In Crimea, consider the issue of the double name of the region: Republic of Crimea - Tauris

In Crimea, the issue of introducing a double name for the republic is being discussed. In addition to the word “Crimea” - the derivative of the Crimean Tatar word “Kyrym” - it is planned to use the Greek name “Tauris” to emphasize not only the multinational ethnic composition of the peninsula, but also historical aspects of this Russian region.

It turns out that the initiative to add the word Tauris to the current name of the Republic of Crimea was made by local Greeks.

The initiative was supported by the republican Council of Ministers. So, the deputy chairman of the Council of Ministers of the Republic of Crimea Georgy Muradov emphasized that the introduction of the second name is not excluded. Muradov made this statement during a symposium on the development of contacts between the Crimean peninsula and Greece.

Georgy Muradov noted that Russia already has precedents for double-named regions. For example, the Republic of Sakha - Yakutia, the Republic of North Ossetia - Alania. By analogy, the Republic of Crimea - Tauris may appear in the Russian Federation.

It is worth noting that previously there was a Tauride province in the Russian Empire and the Soviet Socialist Republic of Tauris in the 1918 year.

In Greece, the initiative of the Greek population of Crimea was welcomed with enthusiasm. At the same time, the official authorities of this country still refuse to recognize Crimea as part of the Russian Federation.

Comments

[Simargl]

Here's how (Tauris) will enter the former borders - and call it that. In the meantime, only the Crimea.

[Tatyana]

In Greece, the initiative of the Greek population of Crimea was welcomed with enthusiasm. Wherein Greek authorities still refuse to recognize Crimea as part of the Russian Federation.

Until Greece officially recognizes Crimea as Russian, no renaming - from a fool (!) As a result of a LOST political provocation in the future - do not rename Crimea !!!

With what income did the Greeks remember Tavrida? just now?! Who thought of that?

And in general, this is supposedly a pseudo-INNOCENT geopolitical proposal of the Crimean Greeks need to be removed from the agenda both in Crimea and in Russia - for the purposes of national security of both the Crimea itself and the whole of Russia!

Before TMV we live!

[Tatyana]

Minusoramwho are cons-minded to those who favor a united Russia for all peoples and against the provocative renaming of Crimea in Taurida in the future on the proposal of the Greek super-MINORITY with a population of as much as 0,13% - 2900 people - in Crimea, Apparently, she wants to separate the sovereign sovereign Russia in Crimea on a national basis!

Crimean Greeks would offer a similar renaming of administrative territory in the USA! It would be interesting to see what happened with these Greeks.

For the social laws of the historical disintegration of single states in the administrative-territorial division of it on a national basis have long been well known in geopolitics. This is a time bomb to disintegrate the entire sovereign state into small sovereign states with their subsequent colonization by more powerful countries.

It is noteworthy that such a national policy of the so-called. "American democracies" by playing the national card is designed by Washington not for use inside the United States, but just for use exclusively as an American export of its foreign policy to other countries for indigenous "useful idiots" in favor of the United States on the principle of "Divide! And rule!"

[Simargl]

Do not look for a black cat in a dark room, especially if it is not there

And for some reason I do not see a proposal to call Crimea Tavrida outside the Russian Federation. Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug Yugra is called and everything is fine.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Simargl

Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug Yugra is called and everything is fine.

You do not understand anything.

At firstwhere is Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug geographically located and where is Crimea located? These are completely different geographical locations of administrative territories. with completely different geopolitical meanings and historical past! You do not see internal dialectic differences between them, but you think like a metaphysician - only purely outwardly, superficially. Here you have a sophisticated mistake.
Second.

Quote: Simargl

And for some reason I don’t see an offer to call Crimea Tavrida outside the Russian Federation.

And at first this is not done right away. In diamat, there is a principle of gradual transition from simple to complex. To understand what it is, let me remind you of the "Overton windows". As a result, we get the following stages:
1. The name of Crimea was changed to Tauris with Greek historical roots at the initiative of local Greek nationalists in Russian Crimea.
2. Then the Greeks declare cultural autonomy in the Crimea.
3. Then the Greeks declare political autonomy in Crimea.
4. Then follow the separatist attempts of the Crimean Greeks to secede from Russia and the Republic of Crimea with the support of foreign states.
5. Etc.

TOTAL They got a historical mine of delayed action, exactly the same as it was during the formation of the USSR with the division of Soviet Russia into 15 national republics.
Well, where was this USSR, divided administratively-territorially into 15 Soviet republics of titular nationalities on December 26, 1991? Where is he? Prove to me that nothing has changed with Soviet Russia!

And you propose to look only under your feet and nevertheless still spar to step on the same historical rake as the Bolshevik-Leninists! History, in my opinion, has not taught you anything.

[maidan.izrailovich]

1. The name of Crimea was changed to Tauris with Greek historical roots at the initiative of local Greek nationalists in Russian Crimea.

You throw a tantrum without knowing the history of the origin of the name Tauris.
Greeks so called the peninsula by the name of the tribes Tauris living there. And no Greek nationalism in this matter (name) is not close.

[Shurik70]

And I immediately remembered how Leningrad was renamed.
Of all the proposed options, the most dybilny have been chosen.

