India will buy Israeli 155-mm autonomous howitzers ATHOS 2052

The Israeli company Elbit Systems won the tender for the supply of 155-mm towed howitzers to the Land Forces of India. According to TSAMTO with reference to Indian Defense News, the amount of the contract could exceed 1 billion dollars.

A consortium of Elbit Systems and Bharat Forge offered the Ministry of Defense a 155-mm autonomous towed howitzer ATHOS 2052. This proposal turned out to be more profitable than the French Nexter and Indian Larsen & Toubro, which offered the Indian Ground Forces a towed howitzer "Traian" modified to meet Indian requirements.

According to unconfirmed information, the consortium set a price for its howitzer even lower than the cost of the Dkhanush 155-mm / 42 howitzer developed in India specifically for the Ground Forces, the first six copies of which have already been received for trial operation by the troops.

Indian media suggest that the Indian Ministry of Defense may understate the need of the Indian Army in 1580 guns to 400 ATHOS 2052 howitzers, and instead of the remaining 1180, purchase the national ATAGS towed cannon.

The ATHOS-155 2052-mm autonomous towed howitzer is designed to support artillery fire from closed firing positions of maneuverable forces of the battalion and divisional levels. The howitzer is mounted on a towed carriage, provided its delivery to the battlefield. In the area of ​​deployment, the howitzer can maneuver independently using its diesel engine and special hydraulic wheel drives. The hydraulic system allows you to easily deploy a howitzer using hydraulic jacks and auxiliary wheels. It is equipped with a loader ammunition. Within a few minutes, ATHOS 2052 is able to leave the occupied position on its own and be deployed in a new position a few hundred meters from the previous one.

The howitzer is equipped with inertial / GPS navigation system, ballistic computer and modern digital communication equipment. The range of fire standard NATO ammunition - 41 km. Calculate 4-6 people. Physical strength when deploying a howitzer is not used.

Comments

[Samara_63]

And the IDF uses such?

[Ravil_Asnafovich]

They wanted to accept Sholekh, they did not.

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Samara_63

And the IDF uses such?

Not . In AOI since 2000 year only self-propelled guns. And this is a towed option.

But until the contract is signed, I don't believe in anything. Although a couple of times after the signing, we ran into termination due to internal squabbles. So I hope Elbit will get the contract, but with great care.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

ran into termination due to intra-Indian showdowns.

Rather, your come across with bribes. So correct.

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Spade

Rather, your come across with bribes. So correct.

Maybe so. You won’t take yours on this. Qualification.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

Maybe so. You won’t take yours on this. Qualification.

Ours did not climb into this dog dump ...
Swedish bribe takers, Israeli bribe takers, local producers and, like a cherry on a cake, Americans. Absolutely honestly managed to sell towed howitzers to the locals at the price of two modern Chinese self-propelled guns.

[voyaka uh]

"Swedish bribe-takers" ////
----
Write also: "Danish bribe-takers"
These countries are the least corrupt countries in the world.

[Lopatov]

Quote: voyaka uh

Write also: "Danish bribe-takers"
These countries are the least corrupt countries in the world.

Google, "The Bofors Case"
Actually, because of this scandal, Rajiv Gandhi got a ride in the elections

[andrewkor]

Look in Google for the connection of Gulnara Karimova with the Swedish TeliaSonera, you will find out a lot of interesting things!

[Kaw]

And what to climb on there? What can we offer them?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Kaw

And what to climb on there? What can we offer them?

All that they needed.
However, the USSR preferred not to participate in this show.

[SSR]

Quote: Aaron Zawi

Quote: Spade

Rather, your come across with bribes. So correct.

Maybe so. You won’t take yours on this. Qualification.

)))
IMHA.
In terms of artillery, there is no one better than the Russian Federation.
Only here it is the "God of War" and only here it is worked out as much as possible, Syria, Ukraine, even the mattresses have admitted that artillery is one of the nightmares from the Russian Federation.

[Lopatov]

Quote from S.S.R.

In terms of artillery, there is no one better than the Russian Federation.

No. We have huge problems in this area. Because of what, in fact, we lost the Indian market. Even under the USSR

[Scoun]

Quote: Spade

No. We have huge problems in this area.

There are problems with art, but the "school" itself is one of the best in the world.

Quote from S.S.R.

Only here it is "God of War"

our grandfather received the "Krasnaya Zvezda" for the fact that his battery destroyed a column of fascists in 43, he seemed to be 25 yet.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Scoun

There are problems with art, but the "school" itself is one of the best in the world.

"School" of what? Artillery itself is one thing. Indeed, the school is powerful. True, since the Second World War, somewhat "lightweight"
But about the design of tools and other materiel, a problem area. And it always has been.

