Resumed construction of a training helicopter carrier for the Russian Navy

In Gorodets, the Ship Repairing and Shipbuilding Company (CCM) has again begun to build a special vessel for the marine aviation. This happened in October 2019.

About this website Mil.Press FlotProm reported two sources related to the shipbuilding industry.

Earlier, the construction of the helicopter carrier was suspended in March last year, but, as it turned out, in the autumn of that year, work resumed.

The suspension of construction was caused by a delay in coordinating a number of issues between the designer, the design bureau of the Central Design Bureau “Balsudoproekt”, and the SKK company, which is constructing the vessel. The second reason for a pause in work was an incomplete set of design documentation.

According to the chief designer of Balsudproekt, the missing documentation was sent to the JCC in the middle of last year. In the process of further coordination, the necessary changes were made to the project.

Project 14400 training helicopter ship will be involved in the Russian Navy to train pilots of deck-based naval aviation helicopters. A special vessel will be based in the city of Yeysk, Krasnodar Territory. The city is located on the coast of the Taganrog Bay of the Sea of ​​Azov.

Comments

[Piramidon]

Suddenly, out of nowhere ...

[Lamata]

A whole cruiser appeared ...

[Alex777]

A whole cruiser appeared ...

[Dante Alighieri]

A helicopter carrier with GDP for one helicopter and even without a hangar is strong!
When will we finally see something in the likeness?

[Alex777]

When will we finally see something in the likeness?

You showed one of the most unsuccessful ships in the USSR.
Of the developments of that time, I like "Ivan Tarava", aka "Kherson":

[Dante Alighieri]

Well, so Tvan Tarava it should have been the UDC, and Moscow and Leningrad were increasingly anti-submariners, which, however, did not prevent them from taking the landing periodically.
At the same time, I never liked the nose in this project, all the same a lot of unused space remains on which military units could also be located. It is not for nothing that the Americans eventually made a continuous take-off deck on Wosp. And I must say they turned out, perhaps, the most concise ship of this class. I understand that this is all flavoring, but personally I really like Wasp. Such you know formidably minimalist aesthetics. And here is Kovur’s most beautiful contours, although he already belongs to light aircraft carriers, but he and Wosp are somewhere close to each other in terms of mass and size characteristics (if the American doesn’t lose his memory harder, but in size + - the same)

[Grits]

Quote: Dante

A helicopter carrier with GDP for one helicopter and even without a hangar is strong!

So this is a floating school desk. To learn how to board a ship.
Although the helicopter carriers "Moskva" and "Leningrad" were not so hot in the opinion of the specialists, I think that even they would now be useful in our Navy. Due to the complete absence of any.

[Dante Alighieri]

Yes, what is the school desk in the conditions of the Sea of ​​Azov, but for one helicopter? With the same success, you can rehearse the take-off and landing on any of the corvettes 20380. And if we had an analogue of Moscow or Leningrad with a wide runway, our pilots could rehearse a group take-off or landing of several cars at once, which is practically not done today. And I am already silent about the number of these very pilots and the possibility of their training in high water - in the conditions of a distant sea or ocean zone.

[Alex777]

Yes, what is the school desk in the conditions of the Sea of ​​Azov, but for one helicopter? You can also rehearse the entry and landing on any of the 20380 corvettes.

Let's be serious. Do you propose building 20380 and stuffing it into the Sea of ​​Azov, risking not only helicopters but also a rather expensive ship?
And on the "desk" there is nothing. There is no expensive air defense, no radar, no PLO, not even Uraniums. Compare the price ...
Places there as much as needed for helicopter training. No more and no less.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Gritsa

Although the helicopter carriers "Moscow" and "Leningrad" were not so hot in the opinion of experts

For their time, these were strong NKs. The ships of Project 1123 were not "pure helicopter carriers", like the French "Jeanne D * Ark", although, in terms of TTD and outwardly, they are very similar. Moscow and Leningrad were anti-submarine cruisers with aircraft weapons. And their armament for 1967 was serious: RPK-1 "Whirlwind" with 8 P-81 (SBP), 2x2 SAM "Storm" with 96 SAM V-611, 2x5-533 TA, 2x12 RBU-6000 with 144 RSB- 60, 14 v / l Ka-25 capable of carrying not only t-dy PLO, but also GB with SBP.
"Zhanna" could not boast of anything of this, except for large-caliber machine guns and 8 military units, although she could take up to 14 units.

[the most important]

Quote: Alex777

A whole cruiser appeared ...

Abramovich, Sechin and other naval commanders simply burst with laughter from such a magnificent ship.

[Alex777]

Have you actually noticed that these are not my words?

[donavi49]

Actually pretty dubious. The basic project had to be redone, due to errors (well, they chose a designer who has no experience working with military customers + he interrupted for a long time from bread to water). Here is the result, the result of the protection of those projects - 2015, the tab 2018 - commissioning before the end of 2019. In fact, the KD plant received only under the tree, and the delivery is now until the end of 21-beginning 22.

Given alterations, jambs, idle space - a boat with 2 day autonomy for a closed training area comes out almost like Makkasar. And he will be alone. Rather, even 1 is too much.

Right there, it was possible to solve this problem by rotating patrol ships 22160. At the same time, as training platforms, they would allow to carry out a larger volume of exercises and exams.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: donavi49

Right there, it was possible to solve this problem by rotating patrol ships 22160. At the same time, as training platforms, they would allow to carry out a larger volume of exercises and exams.