[Olgovich]

Quote: maidan.izrailovich

You throw a tantrum without knowing the history of the origin of the name Tauris.

That's right.

Everything, as in the joke: "Rybonka, are you coming out? - Citizens, he called me s-th !!" (female)

Tauris is a RETURN to historical roots - to TIME NEWS- that’s what her Province was called -Taurideformed in 1784

PS. So Sevastopol, you can demand to rename it to something ... GREEK.

[Tatyana]

Quote: Simargl

And for some reason I do not see a proposal to call Crimea Tavrida outside the Russian Federation.

Quote: Olgovich

Tauris is a RETURN to historical roots — by the time of NEW RUSSIA — that was the name of its Province — Tauride, formed in 1784.

Quote: maidan.izrailovich

You throw a tantrum without knowing the history of the origin of the name Tauris.

All this is a WRITING OF HISTORY in favor of a national minority in the Russian Crimea with DELETING from it the LATEST history of the USSR / Russia. Those. it is conscious provocative distortion of recent history in favor of the Crimean Greeks.
Then logically will follow no other statements from the Crimean Greeks as statements about their occupation by the USSR and Russia!

So I advise you, through thoughtlessness, not to engage in political provocations against Russia.

[Olgovich]

Quote: Tatiana

All this is a WRITING OF HISTORY in favor national minority in the Russian Crimea with DELETING the LATEST history of the USSR / Russia from it.

Yeah, Catherine called the land of Tavrida ... in honor of the Greek minority! And Potemkin Tavichesky-in honor of .. Greeks.

Quote: Tatiana

Those. this is a deliberate provocative distortion of recent history in favor of the Crimean Greeks.

This is nonsense: WHAT .. Greeks ?!
This is the history of Russia! So then they called the cities of Novorossia in the 18-19 centuries: Sevastopol, Ovidiopol, Tiraspol, Melitopol, Mariupol, Odessa.

Quote: Tatiana

Then logically will follow no other statements from the Crimean Greeks as statements about their occupation by the USSR and Russia!

This TS "logic" is only for you! The Greeks never said that, NEVER! Remember this

Quote: Tatiana

So I advise you, through thoughtlessness, not to engage in political provocations against Russia

And my advice is, do not do nonsense!

[Tatyana]

Quote: Olgovich

Quote: Tatiana
So I advise you, through thoughtlessness, not to engage in political provocations against Russia

And my advice is, do not do nonsense!

Do not give me advice if you do not own the science of logic.

In the science of logic, the concept of "Tavrida" in its logical content is in no way identical - that is, absolutely not equal - to the concept of "Crimea".
The concept of "Tavrida" is included in the concept of "Crimea" as a PART in a WHOLE, and not vice versa.

At the same time, you are logically absolutizing - i.e. historically, you stick out a PART (the concept of "Taurida") of the WHOLE (the concept of Crimea ") and thereby change - distort - the general picture of the concept of world history, while the newest history remains in the background, drops out of sight and is leveled out.

It was in this methodological way that the history of Ukraine in Ukraine was replaced in the worldview and Russophobic zombies of the Ukrainian population were carried out during the decommunization of Ukraine against Russia.

The idea of ​​renaming Crimea to Taurida is also one field of Western ideological berries (methodological techniques) to distort the real history of the USSR, Russia, Ukraine, etc., leading to their subsequent dismemberment on ethnic grounds.

All this was laid down by the Americans in their Houston and Chicago projects against the USSR / Russia on the geopolitical collapse of our country and its destruction, some of which the USA has already completed - the USSR has already broken up. Now it is the turn of the collapse of the Russian Federation.
And you also follow in the wake of this hostile western course.

[Olgovich]

Quote: Tatiana

That you do not own the science of logic.
The concept of "Tavrida" is in no way identical in its logical content - that is, absolutely not equal - to the concept of "Crimea".
The concept of "Tavrida" is included in the concept of "Crimea" as a PART in a WHOLE, and not vice versa.

You are logically absolutizing - historically pushing out PART (the concept of "Tavrida") of the WHOLE (the concept of Crimea ") and thereby changing - distorting - the general picture of the concept of world history, while the newest history remains in the background and leveled out.
It was in this way that the history of Ukraine in Ukraine was replaced and Russophobic zombies of the Ukrainian population were carried out during the decommunization of Ukraine against Russia.

The idea of ​​renaming Crimea to Tauris is one field of Western ideological berries (methodological techniques) to distort the real history of the USSR, Russia, Ukraine, etc., leading to their subsequent dismemberment on ethnic grounds.

All this was laid down by the Americans in their Houston and Chicago projects against the USSR / Russia on the geopolitical collapse of our country and its destruction, some of which the USA has already completed - the USSR has already broken up. Now it is the turn of the collapse of the Russian Federation.

All-all-all!

I give up !!!

[Tatyana]

Quote: Olgovich

All-all-all! I give up !!!

However, in your minus, I can’t see this.
Okay! So be it - I accept your "surrender".

[Simargl]

Quote: Tatiana

1. The name of Crimea was changed to Tauris with Greek historical roots at the initiative of local Greek nationalists in Russian Crimea.

