Cracks in the armor. Defective T-34 for the front


Photo from the album of photos of the plant №183 named after Comintern. Source: t34inform.ru


Weak links of steel guard


How can the avalanche increase the output of the front-line needed tanks? In the book of Nikita Melnikov, “Tank Industry of the USSR during the Great Patriotic War,” data are presented on reducing the conditions for receiving finished products by military representatives.

Since January 15, 1942, tank factories have been very "liberal" in assessing the quality of manufacturing armored vehicles. Only every tenth T-34 medium tank and heavy KV at the option of the military representative was subjected to a short five-kilometer run. In the case of the T-60 tanks, obviously, there were more doubts, so every fifth light tank was subjected to mileage. Or maybe such machines were less needed at the front, therefore they were stricter to them even at the acceptance stage. This indirectly confirms the control firing of the guns of each T-60 exiting the factory gates, while the T-34 and KV guns were checked only on every tenth machine. They allowed sending tanks with missing speedometers, turret turning motors, intercoms if they were replaced with warning lights, as well as tower fans. The last point, fortunately, was allowed only in the winter.


Photo from the album of photos of the plant number 183 named after Comintern. Source: t34inform.ru

It should be noted separately that by the middle of 1942 the tank industry had successfully coped with the quantitative indicators of the production of armored vehicles. Uralmash regularly even exceeded the standards for the production of tanks, and the Kirov plant in Chelyabinsk only from January to March increased its production of V-2 diesel four times.

Such production growth rates were largely due to a serious decrease in the quality of tanks coming off the assembly line. An illustrative example is the 121st tank brigade, which during the 250-kilometer-long throw lost half of the heavy HF due to breakdowns. This happened in February 1942. For a long time after this, the situation did not fundamentally change. In the fall of 42nd year, 84 HF tanks were inspected, which failed for technical reasons, which did not even work out 15 motor hours. Most often, faulty motors, broken gearboxes, defective rollers, worthless triplexes and many minor flaws were found. In the summer of 1942, up to 35% of all T-34 tanks were lost not because of enemy shells or a mine explosion, but because of the failure of components and assemblies (mainly engines). Nikita Melnikov in his work suggests that part of the losses can be attributed to the low level of crew qualification, but even with this in mind, the percentage of non-combat losses is too large. However, such faults KV and T-34 could well be eliminated in the field, sometimes simply replacing the unit or assembly. But with the unsatisfactory quality of the armor on the T-34 at the front, it was useless to fight - the armored hulls were brewed from steel with low viscosity, which, when enemy shells hit it, caused cracking, delamination and spalling. Often, cracks formed on new vehicles, which sharply reduced the crew’s chances of a favorable outcome when a German shell hit a crack or an adjacent armor area.








Photo from the album of photos of the plant number 183 named after Comintern. Source: t34inform.ru

The first alarming calls about entering the T-34 unit with cracks were made in May 1942: complaints on 183 vehicles arrived this month at factory No. 13, 38 tanks in June, and seventy-two T-34s in the first decade of July. . The government could not be silent in this case, and on June 5 the GKO adopted a resolution “On improving the T-34 tanks”. The USSR prosecutor’s office was simultaneously instructed to investigate the causes of this decline in tank quality.

In the course of the work, investigators, in particular, found out numerous facts of theft of products from the diet of tank industry workers. Factory workers are simply malnourished. One example of such a predatory attitude is given in a series of materials about Isaac Salzmann, the most controversial leader of tank factories.

Among the enterprises that "distinguished themselves" in the production of defective T-34s, the famous factory in Nizhny Tagil came first. Moreover, the peak in the production of defective products came just at the time of the leadership of the aforementioned Zaltsman. However, the directors of the enterprise, as we recall, were not demoted, but immediately appointed People's Commissar of the tank industry. Obviously, the highest echelons of power decided to blame primarily Vyacheslav Aleksandrovich Malyshev, the 1st People's Commissar of the USSR tank industry. True, sobering came a year later, in the summer of 1943, Malyshev was again put in place of the people's commissar, who he retained until the very end of the war.

In addition to the half-starved existence of factory workers, the prosecutor’s office during work at evacuated tank industry enterprises revealed another problem of the unsatisfactory quality of tanks - a serious violation of the production cycle.

Simplification to the detriment of quality


As you know, the Mariupol plant named after Ilyich could not be defended, he was in the hands of the enemy, and with a mass of technological equipment that they did not manage to evacuate. It was this enterprise (the only one in the country) that was capable of producing full-fledged armored hulls for the T-34 in compliance with all standards. In the Urals, not a single plant could offer such a thing, so the scientific team of the Armor Institute (TsNII-48) began to adapt the Mariupol practices to the realities of the evacuated factories. For the production of high-quality armor in the required GKO volumes, there was an acute shortage of thermal furnaces, so the institute developed a new cycle of hardening of the armor parts. In Mariupol, the armor plate first went to hardening, then to high tempering, then again to hardening. Finally, followed by a low vacation. To speed up production, the first quenching was initially canceled, and then high tempering, which directly affects the viscosity of the armored steel, and reduces the likelihood of cracking. Also among the necessary measures, according to experts of the Armor Institute, the requirement to load not one but four or five rows of armored plates into the thermal furnace stood out. Naturally, it turned out much faster, but the final quality of the plates was very heterogeneous. Interestingly, the Armored Institute later decided to cancel the low-tempering procedure, which reduces the residual stress of the metal, which again did not fail to negatively affect crack formation.








Photo from the album of photos of the plant number 183 named after Comintern. Source: t34inform.ru

It is impossible to cut hardened steel with gas cutters - this thesis is known to everyone, but the realities of the production of T-34 armored cases forced to resort to this unpopular method. It was about steel 8C, which expanded after quenching, and, of course, this forced the plant workers to cut it with high-temperature burners. The meaning of hardening armor in the cutting area was lost.

It is not worth affirming that recommendations for improving the production process carried only negative for the quality of the armor. So, welding of armored plates “into a spike” instead of the old “into a castle” and “a quarter” became a real innovation in assembling the hulls of T-34 tanks. Now the mating parts did not crash into each other, but partially overlapped each other. Only this decision seriously reduced the volume of machine hours on the case from 198,9 to 36.

Cracks in the armor. Defective T-34 for the front

People's Commissar of Ferrous Metallurgy Ivan Tevosyan. Photo: trud.ru

The main supplier of defective steel sheet for plants manufacturing T-34 was the Novo-Tagil plant of the People's Commissariat for Ferrous Metallurgy. At first, he interrupted supplies from the Mariupol plant, and when he switched to his own, a stream of complaints began to flow from the front and from the factories. In particular, in the composition of the 8C armor from this enterprise there were serious differences with the technical conditions (TU) in the content of carbon, phosphorus and silicon. There were generally difficulties with TU. The People’s Commissariat of Ferrous Metallurgy didn’t agree to preserve technical specifications according to Mariupol standards, in which phosphorus, in particular, should be no more than 0,035%. In early November 1941, the People's Commissar of Ferrous Metallurgy Ivan Tevosyan approved new phosphorus standards, which increased the possible content to 0,04%, and from April 4 to 0,045%. It is noteworthy that historians still do not have a single opinion on this, of course, an important factor in the quality of armored steel. Nikita Melnikov, in particular, mentions that the Novo-Tagil plant, on the contrary, by the middle of 1942 reduced the proportion of phosphorus from 0,029% to 0,024%. It seems that different scientists find different reasons for the appearance of defective T-34s at the front. Be that as it may, the indicated standards for the content of chemical elements in the composition of the steel were sometimes not respected. It was difficult for the plants to establish a simple uniformity of the supplied steel. The prosecutor's office also revealed that at the enterprises of ferrous metallurgy in open-hearth furnaces, the armor was "not enough" - instead of 15-18 hours, in reality, no more than 14 hours.






Photo from the album of photos of the plant number 183 named after Comintern. Source: t34inform.ru

When information about the causes of cracking on the T-34 corps reached Molotov, the People’s Commissariats of the iron and steel industry and the tank industry began to shift responsibility to each other. One of the main reasons was the high phosphorus content in the armored plates, the other - serious violations of the technology for the production of shells in tank factories.

As a result, TsNII-34 was connected to work on crack control on the T-48 (although he was guilty of their appearance indirectly). The complex of measures proposed by the institute only by the end of 1943 allowed to eliminate some of the comments. And an increase in the quality of steelmaking at the iron and steel enterprises allowed to reduce the defect share from 56,25% in 1942 to 13,30% in 1945. By the end of the war, enterprises had not reached a level close to 100%.
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  1. polpot 21 February 2020 06: 36 New
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    Thank you very interesting topic
    1. Horde1 21 February 2020 08: 24 New
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      Moreover, the peak in the production of defective products came just at the time of the leadership of the aforementioned Zaltsman. However, the directors of the enterprise, as we recall, were not demoted, but were immediately appointed People's Commissar of the tank industry.


      wow, if Zaltsman established such an order, but he was not punished, then questions arise about the justice and adequacy of socialist legality, and even in war conditions, such a thing could not pass by the supreme. At that time, for stealing a loaf of bread they could open a case , and here is large-scale theft? Why did not Stalin touch this Zaltsman?
      1. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 11: 06 New
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        Quote: Horde1
        At that time, for stealing bread rolls could open a case, but then large-scale theft? Why did not Stalin touch this Zaltsman?

        So comrade Salzman drove into the army defective tanks before the war. Moreover, not only with a manufacturing defect, but also with a constructive one - the design bureau of his factory before the war did not correct any of the comments issued based on the results of testing the HF in 1940
        And also the subordinates of Comrade Zaltsman regularly forged documents, "surrendering" the tanks last month - to fulfill the targets. Moreover, they faked so crudely that the fake was visible to the naked eye: the form was dated at a later date than the date of the "signing" of the act written on it. smile
        1. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 07 New
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          Quote: Alexey RA
          "surrendering" tanks last month - to achieve planned targets

          it was the entire Soviet era, as well as retroactive adjustment of the plan to receive the prize ....
          1. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 18: 46 New
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            Quote: ser56
            it was the entire Soviet era, as well as retroactive adjustment of the plan to receive the prize ....

            Pffff ... otherwise I don’t know about thirty second, thirty third, thirty-fourth and the following days of December. smile
            Delivery under the ribbon almost always actually ended in January. Never domestic domestic equipment never gave up the first time! laughing
            1. ser56 22 February 2020 15: 53 New
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              Quote: Alexey RA
              I don’t know about the thirty-second

              it’s just more than 24 hours in a day ... especially 31.12/XNUMX bully
        2. Horde1 21 February 2020 19: 05 New
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          Quote: Alexey RA
          So Comrade Salzman drove into the army defective tanks before the war.


          and what do you think really happened? Why didn’t they touch him?
        3. Sergey S. 22 February 2020 06: 31 New
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          Quote: Alexey RA
          So comrade Salzman drove into the army defective tanks before the war. Moreover, not only with a manufacturing defect, but also with a constructive one - the design bureau of his factory before the war did not correct any of the comments issued based on the results of testing the HF in 1940
          And also the subordinates of Comrade Zaltsman regularly forged documents, "surrendering" the tanks last month - to fulfill the targets. Moreover, they faked so crudely that the fake was visible to the naked eye: the form was dated at a later date than the date of the "signing" of the act written on it.

          It’s impossible to argue. I suppose it was so.
          But only in terms of “Salzman” and “tank” can any letters be replaced, at least all, and the justice of the statements will not change from this.

          The real thing is the real level of education of specialists and workers.
          Too little time has passed since the start of industrialization. Do not have time ... to realize how to learn. why study, how much to study ...
          Technical specialized universities appeared only after 1930. They also did not work out educational programs ...

          And very rude. Is something different now? In the 1990s, marriage got out of the underground ...
          All the time lags and endless tweaks ... And the specimens in the parades ???

          I do not think that it is necessary to condemn in the person of Comrade Zaltsman all the experience of the USSR.
          If you had done by book. and endlessly licked all the imperfections and all the reasons for the marriage, when we managed to organize mass production and at least some kind of combat training for the crews?
          Now everyone knows the character of Comrade Stalin. And the fact that with all the accusations inspired by Malyshev, Stalin practically did not touch Zalman, suggests that he understood the reasons for what was happening and made government decisions, not immediate ones.

