Iran tried to explain why the IRG did not immediately recognize the strike on the airliner

The Iranian news agency Fars has published a statement by the commander of the Aerospace Forces of the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps, which also includes air defense forces. Brigadier General Amir-Ali Hajizadeh recognized the full responsibility of the IRGC for the death of the Ukrainian Boeing. He stated that "I would like to die, but not to witness such an incident."

According to Hajizade, the Iranian authorities, when they talked about the non-involvement of their country in shelling a passenger liner, did not try to mislead anyone or hide the real facts. They simply did not yet have complete information about the causes of the crash of the Boeing.

The incident happened early in the morning of January 8, and a little later the brigadier general was informed about the involvement of the Iranian air defense forces. Although this information was still unverified and in doubt, he immediately reported it to Tehran. Upon arrival in the capital, he learned about the creation by the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Islamic Republic of the investigative group, but he did not receive permission to provide her with information. At this time, the authorities claimed that the plane crash occurred for technical reasons.

It took about two days to collect all the data and accurately determine the cause of the death of the liner.

Hajizadeh claims that neither the IRGC nor the Iranian military received orders from above to hide information from the public. He says the disaster was due to a mistake by the operator who mistook the plane for the Americans cruise missile. This happened due to the extremely tense situation and increased security measures. The general claims that the IRGC leadership requested the release of Iranian airspace from civilian aircraft.

Against the backdrop of the recognition of the Iranian military command attack on the airliner of Ukraine International Airlines, related questions arise. One of them: if the aircraft commander, before the missile hit the airliner, continued radio communication with the dispatcher and did not report any problems, then why did the calculation of Iran’s air defense systems take the plane that had just taken off for a “cruise missile”? There is no official answer to this question yet.

Comments

[WILL]

The Iranians acted courageously, admitting their guilt.
Time delay is a technical factor, the passage of information from the bottom in increasing order to the highest Guide.

[Grandfather]

Brigadier General Amir-Ali Hajizadeh recognized the full responsibility of the IRGC for the death of the Ukrainian Boeing. He stated that "I would like to die, but not to witness such an incident."

The man.

[svp67]

Quote: ANIMAL

The Iranians acted courageously, admitting their guilt.

Quote: Dead Day

The man.

The general himself would not have made such a decision, but few people would agree to be in his place ...

then why the calculation of the air defense systems of the Iranian air defense took the plane, which had just taken off, for a "cruise missile"?

The Iranians talk about failures in the communication line of the air defense systems, so the question is, weren't these failures "man-made"?

[figwam]

It is interesting how an air defense system operator could confuse a cruise missile with an ESR of 0.1 sq.m, with a passenger plane with an ESR of 70-100 sq.m also near the international airport, the flight path of the planes, and the beginning of the glide path are 2-3 kilometers from the place the location of the air defense system, the range of the complex made it possible to see the aircraft from the moment of takeoff, it is impossible to mix it up with something else. I do not exclude betrayal and deliberate missile launch.

[alstr]

I would also add that walking along a dedicated corridor of takeoff and landing.
In addition, the motion vectors must be different.

A very dark story turns

[volodimer]

No darker than: "July 3, 1988. Iran Air's Airbus A300B2-203 was on commercial passenger flight IR655 on the Tehran-Bandar Abbas-Dubai route, but 7 minutes after taking off from Bandar Abbas, flying over the Persian Gulf, it was shot down by a surface-to-air missile fired from the US Navy's missile cruiser Vincennes, killing all 290 people on board - 16 crew members and 274 passengers (including 65 children).
The crash of flight 655 was the largest plane crash in the history of Iran and the Airbus A300, as well as in the history of the Airbus family of aircraft.
At the time of the missile launch, the cruiser Vincennes was in the territorial waters of Iran. The US government said the Iran Air airliner was mistakenly identified as an F-14 fighter of the Iranian Air Force. The Iranian government, however, claims that Vincennes deliberately attacked a civilian plane. "
How could you confuse a climbing airliner "walking along a dedicated corridor"...
Then there were also discussions about incompatible EPR, the well-known schedule and route.
As a result, according to the American version: "The main reason for the incident in the official report is the psychological state of the Vincennes team, operating in a combat situation under great pressure. The American government considers the incident as a military incident and believes that the cruiser team acted in accordance with the current circumstances."
And the Iranians were not under great pressure? According to the Amer system of case law, this is a military incident.

[Andrey Ilminsky]

That's it .. the same thought .. And foreign intelligence, right after the incident, already in the know what they shot down and by whom .... suggests an idea of ​​traitors ..

[figwam]

The time was chosen just after the terrorist act of a committed fsch. And now let's remember what Boris Johnson wrote in 2013.

“A dead cat on the dining table will have an effect. And this is not about people being indignant, alarmed, disgusted. It is true, but it does not matter. The key point, says my Australian friend, is that everyone will shout: "God, buddy, there's a dead cat on the table!" In other words, they will talk about a dead cat, that is, about what you want them to talk about, and they will not talk about a problem that causes you so many problems, ”Johnson wrote.

Here is the "dead cat" in the form of a downed plane, the terrorist attack by the FSA fades into the background, and Iran turns from a victim into a culprit.

