Heroic Belgium. The first victim of German aggression

We continue the cycle “The Entente's victory is the victory of Russia” (“The victory of the Entente is the victory of Russia. Who is to blame for the outbreak of World War I? ”) Today we look at the contribution of Belgium to the victory over Germany and its allies in the First World War.

Little Belgium was the first victim of German aggression.

Already 4 August 1914 g. German troops invaded the territory of Belgium, which led to the entry into the war of Great Britain - the guarantor of Belgian neutrality. But the territory of Belgium was necessary for Germany - for the implementation of Schlieffen's strategic planning.

Albert I (1875 - 1934) is the King of Belgium from December 17 to 1909 from the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha Dynasty. King of Belgium Albert became a real hero of the Great War. His figure gained great popularity in Europe thanks to the bold and courageous deeds of the young monarch. After heavy defeats from Germany, Albert was not at a loss and led the army himself. Under his leadership, the small forces of Belgium held their bridgehead until the very end of the war, and then successfully acted in the decisive offensive of the Entente. For successful actions as commander in chief, Albert received the honorary name "King Knight". His fame came to England, where the collection "King Albert's Book" was published, dedicated to the king and people of Belgium. Particularly noted the head of the Union State, Russian Emperor Nicholas II, who awarded Albert I with the Orders of St. George of the 4 and 3 degrees.

Operational contribution

The Belgian army entered into an unequal battle with the Germans - actively participating in the Frontier Battle of 1914 (special hopes were assigned to the Liège and Antwerp fortresses), after which most of the Belgian territory was occupied by the Germans.

So, during the defense of Liège 5 - 16 on August 1914, the garrison of the fortress under the command of General J. Lehmann became the first serious obstacle to the German forces.

Gerard Lehman (1851 - 1920) - Belgian military, lieutenant general. The commandant of the Liege fortress during her defense in 1914

The Kaiser command planned to take the fortress with a simple assault and dispense with siege weapons. However, the first attacks of the German troops were repelled by the Belgians. The calculation of the Germans was not justified, and they retreated, suffering huge losses. Only with the help of powerful artillery systems, among which was the 420-mm "Big Bert", the fortress was taken. Nevertheless, the reinforcements of Liège and the courage of his defenders fulfilled their task, having detained the German army for the period of time necessary to mobilize the armies of Belgium and France.

Belgium had to endure the horrors of the German occupation, terror against the civilian population and the destruction of many settlements (the destruction of the city of Louvain became the personification of the atrocities of the Kaiser army).

Ruined Louvain

But the Belgian army, led by Hero King Albert I, retained a piece of their native territory - which became the site of the Western (French) front frozen for the long 4 years. The Belgian army is a participant in Run to the Sea operations (1914), Ypresian battles and operations in Flanders in 1915 - 1918.

So, in the Battle of Ysera 16 - 31 on October 1914, units of the Belgian, French and British armies took part. After the Germans occupied Brussels, the exhausted Belgian army defended along the river. Iser. King Albert himself took command of the troops. In his proclamation, he called this line of defense the last frontier to be defended at all costs. For 6 days, Belgian troops defended themselves against a numerically superior enemy under powerful artillery fire, repelling continuous attacks up to 15 times a night. Turning the tide of the battle helped an unexpected decision - the Belgians flooded the low valley of the river. Ysera by the sea, opening the floodgates of the dam at high tide. The German offensive was stopped. Despite heavy losses, the Allies won a strategic victory.

And during the offensive in Flanders, 28 of September - 20 of October 1918, the Belgian divisions acted as part of the general allied offensive. The offensive was preceded by a German strike in the spring and summer of 1918, after repulsing which, the armies of the Entente countries and Allies of the Entente moved forward. Moreover, the actions of the Belgian army, operating in the battles of Ypres and Curtre, were one of the most successful. During the Flanders operation, the allies managed to advance 100 km, and King Albert's army advanced farthest.

The Belgian army’s operational contribution was to actively oppose Schlieffen’s strategic planning (in particular, a significant number of German troops held Antwerp), and then to stabilize the Western Front and (generally) successfully retain its defense sector.

Belgian troops took an active part in the fighting in Africa.

Exposed forces and losses incurred

In 1914 - 1917 years. Belgium had 6 infantry and 1 cavalry divisions (hereinafter to the figures in relation to the Western Front - see World War in numbers. M.-L., 1934.) The army at 1914 consisted of 175 thousand people.

In the 1918 campaign, the group was doubled - and in February 1918 the Belgian army already consisted of 12 infantry (110 active battalions) and 1 cavalry (24 squadron) divisions.

500 thousand people were mobilized into the Belgian army. Losses amounted to: 100 thousand people killed (and not returning) (20%), 150 thousand wounded (30%) and 70 thousand prisoners, etc. (14%) - total 320 thousand people or 64% of the armed forces.

On August 1 1918, the Belgian army had 419 light and 360 heavy guns, 269 mortars, 1004 light and light machine guns, and 2970 machine guns, 105 aircraft. The army at that date totaled 167709 eaters (including the 134143 fighter).

Military-technical inventions in the service of the Belgian army

The Mauser M1889 is a Belgian rifle from Germany. In 1889 in Germany, a rifle designed for a new cartridge with smokeless powder was designed at the Mauser factory in Germany. In the homeland it weapon did not take root, but the license for its production was bought by Belgium, where it was adopted. A special enterprise was created for the production of Mausers in Belgium, and during the German occupation during the First World War, refugees who left the country were placed at a factory in England, where they continued to work for the benefit of the front, producing these rifles. In various versions, this weapon has been in the arsenal of Belgium for more than 50 years.

