Military Review

The Russian Aerospace Forces decided to modernize the unloading vests of pilots based on Syrian experience

84
It became known about the idea of ​​making innovations in the equipment of pilots of the Russian Aerospace Forces based on the experience of a military operation in the Syrian Arab Republic. Sergey Pozdnyakov, General Director and Chief Designer of NPP Zvezda, talks about the innovations.


The Russian Aerospace Forces decided to modernize the unloading vests of pilots based on Syrian experience


According to Sergei Pozdnyakov, which leads RIA News, the urgent issue was the modernization of the unloading vest of combat pilots aviation. It is noted that the issue of accommodation options for signal flare guns, combat grenades, a pistol, medical preparations and other things important for the pilot is being addressed. The introduction of innovations in the unloading vest is associated with features in the case of ejection into the territory occupied by the enemy.

Pozdnyakov noted that the Syrian events, as once the events in Afghanistan, are pushing developers to new solutions. Modernization of combat pilot equipment is one such option.

At the moment, the final terms of reference for the unloading vest are not formulated, however, by this fall, such a formulation should be, according to Sergei Pozdnyakov, implemented.

Tests of a new unloading vest for pilots are scheduled for 2020 year.

Recall that Russian pilots in Syria were twice as a result of bailouts in the territory occupied by militants. We are talking about the pilot Oleg Peshkov and the navigator Konstantin Murakhtin (Su-24), as well as Roman Filipov (Su-25). One of them was able to return alive - Konstantin Murakhtin, to assist whom a rescue operation was launched behind enemy lines - after a Turkish fighter attacked the Su-24 Russian Aerospace Forces and ejected Russian troops.
84 comments
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  1. Bacha
    Bacha 13 August 2019 07: 18
    +4
    The idea has just arisen. Already had to make changes based on combat experience and the wishes of the pilots!
    1. Terenin
      Terenin 13 August 2019 07: 51
      +11
      Of course, everyone has their own specifics. Whoever is constantly in technology is one type of unloading, who runs and crawls is another.
      Even Wasserman invented his unloading.
      The principle is clear, I carry all of my (necessary) with me.
    2. Civil
      Civil 13 August 2019 07: 53
      +2
      The training of a highly professional military pilot in Russia costs from 3,4 to more than 7,8 million dollars

      The pilot is expensive, so the means of salvation must be appropriate to the place of work.
  2. sir.jonn
    sir.jonn 13 August 2019 07: 27
    -5
    Pilots are not designed to conduct combat operations behind enemy lines. It’s necessary to create special forces for evacuation in such situations,
    A response team adequately armed and technically trained will be much more effective than dancing with a tambourine around the pilots.
    1. Volodin
      Volodin 13 August 2019 07: 30
      +16
      Quote: sir.jonn
      Pilots are not intended for combat operations behind enemy lines.

      This is from the category of "evidence". Here is the pilot, if he found himself behind enemy lines, and you need to hold out until the arrival of the very special forces that you are writing about. And this is not dancing with tambourines at all, but taking into account every little thing that can ultimately save a life. Unfortunately, the rapid response teams to the pilot's ejection site have not yet learned how to move by teleportation.
      1. sir.jonn
        sir.jonn 13 August 2019 07: 41
        -4
        The pilot needs to turn on the beacon and dig deeper, and the special group in constant duty can be delivered to the territory with a radius of two hundred kilometers in half an hour with simultaneous cover from the air. I do not mean the paratroopers who were absolutely unprepared for the pointy, lightning-fast actions, as they had to do in Syria.
        1. Same lech
          Same lech 13 August 2019 07: 49
          0

          The pilot needs to turn on the beacon and dig deeper,


          They will find with dogs ... the pilot will be gutted with special pleasure ... remember how they burned the Jordanian pilot ... the Syrian pilot.
          It would be better to come up with special equipment that allows you to quickly move from the crash site ... like the recently shown flying platform of the Frenchman Zapata.

          1. sir.jonn
            sir.jonn 13 August 2019 08: 47
            +1
            Quote: The same LYOKHA
            They will find dogs ... the pilot will be gutted with special pleasure.

            Any searches by specially unprepared specialists for this can take quite a while, dogs also need to be found. If the pilot himself finds himself starting to shoot, he will be captured without options, the defending lone warriors will take it very quickly.
            Quote: The same LYOKHA
            such as the recently shown French West flying platform.

            It may be better motorized, in addition, the wing during ejection will replace the parachute.
            1. kit88
              kit88 13 August 2019 12: 09
              +7
              It’s dangerous to turn on the beacon. It broadcasts on the well-known emergency frequency. And he can search for his barmales with a stray from Ali-Express, in fact, even dogs are not needed here. This is a fact widely known in narrow circles since Afghanistan.
              Lighthouses need others, not the model of the 60s - coded, satellite ... Sworn friends from Nata already have the fifth generation of emergency lighthouses with all the bells and whistles, and we still have the first model of the war in Korea. sad
              1. sir.jonn
                sir.jonn 13 August 2019 12: 17
                +1
                Quote: kit88
                It’s dangerous to turn on the beacon. It broadcasts on the well-known emergency frequency. And he can search for his barmales with a stray from Ali-Express

