Russia may revive Barguzin’s BJRK project in response to new US missiles

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Russia may revive the Barguzin military rail missile complex (BZHRK) project or create a new mobile ground-based missile complex in response to the development by the United States of medium-range and shorter-range ground-based missile systems. This opinion was expressed by the editor-in-chief of the National Defense magazine Igor Korotchenko.

Russia may revive Barguzin’s BJRK project in response to new US missiles




According to Korotchenko, Russia may consider the revival of the military railway missile project as a response to the possible deployment of medium- and shorter-range missiles by the United States in Asia and Europe. At the same time, according to the expert, a lot of time will not be needed to revive the project, Russia has all the developments on this topic.

He noted that in the case of the creation of such trains, the United States will not be able to track them, which means they will be destroyed by the first blow. Several trains plying the territory of our country will significantly enhance the combat potential of the Strategic Missile Forces.

Earlier, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov, answering the question whether Russia will return to the BZHRK project after the US withdraws from the INF Treaty, replied that this was unlikely to happen, but added that it was his personal opinion.

Recall that the start of work on the Barguzin military railway missile complex (BZHRK) project was announced by the Russian Ministry of Defense in the 2012 year, the Yars rocket was chosen for it in 2014, and at the end of the 2017 year it was reported that the project was closed. As the Russian media wrote, the development was postponed indefinitely. However, it was reported that development work was fully carried out on the project, and missile throw tests for the complex were also successfully conducted. Later information appeared that the resumption of work on it is possible if the military-political situation changes.

The development of the BZHRK was conducted by the Moscow Heat Engineering Institute, taking into account the experience of creating its predecessor - the BZHRK with the Molodets rocket (RT-23 UTTH, according to NATO classification - SS-24 "Scalpel"). "

During the Soviet era, there were three divisions in the Strategic Missile Forces, each comprising four Good Forces combat missiles. Thus, twelve "nuclear trains" carried 36 missiles, each of which carried 10 warheads. BZHRK utilization took place in 2003-2006.
  • Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation
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  1. +10
    October 12 2019
    It's time.
    Moreover, Yarses are lighter and smaller than Well done and can be reliably disguised as a regular freight train.
    If you do not let it in, both the letter and the railways will not be tracked.
    Although how can they not track if the train with its own steam train is traveling?
    1. +77
      October 12 2019
      Something often. We hear this news with the prefix “maybe”, “will” and “going”!
      I would like to hear - BZHRK BARGUZIN REVIVED.
      1. +14
        October 12 2019
        As part of the WWS, the number of other carriers would have to be reduced, because the amount should be constant.
        The Americans are clearly preparing a withdrawal from the treaty, which is why ours are "hinting".
        You can also make such trains for medium-range missiles.
        Then they will not fall under the restrictions.
        1. -19
          October 12 2019
          Nooo, in no case, you don’t need to make rockets on without a BZHRK and on the basis of ships, it is better to submarine and / or unpaved wheeled and / or aviation oversized with a discharge from the BTA (IL-76, etc.). Our (RF) disadvantage is that we (RF) do not have military access to the seas and railway lines near our borders because in wartime these transport routes are easily blocked by the enemy and we won’t be able to do anything (physically it is possible but economically it will be necessary to spend 5-10 times more resources than our opponents combined, which suicidal in economic terms ....).
          1. +6
            October 13 2019
            Why train near the border? The same "Well done" covers 11 thousand versts. Missiles under the INF Treaty - up to 5000.
            By the way, from Moscow to London - about 2 800. To Paris about the same. There will be 2000 reserve range in the direction of the Urals.
            1. -3
              October 13 2019
              Monar, tell me why the MoD has abandoned the already created BZHRK? Do you know these reasons? And then, as it were, the guide tells them (more precisely, I was in this museum at zero). Has anything changed today for these reasons?
              1. +3
                October 13 2019
                Causes? Signed agreement. 91st year restriction on routes, stood still. 93rd - removal from armament according to START-2, cut to 03 years.
                1. -2
                  October 13 2019
                  Yes, the reasons, and this is NOT "START", there were, and there are still fundamental reasons, you just personally and 13+ people above this do not know and do not want to know, otherwise, you would google and find them and be would like me against the BZHRK. In short, compare two soil complexes first: based on w / d and second: on the basis of a \ d (wheeled) where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be useful, where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be harmful. So when you compare, then you will understand that the wheel version will be better in all respects (there are a couple of exceptions but they only confirm this rule).
                  1. +2
                    October 13 2019
                    Quote: ProkletyiPirat
                    In short, compare the two soil complexes of the first: on the basis of railway \\ and the second: on the basis of \\ (wheel) where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be useful, where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be harmful . So when you compare, then you will understand that the wheel version will be better in all respects (there are a couple of exceptions but they only confirm this rule).

                    And even this is not the most important thing, because the deciding factor will always remain the cost of a kiloton, vulnerability, and all associated costs. When everything is scrupulously calculated, it turns out that the BRD complexes are significantly less expensive than wheeled vehicles, and the gain in vulnerability is negligible, given the fact that such complexes are being monitored. Given their operational capabilities and the cost of a kiloton, we can come to a general conclusion - this is the direction of development of our strategic nuclear forces in the current situation for us is unpromising.
                    1. +2
                      October 13 2019
                      When everything is scrupulously counted, it turns out that the BRD complexes are significantly less expensive than wheeled vehicles
                      Can I have numbers? Well, at least primitive. The cost of salt and limpdrichesva. For a day of continuous movement.
                      1. +3
                        October 13 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        Can I have numbers? Well, at least primitive. The cost of salt and limpdrichesva. For a day of continuous movement.

                        These numbers are classified, but believe me, stationary in silos are the cheapest kiloton and this was already known in the Soviet Army (at least to those to whom it was communicated). As for the cost of tanning salons, this is generally a penny in comparison with the cost of the entire complex, so the main costs are not inherent in these costs.
                      2. -4
                        October 13 2019
                        that in stationary silos
                        And what does it have to do with it?
                        If you do not have numbers for the operation of automobile and railway complexes, then why so categorically affirm?
                        I proceed simply from the cost of the constant movement of equipment. For the railway, the main thing is the change of teams of drivers. All. For automobile - the same + constant refueling. Could you tell me how long it takes to fill the tank under the plug at the "Poplar"?
                      3. +3
                        October 13 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        If you do not have numbers for the operation of automobile and railway complexes, then why so categorically affirm?

                        No categoricality - any mobile device always turns out to be more costly to maintain the same type of weapons and equipment, especially expensive, than a stationary object. It’s strange that you don’t know this, but you probably don’t even understand the essence of the term "military economy".
                        Quote: Monar
                        For railway, the main thing is the change of the crew of the drivers. All.

                        This is too primitive an approach, because it does not take into account all the expenses incurred by civil structures for the creation and maintenance of normal activities of such a composition. I'm not talking about the fact that the very movement of missiles along such a route will require much more costs for the maintenance of rolling stock and the missile itself after duty than if it were in a silo.
                        Quote: Monar
                        Could you tell me how long it takes to fill the tank under the plug at the "Poplar"?

                        In fact, military equipment is supposed to be stored completely filled with all types of fuel and lubricants and liquids - I already realized that you were far from the army, once you ask such a question.
                      4. +1
                        October 13 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        The cost of salt and limpdrichesva. For a day of continuous movement.

                        You don't have to compare. BZHRK never went under electric traction. For Molodets, it was a DM-62 diesel locomotive; for Barguzin, the traction locomotive has not yet been identified.
                      5. 0
                        October 14 2019
                        Not a diesel locomotive, but diesel locomotives. And BZHRK spends a lot of time on the state network.
                      6. 0
                        October 14 2019
                        Quote: Aldmit_2
                        Not a diesel locomotive, but diesel locomotives.

                        The base locomotive is being determined, for Molodets it is a somewhat modernized locomotive DM-62 with the addition of special equipment.
                        And about the other changes in the diesel locomotive by reference. http://saroavto2.blogspot.com/2019/10/62.html
                  2. 0
                    October 13 2019
                    you and 13+ people above this
                    And where does this figure come from?
                    By the way, I have never claimed that the BZHRD has no shortcomings. Especially in its first implementation. What is at least the process of taking the contact network aside.
                    That's when compare then you will understand
                    Well, give your arguments.
                    1. +1
                      October 13 2019
                      Quote: Monar
                      That's when compare then you will understand
                      Well, give your arguments.

                      Well, I have already cited above, but you did not express counter arguments, but I repeat going from another side.
                      For example_1: we can use wheel complexes outside the Russian Federation as well, we can export them, but with railway complexes this will not work (the exception is container complexes, and even that is not all).
                      For example_2: wheel complexes are always cheaper because they do not need to spend extra money on laying rails and hardening bridges and roads. (enough dirt roads)
                      For example_3: Wheel complexes have all the advantages with respect to the railway, provided that they can be transferred along the railway.

                      Already these three points are enough to cancel projects BZHRK.
                      1. +2
                        October 13 2019
                        1. ICBMs for export? Are you kidding?
                        And 11 miles range. Why roll them abroad?
                        2. Yes, even under the USSR, I repeat, shifted for 1500 km from the base of the sleepers under such a load. For which Russian Railways is grateful. Heavy trains carry.
                        3. Can you have an example of a carriage, on which a tractor under the "Poplar" without dismemberment will fit?
                      2. -2
                        October 14 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        1. ICBMs for export? Are you kidding?

                        Highlight bold and underlined. Long-range ICBMs and missiles (from 500 \ 1000 \ 5000 \ ... \ km) with not nuclear combat units. For example, the sale of Nicaragua and / or Brazil and / or Venezuela of such missiles with the aim of destroying large industrial and cultural centers of the United States in the event of a US attack on these countries or or blocking their economic activity. There is just a range of 7-12 thousand km. Or For example Sale of such missiles of India with a range of 1000-2000km to protect against Pakistan. Yes, even South Korea can sell missiles with a range of 1000-2000km against Japan.
                        It was about export, now about internal use:
                        Quote: Monar
                        And 11 miles range. Why roll them abroad?

                        As a response to the deployment of missile defense systems along the borders of the Russian Federation, leading to the destruction of the parity of the so-called "nuclear shield".
                        ps Personally, I am against the storage of nuclear weapons in other countries, so I think it is better to develop underwater and air systems.
                      3. -2
                        October 14 2019
                        Are you seriously? Sale of nuclear weapons? Do you want to open Pandora's box?
                        Russia will never do this.
                      4. +1
                        October 14 2019
                        I single out bold and underlined ICBMs and long-range missiles (from 500 \ 1000 \ 5000 \ ... \ km) with non-nuclear warheads.

                        Sorry, Sergey, for harshness, but you froze stupidity. Nobody sells this category of weapons. And does not transmit.
                        By the way, is there an ICBM without a nuclear bomb?
                      5. -1
                        October 14 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        This category of weapons nobody sells

                        Presently, they do not sell, because from this there is harm "guaranteed" but the benefit "may" be (or may not be). But when you have already suffered this very "guaranteed harm", the sale becomes quite profitable.
                        .
                        Quote: Monar
                        By the way, is there an ICBM without a nuclear bomb?

                        If there is no problem then it’s a matter of more long-range iskanders and calibers as means of destroying cultural and industrial objects, that is, transferring means of influence on the United States into the hands of US opponents so that these opponents can use geopolitical and economic levers of pressure on the USA fearing military aggression on their part, for in the event of such aggression the United States will suffer disproportionate losses.
                        Judge for yourself whether a US businessman will vote for a "hot head" if he is 100% sure that his business (plant) will be attacked? In general, in fact, we will do with such missiles what the United States is doing against us, that is, we will create a ring of hostile associations that suck resources.
                      6. +1
                        October 13 2019
                        Quote: ProkletyiPirat
                        Already these three points are enough to cancel the projects of the BZHRK.

                        You have listed only what lies on the surface. And if you dig deeper, then even the cost of state tests when adopting the system will be much lower for ground complexes than for BZHRK. The same is true in the series - everywhere the costs will differ in favor of mobile Topol.
                      7. +1
                        October 14 2019
                        Well, dig deeper. Explain what railway is more expensive than primer.
                      8. 0
                        October 14 2019
                        Quote: Monar
                        Well, dig deeper. Explain what railway is more expensive than primer.

                        Well, at least the cost of the railway itself. complex (without missiles) and a similar in total charge cost of several cars for "Topol". It is obvious that the costs of moving a larger mass of metal will be higher, as well as the fact that even the current maintenance of the railway. trains (not to mention repairs) will require more costs than wheeled vehicles. A simple example that is clear to any designer of military equipment - even the cost of climatic testing of individual sections of the train will require much more funds than the same test for wheeled vehicles.
                  3. 0
                    October 15 2019
                    IMHO, the possible reasons for "not START" should follow from the shortcomings. At that time, they were as follows:
                    1. Dimensions. 100% camouflage under the refrigerator did not work, because extra wheelsets and a long car.
                    2 Mass - reinforced tracks are needed, something has been reconstructed, but in general there is a restriction on the railway tracks. In short, he could not go everywhere, this train.
                    3. Dragged his reinforced locomotive. This is again unmasking. Especially if the train was on an electrified site.
                    4. This train must be inserted into the traffic schedule, this leads to a violation of the privacy regime. If at the very least it is being decided with the military (and that is, traitors), then this infa will fly straight from the Russian Railways straight to the CIA.
                    If you solve the issue of mass and dimensions ... Then maybe everything will be nice.
              2. +2
                October 13 2019
                Citizens, you are fooled by the authorship of the development of the Molodets RT-23 UTTX rocket. This is not the Moscow Institute of Heat Engineering, but the Southern Design Bureau in Dnepropetrovsk! Read Vivikedia
        2. +1
          October 13 2019
          As part of the WWS, the number of other carriers would have to be reduced, because the amount should be constant
          as far as is known in Russia about 1000 charges with a limit on contracts of 1500
      2. +13
        October 12 2019
        This is exactly hi, more boltology, and who is Korotchenko ???
        1. +3
          October 13 2019
          and who is korotchenko ???

