Military Review

In Russia, looking for a replacement for "Corn"

84
One of the eternal themes of modern Russia is talk about the revival of the small aviation and the creation of a new light regional aircraft. At the next round история Went on Sunday, 25 of August 2019 of the year when the RIA agency News referring to the press service of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation, it announced that a new regional aircraft will be created in the country, designed to carry 9-14 people. Actually, the replacement is being prepared for the famous An-2 Corn, not news for the past several decades, only the timing of the launch of the production and the name of potential replacement aircraft are changing.



Light multi-purpose aircraft An-2


In the meantime, the An-2 long-lived aircraft remains the main workhorse of domestic small aviation, which first flew up to the sky back in 1947. Serial production of this aircraft was completely completed in the USSR in the 1971 year, while under license, the aircraft continued to be assembled in Poland and China. Despite its more than venerable age, according to the information of FSUE SibNIA named after S.A. Chaplygin, in the middle of 2017, about 90 percent of all tasks of small aviation in the Russian Federation are still carried out by light multi-purpose An-2 aircraft, which are popularly nicknamed "Annushka" and "Corn".

With the replacement of the An-2 will be determined in September 2019 of the year


Specialists of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of Russia plan to make a decision about which light aircraft will eventually replace the old An-2 in September of the 2019, which was announced recently by the press service of the ministry. 1,25 billion rubles has been allocated from the budget for experimental design work on the creation of a new light-engine aircraft. Moreover, it is already known that when creating a new aircraft, the best practices, technical solutions and the whole backlog obtained during the creation of the TVS-2DTS Baikal aircraft will be used. The development of this experimental machine with the widespread use of composite materials in construction has been done for a long time by aviation specialists from SibNIA from Novosibirsk.

At the same time, it was previously stated several times that this particular model of the aircraft, TVS-2DTS, would go into mass production, although the launch dates were postponed several times. So, back in April 2018 of the year, the official website of the Ministry of Industry and Trade of Russia reported that serial production of the new TVS-2DTS aircraft, created by specialists of the Siberian Aviation Research Institute, will begin in Ulan-Ude on the basis of the local aviation plant, which is part of the Helicopters Corporation Of Russia. ” It was planned to start serial production of a new small-engine small aircraft in the 2021 year, and Polar Airlines from Yakutia were to become the first operator of the new aircraft.

Now, in the best case, the start of mass production of a new aircraft is shifting to the end of the 2022 of the year. This term was indicated by the Russian Deputy Prime Minister and Presidential Plenipotentiary Envoy to the Far Eastern Federal District, Yuri Trutnev, who visited the aviation plant in Ulan-Ude in July 2019. According to a senior official, the end of the 2022 of the year is the deadline set by the Ministry of Industry and Trade of Russia and the aircraft factory.


Light multi-purpose aircraft TVS-2DTS


If in April 2018 of the year the Ministry of Industry and Trade said that it was TVS-2DTS that went into serial production, in August of 2019 of the year it became known that the decision on the fate of this aircraft and which technological features of this project would be used in creating a new car has not yet been adopted. The Rossiyskaya Gazeta in the Ministry of Industry and Trade was told that TVS-2DTS is an experimental model of an aircraft that was created to practice new technologies. Taking into account the technical backlog obtained under this project, a new production aircraft is being created under the LMS program (light multi-purpose aircraft).

So far, the Ministry of Industry and Trade of Russia is looking for a R&D contractor to create a replacement for the outdated multi-purpose An-2 aircraft. It is expected that the contractor by December 2019 will present a general view of the new aircraft, as well as a set of outline design documentation. By September next year, a set of design documentation for a prototype of a new light multi-purpose aircraft should be ready, and it is planned to assemble a prototype of the aircraft by the end of the 2020 of the year.

Why TVS-2DTS from serial to experimental


The aircraft, which over the past few years has been touted as a potentially production model to replace the An-2 and actively participated in various exhibitions and air shows, suddenly turned into an experimental machine. It is no secret to anyone that it is extremely difficult to understand the decisions of the Russian government and it seems that this is exactly the case. The plane, which they wanted to assemble in series in Ulan-Ude, suddenly ceased to satisfy the state with something. Why there was another shift in the launch dates for the series and a new R&D contract with a total value of more than a billion rubles appeared, we can only speculate.

It is only known for certain that TVS-2DTS surpassed the legendary Kukuruznik in its flight performance. So, the cruising speed of the car increased to 330 km / h, the ferry range to 4500 km, and the payload to 3,5 tons. The features of the Novosibirsk aircraft included a new wing, a “glass” cockpit and a new fuselage. The highlight of the aircraft was to be the widespread use of composite materials. And the use of modern avionics made it possible to operate the aircraft at any time of the day and made it all-weather.


Light multi-purpose aircraft TVS-2DTS


True, the story with the Superjet is repeated here, when the aircraft is Russian only on paper. In fact, the heart of the TVS-2DTS was supposed to be the American Honeywell TPE331-12UAN multi-fuel turboprop engine, developing power up to 1100 hp and allowing the plane to fly on kerosene and gasoline. The five-blade propeller and the aircraft equipment complex were also developed by the Americans, Hartzell Propeller Inc was involved in the production of the propeller, and Garmin was the avionics company. Separate mention should be made of composite materials; the new aircraft was planned to be made integral. And here again it is not a fact that it was a question of the Russian composite. As the Far Eastern editorial office of RBC wrote back in 2018, the creators of the aircraft refused to use the Russian composite because of its high cost.

In recent Russian history, such a scheme for organizing production has not taken off on the example of the Sukhoi Superjet 100 aircraft, from 55 to 80 percent of the filling of which in different years was foreign components. Such a scheme for a small aircraft is fraught with even greater problems with the supply of spare parts, repair and maintenance, as well as the choice of repair plants themselves. Separately, one can note the story of the Russian medium-range airliner MS-21, the main feature of which was to become a composite wing. At the same time, the start of mass production of the airliner was postponed for at least a year due to the US refusal to supply composite materials, American sanctions were to blame. Initially, the manufacturer relied on composite materials of American and Japanese production by Hexcel and Toray Industries, respectively.

Perhaps the TVS-2DTS project was faced with the same problem as its older brother. At the same time, the aircraft initially did not fit well with the import substitution policy declared by the Russian government. Probably, it was precisely the large share of foreign components and materials, as well as the increasing cost of the aircraft, that caused the Ministry of Industry and Trade to initiate a new R&D stage to create a light multi-purpose aircraft. Most likely, the novelty will be distinguished by a large volume of domestic components and assemblies.

