Russia risks remaining without military medicine

The first bells about the poor state of the military medical service of the Russian Army rang in 2008 during the conflict with Georgia. Medium wounds in Russian peacekeepers in 100% of cases were fatal, not to mention serious injuries. A few years before these unfortunate events in the Military Medical Service, the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation began a progressive decline in the total number of officers, which was not filled by graduates from specialized universities. We came to the 2008 year with a fairly low staffing level of the primary military unit of the medical service, as well as a serious failure in the middle cadre unit. Up to 30,% of the posts to the captain inclusive were understaffed, which was the reason for the further personnel shortage for senior positions. Actually, we are reaping the consequences of the “reforms” of that time. Earlier, in the 2006 year, there was a shortage of many narrow specialists, such as a surgeon, therapist and anesthesiologist. I think you should not separately point out the importance of doctors of such a profile in the army. And the young specialists did not make up for the losses - in 2004, 170 prematurely quit, and in 2005, in 219, young military medical officers (22% and 29% of graduation, respectively). Serdyukov generally had a certain weakness for military medicine, and almost in the first days of his work he began to “reform” it. From 13 to 2,5 thousand, the total number of doctors decreased, and in 2009, 18 hospitals from existing 175 were closed. Later, 30 was also eliminated from separate medical units, from the infirmary to the polyclinic.

Chairman of the Board of Directors of the Rostvertol Aircraft Building Company (Russian Helicopters Holding); Anatoly Serdyukov, Industrial Director of the Rostec Aviation Complex. The main ideologue of "reform" in the MO

After Serdyukov, in the 47 regions of Russia there were no hospitals and military clinics left at all, and in these regions more than 47 thousand soldiers served. Thousands of military pensioners living in the same territories seem to have been completely forgotten about 350. Optimization continued in the areas of higher medical education — in NNXX, the Nizhny Novgorod, Saratov, Tomsk and Samara military medical institutes were eliminated.

The emblem of the Samara Military Medical Institute. Closed 2010 year

The corps of the non-existent since 2010 of the Tomsk Military Medical Institute

Patches of the Saratov Military Medical Institute. Liquidated together with similar universities of Tomsk and Samara

And they prepared the order of 700 doctors per year. Basic specialties in medical schools — military toxicology, military radiology, military field surgery and therapy, as well as the organization and tactics of the medical service — went to the expense. In the country, the order of 50 departments and faculties of universities engaged in the training of specialists of the medical service of the stock. An absurd situation has developed in the Kirov Military Medical Academy when it was necessary to remove the phrase “military field surgery” from the name of the department. Now it is the Department of Emergency Surgery and Oncology. Moreover, doctors and candidates of sciences were confronted with the fact that if there is no specialty “military field surgery,” there will be no department. The most interesting thing is that with the arrival of Sergei Shoigu, the situation has not changed dramatically, and she couldn’t improve in an instant. Still, to expel several thousand military doctors to the “citizen” is not for you to reduce painters and plasterers. Many of those who left were not just experienced specialists - they went through several “hot spots” and were carriers of a unique experience. Who will have to share is not in the army ...

It creates a stable impression that modern Russia will not be ready for a large-scale conflict - the country's medicine will not be drawn by either the civilian population or the military.

During the transfer of civil defense troops to the National Guard under, the reformers reduced the freelance rescue service units. Their duties included, among other things, protecting the public from the effects of weapons mass destruction. It is understood that this function will now be performed by the system of emergency medicine in the structure of the Ministry of Emergency Situations. Surprisingly, the material and technical base of the territorial divisions of disaster medicine is limited only to road transport, and this makes it possible to evacuate the affected population. Now imagine that the masses of the wounded and victims of weapons of mass destruction will pour into civilian hospitals and clinics - they must now do this in the event of war. I think collapse is inevitable. Not only is the staff not particularly competent in such matters, there is still no simple technical support: the medical warehouses of the civil defense forces have been destroyed.

Obviously, many simply forget that it is impossible to put a sign of identity between a civilian and a military physician. The surgeon from the best “peaceful” clinic will never provide qualified medical assistance in case of a severe gunshot wound, not to mention a mine-explosive injury with aggravation in the form of a chemical or radiation injury. The civilian doctor was only explained in general terms at the university, and the military physician with such cases has to work in the system.

Syrian Arab Republic. Aleppo. Field Hospital of the Russian Army ...

In December, 2016, a tragic and glaring incident occurred: the Russian military field hospital in Aleppo was subjected to mortar fire. Two nurses from the Novosibirsk MoES died, a pediatrician was seriously injured. The fact that the hospital was deployed in the area of ​​the potential fire impact of the enemy and did not set up sufficient security is a consequence of the lack of professionalism of the management of the unit? And incompetence - a consequence of the reform activity of 10-12-year-old? These and other questions are now becoming especially acute for Russia - the situation in the world is not becoming calmer. The existence of a sufficient mobilization reserve of the Military Medical Service of the Russian Army can be questioned. And steps to remedy the situation are needed as soon as possible.

Based on:
Bykov Yu. I., Davydov V. M. Analysis of the problems of modern personnel policy in the military medical service of the RF Armed Forces and the direction of its improvement.
vpk-news.ru

Comments

[Reptiloid]

In our city there were plans to move the Military Medical Academy from the city center to the borders of the region. This would be tantamount to destruction, destruction, as described in the article. Well, that did not happen. As a result of the changes above. And probably, the movers were already preparing! Broken off!

[Kote Pan Kokhanka]

And "to" collapsed if the cadet of the military medical academy began to cook on the border of the Leningrad region, and not in St. Petersburg?
If the modern educational and methodical part, housing for the teaching staff and much, much more was seriously and fully prepared? The question is different in mother Russia, alas, this is not real!
And so the transfer of leading universities to the periphery would make it possible for the regions to rise! And so, the concentration of all specialized medical institutions of power structures in the capitals, except for improving the quality of medical examination of the generals and senior officers of the capital's garrisons and their relatives, does not give anything!

[Reptiloid]

But Shoby understood about the destruction ---- you write in the search engine of the Military Military Administration in St. Petersburg, find out the number, area of ​​buildings, where they were ---- at Smolny, at Finlandsky on the embankment, from Peter's times, by the way, and so on. ..And if you were interested ---- where to move tomorrow ---- it would turn out ---- that there is nothing there! And the words were exactly the same as yours, to cover up the destruction. And old manuals and exhibits ---- are suitable for moving? The point is ---- to leave now, and get ---- well, be patient a bit, nothing has begun yet! Nothing was started, and the eviction was considered. In time, at the time of the change. Not to mention the distance, traffic jams .... Military doctors, they endure hardships in war ..... but in peacetime why deliberately create difficulties, especially for the sake of someone’s benefit and theft

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Reptiloid

But Shoby understood about the destruction ---- you write in the search engine of the Military Military Administration in St. Petersburg, find out the number, area of ​​buildings, where they were ---- at Smolny, at Finlandsky on the embankment, from Peter's times, by the way, and so on. .

However, the location-related problems of the VMA are.
WMA stuck in the historical center of St. Petersburg at Finban. There is no space for expansion. There is no normal access (traffic jams in that area are the norm). Strip for sanitation? Forget who will give you. Training sites? Only in the country.
The problem is that the concept "first fully prepare new areas, and then move"For our state departments, it is still something outrageous. On the other hand, no one wants to leave the city center, no matter how bad it is to work there.

[Reptiloid]

the city center is equidistant from approximately all areas and this is the same for all workers. And Finland is not the only place.
And the features of long-term construction by the example of the stadium and the Museum, of the aforementioned Naval, lead to memories of the time of construction of St. Isaac's Cathedral or even the Egyptian pyramids. I once read about abandoned long-term buildings of the post-Soviet era .... There is something to be afraid of.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

The first thing to do is to do away with the so-called. "military medicine".
The second move is to do away with "military accountants", "military storekeepers", "military cooks" and other "military specialties" that have nothing to do with the army.

You are famously! Is it like this to take and do away with?
I suggest going further.
Eliminate all logistics services immediately! What did you come up with, huh ?!

[Vladimir Postnikov]

But I don’t understand why the Academy should move from the center? It would seem crowded. So no. For residential buildings found. For the expansion of the hotel places were found. What the b ...!
What a time have gone! Anything for a profitable business! All for sale!
The academy at this place was founded even under Peter (Admiralty Hospital). She survived all emperors, she survived the Bolsheviks. Nobody touched her. But the current regime, it seems, will not survive. But because the city center! But because on the banks of the Neva!
The Academy also includes a hospital on Suvorovsky. Also the city center. There in one building there is a marble plaque with a calculation of the cost of building a hospital in the 19 century with an accuracy of half a penny. So no! Damn everything, damn history, damn architecture, and build remodels for the new elite! And we will all be happy!

[Reptiloid]

There is still a metro station at Pushkinskaya ... I’m in surgery for an ambulance .... About the move it was said that, they say, closely .... As I wrote below ---- we could consider the entire embankment to Ushakovsky bridge. Already somewhere there they could find places for additional sites .... And ---- close, along the promenade. Could be preoccupied before!

[Vladimir Postnikov]

The irony of fate lies in the fact that Mr. Lopatov is an artilleryman, and the Artillery Academy is located opposite the Naval Aviation Museum (on the other side of the Liteiny Bridge). Moreover, it would be quite appropriate to move this particular Artillery Academy to Rzhevka (there is an active artillery range), which is a 20-minute train ride from the Academy. Unlike the Medical Academy, which the city needs (precisely in the center of the city) both in peacetime and during the war, the Artillery Academy can be relocated quite painlessly. But, I will also oppose this resettlement. I don't see much sense in this, even for the gunners. This is an old educational institution, and educational institutions can and should be located in the city center. Without them, even mansions for the elite will very quickly lose their meaning. It makes sense to train military personnel where they understand what and what history they have to defend. And Mr. Lopatov's reasoning is the reasoning of a hired landsknecht. I suspect that he did not even read "White Guard" by M. Bulgakov. There are a couple of paragraphs on the topic of this conversation. One begins: "- Excellent ... Artillerymen! I won't waste words ..." And the other, a paragraph, the same Colonel Malyshev: "Whom do you want to protect, I ask? ..