[vadim dok]

And the Russian contracts were called on a "military" basis?

[Lopatov]

Quote: vadim dok

And the Russian contracts were called on a "military" basis?

In artillery? Yes, they could not get anything else at that time

[APASUS]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

But until a contract is signed, I don’t believe anything.

Is technology transfer planned or is it a direct sale of the finished product?

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: APASUS

Is technology transfer planned or is it a direct sale of the finished product?

It is planned.

[Samara_63]

And in Lebanon in the 80s self-propelled guns were only shown on TV, but it looked impressive like that ...

[Maz]

Quote: Aaron Zawi

Quote: Samara_63

And the IDF uses such?

Not . In AOI since 2000 year only self-propelled guns. And this is a towed option.

But until the contract is signed, I don't believe in anything. Although a couple of times after the signing, we ran into termination due to internal squabbles. So I hope Elbit will get the contract, but with great care.

God is on you, I don’t need much ... What else to expect from Indians and Jews. Sucker against a scammer. 1-0 in favor of Elbit and Pakistan from the United States. Boarding towing Indians is like pouring a gasoline into the bonfire of war. And petty petrol.

[Maz]

But it’s good not to use a tzahal, only Gaza doesn’t have its own air force, but Pakistan has it, and these howitzers are a great target for airplanes At a firing position, and even for missiles, the miracle of an immovable target and a bunch of shells nearby for greater detonation

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Maz

But it’s good not to use a tzahal, only Gaza doesn’t have its own air force, but Pakistan has it, and these howitzers are a great target for airplanes At a firing position, and even for missiles, the miracle of an immovable target and a bunch of shells nearby for greater detonation

You sir, what and how AOI plans to use, does not concern in any way.

[Joseph]

The IDF does not use towed artillery.
There is no such thing in their concept
Whoever has it buys the towed ones.
Elbit offers both one and the other.
At the choice of the customer.
And you are not quite familiar with how towed artillery is used.
She, too, is quite capable of acting on the principle of shoot and scoot fired-fled.
If it is equipped with topographic systems, an automatic fire control system, etc.
Elbit himself produces the components of these systems and makes integration.
And towed ones also have advantages.
A decrease in the number of staff is not critical for India.
In contrast, for example, from Israel.
And the price of the product is at least 1 million lower.

[Joseph]

For IDF, Elbit Iokneam (formerly Soltam) is developing a self-propelled.
To replace the old American M109.
The requirements of the IDF are currently self-propelled and maximized automation and, due to this, a minimum of staff.
There are options for wheeled and tracked.
The IDF will probably choose the tracked one.
Although not a fact.

[kiril1246]

Quote: Samara_63

And the IDF uses such?

No. We basically do not have towed artillery. In modern combat, she is too vulnerable. In India, however, they think differently and why not sell them if they themselves are interested in this.

[Observer2014]

Where are they managing to do all this. Do they have a country in three tiers? Joke.

[Joseph]

In Yokneam
North of Netanya
Mortars of all three calibers of the US Army also supply

[kind]

Quote: Observer2014

Where are they managing to do all this. Do they have a country in three tiers? Joke.

We do not understand! Gypsies!

[Vitaly gusin]

Quote: Good

We do not understand! Gypsies!

Eyed
JEWS!

[kiril1246]

Quote: Good

We do not understand! Gypsies!

Well, where are we to you?

[Mouse]

- Yesterday I watched the first Indian porn movie.
- Well, and how, is it all about the Kama Sutra?
- No, everything is like the Germans, only they still dance and sing ...

[boathouse]

An interesting little dog, which seems to be towed, and when deployed, physical strength is not required.

[Lopatov]

Quote: varadero

An interesting little dog, which seems to be towed, and when deployed, physical strength is not required.

Strictly speaking, almost all modern 155-mm towed howitzers have this functionality. Well, besides the expensive American misunderstanding M777

India has such "in service" since the mid-80s. Swedish FH77. Howitzers developed by India have similar functionality.

[Megamarcel]

All? MSTA B does not. More precisely, not so. Not a single Russian (Soviet) towed gun had such a function and does not have it. The American misunderstanding M777 has a mass that allows it to be transported by helicopters. This is its main plus. Nafig Americans do not need these towed misunderstandings, since they howl only with the absolute superiority of their Air Force in the air and they have no shortage of either helicopters or fuel for them. All these towed self-propelled guns are an attempt to make self-propelled guns and save. In fact, complete garbage. And not self-propelled guns and not light M777. He cannot leave quickly and far from a position. The tractor is still needed. No protection. A smaller quantity is better, but self-propelled guns than such carriages with a motor.

[Lopatov]

Quote: MegaMarcel

All? MSTA B does not.

