Military Review

Kommersant claims 95 billion rubles of fire damage at Admiral Kuznetsov

136

A controversy erupted over the network over the damage caused to the Russian aircraft carrier cruiser Admiral Kuznetsov. Recall that at the moment there is an investigation into the causes of fire on a warship undergoing repairs. According to preliminary information, the cause of the fire was a violation of safety regulations during welding.


Just a couple of days ago, the TASS news agency, citing sources, reported that a fire on an aircraft carrier would not affect the timing of repairs, as “change houses with garbage were burnt”. Prior to this, USC president Alexei Rakhmanov also stated that the fire would not affect the timing of repairs and that repairs would be completed, as planned, in 2022.

At the same time, it became known that on board the ship were tanks with tens of tons of engine oil and diesel fuel (a total of about 170 tons). It is alleged that these tanks were not affected.

Against this background, the newspaper Kommersant with reference to an unnamed source at the headquarters of the North fleet provides evidence that the fire on the aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov caused tremendous damage - about 95 billion rubles. Damage caused by repair equipment and aircraft carrier structures during a fire was reported, and what is meant in this case by the “structure” damage is not reported. But it is added that "the consequences of the fire are unlikely to become catastrophic."

Recall that a few months earlier in Novaya Gazeta there was material about "work in the reactor compartment at Admiral Kuznetsov" and about "luminous spots on white overalls." The material caused a wide resonance for the simple reason that there is no reactor compartment on the Russian aircraft carrier. Subsequently, in the "Novaya" they said something like: in the report "they mixed up the ships."
136 comments
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  1. Lord of the Sith
    Lord of the Sith 19 December 2019 07: 36
    +27
    The biggest damage is human lives, they cannot be returned.
    1. Finches
      Finches 19 December 2019 07: 52
      +19
      I would not be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement! But iron, it is iron, money is just paper, but the fact that people died - who will answer for this?
      Here again recalling Joseph Vissarionovich is not a sin, especially on the holiday of military counterintelligence:
      "Every mistake has a first and last name"
      1. Thrifty
        Thrifty 19 December 2019 08: 35
        +12
        Even if the "cabins with trash" were pure gold, they obviously cannot cost much there. belay am
        1. Finches
          Finches 19 December 2019 08: 36
          +2
          This is Russia - everything is priceless here ... except for human life!
          1. Thrifty
            Thrifty 19 December 2019 08: 40
            +1
            Finches hi - I myself know about life, I quit my job where there was a good salary, but safety rules were totally violated! The crisis ended the business - the company recently closed. ... it was "eaten by competitors"!
            1. Finches
              Finches 19 December 2019 08: 40
              0
              hi Perhaps - everything is ours!
              1. Thrifty
                Thrifty 19 December 2019 08: 42
                -1
                Finches hi Alas, but a mess to someone very on hand, on an unclean hand. .. am
            2. st2st
              st2st 19 December 2019 09: 16
              +5
              TB is violated everywhere in Russia. This disease is terrible. PS I worked on Sakhalin for the Irish (Sakhalin-2 project "), safety technology is in the first place. It's a shame for the country. Well, in principle, as one state figure said: women still give birth
          2. frog
            frog 19 December 2019 13: 44
            -1
            If you will, then quote. True, a long .....
            The court recovered from the Ministry of Defense 6 million rubles. in favor of former privates, who during the exercises were placed in the zone of direct destruction by artillery fire. The soldiers were seriously injured, one person was killed. The culprits received suspended sentences.
            The Leningrad Regional Court ordered the Ministry of Defense to pay a total of 6 million rubles. three former conscripts as compensation for injuries sustained during the shooting. This was reported to RBC in the human rights organization "Zone of Law", representing the interests of the plaintiffs.

            According to the court, Dmitry Pakhmutov will receive 3 million, Vadim Gabidullin - 2 million, and Arsen Osmanov - 1 million rubles. Earlier, the Luzhkov City Court of the Leningrad region awarded the soldiers a total of 4 million rubles. They challenged this decision. The regional court, which considered the appeal, fully satisfied the requirements of the plaintiffs, said in the "Zone of Law".


            On September 7, 2017, planned tank firing took place at a military training ground in the Leningrad Region. Lieutenant Colonel Denis Gorelyshev, chief of the engineering forces of the 6th Combined Arms Army, and Lieutenant Colonel Viktor Krivoshein, head of the 33rd Combined Arms Testing Ground, stationed four soldiers in the direct fire zone and neglected security measures. The commander of the firing tank during the investigation said that he did not know that the personnel were in the affected area, the position was not marked with a special red flag.

            After the T-72 tank fired with a standard projectile, 20-year-old Private Andrei Wittich died on the spot due to damage to the iliac artery and blood loss. Three surviving privates have penetrating wounds, limb loss, fractures, massive blood loss and severe traumatic shock. Three more injured during the shooting received less significant injuries, Fontanka wrote.

            After ten months in the hospital and 11 operations, Vadim Gabidullin received a disability of the third group, the bones and joints of the shoulder blade and shoulder are seriously deformed and incorrectly fused, they installed metal implants. Dmitry Pakhmutov lost his arm, suffered spinal injuries and became an invalid of the second group. Arsen Osmanov spent more than two months in the hospital with lung damage, continues to experience pain and shortness of breath.

            In February 2019, both officers received suspended sentences of three years in a case of negligence (Article 293 of the Criminal Code).




            Источник:https://www.rbc.ru/society/18/12/2019/5dfa35119a79471e784df6ea
        2. Vyacheslav Viktorovich
          Vyacheslav Viktorovich 19 December 2019 09: 03
          -3
          Quote: Thrifty
          Even if the "cabins with trash" were pure gold, they obviously cannot cost much there. belay am

          TASS wrote about cabins with rubbish, and judging by the comments, they trust him much more than the "merchant". No one, however, remembers how TASS wrote that a strong recoil could rip off the sights from American copies of the RPG-7. lol
          1. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa 19 December 2019 11: 15
            +7
            Quote: Vyacheslav Viktorovich
            TASS wrote about cabins with garbage,

            This is a fake golem: there are no cabins in the energy compartment, and even with a rag fool
            1. Oden280
              Oden280 19 December 2019 12: 41
              +2
              95 billion - this is a fake golem. For damage to such an amount, a burned box should remain from the ship. And there are change houses in any compartment. Moreover, a rag is always a companion to repair.
              1. Boa kaa
                Boa kaa 19 December 2019 12: 48
                +3
                Quote: Oden280
                And there are change houses in any compartment.

