Turkey takes interest in Be-200 Russian amphibious aircraft

Turkey intends to acquire the Be-200 Altair Russian amphibious aircraft, including to extinguish forest fires. This was stated by Minister of Agriculture and Forestry Bekir Pakdemirli, the newspaper said Hürriyet.

According to Pakdemirli, the Turkish delegation has already visited Taganrog, where it held preliminary negotiations on the conditions for the possible supply of amphibious aircraft. The final decision on this issue will be made after Turkish experts study "all the technical characteristics and evaluate the suitability of the Be-200 to the geography of Turkey."

We looked at this plane for a very long time. We could use it to extinguish forest fires in Turkey. Now we will conduct bilateral negotiations and discuss the conditions. But already now we come to the conclusion that they can satisfy our needs

- the minister said.

Pakdemirli explained that the Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan instructed him to study all the characteristics of the Be-200 amphibious aircraft and the possibility of buying it after he got acquainted with this aircraft at the MAKS-2019 exhibition in Zhukovsky, Moscow Region.

Be-200 Altair is a Russian amphibious aircraft developed at the Beriev TANTK. The first flight was made in 1998 year, the beginning of operation - 2003 year. Payload mass: 5000 kg of cargo, as well as 12 m³ of water in tanks (8 sections of water tanks, with the possibility of simultaneous or sequential discharge).

Comments

[rocket757]

It's not even funny to hear / read!
Are we releasing such airplanes at all, or are we just scattering promises with words?

[Lelik76]

Taganrog makes an hour per teaspoon. Now the question is with engines. Motor Sich will not sell them to us anymore, and under another test, it is necessary to certify them again.

[Pedrodepackes]

Now the issue with engines

so maybe a contract with Turkey will speed up this business for us and the Turks.

[rocket757]

Quote: Lelik76

Now the question is with engines.

It was, they wrote about .... "French" offered to put !!!
Kycosis is that troubles have arisen for a long time, but when are they going to decide?
It is clear that creating an engine, getting certified, is not a quick thing, but still, it is progressing or not even creeping ??? All this is sad! Now the minke whales will hurry up, PD 14 and so on will be hacked to death as "stolen" from them, WHAT WE WILL DO ???
Not funny!!!

[rocket757]

Quote: Last centurion

how can you hack something like stolen? do not certify for flights over the usa? and we do not certify the next Boeing. :) such. who will lose more xs :)

Read the article about criminally punishable patriotism, your questions will disappear by themselves.
The title of a patriot does not exclude the need to think and look around, for a hill, including

[g1v2]

For a foreign contract, put together with the French SaM146. It can’t be set only for our Defense Ministry, but for the Turks - for God's sake. When PD7 is ready, you can put them. What is the reason for the tantrum then? The issue is quite solvable.

[rocket757]

Quote: g1v2

What is the reason for the tantrum then? The issue is quite solvable.

That's when the question will be resolved, we will rejoice and clap your hands !!!
In the meantime, we ask ourselves with JUSTIFIED questions - Is the matter being done or is the language being threshed in vain ??? - Or can you say that everything is going as it should, as it should ???

[svp67]

Quote: Lelik76

Now the question is with engines. Motor Sich will not sell them to us anymore, and under another test, it is necessary to certify them again.

In this case, sell, so these engines will go on airplanes for Turkey. So, there are no problems with the engines. But can the Taganrogs be able to?

[yuratanja1950]

Quote: svp67

In this case, sell, so these engines will go on airplanes for Turkey. So, there are no problems with the engines. But can the Taganrogs be able to?

Hmm ... This is how a "dad" from across the ocean will indicate ... Most likely he will poke at UkroMotorsich ... Moreover, at the moment it is not known at what stage the deal on the acquisition of this Motor Sich by the Chinese side is really at ...

[Rzzz]

Quote: Lelik76

. Motor Sich will not sell them to us

In light of the news about the change of ownership of Motor Sich, everything is not so clear. The Chinese have not bought it for nothing, they will probably want to earn money.

[Gardamir]

Motor Sich will not sell them to us,

So after all, import substitution paces the country

[Destiny]

Quote: rocket757

And we release such aircraft generally, or

There, it’s written a little higher about Taganrog, Gennadyevich, I hope modestly that we are releasing, although with engines there is a pranblem, as Aleksey Alexey correctly said .. ...

