All for the sake of the mental health of the nation. “Death from pity” in the Third Reich

115

Nazis are building a new world


Europeans with Americans, who showed the Germans how to sterilize marginals, already in 1938 at the International Genetic Congress in Edinburgh made a timid attempt to curb the hysteria that was unleashed in Germany. The final statement, in particular, criticized the views of the National Socialists regarding the inheritance of antisocial and criminal behavior. Indeed, such a relationship is not just not studied, but not even fixed. However, such manifestos did not prevent the British, Americans and Scandinavians from promoting the ideas of racial hygiene and translating them into medical practice.


One of the memorials to the victims of the T4 program




It is clear that the Third Reich bonuses did not pay much attention to scientists, among whom there were many Jews, and already in July 1939 in Berlin a meeting was held with prominent psychiatrists and directors of psychiatric hospitals. It was at this meeting that methods and methods were developed for killing the “genetic load” both in our own territory and in future occupied ones. As already said in the first part of the materialPerhaps the main goal of clearing the country of disabled, hopelessly sick and mentally disabled citizens was the release of hospitals and doctors to receive the wounded from the front. Actually, this practice has spread to countries that fell under the German hammer. So, already on 27 of September 1939, the patients of a hospital in Polish Gdynia were shot - later a German hospital appeared there. After the surrender of Poland, gas vans were used for the destruction of patients, in which at least 3000 hospital residents were killed. However, with the rampant violence against civilians in the ranks of the SS, especially “merciful” killers appeared, who were depressed by the actions. As a result, they went to the rear with mental disorders, where they were killed after the examination. Of course, one cannot talk about such widespread practice, but several cases were described in Ernst Kle's book “Euthanasia in the Third Reich. Destruction of an inferior life. " In addition, in Germany there was an action number 14f13, during which disabled people were selected in all concentration camps and later destroyed in gas chambers.


Hitler's order to launch the T4 program


The most inhuman grin of the German racial hygiene program was the mass extermination of inferior children in 30 specialized clinics. Since August 1939, without exception, all doctors and obstetricians of the Third Reich have received a special order on the mandatory registration of all cases of the birth of children with disabilities. Hitler and his doctors decided to revive the principles of natural selection in a developed society by destroying at least ten thousand young and newborn children.

The Germans twenty years ago calculated their own losses from the T4 program and were horrified - only in Germany from 250 to 300 thousand people were killed.

The Münster Lion is not against


Blessed Clemens August Count von Galen, who, through his sermons, drew public attention to the cannibalistic practice of exterminating inferior Germans, was not at all opposed to transferring the T4 program to the eastern territories. At least, simple burghers did not hear any sermons from him about pity for the unfortunate in Poland and the USSR. The first victims in the Soviet Union were 464 patients of the Belarusian hospital in Khoroshch. In August 1941, Heinrich Himmler personally, when visiting the psychiatric colony “Novelties”, ordered “to relieve suffering” of all mentally ill people. But the problem was with the SS men, who were already so mentally exhausted at the constant executions (at one of them Himmler himself collapsed in a swoon) that it was decided to kill the unfortunates with an explosion. The head of the operational Einsatzgruppen in the Criminal Police, Arthur Nebe ordered that 24 patients be taken to a forest bunker and blown up there. This turned out to be not the most effective way of mass murder - it was necessary to lay explosives repeatedly and on a larger scale. Only the second time Himmler’s question was finally resolved.


Memorial in berlin


Many historians also believe that Heaven conducted this action exclusively for research purposes, choosing the most humane way for the SS men to destroy people. In Mogilev, the sadist Nebe on patients in a psychiatric hospital was testing a method of killing in an airtight room, where the exhaust gases of a car were discharged. The entire course of the experimental action was filmed on video, which has been preserved and became material evidence at the Nuremberg trials. It turned out that the exhaust gases of one passenger car is not enough and still require a truck. In total, Arthur Nebe and Albert Widmann (an active member of the T4 program responsible for euthanasia in the Brandenburg camp) in Mogilev killed more than 1000 patients with gases. Heaven himself nearly suffocated in the garage when he drunk fell asleep in a running car. In 1945, his own were hanged as a dog because of involvement in the assassination attempt on Hitler. This, by the way, is very revealing of the characterization of some participants in the failed coup d'etat. Widman generally died peacefully in the 1985 year, having served a total of no more than 6 years.

All for the sake of the mental health of the nation. “Death from pity” in the Third Reich

Arthur Heaven


For a change, the Germans got rid of patients in psychiatric clinics of the USSR in the most faithful, but also the most cruel way - they starved them. So, in Vinnitsa, after establishing the daily food norm in 100 grams of bread, most of the patients from 1800 died of exhaustion, the rest were shot. The attitude of the "new government" to the mentally ill representatives of the Slavs and Jews was very accurately described by the senior garrison doctor Kern:
"... according to German laws, mentally ill are an extra" ballast "for society and are subject to destruction, and since the Germans kill such patients in Germany, this should be done in the occupied territories."


Afterword


The main defendants in the killer doctors case were former imperial health commissioner Karl Brandt and T4 program manager Victor Braque. Both of them were hanged following the results of the Nuremberg trials of Nazi doctors in 1948. In total, only 90 doctors were convicted, of which most in the mid-50's were granted amnesty. They returned to medical practice and became respected doctors.


Karl Brandt before hanging


Niels Pörksen of the German-Polish Association for the Protection of Mental Health claims on the pages of the Bulletin of the Association of Psychiatrists of Ukraine that German doctors continued the practice of forced sterilization of the mentally ill until the beginning of the 70's. At the same time, former employees of the T4 program were involved as the most experienced in this matter. Only when the well-known student unrest began and in Germany began to evaluate involvement in the crimes of the Second World War, the sterilization was gradually turned off. But all the same, the overwhelming majority of the professors of the post-war German Association of Psychiatry and Psychotherapy of Neurology took one or another part in the process of correspondence selection of patients within the framework of the T4 program. And only when the last of the "old guard" died or retired, did the Association formally plead guilty and publicly apologize. It happened in the 2001 year ... And nine years later, the following words were said:
“On behalf of the German Society of Psychiatry, Psychotherapy and Neuropathology, I apologize to you, the victims and their relatives, for the suffering and arbitrariness inflicted upon you during the years of National Socialism by German psychiatrists on behalf of German psychiatry, and for this it is too long silence, underestimation and repression of what happened from the consciousness and memory of German psychiatry in the years that followed ”.
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  1. +3
    14 October 2019 05: 30
    the topic is terrible, but if there is no natural selection, the gene pool will weaken and any species will die out. alas.
    1. +1
      14 October 2019 05: 45
      I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring, give birth to those who are not naturally adapted to this. We have to develop even more sophisticated methods to survive an even more unviable generation. The road leading to the impasse of the destruction of humanity as a species.
      1. +13
        14 October 2019 06: 04
        Quote: Mikhail M
        I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene poolnursing unsustainable babies giving even more unviable offspring

        So how do your views differ from the views of the Nazis set out in the article: get rid of the inferior?

        A human animal, but NOT an animal. Therefore, he and MAN.
        1. +10
          14 October 2019 06: 28
          Andrei hi I disagree with you on many issues, but here you are completely on your side.
        2. -8
          14 October 2019 07: 06
          Quote: Olgovich
          A human animal, but NOT an animal.