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Alexey RA

...... VMA is stuck in the historic center of St. Petersburg at Finban. There are no areas for expansion. ......... Only outside the city ......... concept "first fully prepare new areas, and then move"for our state departments is still something transcendental ...... b.

Over the 15 years that I have been working, enormous changes have occurred in the city in terms of development, and if we were to deal specifically with the problem of relocation, then we could certainly have solved it. Before my eyes, the once-unprincipled part of the Petrograd side changed a lot, factories, some of the old buildings in Vaesto ------ shopping, business centers, a medical paid center, a tourism academy (like) disappeared. All these are large buildings made of glass and concrete. VMA could fit. If in advance, move gradually ......
Or consider the embankment from VMA towards Ushakovsky bridge. ..... In fact, there are still gaps in the city. Even in the center.

[Reptiloid]

I did not think of the Petrograd side for VMA, I wrote stupidity. Since I did not know that VMA is not a few buildings, but 112 !!!!!!!!!! As written on their website, which I began to read, in the column HISTORY. But additional sites on the embankments in the direction of the Ushakovsky bridge could be found. Already after the hotel. Let not within walking distance, but ----- on the promenade for 5-10 minutes After all, there ---- How many things were broken! How many centers have been built!

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Reptiloid

........--- on the promenade for 5-10 minutes After all, there ---- How many things were broken! How many centers have been built!

As well as a complex of species apartments.

[olegfbi]

And "to" collapsed if the cadet of the military medical academy began to cook on the border of the Leningrad region, and not in St. Petersburg?

Lots of things !!!
Relocation - Worse than a fire !!! Folk wisdom.
It is simply impossible to move an institution to a new place without loss! It does NOT happen! There are domestic, technical, social and administrative reasons for this! Lost employees, material and technical base, established communications, etc.
Yes, that's all, it will recover over time, but it takes many years !!! For the move, VERY compelling reasons of a GLOBAL character are needed, and not a commercial "stooltkin" wishlist.
In general, you minus !!!

[PSih2097]

Quote: olegfbi

Lots of things !!!
Relocation - Worse than a fire !!! Folk wisdom.

it’s enough to remember the General Staff’s move, and it was at that moment that 08.08.08 began - an accident or ...

[NOMADE]

Yes, what is the move? Even what is! My mother is a military medic .., tin is going on there!

[Ezekiel 25-17]

To collapse? Yes, the teaching base, plus billions of dollars spent on a new building, plus qualified mid-level personnel. There is a lot to collapse.

[BAI]

And "to" collapsed if the cadet of the military medical academy began to cook on the border of the Leningrad region, and not in St. Petersburg?

After the transfer of the Academy RHBZ them. Tymoshenko from Moscow to Kostroma, there was information that most of the protected (doctors, candidates) teaching staff in one way or another remained in Moscow. Probably, how it affected the quality of education in Kostroma is not necessary to explain.

[Military]

I just wanted to write about it. I heard that some of the teachers go there on a rotational basis. Maybe they’re lying.

[olegfbi]

Relocation, closure of departments, early dismissal of medical officers, etc. this is only one part of the problem!
On the example of a specific hospital (I do not specifically name it):
1. There are no officer posts and accordingly there are no officers in the hospital, from the word at all! Hence the question - And where to serve graduates of military universities, how to promote ???
2. Salaries of civilian personnel below the wage level neighboring city hospital - Who will go to work?
3. Civilian Doctors, nurses, and other hospital staff are NOT eligible for treatment at a military hospital / clinic! That is, if a person is sick - Vali is in a civil hospital because Nizya is being treated at the place of work, it is NOT necessary and NOT legal !!!

This is the main thing in sight! But there are still a lot of problems and questions, albeit not so obvious.
In general: Where to serve the officers, how to recruit civilian personnel and how to ensure the hospital’s work at all ???
Maybe chaotic, but something like that!

[Grandfather]

in the 80s, not far from our "garden partnership" on the picturesque bank of the river, a military field hospital was deployed annually, in full, we went to watch, and we treated the servicemen with what we could from the garden. and they could easily measure the pressure and advise on sores, gardeners are mostly aged. the nearest part was a hundred kilometers away, but we did not know from there or not, a secret is a secret, we did not insist. there were only staff, and "conscripts" - drivers with older cars. they deployed the hospital literally in a matter of hours, everything in an adult way, kitchen, showers, toilets, communications, evacuation vehicles (who remembers on the basis of "Volyn"), everything under "maskets", the helicopter flew several times, apparently checking the camouflage. after 91, everything was over, together with the USSR.

[Narak-zempo]

Quote: Reptiloid

In our city there were plans to move the Military Medical Academy from the city center to the borders of the region. This would be tantamount to destruction, destruction, as described in the article. Well, that did not happen. As a result of the changes above. And probably, the movers were already preparing! Broken off!

And to pay taxes on the cadastral value for real estate in the center of St. Petersburg - is there enough funding for VMA? In general, I don’t understand what those who were placing objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate were thinking about.

[olegfbi]

what were those who placed objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate.

Are you okay with your head?
Maybe you need to see a doctor ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: olegfbi

Are you okay with your head?

Everything is fine with his head.
Such educational institutions should be located where it is really possible to create the best conditions for learning.
And this is clearly not the center of the city.

[olegfbi]

Tell this to the founders and successors of the Academy - Peter I, Paul, Alexander, the Great Pirogov, Sechenov, Botkin and others !!!
Not even funny!

[Lopatov]

Quote: olegfbi

Tell this to the founders and successors of the Academy - Peter I, Paul, Alexander and others !!!

Since then, everything has really, really changed.
Therefore, the "permanent staff" of the Academy have to make incredible efforts to ensure a normal educational process in the existing buildings.

[panov_panov]

Dear Lopatov, you know that since the founding of Harvard and Oxford, too much has changed))) but for some reason there is no idea for anyone to transfer these educational institutions!))

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

Dear Lopatov, you know that since the founding of Harvard and Oxford, too much has changed))) but for some reason there is no idea for anyone to transfer these educational institutions!))

Maybe because these schools were originally correctly located? Just as they should

[panov_panov]

Okay, I'll try to explain it on my fingers), judging by the "icon" you are an artilleryman, and I am just a graduate of this very Academy. It is located just in the right place. Unlike your profession (by the way, I have nothing against it), for the educational and educational process we need people, that is, patients, and the more of them, the more varied the diseases, the more graduates of medical universities can teach. St. Petersburg is the second largest city in Russia, correspondingly more patients, more practice, more varied diseases. In addition to the military personnel and members of their families, of whom there are quite a few in this region, the Academy provides assistance under the compulsory medical insurance system, that is, ordinary people who have nothing to do with the army are also treated within the walls of the Academy, and cadets study accordingly. For example, in St. Petersburg all gunshot wounds and severe concomitant trauma fall into 2 places, this is the Department of Military Field Surgery and the Janilidze Research Institute (distribution according to the territorial principle). I hope the logic is clear: a large city, more patients, better logistics (airports, railway stations, more ambulance stations, many medical institutions, training bases of a number of departments are located in about 5-6 civil hospitals, where cadets study, they exchange experience and acquire skills) , etc. You know, we have not many educational institutions that can boast of such a history, the academy was founded already in 1798 by the decree of Emperor Paul. I will also give you an example: one of the first heads of the academy, Willie Yakov Vasilyevich, bequeathed all his property to the construction of the clinic, which was done, and it still stands today, this is the department and clinic of Military Field Surgery. And what moral right do we have on this place to build another hotel or business center !? Frankly, when they start talking about the transfer of VmedA, I want to pick up something heavier and hit harder !!!

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

It is located just in the right place.

This is the result of its "correct" location.

Away from reality, closer to what is not known.
The Academy should train MILITARY doctors. For the preparation of ordinary there are medical schools.

[panov_panov]

What is the logic between the bombarded MOSN, which, according to the instructions of one of the commanders of a tactical group in the SAR, which was put into the head for a beautiful picture of journalists to be located practically in the combat zone and you transferred the academy to the wilderness ???))

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

What is the logic between the fired MOSN

So you don’t even understand what it is about? It’s sadder.

There, all that had to be buried. Or in other ways, with earthen ramparts, boxes or sandbags, newfangled gabions to protect these tents.
And there would not be so many dead.
No, of course the doctor does not need to know this. Civilian. But the military must know this.
But for some reason he doesn’t know. As practice has shown. Means what? That's right, the study of field medicine away from these fields does not justify itself

[panov_panov]

For you Lopatov, once again I will try to explain on my fingers)) there is such a discipline called OTMS (organization of medical service tactics), and so I will reveal a secret for you personally, according to all the guidelines, the MOSN should be located 10-15 km from the front edge, thanks to a very "gifted general" from the infantry, who, like you, did not listen to the opinion of a military doctor with the rank of colonel)), he ordered to deploy a detachment in fact in the combat zone and got such a result !!!

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

according to all guidance documents should be located 10-15 km from the front edge

8)))))
I don't know what kind of doctor you are, but believe me as an artilleryman, a place "10-15 km" from the contact line cannot be safe in principle. Especially considering the concept of "fighting the second echelons" so beloved by the Americans.
Well, I will not say anything about local wars. There are generally no safe places by default.

