Falling Boeing airliners: US secret weapon?


The crash of Flight PS 752 of Ukraine’s International Airlines, which occurred at Tehran’s international airport just a few hours after the IRGC launched rocket attacks on US military bases in Iraq, does not just give rise to a great many questions. It inevitably provokes stubborn, directly obsessive associations with another tragedy - the Malaysia Airlines airliner that crashed in Donbass in 2014 on the flight MH-17. And the point is not even that in both cases Boeing planes appear (although this, apparently, does matter), but in a whole chain of other, far more sinister and meaningful coincidences and parallels that are worth it to talk about them separately and thoroughly. Immediately I want to dot the “i” - the following should in no way be taken as a statement. This is nothing more than a version, and each reader has the right to support, refute, or even ridicule it. In this case, however, it is recommended to read to the end and then draw conclusions.


Strange, riddles, doubts


I will not retell for the hundredth time the details of the disaster, which have already been repeatedly voiced by all world and domestic media. Let us dwell on those points that initially cause bewilderment and questions. One of them, of course, is the more than strange behavior of the Ukrainian Embassy in Iran. A message about the tragedy on his official website appeared quite quickly. It clearly and unequivocally stated that the cause of the incident was a malfunction of the engine, and the versions of the terrorist act or missile attack were completely excluded. And suddenly something happens ... The meaning of the written changes almost exactly the opposite: the lines above disappear and instead appear words about the commission figuring out the causes of the disaster. And also a rather strange statement that “any statements” regarding the accident before the end of the work of this commission itself are “not official”. At first glance, nonsense. But only at first. Since almost immediately after this, according to world news agencies, “dispersal” of the information of the Jordanian publication Al Hadath begins, claiming that the airliner “was mistakenly shot down by Iranian air defense forces”. No evidence, no references to sources, even traditionally "wishing to remain anonymous." The Iranian government makes an official statement that it has nothing to do with the tragedy and is ready to prove it. However, it’s too late. The process, as they say, has already begun. To what extent this informational “snowball” has grown literally within a day, I will tell a little later.

With UIA Boeing 737-800 NG itself, performing the fateful flight Tehran - Kiev, there are not so many oddities, but extremely many. They can be said, in this case, going through the roof! We must start with the fact that it was one of the newest "boards" of the company, whose technical serviceability did not cause the slightest doubt. Moreover, the last time it was checked literally on January 6 of this year. Crew members - ship commander Vladimir Yaponenko, instructor Alexei Naumkin, co-pilot Sergey Khomenko had 11 plus, 12 and 7 and a half thousand flight hours, respectively. Sergei Vakhrin, instructor for the deceased pilots, claims that with such an emergency situation as engine failure, any of them would be able to cope, and all together - for sure. Thus, the official version of the “technical malfunction” that led to the disaster raises huge doubts. The opinions of professionals on this issue are initially divided to the full polarity. So, Australian aviation expert Jeffrey Thomas categorically denies the possibility of a missile strike, claiming that the explosion that destroyed the aircraft occurred inside it. On the contrary, Vadim Lukashevich, who was presented by one of the Voice of America projects as a “former employee of the Sukhoi Design Bureau,” argues that the priority should be given to the version of precisely getting a guided missile into the ill-fated Boeing. At the same time, he refers to some “photographs”, which, however, his statements “do not prove”. In a word, confusion and reels. Well, and “ahead of the rest”, as usual in such cases, our old friends, Bellingcat, are already running, trying to declare the “killer” of the Ukrainian airliner Tor air defense missile systems. This is done on the basis of a piece of hardware posted on the Internet, supposedly "discovered at the scene of the accident", it is not clear when and by whom. How familiar!

New MN-17?


In principle, the mere fact of an immediate connection to the “investigation” of these bore scribes with a rather dubious reputation is more than eloquent. They, you understand, are already undertaking to “determine” the location of the aircraft in the airspace of Iran and “check” whether it was within the reach of the “Tor” air defense system, which are in service with the local air defense systems. Will we bet on the results of this “objective verification”? I also think it’s not worth it. It’s better to try to deal with a whole series of “indirect evidence”, testifying in favor of the fact that we are dealing with no accident and not even with an “air defense error”, but with the cold-blooded murder of 176 people arranged for the purpose of international provocation. One to one - as with the Malaysian Airlines liner that died over Donbass.

Let's start with the simplest - the citizenship of the dead. There was a minimum of Ukrainians there - a crew, cabin crew and two passengers. Most were Iranian students returning to their place of study after the holidays. But ... Also on board were 63 Canadian citizens, 10 - Sweden, three citizens of Germany and the UK. A kind of sinister "international." What the other day, Mr. Trump was broadcasting about the “need for greater involvement of NATO countries in the crisis in the Middle East” ?! So there’s a good reason for you - it’s better not to come up with ... I completely admit that the corresponding teams were given by those who already knew perfectly well: the IRGC’s “retaliation strike” was delivered from scratch, and it won’t become a reason for launching full-scale hostilities. Ahead is a new stage of the confrontation with Tehran through sanctions and other instruments of international isolation. And it is highly desirable that this time Washington’s desire to drive the Iranians into a corner, its allies supported more actively.

Let me remind you - the collapse of MH17, according to many analysts, just became that “boiling point”, after which the most severe and, so to speak, massive sanctions were imposed on Russia not only by the United States, but also by the European Union, , after which our country was completely shamelessly and shamelessly accused of direct involvement in the armed conflict in the Donbass. Ukraine “played” its role in this heinous action “excellently”, but bad luck - over time, Malaysia began to be self-wishing, and in Europe it somehow diminished confidence in the version of the tragedy that was stubbornly imposed on it. This is the answer to the question of why in this situation the Ukrainian “board” was subjected to destruction. Let me remind you: according to the current protocols of the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), a disaster investigation will be carried out by a commission consisting of representatives of both the country where the incident occurred (Iran) and the states that own the aircraft and its manufacturers. That is, Ukraine and the United States. Can you imagine what they "dig" there? Yes, exactly what will be prescribed from Washington! Moreover, as it became known, US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, with whose "light" hands and all the present bloody porridge was brewed in the Middle East, has already made an official statement of readiness to provide Kiev with "all possible assistance in an objective investigation." And that he intends to "closely monitor this incident." Here is the explanation for the quick “change of shoes” of the “non-down” embassy in Tehran regarding the versions of the tragedy. It is clear that they “stuck” and received instructions to change the text straight from Kiev, where by that time the “correct” interpretation had already been voiced. And, by the way, Zelensky had a telephone conversation with Pompeo just on the eve of the disaster. Really?!.

