the framework of the school curriculum begins with the last, sixth grade of elementary school. Further, in the incomplete secondary school, within the framework of the discipline "social science", the "historical section" is taught along with the "geographical" and "civic". All of them are required items. The elementary school teaches the history of Japan since the advent of man, and within the framework of an incomplete secondary school, mainly the history of the country against the background of global history. And, finally, within the framework of a full secondary school (education in which is not compulsory, but almost all of them take it - 97%), history teaching is divided into two disciplines - “world history” and “history of Japan”, the latter being no more than than one of the disciplines of the student’s choice. While in primary and junior high schools the main emphasis is on the history of one’s own country, the full attention is paid to foreign history within the framework of full secondary education. You don’t need to read bloggers who are sick on the head but simply study the issue. Without taking important things out of context.
        5. Mikhail m
          Mikhail m April 6 2020 04: 45 New
          +4
          Quote: Snail N9
          The Japanese "history" is generally something, for the Japanese in general, there is no history of either Egypt, Greece or other countries,

          But we study the history of Egypt, Greece, Rome and others. But how much do we know about who and how lived on the territory of Russia before Christianity? The pantheon of Slavic gods seems to be a forbidden topic. Besides Perun, the vast majority will not name anyone. Why is this attitude to your story?
          1. Icelord
            Icelord April 20 2020 10: 14 New
            -1
            And no one knows about the Slavic gods, there are no sources, they were illiterate
        6. Podvodnik
          Podvodnik April 6 2020 11: 42 New
          +4
          but the history of Japan itself is studied thoroughly to the smallest event, to the last "nail


          The child received a book “In the Sky of Oranienbaum” (a group of authors) as a prize. I read how !!!! Yo-mayo! Here such events took place, "but the peasants do not know." It’s a pity that we don’t know not only the history of our native lands, the history of Russia is superficial. But the myths of ancient Greece teach .... Sorry. And so you dig a little bit and you are surprised at the events of the past years: our ancestors were not born too.
      2. kalibr
        April 5 2020 07: 03 New
        +7
        Quote: Alexander Suvorov
        complete falsification

        The complete falsification, Alexander, is when there are no links to documents. Your attention is not even presented links, but photocopies of documents. Show me at least one place in my materials that would not be confirmed by reference or photocopy. In the article about 9 liters there were no links. But all the information was taken from the Penza local history website, as was written in the comments. You can check. The difference is only that which is indicated in quarters, and I have converted to liters. So don’t do it ... falsification.
        1. The leader of the Redskins
          The leader of the Redskins April 5 2020 07: 30 New
          +5
          And you know, Vyacheslav Olegovich, I myself “fell into prasak” myself) And this despite the fact that the boy was well-read.
          The historian told us about Cleopatra. And, in passing, he mentioned that she was a courtesan. But we have not heard such a word! Well, I, as the bravest, and ask again - and who is this?
          There, the historian was already feeling a bit overwhelmed, but after all decided, after the “woman of easy virtue”, to add the “prostitute” that was allowed to the movie!))
          1. kalibr
            April 5 2020 07: 34 New
            0
            Who didn’t get in? In 1964, I was doing political information in the classroom ... About the cultural revolution and ... Dzaofani. And the word "red guards" I read incorrectly, with a roll in Russian dialect. Well, the spy ... oh, it was cool. And most importantly, "a boy from a good family," could not be blamed for hooligan motives!
            1. Insurgent
              Insurgent April 5 2020 07: 49 New
              +7
              About how the penis of the same Osiris was eaten by fish, and Isis, his wife, fashioned a new one for him from clay, and, having become pregnant from him, gave birth to a son Horus.

              Isis (Isis), the Egyptian goddess whose name in Donetsk (DPR) is called the Center for Reproductive Medicine (Isis-Don-Ivf), which in 1998 began its activities as a branch of the Kiev clinic Isis-Ivf, but then grew into an independent scientific medical Center.
            2. A. Privalov
              A. Privalov April 5 2020 11: 02 New
              10
              Quote: kalibr
              In 1964, I was doing political information in the classroom ... About the cultural revolution and ... Dzaofani.

              Zhaofani only appeared in 1966. Why I know, because like you did political information. I talked about Zzaofan in 1967, when I moved to the 7th grade. I don’t find fault with such trifles, but I just remembered too ... hi
              1. kalibr
                April 5 2020 11: 12 New
                -1
                Yes, human memory is imperfect ... Therefore, it is best to look at documents!
                1. A. Privalov
                  A. Privalov April 5 2020 12: 39 New
                  +3
                  Quote: kalibr
                  Yes, human memory is imperfect ... Therefore, it is best to look at documents!

                  There's nothing you can do. Such subtleties today only for connoisseurs, alas ...
                2. A.Lex
                  A.Lex April 5 2020 20: 45 New
                  +6
                  laughing laughing laughing And who draws up the documents? What are the historians? Here is the history of Ancient Russia, who wrote to us? Where are the sources? But the information "floated" that the history of the DR of the US was written by the Germans, after the destruction of the original sources (when they were torn to the archives under Peter I.). After all, if you look at the pre-Petrine history of Russia, then there is generally such a read! Also about Ivan the Terrible "who killed his son" ... and about the fact that Rurik was a VIKING ... This is a horrible nightmare!
                  And where is the Doryurik story ???
                  1. kalibr
                    April 5 2020 20: 47 New
                    -4
                    Quote: A.Lex
                    Where are the sources? But the information "floated" that the history of the DR of the US was written by the Germans, after the destruction of the original sources (when they were torn to the archives under Peter I.).

                    In the HISTORY section, just about this there were already 2 materials. Take a look. Apparently, you missed them ...
                  2. Podvodnik
                    Podvodnik April 6 2020 12: 36 New
                    0
                    And where is the Doryurik story ???


                    They cleaned everything up, adjusting the basis for the origin and antiquity of the Romanovs.
          2. knn54
            knn54 April 5 2020 08: 58 New
            +8
            Interestingly, the children would understand the word "walking".
            Vyacheslav, WHY didn’t the Slavic pantheon of gods be studied in schools?
            1. kalibr
              April 5 2020 09: 39 New
              +4
              Quote: knn54
              Vyacheslav, WHY didn’t the Slavic pantheon of gods be studied in schools?

              This has already been discussed. It is studied, but not as deeply as in the history of Greece. And then, what do we really know about him? Christianity has covered everything ...
              1. Ingvar 72
                Ingvar 72 April 5 2020 11: 06 New
                0
                Quote: kalibr
                Christianity has covered everything ...

                Oh, did you recognize the facts of fraud in Vyacheslav?
                1. kalibr
                  April 5 2020 11: 15 New
                  -2
                  Quote: Ingvar 72
                  Christianity has covered everything ...

                  The cover does not mean rigging. These are different things, right? And then fakes and fabrication of fakes always took place. But not the way they write about it in relation to the history of Russia. By the way, there were already two of my material about this here. You can look at the profile or in the HISTORY section.
          3. Olgovich
            Olgovich April 5 2020 09: 47 New
            11
            Quote: Leader of the Redskins
            There, the historian was already feeling a bit overwhelmed, but after all decided, after the “woman of easy virtue”, to add the “prostitute” that was allowed to the movie!))

            Still, the courtesan is not a prostitute, it is, yes, a woman of easy virtue, but spinning in high societyleading social life and kept by wealthy and powerful lovers.
            Still, she chose her lover (s)] herself, unlike the classic ave.

            There is, in my opinion, a more characteristic word pronounced, for example, when unexpected stumble, fall, etc. yes
            1. The leader of the Redskins
              The leader of the Redskins April 5 2020 09: 54 New
              +2
              But it is unprintable)))
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich April 5 2020 11: 14 New
                +1
                Quote: Leader of the Redskins
                But it is unprintable)))

                But pronounced)) yes
              2. www3
                www3 April 6 2020 22: 40 New
                +1
                Quote: Leader of the Redskins
                But it is unprintable)))


                how is it not printed?
                if memory serves, it is found in the novel of A. Tolstoy "Peter 1".
                which by the way, when it was part of the school curriculum.))
          4. Nikolaevich I
            Nikolaevich I April 5 2020 10: 00 New
            +5
            Quote: Leader of the Redskins
            after the “woman of easy virtue” add the “prostitute” permitted in the movie!))

            Mdaaa ... your historian ... did not "catch up"! The definition of "prostitute" is the simplest and most primitive explanation of concepts such as "courtesan", "getter", "geisha" ....
            1. Albert1988
              Albert1988 April 5 2020 19: 54 New
              +2
              Quote: Nikolaevich I
              "geisha"

              But the geisha here at all from the side bake ...
              1. Nikolaevich I
                Nikolaevich I April 6 2020 01: 07 New
                0
                Quote: Albert1988
                But the geisha here at all from the side bake ...

                Mdaaa ... judging by this "saying", you are still that "Japanese" ... "here and there"! I recommend that you better "understand" the topic ... read more about getters, courtesans, geisha! Only for each “question” do not “be satisfied” with only one source! Read at least (!) Three sources ...
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 April 6 2020 12: 42 New
                  +1
                  Quote: Nikolaevich I
                  Mdaaa ... judging by this "saying", you are still that "Japanese" ...

                  I’m curious, I don’t have any words, but the Japanese are among close friends and spoke well with the Japanese, really in English ... Geisha - well, never a getter or courtesan, she could have close contact with a man only once in her life - a ritual loss virginity and trunc ...
                  1. Nikolaevich I
                    Nikolaevich I April 6 2020 13: 23 New
                    +1
                    Once again, I "recommend" (!): Read more! About geishas ... getters ... courtesans! Use different (!) Sources! And then, perhaps, you will understand the “general and the difference” ... for example, between a heterosexual and a geisha! As Kozma Prutkov “expressed”: “A narrow specialist is like a flux ... its fullness is one-sided!” I could "chew" everything to you, explaining my point of view ... what I want to say ... bring fragments from different publications, different authors, showing different sides of the disputed "phenomena" ... But I won’t ... try " learn the essence of things "yourself!
                    1. Albert1988
                      Albert1988 April 6 2020 23: 19 New
                      0
                      Quote: Nikolaevich I
                      Once again, I "recommend" (!): Read more! About geishas ... getters ... courtesans! Use different (!) Sources!

                      Different sources - this is necessary, BUT! Here the catch is that they are exactly what are different - what is the point of reading, for example, the memories of Japan of stupid Caucasians, who in their colonial blindness wrote geisha from their shoulders in ordinary ... ..... ki? I, as NOT a specialist, can hardly immediately distinguish sources like fables from really trustworthy ones. And experts in Japan, with whom I had the good fortune to communicate closely, firstly, knew the situation from the inside, and secondly, they themselves drew Old from a variety of reliable sources)))
          5. Looking for
            Looking for April 5 2020 15: 21 New
            +3
            so. how do you. "falling into prAsak" instead of "falling into a rush" there is a definition- "tradesman in the nobility."
            1. aakvit
              aakvit April 7 2020 13: 48 New
              0
              But sarcasm should be caught!
          6. Siberian54
            Siberian54 April 5 2020 17: 30 New
            +7
            In my class, many have already mastered Mosopan and such questions have not surfaced ..
        2. The comment was deleted.
          1. kalibr
            April 5 2020 07: 53 New
            -5
            Quote: Alexander Suvorov
            and completely ignore other sources.

            If you, Alexander, do not have access to the archives, then how can you know that there are other sources? But you can’t say this without access. And if not? For example, photocopies of the reports of the head of the NKVD were given. And there are no others. And that was what was hidden. And if here all people are literate, able to separate, then they must understand that all the positive (and even not all!) Was in the newspapers. The Pravda newspaper is digitized today and anyone who owns a computer can view it. So this is not so interesting. It’s interesting just what was hidden from the “simple” and it’s not my fault that there is one g ... And if there were no one g ... by the way, we would still live in the USSR today and rejoice. And not so much something Soviet education helped you to distinguish ... right?
            1. Alexander Suvorov
              Alexander Suvorov April 5 2020 08: 07 New
              22
              kalibr (Vyacheslav)
              For example, photocopies of the reports of the head of the NKVD were given. And there are no others.
              Twenty-five again ... Take advantage of the fact that I cannot refute your words once in the archive, not good. Those. in order to refute your lie, I have to drop everything, rush to Moscow, to the archive, spend half a year to study archives, or even more, and for what? In order to dunk you in a bucket of your own slops? Will there be too much honor?
              Or maybe everything is much simpler? Could it be enough to turn on the head and logic? I do not claim that the USSR was a paradise on Earth, I just do not specifically agree with your position on the USSR.
              I see that you really do not have a sense of elementary decency, scolding what you praised before is at least a vile position (to put it mildly), and you don’t even understand this, or pretend you don’t understand.
              There is no faith in a person who lied once, but you lie almost without stopping, so what kind of faith can you be?
              1. kalibr
                April 5 2020 09: 35 New
                -18
                Quote: Alexander Suvorov
                I do not claim that the USSR was a paradise on Earth

                Already something, huh? And this is without visiting the archives. And if you were there, then ... progress would still be that. And do not turn on the head!
                Quote: Alexander Suvorov
                you lie almost without stopping

                And you prove it! All the materials I have provided have links to sources or are photocopies. So - this is not a lie! And the charges are unproven in a lie, this is slander, by the way. And slander, stated in the media or in a public speech, is punishable by a fine of up to 1 rubles or the appointment of up to 000 hours of forced labor. I have long wanted to try this type of earnings on one of the readers of VO. True, now quarantine and all that. But sooner or later it will end and you will have to give explanations in court. Well, no one will give me a milien from you, but why not 000 ruble from each registered visitor of VO (audience)?
                1. Polymer
                  Polymer April 5 2020 18: 28 New
                  +7
                  Quote: kalibr
                  Well, no one will give me a milien from you, but why not 1 ruble from each registered visitor of VO (audience)?

                  Bravo! This is the author’s true attitude towards his readers! It has been noticeable for a long time, but now it’s straight “down with the mask”. There is only one question - what about the "cult of Shpakovsky admirers", from them also "1 ruble"?
                  1. kalibr
                    April 5 2020 19: 18 New
                    -6
                    Sergey, you do not understand. This does not mean the payment of the ruble per person, people have to do with it, but the amount that can be collected from the RESPONDENT, based on the number of registered. It is necessary to start from something? I just didn’t quite exactly express myself legally.
                    1. Polymer
                      Polymer April 5 2020 19: 30 New
                      +3
                      By defendant do you mean a person by the nickname "Alexander Suvorov" or the site topwar.ru? Although, in the case of litigation, the site "hits" in any case.
                      However, in my remark about the author’s attitude towards readers, this does not change anything. The threat of suing the opponent with a weighty argument, of course, but to science, as well as to creativity, it is not applicable, as it seems to me.
                      1. kalibr
                        April 5 2020 19: 39 New
                        -2
                        Sergei. There is a specific person. There is a concrete example of slander. And where is the site? His duty, if there is an appropriate decision of the judiciary, is only to open the address and details of the anonymous person. And that’s all. And the allegations of lies have nothing to do with science. Go take documents, newspapers ... look, write, what's wrong. Can not? Then tame the language and express yourself ... otherwise.
                      2. Polymer
                        Polymer April 5 2020 20: 50 New
                        +3
                        Quote: kalibr
                        And the allegations of lies have nothing to do with science.

                        Yeah, it means that a certain caste of “real” scientists quite calmly blames others for “pseudoscience”, but they themselves are not? The one who has more rights is right - this is as usual.
                        But, speaking specifically on this occasion, in the comments on this article you have been repeatedly caught on the fact that you cannot confirm the truth of your statements. So you have a chance to lose the court. Think about it.
                2. Alf
                  Alf April 5 2020 19: 47 New
                  10
                  Quote: Polymer
                  Bravo! This is the author’s true attitude towards his readers!

                  It is very reminiscent of the scholarly debates in the Middle Ages — if the opponent has nothing to object to, then he applies the technique — so he is a heretic and that’s all ... the opponent is on the fire. So Mr. Shpakovskiy debate leads. When he has nothing to object to, he begins to give a meaningless set of words, ending with two phrases — I've written 100500 books and you're all ... and I'm one smart.
                  P.S. Let dates be your account number, I will transfer him one ruble.
                  1. kalibr
                    April 5 2020 19: 51 New
                    -5
                    One, Vasily, I do not need. Especially with you. And you need a lot from a very specific person. The law is the law, Basil.
                    1. Alf
                      Alf April 5 2020 20: 53 New
                      +2
                      Quote: kalibr
                      One, Vasily, I do not need. Especially with you. And you need a lot from a very specific person. The law is the law, Basil.

