Military Review

US State Department Approves F-35 Fifth Generation Fighter Sale to Poland

104
The United States Department of State approved the delivery of the fifth generation F-35 fighter to Poland. This was reported by the US Department of Defense Agency for Security and Defense Cooperation.


US State Department Approves F-35 Fifth Generation Fighter Sale to Poland


The US State Department has decided to approve the sale to Poland of 32 of the latest fifth-generation F-35 fighters, associated equipment and 33 F-135 turbojet engines developed by Pratt & Whitney. The total amount of the deal is $ 6,5 billion. This notice went to the US Congress, where it must be considered within 30 days with a final verdict on the sale. The beginning and timing of the proposed delivery are not given.

As the US administration said, the proposed sale of F-35 fighters to Poland "will help the goals of US foreign policy and national security and NATO allies."

The proposed sale of F-35 will give Poland significant defense potential to repel aggression in the region and ensure the principle of interoperability with the US military
- The Pentagon said in a statement.

As previously stated in the Ministry of National Defense of Poland, the latest American F-35 fighters should replace the MiG-29 and Su-22 countries that are already in service with the Soviet-built. At the same time, the Pentagon suggests that Warsaw will not have difficulties with the integration of American aircraft into the Polish armed forces.
104 comments
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  1. Nycomed
    Nycomed 11 September 2019 21: 23
    +3
    Will Poland have "pendenzi" for such "happiness"? lol laughing
    1. Lbt21
      Lbt21 11 September 2019 21: 48
      -3
      Have a desire to help finance?
      1. Nycomed
        Nycomed 11 September 2019 21: 51
        +2
        I just asked a question.
        1. Thunderbolt
          Thunderbolt 11 September 2019 21: 58
          +10
          This is their semi-annual military budget.
          Payment will be made in parts, pulled.
          1. dirk182
            dirk182 12 September 2019 02: 51
            +5
            It's right. For 2019, they increased the defense budget to $ 11.44 billion. Moreover, this implies a serious increase in costs in subsequent years. No matter how "funny" it is, it's sad, but their economies are showing stable growth. Why not buy if you have something. Last year the contract for the Patriot PAC-3, this one for the F-35.
        2. Lbt21
          Lbt21 11 September 2019 22: 40
          -14
          I’m just used to counting my money!
    2. Irbenwolf
      Irbenwolf 12 September 2019 09: 52
      -1
      Germany will pay a contribution.
      1. keeper03
        keeper03 12 September 2019 17: 53
        +1
        Well, if such a booze started, meet Cuba - Su-57 !!! laughing fellow soldier
    3. Speedy
      Speedy 12 September 2019 11: 25
      -1
      In general, as long as NATO exists, these are all graters for the distribution of costs. What difference does it make to us whose, in the event of war, at the Polish airfields f35, Polish or American, or else whose.
  2. Magic archer
    Magic archer 11 September 2019 21: 24
    -10
    Where did the money come from psheks ??! They rose at the expense of Europe in the 90 years, are not producing anything at the moment (not counting agricultural products). Or will they give a loan for them? Again, 35 spare parts, operation and armament are very cheap.
    1. kjhg
      kjhg 11 September 2019 21: 36
      +17
      Poland has developed very well all these years after joining the EU. The main merit is of course here in loans. But they were not plundered, as is often the case, but invested in the development of infrastructure. Now there are no worse roads than in Germany. A huge role in the development of Poland was played by investments. Many industries were transported from Western Europe to Poland. The standard of living and incomes of citizens have become higher than in Russia. Therefore, the Poles allow themselves to invest such a lot of money in defense.
    2. Town Hall
      Town Hall 11 September 2019 21: 43
      -6
      Quote: Magic Archer
      Where does pshek get money ??!

      Where are the 32 aircraft of the 5th generation in "rich" Russia?
      1. Andrey Chistyakov
        Andrey Chistyakov 11 September 2019 21: 46
        -2
        Quote: Town Hall
        Quote: Magic Archer
        Where does pshek get money ??!

        Where are the 32 aircraft of the 5th generation in "rich" Russia?

        Here they write about Poland. More attentively ...
      2. figwam
        figwam 11 September 2019 21: 53
        -2
        Quote: Town Hall
        Where are the 32 aircraft of the 5th generation in "rich" Russia?