          This person was dismissed from the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation at 35 years old, by inconsistency, from an engineering position. hi
          His comments are not worth discussing at all. IMHO.
          1. +1
            October 13 2019
            And he always carries a balcony, which does not coincide with reality. For example, the authorship of the Molodets rocket project, which he attributed to the Institute of Heat Engineering. Although it was actually developed by Yuzhnoye Design Bureau by brothers Academicians Utkin in Dnepropetrovsk
      3. -3
        October 12 2019
        Are you right in time and place of basing?
        1. 0
          October 13 2019
          The location will be known, and at present it is difficult to hide. Software, verification of the functioning of rockets and equipment, routine maintenance. Whether all this is on the way or at some temporary parking in a row.
          Another question is whether these trains will be there permanently.
          He took off at night and left, and instead a dummy crawled out of the tunnel.
          1. +1
            October 13 2019
            And how do you distinguish a regular refrigerator from a BZHRK? From the satellite 24 hours a day? Yes, it’s laminar to deceive. Drive a dummy and with a rocket in the depot. And then let them wonder what went west and what went east.
            1. +5
              October 13 2019
              The fact is that there are practically no refrigerated trains on Russian Railways. If you mask BZHRK then for passenger cars. And it was very easy to distinguish: a raft of eight-axle cars driven by three or four locomotives.
              1. +3
                October 13 2019
                Yes? 3 084 dm. for August 19 th year. So your "almost" tryndezh.
                And how do you see from the satellite the number of axles at the car? Again, promising missiles are easier. They need less sparks.
                1. +3
                  October 13 2019
                  These 3 units are thermos and covered wagons converted from refs. And they will soon be decommissioned, since the last of them was built in 089 with a service life of 1993 years. In addition, going outside the composition of the freight train, under a separate locomotive, re-section, will cause very close attention. And, disguised as a passenger of normal composition (28-12 cars) BZHRK - no.
              2. +7
                October 13 2019
                Barguzin is no longer eight-axle, but is designed for a regular carriage, the rocket is 2 times lighter, and less diesel locomotives are needed, PU is developed and tested, automation, regulation and diagnostics systems are developed and delivered. The new train, if there is one, will not differ from the freight train, there is another option with a turbo-gas train instead of a diesel locomotive.
              3. 0
                October 14 2019
                Excuse me, Sir, how do you count the axis from the satellite?
                1. -1
                  October 14 2019
                  The length of the car body. The BZHRK wagon is longer than a conventional refrigerator.
                  1. 0
                    October 14 2019
                    not how much longer is it?
            2. +1
              October 14 2019
              Even during my service at the BZHRK, there were many unmasking signs, by which it was possible to distinguish the BZHRK from a conventional refrigerator ...
          2. 0
            October 13 2019
            By the way, the place of basing was known before. But only in different directions from each, for 1 km the paths were altered under such a load. Even under the USSR. Go look for the wind in the field.
      4. -5
        October 12 2019
        The hope for friendship and normalization of relations remained upstairs.
        1. +12
          October 12 2019
          That's just friendship is not necessary. Collaboration, trade, coexistence and good! Anglo-Saxons are not made for friendship.
          1. +11
            October 12 2019
            Quote: Captive
            Anglo-Saxons are not made for friendship

            That's for sure . They love to only dominate. And they react extremely painfully to any attempt to poke their face in a brown substance (not chocolate). Yes
            1. +3
              October 12 2019
              Into their own substance. I think so. hi
              1. +5
                October 12 2019
                hi
                Quote: Captive
                Into their own substance

                Tough, but fair! lol
                And then these "exceptional" ones are already too hungry ... stop
                1. 0
                  October 12 2019
                  Quote: bouncyhunter
                  hi
                  Quote: Captive
                  Into their own substance

                  Tough, but fair! lol

                  but to someone else? )))))
        2. -5
          October 12 2019
          Quote: Chaldon48
          The hope for friendship and normalization of relations remained upstairs.

          It's not even like that. If the project "One Belt - One Road" is implemented (and everything goes to that), then the Yankees with their pieces of iron will simply drive a nasty broom from Europe. It is no coincidence that Macron has already announced the European army several times. And Merkel agreed.

          And in Asia, where will they be located? I don’t see where they can sit down. Everywhere is hot with an unknown outcome.
          Funny as it may seem, the only peaceful place is Mongolia.

          You can invest billions in this project, but it can happen, it will simply not be needed. The Americans will merge. You can not be mistaken in such calculations.
          1. +6
            October 13 2019
            Quote: iConst
            And in Asia, where will they be located? I don’t see where they can sit down. Everywhere is hot with an unknown outcome.

            Have you ever traveled along the BAM and the Trans-Siberian Railway? And I often had to. I assure you that there are sooooo many places where you can hide not only the train, but also the aircraft carrier.
            1. +1
              October 13 2019
              And now a railway has been stretched to Yakutsk, and there you can hide a hundred of such trains.
      5. -5
        October 12 2019
        Barguzin if I'm not mistaken something like a gazelle))
        1. +7
          October 12 2019
          Quote: Clever man
          Barguzin if I'm not mistaken something like a gazelle))

          Wind on Baikal. Remember a folk song.
        2. +2
          October 12 2019
          Why the name "Barguzin"? The product is new. To vote! "Kirdyk, Kapets, Dryn, Karachun ..." Oh, and the Russian language is rich. Let the analysts there break their heads. laughing
          1. +1
            October 12 2019
            Quote: Welldone
            Why the name "Barguzin"? The product is new. To vote! "Kirdyk, Kapets, Dryn, Karachun ..." Oh, and the Russian language is rich. Let the analysts there break their heads. laughing

            rail
            1. +4
              October 12 2019
              Barguzin, also with meaning. The wind on Lake Baikal has the character of a bore, lasting 2-3 hours. wink
              Well, sable, like a furry animal .... laughing
              1. +3
                October 13 2019
                Quote: LiSiCyn
                Well, sable, like a furry animal ....

                It seems like a polar fox ... only faster
          2. +1
            October 12 2019
            Better call a democratic hello
      6. 0
        October 12 2019
        America, in 3 months after the declaration of withdrawal from the INF Treaty, experienced a new one, i.e. prepared in advance. We need to withstand at least ... probably a year.
      7. 0
        October 12 2019
        We hear quite often. But We will be the last to learn about the revival of the BZHRK. Alas. First, the Western media will scare the entire planet with another "Putin's hand", and only then, between times, as if apologizing, will our politicians begin to explain themselves ... But now we should show the "cartoon"! So that at least Europe shuddered! Poland and the Romanians will scratch their turnips. We have from cartoons to reality - six months.
      8. 0
        October 13 2019
        So there is no money.
        The budget is planned to a penny, everything goes first, to the fleet, especially the underwater, to the second, to the Sarmatians, the proud Petrels, Poseidons, and the slurred SU-57.
        So, for Barguzin it is necessary to carry out one retirement rehwl ..
      9. 0
        October 13 2019
        I think it’s ready. Just waiting for the moment.
    2. -22
      October 12 2019
      Yes, everything will be tracked and recognized, so why not spend a lot of money on the revival of this project. What was relevant in the 80s is now "past the box office". They'll stick some kind of microchip to it, the size of a pinhead, and that's it.
      1. +12
        October 12 2019
        Quote: Nycomed
        Yes, everything will be tracked and recognized, so why not spend a lot of money on the revival of this project.

        You have interesting logic. what Everything can, in principle, be tracked and recognized. An invisible hat only happens in a fairy tale. Example, is it possible to detect a masked gun? - sure! But for some reason, no one puts a gun in the open field for public display, but they try to hide it. Or your example, are you sure that the microchip will be attached to this BZHRK, and not hooked to some kind of train dummy? About mock-ups Have you heard anything?
        1. -16
          October 12 2019
          Have you heard anything about the spies?
          1. +10
            October 12 2019
            Quote: Nycomed
            Have you heard anything about the spies?

            So, at the same time, SMERSH will have to be revived.
            1. -8
              October 12 2019
              Well, and where without them! am
          2. 0
            October 12 2019
            about shpienov
            I’ll add, my traders have enough. All secrets will be sold for a small bribe.
            1. +4
              October 12 2019
              Will definitely sell! And it’s not a fact that for a little, everyone has learned to bargain. Market. request
              1. The comment was deleted.
          3. +5
            October 12 2019
            Quote: Nycomed
            Have you heard anything about the spies?

            If you talk like that, then in general no weapons need to be produced, all the same, after all, spies will sooner or later recognize and track everything.
            1. -12
              October 12 2019
              So then let’s return the armored trains with carts, what are the little things? And on the armored train we’ll install those captured Napoleonic cannons that are in the Kremlin. There are a lot of them. Why are they just like that?
              1. NKT
                +6
                October 12 2019
                And we already have armored trains in service
          4. +2
            October 13 2019
            Quote: Nycomed
            Have you heard anything about the spies?

            Have you heard about the number of trains running through Russia? In Israel, enough for all the spies?
            1. -1
              October 13 2019
              Take an interest in Israel. Why is there a question for me? request
        2. -1
          October 12 2019
          But Nycomed is right. With the number of sympathizers for the fifth column, they will track the BZHRK at each station and will follow along the way. Someone is an ideological Russophobe, and someone will be bought for money. Not to mention saboteurs in the threatened period.
          1. -7
            October 12 2019
            Yes, even at the sunset of Soviet times I knew where one such train is based. And recently I looked on the Internet (now all info is already open) and for sure, right there, right near Perm, not far from Kukushtan. So then every dog ​​knew about it there. And I’m not a railroad worker, not a military man, and even less so a spy.
            1. +3
              October 13 2019
              Quote: Nycomed
              Yes, even at the sunset of Soviet times I knew where one such train is based.

              So after all, where our mobile soil complexes are based is also not a secret for the adversary. Just for some reason, the adversary is very nervous about their presence. Although, it would seem, the soil complex is easier to track. And it’s easier to destroy than the railway.
              Suppose that even, as you say, the chip will be screwed to it, what will it give in an endangered period? Or are you sure that the American super new warhead will chase the train? During the time that a warhead flies toward him, the train leaves for tens of kilometers. And from there comes REMUNERATION!
            2. +6
              October 13 2019
              Quote: Nycomed
              Yes, I still knew at the sunset of Soviet times where one such train is based

              I also could not understand for a long time what the feature of the railway complex is. I myself live in a city with a railway junction and I understand perfectly well that it is not difficult to track such a train. It will take time to determine the exact composition of the train, and then you just need to observe. Especially now, when there is a phone with phones ready to put everything in a row for the sake of likes, not thousands, but millions.

              Then they explained to me that to intercept the US missile defense system, you need to know the azimuth from which the rocket will go. And if the same complex today threatens the west coast, and 14 days later the US east coast, with missile routes through the Atlantic or the Pacific Ocean, and during these 14 days threatens the central US regions with a flight route through the north pole, then its strategic importance very large.
            3. +3
              October 13 2019
              So this BASE was ... not far ... from Kukushtan, station South.
              And right now on Google map you can clearly see where the base station was (the rails were handed over to scrap metal for a long time). The area is 3 times larger than Perm-2 station.
              And the Americans from the satellites saw her perfectly.
              But there is not a chip in the location, but in the location of the train ..
              How do you imagine the online transfer to the NSA and the Strategic Command of the actual location of the train?
              Yes, he will leave 20-20 km from the transmitted coordinates in various ways in 30 minutes.
              So, bomb the whole Transsib?
              There will not be enough bombs ..
          2. +2
            October 12 2019
            Quote: cormorant
            But Nycomed is right. With the number of sympathizers for the fifth column, they will track the BZHRK at each station and will follow along the way.

            if it’s possible, it will be, only it is necessary to aim at them, to plan the neutralization, but it goes all the time
          3. 0
            October 14 2019
            It is known who they will buy. Heads of stations and others.
      2. +5
        October 12 2019
        Quote: Nycomed
        Some microchip will stick to it, the size of a pin head, and that’s it.

        -
        *
        lol By analogy with your assumption. So you can mark any of the most secret weapons ... a beacon and hello. And even better immediately mine. And even better immediately atomic mine .. And even better shandarahanat atomic bomb and hello ... I, your aunt .. fellow
      3. +5
        October 13 2019
        Quote: Nycomed
        Yes, everything will be tracked and recognized, so why not spend a lot of money on the revival of this project

        You can track such a train in Israel. Because his tail will be in a neighboring country if he reaches the opposite end of the country. And on our open spaces not only trains are lost ...
        1. 0
          October 13 2019
          I don't understand, dear, why do you always want to "attach" Israel to me? Apparently, this makes you feel better? May God grant you health! hi
      4. -1
        October 13 2019
        For example, along the paths, you can bury detectors with chips that will respond to the radioactive background of Barguzin. And send the encrypted signal to the satellite.
    3. +14
      October 12 2019
      If the armored train can be compared to a cruiser, then the BZHRK is undoubtedly a missile cruiser! good It’s bad that now we will restore what we recently put under the knife (12 trains !!!) Under no circumstances should the Anglo-Saxons be trusted! stop
    4. +3
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Victor_B
      It's time.

      Not long ago, but what time is right is a fact
      Quote: Victor_B
      Moreover, Yarses are lighter and smaller than Well done and can be reliably disguised as a regular freight train.

      Why only "Yars"? A series of such "trains" could be made for the installation of medium-range missiles ...
      Quote: Victor_B
      If you do not let it in, both the letter and the railways will not be tracked.

      Ha ha ha ha ...
      Quote: Victor_B
      Although how can they not track if the train with its own steam train is traveling?

      Well, of course ... the locomotive brigade is entirely officers, the locomotive is not changed, of course - a "regular" freight train
      1. +3
        October 12 2019
        Quote: svp67
        Well, of course ... the locomotive brigade is entirely officers, the locomotive is not changed, of course - a "regular" freight train

        Well, as part of the diversion of agents, you can run at least three dozen false trains.
        All that is needed is for the locomotive to be from someone else’s railway section.
        And so that it goes like a letter, and how to load it ... the military cargo is full.
        1. +7
          October 12 2019
          Quote: Victor_B
          Well, as part of the diversion of agents, you can run at least three dozen false trains.

          No need to let anything superfluous. Thank God, but there is very heavy traffic on our railways, so it's not difficult to get lost on them
          Quote: Victor_B
          All that is needed is for the locomotive to be from someone else’s railway section.

