The Eighty Years War: Conflict Affecting the Evolution of Warfare


Military affairs at the turn of the eras. Everyone knows about the influence of war on the development of military affairs. They imagine that the warriors and military affairs of the beginning of the Hundred Years War and its end were very different. However, in Europe there was another war, which was also very long, and it also greatly influenced the development of military affairs. And it got the name of the Eighty Years War, although in our country, in traditional Soviet historiography, no one called it that, but called it the first bourgeois revolution in Europe. Meanwhile, this war, which lasted from 1568 to 1648, and yes, indeed, also known as the Netherlands Revolution, was essentially a war for the separation of seventeen provinces of the Netherlands from the Spanish Empire, although economic and religious issues were resolved along the way. However, to a much greater extent it was a war for national sovereignty. And 17 provinces in this war managed to defeat the Habsburg empire, using all the most modern achievements of military affairs at that time.


A feature of this war was that it was fought between two very rich countries, but rich in different ways. Spain received silver and gold from America and could buy everything. The slightest delay in the delivery of precious metals from the New World turned out to be a difficult test for Spain, since its soldiers in the same Netherlands refused to fight in this case. The Netherlands at that time had already embarked on the capitalist path of development, in the country the corvée had died out, commercial agriculture was developing in the countryside, like factories were being built after mushrooms in the rain. The whole of Europe was interested in Dutch goods. It was here that English landlords sold their wool, which just at that time began to pursue an active policy of fencing, and all because of the fact that due to the cooling in Europe, the demand for cloth grew very much, and at first they could only be made in the Netherlands.

The Eighty Years War: Conflict Affecting the Evolution of Warfare

German Reiter of the Eighty Years War. As you can see, it is not very rich weapons. Which, however, is confirmed by documents on the purchase of chain-link drape, a helmet and pistols in batches. So this is not a fantasy of artists. Fig. V. Vuksika and Z. Grbazika.

As a result, the war was fought to a large extent by the forces of mercenaries, whom both the Spaniards, the Dutch nobles, and the merchants hired wherever possible. Yes, of course, there were also Geuza ("tattered") sea and forest, that is, in fact, the same privateers and partisans. But they could not fight in the field against the Spanish infantry paid for in gold, so they were not the ones who won the war. It was in the battles of this war that, first of all, the types of cavalry and infantry became traditional for the New Age, and most importantly, having developed, they passed the battle test.


Here, for example, the protective equipment of a rider of this period from the city museum in Meisen: chain mail and plate glove.

It should be noted that, like the Hundred Years War, its youngest “partner” did not go on constantly, but with interruptions and cease-fires. So, after the 41 year of the war in 1609, peace was concluded between Spain and the Netherlands. Some of the wealthy Dutch provinces freed themselves from Spanish rule and gained independence, and it was the small professional Dutch army under the command of Maurice Nassau who was able to gain important victories over the Spaniards. And, it is also important to emphasize, very serious changes in the Dutch War of Independence were carried out primarily in the cavalry. In 1597, out of the total number of horsemen in eleven regiments, eight regiments were converted into cuirassiers armed with pistols, and three into equestrian arquebusiers. In the same year, at the Battle of Turnhout, the Dutch cavalry virtually independently defeated the Spanish cuirassiers, armed with spears, and infantry with long lances. Imitating their Dutch colleagues, the imperial cuirassiers also abandoned the heavy spear and began to use a pair of pistols.


Exhibits of the same museum: a pair of 1591 pistols of the year. Pay attention, although they are decorated and not at all luxurious, nevertheless, you can notice the insertion of the bone, and decorative elements. I.e weapon then they tried to make beautiful even in those cases when it was intended for everyday use.

And then at the beginning of the XVII century, imperial masters began to produce the appropriate armor, discarding all unnecessary parts, but strengthening the breastplates of cuirasses and helmets. As a result, cavalry armor became heavier and more massive. The heaviest armor available today is exhibited at the museum in Graz: they weigh 42 kg. Their surface is not decorated, and their shape is not so sophisticated, but they protect well. Later, the cuirassiers played a very prominent role in the Thirty Years War, where they were commanded by Field Marshals Gottfried Pappenheim (1594-1632) and Albrecht Wallenstein (1583 - 1634).


These pistols already began to be produced in the middle of the 16th century in addition to knightly sets, that is, armor for the rider and horse. Naturally, for representatives of the nobility who commanded the cavalry units (Armory of Dresden)


Absolutely magnificent samples of pistols with wheel locks from the Dresden Armory. These guns are also from there. Pay attention to the small curvature of the handles. Some are almost straight. This was done on purpose. The shooter needed to stretch his arm far forward to produce a shot, but this, firstly, compensated for the strong recoil, and secondly, removed the spark mechanism from the eyes


As you can see, pistols from different museums look like twin brothers, which is not surprising, because they were produced ... by tens of thousands! And also a winding key was attached to each gun - a repair tool, and to lose it meant to lose weapons for a while, up to visiting the gunsmith. Without it, it was impossible to cock the wheel of a spark castle (Vienna Armory)

It is interesting that Pappenheim used cuirassier regiments of about 1000 people, consisting of ten companies of 100 people each, and at the same time narrowed the front of the attack. Wallenstein, by contrast, preferred a strike on a wide front, and his tactics were more successful.


