Military Review

Who can bite the "Gadfly"?

66
Many media have reported that in the Pacific navy “Smerch”, modernized by RTOs of project 12341 “Gadfly”, came to the test.




How to evaluate it correctly, where to attribute it: to success or not?

In order to understand everything correctly, you need to plunge into historyThat, good, does not cause problems.

The middle of the 60's of the last century. This is yes, already a story. But it was then that work began on the ships of the project, intended for warfare in closed seas and the near ocean zone.

It was not possible to meet the allotted tonnage for missile boats, and therefore, in general, a new class was born, which we got the name of small missile ships (RTOs). The ships of the 12341 project had tonnage of 640 tons, while the missile boats were packed in 500 tons and less.



Our potential, evaluating the armament of the RTOs without further ado, brought them into the class of corvettes.

Indeed, at the time of their entry into the combat watch, the Ovoda were very toothy and problematic ships for the enemy. They still remained small in size, quite nimble (35 nodes) and had a very impressive range: 4 000 miles at 12 nodes and 1800 at 18 tees.

And the weapons seemed to be in full order. 6 Malachite anti-ship missiles, AK-176 and AK-630 artillery mounts, as well as the Osa-MA anti-aircraft missile system with ammunition in the 20 anti-aircraft guided missiles.

Why "seems to be" - more on that below.

There were significant flaws. Seaworthiness limped on both legs, starting with medium excitement. And in a strong pitching, the operation of the ships caused criticism and vicious grumbling of the crews.

The second huge drawback was the use of lightweight aluminum-magnesium alloys of the AMg61 brand in the construction of ships in the structures of the hull superstructure. Light alloys are less durable than steel alloys and, in the event of a fire, are easily ignited, burn quickly and melt, making it difficult to fight for the survivability of the ship.

An example of this is the death of the Monsoon, which hit a missile target launched from another boat. The crew, knocked out by a rocket explosion and a fire that began with the ignition of rocket fuel and an oxidizer, could not fight for the survivability of the ship. As a result, as a result of the disaster, 39 crew members died, another 37 people were saved. But there is also the Commander of the Primorsky Flotilla Rear Admiral Golovko put his mind and skills.

By the way, the MPK-9 sold to Libya, also known as Tariq Ibn Ziyad, also burned down. True, in a real battle.



In general, let's say this: the ship is not without flaws. Plus, frankly weak protection against air attacks. This was shown by the death of "Monsoon", and the Libyan "Ean Zara" and "Ean Zaquit", which could not fend off attacks from the air.

The first series of "Gadgets", the "clean" RTOs of the 12341 project, have long been decommissioned and disassembled. The ships of the 1234.1 project stayed afloat, the freshest of which “Rain” (BF) and “Spill” (Pacific Fleet) were put into operation in the 1992 year, and the oldest - “Storm” - in the 1970-m.

But we, of course, are interested in those ships that are still in service, and, therefore, will go for this very modernization. That is the 1234.1 project.

"Calm" and "Iceberg". In service since the 1979 year. Forty-year-old ships, one might say, are veterans. I can’t say that their presence makes me so happy, 40 years is the deadline.

The youngest is Spill. In service since the 1992 year. "Just something" 27 years.

The rest, as is already clear, was built between 1979 and 1992 years.



Modernization will primarily affect weapons, because the P-120 Malachite today simply looks frivolous.

Instead of 6 launchers of P-120 Malachite cruise missiles with a firing range of up to 150 km following the example of Tornado, ships will receive 16 anti-ship missiles X-35U Uranus with a firing range of up to 260 km and active homing heads.

In addition, artillery mounts will be replaced with more modern AK-176MA and AK-630M.

X-35 “Uranus” is more interesting than “Malachite”. The missile is equipped with a penetrating high-explosive fragmentation warhead, which is designed to destroy missile, torpedo, artillery boats, surface ships with a displacement of up to 5000 tons and sea transports. Plus good protection against electronic countermeasures.

But the main bonus is that Uranus can be used for ground targets, which automatically makes the RTOs a theoretical participant in landing operations, quite capable of supporting the landing.