And, by the way, here's another thing: no matter how cynical it sounds, but it’s quite possible that the choice to sacrifice precisely Boeing aircraft is not at all random. In order to arrange a catastrophe over which experts will then puzzle over, it is necessary to know very well the hidden capabilities of the winged machine. Those in the liners of this particular manufacturer, as shown by the sad experience with the "killer program" MCAS, may well exist. Anyway, the fate of this corporation is now entirely in the hands of the US federal authorities, and the Pentagon is its main savior in a difficult year ... However, moving further in this direction, we are indeed at risk of falling into the shaky ground of conspiracy theories. We can do without it. Absolutely obvious facts are enough to suggest that the accident of PS 752 flight may well turn out to be another act of a secret war waged by those who consider themselves entitled to single-handedly decide the fate of not only individual countries, but of the whole world, while giving human lives no more significance than to broken tin soldiers. The beneficiary state in this case is more than obvious. And it’s easy to get an idea of ​​how far-reaching game can go over time with a properly promoted and generously nourished information campaign on this subject, taking control of squeamishness and familiarizing yourself with some of the freshest “pearls” from the Ukrainian blogosphere. So far, the ravings that Vladimir Putin was in Damascus exclusively “for organizing an Iranian attack on the Ukrainian airliner” are written and discussed only there, in all seriousness. But this is for now ...

Well, all that remains is to express my sincere condolences to the families and friends of all the victims. And also the hope that the names of the passengers and crew of flight PS 752 will complete the list of those whose lives were cut short on Iran’s land for as long as possible.
Author:
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  1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 06: 09 New
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    A typical analysis of a military pensioner under a stack of vodka, the conspiracy theory rode through a multi-port.

    This is nothing more than a version, and each of the readers has the right to support, refute, or even make fun of it
    Thank you.
    1. Same lech 9 January 2020 06: 20 New
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      Since almost immediately after this, according to world news agencies, “dispersal” of the information of the Jordanian publication Al Hadath begins, claiming that the airliner “was mistakenly shot down by Iranian air defense forces”.

      A photo of Boeing’s wreckage has already been posted with supposedly traces of penetration by fragments of a rocket ... it’s too early to draw premature conclusions ... a commission independent of the US should study the causes of the disaster ... there will be too many interested parties to speculate on this.
      1. perm23 9 January 2020 06: 30 New
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        and which commission will believe the media of the West and the United States. if this is not their commission or this commission do not let the bug give the wrong facts. which are needed. . It's ridiculously simple. excuse me .. a simple example. about alleged chemical attack. weapons. in Syria. we brought witnesses and that and NOTHING. . so it will be here.
        1. Same lech 9 January 2020 06: 33 New
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          And do not care about the media in the West and the USA ... they are all aggrieved and bribed ... their editors will do what they order from Washington ... read INosmi.
          Therefore, the investigation should be conducted by organizations independent from the United States .. and do not indulge what they want in the West.
          1. perm23 9 January 2020 07: 41 New
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            The question is something else and who will believe the conclusions of this commission, then who will believe .. if the United States is against it.
          2. 2 Level Advisor 9 January 2020 15: 33 New
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            You are right that there is no hope for the bulk of journalists in terms of truth, but if you link to the inosm.i.ru website, then it’s not worth it, RIA Novosti deals with it (our official office) ..
        2. rich 9 January 2020 06: 50 New
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          A photograph taken allegedly at the crash site of the Boeing 737-800 Ukraine International Airlines liner began to spread on Twitter. It is alleged that it depicts a fragment of a rocket launched, presumably, from the anti-aircraft missile system (SAM) "Tor".

          What is it? Another western photo-toad? Until it becomes known exactly where this photo was taken, this information should be treated with caution.
          1. svp67 9 January 2020 07: 33 New
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            Quote: Rich
            It is alleged that it depicts a fragment of a rocket launched, presumably, from the anti-aircraft missile system (SAM) "Tor".

            And where was he photographed? At the crash site? And how did he suddenly end up there?
            1. iva12936 9 January 2020 12: 01 New
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              He apparently glared like a mosquito and before he could undock, he collapsed with the victim sad
          2. Same lech 9 January 2020 07: 43 New
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            Another western photo-toad?

            Now ... it's too early to draw conclusions ... otherwise you can get into a stupid situation.
          3. knn54 9 January 2020 07: 52 New
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            One of the Ukrainian bloggers does not exclude the drone of the small Yankees. Perhaps a swarm.
          4. barsik92090 9 January 2020 09: 36 New
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            But on these fragments fingerprints of the right push leg of Pampeva appear! With traces of fungal diseases.
          5. Nick 9 January 2020 11: 08 New
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            Quote: Rich
            What is it? Another western photo-toad?

            You can take such a photo in your own country house, and then say that it was photographed anywhere. No location. Therefore, even commenting on these photos is pointless hi
          6. kupitman 9 January 2020 11: 19 New
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            in the photo and no location
      2. svp67 9 January 2020 07: 31 New
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        Quote: The same Lech
        . Too many interested parties will speculate on this.

