Military Review

Red stars under a layer of orange diarrhea

108
Red stars under a layer of orange diarrheaNot so long ago on the patriotic TV channel "Star" showed the documentary series "Red Stars". I drew attention to the 9 part, "He could cancel the war."

You are expecting, they say, here, hopes, they will tell you something so interesting about the secrets of creating and building the famous Soviet aircraft that our grandfathers were proud of! Listen, listen. And from the first phrases you catch yourself thinking that the story, in fact, is not about aviation! Against the background of flying airplanes, air parades and design bureaus, you, the viewer, are being handed the propaganda of the lowest quality of the Cold War, and the enemy propaganda is propagating their own. Who is involved in the orange informational stuffing on the patriotic television channel, I guess, given the bunch of pro-Western ads and Western films that filled the Star.

Attempts to adjust the viewer's thoughts to our own interpretation of ours. stories are noticeable in similar films on a standard set of Western-style cliches and ear-drawn analogies, which makes it disgusting to listen and watch.



Announcer, on the background of 30-s pictures about the development of Soviet aviation:
“... In 1930, a new, dull-like, giant ANT-6 was built. Nowhere in the world have comparable aircraft been produced, not even designed (serious pressure is growing in the voice of the announcer, apparently due to depict fear and horror for the rest of mankind, peacefully creating kettles and primuses instead of powerful aircraft) - he broke all records in lifting goods - 5, 10, then 12 tons. Wingspan - already under 40 m (that is, his wings, apparently, grew with an increase in wearable load?). In a short time built 818 ANT-6. The release sometimes reached the 3 planes per day (no, well, what bastards, eh? I understand if there were three screws and a wheel per day, but three planes ?! Bury! Live !!!). To say that the country was already flourishing during this period (with a sudden grief in its voice) is a frank lie (well, tell us the unacknowledged truth!). Collectivization, with its mass repressions, hunger, attempts to turn the economy on industrial rails - all this is not the best background for aviation giantmania. ”

So there!
In one trough: and drink slop, and my feet!


What side is collectivization and hunger here ?! Is this a story about aviation, or about politics? And what about industrialization - was not needed for the creation of aviation? Such frank demagogy fit Bush Jr. (small Australian or African politician since the Great Dima Bilan). Perhaps it was necessary for the USSR to remain an agrarian country with an illiterate population and undeveloped productive forces? And, if the “repressions”, then what, the country should stop developing, and only grievously frantically, as all present-day freedomists do?

In short, the authors of the film immediately bind the bull to the donkey’s ears, trying to expose all the aviation achievements of Soviet Russia with such an incredible evil sabotage against his people and the rest of the world.

A big pause, further against the backdrop of a flying, already hated for the audience, ANT-6, aka TB-3:
“But big planes with incomprehensible perseverance are built! They don’t carry mail, peaceful cargoes, and air passengers, for them it’s not that secondary, the tenth application (wondering, where have eight or nine more applications been used? Repressed by airplanes, were they taken to Siberia and Kolyma?). For several airlines of the country, there are hundreds or fewer smaller aircraft. A thousand-strong squad of giants is needed for another purpose (for what, I wonder ?!). Tsarist Russia (sic!), And behind it the Soviet Union, is building and improving strategic bomber aviation (Aaa Ahrenet! Thesis on history! In your pocket!). Bombs are the only “useful” cargo that planes are calculated on! .. ”

So there!
Красиво.
Brazenly.
Categorically.
A gravestone!


It turns out:

1. Tsarist Russia was building strategic aviation! The discovery is just a world! I wonder how the kind of troops or the type of armed forces? The documents, apparently, are already being prepared in the same place where the Katyn fakes were being prepared. So, they say, the cruel Russian essence is to gather to bomb everyone around in the Stone Age (familiar phraseology? Not by us, by the way)! Sorry, there is no evidence so far. But, nothing, the authors are masters of frivolous genre, read below ...
2. Russia, that the king, that the Soviet, had one, but - a fiery goal. Carry bombs! Many bombs, different, and more! Well, just a dream idiot! .. As the author thought. Just carry? Where? The ultimate goal, of course, the “smart” viewer is simply obliged to guess himself, if not a fool! With the Russian Empire, in the future - the Soviet Union, borders on a dozen countries. Choose, the golot, which still has neither the army, nor the industry, where we will carry the “useful” cargo for them?! ..

3. Big aviation is necessary, as I understand it, for dwarf states, like Italy or Luxembourg, and not at all with dimensions comparable to the continent. By the way, one small country, the North American united states, tried to build the world's largest flying boat. Did not work. Had to do with aircraft carriers.

The authors rudely and brazenly bury themselves at the very beginning of the watch film. As taught by their grandfather Goebbels, the minister of Hitler's propaganda. If brazen lies are often repeated, people will soon take it for truth!

It is not desirable to listen further to all this bleating about “cruel and inhuman” Russians from people who don’t know about the development of world military and civil aviation, and who just want to splash poisonous saliva into masters and warriors. And in the first two minutes that pass on the screen, the usual aviation amateur or specialist has several memories of world history that contradict the authors of the film.

1. At the end of 20's, the so-called aviation boom swept around the world. Abroad, along with passenger and cargo, military planes, both fighters and bombers, were also built. One can only understand and respect the country that has managed to create such powerful machines, barely escaping from the civil war and intervention that swept across (!) Its territory and did not want a repetition of such “civilization”. It is enough to remember that in the civil war, peaceful Ukrainian villages, sympathizing with the Soviet power, and simply neutral to it, were bombed by American pilots in French and German cars. So, “perseverance”, about which the authors of the film speak with such incomprehension, is nothing but the talented leadership of people who do not want a repetition of such a tragedy.

2. The global crisis that began at the end of 20, diverted the enormous forces of market states to survive, but the planes, including the military, did not stop building in any of the countries.

3. For the stupid and not knowing the real story. In the 30s, the so-called “Douet Doctrine” was widely discussed in the West. Its essence was that heavy bombers, having a large bomb load, range and protected by a large number of machine-gun points, are "absolute weapons", Able to bring their owner a quick and easy victory in the war. As the further development of events showed, this doctrine was largely correct, but it was advanced by the ideological enemy of the USSR - Commander-in-Chief of the Air Force of Fascist Italy Giulio Due. Therefore, the theory of Douai by the politicians of our country at that time was sharply criticized. And this is an indisputable fact that it is impossible to interpret in two ways. Which completely contradicts the idea of ​​the film's authors.

4. 818 bomber planes TB-3, which, moreover, could not fly without intermediate landings, with much smaller declared cargo, even to Berlin, the main enemy in the First World War, and then return, but in such a territory as Russia, - this is not enough. In addition, at the end of 30-x TB-3 (combat load 6233 kg, range 2700 km, maximum speed 288 km / h, practical ceiling 7740 m in the experimental machine, in the series - even less) was considered hopelessly outdated. Or does someone have information that Soviet Russia was going to totally fight with someone at the beginning of 1930? Oh, what aggressors! Apart from the rest of the countries, the “peace-loving” United States only has the B-17 “Flying Fortress” (combat load 2742 kg, range 2736 km, maximum speed 481 km / h, practical ceiling 10850м) with 1935 of the year already configured 12 726 pieces! Apparently, for protection? It turns out that hundreds of terribly dangerous Russian strategic bombers are against, for example, some kind of just a few tens of thousands of European, British and American unfortunate bombers? Laughing out loud! Democratic guys, m-yes, with a little head at you - trouble! ..

5. To the dirty hint that in the USSR practically no civil aircraft were built. K-5, the first domestic passenger aircraft, was developed under the direction of KA Kalinin in the 1929 year, was mass-produced at the Kharkov Aviation Plant until the 1935 year. A total of 258 aircraft of this type were built. The ANT-9 aircraft began to be designed in December, 1927, under the direction of the designer A.N. Tupolev. A total of 66 serial aircraft were produced, of which the PS-9 was the major part, a modification with domestic engines. In addition, the decommissioned TB-1 has long been used as a transport aircraft, called G (civil) -1. In operation, he proved himself a simple, reliable and unpretentious aircraft. TB-1 production ended in 1932. A total of 216 aircraft of this type were built. A large number of TB-3 (G-2) with removed weapons were used as cargo and passenger aircraft in the Far North and in the south of the country. This is to ensure that not only bombs drove. Already in the amount of more than five hundred cars, and not “a hundred or the other,” as the authors say. The power of the country is doing the right thing by creating dual-use airplanes - it simply saves people's money, and does not buy yachts or football clubs for itself abroad.

I guessed the idea of ​​the filmmakers in the third minute. In 1933, Adolf Hitler came to power in Germany. Probably, before creating his own text, the director with the sound engineer and the author of the text, sitting in a smoking-room with a couple of half-meter jambs, came to a terrible and clear thought for any “enlightened” thought. If the “strategic” bomber TB-3 was created in 1930, the West was forced to call Aloizyevich into the realm so that he could resist the armadas of hundreds of monstrous winged Russian monsters! Scrappers crowd happily clap their hands, blow the New Year's crackers and pour themselves syrup out of the barrel. At the same time dancing and singing: “But we told you so!”