[Azim77]

Or maybe this "dead cat" plays into the hands of the Iranian leadership? It is not necessary that there was a personal performance, but on the other hand, the quick acceptance of the blame becomes appropriate. So that after the assassination of Suleimani to cool down a little our charges (like we also became guilty) and so that some radical fanatic does not break his wood, somewhere in the West. Thus, greatly aggravating the position of the Iranian leadership. It is one thing to officially be indignant, to try to save face, to announce a note of protest, and quite another to throw down the gauntlet, provoke a war in which there are clearly few trump cards for victory.

[demo]

How can a "traitor" be motivated to put his head on the block?
After all, they execute, without a doubt.

[volodimer]

Not a "traitor" and not a traitor.
They will not be executed, because he is a commander who took the guilt of his subordinates, they will not give out the "western" justice because he knows a lot (although, there, with competent lawyers, he would be excused), he will be punished at home "to the fullest extent ..." but given the circumstances, it will be suspended and planted. But again, given the circumstances, detention will not be harsh. The punishment for him in fact will be the end of his military career.
It is easy to find the air defense operator who pressed the button, Brigadier General Amir-Ali Hajizade did not hide behind his subordinates ... "they were mistaken, so I trained them poorly" not his words, but this meaning.

Grandfather (Grandfather Old) Man .

I agree to all 100.

[demo]

It is not excluded.
But!
".... Brigadier General Amir-Ali Hajizadeh did not hide behind his subordinates ..." they were mistaken, so I did not train them well "not his words, but this meaning."
The general publicly blamed himself.
But they judge not for words, but for actions.
Who pressed the button?
He is guilty.

After all, if I say that I feel involved in the deterioration of the situation in the country, because I voted for Putin, then no one will seriously take my words?
I hope so!

[volodimer]

After all, if I say that I feel involved in the deterioration of the situation in the country, because I voted for Putin, then no one will seriously take my words?
I hope so!

Here it is !!!
So it's not only my fault
I repent, I got involved too
But if This, like the Iranian general, had pleaded guilty for what had happened, maybe everything would have gone a little different ... And then they are blaming everything on stupid subordinates and no one is responsible for anything ...
Oh, something politota climbed out of me ...

[meandr51]

His transponder was turned off. And deviated from the corridor towards the center of Tehran.

[Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg)]

The transponder turned off at the very moment when the right turn began. Turn from the center of Tehran.

I look Olgins continue to defend Iran in the fight against Nibiru stronger than Iran itself.

[Golovan Jack]

Quote: Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg)

I look Olgins continue to defend Iran in the fight against Nibiru stronger than Iran itself

I look, the local amerskiye got so tired of the "Olginsky" ones that even the unrated ones got fired up ... it's funny, yes

[asv363]

Map from the press conference Amir Ali Hajizadeh from the news of Iranian IA MEHR look:
https://en.mehrnews.com/news/154418/IRGC-Aerospace-chief-elaborates-on-Ukrainian-plane-mishap

[pytar]

It is interesting how an air defense system operator could confuse a cruise missile with an ESR of 0.1 sq.m, and a passenger aircraft with an ESR of 70-100 sq.m.

From the Ministry of Defense of Iran, they explained the reason: The air defense missile system was at the disposal of a unit of the "revolutionary guard". They were recently deployed to this location. There were bad things, they were still settling down. Moreover, the "guards" have a lower level of training than in the regular army. Combat mood, but no experience! Moreover, we could not contact the command post in time! According to the instructions, in this case, the operator must make his own decision in a matter of seconds! And he ... was wrong! Unfortunately!

[figwam]

Quote: pytar

And he ... was wrong! Unfortunately

This is the same as wanting to shoot a hare, but getting into an elephant was simply wrong.

[pytar]

This is the same as wanting to shoot a hare, but getting into an elephant was simply wrong.

With military hysteria, it happens! Happened more than once! We say - "Clean up sa golems for fear!" (Panicking, the eye sees everything terrible!)

[asv363]

Boyan, there is a Russian proverb: "Fear has big eyes."

[pytar]

Yes! I did not immediately remember how it sounds in Russian! Thank you for reminding !!!

[Oleg Zorin]

And the fact of handshake?

[bayard]

Quote: Oleg Zorin

And the fact of handshake?

He is just recognized by the leadership of Iran. But you need to understand that the air defense grouping around Tehran was reinforced with the means of the so-called. "military air defense", that is, the crews that previously covered remote bases and troops on the march.
New location, undeveloped area, psychological stress, early morning (fatigue factor), poor coordination with command posts of regular air defense forces and civil aviation services ...
In a combat situation, in anticipation of a strike, this could not have happened.
... And of course handshake.
We need to learn and improve air defense management systems.
And the connection.

[Astra wild]

And, after all, there really can be a deliberate "setup": at first, someone from high ranks signaled where Suleimani would be. I doubt that Suleimani posted his detailed route on the Internet, the Americans are killing the general. The IRGC is then "substituted".
And now the most interesting: who and for what purpose does this do?
I have several versions, or rather 2, but they have under versions: 1) someone, a high-ranking, is clearing a "place in the sun" for himself, and the ayatol and his support of the IRGC interferes with him. There may be different additional versions. 2) someone, I guess who, wants to radically change the course of Iran.
You can consider this an unsuccessful analysis or female intuition.

[audigamma]

Overslept takeoff. After the TOR alarms were triggered, he misunderstood pressed the start. That's all.

[SovAr238A]

Quote: Dead Day

Brigadier General Amir-Ali Hajizadeh recognized the full responsibility of the IRGC for the death of the Ukrainian Boeing. He stated that "I would like to die, but not to witness such an incident."

The man.