1590 rider's armor pierced by a bullet! (Vienna Armory)

Here we already wrote about the number of formations of Reitars and cuirassiers and the differences in their tactics. Now it is time to emphasize that in the mercenary units of the Eighty Years' War, the armor used by the riders could range from a simple mail shirt or even a cloak to the already well-known “three-quarter armor”. Helmets also ranged from simple "iron hats" to burgons and "pot helmets" - called "sweat" in English. Later there appeared helmets “lobster tail”, which were distinguished by a lamellar collar that really looked like a crayfish tail, and a grill on the face made of fairly rare rods. The main weapon of both cuirassiers and reytarov was a pistol with a wheeled lock. The standard barrel length of such horseman pistols was about 50 cm, but there were longer samples with barrels in 75 cm. Weight could be both 1700 g and about 3 kg. The weight of the lead bullet was usually around 30 g, that is, it was the weight of the bullet of the infantry arquebus of the time. Moreover, even in the 1580 year, there were muskets firing bullets weighing 31 g, and very light arquebuses with bullets weighing 10 g. It is not surprising that such light bullets did not penetrate the cuirassier armor, which gave rise to the hope of protecting them from the fire of foot shooters.


But fate apparently kept this “black devil”. A bullet mark is visible on his cuirass, but it is shallow and flat. Apparently, the bullet that hit him flew in from afar and flattened on metal like a cake. Pay attention to the rib of the cuirass - tauplebrast - they began to do it to increase the likelihood of a rebound. (Vienna Armory)

But already in 1590, Henry IV introduced more powerful muskets in his army, and now they began to pierce armor *. True, their weight was significant, and demanded the use of a stand - forket. From a horseman's pistol, one could quite accurately hit the target with approximately 20 steps; aimless, but dangerous for the enemy fire could be effective at a distance of 45 m. However, against the enemy, dressed in armor, a pistol shot was effective only a few steps away. Liliana and Fred Funkens report that the pistols were often loaded with steel darts and even Carro crossbow bolts. True, apart from them, no one seemed to write about this. It is clear that to shoot such a dart could only be practically point blank until it began to tumbling in flight, but in this way it was possible to break through any armor with guarantee! Reiters, who preferred fire fighting, had up to six pistols - two in holsters, behind the lapels of their boots and two more behind the belt.


Armor of the 1550 of the year, owned by Hans Fernberger von Auer (1511 - 1584). Now, the elongated bells of plate gloves began to play the role of protection for hands, but ceased to cover the elbows with iron. Pay attention to the traditional engraving on his cuirass: Christ crucified on the cross and praying on it ... who? Perhaps the owner of the armor. Like, save me and protect me from the bullet! (Vienna Armory)

Three regiments were turned into equestrian arquebusiers. There are many options for where the name of this type of weapon came from: from Italian whether arcbibuso - descended from a distorted Dutch hakebusse, which in turn came from the German hakenbuchsen, but the translation of the latter is unambiguous - “a gun with a hook”. The first arquebuses weighed up to 30 kg; and fired from them from the fortress walls, catching a barbed hook on the battlements, which made it possible to compensate for the return. There is also an explanation that his butt was in the form of a hook, hence the name came from.

Lighter arquebuses of the early 16th century had wooden lodges and a stock made of walnut, birch or maple wood. The length was up to 1,5 m, caliber 12-20 mm. At first the trunks were made of bronze, later they began to make them of iron. The lock was simple: an S-shaped lever (serpentine - “coil”) was used to fasten the ignition cord made from hemp soaked in a solution of nitrate. By pressing the trigger lever, he descended onto the powder shelf and set fire to the charge of the ignition powder. The bullets were first stone, then lead, iron, and in rifled arquebuses - iron, covered with lead or wrapped in sheepskin. Even the most experienced shooters could, at best, do only 40 rounds per hour, but with the advent of wooden cartridges (usually there were 12 rounds, which is why they were called “12 apostles” in colloquial speech), the rate of fire increased.


Even when the arquebuses replaced the muskets, they continued to be a popular weapon of hunters, since it was not pleasant to lug around the woods with a heavy musket. Before us is the hunting arquebus of Emperor Rudolph II, the son of Emperor Maximilian II of Habsburg (1552 - 1612). The iron parts of this luxurious weapon were made by Daniel Sadeler, a gunsmith from Prague. The trunk is one, but the lock is made with two triggers for greater reliability. Both the trunk and the chickens are decorated with the finest plant ornaments and images of newts. The chickens are decorated in the form of heads of fantastic birds and animals. The protruding parts are burnished, the background is gilded. Repairman is fixed on the trigger shaft. The stock and stock are completely lined with bone inlaid with a black horn or ebony. This work was carried out by the engraver Jerome Borstorffer, a Munich master, who worked in Prague with Daniel Sadeler for Prague court between 1605 and 1610 for years. Masters: Daniel Sadeler, (before 1602, Antwerp - 1632, Munich and Prague), Jerome Borstorffer Sr., (before 1589, Munich - 1637, Munich and Prague). Materials and technologies: Iron, gold, ivory, ebony or horn, carving, engraving, inlay. (Vienna Armory)


The best German arquebus samples had a maximum firing range of about 400 steps. However, the effective range of the battle was much smaller, not to mention the range at which the bullet of the arquebus could penetrate the rider's armor. Nevertheless, it was still greater than the range of the pistol, which led to the appearance of horse arquebusers. Their weapons were of higher quality than ordinary infantrymen, and on horseback or dismounting, they could support the attacks of pistol riders with their fire.