          A human-animal exists according to the laws of nature, including natural selection, NOT an animal does not recognize these laws. I think that nature will take its toll. Statistics of prematurity and pathologies confirm this.
          1. +10
            14 October 2019 07: 21
            Quote: Mikhail M
            A human-animal exists according to the laws of nature, including natural selection, NOT an animal does not recognize these laws.

            A person lives according to human laws: he does not throw his already "useless" decrepit parents in the dump to die, heals relatives for cancer, nurses his babies, because each of them is a separate HUGE priceless world, for example, like premature Kant, Napoleon, Da Vinci , Newton, Einstein, Churchill, etc.

            And lovers of natural selection need to be consistent and to rid their already grown children and society, from burdensome already burdens by oneself
            1. -7
              14 October 2019 07: 31
              Quote: Olgovich
              And lovers of natural selection need to be consistent and save their already grown children and society from the burdensome burden of themselves

              When there is nothing to argue on the merits, we turn to the individual. The reception is well-known and typical. I consider the dialogue unproductive and end here.
              1. +11
                14 October 2019 07: 46
                Quote: Mikhail M
                I consider the dialogue unproductive and end here.

                What kind of "products" are they? themselves run to the clinic (in which case), and do not leave the "natural" course of things to do your natural selection. Yes
                1. +4
                  14 October 2019 09: 36
                  Olgovich, I sincerely bow to you! hi Write everything correctly. soldier
                2. +1
                  15 October 2019 21: 41
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  What kind of "products" are they?

                  What "Products"?
                  Well, for example, the former chairman of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine Paruby with a certificate of mental retardation. Yes, and many more of these lit up on the Maidan, and now in power.
                  And they determine how to live the rest of the normal.
          2. +19
            14 October 2019 07: 23
            Why don't you continue the logical chain of natural selection? If you are for the fact that medicine does not preserve weak newborns, then let us fight each other for food and die for the throat. Everything as in animals is the right of the strong and healthy above all. And it’s easy to talk about beating babies, being in the comfort zone.
            1. +9
              14 October 2019 07: 51
              Quote: Evgeny Fedorov
              Why don't you continue the logical chain of natural selection? If you are for the fact that medicine does not preserve weak newborns

              You can continue further: And why should medicine, in fact, preserve ... lovers of natural selection? True selection does not involve clinics. Yes ..
              1. +4
                14 October 2019 15: 07
                The fathers of the Jehovah's sect forbid their followers to go to doctors and do a blood transfusion to save the lives of loved ones, but they treat their relatives according to the latest American medicine!
            2. +1
              14 October 2019 15: 04
              Dear Eugene! Do you have plans to create an article about events in the town of Taskigi, Macon County, Alabama?
              Over the inhabitants of which for 40 years (from 1932 to 1972) a "medical" experiment was carried out.
            3. +1
              18 October 2019 06: 23
              you imagine a picture in the year 2100 - when the population exceeds 50 billion ...
          3. +1
            14 October 2019 20: 01
            Oh well ?! My daughter was born thirty years ago, very premature .. We have two grandchildren, completely healthy and cheerful. And you actually put yourself on the level of an animal with your statement.
        3. +4
          14 October 2019 07: 47
          Quote: Olgovich
          So how do your views differ from the views of the Nazis set out in the article

          previous commentators generally do not call in their comments for the forced destruction of inferior, but the fact remains, the painful current generation is the merit of medicine. You can’t argue against nature, if a woman has a miscarriage, it means that somewhere in the body there was a genetic malfunction, before, the parents simply conceived a new baby, and now they save and terminate with all their might. In turn, full-term give birth to a new generation and so on. All this impairs heredity. How to deal with this? I don’t know ... So far, our medicine at the genetic level cannot intervene in the human body.
          Quote: Olgovich
          does not throw his, already "useless" decrepit parents in a landfill to die, heals relatives for cancer,

          it’s from another opera in general, caring for sick, aged and crippled relatives is a sign of a social society and it’s not at all what we are talking about.
          1. 0
            14 October 2019 08: 17
            ... caring for sick, aged and crippled relatives are signs of a social society and not at all what we are talking about.

            These are different verses, BUT one song!
            In the Russian language there are expressions such as “it's time to poppies” or “to put on a slide”. They are directly related to the killing of the elderly, who were taken to the forest during the winter season. According to the ethnographer Litvinova, the elderly were lowered into a ravine, while being planted on the forehead. After some time, this tradition was replaced by an equally inhuman one - to keep the old man locked up in an empty cold hut until the death hour.

            Old people take food from the young and strong, but at the same time they themselves do not produce anything! So why feed them and transfer food, medicine and personal time to them?
            1. +3
              14 October 2019 08: 24
              Quote: hohol95
              These are different verses, BUT one song!

              this is according to your version, but not mine. Descendants must take care of their ancestors, this is correct, but how will a disabled person who exists in the world in the form of a vegetable take care of his ancestors? Can you answer this question?
              1. +3
                14 October 2019 08: 44
                Where is it written that descendants must take care of their ancestors? In which regulatory document?
                "Vegetable"?
                Any healthy person having received a certain type of injury will easily become a "vegetable"!
                And naturally he does not care about anyone.
                The Spartans didn’t care about the frail infants or the decrepit old people - and where are those Spartans.
                When Hephaestus was born, he was a sick and frail child, moreover, lame on both legs. Hera, seeing her son, abandoned him and threw him off high Olympus. But the sea did not swallow the young god, but accepted him into his bosom. The adoptive mother of Hephaestus was the sea goddess Thetis. Until his adulthood, Hephaestus lived at the bottom of the sea and was engaged in his favorite business: forged. Fine products came out of the forge of Hephaestus; they had no equal in beauty or strength. As if the pictured birds were flying, people really lived, and even the wind found life in the beautiful creations of Hephaestus.

                Do you want to identify yourself with the Gods of Olympus?
                1. +3
                  14 October 2019 08: 51
                  Quote: hohol95
                  Where is it written that descendants must take care of their ancestors? In which regulatory document?

                  Family Code of the Russian Federation Article 87. in particular, read. Although, I personally had the opinion that with reading you have trouble:
                  Quote: hohol95
                  seeing her son, she abandoned him and threw him off high Olympus. Do you want to identify yourself with the Gods of Olympus?
                  I would like to see where I wrote about the murders of inferior children? And I never saw the answer to my question from the previous comment.
                  1. +1
                    14 October 2019 09: 01
                    Family Code of the Russian Federation Article 87. in particular, read. Although, I personally had the opinion that with reading you have trouble:

                    Oh, you are right - with reading I have trouble, trouble, grief ...
                    And often they bring cases for non-compliance with this article?
                    I would like to see where I wrote about the murders of inferior children?

                    And you applied the concept of "vegetable" to whom? What age group of people?
                    "Revenge, so clean!" Or do you selectively want to cleanse the ranks of those who are incapable of a full life in the human community?
                    And I gave you the answer - NO!
                    1. +7
                      14 October 2019 09: 09
                      Quote: hohol95
                      And often they bring cases for non-compliance with this article?

                      You know, this is a question from another opera, I don’t know how often, but there is a law. I answered your question.
                      Quote: hohol95
                      And you applied the concept of "vegetable" to whom?