          By the way, in World War I in tsarist Russia, with a meager production volume, new domestic equipment either did not work at all. either with marriage, or even the army and navy did not reach ...
          1. ser56 22 February 2020 16: 01 New
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            Quote: Sergey S.
            specialized technical universities appeared only after 1930. They also did not work out educational programs ...

            what nonsense? bully remind you, where did Polycarp, Korolev, Miles, Tupolev get their education?
            Quote: Sergey S.
            with a meager production volume, new domestic equipment either did not work at all. either with marriage, or even the army and navy did not reach ...

            Can I have some examples? crying
            1. Sergey S. 22 February 2020 23: 22 New
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              Quote: ser56
              what nonsense? bully remind you where the education of Polycarp, Korolev, Miles, Tupolev?

              No ... And no bullshit.
              MVTU and St. Petersburg Polytechnic University were very good universities, but ...
              Their graduates were clearly not enough to build a great country.
              And in 1930 ... for example, in Leningrad specialized higher education institutions were established for shipbuilding, weapons, aviation, electrical engineering ... This year, September 1 anniversary is the 90th anniversary of the creation of specialized technical education for the defense industry.
              1. ser56 2 March 2020 14: 47 New
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                Quote: Sergey S.
                MVTU and St. Petersburg Polytechnic University were very good universities, but ...

                But forgot about Kiev or Tomsk Polytechnics? request
                Quote: Sergey S.
                This year, September 1 anniversary - 90 years of the creation of specialized technical education for the defense industry.

                in fact, this is a mistake - faculties turned into universities ... request
                1. Sergey S. 3 March 2020 08: 22 New
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                  Quote: ser56
                  in fact, this is a mistake - faculties have turned into universities.

                  No, not a mistake.
                  The mistake is being made now that universities and specialties are enlarging, the number of students in specialties and for teachers is increasing ...
                  A university is an organism. It is aimed at solving a specific problem. The university establishes appropriate ties with enterprises ...
                  And if you concentrate all education in Universities ... - Polytechs had to be done in the 19th century ...
                  And in the 20th century, the level of industrial development came to the need to have specialized technical universities.

                  This is the ABC of technical success.
                  1. ser56 3 March 2020 13: 09 New
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                    Quote: Sergey S.
                    This is the ABC of technical success.

                    I am a little versed in technical education due to the specifics of the work and I can reasonably say that you are mistaken! In short, the engineer’s education consists of 3 parts - a common foundation (mathematics, general physics, chemistry, computer science), an engineering foundation (descriptive geometry, applied mechanics, thermophysics, TOE, special chapters of mathematics) and special subjects. So the first and second blocks are best given in a large university / faculty and only the third in the department ...
                    By the way, overseas technical universities are large or part of just universities ...
                    1. Sergey S. 3 March 2020 21: 17 New
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                      Quote: ser56
                      I am a little versed in technical education due to the specifics of the work and I can reasonably say that you are mistaken!

                      I apologize in advance for the pun ... They themselves substituted ...
                      In matters of education, due to the enormous cost of a possible mistake, one must understand it extremely correctly ...
                      You have spoken incorrectly about my mistakes. Either I'm not a professional, or I'm not mistaken.
                      Now to the point.
                      Quote: ser56
                      In short, the engineer’s education consists of 3 parts - a common foundation (mathematics, general physics, chemistry, computer science), an engineering foundation (descriptive geometry, applied mechanics, thermophysics, TOE, special chapters of mathematics) and special subjects. So the first and second blocks are best given in a large university / faculty and only the third in the department ...

                      That this happens ... You are right.
                      Especially often, this method of training specialists is implemented by Western universities.
                      In its pure form, it is implemented in the so-called Bologna system, when students of different specialties can consistently study in different universities, including in different countries ...
                      By the way, where education is not specific, for example, for the humanities, I do not mind, let yourself have fun ...
                      As for the training of techies, the intellectual elite of the motherland, in the best universities the graduating departments have been working with their students since the first semester.
                      In the USSR, in good universities, departments that teach foundation disciplines were largely staffed by graduates of their own university who were familiar with the objects of activity of graduates. This helped teachers find common topics for conversations with students, prepare assignments with an approach to their specialty ... Helped them gain credibility with students.
                      Now an enemy rule has appeared - the teacher in the subject must have a basic education. As a result, an army of university graduates appeared in technical universities: pure mathematicians, physicists, chemists ... who have no idea what kind of work their students will do in the future. As a result, these same general disciplines hang on the learning process ...
                      In addition, such disciplines as Descriptive Geometry, Engineering Graphics, Applied Mechanics, and Thermophysics have also, to some extent, turned into general education.
                      For a long time, the graduating departments have concentrated the entire professional foundation in disciplines such as "Theory of work processes .... (object)", "Design and strength calculations ... (object)".
                      By the way, it should be added that specialized Soviet universities were created with the participation of prominent industrial workers, including chief designers, who transferred from the factories to the heads of departments (which they themselves created).
                      Quote: ser56
                      By the way, overseas technical universities are large or part of just universities ...

                      Life has confirmed the correctness of the Soviet way of organization and work of universities. The success of the space program forced US congressmen to organize special hearings and study the experience of the USSR in education.
                      Today, as a result of instilling the Bologna process, the inability of schools to work with modern children, our education is left with memories ...

                      But according to foreign experts, the situation there is no better, even in Germany.
                      One hope - the Chinese and Vietnamese will save civilization on the planet ...
                      1. ser56 4 March 2020 13: 55 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Either I'm not a professional, or I'm not mistaken.

                        funny, especially to me, because I’ll leave anonymity ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        In the USSR, in good universities, departments that teach foundation disciplines were largely staffed by graduates of their own university,

                        but there is a second side - the creation of clans and the absence of a new one, or rather its prevention ... request
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        As a result, appeared in technical universities

                        do you teach hi My experience shows that you are mistaken ...
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        For a long time graduating departments all the professional basis

                        Universities are different, especially faculties ... repeat
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        including chief designers who switched from factories to

                        and were nominal, and all the work was done ... request
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Today, as a result of instilling the Bologna process, the inability of schools to work with modern children, our education is left with memories ...

                        horror story ... request
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Life has confirmed the correctness of the Soviet way of organization

                        it seems you did not live in the USSR ... hi
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        about according to foreign experts there the situation is no better, even in Germany.

                        whining about youth has a very long tradition ... bully
                      2. Sergey S. 5 March 2020 01: 44 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        it seems you did not live in the USSR ...

                        And what country did you live in, and what country do you live in now ...
                        Do not want to accept the information, your right.
                        But the successes of Soviet education are recognized all over the world.
                        It is a pity that in the homeland criticism replaces the desire for the best.
                      3. ser56 5 March 2020 13: 17 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        And what country did you live in, and what country do you live in now ...

                        I was born, graduated and worked in the USSR, I live and work in Russia! hi
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Do not want to accept the information, your right.

                        This applies to you to the same extent, however, I give reasons, and you are emotions ... request
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        But the successes of Soviet education are recognized all over the world.

                        oh, I heard a lot about this from the Time program and different meetings ... bully
                        I will say this - the level of education in the USSR was generally lower than in RI ... request
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        It is a pity that in the homeland criticism replaces the desire for the best.

                        you are sorry, knowledge of the flaws allows you to improve the situation, and varnishing of reality leads to degradation! see the fate of the USSR - everything was good in the reports, but in reality - not at all ... So you and your kind play on the side of the enemies of Russia hi
                      4. Sergey S. 6 March 2020 21: 10 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        you are sorry, knowledge of the flaws allows you to improve the situation, and varnishing of reality leads to degradation!

                        No need to feel sorry for me. What I deserve, I’ll get it. Like, and others ...
                        And the rest I agree completely.
                        Quote: ser56
                        see the fate of the USSR - everything was fine in the reports, but in reality - not at all ...

                        And I agree with that.
                        Quote: ser56
                        So you and others like you play on the side of the enemies of Russia

                        And here it’s the opposite.
                        The experience of victories and the collapse of the USSR suggests that. that no matter how well the engineers and workers work. whatever the best fleet in the world, do not create aviation and the army, there will be talkers who will deceive everything, propagandize the lack of holes .... they will ruin the country.

                        Today it is time to already understand that the collapse of the USSR is not connected with the activities of professionals from science and industry.
                        The enemies of Russia are those who do not have experience in particularly complex industries, do not study particularly complex technologies and spread decadent rumors about the weakness of the homeland, including in previous years, corresponding to the pinnacle of political, military and industrial power.

                        And your statement about comparing education levels in the USSR and the Republic of Ingushetia is a silly fairy tale about the naked king.
                        Actually, we are interested in the level of education in modern Russia.
                        And here is the trouble.
                      5. ser56 7 March 2020 15: 38 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Today it is time to already understand that the collapse of the USSR is not connected with the activities of professionals from science and industry.

                        Seriously? and who drove 3 types of MBT? built 40 nuclear warheads and 000 nuclear submarines?
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        And your statement about comparing education levels in the USSR and the Republic of Ingushetia is a silly fairy tale about the naked king.

                        Not at all - just in the USSR there were other principles of education ... request For example - a labor school, evening, correspondence ... requirements on which were underestimated, but diplomas too ... forgot? request

                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Actually, we are interested in the level of education in modern Russia.
                        And here is the trouble.

                        I didn’t notice ... request
                      6. Sergey S. 7 March 2020 23: 11 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Actually, we are interested in the level of education in modern Russia.
                        And here is the trouble.

                        Did not notice ... request

                        Enter the factories, the timing of orders and the causes of marriage, study ....
                      7. ser56 8 March 2020 15: 23 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Enter the plants

                        they make me products - there are no special problems .. request
                      8. Sergey S. 8 March 2020 20: 32 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        they make me products - there are no special problems ..

                        You tell us about UDMZ ....
                      9. ser56 10 March 2020 13: 58 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        UDMZ

                        I know so many abbreviations ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        tell me ....

                        I'm talking about my experience! unlike Soviet conditions, new technologies are now available - for example, laser cutting of sheet materials, or hydro-forming - these technologies allow us to design differently! I'm not talking about additive technologies, because until I use them myself ...
                      10. Sergey S. 10 March 2020 21: 07 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        for example, laser cutting of sheet materials, or hydro-forming - these technologies allow you to design differently!

                        1. UDMZ - Ural Diesel Engine Plant (Yekaterinburg).
                        2. How is it "laser cutting of sheet materials, or hydro-forming - these technologies allow us to design differently"? I will explain. These procedures do not give surface hardening. the parts made with their use will be of the same size ... These technologies, basically. do not affect the design and design process. but on labor productivity and the organization of the technological process.
                        3. Your example is not clear why - there is a historical process. Only.
                        But Russia over the past decade has practically lost ship diesel engineering .... We do not have many other engineering products ...
                        How many tears shed about the delays of the shipbuilding program ...
                        About the Urals "hotel" - "Armata" even uncomfortable to remember ...
                        And here, additive or some other most modern technologies, how many ostentatiously do not implement, cannot have a decisive influence.
                        We need system-brazovanny engineers who are able to be responsible for the final result. The main designers are almost exhausted. And almost everywhere they were replaced by managers who, in addition to slogans, do not generate anything ...
                        6. Very sad ... when immersed in the problems of real mechanical engineering ...
                      11. ser56 11 March 2020 13: 47 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        I will explain

                        but in vain .... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        These procedures do not give surface hardening.

                        these are dimensional processing technologies ... request If it’s not a secret - according to you, when turning or milling, does the surface harden / recrystallize? bully But with laser melting, no? Do you show your "knowledge" to? repeat
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        These technologies, basically. do not affect the design and design process. but on labor productivity and the organization of the technological process.
                        hmm ... and you still nostalgic fabrications of education, please write ...
                        Do you have any idea of ​​the limitations of milling large parts? and compare this to laser cutting ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        And here, additive or some other most modern technologies, how many ostentatiously do not implement, cannot have a decisive influence.

                        I'm too lazy to explain the banalities to you ... hi
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        We need system-brazovanny engineers who are able to be responsible for the final result

                        therefore, they built several types of ships of the same purpose in the USSR at the same time ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Very sad...

                        to give a handkerchief? wink
                      12. Sergey S. 11 March 2020 22: 22 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        These procedures do not give surface hardening.

                        these are dimensional processing technologies ...

