Chinese tanker: Only Armata T-99 will be able to compete with Type2A14

The Chinese media publish material that says that China has become one of the world leaders in tank building. It is noted that if a few years ago for the PLA Tanks purchased mainly abroad, now the situation has changed in favor of tanks made by Chinese companies and developed by Chinese designers.

CCTV's Wartime program presents material in which a statement was made by deputy commander of the PLA tank battalion, Jia Yuan, who said that the Chinese main battle tank Type99A2 with new dynamic protection, combat management system, radar control system and active radar defense system millimeter range "is among the best tanks of our time for its generation."

What other tanks, according to the Chinese version, are among the best in the 3 generation? It turned out that in the top three "best" there is not a single Russian tank of this generation. It is stated that Type99A2 "is actually in the same row, and often surpasses" American M1 Abrams and German Leopard 2. Also noted that the Chinese Type99A "is already ready to make global competition."

From the material:

The tank "Type 99A2" high level of protection. Any section of frontal armor is able to withstand the first hit of a projectile from the gun of any main battle tank of the world. The only thing that may have a chance to hit the tank "Type 99" from the first time in the frontal direction - a powerful anti-tank missile weapon.

As an example of such weapons, the Chinese complex "Red Arrow 10" - one of the latest modifications of the Chinese "Red Arrows".

Chinese tanker:

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

Comments

[Egorovich]

The usual bragging of one boob. A talker, he is a talker - every sandpiper praises his swamp.

[Serg koma]

Quote: Egorovich

The usual bragging of one boob

The Chinese battalion commander said bluntly - "I think ...".

du_re_n richer by thought - the Russian proverb about the pink dreams of a stupid person.

PS Interestingly, he HAS compared, by what parameters in which tests? If according to the pictures and declared TTX = du_re_n x 2

[210ox]

This is not a battalion commander, but his deputy .. Well, the Chinese captain drank too much .. Damn it, they found an "authority" ..

[svp67]

Quote: 210ox

This is not a battalion commander, but his deputy ..

The question is deputy. for what? Judging by his speech, obviously by the political party ...

[Krasnoyarsk]

Quote: Serg Koma

Quote: Egorovich

The usual bragging of one boob

The Chinese battalion commander said bluntly - "I think ...".

du_re_n richer by thought - the Russian proverb about the pink dreams of a stupid person.

PS Interestingly, he HAS compared, by what parameters in which tests? If according to the pictures and declared TTX = du_re_n x 2

Guys, and if some grandfather (grandmother, as an option) says the same thing, will you also rush to discuss it? You never know what some Chinese said. Even if the deputy. battalion commander. What is there to discuss?

[ver_]

... from the same Damn Clinton - Japanese mother is not on them ...

[Rostislav]

What to discuss? Selection of news which VO selects for publication. Here are the people and zuboscalit for the lack of analytics.

[svp67]

Quote: Serg Koma

du_re_n richer by thought - the Russian proverb about the pink dreams of a stupid person.

Well now, commentators from Ukraine will be outraged ... and then the Russians stole something from them

[sharp-lad]

If a tanker does not believe in his tank, how do you think he will fight in it on a real battlefield?

[stalki]

If a tanker does not believe in his tank, how do you think he will fight in it on a real battlefield?

Well suppose a tanker believes in his tank and the tank, in turn, also suppose it can’t really fight. How? Do they both fight a lot?

[sharp-lad]

On the KV tanks at the beginning of the war they were still at war, although there were enough technical problems with this machine. A lot depends on the person, and not on iron. Take, for example, the beginning of the Second World War, the Germans besides the frankly weak (at that time) T3 and T4 there was nothing (I will not mention T1 and T2, they have a weak relation to tanks), but they were able to subordinate almost all of Europe to their strength. The Soviet troops used the T26 and T60 often with a very sad result for the Fritz not because of the technical perfection of these machines.

[starik80]

Motivate?
But what they learn in the Russian army https://youtu.be/r_yoZEIuQQA

[igorka357]

I also know how, and I also know how to shoot very well, control a tank, infantry fighting vehicle and armored personnel carrier, I know the principles of warfare in different conditions, I understand and assemble weapons well, at least any AK modification, I won't say anything about PM and Stechkin pistols! I was taught by my 2 + 1,5 years of service to the Motherland, understood? Or do you need to necessarily throw links from the teachings of the army of the Russian Federation ???

[Shuttle]

Why dummy, talker? Answered as any soldier or commander should answer about his weapon.
Another question is whether the opinion of the commander of the Chinese tank battalion is generally interesting to anyone.

[X Y Z]

The usual deputy. The commander of a tank battalion, in China, will never express his opinion without the approval of senior management. It won’t even fart. If this happened, it means it was authorized and approved at the highest level. Another thing is interesting for what purpose it was said.

[Shuttle]

It is known with what - to cheer the staff, to please the higher authorities.

[kutuz]

"The usual bragging of one dunce" - well, who would say.

[edge]

Quote: Egorovich

The usual bragging of one boob. Chatterbox, he is the talker

yeah, the best tank school in the world ... ... they hanshin drunk after pokatushek in Russia. Remember, where did they go around the t-72 in tb?

[oleg-gr]

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

[lucul]

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

They took the base from the T-72 and equipped it with all the newfangled buns in tank building (they can afford it - there is an excess of money). And we only have a "naked" T-72, because there is no money to re-equip the tank fleet.
So, in his boast there is some truth.

[Observer2014]

They took the base from the T-72 and surrounded it with all the newfangled buns in tank building

So it is. Whatever one may say. And only "Armata" is a competitor of the T-72 So the Chinese is right

[Lara Croft]

Quote: lucul

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

They took the base from the T-72 and equipped it with all the newfangled buns in tank building (they can afford it - there is an excess of money). And we only have a "naked" T-72, because there is no money to re-equip the tank fleet.

Starting with the first Chechen one, almost the entire tank fleet was equipped with at least active armor ...

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Lara Croft

Starting with the first Chechen one, almost the entire tank fleet was equipped with at least active armor ...
Active armor? I know dynamic protection. And you know it is different. And active defense complexes are by no means at all

Another thing is that the Chinese have few prototypes so far and rearmament will take more than one decade. On the other hand, they will crush anyone with old tanks. Ants ....

[Lara Croft]

Type 99 (tank)
The ground forces for many years constituted the main part of the PLA, under the direct supervision of the Central Military Command. On December 31, 2015, the PLA Ground Forces headquarters was first established.
The number of ground forces is about 975 people (000). Armament:
6740 tanks. Of them obsolete: 1600 units ZTZ-59, 650 ZTZ-59II, 600 ZTZ-59D, 200 ZTZ-79, 300 ZTZ-88A / B; and modern 1000 ZTZ-96, 1500 ZTZ-96A, 40 ZTZ-98A, 600 ZTZ-99, 250 ZTZ-99A.
Light tanks: 650 Type-05 (vn-16), 350 Type-62, 50 Type-63A.
Wheel tanks: 200 ZBL-09 (Type-09), armed with a 105-mm gun.
3800 BMP: 400 ZBD-04, 500 ZBD-04A, 500 ZBL-08, 600 ZBD-86, 650 ZBD-86A, 550 ZSL-92, 600 ZSL-92B.
5020 BTR: 2400 Type 63 (WZ-211), 1750 Type-89 (ZSD-89 / ZSD-89C), 400 ZSL-09, 700 Type-92A, 120 ZBL-11, 50 ZSL-93.
2320 self-propelled howitzers.
6140 towed guns.
2586 mortars.
1872+ MLRS.
1531 anti-aircraft guns.
GZM-003 self-propelled pontoon bridge, GJW-410 excavation pit machine, GCZ-112 engineering demolition vehicle, BTR-89 light sapper tank, GCZ-110 track-laying machine and GQL-111 heavy mechanized bridge.