Quote: panov_panov

thanks to a very "gifted general" from the infantry, who, like you, did not listen

I did it right.
His fault is not that he did not listen, but that he did not control the engineering equipment

[panov_panov]

OH stubborn you Lopatov))), Yes, it can’t be safe, like everything in the war, but still the risk of being hit 10-15 km is much lower when the enemy does not see you in DIRECT VISUAL VISIBILITY !!! As happened with this MOSNom, it was deployed on the battlefield in full view of the militants, who immediately covered it with mortar fire !!!

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

Yes, it cannot be safe, like everything in war

Correctly. Therefore, you need to know how to protect yourself. And this, as practice shows, can only be found on your own skin

Quote: panov_panov

As happened with this MOSNom, it was deployed on the battlefield in full view of the militants, who immediately covered it with mortar fire !!!

Come on, what "in sight" .... On the outskirts of the city. Closed area. No "visual visibility" even from spotters
Those who died completely and completely on the conscience of the boss who did not organize the fort. equipment.

[panov_panov]

Lopatov Here you are a lover of arguing)))) I repeat deployed in direct visual visibility, covered with 2-3 km of mortar fire. MOSN (essentially a small field hospital), unlike the medical point of the battalion, the regiment is a fairly large unit, which is secretly and very quickly deployed, as well as difficult to protect. It never occurred to you why the hospital is being deployed away from the front edge, although logically, closer to the front, you’ll deliver the wounded faster, help you faster)) It’s because of the light target and defenselessness. These distances were not taken from scratch and paid for with their own blood. They really had no time to accept anyone and just turned around as they were covered. In a city in which it is not clear where is his own and where is a stranger! And the one who gave the command to deploy the criminal!

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

I repeat deployed in direct visual visibility, covered with 2-3 km of mortar fire.

8)))) Do not argue with the artilleryman about mortars. To "cover with fire" of them, line of sight is absolutely unnecessary.
In addition, there was a drone shooting, the doctors were located in the "well" of buildings. Therefore, in fact, the mortar was used. And not some ATGM.
Local .... They knew roughly where the doctors were, looked at the exact coordinates on the Google map, calculated the range and direction, gave a series. We looked through the dust where it flew.

Quote: panov_panov

It didn’t occur to you why the hospital is being deployed away from the front edge, although logically, closer to the front, you’ll deliver the wounded faster, help you faster)

Well, firstly, the rear is not at all safe. It is especially unsafe where there is traffic that is perfectly detectable by the SNAR radar. Well, or its aviation counterpart.
Secondly, in order to qualitatively reduce "defenselessness", one can restrict oneself to quite affordable means, for example, ramparts around tents. As it was done back in Afghanistan. Now there are newfangled gabions, you can easily find bags for soil, take the usual capping for artillery shots (though somewhat dangerous, chips). But this can be solved. If you know how. Well, laziness, mother did not eat.

Quote: panov_panov

And the one who gave the command to deploy the criminal!

Here are those times. And here everyone convinced me that the doctors should be where the sick ... It turns out, not always?

[panov_panov]

They just didn't have time to fall asleep; how they got under fire! In addition, you cannot put gabions on top of inflatable tents (there were several mines flying from above. But I can assure you that all the Kimba are in gabions in Khimki at the base))) !!! The last comment on the quote honestly did not understand?

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

Yes, they just did not have time to fall asleep; how they came under fire!

At such distances between the tents, this was not possible. Believe me, here I am a pro, I even had a field ditch protected. Personnel should be busy constantly.

Quote: panov_panov

In addition, you can’t put gabions on inflatable tents from above.

On the contrary, it's easier. There are practically no stretch marks.

Quote: panov_panov

The last comment on the quote honestly did not understand?

This medical facility was deployed where there were civilians who needed to be treated. Otherwise, in another place this could not be done. To bring civilians away, and to treat there, too, would not work. They would be afraid to go.

[panov_panov]

I don’t quite technically imagine how you are going to put gabions on the roof of a rubber tent, but God may be possible, but deploying a hospital a kilometer from the combat zone is stupid! Bury it in the ground, cover it with shafts, gabions, concrete walls, but as prescribed at a specified distance from the combat zone !!! And with regards to civilians, take out on foot, donkeys, donkeys, transport, armor with anything, why risk the lives of both doctors and the same civilians a kilometer from the combat zone ?!

[Ezekiel 25-17]

Quote: Narak-zempo

Quote: Reptiloid

In our city there were plans to move the Military Medical Academy from the city center to the borders of the region. This would be tantamount to destruction, destruction, as described in the article. Well, that did not happen. As a result of the changes above. And probably, the movers were already preparing! Broken off!

And to pay taxes on the cadastral value for real estate in the center of St. Petersburg - is there enough funding for VMA? In general, I don’t understand what those who were placing objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate were thinking about.

The building of the Navy in St. Petersburg has been standing since the 19th century and during the Soviet era, then there were no these problems. The move was needed in order to get kickbacks. They also wanted to sell and transport the Admiralty and Baltic plants
They were planned to be sent to Kronstadt. The goal is the same: kickbacks. Admiralty too. A good example is the building of the Stock Exchange on the Spit of Vasilievsky Island, where the Naval Museum was located. It was transported, and the building is now empty, because it is LOST for private capital to invest in it. An example of a successful sale is New Holland, but we have only one Abramovich in Russia. PS By the way, this kind of activity fits very well into the article by W.K. R.F. "High treason".

[Lopatov]

Quote: Ezekiel 25-17

The move was needed in order to get kickbacks.

Or in order to provide normal training. But it, as I understand it, is a much less important thing than dancing around the cost of real estate in the city center.

So far I have not seen a single argument in favor of the fact that maintaining the existing situation is normal.
Everything, damn it, remembered, from the value of the property to the non-burden of laboratory assistants. But about the organization of the educational process, not a word. It’s even strange.

[BAI]

what were those who placed objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate.

They have been standing there since imperial times. Or at least from the Soviet. What price are we talking about?

[Lopatov]

Quote: BAI

They have been standing there since imperial times. Or at least from the Soviet. What price are we talking about?

That is, an error in the placement of universities and colleges was made initially.
Such educational institutions have no place in cities. This is especially critical for higher education institutions, where such placement often directly worsens the learning environment.

[ZakPo]

May I ask where did you get your education?

[frog]

Apparently, in Nizhneurupinsk, real estate is cheap there .....

[Lopatov]

Quote: ZakPo

May I ask where did you get your education?

Kolomna.
In order to conduct normal classes on equipment, stomp to the support division. 40 minutes on foot. Well, to shoot ... then already in Seltsy, to the training center of the paratroopers, with fifty kilometers in a straight line.

[Mara_say]

Ok, I see. Let, therefore, patients with doctors run about fifty kilometers a day - everything is good for your health! So, Mr. Lopatov?

[Lopatov]

Quote: Mara_Say

Ok, I see. Let, therefore, patients with doctors run about fifty kilometers a day - everything is good for your health! So, Mr. Lopatov?

E .... And in Russian?
What, damn it, "sick with doctors", if we are talking about the cadets of a military educational institution? That need to be taught. And for this it is necessary to create conditions. Which in the center of the second largest city in Russia cannot be by default.

[Mara_say]

You, Mr. Lopatov, seem to have an idea of ​​the location of the Military Medical Academy, but you pretend that there is no one there except for the "cadets of the military educational institution". Perhaps this is the case at the Mikhailovskaya Artillery Academy, but VMedA is primarily about patients and their doctors.

[frog]

Thank. Here in the hometown of the aircraft factory. Which airport within the city, essno. Now, since it works with the left hind paw, flying with a gulkin ...... rod. And in times of totalitarian factory puffed almost in three shifts. And the planes fell too, we can not regularly, but ..... it happened. And on the Moscow highway, and almost on the dam. There the funnel remained about 300 meters away from her. You do not offer to transfer the aircraft factory?
It is clear that looking for those to blame for this kind of "oddities" is a futile occupation. However, there was a helipad next to the regional hospital, and the movement there was no problem. Until the Moscow fosterling came. However, without him there would have been the same latrine, most likely. Maybe move the hospital?

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

May I ask where did you get your education?

Yes, here the campaign and so everything is clear with his education.
I understand that Lopatov is not interested in history, but such a bunch of minuses should have made a person rummage in nete and finally find out - HOW the academy was in St. Petersburg and WHEN!
I am silent about WHY.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Obi Wan Kenobi

I understand that Lopatov is not interested in history, but such a bunch of minuses should have made a person rummage in nete and finally find out - HOW the academy was in St. Petersburg and WHEN!
I am silent about WHY.

Yes, I'm drummed. Not the story is important. Modernity is important.

[Vladimir Postnikov]

Quote: Spade

Yes, I'm drummed. Not the story is important. Modernity is important.

Mr. Lopatov, you surprised me. You are here reasoning like some kind of destroyer. "we will destroy to the ground, and then, we will build ours, we will build a new world ..."
And I, for example, a Leningrader, or a Petersburger. He was born here, and was treated in this Academy for almost 50 years ago. The history of our city is drummed for you. And we, the inhabitants of this city, this is your opinion drummed. Most importantly, you don’t even realize that you are wrong.
My experience suggests that you have health problems. High blood pressure, or something like that. Check if you are not aware of these issues.
Your modernity, which is important to you, lies in the huge land prices in the city center. The view from the window to the Neva, the Hare, the Arrow, the Isaac, the Winter - it is very expensive.
Did not know? Now you know.

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Vladimir Postnikov

....... And I, for example, are a Leningrader, or a Petersburger. He was born here and was treated at this Academy almost 50 years ago. The history of our city is drummed for you. And we, the inhabitants of this city, this is your opinion drummed. .....
Your modernity, which is important to you, lies in the huge land prices in the city center. The view from the window to the Neva, the Hare, the Arrow, the Isaac, the Winter - it is very expensive.
Did not know? Now you know.

