Shamsutdinov, a conscript soldier who shot his colleagues, apologized

Shamsutdinov, a conscript soldier who shot his colleagues, apologized

The conscript soldier Ramil Shamsutdinov, who shot his colleagues and commanders in October 2019, publicly apologized to their relatives by posting his message on the VKontakte social network on the support group’s page.


In his letter, he talked about the reasons for what happened and publicly asked for forgiveness (the author's spelling and punctuation are preserved - approx. VO):
I thank those who supported me and especially my father in this difficult situation. I regret that I could not restrain myself and took an extreme step, but I had no other choice but to endure further abuse of myself. I sincerely condolences to the families of the victims and please forgive me if you can


According to Shamsutdinov, he prepared himself for the army, did not intend to evade service, and later planned to connect his life with the Armed Forces. However, he writes, "did not expect to go to such hell."

Only now I am beginning to realize how much grief brought people, and broke my life

- wrote Shamsutdinov, adding that he does not understand at what point he broke.


Recall that on October 25 last year, ordinary soldier Ramil Shamsutdinov, while on guard, shot ten colleagues in a military unit near Chita. Eight servicemen, including officers, were killed on the spot, two more were seriously injured. Immediately after the arrest, he stated that he did not regret what he had done.

Currently, the criminal case against Shamsutdinov is in court, the defense insists that the crime was committed due to hazing. The Department of Defense previously stated that a nervous breakdown unrelated to the service could lead to the crime.


Photos used:
social network "VKontakte"
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  1. GKS 2111 9 January 2020 10: 03 New
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    Well, what can I say ... The sword cannot be blamed for everything .. It's a pity here, and you won’t get the guys back, and you’ve broken your life, but your family and friends are sorry, no words ...
    1. Stas157 9 January 2020 10: 26 New
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      Shamsutdinov also writes what hell he went to, and that he reached the last limit, and that he could not endure bullying anymore ... It is interesting, but the Moscow Region feels responsible for the relations that have developed there? For good, then, MO also need to apologize ... and change something.
      1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 10: 37 New
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        Something is wrong in our army, my son’s friend served under the contract for 2 years in the Airborne Forces and didn’t want to do this, he told me about the army so that he completely discouraged his friends from serving there.
        I learned from him that our army is rural, almost the entire set comes from the village, since there are no jobs in villages and towns, there are no prospects for a normal life, and there is nowhere for young people to go except for the army.
        1. for
          for 9 January 2020 10: 48 New
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          Quote: Fan-Fan
          I learned from him that our army is rural, almost the entire set comes from the village, since there are no jobs in villages and towns, there are no prospects for a normal life, and there is nowhere for young people to go except for the army.

          And you are so urban and correct, a Muscovite probably.
          1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 10: 52 New
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            No, I'm from southern Siberia, I live in the regional center. He also served in the army, even in the Soviet Union and he saw "grandfathers", saw how they forced the "young" to plow for themselves, many of which he saw was bad.
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                  1. St Petrov 9 January 2020 14: 23 New
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                    Illiterate and broken.


                    Are you talking about the waffles that encountered the Russian army?) of which the girls groan here, how dangerous is it to serve in it?)

                    on the topic is there something to squeeze out? Or will you continue to moan?

                    PS I do not know why my comments were demolished. Moans do not demolish, but my comments were demolished. Well, that's fine.
                    1. Shurik70 9 January 2020 19: 42 New
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                      Quote: GKS 2111
                      Everyone is sorry here, and you won’t get the guys back, and you’ve broken your life

                      If it is true that he indicated as the reason for his action - his pity. But the dead - not at all sorry.
            2. Sailor 10 January 2020 14: 38 New
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              I also served as an emergency service for the sunset of the USSR on a ship for 3 years, and I felt the difference with the service on the shore, we had almost half of the Asians on MT, and it was very difficult to make a Russe for a “race”, but no one started shooting (they ran away while charging, jumped into the water and tried to swim away), too, but shoot !!! And yet, well, I shot, because not all were killed, why go and finish off ??? This is not the victim, but the KILLER !!! And cold-blooded.
          2. for
            for 9 January 2020 11: 07 New
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            Muscovites pulled themselves in!
        2. Frederick 9 January 2020 10: 58 New
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          And what is wrong with the rural population?
          1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 11: 01 New
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            And where to work in the village? There are no prospects in the village, and not everyone can be a landowner and hire peasants.
            1. Frederick 9 January 2020 11: 11 New
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              I’m not talking about this, it’s just in your comment that it would sound either regret or indignation that they say that only the Selyaks in the army serve, but there are no urban ones. That is, as a kind of contempt for the rural people. So I asked what was wrong with them?
              1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 11: 32 New
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                Of course, I also meant something else - that in the village the guys have nothing more to do, how to join the army and they go there with pleasure and serve normally. And on the other hand I wanted to say that the city men are in no hurry, since they have more choices. I also wanted to say that the kids of the oligarchs generally ignore the army, and immediately get into the "elite" under the patronage of their parents. Did the sons of Sechin, Rogozin, Matvienko serve in the army?
        3. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 11 New
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          Quote: Fan-Fan
          the whole set comes from the village, since there are no jobs in villages and towns, there are no prospects for a normal life,

          Not surprising. The army becomes a place of salvation from hopelessness. And the authorities are profitable, the worse in the country, the stronger the desire to join the army. Something similar was in Ukraine - there, the military commissar was given bribes not for dropping from the army, but for getting into it.
          1. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 09: 45 New
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            Hmm, you're right, dear Sylvester! But I’ll correct you about Ukraine: in Central Ukraine they paid and pay to slope, and in Western - on the contrary, they pay in military commissariats to get into the army. And, as in Russia, 90% of the army is from the village, because in the cities there is at least some work, and in the villages, alas ... So the problems of our countries are related.
        4. ltc35 9 January 2020 14: 52 New
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          Here it is not necessary to put OBS in the rank of a reliable source! I served two years in the Airborne Forces and five years after the term, I know all the advantages and disadvantages from the inside. And urban and guys from the countryside, if they get along without deviations. Yes, of course, and we had breakdowns, both arrows and gunners. And it was hard for me, and for others. But there are other ways out. And believe me, with a normally working head you can get along with people everywhere. Do not kill, but get along.
        5. 4ekist 9 January 2020 15: 04 New
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          Why don’t you watch TV? they told you that in the army there are selected contract cyborg contractors and minds in scientific companies and everyone is happy. And you are misleading people.
        6. 4ekist 9 January 2020 15: 16 New
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          I think such “boys” can’t trust anything except a broom and a can of paint. Their service should be limited to auxiliary work in military units and hospitals, work in the galley and near the latrine. These are not dumped from heaven, it is a product of parenting and society.
      2. Proxima 9 January 2020 11: 13 New
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        Quote: Stas157
        For good, then, MO also need to apologize ... and change something.

        Good news, the parents of the deceased servicemen must also bring about changes that raised nonhumans and sadists. After all, the military fell under a batch, which they certainly were not at work, about which Ramil immediately expressed his regret. The main thing is that this case should not be launched on the brakes and Ramil does not become a scapegoat, and all the rest are soft and fluffy!
        1. Stas157 9 January 2020 11: 21 New
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          Quote: Proxima
          the parents of the dead servicemen must also bring about changes that raised nonhumans and sadists

          The dead have already paid the bills in full. It is a pity for those who accidentally fell under the distribution.
      3. Mavrikiy 9 January 2020 11: 16 New
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        Yeah, look at the photo, typical killer?
        Little boy, he was cornered and bullied. It is obvious. And the military uniform can no longer be removed from spilled blood in the "peaceful garrisons".
        I always loved and respected the army, but I hate official scum. Not served, military department and work at the Arys military base.
        1. Andrey Shch 9 January 2020 14: 57 New
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          Well, now for any reason it’s customary to blame everything on officials. What kind of bureaucratic scum are we talking about? Officials are civil servants, and here it is exclusively a military topic, i.e. We are talking about military personnel.
          1. Andrey Shch 10 January 2020 07: 46 New
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            Everyone, of course, has the right to their point of view, but you can explain in a nutshell - what’s wrong, minusers are bad. They went crazy with their cries about officials.
        2. 4ekist 9 January 2020 16: 07 New
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          Then such a “boy” shoves someone in the side somewhere in the gateway. Now let him answer, the corpses will no longer be brought to justice. This so-called boy and Ming remained. defense in the person of fathers-commanders.
        3. Nikolaevich I 9 January 2020 17: 38 New
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          Quote: Mavrikiy
          Yeah, look at the photo, typical killer?
          Little boy, he was cornered and bullied

          It’s good that they admitted that you don’t know the army service! But why, then, “cackle,” like “jahmams” from “committees of soldiers’s mothers?” I remember the period when our “call” passed into “old men” ... we did not scoff at the “young”, did not beat them, did not starved! When we were given a "portioned" drain. oil, we took only the "norm" for ourselves, so everyone got the oil equally. Sometimes, butter was given “by weight” and sugar was given more than “usual” ... We tried to take ourselves at the “norm” and more than once I saw that the “young” got plums. two times more butter and sugar than we "old men" took for ourselves! By the way, sergeants prevailed in our “call” .... And yet, we had incidents! One "young" guy (by the way, a physically healthy guy ... "bull", as they say in such cases) made a "self-shoot" (shot himself in the lungs ...) At first he stated that he was "inadvertently", but when the investigators showed him that "one with the other" does not converge, then he began to "blame" everything on "hazing", on the bullying of the "old people"! "Carry" became all! And the "old people" and the young "! So! To a large extent, the" young "helped us out! They unanimously declared that there was no bullying by the" old ", and this" gunman "had told them a long time ago that he did not want to serve! We were "released" ... no one was deprived of any ranks or positions ... And the "gunman" was transferred to some sort of "house platoon" ... I saw him once when he was "pheasant"! in a civilian sweater on the “backyard” and drove the “young” with might and main, threatening to kick back if he didn’t “move” properly! There was another “bloke” ... he didn’t want to do anything Th! When we undertook to "correct the service", he ran with denunciations to the political officer .. again there were complaints about "hazing"! And again we were helped by the "young" who directly stated that this "zhmyr" is a loafer, which "light I haven’t seen it! And what’s next? Yes, that’s it! Having become a “pheasant”, he began to scoff at the “young” ... put his responsibilities on them ... I remember how inadvertently overheard a conversation between the chief of staff and the political commander ... the chief of staff, lamenting, said: Here we are defending this "hmyr" .... "ran into" the sergeants, "old men", and now he is mocking the "young"! That's what it is like, “army life”! Listening to the lamentations, the cackling of some "discussion participants", I come to the conclusion that these "chela" hardly served "in the army"!
      4. PalBor 9 January 2020 12: 33 New
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        The boy is very difficult. If you don’t really believe our liberal media, who defended it with a wall, and under it began a massive bulk of the RF Armed Forces, then from the evidence and documents, for example, psychological characteristics, this picture is formed. The leader guy, with the manners of the beast leader, began to establish his own rules, similar to criminal ones. With the help of psychological and physical pressure and superiority, he crushed a number of colleagues, the officers did not recognize the authority, did not follow orders, set up the entire platoon and company against himself, not only the commanders. As a result: in cold blood, I emphasize - in cold blood, with the finishing of the living in the head killed 8 people. All the stuffing of "human rights defenders" with his beatings, dipping his head in the toilet and rape has been refuted a hundred times. The media is only reluctant to write about it, for free.
        He is a killer, not a syusi-pusi-victim. And that’s it.
        Then nadysya a fifteen-year-old daughter with an eighteen-year-old lover’s mother beat this girl’s knife and ax. Now the howl will rise, that we must understand and forgive them, because they defended their right to love.
        Come on, finish off the country ...
        1. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 09: 50 New
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          I support. He is the killer and the point. Let him answer now before the law.
      5. Victorio 9 January 2020 12: 36 New
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        Quote: Stas157
        Shamsutdinov also writes what hell he went to, and that he reached the last limit, and that he could not endure bullying anymore ... It is interesting, but the Moscow Region feels responsible for the relations that have developed there? For good, then, MO also need to apologize ... and change something.

        ====
        if they served an urgent term in sa, then they should have some idea of ​​hazing. somewhere it was more, somewhere less. and with a stable psyche it was possible to pass these tests. this man shot the disarmed colleagues in the head, and I strongly doubt that he experienced strong / terrible humiliation from each of those killed, especially from the officers. I think the punishment should be harsh to him, and repentance, if it is sincere, is only good for him.
        1. Stas157 9 January 2020 15: 46 New
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          Quote: Victorio
          idea of ​​hazing. somewhere it was more, somewhere less. and with a stable psyche it was possible to pass these tests

          I am amazed here with local writers! Shamsutdinov, in black and white, indicates that the situation edge was for him! In your lies? That is, it turns out that just like that, Shamsudinov failed seven, out of boredom?
          Another writes:
          Quote: letinant
          bodily harm to young people, I have not experienced this for more than 13 years

          So it means there is none anywhere else! Truth? And this is the story with Shamsutdinov invented by the liberal media! But it’s not clear where the seven corpses came from?

          He wants to tie another story about mopping like Shamsutdinov. Another suspects of Shamsutdinov’s cunning, they say, because he finished off. Just what the "sly" sought this did not indicate.
          People, what are you? Want to hide your head in the sand? To portray that there are no problems, there are not any outrages? It is precisely because of these that such tragic cases occur. They will continue to happen, while the policy of appeasement and polishing of inconvenient reality reigns in everything.
          1. Piramidon 9 January 2020 17: 45 New
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            Quote: Stas157
            Shamsutdinov, in black and white, testifies that the situation was an edge for him!

            In order to reduce the term, which you can’t just say, the more so lawyers will teach you how to speak correctly. The cold-blooded pursuit of wounded unarmed people is no longer a "state of affect" brought to the edge of a person, but a completely conscious cold-blooded murder.
            1. Stas157 9 January 2020 20: 33 New
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              Quote: Piramidon
              To reduce the time, what can’t you say?

