Military Review

The Sukhoi Design Bureau showed a photo with a full-size layout of the Soviet C-22

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The Sukhoi Design Bureau showed a photo with a full-size layout of the Soviet C-22

For the 80 anniversary, Sukhoi Design Bureau presented unique images that capture one of the stages of the C-22 program.


We are talking about the Soviet program to create the latest fighter, the parameters of which, according to today's "standards", relate to the fifth generation fighter.

On photo Sukhoi a full-size model of the aircraft is presented, which in the framework of the mentioned C-22 program was designated as Su-47 (in the end, it was different from the presented version).

This is a fighter with an aerodynamic layout, which provided for the use of a reverse sweep wing.


A unique photograph of the nozzle is also demonstrated. As you can see, the Soviet developers intended to create a nozzle flat - for the operation of promising aircraft engines.




Almost 37 years have passed since the start of development, but to this day it is this type of nozzle that is considered the most progressive and fully appropriate means aviation new generations. Recall that in our country, work is underway on an attack drone under the S-70 program (heavy strike UAV “Okhotnik”), which ultimately should lead to the creation of an aircraft with a flat nozzle. At the moment, flight tests of the "Hunter" with the initial version of the nozzle are being conducted.

Previously, the UAV made a pair flight with a fifth-generation fighter Su-57.

The American F-22 and F-35 fighters (both the fifth generation) could take a lot from Soviet developments. In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.
Photos used:
Sukhoi Design Bureau (booklet for the 80 anniversary), https: //saidpvo.livejournal.com/
128 comments
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  1. rocket757
    rocket757 16 December 2019 09: 47
    +43
    It’s like a reminder for what we’ve lost!
    You can get upset, but you have to go forward!
    1. carstorm 11
      carstorm 11 16 December 2019 09: 52
      +22
      in general, this program was closed in 88)
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 16 December 2019 10: 04
        +5
        Quote: carstorm 11
        in general, this program was closed in 88)

        Learn from mistakes .... nothing happens in vain, despite the time and resources spent!
      2. Per se.
        Per se. 16 December 2019 10: 13
        +14
        Quote: carstorm 11
        this program was closed in 88
        The idea of ​​a "tsar torpedo" was closed in the USSR much earlier, but it came in handy ...
        I decided that such a carrier could be a large torpedo launched from a submarine. I fantasized that it was possible to develop a direct-flow water-steam atomic jet engine for such a torpedo. The target of an attack from a distance of several hundred kilometers should be the ports of the enemy. <…> The body of such a torpedo can be made very durable, it is not afraid of mines and barrage nets. Of course, the destruction of ports - both by a surface explosion of a torpedo with a 100-megaton charge that "jumped out" of the water, and by an underwater explosion - inevitably involves very large human casualties. One of the first people with whom I discussed this project was Rear Admiral Fomin ... He was shocked by the "cannibalistic nature" of the project and noticed in a conversation with me that naval sailors were used to fighting an armed enemy in open combat and that the very thought was disgusting for him about such a massacre. I was ashamed and never discussed this project with anyone again.
        - A. Sakharov “The Cosmic World”: TSAR-TORPEDA

        The idea to cause an artificial tsunami by a powerful (up to 100 megatons tons) explosion near the US coast belongs to academician Lavrentiev. In 1962, he wrote a memorandum to Khrushchev, on whose initiative experiments were conducted to test the effects of a powerful coastal underwater explosion at the Central Research Institute-12 of the Ministry of Defense. Their results showed that, regardless of the power of the underwater explosion, real damage could be caused to US coastal facilities at a distance of 2, a maximum of 5 km from the water edge.
        With the current "effective managers", optimizations and reductions in science and production, much more from the ideas and developments of the USSR will have to be remembered.
      3. keeper03
        keeper03 16 December 2019 17: 07
        +2
        The Chinese J-20 is very similar to the C-22! yes belay
      4. aybolyt678
        aybolyt678 16 December 2019 21: 12
        +2
        Quote: carstorm 11
        in general, this program was closed in 88)

        traitors shut angry
    2. Aerodrome
      Aerodrome 16 December 2019 09: 53
      +38
      The Sukhoi Design Bureau showed a photo with a full-size layout of the Soviet C-22
      showed the "backward USSR" ... crying
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 16 December 2019 10: 06
        +23
        Quote: Aerodrome
        The Sukhoi Design Bureau showed a photo with a full-size layout of the Soviet C-22
        showed the "backward USSR" ... crying

        Yes, such "backward" that many wrote with joy when they managed to stop our great country.
        Okay, let's not look back! There will be another holiday on our Zarechnaya street!
        1. Aerodrome
          Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 34
          +10
          Quote: rocket757
          Okay, let's not look back! There will be another holiday on our Zarechnaya street!

          one humorist said something like: "and the music will play, but you will not hear it ..." I mean that age will not allow you to look at the Normal country. maybe the grandchildren will be lucky, but I don’t envy, it’s worse than living in an "era of change". However, you need to get out of the ERovskaya quagmire.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 16 December 2019 11: 04
            +5
            Quote: Aerodrome
            I mean, age will not allow you to look at a Normal country.