Interestingly, the Vyborg side, being connected with the revolutionary past, does not cause the hostility of rich people. It is enough to carefully look at those buildings that surround the hotel! How many want to live opposite AURORA, or work there in bts. I repeat, and the World Military Administration includes 112 capital buildings, 25 of which are registered in UNESCO, many paintings, frescoes, sculptures, which are worthless. Why repeat ---- those comments are far away.

[DrVintorez]

listen, well, you think with your head. and where does the profession live? in ustperezvezdinsk? look at least from this side! there is no step-by-step opportunity to communicate with a colleague at the mouth of Perezvezdinsk. or what do you think, a professor should live in a hut?

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

listen, well, you think with your head. and where does the profession live? in ustperezvezdinsk?

Exactly.
Damn, do we have what, VMA is designed to ensure that the profession lived well?
Or in order to give military doctors troops?

I emphasize the military. Ordinary any medical institute can teach.

[DrVintorez]

well, OK. and all sorts of "professors" will teach people. do you need it?

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

well, OK. and all sorts of "professors" will teach people. do you need it?

They will teach where to go. Just do not tell tales that the professors of the BMA have apartments exclusively in the city center

[DrVintorez]

those. Do you offer to drive medical (!!!) professors to distant lands? not serious?
and your last name is not by chance Serdyukov?
just the essence is simple, the doctor must have practice. and professor too. whom should he treat in distant places? tigers?

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

those. Do you offer to drive medical (!!!) professors to distant lands? not serious?

Where will they go? Contract signed. Dissatisfied, let the contract be terminated through the court.

Fact: Academy for the training of military doctors. And not for feeding professors.

[DrVintorez]

I have already told you. somewhere in other similar disputes. do not rummage in medicine - do not meddle!
Do you have a contract to fire a gun? signed up. sink to the bottom of the Caspian Sea and shoot. how can you not? there is a contract, come on, charge!
Do not like it - through the court terminate. insanity after all?

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

I have already told you. somewhere in other similar disputes. do not rummage in medicine - do not meddle!

Medicine? No, we are discussing military medicine. it is somewhat different.

Quote: DrVintorez

Do you have a contract to fire a gun? signed up. sink to the bottom of the Caspian Sea and shoot. how can you not? there is a contract, come on, charge!
Do not like it - through the court terminate. insanity after all?

Yeah, so for the aforementioned "professors" to live and work not in the center of St. Petersburg, is it like shooting at the bottom of the Caspian Sea? Original.

[DrVintorez]

are you pretending or really difficult?
tell me about military medicine. that the VMA is not properly placed and needs to be moved. come on, burn it.
come on, tell me that the professors should live in huts in Ust-Perezvezdinsk. The profession. the elite of science, and of the nation.
Do you want to drive these people to Ustperezvezdinsk with the words "you must"? no one says that their apartments should be in the center, etc., etc. although they more than deserve it. but only an outright saboteur can drive the professors into the stars. so or .

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

tell me about military medicine

I tell you. Pioneer. Settlement in one cheerful republic. Mekhan vshshivaetsya on BMPshke. Not far, the deputy commander of the regiment built up fellow officers, and tells them something. Mat. Shot, the mech is falling. Careless handling. The first to reach him was the chief of intelligence of the regiment. The last nachmed. The soldier managed to die. Nachmed did not really train officers, nor did he learn to scratch himself faster.
This is military medicine.

Quote: DrVintorez

come on, tell me that the professors should live in huts in Ust-Perezvezdinsk.

If they signed a contract, they are obliged to live where they are ordered. Are they a separate caste? Do not like it, let them pay the money spent on them by the state and forward on free bread

Quote: DrVintorez

professorship. the elite of science, and of the nation.

Here's a word, I can't call those who "have no land outside the Moscow Ring Road" "the state elite"

Quote: DrVintorez

but only a frank pest can drive a professor into a star.

We open the ranking of medical universities in the world. First place is Harvard. To the second city in the United States, New York, as much as 300 km. Pests !!!!!!

[DrVintorez]

Quote: Spade

Not far, the deputy commander of the regiment built up fellow officers, and tells them something. Mat. Shot, the mech is falling. Careless handling. The first to reach him was the chief of intelligence of the regiment. The last nachmed. The soldier managed to die. Nachmed did not really train officers, nor did he learn to scratch himself faster.
This is military medicine.

not okay. those. the mechanic "enters the BMP" next to the ranks of senior officers - this is normal. good at you. directly statutory.
from what does what happen? gun shot? well, OK.
who should help him in your opinion? nachmed? no, are you serious?

Quote: Spade

The soldier managed to die.

it’s your company / platoon maker, who didn’t train the fighter. What does medicine have to do with it?

Quote: Spade

Here's a word, I can't call those who "have no land outside the Moscow Ring Road" "the state elite"

Duck and do not call. Your opinion, in principle, is not particularly interesting for professors. like mine.

Quote: Spade

We open the ranking of medical universities in the world. First place is Harvard. To the second city in the United States, New York, as much as 300 km. Pests !!!!!!

well, just read about gavrard. what conditions are created there. and also take an interest in medical universities of the USA. and stop talking nonsense on an industrial scale.

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

not okay. those. the mechanic "enters the BMP" next to the ranks of senior officers - this is normal.

Of course it's normal. All the same, war, not a parade. It is necessary for the mechanic to serve the BMP, he is engaged in this

Quote: DrVintorez

who should help him in your opinion? nachmed? no, are you serious?

Absolutely seriously. If there is no trained personnel, this is his direct fault. Do not teach, do it yourself.

Quote: DrVintorez

it’s your company / platoon maker, who didn’t train the fighter.

What "fighter" got a bullet in the neck? And what should have been taught him? To die quietly, so that the nachmed would not be embarrassed?

Quote: DrVintorez

your opinion, in principle, is not particularly interesting for professors

She's only interested in my taxes. "Elite" after all ...

Quote: DrVintorez

well, just read about gavrard. what conditions are created there.

What can be the conditions in three hundred kilometers from a large city? You yourself speak at such a distance, almost like at the bottom of the Caspian

[panov_panov]

An artilleryman, furniture maker, submariner, etc., of course, it’s better than a military doctor to know where the academy should be located))) Yes, of course, in Seltsi, in a tent, it's cheaper))) to teach cardiac surgery, neurosurgery, transplantation)))))

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

To the gunner, furniture maker, submariner, etc., of course, it is better than the military doctor to know where the academy should be located)))

It is intended. Because military doctors, as practice shows, this is not a foot in the tooth.

By the way, do you want a joke? American military veterinarian Sarah Cudd passes one of the tests for the title of specialist in field medicine (Army's Expert Field Medical Badge):

12 miles, 16 kilograms, 3 hours.

[panov_panov]

Well, Lopatov is good, then according to your logic, I better know where you put the compass !!!)))))

[Lopatov]

Well, if I, instead of studying in the fields, studied theory in a warm class, then with a high probability you could know this better than me. And they could point it out to me, just on the basis of common sense.

[panov_panov]

Lord, I’m just trying to convey to you that for us the practice is just more in the city !!! As for you in the field)))

[Reptiloid]

I was twice in an ambulance at the Military Medical Academy, in surgery. In Finnish and Pushkinskaya. Also known to me a person in surgery in Finnish, emergency and planned for 10 years, many times. Yes, indeed, very different diagnoses and accidents. I never thought before that it is the quantity and "variety" that are important. I was there just at 11. The staff spoke about the move, they expected a decision at 12m. And at 12m ....

[DrVintorez]

do not try. useless. medicine is to blame for everything. and everyone should.

[panov_panov]

Do not confuse the veterinarian, whose orderly is the main task to remove from the battlefield)), and a highly skilled specialist who can transplant a kidney, heart, lung))

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

and a high-class specialist able to transplant a kidney, heart, lung))

8)))
We are generally talking about military doctors. Specially trained military doctors.
Which should in the field, under enemy fire, stabilize the condition of the wounded and transfer it to honey. evacuation.
Which will take him to the very doctors who "are able to transplant a kidney, heart, lung))" As practice shows, you do not need to be a military man. And such things obligatory for a military doctor as, for example, a VOG device or the ability to shoot, will not be needed at all for a kidney transplant

[panov_panov]

The one you describe should not be a doctor, for this a well-trained paramedic is enough)) To drag, bring to someone who can provide specialized medical care.

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

The one you describe should not be a doctor, for this a well-trained paramedic is enough)) To drag, bring to someone who can provide specialized medical care.

How sweet ... During the Second World War we had a junior medical staff at the battalion level, a medical assistant, doctors from the regiment and above. The Germans had doctors from the level of the battalion. You here offer doctors from the army level to have. Only in hospitals, if I understood correctly. Interesting ...

And I thought that as the Germans needed.

Okay, then the question is backfill. And why then are these military doctors needed if the experience of the doctors in some emergency hospital will be much greater?
Maybe then VMA is not needed at all if paramedics can easily cope with field medicine?

[panov_panov]

These are the most sensible questions, without jokes, from our entire discussion! And this problem is not only of our country. This question is debatable, and there is serious debate in our midst on this topic, but in practice it turns out that doctors at the emergency hospital have much more practical manual skills than the military doctor, who is involved in shooting, combat training, chemical preparation, UCP, etc. .d, and according to my subjective assessment, 10-15% of working time is actually allocated by medical activity. In my opinion, the doctor should not appear earlier than the level of the brigade, regiment; he has nothing to do in the battalion. Ideally, military doctors should constantly be seconded to hospitals, hospitals, that is, to work practically so as not to lose the skills of specialists, this is especially important primarily for surgeons and anesthetists. But in practice, we have well-marching, shooting, but not knowing how specialists from military medicine.