          I think this can be solved by periodically changing inscriptions on locomotives and adding and decreasing false cars ...
          Quote: Victor_B
          And so that it goes like a letter, and how to load it ... the military cargo is full.

          The tactics of their application have been worked out and systematized, so that they will get the old instructions, blow off the dust, "shamanize" a little, in the light of new realities and go
          1. +6
            October 12 2019
            Quote: svp67
            I think this can be solved by periodically changing inscriptions on locomotives and adding and decreasing false cars ...

            The fact is that the old BZHRK "rocket train" could be identified by any trackman from 100 meters by eye.
            And with a lighter missile, the wagons will not at all differ from ordinary refs.
            And cruise missiles, interspersed with ballistic missiles, can generally be placed on platforms in 40-foot containers, looking like ordinary ones, to be placed.
            Well, military lettering ordinary locomotives carry trains on their sections. With a shift.
            1. 0
              October 13 2019
              Quote: Victor_B
              The fact is that the old BZHRK "rocket train" could be identified by any trackman from 100 meters by eye.

              Well, the presence of an "extra" wheelset is hard not to notice, even for an ordinary person
              Quote: Victor_B
              And cruise missiles, interspersed with ballistic missiles, can generally be placed on platforms in 40-foot containers, looking like ordinary ones, to be placed.

              Yes, modern technology provides an opportunity for maneuver. The difficulty with security, especially when stopping at stations, means they must be passed without stops, and for them to use not hub stations, but small stations and change them every time.
            2. +2
              October 13 2019
              I don’t know to what extent old rocket carriers with a retractable platform were old, only they looked like luggage cars with doors at the end of the car. .
            3. +1
              October 13 2019
              It is necessary to mask either under covered or under fitting platforms with containers, or under the cars of the passenger fleet. There are no more re-sections on the road network.
            4. 0
              October 14 2019
              And where will a 2500 km cruise missile fly from the Urals or Siberia? Only in their own way. It has long been necessary to stop praying for these Caliber, like the navel of the earth. And by the number of calibres Russia is far behind after the United States. And one of their destroyers in the number of Tomahawks exceeds the entire stock of Caliber of the Black Sea Fleet!
          2. +1
            October 13 2019
            Quote: Victor_B
            All that is needed is for the locomotive to be from someone else’s railway section.

            I think this can be solved by periodically changing inscriptions on locomotives and adding and decreasing false cars ...

            The inscriptions on the locomotives are optional. now often not only PM, but also the home road on locomotives do not write, only the Russian Railways logo.
            1. 0
              October 14 2019
              Quote: Sergey Mikhailovich Karasev
              The inscriptions on the locomotives are optional. now often not only PM, but also the home road on locomotives do not write, only the Russian Railways logo.
              Pay attention to the 8-digit code on the sides of the rolling stock.

              "Eight-digit designation system for rolling stock (SS) of railways
              Since 1984 on the USSR main railways an eight-digit rolling stock designation system has been introduced. The reason for its introduction was the creation of a database and their processing in industrial computer centers in connection with the development of computer technology on the railways, as well as the need for a quick search for wagons in a large territory of the country. Such a system simplifies the maintenance of technical documentation, while for a traction substation it also improves the operational planning of its maintenance and repairs. Eight-digit numbers are assigned to each unit (wagon, section) of a traction, non-traction and special substation and are marked on them (on both sides of the side surfaces of the wagons, cabs of locomotive drivers). On passenger cars, such designations are applied in two lines, one above the other (three digits above, five digits below them). On all other PS units, the numbers are plotted in one line. The designation of the traction PS series and (through the dash) the serial numbers of their units (assigned by the manufacturer) on the end surfaces of the sections, buffer bars and other designated places is preserved. These numbers are the 5th, 6th, 7th digits of the 8-digit code of the traction PS, if they are three-digit. For 4-digit numbers and numbers of two- and many sectional locomotives, MVPS the formation of a new code.
              / Eight-digit designation system for the rolling stock (PS) of the railways% 20% 20 Well carriages ...% 20% 20 Vkontakte.htm
        2. +3
          October 12 2019
          They looked like refrigerators. A civil engineer instructor sat on each locomotive. So the railroad workers knew which train was on. Just then there were a lot of refrigerators.
          1. +8
            October 12 2019
            Anyone could distinguish those refrigerators; they had three-axle carts.
            1. +2
              October 12 2019
              And there were also platforms with three-axle carts, on which stood at a decent interval from each other 3 luminous (in appearance) tanks, similar to large flattened milk cans. On the side of each can, apparently for idiots, was the inscription "Cement". Even then I drew attention to the absurdity of the inscription and the excessive power of the platform. I think someone has seen this too.
              1. +1
                October 13 2019
                There was not lumin, but a good 4-mm stainless steel: UDMH was taken to them.
                But this is not only for good "fellows", the voivode was also a drink, there were no TT engines for strategists at that time, and alcohol and kerosene could not carry such weights in acceptable dimensions.
            2. 0
              October 13 2019
              Yes, from which re-feed the three axes on the ref section car? There is either an old CMV or just a freight trolley. Moreover, the ref section is mainly four refrigerators and a car with a diesel generator.
              1. 0
                October 13 2019
                It was on the trolley that the ordinary ref was distinguished from the unusual. Look at the photo of the BZHRK in the museum.
              2. +1
                October 13 2019
                It is immediately obvious: either the Unified State Examination generation or all his life spent in Mukhoy! 100 km from the railway station and did not go on business trips to see what was in question, but was not shown to suckers. It doesn’t even occur to him that for BZHRK, resection is just a camouflage dummy, and if he had seen the thickness of those axes, he would have gone completely insane ... lol
                1. 0
                  October 13 2019
                  Well, of course, as well as trains for nuclear bombs, they also looked like a ref section. And there are transporters for special cargoes both in the cart and along the 4 axis.
                  .A where does the axle diameter if the axleboxes are standard, the bearings are standard, and the axle of a pair of wheels of more than one diameter along the entire length of the axis, does the axle diameter decrease towards the middle?
            3. 0
              October 13 2019
              The satellite does not show a triaxial or biaxial cart. And before, there were a lot of refrigerated cars, but now it is very rare.
              1. -1
                October 13 2019
                So this is because Putin gave all fishing to the liberoids from the Pr-va, and they all registered it abroad, that's why people are sitting without fish, and tax officials are without taxes, but no one can unprotect this gangster cootla.
                And then the maintenance crews would run on the Russian Railways for 20 pairs a day, and the Yankees spies would go crazy, counting the number of axles in the wagons of the wagons, and pounding the sleeper with a jammed radiometer laughing
              2. -1
                October 14 2019
                Quote: _Sergey_
                The satellite does not show a triaxial or biaxial cart. And before, there were a lot of refrigerated cars, but now it is very rare.

                Dachto all of you rested: "The satellite is not visible." There were a bunch of other unmasking signs, not on the train, but on the locomotive. Therefore, if you happen to see somewhere in the vastness of our railways a single-section diesel locomotive with "square" block buffer lamps, adjustable by a blizzard, or even manage to see the number plate "DM62-No. Such and such" on it, you should know, most likely these are the same locomotives that proudly drove the country's nuclear shield. https://zen.yandex.ru/media/1520/eti-teplovozy-vozili-iadernyi-scit-strany-i-rabotaiut-po-sei-den-rasskaz-mashinista-5c5b4e5a2c438f00adf69964
    5. +18
      October 12 2019
      Moreover, Yarses are lighter and smaller than Well done and can be reliably disguised as a regular freight train.


      Those who invented this weapon were not morons. There is no need to disguise it. Let’s say, beyond the Urals, a train goes back and forth along a dead-end protected branch 50 km long. He stands, goes, changes speed, goes the other way. According to a random schedule. Suppose, at the moment A, the enemy precisely detected his position. Rocket flight beyond the Urals from Europe A + 10 min. In 10 minutes the train will be anywhere + - 7 km from the point where it was spotted. For a nuclear munition, such a slip is unacceptable, the train is harmless to zero.
      And there are no self-guided ones yet. When they invent it, it will mean that the entire US carrier fleet will turn into garbage. laughing
      Throw the entire plot of 50 km with nuclear charges every 3 km - you are welcome, the alignment is in our favor.
      No guys, the Americans did not panic in vain. This thing is more serious than a submarine. At least a tail can be attached to the boat.
      1. +8
        October 12 2019
        In Altai, he walked in a circle. The circle was approximately 700km
      2. +2
        October 13 2019
        I saw many times these "refrigerators" at one provincial station, when I went to the dacha.
      3. -1
        October 14 2019
        Just because there is no homing now does not mean that it will never be. Progress Can't Stop
        1. +1
          October 14 2019
          Progress does not stop


          Of course, do not stop. It will appear - the alignment will change. Both trains and aircraft carriers will be a thing of the past. How did the cavalry, battleships, next in line manned aircraft ... This does not mean that right now we must abandon the effective means. To do this, they keep smart people for a lot of money - to make out, count, predict the direction of development. When projects of such a scale are adopted, they do not dismiss opponents, but listen very carefully.
    6. -18
      October 12 2019
      Why the devil is he needed? There are mine and mobile-based yarses, there will be Sarmatians. There are submarines, there are strategic bombers. Do figs produce entities? It is not easier to build an extra submarine or an extra regiment of yars.
      1. +6
        October 13 2019
        Quote: g1v2
        It is not easier to build an extra submarine or an extra regiment of yars.

        Not easier. Can you imagine the cost of a strategic nuclear missile submarine cruiser? And how much with this money can you build BRD?
        In addition, the nuclear submarine is always at risk that it can be tailed by the enemy’s network at any time with the possibility of instant destruction. And what will sit on the tail of the BRD in the vast Siberia?
        1. 0
          October 14 2019
          Quote: Gritsa
          In addition, the nuclear submarine is always at risk that it can be tailed by the enemy’s network at any time with the possibility of instant destruction.

          Especially if the SSBN is located at the base and can shoot being practically at the pier. lol
      2. 0
        October 13 2019
        Do not simplify: strategic bombers have long been reluctant to carry bombs: their task is to destroy the US missile defense systems, perhaps with the use of small-caliber nuclear weapons.
        PLAs are unreliable and do not guarantee a strategic salvo schedule; the surface fleet is not included in the strategic order of forces at all.
        All that remains is the ground, aviation hypersonic and underwater non-mobile (Poseidon) components, on the basis of which it is possible to build a schedule for a retaliatory destroy strike.
    7. +5
      October 12 2019
      Yes, there were other trolleys under the refrigerator section. But the carriage notices everything, but does not hand over anyone. "This is our hard lot."
    8. +1
      October 12 2019
      Well, since the editor of the magazine has spoken, they will definitely listen to him and revive him. And they will tell everyone, and they will be sure to report to Korotchenko: "Your order has been fulfilled, comrade editor! We will provide you the route and schedule for publication tomorrow!"
      If my memory serves me, the existence of "Barguzin" was not particularly advertised. Maybe because Mr. Korotchenko was not an editor?
    9. 0
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Victor_B
      Although how can they not track if the train with its own steam train is traveling?

      ==========
      Unless with the help of sensitive radiometers .... The heads are sound ... request
      1. 0
        October 12 2019
        Quote: venik
        Unless with the help of sensitive radiometers .... G

        winked Maybe with dosimeters ...
        1. +1
          October 13 2019
          Quote: Tersky
          Maybe with dosimeters ...

          =========
          No, just RADIOMETERS! Dosimeter determines the ACCUMULATED dose (or dose rate) of ionizing radiation during its stay in the irradiation zone, whereas radiometer - the density of the flux of particles or quanta through the detector window (Geiger or scintillation). In everyday life, these concepts are often confused - as army devices DP-5 (field dosimeter) are more correctly called radiometers!!!
      2. 0
        October 13 2019
        The radiometer does not determine the material of the signal emitter (the more so it does not determine the number of nuclear warheads), and it’s practically worthless to drive several hundred simulators on the country's roads to complete the task of blocking the useful signal of any field type radiometer with the background.
        1. +2
          October 13 2019
          Quote: hydrox
          The radiometer does not detect the material of the signal emitter

          ==========
          Hello to you !!! Yah? For this there are "radiometers-spectrometers" !!! The radiation spectrum can also be used to determine the material (for example, to distinguish uranium from plutonium, etc.). Although there is no particular need for this!
          And there is no need to count the number of heads - just install a highly sensitive "radiometer" next to the canvas (and they can be very compact) - and "vo a la!" -when passing cars with "nuclear filling" - it will register a surge in intensity !!
          1. +2
            October 13 2019
            You can even imagine how much nuclear crap fusses around, but the spies will jump off their minds having considered what the meter measures it.
            1. +1
              October 13 2019
              Don’t distract the little man: I’m talking about a field radiometer like a dosimeter, and he’s talking about a spectrometer the size of a two-story cottage with a two-story basement! laughing
              1. +1
                October 13 2019
                Quote: hydrox
                Don’t distract the little man: I’m talking about a field radiometer like a dosimeter, and he’s talking about a spectrometer the size of a two-story cottage with a two-story basement! laughing

                =========
                I don't know WHERE you saw a spectrometer the size of a "two-story cottage with a two-story basement" ("they don't live so long!") .... But the GDR "Robotron" which it used about 35 years ago had the height and width of a small diplomat (only 2.5-3 times thicker) and weighed approx. 3 kg !!! fool I doubt very much that since then such a technique has become HEAVIER and BIGGER !!!
                Well, if you have never seen anything other than a field radiometer DP-5 (A or B) in your life does not mean that there is NO such technique! By the way Hungarian field NC-425 dosimeters were almost half the size of the DP-5, and 4 times the weight! In addition, they were allowed to tune to various types of radiation)
                PS Do you see the gopher? No! And he IS !!!
                PPS Funny of course watching the attempts amateur, insert your "5 kopecks" but get bored very quickly!
                1. -1
                  October 13 2019
                  EVERYTHING, everything! Get credit and calm down, just do not litter the space with your school offenders! negative
                  1. +1
                    October 13 2019
                    Quote: hydrox
                    EVERYTHING, everything! Get credit and calm down, just do not litter the space with your school offenders! negative

                    =========
                    Take offense? On people like you? What do you! They are not offended by such stop ... those are sorry!
            2. +1
              October 13 2019
              Quote: saigon
              You can even imagine how much nuclear crap fusses around, but the spies will jump off their minds having considered what the meter measures it.