        Does Poland have their own or were they allowed to buy?
        1. Town Hall
          Town Hall 11 September 2019 22: 03
          -5
          What a difference. The fact that supposedly poor Poland has them. And the super duper is promoted - rich Russia doesn’t. It very much resembles criticism from the owner of his neighbor Lada and his sparkling Mercedes)
          1. abc_alex
            abc_alex 11 September 2019 23: 55
            +8
            Quote: Town Hall
            What a difference. The fact that supposedly poor Poland has them. And the super duper is promoted - rich Russia doesn’t. It very much resembles criticism from the owner of his neighbor Lada and his sparkling Mercedes)


            They are not here. Maybe they will, or maybe not. But even if they are, what are you proud of? That you were allowed to buy a squadron of US-made aircraft? Maybe try to be proud of something that you know how to do yourself? Once Poland knew how to make good planes herself, what can she do now, besides the war with monuments?
            Even if we have problems with the production of the Su-57 - these are our problems with the production of our aircraft. But what can the Poles do themselves? Clean the toilet in England? Demolish a monument to Soviet soldiers? To expose oneself without being shamed for universal ridicule once again?
            winked
          2. Rostislav
            Rostislav 12 September 2019 08: 25
            +1
            Not yet. While they are awaiting permission for the deal. Of course they will. Penguins do not refuse money. And they have not yet stuttered about the delivery time. So it's too early to shout that they "... already are."
          3. 5-9
            5-9 12 September 2019 08: 55
            0
            Do you already have it ??? Or will the supply last for years?
          4. Ka-52
            Ka-52 13 September 2019 05: 50
            -2
            Town Hall (Town Hall) September 11, 2019 22:03
            What a difference. The fact that supposedly poor Poland has them. And the super duper is promoted - rich Russia doesn’t. It very much resembles criticism from the owner of his neighbor Lada and his sparkling Mercedes)

            Your opponent has the right to ask the question "where does the money come from?" But your scream resembles the cry "himself durak". Or in the common people it is called to throw the arrows.
            ps The topic of putting the Su-57 into operation has been discussed for so long, it is already clear "what, when and why", and it seems that inadequate commentators should have ended. But apparently not everything is over
      3. Vladimir_6
        Vladimir_6 11 September 2019 22: 16
        0
        Where are the 32 aircraft of the 5th generation in "rich" Russia?

        So Poland does not yet.
        The beginning and dates of the proposed delivery are not given.

        When they put it, then we’ll count.
        1. Town Hall
          Town Hall 11 September 2019 22: 17
          -2
          Quote: Vladimir_6
          Where are the 32 aircraft of the 5th generation in "rich" Russia?

          So Poland does not yet.
          The beginning and dates of the proposed delivery are not given.

          When they put it, then we’ll count.

          This is called-save knocking the ball out)
        2. Town Hall
          Town Hall 11 September 2019 22: 22
          -3
          Quote: Vladimir_6
          The beginning and dates of the proposed delivery are not given

          At VO they may not be given. And in the rest of the world, they are given.
          The first fighter-bombers of the fifth generation F-35 Lightning II produced by the American aircraft manufacturer Lockheed Martin will appear in the Polish air force by 2024, and by 2026 the country will be able to form a full-fledged squadron of these aircraft, during an international military exhibition in the Polish city of Kielce said Vice President of Lockheed Martin Greg Ulmer, according to Polish Radio
          .
          The first 16-by 2025. The rest-by 2030. And there is no doubt that Lockheed will put them on time. This is not the UAC)
          1. Vladimir_6
            Vladimir_6 11 September 2019 22: 35
            -1
            The first 16 by the year 2025. the rest by 2030.

            And in Russia, the latest fifth-generation fighter Su-57 launched into serial production.
            "A long-term contract has been signed with the Ministry of Defense for the supply of more than 70 aircraft,"
            The contract, signed on the recently passed Army-2019 form, envisages the delivery of 76 Su-57s until 2028. https://pravdoryb.info/su-57-poshel-v-seriyu-178325.html
            1. Town Hall
              Town Hall 11 September 2019 22: 42
              -2
              Quote: Vladimir_6
              And in Russia, the latest fifth-generation fighter Su-57 launched into serial production

              Of course .. bake like hot cakes.
              Quote: Vladimir_6
              Signed a long-term contract with the Ministry of Defense for the supply of more than 70 aircraft, ”

              Yeah .. let's see what they deliver faster .. 2500 Armat or 70 Su-57)
              1. Vladimir_6
                Vladimir_6 11 September 2019 22: 44
                +4
                Yeah .. let's see what they deliver faster .. 2500 Armat or 70 Su-57)

                We will live to see 2030, be sure to see.
          2. Voyager
            Voyager 11 September 2019 23: 39
            +6
            And when was the UAC last time breaking deadlines for fighter shipments?
          3. 5-9
            5-9 12 September 2019 08: 56
            0
            For 10 years, either donkey (Poland) or padish (USA) will die ...
    3. VVAUSH
      VVAUSH 11 September 2019 22: 08
      -3
      I read it today. Other approaches to economics. Therefore, growth.