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

But in practice, we have well marching, shooting,

They do not know how. Moreover, they are not able to train subordinates. But all these arrows, orderlies and above, are on their conscience. The infantry does not have enough knowledge to train them. Similarly, the aunts who do not actually have such knowledge in the MPP are on duty instead of working with their battalion.
By the way, maybe the WMA should start training paramedics for the battalion level, if doctors are not needed in the troops?
Well, the organizers, nachmedov.

[panov_panov]

Well, with regards to women in the army, I don't even want to raise this topic, I have an extremely negative attitude towards this. With regards to paramedics, there were several graduates in the academy, paramedics officers for the battalion level, but this idea was abandoned. There was no elevator for "growth", that is, a paramedic was released with the rank of lieutenant, he was promoted to the head of a battalion's med, and that's it, nowhere further, he has a paramedic diploma, there is no longer room for growth. Higher positions require a doctor's diploma, and this is a complete retraining from scratch. That is, in fact, you are forever doomed to remain at the battalion level. The guys there almost all quit. And they can be understood by presenting themselves to be forever a platoon leader with no chance of growth.

[Lopatov]

Quote: panov_panov

And they can be understood by imagining forever being a platoon commander with no chance of growth.

There were and are many. Warrant officers, sergeants-over-conscripts / contractors. Somehow served ...

[panov_panov]

But it didn’t work, it’s hard to say why, the same sergeants have some kind of growth, a junior sergeant, a sergeant, a senior sergeant, an elder, etc. And in their case, in my opinion, the lieutenant is all.

[VladGTN]

The library is more important for him when learning. And she is on the Fontanka. And you will not run into Rzhevka. Unless of course you want to become a good military doctor.
The main idea of ​​placing serious educational institutions in the city center is the availability of all resources and a short time from the place of residence to the place of study. And not just for students. The professor will not go to teach in Verkhnenizhniderevensk. He wants to live in St. Petersburg, and work near the house. The students will go, but the professors will not.

[frog]

That is, if they are driven out to ....... (somewhere), will the principle of preparing aibolites change dramatically? And where do you need to expel the appropriate institution that trained "one of the commanders of the tactical group in the SAR"? Shaw is characteristic, many of the "fraternal" were trained in our own academies. Judging by their success in the wars with the "chosen people", so-so. Were ours taught the same way? And why didn't they move then?

[Lopatov]

Quote: frog

That is, if they are kicked out in ....... (somewhere), then the principle of training aibolit will change dramatically?

Well yes. To the outskirts, closer to the landfills.
To train a military doctor. Which should have a lot of knowledge, skills and abilities except purely medical.

[frog]

Fine. I agree. And where should our military academies be driven out? And many other universities, not just the military?
After our heroic successes (first of all, the command) have shown our mosch to the whole world, I would like to ask: where are these people to drive out? To Antarctica? And yes, about the different skills and the psychologist running along the strip ..... I kind of know that the standards for physical training are mandatory for everyone. Depending, EMNIP, on age. But can you tell me where our stripe and two-ram army is giving them up? No, the fact that there are quite brave "nasyalniks", I know, the question is, how many are there? And when you look at the fathers-commanders, laughter is not laughter, but anecdotes come to mind ...

[Lopatov]

Quote: frog

And where should our military academies be driven out? And many other universities, not just the military?

So far, I’m talking exclusively about military schools. Because it is for them that the presence of the landfill is critical.
Of course, there are exceptions, such as aviation technical schools. For which it is preferable to have an aircraft building company at hand, like Ivatu, which was closed at Serdyukov.

But in general, the main thing is the training ground. You can’t learn to do a coup without a crossbar.

[frog]

I agree, you can’t teach ..... Especially if you do not want to learn and learn. Did our academies have a decent base in Soviet times?

[Lopatov]

Quote: frog

Did our academies have a decent base in Soviet times?

Yes, not very good, at least for most. The main problem is placement almost in the center of cities. With all the consequences.
The schools are better, but also "not a fountain". For example, in my native school in the USSR, the general departure of the entire school to summer camps in the spring was practiced. Down the river, on a barge. Together with the technique And until the fall. Necessary measure.

And by the way, about moving. Kolomenskoye artillery was originally called the 2nd LAU. Leningrad artillery ... 8))) In Kolomna, it turned out to be not at all under Serdyukov 8)))

[frog]

How did the Union endure such indecency? There, for the sake of defense, the last ports were removed?

[Lopatov]

Quote: frog

How did the Union endure such indecency? There, for the sake of defense, the last ports were removed?

I have no idea. Maybe they just needed "dedicated and determined" in the cities themselves.

[frog]

"Devoted and determined" were not in the academies, do you not know ...
And each city had its own "hope and support". IMHO, the generals did not want to hang around in Mukhski, where it was more and more suitable for organizing the process. And now he doesn't want to. And for the organization of the process, the place plays a role, but not in the first place, and not even in the second place. And if really important things were scored and we hammered, why did they get mad at aibolits?

[Lopatov]

Quote: frog

And if they really scored and hammer in really important things, then what about the Aybolites?

And because with "aibolites" we have full seams.

[frog]

Only with Aybolites ??
And as soon as they get kicked out the vegetable knows where, will everything be right at once ?? Truth?? And where to show off the valiant naval headquarters ?? And many other organizations ?? That is, the main thing is to bung into some thread of obscenity and ffse ??

[DrVintorez]

Quote: Spade

It is intended. Because military doctors, as practice shows, this is not a foot in the tooth.

the gunners know better ...

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Narak-zempo

And to pay taxes on the cadastral value for real estate in the center of St. Petersburg - is there enough funding for VMA? In general, I don’t understand what those who were placing objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate were thinking about.

IN UGOS !! That’s because they are unsuspecting! No, what would it be at the very beginning of the 18th century, when they just started to build an alluvium on the Vyborg side, to take it and think, is it right to create a huge complex of land and sea hospitals on the banks of the Neva? Is it not enough that it’s convenient to bring the wounded through the water, and immediately to the hospital on the shore? And to descendants to pay, after all it will be the center in 300 years.
Yes, and Univer, they built it on Vasilyevsky, and this is also from the most expensive areas after 300 years. It would be better to think better then .... But the Univer’s problem is solved by creating sites here and there .... What prevented such sites from being created for WMA for a long time?
Is sarcasm clear?

[Victorio]

Quote: Narak-zempo

Actually, I don’t understand what those who thought posted objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate.

===
yes, it’s better to go somewhere somewhere in the outback, in the steppe or taiga

[Lopatov]

Quote: Victorio

yes, it’s better to go somewhere somewhere in the outback, in the steppe or taiga

That would be just perfect. Excellent conditions for development, excellent living conditions, no problems with landfills ...
But no, they were "doing it all" ... Better to sit on each other's heads and listen to the floor slabs ready to collapse. As recently happened in the same St. Petersburg.
And about any deployment in the "combat position" of the dressing room can be shown on the fingers. Well, or on a poster.
After all, the value of real estate is much more important.

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Spade

But no, they were "dead-fought" ... Better to sit on each other's heads and listen to the floor slabs ready to collapse.

Just to understand how difficult VMA is, you need to see where it sits. To get new areas for work or training, having built something new on its territory, you must first demolish something old - because there is no place. And it is not a fact that this old one will be demolished - most of the buildings are monitored by KGIOP. And still need to maintain the condition of the old fund, built from the end eighteenth century - and somehow fit the current needs of the Academy into historical interiors (do not forget about KGIOP).

[Lopatov]

That is what I am trying to convey. How complicated it all becomes when time begins to pose new challenges to the Higher School. When a banal increase in the term of study from four to five years turns into a micro catastrophe. Two new batteries have nowhere to settle and nowhere to feed.
And so forth ...

But here. apparently some theorists gathered ...

[Kenxnumx]

Compare their batteries with medicine. Maybe your batteries also shoot every day from morning to evening. VMA not only teaches but also treats students, sorry cadets are involved in this. Plus plenty of civilian staff needed. Which are not required to go in formation, but go to work.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Ken71

VMA not only teaches but also treats

VMA is designed to train military doctors. Dot. For their subsequent military service. Dot. Including in the field, including during real combat operations. Dot.

If additional tasks interfere with the core, they should be canceled. Dot.
So, damn it, is it available?

[Kenxnumx]

My grandfather, working at the Arsenal, tested the gun’s half life. Therefore, he was not very good at hearing. But he thought well. And for you I will repeat. If a doctor who does not know how to treat you will treat you, he will kill you. In order for him to learn how to treat, he must learn this gradually in the clinic for real patients. So far, thank God, we do not have a real war with a sufficient number of wounded, he is studying for civilians at the VMA clinics. Naturally, with special courses in field surgery, etc. So far, is it clear? If not, then this is how to conduct firing on the firing range with live ammunition. But every day. So - these clinics are for obvious reasons located in the city. They cannot be transferred. These cannons of yours can be put into the arsenal and once a month it’s fun to ride on the training ground. Still clear? Then on. You can of course transfer academic buildings with hostels severely out of town, but then cadets should be sent to clinics and teachers should go to clinics because they are practicing doctors. Wake you up even after a year break at night - you will be able to prepare the data for the shooting, and the doctor should constantly practice. Unless, of course, you are personally interested in being cured and not finished off if something happens.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Ken71

And for you I will repeat. If a doctor who does not know how to treat you will treat you, he will kill you.

Correctly! See, you yourself understand this.

Quote: Ken71

In order for him to learn how to treat, he must learn this gradually in the clinic for real patients.

8))))) And these patients are found exclusively in the center of St. Petersburg. But not on its outskirts.

Quote: Ken71

So - these clinics are for obvious reasons located in the city.