I apologize to the marimans, it is possible that I am not right, but, it seems to me, the only thing 22160 is capable of is to train helicopter pilots. Let at least serve in that capacity.

[Grits]

Quote: Krasnoyarsk

it seems to me that the only thing 22160 can do is train helicopter pilots. Let at least serve in that capacity.

But what, you can’t throw nets and fishing rods from it?

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Gritsa

But what, you can’t throw nets and fishing rods from it?

In my opinion you are not far from the truth. Probably for this purpose it was created in order to treat the admirals with fishing.
And between fishing helicopter pilots to train.
And if it's no joke, then for my, below average, mind, this "helicopter carrier" is incomprehensible.
The difference between it and 22160 is in the larger area of ​​the "airfield". I don't know if this is essential for training.

[TermNachTer]

La really very dubious decision. For the same time, for the same money, it would be possible to build something more necessary for the fleet.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: TermNachTER

very dubious decision. For the same time, for the same money, it would be possible to build something more necessary for the fleet.

Most likely this is a "political" decision - to place an order for the SSK. It is necessary to feed the working class so that the shipyard does not collapse. And the order was given to him, with which he will definitely "cope".

[TermNachTer]

It was possible to order an MRK (corvette) or a tanker for the Navy, the same money, but it would be more useful. There are enough ships with a helicopter deck in the fleet - there is something to work on real take-offs and landings.

[Fat]

Bad invented mess! Is gas on a helicopter carrier ... We have to wait. We will see and evaluate the project

[donavi49]

Well, it's better to illustrate the model. For understanding.

[svp67]

Quote: donavi49

For understanding.

That is, this is just a "desk" for training pilots of naval aviation ... Crews are being prepared for "Sevastopol" and "Vladivostok", and of other aircraft-carrying ships.

[donavi49]

Yes. Only with a rework of the project (for money), with a delay of more than twice the original time frame.

And again, this is a very highly specialized vessel. His purpose is to leave the base in the region of the Sea of ​​Azov - to work out a flying day, to go home. He cannot participate in complex navigation tasks. He will not be able to fully work out the takeoff and landing at maximum tolerances (along / wind / wave). Well, etc.

All these tasks can be performed better than 22160. Given the fact that the Moscow Region does not really know where to stick them. On a rotational basis, they could very well work as a school desk - for a week or two in the season of flight training. Ship - loading. The crew is an experience. Flyers - perform tasks of any complexity.

[cost]

Very little is known about the object; the cost is more than 2 billion rubles. The planned time of launching is in 1,5 years.
Its total displacement is 842 tons, the longest is 66,9 m, its greatest is 12,7 m, draft on the waterline is 2,1 m. The full speed of the vessel is 12 knots, the cruising range with a full fuel reserve is 500 miles, autonomy for reserves of provisions and fresh water - 2 days.

[alexmach]

All these tasks can be performed better than 22160. Given the fact that the Moscow Region does not really know where to stick them

Wow. Even 22160 scolded by everyone turned out to be better than someone :)

[Grits]

Quote: alexmach

Wow. Even 22160 scolded by everyone turned out to be better than someone

At first I thought that if a "Katran" was put on it with a full stuffing of ammunition in the hangar, at least some kind of pelemetic-gun on the bow, then it would quite pass for a patrol ship. Pan-headed scare and rodents along the Black (Azov) Sea coast. But when I read about the autonomy of 2 days, I realized that it would be easier for the helicopter to fly itself.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: svp67

Preparing crews for Sevastopol and Vladivostok

Are you talking about the “former Russian Mistrals?” So they have been in Egypt for a long time, and they are not going to change their place of deployment.

Quote: svp67

Well, and other aircraft carriers

we have a lot of aircraft carriers ??? One Kuznetsov, if I didn’t oversleep anything important)
Yes, almost all surface warships have a helicopter platform, many have a rotary-wing aircraft on a permanent basis, but such ships in the strict sense are not. Otherwise, almost 90% of the warships of almost any fleet in the world can be called Aian-carriers.

[Fat]

None of the helicopter carriers are aircraft carriers or landing craft. Ersatz transport with escort aircraft carrier. Target. A delicious target. Up to a hundred pilots and up to a heap of flyers. That's right, the francs refused us since 2014, the time of marketing has shrunk to the tactics of a mobile war in the conditions of "hide nothing"
Mistrals survived before commissioning.

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Gregory_45

about the "former Russian" Mistrals "?

New UDC pr. "Priboy" - laying on May 9 at the shipyard "Zaliv" in Kerch.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Paranoid50

New UDC pr. "Priboy" - laying on May 9 at the shipyard "Zaliv" in Kerch.

from it .... Again, we are talking about the future tense. They would say even after the bookmark ...

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Gregory_45

They would say at least

The trouble is the trouble ....

[Salty]

Quote: Gregory_45

Talking about the future tense again

Sorry, there are just over 9 months left until May 2th. Do you consider this "future tense"?

Quote: Paranoid50

The trouble is the trouble ...

Truly trouble ...

[Grigory_45]

Quote: SaltY

until May 9, a little more than 2 months left. Do you consider this "future tense"?

and what? An event already accomplished?

And who guarantees that the ships will be laid before May 9 of this year? Do you have a time machine, did you fly and make sure that it will be so ???

