Chimera "vundervaffe" against the specter of rationalism

The term "wunderwaffe" (wunderwaffe, miracleweapon) originated in Nazi Germany as the designation of a fundamentally new weapon, or a weapon that is substantially superior in characteristics to everything previously created and capable of bringing significant changes on the battlefield.


Later, the term “vundervaffe” became widespread in relation to armaments that were not only created by Nazi Germany, but also by other countries, both before and after World War II.

Some weapons that fall under the definition of “vundervaffe” were the fruit of megalomania — an attempt to maximize the characteristics of existing weapons, in order to obtain weapons that absolutely surpass everything the enemy could have.

A classic example of such a “prodigy” is the German project tank Panzerkampfwagen VIII "Maus", with an estimated weight of over 180 tons. Tank "Maus" was created on the basis of advanced technologies of German industry, including the electric propulsion system, and was supposed to be an indestructible weapon of breakthrough. The rapidly deteriorating situation of Nazi Germany and the overload of industry with pressing projects did not give these weapons a chance to appear.


Tank "Maus"


If the tank “Maus” had almost no chances for development, another sample of the German megalomania, the “Royal Tiger” tank, was launched in almost 500 vehicles. Its mass was almost twice the mass of most heavy tanks of that time.


Panzerkampfwagen VI Ausf. B "Tiger II" or "Royal Tiger"


Germans alone cannot be blamed for megalomania. At different periods of the development of tanks, there were a significant number of projects of tanks mass 100-200 tons, developed by French, British, American, and Soviet designers. Obviously, even the failure of predecessors to create heavy and super heavy tanks did not allow us to conclude that this type of armored vehicles are unequivocally unpromising.


Heavy tanks, clockwise, starting from the top left image - French “Char 2C”, British А39 of the project “Tortoise”, Soviet “Object 279”, American T28-T95 (Turtle)


At the same time, the mass of some modern main battle tanks has approached, or has already surpassed, the 70 tonnes. In particular, this applies to the Israeli Merkava-4 tank, the American M1A2SEP3 Abrams, the British Challenger Mk 2 and the German Leopard 2A7 +.

If it were not for the problems with transportation and crossing of bridges, then projects of super-heavy tanks would surely try again to resurrect at a new technological level. And maybe they will still be implemented, for example, in the form of articulated combat vehicles.


The concept of the Swedish articulated tank “UDEX XX-20” and the arctic modification of the Pantsir-SA air defense system on the chassis of the two-link (articulated) transporter DT-30


As another example of megalomania can be given the battleships. Starting with the English battleship Dreadnought, their displacement has continuously increased, until it exceeded 70 000 tons of the Japanese battleship Yamato. In addition to increasing the size and displacement of ships, the caliber and the number of artillery guns of battleships increased.

Amazing value made battleships more an instrument of politics than an effective tool for warfare. A rapid development aviation and submarines turned these huge ships into floating targets.


The largest battleships of the 20th century - “Yamato”, “Iowa” and “Bismarck”


You can see a direct analogy between gigantomania in the field of armored vehicles and gigantomania in the construction of surface ships, but projects of superheavy tanks are considered as a curiosity, and an example of a waste of money, and battleships are considered one of the most significant milestones in the evolution of surface ships fleet.

During World War II, the gloomy German genius gave birth to another “vundervaffe” - the super-heavy rail gun “Dora” caliber 807 mm. The 1 350 tons gun, placed on a railway platform, was intended for firing 4,8-7 tons shells at a distance of 38-48 km.

The cost of the Dora cannon is comparable to the cost of 250 howitzer caliber 149 mm. On the one hand, the howitzers are a practical thing, and they would have guaranteed Germany more benefit in the war than Dora, but on the other hand, the 250 additional howitzers would hardly have decided the outcome of the war in favor of Germany.


Dora artillery gun


The project is a giant cannon trying to implement a Canadian engineer Gerald Bull. Initially, the project was intended for civilian use - bringing small-sized cargo to a low orbit at the price of 200-kg satellite into orbit at a price of approximately 600 dollars per kilogram. Not finding understanding in his homeland, Gerald Bull began working with the Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein on the Babylon project.

The project to create a supergun Babylon, based on the principle of a multi-camcorping artillery gun, was launched in Iraq in the 1980s. In addition to the usual propellant charge, located in the breech chamber, there was also an elongated throwing charge attached to the projectile, which moved with the projectile as it progressed along the barrel, thereby maintaining constant pressure in the barrel. Nine tons of special propellant charge superguns could provide firing with shells caliber 1000 mm and weight 600 kg to a distance of 1000 kilometers.

