Military Review

A bunch of UAV C-70 "Hunter" makes the Su-57 a fighter of the 5 + generation

103
The combined flight of the S-70 “Hunter” heavy drone and the Su-57 fighter, in fact, is becoming the first visual example in the world of the flight integration of a drone with a fifth-generation fighter. It is clear that this is still an attempt, but at the same time it is worth noting that the first step in this direction has already been taken, and this is a successful step.




Previously, the developers reported that before the end of the year, the “Hunter” will be tested in the variant flight without operator intervention. Today, a heavy strike UAV has clearly moved to a new level of "independence".

It should also be recalled that they planned to install global positioning and communication systems on the drone, which are created for fifth-generation fighter Su-57. This suggests that the integration of these combat vehicles with the aim of the most effective performance of combat missions will increase.

The combination of C-70 and Su-57 turns the latter into a fighter of the 5 + generation in terms of gaining new capabilities.

Experts note that aviation the unit consisting of several fifth-generation Su-57 multipurpose fighters and the Okhotnik drones can ultimately become not only a single strike component, but also an effective system for breaking through the potential enemy’s air defense zones. The super-maneuverability of the Su-57 and its wide arsenal of air-to-air capabilities can lead to the neutralization of opponent’s aircraft, and the S-70 arsenal at this point can be used for preventive air defense attacks on the ground.

The main emphasis of critics once again boils down to the theses: Su-57 does not have implemented stealth technology, and the C-70 "Hunter" has increased "visibility" due to the lack of a flat nozzle.

Skeptics should be reminded that today's joint flight of these means of aviation does not mean that the Ministry of Defense is showing the final version of the same “Hunter” as the option that in this configuration the fighter and strike UAV will now operate.
103 comments
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  1. _Ugene_
    _Ugene_ 27 September 2019 16: 03
    +15
    Su-57 does not have the implemented stealth technology, and C-70 "Hunter" has increased "visibility" due to the absence of a flat nozzle
    Well, actually fair criticism, but if the S-70 goes far ahead and has the same radar on it, this will significantly protect the Su-57
    1. igorbrsv
      igorbrsv 27 September 2019 16: 49
      +23
      And if there is more than one c-70 unaware of fear ... wassat
      1. GELEZNII_KAPUT
        GELEZNII_KAPUT 27 September 2019 19: 03
        +1
        And if there will be more than one S-70 that knows no fear ... wassat

        Cyber ​​warfare is gaining momentum! wassat
        1. krot
          krot 28 September 2019 18: 37
          +1
          becomes the first visual example in the world of flight integration of a strike unmanned vehicle with a fifth-generation fighter.

          Someone here said that we are catching up on this issue ..) But it turns out to be the first in the world)
      2. NEXUS
        NEXUS 27 September 2019 22: 26
        +4
        Quote: igorbrsv
        And if there is more than one c-70 unaware of fear ... wassat

        The question is very interesting ... can a serial SU-57 be controlled by several Hunters, or will only one C-57 be assigned to each 70?
        1. igorbrsv
          igorbrsv 27 September 2019 23: 02
          +2
          Quote: NEXUS
          Quote: igorbrsv
          And if there is more than one c-70 unaware of fear ... wassat

          The question is very interesting ... can a serial SU-57 be controlled by several Hunters, or will only one C-57 be assigned to each 70?

          I think it was not controlled by a pilot wassat
          1. Lighten
            Lighten 28 September 2019 11: 50
            0
            There is a need for a double version of the 57th.
        2. Ardein
          Ardein 27 September 2019 23: 49
          +7
          And why not?
          After all, smart people realized the idea of ​​autonomous redistribution of goals by the RCC group when approaching the ship order.
          And in terms of drone control, it’s much more logical to set the main parameters: the coordinates of the target area, the behavior algorithm (flight parameters) depending on the actual situation and the level of decision-making. For example, the destruction of armored vehicles that meet certain parameters in a given area. (Well, or with the same ammunition that is being locked up, information about the purposes for which will be relayed to the base aircraft for the pilot to make a decision)
          In fact, the S-70 will be designed to significantly expand the area of ​​target detection and "processing".
          PS The tactical information exchange complex on the MiG-31 at one time was designed specifically for the same tasks ... only the unmanned MiG-31s ​​were not there at that time. :)
      3. Chaldon48
        Chaldon48 28 September 2019 11: 58
        +1
        One who does not know fear is not always able to make the right decision in order to achieve victory. Remember the Japanese kamikaze, in order to hit the target they often lacked the skills and experience, despite all their fearlessness.
    2. hydrox
      hydrox 27 September 2019 17: 03
      +15
      At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.
      Well, a normal person cannot ONE do the work of two, especially in the mode of condensed battle time with continuously incoming inputs requiring an immediate reaction.
      1. Leeds
        Leeds 27 September 2019 17: 24
        -15
        Quote: hydrox
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.
        Well, a normal person cannot ONE do the work of two, especially in the mode of condensed battle time with continuously incoming inputs requiring an immediate reaction.