What prevents to talk about an accomplished event, like all normal people, and not in a trend that is currently fashionable in certain circles; "by such-and-such year they will create such-and-such ...", by such-and-such year he will take up combat duty ... "

[Salty]

Quote: Gregory_45

Who guarantees you that the ships will be laid before May 9 of this year?

Nobody. But if a bookmark date is set, then the project is already running. Do you understand that any action requires preparation? So, the preparation is already underway, "he cannot but eat."

Quote: Gregory_45

What prevents us from talking about an accomplished event, like all normal people, and not in the trend that is now fashionable in certain circles

I do not know. For some reason this does not annoy me. True, I drank nootropics here, maybe it influenced ... relieves irritability and senile pseudomelancholy))

[svp67]

Quote: Gregory_45

are you talking about the "former Russian" Mistrals "?

You probably do not know, but the new one, because in May these names will be laid down in Kerch

Quote: Gregory_45

we have a lot of aircraft carriers ??? One Kuznetsov, if I didn’t oversleep anything important)

As you say, you really overslept. Any ship with a helicopter landing pad is already considered aircraft carrier.

Quote: Gregory_45

but such ships in the strict sense are not aircraft carriers.

I will not philosophize much, I just turn to the Great Russian Encyclopedia. We read:
"AIRCRAFT CARRIER, the generalized name for ships of various classes and types, armed with aircraft (helicopters) and the necessary devices for their deployment and combat use. Aircraft carriers, in addition to aircraft carriers and helicopter carriers, include most of the cruisers, destroyers, frigates, anti-submarine ships , in the navies of some countries - landing ships, command ships and auxiliary ships armed with deck aircraft and helicopters. The largest modern aircraft carriers are aircraft carriers, heavy aircraft carrier cruisers (TAKR), anti-submarine and landing helicopter carriers. Aviation equipment of modern aircraft carriers. power plant, flight deck with aircraft take-off and landing facilities, hangar, deck maintenance facilities, premises (cellars) for storing aviation ammunition, means for preparing, transporting aviation weapons, radio equipment, etc. aircraft carriers, aircraft carriers and helicopter carriers are equipped with a special flight deck, and other types of aircraft carriers are equipped with takeoff and landing pads. Launching an aircraft from an aircraft carrier is carried out using catapults or independently. "

Quote: Gregory_45

Otherwise, almost 90% of the warships of almost any fleet in the world can be called Aian-carriers.

It turns out that so that they also need to train crews and give them the opportunity to hone their skills

[Grigory_45]

Quote: svp67

new in May will be laid in Kerch appropriated these names

it’s not in my rules to talk about what else can be. But for you, apparently, this is the norm.

Quote: svp67

Any ship with a helicopter landing pad is already considered aircraft carrier.

how cool)) We have the entire fleet, it turns out, aircraft carrier)) How do you like: the heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser "Peter the Great"? Sounds like it? Moreover - atomic! And the aircraft-carrying frigate "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Gorshkov" ?? You made a revolution in military affairs, we sometimes cry that there are no aircraft carriers - but what for, when the fleet is already an aircraft carrier?

[svp67]

Quote: Gregory_45

You have made a revolution in military affairs, sometimes we cry that there are no aircraft carriers — but what for, when the fleet is already the entire aircraft carrier?

Are you being "stupid" on purpose? Do you accuse me of the fact that in the Great Russian Encyclopedia this is the definition of "aircraft-carrying ship"? But there is a whole "team of authors" and all of them have titles and honorary titles ... and alas, I am not on this list.
But I will bring it to you, you will find someone to present claims ...

