Military Review

The nuclear-powered cruiser Admiral Nakhimov is half ready

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The heavy nuclear-powered missile cruiser Admiral Nakhimov of the 1144 Orlan project, undergoing modernization at the Sevmash, is half ready and will be commissioned at the end of the 2022 year. This was announced by Deputy Minister of Defense Alexei Krivoruchko.


The nuclear-powered cruiser Admiral Nakhimov is half ready


According to Krivoruchko, work on the cruiser is going according to plan, the Ministry of Defense fully provides funding for the ongoing modernization of the ship. This year, 29,5 billion rubles were allocated for the restoration of Admiral Nakhimov. According to the plans of shipbuilders, the ship will return to the Navy at the end of the 2022 year.

It will be the most powerful naval ship. fleet. We checked the progress, the ship’s readiness is now at 50%

- declared Krivoruchko.

Earlier it was reported that work on the modernization of the ship is in accordance with the approved schedule. According to the results of the work, he should receive the most modern weapons and become the most powerful ship of the Russian Navy.

In the process of modifying the weapons system, the cruiser should receive new unified launchers of UKKS 3С14. They can launch several types of missiles at once, such as various versions of the Caliber and Onyx missiles, a product of cooperation with the Indian defense and industrial complex Bramos, and, judging by the available data, the promising hypersonic Zircon missile. The exact nomenclature of the Admiral Nakhimov’s weapons is still unknown, however, it was stated that the cruiser would definitely receive the Fort-M and Pantsir-M air defense systems, as well as the anti-submarine Package-NK and Response.

The ship has been under repair at Sevmash since the 1999 year, modernization work began only in the 2013 year.

The cruiser Admiral Nakhimov of the 1144 Orlan project was laid down on 17 in May 1983 under the name Kalinin. On the 25 of April 1986 of the year launched, the 30 of December 1988 of the year entered service with the Northern Fleet. April 22 1992 year renamed the "Admiral Nakhimov."

It is one of four heavy nuclear-powered cruisers of the 1144 Orlan project. At the moment, only one of these ships is in a ready state - the flagship of the Northern Fleet, Peter the Great. The modernization of Peter the Great will begin immediately after the return of the Admiral Nakhimov to the Navy.


Photos used:
Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation
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  1. urik62
    urik62 10 September 2019 10: 09 New
    +16
    With a shift to the right while they accept, he will be 50 years old, horror
    1. KVU-NSVD
      KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 10: 25 New
      +9
      With a shift to the right while they accept, he will be 50 years old, horror
      Reply
      That's right - this junk is on needles - Atlantov, Orlanov, Pike, Sharks,! There is nothing to be guided by the backward Americans with their modernized Ticonderoga, Burke, Ohio, Elk And at the same time cut the Tu-95, we American wrecked B-12 should not be an example! Hurray, advanced chelas! Into a brighter future without too much junk!
      1. urik62
        urik62 10 September 2019 10: 31 New
        +13
        What I mean is that you can endlessly shift to the right,
      2. Pavel57
        Pavel57 10 September 2019 10: 51 New
        +5
        There was a good phrase in one science fiction book - to buy a new nuclear bomb, but one, or second-hand, but two.
        1. KVU-NSVD
          KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 10: 53 New
          +12
          Quote: Pavel57
          There was a good phrase in one science fiction book - to buy a new nuclear bomb, but one, or used 2, but two.

          And what is the meaning of this phrase in relation to this context?
      3. Nikolay Semirechensky
        Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 11: 58 New
        +8
        I do not see the point in your foolishness. If Krivoruchko is telling the truth (I see no reason why he should lie), then one Nakhimov at a price will be about six 22350 Gorshkovs, while in terms of efficiency he is clearly not better than them, because he cannot be in six places at the same time.

        If it makes sense to cling to the old giant ships, then they need to conduct maximum VTG, otherwise another such “modernization” will put the entire Navy on all fours.
        1. KVU-NSVD
          KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 12: 02 New
          +6
          Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
          then one Nakhimov at a price will be approximately like six 22350 Gorshkovs, while at

          Please give calculations of your calculations. And so yes. no brainer that six Gorshkovs are better than one Nakhimov.
          1. Nikolay Semirechensky
            Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 12: 07 New
            +6
            There was a link here that the price of one Gorshkov is approximately 450 million dead presidents. This is just around 30 billion rubles. If the ship has been under repair since 2011, although in fact it started somewhere in the 2016th, and if it was half prepared, it is not difficult to calculate that more than 100 billion rubles have already been swollen there and the same amount has been swelled. Further, a simple calculation shows that in aggregate this is the price of six Gorshkovs. Minimum.
            1. KVU-NSVD
              KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 12: 16 New
              +5
              Firstly, Gorshkov is more expensive, and secondly, the same amount is spent on repairs every year - it all depends on the work being done and the degree of tailoring of the military budget. Not convinced.
              1. Nikolay Semirechensky
                Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 12: 31 New
                +4
                The 2011 link states that Gorshkov’s price is 18 billion rubles. Taking into account inflation and a possible jump in the course (although this is not so significant - the components in the ship are mainly ours), let it be 30 billion. Project 885 Ash costs about 0.8-1 billion, presidents, with a displacement of 13500 tons. More than half as much in terms of displacement Gorshkov will cost somewhere half as much, and this is logical.

                As for the non-linearity of the repair price, then I agree. With the only amendment, that the most expensive part in the repair / modernization of this ship (like any other) is its electronic equipment (radar, etc.) and weapons. So, they have not really started to modernize this part yet, and there they will have to spend many times more money. Just for example: the 48n6 missiles of the Fort complex at Nakhimov have long been hopelessly outdated (shelf life of 15 years), most likely they have not been around for a long time, so you will have to buy new ones. The price of such a rocket can be judged by the one for which the Indians sold the R-73 and R-77 - about $ 1 million apiece. Let ours be a little cheaper, but such missiles usually take three full salvos on one side. There will be space prices and this is only for one rocket of one complex.

                I change my assessment - as a result, one Nakhimov will cost 8 Gorshkovs.
                1. Dart2027
                  Dart2027 10 September 2019 19: 28 New
                  +3
                  Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
                  More than half the size of the pots will be worth about half as much, and this is logical

                  I explain on fingers - it makes sense to compare displacement only when ships similar to each other are compared, if only because frigates are with GTU, and Yaseni are nuclear power plants.
            2. Povelitel_buri
              Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 12: 22 New
              +9
              Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
              if it was prepared halfway, then it’s not difficult to calculate that more than 100 billion rubles have already been swollen with money and that the same amount

              Now the stage of procurement of equipment is going on - that’s such a significant annual cost, because this is the lion's share of the cost of the entire contract. It is logical that extrapolating it all linearly to other years is completely wrong approach - when the cruiser was under repair, the cost was clearly lower.
              1. Nikolay Semirechensky
                Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 12: 48 New
                +1
                Something I doubt that the Ministry of Defense will pay for the equipment in advance. Most likely, they pay after the fact, as a maximum, for the equipment that they deliver during this year. For the systems that will be put on the ship next year, Moscow Region will pay only next year.
                If you find on certain forums (I won’t give links, or else I’ll run into it) photos of Nakhimov’s current state, then you’ll notice that there are no radars and weapon systems there, which means that all the main expenses are still ahead.
                1. Povelitel_buri
                  Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 12: 57 New
                  +10
                  Do you seriously think that what is outside is the main waste?
                  Most likely, they pay after the fact, as a maximum

                  but I doubt that opta is done ex post - it’s not for you to buy on the market, here you need to finance the work from the very beginning. Money comes from the main customer for other counterparties from the very beginning of the work - especially since the goods are piece. Therefore, all your calculations do not stand up to criticism.
                  1. Nikolay Semirechensky
                    Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 04 New
                    +4
                    You are an unrestrained optimist, since you believe in what you write :-)

                    Most likely this is the case: the budget of the Moscow Region always lacks money, and in the best case (which should also be considered unreasonably optimistic), it pays for expenses on time, according to a pre-approved schedule.