                        And what did you say ... banalities that do not belong to the meaning ...
                        Who is against the exact cutting ...
                        This is the routine of production. The meaning of what I wrote - laser or waterjet cutting - is a reality, but not revolutionary ... they have a minimal impact on the quality of the product.
                        As a result, the properties of materials do not improve, surface hardening technologies are not canceled.
                        Today it has already become a reality, production is equipped with new equipment, and the quality of products from this not only does not improve, and sometimes even falls ...
                        I tried to write about this.

                        As I understand it, you have nothing to do with complex engineering products.
                        I suppose that the projects were not handed over to the Customer either, the products were not tested ...
                        They did not answer for the final result ...
                        The last paragraph is not quite correct, but after
                        Quote: ser56
                        to give a handkerchief? wink

                        I consider it appropriate.
                        And I am very surprised that you are not worried about domestic engineering.
                      13. ser56 12 March 2020 09: 53 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        platitudes not relevant ...

                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        These procedures do not give surface hardening. Details

                        deal with yourself ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        reality, but not revolutionary ... have a minimal impact on product quality.

                        Seriously? try milling openwork parts made of copper or plexiglass ... hi
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Today it has already become a reality, production is equipped with new equipment, and the quality of products from this not only does not improve, and sometimes even falls ...

                        such productions take off from the market ...
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        As I understand it to complex engineering products

                        You are mistaken ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        I suppose that the projects were not handed over to the Customer, the products were not tested ..

                        My products are supplied by the RF Ministry of Defense ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        And I am very surprised that you are not worried about domestic engineering.

                        I work! hi
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        surface hardening technologies are not canceled.

                        listen - do not show illiteracy so explicitly - I wrote to you earlier:
                        Quote: ser56
                        If it’s not a secret - according to you, when turning or milling, does the surface harden / recrystallize? bully And when laser melting - no? Do you show your "knowledge" to?

                        if you don’t understand, I don’t see any point in writing ... hi
                      14. Sergey S. 12 March 2020 22: 01 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        Seriously? try milling openwork parts made of copper or plexiglass ...

                        You can also apply forging, die forging, electroerosion, casting ...
                        Quote: ser56
                        such productions take off from the market ...

                        So are you from the market? .... And I, a sinful thing, you thought from a serious production.
                      15. ser56 13 March 2020 11: 25 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        You can also apply forging, die forging, electroerosion, casting ...

                        Hmm, do you even realize what you wrote? bully
                        plexiglass forging? or its (fine dielectric) EDM? laughing
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        So are you from the market? .... And I, a sinful thing, you thought from a serious production.

                        Hmm, but I was still trying to explain something to you - I was wasting my time ... repeat
                      16. Sergey S. 13 March 2020 23: 06 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        plexiglass forging?

                        I assume that you are an electrical engineer or something nearby ...
                      17. ser56 14 March 2020 16: 14 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        I assume that you are an electrical engineer or something nearby ...

                        I have written in my profiles my specialty is an engineer-physicist ... bully
                      18. Sergey S. 14 March 2020 18: 50 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        I have written in my profiles my specialty is an engineer-physicist ...

                        Here I am about the same thing - not a mechanic or technologist ...

                        PS
                        As a joke.
                        How is a physicist different from an engineer?
                        Physics is interested in phenomena and what is associated with them.
                        In his scientific activity, the physicist "cleans" the studied product from external influences (for example, filtering interference ...).
                        And the engineer (classic mechanical engineer) when creating the product takes into account all possible external influences, including those that may occur during the life cycle, including when used in areas not specified in the technical task.

                        PPS.
                        In my opinion, it's time to put up ...
                      19. ser56 16 March 2020 14: 08 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        not a mechanic or technologist ...

                        I studied applied mechanics, and you studied nuclear physics? bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        How is a physicist different from an engineer?

                        I’m a physical engineer, and watching on a network of clowns who want to process dielectrics with electroerosion or forge them is funny ... bully
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        for example, noise filtering ....).

                        well, when an illiterate mechanic begins to joke about related areas, it doesn’t even occur to him that interference is the task of radio engineers ... request
                      20. Sergey S. 17 March 2020 01: 25 New
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                        Quote: ser56
                        well, when an illiterate mechanic begins to joke about related areas, it doesn’t even occur to him that interference is the task of radio engineers ...

                        Are you talking about electromagnetic compatibility ???
                        Physicist !!!!
                      21. ser56 17 March 2020 11: 13 New
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                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Are you talking about electromagnetic compatibility ???

                        exactly! radio engineers are doing this ...
                        Quote: Sergey S.
                        Physicist !!!!

                        Do you have problems reading and understanding texts? request Physicists teach at school, and I'm a physics engineer! hi
                  2. ser56 16 March 2020 14: 15 New
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                    Quote: Sergey S.
                    And the engineer (classic mechanical engineer) when creating the product takes into account all possible external influences, including those that may occur during the life cycle, including when used in areas not specified in the technical task.

                    1) Therefore, we have beautiful YaBCh, but mediocre ships ... request
                    2) Nuclear warheads are created only in Russia and from our components, and ships? request
                    3) Continue? crying
                  3. Sergey S. 17 March 2020 01: 28 New
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                    Quote: ser56
                    1) Therefore, we have beautiful JBL, but mediocre ships ... request
                    2) Nuclear warheads are created only in Russia and from our components, and ships? request
                    3) Continue? crying

                    Keep climbing into the barrel.
                    I'm not against.
                  4. ser56 17 March 2020 11: 14 New
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                    Quote: Sergey S.
                    Keep climbing into the barrel.
                    I'm not against.

                    I am too lazy to flog you further with rods of knowledge ... and flood it ... hi
  • Sergey S. 22 February 2020 23: 46 New
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    Quote: ser56
    Can I have some examples?

    A few examples can be ...
    1. In general, the construction of the fleet. Everything is not on time. A lot with deception in terms of parameters, cost, timing. Just a disaster with the construction of submarines such as Bars. Battleships of the Sevastopol type did not even receive a final acceptance certificate, although this example has some objective reasons.
    2. In general, all energy (power) installations. Diesel engines are a complete failure of the Ludwig Nobel factory. They promised to deliver 1320 hp diesel engines to Barça, but actually put diesel engines with 250 hp, in particular to Panther. Diesels 1320 with the help of the company "Vickers" made in the amount of only 2 submarines. Moreover, their real power was not more than 700 hp, and at the same time they smoked heavily.
    3. Novik-type destroyers with Russian-made power did not have the speed of a lead ship with German boilers and turbines. Although here you can try to find an excuse.
    4. Russia was practically without aviation. that is, Russian planes were an order of magnitude smaller than German ones. And on the part of the engines - if not for the allies, we would not have any aviation units ...
    5. Deepening ... Despite the natural wealth of Russia, bearing alloys during the First World War were 90% imported, and rolling bearings were imported 100%.
    6. You can still remember about the period of shell hunger, attempts to arm themselves with placing orders in Germany, essentially arming the enemy, but they did not even know about new projects of Russian tanks of this period in the troops ... Although orders for tanks were issued ... remember rogue Lebedenko.
    1. irontom 23 February 2020 13: 05 New
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      Regarding tanks, Colonel Gulkevich submitted a proposal for booking a tractor in the spring of the 15th, in the 16th he began to build an armored tractor on the Alice-chames chassis at his own expense, so Akhtyrets remained in the singular.
    2. ser56 2 March 2020 14: 57 New
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      Quote: Sergey S.
      In general, the construction of the fleet. Everything is not on time. Much with deception in terms of parameters, cost, timing

      comparable with the USSR? Especially in the 30s? request
      Quote: Sergey S.
      Just a disaster with the construction of submarines such as Bars.

      comparable to submarines of types P, M?
      Quote: Sergey S.
      Battleships of the Sevastopol type did not even receive a final acceptance certificate, although this example has some objective reasons

      Did it affect combat readiness? Do not voice to me the LC put into operation under the USSR? But RI and Ismail would be completed, while their projects, and not fraudulently peeped from the Germans ... request
      Quote: Sergey S.
      Diesel engines are a complete failure of the Ludwig Nobel factory.

      remember - where in the USSR diesel engines?
      Quote: Sergey S.
      with the energy of Russian production did not have the speed of the lead ship with German boilers and turbines

      But Novik was a Russian project, and 7s were bought from Italians, built with overload and insufficient strength ... and 7bis came with Vickers turbines ... request
      Quote: Sergey S.
      Russia was practically without aviation. that is, there were an order of magnitude less Russian planes than German ones

      But they had their own aircraft ... AB in the USSR appeared only in the 70s ... request
      Quote: Sergey S.
      And on the part of the engines - if not for the allies, we would not have any aviation units ...

      remind about land lease?
      Quote: Sergey S.
      90% of the First World War were imported, and rolling bearings were 100% imported.

      while the RIA retreated to Riga, and the Red Army to the Volga ... request
      Quote: Sergey S.
      You can also recall the period of shell hunger

      therefore, tsarist 3dm shells fired at WWII ... request
      By the way - in WWII as was the case with shells? repeat
      Quote: Sergey S.
      projects of Russian tanks of this period in the troops did not even know

      were there many in Germany?
      1. Sergey S. 3 March 2020 08: 39 New
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        Quote: ser56
        remember - where in the USSR diesel engines?

        As a typical answer to everything at once.
        Unlike tsarist Russia, the USSR correctly assessed its real capabilities.
        And they found ways to solve problems that satisfied both the timing and the future.

        Now about the diesels.
        These are two plants - Russian Diesel and Kolomensky.
        The scheme was simple.
        Purchased a license. as a rule, MAN companies, along with it they bought several diesels for head submarines.
        While the boats were being built, diesel plants were mastering the licenses, and the domestic diesel engines were already on the boats of the series no later than the fourth.
        Moreover, on the latest projects before World War II, diesel engines were no longer licensed, but their own.
        That is, by the end of the 1930s, diesel engineers of the USSR themselves were already creating new diesel engines.
        The heyday of the domestic diesel industry in the 1940s - 1960s is a vivid example of this.
  • Simargl 25 February 2020 08: 31 New
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    Quote: ser56
    what nonsense? remind you, where did Polycarp, Korolev, Miles, Tupolev get their education?
    Correctly! Yes, the same Lomonosov, Kulibin - half self-taught. True, these are people who stand in a special order, and for the movement of science and progress, thousands are needed.
    Polikarpov, Korolev, Miles, Tupolev ... Polikarpov, Miles and Tupolev would have built U-2 planes without thousands of engineers, without education. And Korolev would remain a dreamer ...
    1. ser56 2 March 2020 15: 01 New
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      Quote: Simargl
      that is how U-2 level aircraft would be built without thousands of engineers, without education

      1) U-2 was created much later ...
      2) Polikarpov worked at an aircraft factory and built his teacher Grigorovich's amphibian aircraft in St. Petersburg ... you would read, otherwise you repeat Agitprop .. request
      .
      1. Simargl 3 March 2020 15: 02 New
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        Quote: ser56
        U-2 was created much later ...
        I have a word there level there is. You can understand that even the U-2 is difficult to manufacture without engineers.

        Quote: ser56
        you would read, otherwise Agitprop repeats ..
        Which agitprop? Polikarpov had an engineering degree. I argue that without education (this is such a set of measures to educate the population) and (as a result) the availability of engineers, the same Polikarpov was able to build only the simplest things (and at the same time he would have to conduct his own educational program).
        So put the mention of manuals and propaganda under your desk - out of place they are in this case.
        1. ser56 3 March 2020 16: 25 New
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          Quote: Simargl
          There I have a level word.

          extremely slippery definition ...
          Quote: Simargl
          even the U-2 is difficult to manufacture without engineers.

          It can neither be created nor produced without engineers ... request
          Quote: Simargl
          I affirm

          commonplace ... hi
          Quote: Simargl
          So put the mention of manuals and agitprop yourself under a hundred

          you are not mature enough for me to take your advice ... hi
  • Alexey RA 25 February 2020 11: 24 New
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    Quote: Sergey S.
    But only in terms of “Salzman” and “tank” can any letters be replaced, at least all, and the justice of the statements will not change from this.

    The real thing is the real level of education of specialists and workers.
    Too little time has passed since the start of industrialization. Do not have time ... to realize how to learn. why study, how much to study ...