Well, 16 missiles instead of 6 are a significant increase.

In addition, the update will affect the engine compartment of each ship. Sources say that new engines will be installed on RTOs that will be more economical, and in general, the new engine on a forty-year-old ship is a new engine, even if it is Chinese.



It will be natural to add modern artillery fire control systems, as Gadgets have big problems shooting artillery systems when the excitement is greater than 4 points.

Many experts who spoke out believe that in fact all these innovations will give the Gadfly a second life. And at the end of modernization, these ships will meet the most modern requirements of naval combat.

It is clear that these RTOs will not fight against American AUGs. There are no chances, but in the waters of the Baltic and Black Sea “puddles” they can be very useful. Well, in the islands of the Pacific Ocean.

Even a few relatively small ships carrying one and a half dozen stealth and universal missiles protected from interference are serious.

The idea is not bad. In general, the idea of ​​reconstructing a “mosquito” fleet with modern missiles looks very, very optimistic, and most importantly, unlike all the aircraft carriers and destroyers of a terrible tonnage with nuclear propulsion systems, it is feasible.



But here, of course, there is a "but." This is the number and age of the ships. Still, 12 ships in three fleets, this, you see, is not very much. But better than nothing.

But age ... From 40 to 27. It is clear that even a deep modernization will give an effect faster than the construction of new ships. But for forty years ... There are such things as metal fatigue, internal corrosion and other “pleasures”.

Will it be possible to seriously count on such "old new" RTOs? Of course, time will tell, but concerns remain.

We are short of ships. We really lack modern ships. We are short of new ships. Conceived with the old XRNM project RTOs are crutches. This, of course, is better than nothing, but these are prostheses instead of legs.

If we want to have real protection of the sea (and not only) borders, we first of all need to spend money not on creating frankly stupid and useless projects of aircraft carriers and destroyers, over which the whole world will laugh, but to restore shipbuilding enterprises and build on them the ships we needed yesterday.
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Articles from this series:
And in the Pacific Ocean they finished their campaign ...
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  1. mark1
    mark1 25 September 2019 06: 07
    +13
    Well, yes, with the modernization they were 15-20 years late. And for some reason we cannot somehow organize a truly mass large-scale production, and which is typical - only a model appears, development begins in a series, as for a short time they refuse it in favor of a supposedly more perfect and, as a result, the next decade trampling on the spot (as an example; pr 22380 -22386-22160 or pr 885-885M in 30 years at the exit of 2 boats, and when 30 years ago they wanted to)
    1. at84432384
      at84432384 25 September 2019 17: 08
      +11
      Here everything is painfully simple - you can constantly beg and steal money for OCD, but with serial construction all expenses and terms are calculated and it is very difficult to steal. Business is nothing personal. And for business, the main profit. For him, the categories of patriotism, the defense of the homeland, and so on. does not exist. For the business, everything but the profit of the chimera.
      1. mark1
        mark1 25 September 2019 17: 31
        +13
        If only it were that simple. I have long had the impression of sophisticated hostile activity. For example, T-95 - they did it, refused, ordered the T-14 in the end, almost the same thing but ch.z 10 years. or NK-93. They did - yes, he has a big forehead! - but he has a gearbox! - Yes, we just don't need it! Fucked. We do not have a 20-ton truck, but the whole world flies on geared turbofans, now they want to do PD-18 with a gearbox (sometime). The newest - the composite corn plant "Baikal" (the fact that imported materials and the engine are a separate issue, but everything can be solved) - we did it, we admired it - now in series! In less than a month - the maize is atavism! , we will do better - later, when that. Well, at least S-7 undertook to support the project, it may not be lost. But the SR-10 seems to have been buried, and what a pretext! - we'd better revive the MiG-AT (somewhere it looks like an increased concentration of De-Bills)
        1. PPD
          PPD 26 September 2019 11: 27
          +3
          somewhere it seems the increased concentration of De Bill)