                      There was a rather sensational case, perhaps even you heard about it, father, walked with the child (about two months, in my opinion, age), a brick fell directly from the roof onto the baby’s head. Clinical death, the child was pumped out, but warned - not a tenant. Several clinical deaths, trips to doctors and clinics, a warning about irreversible changes in the brain. The child came out, in the sense, was not allowed to die. Now this creature is in a wheelchair, in the care of parents. Question. Was it worth making such incredible efforts to return the creature from the other world (it’s hard to call him a person)? During this time, parents would have brought into the world and raised 2-3 full-fledged children and would have enjoyed life. Now this is an unhappy family, and when the parents die, who will take care of their child?
                      1. +2
                        14 October 2019 09: 16
                        you know, this is a question from another opera, I don’t know how often, but there is a law.

                        The law that the post cannot be jumped over, you can get around!
                        Regarding the case you brought up, everything is in the soul of the parents ... And their ideas about life ...
                        And you judged by a joke about the Chukchi - we will give birth to these new ones or new ones!
                        And I’ll tell you based on my personal modest life experience - not everyone succeeds in giving birth! So the parents fight for the only child by all means. They will not have other children. Never!
                        If you and your spouse with reproductive organs are in full order - happy for you! Be fruitful and multiply!
                      2. -1
                        14 October 2019 09: 24
                        Quote: hohol95
                        The law that the post cannot be jumped over, you can get around!

                        laws were spinning at all times, but this is not the case; collecting child support is a normal occurrence, moreover, our time is much more effective than before.
                        Quote: hohol95
                        They will not have other children.

                        with such a child, of course not.
                        Quote: hohol95
                        still not everyone succeeds!

                        that’s the point, the more we save those whom nature has decided to get rid of, the worse the health of the nation. Vicious circle. Defective parents give inferior offspring, and their offspring generally does not leave offspring.
                      3. +2
                        14 October 2019 09: 38
                        Defective parents give inferior offspring, and their offspring generally does not leave offspring.

                        Nice conclusion ... About strangers!
                        I am glad that you and your family are "true arias" ...
                        May adversity pass you by!
                      4. -1
                        14 October 2019 09: 41
                        Quote: hohol95
                        About strangers!

                        You wrote about abstract people, I also wrote about them.
                        Quote: hohol95
                        I am glad that you and your family are "true arias"

                        it has nothing to do with it, a person must leave posterity after himself, this is the basic law of nature, and if the Almighty did not give it to him, then something is wrong in a person. And I personally did not want to offend you or your relatives. Excuse me.
                      5. +1
                        14 October 2019 14: 45
                        You wrote about abstract people, I also wrote about them.

                        So you are surrounded only by 100% healthy people!
                        But on my life's journey I met people and not quite healthy.
                        And looking like arias, but SKY decided for them and did not give them children even after many medical interventions!
                        And, something may happen to a healthy child - injuries that were not paid attention in childhood can lead to sad consequences!
                      6. 0
                        14 October 2019 17: 45
                        Quote: hohol95
                        So you are surrounded only by 100% healthy people!

                        no, why did you decide? I myself am not 100% healthy, but why are you doing this?
                      7. +1
                        14 October 2019 17: 51
                        And who and how measures fullness and inferiority? What are the criteria for usefulness? I ran a hundred meters for a hundred bucks, full. I didn’t run, it’s my fault. And now what to do with the guilty ones? Do not help? Is it humanism or sadism?
                      8. 0
                        14 October 2019 17: 53
                        Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
                        And who and how measures fullness and inferiority?

                        and what does it have to do with it?
                      9. +1
                        14 October 2019 18: 02
                        Here I am talking about too. What are the criteria for usefulness?
                        Defective parents give inferior offspring, and their offspring generally does not leave offspring.
                        Although the question is wider, and not just childbirth. For example, disabled people in adulthood. But you never know in life situations when a person loses his legal capacity. He himself is not happy about it if in his right mind.
                      10. 0
                        14 October 2019 18: 18
                        Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
                        Here I am talking about too. What are the criteria for usefulness?

                        so what questions to me?
                      11. 0
                        14 October 2019 18: 19
                        Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
                        What are the criteria for usefulness?

                        are you asking me
                      12. +1
                        15 October 2019 23: 10
                        You can say, I ask, I can say I'm interested. But the question is, in general.
                      13. -1
                        14 October 2019 10: 01
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        The child came out, in the sense, was not allowed to die. Now it being in a wheelchair, in the care of parents. Question. Was such an incredible effort to return

                        The question is different (but you are evading him): WHO WILL TAKE OVER - HIS KILLING?
                      14. +2
                        14 October 2019 10: 03
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        The child came out, in the sense, was not allowed to die. Now it being in a wheelchair, in the care of parents. Question. Was such an incredible effort to return

                        The question is different (but you are evading him): WHO WILL TAKE OVER - HIS KILLING?

                        There wasn’t such a question, so I didn’t dodge him. But he didn’t have to be killed, he himself was dying, the doctors suggested disabling the life support systems.
                      15. -1
                        14 October 2019 10: 34
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        There wasn’t such a question, so I didn’t dodge him.

                        Well, well, it pops up in the FIRST turn and much earlier than your question:
                        Was such an incredible effort to return
                        .
                        .
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        But he didn’t have to be killed, he himself was dying, doctors suggested deactivate systems

                        And this is not a murder? What is the other word?

                        By the way, what about other patients, when do you propose to kill (turn off)?
                      16. +3
                        14 October 2019 10: 39
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        And this is not a murder? What is the other word?

                        Olgovich, I thought you were a smart person, in your opinion, if a woman has a miscarriage, then should she be considered, if not a murderer, then an accomplice in the murder? Yes, thousands of people are disconnected from life support systems, now resuscitation medicine has reached such heights that a person in a state of biological life can be maintained for a very long time, but when there is no point, they disconnect the system with the consent of relatives. And no one smears the snot on this occasion, there is a limit to everything.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        By the way, what about other patients, when do you propose to kill (turn off)?
                      17. 0
                        14 October 2019 11: 03
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        In your opinion, if a woman has a miscarriage, then should she be considered, if not a murderer, then an accomplice in the murder?

                        WHERE do I have like? belay
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        Yes, thousands of people are disconnected from life support systems, now resuscitation medicine has reached such heights that a person in a state of biological life can be maintained for a very long time, but when there is no point, the system with the consent of relatives.

                        Where in the legislation is this described?

                        You did not answer the question:
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        By the way, what about other patients, when do you propose to kill (turn off)?
                      18. +1
                        14 October 2019 11: 07
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Where in the legislation is this described?

                        ???? What does the law have to do with it? These cases, disconnection from systems, are described in the press.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You did not answer the question

                        answered when there was no point in prolonging biological life. The dynamics of a person’s recovery can be positive or negative or none at all. those. a person either gets better, or dies, or lies like a plant for a long time. Doctors are generally very cynical people, for example, there are still frequent cases when on the scales the life of a woman in childbirth or a child, whom to save? Who decides what laws? And who is the killer after that?
                      19. 0
                        14 October 2019 11: 53
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        ???? What does the law have to do with it? These cases, disconnection from systems, are described in the press.

                        And on the basis of WHAT to decide? belay
                        Maybe you kill (disconnect) because of an apartment, or because of an inheritance, or debts, or revenge, etc.?
                        Here, without the Law / State, simply KILLING occurs with unclear motives.
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        answered when meaning in the extension of biological life no.

                        And what "meaning" is there in the existence of, for example, a dog? WHO will determine this "meaning"? Who will kill and on what basis?
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        Doctors are generally very cynical people, for example, there are still frequent cases when on the scales the life of a woman in childbirth or a child, whom to save? Who decides what laws? And who is the killer after that?