Russia just needs small aircraft


Such a country as Russia, small aviation is vitally necessary, it is clear to any person who studied geography at school. The size of the country initially contributed to the development of air service. Many regions of Russia are larger than certain countries of the world, for example, not the largest Udmurtia is 1,5 times larger than Belgium and slightly larger than Holland in area, and the neighboring Kirov region is already three times larger in area than the home of the Kalashnikov assault rifle. Needless to say, both of these subjects of the federation today simply do not have small aircraft. A resident of the Soviet Union could easily afford a flight from Samara to Saratov, having traveled about 440 km by air. Today, in order to fly from a million-plus city to a city with a population of almost 850 thousand people, it is necessary to make a flight with a transfer in Moscow with a total duration of 11 hours, is this not a miracle. Today it is commonplace for a country in which 1400 remains from 200 small aviation aerodromes and not all of these two hundred are actively operated.



Although in some form small aviation has been preserved in the Far North, Siberia and the Far East of the country, where it often remains the only means of delivering passengers and goods to remote settlements. Specialists of the Ministry of Industry and Trade note that more than 28 of thousands of settlements in Russia today do not have ground communications, that is, they are cut off from the "big land", and in the 15 Russian regions small aircraft are the main component of the transport system. That is why the aircraft, which should come to replace the An-2, is of such great importance.

Today, the brainchild of Antonov Design Bureau, created at the end of the 1940's, remains the main workhorse of small aircraft, but the number of Kukuruznikov in Russia is only slightly larger than 200 units, all of these aircraft must be changed. In an interview with the newspaper “Vzglyad”, the observer of the magazine “Arsenal of the Fatherland” and aviation expert Dmitry Drozdenko noted that in Yakutia, whose territory is larger than India, the authorities sounded the alarm last year. Today, in this region, which is very dependent on small aircraft, 80 percent of the fleet is aircraft aged over 30 years. According to the expert, by 2026 the fleet of local aviation, represented by An-24, An-2 aircraft and Mi-8 helicopters, will have to be completely written off.

Attempts to create a new aircraft for small aircraft in Russia or to launch mass production of foreign counterparts have already been made many times. Only from 2008 of the year in Russia were the projects of the Rysachok plane of Tekhnoavia company, Expedition of the private MVEN company from Kazan, as well as options for serial assembly in Canada of Canadian Twin Otter and American Cessna discussed. All these projects ended in nothing. Separately, we can single out the localization of production in Russia of the regional twin-engine Czech aircraft L-410 with 19 passengers, which nevertheless began to be collected individually by piece in Yekaterinburg in 2018 on the basis of the Ural Civil Aviation Plant.


L-410 assembled at the Ural Civil Aviation Plant


The main problem that prevents Russia from developing small aircraft and finally creating a new aircraft for it, most experts consider the low solvency of the country's inhabitants. The population, which should be the main consumer of this service, is characterized by weak purchasing power. The small aviation market collapsed. Today, local airlines account for only three percent of Russian passenger traffic. It turns out a vicious circle when airlines do not need to buy airplanes for such flights, but the Russian aviation industry does not need to produce them, there is no demand - there is no supply. The country cannot get out of this trap from 1991 of the year. And if Russian industry is ever able to cope with the technical side of the problem and still create a new small aircraft, then how to make the prices of airline tickets affordable for the general public at a time when real incomes of citizens are declining for five consecutive years is still a mystery .
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  1. Ross xnumx
    Ross xnumx 27 August 2019 05: 27
    +9
    In Russia, looking for a replacement for "Corn"

    They’re not looking there. He had to look for a replacement back in 2008.
    As for the production of domestic aircraft, everything has been known for a long time - a Russian aircraft should not contain foreign "spare parts". This is not a Lego set.
    One of the eternal themes of modern Russia - it's talk about the revival of small aircraft and the creation of a new light regional aircraft.

    It is a pity that conversations are conducted at the tombstone ...
    1. Aerodrome
      Aerodrome 27 August 2019 05: 48
      +9
      In Russia, looking for a replacement for "Corn"
      who is looking ? all the developments are, no one needs a "domestic manufacturer", they are jammed in the bud, the civil aviation industry is not allowed to raise their heads, the "superjet" is almost dead, 21mu, I think the same fate is in store. who do we work for?
      1. Ross xnumx
        Ross xnumx 27 August 2019 05: 57
        +5
        Quote: Aerodrome
        all developments are,no one needs a "domestic manufacturer"

        Naturally! Otherwise, the billions ditched at the Yeltsin center could have been spent in the form of bonuses for the developers of the domestic aviation industry.
        It is necessary to "omit" chemists so much that they could not, with the available spectral analysis,
        in modern laboratories and institutes to create this "unique" composite for small aircraft, which does not burn in fire and does not sink in water ...
        We do not have funds in Russia for "Kulibins", we are spending more and more on "Manilovs" and "Sobakevichs". Even a child understands that:
        1. Monster_Fat
          Monster_Fat 27 August 2019 07: 29
          +7
          The story with "Baikal" is a typical "epic fail" of modern Russian production, based on "screwdriver" technology from Western countries and Chinese components from "Aliexpress". "Import substitution", yeah ... wink
          1. Greg Miller
            Greg Miller 27 August 2019 09: 00
            +6
            In the 20s and 30s of the USSR, without its own technologies, it purchased licenses with factories in the West. If today you want to make an airplane, a complex machine tool or a car entirely from domestic components, then this project will fail, because in Russia, nothing is almost independently produced.
            1. NEOZ
              NEOZ 27 August 2019 15: 54
              -1
              Quote: Greg Miller
              in Russia, nothing is almost independently produced.

              any country in the world with a population of 147 million people cannot produce EVERYTHING!
              ps
              modern technology can only support economic ties of approximately 1 billion people.
              1. Greg Miller
                Greg Miller 27 August 2019 16: 07
                +4
                Well, yes ... They’ll tell you nothing to do nothing ... Just in the USSR there was no 1 billion population, and they released everything that was needed ... But only the ruling elite did not have palaces and capital abroad It was. These were the Titans, the lack of money ready to lay down their lives for the Motherland and its well-being. I recall the First Secretary of the Moscow City Committee of the CPSU, Viktor Vasilyevich Grishin, who died in the Presnensky district council, where he came to renew his pension. Can you imagine in his place his successors, for example Sobyanin or Luzhkov? So I can’t .... And when we can, then we will have domestic and planes, and machine tools, and cars ...
                1. NEOZ
                  NEOZ 27 August 2019 16: 25
                  -3
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  That's just in the USSR there was no 1 billion population, and they released everything that was needed ...

                  jeans? sneakers? sneakers? leather jackets? lace lingerie? many varieties of sausages? cars for every taste and color? ... in the USSR, nobody "got" anything! just bought everything!
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  But the ruling elite did not have palaces and capital abroad.

                  did not have! on this, the Secretary General sold the USSR what would then advertise pizza? .... maybe if there were palaces, then they did not hand over the USSR so cheaply? ...... Gorbachev sold the USSR for a million !!!!! Total!!!!! maybe if the elite of the USSR lived as ELITE, then the USSR didn’t make sense to destroy either?
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  Can you imagine in his place his successors, for example Sobyanin or Luzhkov? So I can’t ....