                    Never. I emphasize, never, the MO will not pay for something that will be produced "sometime then." Even if the contract is signed in advance, the money to the counterparty will get only when necessary.
                    Best case scenario.
                    At worst, read about the “modernization” pr 1155 here on Topwar.
                    1. Povelitel_buri
                      Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 17 New
                      +5
                      MoDs on state defense orders usually finance some small percentage of the total amount of the contract at the initial stage. When the time is right, it turns out that the financing was not rhythmic and the time is lengthening and the total amount is growing due to inflation.
                      1. Nikolay Semirechensky
                        Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 18 New
                        +1
                        So you completely agree with me? :)
                      2. Povelitel_buri
                        Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 24 New
                        +2
                        So you completely agree with me? :)

                        I'm afraid I don’t agree - now the stage of equipment delivery to the ship - i.e. in fact and payment for the work performed. Of course, this is not all the equipment, and next year the supply of equipment can be a large amount. But this does not mean that in previous years they spent the same amount. That's all
                      3. Nikolay Semirechensky
                        Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 25 New
                        -2
                        Surely the order of the amounts varies greatly, especially if the MO reports about 50% of the work performed.
                      4. Povelitel_buri
                        Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 35 New
                        +1
                        MO reports, however, as usual, does not shine with specifics. And 50% of what kind of work does not specify. Maybe 50% of the volume of modernization? those. replaced / installed already 50% of the systems. AND?
            3. Nikolay Semirechensky
              Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 10 New
              +2
              As for the "outside and inside", just include common sense: until the life support systems are ready and the basic subsystems are installed (and there are just thousands of them naturally), it’s simply pointless to install systems of armament and armament, and suddenly the problem and it comes out have to redo it? There, the work will be simply hellish, so the most expensive systems have not yet been mounted and your mind resists the understanding that they most likely do not exist yet. Have you heard anything about Fort M? Yes, no it!
              1. Povelitel_buri
                Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 32 New
                +3
                the most expensive systems and systems, and most of them are inside the case, i.e. hidden. Even from these reports it is not clear how much and what kind of work has been carried out - maybe all general ship systems are already installed or are completing installation, and the installation of weapons systems is already in full swing. And it is not necessary to judge by the installed antennas - this is only the tip of the iceberg.
                1. Nikolay Semirechensky
                  Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 40 New
                  0
                  Yeah, all the systems are mounted, but the ship will only be ready by 2022. Do you believe that yourself?

                  This is a pointless argument. Just don’t be surprised if you hear next year that 40+ billion rubles were spent on modernizing Nakhimov. Its modernization has already gone sideways to the ships of the project 1155 and 971. I won’t be surprised if 945 are not modernized because of Nakhimov. If they take Kuznetsov this way, he will bring the entire Navy to his knees, and if they also upgrade Peter the Great, the whole army will be on all fours.
                2. Povelitel_buri
                  Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 47 New
                  +3
                  all systems are mounted

                  sorry, but who said about all the systems?
                  Just don’t be surprised if you hear next year,

                  And I won’t be surprised - above I described to you that since equipment is not all that if a large amount will appear - nothing surprising.
                  Another thing is that it will already be 2020. those. by the end of that year or by the middle of 2021, all basic equipment and systems should already be standing and paid. For in the same 2021 he must go on the way. And he will have to go and pass the ZHI / GSI for a long time.
                3. Nikolay Semirechensky
                  Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 54 New
                  +2
                  You have very optimistic terms. As practice shows, ships in the modern history of the Russian Federation never surrendered on time.

                  The total amount of Nakhimov’s modernization will be in the region of 200 billion rubles. Which is approximately equal to the cost of six Gorshkovs (or even more).
                4. Povelitel_buri
                  Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 16: 26 New
                  +1
                  optimistic terms with you

                  these terms have already been shifted by no means indulge - by three years from the original!

                  200 billion rubles

                  You again for the old - well, soon we will find out about the final cost. My forecast is the most up to 150 billion.
                  PS The cost of pr. 22350 is already more than 30 billion, but you still have to consider that now you have begun to drive the improved subseries, which will be even more expensive.
                5. ser56
                  ser56 10 September 2019 17: 17 New
                  +4
                  27.09.2017 (16: 40)
                  Repair and modernization of the heavy nuclear missile cruiser Admiral Nakhimov is proceeding in accordance with the schedule. It is planned that the repair and deep modernization of the Admiral Nakhimov heavy nuclear missile cruiser (TARKR) will be completed by 2021, Rear Admiral Igor Zvarych, head of the technical department of the Russian Navy, said this https://function.mil .ru / news_page / country / more.htm? id = 12143718 @ egNews # txt

                  17.01.2019
                  MOSCOW, Jan 17 - RIA News. Tests of the Admiral Nakhimov heavy nuclear missile cruiser (TARKR) will begin in 2020, the press service of the Sevmash production association told reporters.
                  "In the bulk pool, repairs are continuing on the Project 11442M cruiser (Admiral Nakhimov - ed.). Repair, modernization and painting of the hull structures are completed. Painting and insulation work on the outer skin and marking operations are planned. It is planned that the ship will be put out for testing in 2020 year, "the report said.
                  https://ria.ru/20190117/1549508307.html

                  This music will be eternal .... request
                  Quote: Povelitel_buri
                  The cost of pr. 22350 is already more than 30 billion

                  the problem is. that there were no engines for frigates, now they seem to be doing ...
                  but in any case, 6 frigates are better than 1 monster both tactically and in content ...
                6. Cyrus
                  Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 34 New
                  -4
                  Why all of a sudden, he alone will sweep away your pots and move on.
                7. ser56
                  ser56 10 September 2019 17: 49 New
                  0
                  Quote: Cyrus
                  Why all of a sudden, he alone will sweep away your pots and move on.

                  Why, if not a secret? Their shock weapons are the same, but 6 pot weapons have 6 * 16 = 96 cells, and Nakhimov has 72 ... request
                8. Ivanchester
                  Ivanchester 11 September 2019 13: 17 New
                  0
                  The Gorshkovs laid this year already have 24 cells ...
                9. ser56
                  ser56 13 September 2019 11: 35 New
                  0
                  Quote: Ivanchester
                  The Gorshkovs laid this year already have 24 cells ...