                Respected! There is no need to confuse change houses and "STOREROUSES" where useful things are stored .... (tools, spare parts, parts, etc.) Change houses are located on the 2nd deck in the area of ​​the l / s cockpits, but not in the energy compartment. There may also be pantries of instrument inventory, and not on deck 9 (maybe on the 2nd platform, I won't say exactly about Kuzyu), where the DG and ES are located ...
                Somehow, however. AHA.
                1. Oden280
                  Oden280 19 December 2019 14: 13
                  0
                  Not exactly put it. But the meaning remains the same. Covers with clothes and rags are everywhere. The amount depends on the sneakiness of the team and the corrosiveness of the officer.
                  1. Boa kaa
                    Boa kaa 19 December 2019 14: 34
                    0
                    Quote: Oden280
                    Covers with clothes and rags are everywhere.

                    On the first line ships - no! If you have served in the navy, you must remember what a "big tidy" on Saturdays is. Remember the command: - "Tidy objects for inspection"! According to which the instructors of residential and office premises line up at the facilities and present them to the inspectors. And the inspectors - with hooks and white handkerchiefs to check the absence of dust on equipment and mechanisms. In addition, the tidy (small) is made daily, three times a day! After tidying up, a command is given: instructors to carry debris to the wall. If the ship is in the roadstead, then a garbage barge is moored to the spacer, where all the garbage is poured. And if it is not there, then the garbage is burned on the poop in a garbage incinerator ...
                    Therefore, I am extremely surprised to hear about the "rags and garbage in the hold" of the TAVKR. In the years of the collapse of the Armed Forces (90-00 of the last century) - this was. But not today, when the fleet began to revive ...
        3. orionvitt
          orionvitt 19 December 2019 09: 41
          +8
          Quote: Thrifty
          they obviously can’t cost much there

          At Kommersant they can. I am surprised that he did not break a trillion. With him will become, especially "with reference to an unnamed source in the headquarters of the Northern Fleet."
          1. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa 19 December 2019 11: 20
            +10
            Quote: orionvitt
            I am surprised that he did not break a trillion.

            95 million ... well, maybe. But 95 BILLION (!) - this is to cause discontent among the layman! turn public opinion against the "authorities", lower the fleet and blame measures to strengthen the country's defense ...
            1. Ratmir_Ryazan
              Ratmir_Ryazan 19 December 2019 11: 25
              +3
              95 million ... well, maybe. But 95 BILLION (!) - this is to cause discontent among the layman! to turn public opinion against the "authorities", to lower the fleet and blame measures to strengthen the country's defense.


              Just so, Novaya Gazeta went even further, wrote about the fact that the workers at TAVKR were irradiated from the reactor of this ship))).

              These venal skins will find any reason and delight to heaven to obstruct the power and the country. That's what they are paid for.
              1. Boa kaa
                Boa kaa 19 December 2019 11: 56
                +5
                Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
                These venal skins will find any reason and delight to heaven to obstruct the power and the country. That's what they are paid for.

                Soon, probably, the "voice of matzo" will sing about the criminal regime and corruption, and will not forget to remember the fire at the TAVKR ... Today the guarantor will give a big press conference ... So the reason to get rid of the country is very opportune ...
          2. AU Ivanov.
            AU Ivanov. 19 December 2019 13: 07
            0
            Kommersant and RBC are undoubtedly reliable sources that are not borrowed.
            At one time, RBC "bankrupted and abolished" our airline. True, we, its workers, did not know about this and did not even hear, how we flew, and continued to fly.
        4. Victorio
          Victorio 19 December 2019 12: 12
          0
          Quote: Thrifty
          Even if the "cabins with trash" were pure gold, they obviously cannot cost much there. belay am

          ====
          95 billion - a figure from the ceiling
        5. maidan.izrailovich
          maidan.izrailovich 19 December 2019 12: 35
          +1
          Even if the "cabins with trash" were pure gold, they obviously cannot cost much there.

          The liberals from the "merchant" are clearly "modest." I had to add a couple more zeros. crying
          95 billion rubles is 1,5 billion dollars. Yes, if Kuzya really received such damage, it would be easier to dispose of it than to repair it.
        6. Vadim237
          Vadim237 19 December 2019 13: 57
          0
          95 million rubles - I will believe, but 95 billion is a pure duck so "As Komersant reports referring to an unnamed source"
      2. Phil77
        Phil77 19 December 2019 08: 52
        +7
        * Each accident has a name, surname and position *. Lazar Kaganovich. But the meaning of your comment is absolutely correct.
      3. lis-ik
        lis-ik 19 December 2019 09: 03
        -2
        Quote: Finches
        I won’t be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement

        Or, as usual, heavy duty will be hung on sailors and officers, and the masters of life will again leave responsibility.
        1. lis-ik
          lis-ik 19 December 2019 09: 29
          +7
          Honestly, it seems that in this way they prepare public opinion for the sale of the ship.
          1. RUSS
            RUSS 19 December 2019 09: 31
            -2
            Quote: lis-ik
            Honestly, it seems that in this way they prepare public opinion for the sale of the ship.

            The fire damage at Admiral Kuznetsov is equal to its present value.
            “Previously, the damage caused by the fire, is estimated at 95 billion rubles. This is not only about damage to the structures of the aircraft carrier, but also about damaged repair equipment and malfunctioning due to injuries to military and civilian specialists, ”the source said.