          The French aristocracy has nothing to do with it. laughing
          Now ideology is some kind of projects and making money in any way.
          No matter which project, by the way, it’s even better.
          Medvedev canceled the Soviet Guests, and among them, it seemed, about an 8-hour working day.
          The cancellation list does not seem to have been seen at all.
          You want the Soviet State approach from people used to putting everything up for sale.
          It's like sitting on 2 chairs.
          They heard, in the opinion of one comrade of the USSR, they only made galoshes (Buran really sat down, but a trifle) - that's what they think. Soviet most -..... already with a minus sign. And that's all.
        2. Vadim237
          Vadim237 26 September 2019 12: 17
          +1
          NK 93 was created for a specific aircraft - the aircraft did not and hello to the engine.
        3. bayard
          bayard 26 September 2019 13: 16
          +1
          Quote: mark1
          I have long had the impression of sophisticated enemy activity

          Many such figures also have known surnames, and at whose request sabotage was carried out, but ... "we are not 37 years old" ... but it's a pity ...
        4. at84432384
          at84432384 19 October 2019 20: 51
          0
          Corruption, if desired, can always be carried out under the "political" articles of the Criminal Code. And this is true. The result is damage to the country, its economy and defense capability. How did we get the most powerful Western avilobi? It's very simple: Western aircraft manufacturers officially pay bonuses for the supply of their equipment to the officials who influenced it. We have this Prime Minister, the head of the Ministry of Industry and Trade, the head of the operating airline, even smaller bipods. Remember how Medvedev, after the TU-134 disaster, took all the carcasses out of service the very next day ?! The investigation has not yet begun. I felt I will. And how many Boeings and Airbuses crashed after that? And nothing! Top officials are not responsible for their misconduct. Absolutely. And impunity breeds new crimes.
      2. Bad thing
        Bad thing 26 September 2019 23: 57
        0
        Then it turns out that the business is in uniform, because OCD is a design bureau, and the series is already money for the plant.
      3. mikle1999
        mikle1999 16 October 2019 21: 22
        0
        You might think that there is an opportunity to make a series. And this is a fallacy. An example of the same superjet showed. Or with helicopter engines. To make a series of little assembly production, it is necessary that there are no plugs along the entire chain. And she is long.
    2. Dart2027
      Dart2027 25 September 2019 20: 17
      +4
      Quote: mark1
      And for some reason we cannot somehow organize a truly mass large-scale production