                  I proceed from reality, not a bright future ... bully
          2. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 17: 51 New
            +3
            Quote: ser56
            6 frigates are better than 1 monster

            When practicing arithmetic of type 1 to 6 or 1 to 8, one more thing to consider: can industry in 7-8 years (Nakhimov’s modernization period) be able to hand over these same 6-8 Gorshkovs to the fleet taking into account the limited number of slipways? Even if the corvettes are not made at such a speed ... And then all these your 1 in 6/1 in 8 become just demagogy ...
          3. ser56
            ser56 10 September 2019 17: 56 New
            +1
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            subject to a limited number of slipways

            Well, if you do not keep on the slipway for 5 years - quite ... request I note that with such seriality rhythm and cost reduction are possible - see the construction of diesel-electric submarines - they bake like pancakes .... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            And all these your 1 to 6/1 to 8 become just demagogy ...

            1) if it’s not a secret - what is your speculation? everything that makes the bosses right? bully
            2) The eagles were originally a mistake - it was necessary to drive the Atlanteans in a large series - instead of 4 eagles, it was completely possible to build 7-8 pieces in the built 3m ... request
          4. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 18: 09 New
            +1
            Quote: ser56
            Well, if you do not keep on the slipway for 5 years

            The Retive and Strict corvettes didn’t get in the way - they still keep it on the slipway - it will be 5 years soon, and I doubt that the slipway period at 22350 Ave. will ultimately be much shorter.

            Quote: ser56
            and what is your speculation?

            Yes, in general, without any final information on the cost, all this is fortune-telling on coffee grounds lol

            I had to drive the Atlanteans in a big series

            Most likely I will even agree with you!
            However, these Orlan corps provide an opportunity to "experiment" - try to create a truly impregnable goal.
          5. ser56
            ser56 10 September 2019 18: 17 New
            +3
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            try to create a truly impregnable goal.

            initially incorrect statement of the question request Any target is destroyed in the era of nuclear weapons request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            give the opportunity to "experiment" -

            it’s clear that the money is popular - there’s no demand ... bully
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            all this fortune-telling on coffee grounds

            even a pair of potted ones is already better - simply due to the fact that they are new and serial ship easier to operate .... repeat
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            - still hold on the slipway

            There is always a reason, the opposite example from 636 I gave ... request
          6. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 18: 56 New
            +3
            Any target is destroyed in the era of nuclear weapons

            Oh, these arguments about the use of nuclear weapons no
            1) the threat of nuclear weapons comes from a very narrow circle of state-in
            2) in order to use nuclear weapons ... you need to decide on this. For, it is one thing when the conflict, even with thousands of victims, but you can at least somehow de-escalate, and another thing when you are guaranteed to subscribe to Armageddon.
            3) speaking of nuclear weapons against the NK, probably it will still be tactical nuclear weapons. But the carriers of TNWs are already quite vulnerable to themselves, and the radius of physical destruction of NKs from TNWs is not so big - only a few kilometers.

            even a pair of potted ones is already better - simply due to the fact that they are new and serial to the ship easier to operate

            Somehow you’ve got the rest of the criteria somewhere, and according to them the pair 22350 is not standing next to one 11442M

            example with 636

            I consider the Warsaw model example to be completely incorrect regarding the conversation on the construction of a BNK.
            For this is a long time ago worked out project and the contractors for DEPL and BNK are different, they will say so very much, and in terms of complexity they are also incomparable. So you can and "rook" remember - what is already there ...
            Therefore, you need to pay attention only to the pace of construction of a BNK no lower than a corvette in order to assess the real possibilities of industry - there are still too many bottlenecks - this is the serial production of power plants (hello to gearboxes), gun mounts, and, of course, air defense systems.
          7. ser56
            ser56 11 September 2019 10: 59 New
            +1
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            Oh, these arguments about the use of nuclear weapons

            I have such a VUS ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            1) the threat of nuclear weapons comes from a very narrow circle of state-in

            if not a secret, but against whom were the eagles? Against Tanzania? bully
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            to use nuclear weapons you need ..

            the attack of the KR Navy of the USSR with nuclear weapons on board is already an occasion ... something you have with logic ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            probably it will be TNW.

            the use of nuclear weapons quickly leads to a global war ... well, hit the anlant or eagle with its granites from TNR to ACG - what's next? bully
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            and as for them, a pair of 22350 and is not standing next to one 11442M

            From what? Nakhimov will require terrible maintenance costs, and his combat value is doubtful, for a BS it is difficult to use it - they will not be allowed into most ports ...
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            and in complexity are also incomparable

            to build submarines, even DEs, is noticeably more difficult than surface ships ...
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            this is the serial production of power plants (hello gearboxes), gun mounts, and, of course, air defense systems.

            maybe the money spent on repairs of old trash should be invested in the modernization of production? See Almaz-Antey - for the production of S-400 they built a plant in Nizhny and now they don’t know grief ...
            even in the Republic of Ingushetia, before the construction of the north-eastern lands, they invested in the development of shipyards, and now they have been waiting for diesel for years and have been building an 800t boat for 7 years ... nonsense ... request
          8. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 11 September 2019 12: 30 New
            +3
            Quote: ser56
            against whom were the eagles?

            Against whom they WAS no longer important. It is important against whom they will be. And here there may be a whole range of countries that do not possess nuclear weapons, which he can seriously threaten with his 80th caliber.
            Quote: ser56
            already an occasion

            Practice shows that not everything is so simple. Take at least the same example with a downed Su-24 - because of the attack on it, no one has unleashed a war with Turkey. And here the whole WORLD will be at stake.
            Anyway, you forget a little about the important property of owning a weapon, namely the ability to deter the enemy. And this applies not only to nuclear weapons. Now this is very well manifested in the example of Syria - when a powerful group stood near its shores, no one dared to behave abruptly there. As soon as dull frigates remained on duty there, they immediately received a volley of tomahawks and Israel does what they want there.
            And just Orlan, as a deterrent, is ideally suited for this task.

            Quote: ser56
            From what?

            from the fact that according to other criteria that you don’t remember, he completely surpasses a couple of frigates:
            - seaworthiness and the ability to use their weapons with a significantly greater plight (here 100 frigates will not help lol )
            - range and speed, when the combat situation so requires.
            - and of course, the combat potential of both shock and air defense and even anti-aircraft defense.
            and most ports he doesn’t need.
            Therefore, in principle, comparing Project 11442M with any number of 22350 is strange in view of the fact that 11442M will be able to perform such tasks that any number of 22350 cannot do, especially since Project 22350 is a DMZ ship, so what kind of comparison there can be.

            Quote: ser56
            to build submarines, even DEs, are noticeably more difficult than surface ships

            What are you saying!
            structurally, the submarine case is certainly more complicated than the NK case. However, the complexity of building NK in its systems, I already repeat this several times.
            Why, for example, Gorshkov came to the test only by the end of autumn 2014? Yes, because he was waiting for the A-192M. And Polyment headlights installed on it even later. All of these air defense systems are much more complex and expensive than any of the systems for Warsaw.