After it became known about the beginning of the creation of the super cannon according to the Babylon project, the details of the super cannon were confiscated during transportation in Europe. In March, 1990, Gerald Bull died suddenly from an oversupply of lead in the body, presumably not without the participation of Israeli intelligence "Mossad", which apparently took the attempt to create an artillery "vundervaffe" quite seriously.


Estimated appearance and elements of the trunk Babushon Supergus


Nowadays, an attempt to create a fundamentally new type of gun - the railgun (railgun - rail gun) is actively being undertaken by the United States. Projects for the creation of rail guns were considered, starting with the First World War. Despite the fact that the principle of their creation is quite understandable, in practice, developers face a number of problems, as a result of which prototype railguns have not yet left the walls of the laboratories.

Developers in the United States are planning to gradually increase the capabilities of railguns with a gradual improvement in parameters - increasing the acceleration rate of the projectile from 2000 to 3000 m / s, firing range from 80-160 to 400-440 km, muzzle energy of the projectile from 32 to 124 MJ, projectile weight from 2 -3 to 18-20 kg, rate of fire from 2-3, shots per minute to 8-12, power sources, from 15 MW to 40-45 MW, barrel life from intermediate 100 shots to 2018, year to 1000, you need 2025 shots to 6 MW, you can use 10 shots from intermediate XNUMX shots to XNUMX to XNUMX MW, you can get from XNUMX shots to XNUMX to XNUMX MW, you need trunk from the initial XNUMX m to the final XNUMX m.

The lack of combat models of railguns makes many think of them as an attempt to create a “vundervaffe,” with one goal being the use of funds. However, attempts to create rail weapons are being made in other countries - China, Turkey; on a smaller scale, work on weapons of this type is being conducted in Russia. Ultimately, there is no doubt that rail weapons will be created, and will occupy their niche in warships (first of all), contrary to the opinion of skeptics.


The principle of operation and the prototype rail gun company General Atomics



Tests of the prototype rail gun

Another example of "vundervaffe" is often called attempts to create a new type of weapon, to use technologies that the enemy does not have.

History ballistic and cruise missiles, which are in service with the leading armies of the world, began in the 1940s of the 20th century with German V-1 and V-2 missiles. The absence at that time of precision targeting technology made this weapon essentially useless, but at the same time quite resource-intensive.

From the position of “strong in hindsight”, it can be suggested that it would be more beneficial for Nazi Germany not to implement these “vundervaffe”, but to concentrate on the production of fighters and attack aircraft vital for the front. But then the question arises, at what point to begin development? How to understand that the technologies necessary for the “vundervaffe” to become an effective armament complex have already appeared? Obviously, this can only be understood experimentally, i.e. on the basis of the work actually carried out - implemented (and possibly closed) projects of rockets, railguns, lasers ...

Regarding Nazi Germany - start the Germans before work on the creation of the atomic bomb, and the FAA-1 / FAA-2 could by the year 1944-1945 turn into a terrible weapon that could change the course of the war.


Clockwise, starting from the top left image - the V-1 cruise missile, the V-2 cruise missile, the Iskander missile, the Caliber cruise missile.


Nowadays, the main supplier of "vundervaffe" is the United States. At the same time, a huge number of projects are being developed to develop weapons on new physical principles, land, air and sea combat vehicles for various purposes and configuration.

In the accusation of the United States, many talk about the senseless spending of budget funds, but why consider other people's money? In the USSR, a significant number of research and development (R & D) works were also carried out on the creation of completely new types of weapons, many of which stopped at the stage of creating experimental or small-scale samples. It is these R & D, some of which may look like an attempt to create a “vundervaffe,” allowed the USSR to be at the peak of scientific and technological progress and lead in the field of armaments. Russia still enjoys the fruits of these R & D.


Experimental and limited-edition models of the USSR military equipment, clockwise, starting from the top left image - tank "Object 490", bomber-missile carrier T-4, attack ekranoplan-missile carrier "Lun", PLA of the project 661 "Anchar"


Hoping that the US will go bankrupt because of the construction of the “Wunderwaffe” is as naive as thinking that the USSR has collapsed because of the arms race.

