Military Review

Chinese users perplexed by the "desert color" fighter J-20

62

J-20 fighters in the "desert color" spotted in the Chinese sky. Photos of fifth-generation fighters (in the Chinese classification - 4) appeared on the blogs of Chinese authors. J-20's "desert color" perplexed Chinese users and initially raised questions about where the PLA air forces were going to use such fighter options.


However, the Chinese manufacturing sector clarified the desert color situation. In fact, we are talking about a new batch of fighters, which are assembled at the enterprise and sent to carry out factory tests. Therefore, at the moment, there is no question of any specific coloring. It, as noted, will be traditional for the PLA Air Force, and they will begin to apply it after several stages of the mentioned tests. That is, while the fighters are tested with a "factory coating".

In the meantime, it is reported that a batch of aircraft with new engines - its own, Chinese-made - is allowed to test. it aviation Taihang engine, which has a digital traction control system. It was noted that the Taihang version for the J-20 is a kind of intermediate link in the engine lineup, which will make it possible to get an engine with “thrust at the level of the American F-35 fighter.”

From the statement:

The Taihang afterburner is about 18 tons. This allows the J-20 to achieve maneuverability, while still similar in its parameter to the US Air Force F-22.

In the Chinese edition of SINA, commenting on the start of testing the next batch of J-20, they allowed themselves to make a statement that these fighters are "the only new generation invisible aircraft manufactured outside the United States of America."
Photos used:
sina.com.cn
62 comments
Ad

Subscribe to our Telegram channel, regularly additional information about the special operation in Ukraine, a large amount of information, videos, something that does not fall on the site: https://t.me/topwar_official

Information
Dear reader, to leave comments on the publication, you must sign in.
  1. Hunter 2
    Hunter 2 1 December 2019 11: 08
    +2
    Class! good very hot topic! Will we discuss the painting of Chinese fighters? Then discuss repainting? laughing Can vote for the choice of color? belay
    Or discuss the statements of the Chinese ... which even the Chinese themselves seem to not believe about their own engines, comparable to the F35 engines ... ??? request
    1. Mavrikiy
      Mavrikiy 1 December 2019 11: 12
      -2
      Well, and if wider .... Syria, Libya, Africa in general, or .....?
      1. Hunter 2
        Hunter 2 1 December 2019 11: 19
        +1
        Quote: Mavrikiy
        Well, and if wider .... Syria, Libya, Africa in general, or .....?

        And where does Syria, Libya and Africa in general? In the article, the Russian language says ... the coloring will be Traditional for the PLA Air Force, and it will be applied after testing .... laughing
        1. The comment was deleted.
        2. Mavrikiy
          Mavrikiy 1 December 2019 17: 33
          -1
          Quote: Hunter 2
          In the article, the Russian language says ... the coloring will be Traditional for the PLA Air Force, and it will be applied after testing .... laughing
          Turn on the memory from the beginning. What the Chinese say is always divided by 10.
      2. Alexander Petrov1
        Alexander Petrov1 1 December 2019 17: 47
        +1
        They probably decided to offer for sale the main ally of the United States in the desert of Saudi Arabia. laughing
    2. NEXUS
      NEXUS 1 December 2019 15: 24
      +7
      Quote: Hunter 2
      Class! very hot topic!

      The authors of the article apparently do not know that, as they called, "desert painting" is a factory primer coating. So our planes are painted too ... that is, the absolute illiteracy of those who wrote this article is shown, passing it off as a topic of discussion.
      1. Al_lexx
        Al_lexx 1 December 2019 16: 54
        +6
        You are absolutely right. Yellow-green crap, sticky like snot, is aviation soil. When he worked in Yakovlev Design Bureau, in the mock-up workshop, we constantly used her.
        But this is not interesting. Another thing is interesting. For the most part, this primer is applied to the metal. Very rarely on other materials and almost never on composite. Without it, the paint does not go down, peels off instantly. And from here a conclusion, the Chinese have a very small proportion of composites in the glider. And from here there is another conclusion - about its equipping with active radar systems around the perimeter of the airframe, as in our Su. The composite is primed with soil, based on something like chalk.
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 1 December 2019 17: 31
          +1
          Quote: Al_lexx
          And from here a conclusion, the Chinese have a very small proportion of composites in the glider.