                        That’s their job. To save, both, and there, how it goes.
                      20. 0
                        14 October 2019 11: 59
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        That’s their job. To save, both, and there, how it goes.

                        there it is clearly necessary to understand who to sacrifice, anyhow it doesn’t work out. Or two corpses. In our area, a bus crashed, four corpses, three heavy, in critical. There was enough space in the intensive care unit in the hospital, thank God they pumped it out. But imagine, they bring you three of these, and also three places, but on one device such a child - a vegetable or a grandmother, who has been writing truancy for three years in the cemetery. Who will save, whom disconnect, whom in the corridor to die on a gurney leave. You are the head of the department. Will you consider yourself a killer?
                      21. -1
                        15 October 2019 06: 28
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        there it is clearly necessary to understand who to sacrifice, anyhow it doesn’t work out. Or two corpses.

                        Or two alive. Or one is alive. What to guess? The one who manages to be saved will be saved.
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        But imagine, they bring you three of these, and also three places, but on one device such a child - a vegetable or a grandmother, who has been writing truancy for three years in the cemetery. Who will save, whom disconnect, whom in the corridor to die on a gurney leave. You are the head of the department. Will you consider yourself a killer?

                        Whoever enters first will be on the machine. To select an already installed device from one patient for the next, more "promising" patient? Come on, I want to see.
                      22. 0
                        17 October 2019 11: 34
                        To select an already installed device from one patient for the next, more "promising" patient?

                        As far as I know, with a high workload of military hospitals, they help first the slightly wounded, then of moderate severity, and to heavy ones when the turn comes. They can’t help everyone, therefore they save those whom they definitely can.
                      23. 0
                        17 October 2019 11: 30
                        First of all, the mother is saved, because she has rights (primarily to life), and the unborn child has no rights.
                      24. +2
                        14 October 2019 14: 54
                        There was a rather sensational case, maybe even you heard about it, father, walked with the child (about two months, in my opinion, age), a brick fell directly from the roof onto the baby’s head. Clinical death, the child was pumped out, but warned - not a tenant. Several clinical deaths, trips to doctors and clinics, a warning about irreversible changes in the brain. The child came out, in the sense, was not allowed to die. Now this creature is in a wheelchair, in the care of parents. Question. Was it worth making such incredible efforts to return the creature from the other world (it’s hard to call him a person)?

                        The real case of life is
                        Construction of a brick multi-storey building. The carpenter left the entrance, sat down, lit a cigarette and took off his helmet! He put it down next to me. A brick falls on his head. Immediate death! But suddenly it would not be instantaneous and it would have been pumped out after a severe traumatic brain injury. And the breadwinner would become an unnecessary "vegetable" for the family!
                        Your suggestion on his future fate - hypothetically?
                      25. +1
                        14 October 2019 17: 51
                        Quote: hohol95
                        And the family's breadwinner would become an unnecessary "vegetable"!
                        Your suggestion on his future fate - hypothetically?

                        you give a hypothetical case. They said immediately about the child that he was not a tenant. Parents are quite capable of conceive new ones. Here the case is such that you cannot make a new breadwinner only if you live on his disability pension. If this happened to me, I would curse those who got me from the next world. When I was traveling to Chechnya, I gave myself the installation - I will not return to the cripple. Here the decision depends on the relatives, and not on the doctor.
                2. +3
                  14 October 2019 09: 41
                  The Spartans didn’t care about the frail infants or the decrepit old people - and where are those Spartans.

                  Alexey, "genetically healthy most brutal Spartans" somehow got the tinsel from homosexual squad from Thebes. And nothing wiped off. laughing this is to the question of right-wrong. drinks Life is too complicated! hi
                  1. +2
                    14 October 2019 12: 50
                    In those days there were no homosexuals, on the contrary, a pure heterosexual was considered flawed in that society. or if you like homosexuals (bisexuals) were all, including the Spartans
                    1. +3
                      14 October 2019 13: 07
                      or if you like homosexuals (bisexuals) were all, including the Spartans

                      that is, each century has its own concept of "normality". hi if under Hitler homosexuals were persecuted, now Germany has come almost to the ideals of ancient Greece. request each century has its own rules .... what no, I do not at all endorse either one or the other extreme! drinks
                  2. +2
                    15 October 2019 08: 12
                    And if you take the criteria of beauty from different tribes or groups of people ....
                    But I am 100% sure that you cannot create combat units like Theban from modern LGBT people. hi
                    1. +4
                      15 October 2019 09: 17
                      that you cannot create combat units like Theban from modern LGBT people!

                      I suggest not checking this topic laughing and MP M. certainly will not allow it! drinks
                      1. +2
                        15 October 2019 09: 28
                        But he would be put at the head of such a formation and sent to guard the Pole of Cold on the northernmost border of our country!
                      2. +4
                        15 October 2019 10: 33
                        But he would be put at the head of such a formation and sent to guard the Pole of Cold on the northernmost border of our country!

                        Nope, Red Lord has more important concerns - rap battles! fellow laughing
                        damn it, and they also say, Emperor Pavel acted unwise that he personally marched with an esponton .... No. well, modern "rulers" have different occupations .. to record rap .. to give out some garbage into the microphone .. macaroons cost the same .. the king-rag pacified .. what what
            2. +7
              14 October 2019 10: 00
              the topic is terrible, but if there is no natural selection, the gene pool will weaken and any species will die out. alas.

              I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring, give birth to those who are not naturally adapted to this.

              Old people take food from the young and strong, but at the same time they themselves do not produce anything! So why feed them and transfer food, medicine and personal time to them?

              Gentlemen, everything is simple. Man and his activities are part of nature, which means medicine is also part of natural selection.
              In addition, you forget one important thing - no one knows what survival criterion is needed in a critical situation. 65 million years ago powerful, beautiful dinosaurs ran, walked and swam around the planet, but when a large asteroid fell, the amount of food consumed by the body became a criterion for survival. As a result, everything became extinct, larger than the dog, and all plants above a meter died.
              Perhaps the emergence of a new microbe, to which only addicts will be resistant. They will survive. Or a change in solar radiation will kill everyone who has no tubercle bacillus in the body. Or a change in the magnetic field will kill everyone, from 160 cm tall and taller and younger than 30 years old.
              SPECIES SURVIVAL Pledge - GENETIC DIVERSITY.
              1. 0
                16 October 2019 01: 36
                Given the current state of medicine in Russia, nothing threatens natural selection, just the same. Only those who survive will not fall ill and do not fall into her paws, therefore only the most healthy and strong will remain, and when she finally bends, natural selection will begin here, in pure form, we all living now will catch him.
                1. 0
                  17 October 2019 19: 10
                  Only those who do not fall ill and fall into her paws will survive, therefore only the most healthy and strong will remain

                  The smallpox virus on the drum how many times you pull yourself, it will mow down both the strong and the weak. The same with appendicitis, cholecystitis, urolithiasis, etc. You evaluate medicine by the single inflated media cases of medical errors, the attitude of doctors to patients and the general gloomy organization of the industry. If you have sat in a queue for 4 hours in a clinic, then the matter is not in medicine, but in the organizers.
                  There will be no vaccinations and surgeons will all die out, both strong and weak.
          2. +2
            14 October 2019 09: 31
            Quote: Pedrodepackes
            previous commentators generally do not call in their comments on the forced destruction of inferior

            Well yes: a call to refusal of medical care in need of her man (baby) with purpose of his death- what's this? belay
            Quote: Pedrodepackes
            painful current generation is the merit of medicine

            it lives longer and more fulfilling (active life) of the "painless" former ones.
            Quote: Pedrodepackes
            it’s generally from another opera, caring for sick, aged and crippled relatives is a sign of a social society and not at all what is being discussed

            What are you: comrade talking about naturalness natural selection.
            And he is in nature always and quickly gets rid of the old and the weak, who are no longer able to get food. No "pensions" are provided by nature.
            1. -4
              14 October 2019 10: 11
              Quote: Olgovich
              What are you: comrade talks about the naturalness of natural selection.
              And he in nature always and quickly gets rid of the old and the weak, no longer able to get food. No "pensions" are provided by nature.