            The current cost of a ship of this class and with such a service life, taking into account the wear of the frame and without weapons, reaches 110 billion rubles.
          2. Ratmir_Ryazan
            Ratmir_Ryazan 19 December 2019 11: 28
            +3
            Honestly, it seems that in this way they prepare public opinion for the sale of the ship.


            Kommersant, Novaya Gazeta and other corrupt media are preparing public opinion for the sale of the country, for which they are paid by foreign funds, Khodarkovsky and other nits.

            Tavkr restore, Russia needs such a ship.
            1. Graf56
              Graf56 19 December 2019 12: 27
              +1
              Why does Russia need such a ship?
              "That was"?
              In order to screw up on occasion with a clever look: does Russia also have its own aircraft carrier fleet? So this thesis is weak. An intelligent person knows what this so-called "aircraft carrier fleet" is worth, knows its capabilities, its history.
              And the story is quite remarkable.
              Suffice it to recall that most of his heroic life Kuzya stood on a joke. I emphasize - more !!!
              "Kuznetsov", launched in Nikolaev in 1987, was repaired in 1994-1995, 1996-1998, 2001-2004, 2008 and just before going out to the first and only military campaign.
              The results of this military campaign are even embarrassing to discuss. And the point is not in the smoke screen, over which only the lazy did not make fun.
              The specific results are as follows: two sunken aircraft of their own and confirmation of the complete discrepancy between the TAVKR and the declared characteristics. Who needs planes that fly only with an incomplete combat load and an incomplete supply of fuel? Nobody. The command made the right conclusion, shifted the main focus to work from ground airfields and stopped this circus with Kuzya.
              But his misadventures did not end there. Where should Kuzya go after such a glorious military campaign? Correctly, in its usual place, in repair, again gobble up people's money.
              But then there was a problem. The usual repair ended with a recessed unique dock, along with two tower cranes and a broken deck.
              Kuzya calmed down on this? Not at all! He demanded a continuation of the banquet!
              And it followed.
              Kuzya caught fire. Judging by the fact that the press reluctantly acknowledged the fact that the fire was in the energy compartment, the damage was very serious.
              Let's try to think.
              "... on board the ship were containers with tens of tons of engine oil and diesel fuel (a total of about 170 tons). It is said that these containers were not damaged."
              Let's say. We will take on faith, as well as peppy reports that this will not affect the terms of repair.
              Then what burned?
              Rags? Did this rag cause a fire of this area, intensity and duration?
              Maybe someone should not consider people dumber than themselves? Usually just the opposite happens.
              As for whether such a ship is needed ...
              The answer is short: whoever needs SUCH, let him pay. Let him pay for his downtime, his repairs, his sunk planes, floating docks and tower cranes from his pocket.
              1. Ratmir_Ryazan
                Ratmir_Ryazan 19 December 2019 14: 27
                0
                Russia needs an aircraft carrier in order to use aviation where we do not have airfields, but where the aircraft carrier can be reached by sea.
          3. max702
            max702 19 December 2019 12: 09
            -1
            Quote: lis-ik
            Honestly, it seems that in this way they prepare public opinion for the sale of the ship.

            I’ve talked about this for a long time, the MO doesn’t need it, and public opinion and lobbyists both in uniform and from the military-industrial complex do not write off or sell it. , with this money a couple of hundreds of the same SU-35 are orders of magnitude more effective for the country's defense capability ..
        2. loki565
          loki565 19 December 2019 09: 36
          0
          The "masters of life" do not run with autogenes there, so if you ask them, then only for TB campaigning
      4. Potato
        Potato 19 December 2019 09: 03
        +6
        That money is just paper - I will not agree with you. Money in our world can save lives and arrange the fate of many people. Without money, life becomes a struggle for survival. Money can make it possible to create normal living conditions for many - to build a life, get an education, career, create a normal family, extend life with a good treatment.

        That money is just pieces of paper - only thieves say it. To justify theft before his conscience. You steal money - You steal someone's life. Thieves are killers, in fact. Still money is not appreciated by those who have their shaft and they easily got it.

        But you are not like that? Money is not paper. You need to appreciate everything that is. And what cannot be restored or smoothed out, and what is acquired by labor.
      5. Obi-Wan Kenobi
        Obi-Wan Kenobi 19 December 2019 10: 56
        +4
        I would not be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement!

        So I will not be surprised if it turns out that at first the money was stolen, and then they set fire to the ends in the water.
      6. Gray brother
        Gray brother 19 December 2019 11: 00
        0
        Quote: Finches
        I would not be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement!

        Even if "Kuznetsov" is not able to sell that much money in its entirety - it’s one and a half lard dollars))) lol
        1. Finches
          Finches 19 December 2019 11: 03
          0
          This, apparently, together with the crew, aircraft and pilots!
          1. Gray brother
            Gray brother 19 December 2019 11: 08
            -3
            Quote: Finches
            This, apparently, together with the crew, aircraft and pilots!

            Well, let's go without the slave trade, please.
            Considering that everything is very used there, I think that it will have to be loaded with cash pallets in this case too.
      7. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 19 December 2019 11: 07
        +2
        Quote: Finches
        I would not be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement!

        The admiral will be closed, but from the UEC and SRH 35 they will not close anyone. Although at SRH 35 I read one article for 2013.
        35 SRZ - Factory of death for the Navy!

        https://flot.com/forum/index.php?FID=15&PAGE_NAME=read&TID=6745
      8. Incvizitor
        Incvizitor 19 December 2019 11: 09
        -2
        I would not be surprised that some time later, suddenly, they would shut down some admiral from the military-industrial complex for embezzlement!
        I will not be surprised if, as a result, Admiral Kuznetsov is shut down as "not close to restoration.
    2. V.I.F.
      V.I.F. 19 December 2019 12: 16
      -1
      Quote: Lord of the Sith
      The biggest damage is human lives.