    All this would be good if we talked about, say, KhPZ, where the personnel problem was critical. But Zaltsman led the LKZ. The flagship of the domestic tank industry and the factory with the best personnel in the country. Thus LKZ, which made the average tank at a speed of almost 60 km / h and produced it in series.
    And what level of education do designers need to have to understand that if the suspension and transmission are designed for 40 tons, and the tank weighs more than 46 tons, then it won’t end in good? Or that it is impossible to ignore the requirements of the customer to eliminate the shortcomings of the tank they created?
    Quote: Sergey S.
    If you had done by book. and endlessly licked all the imperfections and all the reasons for the marriage, when we managed to organize mass production and at least some kind of combat training for the crews?

    The problem is that tanks are needed not only for study. How to fight in a tank with a cooling system boiling at a speed above 20 km / h, the tower does not turn during the roll, when braking, it can jam the brake on one side - and the tank flies out of the way? Oh yes, when marching along a dirt road, every half hour the tank should stop to replace the air filter. The same filter that passes dust into the engine, but at the same time limits the engine power due to insufficient air throughput.
    In fact of the matter. that in addition to deficiencies on the HF there were critical design flaws that impeded the normal combat use of the tank.
    1. Sergey S. 25 February 2020 23: 18 New
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      Quote: Alexey RA
      And what level of education do designers need to have ...

      You write the right words.
      Almost always agree with you.
      But the right words may not be complete.
      And here is the very case.
      I am sure that if in the actions of Zaltsman there was even a grain of egoism, he would not have survived.
      He was surrounded not only by the old Putilov workers, but also young Chekists who did not have a strict education, but diligent servants ... What you write is the action that would lead many to the Gulag, or even worse. I am sure that Zaltsman was saved only by the fact that he himself. and the people around him sincerely understood the situation, much as I am trying to explain, without reason for the accusations of specific leaders, and relying on state interests.
      In the end, it was precisely this approach to production that significantly contributed to the Victory in the Great Patriotic War.
      At least it seems to me like this.
      1. ser56 2 March 2020 15: 03 New
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        Quote: Sergey S.
        it was this approach to production that significantly contributed to the Victory in the Great Patriotic War.

        That is why the IVS began to imprison air force and aircraft industry commanders after the Second World War? request
    2. ser56 2 March 2020 15: 05 New
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      Quote: Alexey RA
      then on HF, in addition to deficiencies, there were critical design flaws that hindered the normal combat use of the tank.

      and on the T-34, too - and this was understandable BEFORE the war! And there was a T-34M project ... well, they would have made not 1300 T-34, but 650 T-34M until 22.06.41 - would there be a difference? But the fighting efficiency would be higher ...
  • Dmitry V. 25 February 2020 10: 53 New
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    Quote: Alexey RA
    Moreover, they faked so crudely that the fake was visible to the naked eye: the form was dated at a later date than the date of the "signing" of the act written on it.


    Well, there is a tank without a turret turning motor or without some components - they were not submitted to the warehouse by suppliers, so what? The tank was produced this month, but with a 3-5 day delay it will be understaffed and accepted, transferred to the reserve regiment - what month is it released?
    If in the previous month 1700 man-hours were spent on it, and in the next 17?
    What do you find fault with the little things of the Soviet bureaucratic machine?

    Zaltsman was adapted for an article in 1949, only because the system was always and everywhere violated before and after Salzman.
    And Zaltsman’s merit was that he was able to organize mass production of tanks where neither his predecessors nor his followers could cope - even if you had overloaded capacities in the workshops or teenagers or pensioners or women, and you owe them good health to demand performance and quality for men - organizational talent is needed here and Salzman had it.
    1. Alexey RA 25 February 2020 11: 27 New
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      Quote: Dmitry Vladimirovich
      Well, there is a tank without a turret turning motor or without some components - they were not submitted to the warehouse by suppliers, so what? The tank was produced this month, but with a 3-5 day delay it will be understaffed and accepted, transferred to the reserve regiment - what month is it released?

      In the July report, the KZ director announced the release of 15 KV in July; in fact, only 5 tanks were delivered to the ABTU KA this month. The remaining 10 were not finished production. Their completion and surrender to the military representative continued until August 22-24.

      Tanks formally surrendered in July, the army actually could not get another month. ICH, they were handed over all the same incomplete.
  • Essex62 21 February 2020 11: 15 New
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    Is this documented? Or the stuffing is the descritation of Stalin and Soviet power? A lot of this, as if on the topic, skips
    1. maidan.izrailovich 21 February 2020 11: 44 New
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      Is this documented?

      Rezunov read. That sweep the blizzard ..
      19.09.1941/22.07.1941/XNUMX Zaltsman awarded the title Hero of Socialist Labor. And this is at the time of the most difficult battles. When for the slightest hint of wrecking no one was spared. General Pavlov Hero of the Soviet Union was shot dead XNUMX/XNUMX/XNUMX. And here the "scammer" Salzman is all in a marathon.
      1. EvilLion 21 February 2020 12: 52 New
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        With Pavlov betrayal, in full view. But was Zaltsman still to blame for the question, in the Stalinist USSR, people who had outgrown their level of competence were usually demoted to a position that a person could handle.
      2. Essex62 21 February 2020 15: 18 New
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        Surprising is the indulgence of the leader to a scammer. Somehow does not fit.
      3. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 15: 54 New
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        Quote: maidan.izrailovich
        Rezunov read. That sweep the blizzard ..

        Actually, uv wrote about the non-elimination of the LKZ structural defects of his tank M.N. Svirin. And he also quoted the letter of the military representative of Kalivoda.
        According to the materials of tests carried out for 10 months on 5 cars with a total mileage of 5.270 km, it can be seen that the characteristic defects that are repeated on each tested machine are:
        1. Bad air filter of the motor, the filter must be done different.
        2. The efficiency of the engine cooling system is low.
        3. Weak gearbox, you need to make a new one.
        4. Unreliable in-flight clutches.
        5. The brakes are incomplete (burn out, difficult to adjust).
        6. It is necessary to modify the chassis in the direction of its strengthening (rollers, tracks, torsion shaft).
        In addition, the machine has a number of major defects that do not affect its mobility, but reduce the combat qualities of the machine.
        1. The L-11 system, installed on a production vehicle, is rejected and approved for arming tanks temporarily.
        2. Ammunition should be redesigned to simplify and facilitate the ability to use them, as well as to increase ammunition.
        3. Weak shoulder straps under a normal tower, and even more so under a large tower. It must be strengthened.
        4. A large tower with the M-10 system, designed urgently during the period of the Finnish conflict, requires large alterations and improvements.
        5. Defective swivel mechanism and tower stopper. The tower rotates heavily, sticks, the motor does not pull, the stoppers do not hold.
        In addition to the above, the machine has a lot of minor defects, flaws, deviations from the drawings, which are not worth talking about ...
        (...)
        I believe that at the moment it is impossible to call the car combat-ready due to the above defects. You can send her to the army only as a training, not a combat
        © military representative of the Kirov plant military engineer 3rd rank Kalivoda
      4. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 08 New
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        Quote: maidan.izrailovich
        General Pavlov Hero of the Soviet Union was shot dead 22.07.1941/XNUMX/XNUMX.

        Appointed as a switchman for the mistakes of the country's leadership ...
        Quote: maidan.izrailovich
        And here the "scammer" Salzman is in a marathon.

        and who knew about the defects - tankers at the front, and far from them to the Kremlin ... and even anti-Soviet propaganda could be sewn for stories about defects ...
        1. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 18: 52 New
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          Quote: ser56
          and who knew about the defects - tankers at the front, and far from them to the Kremlin ... and even anti-Soviet propaganda could be sewn for stories about defects ...

          Stories are trifles. It came to refusal to accept tanks in units.
          And what touching letters the tankers wrote to the chief designers ...
          TO THE CHIEF CONSTRUCTOR OF TANK ENGINEERING TO GENERAL MAJOR TECHNICAL TROOPS Comrade KOTIN
          Your article "TANKS" in the newspaper Pravda dated 5.XI.42, No. 309 (9080), did not arouse in me a feeling of satisfaction and enthusiasm.
          The reader, the Soviet reader, believes in the central organ of our Great Party, LENIN-STALIN, for he knows that the word of truth is printed in it.
          And you, the reader, deceived him, since he does not know the subtleties of the design of the tank.
          I know in advance how you will respond to this letter, nevertheless I decided to write it with the last hope that maybe after that you will get down to broadcasting things. And not only you, but also the chief and leading designers led by you, the same from declarations and promises will go on to real creativity.
          Perhaps I misunderstood your article, allow me to understand its contents.
          1. "... OUR TANKS SHOWED MYSELF IN BATTLES, AS MACHINES, I WOULD SAVE A SPECIAL, NEW TYPE."
          What is the effect of this "special, new type of tank"? The fact is that from the very first days of the war, almost every unit sent brigades of workers from factories, with wagons of spare parts. Why? Because the tanks on the march became technical failures.
          Could it be better now? No.
          During the march, 100-150 km. in three mechanized corps, due to technical malfunctions, 270 tanks were repaired.
          In one of the Armies, up to 100 tanks were damaged by diesels; after the marches on the Stalingrad and Voronezh front, malfunctions in buildings of 25-30 tanks failed.
          2. "IT WAS TO BE DRAWN, MAKE A BIG LEAP FORWARD. THIS AND LEAD TO CREATION OF MACHINES OF TYPE" KV "," T-34 "AND A ROW OF OTHERS. THIS IS A MACHINE OF A NEW TYPE"
          "..... CONSTRUCTORS BREAKED WITH THE TANKS OF FORMER, OLD TYPES, WITH IMITATION ABROAD. AND DARK EXIT ON A NEW ROAD."
          What is expressed in “daring”? The fact that the KV tank was made with torsion bar suspension and both tanks (KV and T-34) received more powerful armor and weapons.
          Have you resolved the issues of using these advantages in battle? No. The dynamics of the tanks did not increase, but the speed decreased - if only because the speeds had to be switched together. Visibility from the tank remained limited, the crew’s tightness was the same (T-34) and even worse than the old ones. After a minor march, the crew instead of resting for battle sticks upside down from the tank and makes the inevitable adjustment of the mechanisms.
          So what was your daring?
          It is obvious that when in 1939 and 1940 you were asked to use the designs of Comrade BLAGONRAVOV and IVANOV - planetary transmissions for the KV tank - you considered it necessary to disdain them and ditch these proposals.
          And when the German T-2 tank was at the factory for 3-3 months, it was possible to make sure that your “daring”, “break with imitation abroad” and neglect of domestic offers brought you to the oldest, most ancient road.
          3. I willingly believe you that after meeting with Comrade STALIN, you "... left him armed with NEW THOUGHTS, IDEAS, ENRICHED WITH HIS WISE INSTRUCTIONS AND ADVICE."
          Your whole misfortune lies in the fact that you do not translate all this into a real tangible, material one. And from new thoughts and ideas alone, the quality, combat quality of the tank will never increase. In my opinion, you understand this very well.
          (...)
          You take advantage of the incredible patience of our tankers who are ready to put up with any inconvenience just to beat and destroy the despicable fascists.
          (...)
          HEAD OF BTU GABTU OF THE RED ARMY
          COLONEL ENGINEER
          Afonin

          https://kris-reid.livejournal.com/435238.html

          As noted in the comments
          Feels Comrade Afonin would like to get to Comrade Throat. Kotina.
          1. ser56 22 February 2020 15: 56 New
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            yes, the letter is honest! well done colonel - did not eat?
            1. Serg koma 24 February 2020 20: 17 New
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              Quote: ser56
              well done colonel - did not eat?


              Afonin Semyon Anisimovich
              19.08.1900-17.08.1944
              August 17, 1944 died in a car accident. He was buried in Moscow at the Novodevichy cemetery.
              Military ranks: 1st rank military engineer, colonel engineer, general-major of ITS (SNK Resolution No. 900 of 21.08.1943).
              Awards: Order of Lenin (15.12.1943/13.09.1945/1938), Order of the Patriotic War I degree (1942/XNUMX/XNUMX, posthumous), two Orders of the Red Star (XNUMX, XNUMX). Medal "XX years of the Red Army".
              1. ser56 2 March 2020 15: 07 New
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                thank! in the photo a serious man ...
        2. hohol95 21 February 2020 23: 31 New
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          and who knew about the defects - tankers at the front, and far from them to the Kremlin ... and even anti-Soviet propaganda could be sewn for stories about defects ...