                      Guys! Well, let’s throw it all the same, a person needs it, do you all feel sorry for the ruble?
                      Are not you afraid to run into a counterclaim? For slander? As an example, your article on NOVO models in the USSR will go, there you have been caught by the hand so many times that it will be possible to open a factory of models of the Star scale for the proceeds.
                    2. Alexander Suvorov
                      Alexander Suvorov April 5 2020 22: 30 New
                      +3
                      kalibr (Vyacheslav)
                      One, Vasily, I do not need. Especially with you. And you need a lot from a very specific person. The law is the law, Basil.
                      Do not tell, because I don’t know why I laugh harder, from “fear” or from complete delirium fool your statements.
                      And what do you bring to court? What are the reasons? These ones? laughing laughing laughing
                      All the materials I have provided have links to sources or are photocopies. So - this is not a lie! And the charges are unproven in a lie, this is slander, by the way.
                      Yes, the court will send you know where with such arguments?
                      No, well, you certainly go to court, I do not mind, I just purely neigh ... tongue laughing
                      P.S. By the way, they correctly pointed out to you that you can be fucked so in a counterclaim that you’ll look for the “historian” in the fifth corner, you are our unfinished business.

                      ... So on what account the ruble should be transferred, so I will help the sick ...
              2. vladcub
                vladcub April 5 2020 19: 07 New
                +5
                "I didn’t cut 1 ruble from each registered visitor of VO": 1 from each registered visitor or from everyone who swears with you? This is what they say in Odessa: "two different things." Indeed, among those registered there are those who like all your materials
                1. kalibr
                  April 5 2020 19: 14 New
                  -2
                  Svyatoslav, what are you? According to the law, the Respondent pays compensation for the damage caused. It's just that as many people are registered on the site, they make up the information space. And this damage is easiest to calculate based on this amount. Not from EVERYONE REGISTERED, but by the number of them from the defendant!
            2. kalibr
              April 5 2020 09: 43 New
              -15
              Quote: Alexander Suvorov
              There is no faith in a person who lied once, but you lie almost without stopping, so what kind of faith can you be?

              For faith, this is to the priest in the church. I have only bare information: photocopies of archival documents and newspapers. They do not need to believe, disbelief. You just need to read them. Oh yes - you do not like my comments on them. But the comments do not contain information. They contain an emotional assessment, and I have every right to it.
            3. Olgovich
              Olgovich April 5 2020 10: 14 New
              -9
              Quote: Alexander Suvorov
              Twenty five again ... Take advantage of what your words I can not refute once in the archive, not good.

              Alexander Suvorov - I'm only disagree

              Do you even hear yourself, the so-called "alsander s"? lol

              looks like no: themselves acknowledge that refute the Author ... not lol can lol , and, right there ... deny belay lol laughing

              "In Leningrad-city, at five corners,
              Got on the face Sanya S-s.
              Sang not musically, scandalized.
              Well, it’s right that they gave. "(C)

              yes
          2. Sanya Terek
            Sanya Terek April 5 2020 10: 18 New
            25
            Vyacheslav Olegovich, excerpt from your article: "We read further. A textbook of the 7th grade." The knights moved "pig", in the middle there was a heavily armed infantry in iron shells and with axes... "Where does this nonsense come from and how did it get into the school textbook? "

            The following excerpt: “Let us recall the explanation, found again in textbooks, because Bobrok Volynets did not enter the battle on the Kulikovo field, because ... he was waiting for the south wind. And then the south wind blew, carried dust to the Tatars, and then he led them into attack. "

            This is from the textbook of history of the USSR 7th grade in 1971. I studied in this textbook, graduating from our high school in 1977, also studied in this textbook, and the program was unified. Or did your individual school have textbooks?
            1. kalibr
              April 5 2020 11: 24 New
              -14
              I do not understand what you want to say? "A textbook of the 7th grade." The knights moved as a "pig", in the middle there was heavy armored infantry in iron shells and with axes ... "This is a phrase from a modern textbook, which my granddaughter studied. About the south wind from Mityaev’s book" Winds of the Kulikov Field " “In any case, everything is wrong. The Germans had an infantry ... and an infant went with swords? What kind of grandmother did she buy them for?
              1. Arthur 85
                Arthur 85 April 5 2020 11: 59 New
                +6
                Yes god with money. How did the infantry and cavalry advance? They Zinovy ​​Rozhdestvensky commanded, or what?
              2. Sanya Terek
                Sanya Terek April 5 2020 14: 50 New
                +7
                Modern textbooks, not only in history, are "effective managers" because they "see" it. And refer to the book A.V. Mityaeva "Winds of the Kulikovo field" (genre - children's prose)? With the same success you can refer to Russian folk tales.
                And with swords, (the textbook does not state that the infantry was 100% armed), foot soldiers could have acquired after the defeat of the Pskov ratification in August 1240. Would they really have left trophies on the battlefield?
                1. Albert1988
                  Albert1988 April 5 2020 20: 00 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Sanya Terek
                  Modern textbooks, not only in history, are "effective managers" because they "see" it. And refer to the book A.V. Mityaeva "Winds of the Kulikovo field" (genre - children's prose)? With the same success you can refer to Russian folk tales.
                  And with swords, (the textbook does not state that the infantry was 100% armed), foot soldiers could have acquired after the defeat of the Pskov ratification in August 1240. Would they really have left trophies on the battlefield?

                  To get rid of outdated ideas about all our historical battles - listen to Klim Aleksandrovich Zhukov - what arguments he gives, among other things, it’s just modern historical methods.
        3. Vladimir_2U
          Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 11: 26 New
          +3
          You look at the comments on the article
          CAR 816: Sultan among rifles
          In the comments, the author revealed remarkably. As a "connoisseur" of article 58, and as a person.
        4. Astra wild
          Astra wild April 5 2020 13: 12 New
          +3
          Alexander Suvorov, I agree with you so that Vyacheslav Olegovich is somewhat biased towards the Soviet past and this is not pleasant for us. But: “what shame and conscience does the former teacher of the history of the CPSU have in logic”, are all teachers of history of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, unscrupulous people? We had a former teacher of history of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, a walking conscience, limited to a chapel. For a long time I wondered: how is this possible?
          1. ser56
            ser56 April 5 2020 15: 44 New
            0
            Quote: Astra wild
            A former teacher of history of the CPSU lived in our quarter, a walking conscience limited to a chapel.

            exceptions confirm the rules! request
          2. Icelord
            Icelord April 8 2020 21: 05 New
            0
            Until
        5. The comment was deleted.
      3. Sergey79
        Sergey79 April 5 2020 08: 15 New
        16
        Good day. And so it turns out. In one work, an unjustified conclusion is made, then there is a reference to this work and soon the conclusion becomes a dogma. I really liked reading Tiesenhausen (I’m re-reading it for the 4th time). Dan is given an Arabic source, and then its translation and no conclusions.
      4. Barmaleyka
        Barmaleyka April 5 2020 09: 34 New
        +6
        Quote: kalibr
        Show me at least one place in my materials that would not be confirmed by reference or photocopy

        You can link to scientific research here on this item

        Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophone reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%.

        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 10: 34 New
          -16
          For the first time, Vladimir, this information came to me in 2000. I was surprised, but immediately inserted into the text of an article in one of the Penza newspapers, because then it was on everyone’s ears. And since I then wrote mainly to local newspapers, I did not need links. So now I will not give links, alas. Too long ... But in this case we were talking about materials on historical topics. If you give links to each material, then it will become simply impossible to read them.
          1. Barmaleyka
            Barmaleyka April 5 2020 11: 44 New
            +4
            Quote: kalibr
            first, Vladimir, I got this information in 2000. I was surprised, but immediately inserted into the text of an article in one of the Penza newspapers, because then it was on everyone’s ears. And since I then wrote mainly to local newspapers, I did not need links. So now I will not give links, alas. Too long ...

            Q.E.D. laughing
            the question is closed
      5. Ingvar 72
        Ingvar 72 April 5 2020 11: 03 New
        +7
        Quote: kalibr
        Utter falsification

        May be. But when Priapus is called the Roman counterpart of Osiris, it is a MANIPULATION of facts. wink
      6. helvetic
        helvetic April 5 2020 11: 50 New
        15
        Here Vyacheslav is ready in each case to hide behind sources. However, to me, who has worked in the archives of the three former Union republics, it is strange that from this huge array of documents that show the Union in the best light, the author does not try to convey to the reader. Or positive material is not material. Honestly, after being in the archives of the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Georgia and the State Archive of the GBAO of the Republic of Tatarstan and studying key documents of 1988-1991 I want only the total extermination of all those who have ever and poorly said anything about the USSR (this is by no means a call, we are talking about emotions inspired by the hell that the "reformers" then staged - hunger and massacres)
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 12: 57 New
          -5
          So write an article based on the documents you know and links to them. I am sure that this will be very interesting material!
          1. helvetic
            helvetic April 6 2020 16: 35 New
            0
            So I wrote. Five pieces in serious magazines. If VO at least rinsevatsya ...
            1. helvetic
              helvetic April 6 2020 16: 36 New
              0
              Five - according to the era of the collapse of the USSR, of course, and not at all
              1. kalibr
                April 6 2020 17: 08 New
                -2
                Quote: helvetic
                Five - according to the era of the collapse of the USSR, of course, and not at all

                And to rewrite them popularly, is it difficult? Or problems over time?
            2. kalibr
              April 6 2020 17: 07 New
              -2
              Quote: helvetic
              If VO at least rinsevatsya ...

              Yes, that is the problem. When I worked at PSU, I also came across this. But this is a popular science site, here scientific research is not very appropriate.
        2. Polymer
          Polymer April 5 2020 18: 42 New
          11
          Quote: helvetic
          it is strange that from this huge array of documents that show the Union in the best possible light, the author is trying to convey little to the reader. Or positive material is not material.

          On the contrary, the author deliberately searches for and finds exactly the negative, in order to pour another bucket of slop into the USSR later. There is a saying: a pig will find dirt everywhere.
          1. kalibr
            April 5 2020 19: 26 New
            -5
            Quote: Polymer
            On the contrary, the author deliberately searches for and finds exactly the negative, in order to pour another bucket of slop into the USSR later. There is a saying: a pig will find dirt everywhere.

            So Sergey, if it were not true, otherwise it would be true. That's the thing. But you cherish the image of yourself ... "a fabulous country where unpaved streets were lined with non-degreasing rubles." But really it was not so. Just like you did not report it. But in the end, bang and the 91st. How is snow on my head, right? All is well and suddenly ... And not suddenly and not in one day, or even in five years!
            1. Polymer
              Polymer April 5 2020 19: 41 New
              +5
              Quote: kalibr
              But you cherish the image of yourself ... "a fabulous country where unpaved streets were lined with non-degreasing rubles." But really it was not so. Just like you did not report it.

              And to people like you, reported?
              You know, even though I’m younger than you, I have seen this reality with my own eyes. Both before and after. And the "primary sources" I have are my parents, grandparents. They are far from describing everything in pink, but in comparison ... I would prefer to stay in the USSR, in short.
              1. kalibr
                April 5 2020 19: 45 New
                -2
                And they didn’t tell me, Sergei, and I sincerely believed ... But then I got into one archive, another, read the documents. And I realized that the king is naked and sooner or later ... will bend. And you know, I would also prefer to stay in the USSR, but ... you can’t stay in what has collapsed. And you need to find out why it collapsed so as not to happen again. Because one more such collapse we will not tolerate.
                1. Polymer
                  Polymer April 5 2020 21: 04 New
                  +7
                  Quote: kalibr
                  And you need to find out why it collapsed so as not to happen again.

                  Thoroughly sorting through dirty laundry? Somehow it’s not going to analytics ...
                  Vyacheslav Olegovich, because you studied not only history, but also the theory of Marxism-Leninism, as I understand it? Well, get into a serious analysis, find out what went wrong. Where did theory diverge from practice? Such work would be of great benefit to society. Or is it that the work is complicated and long, and the prospects for getting a fee tend to zero?
                  1. kalibr
                    April 6 2020 10: 42 New
                    -3
                    Quote: Polymer
                    Well, get into a serious analysis, find out what went wrong. Where theory diverged from practice

                    So there was already material on this topic. It was called the "Revolution of mediocrity." With links to the work of Lenin. There was a whole series of articles about the working class of Russia in the past and present. Go to the profile and find. You understand, in order to take serious analysis you have to be ... seriously savvy. And you saw a lot of "savvy" here. There are a lot of minuses, but you can count the savvy on the fingers. But let's not talk about sad things. You look at the profile that I advise you.
                    1. Polymer
                      Polymer April 6 2020 11: 22 New
                      +2
                      Quote: kalibr
                      You understand, in order to take serious analysis you have to be ... seriously savvy. And you saw a lot of "savvy" here.

                      It is enough here both educated and able to think. But the arrogant attitude towards the audience ... somehow does not paint, to say the least. But your business.
                      And I read articles on the topic, even if I initially do not like them. Only in the recommended by you analysis is not, from the word at all.
                    2. kalibr
                      April 6 2020 17: 10 New
                      -2
                      Quote: Polymer
                      Only in the recommended by you analysis is not, from the word at all.

                      But in them there is a lot of information on which you can think of yourself. Compare it with what you already knew, look at the results. You can do it, right? And as for the audience ... You see, I ask - I ask the most innocent question, there is no answer, or rather, the minuses in response. This is normal? Half of the comments are as if the authors did not read the article. Or didn’t you notice this too?
                    3. Polymer
                      Polymer April 6 2020 18: 10 New
                      0
                      Quote: kalibr
                      But in them there is a lot of information on which you can think of yourself.

                      This has not been canceled. Otherwise, no one would read such articles. But this situation has already been explained, for example, by the same Alexander Suvorov. Like many readers, I am not a historian, not an analyst, etc., I earn a living in another area. And sometimes, I just have no time to do this. This is a job for specialists in their field, but! - precisely because this is a public work, I, as a reader, have the right (moral) to judge how good the work of these very specialists is. And I have not yet met really good work, because there is no answer to the very question: where did the theory diverge from practice?
                      So far, by the way, I have found the answer closest to the full in Trotsky’s works (let the anger of the Stalinists pass me!). The fact is that it was Trotsky who singled out the bureaucracy into a separate class and suggested two options for the development of events: the working class would defeat the bureaucracy, or vice versa. In the second case, he clearly spoke about the counter-revolution and restoration of capitalism, which ultimately happened. However, even Trotsky has no answer, where is the error in theory.
                      Quote: kalibr
                      there is no answer, or rather, the cons in response

                      I do not understand the concern of many about these minuses. Is it so important?
                    4. kalibr
                      April 6 2020 18: 26 New
                      -2
                      Quote: Polymer
                      I do not understand the concern of many about these minuses. Is it so important?

                      Why did you decide that this is important to me? But this is an indicator, yes ... when there is no answer, but a minus instead. You don’t think so. You answer me, I tell you, but I don’t put you down. I also read Trotsky back in the special guard of Leninka.
                      Now about the rights. You have the rights, no doubt, but why sculpt labels right away (this is not about you), you can always figure out everything in words. And now for the fun part. You earn ... others. I am that. But where is it written that I am obliged to give everything as you need? You yourself wrote "this has not been canceled." So articles are informative? Yes or no? Yes! But you want more, right? Analysis, ready-made answers? And this is difficult, and I do not have access to information of this level. Yes, and I live in Penza, not Moscow. So, as they say, rejoice that they give such a thing - this is no offense. With links to newspapers, at least some archives. Even so ... And if I knew the answer, where did I "split up", I would not write here at all, but sat next to Putin or Trump and gave advice on where to steer. There you go, Sergey!
                    5. Polymer
                      Polymer April 6 2020 18: 35 New
                      0
                      Quote: kalibr
                      But where is it written that I am obliged to give everything as you need?

                      And where is it written that commentators should react to your articles only as you please? And do not put cons in silence?
                      By the way, I attribute to your merits the most active participation in the discussion of materials. Many authors do not do this at all.
                    6. kalibr
                      April 6 2020 18: 44 New
                      -2
                      Quote: Polymer
                      And where is it written that commentators should react to your articles only as you please?

                      Sergei! But do I demand this? Just decently to answer questions? Don't you think so?
                      That was the thesis; "A lot of examples and doctoral dissertations with a clear substitution of facts." I asked to give at least one example with a title, page, etc. The answer did not wait. What? Do not like the question or do not meet the answer?
                      I agree to "silently" when the statement is APPROVED. But no question! Do you think otherwise? Would you be pleased if you answered all your questions with a stream of minuses? I think no. And - yes, I always answer normal claims. Remember, I promised a person an article about Ainu. The topic was postponed for a year, but did. He promised to find about the "bath" (see correspondence with Leonid below), and did not find it. A lot of work really. But as quarantine ends, I’ll certainly look. So don’t have to react so painfully to people. All the same, the past will not change.
                    7. Polymer
                      Polymer April 6 2020 18: 58 New
                      +1
                      Quote: kalibr
                      All the same, the past will not change.