          That's right ... And then one question is: What thickness should the stealth coating be applied to this device of the Chinese aircraft industry so that it reaches the parameters of the Su-57 and the lizard? And I have a suspicion that the thickness there will be the same as the builders sketch cement on the walls.
          1. Al_lexx
            Al_lexx 1 December 2019 17: 39
            0
            Something like that...
            However, I do not like to draw premature conclusions. I know only one thing. The fact that the same Boeing orders carbon fiber elements for our aircraft from us. True, here we are talking about large-sized elements that few in the world sinter. Not everyone has this size vacuum thermo chambers. We are yes.
            What level of similar technologies in China, I do not know. The baking procedure of composite elements is quite simple. I indulged in this in the late 70s, when I was seriously engaged in aircraft modeling. Both propellers and fuselages. Then the same thing happened in Yakovlev’s breadboard workshop, in a group of dynamically similar RU models. But there are so many nuances and the more they are, the larger the dimensions of the parts.
            1. NEXUS
              NEXUS 1 December 2019 17: 48
              0
              Quote: Al_lexx
              But there are so many nuances and the more they are, the larger the dimensions of the parts.

              About three years ago, I said that if you look at, say, fighters, starting from the first generation in dynamics to the fifth generation ... taking into account the sweep of the wings, their area, etc., I have an idea that gradually (as with evolution in nature), the plumage of a fighter, let’s say this grows together, turning into something like a flat ellipse or plate, if you want ...
              1. Al_lexx
                Al_lexx 1 December 2019 17: 52
                0
                Quote: NEXUS
                the plumage of a fighter, let’s say so grow together, turning into something like a flat ellipse or plate, if you want ...

                The aerodynamics and geometry of the bearing planes are very dependent on the destination.
                If we talk about military, combat aircraft, then such a merger of the wing and plumage is done for the sake of stealth and maneuverability (unstable aerodynamics). It is almost impossible to operate such an aircraft without a complex CDS. On transport and passenger aircraft, this will never happen.
                1. NEXUS
                  NEXUS 1 December 2019 17: 57
                  0
                  Quote: Al_lexx
                  On transport and passenger aircraft, this will never happen.

                  It is very controversial ... let's say the same EKIP was designed so that its entire body worked like a wing and its carrying capacity was not bad. It's just that the project itself and further work on the issue of such "flying saucers" did not go further. But I think that if our design bureaus have not yet returned to this topic, they will return very soon.
                  1. Al_lexx
                    Al_lexx 1 December 2019 18: 06
                    +1
                    Quote: NEXUS
                    ..I think that if our design bureaus have not returned to this topic, they will very soon return.

                    If electronics becomes an order of magnitude cheaper and most importantly - the algorithms go beyond the military secrecy, it is quite possible. At a minimum, this will provide fuel economy for flying wing circuits.
                    And so, the classical scheme is more stable in horizontal flight. Her behavior is more predictable. This is due to moments of force, relative to the aerodynamic center and the center of gravity. The larger the shoulder at the rear plumage, the more steering wheels need to be deflected, and the greater the turning radius. Those. such (classical scheme) forgives piloting errors. Remember the I-16, with its short fuselage. The plane had low stability in all axes. Maneuverability was a record, but he also required serious pilot training. Subsequently, such fighters were no longer built until the appearance of the SDE, with its behavior algorithms, in unstable positions.
                  2. Al_lexx
                    Al_lexx 1 December 2019 18: 07
                    0
                    EKIP is a sub-experimental direction for studying the circuit as such.
                    1. NEXUS
                      NEXUS 1 December 2019 18: 11
                      +1
                      Quote: Al_lexx
                      EKIP is a sub-experimental direction for studying the circuit as such.

                      Once the theme of ekranoplanes was also not in demand and was considered something like a gamble.
                      The question is the study of this direction and practical work. Then there will be a result that, I am sure, will greatly surprise aircraft designers.
                      1. Al_lexx
                        Al_lexx 1 December 2019 18: 14
                        +1
                        Quote: NEXUS
                        Once the theme of ekranoplanes was also not in demand and was considered something like a gamble.