He would be a man - if he shot himself.
And now he's a jerk and a chime.
Cowardly. like all the Arabs.

[reservist]

actually he is a pers ...

[SovAr238A]

Quote: reservist

actually he is a pers ...

Stop believing in miracles.
3000 years in the area there were bloody wars.
all fought against each other.
They killed men, raped their women.
Then these women gave birth to children. who subsequently went to kill and rape others, and so on in many circles.
What kind of Persians are there?
only by geography chtoli?

[reservist]

Quote: SovAr238A

... bloody wars were going on in this area.

and by this logic we are not Russians, but Mongols ...

Quote: SovAr238A

What kind of Persians are there?
only on a geographical basis or what?

Yeah, and all Asians are Chinese ...

[Catfish]

The man.

Yes? Well, he would have shot himself, as befits a man and an officer.

[volodimer]

Cat I do not agree. You can’t shoot him now. He took the blame of the entire structure subordinate to him, if he shot himself, then the unworthy media would immediately say that there was an order from the Iranian leadership to bring down the plane. And his suicide is proof of this. Otherwise, why suddenly ... You can’t.

[Catfish]

Hello Vladimir. I think that Iran has always given a damn about all kinds of media and someone else's opinion. They are brutal guys and having such an "ally" can become a big problem for our country.

[volodimer]

Of course, Iran is quite indifferent to foreign opinion, but in modern times it is difficult to spit on the media, one article and now the spontaneous unrest of students, under the strict supervision of the British ambassador ...
Not all Turks will be us allies, but it’s better to keep abreast ...
And about the brutality ... it must be directed in the right direction ... His own Imperial Majesty's Convoy for an example ... well, and from the recent ... one mountain region ...

[Catfish]

Oh, these "mountain regions" ... There was no sadness - the devils pumped up.

[volodimer]

But it's better this way than having a "small, but very proud"
Either we use them for our own purposes, or they are used against us ..
And if for this you need to flatter the mountain ego, then not a big fee ...

[Catfish]

Unfortunately, the fee goes there is specific and very large. "Allah sends" - as the local leader spoke almost in all seriousness.

[YOUR]

For similar actions, an Iranian passenger plane was shot down in 1988 by a missile from the American cruiser Vincennes, the captain of the cruiser received the Order of the Legion of Honor.

[Professor]

Quote: ANIMAL

The Iranians acted courageously, admitting their guilt.

Courageously? They already had nowhere to unlock when they found a video of rocket launch, rocket fragments, shrapnel holes in the side of the liner and shrapnel in the bodies. The Persians courageously split under the weight of evidence.

[alstr]

Well, the Americans did not recognize the broken Boeing in the 80s. Although everyone knows everything.

[Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg)]

Recognized in less than a day. If you lie like that, even in the patriots of Iran you will be shy.

[alstr]

I’ll clarify. They did not admit guilt. Unlike Iran.

[Evgeny Goncharov (smoogg)]

There is no blame, because the cruiser was in combat conditions in Iranian territorial waters. They tried to contact him. Responsibility - recognized, compensation to families - paid

[volodimer]

There is no blame, because the cruiser was in combat conditions in Iranian territorial waters.

Great! We climbed into someone else's terr water behind the engines, shot down a civilian side, with which tried to contact at military frequencies... The cruisers of the URO are chasing motor boats in foreign waters, is that just fine ???

Responsibility - recognized, compensation to families - paid

Well, Iran has recognized responsibility ... and will pay compensation ...
Where did such double standards come from when the dust had not yet settled?

[Professor]

Quote: alstr

Well, the Americans did not recognize the broken Boeing in the 80s. Although everyone knows everything.

Not only recognized, but also apologized at the highest level.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/07/06/reagan-apologized-to-iran-for-downing-of-jetliner/9523c6dc-a244-4b3b-90e9-054168d98c79/
REAGAN APOLOGIZED TO IRAN FOR DOWNING OF JETLINER

[Chingachguk]

Real men! At first, almost 200 people were convicted with a fright, and then they courageously admitted it!

[seti]

At least the Iranians are honest. It costs a lot.

[pytar]

Only strong pleads guilty and does not shy away from responsibility! Respect to the Iranians!

[NEXUS]

Confessing guilt is a masculine and courageous act. But you could have denied or even been silent.

[Lexus]

Andrei
Here, on a nearby branch, some "select" just reproach the Iranians for "wearing dresses". And for some reason the Iranian airliner of the "Stars and Stripes" shot down the "attacking cruiser" as men. This means that the fans under his patronage to shoot at civilian planes "carriers of trousers", probably.

[Kronos]

Could not iron evidence countries ready to cover them no that's why they admitted

[meandr51]

Why cover them? They themselves are able to do this. And could not admit, send all nafig. As the Americans did when they shot down an Iranian airliner from a destroyer, mistaking it for a fighter. The crew of the destroyer was awarded, met with the orchestra.

[Kronos]

So they did not deny that they brought down the Americans, they said that they did everything right. What of course disgusting I do not argue compensation paid

[Catfish]

Lord, Andrew, you’re a sober-minded person. What a bold act here ?! They got involved in the most I can not, where to go then. This is not the case when you can endlessly deny.

[Saboteur Holuy]

Terrorism at the state level ... Iran should not get in touch with the US MTR, eliminates everyone. In the US, they do not like terrorism

[Volodin]

Quote: Saboteur Holuay

In the US, they do not like terrorism

At the same time, they know how to cook it perfectly ...