Italian Breastplate of the Duke Alessandro Farnese (1545 - 1592). OK. 1565. As you can see, it looks very simple in appearance, and the duke was going to fight in it, and not show off in the palaces. (Vienna Armory)

Arquebusier (the so-called such shooters in the French manner) did not wear heavy armor. Initially, they used helmets, cuirasses, and hand and hip protection. In the XVI and XVII centuries. the arquebusier dropped these armor one by one, until only their helmet remained. For personal protection, like the rest of the heavy cavalry, they wore a long heavy sword on their thighs. However, the arquebusiers of the mercenary units were real arsenals on horseback: in addition to the arquebus, they had up to six pistols in holsters and nests of the chest belt. Their pistols were weaker and shorter than those of the cuirassiers, since their main weapon was a relatively long-range arquebus. But to "shoot back" from an unexpected attack of enemy horsemen, without resorting to the help of infantry, they were quite capable!

* In the 1600 year, an arquebus weighed an average of 5 kg and fired a bullet weighing 25. The musket weighed 8 kg, and the bullet to it was 50
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  1. Nehist 7 December 2019 07: 08 New
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    The article is interesting, but for some reason the first reasons are indicated as secondary: (First of all, it was economic problems that were resolved. And independence, etc., etc. were already secondary. What further Anglo-Dutch wars testify to.
    1. Earthshaker 7 December 2019 15: 11 New
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      From my point of view, both reasons are equal, because the vassal dependence (of Flanders from the Habsburgs) allowed the Habsburgs to tax Flanders. And the tax on each trading operation was the last straw in the bowl of patience.
  2. The leader of the Redskins 7 December 2019 07: 49 New
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    Thanks, it was interesting to read.
    Have a nice weekend!)))
  3. Edward Vashchenko 7 December 2019 08: 41 New
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    Great article, thank you very much, I read it with pleasure.
  4. Adjutant 7 December 2019 08: 44 New
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    As I understand it, the Dutch bourgeois revolution?
  5. antivirus 7 December 2019 08: 46 New
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    the endless horror of the "democratic countries", then they cut down all the forests of Europe for swimming and capturing the colonies. now Greta teaches us ants to love
  6. wwr
    wwr 7 December 2019 08: 47 New
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    Thank you, I recalled the Soviet textbook “History of the Middle Ages” for the 5th grade, it is with this event of 1648 that it ends, and then summer vacation and a train to a pioneer camp at sea. good drinks
    1. wwr
      wwr 7 December 2019 09: 00 New
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      Mistake, 6th
      1. Earth 7 December 2019 09: 39 New
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        Quote: wwr
        Mistake, 6th

        at 5 began the History of Ancient Ages.
        Although I saw the History of the Middle ones for the 7th grade (after all, we went both at 6 years old and at 7 to 1 grade)
        military orders quickly forced weapons to evolve.
        When they began to pay more for the best, the process went faster
    2. Captain45 7 December 2019 18: 35 New
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      Quote: wwr
      Thank you, I recalled the Soviet textbook “History of the Middle Ages” for the 5th grade, it is with this event of 1648 that it ends, and then summer vacation and a train to a pioneer camp at sea.

      I still remember how a history teacher in the sixth grade told us about the revolution in military affairs in connection with the use of firearms: the knights said that while he was there, he would run a plaque with a sword or sword, and the infantryman was already a hundred steps away with arquebuses clap and collect scrap metal laughing
  7. The comment was deleted.
  8. samarin1969 7 December 2019 09: 13 New
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    War is the engine of progress! laughing Not for nothing, according to one of the school versions, the massive use of firearms is the end of the Middle Ages.
  9. Free wind 7 December 2019 09: 58 New
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    Ulenspiegel from the same opera? I remember reading in my childhood, I liked it, I felt the ashes of Klaas beating in my heart. The gunsmiths of the clients were bred specifically, they hang around the gun with all sorts of trinkets and shove it, they say it’s absolutely necessary for you, I won’t steal my corefans from the bottom.
  10. kalibr 7 December 2019 10: 02 New
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    Quote: Free Wind
    Ulenspiegel from the same opera? I remember reading in my childhood, I liked it, I felt the ashes of Klaas beating in my heart.

    That's it!
    1. depressant 7 December 2019 10: 23 New
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      Incidentally, the first tanks, or rather prototypes of future tanks were used in the Boer War. There is also a khaki-colored military uniform. I always thought that khaki is a dirty green color. It turned out - the color of a scorched desert. What our military in Syria are wearing))
      1. Catfish 7 December 2019 13: 39 New
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        Dear lady love , about the "prototypes of tanks" in the Boer War, preferably in more detail, if possible. I, as a tanker, although a former one, are very interested. hi
        1. depressant 7 December 2019 18: 25 New
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          Dear colleague Sea Cat!
          Unfortunately, I read about the use of tanks in the Boer War a very, very long time ago and I don’t even remember which edition. Only a fact that surprised me very much was stuck in my memory love
          1. Catfish 7 December 2019 21: 50 New
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            Dear Lyudmila love , I believe that the use of even something like a tank in that war is absolutely impossible. The British used the semblance of armored trains with fairly large guns, but there were problems with the "armored shell". Some guns were covered with armored shields, and wagons and a locomotive were blinded "by God send," from sheet iron and sleepers, to sandbags, reached ship ropes.

            Here is an example of an armored British armored train called Shaggy Mary.


            But the artillery did not always succeed in covering up.
            So what tanks are there ... smile
      2. Alf
        Alf 7 December 2019 22: 21 New
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        Quote: depressant
        Incidentally, the first tanks, or rather prototypes of future tanks were used in the Boer War.

        Incidentally, not at Altist? There is also not such a thing.
        Quote: depressant
        I always thought that khaki is a dirty green color.