      There is a KB. The designer works in it. They need to live on something. The cruiser / corvette / frigate was designed, it turned out to be successful and it was launched into the series - 20 pieces. The construction will last about 10 years and all this time the design bureau will solve minor issues ... And get a penny.
      At first glance, everything is logical - people are paid for the work, and if there is no work, then there is no money, but!
      Employees of the design bureau, just scatter in different sharashka, simply because wait until the new project for years, but there is a need now. And after 10 years, a handful of specialists will remain in the design bureau who physically will not be able to master the new project, and they will have to recruit graduates who can do nothing.
      I explain right away that when I say "they can't do anything" I mean any students, regardless of how they were taught and how they studied - the university gives general knowledge, but they become a real specialist already at an enterprise, where a person gets practical knowledge and delves into particular, and this is several years.
      The result is a delusional situation - designers must lobby more and more new projects in order to preserve the design school.
      What to do?
      In my opinion, it is necessary to have 3-4 ships on which new solutions and technologies are being tested, as eternal stands, and to start up a series of used technologies, according to the principle "you don't need better, you need more."
  2. tlauicol
    tlauicol 25 September 2019 06: 37
    0
    But there is still the modernization of the BOD and the Orlan - it also takes forever. money is being spent, time is running out, ships are getting old. And also MiGs, Carcasses, etc ...
    1. Romario_Argo
      Romario_Argo 25 September 2019 15: 50
      +1
      They said that IPC 1124M Albatross will modernize
      BUT, there is also a suspicion of cannibalism of GSU for RTOs under construction, etc. 22800
      by the way, the engines "in reserve" can also be removed from the MRK Ovod, and the hulls can be written off due to wear
  3. Sahalinets
    Sahalinets 25 September 2019 06: 59
    +6
    Well. here the calculation is simple - it’s better to have at least some ships than none. Given the problems with the engines for karakurt, there is no particular choice here.
    Although for Pacific Fleet vessels less than 2000 tons are as if limitedly useful ...
    1. TermNachTer
      TermNachTer 25 September 2019 19: 17
      +1
      Well, so no one was going on long hikes. Behind relatively not far, overseas - samurai. And they have real presentations.
  4. Polinom
    Polinom 25 September 2019 07: 00
    +10
    In the Kamchatka flotilla they were held to strike at DESO forces.
    For some time, the task was to destroy the RLD ship from the AMG.
    Refused.
    Even, before them, there was an attempt to use the RK pr.205 in the Kuril Islands. There was such a great trip. This is out of despair after the US Flitex-82 exercise.
    Then they were repaired for a long time.
    And in itself, a boat in the near zone is not bad at all.
  5. Brylevsky
    Brylevsky 25 September 2019 07: 03
    +4
    The memoirs of one of the surviving sailors of MRC "Monsoon", published in one of the coastal newspapers: "The ship burned, melting, like plasticine ...".
  6. SVD68
    SVD68 25 September 2019 07: 08
    +4
    The title raised the correct question. But the answer in the article was never given.
    Why are they armed with subsonic Uraniums and not supersonic Onyxes? After all, there is experience with Nakat. Have you adopted a new tactic for using RTOs? They are no longer intended to be used against warships of the main classes?
    1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
      Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 07: 50
      +12
      Uranus is smaller, but better suited for local conflicts, and is cheaper to use as a target for naval air defense. On each of the fleets, 1 ship is made to launch target missiles at the Uranus base. For the KFL and the Black Sea Fleet, they are completing the construction of two "Lightnings", for the Pacific Fleet, the "Smerch" was modernized. Because the Navy needs something to replace the old missile boats with the Termit anti-ship missile system, which are now used as targets for training anti-aircraft firing. Yes, and the carrier of light anti-ship missiles for the destruction of minor targets will not hurt. The small missile ship "Smerch" has undergone modernization, which significantly increased its strike capabilities, instead of 6 missiles "Malachite" on it 16 "Uranov". Ammunition "Uranov" at "Smerch" is two times more than that of the corvette of the project 20380, there are problems with air defense, but it can go under the cover of air defense of the corvette.
      1. venik
        venik 25 September 2019 09: 20
        +6
        Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
        Uranus is smaller, but better suited for local conflicts, and it is cheaper to use it as a target for naval air defense

        =========
        Well, it depends on WHAT "local conflict"! If we take the 08.08.08 conflict, the Georgian patrol boat and one "Wasp" was enough !!!
        Overall, 12 Onyx is MUCH more serious than even 16 Uranus! This already may pose a serious threat to the AUG ... And for frigates or destroyers - so - generally a "pipe" !!! Indeed, unlike the subsonic "Uranus", the supersonic "Onyx" (and even maneuvering on the approach, and distributing targets between missiles of the same salvo - the target for air defense is much more DIFFICULT !!
        1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
          Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 11: 05
          -4
          If we take the 08.08.08 conflict, the Georgian patrol boat and one "Wasp" was enough !!!