                  I also can not imagine a dying pensioner from the Clinton / Bush / Kennedy clan and others ....... maybe these are the laws of nature?
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  And when we can, then we will have domestic and aircraft, and machine tools, and cars ...

                  USSR collapsed people! because natives of the people drove in the USSR! their ancestors of dad / grandfather were ordinary people .... i.e. ordinary people were educating future leaders!
                2. Alexey RA
                  Alexey RA 27 August 2019 16: 37
                  -2
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  That's just in the USSR there was no 1 billion population, and they released everything that was needed ...

                  Yeah ... Japanese machines, Finnish cranes, American grain. smile
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  And when we can, then we will have domestic and aircraft, and machine tools, and cars ...

                  Cars like in the USSR will be - according to the order for the enterprise or by appointment, in ten years?
                3. Den717
                  Den717 27 August 2019 20: 27
                  0
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  But only the ruling elite did not have palaces and capital abroad

                  Can you tell how much money the party and Komsomol functionaries used to whine the entire industry in the 90s? Where has the "party gold" gone? Enough here already to tell tales about "besserebrennikov". Party-Komsomolsky smoothly migrated from the leadership of the CPSU to the management of business. Members of lower rank, who did not get a piece of industrial assets, successfully began to trade in the interests of the country. I agree, not all communists were like that. But the most "successful" part managed to bring production in Russia to a state of coma. And talking about the First Ones, who died in the clinic in line, is tantamount to a 5-year-old child who fell from the 12th floor and remained alive and well. That is, there were cases, but only as an extreme exception.
                  Quote: Greg Miller
                  These were the Titans, the disinterested ones ready to lay down their lives for their homeland

                  It was these rotten "titans" of the 70-80s that brought the Great Country to an inglorious end. With the death of Stalin, the Titans also ended. The remaining dinosaurs were finished off by the Khrushchevs and Suslov.
          2. A1845
            A1845 27 August 2019 09: 39
            +3
            Why there was another shift in the launch dates for the series and a new R&D contract with a total value of more than a billion rubles appeared, we can only speculate.

            it’s not difficult to guess where budget money is flowing
    2. Nycomed
      Nycomed 27 August 2019 20: 50
      -3
      He had to look for a replacement in 1978. and even in 1968.
  2. Strashila
    Strashila 27 August 2019 06: 00
    +6
    "Russia simply needs small aircraft", and does not argue with this. To begin with, let them try to reproduce the AN-2, according to the latest documents with the possibility of maximum modernization from the domestic one, as they did with the TU-160. And it may turn out that there is no need to develop it properly. That we have few aviation universities and enterprises, as in the days of Comrade Stalin, announce a competition, conditionally call the project Anna. The AN-2 was designed using only a slide rule, which with modern computers will become very difficult.
    1. Simargl
      Simargl 27 August 2019 08: 40
      -2
      Quote: Strashila
      To begin with, let them try to reproduce the AN-2, according to the latest documents with the possibility of maximum modernization from the domestic, as they did with the TU-160.
      An archaic glider, with an ancient engine, according to the most ancient technologies, overweight, without the possibility of modernization? In the Tu-160 except the glider, what remains the same? And what did they do to him? Implemented the backlog of the USSR? And is not PAK YA designed to replace the outdated conceptually Tu-160?
      1. NEOZ
        NEOZ 27 August 2019 16: 32
        0
        Quote: Simargl
        to replace the outdated conceptually Tu-160?

        What specific concept is outdated? can be more?
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 27 August 2019 16: 44
          0
          Quote: NEOZ
          What specific concept is outdated? can be more?

          The concept of a strategic missile carrier imprisoned under a supersonic air defense breakthrough at criminally low altitudes.
          Now it’s easier to make long-range ALCMs - and launch them from a large subsonic carrier from outside the enemy’s air defense. It’s better that autopilots go to the target in the WWII, bypass the air defense positions, interfere and die on the way to the target — than live crews.
    2. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 27 August 2019 16: 41
      +1
      Quote: Strashila
      To begin with, let them try to reproduce the AN-2, according to the latest documents with the possibility of maximum modernization from the domestic, as they did with the TU-160.

      And when we try to do this, we again invent a bicycle. First, it turns out that a piston engine on aviation gasoline is too expensive to operate. And then we get the An-3. smile
  3. Revolver
    Revolver 27 August 2019 06: 12
    +8
    In the USSR, when the Germans seized the main aluminum capacities of the country, concentrated in the Ukrainian SSR, they began to build aircraft from what was - wood, fabric, a welded frame made of steel pipes, and what else was there. Maybe they didn't fly as well as the aluminum ones could, but nevertheless they flew and fired. Is there a shortage of wood in Russia? Or did the invaders take over the aluminum factories? Well, they don't supply an American composite - what, there is nothing to replace the word "absolutely"?
    True, under Stalin, engineers (of course, not ordinary, not young specialists) were paid so much that they could buy Pobeda, and, having worked hard, and ZiM. Now what can an engineer with 5-10 years of experience afford? Used Lada?
    1. Errr
      Errr 27 August 2019 07: 50
      +7
      Quote: Nagan
      In the USSR, when the Germans seized the country's main aluminum facilities, concentrated in the Ukrainian SSR, they began to build airplanes from which it was - wood, fabric, a welded frame from steel pipes, and there were more.
      I don’t know what the Germans captured there, but they created the Stalin (now Novokuznetsk) aluminum smelter, including on the basis of the evacuated Dnepropetrovsk and Volkhov aluminum smelters, and it produced its first products on January 7, 1943.
      During the Second World War, aluminum was used for the legendary Katyushas, ​​the fastest and highest-altitude MiG fighters, tanks, self-propelled guns, ships, soldiers' bowlers and flasks. Every fourth aircraft was made of Kuznetsk aluminum. This was a great contribution to the victory.
      Source: https://libnvkz.ru/chitatelyam/o-novokuznetske/ekskursionnoe-buro/musei/musei-nkaza
      Quote: Nagan
      Or have the invaders captured the aluminum smelters?
      To my regret, this has already happened. Take a walk on the tags "Rusal", "Deripaska". And this is yours:
      Quote: Nagan
      True, under Stalin, engineers (of course, not ordinary, not young specialists) were paid so much that they could buy Pobeda, and, having worked hard, ZiM
      amused me so that I want to cry.
      1. Revolver
        Revolver 27 August 2019 08: 06
        +2
        Quote: Herrr
        the first products he issued on January 7, 1943