        > About the economy of Ukraine. https://echo.msk.ru/blog/v_inozemcev/2499311-echo/ The Ukrainian economy was challenged by a serious rupture of economic ties with Russia. Trade turnover fell from $ 39,6 billion in 2013 to $ 15,0 billion in 2018. Ukraine stopped buying gas from Gazprom in November 2015 and faced the loss of a significant part of its industrial potential (in the temporarily occupied territories in 2013, about a quarter of industrial production was produced). And also with the need to divert huge resources to confront the aggressor (the defense budget grew from 14,8 billion hryvnia in 2013 to 163 billion in 2018). Despite all this, according to the results of the second quarter, Ukraine this year recorded the highest GDP growth over the past three years at 4,6% compared to the same period last year; at the same time, salaries increased by 10%, investments in fixed assets - by 17,8%, and the volume of work performed in construction - by 21,2%.
      1. Non liberoid Russian
        Non liberoid Russian 12 September 2019 04: 56
        +2
        the increase in GDP is only an increase in migrant workers' translations ... salaries have grown - so it’s understandable, there’s no one to work on, so they are raised so that the last horses do not scatter across Russia and Europe ... investment in fixed assets is a sale of shares, the same Sich motor for example ... and the construction)))) so finished construction 2-5 years ago and that's it, growth ... so there’s nothing to rejoice about)))) and the fact that the military expenses were raised so this guano is complete ... raised due to the devaluation of the hryvnia, in bucks it turns out many times less, and raised due to what? social programs and loans, rather than the growth of domestic production. that’s all the approaches. read on the echo and not surprise you by playing numbers and blurring your eyes
    4. Phenomenon
      Phenomenon 12 September 2019 22: 23
      0
      I talked with my acquaintances Poles, they are very sorry that they did not join the "Customs Union" and the CSTO.
  3. Irokez
    Irokez 11 September 2019 21: 26
    -3
    It seems to me that they will not sell, but only they look.
    Such a plane is near the borders with Russia, and suddenly something will fall by accident.
    1. Nycomed
      Nycomed 11 September 2019 21: 30
      -1
      And let it fall. Polish will not fall, so take it from another place. Soon they will be half the world. This is not an F-22.
  4. Lord of the Sith
    Lord of the Sith 11 September 2019 21: 29
    0
    Khan of Poland, in bondage))
  5. Shrek
    Shrek 11 September 2019 21: 34
    -12
    No matter where the Poles got the money. It is important that they have an F-35. They wiped their nose on everyone, including Turkey. And yes, the Poles will have fifth-generation fighters more than two-three times that of the Russian Federation. Where did the Poles get the money from? There is another question - where is the money of Russia from the sale of resources, if little Poland again wiped her nose with her big brother!
    1. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 11 September 2019 21: 38
      +1
      Here we must understand the moment, Poland will not have its F-35, but there will be American, for which it will pay a lot of money.

      Unlike other countries that participated in the development of the F-35, Poland will be milked in full.
      1. n0001
        n0001 12 September 2019 00: 10
        -3
        This is the maximum price. After negotiations, the price drops by about 50%
      2. Ilya Melnov
        Ilya Melnov 12 September 2019 05: 03
        -1
        Quote: Lord of the Sith
        Here we must understand the moment, Poland will not have its F-35, but there will be American, for which it will pay a lot of money.

        Unlike other countries that participated in the development of the F-35, Poland will be milked in full.

        oh dear god, ale, half the world is bought by fighters and Nitsche, f35 is a replacement f16 do not carry a blizzard about bondage, half of the annual budget of military Poland, so just say, they say your fifth point is burning up ... wassat
    2. Astra55
      Astra55 11 September 2019 22: 09
      +8
      Quote: Shrek
      Poland again wiped her nose ..

      Kindergarten.
      Tomorrow the teenager will buy the coolest iPhone for Daddy’s money and tell everyone that he wiped his nose on Alisher Usmanov and Mikhail Fridman. Because he has such a miracle, and they again no. laughing

      Everything is considered in the complex. What is Poland globally? No one has heard of this.
      What is Russia on a global scale? One of the countries whose interests extend to the entire globe, and without the opinion of which not a single world issue is resolved.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. Astra55
          Astra55 11 September 2019 23: 23
          +7
          Dear, about starving pregnant retirees falling into hungry faints in lines at a closed clinic, this is a resource you made a mistake.
          The standard of living here and among other Europeans is quite comparable. Of course, the Collective West will be richer (and apart from the Collective West, such a country as Poland is a rogue by definition), but we do not live in dugouts and we don’t save money for Zaporozhets for 10 years. So with the "rogue" you overdo it.
          1. tkoh
            tkoh 12 September 2019 07: 36
            +1
            Maybe you have a standard of living within the MKAD and is comparable to the European one. And in Russia we have salaries of 15-20 thousand rubles.
          2. taurtaurov
            taurtaurov 12 September 2019 07: 39
            +1
            Quote: Astra55
            Dear, about starving pregnant retirees falling into hungry faints in lines at a closed clinic, this is a resource you made a mistake.
            The standard of living here and among other Europeans is quite comparable. Of course, the Collective West will be richer (and apart from the Collective West, such a country as Poland is a rogue by definition), but we do not live in dugouts and we don’t save money for Zaporozhets for 10 years. So with the "rogue" you overdo it.