Take, for example, the American project of the promising destroyer Zumwalt, which only a lazy Russian did not kick. Say and dear, and there are no promised lasers and railguns on it, and generally breaks. But you can’t deny that this is a new generation combat ship, with a lot of technical innovation factors. Here, both the best-implemented stealth technology, the full electromotive movement, and a high degree of automation (the crew of the Zumwalt destroyer is 148 people, while the destroyer Arleigh Burke has 380 people).

There is no doubt that the experience gained during the development, construction and operation of the Zumwalt class destroyers will be actively used to create new and modernize existing projects of warships. In particular, according to some data, in the course of further modernization of the Arleigh Burke class destroyers, they plan to switch to full electric propulsion, including in order to provide power supply with promising models of weapons based on new physical principles. In the newest British destroyer “Daring” the technology of full electromotive does not cause censures.


Destroyers "Arleigh Burke", "Daring", "Zumwalt"


In Russia, the Leader nuclear project destroyer, which by its parameters is more like a cruiser, is often criticized. Obviously, the Russian economy will not pull the large-scale construction of ships of this dimension, and the frigate of the increased dimension of the project 22350М looks much more promising from the point of view of mass construction.

On the other hand, the construction of ships such as the Leader nuclear-powered destroyer-cruiser is necessary at least in order to restore / preserve / develop the competence of the domestic industry to create ships of this class. Moreover, knowing that the “Leader” series of ships will definitely be small - the ship’s 2-4, it may be worthwhile when designing to lay the maximum technical innovation factor - electric propulsion, weapons based on new physical principles, maximum automation. There is no doubt that the first ship will be guaranteed to be problematic, but in the process of debugging an invaluable experience will be obtained that will allow in the future to build the most modern military equipment.

And let the fleet workhorses be the ships of 22350 / 22350М projects.


The frigate of increased dimension 22350M and the promising atomic destroyer “Leader”


In 2018, Russian President V.V. Putin, among other things, announced the speedy adoption of the Poseidon and the Petrel weapons systems, which were immediately attributed by many to the useless Vunderwaffe.


Cruise missile with unlimited range of flight “Petrel” and underwater unmanned vehicle “Poseidon”


Despite the fact that the prospects for using these complexes as effective weapons are doubtful, the technologies implemented during their development may revolutionize the development of other types of weapons, for example, small-sized nuclear submarines and unmanned aerial vehicles with long duration of flight.

And sometimes the weapon gets a "floating" status. For example, take the Armata platform. If the project develops without significant problems, no one will doubt the correctness of the decisions made and the need to create it. But if problems arise during the implementation of the Armat project, then there will be talk that there was no point in creating a fundamentally new platform, vundervaffe, with a lot of innovations, but you had to go on a reasonable way to further modernize T-72 / T-80 lines.


Combat vehicles on the Armata platform


What can be said in conclusion? The fact that within reasonable limits, the creation of a “vundervaffe” is necessary in order to go beyond the existing possibilities, to obtain new technologies for the creation of weapons that can radically change the methods of warfare.

It is often impossible to predict in advance which R & D will bring a positive result in the form of a serial product, and which will only allow to gain experience, including negative one. The existence of a modern, dynamically developing military-industrial complex is impossible without R & D with a large coefficient of technical novelty.

Obviously, it is necessary to observe a certain balance, between the rational modernization of existing weapons, the creation of new types of weapons with a minimal amount of innovation, and the implementation of breakthrough high-risk projects.

In this context, one should not be too skeptical about the fact that potential opponents have a large number of projects that did not lead to the appearance of serial products. One can only assume what results were obtained in the course of their study and where they will be applied in the future.
Author:
Photos used:
warspot.ru, nevskii-bastion.ru, popmech.ru, flot.com, MilitaryArms.ru
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  1. Tektor 25 March 2019 12: 08 New
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    Under miracle weapons in Germany they understood a certain unit that could inspire insurmountable fear to the soldiers of the enemy. An FAU-2 with nuclear filling could become a miracle weapon if the main forces were not aimed at creating exactly the one indicated above.
    1. Vladimir 5 25 March 2019 14: 05 New
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      According to the article: "people, horses, animals mixed up" .. Often a miracle weapon was necessary, like a straw, to extend someone’s agony. (especially clearly Hitlerism). But do not confuse ordinary monsters with breakthrough and promising weapons, the same F-2, which became the legislator of all tactical and strategic weapons for the next centuries ... We sort of "flies from cutlets" for that. That everything in the article is mixed up, especially in new directions., And why mixed up, is already a question of a different perspective ...
    2. Tochilka 25 March 2019 14: 43 New
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      there would be no nuclear stuffing. the Germans, let’s say so, talentedly failed the nuclear program.
      1. businessv 26 March 2019 17: 04 New
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        Quote: Tochilka
        the Germans, let’s say so, talentedly failed the nuclear program.