The weapon that unleashed the war: Browning pistol. It was from this pistol, the birthplace of which is Belgium, that the Serbian terrorist Gavrilo Princip killed the heir to the throne of the Dual Empire, Archduke Franz Ferdinand and his wife Sophia Hotek, which served as the occasion for the outbreak of hostilities of the First World War. Browning pistol models have gained worldwide fame due to their reliability and simplicity. In Russia, Browning was popular among officers.

The armored car with the abbreviation SAVA replaced the obsolete armored car "Minerva". The new armored car was created on the basis of a sports car, which improved its driving performance. The car was reliably protected thanks to a completely enclosed body with a curved windshield, smoothly turning into the roof with a machine-gun turret of circular rotation, which became the "hallmark" of this armored car. The armored car division, which also included the new SAVA models, entered the replenishment of the Russian army’s armored forces in 1915, the “Car Cannon and Machine Gun Corps”, by personal order of the King of Belgium Albert, came to the aid of Russia during heavy fighting in Galicia. The expeditionary armored corps consisted of 375 personnel, 13 armored vehicles (6 cannon, 4 machine guns and 3 commander), 6 cars, 20 trucks, 18 motorcycles and 130 bicycles. After the division arrived, its review in Tsarskoye Selo was carried out by Emperor Nicholas II himself.

Results of participation in the war

The Great War swept a destructive rink around the Kingdom of Belgium. As we noted above, a significant part of the country's territory in 1914 - 1918. was occupied by Germany. During this time, 6000 civilians were killed, 25000 residential buildings were destroyed. About 1500000 Belgians (20% of the country's population) became refugees. The Kaiser forces committed many war crimes, carrying out the genocide of the Belgian people. The spheres of science and culture of Belgium suffered during the war. In particular, the largest library of the University of Leuven was burned. 300000 books disappeared in the fire, including many medieval books and manuscripts.

As a result of the war, Belgium received: Eupen, Malmedy and Moren, as well as a mandate for Rwanda and Urundi in German East Africa. The territory increased by 990 sq. km with a population of 65 thousand people. Belgium also got 8% of the total military indemnity.

One of the consequences of the First World War for Belgium was the rejection of the policy of neutrality and following in the foreign policy channel of France.

Comments

[apro]

Belgium's neutrality was guaranteed by the Angles ....

[Basil50]

You're right looks funny
But the Germans in Belgium were still very humane in comparison with the Belgians themselves. It is not very customary to recall the atrocities of the Caucasians in the colonies, but they were.
The Belgians atrocities like the others, but it's all somewhere far away, and here the Belgians themselves are suddenly forced to kill those who are against. It’s just the right time to scream about misfortune and barbarism towards such educated and even somewhat cultural subjects of Albert.
And the heroism of the Belgians in protecting their own country was frankly not enough. Here are advertisements and stories about * courage * yeah, that’s as many as you want.

[Albatroz]

Of course you are an amateur
Yes only facts stubborn thing dear
Yes, and the heroic resistance to the aggressor, and the mass atrocities of the Germans in Belgium.
And a small country fighting for independence

[Olgovich]

Quote: Albatroz

And a small country fighting for independence

You are right in everything.

And yes, Russia perfectly understood what was happening and looked at it with admiration:

BELGIUM

Defeated but not a slave

You stand proudly without armor

Your shrine is defiled

But the soul is pure, like snow.

Bloody feast in the smoke of fire

Satan’s formidable satan

And under the sword of his blow

Broken brave country.

But the spirit is free, the spirit is mighty

Great powers not quenched,

He soars like a cloud like an eagle

Over a chain of valiant graves.

And the lot of truth will be accomplished:

Your enemy will fall at your feet

And will pray with sorrow

To your broken altars!


Sergey Yesenin, 1914.

[vladcub]

For the first time I see such a poem. Actually, I don’t know I know poems by heart, but Yesenin’s poems were periodically re-read, but I didn’t meet such

[Olgovich]

Quote: vladcub

For the first time I see such a poem. Actually, I don’t know I know poems by heart, but Yesenin’s poems were periodically re-read, but I didn’t meet such

Yesenin S. A. Collected Works: 2 vols. T. 1. Poems, Poems / Word about the poet Yu. V. Bondarev. - M .: Owls. Russia: Contemporary. 1990. - 480 p.,

[Basil50]

That the Belgians, that the French, that the British about their own heroism and wrote a lot of things and told, even a bunch of witnesses were found. That's just really heroic without any embellishment and lies on those fronts was how the RUSSIAN SOLDIERS and OFFICERS fought from the expeditionary force.
The French proved themselves to be ordinary cattle, that the government was just French, when then RUSSIAN SOLDIERS and OFFICERS were then shot or driven into colonies. At the same time, the government and * ordinary * citizens only welcomed the executions and how they drove RUSSIAN people into the colony.
The French and the justification for their bestiality towards the RUSSIAN people were let down, quite in the spirit of the then Europe

[Bar2]

The Mauser 89 rifle was called a commission rifle, because Mauser’s company had nothing to do with this rifle.

History of production
Constructor German Arms Commission
Producer Ludwig Loewerude, Anel, Steyr-Mannlicher, Amberg Imperial Arsenal, Danzig, Erfurt and Spandau, Hanyang Arsenal

https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gewehr_1888

[Albatroz]

Read about the "Belgian" Mauser
In your wiki, it will be interesting

[Undecim]

Bar2, referring to weapons on Wikipedia is the same as referring to "Doctor Aibolit" in relation to the geography of Africa. Gewehr 88 and Fusil d'lnfanterie Mle 1889 / FN Mauser 1889 are two different samples, and the latter was never called a commission.