            This is normal, it is natural, we will sit together on the clouds and rejoice for our descendants, COUNTRY!
            1. Aerodrome
              Aerodrome 16 December 2019 12: 22
              +4
              Quote: rocket757
              Quote: Aerodrome
              I mean, age will not allow you to look at a Normal country.

              This is normal, it is natural, we will sit together on the clouds and rejoice for our descendants, COUNTRY!

              drinks
          2. bober1982
            bober1982 16 December 2019 12: 04
            +14
            Quote: Aerodrome
            one comedian said something like that

            It was not a comedian who said so, he said - a holder of the Order of the Red Star and two Orders of Glory.
            1. Aerodrome
              Aerodrome 16 December 2019 12: 27
              +17
              Quote: bober1982

              one humorist said something like: "and the music will play, but you will not hear it ..

              right .. Great Actor ..
              1. NordUral
                NordUral 16 December 2019 13: 17
                +8
                Or can we do everything so that THEIR music is silent?
          3. NordUral
            NordUral 16 December 2019 12: 21
            +15
            Airfield! And I, at least a little over 70, I hope to see! Time has accelerated, and these they are doing everything so that all the people wake up and shake off the thieves mold.
            1. rocket757
              rocket757 16 December 2019 12: 34
              +7
              Quote: NordUral
              And I, at least a little over 70, I hope to see! Time has accelerated

              Time has accelerated, only our society, like a bear after hibernation, roars, roars the right weed, and then no way, until the whole body wakes up completely! No business except the roar .... how long will this continue ???
              1. NordUral
                NordUral 16 December 2019 12: 37
                +9
                I hope that the sense of self-preservation and parental love for children and grandchildren, great-grandchildren will wake us up and reason us out of a dull and relatively well-fed numbness. But there’s not much time for this, and you don’t have time to wake up. And finally, leaders should appear in the people who can lead to beneficial changes in the country.
                1. rocket757
                  rocket757 16 December 2019 13: 31
                  +5
                  Quote: NordUral
                  I hope that the sense of self-preservation and parental love for children and grandchildren-great-grandchildren will wake up and reason

                  But this is a big question! So it’s easier, I put the child under the nose a TV, game console, computer, smartphone and all business !!!
                  Previously, grandparents trusted children, but there is LIVING COMMUNICATION, and their ancestors will not teach a bad kid!
                  In general, the "unexpected" awaits many !!! A roasted rooster is already coming to them!
                  1. NordUral
                    NordUral 16 December 2019 13: 34
                    +4
                    Hmm, they did their sad contribution, Victor, sometimes such thoughts also come. But still I hope.
                    1. rocket757
                      rocket757 16 December 2019 13: 41
                      +7
                      Quote: NordUral
                      But still I hope.

                      I study with teenagers, teach them practical tricks ... it really hinders the fact that children are not ready to break away from their phone games !!! We have to admonish parents, otherwise nothing.
                      And it is in the VILLAGE !!! What is happening in the cities?
              2. aybolyt678
                aybolyt678 16 December 2019 21: 15
                0
                Quote: rocket757
                that's how long it will last ???

                to a leader who finds the right idea, or to the degeneration of all Russia.
                And the idea should be very simple: Stalin is the continuer of the work of Jesus Christ, the builder of the kingdom of God on Earth !!! exaggerate a little of course smile
            2. Aerodrome
              Aerodrome 16 December 2019 12: 43
              +5
              Quote: NordUral
              Airfield! And I, at least a little over 70, I hope to see! Time has accelerated, and these people are doing everything to ensure that all the people woke up and shook off the thieves' mold.

              hi less "shiysat" almost, your optimism pleases, but your health says something else. Yes, I don't care, I want my grandchildren to at least see a completely different life, not a social rip-off, but a Social State. yes
              1. NordUral
                NordUral 16 December 2019 13: 14
                +10
                We must live in such a way that our grandchildren do not curse us for our dull obedience to the fate prepared for us by those who are now in power. The death of the Union is already on my generation, but we can at least try to justify ourselves that we were deceived.
                But now there are no more illusions, as there will be no forgiveness for us if we surrender to the thieves seized power.
            3. ultra
              ultra 16 December 2019 15: 12
              +2
              Quote: NordUral
              And I, at least a little over 70, I hope to see!