        But the volume of the statement about 5 + is at the level of 5 ++.
        In fact, we have so far seen how the Su-57 flew next to the UAV. Cool, of course, but where is the confirmation of some kind of breakthrough, I don’t see what I’ve written for a long time I don’t take for granted.
        Although the Su-57 surrounded by 3-4 drones significantly increases its chances of survival.
        1. Lipchanin
          Lipchanin 27 September 2019 17: 46
          -1
          Quote: Leeds
          In fact, we while saw how the Su-57 flew next to the UAV.

          So this is a test flight. Movie just a minute. Flight 30. What did they do there you know?
          but where is the confirmation of a breakthrough,

          What "breakthrough" do you want to see? What exactly do you consider a breakthrough?
          1. Leeds
            Leeds 27 September 2019 18: 12
            -8
            Quote: Lipchanin
            Quote: Leeds
            In fact, we while saw how the Su-57 flew next to the UAV.

            So this is a test flight. Movie just a minute. Flight 30. What did they do there you know?
            but where is the confirmation of a breakthrough,

            What "breakthrough" do you want to see? What exactly do you consider a breakthrough?

            I am sure that you know, since there is no doubt that this is pulling to a new level (5 +).
            To doubt or accept the information, as someone unknown gives it to you on the spade, referring to some experts. Everyone’s business.
            A breakthrough for me is not a joint flight with an UAV, but 50 SU-57 per year. We are not arming against the Papuans.
            1. Lipchanin
              Lipchanin 27 September 2019 19: 56
              -2
              Quote: Leeds
              I am sure that you know, since there is no doubt that this is taking to a new level

              Did I say something about +5? I just said that they showed us only takeoff and landing. Conclusions from the minute clip you made
              A breakthrough for me is not a joint flight with an UAV, but 50 SU-57 per year

              Oh really? Have you talked about another breakthrough before?
              In fact, we have so far seen how the Su-57 flew next to the UAV. Cool of course but where is the confirmation of a breakthrough, I don’t see

              Well, where are you talking about the "breakthrough" in the release of the aircraft?
              1. Leeds
                Leeds 27 September 2019 20: 47
                -4
                Yes, you’re right, the fact that the plane flew from an UAV, which had just begun to fly, not to mention testing its combat capabilities, I did not see something unrealistic from the future. Therefore, where is the breakthrough in the intermediate between 5 and 6, only the author of the article “knows”.
                About a breakthrough in aircraft production? (Dreaming forbidden by moderators?)
        2. NN52
          NN52 27 September 2019 18: 03
          +18
          Leeds
          A little to you to understand the process.
          Pay attention to what DISTANCES they flew in tight combat order of the pair (I write this in the ordinary language.)
          Do you think that Hunter was controlled from the ground by an operator, and the pilot with Su 57 trusted this?
          Think and think again ....
          1. Arturov
            Arturov 27 September 2019 21: 37
            -10
            Quote: NN52
            Do you think that Hunter was controlled from the ground by an operator, and the pilot with Su 57 trusted this?
            Think and think again ..

            100% off the ground, near the base, the signal delay is minimal, and there were no idiots to distract the pilot in a tight formation.
            1. NN52
              NN52 27 September 2019 22: 03
              +9
              Arturov
              Well ... you probably were there ..)))
              And enlighten pzhl, what signal delay (near the base) are you broadcasting to us ???
              To be honest, I smiled at your comment ...))
            2. TatrA-50
              TatrA-50 27 September 2019 23: 37
              +2
              Definitely not from the ground
            3. all we te
              all we te 28 September 2019 13: 44
              0
              A helicopter flew nearby, the operator was sitting on it. Because the bluetooth pulls no more than 50 meters, and then the drone can lose touch and fall.
        3. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
        4. Lighten
          Lighten 28 September 2019 11: 53
          +1
          What you mean by breakthrough. This is a modified UAV program. This is the work of a bunch of programmers and the result is poured into the finished iron. Iron is it. Programs are written.
      2. Tusv
        Tusv 27 September 2019 17: 45
        +8
        Quote: hydrox
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.