It is not interesting to listen further. Pictures, of course, are good. Of those that in the early nineties, tons were sold by oligarchic television from the Soviet archives to the West at the price of empty dishes. But the texts of any aviation specialist are driven into a stupor and despondency. Well, there is nothing there about Russian aviation! Only the fantasies of a group of offended dilettantes, with a clever kind of bearing all the same Goebbels stories about Russian subhumans.

Well, we are only on hand that the brainless opuses of the West about Russia are performed by brainless amateurs and non-professionals, who are also lazy just to look in the aviation reference books. Because while they are bleating, Russia is gradually restoring priorities in the arms markets. And the ability to create a magnificent aircraft, superior to counterparts in Western production, was born and became precisely in the early thirties of the twentieth century.
And that moral potential is far from being exhausted! It is clear that such films, mass produced for nothing and thrown onto the Russian market, serve one single purpose: to make the Russians think not about the future, but always repent of what they, as a people and a nation, are innocent. And that, as a topic, it is not worth a damn, compared to the need to improve our present life and the life of future generations. People ashamed of the achievements of their ancestors and cursing their past are, by definition, incapable of this! ..

Why am I writing all this? It's pretty simple. We, Russians, are trying to make us believe by any means that the country has no right to think about the technological future and scientific and engineering breakthroughs, until it feeds and closes its people. This is the point of view of obvious degenerates and speculators who are incapable of elementary understanding the paths of human development.

First, a country surrounded by or bordering on technically developed countries, and even aggressive in its essence and attitude towards it, is not doomed to breakthrough technologies. Sooner or later, while she tries to grow bread using old-fashioned methods, she will be subjected to aggression and enslavement. An example is the aborigines of New World, whose agricultural culture exceeded five hundred years ago the modern European, and who did not starve before the arrival of wild and dirty Europeans, who already had firearms.

Secondly, a large and multinational country, with vast territories, for the sake of its own preservation, which includes not only the language and culture as a means of self-identification of the nation, but also the centuries-old infrastructure of trade routes and habitats, always along with the issue of food must develop timely and adequate defenses against assault and robbery.

And what is behind what - the question is very complex, depending on the environment. What kind of environment did Soviet Russia have at the end of the 20? Peaceful and affectionate Europeans who physically killed 10 millions of people over four years, used chlorine gas, phosgene and chloropicrin to exterminate their own kind, used concentration camps and practiced mass executions in the occupied territories ...

That's it!
Author:
108 comments
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  1. Terry Jones
    Terry Jones 9 June 2012 09: 13
    -13
    In the Name of the Lord!
    , this statue is the essence of your spill of bile, do not forget what is said in the Holy Scripture for those like you - "do not pi ... those, but do not pi ... dima!"
    Amen!
    1. Curculum
      Curculum 9 June 2012 10: 45
      +1
      Terry Jones, what is it said? Or, my friend, your brains are already in Shambhala?
      1. sleepy
        sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 10
        0
        Terry Jones, what is this about what scripture is talking about?
        The quote "in the Holy Scripture for those like you -" do not pi ... those, but do not pi ... dima you! "
        Maybe it's about the gospel: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged".

        Quote from Revelation: "And I also testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds anything to them, God will impose the plagues about which it is written in this book; if anyone takes away from the words of this book of prophecy, God will take away from him participation in the Book of Life and in the Holy City and in what is written in this book ".
      2. sleepy
        sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 11
        +1
        b] Terry Jones, what kind of scripture is this about?
        Quote: "in the Holy Scripture for those like you -" do not pi ... those, but do not pi ... dima! "
        Maybe it's about the gospel: "Do not judge, and you will not be judged"?

        Quote from Revelation: "And I also testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: if anyone adds anything to them, God will impose the plagues about which it is written in this book; if anyone takes away from the words of this book of prophecy, God will take away from him participation in the Book of Life and in the Holy City and in what is written in this book ".
    2. revnagan
      revnagan 9 June 2012 11: 58
      -1
      Quote: Terry Jones
      Holy Scripture for those like you - "do not pi ... those, but do not pi ... dima you!"

      , Terik's plate stuck.
      1. oiuy
        oiuy 9 June 2012 12: 35
        -2
        Especially I will explain for the author of the article:
        My friend, in order to build an airplane in a poor country, a lot of money is required! Where can I get them? To take away by force from the people the remnants of what is. So, to begin with, figure out what funds were used to build the planes in the 30s, and only then talk about your "orange" problems laughing
        People in the villages were dying of hunger! What does "orangeism" have to do with it? Are you generally sane? fool
        1. Dedrusav
          Dedrusav 15 May 2018 12: 43
          0
          The orange problem is yours, the banderlog is false ...))
  2. Alexander Romanov
    Alexander Romanov 9 June 2012 09: 26
    +6
    Already tired of politics, we begin to see it everywhere. Author, oh well them in the bath.
    1. sleepy
      sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 13
      +26
      Who is not interested in politics interests politicians.
      As an example, events on Bolotnaya Square.
      1. Ascetic
        Ascetic 9 June 2012 13: 23
        +21
        Quote: sleepy
        Who is not interested in politics interests politicians.
        As an example, events on Bolotnaya Square.


        If you are not interested in politics, politicians will be interested in you, not even you but your pocket in the first place. It’s clear how to love summarizing Volfovich.
    2. petrakov vowa
      petrakov vowa 9 June 2012 13: 14
      +6
      They would be in the bath, but they are dogs and they will tryndet there, about the same .. In the furnace (time) them!
    3. Neighbor
      Neighbor 9 June 2012 19: 02
      +3
      I personally watched this entire program !!! yes
      I didn’t notice anything like that. What is the point? Russia could create a high-altitude bomber - beyond the reach of any air defense of the West. But did not create. - although in terms of the effectiveness of the dropped bombs - it was almost = nuclear weapons - which still did not exist! . belay
      Stalin first approved, then canceled, then approved! request
      Imagine a situation - there was no 2 world - in Russia - would there be nuclear weapons now? Would it be Russia at all? belay
      WHAT ARE YOU WANTING !!! ??? am
      What years were that? Then it is not now! belay It is then! When not ... was not. belay
      And they did not know to whom and what to believe! What projects to implement, which not, what is the future? With lasers alone - how many years did they last - spent billions - and what's the point? yes And how many more projects - THOUSANDS (but on Topol - BILLION - Soviet rubles were spent - on development and creation) - go - guess what you need in the future !!! yes
      One way or another - we conquered the Nazis, we created the great and mighty country of the USSR, then Russia !!! The greatest and most powerful !!!
      And this is not a channel - Oranzhevizny - the transmission is normal, and the channel - Putevy - I saw it - this is the Author and the article - Oranzheviznye !!!
      Glory to Russia!!! Happy Russia !!!
      Shame and disgrace - Oranzhevizne nasty !!! Article Orangeizhevnaya (who yells the loudest - keep the thief?) - MINUS !!!
      1. 755962
        755962 9 June 2012 19: 33
        +6
        the country does not have the right to think about the technological future and scientific and engineering breakthroughs until it feeds and clothe its inhabitants.
        In other words, until he gives all the money for Western "chemistry" and Chinese clothes don't fucking think about yourself. And tomorrow, sawing from a high bell tower. The same can be said about children, until we ourselves make a fortune, like there is nothing to give birth. So, what? They impose on us existence without a future.
        1. 755962
          755962 9 June 2012 22: 28
          +2
          And how did I forget that you can't touch the "eternal values" ..... broads and minus ..
      2. andrklimanov
        andrklimanov 10 June 2012 11: 28
        0
        I fully support, there was nothing out of the ordinary in the film! also slammed minus smile
      3. valokordin
        valokordin 11 June 2012 08: 56
        0
        Could create, probably not. To create a high-speed high-speed bomber, there is little political will; appropriate scientific and technical support and an appropriate level of technical culture are needed. As for Great Russia, it turned down, in my opinion, it will or will not be in the distant future. As N. Nekrasov said, it’s a pity that neither you nor I will have to live a wonderful life ..
    4. huginn
      huginn 10 June 2012 14: 03
      +7
      Even in football, politics: “This is not the Russian team. This is Putin’s team, and now it’s a shame to root for him. On the football field, these players deserve only a whistle, ”said Vladimir Varfolomeev, deputy editor-in-chief of the Echo of Moscow radio station, after Russia's victory over the Czech Republic.
      1. 10 June 2012 18: 14
        +2
        Quote: huginn
        Even in football, politics: “This is not the Russian team. This is Putin’s team, and now it’s a shame to root for him. On the football field, these players deserve only a whistle, ”said Vladimir Varfolomeev, deputy editor-in-chief of the Echo of Moscow radio station, after Russia's victory over the Czech Republic.