        And what were the planes made from before? Lendlizovskiy aluminum, too, seems to have gone from about that time.
        Quote: Herrr
        amused me so that I want to cry

        About a couple of months ago on Zen there was an article about how somewhere in the Donbass some designer (simple, without a prefix like "general") bought a trophy decommissioned from the regional committee garage, either Mers or Horch (I don't remember what specifically) from under the ass of either Goering or Adolf himself, at a price that exceeded the price of the new ZIM at that time. And ZiMs were then sold to everyone who had enough money. The article was about the fate and modern restoration of a collectible car, but a side note comparing it to ZiM stuck in my memory.
      2. Undecim
        Undecim 27 August 2019 22: 30
        +1
        Dnepropetrovsk and Volkhov aluminum smelters.
        Dnepropetrovsk aluminum plant never existed.
        1. Errr
          Errr 28 August 2019 04: 47
          +1
          Quote: Undecim
          Dnepropetrovsk aluminum plant never existed.
          hi Thanks for the correction. In the word "Dnepropetrovsk" in this case, its part turned out to be completely inappropriate, namely - "petro".))) In reality, it was about the Dneprovsky aluminum plant.
          1. Undecim
            Undecim 28 August 2019 06: 19
            0
            Alas, the Dnieper aluminum plant no longer exists. Deripaska cut into scrap metal.
            1. Errr
              Errr 28 August 2019 06: 25
              0
              Yes, it’s kind of like, the patient is still alive ...)
              1. Undecim
                Undecim 28 August 2019 06: 27
                0
                As an aluminum producer, the patient is dead. Dismantled electrolysis and alumina workshops.
                1. Errr
                  Errr 28 August 2019 09: 31
                  0
                  It is what it is. Now they only have to roll the wire rod.)
    2. Simargl
      Simargl 27 August 2019 08: 42
      0
      Quote: Nagan
      What, tree shortage in Russia? Or have the invaders captured the aluminum smelters?
      There are no problems with wood and lumin. But with composites - there is: the adversary does not want to sell either technology or materials, but they are not yet able to develop and produce themselves.
  4. Zaurbek
    Zaurbek 27 August 2019 06: 47
    +2
    Create a state company such as Russian Railways and let it develop transportation. In general, you need to move towards a revision of the licensing system. In the north of the USA and Kandada there are a lot of private traders on Cessna. He took off, informed the dispatcher and flew.
    1. frog
      frog 27 August 2019 15: 00
      0
      Russian Railways, with your permission, does not develop transportation, but kills them. Methodically and slowly ...
    2. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 27 August 2019 16: 46
      +1
      Quote: Zaurbek
      Create a state company such as Russian Railways and let it develop transportation.

      Russian Railways has already developed transportation in such a way that it is cheaper to deliver goods to Vladivostok by truck than by train. laughing
  5. Local from the Volga
    Local from the Volga 27 August 2019 06: 48
    0
    Looking for something again! Everything has been around for a long time! The problem is in your engine, this is what you need to do first!
  6. Ros 56
    Ros 56 27 August 2019 06: 52
    +2
    In the end, you can upgrade the An-28 for local to 1000 km. lines.
    1. Alex_59
      Alex_59 27 August 2019 08: 06
      +3
      Quote: Ros 56
      In the end, you can upgrade the An-28 for local to 1000 km. lines.

      Soviet aircraft manufactured in Poland and owned by Ukraine, produced in ridiculous quantities.
      Actually, everything ...
      1. avia12005
        avia12005 27 August 2019 10: 44
        +2
        NAPO them. Chkalova at the beginning of the 2000's was completely ready to release a new modification of the An-38. all the same Ministry of Industry and Trade cut it down. Technical documentation and partly an assembly line are still available. And the staff of the enterprise is being reduced.
  7. Out
    Out 27 August 2019 07: 00
    +4
    Actually, everything is written at the end of the article - most of the population does not have money to pay for flights
  8. 72jora72
    72jora72 27 August 2019 07: 09
    +3
    The main problem that prevents Russia from developing small aircraft and finally creating a new aircraft for it, most experts consider the low solvency of the country's inhabitants. The population, which should be the main consumer of this service, is characterized by weak purchasing power. The small aviation market collapsed. Today, local airlines account for only three percent of Russian passenger traffic. It turns out a vicious circle when airlines do not need to buy airplanes for such flights, but the Russian aviation industry does not need to produce them, there is no demand - there is no supply.
    A somewhat controversial statement. It is simply impossible to get out of most settlements of the Far North and the Far East, except by air transport (from the word with everything). In Yakutia, for example, "gray aviation" is flourishing, which is not regulated or monitored by the state at all. And direct prices depend on the greed of the monopolists (there is no competition, usually only one airline operates in the territories). For example, a ticket for the Keperveyem (Chukotka) -Magadan flight (1 km) costs from 185 rubles to 29000 rubles, and a ticket for the Magadan-Moscow flight (40000 km) can be bought for 10-118 rubles.
  9. thinker
    thinker 27 August 2019 07: 25
    +7
    in Yakutia ... the local aviation park ... by 2026 ... will have to be completely written off.