        Something everything begins to resemble a "bloody spectacle." Some killed their opponent, and did so cynically. The latter launched a retaliatory missile strike, but a miracle, the personnel from these bases were withdrawn, and the rest was safely hidden, so that there were no casualties. And then this tragedy ...
        I would not want to produce conspiracy theories, but everything resembles an “agreement” between the United States and certain forces in Iran. Eliminated one of the main, if not the main enemy of the United States in Iran, who was omnipotent there, the United States received a "response", so that the vengeful feelings of the Iranian plebs can be satisfied. And this tragedy, which may be the fact that will play for reconciliation. Both sides have already stated that they are satisfied with the results of the "war", I look forward to when they begin to call for reconciliation against the backdrop of "human grief"
      3. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 16 New
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        Quote: The same Lech
        The investigation of the causes of the disaster should be done by a commission independent of the USA ... there will be too many interested parties to speculate on this.
        and as stated in the article on stakeholders The commission, consisting of representatives of both the country where the incident occurred (Iran) and the states that own the aircraft and its manufacturers, that is, Ukraine and the United States. Can you imagine what they "dig" there? Yes, exactly what will be prescribed from Washington!
      4. bayard 10 January 2020 04: 26 New
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        My comrade and I tonight examined in detail all available photographs from the scene of the disaster.
        The conclusions are as follows:
        - No traces of damaging elements on the debris of the fuselage (fuzzy photo) were found. What seemed to be such before, when viewing a photo of the same fragment in high resolution, showed that these were pebbles and pieces of clay and shadows from them (in fuzzy resolution it could be mistaken for holes from damaging elements.
        - the engine (several photos) has traces of a blow to the ground and holes from the turbine fragments from the inside - it will fly apart under the influence of centrifugal force. Two parallel traces of breaking through from the outside were obtained rather from a face impact by wing elements that collapsed upon impact on the ground.
        - no traces of damaging elements were found on the turbine, just as no traces of warhead explosions in the nozzle part of the engine were found.
        - on the footage of a Boeing crash in the night sky, it is clear that the plane burned in the air, falling in a spiral. Therefore, there was either an engine fire on take-off (unlikely) or an explosion on board causing a fire and a fall.
        The photo of the head of the Tor missile is a fake that has nothing to do with the incident. Why? Yes, because the accident / explosion occurred at an altitude of 1,5 to 2,5 km. and the warhead of the rocket, which supposedly hit the plane, after a warhead explosion and a fall from a height of at least (!!!) 1,5 km. on stony ground, not only not destroyed, but not even deformed from hitting the ground, has no dents or scratches on it, the paint is not damaged and even (OH MIRACLE !!!) the wings of the control system did not wrinkle, did not come off, did not they wriggled, did not bend, but retained their pristine pristine form in order to testify with their whole appearance which particular missile this head part was.
        She was simply laid on the ground and photographed.
        It is unknown WHERE they took it, laid it on the ground, it is not known where, and photographed it.
        And at the same time, she allegedly fell from a height of 1,5 to 2,5 km. Look at her photo below and answer yourself - Do you believe?
    2. Finches 9 January 2020 06: 21 New
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      And what doesn’t suit you? Terror, was adopted by the US special services immediately after the war, first, as a weapon against the communist movements in Europe! And then they spread this experience to other parts of the planet for other reasons ... And even they do not really hide this fact!
      1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 06: 25 New
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        Quote: Finches
        And what doesn’t suit you?
        For example, I am not happy when I talk about conspiracy theory, but they answer me about terror. These are different things. Suleimani was eliminated by a rocket from a drone and immediately reported about it on Twitter, and did not set reptilians against him with nibira.
        1. Finches 9 January 2020 06: 34 New
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          And where does the world conspiracy? Well, they reported, so what? To destroy the liner, then who interfered with them? I understand that here you deliberately stoke for the Americans, but you have no better version than the author of the text - you cannot prove your opinion, neither the author ... But there are historical parallels that allow us to argue that the plane crash at the right time and in the right place - this is a favorite US technique!
          1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 06: 39 New
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            Quote: Finches
            But there are historical parallels that allow us to argue that a plane crash at the right time and in the right place is a favorite US technique!
            Can you point out the crash, about which it is reliably known that they were intentionally arranged by the United States? (This is meant as a provocation, with an attempt to blame someone else. I remember about the Iranian airbus.)
            1. Finches 9 January 2020 06: 47 New
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              Your question contains a provocation - of course, I can’t say it for sure, except when the Americans shot down an Iranian passenger plane without any hesitation! And by the way, they didn’t even apologize. George W. Bush then pathetically declared: "I will never apologize for the United States, in spite of any facts." Which already clearly enough characterizes the United States as a bandit country off the highway! And this is only because the fact could not be hidden - and if they had succeeded, they would still not have pleaded guilty to the destruction of a civilian plane!
              1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 06: 55 New
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                Quote: Finches
                Your question contains a provocation - of course surely I can’t talk about it
                Do you know what follows from this? What is your conviction that for the United States the downed planes are a favorite provocation, based on the cases that you attribute to the United States purely on the basis of the conviction that downed planes are the favorite provocation for the United States. This is a logical mistake https://ru.rationalwiki.org/wiki/Endless_reduction or "vicious circle".
                1. Finches 9 January 2020 07: 08 New
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                  No, this is not a mistake - the USA is a world evil - whether you like it or not - therefore, to blow up an airplane for them in order to provoke that to go to the toilet for little need! This is the style of work of the American administration, God knows from what time!

                  On February 15, 1898, the American armored ship "Maine" was blown up in the harbor of Havana. The United States has blamed Spain. Result: Spanish-American War! But then it turned out that the Spaniards could not do this - time! To enter WWI, Woodry Wilson lacked support and ... On May 7, 1915, a British passenger airliner Lusitania was sunk by a German submarine. Which drove many respected US citizens. As it turned out, Lusitania was led to disaster by luring German submarines into the war zone. This allowed the supporters of the war to pull the blanket in their favor and take the side of the Entente - two! Pearl Harbor - I won’t even paint, but the reason is the same - there was no support from Congress and they stupidly set up their fleet! Three! Thin incident! Four! We skip September 11th, though ... And Colin Power and his famous test tube with washing powder! Five! And these are just high-profile facts of American provocations to solve their political problems that have become public knowledge!