[vladcub]

V.N. not all such erudition. And Vika is at hand. What a sin to conceal, and I look at Vika on every occasion, but another thing is that she is not always true

[Bar2]

Quote: Undecim

Bar2, referring to weapons on Wikipedia -

there are links on wikipedia ...

[Far B]

thanks to the bold and courageous deeds of the young monarch

Young? At 40? He may be a knight king, but obviously not young.

carrying out the genocide of the Belgian people

Damn, and these, it turns out, are genocide:

a significant part of the country's territory in 1914 - 1918 was occupied by Germany. During this time, 6000 civilians were killed.

No, it’s shitty, of course, but obviously it doesn’t attract genocide. But what the Belgians themselves did in the Belgian Congo, is quite attracted to genocide.

[Astra wild]

Colleague Dalny, for the sake of justice, which of the enlightened colonialists played nice with the natives? Remember in childhood: "okay, okay, where were you?"

[Albatroz]

Of course damn
Genocide Women and girls were taken from Belgium and France to Germany
Derived Belgian. Anyway, Belgium was planned for annexation.

[Astra wild]

Perhaps the Belgians in WWI and fought bravely, but in WWII, I don’t remember something about Belgian courage.

[WILL]

I’ll tell you more ... The Belgians fought well in the ranks of the Wehrmacht and the SS! In July 1941 - 373 Walloon battalion was created, transferred to the 97th Infantry Division of the 17th Wehrmacht Army! The Belgians distinguished themselves in the ranks of the SS Viking Division. Only among the Prisoners of War who surrendered to the Soviet Forces were 2010 Belgians!
That is Our Victory in the Great Patriotic War, that the Red Army fought with the troops of a united Europe! Blessed Memory To Our Ancestors - Crushing the Nazi Reptile!

Quote: Astra wild

Perhaps the Belgians in WWI and fought bravely, but in WWII, I don’t remember something about Belgian courage.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Astra wild

Perhaps the Belgians in WWI and fought bravely, but in WWII, I don’t remember something about Belgian courage.

You're not right. The Belgians bravely fought in the ranks of the SS, the Belgian factories bravely replenished the Wehrmacht's arsenals, and the Belgian peasants, just as bravely fed Germany.

[voyaka uh]

It was because of the large losses and destruction in the WWII that the Belgians did not want - in fact, in large numbers - to participate in WWII. Like the French.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: voyaka uh

It was because of the large losses and destruction in the WWII that the Belgians did not want - in fact, in large numbers - to participate in WWII. Like the French.

What the hell is this? The Nazis occupied their country, and they - "and we do not want to fight, because in WWI we had a lot of destruction." And we went to enroll in the 28th SS Panzergrenadier Division "Wallonia" and the 5th SS Panzer Division "Viking".
It’s necessary to think of such a thing.
And the French did not want to fight because they were winners in the WWII? However.

[voyaka uh]

This happens. Large military losses (even in victorious wars) weaken nations and countries. And the next war is no longer enough for people to go and have the enthusiasm. Even if you need to defend your land.
The wars of Charles the Twelfth weakened Sweden, and the wars of Napoleon - France.
And there are many such examples.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: voyaka uh

This happens. Large military losses (even in victorious wars) weaken nations and countries. And the next war is already lacking in people of will and enthusiasm

Yes, yes, it’s not enough to defend our country, but to participate in the capture of a foreign country is enough will and enthusiasm. You better not write than write like that.

[voyaka uh]

I do not write what pleases me, or what I personally condone. And I bring fragments of history, even unworthy.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: voyaka uh

I do not write what pleases me, or what I personally condone. And I bring fragments of history, even unworthy.

That is, the Belgians themselves told you that they had neither the will nor the enthusiasm to defend their homeland? Enough to assist the occupier in capturing another country?
Or did you come up with it yourself? Well, if you came up with it yourself, then you shouldn't pass off these notions as "fragments of history".

[Trapperxnumx]

Quote: Krasnoyarsk

That is, the Belgians themselves told you that they had neither the will nor the enthusiasm to defend their homeland? Enough to assist the occupier in capturing another country?
Or did you come up with it yourself? Well, if you came up with it yourself, then you shouldn't pass off these notions as "fragments of history".

I understand it sounds strange and wild to us, but nevertheless, many historians come to exactly this conclusion and there are reasons for this. Look - the era of the Napoleonic Wars fell on almost the peak of the birth rate and the inner self-consciousness of the French. At this time, their army showed miracles of courage, heroism, self-sacrifice ... One hundred years later, the demographic situation has changed. The birth rate dropped quite strongly, various views and ideas “to live for oneself,” etc., became strong in society. But the general mood was still enough for the truly massive heroism of WWI. No matter how they tell us that the evil tsarist generals drove the poor Russian peasants to slaughter, what was happening on the western front no less, and perhaps more, speaks of the disregard for their soldiers. The percentage of losses in France was much higher than that in Germany and Russia. And it was France who washed in blood in that war. And there is nothing surprising that 20 years later another generation of French people has already grown up. But this does not mean that they were all whiners and slobber. They had Marshal de Gaulle, there was a squadron of Normandie-Niemen, there were collaborators - those who longed for the greatness of France on the ideas of Nazism. Yes, this is wild for us. But they had it.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Trapper7