        Guessed. And what if the Pilot sets only the distance and modes: in front, behind, next to. Yes, he presses the trigger like a remote weapon. The rest is "do as I do". IMHO, such management is not too difficult to do without any AI
        1. hydrox
          hydrox 28 September 2019 07: 50
          -4
          Then it turns out that the S-70 is a kind of weapon, taken out at a decent distance from the shooter - right? But the enemy also has weapons of the same class, which he also owns well and he knocks down the S-70 - are we admitting this?
          But this does not mean at all that the Su-57 pilot remained unarmed.
          The weight of the matter is that the enemy, shooting down the S-70 as a weapon of our Su-57, causes us material damage of about $ 70 million. Doesn’t it seem to you that this price (equal to the price of an airplane) is too high for the Russian Air Force and has nothing to do to AI?
          1. Lighten
            Lighten 28 September 2019 11: 54
            0
            Katz offers to give up?
          2. Lighten
            Lighten 28 September 2019 11: 56
            +1
            B2 costs 2 billion bucks and we have a UAV for 50 with the same capabilities. What is frustrating?
            1. hydrox
              hydrox 28 September 2019 12: 55
              -2
              You’ll probably understand later ...
      3. Lipchanin
        Lipchanin 27 September 2019 17: 49
        -2
        Quote: hydrox
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.

        And if the S-70 is controlled by an operator on the ground?
        especially in the mode of compressed battle time

        The battle leads the Su-57, UAV breaks through to the target. How is that option?
        1. Govorun
          Govorun 27 September 2019 18: 05
          +2
          Enough for him to provide options, otherwise he will have nothing to write about)
          1. Tusv
            Tusv 27 September 2019 18: 14
            0
            Quote: Govorun
            Enough for him to provide options, otherwise he will have nothing to write about)

            So warm-up for the mind and for trunk finger charging laughing
        2. hydrox
          hydrox 28 September 2019 07: 57
          -1
          Conventional rockets are much more suitable for such work, even hyper-, it will EVERYTHING be more productive and much cheaper than using the Su-57 pilot as a breakthrough navigator with the risk of losing all three ...
      4. ultra
        ultra 27 September 2019 18: 03
        +4
        Are you sure that he needs a navigator?
      5. Kontrik
        Kontrik 27 September 2019 18: 10
        +6
        Quote: hydrox
        Well, a normal person cannot ONE do the work of two, especially in the mode of condensed battle time with continuously incoming inputs requiring an immediate reaction.

        Well, the Russians have proved it more than once .. But it’s better that everything is according to the plan .. flight mission hi
        Ours are developing something that will change the world! hi And the massacres in the world will stop .. Do you think I wrote slogans and shouting cheers ..? No, I just smell genes, that it will be so .. Kick!
        1. The comment was deleted.
      6. SSR
        SSR 27 September 2019 18: 50
        +4
        Quote: hydrox
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.

        Kamrad, specially trained people work for this, they create special software where they prescribe, calculate so many algorithms and other readings, and work will still be carried out in this direction, up to the creation of AI.
        1. hydrox
          hydrox 28 September 2019 08: 13
          +2
          Roman, NOBODY has shown us ANYTHING, even EVE elements :: Everything that we saw (even Buran as the top of engineering working on electronic tubes!) Is just programmable automata that have nothing to do with AI , and only slightly different from missiles as a strike weapon, with the goal of hitting a given point and doing the destruction available to his warhead, and this is the ultimate goal of his life.
          And C-70 must also return to the point defined by the flight mission and land - after all, he must perform these actions independently, without the participation of the operator?
          1. Cat man null
            Cat man null 28 September 2019 08: 26
            +1
            Quote: hydrox
            And C-70 must also return to the point defined by the flight mission and land - after all, he must perform these actions independently, without the participation of the operator?

            Easy. The drone for the 500 Baku from the store is perfectly able to do this ... and much more that can.

            This is if you are not up to date by chance wink
          2. Lighten
            Lighten 6 October 2019 11: 44
            0
            Do you want to get acquainted with AI? Type "Alice" in Yandex. This AI has come a long way over the past yea years. I even learned to tease. Respected. If something was not shown to you personally. This does not mean that it does not exist
      7. Mark9103
        Mark9103 27 September 2019 19: 06
        0
        I think it would be interesting to consider the possibility of creating a two-seater version of su57 in order to have a bunch of su57 and su57ub in the future, as we now have su35 and su30.
      8. lucul
        lucul 27 September 2019 19: 18
        -2
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.

        And you imagine that the pilot of the Su-57, you just need to specify the goal, and the S-70 will do everything on its own)))
        1. hydrox
          hydrox 28 September 2019 08: 25
          -2
          This can be done, but imagine that in the process of completing this task it suddenly turns out that the task is impossible (the enemy squadron entered the battle area or the object is covered by the suddenly appeared S-400 battery) - to whom the S-70 will complain and who will be next to it drive or hang up?
      9. Storog dvornik
        Storog dvornik 27 September 2019 19: 26
        +7
        Buy a Chinese drone for as low as $ 500, wonder what feints the toy performs in auto mode ...
        Selfies of a running person from the right distance, flying around obstacles, flying over points, etc ...
        It is clear that if a 500 gram toy allows this, then in a 20 ton machine, place the sensors and brains in the right volume, for a pilot-less operator / operator mode, like two fingers ... on asphalt ...
      10. Alexey Verkhulevsky
        Alexey Verkhulevsky 27 September 2019 21: 08
        +2
        And if you imagine that one Su-57 controls (more precisely, gives tasks) to several S-70s.
        1. TatrA-50
          TatrA-50 27 September 2019 23: 40
          0
          + A - 100 to the heap
      11. Vita vko
        Vita vko 27 September 2019 21: 24
        +7
        Quote: hydrox
        a normal person cannot do ONE work of two, especially in the mode of condensed battle time with continuously arriving inputs requiring an immediate reaction