            Collective West doesn't go to the toilet
    3. Non liberoid Russian
      Non liberoid Russian 12 September 2019 04: 58
      +2
      funny, as dumb as the nickname prototype
  6. Mantrid
    Mantrid 11 September 2019 21: 40
    -1
    Quote: Magic Archer
    Where did the money come from psheks ??! They rose at the expense of Europe in the 90 years, are not producing anything at the moment (not counting agricultural products). Or will they give a loan for them? Again, 35 spare parts, operation and armament are very cheap.

    again ask for subsidies from Germany / France and who else? The Scandinavians will show them the middle finger, but is it not for sprat eaters to ask for the Balkans too? they themselves have nothing to eat! And how to put the penguins, whales will breed them later on the loot with all sorts of upgrades and batch updates laughing
  7. Valery Valery
    Valery Valery 11 September 2019 21: 45
    0
    In 1939, the Poles had one of the largest and most modern armies in Europe, and this army was enough for two and a half weeks.
    1. Nycomed
      Nycomed 11 September 2019 21: 50
      -2
      "In 1939, the Poles had one of the largest and most modern armies in Europe."
      Well, that’s said a lot. Cavalry against tanks. Their tanks and planes are very miserable.
      1. Lord of the Sith
        Lord of the Sith 11 September 2019 22: 05
        -1
        Cavalry and the United States now. It just suddenly turns out that they now have the so-called fur troops with BBM laughing

        Poland also had it in 1939.
        1. Avior
          Avior 12 September 2019 00: 06
          +2
          oh, these mechanized Poles ....
          1. Town Hall
            Town Hall 12 September 2019 00: 08
            0
            Who is the author of this stupid drawing?
            1. fruit_cake
              fruit_cake 12 September 2019 00: 37
              +1
              Pole, he then redrawn German tanks
            2. Non liberoid Russian
              Non liberoid Russian 12 September 2019 05: 04
              +1
              what really pricked? or now we’ll start to sing like hussars with sabers only in Soviet propaganda, they went to the lava panzers, but in reality did the Polish super tanks burn the Germans for a month, until Stalin hit him in the back?
              1. Avis-bis
                Avis-bis 12 September 2019 06: 15
                0
                Quote: Not a liberoid Russian
                what really pricked?

                Yes, no, there was such a collision. Just not as stupid as in the picture. Alexey Isaev:
                A regiment of Pomeranian lancers met on the border of the morning of September 1 of September 1939 and in the first half of the day led a completely traditional defensive battle. In the afternoon, the cavalrymen were ordered to launch a counterattack and, taking advantage of the enemy’s transition as a result of this blow to defense, retreat. A maneuverable detachment was allocated for the counterattack (the 1 and 2 squadrons and two platoons of the 3 and 4 squadrons), he had to go to the 19.00 behind the rear of the German infantry, attack it, and then retreat to the line of fortifications in the area Rytel, occupied by Polish infantry.

                However, a workaround led to unexpected results for both sides. The head outpost of the detachment discovered a battalion of German infantry, located on a halt at 300 – 400 m from the edge of the forest. The Poles decided to attack this enemy on horseback, using the effect of surprise.

                Lancers swiftly rushed to the enemy. The calculation of the surprise of the attack turned out to be true: the Germans who did not expect the attack rushed in a panic all over the field. Cavalry mercilessly chopped running infantrymen with sabers. Interrupted the triumph of the cavalry hitherto hidden in the forest armored vehicles. Having left behind the trees, these armored vehicles opened machine-gun fire. In addition to the armored car, one gun of the Germans also opened fire. Now the Poles swept across the field under deadly fire.

                Suffering heavy losses, the cavalry retreated behind the nearest wooded ridge, where barely half of the riders participating in the attack gathered. However, the losses in the cavalry attack were much less than you could imagine from the description of the battle. Three officers were killed (including the commander of the regiment, Colonel Mastalezh) and 23 lancers, one officer and about 50 lancers were seriously injured.

                Polish cavalrymen did not attack the tanks, but themselves were attacked by armored vehicles in the process of cutting a gaping battalion. In a similar situation, ordinary infantry or dismounted cavalry would have suffered quite comparable losses.
            3. Avior
              Avior 12 September 2019 06: 31
              0
              Polish artist Jerzy Kossak, painted freshly, in 1939, German tanks before that, he just never saw
              There is another version

              But if someone doesn’t believe the pictures smile
              There are photos of this armored car smile , and not one

              In the cavalry they really had horses, it’s not just a tribute to tradition
              1. Town Hall
                Town Hall 12 September 2019 07: 36
                -1
                And in the Soviet cavalry divisions, there were no 2nd world horses?)
                1. Avior
                  Avior 12 September 2019 07: 44
                  +1
                  There were, of course.
                  Once you read the beginning of the thread, it's not about that. It was about equipping the Poles with equipment
                  They wrote that they were cavalry only in name.
                  Cavalry and the United States now. It just suddenly turns out that they now have the so-called fur troops with BBM laughing

                  Poland also had it in 1939.