I understand it sounds unusual and wild for us,

I especially liked the "wild", and "unusual" is the "shot in the milk".
I have a different version: The Belgians simply did not have a king of the 1940 model in 1914. Those. there was no organizer who would lead the struggle of Belgium with the Nazis.
Evidence, as an example, is the RI-USSR. The WWII for RI was also not a festive walk, then the Great Patriotic War and the struggle against the invaders, the most difficult years of collectivization, industrialization, the famine of 32-33, and, despite this, mass heroism and VICTORY!
Because there was an ORGANIZER - VKPb and I.V. Stalin.
As for France, there is not a "lack of will and enthusiasm" among the French, but the division of the ruling "elite" into two camps - supporters and opponents of the fight against the aggressor. As a result, the army was left without a clear and rigid command. In such a situation, any army, no matter how "will and enthusiasm" it may have, will be defeated.
As happened with the Belgians, and with the French, and with the Poles, and with the Czechs and others like them.

[Astra wild]

Warrior, in this case, why do not you refuse to fight? Already in WWII you had to salton. Probably here, something else

[Trapperxnumx]

It's not about losses and defeats. The point is national self-awareness and readiness for self-sacrifice. The French as a great nation just entered a period of decline precisely at the beginning of the 20th century. and now this continues especially clearly. The Spaniards joined this league of former greats even earlier. Since the end of the 19th century. the palm of national identity and development was picked up by Germany and Russia, and it was they who showed the most cruel confrontation

[Astra wild]

The author will say: the Belgians then had a young king. But seriously, it is amazing how different the story is. For example, in WWII, Italians were opponents of Germany, and in WWII, allies. In WWII, the Bilgians resisted, and in WWII they went to serve Hitler

[Albatroz]

But what, not a young king?
Forty years old man. Not only about modern concepts.
But if you compare with the ages of the ruling monarchs of Europe in the year 14

[Hunghuz]

And by the way, it's not even age.
The responsible and heroic man was Albert. I would live to be 40 years old, I would repeat - and I would never think of any surrender. Leopold turned out to be an unworthy successor

[soloveyav]

But the Second World Society did not want war, moreover - after the trench hell of the First World War, many were ready for everything, if only there was no war, and the Germans in Europe behaved themselves pretty well - accordingly, many thought why resist if we live so well.

[LiSiCyn]

Hi Sanya

Quote: soloveyav

the Second World Society did not want war, moreover, after the trench hell of the First World War, many were ready for anything, if only not for war

And with that, the Belgians launched the construction of a global fortified area. Consisting of forts operating on natural and artificial water barriers. True, in the 2nd MV this did not help them. The epic capture of Eben-Enamel by the sapper company of the 1st Parachute Division is something.

[soloveyav]

And good evening to you!
They built it to build, but not one fortified area will stop the enemy by itself. Here the French most of the Maginot line was repulsed until the very surrender of France and surrendered through the mediation of the Vichy regime. But then no one knew how to deal with the Germans - the speed set paid off. And if people did not want peace at all costs - Hitler could be put in place even when troops were sent to the Rhine region or the Anschluss of Austria. But again - we know it now, it has already happened. And then nobody knew that.
Everyone was guided by the experience of 1 MV, where the front did not change for months, and the attacks were choked in blood.

[LiSiCyn]

Quote: soloveyav

Here the French most of the Maginot line was repulsed until the very surrender of France and surrendered through the mediation of the Vichy regime.

That is not very long. Clearly, they did not expect that they would get around so quickly from the rear.

Quote: soloveyav

no fortified area will stop the enemy on its own.

How long did the Brest Fortress hold? Sevastopol?
And the Belgians (as they believed) had everything for defense. Canals (in stone), bridges, gateways are all prepared for undermining. And practically could not do anything.

[soloveyav]

So Belgium was bypassed both through Luxembourg and through France. And they fought for almost a month, which is a lot. Our society was still prepared for the coming war, and the government did not depend on elections. And still there is a difference - one thing your country is occupied, but formally there is, you have almost the same administration, the police and the king stayed and capitulated, and another when you are declared inferior and subject to expulsion across the Urals and turn into slaves. Their situation is different. After the 1 MV that really changed the idea of ​​war, people wanted to wall themselves off and forget. And the government is forced to reckon, otherwise they will choose others. As a result, for their own and neighbors' mistakes - the same period of the "strange war" - everyone paid back in full.

[soloveyav]

Quote: soloveyav

Yes, and they fought for almost a month, which is a lot.

This means based on the area. Belgium is still a small country.

[LiSiCyn]

Quote: soloveyav

Our society was still preparing for the upcoming war.

Yes, and they were preparing. The fort was built from the 32nd to the 35th year. There may not have been a desire to fight, and the example of Poland did not add optimism. Europe was blown away, relaxed after Versailles.

Quote: soloveyav

it’s one thing your country is occupied, but it is formally there, you have almost the same administration and even the police

And the "economic miracle" of Germany was before my eyes.

[soloveyav]

Quote: LiSiCyn

Europe was blown away, relaxed after Versailles.

Many errors, not dangerous individually, came together and got everything for it.

[LiSiCyn]

Was not in Koenig (Kaliningrad)? On fortifications, we also have something to see.

The first two are Sapun Mountain, Diorama. 3 and 4, 35th battery. Sevastopol

[soloveyav]

No wasn `t. And in Sevastopal only a long time and travel. Of course I want to see, all the same, the story in such places feels great.

