The deadlines for the commissioning of the nuclear submarine "Prince Vladimir" have been postponed

The deadlines for the delivery of the Navy of the strategic submarine cruiser strategic project 955A "Prince Vladimir" decided to move to the first half of 2020. About this news agency TASS said a source related to the military-industrial complex.

The reason for the postponement was the shortcomings identified during the latest tests of the submarine cruiser, which took place in December this year. It will take some time to eliminate them.

The source expressed the hope that the transfer of the warship to the Russian the fleet will happen in the first quarter of next year. At the same time, he admitted that before the delivery of the nuclear submarine, she would still go to sea for additional tests. The source added that the state commission will take the final decision on further actions.

Initially, the transfer of “Prince Vladimir” to the fleet was supposed to take place in December 2019, as reported by Vice Admiral Alexander Moiseev, who holds the post of commander of the Northern Fleet.

Before that, in October, the Ministry of Defense announced the successful launch of the Bulava ballistic missile, which was made from underwater position, from the submarine. This test passed as normal.

Comments

[Dart2027]

It's a pity, but alas, the main order (the first in the "A" series) is always not given immediately.

[Finches]

As you recall, until 1991, 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were handed over in the USSR per year ... and now one boat is a public holiday and you understand that Russia is a dwarf state compared to the Union! But the top managers are chic ... On New Year's Eve, I don’t feel sad - well done, I’ve even revived submarine building, but I still wish Grandfather Frost to restore my Homeland, the most powerful Empire of all time, with a fair and popular system - Union of Soviet Socialist Republics! What kind of Poland is there, the United States, with an eye on its bomb shelters, diplomatically presented them with apprehension! Now only the Baltic Fleet would go to the SP-2 laying area and the Swiss would lay pipes to Germany by hand, but alas, only Zakharova in a miniskirt to the microphone could come out and say menacingly that we were choking for sanctions ... Well here, but didn’t want about sad things!

[Invoce]

Quote: Finches

As you recall, until 1991, 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were handed over in the USSR per year ... and now one boat is a public holiday and you understand that Russia is a dwarf state compared to the Union! But the top managers are chic...

I agree 100%. Under the USSR, the ENGINEER became the head of the PROJECT, who grew up from the bottom and was selected according to the results of work, ability, genius, etc.
Nowadays, the brilliant children of the country's leaders, subjects, top managers finally become volume managers. All over the world, nature rests on the children of successful people, but not here. With us, if dad is a leader at the government level, then all relatives, including children and relatives, immediately become very advanced businessmen, occupy posts in state corporations, (Slyusar, Khakimov, Patrushev, Matvienko ...... Rogozin .....) , look - all relatives of a genius. Come on, if it weren’t harming the state, then no, no one will answer for anything, dad or mom will refuse, if there is no obvious rudeness in the appropriation of budget funds

[Vadim237]

Perhaps this is why we had so many accidents and fires with the nuclear submarines - starting from the 60s, boats were introduced en masse, and their quality left much to be desired.

[Rzzz]

Quote: Vadim237

and their quality left much to be desired.

Not therefore. Just the percentage of new and unexplored was so high that design errors were inevitable. Then, by the 80s, the technology worked out, and the accident rate decreased.
On non-nuclear ships there were no such significant problems - what do you think they did with better quality?

[Vadim237]

Well, in the 80s, accident rate decreased: two submarines lost one, with 15 infantry fighting vehicles left at the bottom of the third nuclear reactor exploded at the pier because of structural flaws, a rocket exploded in the mine in Shark, although they cost no losses. Just diesel submarines are simpler than nuclear ones and there were few of them in the Navy.

[Vadmir]

Under the USSR, the ENGINEER became the head of the PROJECT, who grew up from the bottom and was selected according to the results of work, ability, genius, etc.
Nowadays, brilliant children of managers become volume managers

Yes, this is a colossal problem and the point is not only in the "brilliant" kids, the fact is that our point of view has prevailed that a manager is a separate profession, that a manager can just as well run a grocery store and a defense plant, a stadium and a cosmodrome, a bathhouse and a car factory.
Not every good engineer can become a good leader, but it is from engineers and designers who need to look for managers of high-tech industries.
I have no idea what else "effective" managers have to destroy, so that this truth begins to reach those who are engaged in recruiting.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Invoce

Nowadays, the brilliant children of the country's leaders, subjects, top managers finally become volume managers. All over the world, nature rests on the children of successful people, but not here.

The Boat 667 project was developed at the Rubin Central Design Bureau, the general designer of the project was the brilliant S. N. Kovalev. (As of 2019, Project 667BDRM nuclear submarines are the basis of the marine component of Russia's strategic nuclear triad). Something like that.

[Tuk77]

"... but still I wish Santa Claus the restoration of my Motherland, the most powerful Empire of all times and peoples, with a just and popular system - the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics!"
You have already decided, please, what exactly is your Homeland - the Empire of all times and peoples or the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics?
The USSR, let me remind you, lasted only 68 years.
It somehow has little to do with the phrase "of all time".

[Finches]

CCCH - was the Red Empire in the full sense of the word - but "comrades" like you, with the same casuistry, sold it for the sake of American capital - they just sold it and that's it! And the people were naive and stupid and only ... However, even now they have not grown much wiser! Ukraine, as an example of permanent modern folk stupidity!

[Finches]

SSSN Have less to drink!

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: Finches

СССН It is necessary to drink less!

We will write off all the problems for the New Year, as well as this boat.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Tuk77

You have already decided, please, what exactly is your Homeland - the Empire of all times and peoples or the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics?

I do not know how for you, but for me the Russian people, the Russian Empire, the Soviet Union, and Russia are my homeland and the homeland of all Russian people. But if for some this is not so, then you have a different homeland.

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

that before 1991 in the USSR from 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were surrendered per year.

what for? Did it save the USSR from death? Or vice versa exacerbated?

Quote: Finches

But the top managers are chic ...

go to any supermarket, remember the Soviet shops - maybe that will come ...

Quote: Finches

with a fair and popular system

Yes, there was no justice, no nationality ...
as soon as the people got the right to choose, the USSR collapsed ...

Quote: Finches

manually laid pipes to Germany

and what is the difference? and then they drove the gas over the hill and now? but then 40% was gasification in Russia, and now 66% ...

[sergo1914]

Quote: ser56

but then 40% was gasification in Russia, and now 66% ...

Funny numbers. Only here is the hitch. In the denominator is the total number of settlements in the country. You look at the absolute figure. Hair stand on end. Extinct cities, towns, villages how to count?

[ser56]

Quote: sergo1914

Extinct cities, towns, villages how to count?

I am always amused by the self-proporka from lovers of socialism ...
the impression that they 2 + 2 can not add up ....
I'll chew - under what system was the concept of "not a promising village" introduced in Russia? Forgotten already?

[sergo1914]

Quote: ser56

I am always amused by the self-proporka from lovers of socialism ...

But the amusement of the lovers of capitalism amuses me. How does it feel to compare 400/1000 and 66/100?

[ser56]

Quote: sergo1914

And the amusement of the lovers of capitalism amuses me

those. how many Soviet villages destroyed the Soviet power you forgot already?

Quote: sergo1914

How does it feel to compare 400/1000 and 66/100?

to school - to understand what% ...

[sergo1914]

Quote: ser56

Quote: sergo1914

And the amusement of the lovers of capitalism amuses me

those. how many Soviet villages destroyed the Soviet power you forgot already?

Quote: sergo1914

How does it feel to compare 400/1000 and 66/100?

to school - to understand what% ...

In kindergarten to understand that 400 is more than 66.

[ser56]

Quote: sergo1914

In kindergarten to understand that 400 is more than 66.

Hmm, you did not learn the 2nd class, how and why they use% ...

[Jager]

"people got the right to choose" - the right to choose from 20 types of toilet fresheners? Then at least the general secretaries changed. Everyone laughed at Brezhnev. The current one "sat out" for a long time. By the holiday I could hardly find normal chocolate, everywhere the same plasticine is on sale.
He gasped about gasification - how much gasoline cost then and how much now.

[ser56]

Quote: Jager

the right to choose from 20 types of toilet fresheners?

And what's wrong with that? Are you a fan of using newspapers instead of toilet paper?

Quote: Jager

Then at least the general secretaries changed.

you might think we chose them ....

Quote: Jager

By the holiday, I barely found normal chocolate, everywhere the same plasticine was on sale.

Already forgot stores in the 80s?

Quote: Jager

He gasped about gasification - how much gasoline cost then and how much now.

1) in principle - and in Kiev a dyatka ...
2) Gasoline 92 cost 20 kopecks, only cars were not sold freely I'm not talking about their quality and the ability to buy spare parts ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

go to any supermarket, remember the Soviet shops - maybe that will come ...