        So keep counting.

        Beige, he is beige.
        1. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 42 New
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          Basil hi , tanks are sacred! Let's wait until Anton appears - this is his theme: tanks, tropics and mulattos. wink drinks
          1. Alf
            Alf 7 December 2019 22: 43 New
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            Quote: Sea Cat
            Basil hi , tanks are sacred! Let's wait until Anton appears - this is his theme: tanks, tropics and mulattos. wink drinks

            The main thing is that Carbine does not appear, it was so difficult to ban it ... they tried the whole site ...
            By the way, I’m doing just that right now- drinks. Today in Perekrestok beer was brought from Belarus, took a masterpiece, tasty and inexpensive!
            1. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 47 New
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              I don’t know what’s wrong with him, because I’m sort of unban all, but his native is still not visible. God forbid he died or they again closed the ward. I grieve. Sincerely. love
      3. dokusib 8 December 2019 03: 53 New
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        Piglet.
  11. Aviator_ 7 December 2019 10: 33 New
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    Spain received silver and gold from America and could buy everything

    Well, just like the current Saudis - also rich, they also buy everything. They only rake off the Hussites to the fullest.
  12. kalibr 7 December 2019 11: 48 New
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    Quote: depressant
    It turned out - the color of a scorched desert

    Dear Lyudmila Yakovlevna! The trouble of incomplete knowledge. Now fix it. In fact, the khaki color was originally dusty gray, unbleached. Uniform for the British colonial infantry in India was sewn from this fabric. In Urdu, khaki means "dust, earth." When the Boer War broke out in Africa, units were sent including from India. And immediately it became clear that they suffer losses many times less than the British in red uniforms and white ammunition. And only then (!) Experiments were conducted and the "color of Spanish tobacco" was chosen for the new British form. But only for African parts. The "khaki" - dark green with brightly colored stripes and epaulettes - was adopted by the metropolitan forces. And only in 1914 the entire form was transferred to the "Virgin color".
    1. Catfish 7 December 2019 13: 42 New
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      "- This is hacks." Stone said as if apologizing, holding out a green army shirt to Burke ... "(C).
      / James Aldridge "Sea Eagle" /
  13. Fedor egoist 7 December 2019 11: 52 New
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    But fate apparently kept this “black devil”. A bullet mark is visible on his cuirass, but it is shallow and flat. Apparently, the bullet that got into it flew in from afar and flattened on metal like a flat cake

    There is confidence that this is not a combat dent, but a kind of “quality mark”. So often cuirasses were checked at that time. Usually shot in the center of the bib or in the region of the heart. As we observe in the photo. This is hardly a coincidence.
  14. kalibr 7 December 2019 14: 23 New
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    Quote: Sea Cat
    Sea Cat (Constantine) Today, 13: 39
    +1
    Dear lady, about the "prototypes of tanks" in the Boer War, preferably in more detail, if possible. I, as a tanker, although a former one, are very interested.

    Steam wheeled tractors (armored), pulled armored wheeled "cars" with loopholes for shooters, at the end went 127-114-mm gun. She could be unhooked and shot ...
  15. Engineer 7 December 2019 14: 25 New
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    As you can see, pistols from different museums are like twin brothers, which is not surprising, because they were made ... tens of thousands!

    I was very embarrassed by this moment. It seems like a common place that the wheel lock is very expensive and therefore has not received much distribution. And then tens of thousands ...
    but with the advent wooden cartridges (usually there were 12 of them in the band, which is why they were called “12 apostles” in colloquial speech), the rate of fire increased.

    Wooden cartridges on the dressing ... Who can explain? . I know the berendey with charges, but it's not a cartridge, it's just dosed charges. Separated from bullets.
    In general, the author can be given a grand prix for the best visual material for articles on VO
    1. Vladimir_2U 7 December 2019 15: 05 New
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      Twenty thousand can already be considered "tens of thousands"
      Quote: Engineer
      Wooden cartridges on the dressing ... Who can explain

      Perhaps a paper cartridge, the famous "bite cartridge" (bite is a verb))). A wooden case was for him.
      It appeared by the end of the 16th century.
    2. vladcub 7 December 2019 15: 35 New
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      I agree: "wooden cartridges" sounds silly. The Berendeyka of Russian archers is a prototype of the modern unloading of "soldier bras."
      Such a chamber actually accelerated the process of firing
  16. Catfish 7 December 2019 15: 12 New
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    Good day to all!
    Vyacheslav Olegovich thanks. smile

    I haven’t figured out where the musketeer is, but where the arquebuser is. request
    1. kalibr 7 December 2019 15: 37 New
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      Quote: Sea Cat
      I haven’t figured out where the musketeer is, but where the arquebuser is.

      Easy! Whoever holds forks - a support fork, he is a musketeer. Who does not have it - arquebusier!
    2. Looking for 7 December 2019 16: 27 New
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      But already in the XV-XVI century, Europeans were able to create a light portable firearm, controlled by one fighter - arquebus. After about a hundred years, another small weapon appeared on the medieval scene - the musket,
      if for you a hundred years is a trifle. continue to take this illiterate picture. for granted.
      1. Catfish 7 December 2019 16: 36 New
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        ... keep taking this illiterate picture. for granted.


        And who told you that I take it for granted? request
  17. vladcub 7 December 2019 15: 17 New
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    Quote: Adjutant
    As I understand it, the Dutch bourgeois revolution?