    And you just have to sing like Cola Beldy yes
    "A snowball is flying behind my back,
    Riding sledges with steeps.
    Steam engine is good
    The steamer is good
    A plane - nothing
    And deer are better
    !"
  10. Free wind
    Free wind 27 August 2019 07: 54
    +7
    To tell you the truth, the characteristics are not a fountain, the biplane scheme and the expensive gluttonous motor are also affecting, and I do not know what else is there. But with such data, the road was ordered to small aviation. Fuel consumption of 100-150 liters per 100 km is not a large carrying capacity, not a lot of speed, well, and 2 pilots who also require money. So imagine how much a ticket costs. I like the American Sesna 402 more. 2 engines of 300 horses. 450 km cruising speed, up to 10 passengers; ceiling up to 8 km; consumption up to 50 liters. crew of 1 person and the price in a not rich configuration is normal
    1. AU Ivanov.
      AU Ivanov. 27 August 2019 09: 17
      +4
      The Chinese, however, produce a copy of Annushka called Y-5 and do not blow into the mustache. For numbness stamped, you can write in simple. And if you also transfer the engine to gasoline. As for the biplane scheme, you got excited - it provides high take-off and landing characteristics and does not require complicated developed wing mechanization. Well, a glass cabin for an MVL aircraft that flies through PVP, in general, is useless.
    2. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 27 August 2019 10: 30
      +5
      Tsesna is a good airplane.
      In the States, it goes for $ 200,000, inexpensively.
      Two engines for the passenger - plus a fair amount. Safety on one engine.
  11. Errr
    Errr 27 August 2019 08: 02
    +1
    This video is already almost a year old and it is clearly of an advertising nature, but, nevertheless, it is quite informative and useful for getting acquainted with TVS-2DTS "Baikal".
  12. Alex_59
    Alex_59 27 August 2019 08: 09
    +4
    Here the Russian Post is asking for 85 billion rubles from the budget to redesign post offices in cities with a population of less than 20 thousand people in order to expand the range of services provided to the population - it is proposed to start selling beer, food, medicines by mail, accept payments and deposits , issue loans.
    85 BILLION! This is the brand new Su-30 air regiment. And here to replace the An-2 with only 1,25 billion before the 2022 of the year and it is not clear which plane ...
  13. CommanderDIVA
    CommanderDIVA 27 August 2019 08: 45
    +1
    If there is no alternative to replacing the An-2, then it may be to take the old tested glider of this aircraft to stick a new engine and avionics there
    1. Ural-4320
      Ural-4320 27 August 2019 10: 39
      0
      Yes, that was all.
      https://ru.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%90%D0%BD-3
      Look at the lines "first flight" and "start of operation".

  14. donavi49
    donavi49 27 August 2019 08: 47
    +3
    Well, if the import substitution is a strange decision:

    - Avionics, you can replace it with domestic complexes, well, it will increase in price by 30-40% in terms of indicator, because there prices are breaking well. Either return the Alarms, even used earphones can be twisted either from zips, then the price will drop. How will this change in LMS ??? Domestic producer will reduce the price by 30-40%? Or remake for alarms?

    - Composites, other types of composites are needed there, not as highly loaded as those of the MS-21. Moreover, the assembly and molding scheme itself is different there. Actually, Ulan-Ude (helicopter plant) was chosen because there is a developed and modern (already in the 10's modernization) composite workshop and extensive experience in this topic. I admit that European-Japanese are in the prototype, for price-quality-weight. However, how will this change in LMS? The transition to Luminiy, but then again, at the time, Antonov made an all-metal aircraft and it was APPROVED, while the combat Yaki-9 / La and even the firstborn of the Yak-15 / 17 jet school were assembled with wooden consoles and tails. That is, the deficient Dural was allocated to an agricultural rural plane, when the programs for transferring combat aircraft to an all-metal construction were slowed down. Also now - you can return to Luminium = as Antonov would have done wooden AN-2 in due time. Immediately increase in mass, increasing requirements for the landing strip, reducing payload and thrust-weight ratio. Actually, why then was it worth spending money on fuel assemblies ???

    - engine. Here, in general, everything is elementary. Engines on 1000 + hp weighing less than 200kg is not even in development. That is, the LMS will receive the same motor (with declared 9-14 people) - simply because there is NO CHOICE. VK-800 - but he’s 800l.s, that is, he won’t pull the car on 9-14 people, he’s not included in the voiced TK. TVs - on the contrary, they are too powerful. They are no longer needed for such an aircraft. This immediately + 1t take-off weight only due to the giant engine and engine mounts. And to carry 9-14 people on them is only in business class wassat . For if the capacity is doubled, then we must use it. Well, it will be expensive, eat more significantly, the service is unbearable.
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 27 August 2019 09: 02
      +1
      By the way, more about Composites - T-500 made from the same composites does not interfere with putting into series.

      1. Ural-4320
        Ural-4320 27 August 2019 14: 52
        0
        At the last MAKS I saw him in the air. I don’t know the reason for the pilot or the plane, but he somehow flew a pancake. Even the MS-21 heels more in turns.
    2. yehat
      yehat 27 August 2019 11: 42
      0
      Yes, what can I say, we have a problem, even put a screw with a variable pitch!
      This technology is 60 years old and does not require advanced electronics or materials science!
      1. donavi49
        donavi49 27 August 2019 13: 43
        +2
        The problems are not to make your own screw, but to:
        - to finance certification, and it is quite strict and expensive, especially after cases with a spontaneous transition to reverse in flight, this has become even more complicated (and more money is required for certification).

        - to finance production, and more precisely, to organize stable demand. Where to put these screws? The need there for 10 sets / year = is too small to even begin to think. Bigger - no.

        - Well, the minimum match, the screw with the characteristics of 40-50-x today, no one will be needed for nothing.
  15. tihonmarine
    tihonmarine 27 August 2019 09: 36
    +2
    Until now, the old man AN-2 flies and is operated, thank God that Sikorsky's "Russian Vityaz" is not yet.
    And this, thanks to OKB-153, led by Oleg Antonov, immediately received the task of developing an agricultural aircraft. He was given the name An-2 and was first lifted into the air by 31.08.1947. In summer, the composition of OKB-153 was relocated to Kiev. (Thanks to the father of the native Trotskyist Khrushchev).
    Read more at: http://avia.pro/blog/kb-antonov
    Imagine 72 years in the air, there is no such machine in the world with such a long life, so it is after the war, two years later, in ruin and to create a masterpiece. Now we cannot even create anything of the kind, or rather, there are no problems, but to launch it into production, it’s like under Ivan the Terrible to start producing the Mosin rifle, and we are still trying to compete with the world in space. We have no order, this is our trouble, but there are more than enough "Stakhanovite thieves" and "managers".
    1. Alexey RA
      Alexey RA 27 August 2019 16: 50
      +2
      Quote: tihonmarine
      Imagine 72 years in the air, there’s no such machine in the world with such a long life,

      1. tihonmarine
        tihonmarine 27 August 2019 18: 48
        0
        And where did you find such a lively handsome "Lisunov". Incomprehensible!
        1. Alexey RA
          Alexey RA 27 August 2019 19: 12
          +2
          Quote: tihonmarine
          And where did you find such a lively handsome "Lisunov". Incomprehensible!