        But how did they fail, colleague ?! Thousands of scientists were taken to mattress, and our USSR also did not remain naked in this regard! Subsequently, it was with the active assistance of the Germans that they created together what is called nuclear weapons. Another thing is that German scientists could really sabotage the development of such weapons, knowing their Fuhrer and what could threaten the world of nuclear weapons in his hands.
  2. Mexican. 29 25 March 2019 12: 10 New
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    Looking at the various, primarily German, samples of the wunderwaffle, for some reason I thought: the larger the cabinet, the louder it falls
    1. DenZ 25 March 2019 12: 25 New
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      It depends on what soil this cabinet falls into. If, as in the case of the FAU-2, the project is being finalized and improved, this will lead to the appearance of a whole class of a new type of weapon, and if, in the case of the German Mouse, it’s going nowhere, is it worth it to talk about it.
      1. voyaka uh 25 March 2019 12: 44 New
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        FAU-2 was a full-fledged and operational ballistic missile. The beginning of an era.
        And the FAU-1 worked confidently. And she gave birth to a new class of missiles - cruise missiles.
        Both types of missiles turn nuclear warheads into a “miracle weapon”.
        1. Setrac 25 March 2019 13: 48 New
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          Quote: voyaka uh
          And the FAU-1 worked confidently.

          Maybe you will confirm your words about the guidance system of this "miracle rocket"?
          1. Avior 26 March 2019 02: 50 New
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            The projectile control system is an autopilot that keeps the projectile at the course set at the start and height during the entire flight.

            Heading and pitch stabilization is carried out on the basis of the readings of a 3-degree (main) gyroscope, which are summed up by the pitch with the readings of the barometric height sensor, and along the course and pitch with the values ​​of the corresponding angular velocities measured by two 2-step gyroscopes (for damping projectile vibrations around own center of mass). Aiming at the target is carried out before starting on a magnetic compass, which is part of the control system. In flight, the course is corrected by this device: if the projectile course deviates from the set by the compass, the electromagnetic correction mechanism acts on the pitch frame of the main gyroscope, which forces it to precess in the direction of decreasing the mismatch with the compass course, and the stabilization system already leads the projectile itself to this course.

            There is no roll control at all - due to its aerodynamics, the projectile is stable enough around the longitudinal axis.


            Range control
            The logical part of the system is implemented using pneumatics - it operates on compressed air. The angular readings of gyroscopes with the help of rotary nozzles with compressed air are converted into the form of air pressure in the outlet pipes of the converter, in this form the readings are summed up over the corresponding control channels (with appropriately selected coefficients) and actuate the spools of the pneumatic rudders and elevators. Gyroscopes are also unwound with compressed air, which is fed to the turbines, which are part of their rotors. For the operation of the control system on the projectile there is a ball cylinder with compressed air under a pressure of 150 atm.

            The flight range is controlled using a mechanical counter, on which a value corresponding to the required range is set before launch, and a blade anemometer placed on the nose of the projectile and rotated by the incoming air flow twists the counter to zero when the required range is reached (with an accuracy of ± 6 km). In this case, shock fuses of the warhead are unlocked and a dive command is issued (the air supply to the elevator machine is "cut off").

            for atomic strikes would be enough.
          2. businessv 26 March 2019 17: 07 New
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            Quote: Setrac
            Tell us about the guidance system of this "miracle rocket"?

            This, IMHO, is not about weapons, as such, but about a concept that is being applied today throughout the world. You do not ask about the computers used by the Germans for GPS guidance! wink
            1. Setrac 27 March 2019 21: 09 New
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              Quote: businessv
              This, IMHO, is not about weapons, as such, but about a concept that is being applied today throughout the world.