            Quote: ser56
            maybe the money spent on repairs of old trash should be invested in the modernization of production?


            yes - instead of upgrading morally and physically obsolete or outdated pr. 1155, 971, 949, 945 - the modernization program of which, incidentally, has already failed successfully.
            But the story with the Eagles is different - the ships are not morally obsolete, and each of them can really multiply the capabilities of the fleet.
          9. ser56
            ser56 11 September 2019 12: 55 New
            -1
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            Take at least the same example with a downed su-24 - because of the attack on it, no one has unleashed a war with Turkey

            Your example doesn’t roll - is it a KR with nuclear weapons and 1000 people on board?
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            - seaworthiness and the ability to use their weapons with much greater plight

            The seaworthiness of the 5000t frigate is quite, it’s not MRC, but the scale - is it so important? bully
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            that 11442M will be able to perform such tasks that any quantity of 22350 is not within the power

            1) what are these? the main caliber they will now have one ...
            2) This monster flies on a rock or by the stupidity of a watchman and that’s all ... bully
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            All of these air defense systems are much more complex and expensive than any of the systems for Warsaw.

            Seriously? wink somehow many people can rivet NK, but even DEPL - not at all ...
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            - ships are not morally obsolete, and each of them can really multiply the capabilities of the fleet.

            you contradict yourself - they change the main caliber ... request
          10. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 11 September 2019 13: 16 New
            +1
            Your example doesn’t roll - is it a KR with nuclear weapons and 1000 people on board?

            In any case, the consequence of the use of nuclear weapons is incomparably more serious than conventional weapons.
            Quote: ser56
            Frigate seaworthiness 5000t

            You are mistaken, a ship with 5000 tons of explosives still loses significantly faster speed and, consequently, range with say 4-5 points than a ship with a VI of 24000 tons. Here really dimensions decide.
            Quote: ser56
            is balance so important?

            Well, you see, you don’t even suspect such a feature as limiting the use of weapons by the sea’s majesty. For frigates, 22350 is 4 points.
            Quote: ser56
            rivet nk

            many can rivet the body of the NK, but air defense systems and GEMs make only a few for them - even less than those who make diesel-electric missiles. Air defense systems and gas turbine engines - this is the most expensive and time-consuming place for NK.
            Quote: ser56
            you contradict yourself

            You just did not understand my thought sad - obsolescence lies in the fact that how many do not redo it, and there will be no more sense. With the Eagles, this did not happen, precisely because of:
            - large sizes
            - availability of nuclear power plants
            - mine arrangement of missiles.
            Any promising weapon can be loaded into its body - and everything will fit in the right amount and there will be no problems with the energy. What compares it favorably with other ships, for example from 1155, 956.
          11. ser56
            ser56 13 September 2019 11: 33 New
            0
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            the consequence of the use of nuclear weapons is incomparably more serious than conventional weapons.

            who is arguing? But if there is a task to destroy the eagle / AB, then is it not just that? That is why the task of the "unsinkable" is a stupid utopia ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            when we say 4-5 points than a ship with a VI of 24000 tons.

            So what? An AB in 100 tons is even more seaworthy ... why set strange tasks - to fight in a storm ...
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            you don't even suspect

            you are mistaken, you should not attribute your phobias to your opponent ... see above - how much do you need to fight in a storm?
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            Air defense systems and gas turbine engines - this is the most expensive and time-consuming place for NK.

            It seems that they solved the problems with air defense, like the gas turbines ... bully I am deeply convinced that the problems with the gas turbine are a consequence, let's say so softly, of the shortsightedness of the individual leaders of the Navy responsible for shipbuilding ... and maybe with interest ... gas turbines in the country have been done continuously since the times of the USSR; request well, fuel efficiency would be a little worse - this is not a problem ...
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            Any promising weapon can be loaded into its body

            count how old he is hi but this is not even the main thing - the problem is that the idea of ​​monsters / super ships is flawed initially - the fleet should have not a couple of linear RCs, but a combination of surface forces ... request
          12. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 14 September 2019 09: 27 New
            0
            Quote: ser56
            But if there is a task to destroy the eagle / AB

            Then there will already play the role of the presence of forces and means sufficient to confront it. That’s the whole point, because the enemy’s forces are not unlimited either.

            Quote: ser56
            why set strange tasks - fight in a storm

            Sorry, but 4-5 points is not a storm, but often the usual state of the ocean. Therefore, going out into the far ocean on a boat with a 4500-ton VI, get ready to be sky-ready most of the time for the entire BS, and drag yourself around 12 nodes. Yes, and think about the crew in the end - on such a ship in such conditions, you will not "fight" for a long time.

            Quote: ser56
            Like with air defense problems solved, like gas turbine

            Look, yes - they solved the problems - brought to mind PR, mastered the technology of production and testing of turbines. But there is still a bottleneck in the form of gearboxes, which are still not delivered to Severnaya Verf shipyard as part of the DGTA. But the most important thing that we are discussing here is the pace of mass production. So, after all these re-runs with the development of systems, this is another problem, and Warsaw women will not be able to do them quickly, because it is still quite complicated production - that’s the next “narrowness”.

            Quote: ser56
            count how old he is

            I am aware of the grades of used steels and sheet thicknesses. And believe me, this case is really not “worn out”, as one of the developers of this project said

            Quote: ser56
            the fleet should have not a pair of linear RCs, but a combination of surface forces

            Now with the capabilities of our industry, despite significant financial injections, the fleet will not be able to get hold of the "connections" of full-fledged ocean ships, and even for the DMZ. And here there is an opportunity in real terms to multiply the capabilities of the fleet.
          13. ser56
            ser56 24 September 2019 14: 08 New
            -1
            Sorry for the late reply - I was on a business trip ... hi
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            but 4-5 points is not a storm

            I agree, according to the Beaufort scale, a storm with 9 points laughing
            5 points is a wave of 2-2,5 m ... if it's not a secret - to what excitement can an eagle?
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            , and drag on 12 knots

            so big moves require a lot of fuel ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            on such a ship in such conditions for a long time

            his habitability is quite normal - Gorshkov circled almost around the world already hi , and the war will either be, or not ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            this is another problem

            but solved ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            the case is really "no wear", as one of the developers of this project said

            I will say this - the developers have weighed the case - this is not good ... request
            not iron gets tired - insulation of cables, gaskets, etc. is aging - all change troubles a lot request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            Now with the capabilities of our industry, despite significant financial injections, the fleet will not be able to get hold of the “connections” of full-fledged ocean ships, and even for DMZ

            One of the main reasons for this is the dispersal of funds for many projects, see USA, they rivet one project in a large series, carrying out modernization, and we have renovated old stuff and already 2 types of RTOs, 4 types of corvette ... request
            Quote: Povelitel_buri
            there is an opportunity in real terms to multiply the fleet's capabilities.
            and you send this monster to 4 points right away? laughing And how to maintain and repair it - everything is unique ...
  2. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 11 September 2019 16: 40 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    See Almaz-Antey - for the production of S-400 they built a plant in Nizhny and now they don’t know grief

    laughing laughing what exactly was built? building - office? and one workshop .... don’t tell - on the basis of one factory the signboard was changed, ennobled and mounted the workshop !!
  3. ser56
    ser56 13 September 2019 11: 34 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    ennobled and mounted the workshop !!

    have problems with the production of s-400? hi So they did what they needed ... bully
  4. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 13 September 2019 13: 28 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    So they did what they needed.