        These orange monkeys also took the victories of our ice squad. Mutants, what else can you say. They are no longer Russian (mentally) ...
        1. mind1954
          mind1954 10 June 2012 19: 44
          -2
          When hockey and football triumphed during the USSR
          national teams, I understood that this was the result of development
          physical education and sports in the country! And this development I saw around
          I felt myself in my own skin! When I was in college
          physical education, in the absence of a gym, was set like that
          autumn winter and spring, that for four years I have not been sick a single day!
          And now these victories, the result of which, "patriotic vlasishka" ?!
          1. valokordin
            valokordin 11 June 2012 08: 58
            0
            I completely agree with the author
    5. zelenchenkov.petr1
      zelenchenkov.petr1 10 June 2012 20: 45
      +1
      Interesting ... you say something, IN-TE-RES-NO! I envy !!! Allow me a counter question: "What did you come here and what were you looking for? Entertainment ... go?" But if you think about the purpose of the statement, then everything becomes clear; the analogy with the meaning of the article ... OBVIOUS !!!
    6. valokordin
      valokordin 11 June 2012 08: 49
      0
      And without politics, it’s nowhere, it’s military, and technical, and cultural, and administrative, and criminal, etc. Vitaly well done. Ours at VGTRK have already surpassed Dr. Goebels with regard to the denigrating of the past. And Dr. Medinsky signed up for the funeral home. Perhaps he was not a pioneer for ideological reasons, he immediately became a scout.
  3. Zerstorer
    Zerstorer 9 June 2012 09: 26
    +25
    I, too, long ago drew attention to the fact that many documentaries contain a strange ideological component. Article +
    1. sleepy
      sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 17
      +10
      There was a good cycle about the Great Patriotic War on the children's channel "Carousel".
      http://www.karusel-tv.ru/video?q=%EF%F0%EE+%C2%EE%E9%ED%F3#8229
      "Great War".
      http://www.karusel-tv.ru/video?q=%EF%F0%EE+%C2%EE%E9%ED%F3#8305
      He who does not want to know his past loses the future.
      1. Middle-brother
        Middle-brother 9 June 2012 12: 17
        +2
        I saw this "good" cycle, because son "Carousel" looks. Profanation. It is clear that children need to be explained more often, but they showed frank delirium
        1. sleepy
          sleepy 9 June 2012 13: 03
          +2
          Tell me, what is better to watch on TV for children about the Great Patriotic War?
          1. Generalissimus
            Generalissimus 9 June 2012 14: 43
            +12
            Easier to watch on DVD or on the Internet.
            On 99 television,% of war broadcasts are shown through a liberal filter. And there is nothing to be done, for our agitprom is not Soviet, but liberal. Just a reality.

            The question arises - is it better Soviet? Everyone answers this to himself.

            In any case, in raising their own children is necessary system an approach. Only in this case will you help the child to orientate correctly both in lies and in truth. And most importantly, a systematic approach is designed to teach the child the desire to analyze and think.

            First, make a list of what you yourself know about the history of the Second World War. You may need to study something yourself yourself. Then make a list of what your child needs to learn.

            Nothing hesitating, I would advise you to seat your child for watching the documentary epic "The Great Patriotic War" - Unknown War (Roman Carmen, USSR-USA, 20 episodes) 1978.
            It is simply a must.
            For example, here:
            http://voenhronika.ru/publ/vtoraja_mirovaja_vojna_sssr_khronika/dokumentalnaja_k

            inoehpopeja_quot_velikaja_otechestvennaja_quot_neizvestnaja_vojna_roman_karme_ss

            sr_ssha_20_serij_1978_god/22-1-0-404

            "They Fought for the Motherland", "Come and See", "The Ballad of a Soldier", "The Cranes Are Flying" - every child should watch this.
            1. AK-74-1
              AK-74-1 9 June 2012 18: 43
              +5
              And also the film epic Ozerov "Battle for Moscow", "Stalingrad" and "Liberation".
          2. late
            late 9 June 2012 15: 39
            +5
            I really liked Artyom Drabkin's film "The Great War", the first channel, colorful, but at the same time there is newsreel footage of the war years, there are very interesting facts that I have not seen anywhere else, since Drabkin is a professional in his field. he writes books-memoirs of veterans (otherwise not to say) "I am a fighter", "I fought in the T-34", "I fought with the Tigers." I advise you to take a look, you will not regret it!
            1. Dust
              Dust 9 June 2012 16: 18
              -6
              Your Drabkin is a little frivolous - a frivolous source, there are interesting points and quite a lot, but you definitely need to be critical of him ...
              1. Colonel
                Colonel 9 June 2012 21: 31
                +5
                Drabkin relies on the recollections of war veterans. And you probably closer Svanidze.
                1. Brother Sarych
                  Brother Sarych 10 June 2012 12: 29
                  0
                  I don’t know what he definitely relies on there, but it seems to me that, nevertheless, it’s more about his imagination! A sort of new Dumas, hanging his hat on the nail of history - but I do not completely reject his works, there are very interesting moments and quite a lot, especially where there are genuine memories. not their interpretation ...
                  I would not have trusted Svanidze with a broom, for me he’s a bastard of pure water, only when it appears on the screen I want to turn it into a wet place ...
                  And his whole team is still those characters, one to one - the finished TV ..., nowhere to put a seal ...
                2. Dust
                  Dust 10 June 2012 12: 38
                  +3
                  Still, he is an interpreter of events, and by virtue of this, his works must be treated with caution! There are many interesting facts, a normal person will not argue with this, but there is no reason to believe in everything written ...
                  Svanidze, if it were my will, I would be rubbed to the dust, a uniform bastard, and the team hanging around with him on screens would fit him - TV ... on TV ...
              2. late
                late 9 June 2012 22: 38
                +2
                No, he is a serious person and what he did to preserve the real history of the war is a very big contribution for the descendants of the peoples of the entire former USSR.
                1. Colonel
                  Colonel 10 June 2012 13: 38
                  +1
                  Dust, I formed my opinion about Drabkin on a series of books "I fought on ..." Even if the memories are selected, in some way, tendeceous, they still give a completely reliable picture of one or another fragment of the war (my personal opinion, although I do not read only Drabkin). I have not seen anything like it in recent history, maybe I was looking badly, or maybe there was nothing to look for. I am glad that our points of view on S ... dze and others like him coincide.
  4. borisst64
    borisst64 9 June 2012 09: 39
    +12
    Previously, every film, even a fiction, even a documentary, had its author, but now there is no one to send!
    1. Stas57
      Stas57 9 June 2012 13: 12
      +2
      "Great War"
  5. kpox
    kpox 9 June 2012 09: 41
    +16
    I didn’t read the whole article, but 3 paragraphs were enough.
    All this de-Stalinization, instilling a sense of guilt and humiliation of the "Russian spirit" - this has always been the case, throughout the entire history of Russia. It's just that at the current level of speed and accessibility of information exchange, every dropout can start a blozhik and "copy-paste" the "works" of some "IstoreGa" there, and spice it up with his own bile.
    BUT!!! Over the course of a thousand-year-old history, the people of Russia / Russia have gained immunity, and he, albeit sometimes with a delay, always works.
    Good luck to all, comrades (I do not attach communist coloring to this appeal, but it refers to people who are close in spirit and goals).
    1. petrakov vowa
      petrakov vowa 9 June 2012 13: 16
      +6
      We got it, but the younger generation, alas, is not there!
  6. Net
    Net 9 June 2012 09: 48
    +20
    If you already look about the history of the formation of domestic aviation, the best, in my opinion, is a cycle of 18 documentaries by the Wings of Russia studio, they also released the documentary series Armor of Russia about the development of armored vehicles.
    1. ImpKonstantin
      ImpKonstantin 9 June 2012 11: 53
      +2
      Judging by the opening screen of "Red Stars", this is an American documentary, localized by "Star". The truth is not clear why, but it is quite possible due to the lack of material to fill the airtime.
      But once again you can watch and listen to how the achievements of our country are played out in the West.
      By the way, I want to say that not every American documentary film is similar in style to this. Example, a film about Russia during the Great Patriotic War (I don’t remember the exact name, but there is a whole cycle of these films)
      1. PSih2097
        PSih2097 9 June 2012 14: 16
        +5
        By the way, I want to say that not every American documentary film is similar in style to this. Example, a film about Russia during the Great Patriotic War (I don’t remember the exact name, but there is a whole cycle of these films)

        Unknown War (Great Patriotic War) / The Unknown War [Documentary, 20 episodes]