          This is not "Lisunov", but its ancestor - DC-3.
          For example, Buffalo Airways "Douglas" (photo from the company's website):
      2. Ural-4320
        Ural-4320 27 August 2019 19: 49
        +1
        And the white DC-3 motors are no longer radial relatives, but modern ones.
  16. Ural-4320
    Ural-4320 27 August 2019 10: 34
    +1
    Quote: Simargl
    Quote: Nagan
    What, tree shortage in Russia? Or have the invaders captured the aluminum smelters?
    There are no problems with wood and lumin. But with composites - there is: the adversary does not want to sell either technology or materials, but they are not yet able to develop and produce themselves.

    Something I did not catch up: we can do composite helicopter blades, but there are no materials and technologies?
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 27 August 2019 13: 54
      +4
      You all get in the way under one word COMPOSITE. A composite is all in a row, for example, models of ships / planes are made of composites, not those that fly, but those that stand in the window.

      Pour epoxy + on top throw fibers (fiberglass, wood or plastic) and another layer of epoxy, and then press and dry = here is the composite too.

      There are no problems with the marine composite; a lot of boats are made of it. Yes, the same stomps of Alexandrite.
      No problem with a bunch of different composites.

      Have problems with some species highly loaded materials and resins for them. That is, if we make of the material that the blades for the helicopter, the wing for the MS-21 = it will not be needed by anyone, because it is expensive, heavy and such supplies are simply not needed there. It is necessary to make a lightweight composite - so that it can withstand 25 years of intensive flights without the formation of supercritical cracks (and the blade of a wing in flight), while it was as light as possible both in itself and in terms of design. Therefore, the developers turned to the leaders in the segment - to get the most resourceful and lightest wing. Using other fibers and resins - the wing will be heavier / less resourceful.
      1. Ural-4320
        Ural-4320 27 August 2019 14: 50
        0
        It is intelligible! Thank! hi
      2. yuratanja1950
        yuratanja1950 27 August 2019 20: 11
        0
        Quote: donavi49

        There are problems with some types of highly loaded materials and resins for them. That is, if we make of the material that the blades for the helicopter, the wing for the MS-21 = nobody will need it, because it’s expensive, hard

        "That's why the developers turned to the leaders in the segment - to get the most resourceful and lightest wing"...

        I beg your pardon ... I have already tried to clarify the question: in Podlipki-Kaliningrad-Korolev, near Moscow (s), the Kompozit company has existed since Soviet times, which at one time developed a composite coating for the Buran space system ...
        It seems to me that THESE developments are closer to real-life aviation than to models?
        And somehow I can’t believe that they don’t have any close achievements in essence ... Another thing is capitalism is damned, and everyone keeps his secrets to himself ...
        But I repeat again: I don't believe that people from JSC "Composite" will not be able to do something useful for the aviation industry ... Although who knows ... Maybe they have already eaten away the Soviet legacy, but they themselves are effective managers , they can create nothing ... From words and phrases - "absolutely nothing" ...
        1. Cat man null
          Cat man null 27 August 2019 20: 27
          +1
          Quote: yuratanja1950
          Podlipkakh-Kaliningrad-Korolev has existed since Soviet times, the Kompozit company, which developed at one time ...

          It was so long ago that it was no longer true. By the way, during the time of Kaliningrad, which was near Moscow, the company was called the post office A-1147, Central Scientific Research Institute of Materials Science, or Central Scientific Research Institute of Materials.

          Then the company employed 6000 + people and, yes, albeit with a scratch, she could still develop something. By the way, where does it come from that TsNIIMV made the coating for Buran? wink

          Now the office may be a little less than nothing. In the 90s it was successfully sold to a certain LLC "KORA", after which there was no work at all.

          Quote: yuratanja1950
          I do not believe that people from JSC "Composite" will not be able to do something useful for the aircraft industry ... But who knows ...

          Well I do not know. Did it make you feel better?

          Quote: yuratanja1950
          and they themselves can’t create anything in an effective managerial way ...

          It was originally a stillborn office. And if you think that you didn’t know how to cut money under the Union, you are in vain. Sawed - only on the way, the director was there ... appropriate request

          Like this...
          1. yuratanja1950
            yuratanja1950 28 August 2019 11: 19
            0
            Quote: Cat Man Null
            Then the company employed 6000 + people and, yes, albeit with a scratch, she could still develop something. By the way, where does it come from that TsNIIMV made the coating for Buran?


            In the 80s, I had a friend, so his father was the deputy director on this Composite ... I met with his father only once, at the birthday of this friend ... It’s not my father who told me about the cover on Buran, but - son ... But then all these matters were covered by the concept of state secrets ... Believe-not believe, I didn’t think much - after all, in Kaliningrad almost all of the space was spinning, born-controlled ... hi
            1. Cat man null
              Cat man null 28 August 2019 11: 42
              -1
              Quote: yuratanja1950
              ... I had a friend ...

              The name of the acquaintance is not Sparrow, by chance? wink
              1. yuratanja1950
                yuratanja1950 28 August 2019 17: 16
                0
                Quote: Cat Man Null
                The name of the acquaintance is not Sparrow, by chance?


                Shaidurov ... Father - seems to be a doctor of technical sciences, professor ...
        2. donavi49
          donavi49 28 August 2019 07: 57
          +1
          I wrote above - 100500 different composites. But if you make a wing out of them, it will either come out harder than that of luminium (which resets the whole venture) or it will fall off in flight in the first years of operation (regular replacement of the wing - even to replace power elements and cracking = zero out the whole venture).

          Here are light fibers and normal resins, in combination giving a light, sufficient strength and resource for bending wing, in Russia there. And in general, they are not particularly around the world. Watermelon and Boeing are purchased from the same companies from which Irkut was purchased.