              So there was no deadline for this, it was not necessary to kill. But, the guy had other goals. Driven to despair, he least of all thought about how long they would give. After all, it was a suicidal choice. He could have been killed during his arrest. But this did not stop him.
              Quote: Piramidon
              Cold-blooded wounded unarmed people - This is no longer a "state of affect" brought to the brink of a person, but a completely conscious cold-blooded murder.

              Now I’m crying! When a person is taken to extremes by bullying, and there is still a “lowering” ahead, and I would completely kill the "nonhumans" in cold blood. With finishing off.
              You, as I understand it, the role of the victim suits you more? To each his own. I do not blame you for such a choice.
              1. Piramidon 9 January 2020 21: 03 New
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                Quote: Stas157
                Now I’m crying!

                And I will support the killer.
          2. your1970 10 January 2020 18: 40 New
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            Quote: Stas157
            what a situation the edge was for him! In your lying? That is, it turns out just like that, Shamsudinov failed seven, out of boredom?


            1) any killer, I emphasize once againANY!!- will justify YOURSELF. It has a difference - Part 2 of Article 152 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation eight up to twenty years with restriction of freedom for a period of one year to two years, or for life with imprisonment, or the death penalty. ". With this scatter -from 8 to life - he will now say anything and about anyone: that Trump offended him belay that beat him Schwarzenegger belay that his food was stolen by Andrzej Duda, that he was raped by Angelina Jolie and so on ....

            2) the investigation is not yet completed, therefore, "out of boredom" or "for the cause" - is not yet known.

            3) there was such Sakalauskas (1988) - I had a familiar warrant officer VVshnik, who claimed that the convicts who were traveling in that car were happy afterwards - that the killer of the "red feathers" had been saved from the tower by their testimony. I can’t guarantee that I didn’t go in that car, but the examination (situational examination was carried out from May 20, 1987 to February 24, 1988) confirmed thoroughness firing ...
            Here, somehow, a man also carefully shot, did not water in affect from the hip ....

            Therefore, I suggest waiting for the trial ...

            Z.Y. and remember that in the US Army, for example, there are no "grandfathers" and "hazing / fraternities", and arrows are found - for example, Major of the US armed forces Nidal Malik Hassan
        2. Doctor 9 January 2020 19: 43 New
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          and I strongly doubt that he experienced strong / terrible humiliation from everyone killed by him, especially from the officers. I think the punishment should be severe for him, and repentance, if it is sincere, will only benefit him.


          Reviews served in this part.

          I will say this, he served there in the author in 14-15.
          If your son got into the autorot - then everything is OK, hazing is, but on the little things, basically do the work for the old-timers. Well, and squat midnight after lights out 2000 times in body armor.
          If he fell into the guard company - that’s hazing there, consider that he will spend the first six months in terrible stress.
          Well, the constant demands to donate money to the "barracks" needs.

          In the afternoon we ran and jumped, or we dragged outfits. At night, grandfathers swept us, and we spent the nights resting on the bench)). Then on guard for a day. At least some kind of rest !! Recreation!! On guard !!

          I served in this part quit in 2010, part as part! .... I even managed with company G ------ to the lieutenant on the ridge ------- and neither of which the relations with the officers became even better !!!!!!!!

          The unit is good compared to the ones I saw and in which I was, the unit commander and some officers are good. It was in my service a couple of ensigns and sergeants - rare --------, I hope they have already been kicked out of there (ensigns).
          ... He personally saw how a crowd of sergeants beat an ordinary soldier for refusing to "bend" under them.
          ... But in general, the part is normal and calmer than other parts.
          PS Until now, there remains a desire to mark out these ensigns and sergeants who humiliated and beat the soldiers, maybe we’ll meet in life, believe me it hurts ..

          It remains to suffer quite a bit until the end of this nightmare called part 54160 ....


          “The part where Shamsutdinov served was to be disbanded before the end of the year,” said RBC's interlocutor.
          "On the basis of the disbanded unit, another military unit of the Eastern Military District will be deployed, a RBC source in the military district said."

          https://www.rbc.ru/society/04/12/2019/5de660a79a794706f28b8aab
      6. Lone gunman 9 January 2020 15: 40 New
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        The serviceman acted ... out of a sense of justice, but not according to the law, he did not finish legal work, he "sawed" all "commanders" of the unit. And excuses like - "well, there is no female dormitory at a sewing vocational school" does not roll.
        1. Victorio 9 January 2020 16: 17 New
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          Quote: Lone gunman
          The serviceman acted ... out of a sense of justice, but not according to the law, he did not finish legal work, he "sawed" all "commanders" of the unit. And excuses like - "well, there is no female dormitory at a sewing vocational school" does not roll.

          ====
          or maybe a soldier in response to threats / humiliations / did not agree on the characters disarmed his colleagues, then shot them in a fit of anger / anger / inadequacy, and now he sculpts a hunchback to the accompaniment of lawyers / liberals / sympathizers?
        2. 4ekist 9 January 2020 18: 25 New
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          You can’t put a commander near each pod and there’s no way to go after each with a diaper, semolina and persuasion. There is criminality here, from 20 to life.
    2. Alex Justice 9 January 2020 11: 06 New
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      Everyone is sorry here, and you won’t return the guys

      And I'm not sorry, so scum and need. Grandfather beat my relative to death. No one answered, hushed up the case.
      1. letinant 9 January 2020 11: 35 New
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        You know, here I read your essays on this topic and ask myself a question. When was the last time you were in a military unit? What nafig hazing!? They serve one year. From this year, 4 months in the training unit. Yes, by the end of the service, they are just beginning to determine the latrine from the kitchen by smell! Twice a day, a physical examination, for the bruise of the conscript, it concerns the commander of the unit. The contractor was nearly imprisoned, the conscript during cleaning on the wet deck slipped and 5 people fell to the fifth spot, a bruise started. The cleaning contractor was nearly put on trial, although all conscripts who were there unanimously said that he himself, and even the bruised one, shouted most of all. The command told them he scared you, that's all. Only when the bruised one said: what’s going to hit everyone again, who will be to blame, the eldest in this room? Only then did a constructive dialogue begin.
        And about the stories that is going on in the army, I can say. There are two reasons why contract soldiers and officers tell passions.
        1. They exaggerate and try to embellish, seem like heroes, overcoming all adversities.
        2. Others are not made for the army, from the word at all. They come for money, someone wants apartments. and when faced with reality, it’s hard work. To the detriment of yourself and your loved ones, you lose health, loved ones rarely see you.
        Yes, there is enough absurdity, but causing bodily harm to young people, I have not encountered this for more than 13 years.
        1. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 16 New
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          Quote: letinant
          I have not encountered this for more than 13 years.

          If you have not encountered, it does not mean that this is not. Last year, VO discussed "suicide" near Voronezh when they found a body with tied hands and a plastic bag on his head
          1. letinant 9 January 2020 12: 50 New
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            In what place of the military unit found him, under what circumstances, are you familiar with the progress of the case, have you calculated an approximate circle of suspects? Unless you specifically have at least this information, it’s too early to draw conclusions. And who wrote this stupidity in VO (about suicide) if the body was found in this form?
            1. St Petrov 9 January 2020 14: 00 New
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              This is Sylvester. This is normal. This is the fair-faced audience of latent revolutionaries. Why are you talking about details and logic? It also needs tears, groans and emotions. Reading such latent I understand that we are from different planets. And these whine that the people are not the same. So what we have is mutually

              PS they do not know what the guard, service, extreme situations are. Army and men's team. So we will not judge. For them, it is decay and fear and the very embodiment of Mordor
              1. New Year day 9 January 2020 19: 44 New
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                Quote: c-Petrov
                This is Sylvester. This is normal. This is the fair-faced audience of latent revolutionaries. Why are you talking about details and logic? It also needs tears, groans and emotions.

                Yes, no words. You do not read VO, and newspapers too. Primitively somehow it turns out, blah blah
                Learn the materiel
                follow the link
                https://topwar.ru/154136-nekotorye-podrobnosti-o-smerti-soldata-srochnika-na-poligone-pod-voronezhem.html laughing
                1. your1970 10 January 2020 18: 58 New
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                  there is a continuation
                  https://topwar.ru/162136-po-gibeli-soldata-srochnika-na-poligone-oglasheny-neobychnye-vyvody.html
                  and for killing - it’s strange not to take off the bag a bit and to unwind the hands of the murdered one?
              2. New Year day 9 January 2020 19: 55 New
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                Quote: c-Petrov
                Army and men's team.

                "... captain," acting out of falsely understood interests of military service, with the aim of teaching and punishing ... he used physical violence and inflicted at least four blows with his right fist on the body. "
                https://www.vrn.kp.ru/online/news/3420099/
                yes, the "team" am
            2. New Year day 9 January 2020 19: 42 New
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              Quote: letinant
              In what place of the military unit found him, under what circumstances, are you familiar with the progress of the case, have you calculated an approximate circle of suspects? Unless you specifically have at least this information, it’s too early to draw conclusions. And who wrote this stupidity in VO (about suicide) if the body was found in this form?

              take it easy on turns, sir ..

              Some details of the case of the death of a conscript at the site near Voronezh
              follow the link
              https://topwar.ru/154136-nekotorye-podrobnosti-o-smerti-soldata-srochnika-na-poligone-pod-voronezhem.html
              1. letinant 10 January 2020 02: 48 New
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                And what you pointed out. According to possible data, perhaps, presumably, perhaps, it seemed, according to media reports. Are you seriously!? Black hands, HE WAS A SOURCE !!! But fighters are falling asleep, and in places where they themselves can be harmful. And they fell from stools, and leaned on the stove, which was a sin to hide, he fell asleep on the nightstand at the time. Who saw that the captain hit him, also according to media reports? When I see from you an official response to your request to the military prosecutor's office, where your words and the media you specified will be confirmed. Then I admit that you are right. AND WHEN YOU ARE VOID RING!

                PS I feel sorry for my parents, I sincerely offer them my condolences. But you, who cuddle everything around you, make them hurt. When grief comes to the house, you and your media climb into the family with arms and legs, tidy everything up there, they want to figure out who is to blame, and you are using their grief HYIP on it !!! You were not there, you do not know this person. And if the media were professionals, they would have waited for the prosecutor’s report without losing sight of this case and then, if there were inconsistencies, they were drenched in theirs. But no, because then it’s not interesting for you; And KP, trash, a long time ago.
                1. New Year day 10 January 2020 07: 08 New
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                  Quote: letinant
                  When I see from you an official response to your request to the military prosecutor’s office, where your words and the media you specified will be confirmed

                  what prevents you from clarifying the matter yourself? Laziness? Everything has been clear for a long time and the matter has been started. You must chew everything and put it in your mouth.
                  The first document with the conclusion on the death of a serviceman signed by the commander of the military unit, which indicated signs of violent death, was sent to the military prosecutor’s office, the military investigation department of the IC RF, the military commandant’s office and the military commissariat in the Krasnodar Territory.
                  The military investigation department of the RF IC for the Voronezh garrison is investigating a criminal case under the article “Murder” on this fact.
                  The decision to institute criminal proceedings reads: “Stepan Tsymbal was found on the floor in a tent equipped for washing dishes. He was in a sitting position with his legs extended forward and his hands tied with tape. In addition, a plastic bag was wrapped around his head, wrapped around the neck with duct tape. ”
                  This is from the criminal record. So killers they are killers.

                  Quote: letinant
                  And KP, trash, a long time ago.

                  so watch and read the immaculate media laughing
                  As Putin said: no matter who speaks, if he speaks the truth! Here you have to agree with him
                  1. letinant 10 January 2020 08: 59 New
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                    You lie time after time. What nafig conclusion of the commander, the military prosecutor’s office is called immediately, she makes a conclusion. It is up to the commander to cordon off the scene of a possible crime. The criminal case is filed according to the FACT and not according to the statement, in such a situation. Why did they drag their parents back? What did they send? And here is the draft board? Do you rave or remember words related to the army? They can only be informed about the progress of the case or asked to clarify a particular situation. But you don’t know, and therefore funny. It's funny to watch how you get out, go to the person, sending headlines from newspapers. But in fact ZERO.

                    PS I already knew everything. But you are not interested, as I said. You do not follow the information. Only spoil the air. Therefore YOU troll. YOUR FRIEND AND NEIGHBOR PUTINOID !!! wink
    3. smile 9 January 2020 19: 42 New
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      GKS 2111
      Hello.
      Sorry, we, of course, do not know reliably what happened, do not know the materials of the case ..... but your wording sincerely surprises me.
      Do you really believe that in criminal proceedings you must adhere to the principle that the sword does not break the guilty head? "
      I repeat, we do not know the materials of the case. but do you really believe that killing several colleagues can be blamed for them?
      Once again, I apologize, but what do you mean by “the sword does not cut”? Understand and forgive? He’s kidding, especially since he apologized, right?
      Lawyers are simply obliged to say exactly what they say, while not forgetting to maintain the right mood in society.
      Personally, I’m not sure that it was the hazing that caused the person involved in the massacre. How not sure of the opposite.
      But to understand and forgive ... only because the lawyers advised me to write a few lines on paper .... I doubt this even more.
  2. Azazelo 9 January 2020 10: 03 New
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    a rag and a murderer .... it was difficult for him to see and he and Hell got ... on a stake to plant for such a need.
    1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 10: 11 New
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      Quote: Azazelo
      a rag and a murderer .... it was difficult for him to see and he and Hell got ... on a stake to plant for such a need.