              You’re an optimist! I’m a little over 50, but not your optimism. hi
              1. NordUral
                NordUral 16 December 2019 15: 44
                +11
                Michael, I’m a moderate optimist, without pink glasses in front of my eyes. And hope gives me the conviction that we can’t disappear so stupidly. Since the imperious organized crime group is completely numb and already openly laughs in our eyes.
                And I hope that it is the stupid arrogance of thieves and their servants that will finally reveal even to the most stubborn, believers of the good king and bad boyars, that this is one gang that leads the country to death.
        2. NEXUS
          NEXUS 16 December 2019 11: 09
          +5
          Quote: rocket757
          Yes, such "backward" that many wrote with joy when they managed to stop our great country.

          And the lantern is without binding ... here many experts were very indignant that the 57th lantern had a binding, from which the EPR suffers very much ... 88, a lantern without it.
          1. rocket757
            rocket757 16 December 2019 11: 14
            +4
            Quote: NEXUS
            And the lantern is without binding ...

            This is all an experimental model, not the fact that such a flashlight was provided for in the combat model.
            This is a matter of technology, is it or not. Could then do the like of proper quality, reliability?
            1. NEXUS
              NEXUS 16 December 2019 11: 16
              +14
              Quote: rocket757
              Could then do the like of proper quality, reliability?

              I'm sure technologies could and were. Unlike modern Russia, the USSR was de facto an industrial superpower without but and if. That is why now we continue to feed on the backlog of the Union.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 16 December 2019 11: 22
                +9
                Quote: NEXUS
                Unlike modern Russia, the USSR was de facto an industrial superpower without but and if.

                I listened to the story of a former compatriot how they at the research institute solved the problem of glue with the necessary properties in a couple of days !!! I could not even imagine that the adhesive BUSTILAT was created / invented by our technologists in TWO DAYS!
                In the USSR there was a great SCIENCE !!! in the service of the national economy and generally wherever necessary. In Russia, even with leftovers from the past, everything is not easy, according to Satanovsky and many others !!!
            2. Sentinel-vs
              Sentinel-vs 16 December 2019 12: 45
              +3
              This is not an experimental sample, but a full-size layout. Before the flight prototypes still very good. far from the layout and the appearance may change in many ways.
              If technology could and would make an unbinding lamp on serial samples of technology, then they would. L-logic.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 16 December 2019 13: 32
                +3
                Quote: Sentinel-vs
                If technology could and would do

                If it is NECESSARY, then technologies were developed, then!
              2. NEXUS
                NEXUS 16 December 2019 15: 21
                +3
                Quote: Sentinel-vs
                If technology could and would make an unbinding lamp on serial samples of technology, then they would. L-logic.

                For your logic, I have my own logic. If, in your opinion, the taillightless lamp was stuck there from Balda, then didn’t they put atomic dviguns or laser guns there? This is the layout.
                So the breadboard model, but also flat nozzles and a tanning lamp on the model assumed their presence on a serial machine.
            3. Doliva63
              Doliva63 16 December 2019 17: 37
              +3
              Quote: rocket757
              Quote: NEXUS
              And the lantern is without binding ...

              This is all an experimental model, not the fact that such a flashlight was provided for in the combat model.
              This is a matter of technology, is it or not. Could then do the like of proper quality, reliability?

              In the Union, it seems, the MiG-25 had problems with a flashlight. But still they were decided back in the 60s, so by the 80s, the scientific and technical groundwork was probably.
              1. rocket757
                rocket757 16 December 2019 17: 53
                +6
                Quote: Doliva63
                But still they were decided back in the 60s, so by the 80s, the scientific and technical backlog was probably

                So we are about the same! In the USSR there was SCIENCE, problems were solved as they arose. Of course, at the technological level that was in the industry.
                If it was absolutely NECESSARY, they created everything that was necessary.
                The same "Buran" there is so much invented, created and implemented, it is impossible to count!
                This is the legacy of our great country ... now I would continue to increase it !!!! Ehhhh ... no further words, just pee pee pee
          2. The comment was deleted.
            1. NEXUS
              NEXUS 16 December 2019 15: 18
              +1
              Quote: Aerodrome
              duck and "raid" he has no trouble ... then you past the box office Andryukha remember how the 25th lanterns "melted? ...

              No ... here I fell into the hole. I will explain ... we stupidly lost many technologies of the USSR or simply forgot. And I’m more than sure that the USSR had already had the technology of unbinding lantern. Already in material science, the USSR was de facto ahead of the rest.
              And to sculpt on the model of Th at will also did not sculpt. After all, you don’t even stutter about the fact that this model has nozzles with flat nozzles, ala Lizard. By the way, number 22 in this regard is very much in topic.
              I repeat, the USSR was a technological industrial superpower. If not all, then a lot could be there. Because there was a base, brains, school and understanding.
              Stealth is not invented in the United States.
              And about the 25th ... then there was no such task. He performed his functions and so beautifully performed. And why improve what already worked and did everything that was required of him at that time?
      2. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 16 December 2019 10: 16
        0
        Quote: Aerodrome
        showed the "backward USSR" ...