                  And you say a logical mistake! Life experience and knowledge!
                  1. Octopus 9 January 2020 08: 45 New
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                    Quote: Finches
                    then it turned out that the Spaniards could not do this - time!

                    Most likely, this is so, but it does not follow from this that the ship was blown up by the Americans themselves. Used as an excuse - yes, but in those days (yes at any time) it was not something against the rules.
                    Quote: Finches
                    PMV Woodry Wilson lacked support and ... On May 7, 1915, a British passenger airliner Luzitania was sunk by a German submarine

                    The states entered the war 2 years after this story with Louisiana. When liberals leaked Russia, yes. Although Nicholas may have been killed by Wilson to intervene in the WWII, I know little about this.
                    Quote: Finches
                    Thin incident! Four!

                    Tonkin. Are you talking about August 2 or 4?
                    Quote: Finches
                    Skipping September 11th though ...

                    Thank you anyway.
                    Quote: Finches
                    Colin Power and his famous test tube with washing powder!

                    What is Colin Powell? You heard his test tube speech, no?
                    Quote: Finches
                    Pearl Harbor - I won’t even paint, but the reason is the same - there was no support from Congress and their fleet was stupidly set up!

                    )))
                    Republicans in Congress swept this idea for quite some time, baked Roosevelt cake for the 44th election. But it did not grow together, which is characteristic. There are a lot of questions to Roosevelt, but he didn’t do it specifically. Too difficult for its very limited capabilities.
                  2. alex-sherbakov48 9 January 2020 08: 49 New
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                    I fully agree with you !!! The American nation was born on the blood of the Indians, having arranged their genocide there. On that continent, mainly criminals came for whom the lives of other people are nothing. So it continues to this day, and will continue until they are destroyed !!!
                  3. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 24 New
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                    Quote: Finches
                    And you say a logical mistake! Life experience and knowledge!

                    And this is just what we know from the media and the press, and how many such “Tonkin incidents” are under seven locks, but there are not one or ten of them.
                2. perm23 9 January 2020 07: 43 New
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                  You are so vehemently defending the United States. as if not aware of their provocations
                  1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 07: 56 New
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                    Quote: perm23
                    You are so vehemently defending the United States. as if not aware of their provocations
                    I know about the tendency of some people to explain everything in a row through conspiracy theory, and then give their opinion as a fact.
                  2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 25 New
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                    Quote: perm23
                    You are so vehemently defending the United States. as if not aware of their provocations

                    Or are you supporting the United States, or?
                3. abrakadabre 9 January 2020 08: 11 New
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                  based on cases that you attribute to the United States purely on the basis of the conviction that downed planes are a favorite provocation for the United States.
                  All such statements are based on two regular and undeniable facts:
                  1. Timeliness of the disaster for the United States
                  2. Beneficiary - USA.
                  Ordinary statistics in a popular presentation: once - randomness, two times - coincidence, three or more times - regularity.
                  1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 08: 40 New
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                    Quote: abrakadabre
                    All such statements are based on two regular and undeniable facts:
                    1. Timeliness of the disaster for the United States
                    2. Beneficiary - USA.
                    Any incident has consequences, these consequences may be in some sense beneficial for anyone, including the United States. When conspiracy theories are built around individual cases where profit can be indicated, then a bunch of other cases where there was no benefit are ignored. This leads to sample bias.

                    Quote: abrakadabre
                    Ordinary statistics in a popular presentation: once - randomness, two times - coincidence, three or more times - regularity.
                    That's just statistics can not be built on a biased sample, this is a basic error in the application of statistics.
                    1. perm23 9 January 2020 09: 28 New
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                      Based on your theory, everything in the world happens by the will of the stupidity of individuals. and there are never and never have been conspiracies.
                      1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 33 New
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                        No, I do not deny any options, including conspiracy theory. But I divide the hypotheses into more probable and less probable (including much more probable and much less probable).
                      2. perm23 9 January 2020 09: 37 New
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                        hypotheses can be made of course. only the hypotheses of others must be accepted and understood that rot is based on facts. and probability. she is like that. that 1% of a million can win. like for example you were born what was the chance for a sperm.
                      3. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 43 New
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                        Quote: perm23
                        only the hypotheses of others must be accepted
                        In what sense is “accept”? If I believe that the probability of some hypothesis, for example, is 0.01%, do I accept it or not?
                      4. perm23 9 January 2020 09: 47 New
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                        But you think so. and who told you that your calculation is correct. maybe you have errors in the calculations. and the probability is 100%.
                      5. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 51 New
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                        For this, I am discussing and presenting all my arguments with arguments so that anyone can try to find errors in them.
                      6. perm23 9 January 2020 09: 57 New
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                        You do not discuss and reject the arguments of others. without citing facts in their arguments. so that you are wrong to prove to you already. 1 time accident. two - maybe but 3 is already a regularity.
                      7. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 59 New
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                        This is exactly what I answered in great detail with the eight comments above. Where about the biased sample.
          2. prodd 10 January 2020 11: 02 New
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            Hurray here bright thoughts appear. Most events occur by mistake or by coincidence. And not by conspiracy.
        2. bk316 9 January 2020 13: 30 New
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          That's just statistics can not be built on a biased sample, this is a basic error in the application of statistics.

          Do not trynd about what you do not understand. Even as it can, it’s just being built differently.
          In this case, you confuse the concepts of unbiased and representative sampling.
          1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 14: 29 New
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            Thank. Amendment is accepted.
  2. Octopus 9 January 2020 08: 27 New
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    Quote: Finches
    George W. Bush then pathetically declared: “I will never apologize for the United States, in spite of any facts”

    In that speech, Bush did not say a word about the Iranian airbus. The states at that time acknowledged their responsibility, conducted an investigation, began to finish off Aegis and paid compensation almost immediately.
  3. Nick 9 January 2020 11: 27 New
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    Quote: Finches
    Your question contains a provocation - of course, I can’t say it for sure, except when the Americans shot down an Iranian passenger plane without any hesitation!