        YOM: 1979
        Country: USSR
        Genre: Documentary Epic
        Duration: 1-20 of 20 ~ 50 minutes Director: Roman Carmen
        Narrated by: Vasily Lanovoi
        Host: Bert Lancaster
        Description: Based on materials collected during the Great Patriotic War, Roman Carmen, together with the Americans, created the film “Unknown War”, which became a real revelation for the Western audience, who knew almost nothing about the feat of the Soviet warrior and our people, who became the main creator of the victory over Nazi fascism . For his work, Roman Carmen was awarded: in 1942, 1947, 1952, the Stalin, 1960 Lenin and in 1975 the State Prize. He was awarded five orders and many medals. Everything that the lens of his movie camera saw was not history then, as it has become today. It was modernity, telling about which, it was not always easy to place accents, not to sin against the truth.
        From the first days of the Great Patriotic Carmen at the front. He led the front-line film groups of the Central Documentary Film Studio. The soldiers went into battle with machine guns in their hands, and the cameramen came with a movie camera, as Carmen himself later admitted.
        The Great Patriotic War was created in collaboration with American filmmakers - dozens of people of various professions - based on the unforgettable annals of the war. But this work also - and above all - the latest creative work of Roman Carmen.
        http://rutracker.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2884589
        1. Tatanka Yotanka
          Tatanka Yotanka 9 June 2012 16: 58
          +5
          looked in childhood, what he was shown to the Soviet Union says a lot
    2. Pilot200809
      Pilot200809 9 June 2012 21: 30
      +1
      Well, also "The Secret of Forgotten Victories"
  7. Farvil
    Farvil 9 June 2012 09: 53
    +23
    When we understand that Europe is neither tsarist nor any kind of Russia, it needs resources, and preferably without Russians.
    1. kotdavin4i
      kotdavin4i 9 June 2012 10: 56
      +9
      Rather, not even Europe but America - with its global claim to gigemony.
      1. ytqnhfk
        ytqnhfk 9 June 2012 12: 05
        +4
        Yes, for a long time our neighbors have become crowded with us with a sword to visit us!
      2. lewerlin53rus
        lewerlin53rus 11 June 2012 09: 06
        0
        Right! Europeans almost all at one time received a tub of cold water on their hot heads (Swedes, French, Germans, Poles, etc.) But the British and Americans have not yet flown in from us, so they don’t have such a reflex from attacking Russia, which has been vaccinated by the Europeans. Although it has been dulled recently due to all the same Yankees. But nothing, we have enough cold water for everyone.
    2. baron.nn
      baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 35
      +1
      Gold words! It's like an axiom that requires no proof!
  8. Roman Dmitriev
    Roman Dmitriev 9 June 2012 10: 06
    +13
    This is not a matter of politics, but of propaganda. They are trying to make us a dull, brutal cattle under the rule of a handful of sadists. I do not condone Stalin and his team, but with him the country rose from ruins in a matter of years. Now look at modern Russia. For 20 years, everything has been ruined, and they are in no hurry to restore. And by the year 14, they also want to seize the remnants of state assets.
    1. kotdavin4i
      kotdavin4i 9 June 2012 10: 59
      +1
      I agree with you Roman. Stalin did a great deal for the USSR — by what methods is this another question. if today's democrats were restoring the country, they would have damned everything!
      1. sleepy
        sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 21
        +6
        De-Stalinization, First Attempt.
        1. sleepy
          sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 25
          +7
          De-Stalinization The second attempt?
    2. baron.nn
      baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 34
      0
      This is our way ... First, to the ground to destroy, and then we will start building ...
  9. Rodver
    Rodver 9 June 2012 11: 13
    +8
    In this world, everything is interconnected: politics, industrialization, and collectivization. It is only necessary that each person has his own, meeting the interests of the country and people, and civil, and human position. Then the grains will be separated from the chaff.
    1. baron.nn
      baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 33
      +4
      It is difficult to do this, when a stream of lies and dirt pours from all sides ... In the family, the child can be instilled with the right things, but once outside the family circle, how can a person who is not stronger psychologically survive?
  10. AlexxxNik
    AlexxxNik 9 June 2012 11: 18
    +10
    the desire of a humiliated Europe after the Second World War to attribute to the USSR all its tribal deformities is understandable: then we destroyed all historical monuments to them, then we raped them all, then we wanted to attack them first, and now we, okazza, wanted to bomb them in the Stone Age . But another thing is not clear, is this the trend for our seemingly official journalists now? or does market conditions require pouring dirt on the heroic deeds of their ancestors? On the other hand, I know by myself that when you grab grains of truth after a lot of lies, you become a deeply convinced Russophile, so the effect of their hysteria is often directly opposite
    1. baron.nn
      baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 30
      0
      Who pays for the banquet, that girl and dances ...
    2. valokordin
      valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 06
      0
      that’s right, our Posner, Pushkova, Novikov, etc. probably have lived in the West since childhood, studied in their schools and universities, that is yes.
  11. sleepy
    sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 23
    +10
    Can we repeat this?

    We need not de-Stalinization, but a new one industrialization.
    1. sleepy
      sleepy 9 June 2012 11: 26
      +14
      Can we do it?
  12. darkman70
    darkman70 9 June 2012 11: 31
    +12
    Why am I writing all this? It's pretty simple. We, Russians, are trying to make us believe by any means that the country has no right to think about the technological future and scientific and engineering breakthroughs, until it feeds and closes its people. This is the point of view of obvious degenerates and speculators who are incapable of elementary understanding the paths of human development.

    This point of view, why be silent there, is widely supported by the Russian government. One has only to look at the latest achievements in the reforms of Russian education. In Russia, people are brought up who will not only not think about technological breakthroughs, but will not be able to do this if they wish. Take a look at what items will now be mandatory in growing. schools. There is no geometry, physics or chemistry. They don’t need creators, they need consumers and service personnel, or, more simply, illiterate, who don’t know their history, don’t have their own heroes, sure that a Russian person can not create anything a priori. Anti-Russian and anti-Soviet propaganda in Russia is already going wild.
    All this is very sad.
    I hope no one thinks this is an accidental mistake ... unreasonable ministers or officials, and not a deliberate policy of the authorities?
    By the way, you can still look at the composition of the shareholders of the largest Russian companies ... There are very few Russians there, and those are mostly state-owned. structure. And recently, the government announced plans to privatize Rosneft, Sberbank, and other state. monopolies. Who will get all this?
    1. Darn
      Darn 9 June 2012 12: 17
      0
      I agree with you. But in our school. A cool teacher from the top lowered the plan for projects for students on free topics, I graduated from grade 2. I blabbed on my own head that I had grown a salad according to the hydroponic method. Now I’m thinking about how to describe this to my son over the summer it was interesting.
    2. Middle-brother
      Middle-brother 9 June 2012 12: 24
      +6
      I subscribe to your opinion, but about Rosneft, Sberbank, etc. - this is too much. What are these state. monopoly? These are commercial organizations, where co-owners and shareholders are top officials of the state and their relatives and friends. Also, Gazprom and Bank Rossiya write down here.
      1. darkman70
        darkman70 9 June 2012 13: 38
        +1
        The state owns 75% of shares in Rosneft, and 60% in Sberbank. Of course, in the leading posts there are people of their own, but with the change of power they may lose their bread places. Therefore, they will make it so that, if there were a change in power, their people would still remain there. For them, of course, it is better that the government itself does not change, but why the hell is not joking. It is better to hedge and privatize in the right direction.
        By the way, if my memory serves me, then Russian Technologies is also on the list for privatization.
    3. baron.nn
      baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 28
      +3
      There is nothing to be surprised at! How Yeltsin in the 90s began to ruin the country. so Putin. as his successor and follower of his course continues to ruin! I do not want to believe it, but Russian reality convinces of this!
      1. sleepy
        sleepy 9 June 2012 17: 00
        +5
        In the First Rome the authorities took care of bread and circuses for the people.
        In Russia, a little different.
        "Recently, a package of 50% minus one share of the United Grain Company (UGC) was sold to the Summa group of Ziyavudin Magomedov, who will become a co-owner of the state grain company UGC. The valuation of UGC will be ready in two months, it will be done by the American auditing company Deloitte & Touche Tohmatsu." , said Mr. Levin.
        UZK is a state agent for conducting commodity and purchasing interventions in the grain market, is responsible for the preservation of grain from the intervention fund.
        http://www.lenagro.org/federalnye/1860-ziyavudin-magomedov-stanet-sovladelczem-z
        ernovoj-goskompanii-ozk.html