And who claims that it is a) modern and b) 155 mm?
In general, it appeared initially outdated. And now lags behind generations

Quote: MegaMarcel

Nafig Americans do not need these towed misunderstandings, since they howl only with the absolute superiority of their Air Force in the air and they have no shortage of either helicopters or fuel for them.

The M777 helicopter is unable to fully transport. Due to the lack of airmobile traction.
Therefore, in truly airmobile American brigades, artillery divisions are mixed, one M777 battery and two 105 mm axle boxes. howitzers. Necessary measure
From such matters 8))))))))))

Quote: MegaMarcel

Nafig Americans do not need these towed misunderstandings

The vast majority of American guns are towed.
Self-propelled guns are few, and they significantly lose in their capabilities to modern ones. Short barrel

[Vasyan1971]

Quote: varadero

and when deployed, physical strength is not required.

But if in the process, something wedges or the solarium is not delivered in time, then the "Kamasutra" calculation is provided. Not to mention the disrupted performance of the combat mission.

[strannik1985]

An ordinary towed vehicle is guaranteed not to have time to leave the firing position, if the enemy is not a bum, of course.

[Vasyan1971]

If the enemy is not a bum, then this one will not go far. Is that on the highway to equip a position for comfortable clawing.

[strannik1985]

Even the dad of all FH-77 self-propelled howitzers (adopted by 1978) quietly drove through the fields.

[Vasyan1971]

In peacetime?
Although, of course, it has an advantage over the usual towed one. Probably...

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: varadero

An interesting little dog, which seems to be towed, and when deployed, physical strength is not required.

Well this is the standard option today.

[Ravil_Asnafovich]

M-71 Soltam

[The leader of the Redskins]

If only the Indians did not dance around her, as in the famous video. And then also a tambourine will have to be issued by each howitzer))) It's a pity the video does not load ...
And on the topic, the data are satisfactory. At the level...

[Vasyan1971]

In the deployment area, the howitzer is able to maneuver independently, using its own diesel engine and special hydraulic wheel drives.

I watched a funny video about her.

[Lara Croft]

Indian media suggest that the Indian Ministry of Defense may understate the need of the Indian Army in 1580 guns to 400 ATHOS 2052 howitzers, and instead of the remaining 1180, purchase the national ATAGS towed cannon.

Correctly admitted, the responsible Governments do so ...

155 mm standalone towed howitzer ATHOS-2052

As far as I know, such howitzers are not towed, but self-propelled, because The BG specified in the article has its own engine and control system to move independently over short distances without a tractor ...

ATHOS 2052 is mounted on a towed carriage, ensuring its delivery to the battlefield. In the deployment area, the howitzer is able to maneuver on its own using its diesel engine and special hydraulic wheel drives. The hydraulic system makes it easy to deploy the howitzer using hydraulic jacks and auxiliary wheels. It equipped with ammunition loader. Within a few minutes, ATHOS 2052 is able to independently leave its position and be deployed to a new position a few hundred meters from the previous one.. To control the howitzer, a calculation of 4 to 6 people is necessary. When deploying a howitzer, physical strength is not used..

https://topwar.ru/33356-avtonomnay-buksiruemaya-gaubica-athos-2052.html

[Lopatov]

Quote: Lara Croft

Correctly admitted, the responsible Governments do so ...

Sane? This is not the case.
As a result of all this circus, India will have 5 (five !!!) types of towed 155 mm howitzers

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Spade

Quote: Lara Croft

Correctly admitted, the responsible Governments do so ...

Sane? This is not the case.
As a result of all this circus, India will have 5 (five !!!) types of towed 155 mm howitzers

I agree, but apparently the orphans can not be determined in any way by the nomenclature, in addition, the British BG 155-mm howitzer M777 is good (purchased), the rest is probably junk including Soviet D-30 ..... it is unlikely that they will so quickly replace the entire barrel artillery PA ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: Lara Croft

I agree, but apparently the orphans can not be determined by the nomenclature

There is a real complete madhouse. It is not a matter of "they cannot decide", it is a clash of interests between local producers and foreigners, and all this is heavily involved in corruption.

Quote: Lara Croft

In addition, the British BG 155 mm howitzer M777 is good

She is not good for India 8))) And for the Americans
The price is absolutely inadequate 3.7 billion apiece ... At the same time, the characteristics are very, very average even compared to the FH80 in India since the mid-77s

[Lopatov]

Quote: Lara Croft

the rest is probably junk

Quite modern Swedish FH77, its Indian modernized version of "Dhanush", re-barreled by the Israelis on 155-mm caliber Soviet M-46, American-made M777, promising ATAGS and Israeli ATHOS
Horror, kotoche. But calling them "old" will not work.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Spade

M777 American-made, promising ATAGS and Israeli ATHOS
Horror, kotoche. But calling them "old" will not work.

