In China, pointed to the "vulnerable zones" T-90MS for armor-piercing shells of the Type 99A tank

On the Chinese TV channel CCTV a report on the state of affairs in tank troops of the PLA. In particular, the issue of the firepower of the newest Chinese Type 99A tanks was raised. The material contains an interview with the commander of one of the tank units of the Pingjiang Armored Corps. It is noted that the Chinese military has never officially reported the performance characteristics of armor-piercing shells for the aforementioned tanks.

According to the Chinese officer, the projectile departure speed is up to 1800 m / s. This allows him to penetrate the “homogenized” armor with a thickness of 680 mm from a distance of 2 km.

This statement fits in with the words of the general designer of the enterprise, where Mao Ming Type 99A tanks are being created in China. He previously stated that when fired from 2 km with an armor-piercing shell, armor up to 680 mm can break through. In the Chinese media, it is noted that the military confirmed this kind of characteristics after performing numerous practical firing.

In the Chinese edition of SINA, commenting on the statements of officials, they say that today armor-piercing shells for Type 99A "are one of the most penetrating in the world." In particular, a comparison is made with the British L26A1 for Challengers. This is a depleted uranium core shell. At the same time, Chinese reporters note that L26A1 is being discontinued.

From the material:

When the British fired, a uranium-core projectile pierced uniform armor in 625 mm from a distance of 2 km in 90% of cases. Similar parameters are shown for L28.

Also, the Chinese shell is compared with the German DM63 from Rheinmetall. It is added that it is necessary to increase the "survivability" of the barrels of tank guns to 1,5 thousand shots.

From the article:

If our armor-piercing shells are capable of penetrating armor in 680 mm, can this pose a threat to foreign tanks? The answer is yes. Shells capable of piercing including composite armor

The question of the possibility of defeat and Russian tanks T-90MS is considered. It is noted that the Russian tank “has vulnerable areas, including the lower part of the hull and side protection elements - in the area of ​​the caterpillars. They also talk about the considerable probability of overcoming the “Relict” dynamic defense - “thanks to the high-speed parameters of the projectile”.

Chinese version of "where to shoot"

From the commentary in SINA:

The surveillance system from the driver’s position also does not have an impressive uniform reservation due to general design limitations. It is easy to find these weak points for delivering point strikes.

Comments

[Azazelo]

It looks like the Chinese "experts" have brought denyuzhek to yapping at Russian military equipment and inventing fables about their own.
You lost the tank biathlon and not t90, but t72. Accept reconcile.

[Civil]

T-90MS. It is noted that the Russian tank “has vulnerable areas, including the lower part of the hull and side protection elements - in the area of ​​the caterpillars. We also talk about the considerable probability of overcoming the “Relict” dynamic defense - “thanks to the high-speed parameters of the projectile

How is it possible, we have a strategic partnership!

[Lopatov]

Quote: Civil

How is it possible, we have a strategic partnership!

China has no strategic partnership with India, quite the opposite ...
It is more likely that the Chinese may ask us why, despite the "strategic partnership", we are going to sell half a thousand T-90MS to India ...

[Cartalon]

But India has no habit of illegally copying equipment and there are no territorial claims against Russia either.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Cartalon

and there are no territorial claims against Russia either.

The People's Republic of China also does not.
There is the Republic of China. Whose cards are some propagandists giving out as PRC cards

Quote: Cartalon

But India has no habit of illegally copying technology

Well, yes, she does it legally. Rather, trying. After all, technology transfer is an invariable part of any Indian arms purchase deal.

But is this all an excuse for the fact that we are selling weapons and military equipment to the opponents of our "strategic partners"? Does money smell or doesn't smell?

[Cartalon]

Doesn’t smell at all then and I wonder what this partnership is all about? Well, except for the theft of technology, the export of raw materials and the import of consumer goods.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Cartalon

Doesn't smell at all

Actually, it smells like we are losing both markets.

Nobody just likes that.
By the way, here on the site I very often read indignant statements about those who "are trying to sit on two chairs" 8))) For example, Belarus.

[ROSS_51]

How is it possible, we have a strategic partnership!

"Allies are two enemies who have a common enemy" (c) Chinese saying.
After the liberation of China from Japanese occupation and the signing of a 30-year peace treaty of friendship with the USSR, the Chinese had 24 years to open fire on Soviet troops in Damansky.
Do not forget what China is.
If suddenly in the trade war between the USA and China, Russia-China will suddenly become a bargaining chip, all partnership will instantly merge and we will transfer the army to the East and drive new flight missions into Topol ..