For modern tanks, we with the PLA parity, as it seems to me ...
The entire "armored fist" incl. with modern tanks is concentrated on the coast of the PRC (PLA formations and formations armed with modern weapons will be destroyed by the American sea and air-based KR and force them to retreat into the depths of the PRC territory) and on the border with the Republic of Kazakhstan, which has a tank park no worse than the Chinese (in the presence of superiority of the Air Force The US and ROK in that direction, the PLA's armored forces, will also suffer losses).
The situation is saved by the fact that there is a mountain range between the PRC and India.
Therefore, China:
- takes out its ABM / PLO on the islands i.e. outside the PRC, in order to meet the enemy on the far approaches to his coast and disrupt maritime communications in the near sea zone with the help of his many corvettes;
- purchases from the Russian Federation S-400 air defense systems in order to improve its air defense system (creating at least focal air defense);
- purchases from the Russian Federation (and is trying to make himself) 4 ++ generation fighters.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: Lara Croft

The number of ground forces is about 975 people (000)

This is a peacetime army, and in case of war the mobilization possibilities are almost endless
In wartime, theoretically (without taking into account restrictions on material support), up to 750 can be mobilized

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Pilat2009

Quote: Lara Croft

The number of ground forces is about 975 people (000)

This is a peacetime army, and in case of war the mobilization possibilities are almost endless
In wartime, theoretically (without taking into account restrictions on material support), up to 750 can be mobilized

And with what the PRC will arm them, it is common for the Russian Federation to keep 17 million in the arsenal of only AK ...
For example, the Armed Forces of Ukraine have only doubled their number, and have already made a decision and admission to the troops of the machine guns "Maxim", etc.
Huge mobilization resources can be contained only by the Empire and the Russian Federation, one of two of them, China does not appear there, no matter how much you would like it ...
80% of the population of China lives on the coast, if the PLA does not hold it in the early days of the bombing, then no human resources will help, on the contrary, in the event of the loss of the PRC of its industry and mobile groups located on its coast, a large population of the PRC will become for her a burden ...

[edge]

Quote: Pilat2009

On the other hand, they will crush anyone with old tanks

Guderian also thought so .....

[Pilat2009]

Quote: hert

Guderian also thought so .....

Guderian did not have 750 million reserves

[Waldemar]

They still built a tower on a Western concept. It's me so pure five cents insert

[Waldemar]

It is interesting and argue their guts thin?

[2329 Carpenter]

Yes thin - not thin ...
There are people here for whom China is a super-superpower, and our best friend, and future overlord and patron.
Therefore, and if there is something against China - the minus flies instantly, like the "Vanguard"

[XXXIII]

Does Russia have friends so that you can write about them without looking back at others?

[2329 Carpenter]

Of course!
Strategic Missile Forces, VKS, Navy ... I have already been supplemented - Airborne.
Remembered: ZRV. Etc.
Or is there any doubt?

[XXXIII]

Quote: Carpenter 2329

Of course!
Strategic Missile Forces, VKS, Navy ... I have already been supplemented - Airborne.
Remembered: ZRV. Etc.
Or is there any doubt?

No way! ... + SVR + FSB + MTR, etc.

[Waldemar]

+ GRU. In general, our friends live in our own country. that is, our friends by definition are those who are connected with Russia and connect their lives with Russia. These are our friends. All the rest are jackals

[XXXIII]

Quote: Valdemar

+ GRU. In general, our friends live in our own country. that is, our friends by definition are those who are connected with Russia and connect their lives with Russia. These are our friends. All the rest are jackals

That's right, the country is like parents ....

[XXXIII]

Quote: Valdemar

They still built a tower on a Western concept. It's me so pure five cents insert

So the tank is a hodgepodge, everyone uploaded there to be better than everyone else, assembled, but in parts of the tank it’s not even Chinese ....

[freddyk]

Quote: oleg-gr

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

Type99A2 tank with a new dynamic defense, combat control system, movement control system and active defense complex with millimeter-wave radar "is one of the best tanks of our time for its generation."

How can this be manifested in a tank biathlon. Tank biathlon, this show, military sports competition, how can you evaluate the combat capabilities of a tank from it? T-72 is the most warring tank in the world, this is an indicator against the Chinese.

[letinant]

On the "Tank Biathlon" technique works as in combat, for wear. Here the Chinese have already shown for the second time, that is not about wear.

[freddyk]

Quote: letinant

On the "Tank Biathlon" technique works as in combat, for wear. Here the Chinese have already shown for the second time, that is not about wear.

You know that not serial tanks act in the biathlon, it's like KAMAZ trucks to Paris-Dakar. The Chinese claim is, of course, very controversial, but not the biathlon to judge them.

[Slavs]

Well, why do we need Le Mans 24 or Formula 1? There, too, are not serial cars, testing, running-in technologies, solutions ... Then we see something on serial cars ...

[Waldemar]

We have just serial T72b.
Of course, they are licked to a screw by technicians, but there are standard components and assemblies. And the Chinese have exactly the same, and even with "doping". only the resistance material was invented by the Russians (by the way, it is) and the Chinese in alloys and other things are guided by other people's notes and tips

[edge]

Quote: freddyk

but not biathlon to judge them.

then what ...- I remember, Koshkin also drove the t-34 to Moscow, in evidence of the truth

[Serg koma]

Quote: freddyk

T-72 is the most warring tank in the world, this is an indicator against the Chinese.

The Chinese are pushing their products - a statement (just a battalion commander) is replicated solely for advertising purposes. War for the markets however.

[Pilat2009]

Quote: freddyk

How can you evaluate the combat capabilities of a tank?

They rather facilitate the car to the maximum and set the engine to run faster

[Sirocco]

Quote: oleg-gr

And so - bragging.

There is a good joke about boasting, I think this joke is especially relevant in connection with the latest statements by the Chinese media.

A seventy year old patient came to the doctor complaining of sexual weakness.
- And how often do you now have sex?
- Well ... once every two to three weeks.
“Well then, at your age, that’s fine.”
“Yes, but my neighbor, who is much older than me, says that he sleeps with his wife every night.”
- And you say! Who's stopping you?

Do not say gop, Chinese comrades !!! And the best advertisement is the participation of equipment not in biathlon but in military operations, did he participate where?)))

[Tarhan]

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

This is that Chinese tank? At which in biathlon, when passing the "washboard", the left front roller came off.

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

You are so worried about it in vain .. They will attach another full set of spare parts to the tank! :-)

[StudentVK]

Nope) The repair plant will need to be built right away)

[letinant]

Exactly! They also sell their HOWO trucks. On one you go, the second is in the back.

[Waldemar]

When I see Chinese trucks from time to time on the streets, I feel shame for the owners. Buy a Chinese truck is something with a head should be. Firstly, the owner is a goon, and secondly, a boob. They have the same frame torn like a rag if you pull!

[letinant]

Since I live in a city where they were not measured, I can say that the problem is not only in the frame but also in the brakes. They lay along the sidelines and how many people suffered, but they all broke down.

[Waldemar]

I also saw a lot. And I saw how absurdly they break. Let's just say they break down where they should not break even after 20 years in a garbage dump after they have been written off. It only says that they are made from ass and from chicken droppings.
To buy KamAZ or Maz if there is no money for DAF or MAN, some tricked out from the owners of the Chinese bucket did not have enough intelligence. Something may break down there, but this is clearly not a disadvantage to take a garbage fake for a truck for the air conditioner in the cabin

[moisha]

And what could the auto industry of Russia offer? Was there at least one independent project ending in the release of a car? Apart from tanks and missiles, nothing definite came out. Tanks is another question, in the Second World War all major tank battles were lost. What to be proud of, as for me only in quantity.

[letinant]

Moysha, where did you fall from ?! UAZ, KAMAZ, URAL, VAZ, this is from motor vehicles! What kind of lost tank battles, for example?

[bodzu]

Not only with cars is such a story but with machine tools. China is an example of a consumer society, its vanguard of production is miserable parasites for grinding land resources into dust

[Serg koma]

Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich

make another complete set

they have plenty of crews - no need to take care of this

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

,, a set of crews in abundance ,,
Of course you're right! At 1,5 lard crews, two tanks. That's where the power !!! :-)

[Waldemar]

No one counted the number of tanks in China. This is a closed country

[edge]

Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich

For 1,5 lard crews

and here it’s possible to argue, judging by the consumption of food; from the strength of 600 lyam, everything else is finished.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Andrey Nikolaevich

You are so worried about it in vain .. They will attach another full set of spare parts to the tank! :-)

Where did you get it? They cannot supply combined arms units with "armored vehicles" ....

[NEXUS]

Quote: andrewkor

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

Well, Chinese statements can be anything. Saying does not mean getting married. And while the Chinese are not blowing a biathlon even to our old man T-72Б3.

[Prapor-527]

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".
Can the Type 99A2 itself compete with the "Armata"?

[Waldemar]

He would compete with the t90m for a start

[StudentVK]

Yeah. The rink was then lost by the epitsuns. So this is the BEST tank in terms of inspections and maintenance. Which they were probably looking through a microscope before sending.

[Finches]

China has made a real breakthrough in the field, including tank building, but thanks to our experts! In many areas of metallurgy, etc. they were taught by our professors ... But what I want to say is that our tanks were run-in in a real battle, which China did not touch and it judges the advantage of its tank from range indicators, and Russian tankers and engineers are judged by the indicators of real battle - here the role biathlon doesn’t play any - this is a show! But the use of tanks in the mountains of Afghanistan, the city of Grozny, etc. is an invaluable experience that you can’t get by giving out laudatory interviews in talk shows! After all, a tank is 40% success, and the crew is everything else!