    The 1988 Boeing crash over Lockerbie in Scotland was also attributed to Libyan intelligence, but then information began to leak out that this was the work of the CIA, which was trying to destroy witnesses who knew about the CIA’s connection with the drug trade in BV.
  • Same lech 9 January 2020 06: 37 New
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    Suleimani was eliminated by a rocket from a drone and immediately reported about it on Twitter,

    Suleimani was an official of Iran ... so the USA can be congratulated on the initiative ... now they can kill any official of any state and report about it on Twitter ... I won’t be surprised that they will also kill our official representative under some pretext ...who cares.
    1. alex-sherbakov48 9 January 2020 08: 53 New
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      A striking example is the murder of our ambassador in Turkey. I have no doubt that this was commissioned by the United States against the backdrop of improving relations between Russia and Turkey. US intelligence agencies did this with the wrong hands, as they always do.
    2. Nick 9 January 2020 12: 24 New
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      Quote: The same Lech
      Suleimani was an official of Iran ... so the United States can be congratulated on the initiative ... now they can kill any official of any state

      Almost all less developed countries have such an opportunity. The question is who will go to the act of state terror. In fact, the US has become a state using state terror, which they blame, then Iran, then Libya, then Syria, all who they do not like.
    3. 2 Level Advisor 9 January 2020 15: 50 New
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      I agree with you, government officials, this is a taboo!
      But it is worth noting that they had Suleimani on the list of terrorists, ours are not there ..
      Was this the second question already legally introduced there, but he was there ... plus he was nevertheless not on an official, but on a private visit ..
      Although a big effect and the right one to strike back would be something that happened to the Amer general, I’m afraid the Iranians won’t get such an operation ..
  • tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 18 New
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    Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
    For example, I am not happy when I talk about conspiracy theory, but they answer me about terror.

    An interesting expert appeared on the site.
  • bessmertniy 9 January 2020 06: 39 New
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    Of course, everything should be set by the commission. However, the story of the Boeing, shot down in the Donbass, shows that the work of even a very independent commission is difficult to trust, because its investigation and conclusions can be subject to strong political pressure. And in the case of this Boeing, which crashed in Iran, naturally, the version of "Iran’s involvement" will be supported, since this suits many world media. hi
    1. Octopus 9 January 2020 08: 49 New
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      Quote: bessmertniy
      However, the story of the Boeing, shot down in the Donbass, shows that the work of even a very independent commission is difficult to trust, because its investigation and conclusions can be subject to strong political pressure

      The Boeing story shows:
      1. That criminals should not investigate their own crimes.
      2. That in situations where the offender is the state, no investigation is required. More precisely, any investigation is nothing more than a way to refuse a political decision.

      Yes, in this sense, the Ukrainian and Iranian cases are completely similar.
      1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 33 New
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        Quote: Octopus
        1. That criminals should not investigate their own crimes.

        So in your opinion, you first need to find the criminals, prove their guilt, and then investigate the Boeing disaster. Verbally, even a criminal cannot be blamed.
        1. Octopus 9 January 2020 09: 41 New
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          Quote: tihonmarine
          First you need to find the criminals, prove their guilt, and then investigate the Boeing disaster. Verbally, even a criminal cannot be blamed.

          )))
          No.
          In the case when the state is the criminal, you cannot investigate his actions in the framework of the criminal process, since the state is in itself a sovereign object of law. In particular, it may refuse to arrest the accused in its jurisdiction, and even, as it turned out, redeem the accused in other jurisdictions. So in cases where there is reason to believe that the attack was committed by the state, nothing is required to investigate.

          Immediately wet. Or merge, as is the case with MN-17.
          1. Octopus 9 January 2020 10: 03 New
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            Quote: Octopus
            sovereign object

            Subject, of course.
          2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 10: 24 New
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            Quote: Octopus
            So in cases where there is reason to believe that the attack was committed by the state, nothing is required to investigate.

            If you consider the state to be the culprit, then it has already been appointed.
  • Chaldon48 9 January 2020 06: 25 New
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    Do you have more complete information? Share it
    1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 06: 28 New
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      Quote: Chaldon48
      Do you have more complete information? Share it
      More complete information (taking into account more empirical data) sounds like this: the world is governed not by a secret box, but by obvious crap. In a strict form, it is formulated by Hanlon's razor: "Never attribute to evil intent what can be adequately explained by stupidity."
      1. Finches 9 January 2020 06: 38 New
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        In science, the methodological principle is called Occam's razor ... Anyway, everyone is free to consider how he pleases! And there is no question of a world conspiracy - it is the US’s uncleanliness, they have already been caught by the hand, and no more! Moreover, the American special services are very conservative and pragmatic - if this always works, they will not invent anything new!
        1. Octopus 9 January 2020 08: 24 New
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          Quote: Finches
          In science, the methodological principle is called Occam's razor