                      All these disputes are not about the past, but about the future. Because:
                      Quote: kalibr
                      And you need to find out why it collapsed so as not to happen again. Because one more such collapse we will not tolerate.
  • Icelord
    Icelord April 8 2020 21: 09 New
    0
    straight mass killings, lope killed? Where is it written?
  • Caretaker
    Caretaker April 5 2020 12: 11 New
    10
    Quote: kalibr
    Show me at least one place in my materials that would not be confirmed by reference or photocopy.

    It's Easy!
    Quote: kalibr
    Yes, the cards were canceled. But in St. Petersburg, according to the Rodina magazine, in 1956, for one worker there were 6 (six!) Wash days on average per year! Then it smelled of them!

    The link was never confirmed. Even the "help of the hall" did not help.
    It is possible to assume that many of your evidence is just as "reliable."
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 00 New
      -13
      Yes, I could not find this example, cited in the journal Rodina.
      Quote: Caretaker
      It is possible to assume that many of your evidence is just as "reliable."

      But on the basis of this fact alone, "weather" is not worth doing. I don’t see the point of sitting in the library and shoveling the Rodin Mountains for the sake of one single fact. But people doubt in those materials where photos of documents under their nose. So what are you talking about?
      1. Caretaker
        Caretaker April 5 2020 13: 45 New
        +6
        Quote: kalibr
        But on the basis of this fact alone, "weather" is not worth doing. I don’t see the point of sitting in the library and shoveling the Rodin Mountains for the sake of one single fact. But people doubt in those materials where photos of documents under their nose. So what are you talking about?

        That categorical statement: "Show me at least one place in my materials that would not be confirmed by reference or photocopy" turned out to be false.
        If you are not able to confirm the fact, then you should formulate "in my opinion", "read somewhere", "maybe", etc.
        In that article, evidence was given of the fallacy of your conclusions on the issue in which you were not competent.
        It is possible to assume that in other articles there are similar "mistakes", they simply discuss topics in which readers are not well versed.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 18: 09 New
          -7
          You see, Leonid. In general, it was not customary to make references. I started to do this in articles because of ... "uneven breathing" of some, but as they say, you always think better of people. You believe them, so they believe you. But no ... Well ... But you made me angry. I looked on the Web, but the "Homeland" does not upload its materials. I looked at articles and dissertations. I found one material about the "queues in the baths on Fridays and Saturdays", but did not download, because it did not count, and the time was the very end of the 40s. That is, again you will cling. Well ... how to remove quarantine measures will have to sit in the library.
          1. Caretaker
            Caretaker April 5 2020 20: 09 New
            +1
            Quote: kalibr
            In general, it was not customary to make references. This I began to do them in articles ...

            I agree, the explanations to the illustrations really reinforce your arguments in the articles. Links are rare, which may cause dissatisfaction of copyright holders. For most non-profit resources, hyperlinks are sufficient.
            Quote: kalibr
            ... you believe them, so they believe you ...

            To believe, to some extent, is possible if it does not contradict life experience and common sense.
            Arguments refuting your statements are given in the comments on the topic under discussion.
            Quote: kalibr
            I found one material about "queues in the baths on Fridays and Saturdays, but did not download, because it does not count, and time is the very end of the 40s."

            Queues in a public bath still exist, although each apartment has a bathtub with shower. Depends on the day of the week, time of visit and class of the department. There are still lovers to take a steam bath with friends.
            1. kalibr
              April 6 2020 11: 04 New
              -3
              Quote: Caretaker
              To believe, to some extent, is possible if it does not contradict life experience and common sense.

              Here again, it’s very interesting, Leonid. In 1963, both my grandparents hurt me ... I ran after an ambulance, they were taken to a hospital. They were treated ... Life experience and common sense which - everything is OK. Yes? Yes! Now I’ve taken up the archive of OFOPO GAPO and find the certificate for 1961-62. prepared for the industrial OK CPSU on health care in Penza. And there is darkness and horror. All contrary to my memory and experience. I will certainly post it here. What do many want here? So that I alternate successes and shortcomings! And that’s how the help is compiled. But ... "all contrary to common sense." However, you will see her. And now this: we have here, including you have seen a lot of such documents and held them in your hands? And in the archives of Penza, Samara, Ulyanovsk, the Central Committee of the Komsomol .... there are a lot of them !. They say to me, "You are specially selected." If ... Just VO cannot "digest" all this, and it is not necessary. And so it would be possible to give at least three such materials a day. And all with the stamp "secret", "special folder" ...
              Well, and about "believe" ... I've got used to trust people.
              1. Caretaker
                Caretaker April 6 2020 12: 46 New
                +2
                Quote: kalibr
                In 1963, both my grandparents hurt me ... I ran after an ambulance, they were taken to a hospital. They were treated ... Life experience and common sense which - everything is OK.

                Life experience tells you that the hospital was and was treated in it. If someone writes that the hospital worked two days a week in 1963, and the ambulance in Penza went on a chaise, then you will not believe it, although an isolated case could be recorded and noted in the document.
                At the same time, many shortcomings could be identified in the institutions, which is reflected in the acts and certificates.
                1. kalibr
                  April 6 2020 16: 55 New
                  -2
                  It is truth too. This is the everlasting problem of the singular and the universal. But she is more concerned with archaeologists. With documents, everything is easier. However, you will see for yourself.
            2. Icelord
              Icelord April 8 2020 21: 19 New
              0
              uh .... did not meet the queues in the bath, you call you order, if the time is busy report. Carry
  • Krasnoyarsk
    Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 07: 48 New
    25
    Quote: Alexander Suvorov
    Well, yes, it’s funny to read about falsification of history from

    Well, why are you like that! You and I simply don’t understand what it means to know, for example, the history of ancient Egypt. We, scoops, in CeSeSeR, were told about some pyramids there, religion, art, agriculture of ancient Egypt, about all this garbage and therefore we did not know the history of Egypt. But Mr. Shpakovsky told us who inseminated whom and in what way and immediately we became enlightened, we knew the HISTORY (!!!) of ancient Egypt and not only it. That turns out why we were scoops! We were not told the main thing - who, whom and in what way. And also because we were not in the British Museum and personally, unlike the "historian" Shpakovsky, did not see the "fragment of the Book of the Dead by Hunfer"
    1. tlauicol
      tlauicol April 5 2020 08: 17 New
      -9
      write succinctly: "I didn’t read Pasternak, but I condemn! I haven’t been to the Uffizi, but I don’t believe it!"
      Ne sutor supra crepidam
      1. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 10: 04 New
        13
        Quote: Tlauicol
        write succinctly: "I didn’t read Pasternak, but I condemn! I haven’t been to the Uffizi, but I don’t believe it!"
        Ne sutor supra crepidam

        If you quote, then quote correctly - Brodsky did not read .......
        1. tlauicol
          tlauicol April 5 2020 11: 16 New
          -2
          Quote: Krasnoyarsk
          Quote: Tlauicol
          write succinctly: "I didn’t read Pasternak, but I condemn! I haven’t been to the Uffizi, but I don’t believe it!"
          Ne sutor supra crepidam

          If you quote, then quote correctly - Brodsky did not read .......

          Hopeless case
          1. Mwg
            Mwg April 5 2020 19: 11 New
            +3
            What, king? Heavy? ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
  • Sergey79
    Sergey79 April 5 2020 08: 03 New
    19
    Totally agree with you. I do not agree with the author on the following items:
    1. There is no conclusion that it is very “sad” when our children learn the stories of the ancient world from myths;
    2. Basically, those who disagree with the position of official history do not shout that they are not agreeing on something, but ask the question "on what basis is this or that conclusion made";
    3. A lot of examples and doctoral dissertations with an obvious substitution of facts.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 09: 47 New
      -10
      Quote: Sergey79
      A lot of examples and doctoral dissertations with an obvious substitution of facts.

      Give at least one: author, title, place and year of defense, and page. I would be very grateful to you.
      1. kalibr
        April 5 2020 20: 27 New
        -1
        Thirteen minusers, here is no example. Well so liquid ... huh? "And she feeds on fables!" - Pushkin was right when he wrote this!
        1. Sergey79
          Sergey79 April 8 2020 12: 48 New
          0
          I apologize for not immediately responding.
        2. Sergey79
          Sergey79 April 8 2020 13: 11 New
          0
          B.V. Sokolov (D.F.N., K.I.N.) is engaged in falsification in books when calculating the losses of the USSR in the Second World War. There are a lot of such examples ... Unfortunately.
      2. Sergey79
        Sergey79 April 8 2020 12: 47 New
        0
        For example, Mytsyk ... It is possible without pages and bookmarks ... There are doctoral dissertations even copied from books. I won’t give my name, as I respect a person for achievements in another field.
        1. kalibr
          April 8 2020 15: 22 New
          0
          Actually, Sergey, this is not quite what I wanted. Sorry, but again this is nothing. The pages are just important, or do you think that you gave your full name like that and that’s it. And again the catchphrase: "A lot". All these words are empty. Such finds are of little use The same Solovyov, whom you named ... where is the guarantee that he is engaged ... They write the same to me, looking at the text of articles with photocopies of pages. I was hoping you would take it more seriously ...
          1. Sergey79
            Sergey79 April 8 2020 19: 48 New
            0
            Vyacheslav, you asked for examples, I brought. Even the pages do not need ... You understand that every opinion has a place to be, but should be considered from a critical point. These are not my words. AND
            You write, you read, listen. It is strange that you sided with Solovyov ... According to him, only the losses of the Red Army 50 million ....
            1. kalibr
              April 8 2020 20: 44 New
              0
              Sergei! So where did you get the idea that I sided with Solovyov? Well, why is 80% of people reading here not what is written, but what do they want to see? And you there ... I tell you that you need precise instructions, and not "to the village of grandfather." And you tell me: he writes 50 million each. Yes, at least about 100 ... Where, on which page. This is what matters. Or indicating an article on such a site. Such a monograph ... Again, p. Well, oh well. I myself know what it is. But I wanted to see what they would offer me in the end. They didn’t offer what I hoped for. Alas!
  • Basil50
    Basil50 April 5 2020 09: 31 New
    17
    alexander
    You are absolutely right. Historians are caste questions uncomfortable to them * as Serprom .... *.
    It is touching that they always refer to someone, but not to the document, but to the opinion of the next one * shone from history * or to the manuscript, while boldly admit that many chronicles were created * strongly after the event *. The most revealing chronicle scam is a description of how the future saint Vladimir chose the faith. And nothing rolls.
    And today we see how they REFRIGERATE what happened just yesterday, and what Europeans are talking about last century is generally nothing but senility. It is a pity that in RUSSIA there are fans of insanity
    1. Icelord
      Icelord April 8 2020 21: 28 New
      0
      No, there has been great tartaria since the time of the dinosaurs. Everyone knows this, but then the Germans rewrote everything and gave it to the Italians. So?
  • Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 11: 23 New
    12
    Yes, and here it seems the author could not resist, and lied:
    “The knights moved a“ pig, ”in the middle there was a heavily armed infantry in iron shells and with axes ...”
    Of course, I don’t have a textbook for seventh grade at hand, it’s unknown by the way which year of publication, but there’s no such nonsense when searching.
    The tip and sides of the wedge were heavily armed horse knights in iron armor, and its base and center were a dense mass of foot soldiers - bollards.
    This is, and a lot, quite correct for general education.
    The author imagines that education and a lively pen is equal to the mind:
    In a word, this is a long-standing problem, from the time when it was somehow decided that people without university diplomas were quite capable of creating a better society than that run by the graduates of Oxford and Yale. And something even they did. Only then, however, they still outplayed these “comrades”.
    They beat the "comrades" when there were too many in the country, such as the author of this article, Tokugawa lovers.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 03 New
      -11
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      Yes, and here it seems the author could not resist, and lied:
      “The knights moved a“ pig, ”in the middle there was a heavily armed infantry in iron shells and with axes ...”

      But if I find both a textbook and a page? "It seems", however, in store ...
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 13: 17 New
        +8
        Quote: kalibr
        But if I find both a textbook and a page? "It seems", however, in store ..
        Take a shot and put it out, and I will praise you, maybe ... then ... if you want ...
        Although it is clear that the textbook is fresh, they tried to track such mistakes during the USSR.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 13: 46 New
          -11
          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          and I will praise you maybe

          You are not the person whose praises and blasphemy have at least some significance for me, but since sooner or later the school will open and I will have to go there on business, why not. Why not do good to man if it costs you nothing.
    2. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 05 New
      -9
      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      Of course, I don’t have a textbook for seventh grade at hand, by the way, what year of publication is unknown

      But no - why write?
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 13: 20 New
        +9
        But there is no confirmation of the words, there is nothing to give recommendations to write or not. [Quote = Sanya Tersky


        This is from the textbook of history of the USSR 7th grade in 1971. I studied in this textbook, graduating from our high school in 1977, also studied in this textbook, and the program was unified. Or did you have your own textbooks in your school? [/ Quote] There is confirmation here, but not of your words.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 13: 47 New
          -10
          You write it to fans to write about the Russo-Aryans and Hyperborea. There is also no confirmation of the words from the word at all! But you swallow it without interference ...
          1. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 13: 54 New
            13
            Quote: kalibr
            But you swallow it without interference ...
            Why such a conclusion, an absolutely illogical and unproven conclusion? You wrote something about dyslexia there, but what is the defect called that you just demonstrated?
            1. kalibr
              April 5 2020 14: 00 New
              -10
              I did not see your comments of a negative plan for these materials, which were not supported by anything, that’s the conclusion.
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 15: 10 New
                11
                Not to see my comments on materials that I do not read, a powerful argument for the conclusion, very scientific.
                1. kalibr
                  April 5 2020 15: 55 New
                  -10
                  Only one thing I can say: Well done! What do not read. And I was wrong what I wrote to you, without accurate information. But have you really not looked at least with one eye? Somehow it's hard to believe. But if you say so, then it is.
                  1. Vladimir_2U
                    Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 15: 59 New
                    +5
                    Quote: kalibr
                    You are well done! What do not read.
                    Well, do not count the same couple of paragraphs to evaluate the text for reading.
                  2. kalibr
                    April 5 2020 16: 41 New
                    -8
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    You are well done! What do not read.
                    Well, do not count the same couple of paragraphs to evaluate the text for reading.

                    But you already made a click ...
                  3. Vladimir_2U
                    Vladimir_2U April 5 2020 16: 47 New
                    +6
                    And from the title of the article it is far from always clear what this is about. Here's an example of "What historians are not talking about," here's how to guess what’s talking about the fertilization of the divine feline and all this is, among other things, and pictures in the style of "Pah, shame" are posted. Until you open and understand.
                  4. kalibr
                    April 5 2020 17: 03 New
                    -10
                    Quote: Vladimir_2U
                    Until you open and understand.

                    That's it! Only there is not shame, but art. Do not fall into hypocrisy.
  • Icelord
    Icelord April 8 2020 21: 37 New
    0
    What a nightmare I have been doing historical fencing for 20 years, although I had to love walking more and ride a horse. Oksti which wedge each other at a gallop ram?
  • Icelord
    Icelord April 8 2020 21: 31 New
    0
    no one comes with a wedge, much less infantry separately, cavalry separately, doesn’t happen like that, this is nonsense
  • zenion
    zenion April 5 2020 13: 50 New
    +5
    What historians do not agree can be read in the book of the Torah, for the Jews, it is also called the "Old Testament". Now, falsified falsification of falsifiers speaks of falsification of falsifications.
    1. Krasnodar
      Krasnodar April 5 2020 21: 49 New
      +1
      Quote: zenion
      What historians do not agree can be read in the book of the Torah, for the Jews, it is also called the "Old Testament". Now, falsified falsification of falsifiers speaks of falsification of falsifications.