          It could be assembled from Chinese. Or weld the resin itself + use Rostekhov fibers. But there already hurt the benefits of the MS-21 is drastically reduced. Therefore, at the design stage, we chose the best possible indicators. Now how to get out, it’s interesting. For, again - a different composition is not only new static tests for certification, but also at least significant changes in the wing. If it gets heavier even by 15%, then the attractiveness of the aircraft for AK will drop significantly.
  17. avia12005
    avia12005 27 August 2019 10: 40
    +3
    They say in Novosibirsk that Baikal has been hacked to death by two officials of the Ministry of Industry and Trade - Bocharov and Dutov, who have a very distant relationship to aviation. Only one graduated from MAI, and the second is generally a shipbuilder. They also initiate the destruction of SibNIIA, where the Baikal was developed and raised on the wing. And the allocation of over 1 billion is just another money laundering. They still cannot formulate the technical task plainly, such "specialists" in the government.
  18. mik193
    mik193 27 August 2019 11: 06
    +1
    And why not just resume production of the An-2, and then continue all this fidgeting with model selection, developments, "new technologies", etc. The plane is needed already yesterday ... Or is it just money for cuts, kickbacks and new developments for some unknown reason?
    1. Alexey Sommer
      Alexey Sommer 27 August 2019 19: 26
      0
      Taken off the tongue! hi
  19. yehat
    yehat 27 August 2019 11: 37
    +3
    most experts consider the low solvency of the country's inhabitants. The population, which should be the main consumer of this service, is characterized by weak purchasing power. The small aviation market collapsed.

    the author carries some nonsense.
    small aircraft die for other reasons
    1. legislation and taxes. There is not much freedom of flight. If you urgently need to break somewhere and fly, it is quite likely that the pilot will not have time to coordinate the departure and will have a choice - to disrupt his plans or to be outlawed. Relative freedom is an essential condition for existence.
    I developed a private small aircraft. The same problem with the requirements for the duration of the pilot's license.
    For the most primitive segments, there should be a liberalization of conditions.
    The problem is with amphibious aircraft. Personally, I absolutely do not understand with whom to coordinate and by what rules to carry out, for example, landing on the Neva.
    2. market conditions - when an airplane is on the market 1.5 million rubles, and a monthly rental of a place in the hangar where it is based costs 16 thousand rubles, what kind of payback can we talk about? And so many services are overpriced.
    The unjustified costs of services for small aircraft should be greatly reduced so that it becomes sane, at the level of prices for servicing business class cars. The same applies to fuel - both the price of it and the availability of high-octane grades.
    3. The big problem is the loss of the repair base for equipment, a noticeable shortage of competent specialists.
    Unjustified costs for small aircraft should be greatly reduced

    And purchasing power is only in 4th place. It is clear that for the development of small aircraft, the population does not need to have the profit of the drug lords, something more modest should be enough.
  20. yehat
    yehat 27 August 2019 11: 46
    +2
    Quote: tihonmarine
    The old man AN-2 is still flying and operating.

    small aircraft is not limited to an-2.
    this is of course the basis of transportation for little things, but there is not a small fleet of other cars, exclusively
    passenger for 2-5 seats (for example, Yak-18), or direct competitors of the An-2 (like the L-410)
    it would be very good if we had a replacement Yak-40 aircraft, which retained its level of comfort and ergonomics, inexpensive, but more unpretentious, quiet and economical.
  21. Thrifty
    Thrifty 27 August 2019 12: 38
    -2
    Yes, take this poor An2, and create it from scratch taking into account MODERN MATERIALS!
    1. donavi49
      donavi49 27 August 2019 13: 46
      +1
      Here they are - TVS-2DTS is out wink . Modern materials - facilitated the aircraft and made it even more resourceful, a modern airborne complex facilitates training and operation, a modern functional cabin - allows passengers to be transported with proper comfort and cargo, under conversion conditions + the ability to use additional external equipment with power from the cargo compartment. A light multi-fuel, very reliable engine and a new, more efficient propeller significantly increased the operational and flight qualities of the machine.

      However, it didn’t suit you.
      1. Captain Nemo
        Captain Nemo 28 August 2019 00: 30
        0
        One amendment - the TVS-2DTS glider came out much heavier than the An-2 glider. The reason - to ensure high cruising speed, braces and racks have been removed. And it costs a lot more.
        An-2: the rights to it now belong not to Ukraine and not to Poland. And the Western Airbus Military Company.
        And in general, I don’t remember something so that somewhere in the world a colony country could develop aviation of its own production.
  22. senima56
    senima56 27 August 2019 14: 06
    +2
    "It's not a secret for anyone that it is extremely difficult to understand the decisions of the Russian government ..." But do they want to understand ?! More and more often I come to the conclusion that in the Ministry of Transport, in the department of "Civil Aviation" (if there is one), "enemies of the people and wreckers" are sitting entirely! Judge for yourself: MS-21 has been moved to the right for a year! The Il-112V was "overweight" by several tons and now it is also shifted to the right for three years! Now here is the ready, flying "Baikal" - hacked to death! ... How to understand this? And like this: "Someone puts sticks in the wheels! Someone throws stones under the braids!" I repeat: "Enemies of the people and pests!"
    1. Revolver
      Revolver 27 August 2019 17: 44
      +1
      Quote: senima56
      What does it mean? And like this: "Someone puts sticks in the wheels! Someone throws stones under the braids!" I repeat: "Enemies of the people and pests!"

      So to understand, the NKVD is needed and not the FSB.
  23. senima56
    senima56 27 August 2019 14: 14
    +2
    Poor, long-suffering "kukuruznichek"! ... Perhaps not a single plane has ever had such a fate. I remember: they decided to replace the engine and the propeller with the old An-2 (then Shoigu was the governor of the Moscow region and was going to open a plant to modernize the entire remaining An-2 fleet) ... Then a proposal with An-3 ... Next "Baikal", and it seems - the plane arranged for everyone and everyone agreed: "We really need it! Let's go faster!" Yes, it was not there, and this topic was "hacked to death"! Where is that "enemy of the people and wrecker" ?! To paraphrase the well-known words of Comrade. L. Kaganovich: "Each decision (each accident) has a name, surname and position!"
  24. Old26
    Old26 27 August 2019 22: 14
    +3
    Quote: Alexey RA
    Yeah ... Japanese machines, Finnish cranes, American grain

    Yeah. And also Hungarian buses, Czech trams, Polish and GDR passenger and cargo ships .... Not to mention clothes and shoes from the countries of people's democracy, furniture from there.
    It's stupidity when they say that the USSR produced everything. No country can produce the entire range. And if it can, then in very small quantities and expensive. And you will have to sign up for "this"

    Quote: Simargl
    Quote: Strashila
    To begin with, let them try to reproduce the AN-2, according to the latest documents with the possibility of maximum modernization from the domestic, as they did with the TU-160.
    An archaic glider, with an ancient engine, according to the most ancient technologies, overweight, without the possibility of modernization? In the Tu-160 except the glider, what remains the same? And what did they do to him? Implemented the backlog of the USSR? And is not PAK YA designed to replace the outdated conceptually Tu-160?