        If you have not seen how modern combat control algorithms work, then this does not mean that they do not exist. By and large, even in the Su-57, the pilot performs the functions of an extras in real combat work. The on-board computer evaluates the situation faster, and makes the best decisions, and cannot make mistakes. One of the Su-57 test pilots spoke about this when they asked him how difficult it is to fly a modern aircraft. Therefore, the inclusion of one pilot in the C-70 unit under the command of nothing will change anything from the point of view of the pilot's perception of the current situation, only the scale of the tasks to be solved will increase.
        1. Arturov
          Arturov 27 September 2019 21: 41
          +1
          Quote: Vita VKO
          If you have not seen how modern combat control algorithms work, then this does not mean that they do not exist. By and large, even in the Su-57, the pilot performs the functions of an extras in real combat work. The on-board computer evaluates the situation faster, and makes the best decisions, and cannot make mistakes. One of the Su-57 test pilots spoke about this when they asked him how difficult it is to fly a modern aircraft. Therefore, the inclusion of one pilot in the C-70 unit under the command of nothing will change anything from the point of view of the pilot's perception of the current situation, only the scale of the tasks to be solved will increase.

          there are too many if, and all sensors should work perfectly, and there should be no errors in the algorithms, and all measurement errors should be correctly interpreted by the algorithms, and the synchronization of systems should be worked out ... that's why pilots have not been written off so far.
          1. Vita vko
            Vita vko 27 September 2019 21: 49
            +5
            Quote: Arturov
            too much if, and all sensors should work perfectly, and there should be no errors in the algorithms, and all measurement errors should be correctly interpreted by the algorithms, and system synchronization should be worked out
            Do you really think that for Su-57 came up with some special algorithms? The first versions of these algorithms are already at least 30 years old, they have worked on from and to yet on the MiG-31B.
      12. abc_alex
        abc_alex 28 September 2019 01: 14
        +1
        Quote: hydrox
        At least kill :: I just can’t imagine the pilot of the Su-57, at the same time serving as the navigator of the C-70.
        Well, a normal person cannot ONE do the work of two, especially in the mode of condensed battle time with continuously incoming inputs requiring an immediate reaction.

        This is where things are not so scary. All aircraft have a friend or foe system. Therefore, for an accompanying UAV, it is enough to be able to execute the command "hit all strangers". The drone does not need direct piloting, it does not have to repeat the aircraft's maneuvers, it just needs to follow it, or in front of it. With the distribution of targets, the computer of a drone or an aircraft will quite cope, and a network of 3-4 radars with PAR or AFAR will give the enemy detection range. comparable to AWACS.
        There should be no navigational problems in the air, there the task is extremely simple: there are no obstacles and folds of terrain, all opponents are clearly separated from their own. The navigator will simply bring the UAV into the battle area, and then give a forward and face command.
      13. Archon
        Archon 28 September 2019 07: 47
        +2
        perhaps the division into automation and human orders. the pilot will be able to give orders from his cockpit about attack, bombing, etc. and the drone will be able to maneuver and fly by itself.
        drones are already available for sale, flying behind a person on their own and shooting at the same time.
      14. Chaldon48
        Chaldon48 29 September 2019 07: 23
        0
        The drone was probably controlled from the ground, although it is quite possible that some kind of information display was installed in the cockpit.
    3. Nick
      Nick 27 September 2019 17: 58
      +9
      Quote: _Ugene_
      Su-57 does not have the implemented stealth technology, and C-70 "Hunter" has increased "visibility" due to the absence of a flat nozzle
      Well, actually fair criticism,

      Alas, no one has stealth technology. No one is invisible. There are products with relatively low radar visibility, and even then in a fairly narrow range of frequencies of radio waves. In Su-57, by the way, this parameter is not a bad EPR from 0,1 to 0,4 square meters. in different angles. This is slightly higher than that of the F-22, its EPR ranges from 0,05 to 0,3 square meters. but the Raptor is a little smaller. But in terms of multifunctionality and maneuverability, our Su-57 is significantly superior to raptors. Therefore, it is necessary to consider in the aggregate all the pros and cons of the product, and not one of its parameters.
      1. Constructor68
        Constructor68 27 September 2019 21: 52
        +2
        In the Su-57 incidentally, this parameter is not a bad EPR from 0,1 to 0,4 square meters. in different angles.