          The Georgian Navy was armed with two missile boats: one donated by Greece "Dioscuria" (Combattante II class) and the second, "Tbilisi" (Soviet-built missile boat under the 206MP project). Both stood in the port of Poti, where they were blown up on 13 on August, when Russian troops entered the city. Prior to this, Tochka-U hit the port. There were casualties from both civilians and the police, but 5 sailors of the Georgian Navy, including an officer, died precisely from the Tochka-U missile. The Navy itself did not have other losses.
          1. garri-lin
            garri-lin 25 September 2019 13: 43
            +1
            Tobish shot nowhere? And as many as three times?
            1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
              Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 14: 08
              -2
              Georgian missile boats were not going to intercept our ships, because were not on the go. Former Georgian Navy says they did not go to sea.
              1. garri-lin
                garri-lin 25 September 2019 15: 31
                0
                So it was not rocket. It was a scout the size of a scow.
                1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
                  Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 16: 00
                  -1
                  Without accurate data, we will now begin to guess, and this is a thankless task. The fact is that the missile boats of the Georgians were not there.
                  1. garri-lin
                    garri-lin 25 September 2019 16: 41
                    +1
                    It’s a pity that I don’t have a habit of preserving proofs. Infa was. Reprint from a Georgian source, even with names.
                    1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
                      Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 17: 28
                      0
                      About the fact that they shot it for sure. Photo MRK "Mirage" during the call to Novorossiysk, August 2008 year. It seems that they even got into the mobilized fishing seiner of the Georgian Coast Guard. But the data on the losses of the Georgian Ministry of Internal Affairs (to which the Coast Guard is subordinate) were not officially published. I meant that there were no Georgian missile boats there, and there is no information about the sinking of the Georgian patrol boat. hi
                      1. garri-lin
                        garri-lin 25 September 2019 18: 09
                        +2
                        The fact that they shot it for sure. I myself heard the sounds of shots being on the coast in Abkhazia. And I saw how a group of ships in the amount of a few pieces left the horizon and approached the coast at a distance of about 6-8 km, they stalled the course. 5 minutes after the shots. Since I was with children I could not watch. And stupidly made legs.
                      2. loki565
                        loki565 25 September 2019 20: 13
                        0
                        Perhaps this video is from that Mirage, but it’s not accurate)))
          2. maidan.izrailovich
            maidan.izrailovich 26 September 2019 16: 04
            0
            Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
            Both stood in the port of Poti, where they were blown up on August 13 ...

            What are you doing? crying
            And with whom then the Black Sea Fleet ships fought?
            In the patrol area of ​​the Russian ships, 5 unidentified boats operating at high speed were discovered (according to more recent data, 1 hydrographic boat, 3 patrol boats and 1 Dioscuria missile boat (Combatant-2 type, received from Greece, armed with 6 RCC Penguin MK2 "), Tail number 303), which violated the border of the security zone declared by Russia and did not respond to warnings, - Georgian boats went to rapprochement with the ships of the Black Sea Fleet. ....
            Then, at 18.41 p.m., Mirage missile launcher launched two Malachite cruise missiles from a Combatant-25 missile boat from a distance of 2 km. As a result of the hit of both missiles, the boat sank quickly.

            https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Российско-грузинский_бой_в_Чёрном_море
    2. venik
      venik 25 September 2019 09: 08
      -2
      Quote: SVD68
      Why are they armed with subsonic Uraniums and not supersonic Onyxes? After all, there is experience with Nakat.

      =========
      To be honest, this is also absolutely NOT CLEAR to me !!! Why did you decide to stop at only one "Nakat" (pr. 1234.7) ?? The armament turned out oh-ho-ho! 12 TPK "Onyx" - this is "not khukhry-muhry" for you!

      In addition, given that TPK "Onyx" are compatible with UVP "Kvlibr-NK", a rather curious "picture" emerges ... But perhaps it was considered too long, complicated and expensive "pleasure" to rearm the old ships (there would be electronic "stuffing" would have to be seriously "upgraded") ....
      1. Serg65
        Serg65 25 September 2019 10: 16
        +9
        Quote: venik
        Why did you decide to stop at only one "Nakat"

        Because soon after the "meeting with the UFO," they decided to transfer the "Roll-up" to an experimental ship ... specifically for testing those Onyxes!
        The topic of the article is not clear to me at all, RTOs are being modernized only for launching target missiles based on Uran UCC! But some lovers of conspiracy theories saw this as unclear what!
        And yet ... well, this is already to the author, Roman, I consider the actions of Rear Admiral Golovko to be correct and reasonable! AMG alloy was used in all fleets of the world at that time, why did you decide that this was a big drawback for the 1234th project?
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 25 September 2019 15: 34
          +2
          Quote: Serg65
          AMG alloy was used in all fleets of the world at that time, why did you decide that this was a big drawback for the 1234th project?