      The Torah is the Pentateuch of Moses, part of the Old Testament, called the Tanakh in Hebrew, and profane profanation of profane speaks of profanity of profanation)).
  • zenion
    zenion April 5 2020 17: 25 New
    +3
    The author did not admit how the historical Egyptian paintings and so on got to France and Naglia. I would write while passing by that at one time the naglitsy robbed the Egyptians, and at another time their culture was robbed by the frogs. So, no, since you were not in these countries, and did not look at the stolen, robbed, stolen, then history is not subject to you.
    1. Icelord
      Icelord April 8 2020 21: 49 New
      0
      what they stole, then they bought guns to Egyptian felahs
    2. Icelord
      Icelord April 8 2020 21: 50 New
      0
      And there are sphinxes in St. Petersburg
  • Tank jacket
    Tank jacket April 5 2020 20: 37 New
    +1
    "Not the Pharaohs - you know it well - created Egypt, but the gods and priests. It is not the Pharaohs who determine the day and the height of the water rise in the Nile and regulate its spills. It was not the Pharaohs who taught the people to sow, collect fruits, raise cattle. The Pharaohs do not heal diseases and observe so that the state is not endangered by external enemies.What would it be, say yourself, if our caste gave Egypt to the arbitrariness of the pharaohs? The wisest of them has the experience of any two to three decades. for tens of thousands of years. there is only one pair of eyes and hands. We have thousands of eyes and hands in all nomes and even in other states ... Can the work of the pharaoh be compared to ours? And in case of disagreement, who should concede: us or him? "( with)
    1. kalibr
      April 6 2020 11: 08 New
      -2
      "Pharaoh". Roman Boleslav Prus.
      1. Tank jacket
        Tank jacket April 6 2020 11: 10 New
        +1
        He is. They talk about the pharaohs, forgetting about the priests.
      2. Tank jacket
        Tank jacket April 6 2020 11: 22 New
        +2
        Have you heard anything about pre-Christian writing? About features and cuts when you write?
        1. Operator
          Operator April 6 2020 11: 26 New
          +1
          Pre-Christian Slavic pictograms (traits / cuts) are known, writing is not.
          1. Tank jacket
            Tank jacket April 6 2020 11: 47 New
            +1
            Well, so I turn to historians. Write about the pictograms traits / cuts, decode, show with pleasure I read. And about the historical priority of generalized crowd controls. How is the history of the cold war?
          2. Operator
            Operator April 6 2020 11: 52 New
            0
            Traits / cuts indicating their symbolic meanings (good, health, fertility, etc.) are known from German chronicles describing pagan idols on the temples of Western Slavs.

            I'm too lazy to look for the source laughing
  • user
    user April 6 2020 17: 26 New
    0
    Well, yes, it’s funny to read about falsification of history from the falsifier of history itself.


    By the way, if you read the book of Alexander Alexandrovich Bushkov - Russia, which was not there, then discarding all the fantasies of the author about - if only. . . that. . . . and further it can be discussed endlessly, but curiously.
    But after reading how, according to the author, the chronicle is written, well, if someone does not like it - HISTORY, then I completely agree with the author.

    Remember how in the XVII century the English interpretation of history was adopted. It's just that everyone agreed that it will be like that, in the sense of the English interpretation - everything else is false. Curiously, Isaac Newton took the most active part in this story.
    1. Icelord
      Icelord April 20 2020 12: 39 New
      -1
      Who accepted the English interpretation? And by the way, what kind of interpretation is this?
  • alexey alexeyev_2
    alexey alexeyev_2 April 9 2020 21: 39 New
    0
    Here you are right ... The section "History" at VO has long turned into a theater of one actor
  • Olgovich
    Olgovich April 5 2020 07: 57 New
    +6
    Quote: Sea Cat
    Hello everyone and best wishes! Thanks to Olegovich for a new article

    Hello, Konstantin!

    The article is written in the spirit of contradicting the canons and, I think, will cause a lot of comments.

    It is not clear, by the way, this:
    But the fact that their water is "flood" is reported in the text of the annals, which older the earliest reports of her for as many as 100 years.

    Couldn’t be older than events? recourse
    Recall that the history of the Ancient World is taught to us in the 5th grade. And she… kutsaya. And that's why not very interesting.

    I don’t agree: half a century has already passed, and I remember well this black cover textbook with a color photo of ruined marble columns against a piercing blue sky: it was an amazing, fairy-tale world full of amazing myths, legends, deeds, and achievements of mankind!

    Of course, the textbook only gave a “push” and swallowed, with an interest, a lot of other literature about this time - and fiction (Efremov, etc.), and even, in haste, and the monograph on the Punic Wars went with attacks by elephants and archers (sincerely grieved about the final defeat of Carthage Hannibal), etc., etc.
    And the bizarre sexual delights of those times somewhere, vaguely, hinted, but were not interesting either then or today. request .

    But how they arranged in the arena in the Coliseum .... naval battles of the fleets, yes, that's something!
    I have a huge format magazine "Russian Pilgrim" 1912 with the corresponding engraving of the galley boarding scene there is a spectacular sight!
    And so forth ...
    And you always need to remember that there were and will always be more than three graduate students who graduated from higher educational institutions than excellent students and good students. And where are they all, these three-year-olds from the "pedyushnikov", gone? From my 1977 issue, for example, did everyone go where? To school! And all the excellent students went to work where? To university!

    I do not know.... recourse
    Such teachers, highly qualified specialists of the professions taught by them, as in our school, I rarely met later in the university: Mark Abramovich, Isaak Moiseevich, Sofya Markovna, Vera Ivanovna, Irina Illarionovna (Jews and Russians) ....
    1. Snail N9
      Snail N9 April 5 2020 09: 04 New
      13
      Falsification ... Worked somehow in the Russian branch of a western company. So: I had an English chief. I’ll say right away that it’s a “difficult person” and that the most unpleasant thing, no matter how hard I try at work, whatever I do, as a result, I was always bad, but he was always “on horseback” and “in chocolate.” to say that for the "Western comrades" democracy in relations is not an empty phrase and, in principle, I communicated with him normally. So, somehow, after another “dragging out” and “not receiving a prize,” I directly asked a question - if I’m so worthless, then why are we always “ahead of the rest” by the results of your work, you get profit-an addition to the salary, bonuses, and other profit, but I get only "shish"? He answered bluntly: "Do you understand, I’m the boss, you are the subordinate, and therefore: all the" victories "are mine, and all the" defeats "are yours." And neighing. What am I doing? And to the fact that this is how history is written, the one who “writes” it, firstly fulfills someone’s order, and secondly, it depends on who ordered him to write it, or is included in a certain group of “chroniclers” with his obligatory vision and assessment of certain events. Well, and most importantly: the so-called story is based on various “reports”, “documents”, etc. where those who wrote all this always tried (and now try) to put themselves, their achievements in a favorable light, and to “lower” their opponents, competitors, etc. What kind of "objectivity" can there be? Yes, no. Even simply “facts” are sometimes impossible to find — hidden and forgotten, not to mention, about the reasons for this or that. Personally, I was very interested in the topic "Buried and Dug up Russia" - a strange, many-meter "cultural layer" in our cities (and not only in ours), buildings that do not fit into the generally accepted theory of classification, the works of “ruinist” artists, etc. .
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich April 5 2020 11: 12 New
        -2
        Quote: Snail N9
        Falsification ..


        Maybe ... Or maybe not! recourse

        The criterion of truth in History, I think, is not ...
        Quote: Snail N9
        He answered bluntly: "Do you understand, I’m the boss, you are the subordinate, and therefore: all the" victories "are mine, and all the" defeats "are yours."

        A strange boss ... I also had to work in Western companies and it wasn’t like that anywhere: after all, the success of the bosses directly depends on the success of their subordinates, they understood this and, in principle, clearly carried out the counter. obligations and even raised salaries and paid overtime, which was not in the Contract
        1. Snail N9
          Snail N9 April 5 2020 12: 04 New
          +3
          Strange boss ..

          The key word is "ENGLISH". wink
          1. Olgovich
            Olgovich April 5 2020 19: 57 New
            -3
            Quote: Snail N9
            Keyword-"ENGLISHMAN

            Probably yes, these are strange guys.

            I had Germans, Austrians, Scots, Italians.
            I was ready to work with the Scots at least all my life - competent, honest, calm .... sorry the contract was over ....
        2. RAE8
          RAE8 April 6 2020 04: 54 New
          0
          Quote: Olgovich
          The criterion of truth in History, I think, no ..

          The criterion of truth is the same everywhere - SYSTEM. System knowledge of the subject, when absolutely all new data, facts do not contradict this system.
      2. zenion
        zenion April 5 2020 17: 33 New
        +2
        A true story was and will remain in the time of the ancient Greeks. Where they wrote what they saw in travels and about the mountain, then now they dug up something that they did not believe in. Therefore, the basis is the history of the Greeks, and the laws of ancient Rome are the basis of laws. Already in those days there were experts on brain confusion. The worst thing was to be in the prosecutor's office. If the prosecutor was caught lying, then they made him an ax head, it was forever. From this, a conclusion was then drawn. And now you can grind that they will order and they will not punish him and they will not draw conclusions.
      3. Mwg
        Mwg April 5 2020 19: 15 New
        0
        Do you want to distribute links on this topic?
      4. Alexey RA
        Alexey RA April 8 2020 11: 25 New
        0
        Quote: Snail N9
        And to the fact that this is how history is written, the one who “writes” it, firstly fulfills someone’s order, and secondly, it depends on who ordered him to write it, or is included in a certain group of “chroniclers” with his obligatory vision and assessment of certain events.

        Pomnitsa, Lukin had a well-described chronicler in "Katali we are your sun":
        Then the chronicler became thoughtful. The trouble with this laudable word. Vsevolok, suppose, approves, but the Pillars ... Do not understand the Pillars. Either glorifies his priest Berendey, and then he honors all the crusts ... The chronicler sighed, looked through one window, into another. The Svolochansky coast was closer, but from the Teplynsky side a long sandbank was washed away - almost to the very island on which the dilapidated hut was huddled ... So guess what you will please: to Vsevolok or to Pillar sanctuary! And she managed to put the chronicler to the chronicler to place the chronicler in the very middle of the land of Berendey, so that, therefore, it was easier to receive news from all sides! ..

        The chronicler sighed and, laying down his pen, looked out at the left window. Svolochansky shore was empty. Nowhere is a single courage, not a single Varangian. The Varangians took off without waiting for the dawn, and with all their strength left for Stekolnoy, their capital, Varangian. A white park curled over the hills. The incandescent white - almost a bite - the sun quickly burned the frost and picked up moisture, destroying the consequences of an unheard of long night.
        The chronicler turned to the right window. A construction site was still boiling on the Teplynsky coast. A great and awful colossus was already rising from the pit for several rehappings; it looked like it scooped with a long stem [The stem (Berendeysk.) Is black, the handle is sticking up.]. And at a distance they rallied from hewn logs and covered with iron hoops something about an area of ​​uniform perishing - the size of a two-shafted house.
        The day before yesterday, immediately after the departure of the Varangians and Vsevolok, three brave men approached the island in the shallows and with them the prince Teplynsky Pillar. Affectionately having a conversation with the chronicler, he inquired whether he does not suffer what he needs, promised to soon bring the hermit supplies, clothes, and ink nuts. Well, he explained at the same time how to understand such a hastily erected colossus ...
        “And having thanked the good-looking, dispelling adversaries, like the morning fog,” the goose feather creaked again on parchment, “he gave the vow the pillars to lay near the place where Yarilina Doroga has a richly decorated temple, quite pleasing to the light and crackled sun in our midst. ordered the Pillars to be cut down ... "The chronicler stopped again and looked doubtfully at the plaster of a wooden monster gathered near the colossus." ... an enormous rounded idol, in everything like that I can see the sun ... "
      5. Icelord
        Icelord April 20 2020 12: 41 New
        -1
        buried Russia is strong, mushrooms rule
    2. Astra wild
      Astra wild April 5 2020 14: 15 New
      0
      Olgovich, I have with you various ideological convictions, but I put you +.
      If all three-year-olds went to school, and excellent students at a university, then where do the excellent students for universities come from? Maybe the person is talented, but he understands that scientific work is not for him and went to school?
    3. ser56
      ser56 April 5 2020 15: 49 New
      -1
      Quote: Olgovich
      But how they arranged in the arena in the Coliseum .... naval battles of the fleets, yes, that's something!

      was in the Coliseum - is it difficult to imagine a large pool there - or were these fleets driven by land? hi
  • Pessimist22
    Pessimist22 April 5 2020 05: 39 New
    10
    In pre-Christian times, natural needs were treated as necessary, but after the spread of Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam), human natural needs began to appear as some kind of sin and people began to degrade in this regard, even in Soviet schools they tried to somehow circumvent these topics .
    1. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx April 5 2020 06: 46 New
      16
      Quote: Pessimist22
      even in Soviet schools they tried to somehow circumvent these topics.

      There is an opinion that the hero cannot “crap one's pants” at the decisive moment, and the astronaut (ka) has no right to “spit” in the returned capsule.
      There is no need to get stuck on the departure of natural necessities, but it is necessary to provide for appropriate institutions (especially in places of mass crowds: recreation parks, stadiums, etc.) taking into account local climatic conditions. Then it will not be a sin.
      And yet, if you obligate all owners walking dogs to collect feces set aside by their pets, then the cleanliness and appearance of city streets and courtyards will also not be a demonstration of the fall and perversion of morals.
      yes
      1. Siberian54
        Siberian54 April 5 2020 17: 46 New
        0
        At the expense of dogs and their owners: I agree 100% ..
    2. Krasnoyarsk
      Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 11: 12 New
      +7
      Quote: Pessimist22

      In pre-Christian times, natural needs were treated as necessary,

      and therefore colorfully described the act of human deformation, though in different poses and places?
      Something I did not observe this. But this is also - "natural needs"
      Do you really understand what you want to see - natural needs or public adultery and nudity?
      Quote: Pessimist22
      but after the spread of Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam), human natural needs began to appear as some kind of sin and people began to degrade in this regard, even in Soviet schools they tried to somehow circumvent these topics.

      Your untruth. It was not the fact of satisfying “natural needs” that was presented as a sin, but sexual intercourse with anyone, wherever and when it was, i.e. - fornication. And if you are with your spouse, so that no one is present, then you can in any pose that is convenient for you and at a time convenient for you. And no one will say, not even the priests, that this is a sin.
      Let's remember the 90s. We all remember the rampant pornography, sex on screens, etc.
      What was it? High culture? Where "natural human needs" were not hidden. Or is it a drop in morals? Who presented us with these "natural needs"? Are not "cultural and art workers"? Where is the guarantee that not the same "figures of culture and art" created their "works" in those prehistoric times? Whom today are praised by "historians" and their admirers, posing as the "high culture" of the ancient world.
      1. Siberian54
        Siberian54 April 5 2020 17: 49 New
        0
        The rampant "nineties", the usual political technology, as now fagots of all stripes are steaming into the minds of young ..
    3. zenion
      zenion April 5 2020 17: 35 New
      +4
      Of course, in grade 4, you were interested in knowing that in ancient times condoms were made from sheep's intestines, and the contraceptive was crocodile shit in the vagina.
  • Far B
    Far B April 5 2020 05: 40 New
    29
    Many people still have their lips moving, that is, they pronounce the readable text to themselves. Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophone reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%.
    That's a strange thing. I have everything a little vice versa. I don’t move my lips, of course, I read pretty quickly, but I don’t know the speed reading. At the same time, when I turn on the “sprinter” over serious texts, I often catch myself on the fact that by the end of the paragraph I no longer remember what was at its beginning. But when after each paragraph or semantic segment you stop for a specific analysis or comparison - another thing. The meaning of the read is assimilated completely. Better yet, take margin notes.
    And at full speed I read only fiction, which, as a rule, after reading and forgetting is not a pity. Something like this. Maybe for everyone this is still individual?
    1. Phil77
      Phil77 April 5 2020 06: 03 New
      17
      Good morning everybody!
      Quote: Far In
      Maybe for everyone this is still individual?

      I have exactly the same story. So you are not alone. I’ll add from myself that when I read the text in * paper * form, it is absorbed much better than in * electronic *. That's why I have it for some reason. hi
      1. Catfish
        Catfish April 5 2020 06: 17 New
        13
        Hello, Sergey! For example, I don’t perceive audio books at all, after a couple of minutes I find myself thinking about something else. And the "paper" literature or on the tablet, it doesn’t matter anymore, I see letters and the text is absorbed instantly. hi
        1. Phil77
          Phil77 April 5 2020 06: 22 New
          +7
          Hello again Konstantin! wink No, no, I mean the text in * electronic * form. Audiobooks? Well, this is not for me, I tried it once, I didn’t like it.
          1. Lipchanin
            Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 04 New
            +3
            Quote: Phil77
            Well, this is not for me, I tried it once, I didn’t like it.

            Reminds me of the notation your boss reads to you
        2. Private-K
          Private-K April 6 2020 08: 49 New
          +2
          Quote: Sea Cat
          For example, I don’t perceive audio books at all, after a couple of minutes I find myself thinking about something else. And the "paper" literature or on the tablet, it doesn’t matter anymore, I see letters and the text is absorbed instantly.

          I notice this. I think that there is a difference in speed. An audiobook is "slower" than just reading a text. And the brain is already used to the fast visual channel.
          1. Catfish
            Catfish April 6 2020 08: 57 New
            +2
            Good morning Oleg. hi Most likely you are right, I just never thought about it.
      2. Astra wild
        Astra wild April 5 2020 13: 59 New
        +3
        Sergey, I know one grandmother, she loves to read books, but the "paper" option. She says: "when I take a book, I communicate with her, and the computer is a machine"
    2. About 2
      About 2 April 5 2020 06: 28 New
      12
      Your truth, if you want to learn, read it slowly. There is a whole scientific work written by an American university professor on this subject, now I don’t remember the name, but the point is that important and not simple books must be read out and answered certain questions.
    3. igordok
      igordok April 5 2020 06: 47 New
      +8
      I agree with you. I read pretty quickly, not speed reading, but quickly. I remember only something important. My friend, reads slowly, "moving his lips", remembers much more, and for a longer time.