          Mikhail Baryatinsky
          T-34 IN BATTLE
          ... The quality of the Sormovo tanks left much to be desired. In this connection, it would be appropriate to quote the words of Stalin, who wrote to V. Malyshev in June 1942: “... and in conclusion, Comrade Malyshev, I really want to hope that you will finally be able to do something with the“ Sormovsky freak ”on which they are afraid fight our tankmen ... "

          All the necessary information reached even the most ...
    2. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 15: 34 New
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      Quote: Essex62
      Is this documented? Or the stuffing is the descritation of Stalin and Soviet power? A lot of this, as if on the topic, skips

      For counterfeit documents:
      Secretly
      People’s Commissar of Heavy Engineering
      Comrade Efremov A.I.
      From September 9 to September 12 this year according to your assignment, I checked the correctness of the KV tanks at the Kirov Plant and established the following:
      Of the 15 tanks shown in the month of July, 10 were taken by the ABTU military representative under the seal only on August 22-23, this year; 3 of them were presented by the OTK workshop on August 1-2 of this year, and the acceptance mileage of 7 cars passed from August 1 to August 10.
      It is established that in the period from August 7 to August 19 this year in defective acts of the Quality Control Department for each machine from 16 to 40 defects are indicated. As a result of this, the machines returned 2-3 times for correction.
      From the attached copies of the defective statements and the change table, it can be seen that 10 cars were in production for a significant part of the month of August. This is also confirmed by oral reports from the head of the Quality Department of the assembly shop. Ertman, Head of Division 1 — Comrade Landsberg and the head of the assembly shop - Comrade. Abramova. In this case, the head of the tank department Comrade. Landsberg stated that there was allegedly permission from the People's Commissariat to finish the July products and to sell them during the month of August.
      Acts of delivery of cars of the July issue were signed by the Head of the Quality Control Department of the shop, the head of the 1st department and the head of the assembly shop on the days of delivery of cars under the seal to the military representative of ABTU, i.e. dated 23.08; the military representative of ABTU, Comrade Shpitanov, did not sign these acts with the date “23.08”, but instructed the secretary of the production department to clean these dates and print a new “31.07”, which was printed in the secret department of the plant. At the same time, the previously signed acts of Comrade Landsberg and Comrade Abramov were not informed of the correction of the date of registration of the products.
      The clean-up on the acts is clearly visible and, in addition, on these acts there is a date from the preparation by the typist of the Secret Department - “06.08”.
      Of the 22 August cars, only 8 were actually delivered in August; 10 cars were presented to the military representative starting from the 1st to 06.09. At the same time, from September 1 to September 3, defective statements for these vehicles were compiled by OTC personnel and military acceptance technicians.
      The cars handed over under the seal on September 10.09 were not fully equipped with an irreplaceable spare parts. The delivery certificates for the August issue until September 12.09 have not yet been issued. Acts on only 4 cars were signed only by the head of the Quality Department of the assembly shop with the date "06.09". This also confirms the abnormal situation with products being sold at the Kirov Plant.
      (...)
      Head of the Military Department of the NKTM Blokhin
      18.10.1940
      1. Essex62 21 February 2020 15: 52 New
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        Where in this document is Comrade Salzman systematically persecuted marriage stealing products of factory workers? That the act of acceptance was falsified, this practice flourished in the late USSR. People plowed for salaries, but also for rations during the war. And embezzlers under any authority were and will be. Only during the Soviet era it’s easier to take them by the ass, with a ban on enrichment, you can immediately see that a grabber lives beyond his means.
        1. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 16: 02 New
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          Quote: Essex62
          Where in this document is Comrade Salzman systematically persecuted marriage stealing products of factory workers?

          Really good again King directors deceived the insidious boyars shop managers and quality control department? But Zaltsman himself did not know, either by sleep or spirit, that his plant was frustrating the plan, turning in tanks retroactively, and even driving tanks for the year, suitable only as training tanks? wink
          Quote: Essex62
          That the act of acceptance was falsified, this practice flourished in the late USSR. People plowed for salaries, but also for rations during the war.

          Yeah ... and then according to the documents in the army there are tanks, but in fact they are still at the factory for two more months.
          1. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 10 New
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            Quote: Alexey RA
            and then according to documents in the army there are tanks,

            and they are taken into account in operational plans ... and even 20-30 kW is a force ... see Kolobanova ...
          2. Essex62 25 February 2020 11: 17 New
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            The trouble is, someone is arguing. Vissarinich was not sinless, only a man. Look Nikita overlooked and he dirtied everything. But the result is in our favor. Such a beast was mastered. The price is terrible!
          3. Dmitry V. 25 February 2020 14: 30 New
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            Quote: Alexey RA
            Yeah ... and then according to the documents in the army there are tanks, but in fact they are still at the factory for two more months.


            And why would it?
            Good for the development of new products, it takes three to five times more time.
            And in the USSR they say to you - “it was necessary yesterday”.
            "Do as you want," but you won’t do it - a prison, camp, execution ... choose as they say ...
            Therefore, they drove the shaft, and the quality - then, if they have time.
            The fact that the production plan was lowered from above from normative calculations, and not from factory realities, did not proceed from the possibilities of production — hence the decline in quality in the USSR.

            And it was everywhere - in aviation it is similar.
            That this is Comrade Stalin flew to the Tehran Conference on the S-47, and not on the domestic Li-2?
            I was not, I understood the capabilities of the USSR military factories.
            It’s one thing Molotov needed to send to Pe-8 to England and Pusep brought on three engines ... another thing is to fly Baku-Tehran himself 500 km.
            On American engines it was calmer to get to the S-47 itself, Stalin was far from there - he received accident reports.

            And on acceptance of tanks - it’s generally expanse here, a tank cannot fall from the sky - and if something is broken - you can put it on the crew - they say they’re getting dumb with new equipment, you can see that the crew will finish it, something will be silenced by trifles, something factory warranties will fix .

            Moreover, the ChTZ guarantee companies still do not live quietly - they complete production flaws as they did twenty years ago - and in the Second World War.
            1. victor50 27 February 2020 11: 36 New
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              Quote: Dmitry Vladimirovich
              Lee-xnumx

              Quote: Dmitry Vladimirovich
              And in the USSR they say to you - “it was necessary yesterday”.
              "Do as you want," but you won’t do it - a prison, camp, execution ... choose as they say ...

              Li-2 is not domestic. Licensed.
              And, perhaps, first of all, because the lag is 100 years old, it was necessary to go through 10, otherwise they would crush it. Hence all the threats of repression that you painted.
    3. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 15: 37 New
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      Quote: Essex62
      Is this documented? Or the stuffing is the descritation of Stalin and Soviet power? A lot of this, as if on the topic, skips

      It all started with a letter from the military representative to the LKZ about the plant’s failure to eliminate within 10 months the deficiencies identified by the results of the first HF test:
      https://mihalchuk-1974.livejournal.com/82531.html
      They responded to the letter - Mehlis sent a commission. The results of the commission’s work confirmed everything the military representative wrote about:
      In connection with a letter sent to my name by a military engineer, Comrade Kalivoda (former military representative of the ABTU KA at the Kirov Plant), in which he said that KV tanks had serious design flaws, the People's Commissariat of State Control, in agreement with Comrade Voroshilov, checked the production at the Kirov Plant KV tanks. As a result, the following was established.
      The guaranteed mileage established for HF in 2000 km for individual units and assemblies is not maintained, which is confirmed by a number of tests carried out by the plant.
      KV gearbox does not have sufficient strength ... Introduced in August this year in the design of the gearbox, the lock fixing the position of the gears reduces the possibility of emergency breakdowns, however, the strength of the gearbox itself is still unsatisfactory. In October, the plant received an act of complaint from the military unit, which stated that in the tank No. 3622 (adopted by the military representative on September 3), the intermediate shaft of the gearbox was twisted and the tapered bearing was destroyed.
      The HF cooling system does not ensure the normal operation of the engine due to the high temperatures of water and oil in the radiator. On-board friction clutches fail due to overheating due to poor lubrication of the friction clutch bearings. The labyrinth seal introduced by the factory does not hold grease.
      In tanks KV No. 3652, 3653, which passed control tests with mileage and were accepted by the military representative in September, when preparing to ship them to the military unit, a leak was detected through the oil seals of final drives.
      The engine air filter does not provide normal cleaning of air from dust, as a result of which the engine refuses to work when driving along a dusty dirt road.
      Drawings and technical specifications (TU) for the manufacture and acceptance of KV tanks by the factory have not yet been fully developed and the ABTU KA has not been approved. The lack of approved drawings and technical specifications complicates the work of military acceptance and hinders the deployment of mass production.
      It is especially necessary to note the presence of the main design flaws of HF to be eliminated as soon as possible:
      1) insufficient engine runtime without repair (80-100 hours), which reduces the combat effectiveness of the tank;
      2) poor visibility from the tank, inferior to medium German tanks;
      3) the difficulty of controlling a tank in battle.
      The audit also established the facts of illegal execution of acceptance and delivery of unfinished production of KV tanks.
    4. your1970 21 February 2020 18: 15 New
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      Quote: Essex62
      Is this documented? Or the stuffing is the descritation of Stalin and Soviet power? A lot of this, as if on the topic, skips
      -and you read about the lies of Zhigarev Stalin.
      “One of the days of April 1942, Stalin called Golovanov and asked if there were any planes delivered by the factories but not accepted by military specialists at the airfields. There weren’t any such planes, which was reported by Golovanov. After that, Stalin asked him to come.
      “Entering the office, I saw there the commander of the Air Force, General P. F. Zhigarev, something warmly proving to Stalin. After listening to the conversation, I realized that we are talking about a large number of aircraft standing at the factory airfields. These aircraft were allegedly presented for military acceptance, but were not accepted, as they said then, “by battle”, that is, they were not combat-ready, had various technical defects.
      The general finished his speech with the words:
      And Shakhurin (People's Commissar of the aviation industry. - A. G.) is lying to you, Comrade Stalin.
      “Well, let's call Shakhurin,” said Stalin. He pressed the button - entered Poskrebyshev. “Ask Shakhurin to come,” Stalin ordered.
      Coming up to me, Stalin asked if I knew for sure that there were no aircraft on board, but no aircraft for ADD. I reported that the chief engineer of the ADD assured me: there are no such aircraft.
      ... After a few minutes, A. I. Shakhurin appeared, greeted and stopped, looking inquiringly at Stalin. Here they assure us, ”said Stalin,“ that the seven hundred aircraft that you spoke to me about at the airfields of the factories not because there are no pilots, but because they are not ready for combat, therefore they are not accepted by military representatives, and that pilots have been waiting there for months.
      “This is not true, Comrade Stalin,” answered Shahurin.
      “You see how it turns out: Shakhurin says that there are planes, but no pilots, and Zhigarev says that there are pilots, but no planes.” Do you both understand that seven hundred planes are not seven planes? You know that the front needs them, and here the whole army. What will we do, which of you to believe? Asked Stalin.
      Silence reigned. I followed the conversation with curiosity and amazement: is it really true that as many as seven hundred aircraft are at the aerodromes of factories, even if not ready for battle or due to a lack of pilots? I have never heard of so many planes located at the aerodromes of factories. I looked at Shakhurin, then at Zhigarev. Which of them is right?
      ... And then came Zhigarev's confident voice:
      - I am responsible, Comrade Stalin, reporting that the planes in the factories are not ready for battle.
      - What do you say? - turned Stalin to Shakhurin.
      “After all, it is easy to check, Comrade Stalin,” he answered. “You have straight wires here.” Give the task that you personally, each factory director reported on the number of combat-ready aircraft. We add these numbers and get the total number.
      - Perhaps, correctly. So let's do it, ”Stalin agreed. Zhigarev intervened in the dialogue:
      - It is imperative that the telegrams along with the directors of the factories sign and military representatives.
      “That is also correct,” said Stalin.
      He called Poskrebyshev and gave him instructions. Zhigarev asked Stalin to call General N.P. Seleznev, who was in charge of orders at the plants. Soon, Seleznev arrived, and he was given the task of calculating how many planes are at the aerodromes of factories.
      I must say that the organization of communication, Stalin was excellent. Very little time passed, and telegrams from the factories signed by the directors and military representatives were put on the table. He finished the counting and General Seleznev, who did not know about the conversations that were conducted before him.
      - How many planes are in factories? - turned Stalin to Poskrebyshev.
      Seven hundred and one He answered.
      - And you? - Stalin asked, turning to Seleznev.
      “I got seven hundred and two,” answered Seleznev.
      - Why they are not overtaken? - again, turning to Seleznev, Stalin asked.
      “Because there are no crews,” answered Seleznev.
      The answer, and most importantly, his intonation did not cause any doubt that the lack of crews in the factories is a question that has long been known.
      The case was clearly unprecedented. Something will be now ?! I looked at Stalin. He was pale and looked with wide open eyes at Zhigarev, apparently with difficulty comprehending what had happened. It was felt that he was stunned not by why such a huge number of aircraft are still not at the front, that he knew that only the reasons were not established, and that conviction and confidence with which the general spoke a lie.
      Finally, Stalin's face turned pink, it was clear that he had pulled himself together. Turning to A.I. Shakhurin and N.P. Seleznev, he thanked them and said goodbye. I wanted to follow their example, but Stalin motioned to stop me. He walked slowly to the general. His hand began to rise. "Really hit? "- flashed through my mind.
      - A scoundrel! - with an expression of profound contempt, said Stalin and lowered his hand. - Get out!


