Vedomosti signed another contract with China for the supply of AL-31F aircraft engines

Earlier this year, Rosoboronexport signed a contract with the Chinese Ministry of Defense to supply X-NUMX aircraft engines AL-140F worth about 31 million dollars, the Vedomosti newspaper reported, citing a source close to the Rosoboronexport management.

According to the source, the Moscow contractor Salyut has been identified as the lead contractor. This information was also confirmed by a source in the Ministry of Defense of Russia.

At the same time, according to Vedomosti, official representatives of Rosoboronexport and the Salyut plant declined to comment.

REFERENCE

At the end of last year, it was reported on ongoing negotiations with China on the supply of the next 140 AL-31FN engines. In particular, as AINonline.com informed 2011 in early October with reference to the director general of FSUE Salut, Vladislav Masalov, the contract for the delivery of a new batch of 140 engines AL-31FN to China in October-November 2011.

China in 2011 year placed two orders for engines of the series AL-31.

At the beginning of 2011, Rosoboronexport signed a contract for the supply of X-NUMX AL-150F engines to replace the outdated engines of the same type of Su-31 / Su-27MKK / MK30 fighter jets, which are designated as J-2 in China. The executor of this order is OJSC "Ufa Engine-Building Production Association" (UMPO).

At the beginning of June, 2011, another contract was concluded for the supply of X-NUMX engines for AL-123FN to China. These engines are designed for the motorization of J-31 fighter jets manufactured in China by the Chengdu Corporation. The contract value is more than 10 million dollars. Deliveries are planned for the period up to 500. The contractor is the FSUE SPS Salt Gas Turbine Engineering, which previously supplied the engines of this modification to China under several contracts: 2013 units. under contract from 54, 2003 units - under contract from 100 year and 2007 units. - under contract from 122 year.

The total order book of FSUE Salyut Gas Turbine Engineering Plant for the production of power plants of the AL-31 series for China is approaching a thousand units.

For servicing engines, Salyut has entered into partnership agreements with Chinese companies Limin and Tyan Li for the supply and manufacture of spare parts for AL-31F and AL-31FN. In addition, Russia has reached an agreement with China on the transfer of documentation for the repair and maintenance of AL-31F and AL-31FN to the Chinese side. The Russian side agreed to provide all the necessary documentation on maintenance and repair.

Comments

[tronin.maxim]

Strange, usually the Chinese are copying everything, but then they’re buying a lot!

[Aleksey67]

Quote: tronin.maxim

Strange, usually the Chinese are copying everything, but then they’re buying a lot!

It is not so easy to copy a modern aircraft engine, attempts were made, but unsuccessful
Here from the foreign press

The past decade, China has invested enormous resources and a lot of administrative effort in creating an aircraft engine industry. The Chinese are largely faced with the same problems as the Russians at the very beginning. It is difficult to develop the necessary engine design and develop design skills. But China has several advantages. Firstly, the Chinese knew the miscalculations that the Russians had made at one time, so they were able to avoid many mistakes. Secondly, the fact remains: the Chinese have much more access to Western production technologies (both legal and non-legal). And finally, China, unlike the Soviets, had the opportunity to create its own engine building in a market economy. And it turned out to be much more effective than the command economy, within the framework of which the Soviets acted for seven decades. However, state-owned engine manufacturers have failed to create the entrepreneurial spirit that works so well in the West (as well as in other, privatized segments of the Chinese economy).

The Chinese believe that locally designed and manufactured J-10 aircraft and WS-10A engines are part of the training process. And they really learn from their mistakes. However, jet engines for combat aircraft are an extremely complex thing., and China is facing more problems than expected in this area. He finds solutions, but new problems arise with them..

In addition, China still does not want to acknowledge the fact that there are many shortcomings in its efforts to create an engine on its own. For example, two years ago, the Chinese announced that they would replace the engines on their J-10 fighter by installing Chinese-made WS-10A engines to replace the Russian AL-31FN. However, last year, Beijing slowly ordered several hundred more AL-31FN engines in Russia. And more - no talk about the massive use of the WS-10A.

For many years, China imported two types of Russian engines: AL-31 worth $ 3,5 million (for the Su-30 and its local clone J11, as well as for a Chinese-built aircraft J10), and RD-93 (version RD-33 with MiG- 29) for the JF-17 (aircraft type F-16, developed jointly with Pakistan). Then the Chinese engineers thought they would be able to master the production technology of a local copy of the Russian AL-31 engine. This Chinese copy, called the WS-10A, is part of a program under which the WS-13 engine is also being designed to replace the RD-93. The Chinese managed to create quite durable engines, but they still have reliability issues. And this is real death for a fighter, because in an air battle engine malfunction can be fatal.