                Generally easy to solve. The beacon operates in passive mode to scan a request from evacuation groups; when a request signal appears, the beacon sends a signal for direction finding or with coordinates of the evacuation point.
                1. kit88
                  kit88 13 August 2019 12: 31
                  +6
                  Of course, everything is simple. There is no need to reinvent the wheel.
                  Above, you described one of the multi-algorithm workings of the American AN / PRC - 112B1. And this previous generation is already obsolete.
                2. K-36
                  K-36 13 August 2019 13: 37
                  0
                  Generally easy to solve
                  This on your couch is easy to solve. And it is worthwhile to capture such a "requestor" passive responder, and all your plans will collapse overnight. Here, for example, is Kostya Murakhtin's rescue operation. The rescue turntable was hit on the ground. Well, is it far to capture this "interrogator" of the passive mode ?! And when he (the "interrogator") is at the gate, then any of our pilots will surrender himself with giblets, indicating (according to your plan) his coordinates ...
                  So here you have to think, think and think again. Something like this.
                  hi
            2. Puzoter
              Puzoter 13 August 2019 13: 30
              +1
              I have been thinking about this for a long time. Since our pilots died in the water after a collision over the sea. Moreover - a paraglider-drone. The Israelis are already using this to deliver the ammunition to the front line. The drone will deliver the wounded to his or at least closer to the front line / shore. In addition, a paraglider is easier to detect in the air, and can even be captured from a helicopter in the air. The beacon, again, can be used without fear to be direction finding.
              1. K-36
                K-36 13 August 2019 14: 18
                0
                Lighthouse again can be used without fear to be direction finding.

                This is just some new word in the theory of direction finding.
                "Even though he was a mechanic Gavril, Gavrila rejected the film." Sorry generously, I could not restrain myself.
                drinks
                1. Puzoter
                  Puzoter 13 August 2019 16: 07
                  -1
                  No theory, simple common sense - if you fly at an altitude of several kilometers, you can use the beacon without fear - even if they spot it, they will not catch up.
          2. Lipchanin
            Lipchanin 13 August 2019 09: 29
            -1
            Quote: The same LYOKHA
            such as the recently shown French West flying platform.

            Well, and at what height does he move?
            How will he fly over the heads of capture groups?
            Yes, they will knock him out of a slingshot
            1. Same lech
              Same lech 13 August 2019 09: 32
              +2
              Well, and at what height does he move?

              It is necessary to modify the apparatus in this regard ... a parachute is also an excellent target for capture groups ... they will still shoot in the air.
              1. Lipchanin
                Lipchanin 13 August 2019 09: 37
                0
                Quote: The same LYOKHA
                .. they kill the perfect target for the capture groups ... they shoot them even in the air.

                Well, that’s what happened in Syria.
                But the parachute is primarily intended to save the pilot in emergency situations.
                All the same, planes often fight in peacetime.
                It is necessary to modify the apparatus in this regard

                Well, how much space will it take and how to shove it into the emergency reserve. After all, instead of a parachute you will not dress him
                1. Same lech
                  Same lech 13 August 2019 09: 40
                  0
                  Well, how much space will it take and how to shove it into the emergency reserve. After all, instead of a parachute you will not dress him

                  Why not integrate this device into an ejection seat ... in general, designers should think about it ... I’m just proposing an idea. hi
                  1. Lipchanin
                    Lipchanin 13 August 2019 09: 44
                    0
                    Quote: The same LYOKHA
                    Why not integrate this apparatus into an ejection seat.

                    The chair immediately shoots back. Yes, and it is not dimensionless. smile
                    I’m just proposing an idea.

                    So it’s done for this. Discuss, propose and discuss the proposed hi
                  2. quote
                    quote 13 August 2019 13: 05
                    +1
                    Quote: The same Lech
                    Well, how much space will it take and how to shove it into the emergency reserve. After all, instead of a parachute you will not dress him

                    Why not integrate this device into an ejection seat ... in general, designers should think about it ... I’m just proposing an idea. hi

                    To fly over the English Channel required refueling. You would have studied the issue, and then "conceived".
                  3. K-36
                    K-36 13 August 2019 14: 07
                    +1
                    Uv, the same LYOKHA. In order to offer something in the ejection seat device, you need to know a lot. For example, the task of the seat itself, as a means of saving the pilot. And he here (on the airborne) also met such "progressive ideas" as the installation of a parachute-wing instead of an uncontrolled PSU-36. Well, what about? He opened himself over the enemy's territory and flew towards his own ... Well, yes, well, yes ... And after all, it is not known to such "progressives" that the NAZ hangs on the 11-meter halyard below. And as soon as this NAZ catches on to a bush (or tree), the landing will go strictly along a radius of 11 meters (look at the clock face, how it will look). what And if the bailout occurred at night? That's it ...
                    In addition, it would not be superfluous to know the permissible parameters of the weight distribution of the aircraft (to shamelessly push additional devices into the chair, having your weight. Here you, for example, know why on the Su-30 it is used in the design of PGO, but on the Su-35 it is not?!? I explain: weight distribution, center of mass and aerodynamics (and all this on the heap).
                    So, in order to offer something, you need to know a lot. yes
                    This post of mine does not apply to you personally, but to those who are in a great hurry to offer "progressive", without having the necessary knowledge base for this ..
                    hi
            2. sir.jonn
              sir.jonn 13 August 2019 12: 31
              +1
              Quote: Lipchanin
              Quote: The same LYOKHA
              such as the recently shown French West flying platform.