The chief editor and chairman of the scientific and editorial council is Yu. S. Osipov (academician of the Russian Academy of Sciences, president of the Russian Academy of Sciences in 1991–2013).
The responsible editor is S. L. Kravets.
Also included in the scientific and editorial council]:
Academicians of the Russian Academy of Sciences (83 people): S. S. Averintsev, E. N. Avrorin, S. I. Adyan, Yu. P. Altukhov, J. I. Alferov (Nobel Prize in Physics), B. V. Ananich, A. F. Andreev, L. N. Andreev, D. V. Anosov, V. I. Arnold, S. N. Bagaev, N. S. Bakhvalov, O. A. Bogatikov, A. A. Boyarchuk, E. P. Velikhov, A. I. Vorobyov, E. M. Galimov, A. V. Gaponov-Grekhov, M. L. Gasparov, V. L. Ginzburg (Nobel laureate in physics), G. S. Golitsyn, A. A. Gonchar, A I. Grigoriev, A. A. Guseinov, M. I. Davydov, A. P. Derevyanko, N. L. Dobretsov, Yu. I. Zhuravlev, N. S. Zefirov, Yu. A. Zolotov, V. P Ivannikov, V. T. Ivanov, S. G. Inge-Vechtomov, A. S. Isaev, V. A. Kabanov, E. N. Kablov, S. P. Karpov, L. L. Kiselev, A. A. Kokoshin, A. E. Kontorovich, V. M. Kotlyakov, O. N. Krokhin, E. P. Kruglyakov, A. B. Kudelin, O. E. Kutafin, N. P. Laverov, V. P. Legostaev, N. P. Lyakishev, V. L. Makarov, A. M. Matveenko, G. A. Mesyats, A. D. Nekipelov, S. P. Novikov, D. S. Pavlov, A. N. Parshin, N. A. Plate, N. N. Ponomaryov-Stepnoy, Yu. V. Prokhorov, A. Yu. Rozanov, V.A. Rubakov, A. Yu. Rumyantsev, D.V. Rundqvist, G.I.Savin, V.A. Sadovnichy, A.N. Skrinsky, A.S. Spirin, Yu. S. Stepanov, V. S. Styopin, M. L. Titarenko, V. A. Tishkov, Yu. D. Tretyakov, K. N. Trubetskoy, O. N. Favorsky, L. D. Fa Deev, V.I. Fisinin, V.E. Fortov (President of the Russian Academy of Sciences in 2013-2017), K.V. Frolov, Yu. I. Chernov, G.G. Cherny, A.O. Chubaryan, V. D. Shafranov, S.V. Shestakov, D.V. Shirkov.
Corresponding Members of RAS: B. A. Babayan, V. I. Vasiliev, V. A. Vinogradov, P. P. Gaidenko, R. V. Kamelin, M. V. Kovalchuk, N. I. Lapin, S. S. Lappo, A V. Nikolaev, A.V. Yablokov.
Academician of the Russian Academy of Arts: D.O. Shvidkovsky.
State figures of the Russian Federation: A. A. Avdeev (Minister of Culture of the Russian Federation in 2008-2012), A. D. Zhukov (Deputy Prime Minister of the Russian Federation in 2004-2011), S. E. Naryshkin (Head of the Presidential Administration in 2008-2011 .; Chairman of the State Duma of the Russian Federation in 2011—2016; Director of the Foreign Intelligence Service of the Russian Federation since 2016), A. S. Sokolov (Minister of Culture of the Russian Federation in 2004-2008), A. A. Fursenko (Minister of Education and Science of the Russian Federation in 2004-2012), M. E. Shvydkoi (Minister of Culture of the Russian Federation in 2000-2004), S.K. Shoigu (Minister of Emergency Situations of the Russian Federation in 1994-2012; Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation since 2012).
And also: A.D. Bogaturov, V.V. Grigoriev, A.I. Komech, V.A. Mau, A. Yu. Molchanov, D.L. Orlov, S.V. Chemezov.

But there is a definition of an aircraft carrier and we read:
"Aircraft carrier, combat surface ship, intended to gain supremacy at sea, to carry out offensive and defensive missions at sea through the use of carrier-based aircraft. "
I hope you understand the meaning of the definition written here ... and are ready to answer the question: "Do we have many SUCH ships?"

Quote: Gregory_45

it’s not in my rules to talk about what else can be. But for you, apparently, this is the norm.

You are really ridiculous in your "crusade" against me ... Have you read this news? Can't read? Just kidding. Especially for you I bring it

The first domestic universal landing ships, scheduled for May this year, will be named “Sevastopol” and “Vladivostok,” which were previously intended for Mistral-type helicopter carriers ordered from France. This decision was made by the General Staff of the Russian Navy, TASS reports citing a source in the military-industrial complex.
The main headquarters of the Navy decided to name the first Russian UDC "Sevastopol" and "Vladivostok". Previously, such names were assigned to two Mistral helicopter carriers ordered from France.

Quote: Gregory_45

How do you like: the Peter the Great aircraft-carrying heavy cruiser? Sounds like it? Moreover - atomic! And the aircraft-carrying frigate "Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Gorshkov" ??

And what do you dislike about these names? In my opinion, they accurately characterize these ships ... I didn’t come up with this definition, you can write your angry message to the RAS
You are aware that most of our tanks belong to the "rocket-cannon" class, but have you heard and read a lot of this in the name of the tanks? Only in specialized literature

[Grigory_45]

Quote: svp67

Do you accuse me of the fact that in the Great Russian Encyclopedia this is the definition of an "aircraft carrier"?

that you hit in demagoguery. And apply
not generally accepted terminology. None of the sailors will name, for example. missile cruiser (the same Orlans or Atlanta) aircraft-carrying cruisers. No one will call modern frigates aircraft carrier frigates. You will not hear the same from civilian sailors - and now many ships have a helipad, and some also have a fixed-base helicopter.
It would be worthwhile to adhere to generally accepted terminology: an aircraft-carrying ship is a ship in which aircraft are the main armament.
Otherwise, we can say that absolutely all ships (from a missile cruiser to a yacht) are aircraft-carrying - nothing prevents you from organizing a platform for a helicopter or taking a UAV to the port - here is the "aircraft carrier"
I think you perfectly understood what you wanted to say, and you yourself adhered to just such a definition. What did you suffer from the gully?

Quote: svp67

I did not come up with this definition

but you use it and appeal it. Over time, terms and definitions are transformed.
For example, what is a frigate?

1) in a sailing navy - a three-masted warship, the second largest after a battleship. Intended mainly for cruising and reconnaissance. In the middle of the 19th century steam wheels appeared, then screw F. or steamboat-frigates (wooden, iron, mixed). Some F. had reservation and were called armored.

2) F. in World War II 2–1939 — transitional ships between destroyers and patrol ships. Intended for anti-submarine and anti-aircraft defense of warships and convoys of transports.

3) Modern F. - ships of special construction, designed to search and destroy nuclear submarines at sea, anti-submarine protection, anti-aircraft and missile defense aircraft carriers. Displacement F. up to 6 thousand tons. Since the beginning of the 70s. in the USA, serial construction of a nuclear power plant began.

don’t you find, a completely different essence is hidden under one term?