    laughing wassat Well ... it was a question of building a FACTORY! .. only cheers to the patriots were not in the house that the factory was, and it was not difficult to change the sign .... to build a beautiful multi-storey office ... .. to assemble the workshop .... even managed to buy a small part of imported machines .... that's just part and not all !!!
  5. ser56
    ser56 13 September 2019 13: 43 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    only cheers to patriots not to the house that the factory was

    if you have problems with the perception of information - read ... https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/107089/
    or here about the new plant http://nzslp.ru/company/
    https://nn.dk.ru/news/zavod-imeni-70-letiya-pobedy-otkryt-v-nizhnem-novgorode-pri-uchastii-prezidenta-rf-237013704
  6. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 13 September 2019 16: 14 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    if you have problems

    only you have problems, one of our firms was a contractor for this construction !!! negative
  7. ser56
    ser56 13 September 2019 16: 36 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    you only have problems

    think of yourself as your beloved, and give your opponents arguments not of type OBS ... request
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    one of our firms was a contractor for this construction

    those. implicitly admit sabotage? repeat it’s not for me, it’s the prosecutor’s office ... hi
  8. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 14 September 2019 10: 49 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    and give opponents arguments not of type OBS

    so you will not oppose the word at all! I write only what I know, and when I don’t know, I write the word "I think so", but it doesn’t threaten you
    Quote: ser56
    implicitly admit sabotage?

    Is everything normal with you? perform work according to deadlines and estimates do you call sabotage? belay love You wrote about CONSTRUCTION OF A NEW FACTORY - I answered you that this is a lie! they built only an office (large) and assembled a workshop from the structures and all this on the territory of a working plant - which was and will be defense ... ... just changed the sign and refined everything, although at the same time even all the machines did not have time to purchase, sanctions prevented !!!
  9. ser56
    ser56 24 September 2019 13: 51 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    and assembled a workshop from the structures and all this on the territory of a working plant

    if not a secret - what did Putin discover? bully
  10. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 24 September 2019 15: 47 New
    0
    Quote: ser56
    if not a secret - what did Putin discover?

    Putin didn’t open anything ..... if you are talking about his visit? - it was timed to coincide with the production of finished products .... opened it)) everyone’s favorite trampoline Rogozin .... three years ago or so!
  11. ser56
    ser56 24 September 2019 17: 32 New
    0
    I will kindly repeat the link hi
    https://nn.dk.ru/news/zavod-imeni-70-letiya-pobedy-otkryt-v-nizhnem-novgorode-pri-uchastii-prezidenta-rf-237013704
  12. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 25 September 2019 07: 05 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    I will kindly repeat the link

    I repeat once again, Putin came when the plant released a batch of s-400 (your link) .... but the opening was earlier and Rogozin opened it! .... do you know how to listen? but they did not build a plant, but they assembled a modular workshop and built an OFFICE .... + ennobled the territory!
  13. ser56
    ser56 25 September 2019 11: 47 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    I repeat again

    Well, if you don’t know how to read and understand the text, I will kindly make an excerpt ...
    "According to the director general of East Kazakhstan Almaz-Antey Yan Novikov, the total investment into these three factories was 120 billion rubles., including 104 billion - own funds, the press service of the concern. "
  14. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 25 September 2019 12: 40 New
    -1
    Quote: ser56
    Well, if you do not know how to read and understand the text

    This is you personally about yourself beloved !!, since in the materiel - 0!
    Quote: ser56
    According to the general director of East Kazakhstan Almaz-Antey Yan Novikov,

    these "data" specifically to Nizhny Novgorod how much gave? and WHAT did it (construction or equipment or salary and taxes)? ... do you even know what kind of plant it is, what it was built ..... how many kickbacks were there? ... we built ... kickbacks wore .... there are questions ?? and don’t write to me anymore ..... no need ... all the more it is a flood, and he is punished!
  15. ser56
    ser56 27 September 2019 11: 20 New
    +1
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    This is you personally about yourself beloved !!, since in the materiel - 0!

    extremely controversial statement, which is not confirmed by factology ... request
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    these "data" specifically to Nizhny Novgorod how much gave?

    I already noted above that you don’t understand the text - you went to 3 factories ... you said that a workshop and an office were built ...
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    and WHAT did it (construction or equipment or salary and taxes)?

    investment - in the quote quoted by me is noted .. repeat but I'm not doing an audit ... bully
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    we built ... kickbacks wore .... any questions?

    I'm not a prosecutor ...
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    any questions?? and don’t write to me anymore.

    you have a strange construction of a phrase - ask about questions and immediately deny them ... request
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    I eat it more flood, and he is punished!

    I understand that you have nothing to say! The question arises - why did you declare that instead of factories they built workshops and offices, and stole money? I note that this is not a flood but a desire to understand what is behind your statement - reality or ... request
  16. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 27 September 2019 12: 56 New
    +1
    Quote: ser56
    The question arises - why did you declare that instead of factories built workshops and offices

    Do you live in NN? no? then off .... everyone knows what happened and what happened!
    Quote: ser56
    you claimed that the workshop and office were built ...

    you seem to be a troll .... it's useless to write anything .... if you lived in NN you wouldn’t ask stupid questions.
    Quote: ser56
    I'm not a prosecutor ...

    Quote: ser56
    I do not do an audit ...

    then why argue if not at all in the subject .... ??
    Quote: ser56
    I note this is not a flood

    the flood concerns everything that is not related to the topic of the article .... do you want to chat - in PM ... then off!
  17. ser56
    ser56 27 September 2019 15: 59 New
    0
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    Do you live in NN?

    Quote: Tiksi-3
    you look like a troll ...

    poking is not polite, it speaks of bad education ... request
    but in this case I consider it as not the desire to answer for my owl ... request
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    everyone knows what happened and what became!

    all this is nobody - I gave you the exact investment figures for the development of production capacities of S-400
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    if you lived in NN you would not ask stupid questions.

    I understand the specifics will not be? bully
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    then why argue if not at all in the subject .... ??

    I don’t argue, I’m trying to verify information in the media - you refute it ... but without proof .. at the same time with a transfer to the individual. request
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    everything not related to the topic of the article

    from what? I declared that it is necessary to develop shipbuilding capacities in the country, as was done for air defense ...
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    want to talk

    no, experience has shown that you are not informative ... request
  18. Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 27 September 2019 17: 30 New
    -1
    Quote: ser56
    I'm trying to verify information in the media - you refute it ... but to no avail ..

    what evidence do you need ?? fool there was a plant A ... Rogozin arrived - he gave a command - they built an OFFICE and assembled a workshop called factory B .... where is the construction here ??
  19. ser56
    ser56 28 September 2019 15: 52 New
    -1
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    what evidence do you need?

    Well, bad education is for life ... hi
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    need evidence ??

    Your personal opinion is not indicative - can I link to the source?
    Quote: Tiksi-3
    built an office and assembled a workshop called factory B

    1) for 120 billion? bully
    2) by the way, it follows from you that the S-400 for the aerospace forces, China and Turkey was assembled in the office ... laughing
  20. Nikolay Semirechensky
    Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 19: 46 New
    0
    The most unfortunate thing that you have not noticed is that Nakhimov has already eaten money for modernization of 1155 and 971. Even if they finally take up their modernization, it will creep away to the right by the timelines, which eliminates the very meaning of the modernization of these projects.