          Firstly, William Ockham, an Englishman, not Occam, a Japanese, and secondly, he formulated this idea in a more general way. But the meaning is yes, the same thing.
          1. Finches 9 January 2020 10: 06 New
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            I know that he is English and I even know the general wording - I was mistaken in the ending! Thank you hi
      2. perm23 9 January 2020 07: 47 New
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        But in this case. no data about stupidity ... but there are just more reasons for malice
        1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 07: 51 New
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          Quote: perm23
          But in this case. no data about stupidity ..
          The ability to make even very stupid mistakes is a universal human property.
          1. perm23 9 January 2020 07: 54 New
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            That is, to blow up an Iranian plane is a stupid US mistake. . Why do you immediately deny this stupidity
            1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 07: 59 New
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              Quote: perm23
              That is, to blow up an Iranian plane is a stupid US mistake. . Why do you immediately deny this stupidity
              Do not quite understand where and what I deny? Please clarify.
              1. perm23 9 January 2020 08: 02 New
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                But to destroy the Iranian plane, this could be the stupidity of the US authorities. or you deny it.
                1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 08: 04 New
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                  Quote: perm23
                  But to destroy the Iranian plane, this could be the stupidity of the US authorities. or you deny it.
                  The plane of Ukraine, in the sense of? Or is it about the Iranian Airbus over the Persian Gulf in 88?
                  1. perm23 9 January 2020 08: 06 New
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                    It is about this aircraft about the Ukrainian Boeing. . The stupidity of the US authorities who believe that they have the right to do whatever they want.
                    1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 08: 21 New
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                      OK understood. Could the US authorities mistakenly admit that a scheme with secret provocation could work? Could, but for this a mistake should have been made by many more people at once, to do this simultaneously and for a long time. The probability of this is nonzero, but incomparably less than a passing error in calculating air defense.
                    2. perm23 9 January 2020 08: 48 New
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                      where does the mistake of leadership in the United States and not their stupidity. what they have the right to do what they want. Their stupidity is not a mistake. that rot destroyed the plane. but that they believe that what they are doing is right. and about air defense here, you certainly write nonsense., to bring down the plane on takeoff. near the city. which is not fired from by the enemy. This is certainly your stupidity.
        2. bober1982 9 January 2020 08: 13 New
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          For aviation, this is very relevant, although of course I would not call it stupidity, in the understanding that we understand it. In some cases, I mean aviation accidents, the actions of the pilot (crew) simply do not lend themselves to any explanation, and the qualification of the crew itself is high. Great flight experience, high class - does not help, but it happens that it hurts. This is a human property - to enter into a stupor, then the stupid mistakes you mentioned begin next.
          1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 08: 47 New
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            And the pilot’s mistake, of course, is quite possible, but there is a strange coincidence - the pilots make tens of thousands of flights every day, not every day and every year they make a chain of errors that leads to a complete crash, but if the Ukrainian Boeing really fell this time mistakes, it is very strange it happened in the country that made the military attack, and it was on the day when she made the attack. The probability of such an accidental coincidence is very, very small.
            1. bober1982 9 January 2020 08: 59 New
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              Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
              The probability of such an accidental coincidence is very, very small.

              Yes, everything looks strange, although there is no one and no benefit to anyone, for what reason?
              1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 01 New
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                Sometimes people just make mistakes. Fenders in particular.
            2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 42 New
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              Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
              it very strange happened in the country that made the military attack, and it was on the day when it launched the attack.

              Well, finally, you also came to the conclusion that there are not one oddities, and all of them are attracted to Iran. But this is already very strangeFrom this, the conclusion is "Who benefits from it." But one thing can be said, "Only not to Iran," as well as to Malaysian, "Not to Iran."
              1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 46 New
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                Quote incorrectly. Missed the word “if,” which is key to the meaning of the comment.
  • Stas157 9 January 2020 07: 51 New
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    . Ukrainians there was a minimum - crew, cabin crew and two passengers. Most were ...

    Slightly relieved. Though not “brothers,” their pain is given more than any other.
    1. perm23 9 January 2020 08: 04 New
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      but not brothers oh how happy when something happens with us.
      1. Stas157 9 January 2020 08: 07 New
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        Quote: perm23
        but not brothers oh how happy when something happens with us.

        Do you propose to do the same?
        1. perm23 9 January 2020 08: 09 New
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          Of course not. Man must always remain. Just remember some of our non-brothers. how they behave.
          1. Stas157 9 January 2020 08: 12 New
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            When trouble happens with a relative, it often happens that you don’t remember the old insults. You correctly said about humanity.
    2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 43 New
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      Quote: Stas157
      Slightly relieved. Though not "brothers", but their pain is given more than any other

      But I feel equally sorry for everyone, especially since there are a lot of children. Kingdom to them is heaven.
      1. Stas157 9 January 2020 09: 53 New
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        Quote: tihonmarine

        And me all the same sorry, especially since there are a lot of children. Kingdom to them is heaven.

        And near and far? What an unusual case! Maybe Little Russians and Iranians with Canadians are just as distant for you?
        1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 10: 30 New
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          Quote: Stas157
          Maybe Little Russians and Iranians with Canadians are just as distant for you?

          For me there are no far and near ones, and the trouble has no nationality.
          1. Stas157 9 January 2020 10: 44 New
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            Quote: tihonmarine
            For me there are no far and near

            And relatives and close circle, too, no? Ah .. Then it’s clear!
  • Octopus 9 January 2020 08: 16 New
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    Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
    rode a conspiracy theory through a multi-port.

    I read this in the heading, "The Catastrophe in Iran Causes Associations with MH-17," and I think no one dared to dare themselves like Solovyov and Russia's Italian route the other day. I look at the article, but inside the usual Dulles plan, what the hell, nothing new.

    I thought that even the mattress-mounted air defense systems that hit 600 km would appear (they appeared on RenTV yesterday), but even they are not.

    And there really are similarities. Just as the supporters of spirituality brought down some universal people at that time, so this time. Trudeau put his tongue in, apparently, sews bold topical socks for such an occasion. For complete bingo, someone (Ukraine?) Must demand an international tribunal at the United Nations, and Russia should testify this matter out of a sense of solidarity with spiritually close ones. Girkin didn’t go to Tehran.
    1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 48 New
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      Quote: Octopus
      Girkin didn’t go to Tehran.