        The privatization program provides for the complete sale by the state of OZK by 2017.
        "Analysts of the grain market believe that the state should hurry up with the privatization of the state agent, which is in charge of one of the largest transshipment points of the Novorossiysk port."
        Read more: http://www.kommersant.ru/doc/1939878
        No one writes about bread prices, although it is possible that grain exports will increase to the detriment of the domestic consumer.
    4. valokordin
      valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 08
      0
      to whom, to the most intelligent and courageous, chosen people
  13. vadimN
    vadimN 9 June 2012 11: 34
    +11
    By the way, colleagues, what do you think about the creation of "Public Television" on the basis of the "Zvezda" TV channel? In my opinion, this is an attempt to cover up perhaps the only TV channel that somehow supports and conducts patriotic education. In its place, we can soon get a channel "in demand by society", that is - around the clock "Dom-2" and other obnoxious marasmus ...
    1. darkman70
      darkman70 9 June 2012 12: 06
      +4
      vadimN
      It all depends on who gets into this very public council. In Russia, people who are not noticed in great love for the Russian people, such as Venediktov or Svanidze, usually "for some reason" end up in various public councils and chambers. I think it will be the same here.
      Public television has long existed in the West. This is the well-known BBC channel. After the war, public television appeared in Germany, moreover, the Anglo-American occupation administration insisted on this, while the banning of private channels in Germany. This ban has been partially lifted recently. Apparently the Anglo-Saxons were sure of the "correct" presentation of information on these channels. And the BBC itself has never been seen in any kind of opposition. So, "Public Television" is another profanation for the people, like the same elections in "democratic countries"
      But House -2 is unlikely to be there. On the total. There are few entertaining channels. At least in the west.
      I think he grew up. the authorities need such a channel more than Zvezda. Why do they need patriotic programs? Suddenly the Russian people will wake up from sleep. And this is dangerous ... for them.
      1. vadimN
        vadimN 9 June 2012 13: 37
        +3
        This is what worries us that under the brand name "public" antisocial scum are trying to speak for us. I share your fear that Public Television will have "the right guys" too :(
    2. Darn
      Darn 9 June 2012 12: 21
      +7
      In my opinion, entrusting the child's TV set with a TV set is a very bad idea. I knocked him out. There, and in the afternoon crap is coming.
      1. vadimN
        vadimN 9 June 2012 13: 32
        +3
        It is so ... However, whether we like it or not, our children still receive information not only from their parents, but also from the same television, the Internet, etc. ... And the mass media’s propaganda and educational role must not be underestimated! So far, unfortunately, this is well understood by our opponents ... and used.
        1. Darn
          Darn 9 June 2012 13: 51
          +2
          Hello Vadim.
          I completely agree with you, moreover, if for example there are some children in the class who watch TV, then the result in the class begins. Discussions of what they watched, and if your child did not watch some kind of cartoon, then of course they will not be able to accept it, more maybe they’ll look at him, it’s not good. In general, he kind of drops out of communication with peers. While the Internet is saving his city network more precisely, he wanted to watch a movie, or you’re looking for a movie, you enjoy it. Enjoy watching and without advertising. Son of the TV show Galile looks.
        2. Roman Dmitriev
          Roman Dmitriev 9 June 2012 14: 09
          +4
          Well, one such television already exists (ORT - Russian public television). And what do they show there? Let me speak and let's get married. A ditched Channel 5 (St. Petersburg). By the way, REN was upset. We must think of Rezun to show in military secrecy.
          1. vadimN
            vadimN 9 June 2012 14: 33
            +2
            That's it! If there is already (at least formally) public television, then why bring up this topic again? Make ORT what it should be - public television! And here we see an attempt to ditch the last ideological stronghold of patriotism - the Zvezda channel, under the trademark of transforming it into another public TV ... Why? Who needs?
          2. valokordin
            valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 12
            0
            Roman, why are you offended by REW, Suvorov is still a "military secret"
  14. Muxalet
    Muxalet 9 June 2012 12: 05
    +4
    And what do you think, what kind of film in content should it be, if it was shot (mounted) with other people's money and for a Western audience
    Russia, after all, also releases its documentaries with ideological overtones ... Just watch, admire and filter the offscreen "bazaar"

    For the sake of justice, it is worth noting that the Star channel does not often show such films.
    At the heart of all the same, there are much more patriotic documentary and feature films, the history of domestic victories, the history of armaments, etc. The channel is probably the only one on Russian air that does not abandon its history and does not spit in our past.
    1. Muxalet
      Muxalet 9 June 2012 12: 45
      +2
      The film was shot in Ukraine. Kharkivites and its premiere was on 1 Ukrainian television UT-1998. How he became Russian is a mystery
      The series tells not only about the bad, there is a lot of positive.
      Of course, it is much more pleasant to watch "Impact Force", where everything is just fine. So, "put on" rose-colored glasses and rejoice.
      1. Colonel
        Colonel 9 June 2012 21: 40
        0
        Not removed, but mounted and voiced. Along with an entertaining chronicle and really interesting facts, petty comments. For example, how Hitler was two days ahead of Stalin or how PE-2 fell into kindergarten, etc. Summary: the remnants of conscience did not allow the authors to simply mix the whole history of Soviet aviation with shit, but they poured enough dirt.
  15. htpm100
    htpm100 9 June 2012 12: 07
    +1
    Well, on the discovery and worse programs are.
  16. 8 company
    8 company 9 June 2012 12: 14
    -10
    The author is well done that he remembered the designer Kalinin, who created passenger planes in the USSR. Just now, the author, didn’t you write that Kalinin was shot in 1938? Forgot something, huh? And he didn’t mention about Tupolev that, according to the NKVD, he was a member of the Russian fascist party, a pest, a spy of several intelligence services, and he shared his conscientious military secrets personally with the French Aviation Minister, while in Paris, and for all these atrocities for some years repulsed in prison KB. Zack the wrecker created combat aircraft, in what! And what about you, the author, so struck by the mention of hunger? Or is it not your people who were starving? Then it is clear. Just think, several million peasants died of starvation, but they bought machines for their bread! This is Stalin-style, Roslyakovsky-style !!! And in the final, I did not forget to compare gluing the crimes of German fascists to all of Europe. In short, a complete set of an orthodox fan of Dzhugashvili and Beria, a lie interspersed with dirt against his own homeland and his people.
    1. Generalissimus
      Generalissimus 9 June 2012 18: 36
      +3
      “Why were Tupolev, Stechkin, Korolev sitting?” F. Chuev once asked Molotov.

      “They all sat,” answered Vyacheslav Mikhailovich. - They talked a lot too much. And the circle of their acquaintances, as one would expect ... They did not support us ...

      Tupolevs - they were at one time a very serious issue for us. For some time they were opponents, and still needed time to bring them closer to Soviet power ... And one can’t ignore the fact that at a difficult moment they can become especially dangerous. You can’t do without politics in this. With their own hands, they can’t build communism ...

      Ivan Petrovich Pavlov told the students: “This is why we live badly!” - and pointed to the portraits of Lenin and Stalin. This open enemy is easy to understand. With people like Tupolev, it was more difficult. Tupolev is from the category of intelligentsia that is very much needed The Soviet state, but in their hearts they are against it, and along the line of personal connections they carried out dangerous and destructive work, and even if they did not, they breathed it. And they could not otherwise! " (Chuev F. Soldiers of the Empire. M., 1998. S. 141)

      You know, the end result is important.
      1. 8 company
        8 company 9 June 2012 18: 44
        -6
        Quote: Generalissimus
        “They all sat,” answered Vyacheslav Mikhailovich. - They talked a lot too much.


        Something you chat a lot, Generalissimus ... It's time for you to go to the wall, wife to the camp, children in the orphanage. Everything, as the great Stalin taught.
        1. Generalissimus
          Generalissimus 9 June 2012 18: 56
          +3
          Well, what did you prove with this technique? adherence to "universal values"? It doesn't bother me. For stupidity, at least. Lerin's lectures ...

          Here in England in 1939-1945 His Majesty's subjects received 10 years for just the phrase: "Hitler can win."
          You turn your energy there, teach them "universal human values". If the results are good, come back. I'll write you more assignments.


          Each time had its own specifics. And no England, America and France, not to mention the rest of "civilized" Europe, did not differ in any way from what was in the USSR of those years in this region, which was rather slippery for your idols.
          1. 8 company
            8 company 9 June 2012 19: 18
            -6
            [quote = Generalissimus] Each time had its own specifics [/ quote]

            This is clear. If it is necessary to starve several million peasants to buy machines for the saved grain, then there is no problem. It’s necessary - it’s necessary. Our peasants are vast human resources, almost inexhaustible, it’s a sin not to use it. And the designers in sharashka worked pretty well. In any case, no one heard complaints.

            [/ quote] And no England, America and France, not to mention the rest of the "civilized" Europe, did not differ in any way from what was in the USSR of those years [/ quote]

            Well, remind everyone how many people were killed in these countries in the 20th century on political issues. Like, poper against the queen. I want to be horrified.
            1. Generalissimus
              Generalissimus 9 June 2012 19: 21
              +3
              the starving man? clear.
              1. 8 company
                8 company 9 June 2012 20: 01
                -7
                Quote: Generalissimus
                the starving man? clear.


                What, dear, merged? So fast?! belay I thought, round 3-4 at least master ... winked
                1. Generalissimus
                  Generalissimus 9 June 2012 21: 26
                  +3
                  Merged? You have too high an opinion of yourself.
                  Famineers are just a special category. It starts with carrots (traffic rules, Halley's comet ...) and ends with millions of starvation victims in the USSR.
                  You know what's funny? Holodomor theorists, who flourished under Yushchenko, are outcasts in the scientific community, even the United States. For such a blatantly fabricated and falsified data, a decent historian cannot operate, even for the sake of political demands.