    In order for the ships to be mass and serial, they need to be produced in a series of at least 8-10 ships, as was the case with pr 11356 (before the known problems with the gas turbine engine). If you try to do one project as with Orlan, then take on another, then try to upgrade the third and so on without end, then the fleet and money will go nowhere and there will be no ships and the combat readiness will be below zero. Even if industry doesn’t have the strength to immediately build 6 ships of Project 22350, then after a few years they still catch the series and then it will go much faster.
    The Americans are building one single series of main cover and support ships - Arly Berki for over 20 years! And they built them already more than 70 pieces. And they have weak minds. They got a miscarriage called Zumwalt. However, their weak minds are more likely an exception, because if they approached with the logic of “our” MO, then they would have no ships at all.
  21. Povelitel_buri
    Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 20: 04 New
    +2
    Nakhimov has already eaten money for the modernization of 1155 and 971

    and the modernization of these projects is generally a waste of money

    Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
    then after a few years they still get the series and then it will go much faster.

    even when they drive further the series of pr.22350, if they drive at all, then in any case, industry will not be able to supply approximately one frigate per year. Namely, such a pace is obtained in the case of your comparison 1 to 6/8.
    The benefit of seriality can not be explained to me, I understand it very well. Now the question is about a quick multiple increase in the combat power of the fleet, and just the modernization of even two Orlanes allows this to be done.
  22. Nikolay Semirechensky
    Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 20: 29 New
    -1
    Nothing allows. If Nakhimov is ready by 2024, then it will be a miracle. And the additional modernization of Peter the Great will bring the rest of the fleet to its knees, despite the fact that it is unlikely to be ready before 2030.

    That's it, I'm tired of arguing with you. Our dispute doesn’t solve anything, so then without me.
  23. ser56
    ser56 11 September 2019 11: 01 New
    -1
    Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
    Most unfortunate

    exactly! love
  24. Nikolay Semirechensky
    Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 19: 36 New
    0
    The fact that Gorshkov’s value is growing is this fault and Iotovs from the Moscow Region who, instead of giving a good series of 22350, began to rivet the alteration without ensuring the mass production of the head series. If we take Gorshkov as the head ship of the series, then its price will be ~ 30 billion.

    Your forecast for the price of modernization is optimistic. No matter how much they have already spent 100 billion, and the main expenses are yet to come!

    In any case, in terms of efficiency it is no better than 3 frigates (certainly not 5-6), and its loss in the war turns into a national tragedy, which should not be. Drowning 5-6 potted plants will be more difficult.
  • Tiksi-3
    Tiksi-3 11 September 2019 16: 31 New
    +1
    Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
    you will notice that there are no radars and weapon systems there at all, which means that all the main expenses are still ahead.

    belay why all of a sudden? - An example, I am working on the MKD to repair 7 entrances .... .3 already done, but purchased materials for all seven .... does this mean anything to you?
  • Cyrus
    Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 25 New
    -1
    It’s hard for you to probably understand the hedgehogs, but I don’t understand this far, probably because it’s not a hedgehog.
  • Povelitel_buri
    Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 12: 16 New
    +2
    then one Nakhimov for the price will be about six 22350 Gorshkovs

    You sorted out something - from the power of piece 4. And it is not yet known how much the cost of the last two will increase compared to the basic version.
    1. Nikolay Semirechensky
      Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 12: 35 New
      -2
      No, six or even eight Gorshkovs. It’s just that if the repair is now worth ~ 30 billion, then when they start radar and weapons, the price will be even more and more at times.
      1. Povelitel_buri
        Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 12: 39 New
        +2
        You somehow woke up late, the repair phase has already passed. Now in full swing there is a saturation of equipment - i.e. its purchase - from here and such amounts.
        1. Nikolay Semirechensky
          Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 12 New
          -1
          No! Repair will be completed when the ship is ready to sail / walk, and this is not close.
          1. Povelitel_buri
            Povelitel_buri 10 September 2019 13: 19 New
            +1
            something you are with the "repair" completely confused I look. Now the stage of modernization is underway, that's what it is called - this is a completely different scope of work and, accordingly, spending.
            1. Nikolay Semirechensky
              Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 13: 22 New
              -1
              All major expenses are ahead. Fact. You can cling to the wording, but it will not change anything.
          2. Cyrus
            Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 35 New
            0
            Yes, my friend, I’m just a “Troll”, sorry, I didn’t immediately guess).
      2. Paranoid50
        Paranoid50 10 September 2019 16: 14 New
        +2
        Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
        when they begin to radar and weapons, the price will be even more and more at times.

        Exactly. yes By orders of magnitude.laughing laughing laughing
  • Konstantin Blinov
    Konstantin Blinov 10 September 2019 16: 39 New
    0
    Dear accountant, Nakhimov and Gorshkov are completely different ships for different applications and for different areas of operation! And yes, one Nakhimov with 90 Zircons on board will be more effective than 8 Gorshkovs with Caliber / Onyx.
    1. Nikolay Semirechensky
      Nikolay Semirechensky 10 September 2019 19: 57 New
      -1
      Where is it said that Zircons cannot be put on Gorshkov? And yes, in order to drown the 6 Gorshkovs, you need much more nuclear submarines and the chance of this is much less than just one cruiser, the loss of which will be a real tragedy for the country and a real disaster for the fleet’s fighting efficiency.
      1. SASHA OLD
        SASHA OLD 11 September 2019 00: 28 New
        +1
        Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
        Where is it said that Zircons cannot be put on Gorshkov? And yes, in order to drown the 6 Gorshkovs, you need much more nuclear submarines and the chance of this is much less than just one cruiser, the loss of which will be a real tragedy for the country and a real disaster for the fleet’s fighting efficiency.

        above, you directly made it clear that Nakhimov’s fighting efficiency is low compared to several Gorshkov’s, now you write that the loss of Nakhimov is a disaster for combat ...
        But I am so ...
        1. Nikolay Semirechensky
          Nikolay Semirechensky 11 September 2019 02: 11 New
          +1
          No contradictions. Just google how many weapons and missiles he needs to fill his armory cellars - there’s just a breakthrough, you won’t say otherwise. The loss of all this will be a disaster, and a sunken cruiser will also brutally hit the morale of the army.
          1. SASHA OLD
            SASHA OLD 11 September 2019 02: 26 New
            +1
            Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
            No contradictions. Just google how many weapons and missiles he needs to fill his armory cellars - there’s just a breakthrough, you won’t say otherwise. The loss of all this will be a disaster, and a sunken cruiser will also brutally hit the morale of the army.

            got you
          2. ser56
            ser56 11 September 2019 11: 03 New
            0
            Quote: Nikolai Semirechensky
            in the morale of the army.

            fleet ... wink
  • Cyrus
    Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 22 New
    0
    Yeah, only he alone will sweep away your pots and move on.
  • Alien From
    Alien From 10 September 2019 22: 52 New
    0
    there is a sound grain in your reasoning, while we are modernizing the past, the whole world is rushing into the future by leaps and bounds!
  • 1976AG
    1976AG 10 September 2019 23: 46 New
    0
    He alone in one place of affairs can specifically do those that Gorshkov is not capable of. Gorshkov alone is not a warrior at sea, but this one can also give a blow to the teeth.
  • Dangerous
    Dangerous 10 September 2019 12: 20 New
    0
    "There is nothing to be guided by backward Americans with their modernized Ticonderoges, Burke, Ohio, Moose And at the same time cut the Tu-95, we American wrecked B-12 should not be an example"
    Comrade! The Americans are not only modernizing, but also actively building new ones. Read how much they enter each year of burkes and nuclear submarines. They are modernizing what they are making now. It is much cheaper and faster than rebuilding ships that we have not been manufacturing for 30 years. The Chinese generally replace their "Soviet" ships with new ships. The only advantage of this ship is that it looks great and powerful, although it was already written here that it was much better to build 22350. But in our country it is not so simple, since we get these 22350 times every five years, or rather, we only got one.
    1. KVU-NSVD
      KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 12: 24 New
      -2
      Quote: Dangerous
      Comrade!