[LiSiCyn]

In our city of König, the condition is certainly not very, not, not so ... Not everything is still in proper shape. But in Sevastopol, yes there, history is at every turn. I just fell in love with this city. Twice already been, and still hope to visit. In the summer I would like, or even in the sea, only washed and washed my hands)))

[soloveyav]

The main thing is that the restoration process is going on. If people work, then there will be a result. And I liked Sevastopol, although I only saw it for a couple of hours, and it was still considered Ukrainian.

[LiSiCyn]

Quote: soloveyav

I liked Sevastopol, although I only saw it for a couple of hours, and it was still considered Ukrainian.

Just heaven and earth. I was last year in spring and autumn, and even for six months I noticed a difference. In the fall, just Malakhov-barrow was opened, after restoration. In the spring, still on the ferry, in the fall already over the bridge.

Malakhov Kurgan.

[soloveyav]

Handsomely . What else to say)

[LiSiCyn]

By the way, do you see the "holes" on the monument? This is already being hit by fascist shells. And under the monument there is a slab, at this point the nucleus hit Admiral Kornilov. Cores on the slab, the cross is laid out.

[Olgovich]

Well done Belgians, they have thrust the first wedge into the lubricated gears of Germany's "lightning-fast" war.

What is amazing is how much respect they have today for the glorious memory of their ancestors: everywhere there are monuments, preserved trenches, cemeteries, pride in them.

It is stunning against the background of kitchen gardens and dance floors arranged by scoundrels in the cemeteries of the Russian heroes of the WWI, the monuments blown up by them and the feat of the Russian soldier who defended the Fatherland in WWI was blamed by them.

[Astra wild]

Olgovich, what I agree with you is that it is not beautiful to forget the courage of ancestors. Unfortunately, I learned about P MV only on the site a lot of new and interesting

[Olgovich]

Quote: Astra wild

Olgovich, what I agree with you is that it is not beautiful to forget the courage of ancestors. Unfortunately, I learned about P MV only on the site a lot of new and interesting

See the story Brotherly cemetery in Moscow: there were tens of thousandsh graves of Russian soldiers and officers, sisters of mercy, pilots, Serbs. French and British and pr-at each plate and a monument.
Monuments and crosses demolished and right over the graveswithout digging up the remains, they made paths, a cinema Leningrad, a cafe. greenhouses

And so they did throughout ALL of Russia .... Not a single monument to the Heroes of WWI in the USSR, NOT ONE, but the former ones were built, demolished .....

[Kronos]

Because there was nothing heroic of the war of the imperialist powers over the redivision of the world. Only the capitalists received profit while welding in the war while simple mobilized guys from Germany, Russia, France, England and so on killed each other

[Albatroz]

The Second World War was not imperialistic?))
If you look through such glasses Kronos

[Kronos]

On the part of the USSR, no, because not the colonies fought or the Turkish Straits

[Hunghuz]

The USSR was "lucky" to be attacked by his friend and partner. With whom Poland was recently imperialistically divided. And before that they were stripping Finland.
Yes, and the domestic war turned into imperialist. After the rejection of Koenigsberg, a number of other territories. Yes, and there were plans for the straits) Unlike the Russian Empire, by the way. Specific plans.
They were not missed in the years 45-47, but the fact was)

[Kronos]

Poland itself treacherously took these territories, having seized them from the USSR before that, the Finns and the Nazis were friends offering them a peaceful exchange of territories, they were not any other and partner of the USSR and the Reich.

[Hunghuz]

So you can justify anything)
Everything was once someone's) And Koenigsberg was German)
I'm talking about imperialist behavior)
But for me, a worthy state must observe its interests, there is nothing reprehensible here. Less stamps)
And they were friends and partners. Ribbentrop felt himself in the negotiations for the Pact among the "old party comrades." And in 40, in November, ours and the Germans tried to divide the British Empire at the negotiations in Berlin) And when the bombing began, the question followed - is it not those who are now pouring on us from the air?))

[Kronos]

Yes, you just repeat the old mossy cliches of anti-Soviet propaganda nothing new

[XII legion]

Stamps Kronos in my opinion it is with you
When Honghuz, by your own standards, approached the acts of a later period, you blame him for this)

[Olgovich]

Quote: Kronos

Poland itself treacherously took these territories, seizing them from the USSR before

which USSR in 1920, what are you talking about ?!
And SNK SAM itself has denied the borders of Russia by a decree on NON-RECOGNITION of the partition of Poland.

And by the way, who is SNK? Illegal? So all the neighbors spat on him, they had legal. right.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Hunghouse

The USSR was "lucky" to be attacked by his friend and partner. With whom Poland was recently imperialistically divided.

You have a complete "hunhuz" in your head. The USSR did not divide Poland. The USSR regained the territories seized by Poland in 1920. The USSR in 1939 did not go beyond the "Curzon Line" - the border between the USSR and Poland, established and recognized by the European powers, following the results of WWI.
And with Finland it’s not like you fantasize here.

Quote: Hunghouse

Yes, and the domestic war turned into imperialist. After the rejection of Koenigsberg, a number of other territories.

First, clarify about "a number of other territories"
And about Koenigsberg ... This is a payment for what they did with our country during the war years. How many people were killed, how many villages and towns were burned and destroyed. I believe that they still got off cheaply.

Quote: Hunghouse

Specific plans.

Even if there were such plans, which I strongly doubt, and so what? Everyone can, but we LOVE? Among wolves to live, howl like a wolf, do you know such wisdom?

[Hunghuz]

Yes, that's just the Poles did not think so and the Finns)
You are just trying to justify some (WWII) and not others (WWII))
Giving naive justifications.
There is only one answer - then keep quiet about imperialism) if you already play on the field of double standards
Or are some cannibals not as cannibalistic as others?)