[svp67]

Quote: Gregory_45

None of the sailors will name, for example. missile cruiser (the same Orlans or Atlanta) aircraft-carrying cruisers

No cruisers, but aircraft carriers - yes

Quote: Gregory_45

don’t you find, a completely different essence is hidden under one term?

I do not find ... quite normal development.
The same story with tanks ... so what?

[PPD]

It remains only to understand what is better than pr 20380.
The deck and the helicopter are also the same ... III ...?
Money nowhere to go?

[Piramidon]

Quote: PPD

It remains only to understand what is better than pr 20380.
The deck and the helicopter are also the same ... III ...?
Money nowhere to go?

He is neither better nor worse. These are ships of completely different purposes. One is combat, the other is training.

[PPD]

Are you kidding me?
One corvette is true.
And the second is what is? His mission is to cut one money.
Moscow and Leningrad did without this miracle, though they were.
And now only the pelvis is not clear why.

[tlauicol]

thunderstorm of the seas straight

[Vasyan1971]

Quote: Tlauicol

thunderstorm of the seas straight

And this is how non-fraternal naval commanders will decide.

[Dmitry Makarov]

Damn, I really thought something like Mistral.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Dmitry Makarov

I thought something like Mistral

Yes, the title of the article is too loud -

Resumed construction training helicopter carrier for the Russian Navy

Of the 14400, the helicopter carrier is the same as the one from RTOs - the atomic cruiser

[Fat]

For the convenience of landing rotary-wing aircraft, production of "Popovok" has been resumed. At good shipyards, in the absence of good power plants and lack of training for flight personnel ... The artillery component has been upgraded to a missile ... This result is unparalleled ...
I want a grant!
And our company will bring the results to perfection.
Can you think about stealth technology?
And then . We will never be more vulnerable.,. Invisible submarine disc with starter ...
Advise what to call such a Cheka?
No way! Name chosen: "Concern Kalashnikov *
Interesting? And Kalashnikov was thinking about a pair of three generals when the intermediate cartridge came into life?

[knn54]

If it is planned to build helicopter carriers, then pilots for them should be prepared in advance,

[Lamata]

What eggs before chicken?

[Slavutich]

Well, when so!

[Vasily Ponomarev]

sorry for offtop, but https://defence-blog.com/army/us-army-leaks-images-of-its-new-super-cannon.html it is interesting

[Thrifty]

Honestly, a pleasant surprise! We are here figuratively speaking, we are breaking spears, but meanwhile a training one is being built, but our helicopter carrier is being built! Theoretically, it will be possible at one time and how to use combat training. If only they would not stop the construction of the ship. By the way, who can say anything about this project?

[Non liberoid Russian]

combat training? with a deck for one helicopter?

[New Year day]

Quote: Not Liberoid Russian

combat training? with a deck for one helicopter?

but it sounds menacing:
"Resumed construction of a training helicopter carrier for the Russian Navy"

[Non liberoid Russian]

Well, yes, an occasion to whine once again

[Vasyan1971]

Quote: Not a liberoid Russian

combat training? with a deck for one helicopter?

For the Sea of ​​Azov and the adversaries there, I think, enough.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Thrifty

Theoretically, it will be possible at one time and how to use combat training.

will not work. The ship is very small, non-navigable, has no hangar, no compartments for fuel and ammunition for the helicopter. On it, the pilots will work out only take-off and landing, and based on the coastal airfield.

For me, it would be better for this purpose to use one of the corvettes or frigates.

14400 will be just gold, and not fully meeting the tasks assigned to it. And the ship's designer does not have the proper experience

The Ship Repair Corporation (former Gorodets Shipyard), said that they had not previously engaged in the construction of ships of this class

[Servisinzhener]

Quote: Gregory_45

For me, it would be better for this purpose to use one of the corvettes or frigates.

And each time during training flights it will be necessary to knock out this ship. And to do this much in advance. Instead of calmly and plannedly using a specialized ship operated by the training center.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Servisinzhener

And each time during training flights it will be necessary to knock out this ship. And to do this much in advance. Instead of calmly and plannedly using a specialized ship operated by the training center.

on this boat it is still impossible to master the full cycle of training. One way or another, but have to attract something more serious. So why not learn right away on a warship (since you weren’t able to immediately build a normal training ship)? Anyway, all the ships at once do not go camping.

[donavi49]

There nearby (300km) - a whole series of 22160.
Flight work in Yeysk does not follow the principle - today one crew flies - 2 approaches. But after the day after tomorrow another approach of another crew. It is built in sessions - that is, if the weather allows it to densely fly in l / s in a short time. Then the analysis, theory, practice in a different direction, the assimilation of new material, preparation for other types of tasks - and again the flight session on the ship.

In fact, there is more of an organizational issue - it can also be solved 22160 without much interruption from other tasks, or by a specialized ship (this).

However, in this context, the 14400 can only take on basic training. And again, with restrictions. For full training, you still have to attract frigates / 22160 / corvettes / someone else. For example - complex navigation tasks with a change in flight mission, being outside the zone of visible landmarks, at 14400 is simply impossible to accomplish. For all this, you will have to attract other ships.

There are 6x22160 - which are based 300km from Yeysk.