[Starover_Z]

According to the Chinese officer, the projectile departure speed is up to 1800 m / s. This allows him to penetrate the “homogenized” armor with a thickness of 680 mm from a distance of 2 km.

Chinese version of "where to shoot"

And the tankers on the T-90 will stand still and turn for a convenient hit? And what, with an ordinary shell, is there a chance to get from the 2-x km to the indicated areas under the tower in a moving tank?
Optimists are Chinese however!

[Romario_Argo]

to get into the gap under the tower is not realistic, there is inclined armor from the composite package 360-mm (equivalent to 1420-mm) of the tower
the chance to get into the 5-cm gap under the T-90 turret at a right angle and penetrate 2000-mm armor - with a projectile with a penetration of 680-mm is equal to 0, even without accident
the clearance armor under the tower at an angle has a length of 60-cm 2 walls + package length 36-cm. = 960 mm
1 chance of 1 million, if the BOPS came up at an angle of 4 degrees to the edge of the tower shoulder joint, it still falls into the part of the composite with the equivalent of 600-mm and the inner wall of the tower’s shoulderboard in 100-mm = 700-mm - and here is 1 chance on 2 million shots that the BOPS will fall at an angle of 3,3 degrees closer to the junction to realize the penetration of exactly 680-mm.
it’s not realistic to pierce the T-90 into the board; the anti-cumulative screens are now replaced by DZ = 400-mm + the 80-mm board has a ceramic insert 110-mm equivalent to 440-mm = 920-mm at right angles
breaking through the NLD is not possible due to the tactics of using the technique, especially when the T-90 is in the caponier, or when the rhombus is at an angle, again partially covering the NLD with relief

[Serg koma]

Quote: Romario_Argo

NLD penetration is not possible

Hit / Punch lower frontal part really - provided that the tank is on a pedestal. If the object is in motion, plus the folds of the terrain, you cannot target from a kilometer, but you simply cannot see the NDL. Only a static target at the range for armor penetration will "fit" (without remote sensing) for the characteristics of the Type 99A gun declared by the PLA.

[missuris]

where in the pursuit of the tower 2000mm armor?
for a distance of 2 km, the bops flies a little more than 1 second, and 20 centimeters will fall.
Will the dz have time to react to 1700-1600 m / s?

[Romario_Argo]

silicon carbide is equivalent to 4, and boron carbide is equivalent to 8 i.e. 300 mm x 8 = 2400 mm armor
by the way, about welds
T-90 tower is welded. sheets of the overhead of the tower are grit to the outer edge, just sheets up to ~ 30 cm thick are welded at large angles with filling the weld with steel with greater fluidity. this is done due to the large thickness and also to deflect the BOPS higher to the composite package, and when directly hit the tower, and the tower is normal - we get a double approach angle, which simply breaks the BOPS

[Govorun]

Chinese tankers perfectly mastered the game World of Tanks and now they know all the vulnerabilities of tanks))))

[Incvizitor]

Lateral projection at a wide angle is also hardly possible to penetrate, but here, well, 60 degrees, it’s almost sideways ...

[venik]

Quote: Azazelo

It looks like the Chinese "experts" have brought denyuzhek to yapping at Russian military equipment and inventing fables about their own.

=========
But you do not worry, the fact that the Chinese media are increasingly comparing YOUR technique ... not with American, European, but exactly with RUSSIAN?
I'm worried about!
Yes TODAY we are "partners" .... AND TOMORROW (in 10-20 years) ??? WHAT are we going to be?
In politics - there are NO "friends" !!!! There are temporary TRAVELERS! ......
And it is - TENSION! (Well, at least there is Nuclear Potential!) ..... But the growth of the economy and technological potential of the country, which is already painting Siberia in the school maps of China in the colors of China .... This is alarming!

[NEXUS]

Quote: Azazelo

You lost the tank biathlon and not t90, but t72. Accept reconcile.

They lost it. There is no doubt. But ... any tank in the world has weakly protected places. I repeat, ANYONE. And by the way, what they noted is to apply to any tank in the world.
But even mattresses admit that the T-90 is the most protected and tenacious tank in the world. Our tanks are created first of all
for war, not for parades.