      P.S. Why was it, to drag a "reserved seat car" to the topic of speed reading.
    4. Lipchanin
      Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 03 New
      +3
      Quote: Far In
      but I do not own speed reading

      At school I studied in an experimental class, it was 1963 to 1965 vols.
      That is, in the Russian language and literature we went forward 1 year.
      They taught us speed reading. What do we read aloud. An activist from our pedagogical institute experimented on us.
      Once a week he appeared in class and we had to read at speed. Then they counted how many words per minute were “read”. Everything was taken into account. You understand that it was almost impossible to remember what was read.
      As I now remember my "record" of 176 words per minute.
      PS It just so happened that grade 4, 2 months, I graduated from another school and the second time I went through a program in Russian. "dictation wrote with brilliance laughing My memory was still good then.
    5. Krasnoyarsk
      Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 11: 23 New
      12
      Quote: Far In
      That's a strange thing. I have everything a little vice versa.

      This is not a “strange thing”, it’s normal and natural.
      Guys, how serious can one take Shpakovsky’s writing?
      [quote Many still have their lips moving, that is, they pronounce the readable text to themselves. Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophone reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%. [/ quote]
      Is it possible to perceive this as something serious? Here, everything is exactly the opposite.
      1. Icelord
        Icelord April 8 2020 22: 31 New
        0
        Well, it happens, I sympathize, but not surprised
  • Boozer
    Boozer April 5 2020 06: 03 New
    +8
    When you move your lips while reading, then that's nothing. Among my acquaintances there are many who read aloud and at the same time move their finger over what they read. I’m silent about the count on my fingers ...
    1. Far B
      Far B April 5 2020 06: 11 New
      +6
      Among my acquaintances there are many who read aloud and at the same time move their finger over what they read. I’m silent about the count on my fingers ...
      Wangyu ... You are an elementary school teacher! laughing
      1. Catfish
        Catfish April 5 2020 06: 18 New
        0
        You are an elementary school teacher!

        Yes, unlikely, unfortunately. request
        1. Far B
          Far B April 5 2020 06: 35 New
          +5
          If so, then fucking grandpa Wang of me crying But at least I tried
    2. Ross xnumx
      Ross xnumx April 5 2020 06: 38 New
      12
      Quote: Boozer
      I’m silent about the count on my fingers ...

      Among some managers, my skills of quickly adding numbers and multiplying simple ones (multiplication table) are also surprising ... laughing
      1. Snail N9
        Snail N9 April 5 2020 07: 14 New
        +8
        Actually, to be honest, it’s not "among some", but among MANY of our type managers, the skills to use the multiplication table, "divide by column", "add-subtract by column" ALREADY surprise, they are only a calculator or "program- calculator "can use, for this.
        1. Icelord
          Icelord April 8 2020 22: 39 New
          0
          Excuse me, by your definition, a manager, and do you really think that I will look for a pen, paper and divide by a column? No, I'll take a smartphone that is always in my hand and in three seconds I will get the result
      2. Lipchanin
        Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 08 New
        +3
        Quote: ROSS 42
        Among some managers, my skills of quickly adding numbers and multiplying simple ones (multiplication table) are also surprising ..

        Quote: ROSS 42
        Among some managers, my skills of quickly adding numbers and multiplying simple ones (multiplication table) are also surprising ..

        You know, but here I’ve caught myself. As soon as you stop using the calculator, the numbers themselves add up in your head.
        It’s worth turning it on a couple of times, FSE instantly all the skills of counting in the mind disappear laughing
    3. Lipchanin
      Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 05 New
      +3
      Quote: Boozer
      Among my acquaintances there are many who read aloud and at the same time move their finger over what they read.

      In my time in elementary grades, and this is the beginning of the 60s, they taught me to read exactly that
    4. Fat
      Fat April 5 2020 10: 53 New
      +2
      Quote: Boozer
      I’m silent about the count on my fingers ...

      Correctly do that be silent. Counting on the fingers is a very interesting thing though. yes
      And the score on the abacus, the Russian decimal counts, on the suanpan (soroban) is generally a song laughing
  • bober1982
    bober1982 April 5 2020 06: 18 New
    +2
    Pinocchio, did not bother with the theory of reading, he quickly mastered the technique of quick reading - at the end of the book, at the beginning, and in the middle.
    The article is not bad, in my opinion, but the number of obscene pictures is over the top.
  • oracul
    oracul April 5 2020 06: 28 New
    12
    Whoever has pain hurts about that. An “interesting” view of history through genital organs. The consequences of self-isolation with the use of copious drinking of an antidepressant known in everyday life.
  • Phil77
    Phil77 April 5 2020 06: 29 New
    12
    And now directly on the article. Vyacheslav Olegovich, with all due respect, but ... In the fifth grade, should children also express such myths? Somehow it will probably be wrong. Yes, and about the excesses of the Roman emperors it’s also not worth it. I’ll say separately that Your article will flare up serious! A little later ... But, I read it with great interest! hi
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 06: 53 New
      -2
      Quote: Phil77
      In the fifth grade, should children express similar myths? Somehow, it will probably be wrong

      Thats exactly what I mean...
    2. Lipchanin
      Lipchanin April 5 2020 08: 09 New
      +4
      Quote: Phil77
      ..In the fifth grade, children and similar myths to expose?

      And for what? Is that really a story?
  • Fat
    Fat April 5 2020 06: 29 New
    +7
    I sometimes wondered why there were so few male teachers at school almost always. Probably they do not stay at school for a long time. Among my friends there are two bright personalities, university graduates, namely the history faculty. Both made a career in the advertising business, except in practice, at school. At one time in the late USSR they said: There is no mind - go to the "ped". This is understandable, the competition is not very big. It's a shame ... And the quality of graduates is really often less than average. And there are many teachers of men with higher education anywhere, but not at school.
    PS The song on the motive of the funeral march is even more offensive:
    Institute of Culture.
    The best institute.
    Go to the Institute of Culture for .. .. (C)
    There is nothing to be surprised. ((((
    1. Phil77
      Phil77 April 5 2020 06: 39 New
      +6
      Quote: Thick
      I sometimes wondered why there were so few male teachers at school almost always.

      Good morning! It’s still not a sin to recall the material factor, because the teacher’s salary was not quite worthy of their work.
    2. Olgovich
      Olgovich April 5 2020 08: 15 New
      -2
      Quote: Thick
      At one time in the late USSR they said: There is no mind - go to the "ped". This is understandable, the competition is not very big. It's a shame ... And the quality of graduates is really often less than average. And there are many teachers of men with higher education anywhere, but not at school.

      It was not so at my school: the 1960s, male teachers, more than half of the composition. were after teaching at the university, some then went to teach at universities, taught with soul, far beyond the school curriculum.

      Beautiful people!
      Some veterans of the Second World War.

      Half of the teachers are Jews, as, by the way, are the students ....

      Almost all graduates entered universities .... Almost everything is abroad ....
  • Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx April 5 2020 06: 35 New
    12
    What do historians say?

    Do not say anything? Do we have any institute or academy of World History in our country where only reliable data are collected? We study the history of the Russian State by what sources? According to the letters and information remade by the Germans?
    What are the “excellent students"? What are the "triplets"? Here, before everyone's eyes and ears, the historical fact of the coup d'etat of the late nineties of the last century, but some Sambist three-roamers and Rio-historians intensely “entered” completely different concepts into the stage of modern Russian history, trying to perpetuate non-existent merits and whitewash the dark affairs. And this story in the form of the “Yeltsin Center” may remain the source of truth, the source of knowledge.
    Teachers may be different, but two or two will remain four. And, a tested and edited textbook (not by political scientists and politicians but by all sorts of different ones) can be a very good source and the right tool for studying material. This is only in a joke that cough is treated with purgen, and in practice, recommended and proven medicines are used.
    Many people still have their lips moving, that is, they pronounce the readable text to themselves. Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophone reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%.

    I never moved my lips. He began to read at the age of five. He remembered and memorized Borodino from his mother’s words (not being able to read), he knew by heart the History of Vlas, the idler and the lobster ... He knew all the songs that were on the phonograph records ... There was no television, and my parents bought TV only in 1964 ... He memorized poetry at school by reading aloud ...
    You can read up to old age and never learn common truths that are understandable to ordinary people. It’s enough to simply isolate oneself from life and “annoying” human and everyday factors with armored glass and thick Kremlin walls.
    What is happening in Russian education is beneficial for those who are trying to teach us how to live according to the fairy tale "At the command of the pike."
    Thank God that there are people in the country for whom questions of history and education as a whole remain in demand.
    hi
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 06: 55 New
      -4
      Quote: ROSS 42
      According to the letters and information remade by the Germans?

      Again about the redone information? Well, where is this nonsense? You have written well about your ability to absorb material. But then where did you get information about the altered letters. By whom, when, and most importantly WHY. There have already been several articles on chronicles at VO - go through the profile to see ...
      1. Barmaleyka
        Barmaleyka April 5 2020 07: 35 New
        -8
        Quote: kalibr
        and most importantly why

        Well, for some reason, they came up with nonsense about how Russia defended Europe from the horde, about the storm of the winter, about the "peasant" Pugachev uprising, and I ask no one who can explain for some reason the nomad Genghis Khan ran across the whole continent to the west and most importantly HOW him managed in a few years to change the psychology of nomads and unite them
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 07: 42 New
          -2
          Quote: Barmaleyka
          I’m not asking anyone or anyone who can’t explain what kind of nomad the nomad Genghis Khan crossed across the continent to the west and most importantly HOW he managed to change the psychology of the nomads in a few years and unite them

          And why did the Cimmerians, Scythians, Sarmatians, Huns, Avars flow there ... Wave after wave from Asia to Europe hordes of nomads moved. And something united them, right?
          1. Barmaleyka
            Barmaleyka April 5 2020 08: 00 New
            +3
            that's exactly what I’m talking about when you describe a topic, study it, and don’t write nonsense about fast reading, the great migration of peoples was due to CLIMATE changes, it had a SPECIFIC reason
            with Genghis Khan historians frankly "bleat" supposedly it dawned on and popped, SO IT DOESN'T HAPPEN
            1. Rurikovich
              Rurikovich April 5 2020 09: 06 New
              +6
              Quote: Barmaleyka
              SO IT DOESN’T HAPPEN

              Historians have yes laughing Historical science completely rejects the logic, common sense and arguments of techies that technically it is impossible to make many masterpieces of prehistoric times with copper chisels and diarite balls lol request hi
            2. Icelord
              Icelord April 20 2020 13: 08 New
              -1
              but he didn’t change anything, before the Mongols there were Jurjenis, and before them were Khitan, and all relatives from Mongolia
          2. Krasnoyarsk
            Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 11: 52 New
            +6
            Quote: kalibr

            And why did the Cimmerians, Scythians, Sarmatians, Huns, Avars flow there ... Wave after wave from Asia to Europe hordes of nomads moved. And something united them, right?

            It’s strange somehow. It turns out that Asia was a huge incubator, in which entire nations were born, and then perls and perls in deserted (?) Europe.
            It would seem that in Europe, with its mild climate, more people should be born and, moving away from crowding, all hunting grounds and fishing are already occupied, move east, to Asia. But no, the "historians" all the way around. In Asia, with its harsh climate, people breed faster and, from the "crowdedness" breaks into Europe.
            1. Barmaleyka
              Barmaleyka April 5 2020 12: 20 New
              0
              Quote: Krasnoyarsk
              and, from "crowding"

              despite the fact that the population density there is scanty
            2. Icelord
              Icelord April 20 2020 13: 11 New
              -1
              Namely, a poor climate and a nomadic lifestyle, a lot of territory is needed. A few successful years and multiplied, and then bang and a bad year, here they go for zipuns
        2. Barmaleyka
          Barmaleyka April 5 2020 08: 59 New
          +1
          but apart from the minuses have something to answer?
        3. Icelord
          Icelord April 8 2020 22: 53 New
          0
          And about the Khitan who before the Mongols captured China did not hear? There was no need to redo anything there, just the tip changed and that's it
          1. Barmaleyka
            Barmaleyka April 9 2020 07: 33 New
            0
            Quote: Icelord
            There was no need to redo anything there, just the tip changed and that's it

            you would pre-write to learn something about the Khitan he is to the horde by no means, the victims themselves
            1. Icelord
              Icelord April 10 2020 18: 03 New
              0
              you are right, and before that the chjurjeni suffered from the Khitan, but the chjurjeni and the Khitan and the Mongols came from the same place
              1. Barmaleyka
                Barmaleyka April 10 2020 18: 49 New
                0
                you tell the Kazakhs, they will scratch their eyes, they believe that it was they who founded the horde and are back to square one - history - a corrupt girl ...
                1. Icelord
                  Icelord April 10 2020 18: 55 New
                  0
                  We have a lot of Kazakhs, but they are Turks, although messy and they can say what they want, but the core of the horde is from the steppes of Mongolia, and this is proved
                  1. Icelord
                    Icelord April 10 2020 18: 57 New
                    0
                    But it is difficult to argue that their ancestors participated in the campaigns of Genghisides. There are many who participated
                  2. Barmaleyka
                    Barmaleyka April 10 2020 19: 29 New
                    0
                    Quote: Icelord
                    and it is proven

                    say it again to the Kazakhs
                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztaz8425GjQ&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR0VyB-WxaSsWwTZnSlhv5hNpg0ssd0MR-qkHSvRWGnxouTJOTIlBvYSVX8
                    1. Icelord
                      Icelord April 10 2020 19: 34 New
                      +1
                      What kind of business do you tell me about Kazakh false scientists, the Kazakhs themselves are laughing at them. In Russia, there are flakes and fomenko, and a lot more, I have no doubt that in Kazakhstan there are such
                      1. Icelord
                        Icelord April 10 2020 19: 59 New
                        +1
                        Here Krasnoyarsk argued very funny, about why the Mongols should go somewhere, because the population density is lower. To school. They will tell you that nomads need a huge territory, and therefore, farming is more profitable.
    2. I
      I April 5 2020 07: 47 New
      +5
      ,, And, a tested and edited textbook (not by political scientists and politicians, ,,

      In general, the school is a state institution, so the state has always chosen what to teach.


      For example, before the 17th year, children were taught what God created man. The Communists, however, picked up Darwin's theory and began to teach it in schools. Also, for example, in the lower grades they taught us something like atheism.

      But, for example, now for many years there has been an emphasis on mathematics and law, and as a result we get a huge number of economists and lawyers who are useless to anyone. There are so many of them that even Putin spoke out about this. And this is also not just. This is also necessary for someone. And judging by what matters are in the economy, you understand that it is not economists who make the economy. Or they are taught something wrong. And judging by the fact that the main human rights activists in our country receive foreign grants, you understand where the legs grow from.
    3. BAI
      BAI April 5 2020 09: 49 New
      +8
      According to the letters and information remade by the Germans?

      The birch-bark letters open in Soviet times were also rewritten by the Germans?
      1. Krasnoyarsk
        Krasnoyarsk April 5 2020 12: 04 New
        -2
        Quote: BAI
        According to the letters and information remade by the Germans?

        The birch-bark letters open in Soviet times were also rewritten by the Germans?

        And what historical facts from the history of the country are reflected in birch bark letters? If it is possible to draw something from them, then only indirect data.
        Therefore, forged and remade completely different.
      2. Caretaker
        Caretaker April 5 2020 12: 44 New
        -1
        Quote: BAI
        The birch-bark letters open in Soviet times were also rewritten by the Germans?

        The "Germans" did not know about them, but perhaps they knew but did not attach importance. In those days, scientists mentioned birch bark letters were considered "alternative specialists."
        How many birch bark letters were found and recognized as valuable archaeological material before 1917?
        The sculptures of Slavic deities are mentioned in the annals, but how many Slavic wooden idols were found on the territory of the Russian Empire, the USSR, and the Russian Federation? Where are they?
        1. Siberian54
          Siberian54 April 5 2020 18: 00 New
          +1
          And you don’t understand by what methods “people voluntarily refused their religion and joyfully climbed into the font, and how many didn’t let them emerge”? And you think that the wooden idol has long outlived its magi? Moreover, myths about silver treasures on the graveyards were launched ...
          1. Caretaker
            Caretaker April 5 2020 20: 28 New
            0
            Quote: Siberian54
            ... And you think that the wooden idol has long outlived its magi? ...