      Under capitalism, we live. Lives that are priceless for relatives and friends, for gentlemen who think in quite tangible categories, can easily be translated into numbers (lost profits from labor activity, expenses for compensation, etc., etc.). So the lives of the dead and the health of the victims are also included in the indicated amount, you can be sure.
  2. Salavatsky Ministry of Emergency Situations
    +1
    It is abundant, however ... And how much more they will steal ...
    1. bessmertniy
      bessmertniy 19 December 2019 07: 44
      -15
      So they already said - 95 billion! wassat And for a few free subbotniks everything will be put in order. wink
      1. kenig1
        kenig1 19 December 2019 08: 08
        +3
        Did your grandmother selling seeds on the market tell you?
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. kjhg
          kjhg 19 December 2019 08: 42
          +10
          Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
          Look at Abramovich’s yacht * Eclipse * at 13 thousand tons of displacement

          Abramovich is not the richest man in Russia. Although, calling him a citizen of Russia is somehow not correct. It would be more correct to call such people from Russia who "earned" their fortune here and dumped them into the hated Europe, which, according to our propagandists, will soon fall apart.
          So, there are people who are richer than Abramovich, whose yachts are comparable in price and tonnage to our largest and most powerful cruiser, Peter the Great.
          By the way, the total tonnage and cost of the yacht of the richest people in Russia exceeded the tonnage and cost of surface ships of the Navy. Here is such a surrealism request
        3. Potato
          Potato 19 December 2019 09: 14
          +11
          What oligarchs ... You look - the unemployed wife of the country's prime minister flies a business jet around the world. Even the patriarch flies a business jet! I do not speak for the mistress of the director of a state bank. The money paid is also not small, and obviously not their own. Most likely - for the money of the very state bank that fictitiously sold these jets (in fact - transferred) to offshores of a small state. That is - they fly in a fraudulent way and frolic at the state expense. This is all obvious. Only the sovereign is not against such a waste of treasury.
          1. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 19 December 2019 10: 45
            -3
            Quote: Potato
            The money paid is also not small, and obviously not their own.

            They pay their money, they have them "like a makhorka fool."
            1. Potato
              Potato 19 December 2019 11: 13
              +2
              Why do you think so? Where does this "own" money come from? Judging by their declarations on income and property, they do not and cannot have money to use private business aviation. This means that this money is clearly not "ours". You cannot earn less than spend. And you cannot have undeclared income, especially as a civil servant - an official.
              1. tihonmarine
                tihonmarine 19 December 2019 11: 17
                0
                Quote: Potato
                Why do you think so? Where does this "own" money come from? Judging by their declarations on income and property, they do not and cannot have money to use private business aviation.

                Where are you so naive from. They come to power not so that the people live better, but in order to provide for their beloved, and their children with grandchildren.
                1. Potato
                  Potato 19 December 2019 11: 49
                  0
                  Then on their pitchfork! Why are they for society? To live at his expense?
                  1. tihonmarine
                    tihonmarine 19 December 2019 11: 59
                    -1
                    Quote: Potato
                    Then on their pitchfork! Why are they for society? To live at his expense?

                    So the world of capitalism lives, there's nothing to be done.
        4. Ratmir_Ryazan
          Ratmir_Ryazan 19 December 2019 11: 37
          0
          What nonsense are you talking about ?!

          In Russia, there are rich people and the fact that they spend money on yachts bought abroad is not connected with our fleet.

          There are only a few yachts like Abramovich’s and they buy them on their own. They repair and make abroad.

          What do you think in Europe or in the USA there are no yachts from the rich? Or maybe the United States did not burn aircraft carriers and France and Britain have no problems with aircraft carriers. There are no less.

          Problems need to be solved, not whined, in Russia two nuclear-powered submarines stand like all the yachts of the Russian rich, even taking into account the fact that they lied a lot about their cost.

          And you opened your mouth and are being led by these cheap show-offs.

          The fact that people in Russia buy yachts is not bad, it’s bad that these yachts are not made in Russia.
          1. Potato
            Potato 19 December 2019 11: 52
            +1
            We must have everything according to the law without looking to the west or east or south! While officials are absorbed in theft, they will not be able to solve problems effectively. Or do you propose to the VO audience to take the keys and sledgehammers, and go to solve the problem of repairing "Kuznetsov" themselves?
          2. tihonmarine
            tihonmarine 19 December 2019 12: 02
            -1
            Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
            The fact that people in Russia buy yachts is not bad, it’s bad that these yachts are not made in Russia.

            For better or worse, I don’t know, this is the business of the people of Russia; if they like, it’s good.
      3. private person
        private person 19 December 2019 08: 40
        +4
        What is 95 lard for the country when 10-20 lard are seized from palkans in Moscow. Joke of course BUT in every joke there is some truth.
        1. New Year day
          New Year day 19 December 2019 10: 42
          +7
          Quote: private person
          Joke of course

          But why?! It is necessary to force Abramovich, Usmanov to take patronage over "Kuznetsov". There is always an argument

          only this is not "their method"
      4. Fraracol_2
        Fraracol_2 19 December 2019 09: 08
        -3
        In general, in the first messages it was that one of the functionaries said that all this would not even affect the timing of the repair !! To find out who said this then, without even trying to estimate the scale of the disaster. The main thing is to immediately report that everything is "all is well beautiful marquise."
    2. SOVIET UNION 2
      SOVIET UNION 2 19 December 2019 08: 03
      +5
      Why is it stolen? Or is the dock flooding and fire made specifically to hide the theft? Such a modern * Operation Y * *? Here rather elementary gouging along with effective management and optimization. The other day, the news was that in Sevastopol, the dock with the submarine was drowned. The submarine surfaced, the dock drowned. True dock and substrate were recyclable. Why did it happen? It seems that everything is written off and there is nothing to steal! But they could drown after all!
      1. loki565
        loki565 19 December 2019 09: 41
        0
        Yes, it was possible to hand over to ferrous metal fellow , but why drowned.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 19 December 2019 10: 43
        0
        Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
        Why did it happen? It seems that everything is written off and there is nothing to steal! But they could drown after all!