                  On account of the repression of His Majesty's (and not Her), read, at least, Dayton L. - "World War II: mistakes, blunders, losses." Smith's act will not hurt you, including. Well, in general, study history, not the tales of Baba Lera and the Memorial's manuals.
                  Sorry, I am not discussing with the Holodomor - the passed stage on specialized resources. I'm not going to be engaged in educational program with you.
                  1. 8 company
                    8 company 9 June 2012 21: 43
                    -5
                    Quote: Generalissimus
                    Holodomor theorists, who flourished under Yushchenko, are outcasts in the scientific community, even the United States. For so arrogantly fabricated and falsified data a decent historian cannot operate


                    This is for you information. You won’t read anyway, you can only do the odes to Stalin:
                    Doctor of Historical Sciences Ivnitsky N.A. 'The famine of 1932-1933 in the USSR';
                    Doctor of Historical Sciences Aralovets N.A. 'Famine 1932-1933. in the USSR and its demographic consequences';
                    Doctor of Historical Sciences V.P. Danilov, I.E. Zelenin 'Organized hunger. On the 70th anniversary of the common peasant tragedy ';
                    Doctor of Historical Sciences V.V. Kondrashin 'The Tragedy of the Russian Village'.
                    In particular, according to Ivnitsky:
                    '... In Ukraine, at least 4 million people died of hunger; in Kazakhstan - from 1 to 2 million; in the North Caucasus, the Volga region, the Central Black Earth region, Western Siberia and the Urals - 2-3 million ... Hunger claimed 7-8 million human lives. ' From the archived help:
                    in the Chernukhinsky district of Ukraine from January 1932 to January 1934 out of a population of 53672 people. 11680 died (about one in five), of which half were children. During this same time, only 20 children were born.

                    This is not the story of Baba Lera.
                    1. Generalissimus
                      Generalissimus 9 June 2012 22: 03
                      +2
                      Oh Lord ... I read. Ivnitsky is a desperate famine starter!
                      His work was butchered.

                      The famine was. There was no famine. Do you feel the difference?
                      But in this very difference all the salt. I repeat once again - I am not discussing with the famines. I know all your arguments in advance.
                      They have all been examined a hundred times by researchers and disproved.
                      The famines and Polish followers of Matserevich’s theories about the terrorist attack aboard the Tu-154 - one way of thinking. The discussion is pointless.
                      Excuse me. I will not react anymore.
                      1. 8 company
                        8 company 9 June 2012 22: 06
                        -5
                        Quote: Generalissimus
                        The famine was. There was no famine. Do you feel the difference?


                        Ask the peasants who have lost their loved ones in hunger about this difference.
                      2. Kars
                        Kars 9 June 2012 22: 13
                        +5
                        Quote: Company 8
                        Ask the peasants who have lost their loved ones in hunger,

                        my family is like that. Grandma relayed her mother's words about the famine 33-34
                        --- Boo hunger, almost like in 1908,
                        her two younger sisters died.
                      3. Generalissimus
                        Generalissimus 9 June 2012 22: 25
                        +4
                        The difference between hunger and famine is as follows: famine is a term that supposedly describes conscious killing people by starvation by the government of the USSR.
                        Starvation in the USSR really suffered, millions of people died.
                        But the scoundrels invented the Holodomor.
                        That is the whole difference.
                        The theory of the Holodomor has been thoroughly and for a long time studied and refuted not only by Russian historians (and Ukrainian, if it is not Bandera), but also by the historical scientific community of the United States and Europe. Only individual researchers hold on to it, while, in the vast majority, they are lured and treated kindly by Yushchenko. In the historical scientific community of the USA, for example, they do not give a hand.
                      4. 8 company
                        8 company 9 June 2012 22: 32
                        -2
                        Quote: Generalissimus
                        But the scoundrels invented the Holodomor.


                        I agree, the creatures are finished. After all, there was no conscious killing, there was an ordinary conscious failure to take measures, and this is a completely different article.
                      5. valokordin
                        valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 28
                        +1
                        And what are they alive ?. I generally talked with them, but no one spoke about the famine, and they experienced hunger, many starved, including Soviet and party workers, who did not starve, these are especially valuable representatives of the intelligentsia, the military, the NKVD and sometimes not always, speculators, traders and that’s not all. And you read the works of Velikoukrainets-doctor Grushevsky
            2. Curculum
              Curculum 9 June 2012 21: 40
              +3
              Quote: Company 8
              If it is necessary to starve several million peasants to buy machines for the saved grain, then there is no problem. It’s necessary - it’s necessary. Our peasants are vast human resources, almost inexhaustible, it’s a sin not to use it.

              “Trying to get acquainted with the official US demographic statistics is staggering from the very beginning: the statistics for 1932 were destroyed - or very well hidden. They simply do not exist. Without explanation. Yes, they appear later, in later statistics, in the form of retrospective tables. these tables also leaves the attentive researcher somewhat amazed.
              According to American statistics, over the decade from 1931 to 1940, according to the dynamics of population growth, the United States lost no less than 8 million 553 thousand people, and the indicators of population growth change immediately, simultaneously, two (!) Times exactly at the turn of 1930/31 years, fall and freeze at this level for exactly ten years. And just as unexpectedly, after a decade, they return to their previous values. There is no explanation for this in the vast, hundreds of pages, text of the US Department of commerce report "Statistical Abstract of the United States", although it is filled with explanations on other issues that are not even worth mentioning in comparison with the above. "
              "Thus, we can confidently speak of approximately five million direct victims of the 1932/33 Holodomor in the United States of America."
              Source: http://www.novchronic.ru/1322.htm

              “In his material, the researcher touched upon a really“ hot ”topic - the estimate of the number of victims of the American Great Depression, which, apparently, caused such a sharp reaction from the moderators of Wikipedia and the activity of Russian-speaking bloggers. Based on the analysis of statistical data, Boris Borisov in American "estimated the number of victims of the financial crisis in the United States at more than 7 million people - and for the first time directly compared what happened in the United States in 1932-33 with the Holodomor in the USSR in 1932-33."
              Источник: http://www.pravda.ru/science/16-05-2008/268049-0/

              And the anti-colonial struggle that unfolded in the twentieth century, in my opinion, directly falls under your expression "flogged against the queen":
              "The data on deaths from hunger were attributed to the epidemics of cholera and plague that broke out in the starving regions. In 1896-1908, according to the British colonial administration, 6 million people died from the plague in the affected regions.
              In 1933, the Director of the Medical Services of India, Major General J. Migou, reported, "At least 80 million people in India are constantly starving."
              In 1942-1943 the territory of Bengal, the north and east of India was gripped by famine, which killed more than 5 million people. According to some researchers, the famine was the result of a deliberate devastation of the local population by the British and a deliberate blow by Great Britain on the Indian population, which supported the "August Revolution" of 1942 and the anti-British movement led by Subhas Bose. "
              Source: "World History. The Period of the English Conquest." M., 2007

              Also, in Algeria after 1954, about one and a half million Algerians died in the struggle against the French army, the population of hundreds of villages was deported, about 2 million people. sent to concentration camps.

              About the crimes of Nazism-I hope you find it yourself.

              Etc. etc.
              1. 8 company
                8 company 9 June 2012 21: 50
                -7
                Quote: Kurkul
                About the crimes of Nazism - I hope you find it yourself. Etc. etc.


                Equate the crimes of Stalin with the crimes of the Nazis? Well, you are just some kind of liberal!
                1. Curculum
                  Curculum 9 June 2012 22: 16
                  +4
                  Quote: Company 8
                  Equate the crimes of Stalin with the crimes of the Nazis? Well, you are just some kind of liberal!

                  If you are attentive, then you should have noticed what your phrase I answered. Therefore, your "equate" and the rest is completely inappropriate.
                  1. 8 company
                    8 company 9 June 2012 22: 25
                    -6
                    Quote: Kurkul
                    If you are attentive, then you should have noticed what your phrase I answered. Therefore, your "equate" and the rest is completely inappropriate.


                    So do you approve of Comrade Stalin's policy regarding the peasantry or not? Decide, otherwise your color is constantly changing, like a chameleon. Now you feel sorry for the American peasants, then Bengal, then Algerian ...
                    1. Curculum
                      Curculum 9 June 2012 22: 38
                      +3
                      Quote: Company 8
                      So do you approve of Comrade Stalin's policy regarding the peasantry or not? Decide, otherwise your color is constantly changing, like a chameleon. Now you feel sorry for the American peasants, then Bengal, then Algerian ...

                      Determine the colors and direction of pity - is there more than enough? Or insolence is your credo? In this case - success!
                      1. 8 company
                        8 company 9 June 2012 23: 37
                        -3
                        Quote: Kurkul
                        In this case - success!