                        I agree.
                        But ekranoplan, it’s still a little about something else. )
                        I explained the conditions for the mass application of the flying wing scheme. Everything closes to automation. It is possible that in fifty years, maybe sooner, all flying means will be built according to the flying wing scheme and robots will control them. A person will turn into an operator who assigns the starting and ending points of a flight (if we talk about civil and transport aviation).
                      2. NEXUS
                        NEXUS 1 December 2019 18: 18
                        +1
                        Quote: Al_lexx
                        But ekranoplan, it’s still a little about something else. )

                        Well, why?)) There are still ekranolety (not to be confused with ekranoplanes).
                        Quote: Al_lexx
                        It is possible that in fifty years,

                        I think much earlier ... hi
                      3. Al_lexx
                        Al_lexx 1 December 2019 18: 20
                        +3
                        Quote: NEXUS
                        I think much earlier ...

                        We will wait and see. winked
                        Man is a strange creature. And the laws by which society and technology are developing often move non-linearly and sometimes reverse.
          2. SASHA OLD
            SASHA OLD 2 December 2019 01: 37
            0
            Quote: NEXUS
            And here is one question- What thickness should be applied stealth coating on this device of the Chinese aircraft industry

            against decimeter radars - about a quarter of the wavelength of these same radars, that is 2.5 centimeters of the stealth layer ..
        2. Simargl
          Simargl 1 December 2019 19: 02
          -1
          Quote: Al_lexx
          almost never on composite
          fool If you did not differentiate?
  2. svp67
    svp67 1 December 2019 11: 12
    +6
    Yes ... the Chinese are moving forward by leaps and bounds. I wonder when the J-35 will be shown in all its glory.
  3. parkello
    parkello 1 December 2019 11: 14
    +11
    the Chinese, the Chinese are such that they confuse the red man with paint request the same color of the anti-corrosion coating in aluminum winked what would you all fall ... of my envy crying
    1. Voyager
      Voyager 1 December 2019 12: 50
      +7
      Photo of 2010, and the Chinese were just puzzled)
      1. parkello
        parkello 1 December 2019 12: 52
        +4
        and they are definitely Chinese or Estonians?)) laughing
        1. Grigory_45
          Grigory_45 1 December 2019 14: 11
          +4
          Quote: parkello
          Are they Chinese or Estonians?)

          In our time of the heyday of the Internet, so many "specialists" appear in the networks that they will soon be puzzled by the question: where did the legs of the plane (they will not know the words "landing gear") in flight? What to do, the soil cannot be distinguished from the color. It happens. But - all polls iksperdy, with the stars of the sofa generals
          1. parkello
            parkello 1 December 2019 14: 16
            +3
            Albert Einstein was right when he said that (c) when technology will replace live communication. we will get a generation of idiots. winked
          2. SASHA OLD
            SASHA OLD 2 December 2019 01: 39
            +1
            Quote: Gregory_45
            In our time of the heyday of the Internet, so many "specialists" appear in the networks that they will soon be puzzled by the question: where did the legs of the plane (they will not know the words "landing gear") in flight? What to do, the soil cannot be distinguished from the color. It happens. But - all polls iksperdy, with the stars of the sofa generals

            where did the propeller go!?!? wassat
            1. Old Man
              Old Man 4 December 2019 03: 07
              +1
              stuffed into a bomb bay am
              1. SASHA OLD
                SASHA OLD 4 December 2019 06: 56
                0
                Quote: Old Man
                stuffed into a bomb bay am