[mvg]

our tanks were run in a real battle

And how did the break-in battle go? Always lost. It’s devastating at some points. That the Arab-Israeli war, that the Iran-Iraq war, that the Desert Storm, that there are more than 1000 destroyed machines in Syria, that both are Chechen wars. As the old Leopard 2A4 is destroyed, it’s a feat, as the T-62M and T-72A are burning (even with mounted additional armor) so it’s a war ... and not a dozen, but hundreds.
I do not know real examples of how our T-54/55/62/72 and IS-3 showed miracles. Always in the red. At least someone at the helm.

[Finches]

Iron always remains iron! And here "experience is the son of difficult mistakes and the genius of paradoxes is a friend!", invulnerable cars - this is for you to Star Wars, and here is the experience! Experience in using a tank and experience in controlling a tank! He is richer with us. Do you understand?

[mvg]

Tank experience and tank control experience!

Which one? Have we fought somewhere? We instructed the Araps and they lost. That the Air Force, that the air defense, that BT .. In the first Chechen one we showed all possible miracles, how to destroy hundreds of cars in one city ... What is such an experience?
We laugh at the exercises in Norway, and on YouTube we have hundreds of videos on how to turn a 40 ton tank onto a tower ... or drown .. I don’t know how many contract soldiers and conscripts are in percentage terms ... but there are professional armies, but there are recruits .. for six months you will not become a professor.
PS: For example, I can’t, with conditional Lada, transfer to the 18-seater Sprinter and feel as comfortable .. or onto the JCB-3 loader. Although I know how to steer there and there.

[Finches]

I apologize, your length of service in the army, experience, participation in hostilities - that I would know with whom to discuss! With a person in topic or just a person

[Finches]

Yes, I forgot - your VUS, if not difficult?

[113262a]

And if I answer? I'm modest-83-85, VUS-in nickname, 1 TA, 23 TP. Campaign 14-15 Lugansk-Debal.

[Finches]

Vladimir, the question is not from the category of who writes lice on the wall, but on the topic

[mvg]

Just with a man. Voenmekh them. Ustinova. No fighting. in military specialty, in general, the commander of the warhead-2 at MRK. I follow them in tanks, and in VO there are only 2-3 professional articles on this topic. In the 16th and 17th year, with a detailed overview and performance characteristics. I don’t watch a biathlon (sometimes) and just expressed my opinion ... it is very different from the Iraqi, Chechen version and Donbass.
For the Chinese .. they have been producing tanks for> 60 years, and they have a tank school. At least with Russia in the last 10-20 years they compete quite successfully. Not all fools buy from them, and not only because of the price .. Export MBT-3000 are not cheaper than T-90S.

[Finches]

"Voenmeh" - just in the outline of our topic! You know, two Voenmekh professors were convicted for espionage in favor of China in 2012 ... They have a weak school of metallurgy and tank building - here you are not quite right! Was! But they are great - they have invested very solidly in this issue. And, in addition, military service and I have it in my personal file, there are crusts of the T-72 operator-gunner, I really still feel very comfortable in the tank ... I respect this car immensely!

[Lara Croft]

Quote: mvg

And how did the break-in battle go? Always lost. It’s devastating at some points. That the Arab-Israeli war, that the Iran-Iraq war, that the Desert Storm, that there are more than 1000 destroyed machines in Syria, that both are Chechen wars. As the old Leopard 2A4 is destroyed, it’s a feat, as the T-62M and T-72A are burning (even with mounted additional armor) so it’s a war ... and not a dozen, but hundreds.
I do not know real examples of how our T-54/55/62/72 and IS-3 showed miracles. Always in the red. At least someone at the helm.

Partly right. However, one cannot take into account that the USSR was building its army as mobilization, it was supposed to overwhelm the empirialist with everything numerically, and not qualitatively, and this is not only in tank building ...
After the collapse of the Internal Affairs Department, the USSR and the increase in the number and scale of NATO, the Russian Federation could not continue the construction of the Armed Forces according to the "Soviet" model, the economy did not allow it, so they finally came to the reduction of redundant and outdated equipment and modernization of a relatively new one.
Googled SA before the collapse of the Union .. entire TDs in the Ukrainian SSR and the German Democratic Republic, were equipped with heavy T-10s, the Transcaucasian Military District, the Turkistan and Central Asian Military Forces were armed with T-54/55 in the best case, some formations were armed with T-62 and partially rare units and T-72 units ..
Punch when the famous 201st Guards. MSD was rearmament from t-34 to t-55 ...
Now the Russian Federation still has to modernize the remnants of B and VT of the former SA, with the simultaneous development of new conceptual technology that can withstand NATO ...
All this is very difficult and costly, even after the 1/4 century in 2014, the equipment of two countries of the same generation met (differing only in the degree of combat readiness) in essence of one former SA ...

[mvg]

Googled SA before the collapse of the Union .. whole TDs in the Ukrainian SSR and East Germany, were equipped with heavy T-10s

At the time of the ZGV withdrawal, the T-10 was withdrawn from service. Yes, in the German Democratic Republic and Ukraine there were the most modern tanks, And Ukraine, when dividing, got a lot of delicious, T-64/80 mainly. In 2008, during the eight-day war in the Transcaucasian Military District, the T-62s, which were already 40 years old, served .. Here, I agree with you.
But this is not the point, I wanted to convey that comparing a tank biathlon with a real battle .. while emphasizing that the T-72 combatant ride, this is nonsense. And the Chinese brought not drill machines, but also not the most modern ones ... therefore there are jambs. But, in my opinion, the Chinese have long been leaders in the standings and took first place in their first biathlon. Not really knowing the track and the subtleties of the game.
PS: The Ukrainians also failed with their T-84s on the NATO analogue of biathlon, although the car is undoubtedly good. No wonder she won the tender in Pakistan (T-80UD there).

[113262a]

In the GSVG there was no t-10. Everything that was there worked on shield-84 in Magdeburg even 64a. T-10-from Karelia to Magadan! Far, for sure, on the t-34! Two regiments, including Mongolia

[starik80]

I completely agree with you. Cast aside patriotism (and which has no analogues in the world), take a look at an outside observer and ...... what's left. Yes T 90C, that they shipped to Iraq quite well, but what is in parts is not a fountain. I would have looked at a couch patriot whom I had to get out of the hatch to fire from a machine gun in a real combat situation. If you compare with Abrams sep v3 kaz trophy (because they will be in Europe, the upgrade process is in progress) and T-72B3, then as they say the game is in one gate. About the connection between the tanks on the battlefield, it’s not even worth comparing, ours cut off the tactical connection of the crews (real-time battle map), there is no money ... there is only enough for cutting small and small officials. Yes, and the cooperative Lake must be maintained.
So, guys are like in 41g. when the Germans had a radio in the tank, but ours didn’t, only the level of informatization is higher. I don’t even want to write about the training of crews, or you think that you shoot less, you are humorists. So the Chinese by their rights T-72 are outdated, if this were not so, then in the USSR they did not begin to develop T-95, etc.

[mvg]

So the Chinese in their rights T-72 are outdated

I agree. Only in Russia, it is possible to produce a VAZ-2105 from 1982, until 2014 (it seems) without changing anything ... In the West, the real life of the model is 3-5 years.
So here, between Abrasha M1A1, which was in 1970 and SEP v.3, the difference between a car and a bogie. Between the 72 T-1970 and the T-72B3M (and other modifications), not much. It seems that the engine was changed and the OMS, and the remote control was hung, and the connection, but exactly as much as the money was enough. And neither Lead nor Mango Abrams will take, and Reflexes will knock down Trophy. So Leo2A4 and Leo2A7 are different. I don't know what to boast about here. I know that the ancient Centurions and Super Shermans and the more modern Chieftains were able to handle the more modern T-55 and T-62. At the same time, Egypt received the T-62 straight from the needle ... the most modern.

[Waldemar]

There have never been special duels of the above tanks with the same leopard2. Last Minute T is mainly the work of aviation and powerful petro. Have you heard about the massive use of aviation and missiles against NATO tank formations? Me not. Something tells them that they will not be up to par

[mvg]

especially there were no duels of the above tanks

73 years, tank battles were probably the largest, after the Second World War. And very serious. One red-haired Jew on Chiften claimed 60 tanks destroyed from 3 of his ammunition (including T-62, including Vladimir Ilyich (the araps) who had just delivered the weapons unofficially). Leo did not participate in battles. Turks do not count.
Iran-Iraq war. There were massive battles. With varying success, but if you count the losses, then the Persians have less.
Iraq, a desert storm, there were tank counterattacks, with the participation of T-72. To no avail. Not all BTs were killed from the air.