              Some kind of kindergarten. The concept is a chimera, an engraved realization in iron. Wonderfully, Davinci realized a lot of things, but nothing could be realized in metal. Now, too, starships are conceptually inventing - but it is impossible to translate into metal, undergrowth.
              1. businessv April 2 2019 22: 12 New
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                Quote: Setrac
                Some kind of kindergarten. Concept - Chimera

                As for the kindergarten, I agree with you 100%, especially when you say that the main thing is to embody in iron something that is not yet defined in your head. Did you understand what you wrote? They embody the idea in iron, before turning it into a specific application system, that is, into a concept.
                1. Setrac April 2 2019 23: 09 New
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                  Quote: businessv
                  that is, into the concept.

                  Quote: businessv
                  turning it into a specific application system

                  The Germans did NOT have the concept of military use of missiles.
                  They simply sent a rocket towards the enemy plus or minus the country accurate to the continent.
                  Quote: businessv
                  In iron embody the idea

                  There are many ideas, few incarnations. It was not the Germans who invented the missiles; they do not need to give primacy where it does not exist.
                  1. businessv April 12 2019 09: 46 New
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                    Quote: Setrac
                    There are many ideas, few incarnations.

                    You, my friend, a demagogue! hi
                    1. Setrac April 12 2019 18: 27 New
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                      Quote: businessv
                      You, my friend, a demagogue!

                      For this they are not punished?
                      Quote: Setrac
                      Missiles were invented not by Germans

                      You will not dispute this?
        2. Nikolaevich I 26 March 2019 05: 35 New
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          It was possible to do without nuclear warheads ... Perhaps, the “miracle” of the V-1 / 2 was not; but a very effective weapon, worthy of attention - completely! To do this, the Germans would have to work "triple" on the guided bombs (including with television guidance! ...), and use them as warhead FAU-1 / 2 ...
  3. Ali Kokand 25 March 2019 13: 17 New
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    Beckoning people, instilling in Germans the hope of victory, Goebbels mercilessly exploited the concept of wunderwaffe. Yes, so successful that after the victory everyone was looking for this very waffe. And there were many hypotheses. Or there was nothing, one chatter. Either they hid it well, or those who found it were kept secret.
    1. voyaka uh 25 March 2019 14: 05 New
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      For Hitler, the atomic bomb was a miracle weapon. For Goebbels - anything, a changing idle talk.
      At the very end of the war, in 1945, the SS officers appointed by Hitler responsible for the nuclear program lied to Hitler. They knew that the program was at an impasse, but they "pulled money", which they removed from Germany and transferred to Latin America for their own personal salvation.
      What they quite succeeded.
      Hitler, confident that the nuclear warhead was "just about" (and the carriers — the FAU-2 missile — they had) gave strange military orders. For example, the transfer of tank units from Berlin to Hungary. While the Red Army made a direct frontal attack in the Berlin direction.
      1. Tochilka 25 March 2019 14: 47 New
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        where does the nuclear warhead come from, if they could not even build a reactor?
        there is a wonderful book in my library - S.N. Slavina - The secret weapon of the Third Reich. It has two chapters: On the eve of hell: nuclear research by German physicists and On the verge of creating an atomic bomb. Very informative. Recommend.
        1. voyaka uh 25 March 2019 15: 14 New
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          So I'm talking about the same thing. The Nazis' nuclear program has stalled. But no one dared to report honestly to the Führer from this: they could have tortured them in the Gestapo “for sabotage”. And the money was allocated ...
          Well, and so on.
          1. Tochilka 25 March 2019 15: 17 New
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            rather research. the program implies otherwise. wink
      2. Olezhek 25 March 2019 18: 30 New
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        Hitler, confident that the nuclear warhead was "on the verge" (and the carriers — the V-2 rocket — they had) gave out strange military orders. For example, the transfer of tank units from near Berlin to Hungary.


        1 Nice of course, but in 1945 the Germans nuclear warhead already did not save.

        2 Atomic bomb was a miracle weapon for Hitler.
        How did he know about her so precisely?
        About the fact that this is a powerful thing?
  4. kpd
    kpd 25 March 2019 14: 07 New
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    Tank "Object 490" - the picture is an obvious photoshop, the shadows do not match.
    1. The comment was deleted.
  5. Operator 25 March 2019 16: 50 New
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    Whether a vundervaffe is another weapon model is not determined by its design, but by a comprehensive analysis of the method of use and possible measures to counter it from the enemy. Therefore, the author’s approach only to describing the performance characteristics of weapon models does not make sense.