      If the reasons that he points out are true, then he did everything right. It’s a pity only one kid who accidentally got under the hand
      1. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 10: 29 New
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        about how. You see, all have different thresholds. for some, the mockery is that they are forced to wash their floors and this is not a pun. I met personally and more than once. you see on others you can’t raise your voice right away. if anyone from the Khabarovsk garrison is being read here, they should remember the case when a young lieutenant of a brazen boor put in his place in the morning when he was lying about in the location. he threw himself with a stool at him and the lieutenant had to shoot. and many different cases. he did everything right ...
        1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 10: 47 New
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          Quote: carstorm 11
          about how. You see, all have different thresholds. for some, the mockery is that they are forced to wash their floors and this is not a pun. I met personally and more than once. you see on others you can’t raise your voice right away. if anyone from the Khabarovsk garrison is being read here, they should remember the case when a young lieutenant of a brazen boor put in his place in the morning when he was lying about in the location. he threw himself with a stool at him and the lieutenant had to shoot. and many different cases. he did everything right ...

          And when they want to fuck you all-round, is this your threshold or norms?
          1. Stas157 9 January 2020 11: 02 New
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            Judging by his comments, he has a high threshold. Fine. Can withstand.
            1. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 11: 05 New
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              watch that write dear. I am a well-mannered person, but I can also answer in your language. Hamlo.
              1. Stas157 9 January 2020 11: 12 New
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                Quote: carstorm 11
                I can answer in your language. Hamlo.

                No. With a threshold - trouble. The main thing for the machine is not to grab.
                1. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 11: 14 New
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                  let's do it. you ignore me and I you. don't write in my direction anymore. I don’t want to talk with people like you, I don’t want to talk. I don’t have the rank of an ordinary language.
                  1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 12: 49 New
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                    Quote: carstorm 11
                    let's do it. you ignore me and I you. don't write in my direction anymore. I don’t want to talk with people like you, I don’t want to talk. I don’t have the rank of an ordinary language.

                    Hide the knives and forks before it's too late!
                  2. Romka 9 January 2020 15: 43 New
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                    It means not to you, but to this soldier it means just right.
          2. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 11: 04 New
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            necessarily such extremes? and why not to harvest organs, for example, or to recruit in Nebira?
          3. RBLip 9 January 2020 11: 41 New
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            Turn on your head. it doesn’t seem like this .... the little boy had planned everything in advance, no? he finished off colleagues. ADDED. I wonder why? maybe just then, what would you now, and such as verified ONLY his words? hiteeer scum ....
            1. Stas157 9 January 2020 12: 10 New
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              Quote: RBLip
              Turn on your head. ... he finished off colleagues. ADDED. I wonder why? ... hiteeeeer scum....

              First of all, he killed, as he wanted to. What he sought was details that were more likely to indicate his hatred of the offenders. After all, Shamsutdinov did not pursue any mercantile interests. He wanted to get even and was afraid of the promised reprisal. They brought it.
              1. Glory1974 9 January 2020 17: 27 New
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                What he sought was details that were more likely to indicate his hatred of the offenders.

                He himself admitted that he killed two innocents. What for?
                Probably there would be no witnesses.
            2. Roman070280 9 January 2020 13: 11 New
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              And what is surprising that he sought ??
              If you bring me and give me an assault rifle .. I will also kill .. I can also stamp my feet on the corpse after ..
              I never did this .. and didn’t plan anything like that, but .. I think it would be like that .. The trick wasn’t around here ..
              1. Glory1974 9 January 2020 17: 29 New
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                And what is surprising that he sought ??
                If you bring me and give me an assault rifle .. I will also kill .. I can also stamp my feet on the corpse after ..
                I never did such a thing .. and didn’t plan anything like that, but .. I think it would be like that .. The trick wasn’t around.

                He killed two innocents. He finished off those who no longer offered resistance.
                The only explanation is getting rid of witnesses. Those killed cannot speak, now they are only listening to him. A classic example of a pre-prepared and thoughtful murder.
                1. Roman070280 10 January 2020 10: 00 New
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                  The only explanation - getting rid of witnesses
                  This is the last thing that would have crossed my mind ..
                  Apparently, you are just more lucky with the nerves .. since you even have no idea about emotions during such situations ..
                  Preparing and planning in advance is 100% of the fact that a person will calm down and abandon such plans .. because he understands that he is not a professional killer, and throwing a gun into the river will not run away with a million abroad .. And to plan just put yourself in to a slammer, and to break his life for nothing (and already he had broken, no matter how it ended) .. no one is capable of this ..
                  But when the crowd brings you, scoffs .. you and the atomic bomb, not thinking too much, throw them on them ..
                  1. Glory1974 10 January 2020 11: 31 New
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                    Preparing and planning in advance is 100% of the fact that a person will calm down and abandon such plans .. because he perfectly understands that he is not a professional killer, and throwing a gun into the river will not run away with a million abroad ..

                    Just the same experience and practice shows that such executions are planned in advance. It is rumored that the arrest of a cadet of the military-space academy, who had drawn up a plan for a terrorist attack at his university, the shooting of guards in the 90s, when detailed plans for the guardrooms with a diagram of how to act were seized from the shot.
                    The criminal has a different psychology. According to you, there shouldn’t be crime, because at the planning stage comes awareness of punishment. in practice, everything is different.
                    It’s just that you, as a normal person, do not fit this in your head.
                    1. Roman070280 10 January 2020 11: 43 New
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                      Nuuu .. terrorist attack .. this is a completely different story .. like contract killings ..
                      But any fight always happens suddenly .. and it may well end with a stabbing with several corpses .. And if you have a firearm at hand ..
                      As they say, life is richer than fantasy .. and there can be a great many situations .. And everyone sees something different in what happened ..
                      1. Glory1974 10 January 2020 11: 53 New
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                        I write not only about the attack. By the way, a terrorist attack, qualified law enforcement agencies. And he consisted of shooting colleagues.
                        And all the mass shootings of the guards were prepared in advance. Because if you do not prepare, then nothing will work.
                        And here he waits for everyone to disarm, then begins to shoot, successively striking everyone who could resist, kills the wounded and kills including those not guilty. And they just could testify in his favor and confirm that he was subjected to bullying.
                        At the exit there are only corpses and his words, which there is no one to refute.
          4. Victorio 9 January 2020 12: 41 New
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            Quote: Vol4ara
            And when they want to fuck you all-round, is this your threshold or norms?

            ===
            lawyers, coupled with liberals, will not yet tell
        2. Stas157 9 January 2020 10: 56 New
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          Quote: carstorm 11
          for some, the mockery is that their floors are forced to wash

          And for some, a randomly dropped word spoken in the wrong tone! Let's not do demagogy. Shamsutdinov writes about Hell, about bullying and the fact that the instinct of self-preservation worked, not having in mind mopping.
          Quote: carstorm 11
          rushed with a stool he and the lieutenant had to shoot

          But not with a gun. There is a difference. Let's get some more stories!
          1. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 11: 11 New
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            he can write anything. I rely on my own experience. I had organisms which, in my school, even without taking the oath, they imitated suicide and then they sang to parents about hazing. although there were not even close old men there. and another wrote a letter to mom and she took him home I remember. he told such tales there, although the whole part was at the training grounds, but his grandfathers apparently somehow somehow teleported him. no difference. a stool will break his head with one blow. And I spoke of another.
          2. alexmach 9 January 2020 11: 41 New
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            But not with a gun. There is a difference. Let's get some more stories!

            The military commander at school still told the bike that he had to shoot into the air once when a drunk soldier "went" at him. He told me that after that he saved the deer by sending it to his lip, for which he had scolded from investigators who had come later because he had lip-smashed him from the criminal.
        3. The comment was deleted.
      2. senima56 9 January 2020 11: 39 New
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        "If the reasons that he points out are true ...." - here it is "the dog is buried" !!! And what else will he indicate in the cause of the murder? Of course "bullying and hazing!" And if he killed because of hatred of the "infidels" ?! AND? Just do not think that he will indicate such a reason! You need to figure it out properly, what and how. And then judge by law and conscience.
    2. The Siberian barber 9 January 2020 10: 11 New
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      Do you know all the circumstances that led to this tragedy ?? Me not. Therefore, I do not call for the actions that you call for, so as not to become a "murderer"
      1. Pessimist22 9 January 2020 10: 14 New
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        For any lifelong, so many people killed.
        1. The Siberian barber 9 January 2020 10: 18 New
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          Guilt is beyond doubt! But you can’t ignore the circumstances!
          The boy could well be brought to the edge. Let's hope that the investigation and the court will be fair.
          1. Pessimist22 9 January 2020 10: 22 New
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            Do you think that if a person killed 7 people, are there any mitigating circumstances?
            1. Star Destroyer 9 January 2020 10: 35 New
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              Of course. If he put the scum (and the survivors pleaded guilty and are themselves now accused), he did everything right, and he will be released to serve in the military unit.
              1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 10: 47 New
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                Quote: Star Destroyer
                then he did everything right, and will be released in the military unit to serve.

                Well, you have the logic!
            2. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 10: 39 New
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              Quote: Pessimist22
              Do you think that if a person killed 7 people, are there any mitigating circumstances?

              If 7 people before this, all the time they were poking, humiliating, and the day before they decided to omit him all together, then yes. Even if there would be not 7, but 15, but with the same intentions, then yes too, and if he can prove it in court, he will get off symbolically with a term. Not 7 people killed, but 7 freaks
              1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 10: 56 New
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                Quote: Vol4ara
                Not 7 people killed, but 7 freaks

                This will determine the court, but not you.
                1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 10: 57 New
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                  Quote: tihonmarine
                  Quote: Vol4ara
                  Not 7 people killed, but 7 freaks

                  This will determine the court, but not you.

                  I write about this "if what he is talking about is true"
              2. NKT
                NKT 9 January 2020 11: 12 New
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                There, it seems, three people had nothing to do with it .... And the aggravating circumstance for him in this case is “control shots” - finishing.
              3. ZAV69 9 January 2020 15: 25 New
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                Right now, he will not even tell you, especially after the lawyers and the committee of nulliparous mothers. The defendant publishes in social networks .... To get off the fuck. What kind of consequence is this?
                In court, he will be able to prove .... How will he prove it? Is the court so gullible?
                If the person was brought, then he would rather release the store from the belly for the offenders, and would not produce control in the head.
                1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 19: 39 New
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                  Quote: ZAV69
                  Right now, he will not even tell you, especially after the lawyers and the committee of nulliparous mothers. The defendant publishes in social networks .... To get off the fuck. What kind of consequence is this?
                  In court, he will be able to prove .... How will he prove it? Is the court so gullible?
                  If the person was brought, then he would rather release the store from the belly for the offenders, and would not produce control in the head.

                  So no one talks about the state of affect. The guy was told that tonight we will let you down. He thought, and instead of handing over the store and the machine gun killed them all. And judging by the fact that the innocent suffered, whom he did not want to kill, just from the belly
              4. SERGOL 9 January 2020 15: 40 New
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                Dear wolf. Why such confidence in the correctness of this scumbag. He can not justify anything, nothing. And taking into account the finishing of the wounded in the head, only from above. Well, for an example. My soldier left the post with weapons. The nachkar instantly reacted, since there was no timely report from the sentry. Around one in the morning they raised the alarm. Everything is in accordance with the plan for the search for a serviceman with weapons. This soldier climbed the fire escape and smashed a window into the officers' canteen. The watchman's grandfather came out on a clink of glass heaped a shot in the head. Then he went down to the brewhouse. He cheated on the cooker's robes for money and medicines. Further he planned to advance to the Chita region, where he would deal with his older brothers (three) criminals, who began to take turns living with his girlfriend. But when, he was about to leave the dining room, he realized that he was already actively looking for him. He returned, sat on a chair, an automatic machine between his legs, a single fire mode, two bullets in the head.
                1. Glory1974 9 January 2020 17: 32 New
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                  sat on a chair, an automatic machine between the legs, a single fire mode, two bullets in the head.

                  It strains "two bullets in the head on a single." What wasn’t death the first time?
                2. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 19: 41 New
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                  Quote: SERGOL
                  Dear wolf. Why such confidence in the correctness of this scumbag. He can not justify anything, nothing. And taking into account the finishing of the wounded in the head, only from above. Well, for an example. My soldier left the post with weapons. The nachkar instantly reacted, since there was no timely report from the sentry. Around one in the morning they raised the alarm. Everything is in accordance with the plan for the search for a serviceman with weapons. This soldier climbed the fire escape and smashed a window into the officers' canteen. The watchman's grandfather came out on a clink of glass heaped a shot in the head. Then he went down to the brewhouse. He cheated on the cooker's robes for money and medicines. Further he planned to advance to the Chita region, where he would deal with his older brothers (three) criminals, who began to take turns living with his girlfriend. But when, he was about to leave the dining room, he realized that he was already actively looking for him. He returned, sat on a chair, an automatic machine between his legs, a single fire mode, two bullets in the head.

                  Initially, I didn’t know about completing it; during the discussion, details surfaced. And how 2 bullets in the head if a single, reflexively pressed something a second time
            3. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 10: 39 New
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              One thing is - defended his honor.
              1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 11: 25 New
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                Shamsutdinov stated that these and the officer together told him that they would rape him. And in order not to be raped, he did so, did not want to be "omitted."
                1. SERGOL 9 January 2020 15: 42 New
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                  Lies. How do you believe in this get along
                  1. Vol4ara 9 January 2020 19: 42 New
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                    Quote: SERGOL
                    Lies. How do you believe in this get along

                    What's the point then? Just killed, threw a coin - "oh tails, but I thought there would be an eagle, you have to kill everyone"
            4. alexmach 9 January 2020 11: 46 New
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              Do you think that if a person killed 7 people, are there any mitigating circumstances?