          EMNIP, the peak of AMG's popularity on ships fell on the 60s - early 70s. And in the 70s, fires started - and they began to leave light alloys. On the same Sheffield, as on all type 42 EMs, they abandoned the use of light alloys and switched to steel precisely based on the results of the analysis of incidents, accidents and disasters on the “light alloy” ships.
        2. AICEMAN1988
          AICEMAN1988 26 September 2019 11: 50
          +1
          The use of AMG alloys has become a disadvantage of all projects, without exception, where they were used. Fire hazard is not the only problem. The junction of steel and AMG is very weak, and it simply "tears". Plus, the potential difference between metals leads to electrolytic corrosion when in contact with sea water. Plus, after forty years of operation, AMG begins to simply crumble.
      2. TermNachTer
        TermNachTer 25 September 2019 19: 21
        0
        Firstly, the launchers for Onyx and Uranium are easily removable - you can see from the photo. Secondly, how to give target designation to onyx at a distance of about 800 km?
    3. 5-9
      5-9 25 September 2019 12: 24
      +3
      Why on the RTOs is an expensive supersonic 3-ton fool with 500 km of range? This is a weapon against EM-KR and all sorts of monsters such as AUG in general .... how can this boat reach them in the sea-okiyane? Hoping that they themselves will come to our shores is pleasant, but stupid.
      The "partners" have nothing at all, except for the analogue of Uranus and nothing ... they live.
  7. rocket757
    rocket757 25 September 2019 07: 10
    +5
    Mobile installation of coastal defense. In conjunction with everything else necessary, available, it will work!
  8. Ilya Sukhorukov
    Ilya Sukhorukov 25 September 2019 07: 26
    +8
    The next article was written on the basis of advertising brochures. There will be no other GDGD, there are 507 vehicles, which are not enough for new karakurt, Malachite has two types of guidance, radar and thermal, plus it is generally difficult to shoot down a rocket, AK-630M was on the ship initially, AK-176AM is shit, which there is no possibility of firing from the Condenser and the sight-backup. Modernization is extremely controversial.
  9. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
    Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 07: 56
    -1
    Balabin writes about the Stihl MRK that in December 2019, by order of the Russian Navy General Committee, the ship will be excluded from the Navy. Recycling is planned for 2020. I have no reason not to trust him. For the rest of the same type of RTOs, the question is, how many of their 25 assigned years did they complete in the service cycle (floated, spent the resources of the main, auxiliary, main equipment of devices and systems), and how much did they stand waiting for the cut? And so, modernization with an extension of 15 years of service life is carried out under the supervision of the designer.
    MRK "STILL" - GOING TO THE LAST WAY!

    https://balabin-1712.livejournal.com/25421.html
  10. Avior
    Avior 25 September 2019 08: 56
    +2
    But the main bonus is that Uranus can be used for ground targets, which automatically makes the RTOs a theoretical participant in landing operations, quite capable of supporting the landing.

    I don’t know where Roman determined it from.
    as if in other sources emphasize that it can not be used for ground purposes
    The main drawback of anti-ship missiles X-35 and complexes with their use is a narrow tactical niche. Missiles of this family can only be used for hitting surface targets. The specific trajectory of the flight and the characteristics of the radar homing do not allow the use of such weapons to attack ground targets. In the context of shipborne missile systems, this leads to the need to use separate systems to destroy ground targets. In certain situations, the subsonic speed of a rocket, which can increase the probability of its interception, can be a minus.

    https://topwar.ru/76289-protivokorabelnaya-raketa-h-35.html
    The main disadvantages include:

    insufficient flight range at which there is a danger of carrier entering the air defense zone;
    relatively low flight speed increases the likelihood of missile damage by air defense of the attacked ship
    the control system does not allow to hit coastal and ground targets.