              That's it, that natural, not human factor. A war veteran who has lost his sight, or organs, or the ability to think is one thing. A miscarriage or a stillborn (according to the characteristics of the body, and not due to birth injury) are two different things. My acquaintances, almost 30 years ago, a daughter was born, the mother was preserved from the first month of pregnancy, the threat of 4 miscarriages during pregnancy. The child was born and immediately in intensive care, brought home at 2 months of age. A bunch of congenital diseases, since the age of 25, metabolic disorders have begun against a background of hormonal or genetic malfunction, now they are immense sizes. It’s good that no one else got married and didn’t bring children. Is this good for this baby? Or maybe it was better to give birth after a miscarriage of normal children?
              1. +1
                14 October 2019 10: 53
                Quote: Pedrodepackes
                A war veteran who has lost his sight, or organs, or the ability to think is one thing.

                Is a person born without vision different?
                Quote: Pedrodepackes
                My acquaintances, almost 30 years ago, a daughter was born, the mother was preserved from the first month of pregnancy, the threat of 4 miscarriages during pregnancy. The child was born and immediately in intensive care, brought home at 2 months of age. A bunch of congenital diseases

                Man lives with hope and faith in happiness-so it is arranged.
                Some of my friends had wives in conservation, gave birth after a cesarean, and there were premature babies.
                Now, all the "kids" are 30-35 years old handsome men and beauties and clever girls who have their own wonderful families.

                According to your estimates, all this should not have happened, and women were unlikely to survive.
                Quote: Pedrodepackes
                Now these are vast monasteries.

                You are sick MAN say so! negative
                Quote: Pedrodepackes
                Is this good for this baby? Or maybe it was better to give birth after a miscarriage of normal children?

                People remained PEOPLE.
                1. 0
                  14 October 2019 11: 02
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  Some of my friends had wives in conservation, gave birth after a cesarean, and there were premature babies.
                  Now, all the "kids" are 30-35 years old handsome men and beauties and clever girls who have their own wonderful families.

                  and you know that some diseases are transmitted through a generation, or only transmitted to boys or girls. As the doctors say, there are no healthy people, there are unexplored. God forbid that everything was fine with them, but preservation and Caesarean is already abnormal, and how do you explain the general deterioration in the health of the current generation compared to, even with ours, even with such a progress in medicine?
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  People remained PEOPLE.
                  and in relation to unborn children how?
                  1. +2
                    14 October 2019 11: 58
                    Quote: Pedrodepackes
                    May God grant that everything is fine with them, but preservation and Caesar’s is already abnormal,

                    Everything that keeps a person and makes him happy is normal
                    Quote: Pedrodepackes
                    As the doctors say, there are no healthy people, there are unexplored.

                    All-STERILIZE! Yes Just in case ... So?
                    Quote: Pedrodepackes
                    and in relation to unborn children how?

                    No way: they are NOT!
                    1. -1
                      14 October 2019 12: 05
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      No way: they are NOT!

                      it wouldn’t be like that if it hadn’t informed me.
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      All sterilize! Just in case ... So?

                      Olgovich, well this is not your method, you always operated on facts and arguments, for which I always read you with respect.
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      Everything that keeps a person and makes him happy is normal

                      Yes, what was I leading to, this child, looking at himself in the mirror (apparently from happiness), increasingly asks his mother a question (obscenely is not allowed here) “Why did you give birth to me ?!”, and considering that she has been with parents solve many disputes hand-to-hand, I do not exclude that someday there will be blood. But this is all, apparently, from happiness, right?
                      1. -1
                        15 October 2019 06: 34
                        Quote: Pedrodepackes
                        Yes, what was I leading to, this child, looking at himself in the mirror (apparently from happiness), increasingly asks his mother a question (obscenely is not allowed here) “Why did you give birth to me ?!”, and considering that she has been with parents solve many disputes hand-to-hand, I do not exclude that someday there will be blood. But this is all, apparently, from happiness, right?

                        This is the way humanity works: it lives in the hope of happiness.
                        And rightly so.
              2. 0
                14 October 2019 13: 38
                Quote: Pedrodepackes
                Is this good for this baby? Or maybe it was better to give birth after a miscarriage of normal children?

                "Vegetable" (according to your "genius" expression) Stephen Hawking has brought humanity benefits more than hundreds of such "big guys" like you, who consider the sick as unnecessary ballast and urge to kill them. Pray that neither you nor your family will be affected by the disease. And stop write this nonsense
                1. +1
                  14 October 2019 14: 02
                  Quote: Town Hall
                  "Vegetable" (according to your "genius" expression) Stephen Hawking

                  you would, young man, delve into the topic first, and only then sculpt your pearls
                  Stephen Hawking was born on January 8, 1942. In the early 1960s, Hawking began to show signs of amyotrophic lateral sclerosis.
                  this is, firstly, and secondly, where I wrote it
                  Quote: Town Hall
                  considering patients unnecessary ballast and urging them to kill.

                  you have either a degradation of thinking or
                  Quote: Town Hall
                  stop writing this nonsense
          3. 0
            15 October 2019 07: 20
            Quote: Pedrodepackes
            but the fact remains, the painful current generation is the merit of medicine.

            Sorry, but this is not a fact, this is a mistake .... and not only yours, unfortunately.
            The current disease generation is a merit: their parents, themselves, society.
            A simple example.
            In the days of the USSR, the quality of vaccinations was fundamentally worse, their number was greater (count how many scars you have on your hand - three, two or one .. Further, periodic visits to doctors by children were mandatory, and more frequent than they do now. Further, the quality of medicines is also it was fundamentally worse - technology now provides an order of magnitude cleaner product. Yes, and the side effects of drugs have not been so calculated. Now no one will put grams of aspirin into a one-year-old child a day, and 50 years ago it’s easy.
            Here the quality of the education of doctors and the systematic approach were better. But this is not medicine, it is a public problem of medicine.
            Then. Even 30 years ago, a child, starting from 6 years old to 19, was actively moving - he knew the world directly through his experience and his six receptors. What is now - watch the gadget's eyes (my your pipe staggered). This is the knowledge of the world through an intermediary, the body is not needed here.
            This is a small beginning. Medicine is of course included in this pathological chain, but not as seriously and influentially as you think.
            Theoretically, we can hear ultra and infra sound, even in the visual core of the brain there are a couple of neurons that are sensitive to infrared radiation. Neanderthal’s brain was a hundred grams heavier, we could tolerate zero degrees without clothes for months (now up to + 10 degrees). We could even draw both Vasnetsov and Aivazovsky, write complex music ... - we could do an order of magnitude more complex things from simple things.
            But during the evolution we all lost. We do not need this. - this makes our artificial brain.
            Good luck. hi
        4. +3
          14 October 2019 11: 05
          Quote: Olgovich
          A human animal, but NOT an animal. Therefore, he and MAN.