              ========
              Well, actually it is POSSIBLE to distinguish a nuclear warhead from uranium ore or radioactive waste or fuel elements .....
              The question just arose: "Is it possible to identify" YaBCH in the passing train "? The answer is - it is POSSIBLE!
              Another question is - HOW MUCH such devices need to (covertly) be dragged into the territory of the Russian Federation and installed (covertly) along ALL highways? The answer is oooooooo !!! what
              It is possible, of course, to "detect" from low-orbit satellites .... But here are the questions - firstly, the satellite must pass almost exactly over the train, while it transmits information, until it is decoded and processed - WHERE will this train end up ???
              Because BZHRK and effective - too fast move in space !!
          2. 0
            October 13 2019
            I am familiar with such a spectrometer :: it requires a separate building for its installation (it’s just the spy that fits in your pants pocket!) - fantasize further, I already caught you on this ...
            1. +1
              October 13 2019
              Quote: hydrox
              I am familiar with such a spectrometer :: it requires a separate building for its installation (it’s just the right way to wear a spy in your pants pocket!)

              ===========
              Yah!!! And I did not know this and dragged his darling under my arm ....... request Well, I'm a healthy man! laughing wink
              But in general, after such an application, it became clear that you, my dear, have never seen such devices in your eyes !!! Here we got the sweetest !! .....
    10. 0
      October 12 2019
      By the way, parking lots for sludge BZHRK are located SO that no one sees him, therefore, before the locomotives, the railroad should not have any questions.
      As for lettering, this is generally laughter: all the schedules are made on a computer and the BZHRK schedule can be made so that it follows the schedule of an ordinary commodity and does not attract anybody else's attention.
    11. +2
      October 12 2019
      I’ll add as a former railwayman, and then served in military transport. These trains, in addition to the non-standard number of locomotives (steam locomotives, as you call them), also have unusual colors, they immediately catch my eye - something is wrong here winked ... Plus the layout of such cars, which should not be nearby, not to mention additional locomotives. What is his invisibility, I still do not understand. Immediately visible. Who knows what to look for - will find it right away. An ordinary civilian manager who sits behind pieces of paper will not understand. And the enemy scout will immediately calculate. Very dubious "stealth". New developments to place missiles in containers is also nonsense. If a locomotive carries three wagons with containers, it is immediately clear that this is not an ordinary train. Now, if the launcher were to be made autonomous, filled with ordinary cargo and driven over the network, this is the case. And so all these are fairy tales for ordinary people.
      1. +4
        October 12 2019
        Well, partly you are right, but not quite. Where they run, such ligaments are in use, which can easily become familiar. 8-axle tanks frequented us once in the Kaliningrad region. Here was a shock from grandparents-retirees. They remember the shunting locomotives, they remember the twin trains to Vilnius, but they saw the 8-axles in the region for the first time.
        1. +1
          October 13 2019
          You can estimate the shock in the year somewhere 86-87 at the sorting in Krasnoyarsk the same 120-ton tank cracked in half and dripped on the way drinking alcohol that's where the shock was
          1. +1
            October 13 2019
            This is tough !!! Were such tanks allowed for dissolution? Although the grandfathers at work talked about such flights that the hair was on end, but the heads did not fly, because the movement was frantic and no one had time to debrief. It was enough that the rolling stock was serviceable. They say that they did not pay attention to the sliders, if only "the wheel was not square."
            I was already blown for the lack of a chain on the bleed valve and the broken handle of the end crane.
            1. 0
              October 13 2019
              hi ,,, and the tragedy in Syzran 1980g?
            2. 0
              October 14 2019
              Well, I can’t understand about the slider either, on the cargo admission to the slider more than on the passenger, but to the other in the cargo discharge cargo?
              Some kind of strange logic when releasing from the point of formation on wheelsets of a passenger car any serviceability is not allowed, but on the cargo from TO to TO and tolerances and, again, to a friend in a cargo explosive OPS
      2. +1
        October 13 2019
        The first sensible comment. hi
      3. 0
        October 13 2019
        And who's stopping you?
        You take two 40-foot containers under the control and control units, and a passenger service wagon - and the mobile CLUB is ready, it will reach 1,5 kilograms - described 10 years ago.
        1. -1
          October 13 2019
          Ie two containers, a passenger car and a locomotive? Correctly? Everyone in the country will see such a bunch and poke a finger in a year already, such as this: look, a rocket train!))) It’s long been forbidden to put freight wagons and passenger cars together, it’s impossible. They will open right away. Plus a train from several wagons is also nonsense. A plus here I see only mobility and the incomprehensibility of where he will go, but he will not turn off the highway, anyway, the restriction on maneuver. It seems better to drive wagons to me. All over the country, and all, try to find them. A plus in refueling trucks and other options. Here they can be distilled anywhere you like, to the same Ukraine, they won’t find them))) or they won’t see them for grandmas. That NATO will be surprised. And to mask on the railway is all nonsense, I without special preparation and tolerances calculated super-secret trains while working on the railway.
          1. 0
            October 13 2019
            Well, so drive your wagons, but it's more expensive ...
      4. 0
        October 13 2019
        What they caught the eye of was steam locomotives: they always had bright green, clean and shiny!
    12. +1
      October 12 2019
      Follow the news and you will be happy, and not read the old news.
    13. -5
      October 12 2019
      The gut is thin, the polymers have already profiled. There is no one to collect the Barguzins.
    14. +6
      October 12 2019
      And with 2-meter conductors in combat unloading ..
      It has already happened when, back in the GDR, during exercises, 2-meter signalmen came to the combined-arms canteen and demanded their increased amphibious rations ..)
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        So sorry there are such. well - because the signalmen) The truth is somewhere nearby always Strategic Missile Forces
      2. 0
        October 14 2019
        Quote: ROSS_51
        It has already happened when, back in the GDR, during exercises, 2-meter signalmen came to the combined-arms canteen and demanded their increased amphibious rations ..)

        It is strange that you have not heard about this norm, according to which all tall military personnel received additional nutrition:
        Extra food for military personnel
        conscripts and others
        contingents with a height of 190 centimeters and above
        55. Military personnel on military service, having a height of 190 cm and above, are allowed to give out additional food within half of the food rations provided for them. Supplementary meals are prescribed by order of the commander of a military unit based on the conclusion of the military medical commission or the head of the medical service of the military unit.
        Cash compensation and food and travel money in return for food rations to the military personnel specified in this clause shall be paid in one and a half amount from the established amount of monetary compensation (food and travel money).
        1. 0
          October 14 2019
          Nothing strange considering that I served in the SA. In the Airborne Forces then there were increased oil rates and something else (I don't remember)). As far as I understand, the presence of rapid deployment troops was prohibited in the GSVG, so they went there as "signalmen".
          1. 0
            October 14 2019
            Quote: ROSS_51
            Nothing strange, considering that I served in the SA.

            So in CA these standards also existed - you are simply not in the subject.
            Quote: ROSS_51
            As far as I understand, the presence of rapid deployment troops was prohibited in the GSVG, so they went there as "signalmen".

            The GSVG had one DShBr, five Oshb, one Special Forces brigade, five separate companies of the Special Forces and twenty-five long-range reconnaissance companies in reconnaissance battalions. And all of them were deployed to the states of peacetime, wore amphibious uniforms, so that "no rapid deployment troops" were required in the GSVG. They really got a different dietary rate - that's a fact. Therefore, either you were misled, or you yourself did not understand who was in front of you. By the way, there is a special radio communications detachment in the Special Forces brigade, so most likely you saw them if they came to the exercises or worked out their tasks. It's just that humorists usually serve there, so they wove you three boxes ...
            1. 0
              October 14 2019
              You don’t understand .. This was my SPN company changed into signalmen.) And there was a communication group in my company — do you seriously think that they wore the form of signalmen?
              By the way, I also learned to tie a tie in the Airborne Forces. Can you imagine a company that, on command, do it once !, learns to knit a tie?)
              But that's another story)
              1. 0
                October 14 2019
                Quote: ROSS_51
                This is my company SpN dressed up as signalmen.)

                Something I don’t remember, that the companies of the Special Forces from the Union arrived in the GSVG - at least for five years I don’t remember this.
                Quote: ROSS_51
                And there was a communication group in my company — do you seriously think that they wore the form of signalmen?

                I know very well that everyone in the company wore the same uniform. I do not understand the masquerade itself with dressing up as "signalmen" if they had a "mobuta", as far as I remember, and even the winter was envisaged. Although I admit that individual turbulences happened among our commanders, and they apparently thought that the work of the correspondent stations of this company could be passed off as a liaison, although any specialist understands that this is nonsense, and our enemy is not so stupid as not to identify communications sessions.
                Quote: ROSS_51
                Can you imagine a company that, on command, do it once !, learns to knit a tie?)

                Honestly, I have not heard about this, but I do not exclude it.
                Quote: ROSS_51
                But that's another story)

                I agree, there are many different stories that happened that are not entirely clear from the point of view of the inhabitants.
    15. -1
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Victor_B
      It's time

      This is a message from Korotchenko. That one ... That's when other sources will be, then you can discuss.
    16. +3
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Victor_B
      Moreover, Yarses are lighter and smaller than Well done and can be reliably disguised as a regular freight train.

      In fact, it was thought that it was not YRSs (RS-24) that were set on Barguzin, but Rubezhi (RS-26), which is twice as light as YRS, 80 tons against 40 at Rubezh.
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        Quote: NEXUS
        In fact, it was thought that it was not YRSs (RS-24) that were set on Barguzin, but Rubezhi (RS-26), which is twice as light as YRS, 80 tons against 40 at Rubezh.

        Also good. But then the missiles will not reach the main adversary. Only to their mongrel.
    17. +3
      October 13 2019
      And why did their traitors cut in the 2000s? When will they be responsible for this?
      1. +2
        October 13 2019
        And why did their traitors cut in the 2000s? When will they be responsible for this?

        When these traitors leave the government, then according to the experience of the 90s they will talk about it even then at the semi-official level ...
        In general, not earlier than 2024
  2. +12
    October 12 2019
    Russia may revive Barguzin’s BJRK project in response to new US missiles
    too many of these "cans" ... just do it!
    1. +2
      October 12 2019
      It makes sense to revive these train formations if the states deploy medium-range missiles in the EU. hi
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        A perfectly reasonable answer may come to the suicidal initiative of the States.
  3. +5
    October 12 2019
    According to Korotchenko, Russia may consider reviving the project of a military railway missile complex,

    Now I really do not understand. What does "can consider" mean? Actually, it was time to start implementation yesterday. And so that tomorrow they would go across endless spaces.
    1. 0
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Honest Citizen
      Actually, yesterday it was time to start implementation. And that tomorrow they would go through the vast expanses.

      Are you sure that yesterday did not start something that is not yet time to talk about on the screen? In any case, the command to "land" the caliber has already sounded, and for a long time. I think who should remember about "Club ...." These "container" proposals fit well into the commands that were given. It is possible that they, these works on the BZHRK, like those gophers, are not visible or audible, but they are being carried out.
      1. +1
        October 12 2019
        Your words, yes to God’s ears. Well, if so.
  4. +4
    October 12 2019
    Yes, we utilized a lot for the joy of the Enemies!
    1. +2
      October 12 2019
      We didn’t recycle it: the process was led by the Pr-in, and we have it liberoid.
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        A non-resilient such disposal, one of the complexes at the time of destruction was on duty for only 11 years ...
  5. +2
    October 12 2019
    Everything was ... but the disposal has passed ...
    Now you need to create a new one.
    1. -2
      October 12 2019
      Quote: mavrus
      Everything was ... but the disposal has passed ...

      =========
      With the "Well done" - there was a big problem: Because of the huge weight (the rocket alone weighed more than 100 tons) - they simply broke the track ... Therefore, the missiles were stored at bases, and traveled along the roads empty trains (!!) - drivers and crews trained. It was assumed that in the event of a "aggravation of the situation" - the missiles would be loaded and taken to the launch site ..... So the complex was, let's face it - "boundedly-mobile".
      Now the situation has changed - "Yars" weighs less than 50 tons (according to some sources) and therefore the possibility of reviving the BZHRK (and REALLY highly mobile!) becomes a reality! Would there be money .....
      1. +4
        October 13 2019
        Here you are wrong, as a person who served as a 36 rd engineer, I can speak for sure.
        1. +2
          October 13 2019
          Quote: prapor55
          Here you are wrong, as a person who served as a 36 rd engineer, I can speak for sure.

          =======
          Well, I did not serve there, I just read and listened - therefore "for what I bought - for what I sell" !! request
  6. +8
    October 12 2019
    Russia may revive Barguzin’s BJRK project in response to new US missiles


    We must not speak, but do ...
  7. GRF
    +2
    October 12 2019
    can revive, can write off
    chickens do not peck without responsibility or money?
  8. -1
    October 12 2019
    Earlier, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Yuri Borisov, answering the question whether Russia would return to the BZHRK project after the US exited the INF Treaty, replied that this was unlikely to happen, but added that it was his personal opinion.
    ..... In the days of the Soviet Union, the Strategic Missile Forces had three divisions, each including four BZHRK "Molodets". Thus, twelve "nuclear trains" carried 36 missiles, each of which carried 10 warheads. Utilization of the BZHRK took place in 2003-2006.

    Of course it won't, because the USSR had about 18-20% of world GDP, and today's Russia is much less. So it’s not surprising - we simply don’t have the finances to resume this program, which is why, most likely, the Deputy Prime Minister told the truth, although he stipulated it “with his own opinion”. Korotchenko's wishful thinking is obvious.
    1. -14
      October 12 2019
      "The USSR had about 18-20% of the world's GDP" - And a big deal in the pocket from the export of all these products, which the USSR supplied to 120 world parasites, since Russia is now earning money from its exports. BZHRK is too complex and expensive system - and the enemy's reconnaissance means, compared to the 80s, have gone far ahead.
      1. +8
        October 12 2019
        Quote: Vadim237
        BZHRK too complex and expensive system - and the means of reconnaissance of the enemy compared with the 80s went far ahead.