            Probably, the same fate befell many written sources, especially pre-Christian, runes could well be used. Some hundred years ago, birch bark letters were not yet considered as archaeological finds.
          2. Fat
            Fat April 5 2020 21: 29 New
            0
            Quote: Siberian54
            Moreover, myths about silver treasures on graveyards were launched ...
            ....
            And what did you actually want to say using the word "churchyard"?
            It seems that Princess Olga introduced this naming in everyday life in the XNUMXth century on Novgorod lands. Pogost - the place where the prince stopped when collecting taxes. Not?
            1. Siberian54
              Siberian54 April 15 2020 00: 56 New
              0
              the graveyard is the place of worship of the Slavic gods and the place of stay of the Magi. And Olga cynically used this name to improve tax collection - people went to the graveyard easier remembering the old gods
    4. Icelord
      Icelord April 8 2020 22: 47 New
      0
      oh well, you need a coup. No, just finally the nightmare is over
  • nikvic46
    nikvic46 April 5 2020 06: 43 New
    +7
    It doesn’t matter what skills the reader possesses. The main thing that he learns from this. Reading is also a job. You can quickly read just by turning the pages. I don’t like this. The same claims can be made by astronomers and natural scientists .. .And we will load the students beyond measure so that they do not need at all. In addition to the cult of the phallus, the Egyptians had the main god. God of the Sun. Of course, it is possible to show erotic sculptures of India in textbooks, but not for junior students.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 07: 01 New
      -7
      Quote: nikvic46
      The main thing is that he learns from this. Reading is also a work. You can read quickly by simply turning pages.

      Judging by the "letters reworked by the Germans," not everyone succeeds in this work. They read that "lighter" and "dumber."
    2. Private-K
      Private-K April 6 2020 09: 07 New
      +1
      Quote: nikvic46
      In addition to the cult of the phallus, the Egyptians had a main god. Sun God.

      Here you are!
      The other Egyptians did not have Faallic cults! bully It is simply referred to as an important organ. good
      And the cult of the "sun god" was generally a short-term HERESY am picked up by one of the pharaohs and causing great civil unrest. hi
  • Nikolay87
    Nikolay87 April 5 2020 07: 27 New
    +8
    And how did I live for 30 years without this knowledge ?!
    1. Private-K
      Private-K April 6 2020 09: 11 New
      -2
      Quote: Nikolay87
      And how did I live for 30 years without this knowledge ?!

      "And why does your child have your eargaphia! A cabman will take you!" (c) Fonvizin.
      If a person is not interested in knowledge that does not bring him practical "here and now" utility; if he is contemptuous and mocking of those, then this person - bydlyugan.
      And speaking culturally and scientifically - half-dibil with a simplified brain structure.
  • Barmaleyka
    Barmaleyka April 5 2020 07: 32 New
    +4
    That is, it is clear that people with a poor vocabulary and primitive reading technology may be interested only in something completely sensational
    already bullshit, that is, all "real" historians own speed reading, and all "pseudo" do not own
  • Gardamir
    Gardamir April 5 2020 07: 41 New
    10
    It is foolish and unprofessional to judge those who lived a thousand years ago in terms of modernity.
    What do historians say about what happened fifty years ago? Why are they lying? They even lie about what happened 20 years ago.
  • illi
    illi April 5 2020 07: 50 New
    +6
    The story is not given to children at all for such details. And for the general storage of humanity. And from this point of view, it is better to start from the oldest and lead to the present. Roughly describing the development of society. And such details are for professional historians and history buffs. Well, the goal of the teacher, as I already wrote, is to give the storage, so that the student would know approximately in what century the Kulikovo battle took place, who fought with whom, and what happened at that time in other places. Well, to interest students in history, so that they would like to independently delve into all the subtleties.
  • Vitaly Tsymbal
    Vitaly Tsymbal April 5 2020 07: 55 New
    +3
    Dear author, the article is interesting, but ... why mix "porridge with flies" - namely, a school with academic science? It’s just that these two social institutions (school - research institute) have two different goals. A school is a transfer of a minimum of knowledge for adult life, and a research institute is an adult life and work in a very narrow corridor of the topic .... In addition to historians, there are also physicists, chemists, etc. Ask their opinion about our school program in physics, from the point of view of a professional, your opinions coincide in many respects - especially in the question of why the kids at school do not study (for example) the synthesis of cold plasma in physics classes))) You write interestingly, but it’s better to separate : "porridge" - school and university, i.e. education, and, "flies" - research institutes, i.e. science !!!!
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 07: 58 New
      -9
      Vitali is all like that! Now this
      Quote: Vitaliy Tsymbal
      So write you are interested
      The fact is that in the era of online journalism for 80% of readers it does not matter what, it’s important ... how! With this, as you yourself wrote everything is OK.
    2. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 5 2020 08: 31 New
      -3
      Exactly, but how are they taught and that the monkeys found a stick and became humans, really? And so is all school education.
  • lelik613
    lelik613 April 5 2020 07: 56 New
    +2
    "Bad soldier! You started well, but ended badly ..." (c) Master
  • Free wind
    Free wind April 5 2020 08: 11 New
    +5
    We know the history of ancient civilizations, from interfluve and Egypt, to the Incas. But we don’t know our story at all. A tale of bygone years? but what can a monk write other than what he is told. In the Vatican, a huge library is assembled, archives that are pleasing and not pleasing are kept, everything is destroyed in our country that is not pleasing to the kings. And do you need some knowledge about which the author wrote? I read and read a lot and with pleasure. I read in the 5th grade about ancient Greece .. I read about the island of Lesbos and its inhabitants. and that I understood, but nothing. Well, girls love girls. well, in our school girls and girls were friends only, we couldn’t think of anything else. I remember in the 3rd grade the girl kissed her on the cheek seeing me off from school, so she threw me a scandal. that her mother scolds because children are born from kisses. I had to reassure her, so that the children appeared, she would not get off with kisses. One teacher said that they teach in the first class to read, write, count, then a person learns himself, the teacher only helps. Parents instilled in the child a thirst for knowledge, the child will learn. And blame textbooks, exam, etc. there's no point. I don’t like how your child is fed history, get on the Internet, there are a great many free films on historical films. Books many contagion paid, copyright, What rights, Dumas quacked centuries ago !!!. Much of course depends on the teacher, but parents also engage in upbringing.
    1. I
      I April 5 2020 08: 36 New
      +4
      ,, Books many contagion paid, copyright, What rights, Dumas quacked centuries ago !!!. ,,


      Almost everything can be downloaded via torrent
      1. Snail N9
        Snail N9 April 5 2020 09: 29 New
        -1
        Almost everything can be downloaded via torrent

        You can download a lot, but not all. Here is a link to our favorite tracker (we can, whoever needs it, just do not forget the VPN, first put it):
        https://rutracker.appspot.com/forum/index.php
        1. Alf
          Alf April 5 2020 20: 06 New
          +1
          Quote: Snail N9
          Almost everything can be downloaded via torrent

          You can download a lot, but not all. Here is a link to our favorite tracker (we can, whoever needs it, just do not forget the VPN, first put it):
          https://rutracker.appspot.com/forum/index.php

          It is possible without VPN, download and install the plugin for rutrekker and no problems.
  • Van 16
    Van 16 April 5 2020 08: 14 New
    +7
    And I'm almost on the topic, without politics and other things.
    To begin with - there is such a bike that when Astrid Lindgren read the reverse translation from her Russian Carlson in the classic Soviet translation by Lungina, she said: What a wonderful book, it’s a pity that it wasn’t me who wrote it.
    So there are different adaptations, and the respected author is absolutely right, everything has its time.
    This also applies to myths and other children's books. Who read Gulliver in the Soviet children's version, or in the original, he will understand. Well, or "Travel Niels with wild geese", the Soviet retelling, so to speak, as if not better than the original. Everything has its time.
    1. Caretaker
      Caretaker April 5 2020 12: 55 New
      +2
      I read the "Russian Tales" of the publication of the early twentieth century, it was interesting to compare.
      1. Van 16
        Van 16 April 5 2020 15: 20 New
        +4
        Yes, it was also somehow comparing the old, pre-revolutionary translation of the Snow Queen with the later, Soviet version, it was very interesting.
  • fk7777777
    fk7777777 April 5 2020 08: 22 New
    +2
    the author before blaming people who you never knew, you better explain, yeah, about Egypt. The basis of the building material is basalt (the fortress exceeds steel by 2 times), and geopolymer concrete (no one has reproduced its composition on Earth until now), but, at school, they teach that ashot and magician did this with a copper chisel? That is, they drilled pits and wells in basalt, used machine processing of stone, there are traces everywhere from cars, and on the pyramids too. Sorry, but where is so much copper (it is completely useless for these purposes, try it yourself) they took ashat and a magician and most importantly, where are the copper-nickel plants in Egypt (well, their remnants, and all the more should remain SLAM, not to be confused with slag), and? We see high-tech construction, traces of the processing machine, no company can reproduce the construction technology, even those that build skyscrapers in New York, Washington. Well, the author, where are your porno fantasy?
    1. Maks1995
      Maks1995 April 5 2020 09: 37 New
      +4
      Wah!
      You are well done.
      A living example of a whistleblower ..

      Geopolymer concrete.
      Basalt.
      Copper.
      "high-tech construction"

      Classic, classic arguments ......... !!!! For anyone on the internet is full of articles and videos.

      I especially liked the video, where one dark-skinned half-naked aborigine, with a hammer, made of "building material basalt (strength exceeds steel by 2 times)" sitting on a stone in the middle of nature tapped a massive flower vase ..... ancient high tenology !!!!
      1. BAI
        BAI April 5 2020 21: 09 New
        +4
        Geopolymer concrete.
        Basalt.
        Copper.
        "high-tech construction"

    2. Hantengri
      Hantengri April 5 2020 10: 14 New
      +6
      Quote: fk7777777

      the author before blaming people who you never knew for meekness ...

      Well, judging by what you wrote here, he blames it for good reason. lol
    3. Undecim
      Undecim April 5 2020 11: 04 New
      +3
      the author before blaming people who you never knew, you better explain, yeah, about Egypt.
      Basalt building material (fortress exceeds steel by 2 times)
      Another dense ignoramus appeared on the site.
      Before "undertaking" the author, everyone should start with themselves and not write illiterate, stupid comments, because after all, a first grader who respects, thinks that is true. And it is advisable to learn to articulate your thoughts clearly, because it is difficult to find meaning in your recitative akyn.
      To begin, explain what you mean by “fortress” and give a source with numbers where the “strength” of basalt exceeds the “strength” of steel.
      geopolymer concrete (so far on Earth no one has reproduced its composition)
      Geopolymer cement, with the help of which geopolymer concrete is obtained, can be bought at any building market.
    4. Senior seaman
      Senior seaman April 5 2020 13: 58 New
      +4
      The author has a cycle about the pyramids. Read.
    5. Icelord
      Icelord April 10 2020 20: 30 New
      0
      Oh my god, to school boy, to school
  • comradChe
    comradChe April 5 2020 09: 15 New
    +2
    To paraphrase a little, I’ll say this: "He said, wringing his hands, the rubbish and the balamut about the RESIDENCE of science before the secret of Bermuda." Honor, in the Russian sense of the word, is felt.
  • Maks1995
    Maks1995 April 5 2020 09: 30 New
    +1
    Alas. The author is right.
    A few of my friends (for some reason, all humanities and older people) seriously believe in everything.
    From aliens who built the pyramids, to amers who have not been to the moon (and ours hide it all).

    I read other articles of the author, where he is also accused of falsification by commentators)))
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 10: 13 New
      -3
      Quote: Max1995
      I read other articles of the author, where he is also accused of falsification by commentators.

      Look through the profile, there are a lot of interesting materials ... with photocopies of documents and newspaper pages.
      1. Maks1995
        Maks1995 April 5 2020 11: 21 New
        +2
        Thank. I looked. It turns out I read a lot
  • BAI
    BAI April 5 2020 09: 38 New
    +8
    Theses, master's and doctoral, are also a great source of information, moreover, they are all posted on the Internet today.


    six doctors and five candidates of science, settled down in the same dissertation council, are simultaneously presented for appeal - as illegally obtaining these degrees.
    Members of the Higher Attestation Commission voted unanimously ten times and abstained only in the eleventh four. But the decision adopted by the majority, and in this case was categorical: to deprive of a scientific degree. Thus, scientific dishonesty and fraud, opened by the commission of the Ministry of Education and Science in the work of the dissertation council D 212.154.01 at Moscow State Pedagogical University, received a significantly tough assessment.

    And if you also remember the Bible. The Kama Sutra is resting in comparison with her.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 10: 11 New
      -5
      Quote: BAI
      six doctors and five candidates of science, settled down in the same dissertation council, are simultaneously presented for appeal - as illegally obtaining these degrees.
      Members of the Higher Attestation Commission voted unanimously ten times and abstained only in the eleventh four. But the decision adopted by the majority, and in this case was categorical: to deprive of a scientific degree. Thus, scientific dishonesty and fraud, opened by the commission of the Ministry of Education and Science in the work of the dissertation council D 212.154.01 at Moscow State Pedagogical University, received a significantly tough assessment.

      At all times there have been unscrupulous people, both above and below. But, nevertheless, this is still the best source. And then, if there is a link to the document, you can always check it, right? And so, by the way, they are lacking in science and expose!
  • RUSS
    RUSS April 5 2020 09: 52 New
    -5
    Vyacheslav, thanks, great article, we are waiting for the application
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 10: 08 New
      -7
      This, alas, is a one-time article. It is on this topic that there will be no continuation. I had to "by the way" in the process of working on the book ... But there will be a multi-topic topic on the history of clothing and it has already begun. He promised a cycle about the "flood". The first article is about to be released ...
      1. 3x3zsave
        3x3zsave April 5 2020 10: 22 New
        +2
        Hello, Vyacheslav Olegovich!
        The first article is about to be released ...
        The funny thing is that the link to this article is under this material, as part of the cycle. I always thought that the authors themselves determine the attitude of their articles to a particular cycle. But no, it turns out it all depends on the breadth of the flight of the editorial fantasy
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 11: 31 New
          -3
          Anton, you are right. From the cycle ... oh. I just “marked” it for myself once. I inserted it into the loop, well ... to insert it somewhere. I could not come up with a suitable "non-cyclic" name. Good thing you noticed.
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave April 5 2020 11: 35 New
            +1
            So the flood article itself is still in moderation!
            1. kalibr
              April 5 2020 11: 48 New
              -4
              Yes, waiting in the wings.
      2. fk7777777
        fk7777777 April 5 2020 10: 28 New
        -3
        Better about the city of Byblos, well, where Vladimir Ilyich founded the Pravda newspaper, tell us, which was located in the territory of central Egypt, well, you should know the territory of ancient Egypt, how it was later destroyed, and most importantly why? ...
      3. Alf
        Alf April 5 2020 20: 09 New
        +2
        Quote: kalibr
        But there will be a multi-topic topic on the history of clothing

        On a MILITARY review? Better not, you still invite the fame of Zaitsev here ...
  • bubalik
    bubalik April 5 2020 10: 09 New
    +3
    Gods Atum, Osiris and Ptah
    ,,, the author does not mind if I add a few pictures smile?








    1. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 5 2020 10: 31 New
      -3
      And we must take the word that this was done by uneducated ashat and mage walking in their skins (by the way, what kind of skin dressing should be so that a person does not infect himself with intense wear?), And did this with a stick left from his ancestors monkeys? Well nonsense ...
    2. kalibr
      April 5 2020 11: 49 New
      -2
      I'm all for it". Very beautiful photos.
  • Brigadier
    Brigadier April 5 2020 10: 15 New
    +6
    To tell fifth graders about genitalia in history is just that! laughing lol tongue wassat drinks
    1. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 5 2020 10: 32 New
      0
      Yeah, especially dude phimosis, camping trip ..
    2. Alf
      Alf April 5 2020 20: 10 New
      +3
      Quote: Brigadier
      To tell fifth graders about genitalia in history is just that! laughing lol tongue wassat drinks

      Who hurts something ..
  • 3x3zsave
    3x3zsave April 5 2020 10: 37 New
    +4
    My respect, Vyacheslav Olegovich!
    After reading, the material left the main impression: what is the speech about? I’ll consider it a “cry of the soul,” like that joke about the announcement of the dog’s loss.
  • Moskovit
    Moskovit April 5 2020 10: 39 New
    +4
    A good teacher in any subject will always give more to the school curriculum and will interest his students. Not all, but many.
    My daughter is an English teacher. He comes up with all sorts of contests, tasks, from films and the present. Children are thrilled.
    I loved the story terribly. At one time I read a book about the Assyrians. And in the textbook a paragraph was devoted to them ... But you can understand - put 10 thousand years into a small book ...
  • Pacifist with AK
    Pacifist with AK April 5 2020 10: 50 New
    -3
    Good morning, dear Vyacheslav Olegovich! I read your article with interest. There was an aftertaste in the form, if I may say so, of some ambivalence.
    I give you tribute, as a historian, to a painstaking researcher of archives, an erudite and extraordinary person! Your work is captivating by its versatility, the depth of "digging" smile , the quality of processing of the source material, a distinct authorial position. In short, respect!
    On the other hand, the author’s position, sometimes, greatly affects the result, although this is understandable .. You can not grasp the immense and be pleasant and convenient to everyone and everyone!
    Regarding this article. I agree that teaching schematized and traditional history is not the right thing! Indeed, myths and rumors from the past, political cliches, and an outright fake are often presented in history. It’s not for me to tell you that the latest history of any country is a litter for those in power, no more .....
    Regarding the sacred information about who, whom, where, how and with what - completely unnecessary information for children! grow up - they themselves will find out, as it was at all times. Clever - will be critical, not very - they will sacredly believe in the fuel elements of the ancient Egyptians. Ce la vie .... You - success, man You are undoubtedly talented .....
    Would you like to write a history textbook? Or weak Oh? laughing no good
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 11: 38 New
      -1
      Quote: Pacifist with AK
      Would you like to write a history textbook? Or weak Oh?