      Shot ?? yeah schaz ... left for the rear in the Far East, remained a general ....
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. your1970 21 February 2020 19: 21 New
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          Quote: karabass
          maybe the planes were really defective, it was just scary to answer Stalin
          Quote: your1970
          Approaching me, Stalin asked if I knew for sure that there weren’t presented but unaccepted aircraft for ADD. I reported that the chief engineer of ADD assured me: no such aircraft.


          you did not appreciate the scope - 700 (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) aircraft standing in the factories ... and for what reason ... if only the 100th share of what is attributed to the "bloodthirsty Stalin" would be true - there would be Zhikharev’s corpses (for the crews and lies in the eyes), Shakhurin (for disruption of supplies and unavailability of aircraft), Selezneva (for not report on such a wildest situation) ....

          I would definitely slap and my hand would not flinch when THOSE layouts
          1. The comment was deleted.
          2. Evil Booth 22 February 2020 09: 44 New
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            that's why he is totalitarianism: for 5 seeds, 5 years for 500 tanks, 0,5 premiums per month. Threat Germans lost under 20% of aircraft due to accidents associated with the design of the chassis and suffered for years, the panthers spontaneously ignited with a bang of dozens of% failing permanently BEFORE the battle. and Nitsche ... French bombs have not exploded for centuries since the eleventh and still. there’s one of the most vivid and proven examples of Argentinean anti-ship missiles from France
        2. Sergey S. 22 February 2020 06: 45 New
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          Quote: karabass
          I read somewhere that there were plenty of pilots in WWII

          ??
          And so they were prepared according to a truncated program with a scanty number of flight hours.
        3. volodimer 22 February 2020 11: 32 New
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          Because the French were invited to "Normandy." They were trained and with military experience, and after losses of the beginning of the war, we had graduates with a scanty raid and lack of experience.
          To prevent them from breaking in the first flight, experienced pilots were needed. They grew up by the year 43 and broke the Luftwaffe ridge on the Kuban.
          Airplanes were made quickly, but to get a good pilot, time is needed here. And it is possible that closer to the end of the war, the need to drive the untrained to the front simply disappeared, because they did not get to the war.
          And about the defectiveness of aircraft ... this is rather a myth, but the quality could be lame due to objective reasons, but no one would drive a frank marriage. And the described conversation does not mean anything. No crews ... what? Combat or those that just have to overtake aircraft from the factory to the unit? Two big differences. From America, aircraft were distilled by crews, which may not have been very like bombers or fighters, but they were specialists in navigational affairs. Their task was to deliver the plane to its destination in difficult weather and navigation conditions, but others used it for its intended purpose ... Pokryshkin for example hi
          1. your1970 22 February 2020 14: 20 New
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            Quote: volodimer
            And the described conversation does not mean anything. No crews ... what? Combat or those that just have to overtake aircraft from the factory to the unit?
            -packages .... that is, the presence of a commander of the ADD, the commander of the Air Force and the People’s Commissar of the aircraft industry during a conversation - are you not enough to understand the situation?

            Quote: volodimer
            it rather a myth, Yes, the quality could be lame due to objective reasons, but no one would drive a frank marriage.

            next article about cracks in tank armor
            "The first alarming calls about entering the T-34 unit with cracks were made in May 1942: complaints on 183 vehicles came to plant No. 13 this month, by 38 tanks in June, and by seventy-two T- in the first decade of July 34. The government could not be silent in this case, and on June 5 the GKO adopted a resolution “On improving the T-34 tanks.” At the same time, the USSR Procurator was instructed to investigate the reasons for such a decline in the quality of tanks ...
            And improving the quality of steelmaking at iron and steel enterprises allowed reduce the proportion of marriage from 56,25% (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) in 1942 to 13,30% in 1945. . "- yeah. no one would ... her, you human ...
            https://topwar.ru/168094-treschiny-v-brone-defektnye-t-34-dlja-fronta.html#
            1. volodimer 22 February 2020 14: 31 New
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              This is what causes doubts ... The ADD that we had at that time ... in all, released a couple of dozen PE-8s. ER, yes, there was more DB-3-IL-4 ... but also not so many. Well, LI-2 released a lot, but is 700 aircraft standing on the field?
              Well, I don’t believe ... It looks more like a fable ... My opinion.
              About tank armor ... I unsubscribed there hi
    5. Voltsky 21 February 2020 22: 04 New
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      Yes, of course, everything was invented just to slander :) Fear God, there were problems and this was documented ... Who exactly was guilty of this, the question is certainly debatable, but still.
      1. volodimer 22 February 2020 11: 41 New
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        I agree when there were not enough tanks and the SU-76 was driven into the attack ... They lowered the quality for the sake of quantity in the limit that was considered acceptable. It is better to go on the attack with the support of the tank than to wait when it is polished at the factory. In any article they write about the T-60, everything is weak in it ... but its presence at the end of 41 and the beginning of 42 raised the morale of the infantry. And the presence of the T-34 is multiple.
        1. Essex62 25 February 2020 11: 35 New
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          It was a huge number of released 34 ok that allowed to break the ridge of Nazism. Albeit with flaws, but these are tanks. The main striking force of the Red-Soviet Army. T-34 symbol of victory. As for the whole air army at the aerodromes of factories, no words. Hard to believe. And who didn’t they spank? Amazing facts (?) Pop up online.
  • Lamata 21 February 2020 06: 45 New
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    The author rakhmet, there were not many publications on such a topic. Not nice, but true.
  • polar fox 21 February 2020 06: 51 New
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    there is nothing surprising in this. not everyone understands the technology even now, and then not all education had it for granted ... worked at the VAZ, we replaced the chief technologist at the CEC (93-94), there was a man who did not hesitate to approach workers and discuss the production technology of some kind of novelty, at the same time he was distinguished by a phenomenal memory ... in his place they put a red long babushka-stupid (as they began to call), and so she ordered, in order to speed up the order, to cut titanium with volcanic rock .. .3 tons went to scrap. Saw then it was long. Sweat She had plenty of such tricks, a year later she was removed.
    1. Lamata 21 February 2020 08: 29 New
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      Women in leading techno posts are not good. Yes, and in a purely male team.
  • The leader of the Redskins 21 February 2020 07: 08 New
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    Very interesting. I heard before, but I couldn’t read with numbers ...
    And we still poke a finger into the hulls of the ukropovsky armored personnel carriers ...
    1. Ros 56 21 February 2020 08: 37 New
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      Like the redskin, when the T-34s were made and these days, nothing has changed in the banderlog, did you mean to say that?
    2. Mestny 21 February 2020 09: 27 New
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      These cases were made in the XXI century, using modern technologies in peacetime.
      Not at all in conditions when there is a war of extermination.
      So poke right.
      As for the quality of our steel during World War II, I will say this.
      It is surprising that under such conditions it was generally possible to maintain production at the required level.
      German strategists hoped that Soviet industry would collapse during the blitzkrieg.
      However, this did not happen.
      We do not know why Stalin did not shoot Salzman, but, on the contrary, raised him. Perhaps, in difficult conditions he did the maximum possible.
    3. EvilLion 21 February 2020 11: 12 New
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      Well, of course, what difference does it make when there are much more than half the population of the village, you need to build thousands of tanks on the equipment that is, and the 21st century, when in perfectly calm conditions they can no longer manufacture what they did 30 times ago to spit.
      1. volodimer 22 February 2020 11: 50 New
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        It must be remembered that at that moment young boys and women were at the factories (women and children did not want to offend anyone ... according to the classics). There was not enough technology to comply with the time, and either there is a tank with flaws, or there is none at all.
        By the way, about the 21st century, it was somehow from the restorers: it was necessary to pile the chevron gear, as on the Citroen logo, they could not find a specialist ... The technology was lost, two helical teeth put the result.
    4. The comment was deleted.
  • mark1 21 February 2020 07: 09 New
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    Why, the impossibility of preserving the old technology, the shortage of alloying additives, the qualifications of welders, the debugging (long-term) of Paton automatic welding lines ... while constantly increasing the quantity ... you can, of course, "pick up" a lot of violations and shortcomings, but still there was a problem resolved quite quickly (year-1,5) and this (I repeat) with a constant increase in production.
  • Alex 1970 21 February 2020 07: 29 New
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    Interesting article. I did not even suspect that there was so much marriage. Particularly impressed with the hardened steel to customize the cutter. Is there also local heat treatment, or was there no such technology at that time? Maybe someone knows? I can’t insert the picture of the fastening elements, but there is nothing complicated. It is possible to produce high leave as well. To 1100 degrees, the temperature catches up.
    1. AK1972 21 February 2020 12: 48 New
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      Quote: Alex 1970
      You can make a high vacation as well. To 1100 degrees, the temperature catches up.

      It is possible, only the temperature itself does not mean anything, the holding time at this temperature and the cooling rate are of great importance. These parameters cannot be achieved by local heat treatment. I will not go into a deep theory, but repeated hardening with high and then low tempering evens out the structure of steel, making it homogeneous. If you do not comply with the technology, then we get what the brothers got on their armored personnel carriers. Let me speculate why the increased phosphorus content. The fact is that phosphorus increases the fluidity of steel, which allows faster and more complete filling of the mold, reduces the complexity of processing castings, however, it embrittles the metal, and when welding steel with a high phosphorus content, hot cracks inevitably occur.
      1. Alex 1970 21 February 2020 14: 48 New
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        I didn’t enter here the entire technical map for heat treatment of steels, so that as they say “do not litter” the branch. It was only on Thursday that I finished attesting the technology at OKHNVP p. 1 with heat treatment and preheating and thicknesses up to 50 mm, and steel M01 and M11. Who is aware of metal and probably knows about heat treatment. We change reactors in chemical production.
        1. AK1972 22 February 2020 06: 20 New
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          Good morning, colleague! I have also been engaged in certification of technology for 15 years. I have M01, M03 and M21. If I can be useful, write in a personal.
          1. Alex 1970 22 February 2020 07: 17 New
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            Mutually! You also write! Nice to meet a colleague!
  • Snail N9 21 February 2020 07: 57 New
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    I have one opinion about the “incompleteness” of the article, or that it is a “piece” of “torn out” of something more “voluminous” in content? .... winked
    1. volodimer 22 February 2020 12: 05 New
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      It seems that yes, part of the work devoted to "the quality of manufacturing armor in the USSR 1941-1945."
      For a long time I came across a comparison of the armor of 34ki and Sherman ... there was an analysis in dynamics for 45 years ...
      We have a harder one, they have a viscous ...
      Unfortunately I can not offhand remember the source.
      If this is really a part, then with pleasure I will familiarize myself with the continuation.
  • kalibr 21 February 2020 08: 06 New
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    Soviet excellent, what can I say! Add to this the defective fuses from the Penza ZIF, defective ... and why be surprised that they beat the Germans for so long. And in the book "Without Secrets and Secrets" of the Kirov Plant, an odious case is described in general. On the Volkhovskolm front, all the cars of two self-propelled regiments went out of order. They sent J. Y. Kotin himself to understand. And he found out that the reason was the "technical savvy" of regimental techies. In the cold, diesels started poorly and they trimmed the felt on the intake filters with scissors. By the way, back in the 90s I saw in Kubinka at the dump of T-34 41 years old with a crack on the frontal armor. It caught my eye - the redhead himself was rusty, and the weld seams shine like silver. And the crack ... obviously not from a projectile strike. His tracks on the frontal armor were not!
    1. Horde1 21 February 2020 08: 29 New
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      Quote: kalibr
      And he found out that the reason was the "technical savvy" of regimental techies. In the cold, diesels started poorly and they trimmed the felt on the intake filters with scissors.