        We wanted to, but it didn’t work out, doc kyrdyk, but "Kuzya" is alive.
  3. K-612-O
    K-612-O 19 December 2019 07: 39
    +4
    Why not 95 trillion? The last thing is to refer to the Komersant trash.
    1. kjhg
      kjhg 19 December 2019 08: 01
      +4
      Quote: K-612-O
      The last thing is to refer to the Komersant trash.

      Firstly, not Kommersant, but Kommersant. Secondly, name the newspapers respected by YOU. Does speed info go there? Thirdly, in the ranking of business publications in Russia, Kommersant ranks second, between Forbes and Vedomosti. Of course, he is not so popular among security guards and collective farms, but he is very highly regarded in business circles.
      1. Xnumx vis
        Xnumx vis 19 December 2019 08: 22
        +3
        Quote: kjhg
        Thirdly, Kommersant is in second place in the ranking of business publications in Russia, fellow being between Forbes and Vedomosti. Of course, he is not so popular among security guards and collective farms, but he is very highly regarded in business circles.

        I laugh homerically !!!!!! laughing laughing Write that the merchant ranks first in the unreliability of the materials submitted in the newspaper .... These "patriots" lie that most people drink water! Nonsense!
        1. kjhg
          kjhg 19 December 2019 08: 28
          -2
          Quote: 30 vis

          I laugh homerically !!!!!!

          Believe me, I'm not surprised, that's not once.
          among security guards and on collective farms
          in business
          I believe that the first circle of people that I have cited is nevertheless closer to you than the second circle. Keep on homeric laughter wink
          1. The comment was deleted.
        2. The comment was deleted.
      2. Pytnik
        Pytnik 19 December 2019 08: 41
        0
        Do you mean security guards and collective farmers?
        1. kjhg
          kjhg 19 December 2019 08: 47
          -1
          Quote: Pytnik
          Do you mean security guards and collective farmers?

          Where did I write this? belay I, like, wrote in Russian that among different circles of people different publications are popular. And yes, security guards and collective farmers read the yellow press and scanwords more than business publications. This, as they say, is a fact, not an insult. One of the commentators above confirmed my words with his homeric laugh.
          1. loki565
            loki565 19 December 2019 09: 50
            +2
            Some security guards are more decent than some "business people"))) And so it is necessary to wait for official information from the Ministry of Defense, the merchant is not particularly responsible for such publications, he will print a maximum refutation, and even then rarely.
            1. kjhg
              kjhg 19 December 2019 10: 10
              -4
              Quote: loki565
              Some security guards are more decent than some "business people"

              I don’t understand why you wrote this proposal? This statement takes place to be exactly the same as the converse.
              Quote: loki565
              And so you have to wait for the official information from the MO

              Well, wait, I hope. Do you propose to ban newspapers from writing articles citing their sources? What are they now, only official statements of the MO need to be printed? Rave. Everyone should decide who to believe or not to believe. MO sometimes also makes SUCH statements that you think, do they keep us for complete idiots, or simply they have no other choice? I used to get information from different sides and only then, having analyzed it, draw conclusions.
              1. loki565
                loki565 19 December 2019 10: 20
                +2
                I don’t understand why you wrote this proposal? This statement takes place to be exactly the same as the converse.

                So you consider them second-class people, if in this context, put an example.
                Well, wait, I hope. Do you propose to ban newspapers from writing articles citing their sources?
                At least bear responsibility for such publications, or call specifically who gave them the info.
      3. DenZ
        DenZ 19 December 2019 10: 28
        -1
        Quote: kjhg
        Thirdly, Kommersant takes the second place in the ranking of business publications in Russia, being between Forbes and Vedomosti

        It's not about the place in the ranking, but about whose interests it reflects. 95 billion is a huge amount and it is being taken from the ceiling in order to prepare the population for depriving the fleet of the last aircraft carrier. And who needs it, I’ll think for yourself. You don’t need to poke ratings here. It’s not the point.
    2. Advisor to the Council of Advisers
      Advisor to the Council of Advisers 19 December 2019 08: 39
      -1
      Quote: K-612-O
      K-612-O (Andrey) Today, 07: 39 NEW
      Why not 95 trillion?


      After repair, he will be able to fly to the moon.
    3. Fraracol_2
      Fraracol_2 19 December 2019 09: 03
      -6
      It’s clear that Kommersant is to blame for everything ...
  4. knn54
    knn54 19 December 2019 07: 40
    0
    And this is "minor" damage ???
    1. cost
      cost 19 December 2019 07: 41
      +27
      the aircraft carrier was transferred to the United Shipbuilding Corporation (USC) in April 2018. Civilian specialists had to completely upgrade its power systems and weapons. A contract worth about 60-65 billion rubles was signed for these works. Another 23 billion rubles were planned for the reconstruction of the dry dock for repair.
      And here is such an amount.
      Am I alone alarmed that the damage was calculated so quickly?
      1. Laksamana besar
        Laksamana besar 19 December 2019 07: 57
        +4
        The rotten Kommersant has its own "sources" everywhere, they know better. And the amount of damage they named is simply unrealistic, but for the title of the article and howling howling it is.
        1. Aleksandr21
          Aleksandr21 19 December 2019 08: 21
          +1
          Quote: Laksamana Besar
          The rotten Kommersant has its own "sources" everywhere, they know better. And the amount of damage they named is simply unrealistic, but for the title of the article and howling howling it is.


          I don’t know about the rotten, all the same it’s not a Ren TV or a new newspaper. But the fact that the amount of damage at times will be less, so it seems, maybe they didn’t just understand the source, and there is an amount of 95 billion in total, for scheduled repairs + modernization + due to a recent incident, etc. and the question now may be, is the game worth the candle for such funds? (but IMHO of course)
          1. kjhg
            kjhg 19 December 2019 08: 57
            +3
            Quote: Aleksandr21
            perhaps they didn’t just understand the source correctly, and there is an amount of 95 billion in total, for scheduled repairs + modernization + due to a recent incident, etc.