              I believe that there are different articles in the criminal code and every act is classified according to these articles according to formal grounds. And now, in my amateurish view of what and what, and for life, his act certainly does not pull. Life is a deliberate murder from gangster or any other wild motives. And here is almost self-defense. By the way there is also a good article "the increase of necessary self-defense"
              1. Pessimist22 9 January 2020 12: 07 New
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                So this is a deliberate murder, he committed it during the performance of official duties, that is, he planned, and there was no threat in the barracks and his life, but the fact that it is massive and with control shots is aggravating circumstances.
                1. alexmach 9 January 2020 12: 18 New
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                  I am not familiar with the details of what happened nor with the laws in detail, but for me this statement is not at all obvious
                  So this is intentional murder, he committed it in the line of duty, that is, he planned

                  What do "responsibilities" have to "planned"
                  If he had been mocked and deprived of sleep for three days before (and sleep deprivation is actually torture), then it’s generally difficult to say that he planned something ...
                  1. SERGOL 9 January 2020 15: 45 New
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                    Definitely planned murder. Since in the room of the changing guard, he waited until everyone was discharged and began to kill.
            5. The Siberian barber 9 January 2020 11: 50 New
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              Quote: Pessimist22
              Do you think that if a person killed 7 people, are there any mitigating circumstances?

              Have you found somewhere in my posts about "extenuating / aggravating circumstances"?
              I wrote about the circumstances!
              And, as they are, the COURT will determine
              The position "on the count" is surprising, having very vague ideas about the incident, taken from the writings of journalists
          2. Alexey Kurtov 9 January 2020 11: 06 New
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            It is very difficult to shoot such a number of people (and even with control shots) even as a result of a nervous breakdown, and no references to the so-called "bullying" can be accepted.
            1. Roman070280 9 January 2020 13: 17 New
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              Very easy .. All people are different !!
        2. alexmach 9 January 2020 11: 43 New
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          For any lifelong, so many people killed.

          In a state of affect? After three days of bullying? Yes, how to say. May be recognized as innocent.
      2. AU Ivanov. 9 January 2020 10: 48 New
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        I agree with you. There are individuals who rattle on bedside tables, substitute comrades and generally behave improperly in a military team. Then they are surprised that the team begins to educate them.
    3. Stas157 9 January 2020 10: 32 New
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      Quote: Azazelo
      rag and murderer ....

      Maybe on the contrary, how (how could) stood up for himself?
      Quote: Azazelo
      to stake for such a need.

      So he is serving his sentence. Surely knew in advance what was going on. But he writes, this was the last limit. The question is, why does the army bring conscripts to this limit? There must be a civilized way out of this ugly situation so that it does not have to bring down colleagues.
      1. AlexVas44 9 January 2020 11: 36 New
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        Quote: Stas157
        The question is, why does the army bring conscripts to this limit?

        The question is, does the army bring? If arrogant, then the army is the crown. The crown of what has already been invested in these guys before. It’s just that in the army, in a large collective, this manifests itself much brighter than in other collectives (groups, etc.), where some elements of violence also exist. It's just that the army still has weapons .... the answer is very loud.
      2. alexmach 9 January 2020 11: 49 New
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        There must be a civilized way out of this ugly situation so that you do not have to bring down colleagues

        Yes, he didn’t bring down those, it was necessary to commanders, down to the commander of the unit.
        1. SERGOL 9 January 2020 15: 51 New
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          The commanders have to work with the material provided to him by the state. And you respected with such reasoning, a place on the gallows.
          1. alexmach 9 January 2020 16: 16 New
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            Well, no. You have to work with what you have and you need to achieve the result acceptable. In this case, the result of the commanders is unacceptable. Responsible for this commander failed educational work in the team.
    4. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 10: 41 New
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      Quote: Azazelo
      a rag and a murderer .... it was difficult for him to see and he and Hell got ... on a stake to plant for such a need.

      you just
    5. smart ass 9 January 2020 10: 43 New
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      I would do the same. First, I would have warned of course.
    6. Krasnoyarsk 9 January 2020 10: 57 New
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      [quote = Azazelo] a rag and a murderer .... it was difficult for him to see and he got Hell ... on the count put for such a need. [/ quote
      And you, you see, suffer humiliations with joy and pleasure? And you consider yourself steadfast and that no humiliation will "break" you?
      1. Pessimist22 9 January 2020 11: 03 New
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        And it was possible to try to defend oneself with fists or it was necessary to fill up 7 people, including a couple of their friends, unarmed.
        1. Krasnoyarsk 9 January 2020 11: 16 New
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          Quote: Pessimist22
          And it was possible to try to defend oneself with fists or it was necessary to fill up 7 people, including a couple of their friends, unarmed.

          From the photo you can see that the guy is feeble. How to dismiss the physically strong, but De-Bil.
      2. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 21 New
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        Quote: Krasnoyarsk
        You, you see, suffer humiliation with joy and pleasure

        No, he is just one of those who encourage and participate in lawlessness. That's just nobody has pulled at him yet
    7. Mavrikiy 9 January 2020 11: 18 New
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      Quote: Azazelo
      a rag and a murderer .... it was difficult for him to see and he and Hell got ... on a stake to plant for such a need.

      Well, you need to put on a stake for such komenty. hi Him it was not difficultbut there was no life. request
    8. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 19 New
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      Quote: Azazelo
      rag and murderer.

      I wonder what would you do if the commander promised you a rape in the evening? Would you give up? Or did they pick up the machine?
      1. SERGOL 9 January 2020 15: 55 New
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        You put your lizun in one well-known place. Not for you to judge the composition of our aircraft.
  3. Mountain shooter 9 January 2020 10: 06 New
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    Mentally unstable in the army is contraindicated. Not a kindergarten. Hazing dragged ... line of defense, of course. Otherwise, he’s life-long ... This is my opinion, still he had a little relation to the army. The officer did not pay attention to the kid that he was so “nervous” ... Well, he’s from the cadet barracks, where it’s much tougher ...
    1. rich 9 January 2020 10: 26 New
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      The officer did not pay attention to the kid that he was so “nervous” ... Well, he’s from the cadet barracks, where it’s much tougher ...

      I ended up in an urgent cadet barracks. So I can argue with you. But then the time was completely different.
      1. Dmitry Donskoy 9 January 2020 11: 25 New
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        Greetings, colleague. hi Times have nothing to do with it. It all depends on the person who got into the military team from the mother with the folder. I served 30 years. I saw many recruits. The vast majority are painlessly joining units, but there are individuals who are not used to doing something themselves, but only at someone else’s expense and by someone else’s hands. They don’t like such people not only in the army, but in any team. This is exactly the situation here. You had to turn to a psychologist, he is in any unit and commander. Such situations are easily resolved usually by recruiting method to another part. soldier
        1. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 11: 45 New
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          Talk to the commander say? So according to the soldier, the officer participated in the persecution.
        2. The comment was deleted.
    2. Krasnoyarsk 9 January 2020 11: 25 New
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      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      Mentally unstable in the army is contraindicated.

      For some reason, in the parts where the officers fulfill their duties, they are all mentally stable. And where officers transfer their duties to illiterate sergeants, "mentally unstable" always appear there and they MANDATORY - physically weak.
    3. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 30 New
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      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      he is from the cadet barracks, where it is tougher ...

      Here is the answer to the question of lawlessness in the army from the commander. Let me remind you of my example: 2 BDKs standing nearby, on one everything is fine, on the second - night hikes of thugs. And a sailor hanging from a destroyer
      1. Romka 9 January 2020 15: 50 New
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        So the fish rots from the head, that’s the trouble.
  4. Victor_B 9 January 2020 10: 06 New
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    Here he shot a bunch of people.
    The reason is muddy. Could be hazing? Well, in general, it is possible.
    Some kind of conflict was anyway.
    And then lawyers from the right / left-backs come into the case.
    The client immediately changes the testimony (he has the right) and becomes a victim of circumstances.
    If you listen to a lawyer (good) in any process, then his innocent client must be given an order instead of a term.
    Well, and how this story will end - we will take a look.
    But the committee of "not giving birth to mothers" (by the way a foreign agent!) Has already decided everything.
    1. Avior 9 January 2020 10: 10 New
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      There can be no hazing, but precisely hazing.
      There is already a case, and he was recognized as a victim.
      Only now the nameless author with VO either does not know about it, or for some reason did not write about it for some reason
      hi
      1. Victor_B 9 January 2020 10: 14 New
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        Quote: Avior
        There can be no hazing, but precisely hazing.
        There is already a case, and he was recognized as a victim.

        I don’t mind.
        But in recent years, hazing, it seems, has greatly faded.
        But there were always enough goats.
        There, the officer was allegedly involved (and killed), so this is not hazing, but a simple military criminal. Heavy.
        1. Skarpzd 9 January 2020 10: 19 New
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          I don’t understand at all ... serve a year. conditions as in kindergarten. where does hazing come from? rather believe in fraternity. and in any case, huge fault on the fathers - commanders.
        2. Qwertyarion 9 January 2020 10: 56 New
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          Quote: Victor_B
          There, an officer was allegedly involved (and killed), so this is not hazing, but a simple military criminal

          This is not embarrassing in business .. An officer can be either a good person or a maniac.
          How is the work done to track unlawful actions of officers?
          Or, by default, a soldier is in the position of a serf in front of an officer?
          The system of control of personnel in the army should be designed in such a way as to be able to quickly determine and exclude the possibility of non-statutory relations both in the soldier’s environment and in the officer’s.
      2. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 10: 26 New
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        Quote: Avior
        There is already a case, and he was recognized as a victim.

        Is it with such joy that he suddenly became a victim? In the case of hazing, perhaps. And on the fact of the shooting of his colleagues, he is the main suspect and will remain so.
        1. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 22 New
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          only in the case of the shooting of people, the fact of hazing is important evidence of whether he really believed that he was raped after the guard, or whether it was a figure of speech.
          1. Overlock 9 January 2020 18: 05 New
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            Quote: Avior
            The fact of hazing is important evidence of whether he really believed that he was raped after the guard or whether it was a figure of speech.

            obviously he didn’t want to check on himself, therefore he shot
        2. New Year day 9 January 2020 12: 32 New
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          Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
          And in fact the execution of his colleagues, he is the main suspect

          Does anyone dispute this status? "See the root" - K. Prutkov
          1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 28 New
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            Well, the above unsubscribing speaker somehow kept silent about it, exposing him to victims rather than guilty
      3. Cananecat 9 January 2020 10: 27 New
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        For those who are "in the subject."
        Victims were recognized for the hazing episode, but not for the murder episode. Feel the difference.
        We develop a thought. If he had put the people in the barracks, the case could and could be re-qualified as a state of affect, but he shot on guard, i.e. this is intent ... and this is aggravating.
        ... learn the materiel ...
        1. ohka_new 9 January 2020 10: 46 New
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          I agree. There is a “limit” - the concept is purely subjective (often depends on the number of cockroaches in the head), but there is a threat to life, which is objective and to which this case does not belong on any side.
        2. Andrey Shch 9 January 2020 15: 27 New
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          I agree with the first part, and then you develop a bad idea, just a set of words. Intent is a form of guilt, i.e. personal subjective attitude to the deed ("wanted-did not want"), and he (intent) cannot be an aggravating circumstance in itself. And being on guard is not an aggravating circumstance. So before declaring something with aplomb, at least find out a little (Article 63 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation).
          Generally ... "learn materiel" ...
          1. Cananecat 9 January 2020 18: 51 New
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            aggravating ...
            Art.63 of the Criminal Code
            f.1) committing a crime of revenge for the lawful actions of other persons, as well as with the aim of concealing another crime or to facilitate its commission;

            g) the commission of a crime in relation to a person or his relatives in connection with the performance of official activity by the person or the fulfillment of public duty;
            As for the intent ... read carefully ...
            ST 25 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation.
            1. A crime committed intentionally is recognized as an act committed with direct or indirect intent.
            1. Andrey Shch 10 January 2020 07: 35 New
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              Again a set of words. He reads carefully, you see. Already forgot what he wrote? What are these excerpts for? Compare them with your own post, my dear. You in one sentence made such a mistake (here the subject of proof, the forms of guilt, the corpus delicti, and even the passion dragged together) that you need dozens of full-fledged lectures here to explain everything and bring it back to normal. They would listen, but no, they stupidly climb with their stupid opinion. How tired you are, “know-it-alls”, “specialists in equipment”, damn it. You rot in childhood? Women do not give you? You have complexes and you so assert yourself? Well, purely Balls!
      4. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 10: 33 New
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        what the hell is bullying for those who are called together? there is no hierarchy and grandfathers. there are, as in any team, leaders and followers. strong and weak. it is an irregular relationship. and in the case one conscript passes by the suspect.
        1. alexmach 9 January 2020 11: 58 New
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          what the hell is bullying for those who are called together? there is no hierarchy and grandfathers. there are, as in any team, leaders and followers

          You know in human teams very different things can happen. Especially if people are young, not psychologically formed, and upstairs are rams and scum who, instead of developing and directing this team, lead to this. Take an interest in such a thing as
          "Stanford Prison Experiment." Very entertaining 2 films about it were shot.
          1. carstorm 11 9 January 2020 12: 08 New
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            I studied this at one time. I was just trying to make clear that hazing as a kind of relationship is gone. but there are a lot of people with their cockroaches who live in a team while creating an ordinary society with all the consequences. and about scum and rams, of course it was and is. it’s just that my experience shows that those who are not always upstairs can do something. with that old system, even with excesses that are difficult to deny, it could be controlled much more effectively. for all the time of my service, everything happened, but they never beat anyone or scoffed openly. on the little things so little. but after a certain period of time they then communicated very well. and now, without psychologists and special education, I’m afraid it won’t work out anymore. and yes. I agree with you of course.
    2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 10: 58 New
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      Quote: Victor_B
      Well, and how this story will end - we will take a look.
      But the committee of "not giving birth to mothers" (by the way a foreign agent!) Has already decided everything.

      If the "committee" intervened, there would be no justice.
      1. Victor_B 9 January 2020 11: 01 New
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        Quote: tihonmarine
        If the "committee" intervened, there would be no justice.