                        Have a nice one you too. To watch the pathetic attempts of the Stalinists to justify the crimes of their idol is not a big pleasure, so I went to watch football.
                      2. Good tourist
                        Good tourist 10 June 2012 04: 12
                        -1
                        Throw the bad, countryman. Stalinism of the brain is incurable, you should not spend your health and strength on futile healing. Let them frolic on this site-reserve, where they write various articles for themselves and puff menacingly in the comments. Because if such an audience offended by the whole world sticks out somewhere, sheer disgrace turns out: http://euro2012.lenta.ru/news/2012/06/09/_mixfight/ (this, by the way, is about football)
                      3. 8 company
                        8 company 10 June 2012 09: 27
                        -1
                        Quote: Good Tourist
                        Throw the bad, countryman. Stalinism of the brain is incurable


                        Yes I know. One has only to look at the passion with which these would-be patriots regularly talk about the hungry sufferings of the peoples of other countries in order to prove that in our country under Stalin everything was "like everyone else," otherwise it could not have been. And they lie on this topic so selflessly that Goebbels embarrassedly smokes on the sidelines. And it's especially funny to watch them puff nervously when I put up a list of the designers of military equipment who were shot under Stalin.

                        And football is good! good
                      4. valokordin
                        valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 32
                        0
                        It should be noted that anti-Stalinism in Little Russia is much higher than in Russia, Georgia, and Uzbekistan with Moldova, but so that the brothers have in Belarus?
                      5. Kostya pedestrian
                        Kostya pedestrian 10 June 2012 05: 24
                        +4
                        Respectfully your comments; and no matter what - the suffering of people from hunger and cold is not a topic for agitation for and against leaders and powerful people.
                        This is the crown for those who think how to react to this or how to prevent it in the future.

                        But I am surprised at your hatred of the Stalin period of our history, especially those published under the Belarusian flag - which is directly related to this era.
                      6. Good tourist
                        Good tourist 10 June 2012 15: 45
                        -4
                        This is not hatred, but merely a statement. In its assessment, adequate to the essence of that period.

                        As for the current Belarusian flag, you correctly noted that it is disgusted by its attitude towards the Stalin era, unlike the truly historical symbols of Belarus: http://img.tyt.by/n/politika/03/e/scyag_gerb_rb.jpg

                        Well, what can you do: since the neostalinist in power, neostalinism in honor ...
                      7. 12Ural12
                        12Ural12 10 June 2012 21: 49
                        +3
                        Belarusians are proud of their president and their red banner.
                        And keep the Polish-Lithuanian symbols for yourself. We are Belarusians, not Poles or Lithuanians.
                      8. 8 company
                        8 company 10 June 2012 22: 44
                        -2
                        Quote: 12Ural12
                        Belarusians are proud of their president and their red banner.


                        Well, about 20 percent of the stables who, along with Lukashenko, are proud of high inflation, regular devaluations, the lowest average salary in Europe and pensions of $ 100, are in our country.
                      9. Kostya pedestrian
                        Kostya pedestrian 11 June 2012 09: 31
                        +1
                        I find your “crunch-shchevshchina” (- Crimea - Cuba-swamp - private economy + corn) unconvincing and extremely strange - to insult the Leader 1/6 of the land in which the USSR not only increased and created a huge industrial and profitable base, but increased its territory and preserved many peoples and their culture.

                        Under whose leadership the rudiments of MAZ BelAZ and MTZ appeared - modern Belarus is rightly proud and has solid financial assets.

                        I am not a Stalinist, therefore I did not study the works as I.V. Stalin and his opponents, but I know that under I.V. Stalin was not only imprisoned, but also awarded. In addition, many of the repressed returned to their normal activities. But how many scientists, and just talented people, the same athletes were either forced to leave the country, or created such conditions that people either got drunk or ended up in the same prison, only with a warped fate. Not to mention ethnic conflicts, and the associated hunger, cold, nervous exhaustion.
                      10. Kostya pedestrian
                        Kostya pedestrian 11 June 2012 09: 23
                        +2
                        Your statement that you do not need “Polish-Lithuanian” symbols - reflects the essence of, if not nationalism, then simply negligent squandering of both your own and that of others. These symbols are present in both Novgorod and Moscow.
                        In addition, I would like to ask, how about the “Russianness” in this “Polish-Lithuanian” symbol, which was present on the banners of both the Lithuanians and the Russian knights during the defeat of the crusaders and the victory on the Kulikovo field and other victorious wars?

                        They say that Belarus was both under Poland and Lituva, which means that our brothers Belarusians live there too. So for all of us, the story is common. And as a rule, we lived well then when we were friendly!
                      11. valokordin
                        valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 39
                        +1
                        The flag is like a flag, but say thanks to your Old Man that there is no dirt on the streets of the cities and villages of Belarus, the roads are good, citizens have jobs, officials do not take bribes, they do not shoot at each other. Industry and agriculture work, the poor are not collecting food in the trash. Look Do you want democracy in the Russian Federation?
                      12. 8 company
                        8 company 11 June 2012 11: 35
                        +1
                        Quote: valokordin
                        say thanks to your Old Man,


                        Thanks for the advice, but I have a father and I don’t need any additional fathers. Who needs it is his problems, let him turn to a psychologist. And you in Russia, except for garbage cans, see nothing? You have very good economic indicators, especially compared to Belarus, which has already exceeded 60% of its total public debt.
                      13. Morani
                        Morani 11 June 2012 21: 31
                        -1
                        1. Our flag is different;
                        2. he is not an old man to us;
                        3. Hitler with the roads was even better;
                        4. You won’t find normal work without blat;
                        5. It is ridiculous to read that officials do not take;
                        6. each other ... we are led to this by those who have priests attached to the throne;
                        7. industry and agriculture ... learn the nuances of how they work;
                        8. beggars in garbage can collect;
                        9. we do not want such democracy as in the Russian Federation, it is not there.
                      14. Curculum
                        Curculum 10 June 2012 09: 10
                        +2
                        Quote: Company 8
                        Have a nice one you too. To watch the pathetic attempts of the Stalinists to justify the crimes of their idol is not a big pleasure, so I went to watch football.

                        Based on your "inference" and "definition", it becomes obvious: not all patients were killed by the war and starved to death.
                  2. Generalissimus
                    Generalissimus 9 June 2012 22: 34
                    +2
                    do not suffer Curculum. Responding, even in great detail and using sources, you will be forced to go into more and more numerous aspects. Moreover, the opponent himself does not bother himself with thought. In fact, once an hour he will throw you another question, and you will shovel sources and lose time. This is not serious. There is a good definition - trolling.
                    Such discussions make sense only in the form of detailed work, or at one table. Otherwise, you will simply be forced to dump a bunch of information on single-line questions for several days. Ultimately you will be sent nafig. =)) Trolling in its purest form.
                    1. Curculum
                      Curculum 9 June 2012 22: 47
                      +1
                      GeneralissimusThank you, I have the same opinion. drinks
              2. Sehiru san
                Sehiru san 10 June 2012 17: 21
                +2
                Thank you for the information and for the links.
            3. valokordin
              valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 21
              +1
              Brain washed
        2. valokordin
          valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 20
          +1
          this is democratically, if not company
    2. valokordin
      valokordin 11 June 2012 09: 17
      0
      In the company, and who is not repressed now, without means of livelihood, 15 million disappeared without war, killed in gunfights for property, not giving birth to women, judge by the results. read Adam Smith if Carlos Marcosian is not good for you. All that you write to you will be counted.
  17. baron.nn
    baron.nn 9 June 2012 13: 20
    +5
    Something zealously of late has been trying to rewrite the glorious history of our country ... Freedom of speech ... however!
    1. sergey261180
      sergey261180 10 June 2012 19: 12
      +1
      The winners write the story. Who writes now and won it turns out.
  18. wei
    wei 9 June 2012 13: 54
    +3
    when there was a little I watched a comedy about Ivan Rybkin
    he famously thrashed the German invaders, foolish layoffs who do not know how to fight
    positive not experienced not war but laughter
    BUT IT IS NOT SO
    and if the author means the separation of "flies from cutlets" then the film should look like
    as a summary table of comparative characteristics (sorry but what difference does it make who built the plane and how hard) the main thing is that it flies higher and faster
    no need to try and sit down and eat
    I’m not one of those who sprinkles ashes on my head but I don’t even throw hats
    1. Brother Sarych
      Brother Sarych 9 June 2012 20: 18
      +1
      Actually, the films were about Antosha Rybkin - Boris Chirkov played it, and the hero himself first appeared in the Front-end movie collection ...
  19. darkman70
    darkman70 9 June 2012 14: 02
    +4
    when there was a little I watched a comedy about Ivan Rybkin
    he famously thrashed the German invaders, foolish layoffs who do not know how to fight
    positive not experienced not war but laughter
    BUT IT IS NOT SO

    You are comparing a documentary and a comedy. Which is not entirely correct.
  20. 77bor1973
    77bor1973 9 June 2012 14: 13
    +4
    Article "+", but this film is already many years old, I last watched it 7 years ago! The filmmakers made a frank order - complete nonsense!
  21. Roman Dmitriev
    Roman Dmitriev 9 June 2012 15: 41
    +5
    Quote: wei
    when there was a little I watched a comedy about Ivan Rybkin
    he famously thrashed the German invaders, foolish layoffs who do not know how to fight
    positive not experienced not war but laughter
    BUT IT IS NOT SO