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Hunghouse

Yes, that's just the Poles did not think so and the Finns)

And I do not care what the Poles thought there. They still believe that Smolensk is a Polish city. Do I have to listen to their counters?

Quote: Hunghouse

You are just trying to justify some (WWII)

I repeat again - I do not care about WWII, I'm talking about the Second World War.
My late father-soldier does not need any excuses there, he did everything right.

[XII legion]

My late father is a war veteran in some excuses

like my late great-grandfather - a hero of the Second World War

[Olgovich]

Quote: Kronos

On the part of the USSR, no, because not the colonies fought or the Turkish Straits

Yeah, and Russia, which attacked because of the colony.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Olgovich

Quote: Kronos

On the part of the USSR, no, because not the colonies fought or the Turkish Straits

Yeah, and Russia, which attacked because of the colony.

Is not it so? Do you think that if the Germans had won, we would not have become their colony?

[Olgovich]

Quote: Krasnoyarsk

Is not it so? Do you think that if the Germans had won, we would not have become their colony?

Question-have you read?

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Albatroz

The Second World War was not imperialistic?))
If you look through such glasses Kronos

And for us it was the Patriotic War, and not at all imperialistic.

[vladcub]

In fact, courage at all times is worthy of respect. But with PMV, it was far from as simple as we are used to. To begin with, Serbia, Belgium fought for their independence, and that already changes a lot.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: vladcub

In fact, courage at all times is worthy of respect.

When the two organized crime groups came together in a struggle to redistribute the sphere of influence and courageously kill each other in a shootout, do you think I should admire their courage and respect them?

[Hunghuz]

One of these organized crime groups is the St. Petersburg organized crime group, which currently rules in Russia?
And then who is the second, igil?

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Hunghouse

One of these organized crime groups is the St. Petersburg organized crime group, which currently rules in Russia?
And then who is the second, igil?

Well I say - a complete hunghouse in my head.

[Astra wild]

Honghouse colleague, why do you need to repeat unsuccessful analogies?

[Astra wild]

It seems to me that your analogy is not appropriate. At least in relation to Serbia and Belgium, and courage has always been appreciated.

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Astra wild

It seems to me that your analogy is not appropriate. At least in relation to Serbia and Belgium, and courage has always been appreciated.

Then it was necessary to write - the courage of the Belgians defending their homeland and the Serbs fighting for their independence is worthy of respect and memory.
And then he is also not a timid bandit, do I really admire him?

[Astra wild]

I did not have to personally communicate with brave bandits. They are usually brave when they cannot resist

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Astra wild

I did not have to personally communicate with brave bandits. They are usually brave when they cannot resist

Movie tales. Everything is like everywhere else. That is not the question. The question is - should I admire them?

[Olgovich]

Quote: Kronos

simple mobilized guys from Germany, Russia, France, England and so on were killing each other

, yes, poor mobilized guys from Germany WWII.
Cry over them.

[vladcub]

For this there is Kolya from Urengoy

[also clean]

Quote: Olgovich

Not a single monument to the Heroes of WWI in the USSR, NOT ONE, but the former ones were built-demolished .....

But there is no need to lie. In Riga, the garrison cemetery has been and is to this day. The graves of Russian PMV. Nobody took it. There is also a separate cemetery for WWI Germans. Also a whole. Almost ... In the "holy" 90s, lovers of flower gardens tore off copper plates. But everything has already been restored, and under the USSR no one broke anything. I saw it myself - I live nearby

[Olgovich]

Quote: alsoclean

But there is no need to lie. In Riga, the garrison cemetery has been and is to this day. The graves of Russian PMV. Nobody took it. There is also a separate cemetery for WWI Germans. Also a whole. Almost ... In the "holy" 90s, lovers of flower gardens tore off copper plates. But everything has already been restored, and under the USSR no one broke anything. I saw it myself - I live nearby

What are you saying, come on call the WHOLE WWII cemeteries in Russia, Ukraine and Belarus sample 1938 . What. google what? No? What’s so?

Now answer: what the USSR had a relationship. having destroyed ALL cemeteries and monuments of WWI to ... Latvia until 1944, huh? NO? now it got it?

That hands did not reach. as before the cemetery in Chisinau, which also had no relation to the USSR.

And AFTER WWII, after some return of memory to those who have lost their memory, it was already inconvenient.

so do not lie: where they reached, destroyed EVERYWHERE.

[also clean]

What are you saying, name the WHOLE WWII cemeteries in Russia, Ukraine and Belarus of the 1938 model. What. google what? No? What’s so?

Yes! If in principle, then in 1938 the Tsarskoye Selo Bratskoe Cemetery existed completely intact. Truth is on the balance sheet of the parish. Yes, the church was demolished in 1938. The cemetery was closed for burials. But not destroyed. And while the parish existed, there was a cemetery. In 1953, the Tsarskoye Selo Parish was abolished. And in 1956 the crosses were demolished and the cemetery was re-allocated for new burials. What can I say: outrageous. Nikita is a kukuruznik in her repertoire - although .... this is a dark matter. Where did the Moscow Patriarchate look ??

[Olgovich]

Quote: alsoclean

If in principle, then in 1938

I have indicated the year 38 for Ukraine and Belarus, because almost all of them have been PRESERVED in the western part, which fell into the USSR in 39 g.

The cemetery in Tsarskoye Selo was demolished by BULDOSERS and right on the graves, on bones, from above, they built gardens for party nomenclature.

your lovers of cucumbers from the dust of Russian heroes, yes ....