This year, the number of orders from the Russian Air Force increased, and the AL-31 manufacturer had to increase production by more than a third this year. It seems that Russians are confident in the inability of the Chinese to soon solve their production problems. This is illustrated by the fact that China openly (but unsuccessfully) protests against the restrictions that Russia wants to impose on the use of its AL-31FN engines. Russia needs guarantees that the AL-31FN will be used exclusively on Chinese military aircraft, and that none of them will be dismantled to help Chinese engineers create and improve illegal clones of this engine - WS-10A. China has been stealing Russian military technology for many years, especially after the end of the Cold War.

Russia holds China for ... engines, and increases pressure.

[Follow us]

To copy this - few hands, you also need brains. And Asians have problems with this. What new have the Japanese, Koreans, Chinese come up with? Never mind! Only copy invented by the Russians, Germans and British

[Neighbor]

Quote: Siga

What new have the Japanese, Koreans, Chinese come up with? Never mind!

And the more difficult the technique becomes over time - the less chance these ....... have of copying it!
Indeed, to create the same engine - which is just not used - nanotechnology, technology for smelting metals and alloys - State. secret., special. unique hardware, software. Unique specialists. There is at least 1 link - the engine - you can take in scrap metal.
I watched an interview with some of our luminaries - he says - the Chinese - NEVER can create an analogue of the same Poplar! Type brain - not so sharpened. There is no base - scientific and technical.
The same Hindus - asked Russia - to transfer to them the technology of creating Topol.
CAN NOT. do it yourself.
Apparently - Russia and the Russian people are truly God's chosen people - GIFTED !!! After all, it is with us - talents and geniuses - LOTS !!!
Glory to Russia!!!

[hrych]

If amers a midgetman mobile, they could not do what to say about huyvebin. Remember the launch of a Korean rocket, obviously the Chinese comrades drove their own for a couple of rice cars.

[Tersky]

Quote: tronin.maxim

Strange, usually the Chinese copy everything, but

They didn’t succeed in copying the right xerox, but they broke down their own, that’s the puncture.

[vorobey]

No Vitya, they have such photocopiers, though it works the same as the rest of the copies.

[755962]

The Chinese realized that without a reliable engine, flying into the sky is dangerous and expensive.

[Cadet787]

I may be mistaken, but it seems immoral from Russia to arm China. It will turn out to be more expensive.

[hrych]

We sell them an outdated engine, and if not us, we will sell English women with other French, our next generation engines will be launched with the money raised.

[radikdan79]

why? it's just a business. You can sell, but learning to design and create "from scratch" is not only immoral, but also unsafe ... so there is nothing wrong with selling

[sazhka0]

.Nothing to learn .. You need to sell what you yourself do not need ..
And so ... Well, you can’t. After all, we do not sell engines, but brains and technologies. Maybe today the Chinese will not repeat, and tomorrow?

[Alexei]

Quote: sazhka0

Maybe today the Chinese will not repeat, but tomorrow?

And tomorrow we will be better.

[radikdan79]

sazhka0,
there is no talk of technology transfer. after all, the documentation for the repair and maintenance of the engine and the documentation for the engine production technology are not the same thing (which is only the creation ("growing") of a monocrystalline blade). that's why China buys engines (can't copy) ...

[Tirpitz]

We need to maximize anti-spyware security to protect documentation on engines, at least in some ways we have no equal and are not expected in the near future.

[anfreezer]

What can I say, if the same amers buy engines for their missiles from us. although they will be more technologically and engineeringly more Chinese. The Chinese are copywriters by nature, at the cellular-molecular level, so to speak, but with the same design-technological, creative thought, they have a problem, genes are not the same. Which pleases. it’s true that it’s impossible to deceive yourself in any way, just as to stand still, especially as the AL-31FN engines are specially designed for the Chinese.

[Shuhrat turani]

You

Quote: anfreezer

with the same design and technological, creative thought they have a problem, the genes are not the same.

Vasya is not the same ... Russia, apart from the collapsing military-industrial complex, can’t boast of anything more ... Tell me at least one industry in Russia that would produce at least some competitive products that are not related to the military sphere? Ordinary cars cannot be assembled, even from imported spare parts ... Something constantly rattles and breaks.
These purchases are a temporary phenomenon ... They will tighten the technological base, and that's all ... Russia will be erased from the arms market ... AND WHAT GENES WILL YOU TALK ABOUT THEN?
YOURSELF DO NOT DO ANYTHING ANYTHING OR HEAD ...

THE BEST WAY TO EXTEND IN YOUR EYES IS TO DESTROY OTHERS ... Am I RIGHT?