    About herself and there is a conversation.
  18. kalibr 7 December 2019 15: 36 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    Wooden cartridges on the dressing ... Who can explain? . I know the berendey with charges, but it's not a cartridge, it's just dosed charges. Separated from bullets.

    You wrote it right. But the berendey can be called cartridges, it was only necessary to put this word in “quotation marks”. And as for separately from bullets, it is also not entirely true. In Europe - separately. But the Japanese musketeers had "berendeyki" with bullets inside. So what is not a cartridge? Although yes, very specific.
    1. Catfish 7 December 2019 16: 11 New
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      Is this the "Japanese musketeer" with "beoendeyki"?
      1. Mordvin 3 7 December 2019 17: 13 New
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        Quote: Sea Cat
        Is this the "Japanese musketeer" with "beoendeyki"?

        This is Darth Vader medieval. winked
        1. Catfish 7 December 2019 21: 58 New
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          Volodya, I don’t know who Darth Vader is, but since even wicked fools got to the Japanese already when the rest of the world used normal flintlocks, I still think this guy’s name is Toliyamatokanava or Sikokonaka. smile drinks
          1. Mordvin 3 7 December 2019 22: 13 New
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            Quote: Sea Cat
            I don't know who Darth Vader is.

            Yes? recourse Well this one, dad Luikayama, in short ... laughing Ufff ...
            1. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 38 New
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              The picture is clearly according to Freud, the one who made it is clearly not happy with the purely Freudian “Desert Eagle” and I want more. But, as Vasil Ivanitch said - "II !!! - and with a bare heel on a saber!" But I had in mind something else:
              1. Mordvin 3 7 December 2019 22: 51 New
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                Quote: Sea Cat
                The picture is clearly according to Freud, the one who made it is clearly not happy with the purely Freudian "Desert Eagle" "

                This is a question for the director of Star Wars, what kind of desert eagle is there? He was not there when Lucas built his film. drinks
                1. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 56 New
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                  Volodya, I have never seen this film, which I am proud of. And his boyfriend at one time weaned to watch this guilty, specially buying a cassette with the Living and the Dead. My aunts swore at me, they say it’s early, but the guy from the age of twelve permanently tied up with Hollywood crafts. drinks smile
          2. Hantengri 7 December 2019 23: 46 New
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            Quote: Sea Cat
            Volodya, I don’t know who Darth Vader is.

            Quote: mordvin xnumx
            Yes? Well this one, dad Luikayama, in short ... Ufff ...

            He flew from the coils of Anykey Skovorodker, from Storm in a Glass. laughing
            1. Mordvin 3 8 December 2019 00: 16 New
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              Quote: HanTengri
              He flew from the coils of Anykey Skovorodker, from Storm in a Glass.

              There are many who flew from coils. laughing
              1. Catfish 8 December 2019 02: 32 New
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                Guys, I don't know who that is
                Anykey Skovorodker,
                I don’t know what
                "Storm in a glass."
                but I see the black face in the German helmet regularly. I don’t watch TV, especially I don’t go to the movies, I am a dark person and don’t know much, you would be easier with me. Here, I searched and found:

                I do not know how much to the topic, not special. smile drinks
      2. Aleks2000 7 December 2019 22: 33 New
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        IMHO, fantasy - picture. National team arms and armor ....
        1. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 39 New
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          Let's wait, what the Author will say about this. smile
    2. Engineer 7 December 2019 18: 24 New
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      Now everything is clear)
  19. kalibr 7 December 2019 15: 39 New
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    Quote: Vladimir_2U
    Perhaps a paper cartridge, the famous "bite cartridge" (bite is a verb))). A wooden case was for him.

    Yes, by the way, it was like that!
  20. kalibr 7 December 2019 15: 43 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    And then tens of thousands ...

    I don’t remember which of the kings, but there were 7 thousand pistols. I remember that 7 ... Each has two - that's 14 thousand. The opponents - the Dutch, the Spaniards, the British ... also had such cavalry, and also the Polish hussars, Swedes, Russians ... And all had wheeled pistols, two per person, at least. And at least - 5-6 ... And how much will it be in the end ...
    1. Catfish 7 December 2019 16: 13 New
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      With such shorties, the Japanese “pistolieros” do not particularly win. smile
  21. kalibr 7 December 2019 15: 47 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    not received much distribution.

    In the infantry!
  22. Mountain shooter 7 December 2019 15: 56 New
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    The war we know from Till Uhlenshpigel! There are also about arquebuses, and about hired troops, and about Gez ...
    And about the frozen canals of the Netherlands! It was a cold snap, it was !!!
  23. faterdom 7 December 2019 15: 58 New
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    The Netherlands, the scorer Peter Mikhailov, will soon go to these victorious Netherlands.
    And already in 1709, he’ll kick ... the beast of the best army on the European continent at that time.
    And Prince William of the Netherlands will become the king of England, the Bank of England will appear under him, and England itself will begin its non-stop 200-year rise. However, it has already been given. And will not return.
  24. NF68 7 December 2019 16: 43 New
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    People. Does anyone know what this is ?:





    This bandura has a caliber of approximately 25 mm. And the weight is appropriate. Yes, and the return should be such that it can break the arrow all the bones.
    1. Captain45 7 December 2019 18: 30 New
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      Quote: NF68
      People. Does anyone know what this is ?:

      Perhaps some serfdom or, as they said in Russia, "obscure" squeal
    2. Catfish 7 December 2019 22: 09 New
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      This is a serf rifle, in the photographs it’s not good, but you can see the emphasis, which, when resting on the fortress wall, at least somehow restrained the recoil when fired.