[Saboteur Holuy]

Well, Iran has no equal

[Volodin]

Quote: Saboteur Holuay

Well, Iran has no equal

Compared to the USA, it is a living baby.

[Saboteur Holuy]

If you mean bin Laden ... Our Dudaev, Maskhadov, Basaev immediately comes to mind ... who officially gave them weapons from the warehouses of the Moscow Region?

[Vol4ara]

Quote: Diversant Holuy

If you mean bin Laden ... Our Dudaev, Maskhadov, Basaev immediately comes to mind ... who officially gave them weapons from the warehouses of the Moscow Region?

He means the Taliban and Isis

[Saboteur Holuy]

I’m not a lawyer in the USA, but what we did abruptly will be ...

[Vol4ara]

Quote: Diversant Holuy

I’m not a lawyer in the USA, but what we did abruptly will be ...

no

[meandr51]

Yeah. Especially the famous Delta Force. Google how they didn’t like the terrorists who seized the American embassy in Tehran and sent a bunch of aircraft and troops there. Everyone just laughed at them, because they could not even fly. They burned and blew up all of their aircraft.

[Saboteur Holuy]

Primitive reasoning, without analytics

[meandr51]

Who would say ... You yourself have never written more than one phrase. And those do not differ in complexity.

[SovAr238A]

Quote: meandr51

Yeah. Especially the famous Delta Force. Google how they didn’t like the terrorists who seized the American embassy in Tehran and sent a bunch of aircraft and troops there. Everyone just laughed at them, because they could not even fly. They burned and blew up all of their aircraft.

stop carrying this bullshit. you probably never read the real facts.
And Delta Force - performed a miracle at that time.
In fact. miracle.
30 people completely "extinguished" huge Tehran.
Completely deprived of the city management, communications and communications.
Over 100 hostages were released under the guise of.
They took them out of a huge city without any problems.

And if the teams of pilots and aircraft guides from among the US Marines did not go along, everything would be fine ...
And this story is in the textbooks on sabotage activities.
Although this is not familiar to you.
You are missing something. to get to the real facts, and not to listen to the editorials of false propaganda ..

[meandr51]

A beautiful fairy tale, it is a pity that it is devoid of meaning. Why start an operation in Tehran, if even the task of seizing the airfield for the landing of all forces and the subsequent evacuation of the hostages was not solved? Is there anything about 100 released hostages on the Internet? I did not find. Even if this is true, given that there were 6000 hostages, it can hardly be called a success. Operation Eagle Claw was a classic failure overall. At the same time, the quality of the special forces itself does not matter much. Although the fact that the Delta was practically eliminated by Cuban workers in Grenada also says something ...

[VVK]

I think that the fact that the Ukrainian board is not just a coincidence. I am not an expert in the field of air defense, but it is possible that the US special services helped the Iranian military to make a mistake. But now it will be difficult to prove something.

[Kronos]

In order to think so, one must have evidence otherwise this is another theory of a conspiracy about Masons and Jews

[D16]

If you do not have persecution mania, this does not mean that you are not being persecuted .

[K-36]

VVK "I am not a specialist in air defense"and right there"I think". Interesting message.
I served in the crew of the 12th anti-aircraft missile system "Slave" of the Odessa air defense anti-aircraft missile brigade. In 1980, a low-speed radio-contrast aircraft left our territory towards Iran. At that time, my unit was on alert. Naturally, the brigade headquarters set us the task "to capture, accompany / in sight / and be ready to launch the missile immediately upon receiving the command." We have completed everything and reported on it. We only waited for the Start command. And she was not there. All nerves in a string. Above our headquarters is the combined command post of air defense and the civil sector of the EU ATC. From there the Team was supposed to come. And there everything was sorted out in order to prevent a fatal mistake. And finally, the "END OUT" command sounded. Like a mountain off your shoulders !!! It turns out that the 2nd pilot forgot to change the quartz in the "friend or foe" identification system at the set time. And this is the USSR with a long tradition of air defense and with a built-up system for analyzing the situation. And here on you - the human factor. Gouge the 2nd pilot. Who could send himself and all innocent passengers to the next world.
This is to explain a little what the air defense missile defense is, and sometimes it happens when at a given moment in time you are personally responsible for the assigned portion of the sky!

[Glory1974]

He says the disaster was due to a mistake by the operator who mistook the plane for the Americans cruise missile.

Probably a very low qualification of the operator who could not distinguish the airliner from a cruise missile, the reflected signal is different, speeds, altitude, etc., except that the airliner has a transponder on, which is impossible not to see.

why the calculation of the air defense systems of the Iranian air defense mistook the plane that had just taken off as a "cruise missile"?

Probably the delay before take-off played a role. According to the calculation of the air defense system, the scheduled plane had to fly off an hour ago, and suddenly a target appeared, which should not be.
In any case, the Persians should do the work on the bugs and change the algorithm of the air defense.
Respect to the Persians for admitting a mistake, in contrast to the "democratic" USA, which in a similar situation said that the American military was not guilty of anything, although they shot down a passenger plane and did not punish anyone.

[Professor]

Quote: glory1974

Respect to the Persians for admitting a mistake, in contrast to the "democratic" USA, which in a similar situation said that the American military was not guilty of anything, although they shot down a passenger plane and did not punish anyone.

US President Ronald Reagan acknowledged US responsibility for the downing of the Vincennes rocket cruiser Iranian A300 liner on July 3, 1988, and apologized to the victims two days after the crash, July 5. Eight days later, on July 11, 1988, on behalf of the US government, Reagan offered compensation to the families of the victims.