        ==========
        Even if modern reconnaissance means (can you tell me in what way?) It is possible to "spot" such a train, then can you tell HOW to retarget an ICBM at it (it takes into account that it "spits" along a track at a speed of 80-100 km / h, and its route is not predictable - it can turn off at any railway junction !!
        1. -9
          October 12 2019
          What kind of - yes, the same satellites are spies and satellites of the missile defense missile defense system that the United States has, and for all railway nodes tactical drones can work together BRDS - the road is destroyed and everything has stopped.
        2. +3
          October 13 2019
          Quote: venik
          Even if modern reconnaissance means (can you tell me in what way?) It is possible to "spot" such a train, then can you tell HOW to retarget an ICBM at it (it takes into account that it "spits" along a track at a speed of 80-100 km / h, and its route is not predictable - it can turn off at any railway junction !!

          Do not try to convince the supporters of the Navalny and Co. sect. For such - the American aircraft carrier formation is not possible to find, but to destroy it is an insoluble task. And their F-35 is invisible. But in their understanding, calculating the BRZD by some criteria is worth nothing. And to destroy with a "smart and beautiful" American missile is easier than a steamed turnip.
          1. -2
            October 13 2019
            You are to me your idols - do not ascribe trumps.
    2. AAK
      +6
      October 12 2019
      And there are finances, the price of one ICBM for a BZHRK is much cheaper than a PGRK, not to mention a silo rocket or an SSBN, and we are building quite a few of them. In addition, there is nothing to defend our SSBNs either on water or under water. Especially on the Barguzin, unlike the Molodets, not 3, but 6 ICBMs.
      1. -12
        October 12 2019
        The composition will always be more expensive than a machine, and binding to a piece of iron drastically reduces the area of ​​movement of the complexes, compare the length of railways and roads - unpaved, asphalt concrete pavements.
        1. +6
          October 12 2019
          And you try to move the wheeled chassis with a rocket relatively secretively for 500 km.
          1. -6
            October 12 2019
            You won’t hide the train either, since the coordinates of the places where the trains are based, as well as the PGRK, will be known to the enemy - the equipment and the spy satellite grouping has gone far ahead - the best thing now is to reduce the weight and size of the ICBMs using more powerful gunpowder for turbojet engines, more miniature warheads, control systems and lighter but more durable materials.
  9. 0
    October 12 2019
    Well, everyone can express their opinion on this issue, they can do tea on their own money, they will not force ways, shelters and other things.
  10. -1
    October 12 2019
    Our liberties from the government will bury any good beginnings. ..
    1. +4
      October 12 2019
      The "London" shareholders of Russian Railways will be against it.
  11. -2
    October 12 2019
    I don't see any connection ... The withdrawal from the INF Treaty carries, of course, the revival of the threat of a "decapitating strike" and the work of these SD and MDs on the launching and disposition of strategists, but one dog - the RSD - is not an enemy to those who are behind the Urals ... For example ... They cannot do anything against the 62nd division, which they cannot do in the Krasnoyarsk Territory, even in theory. And her alone is enough.
    Trains - a good topic, but terribly expensive, because the tripods could not be made at all - the navel came loose. And we also have options now, abruptly trains
    1. -3
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Uhu
      For instance. They are nothing against the 62nd division, which in the Krasnoyarsk Territory - they can’t do, even in theory.

      That's why we need to transfer part of our nuclear potential to that region, protecting ourselves from the missile defense system in Poland and Romania. And for this, it is not necessary to create a BZHRK, but in order to save money, build new silos, which will provide a guaranteed retaliation strike.
      1. +1
        October 12 2019
        Stupid thing, but I will say.
        "Look, the mines. Great, but everyone knows that they have been
        seen from orbit. If anything - will your work? Although you have a mobile one, it’s not so good. Like a goat on a leash that is not 5 meters away, it does not play, you will not run away from your area. Without saying where the launches are possible, with a sudden attack - you will not run far. and it’s not in vain that your hangar opens ... //
  12. -5
    October 12 2019
    Eh, Korotchenko, Korotchenko .... dreams, dreams, dreams ... although useful idios you always need Russian authorities !!
  13. +3
    October 12 2019
    It would be better if the economy was revived in response to US sanctions. But apparently not a priority ...
  14. +2
    October 12 2019
    Russia may revive the project of the Barguzin combat railway missile system (BZHRK), this opinion was expressed by the editor-in-chief of the National Defense magazine Igor Korotchenko.

    Russia may or may not create. Another predictor, Korochenkov, in the wake of Rogozin
  15. +2
    October 12 2019
    When I read such bravura news about missiles and retaliatory strikes, for some reason I ask myself the question, will there be that "deflected strike" and so vividly imagine: here the president's finger reaches for the red button "key to start" and all around are assistants, generals and perhaps even Kremlin cooks throw themselves on their knees and lament: "Vladimir Vladimirovich, dear, dear you are ours, don't ruin it, there is a house in Florida, kids, my beloved girls, the only ones in Ella study ... We are Russia, like we will endure, and they are there, our girls like? ... ". And this is in the best case, otherwise they will twist their hands, they will say, what are you, completely crazy, houses, yachts, capital, kids!
  16. +5
    October 12 2019
    6-7 years ago, indeed, Mr. Korotchenko's forecasts and threats could be taken into account. Now - it's just the "Skabeeva tribe". bully
  17. +1
    October 12 2019
    The territory is large, it’s a plus ..... but it’s very useful to have rockets close, close to the potential enemy.
    The Club project is much more preferable in this respect.
    1. +4
      October 12 2019
      Quote: rocket757
      The territory is large, it’s a plus ..... but it’s very useful to have rockets close, close to a potential enemy

      Under the Union, the 5th OpEsk included cruisers pr. 68bis, which, like a pistol at the temple, were always assigned to aircraft carriers of Amers. Morality - in the case of a faq, within a few minutes a flurry of 152 mm shells hit the enemy, causing unacceptable damage to the enemy ... Exchange in tenge in our favor is an outdated cruiser for an aircraft carrier. It seems archaic, but practical. The Americans considered this to be a real threat, but they couldn’t drive away the Russian Federation’s non-threatening ships as they were today — they were really afraid and respected soldier
      1. +2
        October 12 2019
        Just regret that there was no point.
        We must live in the world that is and do whatever is necessary so that this world is preserved.
  18. -14
    October 12 2019
    It’s already useless at the level of technology that the United States possesses today, their systems detect any missiles from the Russian Federation and are escorted to the place of destruction, they conducted many tests, one of which was launching a rocket from an island closer to Turkey towards western Germany, the system instantly detected it was destroyed, it was destroyed within 5 minutes after the launch, they created a multi-level defense defense that starts from Europe to America, today it is impossible to go through such a pro, on top of that they are improving all this at a rapid pace.
    1. -1
      October 12 2019
      if it’s impossible to get through, then you have to get around) and this .... IMPOSSIBLE. The Russian man has always been distinguished by his ingenuity, intelligence and quick wit. The solutions were simple but effective. And if the leadership of the country restrains itself from the temptation, then the people will pull together. The Great Patriotic War was won not by Stalin, not communism, but by a simple Russian soldier. God forbid, of course. World Peace.
      1. AUL
        +8
        October 12 2019
        100% impenetrable remedies do not even exist theoretically. And in practice - even more so. Do you believe US missile defense advertisements? Even if 25% of the missiles launched break through to the target, the adversary will have to be very sour. I do not think that such a prospect will please them!
        1. -12
          October 12 2019
          Yes, it is precisely today that it is impossible to break through even the simultaneous launch of all missiles, one system takes over 100 targets, and each missile to capture a free missile that is not captured by other missiles, so the whole system is integrated into a single system that distributes targets between missiles, and they are in an automated mode At the factory can produce thousands of such systems and missiles, they are already completely under the umbrella pro.
        2. 0
          October 14 2019
          is that you asking me a question or baburu?
      2. -11
        October 12 2019
        There is no way around or passing, their agents are aware of the current situation, no, they are against their tools today, integrated circuits have helped them a lot and they have become leaders in communication technologies, information transfer, in communications, in software, in the field of they introduced artificial intelligence with a pro system that makes a decision and destroys a target in a very short time, it deprives other states of using a rocket against them, it nullifies the capabilities of a rocket, this is Mega dangerous.
        1. 0
          October 12 2019
          Dear, are you playing tanks?
      3. +1
        October 14 2019
        The people won the war only with Stalin, the party and communism! Because there was an idea. And now what idea will they fight (if they do)? For the children and grandchildren of oligarchs, deputies, the son of Medvedev or the daughter of Peskov, who live in the west?
    2. -3
      October 12 2019
      Come on.
      The Russians, they say, also conducted tests of their own.
      The moment of opening the mine with ICBMs was detected by a reconnaissance satellite. And after 5 seconds. an interceptor rocket flew into an open mine, so ICBMs were destroyed right at the launching site.
      belay
    3. +1
      October 12 2019
      One feels western orientation. Once all thoughts, aspirations and desires are directed to the side of the setting sun. Like I want to go where the sun is shining now !!! About missile defense from Europe to America, it's pretty cool. Only the earth is round. Wherever you turn, America will be everywhere. Fly PDA Hosh.
      1. +2
        October 13 2019
        I’ll go to clean. No chance whatsoever, not even an answer. Probably Masonic vigorous gifts are already flying ...
        And why should they be afraid, they are not vulnerable, ahead of the rest and the masters of the World in general.
    4. +1
      October 13 2019
      Quote: Babur_Imperat
      This is already useless at the level of technology that the United States possesses today, their systems detect any missiles from the Russian Federation

      You will be surprised, but the "old" technologies possessed by the Russian Federation have long been able to detect any missiles from the United States.
  19. -1
    October 12 2019
    The idea of ​​the BZHRK was good .. the question is whether the problems associated with this complex have been resolved. The problem of topography, the problem of the destruction of the railway track of the BZHRK, the creation of the necessary infrastructure from scratch. Again, you need to train specialists for this complex. And all these if .. It's easier to upgrade what we have. And then again we start playing "star wars"
    1. 0
      October 12 2019
      And where does the destruction of the canvas. BZHRK one-time product, it was shot and all.
      1. 0
        October 12 2019
        If he will stand in one place, and not ply the territory of the country, then what is its value?
  20. +3
    October 12 2019
    And why it was reduced, this did not work out the resource Well done / Scalpel, I would very much like to know from the guarantor belay
    1. +1
      October 12 2019
      A resource-not-missile complex with a resource-missile.
      1. +3
        October 13 2019
        I am not a "rocketman", but something brings to me analogies with my native military aircraft, when the single-engine scheme was recognized by the government as outdated and under this theme, to the delight of the "partners", in 1998 the entire IBA was destroyed (MiG-27, Su- 17M4), which has not worked out and half its resource. As a result, during the second Chechen war, when it became necessary to work on the Czechs more efficiently, not only in the PMU (simple weather conditions), where the Su-25 is not an assistant, they began to look for pilots and the subsequent de-mothballing of aircraft remains. And they are not. Neither the first nor the second. It was here that the introduction of the Su-34, the shock functions of the Su-27SM and other plots "suddenly" accelerated.
        Like everything in our native Russia - until the fried rooster pecks ...
        1. 0
          October 13 2019
          The missiles were produced only in Ukraine. Resource 15 years. Overloading of rolling stock. There are many cons. There are many expenses. And at the same time, the other strategic nuclear forces are in order and the defense capability does not suffer. Can you imagine how much money you would have to invest in the development of your missile or "friendship" with Ukraine?
          1. 0
            October 13 2019
            Why then were the Americans so afraid of the BZHRK? Why did they first impose on us a restriction on the radius of patrols of the BZHRK, and then generally demand to destroy this complex?
            1. +1
              October 13 2019
              Ask the Americans. What and why were they afraid. Well done had many advantages, but he did not give a decisive advantage. Just an element of a multifaceted system.
      2. +1
        October 13 2019
        In your opinion, is the Scalpel rocket resource 11 years old?
    2. +3
      October 12 2019
      Quote: akarfoxhound
      did not work out the resource Well done / Scalpel, I would very much like to know from the guarantor

      You ask Borka for a bruise. Well, if you don’t know the address, I’ll tell you, Yekaterinburg, "Yeltsin Center". You will find it quickly, I guarantee, by the smell of shit and ink stains. Yes
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        Why don't you respect Vovka so much? Or "YeltsinTsentr" aliens built? Where is the logic or just a trend? wink laughing"Not bad" you are a watered commentator bully
      2. 0
        October 13 2019
        Send to the wrong address, Borka did not dispose of any complex - send to the current guarantor
        1. +1
          October 13 2019
          Quote: KERMET
          Borka did not dispose of any complex - send to the current guarantor

          And what is Putin doing? On the contrary, he announced the possible withdrawal of Russia from the INF Treaty in 2000. in response to a US announcement of withdrawal from the ABM Treaty.
          1. +2
            October 13 2019
            With the cases that the utilization of all BZHRK occurred under Putin - there are questions to him, Borka, despite all the booze, is not here
            1. 0
              October 13 2019
              Here is what is on the network:
              "Since 1991, after a meeting between the leaders of the USSR (Gorbachev) and Great Britain (Thatcher), restrictions were imposed on the patrol routes of the BZHRK, they were on alert at the point of permanent deployment, without leaving the country's railway network.
              According to the START-2 Treaty (1993), Russia was to remove from service all RT-23UTTKh missiles by 2003. At the time of decommissioning, Russia had three railways (Kostroma, Perm and Krasnoyarsk), a total of 12 trains with 36 launchers. Despite Russia's withdrawal from START II in 2, all trains and launchers were dismantled (destroyed) during 2002-2003. "