What are you talking about nonsense about the Church? WHO then listened to her? Neither her rights, nor freedom of conscience among citizens, NEVER.

The land did not belong to her, the party authorities decided everything.

[also clean]

Cemetery in Tsarskoye Selo demolished by bulldozers

Yes, it was. Somewhere.

arranged gardens for party nomenclature.

Vegetable gardens for whom ???? Figured it out myself?
Once again, for those "who are in the tank" - a cemetery was made there. A NEW CEMETERY for people, just people ... It's bad of course ... But they did it ,,,,,, by bulldozers.

Who then listened to her? The land did not belong to her, everyone decided the party authorities.

Well, then they decided - from 1939 to 1956 to oblige the Tsarskoye Selo Parish to take care of the cemetery at their own expense. And after 1953, in connection with the abolition of the Parish, the cemetery became "no-man's". 3 years of fuss. And that's it ........

[Olgovich]

Quote: alsoclean

Vegetable gardens for whom ???? Figured it out myself?
Once again, for those "who are in the tank" - a cemetery was made there. A NEW CEMETERY for people, just people ..

For tankmen once again, on a large part of the cemetery were smashed kitchen gardens.

Go and see, ignoramus.

Quote: alsoclean

So they decided then - from 1939 to 1956 to oblige the Tsarskoye Selo Parish to take care of the cemetery at their own expense. And after 1953, in connection with the abolition of the Parish, the cemetery became "no-man's". 3 years of fuss. And that's it ...

Nothing in the state where ALL-state?
Say also that TENS OF THOUSANDS of churches and parishes were closed and destroyed by the Russian Orthodox Church itself.

[also clean]

For tankmen once again, on a large part of the cemetery, the FENCES.

Go and see, ignoramus.

Oh how! Hamim! Oh well! Wikipedia fan!
And he himself doesn’t even live in Russia!
And it is not weak to learn, O idiot youth, that "Tsarskoye Selo Bratskoe Cemetery" was previously called "Military section of the Kazan Cemetery". That exists, and for a long time, the very Kazan cemetery - in the same place. Moreover, since 1784. That there is not only vegetable gardens - there is no housing there. According to sanitary standards. So fade - it is disgusting to even discuss your nonsense. Cave anti-Sovietism !! And cave thinking ..

Quote: Olgovich

Nothing in the state, where EVERYTHING is state?

Child! That is the problem of the Soviet Union: in the state there was a complete draw and no one answered!
And I didn’t see the abandoned churches ?? Not demolished, but abandoned. Decaying ... How's that?

[Olgovich]

Quote: alsoclean

Oh how! Hamim! Oh well!

Stuck-in the stable.

Quote: alsoclean

And he himself doesn’t even live in Russia!

But where?
Russia is not the rest that you left from it, feeding it with the lands of your Ukraine, Kazakhstan, etc.
Cut a bundle on your forehead.

Quote: alsoclean

And it is not weak to learn, O idiot youth, that "Tsarskoye Selo Bratskoe Cemetery" was previously called "Military Section of the Kazan Cemetery". That exists, and for a long time, the very Kazan cemetery - in the same place. Moreover, since 1784.

Yeah:

The red-haired, rather sensibly, albeit monotonously, told the content of the mass brochure "The Mutiny at Ochakovo"

.Read, found out finally?
Maladets!

Quote: alsoclean

That there is not something that gardens - there is no housing. According to sanitary standards.

You rave ..... What ... sanorma at those whom it stopped ?

Kutuzovsky Prospekt Moscow was built right onand bones two cemeteries (Dorogomilvsky and Jewish) - it is also called the "Road of Death", the same with the cinema Leningrad, etc., etc.: almost ALL Moscow cemeteries have gone under houses, etc.
This is today about Kutuzovsky:

“We were driving to the area when a signal was received that the builders had stumbled upon gravestones. We saw these slabs with our own eyes, some of them with inscriptions in Hebrew. I don’t know where they went later. They say some ended up at the builders' dachas ".

In Chisinau, houses are built directly on the bones of the Jewish, Novotroitsky, Armenian and other cemeteries. Bones and gravestones are still being climbed.

The ashes of the great Russian architect A. Bernardazzi are located approximately in the center of the hall of the cinema "40 years of VLCM", where children danced around the Christmas tree. He is being demolished now and they want to restore the monument on his grave, as well as on other graves.

So go, idler, to Tsarskoye Selo and make sure!

Maybe at least you will see at the same time that the "successful" system has long disappeared, crushed by its own problems.

Quote: alsoclean

Child! That is the problem of the Soviet Union: in the state there was a complete draw and no one answered!

Do not talk nonsense, but read the constitution of the USSR.

Quote: alsoclean

And I didn’t see the abandoned churches ?? Not demolished, but abandoned. Decaying ... How's that?

Still not got it ?!

The state took away from people and, of course, ditched. The church, ALL little was carefully preserved. Recovers after it today.

Well, just cave Bolshevism and the same unfading thinking ..

[Astra wild]

I’m not going to defend church authorities, atheist, but I doubt that Patriarch Alexy or whoever was there could resist Khrushchev

[also clean]

Patriarch Alexy of course, but only Alexy 1 (first). Naturally could not. But if for garlic, Nikita was buried. Here, obviously, the local bureaucrats tried ... They say the economic business ...

[Semurg]

The French are bad students and in the WWII and WWII Germans launched an offensive in the same directions, and for the French it was a revelation. Their entire line of maginos wasted money.