Greek nationalists there are a maximum of 3000 people, but the Crimean Tatars there are 100 times more almost. What is the influence of Turkey and Crimean Tatar nationalism?

Quote: Tatiana

2. Then the Greeks declare cultural autonomy in the Crimea.
3. Then the Greeks declare political autonomy in Crimea.

Turkey announced a lot? But she is closer, and there is a desire.

Quote: Tatiana

4. Then follow the separatist attempts of the Crimean Greeks to secede from Russia and the Republic of Crimea with the support of foreign states.

Well, give them (the separators) a boat, put everyone who wants to secede, and fill in the zemlytsev no matter how much you pity!

Quote: Tatiana

TOTAL They got a historical mine of delayed action, exactly the same as it was during the formation of the USSR with the division of Soviet Russia into 15 national republics.

Can i ask you? And Crimea - what status does it have now?

[Tatyana]

Quote: Simargl

Quote: Tatiana
2. Then the Greeks declare cultural autonomy in the Crimea.
3. Then the Greeks declare political autonomy in Crimea.

Greek nationalists there are a maximum of 3000 people, but the Crimean Tatars there are 100 times more almost. What is the influence of Turkey and Crimean Tatar nationalism?

Firstly. I laid out an analytical theoretical calculation-forecast according to scientific logic.
Secondly. I checked 0 and it turned out that the Crimean Greek Nazis have already had cultural autonomy since 2014. So there are no errors in the logical calculation.
Thirdly. You in the Russian Federation - in the Crimea - in addition to the Crimean Tatar nationalism, heated from abroad, is there also not enough Greek competitive with Tatar ?!

Quote: Simargl

And Crimea - what status does it have now?

The Republic of Crimea is a constituent entity of the Russian Federation, which is part of the Southern Federal District and the North Caucasus Economic Region. It was formed on March 18, 2014 as a result of the accession to the Russian Federation of a part of the Crimean peninsula, previously controlled by Ukraine.
If you want to rename the Crimean peninsula itself, then you can’t do without the national-political background in the history of the peninsula! In this case, you again fall into the demagogic international ethnic eclecticism and tautology (i.e. the movement of thought in a logical circle).
For example.
The priest had a dog.
He loved her.
She ate a piece of meat.
He killed her.
Buried in a hole
The inscription wrote:
"The priest had a dog
He loved her.
Etc. to infinity!

[askort154]

Simargle ... Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug Yugra is called and everything is fine.

You are apparently very young! Before the "Yeltsin era", there was the Tyumen region, which included the Khanty-Mansi national district.
After Yeltsin was under a strong boss, in Kazan he publicly mumbled - "... you can all take as much sovereignty as you take away .."
Immediately, "freemen" went to Russia. All the bureaucrats in power have desired their "sovereignty." The division of Russia went on, according to the principle of the collapse of the USSR.
Each "prince" desired to have his own "republic". Which led to the war in the Caucasus. There were those "willing" to create separate republics:
"Far East", "Siberian", "Ural", etc. It has become fashionable.
Realizing it, the authorities of the Russian Federation (then still a "little thinking thought" smoothed out this drunken Yeltsin nonsense, and instead of "republics", found
synonym - "autonomy". So the "autonomous okrugs" became fashionable.
Former Governor of the Tyumen Region Roketsky, pompously handed over the "key of the Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Okrug" to G. Filipenko (they came up with the "poetic" name "Yugra") The Tyumen region was split into parts, thereby increasing the entire administrative and bureaucratic superstructure, which was always insatiable. The income of the region remained the same, but at the "parasite" feeder - several times more.

[Simargl]

Quote: askort154

You are apparently very young!

Yes. Retirement is far away again

Quote: askort154

Before the "Yeltsin era", there was the Tyumen region, which included the Khanty-Mansi national district.

Is it true ?!

Quote: askort154

Realizing it, the authorities of the Russian Federation (then still a "little thinking thought" smoothed out this drunken Yeltsin nonsense, and instead of "republics", found
synonym - "autonomy". So the "autonomous okrugs" became fashionable.

You do not understand what happened? They divided and returned power over the small (not territorially).

Quote: askort154

The income of the region remained the same, but at the feeder of the "parasites" - many times more.

Even funnier: the region’s income has increased, but most of it goes to the federal budget, because bowels belong to the people.

[Chaldon48]

Tatyana, you are right with the names, you need to be careful with your names, considerable forces have come up against Russia and the slightest mistake can be expensive. There is an opinion to create a new Israel in the south of Ukraine, with the prospect of expansion into the territory of Crimea.

[210ox]

In general, I am against the administrative division of the republics, it creates nationalism.

[Zhan]

There is an opinion to create a new Israel in the south of Ukraine, with the prospect of expansion into the territory of Crimea.

Moreover, such a precedent already took place in 1947. The year before the creation of the state of Israel in May 1948.

[maidan.izrailovich]

The name Crimea is of Turkic origin. And it appeared at a time when the peninsula was part of the Golden Horde. Just then, at that time there was a mass migration of Turkic-speaking peoples to the peninsula. From which later the Crimean Tatar ethnic group was formed.
The name Crimea recalls the Crimean Khanate. This gangster entity was engaged in robberies on Slavic lands, the slave trade, murders and robberies. Therefore, it was eliminated under Catherine the Great.
We are not talking about the complete abolition of the name. This is a double name. And historically, this is the restoration of justice. The peninsula from ancient times was called Tavrida.
Moreover, in Russia there is a practice of double names of regions. Sakha-Yakutia, Ossetia-Alania, etc.
I see no reason to throw a tantrum about this.