              Well, who ruled Russia in 2003-2007? Is Yeltsin? The guarantor sawed these trains.
              1. 0
                October 13 2019
                BZHRK Russia will no longer be engaged - since it will have to create a new missile, the complex itself has limited mobility in view of the link to the railway tracks, as well as the significant cost of its creation. All that is now in service with the Strategic Missile Forces and new types of missiles that have recently been demonstrated are more than enough for the long term.
      3. 0
        October 14 2019
        In fact, they cut the BCW already under Vova.
  21. +5
    October 12 2019
    It will be the biggest mistake to recreate the BZHRK. In the USSR there were three divisions. And they planned 7. But either there was not enough money, or the management realized that the project was too costly. Even the infrastructure of the Krasnoyarsk division was not completed to the end, and according to those who served on them rolling stock for the regulations were forced to overtake in Perm
    "Barguzin" planned to deploy in the amount of ONE division with 5 trains (regiments) of 6 missiles each. Each composition (regiment) will have to create its own PPD. And this is by no means a dozen light structures of the "Krona" type. In fact, each regiment has its own railway station with railway routes and structures of the type shown in the photo




    Photos are only a part of the regiment's structures. Now imagine that there should be such "stations" FIVE
    In addition, you will need both "civilian infrastructure" - housing, schools, kindergartens, hospitals and military - barracks and infrastructure of the regiment. It will take either 5 small or one large military town. And this is oh what a lot of money.
    It’s easier, as Korotchenko says, to create a new PGRK ... Or to deploy an additional regiment in existing divisions ...
    1. +1
      October 13 2019
      Yes, you are right. All PPDs are already destroyed. And in 36 rd, in the summer we carried out even without freon. There was hell on the commander, I was more comfortable in the locomotive.
    2. 0
      October 14 2019
      To rebuild the station, structures and access roads is not such a waste when compared with how stupidly we use funds for some projects (I mean in general, and not just in the army) ... And then 7 divisions are really too much, 2- 3 in general, that’s enough, and you can build next to the already formed high-frequency ones, to equip the current with a piece of iron.
  22. +5
    October 12 2019
    Quote: Old26
    It will be the biggest mistake to recreate the BZHRK. In the USSR there were three divisions. And they planned 7. But either there was not enough money, or the management realized that the project was too costly. Even the infrastructure of the Krasnoyarsk division was not completed to the end, and according to those who served on them rolling stock for the regulations were forced to overtake in Perm
    "Barguzin" planned to deploy in the amount of ONE division with 5 trains (regiments) of 6 missiles each. Each composition (regiment) will have to create its own PPD. And this is by no means a dozen light structures of the "Krona" type. In fact, each regiment has its own railway station with railway routes and structures of the type shown in the photo




    Photos are only a part of the regiment's structures. Now imagine that there should be such "stations" FIVE
    In addition, you will need both "civilian infrastructure" - housing, schools, kindergartens, hospitals and military - barracks and infrastructure of the regiment. It will take either 5 small or one large military town. And this is oh what a lot of money.
    It’s easier, as Korotchenko says, to create a new PGRK ... Or to deploy an additional regiment in existing divisions ...

    And let me tell you what a mistake we had in our search for mineral deposits. This money is roughly comparable with divisions, if not more, but what's there ... more. Democrats came (I politely - I do not call them crap ...) And they closed it all. It is very expensive, believe me - from scratch to create infrastructure. So the extraction of oil and gold, as well as rare earths, was a mistake in the USSR? I’ll even add you there ... but why do I need it.
    1. -1
      October 12 2019
      Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
      So the extraction of oil and gold, as well as rare earths, was a mistake in the USSR? I’ll even add you there ... but why do I need it.

      You do not take into account one thing - the search for oil and gold subsequently made it possible to profit from the exploitation of the field and thereby all this went to the good of the country. The BZHRK did not give any profit, their maintenance was very costly, and these complexes did not radically change the overall combat power of the country. So it’s not worth it now to return to their creation, when it’s already obvious that for less money we can now create no less effective attack systems.
      1. +2
        October 12 2019
        You tell it to the Democrats - destroyed the expedition. Exactly where my parents worked, my brother and I - it's expensive to keep it ... feel the analogy? And yet, the search for deposits was not when there was no guaranteed profit - maybe you will find ... or maybe not ... but where without it? This is not a geologist with a hammer, this is a full-fledged exploration with drilling and penetration. This is probably my personal insult, but ... because without this, nowhere. If you want to have gold (I worked on gold) - invest money with an incomprehensible result.
        1. -1
          October 13 2019
          Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
          And yet, the search for deposits was not when there was no guaranteed profit - maybe you will find ... or maybe not ... but where without it?

          Of course not. But we must not forget that smart people built socialism and they knew the scientifically based norms for the distribution of surplus product, where they determined how much money should be directed to development, how much to consumption and how much to the accumulation fund. That is why not all funds were spent on the search for deposits, and resources were laid for failure. So the Soviet model was well thought out and balanced, until various illiterate secretaries of the Central Committee, like Gorbachev and Yakovlev, got to it, but the consequences are known.
          1. 0
            October 13 2019
            Totally agree with you.
    2. 0
      October 12 2019
      Nah ... Mother Russia will not pull. There isn’t enough money; they have long been taken abroad. And with this money, weapons are riveted against us.
  23. +4
    October 12 2019
    And who was responsible for this disposal?
    1. +3
      October 12 2019
      So they still lead the country ...
  24. +2
    October 12 2019
    Rebuilding is always much harder than keeping what is. The Tu-160 was cut into scrap metal - and now what? Those that are in the ranks will have to be written off sooner or later. And there is still no replacement for them. Kazan plant is just beginning to prepare for the resumption of serial production. And how long it will take, only God knows. And if they kept at least half of the destroyed strategists - how much more powerful the VKS would be now. So it happened with the "Barguzins", and with aircraft carriers. And now you have to start all over again from scratch, with much less opportunities than at one time in the USSR. It's a shame that so many valuable resources and technologies were lost in vain.
    1. -3
      October 12 2019
      Already in all production goes in 2022 they promise to lift the first 160M2 into the air, and while they finish two unfinished buildings.
  25. +8
    October 12 2019
    from the series .. our song is good, start over.
  26. +3
    October 12 2019
    Quote: rocket757
    The territory is large, it’s a plus ..... but it’s very useful to have rockets close, close to the potential enemy.
    The Club project is much more preferable in this respect.

    Subsonic? With a speed of 0,8M? Of course, more preferable than a rocket with a speed of 23-25M laughing

    Quote: AAK
    the price of one ICBM at the BZHRK is much cheaper than the PGRK

    Why would it be, if there and there will be the same "Yars" ??
  27. +2
    October 12 2019
    Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
    So the extraction of oil and gold, as well as rare earths, was a mistake in the USSR? I’ll even add you there ... but why do I need it.

    And where does it? We are talking about the profitability of creating BZHRK. Compared to deploying additional regiments in existing divisions, this is a huge amount of money. Moreover, having deployed 4 regiments of the PGRK, we will get more missiles and warheads than in five BZHRK trains. And there are no such enormous expenses for creating from the ground up the RPM of the division’s parts.

    Quote: akarfoxhound
    And why it was reduced, this did not work out the resource Well done / Scalpel, I would very much like to know from the guarantor belay

    The missile was created in Ukraine and EMNIP warranty period of operation it was assigned about 15 years. So the deadline is almost over. And the warranty service for these missiles would have to be done in Ukraine ...
  28. +1
    October 12 2019
    Quote: Victor_B
    As part of the WWS, the number of other carriers would have to be reduced, because the amount should be constant.
    The Americans are clearly preparing a withdrawal from the treaty, which is why ours are "hinting".
    You can also make such trains for medium-range missiles.
    Then they will not fall under the restrictions.

    Not certainly in that way. Not the total quantity should be constant, but the total quantity should not exceed the agreed amount in the contract. As you know, we can, within the framework of the agreement, increase the number by several tens.
  29. -1
    October 12 2019
    Again, only desire and wishlist through "can" ... Russia can do a lot. But a solution is needed.
    1. -1
      October 12 2019
      Russia will not do BZHRK - the MO has enough other expenses for the Strategic Missile Forces; they need to be re-equipped for YRS M, Sarmat, UR 100 - Vanguard, R 39 Liner, Bulava 40 and cruise missiles X 102 and X 50, and soon to create a new infantry rocket . Instead of BZHRK now Poseidon and Petrel are a prospect.
  30. -1
    October 12 2019
    Well, on the one hand. An interesting idea with modern means of delivery, which is much easier and less (special carts, frames and driveways are not needed) on the other hand, but how to really hide it. Indeed, now Any despatcher knows where what, where the train. If it’s supposed to be hidden under a normal load. Then the question is, who will lead him? Etc. a bunch of questions. And the answers can only be yes if only.
  31. +1
    October 12 2019
    Since we are threatened by an attack from a distance in the middle range, then the Barguzins need to be made at the same distance, which will allow the train to be stuffed with a dozen mallet, and the cargo in the car will not go beyond w. q requirements, which is more than wonderful to mask such crafts.
  32. +3
    October 12 2019
    Barguzin is such a furry animal ... Everyone will like it, as indeed a polar fox ...
  33. +1
    October 12 2019
    Quote: venik
    Would there be money .....

    Well, immediately hit the sore spot! Or maybe: herself ... herself? This is more familiar to us.
  34. 0
    October 12 2019
    For strategists, the railway platform is unnecessary. But you can try to revive the Pioneer analogue in the form factor of an ordinary container. Scare the Europeans. And let them ply on highways. From the railway to the barge, from there to the caravan, he spent a week in the jar and again on the road.
    1. 0
      October 13 2019
      We have the main enemy of the United States, and the Pioneers will not reach the United States. Barguzin would get it.
      1. +1
        October 13 2019
        But the Pioneers will multiply by zero the entire American infrastructure in Europe. Which is much more dangerous than middle class niggas escaping from the ghetto.
  35. 0
    October 12 2019
    BZHRK great power! No wonder the mattresses were so happy for their cut .....!
  36. -2
    October 12 2019
    Something seems to me, these complexes have long been there, far from paper.
  37. +1
    October 12 2019
    Quote: venik
    that he "spit" along the track at a speed of 80-100 km / h, and his route is not predictable - he can turn at any railway junction !!

    About "spar". He walked along the Transib at a speed of about 40 km / h and slowed down all movement. This was a headache for dispatchers. Only when I turned to the "ring", then at least on the track people calmed down.
    The route was predictable because navigation aids were hung on poles along the route. I don't remember the name exactly, but something like PDR-600. He could not move anywhere, because the halts where the train could be "uncoupled" into three launch modules were located in certain places. And these places had to have exact coordinates known to the launch crew

    Quote: Naive
    And you try to move the wheeled chassis with a rocket relatively secretively for 500 km.

    Have you decided to justify your nickname? Have you heard anything about the windows in the passage of satellites, as well as that the car chassis can be masked on the track? It (car chassis) is not tied to a piece of iron

    Quote: garri-lin
    For strategists, the railway platform is unnecessary. But you can try to revive the Pioneer analogue in the form factor of an ordinary container. Scare the Europeans. And let them ply on highways. From the railway to the barge, from there to the caravan, he spent a week in the jar and again on the road.

    And you will be able to shove the "Pioneer" into this "form factor"?
    1. 0
      October 13 2019
      The speed of 40 was only in small areas along the main course, we confidently walked 80, if you are about the winter of 1996 in western Siberia. it was a chipboard error that gave me the wrong warning. The dispatcher canceled after the tail for the whole section gathered behind me. soldier
  38. +1
    October 12 2019
    According to Korotchenko, Russia may consider the revival of the military railway missile project as a response to the possible deployment of medium- and shorter-range missiles by the United States in Asia and Europe

    Ensign Ivanov, having sipped from the shell of "Hyacinth", looked sadly at the unaccounted for sealed warehouse: - "Yes Masha, we are parting with you, ... and you will go to Mother Russia, somewhere you will find shelter ... maybe even in You wave America "....
  39. +1
    October 12 2019
    The article is about nothing. Foolishness and slag. Three years ago the topic was closed. And all the attempts on this issue are PR or just getting the author’s money for the article.
  40. +5
    October 12 2019
    Quote: Nycomed
    Yes, everything will be tracked and recognized, so why not spend a lot of money on the revival of this project. What was relevant in the 80s is now "past the box office". They'll stick some kind of microchip to it, the size of a pinhead, and that's it.

    Firstly, you need to know APPROXIMATELY where this steam locomotive stands in order to approach and attach.
    Second, the radius of your pin will be measured in meters. Third, after a week of functioning, the pin needs to change nutrition. Or change the pin itself. Fourth, if you think that a satellite can track nanowatts of a signal at a distance of five hundred kilometers, wouldn’t the security personnel with detectors guarding the engine locate a pin from a distance of several meters? How is it with your school education? Signal strength. as well as illumination (one physics of processes) falls inversely with the square of the distance.

    Do not watch stupid detective films. They are designed for and d and about t about in.
    1. 0
      October 14 2019
      Through the chip, you can send signals to the satellite, no meters of action. There are things like batteries, batteries for recharging. How long does the battery work in a computer? In my laptop since 2007, I have never changed. And the CHIP signals can be sent only periodically, and upward.
  41. 0
    October 12 2019
    There was an article here that it is possible to disguise a caliber of the Caliber type as a container train ... in one wagon 4 pcs. With the right range.
  42. DPN
    -4
    October 12 2019
    Maybe of course they’ll just add VAT on the products and all that, maybe it’s easier for the KUBU to ask for Russia to be included, sugar, bananas and other citrus fruits will be their own military base in comfortable conditions, not to mention the beaches for cold Russia. Barguzins are already the last century, as one said to Paradise others in HELL, there were enough nuclear stocks back in Soviet times.
    1. -3
      October 13 2019
      You will feed Cuba at your own expense.
      1. DPN
        -2
        October 13 2019
        It looks like YOU have fed all 14 republics, so the USSR didn’t overfeed, probably?
        Everyone feeds himself, but about fairy tales that someone feeds a lot of people.
        1. 0
          October 13 2019
          No, the USSR fed half of the world for decades - for loyalty and "coconuts" it finished it off in the 80s, and broke its "neck".
          1. DPN
            -1
            October 13 2019
            The USSR fed half the world.
            And today, whom is Russia feeding? The natural resources remained the same, but the free ones evaporated: housing, education, medicine — on each channel, requests for help.
    2. 0
      October 14 2019
      Once fed Cuba, writing off 30 mln. dollars. Is it too expensive a treat?
      1. DPN
        0
        October 14 2019
        That's why they lived in the WORLD without war with the United States, until the 90s.
  43. +3
    October 12 2019
    A strange game. We deployed 3 divisions, reduced them. We carried out work on the Barguzin and closed it down. It was not easier to preserve it. Conserve the Scalpels. And to modernize them, according to "changes in the military-political situation."
  44. +3
    October 12 2019
    Quote: AKS-U
    A strange game. We deployed 3 divisions, reduced them. We carried out work on the Barguzin and closed it down. It was not easier to preserve it. Conserve the Scalpels. And to modernize them, according to "changes in the military-political situation."