              Well, and at what height does he move?
              How will he fly over the heads of capture groups?
              Yes, they will knock him out of a slingshot

              If the device starts flying at a sufficiently high altitude, it may be lacking, and with a controlled flight, you can try to get as far away from potentially dangerous places as possible. The problem is that when bailout it’s difficult to quickly navigate the terrain, therefore, you need a GPS navigator with an automatically built-in safe evacuation track /
              1. Lipchanin
                Lipchanin 13 August 2019 12: 40
                -2
                Quote: sir.jonn
                If the device starts flying at a sufficiently high altitude, it may be missing

                Please describe how you think that after ejection, he will get this device out of the emergency gang, put it on, fly to his place
                1. sir.jonn
                  sir.jonn 13 August 2019 13: 07
                  +1
                  Quote: Lipchanin
                  Quote: sir.jonn
                  If the device starts flying at a sufficiently high altitude, it may be missing

                  Please describe how you think that after ejection, he will get this device out of the emergency gang, put it on, fly to his place

                  1) The device should be a paraglider wing opening as a parachute.
                  2) An impeller built into the catapult seat on lithium-ion batteries.
                  3) The chair must be protected from penetration by small arms.
                  Ego does not need to wear a pilot is in it from the moment of landing in the pilot's seat.
                  1. Lipchanin
                    Lipchanin 13 August 2019 13: 26
                    0
                    Quote: sir.jonn
                    1) The device should be a paraglider wing opening as a parachute.

                    Let’s suppose. Can you imagine the size of the wing? How many kilometers will it be visible imagine?
                    2) An impeller built into the catapult seat on lithium-ion batteries.

                    Can you imagine the weight? Indeed, in order to pull such a design, one must have a huge capacity of accumulators, therefore there should be several of them.
                    3) The chair must be protected from penetration by small arms.

                    It turns out the pilot will move in the seat? Do you even imagine the weight and dimensions of this whole structure?
                    And how do you fit all this into a cabin as small as you imagine?
                    I understand that you want, and not just you, to secure the pilot. But it's still not even tomorrow. And the article is about what is being done today.
                    Just imagine how difficult it is to create a very reliable ejection seat. And here we need to create almost a new aircraft, combine it with a catapult, an already sophisticated technical tool, and place all this on airplanes of various brands and destinations. Can you imagine what a difficult technical task it is?
                    The life of a pilot is more expensive, but you also need to understand that today it is simply impossible to create it
                    1. sir.jonn
                      sir.jonn 13 August 2019 14: 08
                      -1
                      The visibility and weight of the wing is comparable to the dome, the seat is already on the plane, and for a paraglider is not such a big load. Batteries, an electric motor, an impeller also do not weigh anything; their aircraft models have long been using.
                      In general, the task is nice even for a self-taught amateur with the delivery of components from aliexpress.
                      1. Lipchanin
                        Lipchanin 13 August 2019 14: 18
                        +1
                        In general, the task is nice even for a self-taught amateur with the delivery of components from aliexpress.

                        I wanted to answer you point by point, but when I saw this statement and photo ...
                        Sorry, the desire is gone.
                        I wish you success in promoting this .. I will not find words request
                        I didn’t even think that our engineers and designers are already inferior to self-taught request
          3. beeper
            beeper 13 August 2019 12: 01
            +1
            Such evacuation special equipment already has a catapult seat! yes
            It remains to modify it as a motor glider (most likely with a flexible wing) - a "transformer" and even more robotic-make it programmed to automatically return to its territory or (which is more realistic to do) to move to one of the previously agreed "meeting points (along the route flight) "on enemy territory, coordinated with a squad of search and rescue forces and means, so that they only" pick up (including right in the air, without "transferring" on the ground! winked ) "and evacuated the individually delivered pilot! wink
            Yes, more constructive and organizational problems will need to be solved "in the process", but the value of each qualified pilot is only growing every year!
            1. Lipchanin
              Lipchanin 13 August 2019 12: 42
              -1
              Quote: pishchak
              Yes, more constructive and organizational problems will need to be solved "in the process"

              Sorry, but this is all likely to be in the distant future.
              The article is about saving the life of a pilot today.
              1. beeper
                beeper 13 August 2019 12: 53
                +1
                Lipchanin, "the distant future", with the appropriate setting of the problem, organization of work and funding, may not be "distant" at all! During the Second World War, by organizing round-the-clock work, the terms, from "idea" to "metal", were reduced when it was "very necessary"!
                And, in any case, the MSS service prevails in the survival and evacuation of the surviving pilots - its organization and ensuring the "top priority" should be!
                Although "more convenient unloading" for the pilots, probably, will not hurt, if only for such "obvious", "trees", the dense "forest" itself did not lose sight of ?! winked
                From me is a plus, but the minus was not mine. request
                1. Lipchanin
                  Lipchanin 13 August 2019 12: 56
                  -1
                  I do not respond to anonymous replicas
                2. Lipchanin
                  Lipchanin 13 August 2019 14: 27
                  0
                  pishchak, I think that such work is underway. After all, there cannot be such a thing so that no one else comes up with such ideas.
                  But the problem is very serious. And no labor feat can significantly reduce the period of its implementation. There are some trials, I’m even afraid to imagine how much, I need to carry out. And every failure is a delay.
                  - if only for such, straight to all "obvious", "trees" did not lose sight of the dense "forest" ?! winked