      And Bashirov with Pavlov.
  • Elena Zakharova 9 January 2020 08: 54 New
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    You probably a priori believe that the United States can not be involved in this disaster?
    1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 08: 59 New
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      And you probably a priori think that any probabilities are equal to 50%, and it is impossible to make any more accurate estimates.
      1. Elena Zakharova 9 January 2020 09: 02 New
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        Personally, I believe that any version cannot be ruled out.
        Too often, the crash of Boeing coincides with the general line of policy pursued by the State Department.
        It's like a trump ace that the US always pulls out in situations like this.
        1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 10 New
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          Personally, I also believe that any version, and even conspiracy theory, cannot be ruled out. But https://ru.rationalwiki.org/wiki/Extraordinary statements require extraordinary proofs, and in the philistine consciousness, belief in conspiracy theory is just as easy and with the same presumption of certainty as the belief that tomorrow morning will be dawn and evening - sunset.
          1. Mordvin 3 9 January 2020 09: 21 New
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            Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
            and in the philistine consciousness, belief in conspiracy theory is just as easy

            And where did you get the idea that she is a simple layman?
            1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 23 New
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              I did not say this, and I am not at all inclined to switch to personalities.
          2. Elena Zakharova 9 January 2020 09: 38 New
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            Thoughts about conspiracy theory do not appear from scratch, but on a series of successive events, where the narrow interest of only one participant in the conflict is clearly visible - the United States.
            1. Vyacheslav Viktorovich 9 January 2020 09: 48 New
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              I wrote above - this series is a biased sample.
        2. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 50 New
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          Quote: Elena Zakharova
          Too often, the crash of Boeing coincides with the general line of policy pursued by the State Department.

          And something very frequent coincidences.
          1. Octopus 9 January 2020 16: 26 New
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            Quote: tihonmarine
            And something so frequent coincidences

            Over the entire period of operation of 737 major accidents were 211 times. For example, in 2018 there were 8 accidents, including 2 accidents with large casualties.

            Sign these 8 accidents on the State Department agenda?
  • Vol4ara 9 January 2020 10: 20 New
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    Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
    A typical analysis of a military pensioner under a stack of vodka, the conspiracy theory rode through a multi-port.

    This is nothing more than a version, and each of the readers has the right to support, refute, or even make fun of it
    Thank you.

    It also seemed to me that pulling an owl on a globe.
  • Yuri Nemov 9 January 2020 12: 27 New
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    And what is a military pensioner not an expert? The USA is still being used by Kissinger as an expert, and truancy is already being put to him at the cemetery.
  • 210ox 9 January 2020 06: 32 New
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    Sensible people in vna ask a question. But is it worth contacting the international provocateur and terrorist - the United States? Condolences to the families and friends of the deceased.
  • Vladimir_2U 9 January 2020 06: 48 New
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    And to take and prohibit Boeing flights, due to the "high probability of bookmarks and provocations on the part of the manufacturing country."
    1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 09: 51 New
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      Quote: Vladimir_2U
      And to take and prohibit flights of "Boeing",

      So what a problem, close, I do not mind.
      1. Vladimir_2U 9 January 2020 10: 32 New
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        Yes, they have not risked flying through my apartment for a long time!
        1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 11: 23 New
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          Quote: Vladimir_2U
          Yes, they have not risked flying through my apartment for a long time!

          Respect means.
  • Winnie76 9 January 2020 06: 51 New
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    Interesting information: at the same time in Israel, the same problems with the engine on a Boeing 737. It is strange somehow. It looks like bookmarks in the control system
    https://cont.ws/@Nyka/1550792
    1. abrakadabre 9 January 2020 08: 16 New
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      It’s weird somehow. It looks like bookmarks in the control system
      I will not be surprised that this is a bookmark that allows the same signal-order via satellite to drop the plane. And most likely this development is quite recent. Probable test of this bookmark - remember, a few years ago, the Malaysian Boeing disappeared over the ocean?
      1. tihonmarine 9 January 2020 11: 26 New
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        Quote: abrakadabre
        I will not be surprised that this is a bookmark that allows the same signal-order via satellite to drop the plane.

        Fly domestic aircraft. I give advice and advertising for free.
  • rocket757 9 January 2020 06: 56 New
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    The fantasy of some is incurable .... we are waiting for the results of the investigation.
  • Pessimist22 9 January 2020 07: 11 New
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    Here on Reuters what they write:
    According to the results of a preliminary investigation into the causes of the crash of the Boeing-737 airliner of Ukraine International Airlines, investigators ruled out the version that the plane could have been shot down by a rocket.

    A source in the Canadian intelligence services told Reuters that there is evidence of a technical malfunction in the aircraft, which led to the crash. The probable cause is the overheating of one of the aircraft engines.
  • Andrey VOV 9 January 2020 07: 28 New
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    Iranian authorities will not give the so-called black boxes to Boeing’s employees and they will not be allowed to examine them, the authorities officially said. On January 6, the plane underwent maintenance, the question is, where did it go and by whose forces and means? Can "ears grow" from there? So let's not run ahead of the steam
  • bober1982 9 January 2020 07: 29 New
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    And why the author of this note claims about the announced official version - a technical malfunction, and the Ukrainian side disowned this version, and the Iranian one, noting that the causes of the disaster can be discussed only after a full investigation.
    You can agree with the opinion that a lot of things can be said under a stack of vodka.
  • Mavrikiy 9 January 2020 07: 45 New
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    Yes, Canada began to withdraw its fighters from Iraq, and received greetings from the United States. It is enough to recall the German Boeing that crashed in the Alps, when Germany behaved "not right" to the demands of the United States.
  • Esaul 9 January 2020 08: 17 New
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    The fact that the plane accidentally crashed precisely at this time and in this place is nonsense. Such a chance is possible 1 in a million. So with almost 100% probability he was shot down, judging by the events - the Americans. And Iran has evidence for that, otherwise Trump would not have refused a military response, i.e. apparently agreed on something.
    And how they shot down is another question, possibly with a laser from a satellite.
    1. Egoza 9 January 2020 10: 40 New
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      And how they shot down is another question, maybe a laser from a satellite


      Well, there is such an option ..... However, I have no doubt that the investigation will be stuck as with the Ukrainian Boeing, if agreed there.
      Iranian authorities said the crash could have occurred due to a technical malfunction. However, a source from the Armed Forces of the country told Live Report portal that the cause of the tragedy could be a missile launched by a drone of the US armed forces.