With normal organization (and it will be with 14400 - for the sake of one or two approaches and it will be expensive to take it out) - pulling off 1 patrol ship is not a problem at all + you can practice complex exercises that still need to be worked out and you will have to involve a warship.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Gregory_45

For me, it would be better to use one of the corvettes or frigates for this purpose.

We have so many corvettes and frigates that we can give them under the "desks"?

[icant007]

Quote: Thrifty

Theoretically, it will be possible at one time and how to use combat training.

Or like a yacht))) or for fishing)))

[Fat]

Quote: Thrifty

Honestly, a pleasant surprise! We are here figuratively speaking, we are breaking spears, but meanwhile a training one is being built, but our helicopter carrier is being built! Theoretically, it will be possible at one time and how to use combat training. If only they would not stop the construction of the ship. By the way, who can say anything about this project?

Popova - type of coastal defense battleships, round in plan. Class - monitors.
In terms of Ideal! ))))
And if I sincerely don’t know, colleague
I’m afraid to imagine what the mobile housing will cost even ...

[Volga073]

So far, only 2 reasons for stopping construction were.
How many more valiant officials will come up with?

[lopuhan2006]

And the editor is generally on the site, who can at least fix our incompetent correspondent. Helicopter carrier at 700t? Training helicopter ship? My blood will go right now ..... maybe not in a hurry and better? It’s even without a hangar, and even 700t as a training platform, as if you wouldn’t go to the ocean on it. For the Black Sea and Azov it may come down, but Perekop’s experience is. Cadets can be taught both more broadly and globally. Although there will be a helicopter-free fishlessness as well.

[petrol cutter]

They - helicopters will land on it one by one and take off.
That is to work out takeoff and landing.
It’s enough for this.
Then they will train at their real place of service, landing ships which are involved in the city of Hero Kerch.

[lopuhan2006]

I am in the know for what and where should he be with his characteristics. The question is different: if you do something halfway, then get ready for the half, not the whole. And this self-propelled platform is half. For there is at least 10 days autonomy and no exit to the Mediterranean and vice versa. Yes, and a hangar is needed with internal rooms for cadets. This is how to build a clean tanker for the Navy without taking into account water, fuel, and so on.

[petrol cutter]

God forgive me ... it’s not worth it to drive the theaters of war. I already expressed my thoughts wise on the Internet. In this article. I even said more than what I should say.
I’m starting to bite my elbows ...

[Paranoid50]

Quote: Petrol cutter

I even said more than what I should say.
I’m starting to bite my elbows ...

Everything is normal, Vitaly. Take care of your elbows - they will definitely come in handy for further achievements in your difficult, but certainly most useful business. Yes, I rummaged for the engines for the new UDC - so far the silence, we managed to pinch out only the type - there will be Daewoo, but, which ones ... Well, okay, there is a minuscule wait - we will find out soon.

[donavi49]

He is only for Azov. Rather, for the Tagarog, Temryuk and Yasensky bays.

[Piramidon]

Quote: lopuhan2006

Well, as if you won’t go to the ocean on it

To practice takeoffs and landings, it is not necessary to go out into the ocean. "THREAD", that is generally on land and nothing, train.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Piramidon

"THREAD", that is generally on land and nothing, train.

and do you think NITK is a substitute for a real ship? Neither computer simulators nor flights with NITKi will ever replace flights from a ship, a completely different atmosphere and sensations.
At NITK, you can only conduct an initial training course, without the risk of damaging the ship with green cadets, and conduct experiments.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Gregory_45

and do you think NITK is a substitute for a real ship?

No, I don’t think so. Why do you think so? I only objected to a comrade who believes that this ship must go out into the ocean.

[petrol cutter]

What engines is it planned to equip this certainly useful steamer?
I immediately dropped a drop of healthy poison I.

[donavi49]

There are speeds of 12 knots maximum. Initially, import + water cannon. Now simplified to the classics with diesels (ours or Chinese) and the shaft. He has the task on his own to go to the Taganrog Bay or get around to the Yasensky-Temryuk. And that’s all. He has his stocks for 2 days.

[mark1]

A barge, I would even say a pontoon, will not fit? "Forget" it in the Taganrog Bay, until they train, let the fishermen use it. And so, at the appointed hour, he drove the tugboat, circled around the bay and again at anchor ...

[petrol cutter]

Not likely to do. Pilots will fly in the open sea. And you need to study there. In the wind, storm and other troubles. Which we observe every day of God.
Even in the conditions of the Black Sea.
Lose pilots, why in vain we have no right. They need to be taught too long.

[mark1]

Then there are a lot of questions to the boat, it is really easier to use 22160.

[petrol cutter]

It is hard to say what needs to be used there.
Are you a constructor? Have you calculated all the loads, all the possible risks, all the possible options?
When working on the same slipway, we invite the designer, ask questions: how-so? Dad, do not crawl into mom?!. What is going wrong ?! Then a friend comes and informs, yes, gentlemen ... I adjusted here a little ...

[mark1]

Really, why am I ... I’ll go quietly rejoice to whom it is supposed to figure it out.

[petrol cutter]

Right In a shipbuilding, nothing is done for nothing. No offense...

[Grigory_45]

Quote: Petrol cutter

Pilots will fly in the open sea. And you need to study there. In the wind, storm and other troubles.

this vessel of 700 tons will receive helicopters in a storm ???