    Preserve missiles that are about to end their useful life? For what? A solid rocket was made in Ukraine. In addition, by the time the complexes were decommissioned, it is not known what condition the Pavlograd plant was in. Could he do anything at all ...
    1. 0
      October 13 2019
      Where did you get information about the life of Scalpel missiles? Have you heard anything about extending the life of strategic missiles?
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        Quote: KERMET
        Where did you get information about the life of Scalpel missiles? Have you heard anything about extending the life of strategic missiles?

        The main way to extend the service life is to control the firing of missiles. Nothing else to test a rocket in the TPK. New missiles nowhere to take. Therefore, shooting ammunition we get a reduction in the shock potential of the regiments.

        The story is the same as with the R-39 and 941 project.
    2. 0
      October 13 2019
      Official reason, according to which the "Scalpels" are removed from service, is called the expiration of the service life, although if we take into account that they were taken into service in the years 91-94, this the term should expire only by 2018 provided that regular maintenance is carried out by the manufacturer. But the factory in Pavlovgrad (Ukraine) now makes trolleybuses instead of missiles. And Ukraine, having become a non-nuclear power, under the terms of the agreement can neither have, nor produce or service nuclear weapons, especially now that the new Ukrainian authorities have headed west. And the equipment for the production of rockets that are in service with Russia is launched for remelting.
  45. 0
    October 12 2019
    In Europe and Asia, the United States will not be able to accommodate the INF. Time is not right. None of the European and Asian leaders will do this. Trump does not scare the rattle with Russia, but with China and S. Korea, while realizing that China, S. Korea and Russia will instantly increase the response potential of the INF Treaty by several times the potential American. And they will be forced to create a defense alliance in response to the American threat, and this is the last thing that NATO lacked.
    1. +3
      October 12 2019
      You are mistaken ... Romania and Bulgaria have already deployed a US missile defense system, and Tomahawk cruise missiles can be launched from these installations, including with a nuclear warhead ... Such installations may appear in Poland in the near future ... and patients with Russophobia republics of the former USSR can meet the United States to do their favorite thing - to spoil the Russian Federation ...
      1. +1
        October 12 2019
        Only Romania, without Bulgaria.
      2. 0
        October 13 2019
        I did not mean the fact of the deployment of launchers in Romania and the planned deployment of launchers in Poland. I'm about the new ballistic RSD USA. I do not think that the United States will be able to deploy RSD anywhere else.
        1. 0
          October 14 2019
          But Tomahawk cruise missiles have a range of up to 2500 km, are capable of carrying a nuclear charge and are quite suitable for medium-range missile standards, because the INF Treaty was buried by the United States and prohibited its deployment on land ... allowing them to be installed only on the fleet and aircraft
          1. 0
            October 14 2019
            I'm talking about ballistic missiles with a short flying time.
            And this good (Tomahawk) they have enough in the Navy.
    2. 0
      October 14 2019
      The GDP said that it would be unambiguously placed, therefore, it gave the go-ahead for the creation of a missile system that would break any missile defense
  46. +4
    October 12 2019
    It’s time to revive the BZHRK, this is a matter of national security. Their construction is cheaper than the construction of nuclear submarines, their service is safer, and the effect is almost the same as that of nuclear submarines ... It’s hard to find them, so they will be a great addition to nuclear submarines ... Weapons can vary, from YRSs, to Caliber and X- 101, which they have long wanted to adapt to launch with nuclear submarines, making it universal.
  47. +1
    October 12 2019
    The stability of the BRBD is higher than the SLBM, and it is cheaper in terms of total costs.
    1. +3
      October 12 2019
      This is how to say ... BZHRK can still fall even under the occasional strike of missiles, or enemy aircraft, for example, in a city that it will pass by ... With a nuclear submarine, this is not realistic ... But, as for me, the BZHRK is much more stable wheeled units of the same YaRS, and it can and should perfectly complement the submarines ...
      1. +1
        October 12 2019
        SLBM carriers are under the gun of enemy submarines and submarine forces. It’s purely my assessment that the probability of a successful combat mission is not high.
        1. +1
          October 12 2019
          Well this is not entirely true. Firstly, they can shoot today directly from the pier without even going out to sea, and secondly, the stability of different types of nuclear submarines is different in the sea. Old submarines, as a rule, are noisier, but there are exceptions ... For example, in the US Navy, the most dangerous opponents for our fleet are relatively old submarines such as the Sea Wolf, and not the new Virginia, which make more noise, because of cheaper and less high-quality housing cover.
          1. +3
            October 12 2019
            If you shoot from the pier, then why bother with a garden at all.
            1. +3
              October 12 2019
              Here I agree with you, but this is an extreme case when a launch order was received while parking at the port
    2. -1
      October 13 2019
      Quote: Pavel57
      The stability of the BRBD is higher than the SLBM, and it is cheaper in terms of total costs.

      But in any case, these complexes are inferior in cost to kilotons to conventional stationary mine launchers, and this fact has long been known to military specialists. So we must return to the old, old-fashioned ways of placing them in Western and Central Siberia, and not bother with new-fangled theories. The only thing required is to simplify the mines themselves, because it is unlikely that with a timely decision on a preemptive strike, something will remain in them for defeat, except for the duty shift.
      1. 0
        October 14 2019
        Stationary mines are too vulnerable, since their coordinates are known to the enemy ... The whole point is to make it difficult for the enemy to establish the position of the launchers. For this, they are building nuclear submarines and building the BZHRK
        1. -1
          October 14 2019
          Quote: Sapsan136
          Stationary mines are too vulnerable, as their coordinates are known to the enemy ...

          The coordinates of all military units are known to the enemy - and now what?
          Quote: Sapsan136
          Here all the salt is to make it difficult for the enemy to establish the position of the launchers.

          The salt is not just this, but to open up the enemy’s preparation for a nuclear strike in advance and to release the entire ammunition on duty of the strategic nuclear forces on them until they are hit by the enemy. Even if the intelligence spoils everything, then anyway, from the moment the enemy detects the launch of their missiles, we have minutes to give the command back. So the whole problem lies in the quickest decision-making and the immediate issuance of a command to launch to the strategic nuclear forces on duty so that it is used 100% - then we will not need a missile defense system for silos.
          Quote: Sapsan136
          For this, they are building nuclear submarines and building the BZHRK

          Nuclear submarines are now being built, and first of all, so that part of our nuclear potential is located off the coast of America in order to reduce the flight time. Against China, we do not need nuclear submarines - this is obvious. But the BZHRK at a certain stage played a role in the nuclear confrontation, but now they are not needed for two reasons - firstly, there are mobile wheeled complexes, and secondly, hypersonic weapons are being developed, and it’s more expensive to transport them around the country, taking into account the fact that warheads will maneuver by themselves, which means that it will be difficult for the enemy’s missile defense systems to determine their trajectory, regardless of where they will be released.
          1. 0
            October 15 2019
            Whether the submarine is at sea is not known to the enemy, it and the submarine ... And they built the BZHRK so that the launchers were lost in the vast expanses of the country from enemy satellites ... Wheel complexes are not the BZHRK, for them a march of 100 km is already a feat ...
            1. 0
              October 15 2019
              Quote: Sapsan136
              The enemy does not know whether the submarine is at sea, for that it and the submarine ...

              This is the main advantage because of which we maintain and develop this nuclear component so far and reduce the large surface fleet.
              Quote: Sapsan136
              And the BZHRK was built so that the launchers were lost in the vast expanses of the country from the satellites of the enemy ...

              The American has an orbital grouping of 400 satellites and at least half of them are military, or at worst dual-use. So, even negotiations between road linemakers or workers providing maneuvering, they can classify if they use VHF radio stations during the passage of the BRC. From here and draw a conclusion about their capabilities.
              Quote: Sapsan136
              Wheel complexes are not BZHRK, for them a march of 100 km is already a feat ...

              I think that the main feat will be if they start right from the storage site a few minutes after receiving the command - I hope this requirement still remains valid.
  48. 0
    October 13 2019
    Isn’t it easier to place containers with calibers on bulk carriers in all ports of adversaries?
    1. +1
      October 13 2019
      Not easier ... They have intelligence, and at the helm in Russia is full of people like Boriski Yeltsin’s son-in-law, whose wives and children are citizens of Austria and the USA ... Putin is in no hurry, alas, to get rid of Yeltsin’s rotten legacy ... and this a huge problem, including national security
      1. 0
        October 13 2019
        Returning to the topic of the article, all costs of the options should be considered taking into account how the cost of building the platform, infrastructure, the availability of personnel, the lobby inside the MO, the fifth and sixth columns, possible answers of the enemy (opponents). Given the developed railway networks, BRDZ look very promising.

        The main question is when to have a deployed system.
        1. 0
          October 13 2019
          You and I have no doubt about the need for the BZHRK for Russia, and this is the main thing. I hope the Ministry of Defense and the Government of the Russian Federation agree with us and Russia receives the necessary BZHRK ...
      2. +1
        October 13 2019
        Not the rotten heritage of Yeltsin, but the rotten heritage of the CPSU. All these figures, at one time, carried a party card in their pockets.
        1. -1
          October 13 2019
          The CPSU is a separate issue, but specific individuals have spoiled it and this is Yeltsin, Gorbachev and Shevardnadze ... Kravchuk and Kuchmami also could not do it ... The tsars wanted to sit down and get 30 pieces of silver from the USA ... And Medvedev puts monuments to Yeltsin ... Putin in Moscow, Gorbachev is greeted as an honored guest ... speak of the CPSU ?! Is EP better ?! Or running to the US Embassy Noval to your liking ?!
          1. +2
            October 13 2019
            And EP and consists mainly of former members of the CPSU. So to say heirs and successors. And their respective mentality is soviet. Navalny is also not much different from the current ones, and in addition he receives grants from overseas ones. Here is the reason for our troubles.
            1. +1
              October 13 2019
              So who is the president? Ivanova? Do you have your own party?
              1. 0
                October 13 2019
                And there are no suitable candidates. Zugzwang, in the language of chess. They will not be until we learn how to organize ourselves. And the question is: is it impossible to live without leaders? We are not a mumbo-jumbo tribe.
                1. +1
                  October 13 2019
                  Do you offer anarchy? So we will slide to feudalism ... And so we have almost slipped (in every region, such as Lithuania, the president sits, and even the former Soviet currency prostitute)
                  1. 0
                    October 13 2019
                    Not anarchy, but democracy. For example, the power of the Soviets, which was not in the USSR. (The Communists ruled everything and everything, and the Soviets were for decoration)
                    1. +1
                      October 13 2019
                      Makhno offered the same thing ... It turned out chaos and banditry
                      1. 0
                        October 13 2019
                        Makhnov's chaos was no more than the then Bolshevik or White Guard. "Whites come - they rob, the red ones come - they also rob" The civil war itself is chaos. A shameful page in the history of our country.
                      2. 0
                        October 14 2019
                        Small-town gangs, such as Makhnovskaya, will bring any country to feudalism and the war of city-states against each other ... This is a utopia
                2. -1
                  October 13 2019
                  Try searching in the Leaders of Russia contest.
  49. +1
    October 13 2019
    As for the BZHRK ... I don't know, I don't know ....! Once I read an article "dedicated" to methods for detecting BZHRK and tracking them .... There were many methods. The author of his article tried to explain why Russia decided not to "revive" the BZHRK ... Now, one can recall the "mobile-ground" missile system developed shortly before the "death" of the USSR. They wanted to disguise him as a heavy truck ... ("truckers", sir!). What about 40-foot shipping containers? Ships, railroad trains, truck tractors, "air carriers", finally ... Modern results in the development of materials, rocket fuel, microminiaturization of electronics, guidance systems should help in the placement of long-range BR (CR) in 40-foot (or even in 20ft ...) containers!
    1. +1
      October 13 2019
      Nikolaevich I (Vladimir) Today, 02:06 .... And 40-foot sea containers? Ships, railroad trains, truck tractors, "air transport", finally ... Modern results in the development of materials, propellant, microminiaturization of electronics, guidance systems should help in the deployment of long-range BR (KR) in 40-foot (or even in 20ft ...) containers!

      I believe our developers have taken into account such options that can fully justify their mission.
  50. 0
    October 13 2019
    To transfer such secretly to the same Maduro, the pi.sy decide to attack Venezuela and the unexpected will fly to them in Fashington laughing
  51. +1
    October 13 2019
    Let us remember that the Russian Ministry of Defense announced the start of work on the project of the Barguzin combat railway missile system (BZHRK) in 2012, and in 2014 the Yars missile was chosen for it. and at the end of 2017 there was a message that the project was closed.