This means that they must be transferred from the center closer to the sick, i.e. to the outskirts. Where "sleeping areas" are. Don't you think?

Quote: Ken71

Wake you up even after a year break at night - you will be able to prepare data for shooting

No, everything is very tough. Even a month-long break in practice and do not have time in time.

Quote: Ken71

Unless, of course, you are personally interested in being cured and not finished off if something happens.

You understand, an ordinary doctor can cure me. But the military doctor still has a slightly different profile.

[Kenxnumx]

Well, you finally understand that you can transfer their Pentagon. It’s difficult, but you can transfer academic buildings with classrooms. But clinics with patients and equipment cannot be relocated. And there the clinics are not simple, but over the entire range of specialties. It has been built for centuries. On the outskirts of the usual districts (by the way, and cadets go there), but not out of town. This is immediately the loss of their civilian specialists, who have not forgotten anything outside the city. By a military doctor you mean surgeons and this is not true. Field surgery is a part of surgery, and there are much more specialties even for the military, therefore doctors are 90% doctors and it is good if 10% are military. And there are many specialties. And also to transfer any special laboratories like with radiation or there associated with infections. Believe me, this is wildly complicated and unjustified. I may not understand anything about artillery, but I had to work at VMedA.

[Lopatov]

Quote: Ken71

By a military doctor you mean surgeons and this is not true.

No, dear. By military doctors, I mean those who have and train subordinates, this is first of all.
Subordinates. Up to the orderlies shooters

[Walking]

Your inability to listen to the opinions of other more understanding in this topic shows your horizons. Write better about guns.

[Reptiloid]

About 60 departments in the VMA, which is on their website

[DrVintorez]

let your gunners point at your fingers. on the three remaining.

[Lopatov]

Quote: DrVintorez

let your gunners point at your fingers. on the three remaining.

Also an "argument" ...

[frog]

Duc then it is necessary in all (or almost all) settlements to move all the "accumulation of authorities" to the outskirts. They are constantly whining, sho there is no money.

[Tatoshi]

Placed from there the Soviet people. For in the USSR, medicine and education were not "beggars", and the concept of "cadastral value" was completely absent. Instead, there were "goals of the state" and "needs of the people." Well, now, yes, let's measure everything with money, universally, why!
I hope, if you suddenly need an ambulance, will you ask to have one called from the area? Well, it's not near your residential area to put a hospital where the "cadastral value is high."

[Alexey RA]

Quote: Tatoshi

I hope, if you suddenly need an ambulance, will you ask to have one called from the area? Well, it's not near your residential area to put a hospital where the "cadastral value is high."

No need to juggle - this is not about civilian, but military medicine. More precisely - about the Military Medical Academy. It is located in the city center, which does not have areas for expansion and, in which case, is unable to promptly receive a complex patient.
For some reason, our potential adversaries were able to move the main medical center of the Walter Reed Army Medical Center from the capital District of Columbia to Maryland (in fact - "to the region") - due to the need to reduce costs and the impossibility of creating normal conditions for patients in the old buildings of the Center.

[frog]

For some reason, our potential opponents managed to build new bases for new boats .... And a lot of other things ..... We only get well-known gestures .... It is clear that the location of many .... uh. .... institutions have long been "not consistent", only there is a small problem. Everyone who lives here knows that if something can be done through ..... it is through her that it will be done. And even if it is impossible, it will still be done through it. Not to mention the banal human weakness of the "location in the center". As for the historical value and other things, I don’t know how it is in St. Petersburg, but here nothing prevents us from demolishing this value after re-profiling, or disfiguring it beyond recognition ...

[Reptiloid]

Quote: frog

....... And even if it is impossible, it will still be done through it. Not to mention the banal human weakness of the "location in the center". As for the historical value and other things, I don’t know how it is in St. Petersburg, but here nothing prevents us from demolishing this value after re-profiling, or disfiguring it beyond recognition ...

There are examples of how they stood, stood, stood, stood, and then she ----- times! And she fell apart!

[frog]

Sorry, what are you talking about?

[Reptiloid]

Quote: frog

Sorry, what are you talking about?

This is about architectural values. Let's say an old house with high ceilings of several floors. Someone bought with the promise of restoration, covered it with a net or a beautiful cloth, and then my comment and the previous one.

[Reptiloid]

I continue. After several years of waiting for the building under a cloth or mesh, without glazing and heating, it somehow decayes itself ..... Maybe inside the corresponding work, accelerating this process is carried out .... And then, when it starts to fall apart, it is impossible or already
restoration, the new owner completes the process and builds what he needs. Most often --- shopping center or business center. Kapitaklizm-sssss

[frog]

Now I understand, thanks. I didn’t immediately enter what it was about))))
We have ruins, a former hostel for workers, built by a merchant before the revolution, for sure, or maybe as early as the 19th century ..... For the last 30 years, there is only a frame, no floors, no roof, no windows. If they do not help, the same amount will stand. As for capitalism - here you are not quite right, IMHO, essno. The problem is not capitalism, but indifference to laws. And on this issue it was under the Council of Deputies, both before and after. As the saying goes, "In Russia the severity (severity) of laws is tempered by their non-implementation." Moreover, if this is the very failure to do something right, someone needs ...
Say, in our university about the fact that there is a minimum salary, the opinion of the university is at variance with the law ...... And so what?)))

[Reptiloid]

Quote: frog

...... As for capitalism - here you are not quite right, IMHO, of course. The problem is not capitalism, but the nonsense of laws. And in this matter it was during the Soviet Deputies, both before and after.
Say, in our university about the fact that there is a minimum salary, the opinion of the university is at variance with the law ...... And so what?)))

Right or wrong, I'm right ----- it really doesn't matter. It’s just that similar situations are repeated and I think this is not a nonsense, but the conscious actions of the owner. Under the USSR, the state was the owner, and now --- private individuals came up with such a chip for acquiring land in the city center for construction.

[Reptiloid]

Quote: Narak-zempo

..... And to pay taxes on the cadastral value for real estate in the center of St. Petersburg - is there enough funding for the VMA? In general, I don’t understand what those who were placing objects of obviously impoverished departments (medicine, education) in areas with the highest cost of land and real estate were thinking about.

What and when "those" were thinking, we have already discussed.
Under socialism, foreign students studied at the VMA. From Angola, Cuba, Vietnam ---- free. I do not know about the CMEA countries. But there were sons of African leaders and Egyptians, Syrians ---- paid, in my opinion, the Yugoslavs ----? Grandfather taught them, however, he left a long time ago.
Now, teaching foreign students benefits prestigious educational institutions.

[Nitarius]

Yes .. we in Tomsk with doctors are also not very .. it became!

[Vasiliev Yu]

Now in Russia it is not very much with a lot.
After the tragedy in Magnitogorsk, many people asked:
Suppose that happened in Chicago, would they have taken the baby by plane to Washington for an operation? Already, probably, the necessary equipment and qualified doctors would be found in Chicago. With the same Putin for 20 years, we have a lot of things got worse than they were after the Drunk.
Yes, I'm talking about civil medicine right now. But I remember that before, after some tragedies, it was military doctors who took care of our people, because they had more experience and qualifications.

[DrVintorez]

Taking risks? yes, Russia has practically remained without military medicine. Even if one enters the service of graduates of medical universities, it will only give "numbers in the report", since the civilian physician does not have specialized knowledge. not at all. don't teach.
and the worst thing is that in addition to specialized military universities that trained directly military doctors, military departments in civilian universities were closed down, which led to the lack of a mobile reserve in case of a serious conflict.

[Reptiloid]

So after all, civil medicine has its own problems, and very serious ones.

[DrVintorez]

but no one argues.

[Obi-Wan Kenobi]

About 50 departments and faculties of universities involved in the training of medical specialists of the reserve were closed in the country.

That's it, put out the light, throw a grenade! Doctors ran out. We’ll call the priests, let’s take the funeral right away!

It creates a stable impression that modern Russia will not be ready for a large-scale conflict - the country's medicine will not be drawn by either the civilian population or the military.

The army of the Russian Federation, in terms of military medicine, is now generally not ready for any conflict.
I had a familiar military surgeon. He is long dead. But he fought (operated) in the Second World War. In 1941, he completed the 3rd course. It remained to study another 1 year. Unfortunately, I don’t remember the institute. So, on the orders of Stalin, they were not taken to the front and allowed to finish their studies. The rest were sent to the front by simple paramedics. And he, after graduation, operated in medical battalions from 1942 until the end of the war. How many lives he and his comrades saved! Then there was still participation in other wars, but he never talked about this. Retired colonel honey. service - the chief surgeon of one of the military districts of the USSR.
And all this thanks to Stalin.
And now thanks to the president and co. we returned to the time of Nikolai Ivanovich Pirogov, in the middle of the 19th century.
With such leaders and enemies is not necessary. They will liquidate us.

[parusnik]

Zemsky doctors will establish all medicine, including military ... As Peskov said, in an interview with the Communist Party, our ideal is imperial Russia of 1913 ... and this is what we are going to ..

[Reptiloid]

Quote: parusnik

Zemsky doctors will establish all medicine, including military ... As Peskov said, in an interview with the Communist Party, our ideal is imperial Russia of 1913 ... and this is what we are going to ..

Well, yes, yes, 1913, then 1914, then 1917 ......... February again .....
Night, street, lantern, pharmacy, senseless and dim light,
Live for at least a quarter of a century ------ everything will be so. There is no outcome.
You will die ---- you will start over again and everything will repeat as before:
Night, icy ripples of the canal, pharmacy, street, lantern.

[parusnik]

Well, something like this...