            But it could very well be.
          2. loki565
            loki565 19 December 2019 09: 53
            +1
            Dry dock still needs to be done, and this is 23 lard.
          3. Horon
            Horon 19 December 2019 10: 46
            +3
            He is from you listed:
            ren tv or new newspaper

            Kommersant differs only in the direction of the information and the public that eats it!
      2. The leader of the Redskins
        The leader of the Redskins 19 December 2019 07: 59
        +1
        How many?!!! There, that diamond welding worked and welds made of pure gold were laid, and one drop fell on a rag warehouse made of natural Chinese silk, from which the upholstery of an ebony tree was ignited ?! !!!
        1. U-58
          U-58 19 December 2019 08: 29
          0
          Yeah, that's right))))
          Moreover, the ebony does not burn)))
      3. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
        Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 19 December 2019 08: 05
        +4
        Quote: Rich
        Another 23 billion rubles were planned for the reconstruction of the dry dock for repair.

        As for the cost of modernization of the dry dock at the 35th shipyard, it should be borne in mind that not only one "Admiral Kuznetsov" was repaired in the PD-50, but also the cruiser "Peter the Great" and the SSBN. As Alexei Rakhmanov, President of the United Shipbuilding Corporation (USC), said after the fire at the Admiral Kuznetsov, “The ship is afloat. Has not lost stability. It means he will live. " Some conclusions are drawn about the fire without the results of damage inspection. Another 3-4 medium repairs at the 35th shipyard, and it will be as new (maybe) .. (2 technological cutouts for loading high-pressure steam boilers KVG-4 of Russian production are visible).
        1. Spambox
          Spambox 19 December 2019 08: 54
          +1
          He would have survived this repair, and not 3-4 average repairs after which he will be like new. I’m afraid everything goes to the point that further repairs are considered inappropriate and they’ll saw Kuznetsov (It seems that they don’t know how to get rid of him. At first they wanted to drown him in the dock, didn’t drown. Now they tried to burn, they don’t burn. Let's see what else they come up with ...
      4. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 19 December 2019 09: 32
        -2
        Quote: Rich
        Am I alone alarmed that the damage was calculated so quickly?

        Everything is elementary simple, it has long been counted. Remember why our military depots were burning, why they are burning now in Ukraine, why warships are being burned for repairs.
      5. Gray brother
        Gray brother 19 December 2019 11: 02
        -3
        Quote: Rich
        Am I alone alarmed that the damage was calculated so quickly?

        Why should this Putin’s power be spared? wassat
    2. The popuas
      The popuas 19 December 2019 10: 44
      -1
      For us, "Russians" who receive in the bulk of 20000 rubles is a significant amount, and if a colonel has a billion in his nightstand, then for them it is "insignificant" ...
      1. Gray brother
        Gray brother 19 December 2019 11: 14
        -2
        Quote: Popuas
        For us "Russians"

        Quotation marks characterize you well.
  5. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 19 December 2019 07: 41
    +1
    about 170 tons
    Go to the dock with so much goryochka on board !!!!! This is criminal negligence!
    1. Galleon
      Galleon 19 December 2019 09: 20
      +4
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      Go to the dock with so much goryok on board

      Just the dock as such and no. The ship is afloat. Therefore, there is water for fire pumps. If the ammunition is unloaded, safety measures are taken. The presence of fuel and lubricants in tanks is not an obstacle to being in the shipyard.
      Yes, you all know it yourself, play us here wink lol
    2. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine 19 December 2019 09: 36
      +1
      Quote: Uncle Lee
      Go to the dock with so much goryochka on board !!!!! This is criminal negligence!

      Well, he first stood in the factory, secondly it is a minuscule for the work of the VDG, thirdly the fuel is pumped out of those tanks (and adjacent ones) where flammable work will be carried out.
      1. Uncle lee
        Uncle lee 19 December 2019 09: 39
        +1
        Okay, okay ... Persuaded. I had the right to have fuel on board! hi
        1. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine 19 December 2019 10: 24
          0
          Quote: Uncle Lee
          Okay, okay ... Persuaded. I had the right to have fuel on board!

          Yes, always and everywhere this is done, and now even more so. Try to deposit the fuel, you will be left without pants.
  6. eagle owl
    eagle owl 19 December 2019 07: 46
    -5
    Kommersant - and that’s it. We are waiting for the official
    1. Fraracol_2
      Fraracol_2 19 December 2019 09: 11
      -5
      Here I would doubt it.
    2. New Year day
      New Year day 19 December 2019 09: 26
      -2
      Quote: Uhu
      We are waiting for the official

      According to the Sochi Tu-154, you are still waiting for an official laughing
      1. eagle owl
        eagle owl 19 December 2019 15: 07
        0
        But about the fact that Hmeimim destroyed everything - they quickly figured it out))) Immediately after the publication of Kommersant, that everything was burned out there)))
        “The message of Kommersant about the alleged“ actual destruction ”of seven Russian military aircraft at the Khmeimim airbase is a fake,” TASS reports.
      2. eagle owl
        eagle owl 19 December 2019 17: 48
        0
        Go rejoice - again your Kommersant dipped for nonsense wassat
  7. Fedorov
    Fedorov 19 December 2019 07: 48
    -3
    "Kommersant" I would burn this publishing house slightly. Blizzard drives regularly.
  8. sabakina
    sabakina 19 December 2019 07: 57
    -2
    Fire damage 95 lard .... And how much is the whole Kuzya? recourse
    1. Sentinel-vs
      Sentinel-vs 19 December 2019 08: 03
      +13
      The estimated cost of building the Leader project's nuclear destroyer is about 100 billion rubles.
      A businessman rages fiercely, but most likely he purposefully throws it on.
      1. Tsoy
        Tsoy 19 December 2019 08: 18
        +6
        Quote: Sentinel-vs
        The estimated cost of building the Leader project's nuclear destroyer is about 100 billion rubles.