[rocket757]

Quote: Destiny

It says a little bit higher about Taganrog,

That's why it is NOT FUNNY that the topic has already been considered, more than once! No one could even hint that everything will be a bunch in the foreseeable future !!!
HAPPY BROTHER !!! And for the POWER and for our people! Who knows how, wants to work, to achieve and comprehend .... and all that is hindering him.
I don’t even want to ask what or who is stopping us! I’m afraid no one will be able to speak in simple words ... but it’s not supposed to be any other way!

[donavi49]

Engines Ivchenko Progress - slow down the work.
Moving production to Taganrog is simply a failure, the outcome of the MO refused the contract after 5 years of delay.
The Ministry of Emergencies also wanted to jump off. For aircraft under the 11 contract of the year - are only now being transferred.

On engines, the issue is very slowly being resolved.
The Prosecutor General’s office pointed to inexpediency of using French SaM200 engines for Russian amphibious Be-146 aircraft instead of the previous Ukrainian... According to the department, they are not suitable for such customers as the Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of Emergency Situations, since the "hot part" of the engines is produced in a NATO member country. Hence the difficulties with their use.

According to media reports, the Prosecutor General’s Office even sent the Ministry of Industry and Trade a notice that in this case there is a risk of disruption of the defense order, recalling the introduced anti-Russian sanctions.

Sources in the defense industry said that instead of Ukrainian motors, they plan to install domestic ones from UEC-Perm motors on amphibious aircraft.

But there is a problem. As noted by the media, the engine PD-10 not yet. And ahead of its development.

[Greg Miller]

An empty chatter ... There are no engines to build a Be-200 ...

[rocket757]

Quote: donavi49

But there is a problem. According to media reports, the PD-10 engine is not yet available. And ahead of its development.

Well yes, DEVELOPMENT !!! Still, whatever the top one is, they will arrest and say what to do to us NEVER !!! Because they got all the patents and much more to themselves !!!
Madhouse on the road .... sales betrayal is difficult to call, because such utter nonsense that oh and oh!

[Errr]

Quote: donavi49

PD-10 not yet. And ahead of its development.

PD-10 was not planned to be installed on the Be-200. The PD-8, which is to be installed at Altair, has been in development for a long time (it was previously called PD-7). At the moment, only its "hot" part is not ready, everything else has already been done.

[Civil]

With such a coast - the very thing

[max702]

The cost of the Be-200 is 53mln \ dollars the cost of MI-26t is 25mln \ dollars .. One carries 12m3 of water, the other 20m3 .. Refueling of one is possible only from large reservoirs of the other practically from any, for the operation of the first one you need an airfield with a certain strip, for the second any airfield with equipment .. The first one can be operated almost exclusively as a fireman’s water truck, the second one anywhere and anywhere. The extinguishing accuracy is incommensurable .. The only major advantage is the cost of flight hours for the BE-200 is 200k \ r for MI-26 it is 600k \ r. The question is, what is more effective to extinguish fires ?.

[kupitman]

as I understand it, the be200 can land on the water, i.e. he and the airfield are not particularly needed, a sufficiently wide river, he drove the tank and refuel it. + speed, the ability to transfer from one section to another, the helicopter has a lower flight speed

[max702]

Quote: kupitman

as I understand it, the be200 can land on the water, i.e. he and the airfield are not particularly needed, a sufficiently wide river, he drove the tank and refuel it. + speed, the ability to transfer from one section to another, the helicopter has a lower flight speed

An airfield is needed for maintenance, but you won’t spend it on the river, plus landing in an unfamiliar water area is a very responsible business and is hardly encouraged by instructions (most likely there is a list of reservoirs, and even binding to a specific pilot is clearly available) all salt 200 is an independent and quick refueling, otherwise it loses all the advantages .. Range and speed is good, but attachment to the airfield and low versatility at a higher price calls into question this aircraft .. As for me for extinguishing fires (not to mention everything else) 20 MI-26 is more rational than 10 Be-200 .. Even in coastal areas .. For a reason, for example, the BE-200 is used for its intended purpose mainly in the summer and in the presence of fires, and the MI-26 is used all year round for a wide variety of jobs ..

[kupitman]

I’m not arguing with you, I’d rather reflect. the question is the ability to transfer these 20 mi26 from the Far East to (for example) the Northern or Southern Urals and how long it will take. Finally
MI26 also needs infrastructure for preflight training, etc. So, neither one nor the other option has an ideal solution.

[max702]

Quote: kupitman

So, neither one nor the other option has an ideal solution.