      Thanks for the comment. About the textbook ... I wrote. But ... in the Enlightenment, they explained to me what a headache it is, to promote a new textbook. It’s not enough to write it. It is necessary to prepare manuals for teachers, go through a lot of approvals. And they advised him to convert it into a book for reading. And she came out and recommended as an additional reading to the textbook of the mean. It is called “Knights, Castles, Weapons” (Rosman, 2006). There are three children's school directories: Knights, Crusaders, Indians. (Neva Book Company).
  • Ua3qhp
    Ua3qhp April 5 2020 10: 51 New
    +8
    Quote: kalibr
    And you prove it! All the materials I have provided have links to sources or are photocopies. So - this is not a lie!

    And in the years of 70s-80s, you relying on the same archives proved the opposite, what was the dissertation about?
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 11: 40 New
      -8
      Sergei! Consider: the archives are the same, the documents are different! And the dissertation was about the party leadership of NIRS. And it ... was!
      1. Ua3qhp
        Ua3qhp April 5 2020 12: 13 New
        10
        So I about the fact that the archives are the same, but the documents from them can be got different, and the history with us, especially the closest, becomes different. Yesterday was one, but today it is different.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 13: 35 New
          -5
          That's right, Sergey! In Soviet times, when I wrote a dissertation on the history of the CPSU in the first year, my supervisor said: write carefully weighing the negative and positive, and remember that no one defended on one negative. It was 1985. Then, in 1987, he said: write as it is ... In 1988 - "write as it is, only without a battle against the CPSU." And today, whatever you want, you write. Do you want to praise? There are articles on VO where praise is given, and how. Stalin is called the "red emperor." If you want to scold, please. Everything is on the Internet!
  • Nikolaevich I
    Nikolaevich I April 5 2020 10: 56 New
    +7
    No .... but did the author attack the poor "school history"? And as he presents a brief teaching of history, containing events for many millennia ? How can one explain the causes of historical events to five-graders so that they can understand if the lessons of sex education are introduced in grades 9-11 ... and then "now", and then not everywhere ?! And earlier, children appeared by budding! But not everything was so "scary", and so "bad" in Soviet schools! In history textbooks, a list of literature recommended for "free reading" was given to the topic! And you could read a lot of interesting things! How do you like, for example, "Gargantua and Pantagruel" Rabelais? It was in the "Soviet school" that I became interested in history and began to read a lot! Even at school, the history teacher began to “correct” ... with different “consequences ...” The concept of “self-education” has not been canceled! Someone at school teaches arithmetic in the school curriculum, and some are “curious” (from the same class. ..) houses are "dragged" from trigonometric functions and integrals! Byad of present generations is not even a loss of desire (habit) to read (information can be learned in another way ...); and in the inability to comprehend information ... separate the "grains" "from the" chaff "... correctly prioritize!
    1. fk7777777
      fk7777777 April 5 2020 11: 25 New
      0
      Yeah, especially when trying to calculate the area of ​​wallpaper in the store it’s funny to look at people with disabilities, where did they study?
  • srha
    srha April 5 2020 11: 04 New
    +1
    History is a complex science. Not all, even its scientific and philosophical definition and purpose know: “history is the science of modernity as a result of the previous development of mankind” M.V. Popov. In other words: The present and future cannot be built without the past. Without the past, it is impossible to understand the present and the prospects for its transformation into the future. This is what history does: understanding the present based on the past. Naturally, that in accordance with what they want to build, they’re kurochat (history). In this, by the way, for those who understand the significance of history, plus - you read other people's stories and understand where the people / nation / country are striving.

    As for sex in history (and in general) - and what kids do not see what dogs do in the streets? Well, the city may have himself met a brow (in a construction team) that at first he didn’t distinguish a bull from a cow, they explained it, and the psyche of the brow quite resisted ... It’s stupid to hide, you need to be able to explain it properly, in accordance with the level. After all, they teach the child to go to the toilet correctly, so you need to learn and relate (do not be confused with “engage”, this is only part of the “relate”, and later) to sex - in accordance with cultural traditions. But stupidly hiding is not a tradition, but a political deceptive technology for growing LGBT people on the basis of a psychological technique: close access to the right infa from childhood, and then fill the growing void (after all, a child grows and his intelligence grows, which means that voids grow, at least due to the growth of adjacent areas) in such a way that it is possible this way, this way, and that way, without looking back at the naturally correct one - this is the psychological device.
  • fk7777777
    fk7777777 April 5 2020 11: 22 New
    -6
    Well, listen to the Cyrillic alphabet among the Tatars, the Chuvash have the Latin alphabet, Kazan and Shupashkar are the Volga, there are no people who would write hieroglyphs from top to bottom, and so on to Mongolia, out of 225 boxes. Sakha, well, there are no people there at all. Well, what are the Mongols, maybe the Martians?
  • Undecim
    Undecim April 5 2020 11: 48 New
    +7
    That is, it’s difficult to interest people in the true story, but it’s easy to make all sorts of nonsense.
    This phrase had to be written in the epigraph to the article, since its content has nothing to do with the struggle of historical science and pseudoscience. But it is replete with all sorts of "stupidities" that greatly contribute to the next holivar (or srach) between people who are not even aware of the existence of categories such as theory, philosophy and methodology of history.
    At least, the author should definitely study the methodology of historical science and the methods of presenting historical knowledge at the pedagogical institute, therefore he should know that all those “genital-sexual” details that the article focuses on as the “missing link” in the process of studying history, on in fact, no influence on this very process of historical knowledge is not affected.
    The goal of teaching history at school is a very difficult question in itself and is dependent on the state of society. But in any case, the basis of this process is the history of the development of human civilization. Moreover, in any case, you choose a formational approach to the study of history, as in the Soviet school, or civilizational, as in modern, Priapus’s competition in the length of the phallus with a donkey and the subsequent transformation of the donkey into a constellation for this study does not matter and knowledge of historical processes and the formation of the corresponding worldview does not affect.
    As for me, a series of articles on the methodology of history would be much more useful for combating pseudoscience, which would help to understand that history is a science, with its own laws of knowledge, and not a contemplative-descriptive process of “sent by the Anglo-Saxons of the Germans”.
    It is true that it is more difficult to interest people in such articles than the Priapus phallus, but it is possible.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 11: 53 New
      -11
      Quote: Undecim
      As for me, a series of articles on the methodology of history would be much more useful for combating pseudoscience, which would contribute to the understanding that history is a science, with its own laws of knowledge

      These are: A - difficult, and B - 80% boring. And if so, then ... why?
      1. Undecim
        Undecim April 5 2020 11: 59 New
        13
        These are: A - difficult, and B - 80% boring. And if so, then ... why?
        Then, otherwise it turns out not the fight against pseudoscience, but its (pseudoscience) exploitation and somewhere even popularization.
        Nevertheless, Fomenko operates with astronomy, and you are fighting with him the phallus of Priapus. It looks original, but the effect may be the opposite.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 13: 39 New
          -10
          Quote: Undecim
          It looks original, but the effect may be the opposite.

          The effect is on intelligence, the main thing is that "it looks original."
          1. Undecim
            Undecim April 5 2020 13: 47 New
            +8
            Yes, the use of the phallus in historical disputes is not a trivial phenomenon, there is no arguing here.
  • Mikhail3
    Mikhail3 April 5 2020 12: 09 New
    10
    Well, I didn’t read all the bullshit ...
    the insidious historians conspired and hide from the poor Russian citizens certain "secrets and mysteries" of history that are extremely important to them.
    Favorite intellectual trick. Accuse the opponent of what he did not do and did not say, and then "defeat" him. I would say that it is a shame to use such feints, but historians and shame are incompatible concepts.
    No one claims that historians "hide secrets." You have to be a very inadequate character to say that. To hide something, you need to know this. And the intellectual level of historians of that ... doesn’t really allow to know anything. For our historians, it is a serious secret how "in ancient Athens, non-fading paints were applied to vessels." That is, the "secret" of the glaze is insoluble for historians, alas, the brain does not pull ...
    Calm down, Mr. Shpakovsky. Nobody blames you for knowing some real secrets. Relax. We fully understand the current situation ...
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 38 New
      -6
      It’s good, Mikhail, that you understand. "I know the city will be, I know, the garden is in bloom when there are such people in the Soviet country!" And in Russia too!
  • smaug78
    smaug78 April 5 2020 12: 13 New
    +2
    Well, for example, when in the fifth grade we studied the history of Ancient Egypt, we were told about some beast-headed gods and the first myths about the creation of the world. But they didn’t tell us, and even this is not in the textbook, that among the Egyptian gods there was such a god - Atum. This god was bisexual and held his "female part" in his hand. He created the world by pouring his seed into his own mouth, and then spitting out the cat goddess Tefnut and her husband Shu.
    Yes, it’s very important for a fifth grader to know. And in what class do the genitourinary system of a person go?
  • WayKheThuo
    WayKheThuo April 5 2020 13: 00 New
    +6
    Everyone is happy with the article - I really liked it and I agree with everything, with the exception of the penultimate passage, namely:

    In a word, this is a long-standing problem, from the time when it was somehow decided that people without university diplomas were quite capable of creating a better society than that run by the graduates of Oxford and Yale. And something even they did. Only then, however, they still outplayed these “comrades”.


    What can I say - well, the author of the USSR does not like him, he did not like “that country” —this is his personal business, but:
    1. People who created a society of a new type, at the very beginning of its formation, were, for the most part, without university degrees, that’s true, but it was the owners of these same degrees that destroyed it.
    2. The result was not “something even,” but the first state based on principles fundamentally different from Capitalism. A state that is ahead of the course of History by 500 years, probably. A state that has gained its authority and has set the political tone on the ball is a real superpower. For the historian with whom the author positions himself, such a derogatory statement, from my point of view, is unacceptable.
    3. As for the graduates designated by the author of educational institutions, the essence of studying in conditional “yale”, from my point of view, is not knowledge as such, but the opportunity to get into the caste and acquire connections. And, by the way, they did not “replay” anyone - the top of the USSR itself safely rotted, unable to withstand the requirements that a new type of society places on its elite, because the coachman is unlikely to be able to drive a car, although the job is the same - transporting passengers and goods.

    Nevertheless, it is necessary to pay tribute to the author - he touched upon, albeit briefly, a very important problem - the crisis of humanitarian education in my country. Young people now do not even know, but the older generation perfectly remembers the half-joking dispute between “physicists” and “lyricists”.
    I believe that “physicists”, in a certain historical period, won, which substantially predetermined the ideological crisis of the late USSR, the monstrous degradation of social thought and, as a result, enormous difficulties in developing the ideological platform of modern Russia.
    I think so.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 50 New
      -10
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      I believe that “physicists”, in a certain historical period, won, which substantially predetermined the ideological crisis of the late USSR, the monstrous degradation of social thought and, as a result, enormous difficulties in developing the ideological platform of modern Russia.

      Of course, because they created the bomb. The only thing that did not allow ... to fall apart earlier.
      1. WayKheThuo
        WayKheThuo April 5 2020 14: 53 New
        +5
        The only thing that did not allow ... to fall apart earlier.

        Not a single bomb, unfortunately, because by the end of the eighties we had these bombs, coupled with delivery vehicles, like candy wrappers, but the country fell apart due to an ideological crisis that coincided with the aggravation of economic problems and the complete rebirth of the country's leadership - no bombs helped .
    2. Aviator_
      Aviator_ April 5 2020 14: 01 New
      +6
      I agree with all three points you have highlighted. Regarding the "physicists" and "lyricists," I would like to note the following. “Physicists” did not win. It was not even financiers who won, but people who were obliged to know the laws of the development of society, but did not know it. Social sciences would only benefit if, where possible, the methods of the exact sciences were applied to them. For example, in jurisprudence it is believed that the "presumption of innocence" is the height of human thought, that those societies where this principle does not exist are underdeveloped. However, what this principle essentially means is that under it, some of the criminals will remain unpunished. In a society with a low crime rate this is permissible, but in a society with a high crime rate, crime will simply destroy it. In the absence of this principle, innocent people are punished, but again, the whole matter is in quantity. The picture is quite amenable to numerical modeling.
      Well, as for the Soviet “Engineers of human souls” (the so-called lyricists), I want to say: they turned out to be mostly corrupt, only the “Letter of 42's” to the EBN in 1993 is worth what.
    3. A. Privalov
      A. Privalov April 5 2020 14: 21 New
      +3
      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      A state that is ahead of the course of History by 500 years, probably. A state that has gained its authority and has set the political tone on the ball is a real superpower.

      The course of history cannot be outstripped. It is impossible to get ahead of Time. Pithecanthropus with a stone ax in his hand - Pithecanthropus. Pithecanthropus with a nuclear ax in his hand - the same pithecanthropus. The expression "he / they got ahead / and time" is nothing more than a figure of speech.
      History, or rather Historiography, only reflects what happened as time went on.

      The classics of Marxism-Leninism taught us that progressive socio-economic formations, as a result of an increase in the level of productive forces and the struggle of antagonistic classes, should be replaced by obsolete ones. This theory worked great. It was called the "five-member" and according to the number of formations in accordance with the prevailing industrial relations and forms of ownership was divided into:
      primitive communal;
      slaveholding;
      feudal;
      capitalist;
      communist.
      (In the five-term formational scheme, socialism was considered as the first phase of the highest — communist — social formation.)

      Indeed, the primitive communal system was replaced by slaveholding. Spartak could safely lead its troops under the slogan “Long live feudalism - the bright future of mankind!”, Because feudalism is more progressive than slavery, etc. For the time being - for the time being, everything was in perfect order. During the parallel coexistence of the capitalist and socialist systems, the latter positioned itself as an alternative to capitalism, was even attractive and had followers around the world. However, since the end of the 80s of the last century, this theory has been in a state of crisis, for capitalism theoretically should have been replaced by socialism, and then communism, but alas ...
      In other words, socialism rested in the Bose, communism was never born, and capitalism is doomed to perpetual decay, for there is no real replacement for it today. Dot.

      Quote: WayKhe Thuo
      the essence of studying in conventional “yale”, from my point of view, is not knowledge per se, but the opportunity to get into the caste and get connections.

      I would not simplify it that way. There is my article on VO. "New England. Part 2. Ivy League and the US Navy Submarine Fleet Museum" which tells a little about it. https://topwar.ru/143113-novaya-angliya-chast-2-liga-plyuscha-avtor-gambita-i-muzey-podvodnogo-flota-vms-ssha.html
      hi
      1. WayKheThuo
        WayKheThuo April 5 2020 15: 33 New
        +3
        I would not simplify it that way. There is my article on VO. "New England. Part 2. Ivy League and the US Navy Submarine Fleet Museum" which tells a little about it. https://topwar.ru/143113-novaya-angliya-chast-2-liga-plyuscha-avtor-gambita-i-muzey-podvodnogo-flota-vms-ssha.html


        Thanks for the article - read with interest.
        Naturally, I’m simplifying it a little and it would be ridiculous to say that Yale’s graduate is a stupid * snout dundek, and the level of education received is something at the level of our Polytechnic University, but, from my point of view, apart from knowledge, an ivy League graduate together with a certain invisible pass to the elite club’s dressing room is handed over with a diploma, and a Skull and Bones teammate is probably a certain number at the table in the designated club. The main question here is how much he is deserved and as the owner of this "on-air" acquisition he will dispose of him, but this, as they say, is their personal affair.
  • begemot20091
    begemot20091 April 5 2020 13: 07 New
    +3
    Always did not like historians. In the morning I felt their venality. Here is another leaned out - when the Soviet Union wrote one, now speaks of another. I de sat in the archives. I met such scribblers after the Afghan and Chechen events ... Heroes !!!! They walked with the scouts, they cleared mine ... They didn’t go out of the toilet in the Moscow tavern, but they put on medals, as if they had smoked anasha in Kunduz.
  • Astra wild
    Astra wild April 5 2020 13: 29 New
    +4
    “he never saw her live, because he never visited the British Museum” Vyacheslav Olegovich, you also didn’t live in the Middle Ages, but you know that era well. And who is stopping the LOVELY people from reading about it. The benefit of the Internet allows this to be done by ANYONE.
    R.
    S
    Perhaps, it seemed to me that you are a little drawn that you visited visited many museums and saw them live.
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 13: 52 New
      -7
      Quote: Astra wild
      And who is stopping the LOVELY people from reading about it. The benefit of the Internet allows this to be done by ANYONE.