      So what? if the filter in the cold, somehow began to impede the passage of air, then the actions of technicians are quite adequate.
      1. kalibr 21 February 2020 10: 50 New
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        Paul! I was not there. I give a link to the book. It says that because of this "circumcision" the engines got clogged with sand and were out of order. Surely this book is on the web. You can take and check ...
      2. Undecim 21 February 2020 11: 51 New
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        what?
        And the fact that the engine cannot be operated without an air filter, this drastically reduces the resource. If the air filter does not allow air to pass through, it must be replaced. If the air filter in winter does not let air through, then snow has got into it and cleaning it rather than cutting holes in it will be adequate actions.
        1. BAI
          BAI 21 February 2020 13: 51 New
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          this drastically reduces the resource.

          And what's the difference if the tank lived much less than this resource? It is better to go into battle with an engine that has 10 hours left than not to go into battle with an engine that has 100 hours left.
          But if the
          all cars of two self-propelled regiments

          this means only one thing - the engines idle drove idle and gobbled up the remaining resource in vain. The picture of 1941 could well repeat itself, when the mechanized corps was driven to an unknown destination. Cars started up, but the march wasted - there is no battle. So these are questions to the command, not to the technicians.
          1. Undecim 21 February 2020 14: 06 New
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            Who cares,
            And the difference is that this resource can end in the most unexpected place, during an attack, for example. In front of the enemy’s anti-tank gun. To whom will we ask questions in this case?
            1. volodimer 22 February 2020 12: 22 New
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              A tank that didn’t reach the battlefield is worse ... I’m not a minus, because I agree that breaking down in front of the enemy is w0pa ... (admins, I know that it could be softer)
              In the memoirs of one pilot (it seems, he’s hungry) it was: he flew on the P-40, and so the engine dweller should have 1500 flight hours according to the passport, but in fact after 250 he drove chips into the oil. Our pilot explained this that you fly according to the instructions, the engine is alive, but you are not a fact, but you squeeze all the juices out of it: the engine is scrapped and you are alive.
              I think that tankers have the same principle: if you need to attack, then a filter that prevents you from accelerating and getting out of fire is an evil, even if you later move it to a scrap. And the fact that he can grunt in front of the VET ... Here, everyone understands luck in their own way.
              1. starpur 22 February 2020 21: 14 New
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                Nikolai Golodnikov.
      3. kalibr 21 February 2020 15: 56 New
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        Quote: Horde1
        about the actions of the technicians are quite adequate

        So they thought also in the twentieth, just like you in the twentieth! century.
    2. Vladimir_2U 21 February 2020 11: 49 New
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      Quote: kalibr
      Soviet excellent, what can I say! Add to this the defective fuses from the Penza ZIF, defective ... and why be surprised that they beat the Germans for so long
      Of course, what is it that mass production and, therefore, vocational training have been deployed only by the age of 30, what trivialities, everyone knows, and especially V.P. that a production culture, like secondary education, is given to a child at birth, it’s just that the Germans have straight arms and the Russians don’t. What are the little things that
      As you know, the Mariupol plant named after Ilyich could not be defended, he was in the hands of the enemy, and with a mass of technological equipment that they did not manage to evacuate. It is this enterprise (the only one in the country) was able to produce full-fledged armored hulls for the T-34 in compliance with all standards
      the guilty hands of the Soviet people are still to blame, Shpakovsky should know better. Just did not notice Vyacheslav that
      The complex of measures proposed by the institute only by the end of 1943 allowed to eliminate some of the comments. And an increase in the quality of steelmaking at iron and steel enterprises allowed to reduce the defect rate from 56,25% in 1942 to 13,30% in 1945
      and that’s generally six times!
      1. kalibr 21 February 2020 15: 53 New
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        Quote: Vladimir_2U
        the guilty hands of the Soviet are still to blame
        Sorry, wrong. Not only hands, but the head, of course. Rather, heads.
        1. Vladimir_2U 21 February 2020 18: 09 New
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          Quote: kalibr
          the guilty hands of the Soviet are still to blame
          Sorry, wrong. Not only hands, but the head, of course. Rather, heads

          Those. Is it not the loss of equipment and personnel, the urgent transfer of production to other enterprises that have not previously engaged in such production, and at the same time a sharp increase in output is the cause of high marriage, but strictly the property of the heads of Soviet people? Not bad, not bad. The logic is iron, and only respect for the Soviet people who forged the Victory, right above all others.
          1. kalibr 21 February 2020 18: 31 New
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            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            Those. no loss of equipment and personnel, no urgent transfer of production to other enterprises not previously engaged in such production

            But all this is precisely the result of a "head defect."
            They have been preparing for war for more than one year. It is clear that it is dangerous to have one armored plant - it was possible to build a second one in Siberia in advance. That is, to create backup plants in advance. The reason for the evacuation was also “from the head” - they were preparing for the war, but they missed the war ... and so on all counts. In my article on the marriage of fuses, I cited the figure 62% and for a number of details 92%. By the beginning of the war, this, too, was no longer obsolete ... So, it’s not my fault that these basic things are not available for the polystyrene of your brain.
            1. Vladimir_2U 21 February 2020 19: 31 New
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              Quote: kalibr
              So it's not my fault that these basic things are not available for the foam of your brain
              Wow, what are the conclusions, i.e. your head polystyrene is of higher quality, and let me doubt it, because it was made in the Soviet era, and received education at the same time.
              Quote: kalibr
              It is clear that it is dangerous to have one armored plant - it was possible to build a second one in Siberia in advance. That is, to create backup plants in advance
              Well, of course, it’s a pity that your head polystyrene, although it’s more likely that it didn’t come up with that foam, that the USSR had limited resources and time, that in addition to tanks, a lot of high-quality metal was required, and that the quality of armor improved in two years 6 times.
              Quote: kalibr
              The reason for the evacuation is also “from the head” - they were preparing for the war, but they missed the war ... and so on all counts
              How is it, this comes out in two years of the war, from 41 to 43, everyone's head changed? And radically, does it happen? Or where did they get their heads from? Foam rubber is yours at all, weak.
              1. kalibr 22 February 2020 08: 16 New
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                Quote: Vladimir_2U
                How is it, this comes out in two years of the war, from 41 to 43, everyone's head changed?

                "Roasted cock pecked!"
            2. Sergey S. 22 February 2020 06: 58 New
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              Quote: kalibr
              So, it's not my fault that these basic things are not available for the foam of your brain.

              Inconvenient to read ... Something like this ...
            3. Alexey RA 25 February 2020 11: 53 New
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              Quote: kalibr
              They have been preparing for war for more than one year. It is clear that it is dangerous to have one armored plant - it was possible to build a second one in Siberia in advance. That is, to create backup plants in advance.

              And it was done. But did not have time.
              A radical reconstruction of both armored plants was required, which was provided for by the decree of the Council of People's Commissars of the USSR of August 7, 1938, with a deadline of January 1, 1940. Starting this year, the annual release of armor: the Izhora plant should have been 30000 tons, and the Mariupol factory - 40000 tons. In addition Moreover, by the same time in Chelyabinsk it was planned to build a new plant with a capacity of 50000 tons of armor per year.
              Reconstruction of old and construction of new plants was difficult and actually began only in 1938.
              (...)
              Due to the complete failure in the construction of the Chelyabinsk Combine (only the open-hearth shop was built there by the beginning of the war) in 1939, the main attention began to concentrate on the Mariupol plant, but even there the new open-hearth shop, capable of producing ingots weighing up to 180 tons, did not manage to enter in operation and in 1940
              © Vasiliev
          2. kalibr 21 February 2020 18: 35 New
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            Quote: Vladimir_2U
            forging victory

            Remember the joke? "And around the corner, two workers forged a sickle and a hammer ... Listen, Petka, let's drop it, dock tomorrow!"
      2. volodimer 22 February 2020 13: 31 New
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        Yeah, that's why half of the panthers produced are straight-handed and non-foamy (the word what happened laughing ) by German engineers, they stupidly didn’t reach the battlefield near Kursk ... And in 45, even the Royal Tiger, which ceased to be a problem for the Allied tanks precisely because of the deterioration of the quality of the armor: it became fragile and, when hit, pricked and gave shrapnel. .. And that the Germans did not think of it beforehand ... for a long time after all, they were preparing for war ...
        Namesake hi
        1. Vladimir_2U 22 February 2020 16: 01 New
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          Quote: volodimer
          Yeah, that's why half of the panthers produced
          On this occasion, there is an opinion that the Panthers on the march were very well battered by the PTABs, but this contradicts the fact that in 2 the Germans still had air superiority, according to the Germans and "historians" like Sokolov, in any case. And it is not clear what is more insulting to the Germans, either that Ilya blinked, or that the engineers were able to adapt the idiots for the Tigers, but not for the Panthers.
          Namesake drinks
          1. volodimer 22 February 2020 16: 18 New
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            They seem to recognize technical failures themselves, although if our aviators tried good
    3. Undecim 21 February 2020 12: 12 New
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      Soviet excellent, what can I say!
      In this case, the “Soviet” has nothing to do with the issue, because completely different factors were decisive.
      The production of armored steel and products from it is a complex technological process that requires appropriate technology, equipment, and qualified personnel. It takes time to work out and organize all this, sometimes more than one year. Therefore, in the case when this production was transferred to enterprises that did not have any of the above under evacuation conditions, there could be no other result by definition, be it “Soviet,” “German,” “British,” “American,” etc. .
      One interesting example. In the United States, for enterprises producing military products, there was a special award - "Army-Navy" E "Award".

      The main criterion for awarding the "Army-Navy" E "Award" was the quality of the products.
      So, out of the approximately 85 enterprises that worked in the United States for defense during the war, only 000 enterprises were able to receive this award, and half of them were small firms of less than 4823 people.
  • Aviator_ 21 February 2020 08: 08 New
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    Very interesting article. Respect to the author. One had only to separate the defects affecting the losses. So, defects in armor lead to combat losses, and defects in the undercarriage lead to a lesser degree in combat losses (you still need to get to the battlefield), and mainly in non-combat ones (loss due to breakdowns). This was not only with us - in the fall of 1941, the army of Guderian had almost half the losses due to breakdowns on the march, and even in 1941 the Germans complied with all the production technology.
  • Ros 56 21 February 2020 08: 54 New
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    And then there will be an article about how everything was shitty in the USSR and further on increasing. And in the end, we’ll come to what the Poles, tribals and other riffraff are pushing for striped. But they achieve one thing - our complete destruction. Do not wash, so ride.
    The author does not want to tell how the armor of the Wehrmacht tanks shattered into pieces like a glass cup. Well, how can it be, this is a cultural nation, you think, they destroyed several tens of millions, they did it culturally. They have no flaws.
    And most importantly, how on time the little article fell on display. Only in the USSR were there problems, and in the rest of the world, peace and quiet.
    The author wants to raise the topic, so do it in comparison with others. And after almost 80 years to raise this topic, it smacks of liberal shit.
    Do not find dear visitors?
    1. kalibr 21 February 2020 10: 59 New
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      Such materials require painstaking work in the archives, the search for information, and a lot of work. At this level, write about the Wehrmacht, it is necessary to go to Germany. Work in the Bundesarchive, which is difficult and expensive. You cannot sponsor the author, you cannot. Therefore, be satisfied for now with this, for people like you and this discovery. And about the flying armor of German tanks ... So there is such data. Only in 1944 we destroyed more tanks from the Germans than they do with us. What time! And the armor scattered, and the best tanks in the world, and tankers are heroes. But with something like this happened? Why? By the way, all these calculations are based on Sovinformburo reports published in the newspaper PRAVDA. And she would hardly begin to underestimate the German losses. You can read more about this in my book Tanks of Total Wars. There, all the numbers are painted over the years ...
    2. Trilobite Master 21 February 2020 11: 19 New
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      Quote: Ros 56
      Only in the USSR were there problems, and in the rest of the world, peace and quiet.

      I propose to leave the rest of the world to deal with the problems of the rest of the world.
      Quote: Ros 56
      The author wants to raise the topic, so do it in comparison with others.