Start a cat, feed it with meat and milk at home, and then something can come to you, too, with what is sold in the store.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

Start a cat, feed it with meat and milk at home, and then something can come to you, too, with what is sold in the store.

I'm afraid it will never reach you that you need to buy by looking at the label ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

I'm afraid it will never reach you that you need to buy by looking at the label ...

So the analogy with the fence suggests itself. Please tell me why apples from the garden darken almost immediately, after you cut a piece, and at least henna from a store? What kind of mutants are these? They do not rot, do not deteriorate, they do not smell almost anything ... I think that they cannot make wine out of them either.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

Please tell me why apples from the garden are getting dark

commonplace chemistry - iron oxidation

Quote: Mordvin 3

and store - even if henna?

I don’t know where you buy - I’m buying normal ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

I think that wine cannot be made from them either

but why make wine from apples - do you not like grape wines?

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

I'm buying normal ...

I don’t come across normal ones in stores. Pyaterochka, Carousel ... Foreign agents, in short.

Quote: ser56

but why make wine from apples - do you not like grape wines?

And I can love Calvados. And in general, why buy wine, if you can make it yourself? And with grapes we somehow do not really.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

Pyaterochka, Carousel ...

I sympathize...

Quote: Mordvin 3

And I can love Calvados.

a decent drink ... but it is made from alcohol - after distillation ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

And in general, why buy wine, if you can make it yourself

to find out different varieties ... and no time, only enough for tinctures ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

And with grapes we somehow do not really.

I recommend Taman wines - not expensive and quite high quality ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

but they make it from alcohol - after distillation ...

What other alcohol? We take apple wine, and we drive through the unit moonshine.

Quote: ser56

I sympathize...

About supermarkets you started your first speech.

Quote: ser56

Gasoline 92 cost 20 kopecks, only cars were not sold freely

A motorcycle would be bought. They stood freely. Well, if you like the market economy so much, then who was stopping you from buying an overpaid car? Black Volga. Inexpensive, just twenty-five ...

Quote: ser56

I'm not talking about their quality and the ability to buy spare parts ...

Normal quality. And about the spare parts. Um ... Somehow my uncle went for mushrooms. We saw the skeleton of Zhigulenko in the forest, cut down the roof with axes, and this is the spare part. Then they put it to one ensign for three hundred and fifty rubles.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

What other alcohol? We take apple wine, and we drive through the unit moonshine.

and alcohol is obtained ... it is not a product of fermentation ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

A motorcycle would be bought.

I asked you for advice what to buy?

Quote: Mordvin 3

then who was stopping you from buying an overpaid car?

what for? I could already buy it, one at a time, but I did NOT want to, because of the soviet car service, or rather its lack of it ... it was easier by taxi ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

Normal quality

you have a strange understanding of normality ....

Quote: Mordvin 3

aka my uncle

this is your family ... thanks for the frankness ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

I did NOT want to - because of the soviet car service - or rather, its lack ...

You drive.

Quote: ser56

Thank you for your frankness...

Not at all ... Hereditary car mechanic ...

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

You drive.

you got from the gopota?

Quote: Mordvin 3

Hereditary car mechanic.

that's why you love the scoop ... I prefer to give the car to an authorized salon, and not run around the garages in search of a "specialist" who is not responsible for anything ...

[sergo1914]

Quote: ser56

I don’t know where you buy - I’m buying normal ...

That's honest. Noticeably.

[ser56]

Quote: sergo1914

That's honest. Noticeably.

happy for you!

[Finches]

To make a person happy it’s not necessary to have 100 types of sausages on the shelves, most of which are made of their threshing floor, 2 quality sausages are enough and the USSR doesn’t fall apart, but the top sells it - it just sold to please the USA and that’s it! Then, his Deng Xiaoping was not found in the USSR, as in China - who rolled pro-American bedding on the asphalt and saved the country from puppet fate!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

would a person be happy

it is necessary that he had the right to choose, and not live according to orders ... however, this is an internal requirement of a free person ...

Quote: Finches

not the USSR fell apart, but the top sold it

1) if it’s not a secret - and then the top then who pushed up?
2) Alas, fools in Russia do not need to be grown - they bloom themselves in full bloom ...

Quote: Finches

e was then in the USSR his Deng Xiaoping,

Forgot - no one will give us deliverance, neither God, nor the king and not a hero ...
and all the heroes need you ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Finches

Then, his Deng Xiaoping was not found in the USSR, as in China - who rolled pro-American bedding on the asphalt and saved the country from puppet fate!

The smartest words I hear in the last 28 years!

[dirk182]

so they now have only one argument: "cars are in the yards, store shelves are packed," and so on. It's difficult with such.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: ser56

go to any supermarket, remember the Soviet shops - maybe that will come.

I don't know where and when you were born, but my question is "Why do you hate your Motherland so much?" Homeland is a mother, whatever it is, but it is my MOTHER.

[ser56]

Quote: tihonmarine

I do not know where and when you were born

in the RSFSR, in Siberia, for a long time ...

Quote: tihonmarine

but my question is "Why do you hate your homeland so much?"

the question is stupid and gives an inferiority complex to the asker ...

Quote: tihonmarine

Homeland is a mother, no matter what she is, but this is my MOTHER.

1) The homeland must be done better, and not justify the crooks and criminals who raped it ...
2) I understand that you are closer to the literary hero of Sholokhov - Davydov ... if you remember who his mother was ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: ser56

in the RSFSR, in Siberia, for a long time ...

And I am in Haranor, and also for a long time, for a long time and now I live in Estonia, but I only love my Motherland, as my mother.

[ser56]

Quote: tihonmarine

I willow in Estonia, but only I love my Motherland as my mother.

eh, patriots from behind a hill, divorced ... but I live in Russia ...

[Essex62]

Ser56

What sources have you learned from this? Chubaisik or Mlechin told you the truth about the USSR? We lived in this just and popular state and it was so. Did the people get the opportunity to choose? Ha, the people, relaxed, looked from the outside as traitors in the highest posts, having previously cleaned up the real bearers of ideas in the leadership, up to physical destruction, they were restoring anti-people’s, inhuman capitalism. The orderly order provoked a commodity shortage, although the entire planned industry continued to work like clockwork and there were plenty of goods and products in abundance. It was possible to use bins in the region, for some positions, but these nits arranged the card system pushing Moscow, which was used to abundance, to rebellion. Wagons stood in sedimentation tanks and were not unloaded, under the direct prohibition of a gang of labeled ones. And to reach these repainted, with a party card in his pocket, there was not any opportunity. They purposefully brought down Soviet power. But the people are no longer used to fighting, many were deceived, believing that all the achievements of socialism would continue and attractive foreign clothes would appear. As a result, we got a jungle society where thieves, bandiukas and scammers are covered in chocolate.
What is gasification 66%? Nonsense, more than 50% of villages and towns just disappeared, mortality increased at times. Maybe this figure is for what remains? Gas export to the USSR was not the main budget item.

[ser56]

Quote: Essex62

You got it from what sources

poking is not polite ....

Quote: Essex62

We lived in this just and popular state, and so it was.

1) in your wet dreams?
2) I lived in the USSR - I did not see anything particularly fair ... but rations and specials. I saw distributors for the nomenclature ... like the Birch shops ... like the coupons for sausage and butter I got ...

Quote: Essex62

And the people lost the habit of wrestling

maybe weaned repression? Remember how the Soviet army shot workers back in 1962 in Novocherkassk?

Quote: Essex62

The USSR was not the main budget item.

vodka was ...

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

like the shops Birch ...

Heh, are you from Moscow, or Peter, and still complaining?

Quote: ser56

Quote: Jager
By the holiday, I barely found normal chocolate, everywhere the same plasticine was on sale.

Already forgot stores in the 80s?

I remember very well how I went to a dairy store in Moscow in 89, and there was nothing on the shelves except for "Alenka" and "Babaevsky". All counters were filled with chocolate, but there was no milk.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

Heh, are you from Moscow, or Peter, and still complaining?

I am from Yekaterinburg ... I will tell you a soviet secret - and we had such a store ...

Quote: Mordvin 3

but there was no milk.

would you drink it with chocolate, or would the price bite?

[Mordvin 3]

Quote: ser56

would you drink it with chocolate, or would the price bite?

My grandfather kept goats. So I didn’t recognize store milk.

[ser56]

Quote: Mordvin 3

when I went to the dairy store in Moscow in the 89th year,

Quote: Mordvin 3

I didn’t recognize that the store milk.

you are difficult to understand ....

[Aviator_]

Under Joseph there were no executions, this was tried by the Trotskyist Khrushch Kukuruzny.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

there were no executions

have you drunk? it happens...