    For example, the V-2 rocket was stupid not because of its speed or payload, but because of the cost / efficiency ratio — a single rocket launch cost as a whole bomber squadron capable of carrying out hundreds of sorties for bombing before losing its combat capability.
    The mistake of the leadership of Germany - in the adventure with super-expensive types of weapons, which, as, for example, in the case of the FAA-2, could be recouped only after the creation of nuclear charges, the development process of which in Germany was just suffering from a lack of funding (Hitler lacked an integrated approach and , most importantly, an understanding of the technical aspects of new types of weapons).

    The reverse example is the underwater drone Poseidon, which, by the cost / efficiency criterion, fully corresponds to the task of destroying large coastal targets (megalopolises, naval bases, ports, industrial complexes) and radioactive destruction of the surrounding area - see TV report on the review of the Canyon design and development project at a meeting with the Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation in 2015.
    1. Olezhek 25 March 2019 18: 33 New
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      For example, the V-2 rocket was stupid not because of its speed or payload, but because of the cost / efficiency ratio — a single rocket launch cost as a whole bomber squadron,


      Well .. something like Me 262 also did not suffer from an excess return on the nested brand ...
      But the Germans really “burned”: armadas of Soviet tanks rolled on them from the east, and waves of heavy bomb-carriers flew across the sky from the west ...
      The usual methods did not solve the problem.

      It made sense for the Germans to make many tanks and aircraft in 41-m / 42-m
      43 was already a bit late.

      so they made out as best they could ...
    2. viktorish007 25 March 2019 21: 04 New
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      Poseidon fully fulfills the tasks assigned to it by the American General Staff - a complete and final cut of funds for the construction of ships of the Russian Navy
  6. andrewkor 25 March 2019 17: 05 New
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    But on VO "vundervaffen" turned into a "vundervaflyu" in some country!
    1. Nikolaevich I 26 March 2019 05: 28 New
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      Quote: andrewkor
      But on VO "vundervaffen" turned into a "vundervaflyu" in some country!

      This is a natural process ... the process of "transforming" words into another language ... words created according to the rules ("laws") of one language, "hitting" in another language, are "transformed" according to the rules of this language.
  7. Vadim237 25 March 2019 17: 46 New
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    Where did the author get that the Petrel and Poseidon are useless - first as a duplicate delivery vehicle - if our strategic bombers bases are destroyed and second if part of the warheads is intercepted by missile defense systems, the function of all these new weapons to the enemy - whatever you do, in in case of an attack on us - you will be 100 percentage destroyed.
    1. Avior 26 March 2019 02: 45 New
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      recently, the mine’s article was about Poseidon, 800 comments, and then comments were closed and all comments were lost.
      1. karabass 17 June 2019 20: 00 New
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        It’s true that you are saying that everyone is rubbed - therefore, it is no accident that Timokhin fights with Poseidon like a lion, maybe this crap really doesn’t work, since they react so painfully
    2. Shopping Mall 26 March 2019 09: 24 New
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      Quote: Vadim237
      Where did the author get that the Petrel and Poseidon are useless - first as a duplicate delivery vehicle - if our strategic bombers bases are destroyed and second if part of the warheads is intercepted by missile defense systems, the function of all these new weapons to the enemy - whatever you do, in in case of an attack on us - you will be 100 percentage destroyed.


      I am not so familiar with their exact characteristics as to state whether they are useful or useless, but there are doubts.

      Petrel apparently this overall subsonic KR long range. In order to pose a threat as a means of containing them, there must be a lot of them; Subsonic KR is easily knocked down, much easier than BR. Their main advantage is stealth. It is not clear how they are stored, how the nuclear engine is activated, how much it is stored until the need to recharge. In this context, is not better than BRMC?

      According to Poseidon, there is no longer a single keyboard at zero. I do not know how effective it is. If he can really hit the AUG, then it can be an effective weapon, and if only as a means of strategic deterrence, then it is very specific.
      In any case, there is not enough data for both the Petrel and Poseidon.
  8. Sasha_rulevoy 25 March 2019 17: 46 New
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    start the Germans before the work on the creation of the atomic bomb, and the V-1 / V-2 could turn into a terrible weapon by the 1944-1945 year