Quote: Petrol cutter

Lose pilots, why in vain we have no right. They need to be taught too long.

that's it. And the pilots in this case need something more serious than a yacht with a helipad

[petrol cutter]

China is not welcome in our circles however.
The speed there, in principle, is not particularly worrying.
There are suspicions that the people did not correctly understand the essence of this news.
According to my information, and this was reported on this site, the Russian Federation decided to build UDC in the amount of two pieces (hence my fierce interest in dvigla). Moreover, the bookmark was announced before the May holidays. I talked with people who went there and am inclined to believe that this is exactly what will happen.
So what did I lead to?
As long as the steamboats are being built in Kerch, this steamboat is produced purely for training purposes for raiders.
This is not a combat unit for combating the AUG and the enemy submarines.
I could be wrong, but most likely ...

[pl675]

Quote: Petrol cutter

China is not welcome in our circles however.
The speed there, in principle, is not particularly worrying.
There are suspicions that the people did not correctly understand the essence of this news.
According to my information, and this was reported on this site, the Russian Federation decided to build UDC in the amount of two pieces (hence my fierce interest in dvigla). Moreover, the bookmark was announced before the May holidays. I talked with people who went there and am inclined to believe that this is exactly what will happen.
So what did I lead to?
As long as the steamboats are being built in Kerch, this steamboat is produced purely for training purposes for raiders.
This is not a combat unit for combating the AUG and the enemy submarines.
I could be wrong, but most likely ...

Regarding the article, sorry, this shame is not interesting.
I'm interested in that part of your kament where you look a little beyond the horizon, such as a power plant for future fishing, here I am at a dead end, if it is not an azipod, then what?

[petrol cutter]

, "like a power plant for future udk, here I am at a dead end, if this is not an azipod, then what?"
So the question is what kind of power plant? I even asked fellow authors at one time: if you write, don’t you take the trouble to indicate which engines are planned for installation? Presumably, this is a land of closed information (if the capitalist dviglo). Or have not finally decided to this day ...
Now this is happening. For example, we started talking about the possibility of cutting foundations on two orders for other engines.
I really would not want to do this ... But ... According to rumors, there will be no planned diesels ... And the ships should already be in the sea for two months.
I won’t spread much (as if by the hat I don’t get for a long tongue).

[pl675]

I won’t spread much (as if by the hat I don’t get for a long tongue).

I ask you to send the information in a personal, of course, how it will be possible without the "secret" stamp

[Piramidon]

Quote: Petrol cutter

What engines is it planned to equip this certainly useful steamer?

Outboard boat engine.

[Pavel57]

It was such a word- aviamat.

[75 Sergey]

For this, all our aircraft carriers cruisers were cut, but they were not included in the Forbes list ...
Now we would be training and do not need to build anything.

[Grigory_45]

Quote: 75Sergey

For that, all of our aircraft carriers cruisers were cut

how wrong you are! It turns out that we still have a lot of aircraft-carrying cruisers!))) And Peter the Great, and Admiral Nakhimov, and Moscow, and the Varyag, and Marshal Ustinov). All of them carry helicopters.
According to one comrade with Marshall stars, all ships that have a platform for at least one helicopter are aircraft carriers.

Quote: svp67

CARRYING SHIP, the generic name of ships of various classes and types, armed with airplanes (helicopters) and the necessary devices for their deployment and combat use.

Quote: svp67

Quote: Gregory_45
Otherwise, almost 90% of the warships of almost any fleet in the world can be called Aian-carriers.

It turns out that way

So we are all wrong in saying that in Russia there are no aircraft-carrying cruisers besides the lame Kuznetsov))

[75 Sergey]

Well, fools in Russia are in store for another hundred years, Stalin I.V. take off he fought as best he could, but it’s not enough ...

[TatarinSSSR]

Learning to build helicopter carriers. Then we will learn to serve and use them. Then it’s the same with aircraft carriers .... Rather, it’s possible with one aircraft carrier years later, after ..... eleventh. And with his wing. And either sad or happy .... But obviously not proud.

[aiden]

Doubtful decision. It’s cheaper to build a floating platform and carry it in tows. Cheaper in both construction and maintenance

[petrol cutter]

Of course ... That's why we live well, we will never ..
Introductory! There are no tugs. Rotted everything in '90 -00. What will we carry around?!.

[donavi49]

Tug carriage and trolley. Especially for such purposes, you can generally take the local contract. Well, that is, freight for the operation.

By the way, yesterday a large tugboat was entered at the Black Sea Fleet. This helicopter barge can also be pulled to the Atlantic . By the way, he also has a helipad.

Near the brother is being completed.

[petrol cutter]

What is characteristic when they wrote for the delivery of tugboats to the fleet ... All naval commanders wrote, what kind of a ram is this ?! What the hell tugs ?! Where are the aircraft carriers ?!

[aiden]

We have a lot of tugs, I mean that it is not necessary to use tugs of the Navy, for example, private ones. They will pull this floating landing platform into the sea and let them train as they finish, so the tug will pull it back.

[petrol cutter]

Miracles ... Miracles ... To put it mildly. My wife and her friends bother about the same thing. When they gather for their tea parties.

[Radical]

Quote: donavi49

Actually pretty dubious. The basic project had to be redone, due to errors (well, they chose a designer who has no experience working with military customers + he interrupted for a long time from bread to water).