    So no one, Andrei, speaks about the 1: 1 reproduction of the AN-2. But the composite (and expensive) "Baikal" is also not an option. Cars for MVL are needed. For with large areas of regions (edges), the outskirts are simply torn off from the center. Alternatively, the reproduction of a machine of the AN-2 type in mass quantities. Then machines of the BE-30 (BE-32) type instead of the previously operated Czech L-410. The third stage - machines of the AN-24 and YAK-40 class. And then, if you really want to, and 4-6 seater cars like Western "Cessna". But this must be done, not just making plans.
    A childhood memory when I went with my grandfather to the airfield to see "the planes". Okay, there are machines like IL-14 or IL-18. So there was a huge number of cars such as AN-2 and even Czech air taxi "Morava" (EMNIP)
    There were absolutely no problems getting from one oblast (regional center) to another. Everything depended on desire. If you want it - 7 hours by bus or 10 by train, if you want - forty minutes by plane.
    Now the MVL between the regions is practically reduced to zero. Out of transport, autobots, minibus or train remained. And this is in our open spaces. But there are regions where there are only 1-2 branches of railways. The rest is roads. And earlier, MVL aircraft also flew

    Quote: Nagan
    And the ZIMs were then sold to everyone who had enough money.

    To be honest, it is very doubtful. It was an executive class car (before the appearance of the "Seagull"). It was mainly used as an official car intended for the Soviet, party and government nomenklatura - at the level of deputy minister, secretary of the regional committee, deputy. chairman of the regional executive committee, deputy. Chairman of the Economic Council, but not the first persons, in some cases was sold for personal use.
    My uncle in the late 50s and early 60s, being the head of the regional bureau of forensic medical examination of the Karachay-Cherkess Autonomous Region of the Stavropol Territory, had a ZIM as an official vehicle. From childhood memories - in the late 50s - early 60s rarely, but there were taxis and ambulances. There were probably very, very few private ones. in total ZIMs were produced less than 22 thousand in 10 years
  25. akunin
    akunin 28 August 2019 08: 18
    0
    I flew more than once on the AN 2 in both the passenger and cargo versions (it feels like flying on a tractor), comrades with sensitive vestibular hardware puke in packages - beauty.
  26. Leon2
    Leon2 28 August 2019 10: 16
    0
    Leonid Rutkovsky Not a bad article, but again with omissions. The main axis of reasoning is airplanes for the needs of the national economy, and this is where everything loops. Discussions about how good everything was after 1947 and it is worth returning to this. With rare exceptions, at least someone is trying to say that. that by planes, especially in small ones. aviation is operated by qualified pilots and serviced by equally qualified technicians. Today there is neither one nor the other. No one has been preparing them for a long time. And what is prepared in flight clubs and technical schools cannot be called specialists. Although graduation diplomas are on the same cardboard. If you do not consider the problem as a whole, you get a story when "Masha is at home - Bear is not, and vice versa." To produce even the best airplane without quality education and training of flight and technical personnel is a great folly.
  27. Narak-zempo
    Narak-zempo 28 August 2019 19: 07
    0
    Is it not expensive to fly through all sorts of villages and camps? It cost fuel in Sovka.
  28. PilotS37
    PilotS37 29 August 2019 01: 17
    0
    It is no secret to anyone that it is extremely difficult to understand the decisions of the Russian government and it seems that this is exactly the case.

    Well, in this case, you don’t need to dig so deep:
    1. The banal scenario "no money ..." is quite likely.
    2. Even more likely is the scenario that the Government once again stupidly[email protected]Li: they said that the plane was well-almost-completely-ready-almost..., but it turned out that it wasn’t... This is all the more likely because
    The features of the Novosibirsk aircraft included a new wing, a “glass” cockpit and a new fuselage. The highlight of the aircraft was to be the widespread use of composite materials. And the use of modern avionics made it possible to operate the aircraft at any time of the day and made it all-weather.

    All this, damn it, is just inevitable for our "small" aviation!
    They are there, right, that's right, just-without-THIS and cannot live ...
  29. yehat
    yehat 10 September 2019 12: 42
    0
    a bit off-the-point commentary, but on the topic.
    they found a replacement for corn in 1960 - this is Leonid Ilyich Brezhnev. laughing
  30. yehat
    yehat 10 September 2019 12: 48
    0
    Quote: Old26
    So no one, Andrei, speaks about the 1: 1 reproduction of the AN-2. But the composite (and expensive) "Baikal" is also not an option. Cars for MVL are needed. For with large areas of regions (edges), the outskirts are simply torn off from the center. Alternatively, the reproduction of a machine of the AN-2 type in mass quantities.

    the problem is that the an-2 for "today" is expensive to operate.
    and a more advanced aircraft with a significant share of foreign components is very expensive.
    as a result, both of them are not very good.
    the situation can be greatly improved by liberalization of taxes and fuel prices, as well as the restoration of production of the right brand of fuel.
    say, significant concessions in this niche will reduce the cost of flights on the AN-2 simply by half.
    Now carriers for 200-240 km in configuration for 12 passengers take an average of 3-4 tr. for 1 person. Bus tickets (often with bypass roads) cost there on average 650-900r. To understand the cost of flights, I note that only refueling in such a flight at a minimum costs 250l * 48r = 12 + thousand rubles.
    This difference is too uncompetitive.
  31. yehat
    yehat 10 September 2019 12: 56
    0
    Quote: donavi49
    to get the most resourceful and lightest wing.

    and why is the most-most wing?
    for small aircraft, profitability is our everything.
    if the plane can not pay off in 2-3 years of operation - what for it is needed?
  32. yehat
    yehat 10 September 2019 13: 00
    0
    Quote: donavi49
    However, it didn’t suit you.

    his price tag is just horseback.
    for transportation, you can buy a bu in good condition and an-2 resource for about 3-4 million.
    and this pterodactyl costs 150-180 million
    Well, and who needs him so beautiful ???
    for the money you can buy an-12 in fair condition.
  33. aries2200
    aries2200 14 October 2019 21: 35
    0
    12 years of discussion and nothing sensible ... we need to construct one boltology, etc. And nothing has changed............