[Soveticos]

Reagan did not apologize and blamed Iran itself. The ship was ultramodern for its time, located in the territorial waters of Iran, and yet they made a mistake in mistaking the plane for a fighter. Explanations of situations and reasons are almost the same both then and now.

[Glory1974]

The United States admitted that the military did the right thing and did not punish anyone for this.
everything else is legal casuistry. I read in different sources, everywhere there is a different opinion. But in reality, about the same as with Ukraine, when they shot down over the Black Sea .. They did not recognize responsibility, but they paid the money under a special intergovernmental agreement.

[asv363]

Quote: glory1974

The delay before take-off probably played a role. According to the calculation of the air defense system, the scheduled plane had to fly off an hour ago, and suddenly a target appeared, which should not be. In any case, the Persians should do the work on the mistakes and change the air defense work algorithm.

Amir Ali Hajizadeh was responsible for the formation of an air defense ring around Tehran. I admit that during the threatened period, namely, before the shelling of American bases in Iraq in response to the assassination of Lieutenant General Kassem Suleimani near Baghdad, additional calculations of the IRGC air defense forces were transferred from Tehran from other directions. It is likely that the situation near the capital's airport was not familiar to them.
I will add that inadequate Trump made his share in creating a tense situation in Iran with his warning about a possible retaliatory strike against 52 targets in Iran. The blow could follow from different directions, at the decisive moment the connection was interrupted, the calculation had 10 seconds to make a decision.

[Glory1974]

It is likely that the situation near the capital's airport was not familiar to them.

air defense missile calculations have a flight schedule in the area of ​​responsibility. The Ukrainian board dropped out of the schedule, which could play a role if the changes were not brought to completion, or it was profiled.

[Professor]

Against the backdrop of the recognition of the Iranian military command attack on the airliner of Ukraine International Airlines, related questions arise. One of them: if the aircraft commander, before the missile hit the airliner, continued radio communication with the dispatcher and did not report any problems, then why did the calculation of Iran’s air defense systems take the plane that had just taken off for a “cruise missile”? There is no official answer to this question yet.

What is the relationship between the on-board radio exchange with the dispatcher and the curved-hand monkey behind the remote control air defense system?

[asv363]

Oleg, why do you write in a provocative tone? In Israel, air defense officers are also not sinless.

[Professor]

Quote: asv363

Oleg, why do you write in a provocative tone? In Israel, air defense officers are also not sinless.

A passenger Boeing can be distinguished from a cruise missile, but these F-16 primates will have imagined and shot down an IL-20, or a cruise missile instead of a huge Boeing.

[asv363]

What is the connection between the Syrian S-200 calculation, which opened fire due to the absolutely illegal attack by AOI air forces on Syria and the calculation of the air defense system of the AKSIR IRG, which worked on a civilian aircraft due to the lack of communication and awaiting retaliatory strike from any direction from the United States?

[Professor]

Quote: asv363

What is the connection between the Syrian S-200 calculation, which opened fire due to the absolutely illegal attack by AOI air forces on Syria and the calculation of the air defense system of the AKSIR IRG, which worked on a civilian aircraft due to the lack of communication and awaiting retaliatory strike from any direction from the United States?

In both cases, Krivorukov primates shot anywhere and innocent people died. Such a swag.

[knn54]

-the leadership of the IRGC requested the release of Iranian airspace from civilian aircraft.
And more questions:
- why claims to the IRGC if the air defense is subordinate to the army;
- why "Thor", if there are new "Bavar-373", is. old "Mershad";
- Did the plane deviate from the route? There is a top-secret Malard base 30 km from Tehran.
- why SUDDENLY lost contact with the air defense system operator ...

[opus]

Quote: knn54

- why claims to the IRGC if the air defense is subordinate to the army;

aerospace forces of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC), these "Torahs" are it is in the arsenal of the IRGC (the IRGC is not part of the structure of the Armed Forces of Iran, being a completely independent structure
commander of the aerospace division of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps Amir Ali Hajizadeh

Quote: knn54

- why "Thor", if there are new "Bavar-373", is. old "Mershad";

It was the IRGC base (their missile object), deployed (to strengthen the air defense of the object) recently, prepared to reflect the attack of the Kyrgyz Republic.
Bavar-373 "," Mershad is not very relevant against the Kyrgyz Republic

Quote: knn54

- did the plane deviate from the route - 30 km

deviated, but in fact in the admission of the corridor

Quote: knn54

why SUDDENLY lost contact with the air defense system operator ...

and where is it from?
=====================================
weird in itself this video

The cameraman came out very "well" to smoke.

[thanks]

Quote: opus (Anton)

Bavar-373 "," Mershad not very relevant against KR

Is this about what? Can you justify? Otherwise, this is not true ...

[SovAr238A]

Quote: Mersi

Quote: opus (Anton)

Bavar-373 "," Mershad not very relevant against KR

Is this about what? Can you justify? Otherwise, this is not true ...

Isn't Mershad OTR?

[pashundra]

But shouldn't the interested parties prohibit civilian flights immediately after the shelling of the base (including representatives of the airline). You might think the babahs they have not heard.

[Jack O'Neill]

According to Hajizade, the Iranian authorities, when they talked about the non-involvement of their country in shelling a passenger liner, did not try to mislead anyone or hide the real facts. They simply did not yet have complete information about the causes of the crash of the Boeing.