[Aviator_]

Well, come on, tell me when and where the army was used to suppress popular unrest under Joseph Stalin. And whether there were such unrest.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

Well come on tell me

if it's not a secret - why are you poking your interlocutor? internal rudeness or are you such a "democrat"?

Quote: Aviator_

when and where was the army used to suppress popular unrest under Joseph Stalin.

what year are you? Watching collectivization "In March 1930 alone, the OGPU counted 6.500 mass demonstrations, of which 800 were suppressed with the use of weapons. [62] In total, during 1930, about 2,5 million peasants took part in 14 uprisings against the Soviet policy of collectivization [ 000]. "
I recommend to see the sharp increase in the number of executed (3-4 times) in these years ...

Quote: Aviator_

And whether there were such unrest.

despite the terror - were! Life in the "Soviet paradise" brought people ...

[Aviator_]

Well, just a little more. About "you" This is an answer. You shouldn't have answered my first post like that. Secondly. Do not confuse mass demonstrations and the shooting of protesters with the help of the Armed Forces (Novocherkassk 1962). So that's enough for you today.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

About "you" This is an answer.

It is by no means your gut of the cave Russophobe ...

Quote: Aviator_

Do not confuse the mass protests and the shooting of protesters with the help of B

Have you forgotten how to read?

Quote: ser56

of which 800 were suppressed using weapons

Quote: Aviator_

So you have enough for bread for today.

everyone judges by himself, it seems you do not understand it ...

[Essex62]

Ser56
I do not remember born only. Maybe workers, maybe some other figures. Now it’s not easy to get to the truth. Bourgeois hacks already poured a lot of slop on the Soviet regime. Such a fact, they interpret it in a favorable light, of course.
A society with an equal start in life and equal social guarantees, what could be fairer? Now he was born on a sack by a dad stolen or, worse than that, on blood, looted money and is already higher than others. A working man in the USSR saw any bosses .... Because you can’t send the machine further and you won’t take away the guarantees secured by the Soviet government, they won’t allow it. Without a membership card and special rations you will remain. What a crime, however, in your mind. Funny, special soldering. Was there grub from Mars? Are you a Muscovite? Why are you lying about coupons? There was sausage in all the stores until the labeled one did sabotage.

[ser56]

Quote: Essex62

I do not remember born only.

They didn’t live in the USSR, and therefore love ...

Quote: Essex62

society with an equal start in life and equal social guarantees, what could be fairer?

1) the enemies ... it wasn’t ... recall how old Vasya Stalin became a general?
2) Recall that in the USSR the collective farmers did not have a passport and could not leave the village without the permission of the collective farm chairman - see chairman / c / f serfdom...
further to teach you laziness ...

[Aviator_]

In the USSR, the collective farmer needed the passport just as the residents of the Russian Federation needed a passport.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

In the USSR, the collective farmer needed the passport just as the residents of the Russian Federation needed a passport.

1) For your information - a passport is freedom of movement ... oh, yes - to you, Russophobe, to give Russians rights is a bad manners ...
2) Millions of people go abroad to Russia ...

[Aviator_]

Get, troll, a few more cents. Collective farmers didn’t travel to the city, moving tens of millions. Freedom of movement is the availability of the means that this movement provides.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

Get, troll, a few more cents.

Hmm, fools in Russia have always had enough ...

Quote: Aviator_

Collective farmers didn’t travel to the city, moving tens of millions.

if not a secret - how did they register without a passport?

Quote: Aviator_

Freedom of movement is the availability of the means that this movement provides.

Those. for you freedom depends on the availability of cars or trains in the property? Hmm, wait for the intelligence of the Russophobe ...

[Sevastiec]

As you recall, until 1991, 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were handed over in the USSR per year ... and now one boat is a public holiday and you understand that Russia is a dwarf state compared to the Union!

And it was necessary: ​​5 boats a year? What is the evaluation criterion? Are you unaware that times have changed? Have political, military and military-political tasks changed? Has technology changed in the end? 50 years ago, a decade passed on a generational change. Now, at the same time, it is leaving for a tiny innovation.

[Finches]

I expressed my desire! You express yours - I want to lie under the USA, for example - now it is fashionable and even economically profitable!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

You express yours - I want to lie under the USA, for example -

Do you have any internal problems, but do you sew them for others? By the way, have you been to the USA yourself?

Quote: Finches

I expressed my desire!

funny desires you have ... throwing out 2 yards of bucks annually on a nuclear submarine ... are you ready to finance from your pocket? This is when you cut your pension in half?

[Finches]

I am against capitalism in general! I am for the return of the Red Socialist Empire. USA - I hate every fiber of my soul! In the case of the Socialist Revolution, which today is unfortunately not possible due to the stupidity and weakness of the people, I will support it and stand up as a career officer in the Red Army, in order to destroy those who stand in the White, despite their relatives ties and other decadent tricks. For want of a better one, I support Putin, although he is a liberal, but with the beginnings of a statesman - after him there will be a complete drain of Russia for the sake of Western capital ... Therefore, either the people will change their minds or stand up for puppets in the USA!
This, to simplify the form, is approximately my civic position!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

I am against capitalism in general! I am for the return of the Red Socialist Empire. USA - I hate every fiber of my soul!

it's to the doctor ...

Quote: Finches

as a career officer in the Red Army, which would destroy those

I have no doubt, the Red Army shed rivers of Russian blood, both in the GV and later - in collectivization ....
and her "officers" were Mishka Yaponchik (regiment commander), Kotovsky (brigade commander), Batka Makhno (division commander) - well-known godfathers - criminals

[Finches]

Well, of course, you don’t have to juggle otherwise you will have to remind you that the Red Terror was an answer to the White Terror, and there were enough heroes of no less colorful named by you from the white side, if not more! And the officers of the Red Army were Brusilov, Bonch-Bruevich and many other staff officers of the Imperial Army! Kerensky, by the way, was not released from prisons by the bourgeois-liberal children of Kerensky ... As for the hatred of the United States, it has a normal and adequate explanation ranging from the general inhuman destruction of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, the bombing of Dresden, to the planting of his own around the world. views, as the only correct ones ... But since you are apparently their ideological puppet, all the arguments are useless! You like capitalism - your right! Perhaps you are an ordinary huckster or an exploiter, then this is natural, I do not like it - because I consider this system to be unjust and anti-people! And, unlike young people, I have something to compare!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

Remind you that red terror was a response to white terror

lies ... white terror never had a means - just excesses ... and red it was a STRATEGY for suppressing the Russian people! Let me remind you that the Reds took and shot hostages (see Quiet Flows the Don, for example)! Or Sverdlov gave the directive on the execution of% of the Cossacks ...

Quote: Finches

And the officers of the Red Army were Brusilov, Bonch-Bruevich and many other personnel officers of the Imperial Army!

how illiterate you are in the history of Russia ... there were no officers in the Red Army in those years ...
Brusilov entered during the aggression of Poland ....

Quote: Finches

By the way, it was not the Reds, but the bourgeois-liberal children of Kerensky who were released from prisons

and appointed criminals Kotovsky or Makhno commanders of brigades or divisions?

Quote: Finches

the general inhuman destruction of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, the bombing of Dresden

1) what about the Japanese massacre in Nanjing? Prisoner of war eating liver? On business, they got ...
2) Ba, another sufferer for the Germans ... for the cause they got Dresden - for the destruction of the population during the bombing of Stalingrad! Or do not you remember the number of victims in it, the Nazi henchman?

Quote: Finches

But since you are apparently their ideological puppet, all the arguments are useless!

funny to argue with the Nazi henchman ....

Quote: Finches

And, unlike young people, I have something to compare!

it means they lived a little in the USSR ...

[Finches]

You still give me a link to the works of "outstanding historians of our time" Svanidze, Rezun, Roy Medvedev and others throw me so that I would be enlightened
Good luck in your difficult liberalistic desecration of our history! I hope your comrades from the camp of national traitors will not forget your attempts and enter into some grand fund of Soros

Happy New Year! Thanks for the dialogue - I learned a lot of new and informative!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

You still give me a link to the works of "outstanding historians of our time" Svanidze, Rezun, Roy Medvedev and others throw me so that I would be enlightened

1) I understand that you are not ready to accept the truth about the "commanders" of the Red Army? Or are you ready to challenge positions in the Red Army or the criminal history of Kotovsky, Makhno or Mishka Yaponchik?
2) But I still haven’t told you about Dybenko - this is already an integral commander ....

Quote: Finches

to desecrate our history!

Truth cannot defile history ... want to hear a lie - your right ...