        Well, now the times are different ... I guess.
        Well, the status of a foreign agent imposes a restriction on credibility.
        And so yes! There is always a lot of scent from them.
        To know how many percent is real in the case, and how much for hype. And anyway - have they ever admitted being wrong?
  5. Avior 9 January 2020 10: 08 New
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    Oh, these articles are without authorship, in which important details are often omitted.
    In this case, the one that Shamsutdinova and several other soldiers were granted victim status in the hazing case in part, so the stories of the Moscow Region that he had a nervous breakdown that was not related to the service can be considered obsolete.
    A soldier shooting in Transbaikalia is recognized as a victim in a case of hazing

    https://tass.ru/proisshestviya/7362221
    1. Shooter22 9 January 2020 10: 41 New
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      Respected! And you do not confuse anything? This "warrior", while on duty, committed the massacre of his colleagues, purposefully and deliberately (he shot a runaway in the head, finished off the control), after which he intended to hide. And after that he was granted victim status? Where did you find this nonsense? In the criminal case file or in the GWP comments? Or maybe this is the opinion of sales lawyers or representatives of the committee of soldiers’s mothers, in which there are almost no soldiers’s mothers (I know this office personally)? He can be recognized as a victim only by episodes of hazing in relation to him, if this is proved by the investigation. This ghoul did not kill at the moment of defense against encroachments on his "chastity", but during the performance of a combat mission - guarding with arms in hand. In my memory, not a single soldier who was guilty of the intentional killing of co-workers during military service was acquitted by a military court. In wartime, he would have been executed without trial. And here I consider it logical (with all the vicissitudes of our modern judicial system) - a life sentence for this ghoul will be a logical result. Otherwise, this legal precedent can lead to very sad consequences. Believe me, whoever needs it is well aware.
      1. Avior 9 January 2020 10: 51 New
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        And after that he was granted victim status? Where did you find this nonsense?

        you inattentively read my post that you undertook to comment.
        It says in black and white that they recognized the victim precisely on the occasion of bullying, and the source is a link to a TASS message.
        Thus, the fact that the fact of hazing in part took place is not an invention of this conscript, as some write here, but an established fact.
        And in his case, the court will decide taking into account all the circumstances of the case.
  6. bessmertniy 9 January 2020 10: 10 New
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    I asked forgiveness - this is normal, but you must answer for the misconduct, as the court decides. No matter how guilty the co-workers were before him, it was unlikely that their fault deserved to die.
    1. Qwertyarion 9 January 2020 10: 29 New
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      Quote: bessmertniy
      but hardly their fault deserved to die.

      For some reason, everyone is modestly silent about the guilt of the officers of the military unit that allowed the events preceding the execution.
    2. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 10: 45 New
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      They did not deserve their guilt of death, but the soldiers could not achieve justice, therefore, did so. But does anyone believe that a soldier could count on a fair attitude to himself?
      1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 33 New
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        I don’t need these fairy tales. I could turn to the prosecutor’s office, but I didn’t. I could do the SOCH, but I didn’t either. And I decided to become a kind of avenger in my inflamed consciousness. And in fact I became a murderer and a scumbag
    3. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 11: 03 New
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      Quote: bessmertniy
      Forgiveness asked - this is normal,

      Yes, everyone asks, except for repeat offenders.
  7. polar fox 9 January 2020 10: 11 New
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    strange "extreme step" ... control in the head to do ...
  8. Alexga 9 January 2020 10: 20 New
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    Well, let's talk about what is happening. How it all happened, I will express my opinion. This is the garrison of Drovyanaya, in the time of the USSR the Strategic Missile Forces base, now, too, suckers are not sent there for service. Who commanded the multinational units, faced with such phenomena. Everything is simple, the young soldier thought: "I am a man, and cleaning up the premises is work for women." It doesn’t even smell like a teacher. There are 1-2 offenders, and shot eight. This does not happen. And why did he talk about humiliation, ace simply, this is the usual work of lawyers. They also offended me just by beckoning. This is a common practice. This has been going on since the 90s, and it’s easier for the prosecutor’s office to dismiss the case.
    1. Avior 9 January 2020 10: 25 New
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      hi dear, the prosecutor’s office is already dealing with hazing in part, this kid and several other people were recognized as victims in the hazing case, the link above, and you all say that this did not happen ....
      1. Alexga 9 January 2020 10: 44 New
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        The prosecutor's office will decide how it is easier for her. In this case, I do not believe her. Such cases were not isolated. The whole unit is not just shot. Most likely, the national question is playing here, this was also the case with the Azerbaijanis of 1988 from Sumgait, and the Chechens of the 90s.
        1. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 12 New
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          it may be national, especially since the case is "hazing", but in the unofficial language the case speaks of hazing
          1. Alexga 9 January 2020 11: 32 New
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            No, of course, if he is some kind of Islamist, but they promised another article for the delivery of the cell. What you call bullying is not very similar here, there are too many deaths.
            1. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 42 New
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              directly cases of hazing and execution are formally different cases.
              but they have a connection.
              from the very beginning he had a statement that he did this, since they told him that right after the guard he would be raped in the barracks, and they would be lowered, moreover, a statement from the officer.
              And the lawyer's question in court to prove that it was not a figure of speech was said, not in a figurative sense, but it was a real threat with a real embodiment.
              and the confirmed fact of hazing and other hazing in the barracks is just in favor of the defense as proof that he took the threat literally and precisely in the literal rather than figurative sense.
              Well, and to decide, of course, the court will still be taking into account all the circumstances of the case
              hi
              1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 12: 10 New
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                Quote: Avior
                from the very beginning he had a statement that he did this, since they told him that right after the guard he would be raped in the barracks, and they would be lowered, moreover, a statement from the officer.

                Well, yes of course. And where is the proof? He finished off the witnesses with a shot in the head. So do not broadcast this nonsense. As he himself spoke out immediately as a sodomy, he didn’t threaten him. He killed with cold calculation. In what he himself admitted.
                1. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 07 New
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                  Yes, because this one could scare them and shoot them in the air - why do they need to kick their legs? No, he is a scumbag and only lifelong. Definitely.
      2. Shooter22 9 January 2020 11: 07 New
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        Investigation of hazing in part is the subject of a separate criminal case and it is unlikely that they will be combined into one, this is not bringing to suicide. And I'm talking about the deliberate execution of colleagues. In the first case, he may be a victim, or “omitted,” or anyone else. But the execution - his house - a prison for life with a high probability. So do not engage in populism and interfere all in one heap.
        And besides, this is not a kid, but a trained killer, who overwhelmed 9 people. If he had killed one of your relatives, I would have looked, as you would call him now. Sorry for the question: Have you ever experienced the hardships and deprivations of military service on yourself? hi
        1. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 15 New
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          if my loved one suffered, I would like to punish the guilty.
          And if the fact that this conscript says the truth, then first of all the unit commander.
          But the hazing case itself confirms only that hazing was definitely there.
          1. Shooter22 9 January 2020 11: 37 New
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            Avior (Sergey)! An injured person is a person who has suffered damage, but not as a result of a criminal / administrative offense. And here are the dead, i.e. people deprived of life by force. And the culprit here is, first and foremost, this ghoul who de facto committed this assassination, and is not even in a state of passion. The investigation uses facts, not speculation about the guilt of the command of the unit. And about bullying, it’s been very popular since the 90s. But then you yourself really experienced it on yourself? Even if they (non-statutory relationships) take place in this part, this is not a reason for the destruction of people. Do you have many offenders in our lives? If I sent every offender to the next world, then maybe this ghoul would not have been born into the light of day.
      3. Shooter22 9 January 2020 11: 12 New
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        Investigation of hazing in part is the subject of a separate criminal case and it is unlikely that they will be combined into one, this is not bringing to suicide. And I'm talking about the deliberate execution of colleagues. In the first case, he may be a victim, or “omitted,” or anyone else. But the execution - his house - a prison for life with a high probability. So do not engage in populism and interfere all in one heap.
        And besides, this is not a kid, but a trained killer, who overwhelmed 9 people. If he had killed one of your relatives, I would have looked, as you would call him now. Sorry for the question: Have you ever experienced the hardships and deprivations of military service on yourself? hi

        I have addressed this to you, dear Avior (Sergey).
        1. Avior 9 January 2020 12: 10 New
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          I wrote there above.
          These are different cases, not formally related, but the hazing case is proof that they really wanted to rape and lower him after the guard, and not just a verbal threat
          And there too, as the court decides.
          hi
      4. ghby 9 January 2020 11: 13 New
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        Quote: Avior
        dear, the prosecutor's office is already conducting a case of bullying in part, this kid and several others were recognized as victims in the bullying case

        this is how it will bring to court, or terminate the case due to the death of the perpetrators, then conclusions can be drawn, but for now it’s a reaction to media reports about bullying, we’ll investigate, we’ll figure it out.
      5. Fan-fan 9 January 2020 11: 51 New
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        the prosecutor’s office is already conducting a case of bullying in part

        And if he did not block these ghouls, then the prosecutor’s office would probably not have started any business either. So the guy of humiliation would endure until he escaped or shot himself.
        1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 41 New
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          Quote: Fan-Fan
          And if he did not block these ghouls, then the prosecutor’s office would probably not have started any business either.

          Here it is not necessary fairy tales well? The prosecutor’s office is very fond of chopping off ticks. I had an episode of talking with them when I wanted to witness one of those "offended" as witnesses. They spent the whole day cheating so that I would give the necessary testimonies and merge the duty officer.
        2. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 09 New
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          There is another question - are they ghouls or not ghouls?!? Now, of course, from his words the whole part only dreamed of how to get to his buttocks ...
    2. Shooter22 9 January 2020 10: 53 New
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      Totally agree.
  9. Qwertyarion 9 January 2020 10: 25 New
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    Not everything is clear in Shamsutdinov’s case ...
  10. rotmistr60 9 January 2020 10: 30 New
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    endure further abuse of myself I could not
    The commander of a unit (platoon, company), if he is not 100% sure that he has everything in order in the relationship between the L / C, must (must) spend the night in the barracks until the situation is corrected, and keep the most "greyhounds" under constant control and educate . Unstable relations develop not only because of several frostbitten scoundrels, but also because of the lack of control on the part of the commanders, and sometimes their frank weakness as a commander. Regarding the act of an ordinary, he committed a serious crime, so he will answer according to the law.
    1. Avior 9 January 2020 10: 52 New
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      this is if hazing does not suit this commander.
      But it happens in different ways ....
  11. Agentvyach 9 January 2020 10: 35 New
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    Well done, he apologized and stood up for himself and didn’t disgrace his family, respect
    1. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 10 New
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      Lifetime to him, not respect!
  12. Star Destroyer 9 January 2020 10: 38 New
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    It would be worth noting that this Shamsutdinov is not only an accused, but also a witness in another criminal case, and a victim in a third criminal case, but against those who he has not finished off a criminal case and they are sitting on the lip like him.
    In a circle, a complicated story, but justice must triumph.
  13. Bare 9 January 2020 10: 40 New
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    It all depends on the unit commander. If the commander is not in place, then everything will be shit.
    Hazing and bullying of a soldier is not the same thing.
    Fighters are sorry for all in peacetime. The commander is guilty. He must be prosecuted. Bastard.
    1. Maz
      Maz 9 January 2020 11: 16 New
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      The point is in the system, not in the unit commander. My battalion commander was completely fucked up, what do you say, soldier beat the senior lieutenant? My soldiers jumped out the windows! Combat battalion of four hundred snouts. What to talk about? The company is on the fourth floor. Do you think it has changed? No, the system creates commanders, so it needs to be changed.
      1. pru-pavel 9 January 2020 16: 11 New
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        What horrors you have in your Israel just do not have.
    2. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 44 New
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      The company commander, battalion, or maybe immediately the army commander should wipe the nozzles of the ordinary?
      1. Bare 9 January 2020 14: 54 New
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        The trouble is that the battalion commander wipes the snot, not the sergeant. The unit commander is guilty, it depends on him who will wipe the snot. Or even imagine an old servant, this is already the work of a sergeant.
  14. Ros 56 9 January 2020 10: 43 New
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    No one knows how he would behave on the site of this kid, but I do not mind the officers. It all happened with their submission and they are primarily responsible.
  15. Alexga 9 January 2020 10: 51 New
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    publicly apologized to their relatives by posting his message on the VKontakte social network on the support group page

    Maybe I misunderstood something, is he free if he uses social networks, or how to understand this ?!
    1. Pessimist22 9 January 2020 11: 13 New
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      I wrote a letter.
    2. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 17 New
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      he is sitting, most likely his written statement through a lawyer was transferred and posted on social networks, possibly on his own page
      1. Alexga 9 January 2020 11: 26 New
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        But what about the Code of Criminal Procedure, or is it optional?
        1. Avior 9 January 2020 11: 46 New
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          we don’t know all the circumstances of the appearance of this letter, perhaps the investigator was not opposed.
          otherwise, there will be complaints against the person who transmitted the letter.
          but I doubt that the lawyer was so fraudulent
          1. Alexga 9 January 2020 11: 53 New
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            But the letter nevertheless appeared, and there are people who allowed it.
            1. Avior 9 January 2020 12: 07 New
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              IMHO, if this is with the permission of the investigator, then there are no violations for sure
              If this is just a public apology to the victims, then I also do not see a violation
              But, I think, if there is a violation, then later we will find out
              1. Alexga 9 January 2020 12: 13 New
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                Strange things, the investigator in the next cell.
                1. Avior 9 January 2020 14: 59 New
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                  My friend, I'm sorry, but you obviously don’t know very well the CPC to which you refer
                  Under the Code of Criminal Procedure of the Russian Federation, the Investigator has the right to disclose information on pre-trial investigation, see the Code of Criminal Procedure of the Russian Federation part 2, section 8, chapter 21, article 161 paragraph 2 And stop the empty dispute, otherwise you, I see, have already found a minuscule support group
                  161 Article. Inadmissibility of disclosure of preliminary investigation data
                  .... 2. The data of the preliminary investigation can be made public only with the permission of the investigator or interrogating officer and only to the extent that they recognize that this is permissible .....