    The bomb that the Americans dropped on Hiroshima weighed 5 tons. Neither the BR nor the Germans created a plane with a five-ton warhead. OTR with a five-ton warhead has not been created by anyone to this day. A three-stage BR with a seven-ton load was created by Academician Sergei Pavlovich Korolev at the end of 50's, four Fow-2s were used on it as a lower stage. Could Germans make P-7 in 1945? In any case, they were much closer to the B-29 than to the P-7. At the level of the then air defense, the B-29 could break through to the target with higher chances than the BR could reach without breakdowns. Those. B-29 at that time was the right branch of development, and V-2 - became a formidable weapon only ten years later, when one-ton nuclear charges appeared.
    1. Shopping Mall 26 March 2019 09: 31 New
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      Quote: Sasha_rulevoy
      start the Germans before the work on the creation of the atomic bomb, and the V-1 / V-2 could turn into a terrible weapon by the 1944-1945 year


      The bomb that the Americans dropped on Hiroshima weighed 5 tons. Neither the BR nor the Germans created a plane with a five-ton warhead. OTR with a five-ton warhead has not been created by anyone to this day. A three-stage BR with a seven-ton load was created by Academician Sergei Pavlovich Korolev at the end of 50's, four Fow-2s were used on it as a lower stage. Could Germans make P-7 in 1945? In any case, they were much closer to the B-29 than to the P-7. At the level of the then air defense, the B-29 could break through to the target with higher chances than the BR could reach without breakdowns. Those. B-29 at that time was the right branch of development, and V-2 - became a formidable weapon only ten years later, when one-ton nuclear charges appeared.


      Slightly less - 4,4 tons. Create a German bomber, with the superiority of the US / England in the air it could knock. And then no one could shoot down a rocket.

      Here is a nuance. We are looking back we can understand what is easy to do and what is simple. And at the time when the V-2 or the atomic bomb was designed, they could hardly be told exactly how much the bomb would weigh, and which one could get the maximum payload of the rocket.
      Actually the promise of the article is precisely in this that most of the reasoning about the futility or futility of the work performed is discussed from the position of "strong in hindsight."
  9. vonWolfenstein 25 March 2019 19: 00 New
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    World War II began early in terms of technological and scientific progress. And it is good that it did not break out in the 50s when a nuclear bomb was already created and jet aircraft were in full swing.
  10. vonWolfenstein 25 March 2019 19: 06 New
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    Through the prism of time, we can say that for the 3rd Reich the assault rifles could become a miracle weapon, the STG44 launched into mass production, the Panzerfaust upgraded to RPG, a MANPADS based on it. FAA in the form of air defense systems with guidance over the wires.
  11. Operator 25 March 2019 19: 41 New
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    Quote: Olezhek
    as much as they could

    On the contrary: the Germans could have made a real vundervaffe - an atomic bomb, but stupidly it lacked the Deutschmarks, which went into mass production of the FAA-2, not needed on either the Western or the Eastern fronts.
  12. Regarding "Babylon" ... Years 35 back in the magazine "technique of youth" was an extensive article on this tool. The author has many inconsistencies in information. Firstly, the idea of ​​creating such an instrument was born in Germany. But then technically failed to implement. What are 9 tons of charge? !!! It was proposed a lot of cameras, located "Christmas tree" to the trunk along the entire length and the trunk should not be located on the concrete racks, as in the picture, but on an artificially created slope!
    1. garri-lin 25 March 2019 23: 30 New
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      In the Young Technique in the late 80s there was also an article. And there were U-shaped trusses for the trunk and additional charges of propellant along the length of the trunk.
  13. Viknt 25 March 2019 20: 43 New
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    For some reason, the author limited himself to examples of a hundred-year history and, to a large extent, colloquially called “wunderwaffles”. One could recall the phalanges of Macedon, which conquered vast spaces, many countries and peoples. The appearance of a gunshot that put an end to chivalry. The defeat of the Syrian army by Israel, which used drones for target designation and guidance. "Lasers" of Archimedes. Etc.
  14. Lucky_bard 25 March 2019 20: 58 New
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    At one time, the arquebus was considered something strange and useless.
  15. faterdom 25 March 2019 22: 19 New
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    Over the past 150 years, the development of weapons systems is developing more rapidly. And lagging behind by 20-30 years is already a complete loss, this is not permissible.
    Therefore, applicants are not so much about world domination (the goal is actually so-so - God forbid someone will achieve it - he will quickly make sure that it’s like peacock singing in stories about Munchausen), but they should work for their real sovereignty with their prodigies, and also try to steal or direct strangers on the wrong path.
    Only this business is also becoming more expensive exponentially, and therefore some are trying to shell out "the whole civilized world" into their wunderwaffles. For us, only investment efficiency can compete.
  16. Avior 25 March 2019 23: 16 New
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    Nowadays, the main supplier of the “wunderwaffe” is the United States.