[Chaldon48]

Well, yes, and then help the Greeks and peri-name Istanbul in Constantinople or go deeper into historical justice to peri-name it in Byzantium.

[RUSS]

Quote: Tatiana

Minusoryam, who put minuses to the participants who advocate a united Russia for all peoples and against the provocative renaming of Crimea in Taurida in the future on the proposal of the Greek super-MINORITY with a population of as much as 0,13% - 2900 people - in Crimea, apparently

Regarding the Greek name, for example, no one bothers that our country Russia is also the Greek name of the country, yes, yes!
It was under the influence of Greek (Orthodox) culture that we began to call as the Greeks called us not Russia, but Russia!

[pru-pavel]

I will correct it. In fact, the change in pronunciation of the name is of Greek origin. This is just a modified pronunciation of the word Rus. The very origin of the name Rus has the most likely Scandinavian origin. What data from Finno-Ugric and Scandinavian languages, Russian chronicles and some other data directly indicate.

[Chaldon48]

Lord, how many scientists and not so heads faced their foreheads about this, and so what? Nothing, one thing is clear Russia is Russia and nothing more!

[pru-pavel]

Russia is the self-name of the Varangian tribe is recorded in the tale of bygone years. Until the 14th century, Russia was called only the ruling elite, and not a country or people. You can watch lectures of the same academician of the Russian Academy of Sciences Zaliznyak. One of the most honored Russian philologists

[cormorant]

I fully agree with you. In addition to stupid renaming, it will also cost not small budget money. Strongly against any additions or renaming! If the extra money is left, let’s better kindergarten or build a school.
Maybe the Greeks renamed their island somewhere in honor of our historical friendship? I have not heard. The Greeks vote in the European Parliament for sanctions against us, and we will rename our territories in their honor. Well, is this not nonsense!

[Amin_vivec]

I myself am a quarter of the Crimean Greek, and I know the situation from the inside - so the Crimean Greeks are much more loyal to Russia "national minority" than the Crimean Tatars. When they talk in Crimea about the Crimean Tatar national autonomy, I just jar. For me, Crimea is Russian, Russian, imperial, but not Tatar. The Tatars here are an alien people.
The name "Tavrida" is not even a reference to the Greeks as such. You say that renaming is nonsense. Remember - a very recent dispute between Greece and Macedonia over its name))) Because of this "nonsense", no agreements were concluded, Macedonia could not enter NATO, it went up to an open confrontation, Greece did not recognize Macedonia as a state. The name Tavrida is a recognition of the rights to the Kherson region and the Odessa region - and this is no longer "nonsense" - this is all serious.

[cormorant]

And in the "beginning" lived the Scythians, then the Khazars, I century AD. BC, the Romans settled there, then many different settlers and invaders lived there, including the last Ukrainians, Russians living in the territories of the current country with the letter U ... Well, let's call Tmutarakan, a Russian name, in honor of the Russian principality, when there were fewer Greeks there Rus and Khazars. Choose any nationality or ethnicity.
For me, the name Crimea is associated with the final liberation of the peninsula, with the victories of Russian weapons and the blood of our grandfathers shed in the wars with the Turks.
As for the recognition of the rights to the Kherson region and the Odessa region, there is no need to rename them, these regions are traditionally Russian, everything has its time. The controversy of Greece and Macedonia is a bit from another opera. Although, just this argument and the typical Balkan temperament show that there should not be anything Greek in the name of the island.

[Amin_vivec]

I agree in part.
The automatic attachment of Crimea to the Crimean Tatars, which cannot be the titular nationality, and have any privileges from other peoples, for example, expanded powers in the representative bodies of the peninsula, the official status of the Tatar language, etc., is annoying. And the second name of Tauris is historically justified and, in my opinion, will not be completely superfluous. And for the rights to the Kherson region and Odessa region ... The agreement on friendship, cooperation and partnership between the Russian Federation and Ukraine is terminated by them ... It is high time to make a claim to the whole territory of Ukraine ... For starters, you can also apply to the Kherson region ...

[kapitan92]

Quote: Simargl

Here's how (Tauris) will enter the former borders - and call it that. In the meantime, only the Crimea.

In the Russian Empire, Tavria was called the fertile lands of the Tauride province adjoining from the north to Crimea with the cities of Alyoshka, Berdyansk, Genichesk, Melitopol and others, bounded from the west by the Kherson province, from the north - Yekaterinoslav.

I think it is not worth getting into the "depths" of the history of the peninsula, considering
ancient times, the Middle Ages, etc., but it is necessary to hold a referendum in Russia on a single voting day, and let the residents of the Republic of Crimea determine the name of the peninsula themselves.
The Republic of Sakha Yakutia received this name in 1991. The Republic of Crimea Tavrida sounds good, but this should be decided not in the "Kremlin", but by the population of Crimea.