          Sometimes animals act much more humanely than so-called humans. Take hyena dogs for example. They have a stream of courtship and feeding of crippled and old individuals. Why is it asked to feed "ballast"? So, many people, including some forum users on this discussion platform you should learn mercy from dogs!
          1. +1
            14 October 2019 12: 01
            Quote: Proxima
            Sometimes animals act much more humanely than so-called humans. Take hyena dogs for example. They have a stream of courtship and feeding of crippled and old individuals. Why is it asked to feed "ballast"?

            Surprisingly, truly and atypical.
            Quote: Proxima
            you should learn mercy from dogs!

            This is yes.
            1. +1
              14 October 2019 12: 42
              Quote: Olgovich
              Quote: Proxima
              Sometimes animals act much more humanely than so-called humans. Take hyena dogs for example. They have a stream of courtship and feeding of crippled and old individuals. Why is it asked to feed "ballast"?

              Surprisingly, truly and atypical.

              In fact, the "logic" of Nature is still traced here. Dogs are gregarious animals and through evolution they have developed an instinct for mutual assistance, because the collective survives, and not individual individuals. Hence the instinct for feeding, including mother's milk. We remember Mowgli, the brothers who founded Rome, and so on. hi
      2. +3
        14 October 2019 06: 06
        Two survivors wrote, thanks to even more sophisticated techniques.
      3. +6
        14 October 2019 07: 52
        Quote: Mikhail M
        I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring, give birth to those who are not naturally adapted to this.

        Have you ever taken antibiotics or didn't want to violate the "laws of nature"?
      4. +4
        14 October 2019 10: 45
        Quote: Mikhail M
        Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring

        but I still allow you to disagree. Genetics, although a corrupt girl of imperialism, is moving by leaps and bounds. A generation will pass - another - defects will be fixed. Us, whites, and so with each generation less and less. Women prefer to live on Instagram, ignoring procreation. In this situation, a disabled child who, in the future, due to genetic engineering will leave offspring is still better than nothing at all.
        Moreover, our medicine is not particularly nursing free.
        At the expense of euthanasia is a separate issue. For us, many diagnoses (oncology) are the death sentence. Monstrous amounts for a dubious result. People are slowly and painfully dying.
      5. 0
        14 October 2019 12: 45
        That's right, only you mixed up + and - These, as you call them, non-viable children would undoubtedly die 100 years ago. But now, medicine can enable them to survive! So these kids carry a variety of mutations (before mutations were developed in generations in 1 case by 80 million! Sherpas - for example, a mutation developed 1800 years ago - can live in thin air, where others die. So these in quotes, nonviable children carry mutations in genes - the MOVING FORCE of evolution.Thanks to them, the human species just just enters the development road, no, this is not a dead end, this is the way to the universe!
        Forty years ago, when I read Tsiolkovsky’s works, I treated him condescendingly like a dreamer, and 40 years ago I guessed that He was right 15 times - a person will be able to travel in outer space without a spacesuit in the future. achievements of this quality are already in full view, and these children are a small step in the beginning of the way
        1. +3
          14 October 2019 18: 04
          Quote: karabass
          He’s right 1000 times - a person will be able to travel in outer space in the future without a spacesuit. I don’t know the appearance of him (the future man), but the way to achieve this quality is already in full view.

          So he can now! It is enough to shove, for example, you into outer space without a spacesuit ... And travel to your health! And the fact that it’s not very lively and kind of substandard ... so - it was necessary to train better, in the sense of mutating faster! wassat
          1. +1
            14 October 2019 18: 10
            I love a good joke, laughing heartily
            1. +1
              14 October 2019 20: 41
              You're welcome! hi
    2. +5
      14 October 2019 07: 30
      Quote: Aerodrome
      but if there is no natural selection, the gene pool will weaken and die out

      Do you think that it is NOT a natural extermination of people who differ in behavior from the generally accepted, by natural selection?

      Quote: Michael
      Medicine undermines the gene pool

      Do you think that the intellectual development of mankind is evil and stands for the return of us to the Stone Age? Do you think that God (nature) is pleased with bipedal biological creatures grazing in herds on plains covered with lush grass? In my opinion you do not agree with God in terms of the one to whom he gave the mind, such as a mistake?

      Quote: Michael
      Animal man

      Man differs from the animal by the presence of reason. Do not put us on all fours.

      I join the question Olgovich (Andrey).
    3. +2
      14 October 2019 07: 31
      Quote: Aerodrome
      the topic is terrible, but if there is no natural selection, the gene pool will weaken and any species will die out. alas.

      Most of the scientists and people who made a significant contribution to the development of civilization were sick, and some seriously ill .. thanks to medicine they were able to create .. so it's not so simple ..
    4. +2
      14 October 2019 12: 33
      If strong healthy people stare en masse at TV sets, smartphones and ignore normal communication and a healthy lifestyle, then at that pace Sparta will be bent with her approach to selection. Because by the age of 35, a person in this mode presents a miserable sight, both physically and spiritually and mentally.
    5. 0
      23 October 2019 15: 32
      That's right, destroy all the weak, but it seems to me that you are a weak airfield and should not spoil the country's gene pool. How to kill you, tear a Bosko or just break your neck?
  2. +7
    14 October 2019 05: 34
    Blessed Clemens August Count von Galen, who, through his sermons, drew public attention to the cannibalistic practice of destroying inferior Germans, was not at all opposed to transferring the T4 program to the eastern territories. At least, simple burghers did not hear any sermons from him about pity for the unfortunate in Poland and the USSR.
    Thanks, author. Excerpts were similar materials, but in such detail enough I viu for the first time. Thank you once again for reminding me, this should not be forgotten and forgiven.
  3. +3
    14 October 2019 06: 06
    . However, with the rampant violence against civilians in the ranks of the SS, especially “merciful” killers appeared, who were depressed by the actions. In the end, they mental disorders sent to the rear, where after the examination they were killed.

    Much more psychopathic were those in the SS who did not go crazy ....
  4. +4
    14 October 2019 08: 24
    To feel sorry and look after, or to kill terminally ill for humane reasons? Think this is yesterday? Look at modern Europe. Euthanasia is like humanity! Can be called home for euthanasia. They discussed (and it seems they have already passed the law) on the voluntary euthanasia of juvenile patients with incurable diseases or depression. Therefore, talking about the events in the article as the past tense is not worth it. History develops in a spiral! And what is humanity in translantology? Organ trading! Is it evil or good? Or just a business? Or the triumph of financial superiority?
    1. -2
      14 October 2019 08: 34
      Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
      To feel sorry and look after, or to kill terminally ill for humane reasons?

      condemn?
      Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
      And what is humanity in translantology? Organ trading!

      and condemn this? But this is for the sake of saving people. Or ask a question
      Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
      Is it evil or good?

      and where is that line separating evil from good?
      1. +2
        14 October 2019 08: 55
        But all these issues are interesting to discuss. Especially living in a modern capitalist society sharpened on efficiency. To be effective or humane? If you are effective, then you need to get rid of the sick, old, alcohol and drug addicts. To be humane means to support the weak, treat the sick (free), treat alcohol and drug addicts. Judging by modern politics, we strive to be effective. There are no infirmities to support money, there are no patients to heal money (go get paid), alcohol and drug addicts will die themselves and there is no need to spend money on them to return to society.
        1. 0
          14 October 2019 09: 01
          Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
          Judging by modern politics, we strive to be effective. There are no infirmities to support money, no patients to heal money (go get paid), alcoholics and drug addicts will die on their own and there is no need to spend money on them to return to society.