Such a simple otmaza ...
The Iranians didn’t know who they were shooting at? Well what a nonsense!

[Alex Justice]

The Americans thought.
America is the cause of the incident. Nothing would have happened if America had not killed the general.

[Old26]

Quote: VVK

I think that the fact that the Ukrainian board is not just a coincidence. I am not an expert in the field of air defense, but it is possible that the US special services helped the Iranian military to make a mistake. But now it will be difficult to prove something.

IMHO it's still a coincidence. The board took off 30 minutes before, and 30 minutes later, too. And how did you help? After all, the Ukrainian Boeing took off at the wrong time? Do they (the Americans) have "moles" everywhere, even at the dispatchers?

Quote: glory1974

Probably the delay before take-off played a role. According to the calculation of the air defense system, the scheduled plane had to fly off an hour ago, and suddenly a target appeared, which should not be.
In any case, the Persians should do the work on the bugs and change the algorithm of the air defense.
Respect to the Persians for admitting a mistake, in contrast to the "democratic" USA, which in a similar situation said that the American military was not guilty of anything, although they shot down a passenger plane and did not punish anyone.

Delay? It turns out that there is no contact between the dispatchers of the international airport and the air defense crews? Flight delays are a common occurrence. When for weather conditions, and when for "technical reasons". In this case, there was a technical reason.

Admitted error after three days. And I apologize, yet it all looks like an excuse. Here is the paragraph and article where it says

The incident happened early in the morning of January 8, and a little later the brigadier general was informed about the involvement of the Iranian air defense forces. Although this information was still unverified and in doubt, he immediately informed her in Tehran. Upon arrival in the capital he learned about the creation by the General Staff of the Armed Forces of the Islamic Republic of the investigative group, but did not receive permission to provide her with information. At this time, the authorities claimed that the plane crash occurred for technical reasons.

There are questions.
1. To whom did he convey the information to Tehran? A person who is the leader of the armed forces and "overwhelmed" of whom there are practically only two. Deputy commander of the IRGC and commander-in-chief of the IRGC, that is, occupying the third place in the hierarchy of subordination of the IRGC, to whom he could convey information. Only up
2. The second. He did not receive permission to transfer information to the investigation team of the General Staff. Who could forbid him. Again these two superiors. But then the ban on contact with the investigation team can only be regarded as an attempt to keep the air defense guilty secret from the calculation, maybe they don’t know. After all, although the IRGC is officially part of the armed forces of Iran, but in fact it is a parallel army ...

[Astra wild]

Old Colleague, I almost repeat your idea that there may be a conspiracy in the leadership, or it may turn out that someone is not interested in the leadership paying attention to the IRGC, and there may be dubious deals

[Gardamir]

tried to explain

It seems that the Iranians were forced to repent. For those who consider Iran to blame, watch this film. as they say, not everything is so simple. The film was shot about 12 years ago. Since then, the capabilities of the special services have increased.

[Old26]

Quote: knn54

And more questions:
- why claims to the IRGC if the air defense is subordinate to the army;

The IRGC also has its own Air Force-Air Defense (this structure is called the military space forces), and its ground units, and its fleet

Quote: knn54

And more questions:
- why "Thor", if there are new "Bavar-373", is. old "Mershad";

Because it was the optimal complex for this. The aircraft was spotted at a distance of 19 km from the base, and was hit at a distance of 12 km. To use long- and medium-range complexes against the target at such a distance hardly made sense. Moreover, it is not known whether they were there.

Quote: knn54

And more questions:
- Did the plane deviate from the route? There is a top-secret Malard base 30 km from Tehran.

Apparently (according to open data) - it is possible that not. The base was, according to various sources, from 24 to 30 km from the airport. The do-it-yourself liner of course was, but how programmed is HZ.
But what circulates in the network

[vector333]

I have only one question left regarding the situation: explain to me exactly how the USA / Israel managed to do this by the hands of the Iranians? A beacon? Serious agents (air defense calculation is not one person, how would ...)? A Boeing transponder, and indeed all electrics and software subject to specialists (plant, mikruh and software developers) from the USA?

[Aleksandr21]

Quote: vektor333

I have only one question left regarding the situation

The answer actually lies on the surface, just a lot of people don’t like it, because, in the opinion of the cheers of the patriots, the USA must be guilty of this catastrophe. And in fact, what do we have? the human factor, an error on the part of the air defense operator, I don’t know whether he lost his nerves or the preparation to leave much to be desired, but this is already a recognized fact. I personally do not see a connection, except for the mistakes of Iran itself. Who prevented them from closing the airspace? If only this decision would have made it possible to prevent such a mistake, especially if they were waiting for answers, and the Persians got it wrong, but our people are stubbornly trying to find new versions. It’s interesting, if it were a plane of a Russian company and our fellow citizens would die there, then on the website they also beat with a heel in the chest that the Iranians were not to blame and they were all good fellows, what did they admit?

[vector333]

I have no sense so far that the entire air defense calculation was complete dumbass. And escorting the aircraft practically from the airfield itself did not have the opportunity to check the situation. The day before the event, Trump makes a number of controversial statements. The plane is selected of the country with which it is easiest to solve any nuances. 90% of passengers are either Iranians by citizenship, or citizens of another country but Iranians by origin. The notorious video that someone knew where to shoot and when. The signature of the aircraft is large. Etc. etc.
You missed the most basic and easiest moment. The United States is to blame for the situation, because they brewed it hot earlier days and a long time ago in principle.
So they screwed up with Iran on equal terms. You can protect them further. Although I don’t understand at all who should be in this life to reach for pndos.