        Are they showing us advanced Russia now? Was it not soon that they appointed themselves "pedagogues"? Or has the white flag stopped obscuring the eye? Or have you listened to streams of slander?
        In the USSR in 1982 there were no such technologies and materials to sculpt a product in kind. Now you can try, is it necessary? Reverse sweep is useful for carrier-based aviation, but we (according to the latest reports) have no deck ...
        1. Aerodrome
          Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 37
          +2
          Quote: ROSS 42
          And now they show us advanced Russia?

          you have absolutely bad with Chew? don't you see sarcasm? request
          1. Ross xnumx
            Ross xnumx 16 December 2019 10: 47
            -1
            Quote: Aerodrome
            you have absolutely bad with Chew? don't you see sarcasm?

            Have you noticed the irony?
            1. Aerodrome
              Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 52
              +1
              Quote: ROSS 42
              Quote: Aerodrome
              you have absolutely bad with Chew? don't you see sarcasm?

              Have you noticed the irony?

              call me ... hastily ... hi
      3. knn54
        knn54 16 December 2019 10: 42
        0
        The question is why SU-57 has a "TRADITIONAL" swept wing?
        1. Operator
          Operator 16 December 2019 11: 07
          +13
          Because the wing with reverse sweep works only on the sound.
      4. Proton
        Proton 16 December 2019 10: 56
        +2
        So otsyali that for 30 years we can’t catch up with what was wassat
    3. Odati71
      Odati71 16 December 2019 09: 55
      -11
      It even flew. Golden eagle project. But bad and with problems.
      1. Aerodrome
        Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 01
        +4
        Quote: Odati71
        It even flew. Golden eagle project. But bad and with problems.

        for 37 years, not bad ... the Yankees drooled.
        1. carstorm 11
          carstorm 11 16 December 2019 10: 08
          +4
          Golden eagle is already for the Navy sort of like the deck did. if memory doesn’t change but everything began as promising for the Air Force. then at 88 they closed the project.
        2. Kirill Dou
          Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 10: 13
          -7
          what did they drool for? In 1984, they raised their experimental back-wing fighter into the air. 13 years before the first flight of the Su-47.
          1. carstorm 11
            carstorm 11 16 December 2019 10: 21
            +7
            it's not just a back wing)

            Germans flew even earlier) the point is the concept of a promising fighter. and there are a lot of things)
            1. Kirill Dou
              Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 10: 29
              +1
              the point is the concept of a promising fighter. and there are a lot of things)
              - So the American experimental Northrop Grumman X-29 was also created as part of the concept of a new promising fighter.

              my comment referred to the words "Americans were drooling." By the time the Berkut flew, the Americans had been using their experimental Northrop Grumman X-13 with a reverse wing for 29 years, and at the same time they were developing a really promising and breakthrough Raptor. Which, we note, went into series, and did not remain a flying laboratory in a single copy.
          2. Vladimir_2U
            Vladimir_2U 16 December 2019 10: 33
            +2
            Quote: Kirill Dou
            experimental fighter

            There from the fighter a set of nodes from different cars. There is no radar, no sighting systems, no suspension, no fighter.))
            1. Kirill Dou
              Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 10: 51
              -8
              Cram into the glider radar, sights and weapons of labor would not be special.
              1. Vladimir_2U
                Vladimir_2U 16 December 2019 11: 14
                +6
                Quote: Kirill Dou
                Cram into the airborne radar, sights and weapons of labor would not be special
                Pf, really, balancing, weight distribution, power supply, shifting the aerodynamic focus - some rubbish. Without much labor, it means without much labor. It is a pity that the people are not in the know.
                1. Kirill Dou
                  Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 12: 37
                  -6
                  Oh, damn it, seriously? To distribute avionics and armament to the developed glider in such a way as to preserve its flying qualities - is this such a fundamentally big task? Do you want to threaten it for decades?)
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            2. Good_Anonymous
              Good_Anonymous 16 December 2019 20: 52
              -2
              Quote: Vladimir_2U
              There is no radar, no sighting systems, no suspension, no fighter.))


              And the plane - is and flies (more precisely, it was and was flying). Unlike the layout.

              By the way, the X-29 fulfilled its task - it showed that the reverse sweep wing is unprofitable. Sukhoi Design Bureau reached the same conclusions in 10-15 years.
          3. Aerodrome
            Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 38
            +1
            Quote: Kirill Dou
            what did they drool for? In 1984, they raised their experimental back-wing fighter into the air. 13 years before the first flight of the Su-47.

            and? our "laboratory" still flies, and even at parades. and where are they?
            1. Kirill Dou
              Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 10: 58
              +3
              The American X-29 made a total of 374 flights. Will "Berkut" have enough?