    http://rbase.new-factoria.ru/missile/wobb/uran/uran.shtml
    Maybe someone will clarify the situation?
    1. vladcub
      vladcub 25 September 2019 13: 55
      +4
      Kamrad Avior, "where did Roman determine it from," and he will say: the opinion of MY sofa. The thing is that Roman is not an expert and used the first available data in his work. It would be great if this topic was covered by a specialist, otherwise how many sofas and so many opinions
    2. Yuriy Malyshko
      Yuriy Malyshko 9 October 2019 01: 04
      0
      Shooting "Uranami" is possible only at coastal contrasting radar targets (port facilities, cranes, fuel storage, etc.). What will capture the GOS on the edge of the coast!
      1. Avior
        Avior 9 October 2019 06: 34
        0
        Or an old abandoned rusty warehouse on the shore?
        The Indians, I remember fired at the tanks with fuel heated for the day, but there were infrared heads of the seeker.
  11. Operator
    Operator 25 September 2019 09: 30
    +1
    "We really don't have enough ships"- which ones?
    1. Livonetc
      Livonetc 25 September 2019 09: 42
      +8
      I will answer from the land "history".
      Before the war, there was a line of defense consisting of powerful fortifications.
      However, shortly before the start of the Second World War, it was considered obsolete and dismantled.
      They began to build a new line of fortifications and did not have time.
      But all is missing.
      Especially when compared with the Soviet fleet.
      And the Soviet Navy was missing a lot of things.
  12. Pavel57
    Pavel57 25 September 2019 09: 40
    +2
    Already a third article on this topic.
    What new have you learned -
    - Chinese engines.,
    - the presence of ARGSu X-35 "Uranus" (is it always good?).
    - - weak air defense even at the time of construction of the ships, which makes them dependent either on the cover of aviation or on air defense ships.
    1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
      Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 25 September 2019 12: 19
      +3
      Quote: Pavel57
      What new have you learned -
      - Chinese engines.,

      There will be Russian M507 diesel engines manufactured by the Zvezda plant in St. Petersburg, which are also equipped with XRNM Karakurt project MRKs. About Chinese diesel engines, the author apparently had in mind the RTOs of the 22800 Buyan-M project.
      Work on the modernization of the "Gadfly" has already begun. In April of this year, the Kingisepp Machine-Building Plant completed the repair of the main engine compartment of Rassvet MRK. At the end of 2018, the engines of the Iceberg and Geyser were put in order there. In Kamchatka, MRC Smerch is being repaired. MRC “Swell” of the Baltic Fleet, which has long been slow-moving, is waiting for a major overhaul of the main engine at the 33 shipyard.

      https://iz.ru/872211/aleksei-ramm-bogdan-stepovoi/ovod-dlia-gordosti-vmf-moderniziruet-malye-raketnye-korabli
  13. Operator
    Operator 25 September 2019 09: 46
    -1
    Quote: Livonetc
    all is missing

    What exactly?
  14. tivivlat
    tivivlat 25 September 2019 09: 57
    0
    The conclusion is one, the weapon allows RTOs to work in the ocean, but seaworthiness is not.
  15. certero
    certero 25 September 2019 10: 45
    0
    The practice of all fleets shows that large ships are more profitable than small ones. But Russia does not have money for large ships ...
  16. dgonni
    dgonni 25 September 2019 12: 24
    0
    The author did not touch on the main issue on this project! Namely WHO? Target designation will give them a distance of 250-300 km ?! Well, given their seaworthiness, then at the Pacific Fleet they will in fact be useful with target designation no more than half a year a year or even less!
  17. Ryaruav
    Ryaruav 25 September 2019 12: 29
    -5
    it’s all just like with the last supposedly investigations in different areas, the authorities are trying to show their activities on the one hand and at least somehow protect their patrimony (corvee, inheritance) from alien (partners) predators, because, as events have shown, our thieves' riffraff in the west is not needed this is the only reason why our homeland is alive
    1. Saul_Rhen
      Saul_Rhen 25 September 2019 19: 46
      -1
      Our homeland Rosiya