      These guns, in modifications and under a unitary cartridge, were preserved in different armies until the beginning of the XNUMXth century.
      1. NF68 8 December 2019 16: 16 New
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        Quote: Sea Cat
        This is a serf rifle, in the photographs it’s not good, but you can see the emphasis, which, when resting on the fortress wall, at least somehow restrained the recoil when fired.

        These guns, in modifications and under a unitary cartridge, were preserved in different armies until the beginning of the XNUMXth century.


        Thank. According to see another instance of rouge from the same residence in the city of Bad Arolsen. He has a barrel length of almost two meters. In the left corner behind the glass:

        1. Catfish 8 December 2019 16: 51 New
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          So, after all, everyone is "showing off as best he can," no wonder. There were amazing constructions before, and now there are enough of them too. request smile

          "Double Colt," ward number six resting. drinks
          1. san4es 9 December 2019 11: 27 New
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            Great cat hi Once there was a bi-caliber "barrel". I could not find something. Maybe I had a dream recourse
            1. Catfish 9 December 2019 18: 31 New
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              Sanya, "bikalibeony", is when two men with one girl in the bath. (joke). laughing good drinks
          2. NF68 9 December 2019 15: 31 New
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            Quote: Sea Cat
            So, after all, everyone is "showing off as best he can," no wonder.


            Perhaps the point here is not to show off, but to increase the firing range? Or is the fact that a longer barrel allowed confidently piercing armor?
            1. Catfish 9 December 2019 18: 37 New
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              Kohl, while increasing the caliber and lengthening the barrel dragged overweight and monstrous returns. A serf rifle was to be used and maintained by one person, then a gun. Therefore, I am talking about "show off." Each weapon must correspond to what it is intended for. hi
    3. abrakadabre 13 December 2019 08: 59 New
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      Yes, and the return should be such that it can break the arrow all the bones.
      It should be borne in mind that charged smoky, not modern gunpowder. And there were problems with the bullet obturation in the barrel bore, despite the wad and bullet wrap. Which significantly reduced overall returns. Again, depending on how much gunpowder to hang. You can also stuff the floor of the trunk with it.
  25. NF68 7 December 2019 16: 44 New
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    Interesting article.
  26. Undecim 7 December 2019 17: 20 New
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    The Eighty Years War: Conflict Affecting the Evolution of Warfare
    Very interesting article. But the author never made conclusions about the most important contribution to the evolution of the military affairs of this war, got stuck in the details, although one author of this "evolutionary innovation mentioned - Maurice Nassau.
    Volley fire and linear tactics are two truly revolutionary outcomes introduced by the Dutch in the person of Moritz of Orange and his cousins ​​Wilhelm Ludwig of Nassau-Dillenburgsky and John of Nassau-Siegen and existed until the end of the XIX century, and in the minds of some “generals”. all remembered about the "fool - bullet" and "well done - bayonet", also in the twentieth century.
    1. 3x3zsave 7 December 2019 20: 13 New
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      I agree with the first statement!
      However, most readers of VO, as well as the majority of the reading population of this planet, judge this war impressed by de Coster’s novel (by the way, that little booklet, in its full version, G. Miller and C. Bukowski envy black envy!).
      It would be great to read an unbiased and objective series of articles dedicated to this confrontation.
      By the way, I note that it was not the Anglo-Saxons, not the Jews, but the Dutch who actually gained independence who created the first "stock bubble" in the history of mankind - "Tulip Fever."
      1. Engineer 7 December 2019 21: 59 New
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        The topic is interesting.
        However, most readers of VO, as, indeed, the majority of the reading population of this planet, judge this war impressed by de Coster’s novel

        "Black Legend" about Spain. Then the "White Legend" about Spain. In general, Shakespearean passions.
        Maybe there will be a series of articles about this War in VO. Or was it already?
        1. 3x3zsave 7 December 2019 22: 18 New
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          Over the past 3 years have not been.
          1. Engineer 7 December 2019 22: 21 New
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            I mainly judge that war according to the magnificent book of G. Cayman "Spain. The Way to the Empire." But there, at the forefront, it’s not the military, but the “imperial” aspect
        2. Hantengri 7 December 2019 23: 53 New
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          [quote = Engineer] Maybe there will be a series of articles about this War in VO. Or was it already?
          I can recommend:
          Klim Zhukov - religious wars, part 5: the Dutch bourgeois revolution and the Battle of Newport https://oper.ru/video/view.php?t=3288
          1. Engineer 8 December 2019 00: 20 New
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            I do not want to seem like a snob, but how can this be liked? Neither format, nor diction, nor the work of the presenter (there is anti-work). It’s easier and faster to see Wikipedia if you are interested in google literature.
            Well, the political and economic determinism of Marx as the primacy of historical events is how history cannot be comprehended.
            1. Hantengri 8 December 2019 00: 22 New
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              Quote: Engineer
              Well, the political and economic determinism of Marx as the primacy of historical events is how history cannot be comprehended.

              Well ... To taste and color, all the markers are different. hi
              1. Engineer 8 December 2019 00: 30 New
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                This is not a claim. I often wonder if this is something I misunderstand.
                Marxism simply does not work in the analysis of historical events. Or works through time. The most developed part of the Netherlands - the south ultimately remained with Spain, and according to the logic of the Marxists, it should be an irreconcilable stronghold of the revolution.
                1. Hantengri 8 December 2019 00: 36 New
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                  Quote: Engineer
                  Marxism simply does not work in the analysis of historical events. Or works through time.