[The leader of the Redskins]

Thank. It was interesting to read. I never thought that Belgium is such an active participant in the war ...

[Albatroz]

Volumes of documents on the atrocities of the German military in the occupied territories have been published. Well, the Germans had a special attitude towards Belgium in the year 14.
The relationship of the aggressor and the victim in a pure form. No wonder the real guerrilla war unfolded in Belgium. And almost the whole country was occupied for 4 years.
WWII became a struggle for liberation, for national survival

[Aviator_]

About the guerrilla war of the Belgians in WWI I would like to know more.

[Albatroz]

I agree, I think it would be very interesting)
By the way, the hostage system passed through

[Aviator_]

The hostage system is as old as humanity. And were there Belgian poppies at all?

[Hunghuz]

Why poppies?
There was resistance. Mobile partisan groups
I also read it.

[Aviator_]

Maki is the name of resistance fighters in France. A lot is known about them. It is also known that after WWII the number of participants suddenly increased significantly. But I hear about the Belgian resistance for the first time. Can you tell me exactly where you read about it?

[XII legion]

And what does France have to do with it ??
That's why they told you what the poppies have to do with it.

Can you tell me exactly where you read about it?

There is quite an interesting literature on this subject. But can we wait for information on VO?

[Aviator_]

Despite the fact that its resistance in WWII was approximately the same, taking into account the size. You cannot cite the sources of your conviction, you would have written right away.

[Astra wild]

Dear colleagues Hunghouse and Albatross, if you have such information, tell us

[Albatroz]

Sources are good to the place
But the fact is quite famous. This is me Belgian partisans of the PMV.
I don’t know why you are so

[Basil50]

Well, yes, * partisans *, it was after the war that they all suddenly remembered that they were Belgians.
Just after WWII, French Poles and other inhabitants of Europe suddenly all became such patriots of their own countries. The resistance figures recorded everyone in a row, it was enough just to declare it and that’s it!

[Aviator_]

It became profitable to be with the winners, that's all. Skins. Since the fall of 1943, when our troops reached Perekop, the Crimean Tatars suddenly realized that the war would not end the way Dr. Goebbels told them in 1941-42. And they timidly began to look for a connection with the Crimean partisans, hoping for forgiveness. It is very well written about this in the book "900 days in the mountains of Crimea", the author is A. A. Sermul, Simferopol, 2004.

[Astra wild]

The Poles fought quite well with the Germans, but about the French ... Keitel in Potsdam said about them: "We lost to them too?"
I especially liked the Hungarians: almost to the last they were Hitler's allies, and then almost everyone turned out to be sympathizers if not communists. My grandmother kept saying that there are almost no real socialists among the countries of the social community

[Alf]

Quote: Vasily50

The resistance figures recorded everyone in a row, it was enough just to declare this and that was it!

I was also in the Resistance.
And what is your participation?
When the Germans entered our bar, we did not get up!

[Hunghuz]

The contribution for such an insignificant state is certainly very tangible. Starting from hostilities and ending with the percentage of those called up and dead.
It is a pity that in the Second, when the king of the knight was gone, the picture was different. Here by the way is a vivid example of the role of the individual in history!

[Astra wild]

Honghuz, I’m far from being a monarchist, but for the sake of justice: there aren’t any politicians in Belgium, but the king led the resistance, it seems in the WWI and the Serbs led the monarch. During WWII in Norway, King Haakon7 was the banner of resistance. Here on the site I learned that the Soviet government of the Romanian king was awarded the Order of Victory.
Not a long story when the Spanish king foiled a fascist coup.
And among the monarchs there are decent people
P.S And the Belgian king is handsome

[Fevralsk. Morev]

Genocide against the Belgians !!! During the four years of occupation, 6 thousand people died. It smells like the history of the famine in Ukraine, when all the dead (from old age, victims of accidents, crimes, illnesses, suicides) were recorded as dead from starvation.

[Albatroz]

Is genocide just a direct kill for you?
This is me about 6 thousand.
Or is it the purposeful actions of the invader that are called to make the living conditions of the indigenous population impossible? And then we recall that 20 percent of the population was forced to leave Belgium, as well as the destruction of infrastructure and the destruction of cultural and historical values.

[Hunghuz]

Yes, genocide also presupposes the creation of conditions in which the population is forced to leave its territory. No wonder they are now talking about the genocides of the Ukrainian and Russian peoples.
True, their own governments are carrying out this genocide. But what can you do, sometimes your government is worse than external invaders)

[Fevralsk. Morev]

About the genocide of the Russian people from 1992 to the present day, you apparently forgot to mention.

[XII legion]

About the genocide of the Russian people from 1992 to the present day, you apparently forgot to mention.

is not that ???

No wonder they are now talking about the genocides of the Ukrainian and Russian peoples.

I mean, as I understand it, the nineties and two thousandths.

[Fevralsk. Morev]

Absolutely.

[XII legion]

The contribution of all countries is slightly different. Like the environment in which they operated.
Therefore, I think it is extremely interesting to look at it (albeit with strokes) as the author suggests

[faterdom]

For the first time, the Belgs, as stubborn and evil opponents, were described by Julius Caesar in his Notes on the Gallic War.

[Astra wild]

I do not argue with Caesar. But seriously, Julius Caesar was smart

[EvilLion]

To say that the Entente’s victory is the victory of Russia, it’s something in terms of psychiatry. If you have suffered a billion loss in a few years, lost people, and they give you a maximum of a couple of million reparations (do not think that you could have ripped off a lot from Germany, you should have nothing to rob in a country defeated after a total war), then there is a feeling that you just used.