      But for some reason they don’t do it!
      1. vladcub
        vladcub April 5 2020 15: 43 New
        +1
        Perhaps they are not so inquisitive?
    2. kalibr
      April 5 2020 20: 13 New
      -4
      Nowhere, Astra, did I write that I was in the British Museum and that I was in England. I have not been there yet.
  • Operator
    Operator April 5 2020 13: 36 New
    +2
    I did not understand - when did religious studies manage to become part of historical science? laughing

    Yes - and when did it begin to be taught in detail in secondary schools of the Russian Federation? laughing

    Well, for a snack - when the graduated university graduates in the specialty "History of the CPSU" (even with a large vocabulary) became historians? laughing
    1. kalibr
      April 5 2020 14: 05 New
      -5
      Quote: Operator
      graduates of universities with a degree in History of the CPSU

      What are you, Andrey! There were no university graduates in this specialty. Only after completing graduate school, it was possible according to the results of the defense, to obtain a degree from it. Clear? A university diploma was usually a history teacher. Or as in my case: history and English. And then she covered herself with a copper basin in 1991, and now 2020. It was possible to change the specialty many times and get not one, but several educations, and higher ones.
    2. agond
      agond April 5 2020 14: 06 New
      +1
      History is a tricky science .... they bring these documents to one place, supposedly for storage, where they mysteriously disappear forever, but instead appear “copies” that are stored in archives, then they are poked into the nose of historians, and then they tell us, "adult children" retell tales
    3. vladcub
      vladcub April 5 2020 15: 41 New
      -1
      There is no such specialization. Perhaps a historian, but specializes in one thing. Like our Olenev in WWI, and the Wind in the history of the Caucasus
      1. Operator
        Operator April 5 2020 15: 46 New
        +2
        Now it’s not, but before 1992 it was very.
        1. kalibr
          April 5 2020 16: 48 New
          -7
          Quote: Operator
          Now it’s not, but before 1992 it was very.

          Do not tell tales!
          1. Operator
            Operator April 5 2020 17: 42 New
            +4
            Damn, what are these tales - here's the notorious source:

            Order of the Ministry of Higher and Secondary Special Education of the USSR dated November 17, 1987 No. 790 "On approval of the list of specialties of USSR universities" - the specialty "History of the CPSU" is named in the annex under number 02.06
            http://docs.cntd.ru/document/901904975

            There is nothing to mislead Russian youth - we Soviet have all your moves recorded bully
            1. kalibr
              April 5 2020 17: 51 New
              -4
              Andrew! We are just talking about different things. In the list of specialties of graduates of pedagogical universities of the USSR there was no specialty HISTORY of the CPSU. "A university teacher usually had a history teacher. Or, as in my case: history and the English language." I already wrote about this. And this concerned ALL pedagogical universities of the country. Nevertheless, this specialty was certainly, dissertations were defended on it, it was taught. It is possible that in one of the main universities of the country, for example, Moscow State University, she went as a specialization. But not a single graduate of the country's pedagogical institutes had a diploma "historian of the CPSU." Available explained?
              1. Operator
                Operator April 5 2020 18: 09 New
                +4
                There are no questions about graduates of "pedagogical institutes" (for collegiate colleges) laughing

                Admit it - the historian of the CPSU is not a specialty, but a vocation.
                1. kalibr
                  April 5 2020 18: 30 New
                  -3
                  "named specialty" History of the CPSU "The same as any other. Each has its own courage, its own preferences ...
                  1. Operator
                    Operator April 5 2020 19: 13 New
                    -1
                    The history of the CPSU, taught in Soviet universities, was the most mythologized discipline.

                    For example, nothing was said about the Russophobia of the ideological mastermind of the communist movement Mordechai Marx, who was a member of the Masonic Bnai Brit box, along with the vast majority of leaders of the First International.

                    About the Russophobic upbringing of the Ulyanov brothers by a non-Russian mother, constantly repeating about the natural stupidity of the Russians, as well as about the regular summer vacation of the Ulyanov family in the estate of then-living grandfather Srul Blanca, who undoubtedly shared his thoughts with the younger generation about the place of Jews in the world.

                    About the initial formation of the RSDLP under the wing of the BUND with the co-optation of the leadership of the new batch of functionaries of the old (the majority). About the sources of financing of the RSDLP before the October Revolution (Jewish banking capital represented by the Rothschilds and others). On the political cover for the subversive activities of the RSDLP by the Jewish lobby in Europe (issuing foreign passports, arranging crossings of European borders, facilitating congresses and training courses for party functionaries).

                    About the controller Vladimir Ulyanov from his financial sponsors in the person of Angelina Balabanova, a Russian Jew by birth, who controlled, until 1917, along with a promising Russian citizen, also an Italian citizen Benito Mussolini, as well as an Austrian citizen Adolf Hitler (they don’t put eggs in one basket, they don’t is it true).

                    About how the "Russian" elite of the RCP (b) betrayed Russia's allies in WWI, routinely destroyed Orthodox churches, incited terror during the Civil War, and with a stroke of the pen transformed the federal Russian state into a confederation of nation states in 1922.
                    1. kalibr
                      April 5 2020 20: 11 New
                      -3
                      Quote: Operator
                      The history of the CPSU, taught in Soviet universities, was the most mythologized discipline.

                      This is you to the point.
  • Vovan
    Vovan April 5 2020 13: 59 New
    +9
    Such reading allows you to learn only 20% of the text! It happens that the lips themselves are motionless, but the larynx moves. This “laryngophone reading” is 50 to 50. And only when the text is scanned by the eyes (“quick reading”), the text is absorbed by 80-90%.

    Amused - from the heart, and most importantly - peremptory of what was said: anyway, what is read - Kant, Shakespeare or Landau - the main thing is to scan the text with your eyes, and you will be happy and understanding. Keep it up!
  • Vovan
    Vovan April 5 2020 14: 14 New
    +7
    Quote: YOUR
    At first I thought I was kidding. For example, you can’t open the microwave door because harmful waves still run there, reflected from the walls.

    But it will surprise you greatly that radio astronomers have been looking for a source of short bursts of radio waves for ten years, which turned out to be microwaves that open prematurely stops?
  • Ivan Kolodin
    Ivan Kolodin April 5 2020 14: 29 New
    +8
    I’m probably getting old, but it seems to me that this article was written after a hard drinking, to be honest in history, a lot of interesting things were not told, but in addition to the writings of the ancient Gods, and the deed of the ancient Roman emperors ....
    I recommend the author to oversleep and have a bite .... And then the style of presentation is a subject for the study of psychiatrists .... Or narcologists
  • Pacifist with AK
    Pacifist with AK April 5 2020 14: 56 New
    +4
    Let’s lower the passions! Dedicated to historians ......
  • Ua3qhp
    Ua3qhp April 5 2020 15: 00 New
    +4
    Quote: A. Privalov
    for capitalism theoretically should have been replaced by socialism, and beyond that, communism, but alas ..

    Probably could not. But it was the USSR that made the capitalists turn to face people and spend money on the social protection of the population.
    1. ser56
      ser56 April 5 2020 15: 54 New
      -1
      Quote: Ua3qhp
      But it was the USSR that made the capitalists turn to face people and spend money on the social protection of the population.

      read Henry Ford - he reached the right conclusions before 1MB request
      1. Ua3qhp
        Ua3qhp April 5 2020 18: 38 New
        0
        To paraphrase one well-known expression: "With a kind word and a revolver, you can achieve more than one good word."
        So the USSR, in my opinion, was the very revolver, in addition to the words of Henry Ford.
        1. ser56
          ser56 April 5 2020 18: 51 New
          0
          Quote: Ua3qhp
          thereby revolver, in addition to the words of Henry Ford.

          who knows what is more important, the main thing Ford started earlier - I’m just talking about something else - that capitalism adapts itself well enough ... request
    2. A. Privalov
      A. Privalov April 5 2020 19: 10 New
      +2
      Quote: Ua3qhp
      it was the USSR that made the capitalists turn to face people and spend money on the social protection of the population.

      I want to surprise you.
      The first kindergartens were created in Germany in the middle of the XIX century. The first state pension system was also created in Germany at the end of the 70th century. It was created at the initiative of the “iron chancellor” Otto von Bismarck for those “who cannot work due to age” - then people left for a well-deserved rest after XNUMX years.
      In 1916, despite the war, the retirement age in Germany was reduced to 65 years and remained so for almost 100 years.
      Following Germany, in 1891, Denmark introduced the pension system, in 1898 New Zealand, in 1908 Great Britain, and in 1910 France. It introduced compulsory pension insurance of employees for old age, disability and loss of breadwinner.

      Only in 1930, the USSR adopted the “Regulation on Pensions and Benefits for Social Insurance”, and in 1932, the legislatively established age for retirement was 55 years for women and 60 for men. Finally, the pension system in the Soviet Union was established only in 1956, together with the adoption of the law "On state pensions."

      I'm not talking about the notorious American food stamps - food stamps that are issued to citizens who have no income or have low income. This program worked in the 30s and 40s and began to work again in 1961 and is valid to this day. hi
  • faterdom
    faterdom April 5 2020 15: 13 New
    +8
    It’s just that attempts to make mankind happy at one stroke are futile. And under Djoser there were highly learned priests, and dark peasants. So it is now - in-depth knowledge of the subject cannot be forced upon everyone, including those to whom it is uninteresting and even disgusting.
    There was a strong gymnasium education in pre-revolutionary Russia, it was not for everyone, it was not for everyone, but not only for the "elite".
    Gave us Tsiolkovsky, Bulgakov, Sikorsky, Zvorykin, Paustovsky, Bonch-Bruevich, Krylov - there are many who ... But not a hundred million geniuses.
    The Soviet school was already simpler, although, perhaps, in terms of physics and chemistry, you are more advanced - after all, a hundred years have passed. I had a classmate who read in syllables in the 7th grade. There was another one who simply skipped classes at grades 7-8, shoved the exams with the help of compassionate teachers. He wanted to become a chauffeur, and he became one, everything is fine with him, and he has no problem with the problems of the Great French Revolution.
    Americans generally have deep specialization, horizons, and encyclopedia are "impractical." Why know everything if they pay me only for this and that?
    I remember that Dr. Watson tried to make a portrait characterization of his neighbor, and was surprised to find that he had deep knowledge of chemistry, and absolute zero in astronomy.
    In my opinion, school education should still be broad-minded, whoever absorbs, will at least not be a layman, who will be carried away by some of the subjects - let him go deep into the tower.
    Only now profane teachers, indifferent, hypocrites are not needed, even harmful - they cripple the souls of children, answering them the naive question: "And what, could it be?"
    And grades should be obtained not by “testing”, but in the most fierce form of brain gymnastics: dialogue with a strong interlocutor, be it a teacher, or maybe a classmate. Like Plato.
    History is an interesting science. Only 95% do not need it in practice, and 60% is simply not interesting, as such.
    1. I
      I April 5 2020 15: 37 New
      +3
      The main task of the school, in my opinion, is not to discourage the child from the desire to learn and strengthen the desire for knowledge. Learning should be interesting, then there will be much more geniuses. Moreover, there are many great names that are poorly studied at school. And how many great ones who did not realize themselves, we lost.
    2. Caretaker
      Caretaker April 5 2020 15: 56 New
      0
      Quote: faterdom
      History is an interesting science. Only 95% do not need it in practice, and 60% is simply not interesting, as such.

      You probably meant history as a science, although in this case too I would not say so categorically. Knowledge of the sequence of events, their relationship between themselves and natural phenomena, combined with a knowledge of geography, has practical value for each person.
  • shubin
    shubin April 5 2020 15: 17 New
    +3
    And the ancient Egyptians with the Greeks are still inventors! It is evident that they themselves came off to the fullest in order to come up with this! laughing
  • didra
    didra April 5 2020 15: 28 New
    +6
    I apologize, but there is no such thing as a primary source in historical science. There is a historical discipline-source study, it is also engaged in the classification of types and types of sources. There are also auxiliary historical disciplines - paleography, metrology, chronology, sphragistics, heraldry, numismatics, historical onomastics, geneology and the system of social etiquette. These disciplines are taught at the history departments of pedagogical universities:) Of course, none of the normal adults tells children about the genitals - we all have to put up with this. Teaching children the story from the source (beginning) to our days is natural. Firstly, any story, like a plot-event canvas, is told from the beginning. Secondly, the closer to our days the more complicated, eventful the historical canvas is. It is clear that in 13-16 years it is easier to learn. Thirdly, memorizing dates - cramming, forms perseverance, will and ability to obey elders, which is very important for every person.
    PS The prime mover is the source of all movement, the primary source is the source of any source! Question: The primary source is an event or creature?: integral
    1. Operator
      Operator April 5 2020 15: 56 New
      +2
      In the "History" section of the VO portal, there is a group of adherents of written sources of historical data - such as if the radiocarbon / genetic / isotope analysis contradicts the dialogs / annals / chronicles / sagas (the chronicles do not count, since they are supposedly all too late fakes), all the worse for analysis .
      1. didra
        didra April 5 2020 21: 14 New
        0
        Dear, did I write - a written source? I wrote that there are different types and types of sources. And it’s not entirely clear why you are boiling? What are you, an adherent of dendrochronology? Or you are simply not in the subject? Now, if a person, not in the subject, crawls into a tank or tries to shoot from a grenade launcher, tell him something? And where do you climb? I know there are a lot of different people (smart and not very) who repeat like parrots: history is not science, history is not science, history is not science ......: but let me ask you, what is history and what is science?
        1. Operator
          Operator April 5 2020 21: 47 New
          -4
          Quote: didra
          let me ask you

          I will not allow it - continue to climb your wall.
          1. didra
            didra April 5 2020 22: 33 New
            +1
            As you wish, but this is a recognition of your wrong. In essence, you cannot answer.
            1. Operator
              Operator April 6 2020 10: 43 New
              0
              Rude is not necessary.
  • vladcub
    vladcub April 5 2020 15: 32 New
    +2
    "tying a rope for his testicles, and the other end to the goat," he is some kind of masochist. And do not feel sorry for him their "bells"?
  • Radikal
    Radikal April 5 2020 15: 38 New
    +6
    Well, for example, when in the fifth grade we studied the history of Ancient Egypt, we were told about some beast-headed gods and the first myths about the creation of the world. But they didn’t tell us, and this is not even in the textbook, that among the Egyptian gods there was such a god - Atum. This god was bisexual and held his “female part” in his hand. He created the world by pouring his seed into his own mouth, and then spitting out the cat goddess Tefnut and her husband Shu. According to the Egyptians, this is how the Universe appeared.

    Yeah, how can I not recall the joke about Vovochka, who burst into the classroom with a cry - "You are sitting here, but do not know what turns out to be ................. ........... called! "So we - lived, lived, but it’s just like that! But it is curious - the Guarantor is aware of this Atum .... wassat
  • ser56
    ser56 April 5 2020 15: 39 New
    +5
    What nonsense! bully For many years, historians have adapted the picture of the world to ideological attitudes, but the people who have ceased to trust them were to blame ... request
    “Oh, is it clear that people with poor vocabulary and primitive reading technology”, if not a secret, did the author read at least something really serious? For example, on the differential. partial differential equations or integro-differential. equations? Knows what is magnetic hydrodynamics? Yes, even a beam with one flaky end can calculate? hi Tired of these illiterate type of historians .... request
    “moreover, printed in reputable publications and necessarily with reviews of the Russian Academy of Sciences or relevant institutes”
    what primitive type of thinking ... bully publish in normal Q1 magazines or do not take? bully
    "Theses, master's and doctoral" are just laughter - qualification papers are presented as scientific ... it seems the author suffers from a reverence for scientific degrees ... laughing
    1. Horon
      Horon April 5 2020 19: 16 New
      +2
      For example, on the differential. partial differential equations or integro-differential. equations? Knows what is magnetic hydrodynamics? Yes, even a beam with one flaky end can calculate?

      What do you! There, the “eye scanning” method is not acceptable, which means that people reading using another method, according to the author, suffer:
      inability to learn and intellectual laziness.

      winked