[Reptiloid]

I myself haven’t heard about the idealization of 13 years, but bewilderment .... Under the tsar, VMA was respected, under the USSR too, and in this century they decided to destroy ... I became interested and began to read about VMA,
you can start from their site ...... the construction of the building was started by Antonio Porto and completed under the direction of Voronikhin in 1809. The walls of the main building are decorated with frescoes by Piero di Angeli, as well as his images of the goddesses of Healing, Pharmacy, and Science.
The architectural ensemble includes 112 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CAPITAL buildings, 25 of which have UNESCO status !!!!!!!!
And of course, in these buildings and on the territory there are a large number of cultural values ​​preserved in the USSR. Apparently these values ​​do not haunt someone.

[akunin]

in general, zemstvo medicine in Russia was decently financed by the zemstvo and the state, the father of our neurosurgery, academician burdenko, war-yasenetsky and many outstanding doctors left the zemstvo. Now the level of medicine is sharply reduced the greater the distance from the regional center

[parusnik]

You know, in our time ... in a totalitarian course, in a neighboring village there was a cardiology center, now there is one cardiologist in the entire area ... Paid .. And how this affects the level of medicine, it’s not clear .. And what will be Zemstvo doctors, I’m not sure that they will rush to work in villages and villages in orderly rows and columns .. It’s clear that we will bring Russia to 1914 and live ...

[Reptiloid]

Quote: parusnik

...... It is clear, we will bring Russia to the indicators of 1914 and live ...

Previously, I did not think that humanity could voluntarily abandon scientific progress, technology, and astronautics. But, as written in Murphy’s laws ..........
And when I started reading science fiction, ours and Western, it got so bad there! ....... I didn’t believe that voluntary degradation is possible, I thought ---- Western writers are lying ...
Sources:
Paul Anderson, Orion Rises and the Maurai Tales
Sterling Lainier, a dilogy about "Iero"
Jerzy uławski, "Lunar Trilogy"
Harry Garrison, "the captive universe"
Arthur Clarke, City and Stars
Philip Jose Farmer, Brian Aldiss --- I do not remember the names. In some novels, the action takes place on Earth, in others --- in spaceships (!!!!!) during the flight! And Kir Bulychev also wrote something like that .....

[Shepherd]

Quote: parusnik

there will be zemstvo doctors,

Where will they be without a zemstvo? And the zemstvo is only a civilizational episode in the history of Russia, and it has long passed. A reference to the zemstvo is a reference to nowhere.

[akunin]

Quote: parusnik

And how this affects the level of medicine is not clear

yes, everything is very simple: where was the rural outpatient clinic now, or nothing at all, not even "for money." If you live closer to the regional center, then the availability of basic medical care for you increases. zemstvo doctors did not earn bad money and were provided with housing , and "loot triumphs over evil". you have in the south (

in the neighboring village

) the standard of living between the city and the village differs less + there are more roads, and we are getting sadder.

[Tatoshi]

In fact, with zemstvo medicine, one doctor was on, emnip, 17 thousand people. Whom would your Burdenko and Yasenetsky manage to cure, or the doctors trained by them? A couple of hundred gentlemen?
It is possible to prepare single copies at the world level, I admit it. Just what with this common people? You need a system, not "stars".

[akunin]

Quote: Tatoshi

In fact, with zemstvo medicine, one doctor was on, emnip, 17 thousand people.

and now in some areas there remains medicine of the central level, divide by the population of the district and get a close figure, and at the expense of Burdenko and the war - Yasenetsky (whom I just cited as an example, as outstanding doctors who came out and Zemstvo medicine) they are known for their teaching activity.

[Lamatinets]

so we have the words optimization, investment, innovation, digitalization, but they still look, and the management itself is openly sore

[Mcar]

Russia risks remaining without military medicine

And the fig is needed? Robots inject, not a man!

[Lamatinets]

And where is the man?

[Leopold]

Robots to repair.

[Mcar]

Quote: Lamatinets

And where is the man?

It depends on what.

Those who have a lot of chat rooms - to islands, yachts, castles. And those who have few chatrooms are scrapped.

Under capitalism the upcoming robotics and automation will lead to the elimination of 90-99% of the world's population. A robot is a liquidator of jobs, which means salaries, which means livelihoods. This is on the one hand. And on the other - the robot can produce anything and as much as you want, but who will buy it? No jobs, no salaries, no buyers. Dead end.

For the Russian Federation, this is by no means the near future. As long as there are those who want to work for beggarly salaries, no robotization or automation threatens us. Children, grandchildren can already touch.

[Lamatinets]

I agree with you.

[Vadim237]

Robots will be needed to develop the solar system and human power will need a lot.

[Mcar]

Quote: Vadim237

Robots will be needed to develop the solar system and human power will need a lot.

Well yes! They are heavy, robots. Pushing them to other planets is hard ...

[Vasiliev Yu]

Under capitalism, the upcoming robotization and automation will lead to the elimination of 90-99% of the world's population. A robot is a liquidator of jobs, which means salaries, which means livelihoods. This is on the one hand. And on the other - the robot can produce anything and as much as you want, but who will buy it? No jobs, no salaries, no buyers. Dead end.

For the Russian Federation, this is by no means the near future. As long as there are those who want to work for beggarly salaries, no robotization or automation threatens us. Children, grandchildren can already touch.

Nonsense. Robotization is needed, many things are already being produced, where exactly robots and competition in the world are needed. Read:
https://www.pravda.ru/economics/1407511-kolganov/
I once read about Beretta’s weapons production in Picabu, only 3 people (all from workers to management) participate in the production of weapons, the whole world provides their weapons because they are used by production robots and not CNC machines (this is already the last century in reality) and they themselves design these robots.
And if Kalashnikov himself did such plants?

[Mcar]

Quote: vasiliev yu

Nonsense. Robotization is needed, many things are already being produced, where exactly robots and competition in the world are needed.

You are considering the process of consuming arsenic brownies - delicious. And I am considering the final, resultant phase of the use of what was tasty in the process - a corpse. That is why, when not yet a corpse, it seems to you that this is "nonsense."

Under capitalismwhen robotics reaches its highest stage and replaces a person wherever you can imagine, the number of people needed to repair and maintain these robotic and automated systems will require no more than 1-10% of what is now on the planet.

But in the process, especially at the very beginning, nothing is visible and, as it were, everything is tolerable.

[Vasiliev Yu]

Under capitalism,

Jerking.
А under communism we should strive to make phones, computers and rockets manually and with a sledgehammer; robotization is from the evil one and the capitalists.
What are some of your concepts for children. Phones and computers just cited as an example. No need to listen to the unfortunate communists precisely from the plow, more they can not be trusted.

[Mcar]

Quote: vasiliev yu

Jerking.
And in the conditions of communism, we should strive to make phones, computers and rockets manually and with a sledgehammer; robotization is from the evil one and the capitalists.

Illiteracy.

Communism is the social means of production, the lack of exploitation of man by man and the most equitable distribution of public funds. All. Your speculation about a sledgehammer from denseness. It's never too late to learn - start now.

Understand at least the goals of production in communism and capitalism. They are very different. And then it will become clear to you why the upcoming robotization and automation of production IN THE CONDITIONS OF CAPITALISM this is the death of civilization, and IN THE CONDITIONS OF COMMUNISM this is the prosperity of civilization.

[Vasiliev Yu]

Illiteracy.

How to explain to a person if he does not want to understand anything?
Do you think we don’t need robotization now? That's when communism comes to us, then we will introduce it. So your way?
Your remarks remind you of the Luddite peasants in the 19th century. Which participated in the pogroms of machinery and equipment, because they drove people out of production.
Maybe this will be news for you, but the technology gets complicated every year, try making microchips without production robots for the same computers and phones, military and civilian missiles. These are just a few examples.

[Mcar]

Quote: vasiliev yu

How to explain to a person if he does not want to understand anything?

Are you talking to yourself?

Quote: vasiliev yu

Do you think we don’t need robotization now?

Did I say that somewhere?

That’s what the manner — well, just like that of an exams excellence — is to think up something there for yourself and pass it off as an argument of your interlocutor? The conversation is not oral - copy here from what my words a reasonable person could deduce such a question.

Quote: vasiliev yu

That's when communism comes to us, then we will introduce it. So your way?

No not like this.

Communism grows out of capitalism. Capitalism is the mother of communism. So in my opinion.

And in my opinion - universal robotization does not threaten us for a long time, since there are dozens of times less industry in the Russian Federation than in the USSR and there are more than enough people who want to work for a penny. No capitalist will buy a robot if there are Tajiks, Uzbeks, Kyrgyz, and others.

Quote: vasiliev yu

Maybe this will be news for you, but the technology gets complicated every year, try making microchips without production robots for the same computers and phones, military and civilian missiles. These are just a few examples.

And you without examples write here what is the purpose of the production of computers, telephones, and other things in capitalism and communism. It is desirable in one phrase - not spreading over the tree. Just don't peep. And then, maybe already in the process of writing, you will understand what robotization will ultimately lead to, in one form or another.

[Vasiliev Yu]

general robotics does not threaten us for a long time, since there are dozens of times less industry in the Russian Federation than in the USSR and there are more than enough people who want to work for a penny. No capitalist will buy a robot if there are Tajiks, Uzbeks, Kyrgyz, and others.

Convinced. So I do not mind, let the same Uzbeks in pharmacology at the factories for the production of medicines manually weigh the components and divide into doses, stamp tablets with hand presses. Let the Uzbeks and the Kirghiz (about the sledgehammer exaggerated of course) collect microchips and chips using a magnifier and a soldering iron (manually assembled they will obviously be more reliable in rockets, airplanes, computers and phones).
You convinced me that this is exactly what is being done in our country. After all, why spend money on robots if there are Uzbeks?

What is the purpose of the production of computers, telephones, and other things in capitalism and communism.