Quote: Finches

Your efforts and will be added to some grand fund of Soros

I receive grants only from the Russian Federation
But I understood the essence of your message - anyone who tells the truth about the history of Russia is an enemy ...
sorry for you ... like you and wrote denunciations in the 30s, hesitated with the line of the Party ...

Quote: Finches

Happy New Year! hi

Mutually!

Quote: Finches

Thanks for the dialogue - I learned a lot of new and informative!

Alas, I heard only agitation from you ...

[Finches]

Do you think that you set out exclusively historical facts? You are also a deeply self-confident person! You remind me in your judgments of the doctor of sciences Boris Chubais - the same prominent historian - he seriously says that there was no blockade of Leningrad! This is supposedly communist propaganda - as you put it - information from the agitation!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

Did you set out exclusively historical facts?

I am waiting for a refutation of the facts voiced by me ... weakly?

Quote: Finches

You remind me of your judgment

this is your problem, no more .... this is when the ostrich's head is in the sand - and you are hiding from the facts with various references ... I can advise you not to read nonsense ...

Quote: Finches

and deeply self-confident man!

you are so curious, my person, yours does not interest me ... I am discussing, no more ...

[evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru]

Why are you rude to people, Sergei? Why go "on the individual" ("see a doctor" and so on ...)? They are trying to talk to you politely ... Although this is difficult. And the people clearly react with "minuses" to your anti-Sovietism. What's wrong?
On the merits of the question. We still live "eating up" the reserves of the USSR. And "Su" and "MiG" - Soviet fighters of the Soviet design bureaus, Su-24 and Su-25, operating in Syria - Soviet fighter-bombers. The basis of ADD - Tu-95 and Tu-160 - Soviet bombers. The famous "Backfire" Tu-22 M3 is a Soviet bomber. The basis of anti-submarine aviation of the Republic of Kazakhstan ("Capitalist Russia") is made up of machines based on the Il-18, a Soviet aircraft of the Stalin era. IL-76 (and its modifications) is a Soviet transport aircraft, which is now the basis of the VTA RK. The Mi-8 (Mi-17) helicopter is a Soviet helicopter that has been successfully sold in the United States this century. You can go on for a long time ... Does it make sense?
We can see what the state of the Republic of Kazakhstan can do on the example of the Su-57, a fifth generation fighter. This car is about 5 years old. And everyone calls it "the latest Russian fighter". Until now, they can not start the series. During the year, they could not, through the efforts of the "entire aviation industry" of the Republic of Kazakhstan, produce TWO (!) Machines. In the United States and China - two serial fifth-generation aircraft. The number of cars produced is in the hundreds.
What can the state of the Republic of Kazakhstan in the field of civil aviation see on the example of the "Super-duper-jet". It took about 15 years for this ... car and hundreds of millions (ours too) rubles. Russian passengers are afraid to fly this, foreign customers who have already purchased this politely return it back. Aviation is an excellent "litmus test" of the viability of this or that state.
Not only is the Republic of Kazakhstan, let's say delicately, not a "hand" state, but it is also a weak state. And this is already very bad. Serious "monsters" around! They are, forgive me, how dogs feel with l and n y. And now, from some capital, the idea of ​​JOINT responsibility for the safety of pipelines "along the entire length" is heard.
Here's a "100 varieties of smoked sausage." And "Soyuz" and "RK" should be understood and accepted not only through numbers. More importantly - through the soul

[D-ug]

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

RK ("Capitalist Russia")

Capitalist Russia, this is still a very distant future. Russia still needs to grow up to bourgeois society (capitalism).

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

We still live "eating up" the reserves of the USSR.

These "backlogs" are nothing more than a myth. There was no "Soviet groundwork" at all.
There was a pipe. Even two oil and gas.
There are metals in bullion now, it wasn’t before. All metal went to stupid "Soviet products."
The forest in the logs was and is.
Everything, there was nothing else. And no.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

And "Su" and "MiG" - Soviet fighters of the Soviet design bureaus, Su-24 and Su-25, operating in Syria - Soviet fighter-bombers

These are not fighters, this is a flying UG.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

The basis of the ADD - Tu-95 and Tu-160 - Soviet bombers.

And this is generally nonsense. That one, that the other. I don’t think anyone can explain why they are needed at all. And what combat tasks can be completed with their help.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

We can see what the state of the Republic of Kazakhstan can do on the example of the Su-57, a fifth generation fighter. This car is about 5 years old. And everyone calls it "the latest Russian fighter".

The USSR built its military products, depriving the poor population of virtually everyone.
Russia allocates more money specifically for the welfare of the population, and military products come later.
Why the population of the Su-57? It wanted to sneeze at him. Better a higher salary, but better medicine. And the Russian authorities are listening to this opinion. Unlike the authorities of the USSR.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

In the USA and China - TWO serial fifth-generation aircraft. Account issued cars - hundreds of pieces.

The United States is 99,3 times richer than the Russian Federation. China is richer than the Russian Federation by 24,6 times. No need to nod in their direction. Nod better towards India. It is richer than the Russian Federation 2,9 times. Or towards Brazil. It is richer than the Russian Federation 2,2 times. Or Sweden, which is 1,5 times richer than the Russian Federation. Do they have how many 5th generation fighter jets produced?

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

on the example of "Super-duper-jet". It took about 15 years for this ... car and hundreds of millions (ours too) rubles.

Russia is learning how to make normal civilian aircraft. Not miserable Tu-154 type airplanes (or even Tu-334), but normal airplanes.
Yes, there are few normal components for them in Russia. Therefore, you have to buy them abroad.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

Russian passengers are afraid to fly

It’s not necessary to invent nonsense. Nothing SSJ100 for passengers no worse than other normal aircraft. And the fact that normal pilots often work where they pay more, nothing can be done about it.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

foreign customers who have already purchased this politely return politely.

No service. Service is generally a weak point of the entire former Soviet.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

Not only is the Republic of Kazakhstan, let's say delicately, not a "hand" state, but it is also a weak state.

Where have you seen a poor but strong state? Or did you actually believe (and believe) that the USSR was a "mighty power"?
If so, it’s funny. Afghanistan could not be taken.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

And now, from some capital, the idea of ​​JOINT responsibility for the safety of pipelines "along the entire length" is heard.

You watch less TV. You’ll be calmer.

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

And "Soyuz" and "RK" should be understood and accepted not only through numbers. More importantly - through the soul

And you can also explore the soul through the anus.
You don’t really have to invent a bicycle. Everything has long been clear and painted BEFORE YOU.
The achievements of the German guest workers of the 40-50s by the 80s of the last century turned into scrap. Scrap they now. Since then, there have not been and will not be any new developments.
It was not in the USSR because slave labor was unproductive. And the illiterate population with crusts was not capable of anything sensible.
And in the Russian Federation it will not be because those who are capable of it work in other places and for other money.
Those. the advanced technologies that the USSR procured in the Reich, the Russian Federation were simply ANYWHERE to get. And nobody will invest them in the Russian Federation, because This is not China.
You just need to realize your PRESENT place of the Russian Federation in this world. And stretch legs on clothes. And do not make yourself Danish princes, having a pair of torn pants on your ass.

[ser56]

Quote: D-ug

You just need to realize your PRESENT place of the Russian Federation in this world.

of course ... just for an example - but can the USA enrich uranium? Or build 3+ generation blocks?
so our place is not quite what you understand ...

Quote: D-ug

Afghanistan could not be taken.

and the USA could?

Quote: D-ug

The United States is 99,3 times richer than the Russian Federation. China is richer than Russia by 24,6 times

1) bullies ... yes, when counting simply by bucks, it’s not so, and considering PPP it’s not so at all ...
2) Sorry. what do you perceive criticism of the USSR as a way to humiliate Russia ...

[D-ug]

Quote: ser56

so that our place is not quite what you understand ...

Just do not hesitate.
Success and development is determined not by blocks, but by other indicators.

Quote: ser56

and the USA could?

And where does the United States? It was about the USSR.

Quote: ser56

and considering PPP this is not so at all ..

Dear, if you do not understand the economy, then you do not need to write on this topic. Go to my profile and read a short educational program, what is GDP, PPP GDP and why these SMALL economic indicators stick out so much and flock with a shaggy people.

Quote: ser56

Sorry. what do you perceive criticism of the USSR as a way to humiliate Russia ...

I generally do not draw parallels between the USSR and the Russian Federation. The USSR was one thing, the Russian Federation was absolutely different. And nonsense about "legal admission" is just nonsense.
By the way, the Russian Federation is a MORE RICH country, in comparison with the USSR. And the population of the Russian Federation (Russians) is much richer than the poor fellow citizens.

[ser56]

Quote: D-ug

Just do not hesitate.

I don’t see any reason to refute you - you don’t hear arguments ...