[maidan.izrailovich]

There is no innovation in renaming.
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Таврическая_губерния
Tauride province is an administrative-territorial unit of the Russian Empire, the Russian Republic and the RSFSR. The province existed from October 8 (20), 1802 to October 18, 1921. Provincial city - Simferopol.
The Socialist Soviet Republic of Taurida (also known as the Tauride Soviet Socialist Republic) is a Soviet republic, de jure independent, de facto part of the RSFSR [1], proclaimed in Crimea on March 21, 1918.
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Социалистическая_советская_республика_Тавриды
Before the revolution, the name Tavria (Tauris) was more common than the Crimea.
In the Russian Empire, Tavria was called the fertile lands of the Tauride province adjoining from the north to Crimea with the cities of Alyoshka, Berdyansk, Genichesk, Melitopol and others, bounded from the west by the Kherson province, from the north - Yekaterinoslav.

[Piramidon]

I think that all the same Greek - "Tavrida" ("Tavria") is somehow closer to us than the Tatar "Kyrym".

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Piramidon

I think that all the same Greek - "Tavrida" ("Tavria") is somehow closer to us than the Tatar "Kyrym"

When this territory was annexed to the Russian Empire under Catherine the Great, this territory was called CRIMEA, and no one cared what it used to be called. That Crimea is called, so it was, is and will be Crimea.

[Piramidon]

Quote: tihonmarine

When this territory was annexed to the Russian Empire under Catherine the Great, this territory was named CRIMEA

Not the Crimea, but the Tauride province was annexed, if not mistaken.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Piramidon

Not the Crimea, but the Tauride province was annexed,

Of course Taurida Province but the Crimean Peninsula. This is what is written in the Kuchuk-Kainarzhi peace treaty (they could write beautifully)

Russian empire
will leave this Tatar nation, except for the fortresses of Kerch and Yenikol with their
counties and marinas that the Russian Empire followed
holds, all cities, fortresses, villages, lands and marinas in
Crimea and Kuban, her arms acquired, the land lying between
by the Berdoy River and Horse Waters and the Dnieper, also all the land to
Polish border between the Bug and Dniester rivers, excluding
Ochakov fortress with its old county, which is still beyond
The brilliant Porta will remain

[Piramidon]

Quote: tihonmarine

Of course Taurida Province but Crimea peninsula

It seems that no one suggests changing the geographical name of the peninsula, but only the name of the subject of the Russian Federation, which is located on this peninsula. Similarly, the Kola Peninsula does not cease to be Kola because the Murmansk region is located on its territory.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Piramidon

Not the Crimea, but the Tauride province was annexed, if not mistaken.

In general, I agree with your arguments. Crimea should remain Crimea, but be named, as in connection with the Russian Empire, the Tauride province of the Russian Federation, and not the Republic of Crimea.

[Tersky]

Quote: tihonmarine

That Crimea is called, so it was, is and will be Crimea.

The only question is by whom and when. In antiquity, Crimea was known as Taurica (Tauris). Since 1223, the Tauride Peninsula was ruled by the Mongols, and its administrative center was the city of Crimea, which later gave its name to the entire peninsula.

[maidan.izrailovich]

I think that all the same Greek - "Tavrida" ("Tavria") is somehow closer to us than the Tatar "Kyrym".

Definitely.

[tihonmarine]

Quote: maidan.izrailovich

Definitely

Sorry, but the people of the Tatar nation live in Crimea, they need to be respected, for them Crimea is hundreds of years like Crimea.

[Amin_vivec]

Do they live there alone? Are they the majority in Crimea? Should newcomers of the Tatars have a privileged position over other indigenous peoples of Crimea? Others that do not need to be respected?

[tihonmarine]

Quote: Amin_Vivec

Indigenous peoples of Crimea? Others that do not need to be respected?

Well, honestly, I knew that the Crimean Tatars swore an oath to Empress Catherine the Great, but I did not hear about other indigenous nations.

[German Titov]

As the Crimea will not be called, "Adnachno-Crimea". And in the photo, in my opinion, "Genoese fortress, on the border of Sudak and the New World"? In May, Donetsk, dialogue. Question: "Whose tomatoes?" Question: "Whose Crimea?" Answer: "Our". "So our tomatoes".

[Piramidon]

Quote: German Titov

And in the photo, in my opinion, "Genoese fortress, on the border of Sudak and the New World"?

The picture shows the castle "Swallow's Nest"

The stone castle did not appear at this place immediately. The first owner of the picturesque site was a retired general who built a wooden cottage here after the end of the Russian-Turkish war in the late 19th century. One of the subsequent owners of the estate, the merchant woman Rachmanin, demolished the old building and erected a wooden castle on the top of the cliff. It was she who came up with the illustrious name for the castle, which really resembled a nest of a brisk bird, accustomed to huddle in sheer cliffs.

The modern building of the castle in medieval Gothic style was built at the expense of the German magnate, Baron Stengel. In 1914, this architectural masterpiece passed into the hands of the merchant Shelaputin, who tried to make a restaurant out of it, but the institution brought only losses. After the death of the entrepreneur, several more owners changed.