                  You, apparently, Marx from cover to cover ... lol In this case, you know better! laughing I am not capable of such a feat.
                  1. Engineer 8 December 2019 11: 22 New
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                    You apparently marx from cover to cover

                    Of course not. Only selectively. Therefore, a Marxist can reasonably reproach me for not arguing with Marxism, but with its "vulgar understanding" or something like that.
                    The principle of considering history through the prism of a change in socio-economic formations is simple and even primitive. The old reactionary inevitably loses and gives way to the new progressive. That's just in practice, primitive Spanish thirds drive the progressive Dutch linear infantry almost the entire war. So it turns out that it’s better not to look for exactly where the defect in our prism is, but simply to change it
                    In general, the Eighty Years War is interesting to me in the framework of the "imperial project"
                    1. Hantengri 8 December 2019 12: 51 New
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                      Quote: Engineer
                      That's just in practice, primitive Spanish thirds drive the progressive Dutch linear infantry almost the entire war. So it turns out that it’s better not to look for exactly where the defect in our prism is, but simply to change it

                      If, with the help of a telescope, we try to study exclusively the structure of the cell, we can conclude that this is no good device. laughing
                      Marxism, in its materialistic part, considers the movement of social matter in connection with the development of productive forces and production relations, and not such trifles as who drove anyone on the battlefield.
                      1. Engineer 8 December 2019 17: 46 New
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                        Marxism, in its materialistic part, considers the movement of social matter in connection with the development of productive forces and production relations, and not such trifles as who drove anyone on the battlefield.

                        Nah, Marxists have comprehensive Marxism. Politics is a function of the economy. Military affairs is the result of socio-economic relations and the level of productive forces. If a more progressive relationship wins the battlefield, the Marxists proudly declare that it’s all as we say. If on the contrary, then they begin to cast a shadow on the wattle fence. England wins in the Hundred Years War - of course, the British rely on the middle class of Yeomen from which they recruit archers. Progressive after all. France wins - babble begins about the national popular liberation movement, (such as even more progressively), although it was the French aristocracy who took up the mind that won the century.
      2. kalibr 7 December 2019 22: 17 New
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        Mary Maple Dodge - SILVER SKATES - a very interesting book about Holland, albeit a children's one.
      3. Catfish 9 December 2019 18: 43 New
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        Anton, without any anti-Semitism, and how much do you know that at that time there were no Jews in Holland? laughing drinks love
        1. 3x3zsave 9 December 2019 20: 20 New
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          There were, and most likely quite a few, the descendants of the Sepharads who fled from Spain.
          1. Catfish 9 December 2019 22: 23 New
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            Where to go ... request
            1. 3x3zsave 9 December 2019 22: 37 New
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              Nowhere. Only in the kibbutz on the Jordanian border.
              1. Catfish 9 December 2019 23: 20 New
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                Rodney is not there, otherwise he would have wound up. )))
                1. 3x3zsave 10 December 2019 06: 21 New
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                  Me too, but I've been there. In fact, Russia and Israel have a visa-free regime.
    2. Catfish 9 December 2019 18: 40 New
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      ... but in the minds of some generals. all remembered about the "fool - bullet" and "well done - bayonet", also in the twentieth century.

      Vic, good evening. If you are talking about Zhukov’s companion, then I completely agree with you. drinks
      1. Undecim 9 December 2019 19: 06 New
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        Good evening, Konstantin. Comrade "Zhukova" was not yet in the project, when in 1879
        M.I. Dragomirov, the largest military theoretician of the Russian Empire in the 2nd half of the XNUMXth century, wrote in the Tactical Textbook that "... the bullet and bayonet do not mutually exclude each other, but complement each other: the first paves the way for the second. This relationship between them will always remain, as if no improvement went on to improve firearms. " So through all the charters, that of the Russian Empire, that the pre-war Red Army, this thought passed. Therefore, Zhukov, the royal non-commissioned officer, could very well have the same point of view.
        1. Catfish 9 December 2019 22: 20 New
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          Therefore, Zhukov, the royal non-commissioned officer, could very well have the same point of view.

          I can’t say anything except one thing: Unter’s brains remained in place, although they were promoted to marshals. request
          1. Undecim 9 December 2019 22: 41 New
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            Today, in order to try to objectively evaluate Zhukov as a military leader, in my opinion, there are only archives. Whether anyone is willing and able to do this and whether they will let him into the archives is unknown.
            The current assessment, again - my opinion, is our "swing of the line" from one extreme to another.
            Unfortunately, neither in the USSR, nor today, objective history was widely available. Either the cult of personality, or the debunking of a cult, then stagnation, then perestroika, now glasnost. Today, in general, a bacchanalia brought to insanity, if only to occupy the brain and direct it in the right direction.
            The story with Zhukov - completely in the trend - then the Marshal of Victory, then heaps up with corpses.
            I do not believe in absolute plus or absolute minus. And even in the writings of the current type of historians and even more so. Look at the site for a week, the “Finnish military” was exposed and the hamsters already hooves were washed up to the blood on the keyboard in righteous anger.
            So Zhukov’s assessment is objective, so far a matter of perspective.
  27. kalibr 7 December 2019 17: 33 New
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    Quote: NF68
    People. Does anyone know what this is ?:
    This bandura has a caliber of approximately 25 mm. And the weight is appropriate. Yes, and the return should be such that it can break the arrow all the bones.

    The serf gun ...
  28. kalibr 7 December 2019 17: 35 New
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    Quote: Sea Cat
    Is this the "Japanese musketeer" with "beoendeyki"?