        An interesting source of data on the EPR Su57, and even from different angles. This topic has recently been discussed.
        1. Nick
          Nick 28 September 2019 02: 12
          0
          Quote: Designer 68
          An interesting source of data on the EPR Su57, and even from different angles. This topic has recently been discussed.

          The topic is constantly being discussed. On the Internet is full of information.
          1. Constructor68
            Constructor68 28 September 2019 06: 31
            +3
            The topic is constantly being discussed. On the Internet is full of information.

            That's the problem that it is all from the Internet. That is of dubious reliability. Appealing such data is pointless. We will not know the exact numbers from different angles, from different frequencies and powers of the probing signal obtained in radio frequency anechoic BEC cameras in the next decade.
            1. Ponchik78
              Ponchik78 28 September 2019 07: 47
              +2
              Well, the data on the EPR of Raptor and Penguin, as it were, were also not personally received from the US Secretary of Defense)))
            2. Nick
              Nick 28 September 2019 08: 46
              0
              Quote: Designer 68
              We will not know the exact numbers from different angles, from different frequencies and powers of the probing signal obtained in radio frequency anechoic BEC cameras in the next decade.

              Well, if you wait for the exact data, then there will be nothing to discuss at all. Everyone uses data from the Internet, at least those who are not a secret bearer in this area.
      2. igorbrsv
        igorbrsv 27 September 2019 22: 28
        0
        Quote: Nick
        Quote: _Ugene_
        Su-57 does not have the implemented stealth technology, and C-70 "Hunter" has increased "visibility" due to the absence of a flat nozzle
        Well, actually fair criticism,

        Alas, no one has stealth technology. No one is invisible. There are products with relatively low radar visibility, and even then in a fairly narrow range of frequencies of radio waves. In Su-57, by the way, this parameter is not a bad EPR from 0,1 to 0,4 square meters. in different angles. This is slightly higher than that of the F-22, its EPR ranges from 0,05 to 0,3 square meters. but the Raptor is a little smaller. But in terms of multifunctionality and maneuverability, our Su-57 is significantly superior to raptors. Therefore, it is necessary to consider in the aggregate all the pros and cons of the product, and not one of its parameters.

        I would say that depends on the range wassat
        Be i smart
        1. Nick
          Nick 28 September 2019 02: 07
          0
          Quote: igorbrsv
          I would say that depends on the range
          Be i smart

          Yes, you really strain, tighten the intellect. hi
    4. Constructor68
      Constructor68 27 September 2019 20: 17
      +3
      Well, actually fair criticism

      What is fair?
    5. Alex Fox
      Alex Fox 28 September 2019 11: 36
      -1
      What is fair? is that realized stealth f35 myth? and the su57 link in conjunction with the s-70 will overcome any western pro without interference? in that?
    6. Voyager
      Voyager 28 September 2019 21: 04
      0
      Where is she fair? Stealth technology on the Su-57 implemented. And the nozzle in the S-70 does not essentially affect the EPR.
  2. Lipchanin
    Lipchanin 27 September 2019 16: 08
    +3
    Experts note that the aviation link consisting of several fifth-generation Su-57 multipurpose fighters and Okhotnik drones can ultimately become not only a single strike component, but also an effective system for breaking through the potential enemy’s air defense zones.

    So for this, such a bunch is created
  3. Vinnibuh
    Vinnibuh 27 September 2019 16: 10
    +3
    I am happy for our planes and drones. Well done. But the title of the article just makes you laugh, for example, if you add a rocket to this pair, for example, will it be 6 +++? laughing
    1. SHURUM -BURUM
      SHURUM -BURUM 27 September 2019 16: 15
      -13
      I don’t understand how small, with protruding chassis, can fly along with the Su-57? Most likely, small after pair skating with SU-57, will receive a qualification upgrade and champagne.
      1. ciujoilu
        ciujoilu 27 September 2019 16: 20
        +8
        Not so small, 10 tons heavier than Mig-29
      2. Paranoid50
        Paranoid50 27 September 2019 16: 22
        +9
        Quote: SHURUM-BURUM
        with protruding chassis,

        The chassis is perfectly cleaned, as shown in the video (adjacent branch).
      3. ltc35
        ltc35 27 September 2019 16: 30
        +9
        Sticking out chassis say nothing. This is the flight of the prototype in the framework of tests where flight modes and system interactions are checked. Then everything that needs to be cleaned up)
      4. igorbrsv
        igorbrsv 27 September 2019 16: 51
        0
        It is provided for by flight tests. To my mind wassat
        Quote: SHURUM -BURUM
        I don’t understand how small, with protruding chassis, can fly along with the Su-57? Most likely, small after pair skating with SU-57, will receive a qualification upgrade and champagne.
      5. IvanT
        IvanT 27 September 2019 17: 13
        +5
        Do not bother, it is not yours!
      6. Nick
        Nick 28 September 2019 02: 17
        0
        Quote: SHURUM-BURUM
        I do not understand how small with protruding chassis, can fly along with the Su-57? Most likely, small after pair skating with SU-57