                  What I wrote to you several times already
                  hi
                  1. Alexga 9 January 2020 15: 16 New
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                    Yes, the Code of Criminal Procedure of the Russian Federation, I do not really know, more codes of the Soviet era and Belarus. Now they are not the point. The investigator, if he allowed this to be done, with his permission begins to confirm the version of the unregistered person, is that so? This is a convenient position of lawyers, committees of soldiers' mothers, and even make the eight dead "to blame." I do not believe it, I already wrote that it is more likely the national reason, I'm a man!
                  2. Alexga 9 January 2020 15: 51 New
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                    Sergey, I will supplement in more detail. This PRTB Strategic Missile Forces, with a high level of secrecy regime, they contain and transport the heads of missiles, with a large military counterintelligence department, with so many sec.sots that if you count them per square meter, then their density is comparable to the density on Lubyanka. So, if there was a lack of discipline in the team, then the Specialists would definitely know absolutely everything about this. And no one would have appointed soldiers to the conflict in the conflict. In this case, it is very profitable for many to write off as an irregular. This is my point of view, based on personal experience over very long years of service. And if I'm wrong, then the Fatherland is in danger!
                    1. Maz
                      Maz 9 January 2020 23: 43 New
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                      Quote: AlexGa
                      Sergey, I will supplement in more detail. This PRTB Strategic Missile Forces, with a high level of secrecy regime, they contain and transport the heads of missiles, with a large military counterintelligence department, with so many sec.sots that if you count them per square meter, then their density is comparable to the density on Lubyanka. So, if there was a lack of discipline in the team, then the Specialists would definitely know absolutely everything about this. And no one would have appointed soldiers to the conflict in the conflict. In this case, it is very profitable for many to write off as an irregular. This is my point of view, based on personal experience over very long years of service. And if I'm wrong, then the Fatherland is in danger!

                      Brad, you served in the army as a soldier? Counterintelligence of the pen doesn’t get dirty, they are white people in the army, until such a shamsutdin turns out, or who really doesn’t knock on black. But the snitch from the soldiers is quickly identified and then his life in the army turns into torture. and counterintelligence lets all commanders and violations dismiss commanders, doesn’t intervene, like the prosecutor’s office, hence the mutual responsibility. Well done Shamsutdinov. Only egregious cases cause trembling of the system, then the dolls commanders change and after a while everything returns to normal. You can’t immediately change the mentality of the middle management or retrain them. no! so I think this shamsutdinov is the first swallow, or rather the one that was seen as the tip of the iceberg .. There will be more. it’s still not a demobilization parade.
                      1. Alexga 10 January 2020 10: 22 New
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                        Sucks to serve in the construction battalion, sympathize. soldier
                      2. Alexander Seklitsky 10 January 2020 10: 27 New
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                        Quote: Maz
                        But the snitch from the soldiers is quickly identified and then his life in the army turns into torture.

                        What a torture. Serve such as cheese in butter. Even officers are afraid to touch them. Another thing is that no one especially leads friendship with them. A peculiar caste of untouchables
              2. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 15 New
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                I would also allow this in the place of the investigator. And what is the violation? Although, maybe the lawyers’s cunning work is already here - they say, he was still sitting, and he began to realize, repent ... he wasn’t such a scumbag, but control shots - he accidentally got it, because he was given few hours to work with weapons and real combat shooting.
  16. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 10: 52 New
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    Quote: Mountain Shooter
    Mentally unstable in the army is contraindicated. Not a kindergarten. Hazing dragged ... line of defense, of course. Otherwise, he’s life-long ... This is my opinion, still he had a little relation to the army. The officer did not pay attention to the kid that he was so “nervous” ... Well, he’s from the cadet barracks, where it’s much tougher ...

    the telly sings to us that everything is fine in the army. but the one who served knows more. bullying is there? is, and it is a fact. is silence happening? yes, and that too is a fact. some started up the drain, and here is the result. the kid must be justified. plant the unit commander. journalists, the so-called collective farm shit. Commander-in-Chief strict reprimand, with the introduction ...
    1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 26 New
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      well, let’s allow everyone to blame everyone. Why do we need a criminal code. Nahamili ... overwhelmed. The head overwhelmed with work ... also overwhelmed. Someone cut himself on the road ... and you were overwhelmed on the spot. Not life, but a fairy tale, huh?
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 15 New
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        there is a specific situation. UPGRADING TO INCIDENT. in principle, he had only 3 options. all are bad.
        1. turn in
        2. shoot yourself
        3. shoot
        in order to choose option 3, you need to have a pretty strong character. and such people do not knock everyone. his nerves were twisted into a knot, but he did not break. the fuse just broke and it broke everyone. with normal handling and good preparation, great fighters are made of these.
        1. Alexander Seklitsky 10 January 2020 05: 24 New
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          Quote: ELEZKIY
          these make great fighters.
          from unbalanced excellent fighters do not work. Excerpts and self-control of zero. If he had smashed it with a bow from a bed of Bosko to specific offenders, I would have understood him. And so meanly he waited until everyone surrendered their weapons and began to shoot.
        2. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 18 New
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          So, can he justify him in the special forces, and then to Syria - even with his blood atone for guilt?!? So do you think it turns out?
          By the way, a strong character is needed with your option number 2.
  17. Shuttle 9 January 2020 10: 55 New
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    It is very strange to draw conclusions justifying or condemning Shamsutdinov without knowing the circumstances of the case. In any case, those who, with his words, scoffed at him did not kill him, but he killed. And not one or two, but eight. And maybe ten.
    I would refrain from any conclusions and conclusions without thoroughly familiarizing myself with the incident. How could he get into living people so many times?
    1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 48 New
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      it’s very simple. He shot a guardhouse in the gun room. He waited for everyone to hand over the gun. He shot everyone indiscriminately, even his poor fellow spirit, shot him for the company, as well as some people he didn’t contact at all
      1. Shuttle 9 January 2020 14: 07 New
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        Quote: Alexander Seklitsky
        it’s very simple. He shot a guardhouse in the gun room. He waited for everyone to hand over the gun. He shot everyone indiscriminately, even his poor fellow spirit, shot him for the company, as well as some people he didn’t contact at all

        Then this is no affect. If his revenge was of a personalized nature, then why, except for the purpose of cleansing witnesses, kill innocent people? I’m afraid I can’t do without the conclusion of psychiatrists here. It is a pity that Alexander O. Bukhanovsky is no longer in this world.
  18. knn54 9 January 2020 10: 55 New
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    WHO will guarantee that they would not have drowned him in the toilet or if they had not mutilated him.
    Guilt in that suffered (and?) And innocent (e).
    I think that it’s not difficult to check whether the incidents were LIKE in part.
    There are two reasons to use a weapon (I exclude a terrorist attack)) p-psychiatric disorder, terrorist attack and madding.
  19. Maz
    Maz 9 January 2020 11: 10 New
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    Correctly done, let the army scratch it. And then soon again the Poles will write a book “one hundred days after the call”, then we will start
  20. georggy 9 January 2020 11: 16 New
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    He’s lying.
    The skin saves. Scum.
    Death to him, bastard.
    1. gorenina91 9 January 2020 14: 55 New
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      - It’s a pity that there wasn’t a single Dag or a Chechen .. -Then this creature and all its relatives ...- they would come and punish him for that ... -And no one would save this creature ...- Yes, this coward would not dare to shoot Caucasians ...- there were wordless Russians in front of him ... -And now the relatives of the murdered are silent ... -It’s just not clear ...
      -That I personally am Russian, but if my brother were among the dead ... -That I would just not leave it ...
      -This creature simply has no right to walk on the ground ...
      - I still think that the Russian relatives of those killed will not leave everything "just like that" ...
      -However the hired Tatar lawyers would stop him ... no matter how they hide him ... -This creature will still get its own ... -That's the hope ...
      1. georggy 9 January 2020 14: 58 New
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        Yes, they must pay with the blood of their entire kin.
        He was getting ready for it. And he did it in cold blood and ruthlessly.
        And there is nothing to come up with tales about the offended.
        And who prepared him for this must be clarified. and you have to start with your father and brother.
        1. gorenina91 9 January 2020 15: 05 New
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          -Yes exactly...
          -This coward walked and calmly shot our guys in the back of the head ... -Ah, what a "brave man" ...
          -And when people with weapons started to arrest him, that creature immediately threw the machine gun away and surrendered ...- the creature realized that they could kill him ... -And where is the "state of affect" and "nervous breakdown." ???
          -From a cowardly insignificance, they are trying to make a "hero and a brave man" ... -and also a "victim" ...
          -Well ... and an abomination ...
    2. Andrey Zhdanov-Nedilko 10 January 2020 10: 20 New
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      Let’s limit ourselves to life, although such crimes happen that the highest measure as needed !!!
  21. Alexey Kurtov 9 January 2020 11: 25 New
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    Hundreds of thousands serve in the army, unfortunately they are mentally unstable among them. The soldiers (and in my memory) ran away and threw themselves with a “stool” and there were cases of using weapons (mostly without serious consequences). All of these are sent for examination and most often In other words, a soldier with weapons ran away, caught, examined, sent home. Everyone is alive and well. That is, the system has been worked out for a long time, there is always a way out and you don’t need to blame the army, hazing and don’t understand anyone. And if there is an abnormal shooter co-workers ikak justification should not save him!
    1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 50 New
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      Strange. Adequate koment, and minus
  22. Usher 9 January 2020 11: 55 New
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    Controls in the head, this is not a state of affect 100% there you have to think.
  23. Maalkavianin 9 January 2020 11: 58 New
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    Such cases have been and will be more than one. And the point is not in the system, as many write, but in people. No one ordered the soldiers to abuse the guy. This is their decision. And here is the result.
  24. Same lech 9 January 2020 12: 08 New
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    In a letter, Shamsutdinov writes to run away and had nowhere to complain ... something I can hardly believe.
    I believe that this letter Shamsutdinov wrote under the dictation of a lawyer ... so to speak, to prepare public opinion in his favor, leaning on hazing.
    But there are a number of points that do not fit in with Shamsutdinov’s version ... firstly, he could well complain to the prosecutor’s office or submit a report to the commander about all harassment, he could inform his parents in any way that he was in danger from his grandfathers.
    Believe me, if prosecutors, at the request of their parents, cling to the unit commander, it will be bad for all grandfathers.
    Further on Shamsutdinov’s appearance, I don’t see that these grandfathers would strongly torture him ... Shamsutdinov has no idea what real human pressing is, both morally and physically ... I think he had a pathological fear of pain, both physical and moral ... this is a question But to the doctors of the selection committee of the military registration and enlistment office ... how such a jerk could get access to weapons.
    Now he has the only chance to avoid serious punishment is to pity the public ... to show how poor and miserable he was, clogged with his colleagues, was forced to shoot them ... I do not believe him ... I do not believe a single word of him.
    1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 39 New
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      admission committee in a madhouse. there was a draft in the military registration and enlistment offices. Or am I behind life?
      1. Same lech 9 January 2020 16: 54 New
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        admission committee in a madhouse. there was a draft in the military registration and enlistment offices. Or am I behind life?

        Right all right smile it is connected with my work ... the old one has already become. what sclerosis began to torment.
    2. Doctor 9 January 2020 20: 08 New
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      it’s a question for the doctors of the selection committee of the military commissariat ... how such a jerk could get access to weapons.


      I will answer professionally. Easy. And excellent.
      There are three main reactions to stress, roughly: “hit”, “freeze”, “run”.
      Almost certainly he has a “hit," he is a warrior. Not a jerk. Not a wimp. Not a coward. I just determined such a goal for myself.
      In Chechnya (and in all other wars), officers clearly grabbed such and made them indigenous to combat. And they tried not to quarrel with them.
      1. Alexander Seklitsky 10 January 2020 10: 32 New
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        Quote: Arzt
        Almost certainly he has a “hit," he is a warrior.

        A warrior would take the bow from the bed and mark the offender. And he would do it every time. But no, he was not a warrior at all, but a cowardly jackal.
        1. Doctor 10 January 2020 12: 17 New
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          A warrior would take the bow from the bed and mark the offender. And he would do it every time. But no, he was not a warrior at all, but a cowardly jackal.


          Yes, this is also a fighter’s reaction. But he chose a more reliable option. But not a coward, a coward would have escaped from the unit. "Freeze" would have reconciled with his fate (such a majority, up to 60%).
          1. Alexander Seklitsky 10 January 2020 12: 29 New
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            so he ran .. No need to pull an owl on the globe and ascribe to him non-existent qualities
            1. Doctor 10 January 2020 12: 47 New
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              so he ran

              He gave up. After he did what he planned. Here, too, courage is needed, because he knew what awaited him.
  25. Nikolaevich I 9 January 2020 12: 10 New
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    What kind of rubbish settled in the head of a man? In the head of the Scarecrow were "elementary" filings, but even they brought their "master" much more benefit! I repeatedly notice that the "race of the race" after the demise of the USSR turned out to be "omitted" ... both morally and mentally! A “wave” rose in defense of the “poor boy” Shamsutdinov! A priori, the murdered were called guilty even before any showdown! What kind of human idiocy (?) ... the killer said it was so (!) ... then it was so! And if it all started with a refusal to clean the toilet? Everyone should clean the toilet ... except "His Majesty"!? Whatever it was, but still ... if in the "protective comments" they call not only to justify the killer, but also to reward (!!!), then, except as an abomination, I can not name these "calls"! And then, when I served in the SA, "hazing" was ... but it never reached the point where there was only one way out — to shoot ... or to shoot! Guys in whom parents from an early age laid the "core of life", it only tempered! First of all, they broke, “sissy's sons!” What is Russia turning into? A country of fearful idiots? An abode of rude “yazhmamoks”, legal nonsense, sissy, “socially passive” inhabitants?
    1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 12: 22 New
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      I wonder when and in what troops did you serve?
    2. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 53 New
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      Bravo: A very adequate comment.
  26. Donchanin 9 January 2020 12: 21 New
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    Hold on boyfriend. You correctly taught the scum. To apologize to those who raised these scum is not necessary. Including "officers" who benefit from hazing.
    1. Same lech 9 January 2020 13: 20 New
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      Mdaaa ... this means if you accidentally offend anyone, the offended person has every right to shoot you ... if the offended one accidentally thinks you want to omit him, he generally has the full right to cut you into pieces ... no words.
  27. Donchanin 9 January 2020 12: 33 New
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    Here, the shitty thing became more active on the forum, "like I could complain, crazy, etc." I suppose that these are either those who did not serve, or those who were the grandfather of the type described above, or the “officer” who connived at the grandfathers. Those who served, not in the Moscow Military District, know that this is impossible. Mutual responsibility.
    In my time, this happened. Not very often, but it happened. The first guard was sometimes the only way to punish offenders. And in this case - really the only one. Being left out is also a trauma. Therefore, I justify the soaring.
    1. Shooter22 9 January 2020 13: 19 New
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      You, Vladimir Pavlov, are the shit that has a place not on this forum, but on the same guard with this ghoul that day! Maybe you were there or you kept a candle when they allegedly lowered it there? Or are you a trail who studied the materials of this criminal case? Or has the trial already taken place, and you were at the announcement of the verdict? What would you say if you knew you were wrong? Or maybe you yourself shot a couple of guards that now you feel so right?