    It is nonsense!
  29. kalibr 7 December 2019 22: 15 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    Maybe there will be a series of articles about this War in VO. Or was it already?

    No, it was not. But first I would like to go to Holland ... to see ... to feel ... and only then to write ...
  30. Aleks2000 7 December 2019 22: 30 New
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    Goblin + Klim Zhukov has just a program about it.
    And there is a lot about the economic bourgeois background.
  31. kalibr 8 December 2019 08: 05 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    The most developed part of the Netherlands - the southern one ultimately remained with Spain, and according to the logic of the Marxists, it should be an implacable stronghold of the revolution.

    Do you know why this happened? The Spaniards needed a UNIVERSAL source of goods. And they became the Southern Netherlands. They are their gold, these are their goods. And the Northern Netherlands was focused, firstly, on maritime trade (competitors), and secondly, they had a monocultural focus - processing wool into cloth. Spain has suffered less from the climate minimum. There was no such demand for cloth there. And here - the connection with the English heretics + production of unnecessary cloth for anyone. And ... rich! Rob them ...
    1. Engineer 8 December 2019 11: 06 New
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      I have a slightly different explanation.
      1. The southern Netherlands is corny closer to the land route for the delivery of reinforcements to Flanders. Operations for the Spaniards are more convenient there.

      2. In the Northern Netherlands, there are noticeably more canals and lowlands. It is more convenient to defend oneself.
      There was no such demand for cloth there

      This is a very controversial moment. Everyone needs a cloth. Both peasants and merchants and nobles wear it. The number of varieties was enormous. Cloth is desperately needed for a soldier's uniform (hello Spanish imperial policy). My conclusion is that you really need cloth.
      The Spaniards needed a UNIVERSAL source of goods. And they became the Southern Netherlands. They are their gold, these are their goods

      It will not be enough. Belgium could not provide the whole Empire. Plus the most important moment, what will we deliver? During the war, the Dutch acquired the largest merchant fleet in the world. Moreover, any trade with Spain and its colonies is prohibited for them and for England and France. The answer was the actual legalization of smuggling from these countries to the colonies, carried out on the ground. The Spaniards themselves failed at the word trade completely (production also failed, but not completely). It got to the point of absurdity when the Dutch robbed with one hand and the other brought in supplies, including the military. And Kamen cites the words of a contemporary that Portuguese sugar in London can be bought three times cheaper than in Lisbon (Portugal under Philippe became part of the Empire)
      But with such a scheme, Belgium still has less space in the imperial economy, because the British and Dutch imported their , not Belgian goods. And after the Revolutionary War, when Spain was forced to proclaim freedom of trade, the importance of Belgium should still fall.
      It turns out that Belgium desperately needed to follow the Netherlands just to ensure a market. And if so, then where is the struggle to victory like the Dutch? (Hello Marxists, laughing ) And the second, if Protestantism is the ideology of the emerging bourgeoisie, protest ideology, then how does it turn out that in the richer and more developed Belgium Protestants were in the minority? Again, Marxism is torn like that owl. laughing
      My conclusion. The preservation of Belgium as part of the Empire occurred as a result of a set of reasons, mainly military-political, but not economic in nature (see the beginning of the post)
  32. kalibr 8 December 2019 11: 08 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    My conclusion. The preservation of Belgium as part of the Empire occurred as a result of a set of reasons, mainly military-political, but not economic

    It is truth too. I tend to sin by simplifications - the habit of a popularizer.
  33. sivuch 8 December 2019 11: 24 New
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    It is interesting that Pappenheim used cuirassier regiments of about 1000 people, consisting of ten companies of 100 people each, and at the same time narrowed the front of the attack. Wallenstein, by contrast, preferred a strike on a wide front, and his tactics were more successful.
    ---------------------
    From this phrase one might think that Pappenheim fought on his own, and Waldstein himself. Meanwhile, in addition to the company in Westphalia, the first was a subordinate of the second. (And he also came up with pappenheimer).
    And both have never been to the Netherlands.
  34. alexey alexeyev_2 8 December 2019 12: 12 New
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    Hmm .. I found out a lot of useful things .. But somehow the formation of artillery as a kind of army did not light up .. But it was artillery that made a revolution in military affairs .. Yes, and in this war played a decisive role ..
    1. kalibr 11 December 2019 07: 08 New
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      Quote: alexey alexeyev_2
      Hmm .. I found out a lot of useful things .. But somehow the formation of artillery as a kind of army did not light up .. But it was artillery that made a revolution in military affairs .. Yes, and in this war played a decisive role ..

      It will be separately!
  35. faterdom 8 December 2019 12: 28 New
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    Quote: Engineer
    The preservation of Belgium as part of the Empire occurred as a result of a set of reasons, mainly military-political, but not economic

    Small and medium-sized states in Europe, all their independence or lack thereof, is a product of military-political graters and decisions of large states and their capabilities. This applies to Luxembourg, and Switzerland and other Monegasques there. This is lucky and they live well, causing envy among Veneto and Valencia. But Northern Ireland - no luck, and it does not cause anyone to envy.
    But one desire - not enough, even manifested for centuries and in the most active forms - the Basques do not have a separate state.
  36. Basarev 10 February 2020 17: 57 New
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    Well, I don’t know, for me so being in the Empire is an honor in itself. And if such an honorary membership has costs - you need to courageously transfer and pay them - the rest of the provinces calmly pay, why should the Netherlands not? It would be closer to me if the Spanish empire within its maximum borders still existed. Better few countries, but really strong, rich and developed. And sovereignty is too overrated.