Honestly, to me ... what is the purpose of production of telephones, computers and other things under communism. For me it is more important that we do not find ourselves on a par with Zimbabwe in technology and production of various equipment now.

[Mcar]

Quote: vasiliev yu

You convinced me that this is exactly what is being done in our country. After all, why spend money on robots if there are Uzbeks?

The wrong question is, I'm not a capitalist.

Only I can hardly imagine a bourgeois in the Russian Federation who would prefer a crane in the sky than a tit in his hand. A robot or an automated system will "fight back" for years, and a Tajik makes a profit every month. And how many capitalists do you know who are ready to do something serious in Russia at our refinancing rate, at our taxes and at our purchasing power?

Quote: vasiliev yu

Honestly, to me ... what is the purpose of production of telephones, computers and other things under communism. For me it is more important that we do not find ourselves on a par with Zimbabwe in technology and production of various equipment.

"Na ... rat" and "Zimbabwe" are interrelated things.

The more people do not know economic laws, the sooner we will begin to catch up with Zimbabwe.

[Vasiliev Yu]

Economic laws? Do I also have to explain this to you?
Do you understand that there is a different production? Dig holes - here yes, Uzbeks are beyond competition, and do rockets and planes is a different level? Although looking at Rogozin, the feeling that he is trying to make rockets and Uzbeks.

[BAI]

In our hospitals, doctors from the Caucasus and Transcaucasia speak Russian with an accent, then he is a surgeon, then a urologist. They are only occupied with pulling their own, surviving competitors of other nationalities.

[Victorio]

yes, there was a case, I came across this in St. Petersburg in the early 2000s, making money from military doctors prospered.

[Reptiloid]

Perhaps not everyone knows that the VMA accepts sick civilians by ambulance as well as scheduled operations, examinations, and cooperates with civilian institutions. In this context, there are civilian and paid rooms. So what? Bad? Whoever wants to from the street can come and sign up for a fee without barriers. No one drags by force.

[Reptiloid]

continue, supplement. I know that doctors from the BMA are not always in the city. From time to time they go on business trips. For several months. By specialty.

[Victorio]

Quote: Reptiloid

Perhaps not everyone knows that the VMA accepts sick civilians by ambulance as well as scheduled operations, examinations, and cooperates with civilian institutions. In this context, there are civilian and paid rooms. So what? Bad? Whoever wants to from the street can come and sign up for a fee without barriers. No one drags by force.

===
the only bad thing is that the money went past you in your personal pockets

[Reptiloid]

To say so, you need to know this for sure. Otherwise, it is speculation and slander against doctors

[akunin]

This is bad, especially against the background of a decline in the quality of civil medicine, "if tomorrow is war ..." then brilliant green and iodine are ours. Our garrison hospital was closed 12 years ago.

[orcinus]

well, to the question "Who is to blame?" The author seemed to answer, now there is a second one - "What to do?", constructive suggestions on points, please.

[Jubilee]

He also destroyed all military schools of communications of the Moscow Region.

[Nestorych]

Anatoly Serdyukov. The main ideologist of "reforms" in the Ministry of Defense

Outright lies. He is only a high-ranking performer, and the ideologist is called the commander in chief!)))

[pafegosoff]

And what - Serdyukov? Chubais, Mubays ...
Our supreme commander, not Serdyukov. Our great teacher, not Fursenko. Our great financier, and not Kudrin, Gref, Siluanov, Nabiulin and Misha-2 percent. Our...
So who is Poroshenko with his death lady, with his economists, security forces, warlike slogans and the opening of toilets, FAP and bridges across the rivers, posing in the Su-27 cockpit, etc.?
And this is such a janitor with a broomstick from a cartoon about a plasticine crow ....
A big janitor with a broom ... But he has a broom ... such a broom!

[iouris]

All medicine and civil defense is a mobilization resource in case of emergency and war.

[Private Major]

problems of military medicine are much deeper than indicated in the article. the role of the doctor in the structure of the military unit, the connection is sometimes belittled to the level of a stucco, however, as in the state in general. the lordly-condescending attitude of commanders and political workers towards the doctor is often compensated by the level of his professional training in the military schools listed in the article.

[Mara_say]

Amendment to the article: the two nurses who died in Aleppo, Galina Mikhailova and Nadezhda Durachenko, were from the Birobidzhan Military Hospital. Both alone raised children, a blessed memory to them.
And the idiot Imyian, who offers to do away with "military medicine", then with "military accountants, storekeepers" and so on. I can only advise you to take haloperidol, everything else is unnecessary here.
It is no secret that plans to reduce military doctors to the concept of "absolutely" under Serdyukov existed exactly before the first real exercises, when it turned out (all of a sudden!) That the civilian doctor was not eager to stay in the exercise area after 17.00, to crawl under the shots (albeit blank) and in general, the "hardships and deprivation of military service" is too much!
Meanwhile, the staffing of the military medical service, especially in the Far East, especially at the military level, remains a serious problem. For years (some for decades) officers have been holding the same positions with the only prospect of leaving them - to enter the Military Medical Academy. There is practically no rotation from the Far East to the center of the country, and if there is, then the issue has been resolved on an individual basis, often for a considerable bribe. Raising the age limit for service from 45 to 50 years also played a certain negative role in all this, namely, if there are no prospects for career growth, another rank, then what is the point of sitting in the same place for five more years? And such officers prefer to leave at the end of the contract. Especially if the length of service allows you to count on a pension and / or a housing subsidy from the RF Ministry of Defense. I personally know about three people who are leaving one small hospital in the Far East, only this year. And three more - in the next. All - at the end of the contract. And for a basic hospital with 300 beds, such a situation is a real mass exodus. Taking into account the fact that graduates of the residency and, to a lesser extent, the internship of VMedA, having studied in St. Petersburg, are extremely reluctant to agree with the appointment to those regions, it can be assumed that the personnel problem will not be resolved soon. And this despite the fact that service in a hospital cannot be compared to service in a military echelon - a regiment, a brigade. In hospitals, at least they are primarily engaged in medicine, and only then - the delivery of physical examinations, drawing up notes, checking parts, etc. In the medical service of the military level, everything is exactly the opposite! Therefore, when some head of the first-aid post, dressed in a field uniform, communicates with the doctors of the hospital in overalls and dressing gowns, he envies them with white envy. Since, from his point of view, the "hospital" ones are busy with what they studied: surgeons - in operations, therapists - in diagnostics and treatment, anesthesiology - in various critical conditions. While the military doctor is either sitting at the training ground with a unit, then trying to get the deputy tech out of the binge, or even forced to hide the injured soldier in the city hospital. So it turns out that the only personnel reserve for hospitals remains the same military link, but in no way graduates of the best military medical educational institution in the world.

[DrVintorez]

Quote: Mara_Say

that the civilian doctor is not eager to stay in the training area after 17.00 p.m.

Choi then ??? up to 15-00 maximum!
but otherwise true.

[orcinus]

I’ll write it rudely for some local comrades, but conscience does not allow it in any other way:
1. The VMA must be where it is! These are both centuries-old traditions and location in St. Petersburg itself (someone wrote about providing assistance with combined trauma and logistics); Moving clinics to the outskirts, the city will not be convenient to "drag" ambulances there, and the flow of specialized patients will sharply decrease - hence the practice of trainees!
2. for the above reasons, the BMA cannot be transferred to a smaller city;
3. Yes! the faculty of the VMA is the elite, many of whom are known all over the world, many directions in medicine were developed precisely in the VMA, so the professor should not go to the "red pole" and practice there! And do you also propose to organize world-class symposia in the countryside?
4. My favorite: here SOME general military men began to write a mantra that the country needs military men, and then doctors, so a medical cadet must "walk 10 to the range", etc., and they compare gunners, infantry with doctors. I call this category "kitchen rambos" because people who really fought know the role of military doctors and never talk to them like that, but when such individuals are going to retire or an urgent vacancy for the head of a bank / warehouse security looms, they immediately look for it has thousands of diseases to get rid of "due to illness". The same limited tried to shove a doctor into each company.
5. Yes, the system needs some kind of reform. the foundations were created in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. So, for example, there are garrisons for 1000-2000 people in a small village, so let the doctors not sit in the first-aid post, but as residents in the local central district hospital, and the practice will be and the local head physician will be glad to "extra hands and on duty". We have to go to the training ground - they sent one, the rest are working in the hospital. By the way, the problem of the practice of military doctors is also acute in the United States, where this is one of the reasons for staff turnover.

[DrVintorez]

Man, let me shake your hand. at least virtually, but at least so.

[DrVintorez]

Man, let me shake your hand. at least virtually, but at least so.

[serg v stock]

The structure of hospitals has remained since the time of the 5 million army. The army has shrunk to one million, why so many doctors in uniform?

[orcinus]

Do you understand the difference between the hospital staff and the number? Military doctors have already been reduced to a plinth. And, if we already touch on this parameter, as the numerical strength of the Armed Forces, then the number of specialists, in particular doctors, is not in algebraic dependence on the number of Armed Forces. The tasks, tactics, strategic priorities have changed, and along with them, the potential theater of operations. This requires a systematic approach to the number, and not like a collective farm "twosome!"

[Barmal]

And they do not need doctors in such numbers. That they broke to contain. Moreover, they can hire doctors in neighboring countries. This is about the medical guest workers speech. There is competition with the countries of the former USSR. A military doctor in the logic of a liberal economist is no different from a civilian doctor. And sooner or later the medical officer will be on the labor market. Why fill this market if there is a reduction everywhere?

[Reptiloid]

All that for people and the country ----- the liberals do not need, just imagine

[Doctor]

It is rightly said: "History teaches man that man does not learn anything from history." In the Second World War, a cloud of military schools was convulsively thrown inland, but there were no conclusions.