                  Well, probably all the same, the engineers and designers of the catapults do not deal with the issue of unloading equipment)
                  Yes, it's not the pros and cons.
                  I’m already used to being minus not for comment, but seeing nick
                  1. beeper
                    beeper 13 August 2019 17: 43
                    0
                    Lipchanin, about something similar, abroad and here, associated with ejection and further controlled flight (both with a mini-engine and in free gliding from a height, at a distance of many tens of kilometers from the place of "drop"!) Of pilots and saboteurs on high altitudes and speeds, was repeatedly published in our Soviet magazine "Tekhnika-Molodyozhi" back in the 60-70s of the last century.
                    Then in the West, the "Rogallo wing", which became the prototype of the first hang gliders, was just becoming fashionable, and like everything new, they "idealized" it and tried to adapt it for everything ... just developed the idea a little in the light of progress (including miniaturization and new materials ) control systems, programming (otherwise I remember, heavy and oversized, military programmers - "relays" with sets of control eccentric rollers, as in household washing machines of the 80s), navigation, engine building, aerodynamic surfaces ...
                    IMHO-universal Information field is arranged in such a way that the same or similar ideas arise, independently and approximately simultaneously, in the brain of several inhabitants of our planet, on any continent, and some of us will surely "grasp" such a "thought", considering it a priori unique, it will think about it and even more induce it into "universal brain access" ... no "secret safes" will keep secret, so it makes sense to immediately combine as much effort as possible on universally significant "consistent" areas of human activity! yes
            2. Nikolay Balashov
              Nikolay Balashov 13 August 2019 19: 31
              0
              Why flexible? Our self-taught designer created an airplane in a suitcase. (the one who created the X-14, there are many articles on the internet). Shot down, catapulted, flew on, and shot down? then a parachute.
              1. beeper
                beeper 13 August 2019 20: 56
                0
                Nikolay Balashov, if you have contacted me, then, in my opinion, the flexible wing version is the most realistic in terms of mass and dimensions, relative simplicity of the device and deployment, the possibility of stealthy non-motorized hover, the stability of its "set" and overloads during ejection ... and the overcomplicated and rather contradictory design of the "Dmitriev" microplanes a priori clearly loses in these parameters, even if it is made at the "highest level" of constructive study and selection of materials. IMHO
                In addition, we should not forget that the bailout, even of a pilot not injured in battle, is a physically-traumatic factor for any human body and will only be used in a difficult hopeless situation!
                Therefore, the simpler, more expedient and automated will be the "scheme of the process" of rescuing our pilot (the "ideal scheme" for him should consist of two points: "1). Somehow the process of ejection from the damaged aircraft-2 is activated). With minimal costs the pilot is accepted on board the MSS and he is immediately provided with the necessary medical assistance on the way home "!), so much the better for him and the relevant services! winked

                For the optimal solution of ANY problem, both small-scale and the most nistrategic-global, it is important to have a clear and precise representation of the ultimate goal that we want to achieve - in this case, the ideal ultimate GOAL of "evacuation of the aircraft operator" is 100% return of the pilot to combat build after the loss of his car ("modernization of the unloading vest" is only an auxiliary element, a step on the way is one of many, but by no means a solution to the main problem of "100% pilot return", which requires more radical approaches than "shifting pockets"! )!

                PS An even more fantastic "approach", which, perhaps, will turn someone from those involved in the "problem solving", his "train of thought" and lead to the necessary results, is to make the enemy even afraid to look in the direction of the ejected pilot, and not to shoot, cut and somehow try to approach or harm him, literally, so that the eyes of the enemies "burst" and "the mind goes beyond the mind" in any such attempts .... sapienti sat! wink
        2. 72jora72
          72jora72 13 August 2019 08: 33
          +3
          The pilot needs to turn on the beacon and dig deeper
          If Konstantin Murakhtin acted on your advice, then he would not have been alive long ago.
          1. sir.jonn
            sir.jonn 13 August 2019 09: 03
            0
            Quote: 72jora72
            The pilot needs to turn on the beacon and dig deeper
            If Konstantin Murakhtin acted on your advice, then he would not have been alive long ago.

            Konstantin Murakhtin survived because the Mi-8 evacuation team arrived in time, where, in turn, the marine corpsman Alexander Pozynich also died.
            1. K-36
              K-36 13 August 2019 17: 10
              +2
              sir.jonn
              You are right here. However, you are missing one very important detail. Kostya Murakhtin noticed that as soon as he gets in touch with the search turntable, he immediately hears the sound of approaching jeeps. He realized that he was being tracked, so he decided to "make his feet", not including the radio station. Tore off the tips of his fingers so that blood began to flow from under his nails (and he climbed up the hill to get away from the jeeps). But I got in touch with the PSS-noy turntable in a different way. Which one I will not say in principle, because it saved his life. Now he is alive and flying. May God let him realize everything, experience and find his correct attitude to his future destiny.
        3. Lipchanin
          Lipchanin 13 August 2019 09: 27
          0
          Quote: sir.jonn
          The pilot needs to turn on the beacon and dig deeper,

          So this is already needed excavator.
          The usual bayonet, especially the smaller sapper, this will not work.
          1. K-36
            K-36 13 August 2019 17: 17
            +2
            The usual bayonet, especially the smaller sapper, this will not work.