        And he doesn't have to fly like the Su-57. The Su-57 can fly like a Hunter. The chassis is retractable. And this is still a test.
    2. Nycomed
      Nycomed 27 September 2019 16: 47
      -12
      And if a reusable "shuttle" such as "Buran" or "Shuttle", then there will be 8 at once and it is possible without additional advantages. winked
    3. SSR
      SSR 27 September 2019 18: 56
      +2
      Quote: Vinnibuh
      But the title of the article just makes neighing, for example

      Oh, come on, if you accept the concept that the 6th generation is an unmanned fighter, then the "hunter" operating in tandem with a fighter (not to be confused with other drones) gave the opportunity to put + to the 5th generation, so to speak.
  4. Tahtvjd2868
    Tahtvjd2868 27 September 2019 16: 12
    +6
    If they have the same EPR, then the air defense will be more difficult to determine the most dangerous target .. for this they need to fly just as close as possible as in the video
    1. Tusv
      Tusv 27 September 2019 20: 19
      +1
      Quote: Tahtvjd2868
      If they have the same EPR, then the air defense will be more difficult to determine the most dangerous target .. for this they need to fly just as close as possible as in the video

      Think right. Favorite game is passing Control Objectives. Maximum jammers from the Flyers side. We, the Paramilitaries, "wet" them according to their behavior (one way or another the false target behaves predictably) and always win. And here. Feel "soaked" and Paramilitary will lose to the Flyers for the first time drinks
  5. yehat
    yehat 27 September 2019 16: 23
    +1
    great, now if it rains, the su-57 has nothing to fear
    UAV will cover
  6. Thunderbolt
    Thunderbolt 27 September 2019 16: 45
    +8
    I foresee Western skeptics. They will argue that these insidious Russians put a dwarf in the "Hunter" and he controls this airplane through an inconspicuous hatch.)))
    1. igorbrsv
      igorbrsv 27 September 2019 16: 56
      +2
      Ndaa ... Indigents. Americans themselves offered us. Instead of Squirrels and Arrows. It still excites me. No. I feel sorry for the dogs. But so disrespectful to people ...
  7. Keyser soze
    Keyser soze 27 September 2019 16: 57
    -1
    Hint for journalists: I have been waiting for a long time to stick a plus to the top five. But do not limit yourself to 5 +. If the pilot slept well - immediately put another plus. Even two. And so in the geometric ....
  8. Vasyan1971
    Vasyan1971 27 September 2019 17: 06
    0
    Experts note that the aviation link consisting of several fifth-generation multi-role fighters Su-57 and “Okhotnik” drones could eventually become ...

    Maybe it can't. Some kind of coffee grounds. Why shout "gop" ahead of time? God forbid jinx it.
  9. Vladimir61
    Vladimir61 27 September 2019 17: 17
    +7
    The main emphasis of critics once again boils down to the theses: Su-57 does not have implemented stealth technology, and the C-70 "Hunter" has increased "visibility" due to the lack of a flat nozzle.
    When experts in their field criticize, this is understandable - this is the job. Probably, the designers know the nuances no worse than the experts and are unlikely to sit idly by. It is worse when criticism and reasoning come from those who are to aviation, aerodynamics and "God knows him", to what other sciences there, has the same relation as a nurse to neurosurgery.
  10. The comment was deleted.
  11. gvozdan
    gvozdan 27 September 2019 17: 47
    +4
    Does f35 have a flat nozzle?
    1. Tusv
      Tusv 27 September 2019 19: 14
      +5
      Quote: gvozdan
      Does f35 have a flat nozzle?

      You see, Western iksperds believe that the tail of a Penguin disperses, but for some reason the Su-57 isn’t a fig fool
  12. Kenxnumx
    Kenxnumx 27 September 2019 18: 02
    +5
    Interesting concept. If this thing hangs nearby and attacks the same targets as the Su-57, this can be very frustrating for the opponent.
  13. Kontrik
    Kontrik 27 September 2019 18: 02
    +2
    The joint flight of the S-70 “Hunter” heavy drone and the Su-57 fighter, in fact, becomes the first visual example of flight integration in the world