                  And it is not.
                  Of course, we went in battle in a hurry, like ours, horses were used as transport, no one with peaks at the tanks did not rush. But the equipment of the Poles, including armored vehicles, was low.
                  hi
                  1. Town Hall
                    Town Hall 12 September 2019 07: 53
                    -2
                    I called the picture stupid, not because of the presence of horses, of course. But because of the "checkers on tanks" and all the heap of stupid prejudices associated with it. As for the mechanization of the Polish army arr. 1939, this is certainly not the Wehrmacht or the Red Army. But it is not Africa)
                    1. Avior
                      Avior 12 September 2019 08: 48
                      +1
                      The battle of Kroyant and the invention of Gudarian have been examined many times.
                      But for example, the story of an attack with Cossack sabers in a battle near Kushchevskaya is less known, although they write about it ...
                      Horsemen at a gallop flew up to the tanks, jumped onto the armor and set fire to military vehicles with bottles of combustible mixture. During the battle, Kushchevskaya passed from hand to hand three times.
                  2. n0001
                    n0001 12 September 2019 20: 01
                    0
                    There was no attack on the tanks. In a battle on the Bzura River, the cavalry unit broke into Warsaw at night. In the dark, they accidentally stumbled upon an armored group. There was also a group of journalists. The legend has gone into the world.
  8. Valter1364
    Valter1364 11 September 2019 21: 46
    +1
    Poland, this is the connecting link between the nightmare for the Crown, the alliance of Russia and Germany. On it, the states will beat, inciting hatred and Russophobia.
  9. A.K.
    A.K. 11 September 2019 22: 22
    0
    Well Poland will buy these f35.and what. Well, actually nothing supernatural will happen the whole world, she does not hawala and especially us. But seriously, now the Turks will definitely buy our Su 35 or Su 57e fighters, everything will be fine with us, too, with this there are more pros and cons for us. And the costs will be very serious in connection with the purchase of such expensive toys, the Polish treasury, and as you know, you need to live within your means. And in general, Poland is betting on the wrong country in this game once again in its history, but we need to think first of all about ourselves and not about some kind of henchmen there.
  10. Pavel57
    Pavel57 11 September 2019 22: 30
    +1
    So we will remove their real EPR from Kaliningrad.
    1. LiSiCyn
      LiSiCyn 11 September 2019 23: 05
      +1
      Ours fly all day
      Quote: Pavel57
      from Kaliningrad

      Both "fighters" and "bombers" ... Here, just stopped, about ten minutes ago. And our weather is "not a fountain", the sky is overcast.
      Oh, they started again. yes
  11. DPN
    DPN 11 September 2019 22: 46
    0
    Another tension on the border of the Russian Federation with Poland, the United States steers. In Thailand, for example, Tagil rules-read himself.
  12. sharp-lad
    sharp-lad 11 September 2019 22: 55
    +1
    Since when did the fighter with subsonic cruising speed become the 5th generation?
    1. fruit_cake
      fruit_cake 11 September 2019 23: 19
      +2
      since when it needs to be sold
    2. Ilya Melnov
      Ilya Melnov 12 September 2019 05: 09
      -1
      Quote: sharp-lad
      Since when did the fighter with subsonic cruising speed become the 5th generation?

      since when has this become the main criterion? Do not write nonsense, * fifth generation * is just the name of the technical task issued by the US Air Force to its manufacturer.
      1. sharp-lad
        sharp-lad 13 September 2019 18: 11
        0
        Ever since the United States itself proclaimed this criterion. smile
  13. akarfoxhound
    akarfoxhound 11 September 2019 22: 58
    +1
    If you want to ruin a small country - give her a battleship ...
  14. Sergey Averchenkov
    Sergey Averchenkov 11 September 2019 23: 07
    0
    Quote: Town Hall
    Quote: Vladimir_6
    And in Russia, the latest fifth-generation fighter Su-57 launched into serial production

    Of course .. bake like hot cakes.
    Quote: Vladimir_6
    Signed a long-term contract with the Ministry of Defense for the supply of more than 70 aircraft, ”

    Yeah .. let's see what they deliver faster .. 2500 Armat or 70 Su-57)

    Did you come to crap here? I know there are such people - just to spoil. I feel sorry for you.
    1. Ilya Melnov
      Ilya Melnov 12 September 2019 05: 10
      +1
      Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
      Did you come to crap here? I know there are such people - just to spoil. I feel sorry for you.

      is it like your election promises ??? After the election, is it forbidden to remember them?
  15. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 11 September 2019 23: 23
    -4
    For Russia, very unpleasant news.
    Poland will have a strategic "long arm".
    Which will force to redo the entire air defense system
    in the European part of Russia.
    1. abc_alex
      abc_alex 11 September 2019 23: 45
      +7
      Quote: voyaka uh
      For Russia, very unpleasant news.
      Poland will have a strategic "long arm".
      Which will force to redo the entire air defense system
      in the European part of Russia.