                I knew it..)
      2. Old Man
        Old Man 4 December 2019 03: 06
        +1
        even made a smiley with holes on the right side :)
  4. Kosh
    Kosh 1 December 2019 11: 18
    +7
    What the hell is desert coloration? What kind of blogs were they when all the experts and just aviation enthusiasts know that this is the usual factory "paint" of new aircraft. Standard paintwork and side numbers are applied to aircraft when a given batch is accepted by the Air Force.
    1. The leader of the Redskins
      The leader of the Redskins 1 December 2019 11: 58
      0
      Well, excuse them not literate! Not everyone went on excursions to aircraft factories! I myself, if I had not visited the workshops, I would also be puzzled!)))
    2. yustas
      yustas 1 December 2019 12: 54
      +1
      Yes, and where does the color? The coating of aluminum is, from corrosion, that is, oxidation
    3. Grigory_45
      Grigory_45 1 December 2019 14: 13
      0
      Quote: Kosh
      What kind of blogs were they when all the experts, and just aviation enthusiasts, know

      Believe me, we have such "specialists" a dime a dozen too. How they will write - you do not know whether to laugh, or to call the orderlies for them
  5. Potato
    Potato 1 December 2019 11: 23
    -2
    Wow. If the Chinese do not lie, then afterburning traction this engine will be more powerful than the 35th and 57th! And if you look at the nozzles, then they already began to implement stealth. From so ...
    1. Errr
      Errr 1 December 2019 11: 36
      +4
      Quote: Potato
      And if you look at the nozzles, then they already began to implement stealth. From so ...
      Urgently to the optometrist! laughing Otherwise, to a psychiatrist ...
      1. Potato
        Potato 1 December 2019 13: 29
        0
        It is bad to be a smug and ignorant boor.

        Вот, ознакомьтесь: http://errymath.blogspot.com/2016/09/j-20-uses-ws-15.html?m=1




        Work on the engines is underway ... There are many options and the "home ws 15" has already been brought to mind
        1. Errr
          Errr 1 December 2019 14: 41
          +4
          In your middle photo there is an American Pratt & Whitney F119-PW-100 with a flat nozzle.
          In vain did you emboss it as evidence of Chinese progress in stealth technology. You can even watch the video where the Americans torture him at the stand.In the top and bottom photos you have just proof of the work of Chinese engine engineers in the field of all-aspect thrust vector deviation. No "stealth" there and does not smell. You shouldn't have taken offense.)
          1. Potato
            Potato 1 December 2019 15: 02
            +4
            Oops, really, accidentally screwed up with pv100 ... Soryan. And about stealth - the nozzle with the ovt in the bottom photo is just with stealth elements. I read somewhere that this is why it has such a characteristic shape and black color - a stable ferromagnetic coating that reduces radar visibility.

            By the way, our people are making progress. Please note: it was



            And it became so:


            1. Errr
              Errr 1 December 2019 15: 25
              +2
              Thanks for the important observation. I don’t know if the engines are the same on them, but the fact that the engine nacelles are clearly different is a fact. hi
    2. Donald72
      Donald72 1 December 2019 12: 54
      0
      Yes, of course, you can immediately see from the nozzles that the Chinese compass is smoother and the Americans didn’t use the compass on f22
    3. Herman 4223
      Herman 4223 1 December 2019 13: 32
      0
      18 tons on the su-57 will also be. On the engine of the second stage. Here's the rest of the characterization of how it will differ, it is interesting.
  6. askort154
    askort154 1 December 2019 11: 33
    +3
    The factory paint is standard, the so-called primer for aluminum. We have it yellow-greenish, the Chinese have yellow. The final painting is done on the "exhaust" of the product, at the request of the aircraft customer, including the "little notice".
    If you scratch the F-35, then on aluminum products, the same will be - the primer. And if the products are carbon fiber, then there is another painting technology. Although there, the presence of a primer can not be avoided.
  7. Alex_You
    Alex_You 1 December 2019 11: 35
    +5
    And it is clear to a fool that this is a factory coating. Won Su-35e is also in "desert" color:
    1. Old Man
      Old Man 4 December 2019 03: 12
      0
      we have a "desert - greener"
  8. Pavel57
    Pavel57 1 December 2019 11: 43
    0
    Any option, provided that black.
    1. Andrey Chistyakov
      Andrey Chistyakov 1 December 2019 11: 54
      +3
      Quote: Pavel57
      Any option, provided that black.