    loud. but unproven.
    Zamvolt does not belong to the “prodigy”, Zamvolt today is an example of what happens if you arbitrarily cut the financing of the program.
    Zamvolt has new cells with much greater capabilities, but no one is developing rockets for them, they only use old ones.
    And the capabilities of the Zamvolt cell allow you to create a rocket that is almost twice as large as the SM-3.
    An obvious candidate for missile defense against ICBMs.
    They made a new gun, but did not make suitable shells for it.
    and so on many issues.
    1. Shopping Mall 26 March 2019 09: 37 New
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      Quote: Avior
      And the capabilities of the Zamvolt cell make it possible to create a rocket that is almost twice as large as SM-3. An obvious candidate for a missile defense against an ICBM.


      I skipped information that he had just problems in terms of solving missile defense tasks ...
  17. Earthshaker 26 March 2019 07: 06 New
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    There is nothing wrong with a child prodigy when an ordinary waffle is fine. When the bottom breaks everywhere, the wunderwaffe is evil.
  18. Pushkowed 26 March 2019 17: 03 New
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    Gerald Bull suddenly died from an excess of lead in the body
    After reading this, at first I decided that he had been harassed. But no. Really lead. Sarcasm is such sarcasm ...
  19. Old26 30 March 2019 20: 55 New
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    Quote: kpd
    Tank "Object 490" - the picture is an obvious photoshop, the shadows do not match.

    Shadows? Yes, there is some discrepancy. But this tank existed. Here is a tearing photograph


    Quote: Sasha_rulevoy
    A three-stage BR with a seven-ton load was created by Academician Sergei Pavlovich Korolev in the late 50s, four V-2s were used on it as the lower stage.

    NU FAU-2 as a lower stage is enchanting. I have not heard that before. Different nonsense happens, but this ... By the way, R-7 (8K71) and R-7A (8K74) were always TWO-STAGE. And the maximum "payload on 8K71 was 5,37 tons. The seven-ton warhead there didn’t smell at all

    Quote: Sasha_rulevoy
    Could the Germans make the R-7 in 1945?

    In the 45th hardly. And in general, in order to bring all their “wunderwaffes” to condition, they needed time. But he was gone. Soviet troops already stood at the borders of the Reich. Although, if they had time, they could have brought A-9 / A-10, and the analog of R-7 too. But certainly not in 1945

    Quote: Avior
    And the capabilities of the Zamvolt cell allow you to create a rocket that is almost twice as large as the SM-3.
    An obvious candidate for missile defense against ICBMs.

    For the MK-57 launchers, the SM-3 Block 2B Standard missile was planned. But it was closed. In particular, due to the fact that its caliber, suitable for the MK-57, was prohibitive for the MK-41. I would have to rebuild the cells on almost 80 ships. And the "Standard SM-3 Block 2B" should have hit the ICBMs
  20. Kostadinov 10 June 2019 15: 26 New
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    Quote: voyaka uh
    So I'm talking about the same thing. The Nazis' nuclear program has stalled. But no one dared to report honestly to the Führer from this: they could have tortured them in the Gestapo “for sabotage”. And the money was allocated ...
    Well, and so on.

    Very little money and time was spent by the Germans on nuclear weapons (about 100 times less than the United States) and this is one of their absolutely correct decisions. Purely theoretically, at best, they could collect several nuclear warheads for V-2s before surrender and use them against London, Antwerp and Leningrad. For the battlefield, suitable delivery vehicles did not hit except a nuclear mine could hit. This could not save them from unconditional surrender, but could significantly increase the fit of the convicted Germans after the war.
    The only way that could, theoretically, save Germany from unconditional surrender, is to arm the whole people and turn the country into an underground fortress. About 10 years could have been enough, but it was necessary to start doing it no later than 1930.
  21. Kostadinov 10 June 2019 15: 53 New
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    The bomb, which the Americans dropped on Hiroshima, weighed 5 tons. The Germans did not create a BR or a plane with a five-ton warhead. OTP with a five-ton warhead has not been created by anyone to this day.

    The first plutonium bomb weighed 4,6 tones and of these, half the weight of the armored shells was beaten against fragments of anti-aircraft artillery. So without an armored corps the whole bomb hit less than 2,5 tones.