      Since when did the f-35 become an element of strategic weapons? And do not confuse Russia with your opponents cutting through the sands in greasy robes and slippers. Russia's strategic defense is carried out by missile systems with special and not very special warheads. In the event of a threat from the Polish Air Force, the deterrent will not be the ability to intercept a dozen "penguins", but the ability of Russia to turn the territory of Poland into a desert, sometimes radioactive, in a matter of hours.
      But air defense must be improved, regardless of whether Poland has airplanes or not ...
      1. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 11 September 2019 23: 54
        -3
        "there will be no ability to intercept a dozen" penguins "" ///
        ----
        "Into the desert" is, I agree, technically possible and cool ... but this is an extreme case.
        But the ability to intercept a dozen penguins is not at all what
        intercept a dozen F-16 or F-15. It is much, much more complicated.
        (Although, of course, nothing is impossible).
        And the air defense will have to be overhauled.
        1. abc_alex
          abc_alex 12 September 2019 00: 04
          +5
          Quote: voyaka uh
          But the ability to intercept a dozen penguins is not at all what
          intercept a dozen F-16 or F-15. It is much, much more complicated.


          You did not understand. Penguins will only have to be intercepted. when someone in Poland gives them orders to strike Russia. But the threat of a missile strike on Poland with the use of nuclear weapons will keep from such an order of any Pole. Nothing is weirder than intercepting bullets or arrows. It’s easier and more reliable to kill the shooter. The doctrine of nuclear deterrence is based on that.
    2. Voyager
      Voyager 11 September 2019 23: 51
      +4
      Quote: voyaka uh
      Which will force to redo the entire air defense system
      in the European part of Russia.

      What do you mean, Alexey? In the European part, layered air defense systems, including the S-400, are already concentrated; MiG-31BM and Su-35 are based. In addition to stationary radars, almost all AWACS are located there. In short, all the most modern air defense systems in service. No other country in the world has such a complex of air defense measures and capabilities. Stop chopping off more than one "hand".

      You greatly overestimate the capabilities and influence of F-35, because you were correctly told above that in the event of a threat, Poland will empty very quickly. Many will not even have time to take off if necessary, and not only because of the Iskanders.
      1. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 12 September 2019 00: 05
        -7
        "What do you mean, Alexey?" ////
        ----
        I mean, the density of missile defense will have to increase
        several times. Where guaranteed to intercept the usual F-15/18/16 ...,
        The F-35 will pass like water through a sieve. Of course, Voronezh will "shout" about danger,
        MiG-31s ​​will scour the search (and sometimes find and shoot down), but the overall picture is
        will not change - air defense will be passed.
        Well, of course, there is nuclear weapons, etc. but we are talking about technical aspects of air defense, and not about global issues.
        1. Voyager
          Voyager 12 September 2019 00: 20
          +4
          There are 4 S-400 divisions in Kaliningrad alone. These are 48 installations of 4 missiles each and equipped with their own standard early warning radars and radars of decimeter ranges. I'm not talking about dozens of divisions in the Leningrad and Moscow regions, I'm not talking about the echeloning by Armor-S, Torahs, about the many "last year" S-300s, the Mig squadron, and so on. You said yourself about the radar. Do you seriously think that 32 F-35s are able to go through all this, or even open them?
          1. voyaka uh
            voyaka uh 12 September 2019 00: 54
            -4
            "Do you seriously think that 32 F-35s are able to get through all this,
            or even open "////
            ----
            I do not have accurate data, but their possibilities of passage and opening in several
            times higher than those of those "traditional" NATO aircraft against which this air defense was created.
            I don’t shout "everything is lost, give up!" New weapons will appear at the borders.
            It requires a new sober defense assessment. About this and the discussion. drinks
            1. Ross xnumx
              Ross xnumx 12 September 2019 04: 00
              0
              Quote: voyaka uh
              It requires a new sober defense assessment. About this and the discussion.

              You know, only one thought worries in such a discussion: there would not have been any "advanced" Polish pilot who decided to immortalize his name in history by repeating Rust's flight and just accidentally landed on a Russian airfield ... yes
              I suppose, in any case, from Moscow, as from the Don, there will be no extradition.
              As for your concern for the state of Russian air defense, Grekhov, Yuri Nikolaevich, has enough information and means to implement it. But thanks for the care!
              Glad to try, Property!
              soldier
            2. g1washntwn
              g1washntwn 12 September 2019 08: 49
              -1
              The fact that the F-35 has a reduced signature does not mean that they will be abandoned to break through air defense. They have a slightly different concept - "the long arm is called". With a saber bald and shouts of "Hurray!" they are not intended to rush to radars.
              As a delivery vehicle for American nuclear weapons after global strike - yes. There is such a risk.
              1. Voyager
                Voyager 12 September 2019 10: 58
                0
                Well, in general, the F-35 by their creators is nevertheless positioned as can openers for air defense. The question is that their signature on logic is not less than that of the F-117, and the latter, in turn, were effective against the air defense of the 60's.
                1. g1washntwn
                  g1washntwn 12 September 2019 11: 12
                  0
                  The second part of your comment contradicts the first. That's why I explain that stealth is "invisible" while it is far from the radar. It is contraindicated for him to appear next to air defense radars, like the same F-16, but from afar it is safer to launch the same HARM or planning bomb on the radar. To fly over air defense positions and throw uncontrollable poop with impunity, as the US military-industrial complex and individual commentators assure, this is an advertising slogan and not a real tactic of use.
          2. Ilya Melnov
            Ilya Melnov 12 September 2019 05: 16
            -1
            Quote: Voyager
            There are 4 S-400 divisions in Kaliningrad alone. These are 48 installations of 4 missiles each and equipped with their own standard early warning radars and radars of decimeter ranges. I'm not talking about dozens of divisions in the Leningrad and Moscow regions, I'm not talking about the echeloning by Armor-S, Torahs, about the many "last year" S-300s, the Mig squadron, and so on. You said yourself about the radar. Do you seriously think that 32 F-35s are able to go through all this, or even open them?