              and in parades even
              - what an achievement))

              still flies
              - does not fly. At MAX-2019, he stood on a static exposition. Since 2007, the only copy is in the Gromov Museum.
              1. fighter angel
                fighter angel 16 December 2019 12: 42
                -1
                Yes, at least 100500 flights X-29 made.
                What's next?
                He did NOT become a prototype of a fighter!
                As he was an easy demonstrator of CBS technologies, so he remained.
                1. Kirill Dou
                  Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 13: 53
                  +2
                  He did NOT become a prototype of a fighter!
                  - And the S-47 became the prototype of a serial fighter? In which universe?
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                  2. fighter angel
                    fighter angel 17 December 2019 10: 33
                    +5
                    The "specialist" who is kirill dou!
                    And you, dear man, "snitch", it turns out!
                    Modera quietly complained, I thought no one would recognize ...
                    It’s not manly. And not honestly on your part.
                    Normal people warn those to whom there are complaints.
                    And only then they file a complaint to the moderator.

                    But back to the topic of dispute.
                    Firstly, not S-47, but either S-37 or Su-47. Learn at last the already competent name of the aircraft!
                    And secondly, in our universe! Became one of the prototypes of the T-50, aka PAK FA, and also in the Su-57 series. As far as it is possible to learn from the declassified data, the Su-47 most of the flights, and their number is quite impressive (no matter how you would like to see the opposite), made in the interests of the PAK FA program, the development of stealth technologies, and also, one of the tasks, on it was spent, was the placement of missile weapons inside the fuselage.
                    Third: In the same way with the Yankees: X-29 became one of the intermediate stages of work on the Fu-22 / Fu-35, although they do not advertise this.
                    Fourth: It is absolutely incorrect to compare the Kh-29 and the Su-47. Our Berkut is a full-fledged fighter, albeit an experimental one. With working avionics and weapons, built-in cannon and 8 tons of combat load, with a twin-engine power plant, its dimensions are 3 times larger than the American "bike" X-29 with one engine, which has no avionics and no weapons. Moreover, the very possibility of placing this all on the X-29 simply does not exist. "Bicycle" - it is "bicycle".
          4. ultra
            ultra 16 December 2019 15: 17
            +1
            Quote: Kirill Dou
            In 1984, they raised their experimental back-wing fighter into the air.

            Are you sure about this? Was it a fighter?
            1. Kirill Dou
              Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 15: 26
              -1
              It was exactly the prototype of a fighter, yes.
              1. fighter angel
                fighter angel 17 December 2019 11: 06
                0
                Never a prototype fighter!
                Light jet aircraft, "worker" of the KOS concept.
                Pure unarmed "experimentalist".
        3. Zaurbek
          Zaurbek 16 December 2019 10: 34
          +4
          Yankers at the same time developed F22 and F23 ...
          1. Aerodrome
            Aerodrome 16 December 2019 10: 55
            -2
            Quote: Zaurbek
            F23 ...
            how much ?
            1. Kirill Dou
              Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 11: 02
              +1
              2 copies. 2 times more than "Berkuts".
            2. Zaurbek
              Zaurbek 16 December 2019 11: 48
              +4
              Moreover, turbojet engines too .....
      2. rocket757
        rocket757 16 December 2019 10: 09
        +2
        Problems are solved with due persistence and investment of labor / funds.
        Concepts are also changing / correcting. Simple \ difficult, but solvable.
    4. Azazelo
      Azazelo 16 December 2019 11: 30
      +5
      As the dude said on the channel "Time Forward", we (Russia) need to catch up not with the Americans, not the Germans, but ourselves in the past.
      1. Zaurbek
        Zaurbek 16 December 2019 11: 50
        +3
        Rather, repeat the experience of the first five-year plans for the development of advanced developments in the West. And, in addition, methods of commercialization of these developments.
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    6. ruslanverchenko
      ruslanverchenko 16 December 2019 17: 33
      +1
      Yes, that's right, you don’t have to live by memories .. but create them ..
    7. maidan.izrailovich
      maidan.izrailovich 17 December 2019 07: 14
      +3
      .... You can get upset ....

      We must not be sad, but draw conclusions and learn from mistakes. In order not to step on the same rake in the future.

      And with this I also agree:
      ... you have to go forward !.
      .
      1. rocket757
        rocket757 17 December 2019 07: 19
        +1
        Quote: ruslanverchenko
        Yes, that's right, you don’t have to live by memories .. but create them ..

        Quote: maidan.izrailovich
        draw conclusions and learn from mistakes.