Quote: D-ug

And where does the United States? It was about the USSR.

everything is relative...

Quote: D-ug

Come to my profile and read a brief educational program,

I don’t see the point - from what you write here your poor level is visible ...
for example, GDP at the face value of the United States in 2018 is 20,58 trillion. bucks, RF - 1,66 ...
ratio - 12,4 times, let me remind you that you wrote above "the USA is 99,3 times richer than the Russian Federation"
pin 2:
a) You are not good at arithmetic
b) You are a paid propagandist, and stupid ...
Choose ...

Quote: D-ug

PPP GDP and why these SMALL economic indicators

there is such an index - Big Mac - I highly recommend it! and so - the fare in Yekaterinburg costs 28 rubles, in Oslo - 45 kroons (roughly 4,5 euros) ... If you did not understand my example, your problem ...

Quote: D-ug

And nonsense about "legal admission" is just nonsense.

this is a legal term ...

Quote: D-ug

And the population of the Russian Federation (Russians) is much richer than the poor fellow citizens.

but I agree with that

[ser56]

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

And the people clearly react with "minuses" to your anti-Sovietism.

but you never know fools in Russia ....

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

We still live "eating up" the reserves of the USSR.

and the USSR was eating up the backlogs of RI ...

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

This car is about 10 years old. And everyone calls it "the latest Russian fighter

read at your leisure how many years the Americans brought their F-22 or F-35 and what they got ...

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

we see on the example of the "Super-duper-jet"

Did you fly? I - yes ... a normal plane ...

Quote: evgeniy.plotnikov.2019mail.ru

More important - through the soul

if not a secret - what did your soul do for Russia? As for me, in the days of the USSR, I also made products, and now my development has been accepted for supply to the RF Ministry of Defense ...

[Finches]

Namesake (Eugene Plotnikov) Unfortunately, Sergei will not understand - he has already been reprogrammed!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

Unfortunately, Sergei will not understand - he has already been reprogrammed!

it's you zombies! I am waiting for an answer to at least one of my arguments, and not epithets ...

[Finches]

I’m saying that you have a huge conceit - where did you see the arguments? As an example, I tell you that in historical science it is customary to believe that the White Terror first began with specific dates and acts - the assassination of the German Ambassador Mirbach and the assassination of Fanny Kaplan against Lenin, behind which stood the Socialist Revolutionary underground, which entered into confrontation with the liberal-bourgeois parties! And you write me some kind of nonsense!

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

I tell you that in historical science it is customary to consider

this is not historical science - this is propaganda ...

Quote: Finches

first the white terror began with

Do you actually know who the whites are?

Quote: Finches

the assassination of the German ambassador Mirbach

it was conducted by an employee of the Cheka - this is a showdown between revolutionaries for power

Quote: Finches

the assassination of Fanny Kaplan on Lenin

see above - the same ... let's put it this way - you live in a world of illusions, where the left Social Revolutionary and Cheka employee Blumkin became a conductor of white terror! What a nonsense!

Quote: Finches

there was a Socialist Revolutionary underground

so the Left Socialist Revolutionaries were part of the government of the RSFSR ...

Quote: Finches

And you write me some kind of nonsense!

you re-read yourself - write nonsense with a smart look ....
Try to understand - the Bolsheviks started the terror by seizing power, and continued to shoot the workers ’demonstration in St. Petersburg after the dispersal of the Constituent Assembly ... Eka brainwashed you ...

[Aviator_]

Do not feed the troll ser56, it is more than already revealed here.

[Finches]

Honestly funny animal! I check my memory on it

[Aviator_]

Well, if only so ... And clearly on a training manual spares.

[ser56]

Quote: Aviator_

And clearly on a training manual spares.

where did you read it? do not bring a reference? or in the bushes?

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

Honestly funny animal! I check my memory on it

you are a faithful Leninist - for you people are animals or insects ...
but in fact you are illiterate and zombie! see above!

[Finches]

Do not worry - you are not alone ... And in Russia such as you have been missing for centuries!

Vain work - no, you will not understand them, -
The more liberal, the more vulgar,
Civilization is a fetish for them,
But their idea is not available to them.
As you bow down before her, gentlemen,
You do not get recognition from Europe:
In her eyes, you will always
They are not servants of enlightenment, but servants.

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

Do not worry - you are not alone

I know, and I also know something else - when agitation and poetry come in response to arguments - this does not mean the ability to prove one’s point of view!
However, what to expect from a "connoisseur of history" if he has a white terror carried out by a Socialist-Revolutionary and an employee of the Cheka!

[Finches]

The White Terror began with this and yes, they were employees of the Cheka - I wrote somewhere that this is not so? And you didn’t notice that you are not very supported on the site - apparently, all narrow-minded and poorly educated here and just can’t understand your noble impulse to drag us, silver-winged, into an enlightened society ... Have you ever thought about it? Why do so many disagree with you, and in general there is no support. Maybe all the same you have a problem with the knowledge of Russian history?

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

The White Terror began with this and yes, they were employees of the Cheka

do you read yourself? Alas, you don’t realize the level of nonsense that you write ...
after that you still dare write something like:

Quote: Finches

Maybe all the same you have a problem with the knowledge of Russian history?

1) you are not just a layman in Russian history, but also a militant ...
2) Your "white terror" is a showdown of revolutionaries for power - and they killed the elite of Russia - scientists, industrialists, officials, engineers, etc.

Quote: Finches

And you did not notice that you are not very supported on the site -

to me the opinion of the illiterate is deeply purple

Quote: Finches

Why do so many disagree with you, and in general there is no support

people are lazy and have neither knowledge nor desire to have them ... alas ...

[Finches]

And how do you prove this nonsense?

[ser56]

Quote: Finches

And how do you prove this nonsense?

yes you yourself in this phrase proved my thesis -

Quote: ser56

people are lazy and have neither knowledge nor desire to have them ... alas ..

but for the sake of the Nativity of Christ, I will show mercy and personally chew you the level of your knowledge on the subject under discussion:

Quote: Finches

The White Terror began with this and yes, they were employees of the Cheka -

1) the Left Socialist Revolutionaries entered the Soviet Government in the summer of 1918, therefore it is impossible to attribute them to the Whites from the word at all ...
2) In the SNK decree on Red Terror, it is said about the shooting of the White Guards - see paragraph 1 - did the Left Socialist Revolutionaries become White Guards? Or is it a reason to destroy the Russian elite? I note that in RI there was a terror of the Social Revolutionaries against the authorities, but they never shot the innocent! And even more so, members of the revolutionary parties on the list .... Maybe in vain ... so for reference: "In 1907, every day, on average, up to 18 people died. According to the police, only from February 1905 to May 1906 were killed: governors-general, governors and mayors - 8, vice-governors and provincial councilors boards - 5, police chiefs, district chiefs and police officers - 21, gendarme officers - 8, generals (combatant) - 4, officers (combatant) - 7, bailiffs and their assistants - 79, district warders - 125, police officers - 346, police officers - 57, guards - 257, gendarmerie lower ranks - 55, security agents - 18, civilian ranks - 85, clergy - 12, rural authorities - 52, landowners - 51, factory owners and senior factory workers - 54, bankers and large traders - 29. "
3) So that they understood the execution were subject to "14. All members of the former patriotic and Black Hundred organizations." If it's not a secret - are you a patriot of Russia?
4) "At the end of 1919, a special commission created by General Denikin, determined the number of deaths from the terror carried out by the Soviet government only in the period 1918-1919. 1 766 188 people, including 260 soldiers and 000 officers, about 54 priests, 650 peasants, 193 thousand workers, 59 thousand policemen, 13 thousand landowners and more than 370 thousand representatives of the intelligentsia and the bourgeoisie "curious figures? How did the Bolsheviks care about the people ...
5) "The large number of victims of the Red Terror, the lack of justification and legality in the actions of the Cheka F. E. Dzerzhinsky could not but cause resistance from a number of party leaders in the Bolshevik camp, as evidenced by some polemics in October - December 1918. In particular On October 25, the Central Committee began to discuss the new regulations on the Cheka, a number of party members condemned the "sovereignty of an organization that places itself not only above the Soviets, but also above the party itself," Bukharin, Olminsky and the People's Commissar of Internal Affairs G. I. Petrovsky demanded that measures be taken by restriction "the arbitrariness of the organization, stuffed with criminals, sadists and decayed elements of the lumpen proletariat", LB Kamenev, appointed chairman of the political control commission, proposed to abolish the Cheka." V. I. Lenin declared about the resolute defense of the Cheka, "who, for some of their actions, were subjected to unfair accusations by the limited intelligentsia ... terror in a broader perspective ”[110]
Finally, the already indecisive criticism of the actions of the Cheka was banned by the decree of the Central Committee of the RCP (b) of December 19, 1918, at the suggestion of V.I. Lenin. Yes, yes, the very "grandfather Lenin" who called for shooting people like insects ... find something similar in Denikin, Kolchak or Wrangel ...