      Add author. (G. Ford)
    2. Old Man
      Old Man 4 December 2019 03: 13
      0
      Ford still had such a statement - that if he had to do what the public requires, it would be horse-drawn carriages.
  9. lexseyOGK
    lexseyOGK 1 December 2019 11: 55
    +2
    This painting is called primer-EP-0215. applied to aluminum alloys. From the photo video that j-20, this is not the 5th generation. The whole surface of aluminum
  10. knn54
    knn54 1 December 2019 11: 58
    +1
    - own, Chinese production. This is a Taihang aircraft engine ...
    A couple of years ago, a Chinese engineer was expelled from Belgium .. He is suspected of being engaged in industrial espionage at General Electric.
    In the United States, several Chinese engineers working in the aviation industry were arrested.
  11. Sitearvi
    Sitearvi 1 December 2019 12: 08
    +4
    Whatever the color, the Chinese, as usual, praise their swamp, not forgetting to spray other people's planes with mud, especially ours, purely in partnership, but time will tell.
  12. rocket757
    rocket757 1 December 2019 12: 22
    +1
    . these fighters are “the only new generation stealth aircraft manufactured outside the United States of America

    Invisibility, so invisible .... and then LOOK?
    1. Starper-xnumx
      Starper-xnumx 1 December 2019 12: 32
      0
      Quote: rocket757
      Invisibility, so invisible .... and then LOOK?

      In Syria, they would be checked in the joint patrol of the BV sky with Russia .. Here then you can discuss something .. hi
      1. Vladimir_2U
        Vladimir_2U 1 December 2019 13: 15
        0
        But while patrolling with the Turks, and on armored personnel carriers, and not on fighter jets.))
      2. cost
        cost 1 December 2019 13: 19
        0
        In Syria, they would be checked in a joint patrol of the BV sky with Russia. Then it’s possible to discuss something

        And then check again at the Khmeimim airbase .... at night ... when the Chinese comrades are fast asleep wink
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 1 December 2019 13: 24
          0
          Quote: Starper-777
          In Syria, they would be checked in the joint patrol of the BV sky with Russia .. Here then you can discuss something ..

          The wish is understandable, but the Chinese partners, even those partners !!!
          They, like everyone else, have their own interes!
          In the meantime ..... sandpiper is a swamp, something like that.
        2. Starper-xnumx
          Starper-xnumx 1 December 2019 13: 39
          -1
          Quote: Rich
          And then check again at the Khmeimim airbase .... at night ... when the Chinese comrades are fast asleep

          Well, this is a must, every night "Raise the alarm .." and sirens howl .. and everyone runs ... The eyes of the Chinese comrades will immediately widen under such loads .. heh heh
          Quote: rocket757
          The wish is understandable, but the Chinese partners, even those partners !!!
          They, like everyone else, have their own interes!
          In the meantime ..... sandpiper is a swamp, something like that.

          Are they waiting for the corpses of the USA and Russia to sail along the river? ..
          Well, without Russia they would have been soaked for a long time, and the Chinese would know that, but still they are trying to bend their line .. Well, let them try.
  13. ltc35
    ltc35 1 December 2019 13: 10
    +2
    “The only new generation stealth aircraft manufactured outside the United States.”

    That is, according to the Chinas, our Su-57 is not invisible and not a fifth-generation aircraft? Chinatown’s ambitions are clearly over the edge.
    1. ROMANO
      ROMANO 1 December 2019 13: 37
      +1
      "China Town" - literally, "Chinese town", settlement, quarter. A place of compact residence of ethnic Chinese outside the PRC. The article provides the opinion of the population of the metropolis, and not of numerous foreign diasporas.
      1. ltc35
        ltc35 2 December 2019 13: 26
        0
        "Sorry, I forgot: a sense of humor is not your element ..." © a phrase from the movie "Old robbers"
  14. Grigory_45
    Grigory_45 1 December 2019 14: 07
    -1
    Chinese users were puzzled by the "desert coloring" of fighters
    mdya ... users, apparently, are very advanced. That the factory primer cannot be distinguished from painting ...
  15. Lord of the Sith
    Lord of the Sith 1 December 2019 20: 39
    +3
    And from which banana of civil users are interested in the colors of military jets?

    Take a walk)