        But so far no nuclear destroyer Leader has been built, this amount taken from the ceiling. If you draw parallels, the Indian Vikramaditya was transferred free of charge, but with the condition of equipping an air wing and a major overhaul, the contract value amounted to $ 2.3 billion.
        1. Sentinel-vs
          Sentinel-vs 19 December 2019 08: 22
          -1
          Agreed that the virtual price for "Leaders", but nevertheless indicative in comparison with the amount declared by "Kommersant".
          2,3 yards of dollars at the exchange rate of 2013 = 75 yards of rubles.
          1. Tsoy
            Tsoy 19 December 2019 08: 34
            -1
            Quote: Sentinel-vs
            Agreed that the virtual price for "Leaders", but nevertheless indicative in comparison with the amount declared by "Kommersant".
            2,3 yards of dollars at the exchange rate of 2013 = 75 yards of rubles.


            Well, at 95 yards from my purely land point of view, a quarter of the ship should have burned out in the trash. On the other hand, who will now figure out what is damaged by the fire, and what was received as a result of the incident with the floating dock. If you remember there was information that the crane fell on the deck. The newspaper, of course, is still that newspaper, but isn’t anyone trying to cover the other with one jamb?
          2. Avior
            Avior 19 December 2019 09: 05
            0
            And why do you think that at the 2013 exchange rate?
            Maybe at the exchange rate 2019 will be more correct?
            1. Sentinel-vs
              Sentinel-vs 19 December 2019 09: 08
              -2
              Vikramadity was transferred to India in 2013, so I think at that rate.
              1. Avior
                Avior 19 December 2019 10: 23
                +1
                In the original post, they estimate the damage for Kuznetsov, and he is worth it in 2019, so if you compare his repair with Gorshkov, you need to take the numbers for 2019
        2. Stirbjorn
          Stirbjorn 19 December 2019 08: 50
          +3
          Quote: Choi
          But so far no nuclear destroyer Leader has been built, this amount taken from the ceiling.
          That's for sure, in the process of building such large ships, the amount guaranteed grows substantially
    2. Fedorov
      Fedorov 19 December 2019 08: 09
      -3
      He stands like a murdered Ukrainian fleet. soldier
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 19 December 2019 10: 28
        +1
        Quote: Fedorov
        He stands like a murdered Ukrainian fleet.

        The Far Eastern submarine flotilla at the time of the collapse of 42 boats, now 7 boats.
    3. Strashila
      Strashila 19 December 2019 09: 00
      0
      Duc, 95 so for the seed of conversation, pour out of historical practice in all 950.
  9. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 19 December 2019 08: 03
    +1
    Over the past 5 years, this "unpalatable" Kommersant has buried Russia several times that he had some kind of aircraft-carrying cruiser. wassat
  10. alavrin
    alavrin 19 December 2019 08: 14
    +1
    And this is only one episode of the Russian mess. And its price is not only in money, but above all in lives.
  11. Corn
    Corn 19 December 2019 08: 21
    -2
    Apparently, 95 billion in addition to the 50 billion already spent on mediation ...
    But there is no choice, it is necessary to repair absolutely at any cost, to all Russophobia in spite, and then also rename it “Vladimir the Victorious”.
    The best symbol of victorious Putinism simply cannot be found.
  12. Stirbjorn
    Stirbjorn 19 December 2019 08: 43
    +10
    Just a couple of days ago, the TASS news agency, citing sources, reported that a fire on an aircraft carrier would not affect the timing of repairs, as “change houses with garbage were burnt”. Prior to this, USC president Alexei Rakhmanov also stated that the fire would not affect the timing of repairs and that repairs would be completed, as planned, in 2022.
    oh, how it all reminds the story of the fire on the Georgy Kurbatov minesweeper under construction in 2016. At that time, the offshore agency also said that everything was fine and the construction time would not change. So, hurray-patriots and critics of "Kommersant" would like to remind that "Kurbatov" has not even been launched into the water, although 3 and a half years have passed since the fire. One minesweeper from the queue has already been built in two years and was accepted into the fleet, and the second will soon be accepted, also after the fire filling.

    As the network now decrypts such statements from military and other officials
    "Smoke" - strong fire
    "Combustion" - very strong fire
    "The seat of the fire is localized" - burns, and is not extinguished yet
    "Received non-life-threatening injuries" - they took the living to the hospital
    "Evacuation is carried out" - whoever could run away
    "There is no ammunition or weapons" - the devil only knows what is burning out there. "
    1. Strashila
      Strashila 19 December 2019 08: 58
      +2
      "There is no ammunition or weapons" - the devil only knows what is burning out there, most importantly, explosions are not heard and fragments do not fly.
    2. kjhg
      kjhg 19 December 2019 09: 14
      +1
      Quote: Stirbjorn
      "Smoke" - strong fire
      "Combustion" - very strong fire
      "The seat of the fire is localized" - burns, and is not extinguished yet
      "Received non-life-threatening injuries" - they took the living to the hospital
      "Evacuation is carried out" - whoever could run away

      I will add from myself:
      "The radiation background is normal" - there was a radiation release, which is why they cordoned off the contaminated area and prohibited the nearest weather stations to transmit the radiation background readings.
      "The plane (or helicopter) made a hard landing" - the aircraft was smashed into trash and cannot be repaired, but the pilots (or part of the crew) remained alive.
      "There are no losses" - there are losses, but until documentary evidence appears in the media, photos and videos of victims or statements by relatives, we will not tell you about them.

      Maybe someone will continue?
  13. Strashila
    Strashila 19 December 2019 08: 55
    +2
    With a high degree of probability during the planned work, now there will be an unscheduled amount.
    Long-term exposure to temperatures and combustion products clearly will not become improving factors on the design of the ship, now additional replacement of damaged elements will be required.
  14. Avior
    Avior 19 December 2019 09: 09
    +1
    . Prior to this, USC president Alexei Rakhmanov also stated that the fire would not affect the timing of repairs and that repairs would be completed, as planned, in 2022.

    I would not really rely on this statement.
    Rakhmanov said this at a time when the fire was in full swing, and not yet extinguished, it was obviously still impossible to assess the damage from it
  15. tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 19 December 2019 09: 24
    0
    At the same time, it became known that on board the ship were tanks with tens of tons of engine oil and diesel fuel (a total of about 170 tons). It is alleged that these tanks were not affected.
    It is interesting, and what kind of capacities are these, and where they were located.
  16. ender
    ender 19 December 2019 09: 28
    +2
    somewhere upstairs ..