You can continue to write ... but it is enough for those who want to understand, who do not want to - it is useless to explain something ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: ser56

By the way, have you been to the USA yourself?

Excuse me, do you live in the USA now?

[ser56]

Quote: tihonmarine

Excuse me, do you live in the USA now?

why - in Russia, in the Urals ... But I’ve been to the USA, so I know a little how people live there ... but you are unlikely ...

[Sevastiec]

YOU, can lie under anyone. And do not stoop to delirium and insults. Better answer: why do you need to have fifty thousand atomic warheads, if two are enough?
I am the last one to say that the scoop was torn over due to an arms race. Its collapse has completely different reasons. Nevertheless, the question of reasonable sufficiency remains. Modern Russia, just the same, shows an example of how with limited resources, one can achieve much greater results than a potential adversary with an excess of resources.
It is much worse not to rent five boats a year, which did not help to save the country in any way, but to have a fat ass and brains, unable to think faster and better than the "competitor".

[Finches]

So I ask you not to offend my Motherland. The Soviet Union "shovel" is, first of all, and the fact that the arms race undermined the economy of the USSR is a delusion - economic indicators in the 80s, even experts in the United States admitted this, were fine and not about any collapse out of the question! A different card was played with the economy - as in the bourgeois revolutions in February 1917 - "Perfectly Organized Hunger". This is a topic for another discussion - then the young reformers launched a propaganda machine perfectly lubricated with American money, so that they would veil all their crimes and drive the electorate into our heads (we used to be called the people), that they all were killed by an arms race and an inefficient planned economy! Which, by the way, for some reason paid the market economy of the European Union in the first version during the Second World War, restored the country and made it a superpower in a short time! Here is such a parsley! And the USSR was respected all over the world precisely thanks to the Army, and now even Zanzibar can arrest our tourist and throw him for eating in a pit to alligators ... And at that time, even the USA asked permission in the Kremlin to detain a person with a sickle-and-hammer passport!

[Sevastiec]

I think you just need to grow up a little. Firstly, you are clearly very inattentively reading what they write to you, and secondly, you reason like a child. Maybe you should not express your opinion on state affairs? This is clearly not your level. With all due respect...

[Finches]

This is your level - it is undoubted! Do not sit in the State Duma - we have the most intelligent, highly educated government people gathering there - they judge everything and everyone, who grow up, who grow wiser and of course believe that their views on the existing reality are the ultimate truth

[dirk182]

Criterion? A couple of months ago I watched an old film, 80s. A regular boxing workout. I looked at the faces of the children. Bright, eagerly listening to the coach. And a coach proudly talking about the country. The criterion is pride in your country. The desire to develop personally !!! To correspond to it, to proudly curse: "I am a citizen of the USSR (RF)" that is the criterion.

[Sevastiec]

You can still make such a film. Now, in children, the faces in training are dark and not attentive?
Are you not proud of the country? I wonder why? A country thanks to WHOM should it become worthy of pride? Should the mythical "power" of the "Martians" do this? And every ordinary boxing coach, or for example a teacher - who are they? Do they belong to the authorities, or to the people? And you? Also a little man, on whom nothing depends, but nevertheless, really want to be proud? Well ... without getting up from the couch.

I now believe that my country in Russia has much to be proud of. And I do not divide it into different countries, but only into different historical periods, but this is one country. You divide the country in power, and I in people. I live in Russia, and was born in the USSR, and my grandfather was born in the Russian Empire and lived in the USSR; it means people are one, and the country consists of people, which means the country is one. That is my opinion.

[dirk182]

show specifically where I share power? Fair? I am not proud. Nothing. Sadness only increases every day. Because my children told me that they did not want to live in this country. That's all. Everyone has their own opinion.

[Sevastiec]

You on-the-go, did not understand anything. All polls, in our time, are eager to write their opinions on the Internet, however, they cannot even read what is written in Russian in white and understand the meaning of what is written. But at the same time, it is absolutely certain that they "know" everything about government and how it is made great. Wonders!..

[dirk182]

maybe you need to look for the reason for this, and not condemn (always to blame) ordinary people?

[Sevastiec]

Explain to me the term "common man". Who is this? This is the first thing. And secondly, in general, I am always against collective responsibility.

[sergo1914]

Quote: Finches

Until 1991, 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were decommissioned per year in the USSR

It is worth going through the historical center of Severodvinsk and everything will become clear. And look at the cemeteries. Those generations are gone. Forever gone.

[Vadim237]

Those left and new materials came the equipment of the design system and much more - and times have changed, now we don’t have an arms race, which was under the USSR.

[sergo1914]

Quote: Vadim237

Those left and new materials came the equipment of the design system and much more - and times have changed, now we don’t have an arms race, which was under the USSR.

Everything is not quite as it seems to you.

[Vadim237]

Just everything is as it is now.

[Fat]

Quote: Vadim237

Just everything is as it is now.

There is time, enjoy the moment. )))

[Vadim237]

There is no countdown — life goes on and will go on, without any fantasies.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Finches

As you recall, before 1991, 5 to 10 nuclear submarines were handed over in the USSR per year

Do not tell me how you remember ... In 1987, there was one 667 BRDM after the transfer pool and three in the boathouses at Sevmash. There was a time.

[frog]

It was. And how many of these vehicles regularly served? That is, that same KOI is memorable)))) It's not a matter of something, but the ability to use it. But with this we always have eternal questions ....

[Fat]

Lieutenant will you drink?
Oh, leave ... Why are you personally not happy with the scientific preparation of Baumanka graduates, for example. recounted a draft of the sister on the heading IR infrared homing in severe smoke. Forgive me, God 76 year of the last century. If there are everlasting questions, so only in your virtual machine. The science and specialists of our Motherland are all shy.

[frog]

Is this all for what? Have you already drunk?)) And here are Bauman’s graduates and the use of already built iron of all sorts and varieties? And with graduates, everything ..... is not obvious .... Since you can draw, write and write on paper anything. But as for the production of real products .... And, even more so, its operation ....

[Dart2027]

Quote: Finches

5 to 10 nuclear submarines were decommissioned per year

Surrendered a year and built in a year are two different things.

[Fat]

I can not agree. Do not pull the Great to the knee. We discuss everything, it will be a shame

[Aviator_]

Our Psaki (Zakharova), who hates Stalin, is only able to voice the current official information and to dance before the NATO.

[Charik]

SP2- "Santa Claus" gave the Americans for candy wrappers

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Dart2027

It's a pity, but alas, the main order (the first in the "A" series) is always not given immediately.

I am a man of the sea, and there were always problems when getting a new ship, whether it was a Soviet shipyard or the vaunted Finnish Wärtsilä, and delays, this is not a problem, it will be a problem if the ship leaves with imperfections. Then there will already be problems, for they cannot be eliminated at sea. (Of course, if you fix imperfections on the stocks for a year or two, then this is also a problem). And here there is nothing terrible and criminal. Good luck 955A "Prince Vladimir" and "three feet under the keel."

[Dart2027]

Quote: tihonmarine

I am a marine man

Similarly.

Quote: tihonmarine

there were always problems when receiving a new ship, whether it was a Soviet shipyard or the vaunted Finnish Wärtsilä, and delays, this is not a problem, the problem will be if the ship leaves with incomplete

So.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Dart2027

So.

Well, Happy New Year to you! Health, with greetings Vladimir.

[Dart2027]

Quote: tihonmarine

happy new year to you

And you.

Quote: tihonmarine

moreman

Shipbuilder.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Dart2027

Shipbuilder.

I also rank you in the Moreman, you patched me and the skin, and gave life.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

The lead ship "Borey-A", possibly even a full-fledged 4th generation. So it's no surprise that everyone gets out

[NKT]

It seems that a full 4th generation is Borey-B, isn't it? Only expensive came out painfully.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: NKT

Only expensive came out painfully.

The main product is made, it will be beautiful, and money is the third thing.

[NKT]

Borey-B canceled.

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Quote: NKT

It seems that a full 4th generation is Borey-B, isn't it?

No. On the idea of ​​†‹вЂ‹ the 4th generation was supposed to be "Borey", but in connection with the disposal of buildings and equipment, it turned out 3+. In theory, "Borey-A" is a full-fledged 4th, and "Borey-B" is its development, like Block- and at "Virginia". By the way, "Borey-A" is very inexpensive

[Aerodrome]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

The deadlines for the commissioning of the nuclear submarine "Prince Vladimir" have been postponed

just didn’t surprise at all ... everything is familiar already.