Something tells them that they will not be up to par

Correctly prompts, 2006, the Lebanese war. The Merkavas suffered losses. But it was BEFORE installing KAZ Trophy on them. But they fought against the whole country, and lost about 10-15 tanks, and we against one city, and lost hundreds. Also a regular army, with aviation and our military school. What's wrong? So I ask, what experience do we have?

[Waldemar]

Your red-haired Jew must have shot at tanks without crews on the chieftain. even if he shot the T-34 he wouldn’t succeed. If this is a military operation, then the conditions you have are not in a dash when shooting skeet and shoot like 1 shot - 1 tank is a cheater of some fraudster

[Altona]

Quote: mvg

how the T-62M and T-72A are burning (even with mounted additional armor) so this is a war ... and not a dozen, but hundreds.

---------------------------------
What kind of fight are you talking about? Explain.

[svp67]

Quote: andrewkor

+18
We look forward to not waiting for Biathlon or weak!

No, biathlon is "games". Everything will fall into place only after the combat use of these tanks, as happened with the Abrams, Leo-2 and our T-62M and T-90A.

The Chinese media publish material that says that China has become one of the world leaders in tank building.

Well, it’s really so, just show me at least ONE tank of a completely Chinese design ... So far, all of their main vehicles are variations on the Soviet T-55 and T-72

[mvg]

So far, all of their main cars are variations on the Soviet T-55 and T-72

Type 99A2 about 500 pieces already, is this the main tank? And what's in it from the T-72 school. What is borrowed? All his own .. So it’s possible to say about any other tank that Abrams and Leo are from the same project. Black panther, type 10 and Altai, with a German school ... Challenger island))), but definitely looked at the American project ..

[svp67]

Quote: mvg

Type 99A2 about 500 pieces already, is this the main tank?

The fact that the tank is "main" is not determined by its quantity, but is determined by its QUALITIES

Quote: mvg

And what's in it from the T-72 school.

Excuse me, but are you a tanker? You do not see that the layout of the tank, chassis, AZ - this is all in it from the T-72. The basis of this tank is the T-72.

[mvg]

chassis, AZ - this is all in it from the T-72. The basis of this tank is the T-72

The layout is classic, the engine is its own, the tower is its own, the AZ is its own (crowbars> 1 meter fit there, the tower is its own (welded and the type of armor is like that of the Merkava), KAZ, OMS are its own, the chassis is also its own ... WHAT is there from T- 72 ??? Tankers, and those are their own! When did China buy a license for our tanks for the last time?
And in the Black Panther, German weapons and an engine (and then already a transmission and a diesel engine), in Altai the same thing ... only diesel Austria and so on about each tank. Only in the PRC there is nothing from the USSR / Russia in the tanks, so where are they "copied" from?

[svp67]

Quote: mvg

so from what are they "copied"?

With the T-72 ... armored you are our ...

Type 99 (ZTZ-99) is a modern Chinese main battle tank of the 3 generation, created on the basis of the prototype Type 98G.Is a development of the concept of the Soviet tank T-72

The main weapon is the ZPT-98 smoothbore gun (unlicensed copy of the Soviet 2А46) The gate is placed in a heat-insulating casing. The autoloader is electromechanical, also copied from the Soviet model (China previously acquired several T-72 tanks in the Middle East); when using it, the rate of fire is 8 rounds per minute. Ammunition - 41 shot separately-shell loading (in the machine gun 22 shots). The armament consists of armor-piercing-subcaliber shells with a detachable pallet; cumulative and high-explosive fragmentation ammunition; ATGM 9М119 "Reflex"; and in cooperation with Israel, armor-piercing-ammunition from depleted uranium.

... two-plane weapons stabilizer (unlicensed copy of the Soviet 228)

A mechanical planetary transmission provides 7 speeds forward and one back, a torsion bar suspension with hydraulic shock absorbers (on the first, second and sixth suspension units). Gable rollers with rubber bunches, from one side 6 main and 4 supporting. The caterpillar has rubber-metal joints; installation of rubber pads for movement on asphalt surfaces is provided. Basically, the undercarriage is copied from the T-72.

They changed the additional fuel tanks on the fenders to be too lazy, they left the switchgear open, like T-72. The wind sensor did not change ... but why, it works

[Waldemar]

sorry, but the Chinese do not have their own engine. these are all copies. copies of MTU Cummins and so on. Samples from all over the world, of all types and purposes, they have received long ago. sorry to disappoint

[mvg]

sorry to disappoint

It’s hard for you to disappoint me ... That's when we made engines for planes in the Second World War .. At the beginning of the 30s, we bought licenses for Wright, Dwarfs, BiMVi, and got M-17, M-25, ASh-62, which later developed ... then what is it? Soviet engines? We ourselves came up with direct fuel injection, turbocharging, or all the same, they took it from advanced Germans, Americans, British Merlin ..
But no one remembers that not a single "own" engine flew either on La or Yak ... But the Chinese, dirty tricksters, copy everything ... only some "extra" details are thrown away, while others are added ... If so .. Take, for example, Zvezda or Kolomna and copy the GTU for 11356 from the German MTU, or at least from the Khokhlyatsky one, but we can't .. my conscience probably doesn't allow it! Well, or in Lebanon to catch the Merkava, remove the KAZ from it and make a working Drozd or the Arena ... and no one will say a word. Only slaps.
PS: We generally have "everything in chocolate", we don't need to catch anyone, we have samples, we just can't make them .. And there is a research institute, and gee-gee, a school for decades .. and experience and personnel, but We cannot do it .. About computers, and everything that is more complicated than shovels, I don’t say… Only at the bakery there is 5 year old Italian equipment, on MV Eurodisk, 15 year old Italian equipment .. and we, the navel of the Earth, do not hesitate to work on it.
P.P.S.: I’m tired of the topic already ... yes, the Chinese are bastards, they all fake it, yes, it’s a bastard, that sometimes it’s more interesting than the original .. somewhere it’s grinded with a file, that makes Xiaomi cheaper and more interesting IPhone X. And Cyrix is ​​catching up with Intel ... But where is it going to Elbrus ... which in the top versions costs more than I7, but, for some reason, it works like a budget Atom. But your !!! only here is a factory in Taiwan ..

[Waldemar]

conscience? the Chinese are unofficially allowed to rub everything. and if everything will be copied with us, they will drag us through the courts. This is an iron fact. Well, as for the engines on La and Yak, I would be silent in your place, because you apparently are not completely in the subject. They put copies on them, but they did not stop there. Moreover, one must be a villain in order to set wartime as an example. On the topic of licenses and the creation of an engineering and scientific school in the USSR, the process can be called the opposite. At first, the West did not sourly steal various developments in Russia, then after the civil war and the actual destruction of the country, it was necessary to collect this necessary from around the world. The world has never been shy about tyrit Russia and call it the name of Edison, for example. What is it worth only a light bulb invented in Russia by Lodygin.

[Ross xnumx]

The only thing that may have a chance to hit the Type 99 tank the first time ...

Quote: andrewkor

Don’t forget the spare rollers, but more. The sra-th!

It's right. Praised Steel:

[Demon_is_ada]

Yeah ... if they have armor of the same quality then ... well, it’s a miracle of world tank building ... I’m better on foot The devil he is known in the details ...

[sak1969]

Quote: ROSS 42

It's right. Vaunted steel

In Russia, during the Tank Biathlon competition 2015, a hull burst in one of the upgraded Russian T-72B3 tanks. The armor of the tank was not as strong as expected, and burst from the outer and inner sides of the hull when it hit a wall.
http://andrei-bt.livejournal.com/381098.html

[Invoce]

I'm not a specialist in armored vehicles at all, but the question is
1. Is it a Russian tank?
2. Was it at biathlon?
3. And is it not photoshop?

[sak1969]

Invoce
In 2015, I saw an unofficial shoot, so it wasn’t funny when the Chinese skating rinks lost.
And I only found those photos today.
Alabino tank biathlon semifinal 2015
Green tank Tajik crew.
There is nothing epic!
5:10:35 there is a tank with a jammed left steering wheel.
5:10:42 - 5:11:09 a crack is visible in front of the right caterpillar.

[Invoce]

At Biathlon - weak! the best advertisement is blah blah blah ... everything is tested in battle ...

[Klingon]

Quote: andrewkor

We look forward to not waiting for Biathlon or weakly! Do not forget the spare rollers, but more. Trepachishki sra-oh!

- and spare drives for the tower, I remember the tower also jammed)))

[private person]

Who will he compete with in biathlon? We did not see the "Armata" there either, the biathlon competition is more likely to be calculated, since all T-72s, and well, yes, China performed for the first time on its own. The question is, how many of these Type99A2s do they have in service? And how many "Armat" are in the RF Armed Forces,

[Uncle lee]

with the Type99A2 tank can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14

They will not die of modesty!