      For reference: 25 years of service (not in the Arbat VO) in places where you have never been and never will be. Be angry ferret!
      1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 14: 09 New
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        Read the source "officer". You are not aware of the topic. And I congratulate you on the 25th.
    2. Same lech 9 January 2020 13: 24 New
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      Just those who justified the killing of our soldiers for various reasons have intensified ... there is no excuse for this.
      1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 14: 10 New
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        I asked you a question. Where and when did you serve? There was no answer. I conclude - you are a sofa shelupon.
        1. Same lech 9 January 2020 15: 10 New
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          I asked you a question. Where and when did you serve? There was no answer. I conclude - you are a sofa shelupon.

          Are you a prosecutor ... or a deputy of the Lord God ... served somewhere and already started tearing my shirt off so I and all around the sofa sheluponi ... I understand that you are just a cheap provocateur ... and you have tricks cheap ... sub-fence gopnik.
          1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 15: 17 New
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            You are in every way like a piece of couch crap. But this piece climbs to judge a person who is in a very difficult situation. I tried to find out who you are, what you allow yourself to judge people. And I found out - you are a shelupon sofa.
            1. Same lech 9 January 2020 15: 18 New
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              Yah smile ... I will not be like you ... why should I copy your rudeness and rudeness again and again.
              1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 15: 22 New
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                You did not answer again. Your blah blah doesn't fit. Sorry - you're a piece of couch crap.
                1. Same lech 9 January 2020 15: 51 New
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                  Donchanin (Vladimir Pavlov) you have no other arguments, I think so ... very nice smile ... well, let’s once again your catchphrase.
                  1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 16: 19 New
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                    No, I won’t. I just compensated for your flood on the forum and devoted too much time to you, a blanket.
                    1. Same lech 9 January 2020 16: 38 New
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                      No, I won’t.

                      Thank you Vladimir ... even though they spoke in human language ... I'm glad. smile hi
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Yuri T. 9 January 2020 18: 46 New
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              But at the same time, you yourself condemned 7 people in absentia!
              You know, Chikatilo also looked miserable, and his fate was miserable, his wife even spinled ...
    3. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 13: 58 New
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      What offenders did he punish? He had a conflict with three, and he threw the rest because they fell into the arm. And then the conflict was due to the fact that the push refused to clean and the commander forced him to learn the guard duty regulations
  28. Lycan 9 January 2020 12: 44 New
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    It’s a pity everyone, but the guy took the initiative in his own hands and stood up for himself.
    To the guy - to be fixed.
    Relatives of the victims - condolences and regrets that their children have to shoot. Alas. Otherwise, no way, apparently. Whose upbringing, if it grows up as a monster? ...
    1. Same lech 9 January 2020 13: 22 New
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      It’s a pity everyone, but the guy took the initiative in his own hands and stood up for himself.

      Yes, a whole unit of soldiers was put out of action ... you are out of your mind ... in wartime he would have been shot for it right at the crime scene ... well, what time has come ... a jerk of soldiers who destroyed the floor of the squad is raised to the rank of a hero. ..right some kind of craziness in people's minds.
      1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 14: 11 New
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        He is a hero, and you are a sofa shelupon!
        1. Same lech 9 January 2020 15: 01 New
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          Oh, well ... Donchanin (Vladimir Pavlov), I think you’ve gotten hamly here to insult the members of the forum ... unfortunately I can’t answer you mutually according to the rules of the forum ... well, I hope the moderators will quickly fix your brains.
          1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 15: 08 New
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            Dear not. You did not say where and by whom you served. Therefore, you are a sofa shelupon.
            1. Same lech 9 January 2020 15: 13 New
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              Dear not. You did not say where and by whom you served. Therefore, you are a sofa shelupon.
              Yes, I’m not going to tell you anything cheap gopnik ... I understand your communication tactics and you won’t be able to get me into a fight smile ... like you, I just despise.
      2. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 18 New
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        in wartime he would be their brother
      3. The comment was deleted.
      4. Lycan 9 January 2020 15: 21 New
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        1. I absolutely agree with you - they would have shot him. But the rot in the unit deserved it.
        Conclusion - if the Moscow Region (and all civilians as well) does not want this to happen, we need to work on it. Otherwise, the guy would harbor a grudge deeper and let the unit down at the time of the combat mission. And so - MO (as well as those who have a bipedal "beast" grows) have something to think about at their leisure.
        2. Not everyone can effectively stand up for themselves, especially before the "grandfathers". But this is more effective than “breaking down” and being “used” as a thing, or worse, as a gender. partner. I repeat - I am very sorry for everyone, but as should he have acted if his life was on the verge of “breaking” (by the way, like many others who made a different choice)?
    2. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 14: 01 New
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      Where do you come from then with broken brains. belay
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 15: 44 New
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        from our army
    3. The comment was deleted.
  29. friend of animals 9 January 2020 13: 00 New
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    The conditions in the army must be relaxed, the charter must be amended. There is no need to make a soldier out of every draftee, this is pointless in modern realities. The basic course was over six months, no overloads, and returned to normal life. Who wants to become a professional soldier - extends the service life and forward - to endure all the hardships, but get paid for it.
    1. Alexander Seklitsky 9 January 2020 14: 02 New
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      Do you also need to wash the push for them? And then all of a sudden the little ones will work
      1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 14: 25 New
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        Seklitsky, whose will you be? Read the first article about this. Check out the material, so to speak.
        In the early 80s, such scum beat off the spirit of the egg, because it said incorrectly where the tea is. In my company duty. The kid became disabled, and this goat was partly otmazyvat. This is just one example of those that were overdue. Not to mention similar cases which could be heard in the commandant’s office. By the way, I did not serve in Transbaikalia.
        If you served, you should know that problems in the army by mopping do not end there.
        And this embittered ferret, shooter 22 /// 25 years of service (not in the Arbat VO) in places where you have never been and never will be ./// like the "ilite" of the Armed Forces, also probably knows about it, although it disguises itself .
        1. Alexander Seklitsky 10 January 2020 05: 57 New
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          I read his first explanations. The platoon crepedan, because he had not learned the charter of the guard service, instead of having to rest, he forced him to teach a couple with a conscript. For this, he began to gobble him. Then, in the afternoon, the push refused to wash the guard. should such armored be? Do you see him not "upright" let others do? Yes, they gave him their own horns. For the service I dofig such seen enough "peppers" who are not supposed to. By the way, I myself served in ZabVO to a very unregistered military unit. From the mention of which at one time all the soldiers of the Chita region laid bricks, namely 272 SMEs in Borzya. So all this kitchen was inside.
    2. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 16 New
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      that is, to make a dovecote out of the army ?!
  30. ILIA 9 January 2020 13: 16 New
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    Human rights with weapons are somewhat broader than human rights without weapons))
    Disciplines however.
    Society will quickly become polite.
  31. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 20 New
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    Quote: ELEZKIY
    It’s a pity everyone, but the guy took the initiative in his own hands and stood up for himself.
    To the guy - to be fixed.
    Relatives of the victims - condolences and regrets that their children have to shoot. Alas. Otherwise, no way, apparently. Whose upbringing, if it grows up as a monster? ...

    quite right
  32. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 14: 33 New
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    Quote: Shooter22
    You, Vladimir Pavlov, are the shit that has a place not on this forum, but on the same guard with this ghoul that day! Maybe you were there or you kept a candle when they allegedly lowered it there? Or are you a trail who studied the materials of this criminal case? Or has the trial already taken place, and you were at the announcement of the verdict? What would you say if you knew you were wrong? Or maybe you yourself shot a couple of guards that now you feel so right?

    For reference: 25 years of service (not in the Arbat VO) in places where you have never been and never will be. Be angry ferret!

    it’s because of such lengths of service that such tragedies occur. the country of the soldiers trusts you, and you still play the soldiers. all the fault of the unit commander. a normal officer knows how each soldier breathes, and in the presence of conflict situations does not put under arms. is a ghoul for you a soldier? whom did you serve? 25 years of life at least for nothing
    1. Shooter22 9 January 2020 15: 18 New
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      Listen to the namesake, ELEZKIY (Alexander), have you served with me or have you shared? Are you already trying to tell me how to give marks to an officer? Whose will you be? How old are you that you suddenly decided to read me notations?
      For your information, I returned all the sailors home alive, although some tried. I have not lost a single one for my service. He returned all of their mothers, despite the fact that they were all different, both good and bad. So I have NO guilt complex, like half of those present here on the forum. But following your logic, it was only necessary to have a good home, and the rest - at a cost.
      And for your information, “expert” Alexander, calling a “soldier” a ghoul who shot with cruelty 9 (not eight) of these colleagues, you drop this meaningful word for many below the level of the city sewer. And the truths from the course of PPR you read to your wife at night, will fall asleep faster. In life, everything is different.

      PS: The last question (just interesting): Why on the profile picture of V.I. Lenin set?
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 16: 24 New
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        It is a pity that you were not the commander of our battalion, we would also not lose 5 people b. You have taken an unequivocal position, as indeed I, and they are opposite. I rarely comment, but it hurt. we were abandoned by the commanders. and the fact that I served without excesses for 2 Soviet years, the merit of my infernal patience and the lack of weapons in the armory. therefore, in this situation, I am for this kid. who passed the draft board (not crazy), took the oath (soldier), destroyed the enemy (fighter). control in the head (a good fighter). without much cruelty (no disabled). I also went to serve the homeland, and not 2 years from the freaks to fight back. here commanders could not do without slackness. the dead of course a pity, these are people. but when a weapon is in hand, you cannot joke with fire. about Lenin is simple. I am a Komsomol member. I do not believe in gods and praying KGB officers. Sincerely, Jr. Sergeant of the 5th Red Banner Poznan Separate Railway Brigade. highway Abakan-Tayshet
        1. Shooter22 9 January 2020 17: 19 New
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          Well, straight and honest! No complaints. Thank.
  33. gorenina91 9 January 2020 14: 37 New
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    - And away we go ...
    -Yes .., let me be banned or banned ... -But it is exposed as an innocent prank ...
    -Eight corpses .... -consciously young Russian guys ... -And this creature who methodically killed them turns out to apologize for this ... -And this creature is still here and is pretending to try to put itself out as a victim ... -How the same ...- taught him ... how to do everything ... -Tatar lawyers did their job ...
    -And one of them., Of these Tatars would want such a creature to call into his house, to his household, put at his table ????? -Yes nobody
    1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 14: 54 New
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      Madame! I love you!
      Only when you become a mother, and your son, while doing military service, is crippled mentally, or physically by the aforementioned /// young Russian guys ///, how many Tatar lawyers or doctors will you hire to rectify the situation?
      It is clear that hormones do their job, but for the words how and with what answer?
    2. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 19 New
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      If you mocked your son, you would have them yourself ....
      1. gorenina91 9 January 2020 17: 41 New
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        You can compose anything ...
        -This cowardly creature is simply elevated to the rank of a hero ... -That's what they’ve already agreed to ...
        -This abomination is now vigorously justified and guarded ... -Such as in places where convicts for crimes are serving their sentences ...- consider shame on mankind ... This creature is such ...
        -You are ready to adopt this offspring ... or give your daughter for such ...
        -Yes, it's just a plot for horror movies ...
        -It is not clear only ...- why all the relatives of this inhuman did not bear responsibility ... -And he has relatives who serve in law enforcement agencies ...
        -And the father of this creature and relatives are for some reason not dismissed from law enforcement agencies ... -what they do there and what they do up there ...- maybe nobody just knows about it ...- maybe they use their official position and create what they want ... -who needs such law enforcement officers ... -You need to run away from them yourself ...
        -And his father easily participates in the trial and is not detained or isolated by anyone ...
  34. Region-25.rus 9 January 2020 14: 54 New
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    Quote: Siberian barber
    Guilt is beyond doubt! But you can’t ignore the circumstances!
    The boy could well be brought to the edge. Let's hope that the investigation and the court will be fair.

    You sir saw the faces of people, it is BROWNED? Apparently not! I saw it! And they do not look like this plump boar with calm eyes! From the word Absolutely!
    1. Lycan 9 January 2020 15: 41 New
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      This is a pretty young guy - he doesn’t need much. Maybe he had previously lived in a family with balanced people. And then, once - and threw into the barracks with the beast. And he is with hot blood.
  35. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 15: 06 New
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    Quote: Victorio
    Quote: Stas157
    Shamsutdinov also writes what hell he went to, and that he reached the last limit, and that he could not endure bullying anymore ... It is interesting, but the Moscow Region feels responsible for the relations that have developed there? For good, then, MO also need to apologize ... and change something.