    We were waiting for the Merikatos to withdraw from the INF Treaty. Now, for the sake of decency, let’s wait a little, and work on “Barguzin” will begin.
  52. 0
    October 13 2019
    I have a project! let's place nuclear weapons on carts, mowers, scooters, scooters. They won’t be able to track it for sure! The good thing about nuclear forces is that you can immediately notice the movement around them, both here and over the hill, and they serve as intimidation. Why do we need a new project? What will change and in what direction? Let's remember how "Barguzin" ended. Step on the same rake a second time.
    1. +1
      October 13 2019
      Quote: serg v zapase
      let's place nuclear weapons on carts, mowers, scooters, scooters

      And also on bicycles... The bears rode on a lisaped, and behind them a cat, backwards...
  53. +1
    October 13 2019
    The history of the development of military equipment shows that improving the theme of the BZHRK is for Russia the most successful response to any manifestations of militarism on the part of its “sworn friends.”
  54. +1
    October 13 2019
    What is there to revive? The latest information was that all design work has been completed, components have been tested in parts. What remains is the stage of general testing and production deployment. But further work was suspended due to financial reasons and redundancy.
    1. -1
      October 13 2019
      The officials have already come up with this redundancy to justify themselves. And the main reason is there is no money. Su-57 where? Where is Armata? Are they also redundant? I repeat - there is no money, the money wasted on a football show.
  55. +1
    October 13 2019
    Well, well, we’ve been listening to these songs about the main thing for what year? Ass?
  56. +1
    October 13 2019
    Since the decommissioning in 2007, there have been persistent rumors about a replacement, and they are also circulating in 2019...
  57. 0
    October 13 2019
    Some guy just blurted out without thinking. laughing
  58. -1
    October 13 2019
    Isn’t it easier to complete the Kalibr-NK container launchers (in sea containers) and place them on dry cargo ships that will sail around the United States and around European “partners” until X hour?
    1. 0
      October 13 2019
      Processing information and working with big data allows them to be calculated.
  59. +3
    October 13 2019
    Quote: KERMET
    Where did you get information about the life of Scalpel missiles? Have you heard anything about extending the life of strategic missiles?

    It is well known that the initial period was set at 10 years. Only the lazy did not write about this. As for extending service life, of course I heard. But the rocket was made in Ukraine and most likely the possibilities for design support were minimal. That’s why they were written off after less than 10 years of operation.

    Quote: kit88
    The moment of the opening of the ICBM silo was detected by a reconnaissance satellite.

    yes, but our rocket scientists don’t even know when the American satellites will fly by. Which inspect the same point approximately 2-3 times a day. And it should be. Just at this moment we open the shaft lid...

    Quote: kit88
    And after 5 seconds. an interceptor missile flew into the open silo, so the ICBM was destroyed right at the launch position.

    Yes, your weed is great. Not only does your satellite aim at the target, but your Qo is such that the interceptor flies into the mine. Is it okay that interceptors are designed to intercept missiles above the surface of the earth, and not in silos???
    And third. The distance to the nearest taxiway, which once housed ICBMs, is 540 km from the Baltic Sea, from where an interceptor could theoretically be launched. In 5 seconds, cover 540 km - 108 km/s. Almost 7 times faster speed THIRD SPACE... Yeah cool
  60. -5
    October 13 2019
    Well, well, another propaganda nonsense. They won’t create anything in the Russian Federation, they’ll just cut off the money and that’s it.
  61. 0
    October 13 2019
    Russia may revive the project of the Barguzin combat railway missile system (BZHRK) or create a new mobile ground-based missile system

    Given our vast territories covered with impenetrable taiga .. This is a very invulnerable weapon of retaliation ..
    What is there to restore? So modernize it a little and make it even more secret... I think such trailers have been roaming around Russia for a long time.
    What should “gentlemen” do? Let’s defend ourselves as best we can..

    Don't anger the Russians and you will be happy soldier
    1. 0
      October 13 2019
      Beauty, great start.
  62. 0
    October 13 2019
    in essence, today there is no reason to comply with any agreements with the United States, in view of the upcoming reformatting of the world. So if it is technically and economically feasible, then you can do
  63. 0
    October 13 2019
    What is this?!.. They cut, then resume, then pause the resumed... What kind of shirking from side to side?!.. When will this end?!. Where is a clear military doctrine with a list of weapons necessary for it?!. And also the enterprises that will actually implement these very weapons?!..
    1. +1
      October 13 2019
      No one is renewing anything - the news is the thoughts of one expert.
  64. 0
    October 13 2019
    There, most likely, they will not use the Yars, but the Mace, adapted for land launch... It is lighter, flies successfully on land, and carries more AP...
  65. +1
    October 13 2019
    Quote: Clever man
    Barguzin if I'm not mistaken something like a gazelle))

    Like a deer.
  66. 0
    October 13 2019
    Korotchenko as always. is engaged in hat-throwing.
  67. 0
    October 13 2019
    Korotchenko as always. is engaged in hat-throwing.
    1. -1
      October 14 2019
      Quote: kuz363
      Korotchenko as always. is engaged in hat-throwing.

      Korotchenko voices his opinion, which is often very sensible. But sometimes he gets carried away, and he puts forward superficial judgments that are more consistent with the current situation than with common sense, based on a deep knowledge of the problems of the military economy and the problems of our military-industrial complex.
      But don’t worry too much - his personal opinion does not in any way affect the planning at the State Educational Institution or the current (or being developed) weapons program, so take note of what he says, but do not consider it the ultimate truth.
  68. 0
    October 13 2019
    Quote: ProkletyiPirat
    Yes, the reasons, and this is NOT "START", there were, and there are still fundamental reasons, you just personally and 13+ people above this do not know and do not want to know, otherwise, you would google and find them and be would like me against the BZHRK. In short, compare two soil complexes first: based on w / d and second: on the basis of a \ d (wheeled) where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be useful, where, when and under what conditions the first \ second will be harmful. So when you compare, then you will understand that the wheel version will be better in all respects (there are a couple of exceptions but they only confirm this rule).

    All your nonsense is broken about the autonomy of a railway train and several cars, albeit of cyclopean size. Voyage radius of railway platforms and cars. The speed of reaching the launch site specified by the target and route of the combat missile. Possibility of servicing the warhead, reprogramming the flight route in both cases. Possibilities for protecting and guarding the train on the way and at stops. Single launch vehicles do not operate. The string of everyone accompanying them unmasks perfectly.
  69. 0
    October 13 2019
    Since 2010, we’ve been reading about these BZHRKs, booga-ha-ha!!!!
  70. 0
    October 14 2019
    IT'S JUST A CIRCUS! Well, there are no words))) And throw stones at me)))) THIS is called whipping up hysteria in a country where the standard of living is below the baseboard! The richest country! If you don’t pump up about the Enemies, then where are the successes? Is the standard of living of tens of millions comparable to poor Spain? Greece? After all, the poorest countries! Or the same Turkey? No? RICHEST COUNTRY! So they’re scratching...it’s a super rocket with a nuclear engine...it’s an apocalypse torpedo))))) And so we answer everyone normally! The authorities are persecuting fools because in the country “not very” to put it mildly.
  71. +1
    October 14 2019
    Who is this Korotchenko to talk about our ideas and capabilities on behalf of Russia? A very strange type, who served for only 12 years, was dismissed under a dubious article, and it is unclear how he became a colonel and even an expert...
  72. 0
    October 14 2019
    Why was it folded?
  73. 0
    October 14 2019
    It was a huge mistake to dispose of the BZHRK, but what can we say about it now? This complex was needed yesterday, another thing is that it will be much more difficult to revive, many technologies have gone far ahead, except for the railway composition, everything has changed, given the other directions of development of the Strategic Missile Forces, it is very doubtful that ours will decide to rely on the railway, which is a pity!
  74. 0
    October 14 2019
    Quote: kuz363
    Through the chip, you can send signals to the satellite, no meters of action. There are things like batteries, batteries for recharging. How long does the battery work in a computer? In my laptop since 2007, I have never changed. And the CHIP signals can be sent only periodically, and upward.

    If you had been educated in this matter at least in the first three lines of textbooks, you would not have tolerated such nonsense. The battery in your computer keeps the system clock running, which consumes nanowatts of power. To transmit information over at least two dozen kilometers, watts of power are needed. Be curious about what a yoki-toki radio station is. Don't you have a cell phone? Move a couple of kilometers away from the cell and try using your phone to communicate with an almost watt transmitter. Further. A directional antenna is a complex and bulky structure. Look at cell phone antennas. They have pie charts to catch from everywhere. But to form a beam, you need a canvas hundreds of times larger than such an antenna. Parabolic, for example. How long does your cell phone battery last? For a week, maximum, in silent mode, when the phone PERIODICALLY “talks” to the cell, in order to maintain a working communication line. And in boltology mode? Day?
    Photovoltaic panels MUST be outside, but they will be visible. A panel of tens of square decimeters is a perfectly visible mirror.


    "Power
    Well, we've decided on the range. Now let's decide on power. In many countries, including Russia, the permitted power is 0,1 W. It is enough for communication at a distance of a maximum of 1-1,5 km, and even then with direct visibility. In principle, at such a distance you can do without radio stations - just shout loudly. But increasing the power to 2 W allows you to communicate at distances of up to three kilometers, and at 4 W – up to five kilometers!”

    Teach materiel.

  75. 0
    October 14 2019
    Quote: Archivist Vasya
    It was a huge mistake to dispose of the BZHRK, but what can we say about it now? This complex was needed yesterday, another thing is that it will be much more difficult to revive, many technologies have gone far ahead, except for the railway composition, everything has changed, given the other directions of development of the Strategic Missile Forces, it is very doubtful that ours will decide to rely on the railway, which is a pity!

    Technology has moved forward. Yes, this is a blessing! Lighter rockets appeared. What is the main problem with such an installation? Fit almost 120 tons of cargo into a 90-ton car. And do it without notice. With the new carrier, the problem, if not completely removed, will be significantly weakened. It's the same with dimensions.
    Further. The use of modern control systems, when the flight program can be entered upon receipt of such a command on the fly, there is no need to stand at the launch point, sometimes hundreds of kilometers away.
  76. +2
    October 14 2019
    Quote: prapor55
    The speed of 40 was only in small areas along the main course, we confidently walked 80, if you are about the winter of 1996 in western Siberia. it was a chipboard error that gave me the wrong warning. The dispatcher canceled after the tail for the whole section gathered behind me. soldier

    Most likely this is what we are talking about. At least it is a fact that there were areas where the BZHRK slowed down traffic. I’ll try to contact a friend who served for them, perhaps from your RD, and check the time

    Quote: Dzafdet
    There, most likely, they will not use the Yars, but the Mace, adapted for land launch... It is lighter, flies successfully on land, and carries more AP...

    She has two disadvantages.
    1. Shorter range
    2. Ban on the use of SLBMs on land (there was such an article in the SALT/START treaties)
  77. 0
    October 14 2019
    Quote: Samum
    Since 2010, we’ve been reading about these BZHRKs, booga-ha-ha!!!!

    What are the stallions doing here? You need to neigh in the stall.
  78. +1
    October 14 2019
    Hello!
    Sorry I didn’t read all the comments completely, so if I repeat anything, don’t swear. He served at this complex for more than 7 years.
    The BZHRKs were initially laid up by our Gorbachev under an agreement with the Americans. According to the agreement, they were prohibited from going to the IBP. They were on duty at the PPD, which the Americans were very happy about. Then, according to the new agreement, they went under the knife. Yes, the complex was developed back in the USSR by Yuzhmash in cooperation with others, but most of the systems were made by them. Because of this, after 1995 -1996, some problems with spare parts began. I think this was one of the main reasons for their reduction. In those years, they had not yet been able to replace suppliers from Ukraine for the most “painful” systems. The second reason is that the TRB zone has not been fully completed for normal maintenance of the complex. One of the divisions did not have it at all and therefore had to send trains to carry out RTO across half the country. Probably for these and some other reasons (political, economic) they were given under the contract.
    Regarding the economic component. When they write about its high cost of upkeep and maintenance, one gets the impression that the person who writes this did not serve in the Strategic Missile Forces. Have you ever been present at the divorce of the DS division of the BZHRK, OS, and SPU? So, just by the number of officers and warrant officers and soldiers in the DS of the BZHRK and SPU, much becomes clear. Changing the BZHRK is approximately equal to changing one SPU division. And the amount of equipment that eats fuel and lubricants cannot be compared at all. If a regiment of an SPU or BZHRK is on duty at a permanent deployment point, then everyone is standing on the “Columns” of electricity. If the movements are planned according to the plan to the area, can you even imagine how much equipment the SPU regiment is driving out. Moreover, in terms of the number of diesel engines consuming fuel and lubricants, the SPU regiment will give the heat, just hold on. If you add up all the diesel engines in the BZHRK regiment, there are simply many fewer of them compared to the SPU. In terms of the number of necessary structures in the PPD of the SPU and BZHRK regiments, this is also far from being in favor of the SPU. Mobile complexes need more of them at times. BZHRKs were generally created to be permanently located on the IBP. We called them land submarines. The autonomy is large, only occasionally go to the PPD to replenish and service equipment, or to troubleshoot problems. All. Economically justified and only lost to the OS shelves. In general, I can write a lot about this. But it’s definitely a pity that these complexes were removed. Another example. When I served in one of their divisions, this division covered up to 50% of the tasks of the entire army of which it was a part. By the way, this army included two huge SPU Topol divisions and another reduced SPU division. And by the way, we did not strengthen the sleepers and bridges. The quality of the Ministry of Railways' tracks was sufficient to carry out its tasks. And the length of the BZHRK IBP compared to the SPU position area is a gigantic difference. Something like this. Sincerely
  79. 0
    October 14 2019
    Why this train, there are VANGUARDS! Or is there no money or materials for it?
  80. +3
    October 15 2019
    Quote: Sapsan136
    You and I have no doubt about the need for the BZHRK for Russia, and this is the main thing. I hope the Ministry of Defense and the Government of the Russian Federation agree with us and Russia receives the necessary BZHRK ...

    I hope that common sense will prevail in the Ministry of Defense, and then in the government, and they will put a big, bold end to Barguzin. Huge costs for creating a PPD division (and just one). It is cheaper and more efficient to deploy additional regiments in divisions equipped with RGRK

    Quote: NEXUS
    In fact, it was thought that it was not YRSs (RS-24) that were set on Barguzin, but Rubezhi (RS-26), which is twice as light as YRS, 80 tons against 40 at Rubezh.

    Work on "Barguzin" began even before work on "Rubezh" began. And starting work on the complex without having a rocket is very wise.
    1. 0
      October 16 2019
      As for costs. The costs of creating a PPD for a BZHRK division are no more than for an SPU division, and in fact less. At least the number of buildings in the total number is less. When comparing, the BZHRK division's PPD is often confused with the SPU regiment. The SPU division is 4-5 regiments each with its own huge farm. Zone TRB, RTB and so on. In the BZHRK, the shelves are on one PPD and that’s it, plus the TRB and RTB zones, which are also smaller than the SPU. And in terms of the number of personnel, the BZHRK regiment is not much larger than the SPU division. And so on. Best regards, Dmitry

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