            There is no shovel for pilots in NAZ (neither a bayonet nor a small engineer).
            hi
            1. Lipchanin
              Lipchanin 13 August 2019 17: 19
              -1
              Quote: K-36
              There is no shovel for pilots in NAZ (neither a bayonet nor a small engineer).

              I know. Just did not put a smiley so that a person does not offend inadvertently smile hi
              1. sir.jonn
                sir.jonn 13 August 2019 17: 30
                +1
                Quote: Lipchanin
                I know. Just did not put a smiley so that a person does not offend inadvertently

                If the stone is in my garden, then the expression to dig deeper initially meant to hide, to avoid contact with the enemy, which Konstantin Murakhtin did
                1. Lipchanin
                  Lipchanin 13 August 2019 17: 34
                  -1
                  Quote: sir.jonn
                  If a stone is in my garden

                  Not a stone.
                  then the expression to dig deeper initially meant to hide, to get away from contact with the enemy,

                  That's why I didn’t put a smiley on it, I thought that you just forgot to quote this expression hi
                  1. sir.jonn
                    sir.jonn 13 August 2019 17: 37
                    0
                    Quote: Lipchanin
                    That's why I didn’t put a smiley on it, I thought that you just forgot to quote this expression

                    Of course, digging is also not bad, but as you noticed, you can’t do without an excavator. recourse
        4. Shkodnik65
          Shkodnik65 13 August 2019 13: 29
          +2
          Do you remember how the commander of the Su-24 was killed in Syria? He did not even manage to reach the ground. Where to bury, if a pilot can land in front of the "barmaley" in a field, desert, some settlement? I will assume that you are simply not in the subject. In NAZ, the pilot has a beacon and a machine gun and much more, but reality throws out such tricks that the beacon can be broken and the enemy - here it is. It is absolutely necessary to arm the crews in the event of a real combat mission.
      2. Pedrodepackes
        Pedrodepackes 13 August 2019 08: 33
        -4
        Quote: Volodin
        Unfortunately, quick response teams to the pilot bailout site have not yet learned how to move.

        so they need to be prepared and equipped. sir.jonn (Eugene) rights and his innocence is confirmed by the practice of amers, their rescue groups, which have been very effective from Korea to the latest conflicts. There is nothing to make "Rambo" out of the pilots, they are learning for another and, as practice has shown (in Afghanistan), if they have found you, then fight back, even with the AKSU, the chances are scanty. Only specially trained PSS teams will help.
        1. Volodin
          Volodin 13 August 2019 08: 45
          +3
          Quote: Pedrodepackes
          the chances are scanty. Only specially trained MSS groups will help.

          No, well, if, as you write in one of the comments below, the pilot will ask for a "couple of bubbles" instead of himself to jump with a parachute and continue "baiting bikes" instead of practicing shooting exercises, then, of course ... - we can only hope for the group salvation ...
          1. Pedrodepackes
            Pedrodepackes 13 August 2019 08: 58
            -4
            Quote: Volodin
            instead of practicing shooting exercises, then, of course ... - all that remains is to hope for a rescue group ...

            even if he performs shooting and jumping exercises, which are supposed to be a pilot, it will not save him in such cases. It is impossible to grow both "Rambo" and "Pokryshkin" out of one person in one bottle (only in a piece, perhaps). It is easier and more effective to prepare a MSS with the proper qualifications.
      3. donavi49
        donavi49 13 August 2019 08: 54
        +3
        Well, there are different cases. Filipov and Pecheneg would not help, even if it would be a spark and the second commando also with a machine gun. They fell right on the heads of the broads. In 300 from the supporting village of KhTS.

        Here perhaps (POSSIBLE) would help only a parachute wing, which can fly far. And the second plane, which would entertain the broads, not letting run-go behind the flying wing.

        If you managed to hide, then you need to turn on the beacon and eat biscuits with bars, before the arrival of help.

        Well and still to drag rescue forces to the American level. Create a mobile network of bases, which allows you to raise a rescue squad from the nearest cell, reducing flight time (well, Osprey - which are not).
        1. sir.jonn
          sir.jonn 13 August 2019 09: 06
          -1
          Quote: donavi49
          (Well, Osprey - which are not).

          MI-24 in such a situation is preferable to a small advantage in speed is more than covered by maneuver and fire support.
      4. K-36
        K-36 13 August 2019 12: 03
        +2
        Alexey Volodin, do you have a (journalistic) opportunity to address the "top" of the aircraft industry? For a long time ago, the need to install a fired radio beacon on each civilian aircraft / helicopter in the event of its (s-that / in-that) fall is overripe. The search sometimes drags on for years. And, as you know, help is effective within the first 7-15 minutes !!! And the implementation of such an idea (shooting a radio beacon) is extremely simple. The radio beacon itself in today's Russia fits into a 30 mm signal flare (in size). A firing sensor can be used already 40 years ago by an industrial overload sensor, which was used in combat aircraft to destroy the "friend or foe" responder in the event of our aircraft being shot down over enemy territory. In this sensor, it is enough to set the value of g (in units of overload), and it will give an electrical (or mechanical, no difference) signal to shoot such a p / beacon. In hostilities, this signal was transmitted to the "Explosion SRO" (Defendant's radio system). Until then ... everyone is looking for a Korean Boeing that went missing a few years ago. Apotheosis: "... They have been looking for a long time, but cannot find. They are looking for firemen. The police are looking. They are looking for photographers and ... other persons" S.M. Marshak
        And I propose to make such a device in Russia. Current for ... was already knocking on various "supreme doors".
        Best regards hi
    2. 1 Navigator
      1 Navigator 13 August 2019 19: 44
      0
      Well, there is a PSO, and the pilot must hold out until her arrival.
  3. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 13 August 2019 07: 29
    +5
    For some reason, pilots do not like to shoot from their personal weapons, they evade training in every possible way ... I remember that in the garrison only a couple of pilots fired well and FULFILLED the standards "for everyone" ... The authorities turned a blind eye to this ... Maybe the omen is bad?
    1. Volodin
      Volodin 13 August 2019 07: 39
      -1
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      For some reason, the pilots do not like to shoot from personal weapons, in every way evade training ...