    ====
    if they served an urgent term in sa, then they should have some idea of ​​hazing. somewhere it was more, somewhere less. and with a stable psyche it was possible to pass these tests. this man shot the disarmed colleagues in the head, and I strongly doubt that he experienced strong / terrible humiliation from each of those killed, especially from the officers. I think the punishment should be harsh to him, and repentance, if it is sincere, is only good for him.

    in exactly the same way I would describe where I ended up in SA. he just wrote my words. I was lucky that weapons were taken from part of ours. many would shoot each other. but still, there were some dead bodies. but at that time the officers were wise. although all sorts of. and so he pulled out a year on his teeth, then it became easier. and the army is also eager, homeland duty and all that. and there really was hell. I’m only talking about my battalion, although the whole brigade was no better, that's for sure. no, I understand him. until you bleed, they will not calm down.
    1. Victorio 9 January 2020 15: 39 New
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      Quote: ELEZKIY
      in exactly the same way I would describe where I ended up in SA. he just wrote my words. I was lucky that weapons were taken from part of ours. many would shoot each other. but still there were some dead bodies. but at that time the officers were wise. although all sorts of. and so he pulled out a year on his teeth, then it became easier. and the army is also eager, homeland duty and all that. and there really was hell. I’m only talking about my battalion, although the whole brigade was no better, that's for sure. no, I understand him. until you bleed, they will not calm down.

      ====
      hell was in disbats, in parts these issues were resolved. We had a case (82 years old) when a young Armenian, and they were sent by several people of the same conscription to perform some work in a platoon location, in response to the sergeant Tajik’s harsh remark / demand , albeit in a menacing tone, he immediately cut the face of that sergeant with a blade. and the command disbanded the sergeant's platoon and sent it out to different parts.
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 13 New
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        logical by the way
  36. grigor727 9 January 2020 15: 06 New
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    I think that Shamsutdinov is a man with an unbalanced psyche, who was looked at by doctors during a medical examination. This is the first. Second, the company and platoon commander looked at his relationship with the team. I think we shouldn’t let relations in the team go by chance, we should conduct personal conversations to identify such problems, to know who is friends with whom, communicates, most likely he had no friends and he I didn’t communicate with anyone. We also need to identify “leaders” who are trying to gather around themselves the so-called gang in order to engage in hazing. “unintelligible relationships” and breaking up these “groups” by scattering them into other units. Also, perhaps Shamsutdinov should have been transferred to another part, a division, maybe he would have found friends there, well, at least who to communicate with. shooter, "who also did not have a relationship in the team, perhaps he was a kind of autistic. And finally, Shamsutdinov could meet with the deputy com. part, explain to him the situation, without even revealing the names of the offenders, ask, write a report on the transfer to another part. I myself served for 90-92 years, and also under contract 98-2000 I saw hazing and I know all this firsthand.
    1. Donchanin 9 January 2020 15: 19 New
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      Read the first article. Who would transfer him and where? Nonsense.
    2. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 12 New
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      if it was viewed by everyone, it means that this is the specific fault of those who neglected (or for money), their official duties. Do you understand that you are already blaming the system? in principle, all this can be true, that is, there are much more “ghouls” and “evil ferrets”?
  37. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 15: 31 New
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    Quote: Shuttle
    It is very strange to draw conclusions justifying or condemning Shamsutdinov without knowing the circumstances of the case. In any case, those who, with his words, scoffed at him did not kill him, but he killed. And not one or two, but eight. And maybe ten.
    I would refrain from any conclusions and conclusions without thoroughly familiarizing myself with the incident. How could he get into living people so many times?

    Well, let's say you are not killing anyone, but simply, being, for example, in the Caucasus, for example in Chechnya, say something that is not very good for the mother of a Caucasian. they kill you silently, for example. the result - you are definitely good, but not the killer?
    and about the number of hits - this is the army, and there they actually learn to kill. well taught, then ...
    1. Victorio 9 January 2020 15: 51 New
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      Quote: ELEZKIY
      Well, let's say you are not killing anyone, but simply, being, for example, in the Caucasus, for example in Chechnya, say something that is not very good for the mother of a Caucasian. they kill you silently, for example. the result - you are definitely good, but not the killer?
      and about the number of hits - this is the army, and there they actually learn to kill. well taught, then ...

      ====
      we will go far if we answer each word with a bullet or knife.
    2. Shooter22 9 January 2020 16: 13 New
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      Quote: ELEZKIY
      and about the number of hits - this is the army, and there they actually learn to kill. well taught, then ...


      Finish control in the head? Give me at least one training manual for linear parts where this is taught. This is basically the lot of "spirits" and gopota gangster.
      From my own memory I can give only one example when this was done for the good: when in this way the suicide bombers on Dubrovka (Nord-Ost) were persuaded so that their fingers with contacts didn’t accidentally close, otherwise there would be no one to save ... But such guys worked there, where such ghouls like this criminal would not be allowed without a muzzle for a kilometer.

      But your correspondence, Alexander (and others like you) on this thread, reminds me more and more of the debate in the Club who got embittered animals in a hurry on the scoreboard in a hurry, to hang tags here for everyone. It is a pity that such substandardness was drawn to the VO forum! Sorry for the time spent.
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 06 New
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        I have the honor ...
  38. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 15: 42 New
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    Quote: The same Lech
    Dear not. You did not say where and by whom you served. Therefore, you are a sofa shelupon.
    Yes, I’m not going to tell you anything cheap gopnik ... I understand your communication tactics and you won’t be able to get me into a fight smile ... like you, I just despise.

    pisser from afar to see
    1. Same lech 9 January 2020 16: 00 New
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      Of course see smile ... is it the courage to insult a person or shoot secretly his colleagues ... it is much more difficult to resist and not to naughty in response a rude person or not to stab him ... which I try to do to the best of my tender nerves ... in my lifetime I have seen a lot of boors and normal people ... for some it is unacceptable in any form to insult a person ... for others it is unacceptable in any form ... so Donchanin’s behavior is not surprising to me ... he didn’t come out of childhood ... see mom with a folder did not explain to him in childhood what is good and what is loho.
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 00 New
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        The Donchanin is a man, I’m easily into intelligence.
        1. Same lech 9 January 2020 17: 01 New
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          Go ... and I don’t even sit down at the table with such a meal .. the bedroom in the back is stealthily still under the mood ... he is too unbalanced.
  39. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 15: 57 New
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    Quote: Donchanin
    Seklitsky, whose will you be? Read the first article about this. Check out the material, so to speak.
    In the early 80s, such scum beat off the spirit of the egg, because it said incorrectly where the tea is. In my company duty. The kid became disabled, and this goat was partly otmazyvat. This is just one example of those that were overdue. Not to mention similar cases which could be heard in the commandant’s office. By the way, I did not serve in Transbaikalia.
    If you served, you should know that problems in the army by mopping do not end there.
    And this embittered ferret, shooter 22 /// 25 years of service (not in the Arbat VO) in places where you have never been and never will be ./// like the "ilite" of the Armed Forces, also probably knows about it, although it disguises itself .

    prose of life. there is a battalion on the parade ground, (I'm in the first company). a window of a third floor flies out. back against the curb. I’ve been taken away and honestly, I still don’t know if I was still alive. two brothers alongside wanted him .. addition. result: two freaks with the letter "n" normally served, and a person either died or was disabled. and which is better is not clear. and if they slammed them, two roosters would have become less, and he would have come home and family, children for the motherland, etc. I don’t know how anyone, but I’m banging for.
    1. Victorio 9 January 2020 16: 00 New
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      Quote: ELEZKIY
      prose of life. there is a battalion on the parade ground, (I'm in the first company). a window of a third floor flies out. back against the curb. I’ve been taken away and honestly, I still don’t know if I was still alive. two brothers alongside wanted him .. addition. result: two freaks with the letter "n" normally served, and a person either died or was disabled. and which is better is not clear. and if they slammed them, two roosters would have become less, and he would have come home and family, children for the motherland, etc. I don’t know how anyone, but I’m banging for.

      ===
      why didn’t they bang or would they say at worst ?!
      1. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 16: 57 New
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        where I served, to declare, how would I tell you, means to go to discharge, to a very poor discharge, in general
        1. Victorio 9 January 2020 17: 11 New
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          Quote: ELEZKIY
          where I served, to declare, how would I tell you, means to go to discharge, to a very poor discharge, in general

          ===
          Well, you see, the battalion stood, the battalion saw, the battalion was silent. prose of life (
  40. faterdom 9 January 2020 16: 00 New
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    Search - and from Chikatilo a similar "literacy" is probably there. There is no reason and can not be any reason to shoot colleagues. A normal person has a barrier to this in the brain. Abnormal - there is nothing to do in the army, in any capacity - this is the subject of the Ministry of Health, and not the Ministry of Defense.
    For a similar act from the army of the time of Gilgamesh to the modern - the highest measure, and not as revenge, but as a preventive measure against this.
    Attempts to justify are understandable on the part of relatives, to delve into and understand - on the part of the leadership.
    But attempts to justify using the media, "from the point of view of public opinion through its formation" - this is an undermining of the army organization as such. To disband a part - if this solves the issue for other commanders, so that they open their eyes - is expensive, troublesome, but it may be appropriate.
    If just like that, for show, "severe measures taken" - stupid!
    1. The comment was deleted.
  41. Blue fox 9 January 2020 16: 27 New
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    Personally, I perceive such opuses as an attempt to otmazyvaniya. Although I happened to wander around the garrisons. But I won’t believe that it’s easier to put a guard than to stick behind the fence (and now you don’t even need to, just call the number that hangs in your “lenok-leisure” in each barracks) and open arms of military prosecutors will be accepted as a native, but given the realities centuries, when any hose on-line can transfer to the "committee of mothers without mothers" how they force him to beat off an unfortunate girl with bumps on his bunk ....
  42. kiril1246 9 January 2020 16: 35 New
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    I want to understand something else, how in such a homophobic society as the army, gays were able to get into officers and turn the army into a sadomasochistic club using young soldiers as slaves to satisfy their own lust.
    1. Doctor 9 January 2020 19: 27 New
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      I want to understand something else, how in such a homophobic society as the army, gays were able to get into officers and turn the army into a sadomasochistic club using young soldiers as slaves to satisfy their own lust.


      What kind of homophobia? Entire dynasties have already taken shape there. Starting with cadets.
      1. kiril1246 9 January 2020 22: 34 New
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        Quote: Arzt
        What kind of homophobia? Entire dynasties have already taken shape there. Starting with cadets.

        Can you write in more detail about which such dynasties do you write?
        1. Doctor 9 January 2020 22: 57 New
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          Can you write in more detail about which such dynasties do you write?


          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8umECNNAZkY
          1. kiril1246 9 January 2020 23: 58 New
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            Quote: Arzt
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8umECNNAZkY

            I am ashamed of the army. Apparently this infection has penetrated the highest echelons and from there it is encouraged, and they want to make the guilty ordinary soldier who stopped this homosexual debauchery.
  43. Ural resident 9 January 2020 16: 50 New
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    Quote: Stas157
    Shamsutdinov also writes what hell he went to, and that he reached the last limit, and that he could not endure bullying anymore ... It is interesting, but the Moscow Region feels responsible for the relations that have developed there? For good, then, MO also need to apologize ... and change something.

    Until those responsible from the Moscow Region will be punished for lawlessness, this will continue. The officers don't give a damn what’s going on, sort of figure it out themselves. That's when the prison sentences begin to be received, then they will think about what is happening in their unit.
  44. ELEZKIY 9 January 2020 17: 03 New
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    Quote: Victorio
    we will go far if we answer each word with a bullet or knife.

    if you are a grown man, you must understand the degree of responsibility for each word and action
    1. Yuri T. 9 January 2020 19: 33 New
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      Quote: ELEZKIY
      Quote: Victorio
      we will go far if we answer each word with a bullet or knife.
      if you are a grown man, you must understand the degree of responsibility for each word and action

      By your own logic: "Blood for blood?" Or even blood feud? Then I consider any relative of the murdered
      he can judge, like this "...", who is guilty, for what, and how to punish. Someone thinks that one of his skins is not enough, and all his relatives, friends and defenders need to be pulled in too, like this "...", the whole sentence sentenced, carried out and executed? Once a pedestrian once folded a mirror for me (did not break it) - it seemed to him that I was wrong. And it seemed to me that he was a udak, because I think that he didn’t break anything, and because my mother was on the right (where he beat), and my pregnant wife was behind. So did I have the right to shoot him out of injury, or at least break my jaw? (I’ll say right away, I had a physical opportunity and VERY wanted)
      Or should DePoS decide this first, and then the court?
      Naturally, the pretzel was not going to wait and understand the law, and quickly, but with obscenities, retreated. And, as a rule, everyone wants justice here and now, according to their norms and rules, but it will be a completely different society, worse than the “blacks” (in every sense, by color and blood) even. You take the right to judge for yourself; you are prepared that you will be.
  45. Fedorovich 9 January 2020 17: 06 New
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    The impudent, vicious cattle, accustomed to impunity, suddenly discovered that the papamusar would not take him away - of course, he would whine and put pressure on pity.
    1. ddmm09 9 January 2020 19: 50 New
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      Fedorovich, do you personally know everyone that you allowed yourself to stoop to such turns of speech ?!
      1. Fedorovich 11 January 2020 12: 16 New
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        Benedict, move over.
  46. Flatter 9 January 2020 18: 10 New
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    I don’t believe Shamsutdinov. Even in the most desperate situation of the tortured, there is always someone who initiates lawlessness. And lay him there, especially since you can always find opportunities for this. And this is natural. The psychopath was sent to serve him.
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  49. savment 9 January 2020 22: 40 New
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    What the hell is he in? Here in the 90s there was hell with hazing when I served. If what pigs will not be. What would he do then. Wimp. He brought so much grief to people. Life will receive, there will be time to think.
  50. Lekz 16 January 2020 13: 42 New
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    It is necessary to answer for the deed according to the law. The court must take into account all extenuating / aggravating circumstances and make a lawful decision. This is trivial. A story about the horrors of the army for college students. The army is a cast of society, the same citizens serve there as in other societies. No one claims that the army is a kindergarten. This work is for men. So it was and it will be so.