    Well, roughly speaking, they are talking among themselves .. Where are the goals, etc.
    Our Kulibins work well ..
    In Russia, something new is being created, or created already .... The future will show!
    But this time we will not run around from the "messengers" ... hi
  14. APASUS
    APASUS 27 September 2019 19: 39
    +1
    So far, for sure, we do not know the complete performance characteristics of the S-70 Hunter, to say that the combination with the Su-57 makes its 5+ generation is too early
    1. Kontrik
      Kontrik 27 September 2019 20: 16
      -3
      Quote: APASUS
      So far, for sure, we do not know the complete performance characteristics of the S-70 Hunter, to say that the combination with the Su-57 makes its 5+ generation is too early

      Everything will be cleared up if Russophobes come to us again with a "crusade".
      There will be many echelons of protection ... The last one is men with warlocks and machine guns Maxim on the hills of the Ural Mountains of Russia soldier
      If the "Maidan in Moscow, etc." The Urals will go to disassembly .. Echelons!
      These are the things in the military-industrial complex of the Urals, etc. hi
      1. The popuas
        The popuas 28 September 2019 10: 01
        -2
        Ural for Muscovites ... wassat ridiculed .... by God they ridiculed laughing
        1. Kontrik
          Kontrik 28 September 2019 10: 17
          0
          Quote: Popuas
          Ural for Muscovites ... wassat ridiculed .... by God they ridiculed laughing

          Did I write about this? hehe Muscovites, this topic is very painful for the rest of Russia all
          While we tolerate, but if that Russian rebellion will be merciless from the province .. Remember this gentlemen! hi

          These are the things in the Ural tank divisions ...
          1. Gaersul
            Gaersul 28 September 2019 19: 41
            0
            Quote: Kontrik
            hehe Muscovites, this topic is very painful for the rest of Russia all

            The entire so-called "civilized world" thinks that the Russians are to blame for everything. In Russia they think that Muscovites are to blame for everything. Consequently, Muscovites are the most terrible people on the planet, and Moscow is the center of world evil (this is irony, if someone does not understand).
  15. Force
    Force 27 September 2019 20: 57
    -9
    Quote: Nick

    Alas, no one has stealth technology. No one is invisible. There are products with relatively low radar visibility, and even then in a fairly narrow range of frequencies of radio waves. In Su-57, by the way, this parameter is not a bad EPR from 0,1 to 0,4 square meters. in different angles. This is slightly higher than that of the F-22, its EPR ranges from 0,05 to 0,3 square meters. but the Raptor is a little smaller. But in terms of multifunctionality and maneuverability, our Su-57 is significantly superior to raptors. Therefore, it is necessary to consider in the aggregate all the pros and cons of the product, and not one of its parameters.

    And where did you get the idea that the Su-57 is significantly superior to the Lizard in maneuverability.
    I saw his demonstrations at the MAKS, honestly, I was not particularly impressed.
    1. Alex_You
      Alex_You 28 September 2019 02: 23
      0
      And I about the same, the Su-35 looked much more effective.
  16. Alexey G
    Alexey G 27 September 2019 23: 22
    0
    I saw somewhere a video there F22 flies surrounded by drones. There is also a satellite and an AWACS aircraft it seemed! In this sense, we have not done anything particularly new! Well, caught up with the amers, which of course is good! But that's why 5+ is not clear. Apparently this is the concept of a new network-centric war! An inconspicuous aircraft goes in conjunction with robots that may play the role of intelligence, but it does not turn on its radar and does not reveal itself to the enemy. Su 57 receives data from drones and beats according to their target designation and reacts to the fact that someone is attacking them! In this case, the Su 57 gets the right to the first strike from the shadows. Well, how is the version?
  17. JD1979
    JD1979 28 September 2019 00: 57
    0
    They say a bunch of brains with hands makes a graphomaniac an adequate person. I don’t even want to comment on this ... Question and why immediately at 6+?
    1. Ugolek
      Ugolek 28 September 2019 06: 47
      0
      Nevertheless, his price confuses him; for any reason, he will be expensive. At this price, it will initially be limited in use due to fear of losing a car. On the other hand, if such an air armada without pilots is capable of destroying, for example, AUG, then the price does not matter, as the enemy has unacceptable losses in comparison with us.
  18. Lunt
    Lunt 28 September 2019 09: 54
    -1
    Compared to the TR-3b, Astra is yesterday, a dead end.
  19. Dargavs
    Dargavs 28 September 2019 12: 35
    0
    Quote: Alexey G
    An inconspicuous aircraft goes in conjunction with robots that may play the role of intelligence, but it does not turn on its radar and does not reveal itself to the enemy. Su 57 receives data from drones and beats according to their target designation and reacts to the fact that someone is attacking them! In this case, the Su 57 gets the right to the first strike from the shadows. Well, how is the version?