      What does "evade" mean? Perhaps it was some kind of separate case, and rather strange
      1. Mountain shooter
        Mountain shooter 13 August 2019 07: 42
        +2
        Quote: Volodin
        What does "evade" mean? Perhaps it was some kind of separate case, and rather strange

        We went to the shooting range and shot an exercise for everyone ... About one shooter per squadron ...
        Maybe local "hooliganism", I didn't go with the inspection ... wassat
      2. a.hamster55
        a.hamster55 13 August 2019 08: 25
        +2
        Dear Alexey! Why did you sign up for spies, and don’t know the simple tricks in the army. Probably did not serve with Us. I personally handed over physically for the son of NS of our air division, I even trained a pronunciation specific to the report. Colleagues almost burned with their smiles.
        1. Volodin
          Volodin 13 August 2019 08: 33
          0
          Quote: a.hamster55
          Probably did not serve with Us.

          I don’t know where “you” is, and even with a capital letter and some specific pronunciation)) Therefore, perhaps, I will not ask the question, what is the connection between “handing over physo for the son of the chief of staff” and shooting exercises.

          And this is also "very interesting":
          Quote: a.hamster55
          Why did you sign up for spies

          Where-where am I, sorry, signed up? ..
      3. Pedrodepackes
        Pedrodepackes 13 August 2019 08: 37
        0
        Quote: Volodin
        What does "evade" mean? It may have been a separate incident.

        yeah, so separate that in our regiment, even for a couple of bubbles, they managed to expose other "lovers" of parachute jumps for themselves, and on the shooting range they went purely to bait bikes and shoot a couple of times if they were hunting. Actually, the programs for shooting training were like for the pioneers in the park: three sighting and three in the offset, that's the joy.
    2. bober1982
      bober1982 13 August 2019 07: 55
      +1
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      For some reason, pilots do not like to shoot from personal weapons

      Then the gun had to be cleaned, in any case, wiped with an oiled cloth. (joke)
      Shooting was forced, because they had to shoot a pistol, which means they were shooting.
      The main type of shooting is "Macedonian", that is, with two hands, of course there was no question of accuracy. In short, one whim.
  4. Professor
    Professor 13 August 2019 07: 52
    -2
    According to Sergei Pozdnyakov, quoted by RIA Novosti, the issue of modernization of the unloading vest of combat aviation pilots has become urgent. It is noted that the issue of options for placing signal flares, combat grenades, a pistol, medical preparations and other things important for the pilot is being addressed. The introduction of innovations in the unloading vest is connected with the peculiarities in the case of ejection into the territory occupied by the enemy.

    And before the war in Syria, there were no questions? The pilots were happy with everything and didn’t think about the placement of flare flares, combat grenades, pistols, medications and other things important for the pilot? request
    1. Mountain shooter
      Mountain shooter 13 August 2019 07: 59
      +4
      Quote: Professor
      And before the war in Syria, there were no questions? The pilots were happy with everything and did not think about the placement of flare guns, combat grenades, a pistol, medical preparations and other things important for the pilot

      So you didn’t catapult over enemy territory for a long time ... Afghanistan has already forgotten ...
      1. Professor
        Professor 13 August 2019 08: 25
        0
        Quote: Mountain Shooter
        So you didn’t catapult over enemy territory for a long time ... Afghanistan has already forgotten ...

        ... and did not work out such situations? Did not calculate the chances of survival? Waiting for a real bailout on enemy territory?

        PS
        I don’t remember the case when a downed pilot took the fight and waited for the evacuation. Arm him with at least a machine gun, there is no chance to fight back. He needs to be able to hide and sit quietly until his people are pulled out. If pulled out at all.
  5. SERGEY SERGEEVICS
    SERGEY SERGEEVICS 13 August 2019 08: 08
    0
    If this modernization will benefit the pilots, then everyone will do the right thing. If you already have some experience, you need to proceed from it and more confidently implement these modernizations.
  6. Carib
    Carib 13 August 2019 08: 18
    +1
    Updated AK-74U + 2 horns + 4 packs of cartridges, well, and 2pcs RGD5 + F1 ...
    1. Military Builder
      Military Builder 13 August 2019 08: 49
      +2
      + F1.

      when the ammunition is used up and you don’t feel like capturing (without irony)
    2. donavi49
      donavi49 13 August 2019 09: 03
      +2
      There are grenades. AK in a chair in NAZ is usually, but to reach it is far from always possible. Packs of cartridges are not needed. If everything is quiet, then why? If overlaid, then there will be no time to fill stores.