[TermNachTer]

Any tank has vulnerabilities, but they still need to be hit. It's one thing when you shoot at the firing range and quite another when they shoot at you. Regarding "Relic" - did anyone try it or is it theoretical calculations?

[Evil543]

Maybe in response to their tank in general the whole red paint over?

[Potato]

And what are the Chinese wrong about? Their tanks have the same weaknesses, if that. And, by the way, the sides of the tower of the Chinese tank look bulky and probably weaker than the sides of the t90 tower.

[Uncle lee]

Quote: Evil543

paint over the whole red?

Dobrynya, sprinkle it with chalk, I’m leaving it with a mace!

[Potato]

Well, then, all modern OBTs have weaknesses. The side armor of the hull of even the heaviest outfits is most often a steel armor plate up to 70 ... 80 mm thick. Let the screens, but even the old t55 armor-piercing projectile easily break through this obstacle.

But the t90ms gun mask has ceased to be a weak point, and it pleases)

[Rwmos]

Exactly. In response, I can rightfully say: "The weak point of the Chinese soldier is the head."
And I’m not lying! Well, don’t protect her, one dog. But it sounds completely different!

[Serg koma]

Quote: Potato

the most often represents a steel armor plate with a thickness of up to 70 ... 80 mm.

Quote: Romario_Argo

it’s not realistic to pierce the T-90 into the board; the anti-cumulative screens are now replaced by DZ = 400-mm + the 80-mm board has a ceramic insert 110-mm equivalent to 440-mm = 920-mm at right angles

[rehev931]

Any tank has weakened zones of armor protection, because the tank is not a full parallelepiped made of armored steel. Side, aft, lower, upper projections, observation and guidance devices. The task of developers is precisely reduced to minimizing the likelihood of damage to these areas

[novel66]

1800 m / s - here it is, hypersound something!

[aszzz888]

novel66 (novel) Today, 08: 43 NEW
0
1800 m \ s - here it is, hypersound!

..and we are not far away. But the Chinese armor penetration is something too high, it seems to me

Characteristics of 125 mm shots

3VBM17 ZVBK16 ZVOF36 ZUBK20
Shot mass, kg 20,4 29 33 24,3
Projectile weight, kg 7,1 19 23 17,2
Mass of explosives, kg - 1,76 3,4 -
Materials:
core Tungsten alloy - - -
obturator band Polyamide Copper Copper Copper
Projectile initial velocity, m / s 1715 (905) 850 400
Armor penetration of homogeneous armor at a distance of 2000 m at an angle of 60° from the normal, mm 250 260 - 350 behind DZ
Operating temperature range, °С -40...+50 -40...+50 -40...+50 -40...+50

[novel66]

Yes, and our gun, go?

[Mavrikiy]

Everything is ours there, but in the Chinese version, including the brains of the tanker.

[missuris]

depends on the length of the scrap 72, 80 and 90 in the carousel there is no place for long crowbars. in modern bops, the length reaches 1 meter.

those. the problem is only in the old automatic loader and in stocks of 72 and 80.

in theory, already 90 should have been higher and wider so that the new machine was larger.

or a new automatic loader as on 14

[Albert1988]

Quote: missuris

in theory, already 90 should have been higher and wider so that the new machine was larger.

Wider is not necessary, higher, too, for:

Quote: missuris

new automatic loader as on 14

[Esaul]

If the Chinese tanks are of the same quality as the rest of the Chinese products, then their tank will either break down, or it can be punched with a kick from the foot

[Evil543]

Climb the kids up and that’s all, kapets to the tank

[L-39NG]

In this question, I would try to be more delicate. One side is when China litters the whole world with its cheap goods and the other side when they make spaceships for themselves and send robots to the moon. Let the technologies "copied" or bought be the main result, but the Chinese have the results.

[SERGEY SERGEEVICS]

Tank biathlon, other statistics showed that not everything is so smooth with their tanks. After the fight, they no longer wave their fists.

[Mavrikiy]

In China, pointed to the "vulnerable zones" T-90MS for armor-piercing shells of the Type 99A tank

1. "They see a speck in someone else's eye, they don't notice a log in their own"
2. Are you going to fight in dreams? Oh well. Go king of the monkeys.

[Egor 11]

The Beijing regional committee is usually cunning and insinuating.
Therefore a really strange statement.
May mean -
T-90 is the best tank in Eurasia, and we easily ...

[Chaldon48]

There are no vulnerable combat vehicles; there is a powerful shell for every defense trick. The most important defense is the head of the tank commander, driver agility, firepower maneuverability, speed and only then armor.