        All right, that’s what we are talking about! There are still many ahead of us, many different things waiting for us !!!
    8. zombirusrev
      zombirusrev 21 December 2019 14: 56
      0
      "Get sad!" (C);))))))))))))))))))))))
      With this attitude, Hitler can also be justified. Guilty must answer in all severity!
  2. V1er
    V1er 16 December 2019 09: 48
    +1
    What a handsome man!
  3. Alexander Suvorov
    Alexander Suvorov 16 December 2019 09: 48
    +5
    Yes, a lot of things were developed under the USSR breakthrough. Many developments of that time just now saw the light. And how much the Americans stubborn during the fight-drunk ...
    1. bessmertniy
      bessmertniy 16 December 2019 09: 57
      0
      It is a pity for the stolen one, but the main thing is new developments that should bring our defense industry to technological leadership, and - so that they do not get to the enemy.
  4. MoJloT
    MoJloT 16 December 2019 09: 50
    +3
    Almost 37 years have passed since the start of development, but to this day it is precisely this type of nozzle that is considered the most progressive and fully.
  5. Gosh 60
    Gosh 60 16 December 2019 09: 51
    +1
    American F-22 and F-35 fighters (both fifth generation) could take a lot from Soviet developments. In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.

    They not only could - they absorbed! How much? History is silent.
  6. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 16 December 2019 09: 51
    -3
    Beautiful ... Like a bird.
  7. Vladimir_2U
    Vladimir_2U 16 December 2019 09: 53
    +1
    The layout of the nozzles is good, but the air intakes are not visible at all.
    1. Zaurbek
      Zaurbek 16 December 2019 10: 35
      +2
      On the Golden Eagle on top of them, too, is not visible
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 16 December 2019 10: 46
        0
        Photo "Berkut", bottom view, complete. If this is the same on the layout, then with stealth in front everything is not very good.
  8. Odati71
    Odati71 16 December 2019 09: 53
    +2
    Reverse sweep proved to be poor in strength parameters. And how such a nozzle will be with a variable vector or down with super maneuverability.
    1. K-612-O
      K-612-O 16 December 2019 09: 57
      +1
      On the Raptor is just UVT, though only vertically
    2. ultra
      ultra 16 December 2019 15: 20
      +1
      Quote: Odati71
      And how such a nozzle will be with a variable vector

      It is with the variable, but only in the vertical plane.
  9. Pavel57
    Pavel57 16 December 2019 09: 56
    +2
    His draft 1-42 went around.
    1. Pete mitchell
      Pete mitchell 16 December 2019 10: 07
      +3
      37 years old, but still looks relevant today, stunned .. As the classic said there - Yes, there were people nowadays, not like ...
      1. NEXUS
        NEXUS 16 December 2019 10: 39
        +2
        Quote: Pete Mitchell
        37 years old, but still looks relevant today, stunned .. As the classic said there - Yes, there were people nowadays, not like ...

        I’m sure that I would give the Raptor 100 points ahead ... if it weren’t for the leaders of the top pros-haters and sellers of the USSR, today we would fly on flying saucers no worse than aliens.
        1. Pete mitchell
          Pete mitchell 16 December 2019 11: 21
          +4
          As Stanislavsky said - live in the proposed circumstances . Lermontov closer, those people themselves created circumstances for half the world. I repeat: the Russian Federation behaves like a magnanimous bear, but it has long been clear that it turned out to be at the table with cheaters - keep the candelabra at hand and be ready to embed ... They didn’t understand, they don’t understand and they won’t understand
          1. NEXUS
            NEXUS 16 December 2019 11: 24
            +2
            Quote: Pete Mitchell
            RF behaves like a generous bear

            No, not like that ... we were hoping that like that ... a noble bear, and all that. But in fact, looking at what our helmsmen are doing, this is called a simple word, prostitution. There is nobility, respect for their land, homeland and people, but their own selfish interests and nothing more. And these glavnyuki are no better than those who sit in Berlin, Washington or London.
            1. Pete mitchell
              Pete mitchell 16 December 2019 11: 29
              +3
              Quote: NEXUS
              No, not like that ... we were hoping it was like that.

              I probably want to believe in the best, but I do not rule out the possibility that you are right. It is a pity that in foreign policy Russia does not follow the precepts of Catherine the Great
            2. Pete mitchell
              Pete mitchell 16 December 2019 13: 35
              +3
              I want to believe that there is a long game plan ... “Russia is reproached for being isolated and silent in the face of facts that are not in harmony with either law or justice. They say that Russia is angry. Russia is not angry, Russia is focusing. ”A.M. Gorchakov.
            3. Doliva63
              Doliva63 16 December 2019 17: 47
              +2
              Quote: NEXUS
              Quote: Pete Mitchell
              RF behaves like a generous bear

              No, not like that ... we were hoping that like that ... a noble bear, and all that. But in fact, looking at what our helmsmen are doing, this is called a simple word, prostitution. There is nobility, respect for their land, homeland and people, but their own selfish interests and nothing more. And these glavnyuki are no better than those who sit in Berlin, Washington or London.