[Big lexey]

Absolutely right!
The design idea is dying, universities are training only sales managers, the level of training of technical specialists at the plinth level, very few people want to go to work due to low salaries and a complete lack of prospects ... The vast majority of high-tech equipment currently being produced is the work of Soviet engineers.
Overwhelming majority!
But what to say, if we, having not very expensive labor force, are bringing many assembly plants to China. We have lived that we produce ordinary metal-cutting and metalworking tools in China. For Russia. Under the label - "Made in Russia".

[hrych]

I call the industry - aircraft engines (read above), rocketry (Proton, Soyuz, S-300, 400, Tor, Iskander, Topol, ........), construction of nuclear power plants, Tank construction, Aviation, Corvettes, radar stations, nuclear submarines, ......
And what, you collect, dear, except for opium?
My opinion is that you do not read the news on this site well. And to assemble an iPhone and a Gelenvagen is not such a big science, but neither Germany nor Japan can assemble a Putny aircraft engine. Only Anglo-Saxons with Franks, they can do something, but Mother Russia. And, you, apparently, are not of a great mind, since such silly comments are falling off, and I’m telling you this in vain, because there’s no sense, apparently you are not a donkey and you don’t understand.

[Horde]

I call the industry - aircraft engines (read above), rocketry (Proton, Soyuz, S-300, 400, Tor, Iskander, Topol, ........), construction of nuclear power plants, Tank construction, Aviation, Corvettes, radar stations, nuclear submarines.

- this is all the developments of that country, during the days of "democracy" NOTHING of its own has been created, SCIENCE is now being destroyed, therefore this country is ALREADY unable to go forward. All the best people of the country, our pride of a designer and skilled workers get a penny, therefore, come to naught, and 64% and stooltkin are bargaining for a defense order, just not to pay an extra penny to their own, better money for a hill, for mistrals, drones, iveki. So, Khrych is your optimism.

[hrych]

Topol-M, Bulava, S-400, Iskander, P-50, nuclear submarine "Borey", Pantsyr, radar "Voronezh", etc. created not in the USSR, but in the Russian Federation, the school has been preserved, there are personnel. Both engineers and qualifiers earn. workers are good, even by world standards. The Russian Federation remains a developed industrial country with a powerful mechanical engineering. And it is not necessary to judge by everyday life, in it we always lagged behind, tk. it is of secondary importance. We are building nuclear power plants, including over the hill, believe me, these are the highest technologies. Space, I will keep silent, we are the only country in the world providing manned space exploration, the United States left with shuttles. This is a monopoly and at any time partners will go to the forest. I have no optimism - this is reality, of course thanks to the legacy of the USSR, but unlike the CIS, where the entire industry was irrevocably destroyed in Russia, it has revived. Mistral is a good thing and we didn't have it, and why build years when you can buy it, but it has an Alligator. We have consumer goods in our anus, largely due to the blockage of cheap Chinese, but this cheapness due to slave labor for a cup of rice, well, let them, but they cannot make an engine. Let me remind you that in order to make an engine you need to have a bunch of factories and technologies, but the PRC turned out to be beyond its power, this is not an iPhone to copy and not to sew sneakers. And the talk about the purchase of weapons abroad is partly pressure on our manufacturers to lower prices, and secondly, they tested the rifle in the Airborne Forces, rejected, tested a wheeled tank, rejected. And after that, potential buyers of this trash in Arabia and Mozambique will say that they do not need it either, this may be one of the methods of an unfair fight for the arms market.

[Horde]

Topol-M, Bulava, S-400, Iskander, P-50, nuclear submarine "Borey", Pantsyr, radar "Voronezh", etc. created not in the USSR, but in the Russian Federation,

created of course, just how? s-400, the carapace, the needle was created contrary to, and not thanks to without any funding, without government orders. The management of the plants showed miracles of resourcefulness and heroism completely inappropriate in peacetime. If they drowned, as we say the same yak-141 or ekranoplan, then no one would not answer for it, no one would be hurt.

Earn, both engineers and kwal. workers are good, even by world standards

and, where did you see a good salary in production? On the Izhevsk mechanical average salary of 16 thousand rubles and it’s not always paid, or on top of yesterday’s news, read what’s going on with the production of ammunition - a complete mess
http://topwar.ru/14956-rabotniki-boepripasnoy-otrasli-iz-novosibirska-napisali-p
ismo-putinu.html

Mistral thing is good

and what is this thing good for? A ridiculous, awkward vessel, our aircraft carriers such as Kiev are more attractive both in appearance and in functionality. Mains are a clean cut of a babda.

pressure on our manufacturers to drop prices,

all imported items are bought for a lot of money, the same wills are worse and much more expensive, however, a stool with friends went out of their way to shove this Illyan trash in our army and so on. Everything else does not have faith in our leadership.