[Pavel57]

Rather, an article to support Pakistanis.

[svp67]

Yes ... this unknown "Chinese tank commander" revealed to the whole world the "open secret". There are no non-vulnerable tanks, so yes, the shells of the Chinese Type-99A are capable of hitting our T-90MS, but the other thing is equally true that their Type-99A has weak points that our T-90MS is also capable of hitting.

[Yrec]

The areas marked in red are vulnerable to ANY tank. But, it is impossible to get into the NLD from 2 kilometers only if the tank, while meeting the projectile, does not run into an obstacle and does not lift its nose. Otherwise, no. Getting into the turret zone is a matter of chance. The lateral projection of the tank is generally not designed to protect against BPS. Actually, it can be pierced with an ordinary blank from a tank gun. In general, even when shooting from an ambush (that is, from a place, having the ability to accurately aim) from a distance of 2 km, just getting a projectile at a moving tank is very good. Healing vulnerable areas in the frontal projection from such a distance is pointless.

[carstorm 11]

Yes, it's generally some sort of darkness. red color for traditional weak zones for all tanks is brilliant. explain how the LMS works laziness. for the concept of hitting an object, just look at the video of which a bunch of shells hit the profile target.

[Stalllker]

The guys also play WoT)))

[Shuttle]

Inspired by ...

Three heroes are riding, and towards them - three Musketeers and d'Artagnan. Gascon quickly jumps off the horse and invites Ilya Muromets to dismount.
- Alyosha, what is he?
- He wants to fight on foot ...
Ilya climbs down to the ground. D'Artagnan approaches him and draws a cross on the hero's chest with chalk, opposite the heart. Then he pulls out his sword and takes a terribly effective pose.
- Alyosha, what is he?
- Yes, in this place he is going to stick his saber to you ...
- Aaaaaaa! Well, okay ... Sprinkle it with chalk and give me my club ...

[_Ugene_]

It is noted that the Russian tank “has vulnerable areas, including the lower part of the hull and side protection elements - in the area of ​​the caterpillars.

Looks like they outplayed WOT. As for the NBL - try to get into it in a real battle, the probability is very small, and as for the airborne jokes in general - which tank keeps the bops on board? no

[mister-red]

Isn’t it their tank’s biathlon a couple of years ago, the caterpillar flew off from behind a finger shell, and this year it’s a skating rink at all?

[abc77777]

Good day to all. At the beginning of the 90, one familiar tanker told how his comrade died in the Caucasus. Well, this is when the Armenians fought with the Azerbaijanis. The guy was sitting behind the gunner. They rolled out around the corner right on BMP2. And they got a long line in the forehead. The whole crew was shell-shocked, and the gunner's flown sight blew his head. Farther. As an artillery officer, I’ll say, any hit of a projectile in a tank and that’s all, a hike to the tank and the crew. And about the lateral or rear projection we will be silent. As such, the armor is not there. And this is not only T90, these are all tanks. Remember the Turkish Leopards. The Kurds mostly hit on the left side. Where is the extra ammunition.

[ROSS_51]

Quote: abc77777

And they got a long line in the forehead. The whole crew was shell-shocked, and the gunner's flown sight blew his head. Farther. As an artillery officer, I’ll say, any hit of a projectile in a tank and that’s all, a hike to the tank and crew.

Crew shell-shocked with 30 mm shells?
Farther. As an artillery officer, please tell me why then all sorts of BOPs are invented and improved, if there are such beautiful land mines?

[Kerensky]

Bad thing, experts shredded. Does this device have an armor effect? Or just knows how to stick into a homogenous from two kilometers, but normal ....

[Evil echo]

If our armor-piercing shells are capable of penetrating armor in 680 mm, can this pose a threat to foreign tanks? The answer is yes. Shells capable of piercing including composite armor

And if it rains? Or God forbid fog?

[sir_obs]

And if it rains? Or God forbid fog?

A Chinese anti-tank platoon enters the battle - 800 man with wrenches and screwdrivers.

[Karabas]

It is added that it is necessary to increase the "survivability" of the barrels of tank guns to 1,5 thousand shots.

Chinas in the tank in the trench will hide and will stream and stream, stream and stream ... until he reorganizes everyone

[Alexey-74]

In general, the Chinese suffered .... if you compare when they started modernization and how quickly they became "leading experts" in the field of military development ....