[kdakda]

The usual pulling of a blanket.

[Alex777]

But how do the Chinese still behave?
Otherwise, no one will buy it abroad.

[pofigist_26_eng]

On the contrary, this tanker actually admits that the Type 99A2 is an unfinished vehicle, unsuitable at the moment for full service. Since it is precisely such a tank (experimental) that the T-14 is, and in my opinion, the T-14 is a transitional model, as the T-44 was at one time.

[StudentVK]

This should not be emphasized)))) The trick is that this tank of theirs may not be bad at all, but they also take armature, which is PRINCIPLALLY of a different generation than this Chinese miracle.

[letinant]

If their chassis is an exact copy of the T-72 chassis. Then they, with their bells and whistles, overtaxed him, and this, uhhh. Tell me about the T-90, then there is only a similar look, and the chassis itself is completely redesigned. New alloys, new technologies.

[113262a]

Not exact! Closer to the T-80.

[Semen Semyonitch]

PRINCIPLE

Principle ... Gavrilo ...

[StudentVK]

Specially made a mistake and wrote in capital letters for "attentive"))

[Semen Semyonitch]

Aging means)))

[Waldemar]

If T14 goes to the army in hundreds, then it will be something like T14a called as always

[Andrey Chistyakov]

Not tired of seeing more from fantasies .. Show in battle !!!!

[Vlad.by]

the goal is to develop export potential. Marketing drives

[afrikanez]

Most importantly, the Chinese maintained a firm belief that their tanks were the best. Disappointment for them will be instead of a bomb in shorts!

[Izotovp]

Together with her !

[sabakina]

Quote: afrikanez

Most importantly, the Chinese maintained a strong belief that their tanks were the best.

I need to translate them into Chinese
"the armor is strong, and our tanks are fast ..."

[StudentVK]

So they and Katyusha and our other war songs have already been translated into Chinese. Personally, I think that this is just stupid clumsy propaganda. It's like if you marry a princess, if you steal a million)))

[TRex]

Well, why are you so killing? You won’t be so killed!
One must listen to the opinion of the Chinese comrades, especially if he is the whole DEPUTY COMMANDER OF THE TANK BATTALION!
But why not publish the opinions of our tankers on the site? At least three or four dozen battalion commanders?

[orionvitt]

There is nothing like leather. I remember that the Chinese "super" tanks in biathlon were inferior to the old Soviet (70s) T-72. Not to mention the fact that on the comb their skating rink stupidly broke off. And there too. Let him first prove his effectiveness in battle, and not on the training ground.

[mvg]

inferior to the old Soviet (70s) T-72

The old Soviet T-72, this is a V-84-1 engine with 780 (840) horses and a control system based on the TPD-2-49 rangefinder sight, the TNP-1-49-23 night scope, 2E28M weapon stabilizer (even without a thermal imager) . On biathlon tanks there are 1130 horses and Sosna-U.
As the tank had a bare forehead, it remained. It breaks through the old 105 mm English L-7.

[113262a]

Yes 72-tank for the poor!

[Andrei Nikolaevich]

Now the tanks will be consumer goods! Lived ... :-)

[K-50]

Chinese tanker: I think that the Russian T-99 Armata can compete with the Type2A14 tank.

Another sandpiper with its swamp.

[Mountain shooter]

Our tanks are at war, theirs are PR.
Brought to the biathlon - let's see how they all "do" ... Contrary to our 72s. Last time - the racing version was stuck. Overlaid with radiators, eased to the limit, so what?
Well, bring a new one. Bench press? Are you afraid of reputational losses? Then there is no need to "speak"!

[sabakina]

As I understand from the article, they are positioning that their tank is not penetrated the first time. will we shoot them at the training ground?

[Klingon]

Quote: sabakina

As I understand from the article, they are positioning that their tank is not penetrated the first time. will we shoot them at the training ground?

Or maybe it should be? to put on the biathlon two demonstrators of the frontal armor of the tanks of the opponents and pierce with standard ammunition for points ?? two crowbar, two cumulative and 2 UR- immediately we will understand who is lying more)))

[rayruav]

where are our tankers why they are silent in this case, I would like to know the opinion of professionals, and let everyone look at their own computer, where it is done, if this is not a high-tech production, well, I don’t know

[sabakina]

Firstly, our tankers were already singing "Armor is strong, and our tanks are fast ...", secondly, combat performance characteristics can only be checked in battle, and thirdly, what have the Chinese computers to do with it?

[StudentVK]

Respected! As for the computer and, of course, the other, I agree, but with one, but to a greater extent, the vast majority of Chinese industry and others belong to FOREIGN capital, more precisely to Western. So, as the Chinese do not cuddle with us, but as for the dough and other specific economic actions, they lie like a log and cannot. Also with technology. The fact that they are given a cut is what they take. It’s like we have in the 90s that they didn’t lie well and took it.

[Dull]

"In the program" Wartime "of the CCTV channel, material is presented, which cites a statement by the deputy commander of the PLA tank battalion Jia Yuanyu, who stated that the Chinese main battle tank Type99A2 with new reactive armor, a combat control system, a motion control system and an active protection complex with millimeter-wave radar "is one of the best modern tanks for its generation."
Interestingly, if he had declared that Chinese tanks didn’t even compete with the T-72, which was clearly manifested in the tank biathlon, then where would it be in a day?

[StudentVK]

Wow! Directly removed from the tongue)

[3vs]

It remains only to drive the Chinese development in Syria ...

[evgen1221]

PR and marketing - you’ll not outgrow a competitor; you will not sell. That’s it, comrades disagree.

[yellow vest]

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

And how does the Chinese know that even the designers themselves do not know about Armata?

[loki565]

Leopards were also invulnerable until they were burned in Syria))) So we are waiting for real combat use, and then the opinion of experts))

[Pivot]

Dreaming is not harmful; it is harmful not to dream.

[Awaz]

The Chinese do not have any school of tank building, so they are not yet able to create any super duper tank, even by hanging a bunch of all sorts of babies on the T72 - it’s not yet known how all this will behave in a real battle with a good level protivnik. The Georgians pumped 72 Jews in no way ... And no matter how we scolded our gunsmiths, even the 90th is a new step in tank building and the Type 99A2, this is a good modification of the tank created back in the late 60s of the last century

[starik80]

In vain, they are followers of the Soviet school. Not Russian, but Soviet. The Chinese have technology, and what they do not know how to buy. They can afford it.

[bolt]

...statement deputy commander of a tank battalion PLA ...

Earlier, statements were discussed by leaders of states, then by ministers and generals, recently they began by retired American colonels, now this is it.
In a month, I suppose, we will enthusiastically discuss the conversation of two German sergeants in the beer hall of the glorious city of Munich.
And this "Jia Yuanyu" is apparently the deputy for political affairs. He was instructed, he learned and voiced. Now he will become deputy regiment commander. Politically.

[Adimius38]

Well, in the tank biathlon so far, that only the t-72 scattered. One will conjure the other. And the Chinese tank can be quite successful, and with the help of advanced active defense and the latest dynamic protection, it’s certainly a cut above the old T-72, but it’s unlikely to reach out to the armature, but the question is where is our armata, and at least the T-90 a breakthrough? so it turns out that the same t-72 is against it, albeit with minor improvements in the T-72BZ version, and since the T-72BZ does not have active protection, it means that it loses a lot to the Chinese

[Grits]

Quote: Adimius38

Well, in the tank biathlon so far, that only the t-72 scattered.

But you didn’t notice that on the tank biathlon almost all tanks are T-72. What else is there to crumble?

[Adimius38]

it’s just that I paid attention to this, if other tanks would have paid attention to them, however, tanks of the Chinese People’s Army took part in biathlon

[bolt]

Quote: Adimius38

... however, tanks of the Chinese People’s Army took part in the biathlon ...

And didn’t you notice the tanks of the Martian People’s Army? Does their technique stand?

[SASHA OLD]

Quote: Adimius38

Well, in the tank biathlon so far, that only the t-72 scattered. One will conjure the other. And the Chinese tank can be quite successful, and with the help of advanced active defense and the latest dynamic protection, it’s certainly a cut above the old T-72, but it’s unlikely to reach out to the armature, but the question is where is our armata, and at least the T-90 a breakthrough? so it turns out that the same t-72 is against it, albeit with minor improvements in the T-72BZ version, and since the T-72BZ does not have active protection, it means that it loses a lot to the Chinese

just one action show has appeared

[Adimius38]

let gazikov in a puddle and the specifics zero times you're such an expert

[rocket757]

The frog, for its swamp ..... everything is normal. Not interested.
We do the sho so yes, Schaub others were jealous and afraid.