[Aleksandr21]

Quote: vektor333

You missed the most basic and easiest moment. The United States is to blame for the situation

The Iranians shot down the plane, the Iranians did not close the sky, and the USA is to blame for the plane crash, of course .... but for the Americans no one is blocking them, just in this situation the Iranians are solely to blame, who prevented them from closing the sky? Now I’m not even talking about a mistake with air defense, but simply banal things that the Iranians should have done in their minds. But they did not make them, so there is no need to shift them from a big head to a healthy one.

[Oleg Zorin]

What is there to explain ... It took half a day to collect information and bring it to the political leadership. Day for a debate ... Half a day for the realization that it will not work out.

[volodimer]

Now, if it weren’t for one word, I would put it, put it to you, plus ...

[Oleg Zorin]

I'll go shoot myself, since you did not give me a plus)))

[volodimer]

Well, absolutely so absolutely not necessary

[Oleg Zorin]

Joke, buddy, joke.

[Shahno]

Quote: Astra wild

And, after all, there really can be a deliberate "setup": at first, someone from high ranks signaled where Suleimani would be. I doubt that Suleimani posted his detailed route on the Internet, the Americans are killing the general. The IRGC is then "substituted".
And now the most interesting: who and for what purpose does this do?
I have several versions, or rather 2, but they have under versions: 1) someone, a high-ranking, is clearing a "place in the sun" for himself, and the ayatol and his support of the IRGC interferes with him. There may be different additional versions. 2) someone, I guess who, wants to radically change the course of Iran.

Your version is supported by rallies against the spiritual leader of Iran. There are now demands up to the resignation of the commander in chief ...

[Shahno]

Quote: alstr

I’ll clarify. They did not admit guilt. Unlike Iran.

So pressed them .. You still misunderstood. Such things are not very recognized if there is a minimal possibility of a tacit code.

[svoit]

Quote: Old26

There are questions.

VO for some reason did not want to bring a complete test, but I’m not too lazy
https://diana-mihailova.livejournal.com/4388248.html

[askort154]

svoit VO for some reason did not want to bring a complete test, but I’m not too lazy

Thanks for the link. The interview of the general, verbose and confused, very vividly paints a picture of what happened, which can be called in one word - a mess.
As a result, they shot down a "target" flying not towards the capital of the country, but away from it.
What logic can there be here ?!

[Golovan Jack]

Pure reaction: the plane is Ukrainian. Under whose control this unfinished - well, probably, it is understandable. In Iran. Which country provokes graters with Iran?

Coincidence?

Yes, of course, everything happened by chance

[pru-pavel]

Correctly shot down a pro-American plane in short. The answer was powerful. At the same time, they skipped the skakuas.

[Golovan Jack]

Minus. Too lazy to disassemble the wrap.

[Old26]

Quote: svoit

Quote: Old26

There are questions.

VO for some reason did not want to bring a complete test, but I’m not too lazy
https://diana-mihailova.livejournal.com/4388248.html

Thanks for the link. Before that I had read (though with translators) the English version of this interview. there is a difference, but basically the interviews are textually the same

Nevertheless, some passages of the general raise even more questions .... Here are some of them.

So, all air defense systems were at the highest alert level. On several occasions, these systems, including the one involved in the incident, were notified by the integrated network that cruise missiles had been launched across the country. Within a couple of times, they received reports that "cruise missiles are coming, get ready."

The air defense units were notified by the integrated network - that is, it turns out that the air defense network was functioning normally. But then how to perceive the information that "cruise missiles are launched, are coming"? What then did the Iranian air defense see? Non-existent cruise missiles?

At the signal that the cruise missiles were on, the corresponding air defense unit took the target to escort and fired rockets.

How to understand this? That, the calculation of the complex gave a damn about what its own radar shows. Did they have enough information that "cruise missiles are coming"? And they escorted the first target they came across?

At the moments when the incident occurs, this air defense unit discovers that there is a target - which she identified as a cruise missile - at a distance of 19 kilometers.

Yes, they took me to escort precisely at such a distance. But I repeat again. How could one confuse a cruise missile and an airliner when the EPR of the first is a couple of orders of magnitude smaller, like the illumination on the screen. How could one take a target for a cruise missile, not only a huge one, but also coming from the capital? Where did she suddenly come from? At the same time, it’s going not to the SMV with a relief envelope, like all cruise missiles fly, but at a height of several kilometers, while gaining altitude? Not to mention that the goal was with a working transpoder. Even if we take it as an axiom that the transpoder suddenly shuts off at a reversal, then BEFORE it worked and the mark on the radar said that it was a civilian plane. Or follow the marks on the radar was not the responsibility of the calculation? Then what is their professional level? At baseboard level or lower?

This plane takes off from here and rises in this direction. This means that this is the point of impact. Given the information sent to this operator - that it was a wartime situation and the rockets were fired - this poor guy defines it as a cruise missile.

The stress of the operator can be understood, but to make such a monstrous mistake, to take a huge liner for a small missile - what could have happened then, if it weren’t at the remote control of the air defense system, but at the CP of ballistic missiles. Or is there no training level ??

Then he moves along this trajectory, and here is the place where he falls to the ground. I have to explain some points here. Prior to the statement of the Armed Forces, the country's aviation organization resolutely defended [its position] and insisted that not a single missile hit the plane, and that the issue was under investigation. First, I must say that they operate on the basis of their own knowledge; they did not know about this incident.