      You are not to me tovarisch. Moderate your tone and then maybe we will communicate on the merits.
    2. Sergey1987
      Sergey1987 10 September 2019 14: 48 New
      -1
      Quote: Dangerous
      The Americans are not only modernizing, but also actively building new ones.

      And what do you suggest? Get involved in an unnecessary arms race with a 2nd world economy? We do not pretend to be the world gendarme and do not think that we need to build 10 aircraft carriers like the United States.
      Quote: Dangerous
      The advantage of this ship is that it looks great and powerful

      I think that the cruiser armed with 60 KR will not only look mighty, but also be a strong military unit.
    3. Cyrus
      Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 38 New
      -4
      22350 a ship that is absolutely unnecessary and even harmful to the fleet, too expensive for its class, unable to fulfill the main function of a warship - combat. 22350 is just a dumb cut dough.
      1. max702
        max702 11 September 2019 12: 16 New
        0
        Quote: Cyrus
        22350 a ship absolutely unnecessary and even harmful to the fleet, too expensive for its class, unable to fulfill the main function of a warship - combat.

        Duc to battle with an equal or superior opponent, the current fleet is not designed! Favorite weapon between more less equal opponents is NAVAL! For this is not the use of weapons against another opponent, but just a collision .. Even in civilian life, if you fire someone with the butt of a gun and he dies, then it will be considered completely different if you would shoot him stupidly ... And here it is! What Ukrainian pelvis we could not melt at the bridge? but I had to crush onboard for this is a "completely different" thing .. Any naval battle and even with the results of the destruction of drowning between major powers (and other fleets do not) will lead to the use of strategic nuclear forces .. Therefore, in the PRINCIPLE, IT IS SPECIAL AND NOT IMPORTANT THAN WEAPONED THE SHIP IS IMPORTANT THE STATE-VA FLAG OVER THEM .. Zimbabwe or Laos nuu can be drowned by shooting (they themselves will never climb prada), but if the USA, China, Russia and others inflate their cheeks with frowning eyebrows and a neat ram as much as possible .. EVERYTHING is fraught. . That's why I washed away the analogs of AUG and our Eagles in super duper ships TODAY .. The only thing is that you can drown a submarine relatively secretively and this is far from always and not everywhere ..
        1. 1976AG
          1976AG 11 September 2019 14: 45 New
          0
          Therefore, in the PRINCIPLE, IT IS SPECIAL AND NOT IMPORTANT WHAT THE SHIP IS ARMED, THE STATE-WA FLAG IS IMPORTANT ABOUT THEM .. Zimbabwe or Laos nuu can be drowned by shooting (prada they themselves will never climb) and if the USA, China, Russia and others then we inflate our brows frowning and a maximum neat ram .. EVERYTHING is fraught .. That's why it washed away in the super duper ships AUG analogues and our Eagles TODAY no ..
          Well, you are very bent! Following your logic, you can simply old trough without weapons, but with the flag of Russia to release the protection of sea borders! For why does he need a weapon, if it still cannot be used. Any military unit should be ready to use weapons, only then it will mean something. Moreover, because of the sinking of one enemy ship, the war will not start, because everyone wants to live anyway, and not everyone is ready to give their life for the sake of principle, so it's time to stop the tales of the third world because of the sunken enemy ship .
          1. max702
            max702 12 September 2019 00: 17 New
            0
            You look at the facts, not idle talk ..
            And in fact NAVAL and all .. The rest is from the realm of fiction.
            RS: The world of the sunken ship did not start due to a VERY hefty vira and it was not long ago (Kursk) ..
            1. 1976AG
              1976AG 12 September 2019 11: 36 New
              0
              Quote: max702
              You look at the facts, not idle talk ..
              And in fact NAVAL and all .. The rest is from the realm of fiction.
              RS: The world of the sunken ship did not start due to a VERY hefty vira and it was not long ago (Kursk) ..

              The reasons can be called different, but the result is that the world has not begun. The details of the incident are also important. It is one thing if we sink a NATO ship somewhere near the territory of the United States and it is completely different if we sink in our territorial waters, in this case no third world war will begin. In this case, the NATO will think again before approaching our borders. If the Americans want to find a reason to start a war, be sure they will find it. And if every time we will be like an ostrich head in the sand, then for them it is a sign of our weakness and then everything will happen again in 1941. But history also teaches us nothing, again as before "the main thing is not to succumb to provocations!"
              1. max702
                max702 13 September 2019 16: 47 New
                0
                Quote: 1976AG
                It’s one thing if we sink a NATO ship somewhere near the territory of the USA and it’s quite another if we sink in our territorial waters

                Well, so remember the most famous bulk in the World Cup during the USSR .. There was a ship in our waters but we didn’t dare to scorch it from all trunks .. And with considerable risk they pushed it into neutral waters .. Any bulk carrier or tanker could do the same if the flag hung right .. And I repeat this just in the days of the USSR when the adversary was well aware of the return flies! But ours understood that they wouldn’t get off with “tomatoes” and decided not to aggravate .. Today the same thing is possible except that the “partners” are not so sure of the retaliatory strike ..
  • Corn
    Corn 10 September 2019 14: 27 New
    -3
    it’s old stuff - Atlantov, Orlanov, Pike, Sharks!
    save a couple as museums in some kind of Kronstadt or St. Petersburg, near Aurora, and the rules. In general, yes, it’s time to write off the obsolete wunderwaffs (actually, they’re actively doing it now)
    There is nothing to focus on backward Americans with their modernizable Ticonderoges, Burke, Ohio, Elk
    backward Americans and Chinese are trying to write off ships older than 30 years, and only the domestic Navy has its own way.
    at the same time cut the Tu-95, we American wrecked V-12 should not be an example!
    The retention of the b-52, this is clearly not the example to which it is worth following.
    Into a brighter future without too much junk!
    You’re easier with such slogans, municipal elections have already passed.
    1. KVU-NSVD
      KVU-NSVD 10 September 2019 14: 37 New
      +3
      backward Americans and Chinese are trying to write off ships older than 30 years,
      It’s not funny for yourself? The most recent example is the complete overhaul of head Ohio. Find out how old he is. Further examples give laziness. About the Air Force is not an argument for you, but it’s the same with the Abrams, for example ... Nobody in the world writes off equipment only because it has been there for many years, they write off only when there is a replacement, moreover, a replacement justified by the price ratio -efficiency
      1. SASHA OLD
        SASHA OLD 11 September 2019 00: 34 New
        +2
        Quote: KVU-NSVD
        backward Americans and Chinese are trying to write off ships older than 30 years,
        It’s not funny for yourself? The most recent example is the complete overhaul of head Ohio. Find out how old he is. Further examples give laziness. About the Air Force is not an argument for you, but it’s the same with the Abrams, for example ... Nobody in the world writes off equipment only because it has been there for many years, they write off only when there is a replacement, moreover, a replacement justified by the price ratio -efficiency