So yes, I agree .. It’s just that the funds are not endless, and for my opinion the MI-26 countries are preferable, BUT if there is a foreign customer for equipment then why not ..

[kupitman]

And if you create a fire extinguishing network. Those. 5 mi26 each in the region (they should be enough to extinguish small fires) + 5 be200 for the federal district. So we get the opportunity to quickly build up a grouping in a region by transferring aviation to the border of the regions already in the first day. It is clear that the specifics of a particular region must be taken into account, but the idea must be clear. and + "air division" of the nth number of firefighters or 76 (78?) standing somewhere in one place in the country. Perhaps it is expensive, but given the specifics of our country, its length, any project will be expensive.

[Avior]

There are no wide rivers in Turkey.
Only the sea

[mammadov teymur]

there are water sheds on those very narrow rivers

[Avior]

my experience is mainly between Istanbul and Antalya
The rivers under the wing are not visible, in any case such that the Be-200 could land and take off safely

[rocket757]

Quote: max702

The question is, what is more effective to extinguish fires ?.

And do we have at least one, though another, in excess THERE ???
By the way, the complexity of maintenance and so on, so on, the helicopter has all kinds of more ... efficiency, range, there is a difference! A helicopter can fly overseas!
Each "vegetable" has its own place, and therefore NOTHING will be superfluous!

[karabass]

I don’t know which helicopter can fly over the ocean, maybe I’m not special. But Mi26 just can’t. He flew once from Anadyr to Cape Schmidt on mi 26, so 8 additional fuel tanks were put into it - the whole cabin

[Last centurion]

by itself be. since mi will gobble up over 200k / r in an hour more than 2 be. at the same time, 2be will drop not 20cubes but 24.

[max702]

Quote: Last centurion

by itself be. since mi will gobble up over 200k / r in an hour more than 2 be. at the same time, 2be will drop not 20cubes but 24.

The mathematics of pseudoscience? Two MI-26s are not 20t but 40t versus 24t for the Be-200 .. What about the accuracy of the discharge?

[kupitman]

As I understand it, the Be200 tanks are installed under the floor in the cabin, because it can also be a transport for the wounded and sick + deployment of a mobile hospital + speed of transfer in case of an earthquake. It’s always faster to deliver the wounded by plane than by helicopter, especially if the area is remote, and if there is no airdrome, it’s possible to get splashed. In the end, he can reset the help while helicopters fly to the landing site, if these are the same mountains.
by the way, he doesn’t have to sit down to replenish his tanks. he can do it in flight.

[Errr]

+, but only here is he able to take water from a reservoir not in flight, but in gliding mode at speeds from 180 to 210 km / h.)

[kupitman]

I meant it, I just wanted to say that it’s not necessary for him to sit on the airfield and wait until they get the tank up and pumped

[Errr]

And there is. If the parameters of the reservoir allow Altair to take water on planing, then the airfield with tanks is unnecessary for it.)

[Piramidon]

Quote: max702

The first one can be operated almost exclusively as a firefighter

This is actually a multi-purpose aircraft. It can be used, besides a firefighter, as a patrol, search and rescue, it allows you to quickly convert it to transport passengers or goods ...

[max702]

Quote: Piramidon

Allows you to quickly convert it to transport passengers or goods ...

How fast is that? Day, week? Month? MI-26 clings to a dumping device and on the road .. Although for the development of aviation in Russia, any aircraft released is good ..

[Piramidon]

Quote: max702

How fast is that?

With a stopwatch did not detect. Is it so important? They write that in a short time and by the forces of the operator. Well, it already depends on the curvature of the hands and the presence of brains. In general, I objected to your statement that you can use it

only in the role of a fireman water carrier

rather than arguing with you about using the Mi-26

[Lelik76]

Yes, you can even fly with chairs. Chemical tanks will only interfere with a few seats along the side of the set. And so you can install for 2 hours. The fastening is standard as in passenger airplanes.

[Lelik76]

Everything is correct. In the emergency situation, a thermal imager is installed on it and the operator’s place for it, the blisters for viewing are large (the anti-icing system on them is an alcohol-water mixture of 50% ), there is a rubber boat pressurization system and a boat with a motor, all kinds of anchors, hooks on it as part of standard equipment are included. The floor inside is normal, as in an ordinary passenger plane with standard profiles for fastening or seats or pallets for cargo containers, again, a large cargo hatch for the same containers or an inflatable boat. The toilet even has a normal one on board.