[Boa kaa]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

it is not surprising that everyone climbs out

Andrew,
Anything can and should come out when taking a new product. This is normal world practice.
Another thing disturbs me: Why, without climbing over the fence, shouting GOP !? Forever run ahead of the engine and whistle all the whistles, releasing propaganda steam PR!
Under the Union, they did everything silently, so that enemies would not engage in spitefulness. And now, only promises with their promises - hmmm ... And then, tail-tailing, they can’t even make excuses for the next postponement of the product ...
Sadly all this ...
Somehow, however.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Boa constrictor KAA

Why, without climbing over the fence, screaming GOP !? Forever run ahead of the engine and whistle all the whistles, releasing propaganda steam PR!

And we have all the time, some shouting Hurray, others Sentry!

[NEXUS]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

The lead ship "Borey-A", possibly even a full-fledged 4th generation. So it's no surprise that everyone gets out

The namesake, with the coming of you! Better let them hold and bring than then, sailors and warrant officers from improvised means invent something in order to patch up the problem.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk

So it’s not surprising that everyone gets out

If it weren’t, it would be amazing. Holiday greetings !

[75 Sergey]

Not surprising and expected.
Maybe it's better not to voice them?

[tihonmarine]

Quote: 75Sergey

Maybe it's better not to voice them?

Better YES!

[Chaldon48]

Eliminates flaws and will accept, not where to go!

[Mountain shooter]

Not critical ... We must bring it - it means we must ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Mountain Shooter

Not critical ... We must bring it - it means we must ...

If you remember, there used to be a first presentation, a second and a third. The first presentation is a premium of 100% and further downstream to all plant personnel.

[Vladislava_I]

Today I do not want to be sad, today I want to experience the most positive emotions.
In this regard, Dear men, I wish you a successful and prosperous year so that you can realize your desires and dreams of your loved ones. I wish you only happy events and happy occasions. Let success help in work, and good luck in life. Let love be an indispensable attribute in your hearts. Happy New Year!

[Finches]

Here is a clever girl! Many thanks!!! And have a great New Year !!!!

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Finches

Here is a clever girl! Many thanks!!! And a wonderful New Year!

Well, how not to support such a wish. Happy New Year to you Friends !!!

[bouncyhunter]

Thank you for your kind wishes ! But all this is possible only if there is a strong rear in the person of the Fair Sex! Therefore, I congratulate all the lovely ladies on the upcoming! Best wishes !!!

[Finches]

Hello Pasha! Happy New Year! Health and all the best!

[bouncyhunter]

Salute, Zhenya! Mutually, my friend !!!
As for the postponement of deadlines to the right: unpleasant, but not fatal.

[Vladislava_I]

Thank you very much, very nice to read

[tihonmarine]

Quote: bouncyhunter

But all this is possible only if there is a strong rear in the person of the Fair Sex!

We’ll raise glasses for them !!!

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Vladislav_I

In this regard, Dear men, I wish you a successful and prosperous year,

Thank you the same, Happy New Year, health!

[Vladislava_I]

Thank you namesake

[knn54]

The trouble is in another - the level of shipyards has been reduced to a shipyard. Boats, corvettes. Yes. The nuclear submarine "Kashalot" has been mothballed since 2003 - they cannot be repaired. 6 nuclear submarines have been decommissioned in 7 years. In 2021, the eighth will be disposed of,
Out of 13-8, no. What's next?

[Boa kaa]

Quote: knn54

shipyards reduced to shipyard

The shipbuilders do their part of the work. And they do it perfectly. But with the filling (as is customary among motorists - with minced meat) things are ... to put it mildly, not very much. Therefore, all the time and wrap up the cases to eliminate the identified shortcomings ... The level of the electronic "industry" is lost, that's the catch. Or maybe the weapon didn't work ... They don't tell us where they got the jam ...

Quote: knn54

Out of 13-8, no. What's next?

Sadly, of course. But they will, to the best of their strength and capabilities, restore the "livestock" of Leviathans ... But where to go - otherwise it is impossible: the Herods will peck fouled damned!
AHA ...

[Aristarkh Lyudvigovich]

Quote: knn54

The submarine "Kashalot" has been mothballed since 2003 - they cannot be repaired.

The repair of the Sperm whale has already been completed. Arctic fox came to him.

[Vladislava_I]

Quote: Finches

Here is a clever girl! Many thanks!!! And have a great New Year !!!!

[Rocj]

“Prince Vladimir” is interesting, can he immediately launch all of his missiles from underwater position ???

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Rocj

“Prince Vladimir” is interesting, can he immediately launch all of his missiles from underwater position ???

Recent tests (recently) have shown that YES.

[Escobar]

Who would doubt

[Grievous]

And I have a new year in 2 hours

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Grievous

And I have a new year in 2 hours

And I have at 23.00 With the coming!

[Gardamir]

from the archive of VO
https://topwar.ru/128422-apl-knyaz-vladimir-spustyat-na-vodu-v-noyabre.html
https://topwar.ru/149833-mo-rf-apl-kazan-i-knjaz-vladimir-zakanchivajut-ispytanija.html
https://topwar.ru/155716-apl-kazan-i-sprk-knjaz-vladimir-vojdut-v-sostav-vmf-v-dekabre.html
And so the main thing is to promise. Get rewards, raise the rating, and then finish it endlessly.

[Vadmir]

Get rewards, raise the rating, and then finish it endlessly.

Now, if they had accepted it with imperfections but before the end of the year, then we could have agreed. And the postponement of the time just says that they will accept the already completed, fully combat-ready boat.
Yes, I would like the deadlines to be met, but an honest transfer is better than a semi-finished product in service.

[Gardamir]

better honest carry

I agree, but it would be nice to still learn how to calculate deadlines. And then at one time, such cases were used to break the Union

[Vadmir]

It would be nice to learn more, to calculate the timing

So I make sites, I make them for a long time, all the deadlines have been counted and tested in practice for a long time. However, the artist with the logo will drag out, the copywriters will break the deadlines for writing texts, then the lights will be cut off at the wrong time, or the Internet will interrupt. Or the customer will make changes to the project. Here are the deadlines and shift even count them, at least not.
But building a ship is not creating a site, it is much, much more complicated and there are many more subcontractors, and if the ship is a new project, then the number of accidents that can slow down the work can not be predicted at all. All dates can only be approximate, whether we want it or not.

[Gardamir]

Here I am making sites, And building a ship

Invalid comparison. I can understand your difficulties. but military affairs, the business of the state, is your copywriter washed down, but in the production of a submarine everything should be like clockwork. However, it is better not to call in advance, but to say in the present tense, "Yesterday we surrendered this and that to the army."

[vladcub]

Comrades: Gardamir and Pyramidon, I agree with you: it’s bad when they ring the whole world, and then zilch turns out.
As the people said: "if you gave your word then hold on"
In the Soviet Union, there were also cases when the object was handed over with imperfections, read Beria's diaries, but then there was no fashion to shout from every iron: at the end of the year we will hand over the super-gun. The Armata tank tore everyone up, and this tank has not yet passed the entire set of tests. If it turns out that the tank did not cope with the tests, remember how it stalled in Red Square?

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Vadmir

So I make sites, I make them for a long time, all the deadlines have been counted and tested in practice for a long time. However, the artist with the logo will drag out, then the copywriters will break the deadlines for writing texts,

Imagine what a nuclear submarine is, where hundreds of subcontractors are involved, everything from "smart things" to reactors, turbines, electronics and weapons. This is a colossal complex of "ship, navigation aids and weapons. (I wrote this minuscule). And all this needs to be brought into one" Nuclear cruiser. "Thank you, shipbuilders, I know how hard it is for you, good luck and Happy New Year.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Vadmir

Now, if they had accepted it with imperfections but before the end of the year, then we could have agreed.

There is such a ship, still tormented.

[Vadim237]

In the USSR it was the same.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Vadim237

In the USSR it was the same.

At the expense of weapons in the USSR, there was generally silence. Nobody shone their faces with plans for rearmament on all screens, as now. Well, the rest is a moot point. Only "Corn" promised - communism in 20 years, and the rest of the five-year plans were practically fulfilled

[ser56]

Quote: Piramidon

and the rest of the five-year plans were practically fulfilled

no, they were simply corrected by the end of the term due to "objective" difficulties ... it began with the First Five-Year Plan ...

[frog]

As for the implementation of the five-year plans, you got a little excited .... There are more than enough materials on this topic. But as for armaments - yes, you can’t argue. With the habit of secretly deciding everything ....

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Vadim237

In the USSR it was the same.

And what, in the states with an aircraft carrier, too, a problem.