      Americans and not only experimented with PDW. Personal weapons under a single cartridge for the pilot, sailor, tanker, who is always with him. In fact, only the 5,7 pistol and PP P-90 were born. The Germans got off the contest. And the Belgian is not particularly popular, in the sense for pilots.

      In Afghanistan, they usually carry their favorite gun with them (if they are Americans or others with free circulation). And the arch - performed by a carbine.
  7. Avior
    Avior 13 August 2019 08: 27
    0
    A gun will not help the pilot much, except from local peasants with hoes. Need a light and compact submachine gun for self-defense. And of course, a rescue group ready for departure, and a helicopter for it with an extended range
  8. a.hamster55
    a.hamster55 13 August 2019 08: 46
    +2
    Ejection even over its territory, even in peacetime is always a great stress. And a safe landing on the sand of the sand dune still does not guarantee anything - for example, drags the dome onto a crawling gyurza .... Something to put on an hour to sit on the sand, but this does not guarantee adequate action.
  9. Griol
    Griol 13 August 2019 09: 12
    -3
    For a long time it was necessary to provide for everything in the pilot's vest so that search, survival, defense were as reliable as possible. And then, while the roasted cock .......
  10. Sochi
    Sochi 13 August 2019 10: 35
    0
    The idea is good, necessary, long overdue ... The pilot should have a chance at survival, and here every detail in its equipment is important.
  11. yehat
    yehat 13 August 2019 10: 44
    +3
    Quote: sir.jonn
    quick response team

    our flights are not secured
    there is no one on duty nearby who could help
    and you’re talking about some kind of response group.
    And the feverish gathering of the group and departure immediately to a blind environment is also a risk for the personnel
    To make flights safer, you need to actually 2-3 times increase the cost of their provision,
    but it’s much cheaper just for a pilot to throw a 20-30 thousand risk premium.
    In the same way, several servicemen (spotters, advisers, instructors) who fell under the melee distribution were killed - stupid savings. Landmines on the roads on which our cars were blown up are also a consequence of savings on road safety.

    That's all. The question is stupid in money.
  12. Stepych
    Stepych 13 August 2019 10: 52
    +1
    my question is different:
    why in order to make changes to the unloading vest people had to die?
    It was impossible to think of this without practice? After all, ash stump that pilots risk being shot down during hostilities
  13. Operator
    Operator 13 August 2019 11: 17
    -2
    Aviation does not need to fly into the enemy rear, strikes must be carried out remotely using guided weapons, and then an unloading vest along with a helicopter rescue service will not be needed.

    Since guided aviation weapons are primarily represented by gliding bombs with a range of up to 120 km, the use of aviation in conflicts such as the Syrian one can be reduced by a factor of several - it is quite enough to shoot at such a range with guided missiles MLRS "Smerch" with a warhead mass of 250 kg - exactly exactly like the air bombs featured in reports from Syria. External target designation remains the same - from the UAV, equipped with an HDTV camera and a laser designator.

    For especially protected or remote targets, there should be an OTRK based on the same Smerch MLRS, since Russia has withdrawn from the treaty on medium and short-range missiles.

    PS All Su-24 / 25 / 27 / 30 / 34 need to be sold in FIG to different indies, and to purchase more Su-35 / 57 for revenue bully
  14. Tektor
    Tektor 13 August 2019 11: 43
    0
    Need a short sniper, Vintorez to keep spirits at a long distance. And besides grenades, you need a boa constrictor, also with a silencer and a laser target designator.
  15. K-36
    K-36 13 August 2019 12: 32
    +3
    [quote = yehat] [quote = sir.jonn] quick response group [/ quote]
    our flights are not secured
    there is no one on duty nearby who could help
    and you’re talking about some kind of response group.
    And the feverish gathering of the group and departure immediately to a blind environment is also a risk for the personnel