[Passing by]

And the flight speed? On which the number of flights per day depends, I think by the amount of water they will be equal per day, or even BE200 will come forward. Well, no one has canceled the economy

[rocket757]

It all depends on the specific conditions !!!
Everything is needed in sufficient quantities!
The question, after all, is that we have neither one nor the other in abundance and the prospects are vague when everything is enough.

[Loess]

But already now we come to the conclusion that they can satisfy our needs

- the minister said.

If only they didn’t forget to pay ... And it’s better to go ahead.

[Pedrodepackes]

Turkey intends to purchase Russian Be-200 Altair amphibious aircraft, including for extinguishing forest fires.

interesting offer,

extinguishing forest fires

presumably cover for Uncle Sam’s excitement?

[Nycomed]

We ourselves have nothing at all, and the question is with engines.

[rocket757]

Quote: Nycomed

We ourselves have nothing at all, and the question is with engines.

With engines, not a question, but a kirdets!

[wellaut]

Well, if Erdogan himself ordered to study technical capabilities, then he will definitely do!
And besides fires, you can still dump water on the rebellious Kurdish villages

[Lelik76]

It has a system of "chemicals supply" in general, a foaming agent (ordinary dishwashing liquid) can be added to the water compartments. If you pour some nasty stuff there (1200 liters is included), you can dilute such water and pour it on the villages in principle.

[Destiny]

Quote: Lelik76

If you pour some nasty things (includes 1200 liters), you can dilute such water and pour it into the villages in principle.

Well, you and the beast, namesake!

[Kamiran]

SELL ONLY FOR RUBLES! No dollars, euros and other nonsense. It must be a tough condition!

[Kontrik]

Quote: Kamiran

SELL ONLY FOR RUBLES! No dollars, euros and other nonsense. It must be a tough condition!

I think Turkey doesn’t mind .. They’ll pick up rubles easily, but how will the US and Israel react? M. Kadaffi is remembered that something similar was stated and there are NO more countries!

[Lelik76]

Quote: max702

The mathematics of pseudoscience? Two MI-26s are not 20t but 40t versus 24t for the Be-200 .. What about the accuracy of the discharge?

You can read in different ways. When moving away from the aerodrome, say 150-200 km, MI-26 must be filled with water and driven off once and then returned. Be-200 in one departure (if there is, say, 50 km of a suitable reservoir) can pour 100 tons of water. Somewhere there were such calculations with calculations. This year, when fires extinguished in the north of the Irkutsk region, it was like that, I tracked Be-200 flights on a fly radar, they just cut circles over the Angara to take water and then dropped water on the fires, watched for 7-8 calls .

[Lelik76]

[quote = Destiny] [quote = Lelik76]
Well, you and the beast, namesake! [/ Quote]
Yes, this is how it turned out for a specific post, I just collected this system, I know what’s how ... Standardly, according to the documentation, a washing liquid of the "Pemos" type is poured there if my memory does not change

[Passing by]

[quote = Lelik76] [quote = Destiny] [quote = Lelik76]
Well, you and the beast, namesake! [/ Quote]
Yes, this is how it turned out for a specific post, I just collected this system, I know what’s how ... Standardly, according to the documentation, a washing liquid such as "Pemos" is poured there, if my memory does not change [/ quote]
What kind of plates do they need to wash?))))
Or is it really fire foam pouring water instead of water?

[Lelik76]

[quote = Passing by] [quote = Lelik76] [quote = Destiny] [quote = Lelik76]
Well, you and the beast, namesake! [/ Quote]
Yes, this is how it turned out for a specific post, I just collected this system, I know what’s how ... Standardly, according to the documentation, a washing liquid such as "Pemos" is poured there, if my memory does not change [/ quote]
What kind of plates do they need to wash?))))
Or is it really fire foam pouring water instead of water? [/ Quote]
You collect water (either at the airport or on planing 12 tons in 45 seconds), there are pumps, pipelines supply liquid to the water tanks (the number can be adjusted by the supply taps), it mixes, and foamy water falls out of the tank. On the show, if you saw the Be-200 dropping a tricolor from water (I saw it in Irkutsk on the anniversary of the plant), the colors are made with chemical dyes. tanks located in the cabin 6pcs. 200 liters each.

[Kontrik]

Well, I’m not going to shout. Turkey is a serious partner, maybe after such a contract, we will begin to move in this direction? There are also ekronoplany, they are dead weight ..
The engines are not special, but how they love unas in Russia .. "The party said it is necessary, the Komsomol answered there!" .. All hope is for this impulse ..