              "... have their own selfish interests and nothing more."
              Does capitalism mean anything else?
        2. Good_Anonymous
          Good_Anonymous 16 December 2019 20: 54
          +2
          Quote: NEXUS
          Raptor sure 100 points forward would give


          I would not give it. They decided to build the Su-57 with a normal wing and nozzles.
          1. Kirill Dou
            Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 23: 49
            +1
            Let people dream about a future that has not come true and will never come true already)
            1. Good_Anonymous
              Good_Anonymous 17 December 2019 12: 23
              +1
              So this version of the future, one might say, came true in the form of "Berkut". But, as it turned out, there are more problems than benefits from CBS.
  10. Paul Siebert
    Paul Siebert 16 December 2019 10: 05
    0
    It looks very futuristic! I can’t even believe that the project is about forty years old!
    I hope that the ideas embodied in the layout are alive.
    It is necessary to move forward. But do not forget the best practices of the past.
  11. Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 16 December 2019 10: 08
    +1
    The American F-22 and F-35 fighters (both the fifth generation) could take a lot from Soviet developments. In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.

    They could have absorbed and absorbed ... There are a lot of things that the EBN Democrats presented. By the way, about:
    these Russian "ordinary polymers"

    https://topwar.ru/29719-zachem-russkie-otdali-ssha-svoy-uran-i-otdali-li.html
    1. Good_Anonymous
      Good_Anonymous 16 December 2019 21: 01
      0
      Quote: ROSS 42
      Could absorb and absorb ...


      Do not confuse - F-35 copied from the Yak-141 feel
  12. Kirill Dou
    Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 10: 10
    -10
    American fighters F-22 and F-35 (both the fifth generation) could take a lot from Soviet developments. In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.


    Where the author noticed the similarity between the classic layout with a conventional wing in American aircraft and a "canard" with a PGO and a forward-swept wing is anyone's guess.

    could take a lot from Soviet developments.
    - Is it such a consolation, or what? Like, of course, we didn’t have it brought to mind, but without our developments there wouldn’t be your F-22/35

    But what the glider shown in the photo really looks like is the Northrop Grumman X-29 aircraft. The only problem is that this plane first took to the air back in 1984. So, rather, these are just Russian fighters "could have absorbed many American developments."
    1. Pavel57
      Pavel57 16 December 2019 11: 39
      +4
      The first jet aircraft with a sweep wing was the German bunker Junkers Ju-287 (1944).
      1. Kirill Dou
        Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 12: 40
        -3
        Quote: Pavel57
        The first jet aircraft with a sweep wing was the German bunker Junkers Ju-28
        - Well, you look at the Junkers with a classic aerodynamic design, and the American X-29 with a morning design and front horizontal tail. And you will understand which of them the S-22 glider looked more like.
        1. Pavel57
          Pavel57 16 December 2019 18: 48
          0
          Many planes are similar, the S-37 / Su-47 has a fence similar to Rafal’s, and what of this?
          The duck pattern has been known since the birth of aviation. The first Soviet duck aircraft was made in 1945.
          Each scheme has its pros and cons.
          It is a mistake to assume that C-22 is copied from X-29.
          1. Kirill Dou
            Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 18: 59
            0
            It is a mistake to assume that C-22 is copied from X-29.
            - I just pointed out their similarity in response to this passage in the article:
            The American F-22 and F-35 fighters (both the fifth generation) could take a lot from Soviet developments. In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.


            Agree, the American "fives" are much less similar to the C-22 than the C-22 is similar to the X-29.
            1. Pavel57
              Pavel57 16 December 2019 19: 30
              -1
              But it does not seem that the F-22 is similar to the F-15, but that one is just a copy of the MiG-25.
              1. Kirill Dou
                Kirill Dou 17 December 2019 00: 00
                -3
                Read carefully: my comment about the similarities between S-22 and X-29 was a response to the aforementioned passage from the article.
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  13. Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 16 December 2019 10: 21
    +1
    Developments of the USSR are still used in Russia and in the USA (those that were able to buy, steal, etc.)
  14. Sentinel-vs
    Sentinel-vs 16 December 2019 10: 33
    +1
    Quote: rocket757
    It’s like a reminder for what we’ve lost!
    You can get upset, but you have to go forward!

    Are you sure that we have lost something and no one is moving forward? Only NOW it became known about these developments of the USSR, who can say with confidence that various breakthrough concepts that we will learn about no sooner than a dozen years are not being developed and tested now?
  15. The comment was deleted.
  16. Lone gunman
    Lone gunman 16 December 2019 11: 01
    -4
    "American fighters F-22 and F-35 (both - the fifth generation)" ... F-35))), what are you doing ?! The F-35 is not some kind of 5th generation, but a 4 ++ * aircraft, in vertical takeoff and landing, namely takeoff, it can hover, which means it can take off without "special" problems. But the car ... is good for NATO countries, we could have done better, well, this is for NATO countries, and so it goes. Scribes)))
    1. Good_Anonymous
      Good_Anonymous 16 December 2019 21: 03
      -1
      Quote: Lone gunman
      F-35 is not not the 5th generation, but a 4 ++ * airplane, in vertical take-off and landing


      If you are so accurate, then do not attribute the F-35 to vertical take-off.
      1. Lone gunman
        Lone gunman 16 December 2019 23: 57
        0
        Russian simplicity ... look at 22:22 very "interesting" shots)))
        1. Good_Anonymous
          Good_Anonymous 17 December 2019 12: 20
          0
          AND? He cannot take off vertically with fuel and weapons (like Harrier or Yak) and is not intended for this. He cannot even sit upright with a combat load.