[Avior]

It’s difficult to call it a castle.
A stylized house on a rock rather, from a distance, looks much better than close, however, everyone can have their own opinion on this.
I don’t know how the house on the rock reminded a swallow’s nest.

[Piramidon]

Quote: Avior

I don’t know how the house on the rock reminded a swallow’s nest.

Well, it’s not for me and you to discuss how the first owners called it a century and a half before your birth. Don't like it - call it your own way, but for your own use. For everyone else, it has always been and is - "Swallow's Nest" regardless of your wishes and objections.

[Avior]

For me, this is also a Swallow's Nest since childhood. And I didn’t seem to suggest another name for how you write. It is also ridiculous how to rename Crimea.

[Rwmos]

Count Bender-Transdanubia. Famously they dill brain washed - for 5 years Hohlyatskie show-offs did not disappear. Another Black Sea double name zafigarte. Black Sea - Pont Aksinsky. Nafig, too, is not necessary, except for sawing money on changing plates, but the show-off is even more clearly visible. Chernoaksinsky such a Pontomore mood

[Olya Tsako]

Like the Sheremetyevo-Airport named after Pushkin. Invalid name. Hollow holes burned so much money from the treasury for worthless contests and lascivious advertising.
What has taken root? The shame of agonizing inventors.

[RUSS]

Quote: RWMos

More Black Sea double name zafigarte

The modern name "Black Sea" was given by nomadic Turks who came here from Central Asia, who called it "Kara Deniz", but in the XIV century, in ancient Russian, Arab and Western sources it is referred to as the "Russian Sea", which is associated with its active the use of sailors from Russia.
So let's give a double name not the Pontus of Euxinus, but the Black Sea - Russian Sea !!!

[Tersky]

Quote: RWMos

Another Black Sea double name zafigarte.

If he, the sea, is given back the name that existed in the 10-14 centuries (in ancient Russian, Arabic and Western sources it is referred to as "Russian Sea"), I will not object at all.

[Fedor Sokolov]

It would be nice to return the historical name of Crimea "Russian Tavrida" and without any double names.

[Avior]

Correctly. And the Taman Peninsula to return the historical name of Tmutarakan
PS and "Russian Taurida" - such a name exactly existed?

[RUSS]

Quote: Avior

Correctly. And the Taman Peninsula to return the historical name of Tmutarakan
PS and "Russian Taurida" - such a name exactly existed?

Tmutarakan is not the name of Crimea, but the city which by the way was not in Crimea, but on the territory of modern Krasnodar Territory.

[Avior]

Tmutarakan was located on the Taman Peninsula and only partially in the eastern Crimea.
I wrote about it ....

[Zaval]

The idea of ​​dominating Crimea in Tauris, or Crimea - Tauris, belongs to the Greeks of Crimea, and to be precise, to the chairman of the Greek community Ivan (Janis) Shonus. He has been worn with this idea since 2014. Each time he expresses it and each time she does not find final support. The issue of renaming Crimea is a question, if not a referendum, then at least a public hearing and the support of the majority of Crimean residents. Crimean Greeks are not the largest diaspora and their idea of ​​renaming Crimea, to put it mildly, is not the most relevant for Crimeans and raises more questions than support and understanding. My opinion as a resident of the Crimea is definitely not, with all due respect to Janis Shonus, whom he once knew personally.

[Dym71]

Quote: ZAVal

The idea of ​​dominating Crimea in Tauris, or Crimea - Tauris, belongs to the Greeks of Crimea, and to be precise, to the chairman of the Greek community Ivan (Janis) Shonus.

In gives!
And he doesn’t want to change his name to Demis Roussos for a start?

[Tatyana]

Quote: ZAVal

He has been worn with this idea since 2014.. Each time he expresses it and each time she does not find final support. The issue of renaming Crimea is a question, if not a referendum, then at least a public hearing and the support of the majority of residents of the Crimea.

Agree with you! This idea is politically extremely slimy and smacks of a separatist national chauvinistic bias. Moreover, it has been expressed by the Greeks not sometime, namely since 2014!

Why, one wonders, the Greeks do not live quietly under the historically established name "Crimea" neutral for everyone ?!

[Reserve officer]

If the Greeks so want to change the names in other states, then I advise you to try to rename Istanbul to Constantinople. Or right away to Constantinople, so what a trifle ...

[RUSS]

Quote: Stock Officer

If the Greeks so want to change the names in other states, then I advise you to try to rename Istanbul to Constantinople. Or right away to Constantinople, so what a trifle ...

No, if we take the historical truth, then Istanbul must be renamed Byzantium.

[Reserve officer]

And I don’t mind. Byzantium is so Byzantium. Or, if you follow the presented logic of double names, Byzantium-Constantinople.

[Avior]

Greeks in Crimea make up as much as 0,13 percent of the population - 2900 people.

[maidan.izrailovich]

Greeks in Crimea make up as much as 0,13 percent of the population - 2900 people.

Tauris is a name from the Tauris. Which do not exist on the peninsula for many centuries.

[Vkd dvk]

Quote: Fedor Sokolov

It would be nice to return the historical name of Crimea "Russian Tavrida" and without any double names.

Of course, everything was decided, not only urgent, but also .... Why shouldn’t you use shit?