The general defends, and this can be understood by the country's Iranian aviation organization. And this can be understood. But what, the airport dispatch service has no means of control (radars) Didn’t detect that a fast-flying target appears, going towards rapprochement with the airliner? Doesn’t he see that after these two marks coincided, the mark of the airliner began to behave quite differently? Lose height? Even assuming that they DID NOT KNOW about the defeat of an airliner by an anti-aircraft missile, such a mark behavior should at least alert them. They say that the connection with the liner was almost before a collision with the ground (I do not know how true this is). What, the crew did not report a missile defeat? Moreover, a certain operator shoots and uploads to the network video with this tragic incident?

It is necessary to clarify, when I was informed about the incident on Wednesday morning, I immediately reported this to the country's leadership. They told me: we hit the target.

How then to understand this? The country's leadership knew, but supported the version of a technical malfunction?

They said that the plane was not destroyed; he turned and wanted to land. Look, as the plane was hit at low altitude, a short-range missile with a small warhead and radio fuse exploded nearby [of the plane]; therefore, the aircraft continued to fly for some time; he did not explode in the air and flew before a collision with the ground.

The most interesting question. Speaking on TV, some of our test pilot the day after the tragedy, when shots from the crash site appeared, expressed surprise that there were no large debris that, logically, should have occurred when the plane was destroyed by an impact on the ground. He said that such fragments are more characteristic of an explosion in the air. so what really happened? Explosion in the air from two missiles or still destruction from a blow to the ground ???

[alien]

The general claims that the IRGC leadership requested the release of Iranian airspace from civilian aircraft.

That is, it is very likely that the air defense of the IRGC did not expect the appearance of a civilian aircraft at all, therefore it was shot as a target. Now the IRGC takes responsibility to save the reputation of the one whom it "asked to free the airspace of Iran" ... The one who deliberately gave permission to take off the aircraft is to blame.

[xGibSoNx]

Judging from the text of the news, which was undoubtedly selected, edited and absolutely precisely, is not a literal quote, only one conclusion can be drawn! The man who took responsibility admitted that he was so ... Really well done! But now, let's think about how things really happen in the Army! Moreover, the Army of the country, where they can ask "how to understand." Especially, given that the IRGC, in general, does not in fact obey the Iranian authorities .. There is a lot of question ... Given the mentality of the Persians, it may very well be that this very specific person openly specifically regrets what he has done .. Questions, in general, then, to him and not .. Questions are for those who organized all this! And most importantly, why he organized so badly!

[alien]

Quote: xGibSoNx

There are questions to those who organized all this!

Another interesting point: Evgeny Dykhne (UIA President) explained the delay in departing PS 752 flights for an hour due to the large amount of luggage and hand luggage on board.
“The commander, having determined the take-off mass of the aircraft, saw a discrepancy and decided to unload a certain amount of baggage from the trunk,” said the head of UIA. https://www.avianews.com/incidents/2020/01/11/mau_why_not_cancelled_flight_ps752/

[iouris]

Why is the IRGC not recognized immediately? Because there was no team. Who gives the command - Ayatollah. Why didn't the ayatollah take political responsibility? He probably has some thoughts. The leader of a lower rank was given the command to take everything upon himself. Which he did. What did he take upon himself? He took political responsibility for the unintentional (???) destruction of a passenger plane by air defense systems in the acute phase of a military conflict with the United States. The conflict arose due to the destruction of an official - a senior leader of the armed forces. The plane took off at a time when the US was expected to retaliate against Iran. Ukrainian plane. Ukraine is an agent of the United States (or, to a greater extent, the US Democratic Party).
Information warfare is what we (not all of course) see in Iran. There is an "orange revolution". Yes, it's already coming. If the destruction of the Ukrainian aircraft is a "pure accident", which will have consequences in the form of overthrowing the regime in Iran, then we must, comrades, take a closer look at this "accident"!

[Kronos]

Secular regime will be better in Iran

[alien]

Quote: iouris

"pure chance", which will have consequences in the form of overthrowing the regime in Iran, then it is necessary, comrades, to take a closer look at this "accident"

Yes, such "accidents" are planned only in war ...

[Fat]

Well ... Qui will sell ... I see. Iran has air defense, and it’s stupid ... Don’t fly whoever gets where you don’t need to, when there is a thread around the war ... My condolences to the non-combatants.

[Old26]

Quote: meandr51

His transponder was turned off. And deviated from the corridor towards the center of Tehran.

Where does this information come from? Kamrad orus laid out a scan yesterday. There was no turn towards the center of Tehran, just as there was no sharp turn to the right, as some write here. And the deviation was within the corridor.

[Thompson]

related questions arise. One of them: if the commander of the aircraft, before the missile hit the airliner, continued radio communication with the dispatcher and did not report any problems, then why did the Iranian air defense missile systems take the plane that had just taken off as a "cruise missile"?

And what, the operator of the air defense system and negotiations is listening to PASSENGER airplanes?
Oh, these Experts

[Shchors take it]

it is strange that no one talks about an unknown drone in the crash zone of the Ukrainian side! and why did the recognition system suddenly turn off? Yes, and the course changed suddenly! If the black box were not studied in France, much would have been ajar ...

[Kuzmitsky]

Everything can be, maybe the Ukrainian side was framed. But the Iranians completely took the blame, so now this is probably not important.