      You scorch a lot in your fight
  18. mik193
    mik193 25 September 2019 14: 22
    -2
    The last two paragraphs of the article - in the hole! The author is well done!
  19. Vladimir61
    Vladimir61 25 September 2019 14: 56
    0
    Who can bite the "Gadfly"?
    Whoever can, they will bite!
    Naturally, I want everything new and more, but if in the wallet there are only coins for "Doctor's", then for "Hunting", you have to count on until better times. And today, a bird in the hands is better than a crane in the sky.
  20. Pacifist
    Pacifist 25 September 2019 14: 58
    0
    Of course, with these dimensions it’s difficult to talk about a more advanced modernization ... although this butter is for bread, but there should be air defense of the ship. at least a numbed shell there or something close ... a wasp is already no way.
  21. yehat
    yehat 25 September 2019 17: 32
    +2
    the author, but where is the promised about air defense weapons?
    no detailed wasp problems, no change options - nothing
  22. Serhiodjan
    Serhiodjan 25 September 2019 23: 18
    +2
    We may not really need aircraft carriers, but we need a destroyer.
    And why should the whole world laugh at them? However, a car with a jerk this can not be taken away.
    That project of the leader as it is, looks very decent, size, weapons, nuclear installation are all on the level.
    I am sure that our fleet will go along this path, choose the construction of destroyers but not aircraft carriers.
  23. phair
    phair 26 September 2019 00: 17
    0
    The eastern shipyard is being built, not without problems, but being built. I saw her a week ago, the BOD will pull.
  24. The comment was deleted.
  25. storm
    storm 26 September 2019 05: 10
    0
    Accordingly, only six of the most "fresh" MRKs should be modernized and assembled in one place, preferably at the Pacific Fleet in a separate brigade.
    The remaining 6 "oldies" should be repaired and left to serve at the BF or KFL, another option is to form a brigade for the Azov flotilla out of them.
  26. Vyacheslav
    Vyacheslav 26 September 2019 10: 13
    +1
    Well, this is clearly a temporary measure. Now in terms of the "mosquito fleet" there is a clear emphasis on the Karakurt MRK. Perhaps the Buyan-M project will be modernized, but personally I do not see the need for this. The order for the first 18 Karakurt is just the beginning. I am sure that the total number of such "crumbs" will reach at least 48 pieces. for 4 fleets. These RTOs may well make any cruiser or destroyer feel hot on the windowsill. And a flock of 6 such ships will be very worried about the AUG, if the United States comes up with the idea of ​​approaching the range of a shot (now, by the way, the Onyx range has been increased to 800 km). In addition, the Karakurt can also carry the Caliber, which works well for ground targets. And the modernized Gadflies is a very correct decision, but, again, temporary. I think the calculation goes for about 15 years of operation, until Karakurt is riveted. So - GOOD MEN!
    1. dgonni
      dgonni 26 September 2019 13: 37
      0
      Yes it's good! The question of target designation hangs in the air! That is life! And considering life's revleys? Very hard. Even air defense is not the main problem!
    2. Cyrus
      Cyrus 27 September 2019 14: 36
      0
      They won’t arrange a damn thing, where cruisers and destroyers of MRK go, the path is ordered.
  27. Cyrus
    Cyrus 27 September 2019 14: 33
    0
    And what kind of ships did we need yesterday?
  28. Cyrus
    Cyrus 27 September 2019 14: 34
    0
    "... Not a bad idea. In general, the idea of ​​recreating a" mosquito "fleet with modern missiles looks very, very optimistic, and most importantly, unlike all the aircraft carriers and destroyers of terrible tonnage with nuclear propulsion systems, it is feasible ..." it is also useless.
  29. Egor2517
    Egor2517 30 September 2019 15: 09
    0
    "What's new in Russia? Nothing, stealing." And how do you like the creation of the Angara, which wasted a lot of money, but at the exit it turns out that such a rocket does not suit us, let's cut a new one. And no one will answer for the embezzlement, they shared with all the necessary.
  30. vredlo
    vredlo 30 September 2019 17: 39
    -1
    Quote: Ryaruav
    Our homeland Rosiya
    skip past you slept