[Mcar]

... to emphasize not only the multinational ethnic composition of the peninsula, but also the historical aspects of this Russian region.

Yeah. And to emphasize the multinational composition of Russia and its historical aspects, it is necessary to rename the Russian Federation (or at least a large part of it) to Tartaria. Could not find smarter argument?

[kolkulon]

All the problems have already been solved, as I understand it. It remains only to rename.

[Olya Tsako]

You are 100% right. Airports renamed. Played a bugminton. Logger collected. Police-Police-Rosguard. Hogweed has been eradicated. The regional time was changed back and forth.
Killer whales were released for six months on all channels. They brought the forest to China, burned the rest ..
We move on to a four-day week (whom gastrebaytnry did not lose their job).
And forward to the victory of nihilistic surrealism of the brilliant creators of history.

[samarin1969]

If the Greek community folds and pays for all changes of plates and documents - then it is possible. In the meantime, and so there is something to spend money on.
The administrative itch of our "fathers" is clearly inappropriate.

[Lieutenant Colonel of the USSR Air Force in stock]

Looks like the remaining problems are absent in Crimea.

[Rusj]

Not that something is really not that site! He is not Russian. This is an Israeli site! You can understand and track everything. just started to pay attention

[Lord of the Sith]

Can. Historically, Tauris is Russian territory. And the Sumerians will come out with poison))

[Antares]

Quote: Lord of the Sith

Historically, Tauris is Russian territory. And the Sumerians will come out with poison))

if all other problems are solved, then we will rejoice.

[Svlad]

I personally, like my friends, do not need this Crimea

[dolfi1]

Beautiful, I always liked the name Tauris

[Dym71]

Quote: dolfi1

Handsomely

Who would argue
The hills of Tauris, a charming land -
I am visiting you again ...
I drink the languid air of voluptuousness
Like I hear a close voice
Long-lost happiness.
But now it seems that in Crimea, are there any other problems?

[Zeev Zeev]

And where are the Greeks from? They were deported in 1944 along with the Crimean Tatars, Bulgarians and Armenians from Crimea. Really come back?

[Cry]

Taurus is an extinct bull - tour. The last round in the 17th century was killed in Poland. The Republic of Crimea, a dead bull, will be transferred to foreigners, and in Kiev they will explain it this way.

[Cry]

Explain why, if you can?

[Graz]

Taurus it was such a people in the Crimea, along with the Goths and Scythians at one time

[maidan.izrailovich]

Taurus is an extinct bull - tour. The last round in the 17th century was killed in Poland. The Republic of Crimea, a dead bull, will be transferred to foreigners, and in Kiev they will explain it this way.

You yourself have come up with such stupidity. Or was the "mind" enough only to repeat someone else's?
In ancient Greek, the bull is really tavros (ταύρος). And any bull. Not just a tour.
But it has nothing to do with the name Tauris. The peninsula is named after the Tauri tribes who lived there.
Taurus (ancient Greek. Ταύροι) - the people who inhabited in ancient times the southern coast (mainly the mountainous part [1]) of Crimea, known at the same time as Taurica or Taurida (ancient Greek Ταυρίδα). Mentioned in the writings of Greek and Roman historians and geographers. The first mention is the VI century BC. e., the last - I century BC e. By this time they mixed with the Scythians and were usually called “Taurus Scythians” (Greek Σκυθοταύροι, Ταύροι Σκύθες, Ταυροσκύθες).

[Cry]

Taurus, Taurus, all one, tour - the primitive extinct bull, 180 cm at the withers with long horns, which tore everyone and everything in the Black Sea https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A2%D1%83%D1 % 80 _ (% D0% B1% D1% 8B% D0% BA)
From him went all the dead cowgirls around the world. Most importantly, the first mention of Herodotus? Tauris put skulls of enemies over the house to intimidate and commemorate victories. With these how to be?

[Tersky]

Quote: Choro

Taurus is an extinct bull - tour. The last round in the 17th century was killed in Poland.

They forgot to drag the mammoth here. My dog ​​has a pogonyalovo "Kuzma", but this did not make him a Prutkov. Taurus is the oldest of the Crimean ethnic groups, which has its own name.

[Cry]

Here is a link to the "History" of Herodotus, Book IV - Melpomene

103. The Tauris have such customs: they sacrifice to the Virgo of the wrecked mariners and all Hellenes whom they capture in the open sea as follows. First, they hit the doomed with a club on the head. Then, the body of the victim, according to some, is thrown off a cliff into the sea, for the sanctuary is on a steep cliff, their head is nailed to a pillar. Others, agreeing, however, regarding the head, argue that the Taurus do not throw the body off the cliff, but put it to the ground. The goddess to whom they make sacrifices, in their own words, is the daughter of Agamemnon Iphigenia70. With the captured enemies, the Taurus do this: the severed heads of the captives are carried into the house, and then, having stuck them on a long pole, they are set high above the house, usually above the chimney. These heads hanging over the house are, they said, the guardians of the whole house. Taurus live robbery and war.

[iouris]

No need to rename anything - this is Bandera syndrome.

[Laksamana besar]

The Tauris highway is there and this is enough.