[Ivan Simakov]

C'mon, you attacked the Chinese. Try to chowder the soup with chopsticks, you’ll not write such nonsense about the Chinese tank industry.

[ANCIENT]

Che that the Chinese are actively engaged in seduction! their tanks are stolen copies of ours, their weapons are also from the USSR, or Russia, their only crew! !!

[mvg]

tanks are stolen copies of our

What is there (in type 99) of "our" left? Its engine is 1200-1500 l / s, its own control system, its own computer, its own gun, its own ammunition, more armor from the Merkava .., its own DZ, the suspension was altered .. ours did not choose which is better, T-64, T- 72 or T-80.
PS: They are not stupid, do not hesitate to copy not only Soviet, but also Western. Take the best from each side. And industrial espionage is better established than anyone else. They have no problems with matrices for a thermal imager, with optics, with an element base (which even in the USA they don’t disdain), with rockets launched through the barrel, with an engine .. with money in the end. And they did not have 90 years and the collapse of the country. And their 1.5 lard and they work.

[SASHA OLD]

But the fact that they have neither an SLA, nor a komplyukter, nor a gun, nor armor, nor demonic defense in real conditions is worked out on the drum, right?
they kept copying all the time, they didn’t have any developments, they didn’t have any experience with using them - they don’t have their own school, they don’t have a fundamental foundation, they still have to work at the level of our tanks, but they will reach, I have no doubt about it, only when they reach our today's level we will finish with the next and move on to promising.
BUT!
China, admittedly, has been rushing uphill in recent years with quick steps, so as an option their lag will be reduced

[mvg]

option their backlog will be reduced

As an option, now they are AHEAD of Russia in many technologies, and in some of them they are still ahead of the rest of the world ... Should you name it or find it yourself? And, besides this, these technologies are already in serial "goods", in huge quantities.

[SASHA OLD]

Quote: mvg

Say or find yourself?

say please

[mvg]

say be

The Navy, the Chinese themselves are surface ships of all classes .. with all possible GTUs. Destroyers with "Aegis" on gas turbines and electric propulsion units (052C / D 055A), frigates on diesel engines (054A / B diesel license from France and Germany, which we did not get), aircraft carriers, including nuclear ones with an electromagnetic catapult. TFR, UDC, BDK, minesweepers, mosquito fleet ... in such quantity that one can only dream. And on all this there are quite modern air defense systems, PLUR and anti-ship missiles, in no way inferior to Russian counterparts (if any). For example, HQ-9B is definitely more interesting than Fort-M on Petra and Atlanta, HQ-16 on frigates, without analogs on 1155 and 22380/385/386. This is what is already, and not in Rogozin's Wishlist.
AFAR on J-10B, J-11D, J-15, J-20, we do not have a serial AFAV, Zhuk-ME is already outdated ... And indeed there is no light single-engine front-line fighter ..
According to BT, there is MBT with serial KAZ, in large numbers, there are serial tank engines of 1200-1500 l / s. We have 1130 and something in Almaty, from a forced 1200 X-shaped. Hardly in a big series. There are MLRS for 400 km, no one has this. There are OTR of different classes, here ahead of the rest, because and the US and we are bound by the INF Treaty. And very interesting options for the DF-21 / 31D.
In space there are a number of ambitious programs ahead of the rest .. the world leader in the number of launches (by margin).
Own electronics, which no one disdains, neither Russia nor the United States.
There are no problems with import substitution (well, there are matrices for thermal imagers, elemental base, avionics, engines for Mi helicopters, for SuperJet, for 11356 and everything else ..) They have either their own, or licensed or stolen ..
PS: So which of us is retarded? That we have 1 piece of 885 and 3 pieces of 955, which are NOT yet in the Navy of China, or avant-gardes / Poseidons / daggers / Sarmatians, which in a single copy will not do the weather? Wunder-waffles never won wars. Only for its population .. balm for the soul.

[SASHA OLD]

HQ-9B - the basis of S-300, HQ-16 - a joint project with our technologies (not their technology, ours)

destroyers in old hulls and their fillings, but there aren’t any unique technologies there, Aegis is awesome !!! Ketayans Aegis ... and they themselves know? (almost all weapons or copies or joint projects - nothing unique, about Aegis in general laughed out loud - did the Americans share it?))

I agree only about the SMD missiles - and that is because they were not bound by the agreement, although we also have them on ships, like the Amers ...

We also have AFARs (I think that if necessary it will be delivered) - again, no unique technologies ...

so still I repeat the question: what unique military technologies do they have that give them an edge

[philosopher]

Probably, 99% of all the technologies available to them, China received in finished form. Name at least one industry where the Chinese are leaders in development, rather than manufacturing of turnkey solutions; if I was not mistaken and they have at least 1%.

[Waldemar]

Everything is copied from them. Let's be honest.

[Guard division of divan troops]

Hmm, what can I say about the tests in real battle, even if on a tank show he had rollers from the comb fell off. I would like to see the use of its KAZ and DZ in combat conditions.

[orcinus]

quote the deputy. battalion commander, have come! We are waiting for the authoritative opinion of the platoon commander, and then the squad)

[taiga2018]

Sorry, but in what conflict did the Chinese tank manage to prove itself?

[nathanael]

Yap!!! Chatterbox find for a spy ....

[Incvizitor]

Any area of ​​frontal armor is able to withstand the first hit of a shell

It was already like that when they talked about the lousy abrashka, but in reality it turned from old RPGs into a fire.

[Adimius38]

in fact, the abrashka was fired not at the frontal armor but at the stern and sides with RPGs, in the first versions it was their most vulnerable spot

[Incvizitor]

I’m saying that in modern local conflicts, it’s not enough to cover one forehead well and in global conflicts it’s unlikely to reach tanks, here the front protection is crammed and the sides are bare.

[113262a]

This is a weak spot for everyone!

[svp67]

Quote: 113262

This is a weak spot for everyone!

You can't put a person in a solid piece of metal, two meters thick and force something to do there, anyway, somewhere you need to make "holes"

[113262a]

So I do not understand the point in the discussion! The impression that the audience replayed in Tanchiki!))) There will never be tank battles on the scale of the Kursk Bulge, and in lokalka, the side with IMPACT tanks will not necessarily win! There is an option to sit on a minefield, or just a land mine, or be flunked from all angles by Flies! The infantry is now evil and can!

[philosopher]

And who and when beat in the most protected place? What for? Especially when there is an ultimatum defense, and from a different angle, it is possible to break through the simplest (outdated) anti-tank weapon. So the tanks burn despite the country of origin and the year of modernization, because vulnerable sides are +/- at all.

[Berkut24]

Only the T-99 "Armata" can compete with the Type2A14 tank

As long as the Chinese themselves have not yet competed in the real battlefield, it’s better to be silent. A TV box worn on the tower of a copy of the T-72 can add bonuses to the game, but real life is more cruel.

[Hypersound]

Does he have an uninhabited tower? If not, then this is not a 3rd generation tank. The T-14 not only "can compete", but better. Yes, even the top version of the T-90 is most likely not inferior

[StudentVK]

Well, I’m saying that stupid clumsy propaganda. I will say right away that we partially have it, but since in China)))))) Definitely not)))

[Fantazer911]

Such allegations that the Chinese tank is better, only in words can the Russian T14 know well only those who created it on those mistakes and tests in other models, and the Chinese technology was the same. It remained so!

[Morphius]

I’m laughing at him)))) although the Chinese have honestly achieved a lot and, in particular, have become, but as practice shows, their tanks did not pass through and break down only once ...

[Horon]

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

Take More - Star Wars Death Star!

[moisha]

Where is Armata? If the grandmother throws off a ruble, then China fills up with armatures.

[SS-18 Satan]

I read comments .. and I can not understand some comrades. they either inspire themselves, or others ?? then what not.

[watchmaker]

The Chinese have learned a lot not to create new technological weapons, but to steal technologies and pass them off as their own. Well what can I say - "do not wash so skating" well done.
In the light of recent events, I’m just sure Old Man, from anger and helplessness in front of Putin, is draining for money all the technologies that he can know, and not just China.

[TOR2]

What other tanks, according to the Chinese version, are among the best in the 3 generation? It turned out that in the top three "best" there is not a single Russian tank of this generation. It is stated that Type99A2 "is actually in the same row, and often surpasses" American M1 Abrams and German Leopard 2. Also noted that the Chinese Type99A "is already ready to make global competition."

Well, and weakly continue the advertising campaign. 10 Type99A ships to Syria at no cost and take part in the most intense battles.

[Vasyan1971]

Quote: TOR2

10 Type99A ships to Syria at no cost and take part in the most intense battles.

Turks. They have already advertised "Leopards", so they will provide Chinese "typuses".