    - drowned?
    - drowned, but did not drown
    - burned?
    - burned, but did not burn
    - hmm .. can it really repair?
    - so the money has already gone .. well, according to the old scheme ..
    - and how much now? .. how much? .. well, well .. let's see. in the meantime, double the amount and give it to the press - as a result of the fire, the damage amounted to ..
    () all matches are completely random
  17. Pecheneg
    Pecheneg 19 December 2019 09: 30
    +1
    They wrote off money as a loss under the guise and put it in their personal pockets. For 95 billion 40 Su-57 could be contracted.
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  21. kudma
    kudma 19 December 2019 09: 57
    0
    Cut this junk into needles. It’s better to build other ships with this money. How much can you already suffer with him and throw money away.
  22. Sashka
    Sashka 19 December 2019 10: 23
    +3
    I think it’s easier, they’ve cut money, and now they’re sweeping tracks ...
    We have "mastered" the budget allocated for repairs, and now everything has "burned out". And now you can't prove anything.
    This is how Taiga burns, "spontaneously ignites" in 5 places, in those areas where the Chinese cut down.
    And Kuzyu, I think, will be sent to the scrap ...
  23. bogart047
    bogart047 19 December 2019 10: 24
    +1
    only one thing will help - to shoot the guilty
  24. Jack O'Neill
    Jack O'Neill 19 December 2019 10: 25
    +3
    Considering such costs for "Kuzya", it is worth asking yourself the question: is it worth it?
    It’s a very problematic ship, especially for us, since we are not the richest country (even we are not included in the top 10 economies of the world).
    Of course, we need such a ship, like aviation in the ocean. But the ship is needed so that it’s not standing at the berth all its life and doesn’t get up after a repair trip!
    On the one hand, the costs of the Kuzya are too high, on the other hand, the need for naval aviation and this type of ships in our Navy.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  25. Kosty
    Kosty 19 December 2019 10: 27
    +2
    Counted too fast, it doesn’t.
    1. Victorio
      Victorio 19 December 2019 12: 23
      0
      Quote: Kosty
      Counted too fast, it doesn’t.

      ===
      the main thing for a newspaper is to "hyip" first, someone clearly does not finalize on the part of jurisprudence, I think in the states such things from the media can cost a pretty penny
  26. V.I.P.
    V.I.P. 19 December 2019 10: 59
    0
    Interestingly, with such damage, they will continue to repair it? Or with this money they decide to buy extra frigates, or maybe they will try to make VNEU for submarines? In my opinion, repairs are no longer needed. It will drag on for 10 years, they will saw a lot of money, and when they do, it is the Indians and Chinese who will write off their analogues as obsolete ....
  27. fa2998
    fa2998 19 December 2019 11: 09
    0
    What a bad thing, the fall of the crane is 70 billion, the fire is 95 billion, and the repairs will take another year. sad hi
  28. Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich
    Abrosimov Sergey Olegovich 19 December 2019 14: 58
    0
    Dear forum experts in the field of the Navy and shipbuilding, clarify this question: Admiral Kuznetsov is not scolded only by the lazy. He is called a pre-aircraft carrier, the most unsuccessful aircraft carrier in history, they say that he has extremely weak missile weapons and an insufficient aviation group ...
    There is only one conclusion: the ship is absolutely nowhere to be used; it does not represent combat value.
    Suppose
    However, some repairs were carried out on it, now there was a fire, as a result of which a lot of things will need to be changed ...
    So question 1: is it possible (price is a minor issue) to carry out such a reconstruction of Admiral Kuznetsov, as a result of which he will turn into a real aircraft carrier, which could be proud of as a masterpiece of shipbuilding art and which would have real combat value?
    Question 2: what, in your opinion, needs to be done (in addition to the notorious replacement of boilers)?
  29. Lone gunman
    Lone gunman 19 December 2019 18: 22
    0
    We need to ask Putin about 95 billion rubles ... interestingly, the utilization and construction of 2 new AUGs will be less than 95 billion. ?!
  30. Petrol cutter
    Petrol cutter 19 December 2019 18: 51
    +3
    I am not inclined to seriously discuss the statements of a newspaper, which has nothing to do with ship repair in general, or with ships in particular. People write, just to write.
    Nobody, ever to any "Kommersant" at the plant will ever disclose (especially about such losses). Bo for such disclosure, they will figure out and fire tomorrow. And they can also plant. And they will do the right thing.
    Because everyone working in such factories gives an appropriate subscription. I in the North, gave three times.
    Therefore, you and I were not there, we didn’t make any troubleshooting, what was there, but how — we have no idea. We will leave the business to professionals on site. And all the best to the Kommersant newspaper. hi
    1. Paranoid50
      Paranoid50 19 December 2019 20: 31
      +1
      Quote: Benzorez
      Let professionals do business on site.

      Well, what are you, Vitaliy, how can you ?! What kind of professionals ?! Everything fell into the ears of comrades, and the chime went ... fellow Moreover, judging by the reaction, many "guardians-detractors" literally at a low start expected such news. It is, of course, when everything goes to "NO", they will roll back, regroup and hang for a while in standby mode ... until the next news. Someone has such a job, and someone
      banal information junkie, fried hunter. yes hi
  31. Petrol cutter
    Petrol cutter 19 December 2019 19: 26
    +3
    "At the same time it became known that there were containers with tens of tons of engine oil and diesel fuel on board (a total of about 170 tons). It is said that these containers were not damaged."
    Apparently these same tanks were called by a proud name, fuel tanks?!. In this connection, they should have suffered?!. Was the torpedo attack on the ship? Wonders....
  32. Vladimir Fedin
    Vladimir Fedin 19 December 2019 19: 46
    +1
    Kommersant "is now something like" AIDS-info ". They carry any blizzard, referring to" certain "sources.