According to Wiki, these samples are not in service with the Indian Army ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: Lara Croft

According to Wiki, these samples are not in service with the Indian Army ...

M777 is for sure.
And about ATAGS and ATHOS in this article it is written. This will be the third and fourth howitzer.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Spade

Quote: Lara Croft

According to Wiki, these samples are not in service with the Indian Army ...

M777 is for sure.

I kind of wrote about her in my comment above ...

British BG 155 mm howitzer M777 good (purchased)

[Aaron Zawi]

Quote: Spade

Ours did not climb into this dog dump ...
Swedish bribe takers, Israeli bribe takers, local producers and, like a cherry on a cake, Americans. Absolutely honestly managed to sell towed howitzers to the locals at the price of two modern Chinese self-propelled guns.

Well it is understandable. Oh, it’s just not more honest than yours.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Aron Zaavi

Oh, it’s just not more honest than yours.

Well yes. It’s not our two countries in a row who managed to get caught, first in India, then in Kazakhstan.

[Thrifty]

Patience to the Israelites, and, three buckets of valerian, for the Indians still nerves shake them! !!!!!!!!

[Miron]

I used to respect India’s arms procurement policy. But if recently this policy has ceased to inspire a sense of reasonable approaches, then what can be changed here. What are my one opportunities to influence. Hard to say.
As a brief skirmish in the air showed, disparate weapons work together poorly. And not a high-quality weapon that works in an autonomous mode, it is a hole, a failure in a military conflict, which immediately leads to irreparable losses.
Israeli weapons showed their worst side, the Russian, on the other hand, was not much different from the usual one - simple, reliable and significantly superior to all the characteristics that were in the contract agreement, in other words - support and support. Not necessarily in hostilities.
Can we welcome the position of India, which buying obviously failed combat systems gives a silent signal to enemies "we are unarmed, stupid, and rich"? Is a country acting in this way a reliable partner?

[ded_mazai]

Quote: Miron

purchasing obviously failed combat systems

Do you mean the MiG-27, MiG-29K, PAK FA and Gorshkov ?! Explain what exactly India bought from Israel. Popcorn has already cooked.

[san4es]

Charging for 6 rds / min

[voyaka uh]

You are right, this howitzer has some record-breaking performance.
It gives good accuracy at medium rate of fire and range.
But it was made specially for the Indian tender. What they need is
and designed. And transfer technology to them by building a factory in India -
also not a problem.

[awg75]

2С19 these clowns in the Rajopanams would be sure that

[VladislavL]

According to the performance characteristics of the projectiles themselves, above are the uncle Bull’s precepts made shell + howitzer G6 G5 produced by Denel Rheinmetall range with self-propelled guns G6 54km active reactive, which allows, unlike the Israeli cannons, to cover the batteries of long-range export guns of the PRC. Rate of fire 3 shots in about 26s.

From self-propelled guns, this is one of the fastest-firing and long-range in the world PZh2000, more than 56km - Assegai V-LAP shell

and charge blocks (6 pieces) of the same - there a professor at the company at Rheinmetall worked on exponential powder very advanced - the Germans love guns traditionally. As well as Russian t..k. according to the General Director of the Central Research Institute "Burevestnik" (data published in the open press), the Coalition, I suppose with the GPVRD, has a range of more than 70 km.

In general, there is no sense in the receiver further at 20 km. The scatter is large - the Germans in Afghanistan faced this - even for Pzh20000, 22 km is critical. There, better MLRS work with controlled detachable planning units. The range may exceed 300km for 450-500mm shells in the case of planning units with high aerodynamic quality and a small cluster part equivalent to a 6-inch shell above the target, with a controlled dispersion ellipse of submunitions.

[Strashila]

Once again, they bought it for the parade, perhaps the guns are not bad, but for Israel, its climate and the size of its territories and the level of training of artillerymen.

[Kaw]

Calculation of 4-6 people. Physical force is not used when deploying a howitzer.

You can compare with the Msta gun, which is now marching into the Russian army. The maximum range is 24 km. In the towed version, all operations are performed manually.

[Megamarcel]

Is the helicopter unable to transport the M777? How is it? Carrying capacity of CH47 Chinook reaches 12 + tons, weight M777 4 + tons? Why can't he transport her? What other shortcomings of the Chinukov are in the US Army? Yes, they only have this type of 400+ units. The stakes in such artillery were made precisely on the M777, and in this, based on the expeditionary type of warfare, they have logic.

[ded_mazai]

Fine! Congratulations to Elbit Systems!