            excuse me, but THIS can not be called a layered defense. Separated defense is only in Moscow.
        2. Vladimir_6
          Vladimir_6 12 September 2019 06: 37
          +2
          Where guaranteed would be the usual interception F-15 / 18 / 16 ...,
          F-35 will pass like water through a sieve.

          If F-35 is so invisible and not knocked down, why are your pilots attacking Syria from Lebanese airspace?
          1. atalef
            atalef 12 September 2019 06: 52
            -2
            Quote: Vladimir_6
            Where guaranteed would be the usual interception F-15 / 18 / 16 ...,
            F-35 will pass like water through a sieve.

            If F-35 is so invisible and not knocked down, why are your pilots attacking Syria from Lebanese airspace?

            Well, first of all, who told you that this is f35, and even more so why they decided that it was only from Lebanon
            1. Vladimir_6
              Vladimir_6 12 September 2019 08: 54
              0
              Quote: atalef
              Quote: Vladimir_6
              Where guaranteed would be the usual interception F-15 / 18 / 16 ...,
              F-35 will pass like water through a sieve.

              If F-35 is so invisible and not knocked down, why are your pilots attacking Syria from Lebanese airspace?

              Well, first of all, who told you that this is f35, and even more so why they decided that it was only from Lebanon

              In the airspace of Syria, Israeli pilots appear life-threatening.
              Israel admitted that the F-16 fighter was shot down by Syrian air defense https://ria.ru/20180211/1514412547.html
              In addition, a vague story about the "meeting" of the F-35 with an unknown bird.
              You greatly overestimate the capabilities and influence of the F-35
              1. atalef
                atalef 12 September 2019 17: 31
                0
                Quote: Vladimir_6
                In the airspace of Syria, Israeli pilots appear life-threatening.

                Seriously ? belay
                Well, in addition to laughter, it doesn’t cause anything

                Quote: Vladimir_6
                Israel admitted that F-16 fighter shot down Syrian air defense

                And the most interesting thing is that he was shot down over the territory of Israel.
                CEP laughing
                it’s possible to shoot down over Israel, but not over Lebanon and Syria laughing
                For one shot down plane, we Syria took out half of the air defense for 2 blows, let them try to shoot more.
                1. Vladimir_6
                  Vladimir_6 12 September 2019 18: 31
                  0
                  Quote: Vladimir_6
                  In the airspace of Syria, Israeli pilots appear life-threatening.

                  Seriously ?
                  Well, in addition to laughter, it doesn’t cause anything

                  Quite seriously.
                  We can laugh at the forum. Your pilots are probably not laughing.
                  And the most interesting thing is that he was shot down over the territory of Israel.

                  Reached the territory of Israel. Moreover, it was shot down by a Soviet-made S-200VE Vega-E complex
                  For one downed plane, we Syria took out half of the air defense in 2 attacks

                  "Military experts have studied in detail satellite images of the positions of the 16th Air Defense Brigade, which is deployed near the Dumeir airbase near Damascus. The photos appeared on the network," Vestnik Mordovii reports.
                  Judging by the photographs, the launchers after the F-35 strike remained intact, only the antenna post with the target illumination radar could be damaged.
                  let them try to bring down yet.

                  There will be a need, knocked down. Moreover, now in Syria the S-300s are on combat duty.
      2. VVAUSH
        VVAUSH 12 September 2019 00: 28
        -9
        Wow, cool.
        It is a pity Rust did not know about this.
    3. Non liberoid Russian
      Non liberoid Russian 12 September 2019 05: 13
      +2
      home airfields are also "strategically invisible" and are capitally protected from a missile strike? or do you think if your patrons from the United States decide to strike, then the Polish airfields will quietly stand on the sidelines and they will not get anything?)))) funny such in attempts to show their significance
  16. Pavel57
    Pavel57 11 September 2019 23: 32
    +2
    There are so many threats to Kaliningrad that if every time you are afraid, then the dream will disappear.
  17. shadow
    shadow 11 September 2019 23: 42
    0
    Also, probably, like the Japs: take off and fall, where then they will search for it for a long time and hard. And then they will say: the Russians did a dig and the plane was taken in order to find out the next bullshit secrets of a rusting machine.
  18. shadow
    shadow 11 September 2019 23: 45
    -1
    Quote: voyaka uh
    For Russia, very unpleasant news.
    Poland will have a strategic "long arm".
    Which will force to redo the entire air defense system
    in the European part of Russia.