    If you transfer your tirade to a database in Syria, then, I’m called, you froze a complete ... muin. In the case of Our departure to strike in the air, the spinner also rises without fail. On board are two groups, each of which has its own commander. 1. GOP-nicknames (fire cover group). As a rule, they are marines or special forces. They provide fire cover for a rescue turntable, an evacuated pilot and children from the PSS group. 2. The MSS group - rescuers who are responsible for delivering a wounded pilot to a helicopter.
    Each of these groups has its own commander. Therefore, before their joint use, combat coordination is carried out. And only then the admission to real flights is given. Something like this. All my former colleagues from the PSS have already visited the kindergartens, so I know the picture "firsthand" (as they say).
    hi
  16. Prutkov
    Prutkov 13 August 2019 14: 20
    0
    Saving pilots is really a problem. To fasten a sports controlled parachute is an exit, as pilots leave the plane in a stressful state and cannot always control a parachute. And such a parachute has a too high drop rate. Without control, such a parachute can be broken or crippled. So, other ways are needed. Why not make it so that the pilot can land much earlier than the parachute lands on the ground? Alternatively, it would be possible to attach a coil with a strong cable 100 meters long to the parachute suspension system. After leaving the aircraft at a certain height, such a coil begins to unwind slowly, increasing the distance between the canopy and the person. As a result, it becomes possible to land earlier than a parachute and take cover while the barmalei run after the descending dome. Now the signaling. Any radio signal is direction finding. And Almighty, by a strange coincidence, sends modern barmels modern means of air defense and radio direction finding. In these conditions, turning on the transmitter is deadly. Why not add a laser pointer device to the beacon. When a search team appears in the pilot’s visibility area, it directs a laser beam at the plane. On which a hanging container with a set of laser radiation receivers is mounted. By what receiver received the laser signal, you can determine the approximate direction from where the beam came. One can even organize a one-way telephone channel from pilot to board along this beam.
    1. K-36
      K-36 13 August 2019 15: 15
      0
      By what receiver received the laser signal, you can determine the approximate direction from where the beam came. One can even organize a one-way telephone channel from pilot to board along this beam.
      Another "progressive" negative .
      Well, the aircraft of Peshkov and Murakhtin were shot down. Murakhtin managed to dump into the mountains. And Peshkov was shot in the air. And his entire NAZ was at the barmaley. Well, what does it cost them, having captured Peshkov’s NAZ, to turn on such a laser pointer in order to launch Our rescue helicopter?!? To later capture the entire crew, along with GOP nicknames and PSS nicknames?!?
      Oh, wise couch ... recourse
      1. Prutkov
        Prutkov 13 August 2019 15: 41
        0
        Before being rude, I would carefully read the entire text. It says that it provides a one-way communication channel, and the pilot can in real time report with a conditional phrase what is with him and where he is.
        1. K-36
          K-36 13 August 2019 16: 30
          0
          I had no intention of being rude. Sorry if I accidentally offended. I naturally read all of your text. Only now it immediately caught my eye - raw and absolutely ill-conceived. Hence my reaction. Here's the answer: what is the solid angle of radio relay communication? And in the laser beam? I propose to consider the option of night. And where should the pilot send his laser pointer to transmit his encoded message? Somewhere to where he heard the sound of a helicopter (this is through the roar of firing)? Well, what are the chances? And if fog or rain? The laser pointer turns out to be a useless toy.
          In addition, I hinted openly about the situation of Peshkov and Murakhtin. The second laser pointer (in the considered example - Peshkova) may appear at the barmaley. And, if the surviving pilot just needs to hide behind any terrain folds, then the barmalei can broadcast from the open area, which dramatically increases their communication capabilities (unlike ...). In a word, what I wanted to tell you (and not only you) that before you offer anything, you must have good basic knowledge and think carefully for a long time before ...
          Something like that. If you again consider this rudeness, then God will judge you. If Che, then Peshkov and Murakhtin are pilots from my native azrodrom.
          hi
          1. Prutkov
            Prutkov 13 August 2019 17: 15
            0
            Apologies are accepted. I understand that your emotional message is connected with anxiety for the fate of the pilots. Touching the example you brought with Peshkov and Murakhtin. And in this case, the barmalei had the opportunity to capture the radio beacon and turn it on. As for your fear that a narrow beam of a laser pointer will not allow you to fix the beam on a rescue helicopter. Try an experiment with a regular laser pointer by pointing it at a remote building. And you will see that the size of the light spot will already be decent. Well, for general erudition ... In radio-relay communication there is no concept of “solid angle”, but there are “Fresnel zones”. The size of these zones depends on the wavelength and distance from the radiation source. One can try to solve the problem of beam permeability through precipitation by selecting the appropriate radiation wavelength. I just gave my suggestion. But in my proposal, I did not indicate anywhere that we should abandon the existing system with a radio beacon. A compact laser pointer can complement an existing system. And what exactly to include at the moment, the pilot will decide, based on the situation. Well, so that there were no options that the barmalei lured the rescuers, I suggest using passphrases, passwords, which meant that “I’m fine, I’m waiting for the arrival of the team” or “I’m alive, but in the hands of the barmales” ...
            1. K-36
              K-36 13 August 2019 18: 01
              0
              Well, dear Prutkov, you are already slowly starting to feel and comb your proposed topic. What pleases (unlike paragliders with a motor lol ) However, you again carefully avoided the possibility of capturing all communications equipment of the pilot by the enemy (in our case, barmaley). And such cases are already pulled by a cart and a small cart. Google how many of our turntables got into the territory of the barmaley in Syria. And the question arises already edge on. How not to get ambushed by the MSS turntable when the barmalei use the captured communications equipment of our pilot?
              I have already expressed my thoughts to the staff officers of the PSS. How much will they be heard, and will they be heard at all? Time will tell. Of course, I will not discuss them on this site (because this is a section of the PSO DB). I can only say that this does not concern any modernization of the ejection seat. The creation of a special combat radio station and code protection, yes, it does. On this topic I close. But with floodlights of rash sofa ideas, all the same, I’ll fight here.
  17. sibiryak.vitya
    sibiryak.vitya 13 August 2019 19: 48
    0
    Quote: Operator
    Aviation does not need to fly into the enemy rear, strikes must be carried out remotely using guided weapons, and then an unloading vest along with a helicopter rescue service will not be needed.

    If you do not fight, then military aviation will not be necessary.
    You are dressed in Tanchiki. Virtual confused with reality.
  18. Flatter
    Flatter 13 August 2019 21: 05
    0
    It is necessary to include a gas mask and a grenade launcher with neuroparalytic grenades in the unloading vest.