[Nikolaevich I]

They say that a Jew cried when xoxol was born .... Hmmmm, they still do not know the Chinese!

[silverwolf88]

how many cheap show-offs from scratch ... it is clear that advertising for sale BUT is clearly overkill ... let's see how it will fight this product somewhere)) ... and there you can sing songs

[Vasyan1971]

Chinese tanker: Only Armata T-99 will be able to compete with Type2A14

What a brave one! Let them bring it to biathlon, let's see. And how famously everyone knows how to take off shoes.

[Leonid Har]

Drive at least one type 99 in Syria. It will be seen there

[Lara Croft]

Chinese-made T-59/69 tanks in both Iraqi companies proved their inability to withstand the coalition tanks - the American M60, M1A1; British "Chieftains" and "Challengers", French AMX 30B2 ...
Where did they get the idea that their Type99A2 tank (being a "replica" of the Soviet T-72) would cope with the Russian T-72B3 and T-90 MS? The latter, unlike the Chinese tank mentioned in the article, have a rich (T-72) experience in combat, incl. combat experience (both) in the SAR ...

Chinese tanker:
I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

He apparently reads VO and knows very well that he will not appear in the NE of the Russian Federation soon ...

[Adimius38]

And what was the largest tank battle taking place in Syria using modern tanks ??? there seemingly rolled out the latest leopards, Korean panthers, etc.> ??? Yes, there is just the level of battles for the T-72 tanks of the 80s of the last century. In the current war with an enemy equipped with advanced weapons, any poorly equipped tank is just a pile of iron, and this is no exception for the T-72 tank. At a minimum, a modern tank should be equipped with a KAZ.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: Adimius38

And what was the largest tank battle taking place in Syria using modern tanks ??? there seemingly rolled out the latest leopards, Korean panthers, etc.> ???

Like the German and American in the SAR were and burned gloriously, in France Yemen French Leclerc and Abrams burned, in Iraq Abrams also burned ...
Our tanks purchased by the SAR already during the period of conflict withstood the ATGM of enemy states ...
About your main argument, the lack of tank battles in the SAR:
In your opinion, the clashes between the tank and the ATGM operator have no significance in modern warfare, as according to your logic, the columns of NATO armored vehicles across the territory of the Russian Federation will go along the highway avoiding the urbanized, mountainous and wooded areas occupied by the Russian Armed Forces?
Interesting reasoning. So all the burnt enemy cars were originally old modifications (excusably means), and those that were burned along with modern Syrian and Iraqi crews ...

At a minimum, a modern tank should be equipped with KAZ.

In what combat charter (including the American field fn -....) is it written or a manual?
I still thought that the commander should skillfully carry out the assigned combat mission using ALL the given (and requisitioned from the population) means of suppressing the enemy ...
We cannot afford to put all 10 tanks in KAZ And 000 T-2 we can’t do quickly ... accordingly, we need to learn to fight with what we have, improve what we have in Nalya, and do not hope for rearmament of all tank units and units with the new T-300 ...
Otherwise, our military-political leadership will turn into extras ....

[starik80]

"we must learn to fight with what we have" we already passed about 70 years ago, the Germans did not teach you anything, they forgot everything. 27 million dead are watching you.
The question is not about getting an ATGM, but in a duel. Will the T72 withstand the hit of BPS abrams in the forehead. I am sure that they fired at their abrams.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: starik80

"we must learn to fight with those" we already passed about 70 years ago, the Germans did not teach you anything, they forgot everything. 27 million dead are watching you.

About how they spoke arrogantly, the hero is the guardian of Russia, well, try to make 2 T-300s in a couple of years, ruin the economy ....
Who is your husband? You did not teach history well, because at the beginning of the 40s, there were just other statements: "with little blood", "on foreign territory" ...
Why are we supplying the T-72B3 to the troops, right, because the T-90 is too expensive, we will not master ...

T-72B3 ... what is this beast? 1 part

https://topwar.ru/35631-t-72b3chto-eto-za-zver-chast-1.html

The T-72B3 modification is designed as a cheap alternative to the T-90A main tank until the receipt of a new generation of tanks by the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation. It is a relatively simple modernization of the T-72B tank, bringing some parameters to the T-90A level.

By the way, removing hundreds of T-80s from storage also speaks of my version (saving the budget) ...

Will the T72 withstand the hit of BPS abrams in the forehead. I am sure they fired at their abrams.

Will the T72 withstand the hit of BPS abrams in the forehead. I am sure they fired at their abrams.

Of course not, such a task was not set, the T-72 can only compete with the American M60, the British Chieftain (without additional attachments of the Chepham type), the French AMX-30V2, the German Leopard-1, the Ukrainian and Polish counterparts. ...
The problem is that completely different vehicles (those that I have listed for a long time been withdrawn from service of most NATO countries) are opposed to the RF RF by the members of the Western OSK.
In addition to the above, NATO has an advantage in AA attack aircraft and attack helicopters ...

I am waiting for recommendations from you on strengthening the armored fist of the Russian Federation Navy (and the BS of the Russian Navy), at least in the Western direction ...

[starik80]

In terms of detection range, we lose, in terms of armor penetration, we also lose (destruction by the first shot). Everything is sad for our tankmen and not only.
"recommendations for strengthening the armored fist of the Russian Army" - Under the current government, I can only recommend keeping everything in foreign currency, and in the case of a big naughty ..... no, not to buy a combat vehicle :)
I will add about the "hero guardian of Russia", when will it be not you for the Motherland, but the Motherland for you? And then pay to study, pay for treatment, you will not survive the pension.

[Adimius38]

you write everything right.

[Lara Croft]

Quote: starik80

"recommendations for strengthening the armored fist of the Russian Army" - Under the current government, I can only recommend keeping everything in foreign currency, and in the case of a big naughty ..... no, not to buy a combat vehicle :)

So there are no recommendations, there is only sustained dissatisfaction ...

I will add about the "hero guardian of Russia", when will it be not you for the Motherland, but the Motherland for you?

As one empiricalist (deceased, J. Kennedy) used to say: "Do not ask the country what it has done for you, ask yourself what you have done for the country" ...

[Adimius38]

T-90 you do not master? But what do you master? you had 18 years to master, during this time after the war in the 20th century, cities were rebuilt from scratch, spacecraft were launched into space, and you have not mastered for 18 years. Where can you master with such a wonderful team ....

[113262a]

Wrong question! How many tanks will reach the front end and will be deployed from the convoy in some sort of battle order? With the full use of artillery, reconnaissance, aviation and anti-tank weapons by the enemy? The Donbass campaign showed that the main loss of tanks on both sides was not from tank fire! In Syria, the same garbage!

[Adimius38]

ONCE AGAIN I WILL REPEAT — that a war with barmales in which, in addition to old garbage trucks sheathed with sheets of iron and equipment, in the best case of the 60s in single copies without any air cover, this is not the same as a war with a strong well-equipped enemy armed with the most advanced equipment. Therefore, do not here la la and write sheets. The t-72 tank was good in the 80s but not in the 21st century, and against modern equipment and infantry equipped with advanced means of fighting tanks, it is already clearly weak.

[Varaga]

... is weak if you do not upgrade the remote sensing system or fire control system, for example.
What did the T-72B3 not please you? This is not the same T-72.

[philosopher]

And upgrade the frontal armor package too? That is, to weld the body and change the filling of the combined protection? No, the T-72 of any degree of modernization cannot be equated with the new T-90M. More precisely, theoretically it can, but not within the framework of the adopted modernization program. Simply because 95% of the construct will have to be changed and the work will turn out to be more expensive than releasing the T-90M from scratch (although this is exactly what the Americans do). Therefore, the T-72 is definitely outdated, the T-72B3 is a modern upgrade based on compromises, and the T-90M is a "no-compromise upgrade of the T-72," so to speak.

[Varaga]

A package of frontal armor without remote sensing will not help against modern cumulative warheads. Especially tandem. Realizing this, our military-industrial complex upgraded the T-72B with "little blood". Cheap and cheerful without any exaggeration. The point is to release a lot of T-90, if it is already outdated, and it is being replaced by the T-14? And the T-90 in various modifications will be exported for a long time.

[Dzungar]

Yes, let him want what he believes ...... What is this to us ..?

[Doliva63]

"The only thing that can have a chance to hit a Type 99 tank the first time in a frontal direction is a powerful anti-tank missile weapon."
Tin. And what else are they fighting with tanks, if not anti-tank weapons ?! It turns out that the tank is mediocre in defense, if not worse. Like, advertising is the engine of trade, no more.
But the star on the tower looks good!

[Samvel]

And for this they cannot bypass the T72 at the biathlon.

[Ros 56]

We’ll wait and see what it is for nothing to grind with our tongue.