        I confirm: I just read today - “The Warthog” (A-10 Thunderbolt 2 - Amersky Stormtrooper) will be modernized again
  • capsid
    capsid 10 September 2019 14: 53 New
    0
    He’s not even fit for needles bully
  • Konstantin Blinov
    Konstantin Blinov 10 September 2019 16: 34 New
    -2
    SO THIS IS A PROJECT "EAGLE" !!! DO NOT UNDERSTAND ANYTHING AND WRITE SUCH SUGGEST!
  • smart ass
    smart ass 10 September 2019 15: 55 New
    0
    Giblets of offal are new, the reactor drags and everything is OK
  • Kamiran
    Kamiran 10 September 2019 10: 11 New
    -6
    I think that it is necessary to rename the class of these ships to STAOKR - Over Heavy Atomic Ocean Cruiser.
    1. PROXOR
      PROXOR 10 September 2019 10: 26 New
      +1
      Forgot one letter. STAOGKR - Over Heavy Nuclear Ocean Guard Cruiser
      1. The comment was deleted.
      2. Pavel57
        Pavel57 10 September 2019 10: 52 New
        -1
        Shorten the name - ARL - atomic missile battleship.
        1. PROXOR
          PROXOR 11 September 2019 10: 44 New
          0
          The battleship must have a non-acidic reservation. But Nakhimov has no armor.
    2. Cyrus
      Cyrus 10 September 2019 17: 39 New
      0
      Easier to battle cruiser
  • Cruel beaver
    Cruel beaver 10 September 2019 10: 34 New
    +5
    I am writing from .Ukraine .... there are no words the soul hurts for Russia .... the glory of Russia !!!!!
  • tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 10 September 2019 10: 58 New
    +3
    The 1144 "Orlan" project of such a handsome man can only be compared with "Cutty Sark"
  • Old bun
    Old bun 10 September 2019 11: 03 New
    +6
    The most beautiful ship, the base of the compound, its skeleton, Russia needs such, it needs. well that upgrade. and takes pride in the USSR, such handsome men built. ehhh
  • parkello
    parkello 10 September 2019 11: 03 New
    -6
    half ready? is it from the point of view of optimists or pesimists? recourse it would be better if he was called Kalinin, you see it would be more useful for him ... I remember one Admiral Nakhimov from Batumi when he was resting ... he sank. they can’t finish the second one .. change the name of the ship, otherwise it will never go on the way.
    1. Paranoid50
      Paranoid50 10 September 2019 16: 17 New
      +2
      Quote: parkello
      change ship name

      In the courtyard of the Middle Ages,
      Obscurantism and jazz ...

      wassat
  • Graz
    Graz 10 September 2019 12: 16 New
    +1
    we are doing everything very slowly
    1. igorlvov
      igorlvov 10 September 2019 12: 21 New
      +5
      schA still enter the 4-hour day and rush everything to the right)))
    2. SlavaS
      SlavaS 10 September 2019 13: 26 New
      +4
      What will happen faster, the ship will be completed, or Sechin will complete the cottage
  • And
    And 10 September 2019 13: 09 New
    0
    Is it interesting to carry out restoration and modernization work with Ushakov and Lazarev, or did they finally decide to put them under the knife?
    1. Orkraider
      Orkraider 10 September 2019 13: 24 New
      +4
      Quote: And
      Is it interesting to carry out restoration and modernization work with Ushakov and Lazarev, or did they finally decide to put them under the knife?

      No, it makes no sense to restore them for a number of reasons:
      - There is no place in Sevmash, after Nakhimov’s exit, Peter will take his place.
      -Ushakov and Lazarev in poor condition, both in buildings and in equipment.
      The decision has already been made, albeit sad and sorry for these beauties, but alas .... And the fact that the two will be operational and modernized is good, let's be optimistic and rejoice at these large and fattened tits laughing
      1. And
        And 10 September 2019 14: 00 New
        +2
        I agree, in this case it’s better than not at all. All the same, 2 is better than 1. Although as early as the 15th year, as it turned out, Lazarev was planned to be overhauled. But apparently did not grow together, sorry.
      2. Paranoid50
        Paranoid50 10 September 2019 16: 21 New
        +1
        Quote: Orkraider
        And the fact that the two will be in service and modernized, it pleases,

        Well, Duc, just for KSF and Pacific Fleet. In the Baltic and Black “Eagles” did not rest against various reasons, both objective and subjective. yes hi
        1. Ivanchester
          Ivanchester 11 September 2019 13: 34 New
          +1
          I nevertheless modestly hope that the command of the Navy will still guess not to breed the ships of the same type in different fleets.
          It will be much more effective if both Oralans are in the North, and Ustinova is transferred to the Pacific Fleet.
          Although, given the fact that both Peter and Varyaga also need to be capitalized, the time when we will have at least two cruisers on both fleets will obviously come soon :(
          1. Tiksi-3
            Tiksi-3 11 September 2019 16: 54 New
            +1
            Quote: Ivanchester
            and they’ll transfer Ustinova to the Pacific Fleet.

            good but -
            Quote: Ivanchester
            taking into account that both Peter and Varyag also need to be capitalized, the time when we will have at least two cruisers on both fleets will obviously come soon :(
            recourse
  • Whowhy
    Whowhy 10 September 2019 15: 29 New
    0
    I hope the title of the article is not a hint of a known anecdote: "Like this - in general, and half - like that (well, the gestures are appropriate)." laughing
  • FRoman1984
    FRoman1984 10 September 2019 15: 39 New
    +1
    Beautiful ship.
    "Peter the First" is next, the remaining 2 are sorry that it will not work to upgrade. I met somewhere an article that the Ministry of Defense decided to dispose of them.
  • Andrey Andrey
    Andrey Andrey 11 September 2019 00: 27 New
    0
    By the way Kuzya is everything. Disbanded. The order has already been given.
    1. Pavel57
      Pavel57 11 September 2019 11: 02 New
      0
      You can understand. Everything will have to be from the beginning, with UDC.
    2. Ivanchester
      Ivanchester 11 September 2019 20: 44 New
      0
      And do not share the source of this sad news?
  • Div Divich
    Div Divich 11 September 2019 12: 28 New
    0
    Quote: Povelitel_buri
    MoDs on state defense orders usually finance some small percentage of the total amount of the contract at the initial stage. When the time is right, it turns out that the financing was not rhythmic and the time is lengthening and the total amount is growing due to inflation.


    Inflation, this is such a tricky word, when they do not want to understand the increase in costs, they first point to it. And if you start to understand, then inflation will have names and surnames, and cottages with cars bought with this money.

    Energy resources (gasoline, electricity, gas) mainly create inflation, so their shareholders buy cottages with foreign cars for money from inflation.