    Well, such comedies were shot not only in the Union. By the way, even now I prefer to watch old Soviet films about the war. Much of course there is embellished in our direction, there is enough ideology, no special effects. But I want to review them.
  22. chistii20
    chistii20 9 June 2012 17: 04
    +3
    Many thanks. The author has taught a lot. I really learned. But I believed. This bitter but true. It’s a shame for those brainless comrades who write garbage about Russia.
  23. Prophet Alyosha
    Prophet Alyosha 9 June 2012 19: 01
    +2
    And what is there to be surprised !? The current authorities are conducting such a brainwashing of the "electorate" that the Bolsheviks never dreamed of! Lies and deception, the imposition of false images and negative associations, the latest methods of NLP programming, etc. - everything goes into action with one goal - to fool people by slandering the past and distorting the present to drag them into a destructive future !!!
    1. Tatanka Yotanka
      Tatanka Yotanka 9 June 2012 19: 12
      +6
      Trotsky is alive
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOU1m-iArXc&feature=related
      1. Prophet Alyosha
        Prophet Alyosha 9 June 2012 19: 31
        +1
        YES !!!! I don’t know how Trotsky is, but his followers are still in the Kremlin !!!
  24. Yura
    Yura 9 June 2012 19: 55
    +3
    I haven’t seen the film, so I’ll hardly be able to adequately evaluate the article, although the style and content in terms of the attitude to orangeism are fully consistent with my vision of these "adversaries", but I gave the author a plus for the lesson, do not rush with assessments and conclusions, but try to understand whether here are the pitfalls. I don’t want to think that so everyone wants to go around you and suck in your subconscious what you don’t want.
  25. muzhik
    muzhik 9 June 2012 20: 06
    +3
    We have been hammered into our heads for so many years that the Russian bloodthirsty ghouls are invaders ... Maybe we should believe this, and even clean out the whole democratic democracy.
  26. suharev-52
    suharev-52 9 June 2012 20: 17
    +6
    I didn’t watch the film. Therefore, I will not discuss. I would like to speak about Russian television. And you noticed that even the announcers or those invited to the programs are not Russian surnames. Watching the TV box it seems that such a nation as Russians no longer exists. There is such a thing as an impact on the subconscious. So, with the help of TV, they unobtrusively inspire us around the clock, What is impossible to live in Russia. But Russians as a nation no longer exist. And what have you personally done so that this is not so? Sincerely.
  27. Alexey Pototsky
    Alexey Pototsky 9 June 2012 21: 01
    +2
    the film is so-so ... The author of the film clearly works on Western ideology ...
  28. Uhalus
    Uhalus 9 June 2012 22: 44
    +2
    Everything that dear colleagues said, I find it correct. There is a certain pattern: they canceled the old ideology, but did not give a new one. The old one somehow protected the integrity of the country and people. Nature does not tolerate emptiness. A state that does not have its own ideology will have someone else's. And in the end, such a state and its people will be enslaved.
  29. Odesit
    Odesit 10 June 2012 02: 32
    +2
    Here is a new ideology for you.
    Russia, rich, armed to the teeth with modern weapons, RUSSIAN EMPIRE! Which will be feared and respected as frogs by all Anglo-Saxons and Jews.
    The greatest of all EMPIRE.
    We still have the heir to the Imperial throne, the young GRAND PRINCE.
    Anything is possible men, just wish
    Colonel Drozdovsky in 1918 brought a bunch of naked, barefoot, RUSSIAN OFFICERS from Romania - they made up the backbone of the shock regiments of the army of HIS EXCELLENCE GENERAL KORNILOV. LAVRA GEORGIEVICH. (the so-called Drozdovsky regiment)
    We all can, we just need to rally RUSSIAN!
  30. lotus04
    lotus04 10 June 2012 09: 32
    +3
    Yes, the "Zvezda" channel has indeed been surprising not for the better lately! On a white day, beer advertising is spinning and at least that!
    1. sergey261180
      sergey261180 10 June 2012 19: 24
      +2
      Hunger is not an aunt. You cannot put patriotism in your pocket, and you will not spread it on bread. So the channel is engaged in what is usually called prostitution. And the film was shot in the 90s, and even in Ukraine. The spirit of that prostitution time is felt.
  31. UAZ Patriot
    UAZ Patriot 10 June 2012 15: 28
    0
    and FOR ME "ZVEZDA" IS AN EXCELLENT CHANNEL AND WAS AND IS !!!! ROUND DAY TELIK ONLY OILS IT! a ARTICLE PROVOCATION AND MASTURBATION (in view of the author's attempt to self-gratify)
    1. Colonel
      Colonel 10 June 2012 17: 26
      0
      This is a film, as it turned out by Ukrainian experts, about the history of Soviet aviation "Stars on the Wings". Channel "Star" has nothing to do with it.
  32. Rider
    Rider 10 June 2012 15: 44
    0
    Quote from the article:

    “Peace-loving” USA only B-17 “Flying Fortress” (combat load 2742 kg, range 2736 km, maximum speed 481 km / h, practical ceiling 10850 m) since 1935 already configured 12 726 pieces!

    The author, do not distort the numbers. By December 7, 1941 (attack on Pearl Harbor), there were 200 Flying Fortresses in the US Air Force.
    Considering that at this point in the US Army there were 50 tanks, the American military-industrial complex can really be called "peaceful"

    The B-17 was developed in 1935, on March 1, 1937, 13 prototypes of the YB-17 were ready, and the fact that 12000 bombers are indicated in the article is a cumulative release over the years of the war until 1945.
  33. Sehiru san
    Sehiru san 10 June 2012 17: 01
    +1
    1. Tsarist Russia was still building strategic aviation! The discovery is simply world!

    In principle, we can say so. wink Example - "Ilya Muromets" There were a lot of them built. (at that time) It seems like 60 pieces. Nothing of the kind, no one else, was.
    And quote:
    Out of 60 Ilya Muromets bombers, only 1 was shot down by the Germans, while 20 fighters attacked him simultaneously. (from 5 - 6 he easily fought back) Another 3 were hit, but got to their airfields.
  34. Van
    Van 10 June 2012 22: 16
    +1
    Why am I writing all this? It's pretty simple. We, Russians, are trying to make us believe by any means that the country has no right to think about the technological future and scientific and engineering breakthroughs, until it feeds and closes its people. This is the point of view of obvious degenerates and speculators who are incapable of elementary understanding the paths of human development.


    A well-fed person is a lazy person, and need is always an incentive in his development.
    Wars are also an engine of progress (forced at least) bully
  35. warmaster
    warmaster 11 June 2012 02: 15
    0
    A near emotional article - a lot of superfluous is written, albeit correctly.
  36. Viking
    Viking 11 June 2012 02: 44
    +1
    Bullshit and not some kind of movie!
  37. Ivan Tarasov
    Ivan Tarasov 11 June 2012 15: 37
    0
    The main message of the Rezun / Goebbels theory is that "the USSR was planning an attack on Germany."
    This promise is initially incorrect.
    From this and all are not the connections that scatter this theory to the nines.
    Even with this small example, we see that if Stalin planned an attack on Germany, the USSR would automatically join the ranks of aggressors, and subsequently fight with the whole world.
    And without strategic aviation, a total war with the whole world cannot be won.
  38. Leksander
    Leksander 11 June 2012 23: 12
    0
    The essence is invariable: who does not want to feed his army will feed someone else's. everything else is from the evil one. This applies to the film, and more to the article!
  39. Simonov
    Simonov 15 June 2012 13: 28
    0
    Leksander,
    Well, now it is a little different: "He who does not want to feed his scientists will feed someone else's army."
    And about the "second industrialization in 10 years" - I will not go to the camp or to the sharashka!
  40. sleepy
    sleepy 19 June 2012 15: 39
    0
    Quote: Simonov

    "And about the" second industrialization in 10 years "- I will not go to the camp or to the sharashka!"

    Now there are no camps, but there is low-paid work for specialists and high-paid work for managers, bank employees, lawyers ... Now there are no "sharashki", but were design bureaus with unique best practices.
    If you raise the salary of engineers and technologists by two or three times, then there will be more than enough people who want to work there.
    If you increase the salaries of programmers fivefold, you will return to those who left at one time in the USA, India, China ...
  41. Simonov
    Simonov 21 June 2012 11: 53
    0
    You cannot enter the same river twice. About those who "were" - another 3-4 years and you can forget. There is no succession of generations - "schools". Correct work of a programmer is 80% correct task, as an example. And where to spend this money? On tour trips over the hill? There is no infrastructure for a comfortable life, there is no normal education for children, many things are missing. Wherever you go - "increase our salary 5-6 times and everything will be great." Only the dumb don't say that.