[Old Michael]

Surely, most of the participants in the VO forum read Aksyonov's Island of Crimea.
So - not advice, and not even a wish, but only IMHO regarding utility:
- who has read it in samizdat - reread it. The perception of that time was inevitably associated with the sensation of touching the forbidden;
- read in the journal "Youth" for 1990 - re-read from other sources (there were significant notes in the journal);
- those who have read the versions published on "wide-mouth" Internet resources before 2014 - reread (after the crash there were copyright edits);
- those who read it for the first time in any version after 2014 - reread it. Try to do it as if the USSR still exists and the stupid question "Whose Crimea?" not yet.

It turns out that this is not about Crimea at all, and not about any geographical island / peninsula. And the title issue will seem like an attempt to divert attention from more significant issues.

[Alex Justice]

Do not waste time on “Island Crimea” and other books by Aksyonov. Nothing special. I read and forgot.

[Minato2020]

You can earn money on renaming when replacing seals, names, signs
Something in the Crimea somehow is not very, as we would like ...
Crimean showdown - http://kara-dag.info/kto-privatiziroval-krym/
http://kara-dag.info/sejlem-krym/

[Zliy_mod]

I think everything is much deeper here. Renaming the Crimea will allow to separate the Russian Crimea-Tauris from the Ukrainian Crimea, i.e. officially in all countries of the world Crimea is registered in Ukraine. And including the ban on banking operations and other types of economic activity are severely limited on the peninsula. Renaming will make it possible to smooth the corners precisely in international relations, and the Greeks, Taurus, Genoese and Tatars here are already a trailer.

[Reserve buildbat]

That is why the Greeks, who consider Crimea Usrainsky, support renaming.

[fruit_cake]

rename Ukraine to Russia, Russia to Tartaria

[Amin_vivec]

Ukraine to Russia, and Ukrainians to Russian?

[Errr]

In addition to the word "Crimea" - a derivative from the Crimean Tatar word "Kyrym" ...

For a very long time, the Russian language has had the root KROM, which means a defensive fence. Hence the cognate words KROMka, ZAKROM, UKROMny. Chances are high that the TEMPLE, CHOROMAS, etc. STORE, KEEP, PROTECTION are also modified derivatives from the root KROM. And now let's take a closer look [listen to] the "Tatar" CRIMEA (KYRYM) ...) Is it worth it after all this to fence a garden with Taurida?

[rocket757]

This is a fundamental question ??? Or do they want to expand ethno tourism?

[bald]

If someone had a desire of this kind, I see in these, by the way, normal people, visitors to the Hermitage, Peterhof, the Armory in Moscow - there is a desire, yes call it, only we were born before CRIMEA, and we remember Taurica - there’s nothing to do about the bazaar - you would be historians (not you, of course), changed the psychology of people - in the normal direction.

[Reserve buildbat]

Yeah. The republic of kyrym is horse mackerel.
What ... again, the autumn aggravation hit the wrong place?

[Operator]

To knock the local Council of Ministers on the head and close the question.

[Cry]

For everyone who has not read the "History" of Herodotus, I quote item 103 from Book IV - Melpomene

103. The Tauris have such customs: they sacrifice to the Virgo of the wrecked mariners and all Hellenes whom they capture in the open sea as follows. First, they hit the doomed with a club on the head. Then, the body of the victim, according to some, is thrown off a cliff into the sea, for the sanctuary is on a steep cliff, their head is nailed to a pillar. Others, agreeing, however, regarding the head, argue that the Taurus do not throw the body off the cliff, but put it to the ground. The goddess to whom they make sacrifices, in their own words, is the daughter of Agamemnon Iphigenia70. With the captured enemies, the Taurus do this: the severed heads of the captives are carried into the house, and then, having stuck them on a long pole, they are set high above the house, usually above the chimney. These heads hanging over the house are, they said, the guardians of the whole house. Taurus live robbery and war.

[askort154]

It is worth noting that previously there was a Tauride province in the Russian Empire and the Soviet Socialist Republic of Tauris in the 1918 year.

Each government changes history to please its political ambitions.
Now someone wants to forget the shed blood of our great-grandfathers, grandfathers and fathers for the Crimea, not for Taurida. This theme from the same opera as the role of the USSR in the Great Patriotic War against fascism, in the 21st century is reduced to the West to "0". The modern Western generation is confident that the USA and England won the victory over Germany in 1945. Unfortunately, we are losing the information war in the 21st century. And this is understandable. Their capabilities are many times greater than ours (the media) We can win by bringing only truth and justice.

[APASUS]

Caught a disease from Ukraine? What name doesn’t suit you or have already solved all problems

[Petrol cutter]

Who is he discussing with? This is the first time I personally hear about such an urgent and topical issue.
And in Crimea, for an hour, they don’t want to discuss the cost of an hour of work of assemblers, welders at shipyards ?!
They do not want to discuss, why do qualified specialists get less than laborers at a construction site? A handyman less than a thousand a day will not go to your work (it's clean, on hand). We have one hundred and eleven an hour (it's dirty). Who will build the steamboats with such a tariff tariff ?!
The funny thing is that during the time that I spent on construction sites, I became a pretty good finisher. But how the handyman will collect the removable sheet of the engine room tomorrow is a big question.