    For some reason, everyone pays attention only to the improved characteristics of target designation and reconnaissance, and no one is discussing that, with the introduction of an unmanned vehicle with the characteristics of su 57, it improves its speed and maneuverability by an order of magnitude (which are recognized as the best in the world in Russia). He will be able to go to overloads that are not achievable for manned, and therefore he can get away from air defense much more efficiently.
  20. Cresta999
    Cresta999 28 September 2019 13: 39
    +1
    The problem is not in the plane. The problem is in the economy. This is a military plane. It should be carried out not only in conditions of sanctions, but in conditions of war. At the same time in the right quantities. What we see today in our economy (lack of production of means of production) almost completely deprives us of hope for this.
  21. Miron
    Miron 28 September 2019 15: 38
    0
    So far, PAK-FA has not reached generation 5.
  22. Joker62
    Joker62 28 September 2019 17: 53
    +1
    Quote: allwe te
    A helicopter flew nearby, the operator was sitting on it. Because the bluetooth pulls no more than 50 meters, and then the drone can lose touch and fall.

    Do not carry nonsense if you yourself do not understand the mode of operation in automatic mode according to a given algorithm of the program.
    Remember the first unmanned Soviet shuttle "Buran", which flew around the balloon and landed in automatic mode. You will also say that the operator sat on the helicopter and controlled the "Buran" ???
    Himself is not funny?
  23. Vipirozhnikow
    Vipirozhnikow 28 September 2019 19: 52
    0
    Quote: NEXUS
    Quote: igorbrsv
    And if there is more than one c-70 unaware of fear ... wassat

    The question is very interesting ... can a serial SU-57 be controlled by several Hunters, or will only one C-57 be assigned to each 70?


    It will cope with additional target designation and assigning "priorities" to detected targets if it goes behind the group of "Hunters".
  24. Nikolai
    Nikolai 28 September 2019 22: 45
    +1
    1. Attack of the enemy’s object. 57th has powerful radar and other means of intelligence and rep. It flies at high altitude above the radio horizon. Detects air defense objects outside the reach of enemy air defense forces. 70th in radio silence mode flies at low altitude under the radio horizon of enemy radars. 57th gives tsu 70th to destroy (launch missiles planning ab) enemy air defense facilities. 57th controls the outcome of the attack. 57th enters the gap and attacks the guarded object. The 57th defends the 70th from attacks by air defense missiles and enemy fighters.
    2. Reflection of the attack. 70th in radio silence in front, 57th behind. 57th sees the enemy at the limit of the radar range. Issues tsu 70th to launch missiles on enemy aircraft. 57th controls the effectiveness of the launch. 57th defends 70th.
    3. etc. And even: 70th - tanker for the 57th.
    1. Svlad
      Svlad 29 September 2019 07: 39
      0
      Another window dressing like Leader, etc.
  25. Sancho_SP
    Sancho_SP 29 September 2019 12: 21
    0
    In the photo they are flying nearby, a bunch of what?
  26. gregor6549
    gregor6549 29 September 2019 14: 55
    -1
    In my unenlightened view, no "pairing" of one aircraft of one type with an aircraft of another type transfers any of these types to the next generation. This time.
    And two. How will the 57 SU pilot control two planes in combat, especially in close combat? He would have time to assess the rapidly changing air situation and on time, as well as adequately respond to it. And in this With 70 is unlikely to help him, but it will interfere pretty much.
    If SU 57 was a two-seater, then the task of interacting with the C 70 could be solved with a sin in half by the operator (not the pilot) of the SU 57, but the main combat version of the SU 57 is single and therefore indulge in fantasies about the effective control of the SU 57 pilot with a pair from C 70 and SS 57 are very fraught. And let's not forget that when designing modern manned aircraft, developers spend hundreds and thousands of hours simulating the interaction of a pilot with a machine and trying to squeeze out of this simulation the most effective human-machine interface, including in extreme situations that this aircraft can get into. Yes, these models provide1 for the pilot to interact with pilots of other manned aircraft, but alas, not with drones. Fairy tales about the elements of artificial intelligence (AI) that are supposedly endowed with modern aircraft are still fairy tales. in ANY military equipment, be it an aircraft, a tank, a radar or an automated control system, key decisions in the process of functioning of this technology are and will be made by a person. And not because AI is not yet ripe, but because no one wants to risk giving AI the right to make decisions.
    By the way, one of the reasons for the adoption in the past of agreements on limiting the RMSD was just the fact that if the RMSD had a short flight time, there would simply not be enough time for a person to make decisions on detecting the RMSD and it would have to entrust all key decisions to automatic systems , i.e. the same AI and any failure in these systems would entail a completely understandable disaster.
    1. Nikolai
      Nikolai 29 September 2019 18: 26
      +1
      There are a lot of buzzwords. Argument against: 57th and 70th are one machine spaced apart. And that's all. Even simpler: the 70th "bus / platform" weaponry of the 57th. And even simpler - heifer after cow.