          Well, firstly, and now they are treating, and contain, and return, at least, try to return.
          Quote: SOVIET UNION 2
          To be humane means to support the weak, treat the sick (free), treat alcohol and drug addicts. Judging by modern politics,
          hinting that in the "early times" everything was like honey and sugar?
          1. +4
            14 October 2019 09: 15
            Quote: Pedrodepackes
            Well, firstly, and now they are treating, and contain, and return, at least, try to return.

            They do not cure, but cripple. My mother was blinded, she was cured ...
            1. +1
              14 October 2019 09: 19
              Quote: Mordvin 3
              My mother was blinded, she was cured ...

              But for me, on the contrary, they saved my mother from blindness, developed against the background of diabetes mellitus. In Soviet times, too, not all the efforts of doctors ended in success. "One is cured, the other is crippled" - a saying from those times.
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                    1. +3
                      14 October 2019 09: 34

                      Here, damn it, a short comment ...
                      1. +1
                        14 October 2019 10: 17
                        Quote: Mordvin 3
                        Here, damn it, a short comment.

                        Wow, "short" - for almost 8 minutes a man talks about his extinction: 10 times about the fact that he is "not interested in anything", and 20 times about the fact that he is already "tired of everything."

                        It is understandable: foolishly took an overwhelming loan in his old age, and a mortgage that he cannot pay. But at the same time, for some reason, the President must .... cover his own stupidity ... belay request
                    2. 0
                      14 October 2019 09: 38
                      Thank! This video made my day! good
          2. +4
            14 October 2019 17: 42
            While being treated almost for free. But free treatment is socialism. Our president and prime minister have already expressed their attitude to socialism. Therefore, paid medicine is not nearly more humane than Nazi ideology. The presence or absence of money is also a selection. And our country has already joined this selection. Or are you hinting that we are moving in a time where everything will be honey and sugar? The ideas of class superiority are no better than the ideas of racial superiority. At the heart of these ideas is the idea of ​​the superiority of some over others. About voluntary euthanasia is not necessary. This is Overton's Window. People are smoothly led to the need to be effective. Work hard and die quickly if you can’t work anymore. Judging by the comments, Overton's windows are working successfully.
  5. +4
    14 October 2019 08: 39
    The current pension reform is also somewhat reminiscent of getting rid of extra people. Either because of unemployment, because it is extremely difficult to get a job at the retirement age, especially in small towns, or because of health problems, because not many will be able to work hard before the age of 65, well, except for our clown artists and deputies
  6. +4
    14 October 2019 08: 50
    According to some comments on this article, my opinion is born - a global war or catastrophe is required!
    To get rid of all frail and weak! And only the most healthy, tenacious and unprincipled will remain!
    And they will live long or not so ...
    But in the end it will be just like in the movie "Highlander" - "IN THE END, ONLY ONE WILL STAY" !!!
  7. +9
    14 October 2019 09: 34
    To all supporters of cleaning, stripping and strengthening the health of the nation through the killing of the inferior, I quote part of one of the documents.
    Forensic medical examination of corpses

    April 1943, 15, by us doctors of the city of Yeisk, forensic experts - the captain of the medical service, doctor I. KERIMOV, surgeon A. GENKINA and therapist MAKARENKO N.A. in the presence of witnesses from the city of Yeysk Egorova P.A., Sidorenko V.A., Kinchev P.P. of this number, a physical examination was performed, without opening, 214 corpses of ex-children. pupils of the Yeisk orphanage KraySO.

    Inspection was carried out at the excavation site of the grave pit located in the eastern part of the city, near the road going to the Simonovka farm 1500 meters from the profile going to the Shirochansky farm.

    Circumstances of the case: 
    According to the testimony, as well as familiarization with the written material about the death of the aforementioned children, it was found out that the children were seized by the Germans on 9 / X and 10 / X-1942 and taken away in large hermetically sealed cars with a metal body of 1,5 m. heights - type deskamera.

    The Germans threw up to 80 children into one car, the cars taking the children away, went very quickly.

    INSPECTION: 
    When excavating a 4 x 3 grave, the depth is 2 m. We found 214 children's corpses, boys and girls, aged 4 to 7 years old (roughly lying randomly on top of each other), most of them clasped by hands. Some had sticks and crutches in their hands. Children are wearing rotten clothes ...

    Who wants to let him read about the Yeisk orphanage.

    My childhood friend had an accident. It seems to have gotten over, but then complications went on, he was in a coma for the second year. Doctors said it was useless. Retired parents took him home. Courted. Who dares to tell them, you already put him to sleep like a dog.
    As long as we are people, we must be them in grief.
    1. +3
      14 October 2019 10: 21
      Quote: Moskovit
      As long as we are people, we must be them in grief.

      I agree. And that is why we are PEOPLE.
  8. BAI
    +1
    14 October 2019 10: 26
    It's all about financing, which the Germans directly said:
    mentally ill are superfluous "ballast" for a society

    There are American calculations (no one has refuted them either), that to inflict maximum damage the enemy does not need to kill his soldiers. It is necessary to cripple them, making lifelong disabled people, so that they live as long as possible. Because Serving one disabled person requires 3 healthy people who are removed from the economy.
    Thus, since patients harm the economy, but it is not humane to kill them, medicine must solve 2 problems:
    1. Prevent the birth of indistinguishable patients (that is, track their appearance at an early stage, when abortion is not a murder, but a medical procedure, not even an operation).
    2. All the same, medicine must learn to cure "incurable" (at least now) diseases.
  9. +4
    14 October 2019 10: 34
    Quote: Olgovich
    get rid of inferior

    Do not distort.

    Currently, natural selection in the human population consists only in blocking reproductive function in people with genetic diseases, and not in killing them.

    Artificially born children who do not have genetic diseases, and older people who have left reproductive age, by definition, by no means belong to natural selection.

    Another thing is that the fashion for surrogate motherhood using the genetic material of older people (such as Pugacheva) with a high degree of probability leads to the birth of children with genetic diseases, which then themselves fall under natural selection, but this is the choice of their parents.

    As a first step towards natural selection, it has long been proposed to conduct continuous genetic testing of citizens of the country and the creation of a national database so that couples, even before conception, independently decide on the birth / non-birth of children with genetic diseases or use a bank of frozen genetic materials from healthy donors.
    1. +1
      14 October 2019 11: 18
      Quote: Operator
      Do not distort.

      Currently, natural selection in the human population is only in blocking reproductive function in humans with genetic diseases, not killing them.

      1. Do not distort: ​​a comrade spoke of the refusal of medical care to a sick person (infant) with a goal. his death (the so-called natures selection)

      2. With what a fright someone for a person will make decisions about his ... sterilization ?!
      Giving birth, not giving birth is his ESSENTIAL RIGHT.
      Quote: Operator
      As a first step to natural selection, it has long been proposed to conduct continuous genetic testing of citizens of the country and create a national database so that couples even before conception independently decide on the birth / unborn of children with genetic diseases

      Yes, but it is already available today, if desired and possible.
      Quote: Operator
      older people emerging from reproductive age, by definition, do not belong to natural selection by any means.