[ZVS]

And the Chinese are going to fight with Russia ?! This is a hello to Putin from his friends. If the issue is such that the yellow-faced are already considering the possibility of defeating Russian military equipment, then it is necessary to close the border and prohibit the import of Chinese products poisoning the Russian population.

[sir_obs]

yellow-faced are already considering the possibility of defeating Russian military equipment

t-90 are in the arsenal of India, which has long been at odds with the Chinese, but Putin still hello, but how about it.

[bukhach]

Even with Vietnam graters, there is also the t-90. And, yes, hello to Putin.

[d4rkmesa]

Sina is Chinese Yandex Zen, how can I quote them? Yes, here in the comments are better understood than there.

[seacap]

The question is completely different, at a distance of 2000 m the problem is to get at least into the silhouette of a target moving over rough terrain, and even in the conditions of a battlefield and active opposition. Moreover, "prokhorovka" is not envisaged in the concept of modern combat, tanks do not fight with tanks, this is an exception, and everything else is ordinary marketing.

[voyaka uh]

"at a distance of 2000 m the problem is to hit at least a silhouette
target moving over rough terrain "///
----
Since 2000 - no problem. This is a standard close range.
All day optics are optimized for 2 km. Everyone is training on it.
From 3000-35000 m special skill is already required.

[seacap]

Judging by the results of the shooting of the average Tr (tvvz) at its target range at fixed targets and moving in a straight line and at a constant speed, it is still not so simple. And now to impose enemy fire on it, limited visibility and maneuver a high-speed small-sized target using terrain, shelters, etc., it becomes a problem to even detect it in a timely manner. Yes, and it makes no sense to discuss this article, because. any given vehicle is affected in these areas, as it has been since the appearance of tanks.

[Incvizitor]

It’s just some kind of captain evidence, the Chinese tank also makes its way into the lower part of the frontal projection, under the tower and in the sides, and any tank, including their type, they would also show the back.
In general, I wonder why no one hangs on this lower part of the DZ or does not pile up additional armor?

[Dzafdet]

It would be interesting to fire type 99 from a twin RPG-7. And see what happens to him ...

[voyaka uh]

They did not say anything new.
The classic vulnerability of all Soviet and Russian tanks is the hatch
driver mechanic. It is located strictly in the center of the "target", which is wide,
that in height. All the arrows of the enemy aim at him.
Only at Armata this vulnerability was finally removed.

[Albert1988]

Quote: voyaka uh

Luke
driver mechanics.

The driver's hatch was located in the VLD only in the T-34, and in the I-64/72/80/90 there was a weak point in the VLD - the so-called "decollete zone", where there is a cutout in the armor for observation devices of the same mechanic ...
Be more precise, dear Warrior)

[ROSS_51]

Quote: Starover_Z

And the tankers on the T-90 will stand still and turn for a convenient hit? And what, with an ordinary shell, is there a chance to get from the 2-x km to the indicated areas under the tower in a moving tank?
Optimists are Chinese however!

Yes, chatter is all at the shkolota level .. In these vulnerable areas, any modern tank and outdated ammunition are affected. And the statistics of past wars suggests that hits in the NLD are about 1%.
Let them aim ... from 2 km ..

[Mentat]

Quote: Spade

But is this all an excuse for the fact that we are selling weapons and military equipment to the opponents of our "strategic partners"? Does money smell or doesn't smell?

Opponents? Where did you get this from? Neither India nor China are going to fight with each other.

[ROSS_51]

Quote: voyaka uh

They did not say anything new.
The classic vulnerability of all Soviet and Russian tanks is the hatch
driver mechanic. It is located strictly in the center of the "target", which is wide,
that in height. All the arrows of the enemy aim at him.
Only at Armata this vulnerability was finally removed.

Hey, tovarisch..you do not confuse potato and tundra forum with a discussion of real technology? Where are you aiming at toys there, you are there and discuss.
First, find on the network the images of what a tank looks like from 2 km in the tank’s sight .. They aim .. in the driver’s hatch .. from 2 km, yeah ..

[AlexG83]

Well, in some ways, of course, they are right, it's not for nothing that on the T-90M "Breakthrough-3", in the front part of the tower, gratings (or chains with balls) were installed to cover this very "neck", and on the T-14 it was hung on the sides dynamic protection is not frail thickness. Well, remember the so-called "soft protection" in the form of bags attached to the sides of the T-72B3 of the latest modifications.