    That's why they stopped flying in Syria when the S-300 was brought up. Even the message was how the S-300 took the F-35 four for escort and they screwed. In Yandex, enter and read it yourself, if such is not gullible.
    1. Ilya Melnov
      Ilya Melnov 12 September 2019 05: 17
      +1
      Quote: Shadows
      That's why they stopped flying in Syria when the S-300 was brought up. Even the message was how the S-300 took the F-35 four for escort and they screwed. In Yandex, enter and read it yourself, if such is not gullible.

      yeah, stopped, so big, but you believe in fairy tales ...
  19. Pacifist with AK
    Pacifist with AK 12 September 2019 00: 04
    +1
    Quote: abc_alex
    Quote: voyaka uh
    For Russia, very unpleasant news.
    Poland will have a strategic "long arm".
    Which will force to redo the entire air defense system
    in the European part of Russia.

    Since when did the f-35 become an element of strategic weapons? And do not confuse Russia with your opponents cutting through the sands in greasy robes and slippers. Russia's strategic defense is carried out by missile systems with special and not very special warheads. In the event of a threat from the Polish Air Force, the deterrent will not be the ability to intercept a dozen "penguins", but the ability of Russia to turn the territory of Poland into a desert, sometimes radioactive, in a matter of hours.
    But air defense must be improved, regardless of whether Poland has airplanes or not ...

    Very nice comment, dear! While I was giving birth to my own, with similar theses, you almost took my tongue off))))))) Speaking more simply, Poland is a presumptuous box trying to portray godfather.
    Not according to Juan sombrero. In the event of a big conflict, they will blaze like a hay block that does not even reach the middle of a large bonfire .....
    1. VVAUSH
      VVAUSH 12 September 2019 00: 32
      -3
      In the event of a major conflict, everything will burn.
      Well, we, however, to paradise, as the Supreme promised.
      True, I don’t want to check.
      Yes, and a lot of sketches gathered, the entire former Warsaw treaty, plus the Baltic states, Georgia and Ukraine.
      Good luck fighting off :-)
    2. The comment was deleted.
  20. Rwmos
    Rwmos 12 September 2019 00: 51
    -1
    wink Just exactly - "feed the jellyfish"
  21. Paranoid50
    Paranoid50 12 September 2019 01: 20
    0
    The proposed sale of F-35 will give Poland significant defense potential to repel aggression in the region and ensure the principle of interoperability with the US military
    - The Pentagon said in a statement.
    Well, and then the psheks were worried at all: "Yes Bolton - that's all, yes Red with the Russians, but they are pouring us out, they send signals ..." But they whined early - they had just begun to be used. And they will merge ... they will certainly merge, but then. yes
  22. dmitry --- spb
    dmitry --- spb 12 September 2019 01: 56
    0
    Cool. It is interesting what the Germans think on this subject.
  23. Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 12 September 2019 03: 48
    0
    The United States Department of State approved the delivery of the fifth generation F-35 fighter to Poland.

    First thought: here they are "invisible" targets for training the calculations of the S-400 and S-350. Right by your side. Thanks to "noble partners" for delivery to your home!
    hi
  24. tolmachiev51
    tolmachiev51 12 September 2019 05: 08
    0
    Have fun !!! Europe contains - American planes buy.
  25. rocket757
    rocket757 12 September 2019 07: 29
    0
    Good deal .... "daddy" will be pleased.
  26. shadow
    shadow 12 September 2019 17: 00
    0
    Quote: Ilya Melnov
    Quote: Shadows
    That's why they stopped flying in Syria when the S-300 was brought up. Even the message was how the S-300 took the F-35 four for escort and they screwed. In Yandex, enter and read it yourself, if such is not gullible.

    yeah, stopped, so big, but you believe in fairy tales ...

    If you do not know, then let it be fairy tales for you.
  27. FRoman1984
    FRoman1984 12 September 2019 22: 18
    0
    And we are ordering 3 regiments (72 cars) in the next 10 years for the entire fleet of VKS?
    And when will the engine be ready, at least approximately?
  28. The comment was deleted.
  29. Sergey Averchenkov
    Sergey Averchenkov 14 September 2019 19: 45
    0
    Quote: Ilya Melnov
    Quote: Sergey Averchenkov
    Did you come to crap here? I know there are such people - just to spoil. I feel sorry for you.

    is it like your election promises ??? After the election, is it forbidden to remember them?

    I have?! Yes, you’ve lost your mind about what election campaigns I have a criminal record, so I can’t even think of princely service. :) I’m so ... I’m looking from the side ... well, I’m glad for Russia.