      Natural selection does not imply the life of creatures who are unable to earn their own food: a worm given to an old bird is taken from the chick, which reduces its chances of survival ..
  10. +2
    14 October 2019 11: 05
    The 4 points raised a complex question. The answer to which, an unequivocal answer, is already a crime against conscience. Who faced the choice will understand. Who has never encountered will not be able to understand. In a humane person, any choices made will be wrong. Regrets and self-flagellation will haunt for years.
  11. +5
    14 October 2019 11: 24
    Quote: Olgovich
    Giving birth, not giving birth is his ESSENTIAL RIGHT

    Well, let the obligation to support and treat your genetically ill child at your own expense be attached to the law - like we warned you in the form of a genetic decoding of your heredity and heredity of your wife. Those. Do not extend health insurance to such cases.

    Natural selection according to Darwin does not imply the continuation of offspring from individuals with genetic diseases.
    1. 0
      14 October 2019 11: 44
      Or, at the expense of medical insurance, provide the right to choose IVF from "pure" genetic material. Plus, due to medical insurance, the psychological adaptation of the parents to the idea that the child is not really theirs. Although there is a question of responsibility to a child who is "forced" to live with handicapped parents and thus doom to greater difficulties in comparison with other children, both growing up and "examining" handicapped parents.
      1. +9
        14 October 2019 12: 53
        As for your version of responsibility to the child, I do not agree: my distant relative had a only son in the family who had been diagnosed with schizophrenia by the age of 16, and before that he was a normal teenager - it becomes terrible if you figure out a similar situation (in 16 years, find out that ahead of a quick disintegration of personality).

        The culprit was the mother in whom men in the family were born with this disease, but she did not warn her husband in the hope that a girl would be born. This situation was easily avoided without any genetic expertise when showing responsibility on the part of the mother and using a donor egg.
        1. +1
          14 October 2019 13: 03
          In the situation you submitted, I agree. But imagine if one parent has a strong genetic defect. For example, Huntington's syndrome. Which manifests itself at an older age. Ginseng gives birth to a child from a donor cell, brings up, and at the age of a child, say 13 years old, the mother’s disease begins to progress. As a result, the teenager will have to live next to her beloved but very sick mother. And the external manifestations of Huntington are good for relatives. The prediction of how many mental wounds will be experienced by a teenager who has survived the long, painful and successful death of a loved one. Is it possible to take responsibility for such youth?
          1. +9
            14 October 2019 13: 17
            In the event of a mother’s illness, her parents will be to blame (after the introduction of a continuous genetic examination of the population, of course). But even in this situation, it is possible to place the mother in a medical institution in order to minimize the psychological damage to her children.

            In the case described by me of the beginning of the disintegration of the personality at a conscious age in the child himself, it will be impossible to isolate himself from himself.
            1. +2
              14 October 2019 13: 26
              Sick children are terrible. But healthy children who see sick loved ones and suffer from this is also terrible. Very slippery and many-sided question. It is unlikely that it will be possible to come to a consensus. Depending on the situation, sometimes opinions change dramatically.
  12. +4
    14 October 2019 13: 28
    Quote: Michael m
    I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring, give birth to those who are not naturally adapted to this. We have to develop even more sophisticated methods to survive an even more unviable generation. The road leading to the impasse of the destruction of humanity as a species.

    In the wild it is, the weak and the sick are eaten first. You just need to understand that man has evolved in society and nursing the weak and old has been going on for millennia, and nothing: it turned out the way it is. In addition, congenital deformity or disability does not affect future offspring, this is a one-time deviation, in the vast majority of cases, genes are not violated.
    1. 0
      14 October 2019 19: 56
      Patients should be treated, help the weak, try to nursing premature babies. Since it is not known what will come of it. From a full-term one, a moral and a criminal can turn out, and from a pre-term one, a person who has abilities, intelligence, intelligence, despite low growth.
      But what about those who drink, gobble up and get fat? Or other bad habits? It turns out that they also need this then ..... After all, then, due to the harm done to themselves by health, they will be given disability ..... There are a lot of such cases. Or they cannot be treated if they themselves are to blame for their illnesses .....
      For a long time there was once a transmission about euthanasia. A young guy, Russian, says why a child should be tormented if he suddenly falls ill .... This is the approach of some.
    2. -1
      14 October 2019 20: 47
      About nursing non-viable for millennia you are fundamentally wrong. A hundred years. From strength 120. All that was previously pure Darwinism in its purest form. Strong gives offspring, weak only with luck.
  13. +7
    14 October 2019 21: 25
    The idea of ​​genetic cleaning is tenacious, which means there is a need for it. Yes
    It remains only to determine the criteria by which this cleaning is carried out. It seems to me that the first and almost the only such criterion should be the very attitude to such an idea.
    The fact is that people who support this idea, for some unknown reason, believe that either they themselves will determine who lives and who should not, or, at worst, this will not affect them - they have, of course , everything is fine. No guys not alright. You have a certain complex of pathologies that allows you to consider yourself in the right to determine whether someone lives or not. And it is precisely with this complex, as it seems to me, that it is necessary to fight in the first place.
    So let's do this: first of all, when deciding who should continue to exist, and who will not, we will look at the attitude of a person to this problem as a whole, and the first candidates for destruction will be precisely the supporters of murder for reasons of expediency. It will take some time and again the people will ask - should we continue? If people say "it is necessary" - we will continue according to the same criteria. He will say “no” - well, “the voice of the people is the voice of God,” and therefore no.
    This is how it is. request
    1. +5
      14 October 2019 21: 46
      Those who support this idea, for some unknown reason, believe that either they themselves will determine who lives and who should not, or, at worst, this will not affect them


      7: 1. Judge not lest ye be judged,
      7: 2. for by what court you judge, you will be so judged

      If we undertake to judge others, we should expect that we will be judged by the same court.
  14. +4
    15 October 2019 03: 57
    An article about terrible, but the comments are even worse. The Germans then needed resources, so they destroyed the "inferior", and understanding this in a peculiar way. Now the question is not so in Europe, it (the question) is being resolved - disabled people have become a significant source of income. We are so far away, yet. However, my observation is that at the beginning of the 60s there was one boarding school for children with mental disabilities in two huge districts of the city (approximately 450 thousand population), there were 200 children studying there. Over the next three decades, the number of similar establishments has increased significantly. In ordinary schools in the 2000s, classes were already organized for such children. Moreover, in the USSR, jobs were organized for them, now there are almost no such jobs.
  15. +1
    15 October 2019 07: 02
    Quote: Michael m
    I agree completely. Medicine undermines the gene pool by nursing non-viable infants giving even more non-viable offspring, give birth to those who are not naturally adapted to this. We have to develop even more sophisticated methods to survive an even more unviable generation. The road leading to the impasse of the destruction of humanity as a species.

    Explain then why the same 'asocial elements' often have Normal children, while the 'elite' (professors, scientists, 'successful entrepreneurs' and the like) are degenerates with congenital defects ??
    I myself know a neighbor's family that they have been drinking since high school, but four children have grown up, have learned, two are studying in a higher education institution, they are successful, and they do not show any signs of 'nonviability', although the Reich 'scientists' would probably have identified them in the oven, 100%.
    But the rich and allergies have different newfangled people about whom my city is born and they never heard, and heart defects, problems with blood, and the psyche killed (although, it would seem, parents give them the best and cherish and cherish).

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