      From a person who has not published a single article, advice in such a crude and categorical form is somehow strange to hear. I think it would be more appropriate for you to express such thoughts in the form of a wish or request to the author.
      Quote: Ros 56
      And after almost 80 years to raise this topic, it smacks of liberal shit.

      That is, the correct article, in your opinion, should be built according to the following scheme:
      Russian (Soviet) is always the best - the main thesis.
      If the author is a true patriot, then he will not talk about problems and shortcomings in his native country.
      If you nevertheless decided to talk about them, you should definitely note that they were insignificant, while the opponents have the same thing, but on a much larger scale.
      The thesis about the unsurpassed steepness of the whole Russian (Soviet) should not be questioned and should be proclaimed in a categorical form at least twice in each article - at the beginning and at the end as the main conclusion.
      The author, not following the indicated scheme, is considered a "liberal", but his article, as you deigned to say it, is a "shit".
      Right?
      I draw your attention to the fact that the section in which this article is published is called "History" and not "Opinions" or "Analytics". Therefore, the articles published in it should have, first of all, an educational function, and not a journalistic or propaganda one - for this there are other sections on the VO that I mentioned above. And although, for reasons unknown to me, this section often publishes materials on the story, in fact, not related and having a pronounced nature of a fan attack (I consider this a gross system error of the site administration), it is this article that is written exactly as an article on history should be written in a popular publication - it is objective, impartial, not overloaded with information and easy to read.
      Thanks to the author.
    3. volodimer 22 February 2020 13: 41 New
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      Yuri, I don’t find ... Because I consider this article not as a libel on the USSR, but as a reflection of real problems with the production of armored steel in military conditions in our country. The author did a serious job, for which he thanks, and everyone could draw conclusions whether the quality of the armor was reduced due to the increase in the number of tanks produced. The Germans at the end of the war also had similar problems with the quality of the armor.
      For the last paragraph, you obviously grabbed the cons. Mikhail is somewhat harsh, but you found something from the author that he did not write.
  • Podvodnik 21 February 2020 09: 06 New
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    A significant example is the 121st tank brigade, which during the 250-kilometer-long throw lost half of the heavy HF due to breakdowns

    250 km tank throw? And do you think this is normal? Why not 500 km?
    Failure of only half of the mat part after such a long march is not that a very good indicator? After all, the tank is not intended for march-throws for hundreds of kilometers.
    1. svp67 21 February 2020 11: 00 New
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      Quote: Podvodnik
      250 km tank throw? And do you think this is normal? Why not 500 km?

      And really, why not 500? Just refueling should have been enough. And apparently due to the fact that the second half would have become. Tank formations are good because they know how to make such marches and appear where their enemy is not waiting. This was very well used by the Germans when they managed to “Blitzkrieg”, and our military commanders, in the second half of the war, mastered it
      1. CTABEP 21 February 2020 16: 08 New
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        Therefore, the mechanized corps opened up not only with the experience of commanders and improving the OSH, but also when they were able to deep breakthroughs and spans without losing half of the tanks after 100km for non-combat reasons. Immediately, the German did not become so terrible, and the losses fell.
    2. EvilLion 21 February 2020 11: 17 New
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      In the 45th such march tank columns withstood without any problems. But in general, the impossibility of long-term operation of tanks seriously limited the ability to maneuver and advance the Red Army.
    3. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 14 New
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      Quote: Podvodnik
      After all, the tank is not intended for march-throws for hundreds of kilometers.

      even when chasing an adversary? request
      for example, in 1939, our fire brigades made marches for 500 km or more with minimal losses ...
      1. volodimer 22 February 2020 13: 59 New
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        Good old, debugged to the smallest detail ... Perfectly mastered by the BT-5 crews (7) .... Yes, there is no doubt, but 34ki ... at the beginning of the war are still raw, and then military production with a bunch of simplifications for mass production ... Children's diseases of the original design were eliminated, but they were replaced by others, determined by the conditions of production.
        1. ser56 22 February 2020 15: 58 New
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          Quote: volodimer
          but 34ki ... at the beginning of the war there are still cheeses

          even before the war, the T-34M was created with torsion bars and a turret - but they drove the same freak ...
          1. volodimer 22 February 2020 16: 13 New
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            The T34M is cool, but it was unrealistic to put it on the stream ... The T44 was also developed during the war, but it was necessary to stop in-line production for the sake of a new tank ... KV was driven, although its shortcomings were evident by mid-43. KV-1S and KV-85 did not solve the problem ... eventually changed to IS, but they also stamped in parallel, and they had fewer differences than 34 and 34M .. candles and torsions are already
  • BAI
    BAI 21 February 2020 09: 15 New
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    Well, what to do? A huge number of tanks was required, the amount always goes to the detriment of quality, especially in wartime, when resources (material and time) are limited.
  • Olgovich 21 February 2020 09: 57 New
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    that when enemy shells hit, it caused cracking, stratification and spalls.

    Chipped armor inside the tank after a shell hit is one of the main reasons for the loss of our tankers - oh this is a lot of evidence of the tankers themselves in the memoirs.

    but, as the author showed, the choice was simple: either produce tanks, albeit weakened, or nothing.

    And the choice was made correctly.

    At the same time, the theft of zalmans among workers is disgusting ...
    1. Operator 21 February 2020 11: 21 New
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      The poor food supply of the Ural workers during 1941-44 was caused by small food resources in the USSR, which temporarily lost the main areas of agricultural production - Ukraine, the Volga region and the Kuban.

      The contribution of theft at the level of those involved in the distribution of products was at the level of statistical error.

      As for the quality of Soviet armored (and aviation) equipment, it was absolutely adequate to the level of Soviet technologies and the production culture of those years. People’s commissions and factory directors were those who understood this secret of the open door.
      1. Olgovich 21 February 2020 11: 48 New
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        Quote: Operator
        The contribution of theft at the level of those involved in the distribution of products was at the level of statistical error.

        wow "error" in hundreds of tons Products:
        An investigation carried out by the USSR Prosecutor's Office established: in the first half of 1942, employees of the URS of the Kirov plant in the city of Chelyabinsk squandered rationed food funds: meat and fish - 75133 kg, fats - 13824 kg, cereals - 3007 kg, sugar - 2098 kg, cheese - 1539 kg and pr belay
        1. Dmitry V. 25 February 2020 10: 39 New
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          Quote: Olgovich
          wow "error" in hundreds of tons of products:


          What did he gobble up these products?

          Hundreds of tons of food are additional rations for young workers and employees of the design bureau - because the guys are 13-15 years old, doing work and very hard work for adults, they simply did not have enough strength and Zaltsman ordered them to be given rations in excess of the norm (UPD).
          And during the fabrication of the “Leningrad affair”, Zaltsman recorded this overspending of products as an abuse.
      2. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 18 New
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        Quote: Operator
        The contribution of theft at the level of those involved in the distribution of products was at the level of statistical error.

        But how did the half-starved people at the machines standing for 12 hours look at this?
    2. ser56 21 February 2020 18: 17 New
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      Quote: Olgovich
      And the choice was made correctly.

      there was no choice ... request
      Quote: Olgovich
      At the same time, the theft of zalmans among workers is disgusting ...

      This is an IVS policy! If the brocade women receive a second salary in a package without taxes, have special distributors, special apartments and dachas - then what does his industry general have to say?
  • Kostadinov 21 February 2020 11: 21 New
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    Then Vibor beat ten tanks out of 2-3 with defects or 1-2 tanks without defects.
  • Operator 21 February 2020 11: 52 New
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    Quote: Olgovich
    hundreds of tons

    That is exactly what I had in mind.
  • Andrew Matseevsky 21 February 2020 13: 12 New
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    Very interesting post. Actually, from these pieces of information only, one can add a more or less objective picture of why the Red Army fought so badly. The great Marxist, Comrade Stalin, did not understand dialectics at all, trying to replace quality with quantity. And it happened everywhere. A huge army of poorly trained disposable soldiers. Socialism is a plan, a plan, and once again a plan. It is worth reading Solonin how Stalin took the lead of aviation plants by the throat and demanded to increase the production of aircraft. Do not hesitate with the same results. I once read a note in Science and Life about how gearbox gears were strewn on the T-34. An investigation showed that the factory did not really control from what concrete steel the billets went to the same gears. Steel came across the wrong brand and the gears crumbled. Actually, when the production is put up with cancer, then the choice is small- or underfulfill the plan and be punished immediately or fulfill at the cost of marriage. Then maybe they will punish but not today. The socialist economy in all its glory.
    1. Trilobite Master 21 February 2020 14: 15 New
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      Quote: Andrew Matseevsky
      Worth reading corned beef

      I think it’s not worth it. Apart from Solonin’s own point of view, there is nothing more in his writings. He does not ask how it was. He wonders "how to prove that it was bad." And at the same time he regularly lies, uses dubious sources, and selectively selects materials. A bad person, in short.
    2. Alexey RA 21 February 2020 16: 12 New
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      Quote: Andrew Matseevsky
      It is worth reading Solonin how Stalin took the lead of aviation plants by the throat and demanded to increase the production of aircraft.

      And he was generally right. Because with the start of the war, aircraft factories would still have to increase output. But only it would have to be done in the conditions of evacuation, mobilization and the accompanying mess. And so it was possible train on cats - back in peacetime, increase output and identify all bottlenecks. In fact, the aircraft industry of the USSR was mobilized before the start of the war.
      And the reason for this mobilization was the information of the Soviet delegation who visited the Reich aircraft factories that the Germans calmly produce 80 cars a day. So they decided to pull our issue to German.
  • CTABEP 21 February 2020 16: 04 New
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    In general, when there is a chance to go to places that are not so distant, and in the worst case, lose one’s head for a plan shortfall, it is better to drive the marriage out of self-preservation instinct than to give a colossal short release. Moreover, acceptance requirements are reduced, but not fat at the front.
  • bubalik 21 February 2020 17: 14 New
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    ,,, how not to remember the Lend-Lease. winked
  • ser56 21 February 2020 18: 04 New
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    Thanks to the author for interesting material!
    And the photo is just a miracle! hi
  • Petrol cutter 21 February 2020 20: 50 New
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    This only adds respect to the heroic men from the tank troops of the Red Army.
    Reasons for marriage are objective and subjective (as far as I know). In this article, both are voiced.
    Moreover, in my unenlightened view, first of all, objective reasons led to this state of affairs.
    As much as possible, they tried to fix it. I learned about this in the same article.
  • Sapsan136 21 February 2020 21: 26 New
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    The T-34s of the 1941-42 model did not differ in quality at all, regardless of the manufacturer’s factory ... And the T-54s produced later on in the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic caused only swine in the army ... and the T-64 did not turn out to be a child prodigy and not of high quality, which is proved by its operation and combat use ...
  • Miron 22 February 2020 09: 55 New
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    Who writes this wild nonsense ...
    This is of course the question. But who can believe in these mucks.
    Some flock of rams pinned their heads and nod empty heads in response to the bleating of a moron who wrote this "opus."
  • Radikal 22 February 2020 15: 23 New
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    I got acquainted with the article, I would like to know what the author generally wanted to say - there is no conclusion at the end. sad
  • itarnmag 22 February 2020 22: 52 New
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    My father, a veteran of the Great Patriotic War, told me about the low viscosity of the armor of our tanks. He said something like this: "The projectile hits, the tank is intact, and the crew perishes from fragments of the armor of their own tank
  • itarnmag 22 February 2020 23: 01 New
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    The result of the race for quantity to the detriment of quality is excellently shown in the movie "Particularly Important Mission", where a malnourished and sleepy boy mixed up bolts, as a result of which there were crashes with IL-2 aircraft
  • irontom 23 February 2020 13: 27 New
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    Let's just say that the T-34 of Red Sormovo differed in my very poor quality. In my youth, the T-34 model was assembled in a variant of this plant - the main differences are due to the quality of the armor on the front sheet, and additional handrails on the body in the area of ​​the ventilation mesh in the stern and so on the little things.
  • Dmitry V. 25 February 2020 10: 13 New
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    One example of such a predatory attitude is given in a series of materials about Isaac Salzmann, the most controversial leader of tank plants.


    The fiction of the author.
    Zaltsman organized food for factory workers in excess of rations - UPD (you die a day later).
    And with the falsification of the NKVD case, the consumption of products for these rations was recorded as unlawful waste of products.
    The author creates fiction, as if Salzman alone gobbled up these products.
    In fact, he allocated rations in excess of the norm not only to young workers, but also to KB employees.