[hrych]

We have helicopters - the Black Shark and the Alligator, who lost the tender to the MI-28 strike, and if they lost, then they would not have gone into the series. However, the cars are so good and that would not duplicate the Mi-28, they were handed over to the Marine Corps, as you know, the Kamovtsi co-operative scheme is unique during sea rolling and in the mountains where pressure and all kinds of air holes change sharply, etc. We didn’t and didn’t plan to make our own ships capable of carrying a squadron of such vehicles, the issue was solved simply by import, plus the following Mistrals will be assembled at our shipyards. Such a ship must be designed for years and years to build, but war is not expected. The decision was made after the Georgian reconciliation, where it is necessary to attack the mountains from the sea. Such machines need to live, which will not be equal until they master anti-gravity, but in ordinary field conditions it is better than MI-28.
Salaries for everyone are different for Izhak’s problem: they let AK out 100 years ahead, they have been stacked in oil in warehouses since the Soviet era, he lives now selling civil shit, but you won’t get rich on it, I think they will save this unique production by subsidies. And at the factory for the production of aircraft engines or drilling equipment, kval. hard worker earns be healthy.

[hrych]

Sorry, the typo is not P, but T-50.

[Big lexey]

Do not judge by yourself, but you will not be judged ... Especially in the part on the assembly of opium or who knows what.
What aircraft engines were developed in the Russian Federation? AL-31 - was developed by the designers of the Soviet school back in Soviet times.
Missile technology - Protons, Unions, S-300, Poplar, as well as in all other positions - similarly ...
Before writing, you should study the history of the creation of these samples ...
You can be a "hurray-patriot" and "beat the enemy on his territory with little blood" - but not for long, until the first encounter with reality.
Take off your rose-colored glasses, in Russia, over the past 20 years, so many problems have accumulated in the industry that incredible efforts are needed to correct the situation for the better. Although, what pleases, there has been a correct trend lately, if only demagogues would not "talk about" it.

[jo_lik]

And what are YOU doing now?

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

Well, the news is great. Firstly - "Salut" received an excellent order, let the guys work! Secondly, in connection with the increased PR of the Chinese so-called fifth-generation aircraft, the question crept in - could the Chinese quietly be able to make a technological breakthrough and create a dvigun for the fifth generation? Or at least improve the engines of the 4th generation fighters?
Everything fell into place - no fifth, no fourth, parodies of our ancient Al-31 alone.
Maybe this is not good - talking about a neighbor’s failures, but a neighbor’s something has somehow become impudent lately ...

[Shuhrat turani]

IT WILL NOT KNOW WHAT FOR THE CRAFTS WITH THE T-50 WILL BE ... F-22 ALSO ADVERTED LONG AND EASY ...

[Andrei from Chelyabinsk]

You can ask - and where does the T-50? We’re talking about engines ... As for dvigla, then after Al-31FN AL-31F-M1 was born (the thrust of AL-31FN increased by EMNIP 800 kgf with the same dimensions and weight, and most importantly - One of the modifications of this engine was controlled thrust vectoring - then AL-31-МХNUMX (+ 2 kg more, resource increased to 300 hour. And finally Su-3000 with Al-35Ф41С are in the series - in many respects a fundamentally new engine with respect to any of the series AL-1.At the same time, AL-31F41C is a lightweight version of the AL-1F41 which is put on the T-1.
Those. by the most conservative estimates, China lagged behind by 3-4 steps. In fact, this means that they are not able to independently exploit anything other than 4+ or 4 ++ there - analogues of the Su-35, Mig-35, Silent Hornet and Silent Eagle - but even the usual fourth generation is not by forces.

[atos_kin]

If they sell, I hope that they have already done better.

[Oleg777]

Stop selling technology to the Chinese !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Today they are for us and tomorrow a knife in the back, more than once it was ......

[nekromonger]

Do you think selling an engine is selling technology? yes, they washed everyone’s brains in the 90s

[Oleg777]

In the 90s I was 1 year old

[anfreezer]

Although a little late, but I think it is necessary for someone to answer. I meant the flight of CREATIVE DESIGN THOUGHT, BREAKTHROUGH in some of the scientific fields - here we are one of the first, and this is beyond doubt! Name at least a dozen Chinese inventors, scientists and engineers who have left their mark on world science! Another question (here BigLexey is right) is the organization of labor and production, here the Chinese are on top. Carefully read the posts, and not bang your head on the keyboard in a fit of incomprehensible indignation to me!