      The credibility of this version is evidenced by the MQ-1 Predator UAV found in the vicinity of Tehran, which is only in service with the US military.
  • 75 Sergey 9 January 2020 08: 23 New
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    It is somehow strange to attract Iran’s air defense here, with what a fright, but the Americans could easily, especially since their shelling was just at that time.
    They are not the first to shoot down Iranian civilian aircraft.
  • Ham
    Ham 9 January 2020 08: 28 New
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    the second time they are afraid to stir up such a provocation ... too pale! and what would they need to play correctly they need Ukraine! and it’s just not there in the Middle East
  • Snigir 9 January 2020 08: 31 New
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    Good article. The author on REN-TV needs to work bully
  • BAI
    BAI 9 January 2020 08: 51 New
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    An investigation of the disaster will be carried out by a commission consisting of representatives of both the country where the incident occurred (Iran) and the states that own the aircraft and its manufacturers. That is, Ukraine and the United States.

    Well, Iran just will not let the linden smuggle.
  • Zaurbek 9 January 2020 09: 17 New
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    By the way, who remembers how much was and how long the noise after the disaster with the SSZH100 in Moscow? And the soul and construction turned. And now the third B737 is falling and there is no noise .... where are the experts?
    1. bober1982 9 January 2020 09: 24 New
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      Quote: Zaurbek
      where are the experts?

      We won’t find out the truth, as experts say.
      1. Zaurbek 9 January 2020 09: 39 New
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        In the United States, they dig well under Boeing, only silence on export markets ... but in our YouTube, see a set of experts on the topic of PPC accidents! And silence.
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. kig
      kig 14 January 2020 08: 31 New
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      Quote: Zaurbek
      By the way, who remembers how much was and how long the noise after the disaster with the SSZH100 in Moscow? And the soul and construction turned. And now the third B737 is falling and there is no noise .... where are the experts?


      Well you give. SSJ did not fall, but returned to the airfield due to malfunctions, and collapsed during a hard landing. And this unfortunate one was shot down by a rocket. Do you think there is a difference?
      1. Zaurbek 14 January 2020 16: 51 New
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        Destroyed by improper landing ... and two Boeings before that, also shot down by a rocket?
  • K-50 9 January 2020 09: 23 New
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    In general, to summarize, we can say, well, or advise those who fly airplanes.
    When buying a ticket for a particular flight, you should probably pay attention to the plane carrying out the transportation, and if it is a Boeing, then you should probably think about it, is takeoff so important to you without the possibility of a soft landing?
    After all, if it is confirmed, but over time everything can be, then wait until the crazy pin again wants to use the undocumented software capabilities of the aircraft of this company, is it like wandering around the minefield and waiting for “smells” or not?
    1. Zaurbek 9 January 2020 09: 41 New
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      I've been flying often ... We don’t have B737 NG. They were only ordered, but no delivery is heard. I flew to An 148, which crashed (Saratov), ​​I fly to the SSJ, every year there are more of them and there’s no escape from them.
    2. Karislav 9 January 2020 10: 34 New
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      spurjet! only him! On it all our ministers "fly" and the oligarchs !!
  • Karislav 9 January 2020 10: 33 New
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    Well, we already passed the Voloshin pilot with the fighters, the corpses weren’t fresh either (the author again steps on the same rake), everyone screamed that air-to-air rocket ... then it turned out that BEECH ... reputation guys ...
  • ZAV69 9 January 2020 10: 59 New
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    Quote: Octopus
    I thought that even the mattress-mounted air defense systems that hit 600 km would appear (they appeared on RenTV yesterday), but even they are not.

    How much does a stinger shoot? Just on the engines induced. There is no need for special military art on the take-off board from the gateway.
  • Engineer 9 January 2020 11: 20 New
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    Does the site administration not care about its reputation? Why is this yellowness and conspiracy theories here?
    1. Larisa Byvsheva_3 10 January 2020 15: 48 New
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      Since you are here, you obviously don’t care.
  • dgonni 9 January 2020 12: 21 New
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    Shifting in the air for one reason. The airline belongs to Bene Kolomoisky. Therefore, it is better to be silent than to speak. For loot conquers evil.
    P.S. What is the similarity with MN-17 I personally did not understand! UIA Samol fell during a climb with a fire and collapsed when it fell to the ground. Boeing of Malaysia fell from a height of 10000+ meters collapsing in the air. Great resemblance to the author right?
    1. iouris 10 January 2020 13: 17 New
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      Quote: dgonni
      Samol

      These comments should be ruthlessly deleted. Sabotage against our language should be suppressed. Yes, and with the logic of the author of the post is very bad.
      1. dgonni 10 January 2020 16: 03 New
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        I will tell you a terrible secret! For pilots, slang passengers are called pax! So suddenly isn't it?
    2. Larisa Byvsheva_3 10 January 2020 15: 47 New
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      Chu at you again! The similarities in Russian weapons, then Buk, then Thor! Well, you are deer!
  • iouris 9 January 2020 12: 28 New
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    Well, firstly, the fact that it is the Boeing’s that fall may be an accident, though .... The fact that the states that should be destroyed (and some are already destroyed) are declared guilty of the death of passengers is a regularity. Secondly, the engine failure, most likely, could not lead to such consequences, and the picture of the scattering of debris, apparently (I didn’t see it, but heard it), indicates an airplane explosion. The result of the explosive destruction of the aircraft can be not only "external impact" (for example, a missile with a TGS launched by mistake or intentionally), but also sabotage. The diversion can be carried out without the use of explosives, the aircraft (especially the latest) can be influenced via the Internet.
  • toha124 10 January 2020 13: 15 New
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    But it’s interesting - but do Americans have the technical ability to bring down Boeings remotely, on command? Strictly if necessary.
  • Larisa Byvsheva_3 10 January 2020 15: 45 New
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    The third Boeing in a short time.