[Piramidon]

The deadlines for the commissioning of the nuclear submarine "Prince Vladimir" have been postponed

Immediately I remembered the incorruptible from Viktor Stepanovich - "It never happened, and now, again"

[frog]

You can still ask about the fate of the icebreaker of the same name))))

[Stirbjorn]

Something with all major projects we have transfers .. "Kazan" transfer, "Kasatonov" frigate 22350 transfer, corvette 20385 "Thundering" transfer, large landing craft "Morgunov" 11711 transfer, now "Vladimir" transfer ... although everyone was promised hand over by the new year until December ... they hand over one little thing, such as MRK

[Victor March 47]

Quote: Finches

CCCH - was the Red Empire in the full sense of the word - but "comrades" like you, with the same casuistry, sold it for the sake of American capital - they just sold it and that's it! And the people were naive and stupid and only ... However, even now they have not grown much wiser! Ukraine, as an example of permanent modern folk stupidity!

You are deeply mistaken. Blame your own stupidity on others, condemning the collapse. Stupid economy drove the POWER in the toilet. Deception, total, all-pervading, window dressing and hatchering for only 80 or so years, brought to the sum. A check mark in the report replaced the production of a particular product. The search for excuse - replaced the search for opportunities.

[ser56]

Quote: Victor March 47

drove the POWER in the toilet.

It's right!
but

Quote: Victor March 47

just a little over 80, le

a mistake ... 1991 - 1917 = 74

[Jager]

Well, now everything is all right - they crawled out of the toilet, pretended to be a show, now a large (banana) oil and gas power, yes ...

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Victor March 47

You are deeply mistaken. Blame your own stupidity on others, condemning the collapse.

Why are you spoiling people's mood on the eve of the New Year? We already know everything about collapse, etc. and I'll just say "We survived WWI, WWII, fire, water and copper pipes, and we'll survive the rest." Happy New Year to you.

[Lord of the Sith]

Tarapitsa ne necessary! Comrade Saahs

It is better to run in and eliminate all the children's sores that are inevitable during the construction of such a handsome man.
Good luck!

[Piramidon]

Quote: Lord of the Sith

It is better to run in and eliminate all the children's sores that are inevitable during the construction of such a handsome man.

Undoubtedly, I agree. But here everyone is not talking about this, but about the fact that these "talking heads" are on the screens and the government guys who have mastered the "mordobook" in the internet. too many TRYNDYAT, not controlling the situation and, harnessing the cart in front of the horse. Who pulls them by the tongue with their statements-promises?

[vladcub]

Perhaps you remember such a satirist: Arkady Raikin? He had a scene about allies: they promised a bunch and didn’t fulfill it. And now it may be the same

[Al Asad]

The main thing is that in the end they should not be postponed for several years, as it became commonplace with us.

[The Siberian barber]

First, scream, from all vacuum cleaners, then adjustments, to the right (
Fashion is such today.
The good news is that they did not hand over the crude order

[Old26]

Quote: Rocj

“Prince Vladimir” is interesting, can he immediately launch all of his missiles from underwater position ???

Maybe, but why?

[aries2200]

the usual practice of production ... an extremely complex product ... most likely not improvements but improvements ...

[Dzafdet]

Corruption and nepotism will destroy this country ...

[vladcub]

That's what tests are to reveal all the flaws. It would be much worse if commissioned with malfunctions.
In December 1989, my brother was given an apartment in a new house. We spent 2 months with him plumbing with plumbing: all the time leaking .. And if something like that on a nuclear submarine then .. Hello parents

[Positiv]

It's a pity of course, but in such serious developments it is better not to rush ..
Let's remember the nuclear submarine Komsomolets ..

[Freedim]

"Prince Vladimir, swearing,
Steers into the sea on the board.
I look at this thing
In the Old Russian melancholy "
(c) BG

Again, in such a case, as the saying goes, it is better to overbid than to underdo it ... Technology should not let down those who are not "for money" but for the state.

[Petrol cutter]

"At the same time, he admitted that before the delivery of the nuclear submarine, it will still go to sea for additional tests. The source added that the final decision on further actions will be made by the state commission."
What does it mean He admitted ...
Without options, the boat will leave again, but it will be necessary again!
And so, until they bring it to mind.
As our master says, we are building ships here, not riveting stools!

[Petrol cutter]

The surrender of any more or less serious ship (especially of such a level) is not a borscht to cook a pan.
Do you even understand what level of responsibility there is and how many dozens of systems are required to interact smoothly ?! How many dozens of pumps, motors and mechanisms should work simultaneously and interconnectedly?!. Honestly, even I do not understand. Although I'm building some ships ...

[Petrol cutter]

Therefore, ship exits to the sea are their natural state in principle.
Out of a faulty ship at sea - this is a disaster. Such exits entail rescue measures.
Which we categorically do not welcome.

[sergo1914]

Couch, I'm stunned by you.
PS Congratulated the younger brother now. He goes there to shift by 00-00.
Iksperds ... they are so Iksperds.

[musorg]

And what did they say from what they said? 1 DEPL and 2 RTOs, However, in 2020 there will be even more!

[Looking for]

deficiencies are eliminated at the design stage. But defects are a consequence of the level of industry.

[Looking for]

Quote: Stirbjorn

Something with all major projects we have transfers .. "Kazan" transfer, "Kasatonov" frigate 22350 transfer, corvette 20385 "Thundering" transfer, large landing craft "Morgunov" 11711 transfer, now "Vladimir" transfer ... although everyone was promised hand over by the new year until December ... they hand over one little thing, such as MRK

one robbery of the people on a schedule.

[Victor March 47]

Quote: Vadmir

Not every good engineer can become a good leader, but it is from engineers and designers who need to look for managers of high-tech industries.
I have no idea what else "effective" managers have to destroy, so that this truth begins to reach those who are engaged in recruiting.

And how do you like the Chief Surgeon of the region, doing miracles in his youth, collecting patients from nothing? First he grew up to the Chief Surgeon of the district hospital, then to the city, then .... As an OFFICER, you do not need to have the hands of a surgeon, but with all the talents, he never learned to count loot and make plans for improving the industry. It is a stupid situation when from below, from production engineering, mathematics, chemistry, and humanities, to grow production commanders. The Kulibins are crushed, and the Carnegie are not born. Don't you understand that MANAGING teams by ORDER is more complicated than managing a scalpel or a designer’s pencil? And they require completely different tools, control algorithms, incentives .... The manager’s engineering education is only a seed for the development of his abilities. The failure today is not because the auto mechanic took up rocket science. This is an old sore when BLAT (now-kinship) steers on horseback. A PARTICIPANT has such an exceptional rarity. He takes on a thieves position when the connections of this idiot help. But he won’t think for a second when this bubble bursts. Will not look at any Labor Code and expel in a second.

This happens for a simple reason - the private trader is filtered out on the FAR accesses to business and management.

[Victor March 47]

Quote: ser56

Quote: Victor March 47

drove the POWER in the toilet.

It's right!
but

Quote: Victor March 47

just a little over 80, le

a mistake ... 1991 - 1917 = 74

It seems that something has changed a lot in 2020? Here the arithmetic is different.

[Victor March 47]

Quote: mordvin xnumx

Quote: ser56

go to any supermarket, remember the Soviet shops - maybe that will come ...

Start a cat, feed it with meat and milk at home, and then something can come to you, too, with what is sold in the store.

I doubt that the cat fed TOY chicken would stretch out to his old age.
We then called her "the bird of happiness" Blue bird. Slimy, which could only be consumed by washing in a solution of potassium permanganate. Mom always did just that. Having washed and peeled off the skin, which turned brown from this.
Soup sets sold from a car shop at the factory entrance, which were given by a throw to the crowd, since it was impossible to get closer. The machines stopped, the design bureaus, departments were closed.
I don’t need to say anything about the bird, because I worked at the poultry farm for 11 years. THEN kept the chickens for 60 days, and sold a weight of one kilogram. Now 28 days and weighing two. Gas consumption by modern technology decreased by 7 times, electricity by 10 times. The feed consumption for the whole life of a chicken is 1, 2 kilograms per kilogram of live weight. That is, everyone ate 2,4 kg of compound feed during their short life.

[Rocj]

Quote: tihonmarine

Quote: Rocj

“Prince Vladimir” is interesting, can he immediately launch all of his missiles from underwater position ???

Recent tests (recently) have shown that YES.

it is very good!

[Rocj]

Quote: Old26

Quote: Rocj

“Prince Vladimir” is interesting, can he immediately launch all of his missiles from underwater position ???

Maybe, but why?

strange question if you understand this.

[iouris]

Decoration is kitsch (in the latter case). I won’t say anything about the rest.