          Or, if you think the F-35 is capable of vertical take-off, consider it also capable of afterburning supercruise - it accelerates in afterburner, then flies several tens of kilometers without overburning in supersonic.
          1. Lone gunman
            Lone gunman 17 December 2019 17: 59
            0
            ))) and the point.
            1. Good_Anonymous
              Good_Anonymous 17 December 2019 22: 51
              0
              Quote: Lone gunman
              and point.


              No questions.
  17. Dmitry Vyazmenskiy
    Dmitry Vyazmenskiy 16 December 2019 11: 18
    0
    Maybe they closed it because it does not meet the necessary requirements, and the monkeys from .... licked! But God sees everything!))
  18. opus
    opus 16 December 2019 13: 32
    -2
    Quote: Author
    The Sukhoi Design Bureau showed a photo with a full-size layout of the Soviet C-22

    only the OKB "Sukhoi" do not know what they showed

    appeared all 14 hours ago:

    provides a link to

    but he doesn’t have it
    Quote: Author
    On the occasion of the 80th anniversary of the Sukhoi Design Bureau

    mmm ..
    The history of the Sukhoi Design Bureau Open Joint-Stock Company dates back to the AGOS TsAGI brigade No. 4, which in October 1930 headed by P.O. Dry. From this moment, the formation of the design team of the future design bureau begins.


    2019-1930 = already 89 years old.
    Officer:
    They did not say anything on the 80th anniversary
  19. peter rusin_2
    peter rusin_2 16 December 2019 14: 04
    0
    Any information will always be in demand! Negative for not repeating mistakes, positive for future and present use!
  20. Vlad5307
    Vlad5307 16 December 2019 15: 14
    0
    Quote: carstorm 11

    9

    Sorry, minus because the research results always carry useful experience that allows you to avoid mistakes in the future and use what is useful in the course, even if it was closed in the future. wink
  21. YakimovSS
    YakimovSS 16 December 2019 16: 25
    +1
    In particular, you can pay attention to a certain similarity of the design of gliders.

    Where to look?
  22. Alex_You
    Alex_You 16 December 2019 16: 32
    +1
    Handsome, what else to say.
  23. Shelest2000
    Shelest2000 16 December 2019 17: 44
    -1
    Such a country was dried out ... (c)
  24. Doliva63
    Doliva63 16 December 2019 17: 53
    0
    I wonder how many suspension points were supposed to be? There seems to be nowhere to hang. Already on the 5th generation already then waved?
  25. Alexey from Perm
    Alexey from Perm 16 December 2019 18: 07
    0
    It seems that there is an excuse in the magazine, so look, you see, we were the first to come up with a flat nozzle. And do not care that on Su 57 it is standard ...
    1. opus
      opus 16 December 2019 18: 46
      -2
      Quote: Alexey from Perm
      And do not care that on Su 57 it is standard ...

      Well, on the F-35 it is also standard.
      B-2B has a General Electric F118-10 engine with a "normal" nozzle, only the exhaust is in the casing
      1. Alexey from Perm
        Alexey from Perm 16 December 2019 20: 22
        0
        On a bomber, this is easier to implement due to its size; is the sheepskin worth dressing at all? From the point of view of gas dynamics, the square nozzle is continuous loss, both speed and weight. For modern IR missile heads, does it really matter which nozzle there is?
        1. opus
          opus 16 December 2019 21: 06
          -3
          Quote: Alexey from Perm
          For modern IR missile heads, does it really matter which nozzle there is?

          I'm not IKGSN ... belay
          IR visibility is reduced by correctly forming the ratio of the width to the height of the nozzle and the exit jet in order to lower its temperature. The thrust vector control on such a nozzle is made according to design capabilities only in the vertical plane.

          but I think there is a difference
    2. Kirill Dou
      Kirill Dou 16 December 2019 19: 00
      0
      Moreover, just the Americans began to experience the flat nozzle - back in 1988.
  26. KJIETyc
    KJIETyc 16 December 2019 20: 21
    -1
    Quote: keeper03
    The Chinese J-20 is very similar to the C-22! yes belay

    What kind of sou ale? your ji 20 is a copy of the instant 1.44
  27. vfvlasov
    vfvlasov 16 December 2019 22: 07
    0
    I remember riveted this crap in 1984. But they did it for destruction in tests at the institute. Not for flying. Apparently did not have time.