Probably this designer is someone's brother-in-law, a childhood friend, a bedmate in the army, etc., who decided to give some money ....

[Professor Preobrazhensky]

Today, about 1.200 helicopters of all modifications are in service with Russia.
If we build such a ship for each of them, then we will have the most helicopter-carrying navy in the world or the most crab helicopter forces.
In short - all the cranes at sea and in the air.

[Mihail2019]

"Helicopter ship" - I was not mistaken ?!
"They say that in Yeisk, quite in a European way, freedom of speech - if it's a mate!" (c) V.S. Vysotsky.

[Luty]

Very strange ship. It would be easier to use something based on civil transport or fishing. And the volumes are larger and seaworthiness is higher. But someone convinced and will now be a pocket PLO helicopter carrier.

[petrol cutter]

Then you understand what’s the matter ... When they say to me, it's easier ...
I, as a shipbuilder, understand that it will be not only easier, but also more difficult. Therefore, I am very cautious about such proposals. Though not for me to do it. But to those guys, I really don’t envy.
Well, not a ship, but a ship.

[donavi49]

He is officially a ship.

Well for the industry, what's the use of it?
The designer is the first and last ship of this type, most likely the last order on the MO line, because all that could be torn off, the money was overspended, the MO was about to sue the designer if the deadline was to be disrupted for the transfer of the design documentation.
Shipbuilder - makes moorings.

small docks

Various barges (oil / functional) and hulls for picking at other enterprises.

This "helicopter carrier" is for them, hemorrhoids from which cannot be abandoned, because from a stable customer (MO), which, again, should have been commissioned under the tree. But in the end, the mortgage section and part of the assembled structures simply occupied a place at the plant for a year and a half, work on them was not carried out due to the lack of documentation.

[petrol cutter]

For shipbuilders, a single ship is also a ship. Yes, to blame. May he proudly be called a ship.
To me, first you need to build a slipway under it. This is money. Perhaps not one if it will be assembled in sections. This is money. Then assemble the sections. This is money. Then assemble it to bother with sections. This is also money, although half as much.
Thus, more ships! Good and different. I always said that.
And you don’t want to. Give me a series of pieces for fifty. We also need to live on something and feed the kids.

[axiles100682]

On the one hand, some garbage, and not a helicopter carrier, only one name. But on the other hand it will not be so unfortunate if one of the young flyers drops a spinner on it.

[Fat]

Fathers! I have a lot of comments and facts, both against and for ... Ilyich was not right. Declaring Vendee red-green resistance as an enemy.

[Fat]

Quote: Thick

Fathers! I have a lot of comments and facts, both against and for ... Ilyich was not right. Declaring Vendee red-green resistance as an enemy.

Ilyich was presented with a rifle and a mark of support for the course on a scale m scattering. Everyone is silent, but I saw it with my own eyes. So and who did the screws and the cartridges. Not too old me.?.
They hid the Name of green for a long time, and he himself refused kaftn .... We remember. I remember..

[Fat]

I lied. It was not I who refused in 1917 this year the merit for the "crown" ... But with the iron of Azinn they stood against them for two years, and the Azinsky terror of Kolchakovsky was no easier ... There were many prisoners. Barges haatalo and hostages. So Izhesev was broken. White Barge - Red Barge. And rifles floated to the Red Army. Hostage.
ABOUT! How did we manage to kill each other? Tell me

[lopuhan2006]

Quote: Petrol cutter

God forgive me ... it’s not worth it to drive the theaters of war. I already expressed my thoughts wise on the Internet. In this article. I even said more than what I should say.
I’m starting to bite my elbows ...

Can you read carefully? The need for this ship is just like a chair in Yeysk. This is not even a shop for the Black Sea. And if they were more attentive and not wiser, then they would have seen exactly what they indicated on the lack of fish and cancer-helicopter ..... I have already bitten my elbow ...

[petrol cutter]

I apologize.
If it makes you feel better.
Frankly, I don’t give a damn about this ship, since it’s not being built here.

[Kaetani]

God grant a quick and high-quality construction and commissioning.

[viktor_ui]

What a title, what a content ... nothing but

[lopuhan2006]

Quote: Petrol cutter

I apologize.
If it makes you feel better.
Frankly, I don’t give a damn about this ship, since it’s not being built here.

I always accept my sincere apologies and am ready to bring it myself. And for a boat, they break too many copies. He does not deserve this.

[VLADIMIR VLADIVOSTOK]

He is not needed on the Black Sea. On the Pacific Fleet more needed. The Kremlin covers its ass. BSF, Baltic Fleet, North. Toph will soon fight with boats, like Somali pirates ..

[lopuhan2006]

Quote: VLADIMIR VLADIVOSTOK

He is not needed on the Black Sea. On the Pacific Fleet more needed. The Kremlin covers its ass. BSF, Baltic Fleet, North. Toph will soon fight with boats, like Somali pirates ..

In this case, it is Black Sea Fleet training in our Yeysk, and not in Nakhodka. And even more so with its characteristics TF is contraindicated to him in principle. How do you imagine its value as a combat unit on TF? 2 days of autonomy, 700t and a platform without a hangar! He will reach Istanbul, but will not be able to return. And on TF with its distances, where do you see him? No need to write nonsense. There is simply an expression: we are not rich enough to buy cheap things. In this case, it's cheap.