[APASUS]

Yesterday, the Chinese bought tanks from us, and today their tank immediately stepped into the 3rd generation. Well, for now you can safely state: Composing fairy tales for the media, they have learned excellently!

[Old Horseradish]

Well. They are preparing to fight in winter conditions. Yes, they found friends on their heads. With such friends, enemies are not necessary by definition.

[APASUS]

Quote: Old Fuck

Well. They are preparing to fight in winter conditions.

Winter conditions of Siberia and winter conditions of China, like heaven and earth! What can they learn when they have snow on holidays?

[Varaga]

Yes, here you will not get sick. With what they come, they will leave without it. If the stilts do not frostbite ...

[Hodok437]

The Chinese are sending stations to the moon, but as always, everything is fine with us. And we are sawing our own forest for them, we only have a deadwood left. It’s an honor to be a patriot.

[Adimius38]

Well, what do you think is the current reality

[Adimius38]

The fact is that if China approves its prototype armata, then it will be able to rivet them with thousands thanks to its powerful economy, Russia cannot master even a hundred armatures. Already, China is building powerful destroyers in batches, and we have one muzzle barrel with poppy seeds and single ships of the near sea zone

[starik80]

But we have yachts of oligarchs that cost more than all the built warships of Russia. My pride is bursting with power. Yes, and the mayor of Klintsov receives more than the mayor of New York !!!

[Mentat]

Quote: rayruav

let everyone look at their computer, where it was made, if it’s not a high-tech production, well, I don’t know

That's it, you don't know. The production of chips and boards using imported equipment according to the instructions provided is not high-tech production. This is the removal of hazardous production abroad to China, where labor is also cheaper.
In Russia, we put together some European car on an assembly line, does this mean that we designed its engine, suspension, all components and assemblies? What's wrong with your logic, did you go for a walk?

[Govorun]

Chinese tanker: Only Armata T-99 will be able to compete with Type2A14
Chinese tank crews now know everything and even more...

[CAT BAIYUN]

I think that the Type99A2 tank can only compete with the Russian T-14 “Armata”

... Well... dear.. You can think whatever you want, but you can’t even make sure that the rollers of tanks of Chinese origin don’t break in half at the biathlon... And what can you, dear, know about "Armate"?
But in general, gentlemen, the Chinese are moving further and further. At the beginning they take quantity and price, and then the quality will improve.

[bone1]

Chinese tankman thinks -I wonder what? -To compare tanks, you need to know something about them other than the name.

[113262a]

Nothing! The Chinese never got out, unafraid. What war is he going to fight in? Who will be in charge? If in the city with barmalei it’s one thing, if in the desert with them it’s another, if with ours in nature it’s third, if you’re stupid in biathlon it’s fourth, if with us in nature it’s fifth, if in the mountains with Pakistan - well, do you understand? Should the Chinese, who haven’t smelled gunpowder, give orders? You see how many possible answers there are! There is no indestructible tank, no universal one!

[philosopher]

We must also take into account that the Chinese themselves are very mediocre warriors. This has been proven for CENTURIES. Even the Chinese emperors were guarded not by the Chinese, but... by the Slavs. But the Chinese are strong only in words, in legends and films. Well, if it’s real, then only in number, moreover, a multiple, or even orders of magnitude, greater than the opponent.

[Mentat]

Quote: Mentat

Quote: rayruav

let everyone look at their computer, where it was made, if it’s not a high-tech production, well, I don’t know

That's it, you don't know. The production of chips and boards using imported equipment according to the instructions provided is not high-tech production. This is the removal of hazardous production abroad to China, where labor is also cheaper.
In Russia, we put together some European car on an assembly line, does this mean that we designed its engine, suspension, all components and assemblies? What's wrong with your logic, did you go for a walk?

I couldn’t answer anything, I came in silently and put a minus, all dissatisfied.

[segamegament]

Normal people do not compare allied tanks; they compare their tanks with the tanks of a potential enemy, and the Chinese do not consider Russia as such...)))

[Jeremiah]

All this is chatter..What is from one bank of the Amur, what is from the other...It’s smart enough not to check...Well done. No? Then the fight will show who can compete with whom. Together with the best at that time, the T-34, and with the collective farmers holding the levers, we ran to Moscow... Equipment is not an indicator...

[Varaga]

“To Berlin” - did you mean to say?)

[Note 2]

How does the Chinese know that his wood cart is better than the T 14? Complete nonsense.

[shans2]

Chinese propaganda for the domestic market is the most ridiculous and stupid and surpasses the most extreme Western propaganda in terms of the intensity of idiocy. It’s even funny how people here on the site seriously react to all sorts of custom-made freaks in the Chinese media). Just understand that the Chinese have a priori all of their state propaganda - the best, even if the rollers fall off on the move in non-combat conditions... For them, comparing the incomparable and different generations is generally a special feature.

[Varaga]

I absolutely agree. I am sure that our T-90 will smear this Chinese soap dish by one and a half times.
I’ll keep quiet about the T-14 for now - pitchforks through the water because...

[Vasili09]

Quote: Lara Croft

Quote: lucul

When they prove themselves at the tank biathlon, then we’ll evaluate it. And so - bragging.

They took the base from the T-72 and equipped it with all the newfangled buns in tank building (they can afford it - there is an excess of money). And we only have a "naked" T-72, because there is no money to re-equip the tank fleet.

Starting with the first Chechen one, almost the entire tank fleet was equipped with at least active armor ...

active protection? no, I haven’t heard, it’s dynamic, but the active one seems to be installed serially only on the T-55, so to speak, and is planned for the T-14

[Vasili09]

Quote: Doliva63

"The only thing that can have a chance to hit a Type 99 tank the first time in a frontal direction is a powerful anti-tank missile weapon."
Tin. And what else are they fighting with tanks, if not anti-tank weapons ?! It turns out that the tank is mediocre in defense, if not worse. Like, advertising is the engine of trade, no more.
But the star on the tower looks good!

this means that kinetic bullets fired from a tank gun do not penetrate

[av58]

The “Middle Empire” began to show off its weapons :-) Let them first show off their tanks in at least one real conflict.

[wild]

I saw how their rollers flew off at the biathlon. piz.. l narrow-eyed.

[nnz226]

Isn’t this type of tank losing its “rollers” at the Biathlon??? What a show-off!

[Varaga]

I think that with the tank Type99A2 can compete, perhaps, the Russian T-14 "Armata".

Another unfounded "tryndezh". It is surprising that the Chinese adopted the manner of the Anglo-Saxons.

[ppgt90]

To be honest, I don’t even know what the discussion is about here. China did not have and does not yet have a school of domestic tank building, as well as aircraft manufacturing and the creation of weapons in general. The Chinese select supposedly the best samples, again, please note, the best in their opinion and they copy them. It is far from a fact that a copy will be able to show the same results as the original. Chinese weapons of any type have not undergone serious testing in military conflicts, where defects that cannot be identified at testing sites usually appear. So it is simply premature to talk about any Chinese breakthrough in the field of weapons. There will be any clashes, then we’ll see the results. Until then, blah blah blah.

[Vodka and Meldonium]

Well, Chinese tank crews are recognized experts and developers of new land combat strategies with practical skills. It makes sense to listen to them.

[Igor Nikitin_2]

A Chinese tank is like a Chinese car - components and assemblies are copied, engines are produced under license but they don’t know the magic words, so it turns out worse than the original. The same problem with aircraft engines - well, they copied it, but the resource is far from the original. It takes 50 years to learn how to do it at a level.

[servant.]

That’s how we started making good engines for airplanes from copies.....we learned....

[tank64rus]

The question is, is the basis of this supertank not the T-72 by chance? I think that the T-90M and T-80M are in no way inferior, and maybe even superior to this model. Well, if their chief designer had said this, then it would have been possible to attach some meaning to these words, but for the deputy battalion commander, this is not respectable. PR and when you’re drunk, you’ll say the wrong thing and that’s it. But the fact that at Army 2018 they went through all the new items more than once, and the fact that they don’t spare money for the defense industry, is not like “our” Government where the slogan is “there is no money, but you hold on.” This is very, very worrying.

[Larum]

Regardless of advertising, China is clearly catching up and starting to sell abroad. And quickly

[philosopher]

How nice, the Chinese have put themselves among the leaders of tank-building powers. And where, may I ask, did this new Chinese tank fight, and what performance did it demonstrate? From the achievements of Chinese engineering, I personally know about the ability to beat and copy everything. Well, honestly, are there at least some of their own developments, not copied or peeped from others? It is trite to accuse China of plagiarism, but alas, it is still quite relevant.

[Varaga]

Quote: ppgt90

Chinese weapons of any type have not undergone serious testing in military conflicts,

Actually, like the Chinese themselves. Therefore, I absolutely agree with you.