Carelessness in purchasing electronics can cost Russia defenses

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It is not a secret for anyone that, despite all the efforts made and billions of dollars in financial injections, the Russian defense industry has not been able to cope with its dependence on the foreign electronic component of the base.





In the Russian army, more than half of all weapons and military equipment are stuffed with imported ECB. Starting with computers in the systems of automated command and control of strategic and tactical forces, the Uran-9 robotic systems, and ending with the Su-30CM and Iskander OTRK fighters.

The total volume of foreign ECB in the production of samples of domestic weapons and special equipment is 70%. According to According to JSC Concern Radioelectronic Technologies (KRET), it will take from two to five years to replace more than 3,5 thousand elements of imported EKB, but about 7-8% of them are not reproducible.

Consequently, completely overcome the dependence on imported electronics in the defense industry will not succeed. In other words, the use of foreign ECB for critical applications, unfortunately, will take place for a long time.

In this regard, special attention should be paid to the security guarantees of the use of e-filling imported.

According to experts, in addition to military-technical dependence, imported electronics can conceal a lot of other “surprises” that Russian military leaders are not even aware of.

In particular, according to foreign studies, without the knowledge of the customer, a hardware trojan can be introduced into each chip, which, at the command of its "owner", is able to perform a variety of unauthorized actions: change operating modes, transfer any internal (secret) information through external channels, change electrical modes the operation of the chip up to its destruction or failure by an external signal of the attacker. The command can come at a certain time or on a certain external signal.

For the first time, the fact of introducing such a trojan into a microchip was documented in a “dashing 90-e” by Sergei Skorobogatov, an employee of a security group in a computer laboratory at the University of Cambridge, a Moscow university graduate who found work at a US university. This microcircuit was advertised by both the developer and the US Department of Defense as absolutely safe, with multi-level protection. Therefore, it was widely used for many years in military systems (submarines, aircraft, precision weapon).

In September 2007, Israel attacked a suspicious nuclear facility located in Syria. Shortly before the Israeli raid begins aviation ultra-modern radars of the Syrian army, which were used in the air defense system, failed. After this incident, computer security experts sounded the alarm: in their opinion, the backdoor (an algorithm defect that is intentionally built into it by the developer and allows unauthorized access to data or remote control of the operating system as a whole) caused by such chips radars still at the production stage.

At the Pentagon, they took this possibility quite seriously many years ago. Indeed, in this case we are talking about the emergence of a new type of weapon - a scientific-technical, or cyber-weapon, which allows not only to "win", but also to "survive" the attacking side. After all, it is quite obvious that the use of types of “classical” weapons and such “exotic” weapons as biological, climatic, seismic, psychological, neural, etc., on Earth today will be nothing but a rather sophisticated “suicide method” .

The issue of ensuring technological security was classified in the USA and NATO countries among the state tasks with the highest priority of importance. The headache in ensuring the safety of the supply channels for ECB for critical systems was assigned to the Pentagon.

In the structure of the US Department of Defense, as a result, a number of special units were created to ensure the safety of supply chains for microcircuits in the interests of the defense department, NASA and NATO member countries. The most well-known of the open sources such an "anti-Trojan" division is the special division of the US Department of Defense - JFAC (Integrated Federal Center for the Reliability of Microchips).

It is worth noting that in the matter of security control in microelectronics of the USA ahead of the rest. At the end of 2017, the US Department of Defense had 23 certified factories at its disposal, which ultimately allowed Americans to place their manufacturing orders with subsequent certified delivery of chips manufactured using twenty different technologies.

In the Russian defense ministry, the issue of security monitoring of purchased chips is more than negligent.

Despite the fact that the structure of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, there are a number of special units whose main functions are similar to those of their American counterparts: 18 Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense, 46 Central Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense, branch of the Central Scientific Research Institute of the Ministry of Defense (formerly 22 Central Research Institute) production is not even discussed.

In a country that buys more than 70 percent of all electronics for the defense industry from the USA, China and other countries, the security infrastructure of supply chains is completely absent: from the development of a set of regulatory and technical documentation to the creation of competence centers.

In the issue of control of the imported ECB sometimes it comes to the point of absurdity. So, according to the technical assignment for conducting incoming inspection and certification tests of the electronic component base of foreign production designed for Iskander OTRK (!), The main criteria for testing were insulation resistance and a range of operating temperatures. Speech about the analysis of the topology and the search for undocumented elements does not even go.

However, in the media, there are more and more reports of the identification of Trojans in the chips. Recently it became known that Chinese military intelligence installed spy microchips on motherboards that were supplied for equipment of American companies. They were used for espionage and remote access to computer memory.

Isn't it time for the heads of competent departments and ministries, instead of lowering billions of dollars in mindless import substitution, to finally appreciate and realize the harsh reality (already known from American experience) and take the necessary measures to neutralize the threat of cyber weapon use by laying software and hardware trojans in the import ECB?
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  1. +13
    10 October 2018 05: 27
    here you have the "Armata" and the SU-57, and used pilots ...
    1. dSK
      +12
      10 October 2018 06: 18
      Quote: Andrey Yurievich
      here
      in the USSR, in the north of Moscow, the city of Zelenograd was built for the production of microelectronic components. Perestroika "buried" him. "Skolkovsie" boys work according to an interesting scheme - they receive government funding, but do not have "assignments", if they will invent something, if not ...
      1. +11
        10 October 2018 06: 49
        Quote from dsk
        in the north of Moscow, the city of Zelenograd was built for the production of microelectronic components. Perestroika "buried" him.

        Unfortunately, Russia has not restored for almost 20 years, nothing of the destroyed. This is not the first time we are pouring from empty to empty, as we are here, as well as other mass media, they say we must get rid, but no, we’re sitting, we are waiting for thunder from the sky)))) If on the topic, then we are in a single economic system, no one let us get out of it, all these patriotic slogans, both here and abroad, are designed for local Aborigines. I think it’s not worth introducing the main developer of modern electronic components.)))))
        1. +6
          10 October 2018 08: 44
          It is not a secret for anyone that, despite all the efforts made and billions of dollars in financial injections, the Russian defense industry has not been able to cope with its dependence on the foreign electronic component of the base.

          They will put you in trouble, but don't steal!?!?!? - Yes, if these words were prophetic, then it went well .... and so all the friendly GANG, which we associate one-sidedly with "RED BLACK", prosper to this day !!! I will not talk about sad things, I’ll go and sort out another electronic device, I sigh, because spitting is already useless ...
          1. dSK
            +3
            10 October 2018 09: 54
            Quote: rocket757
            I will not be about sad

            Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev wrote an article entitled Russia-2024: A Strategy for Social and Economic Development, which was published in the October issue of the scientific journal Issues of Economics on 24 pages.
            One of the prime minister’s most striking conclusions is that the country lacks officials with which Russia could conquer new digital and innovative heights.
            The introduction of technology, robotics, in a word, more and more machines must work for a person. However, Medvedev proposes to solve this problem from the other end - on the contrary, to increase the staff of officials who could oversee the digital and innovative spheres. “A million officials (there are already 5,3 million of them now), technological offshore companies, etc. All this, Russia has repeatedly passed. They created a huge number of "development institutions" (from Rusnano to Skolkovo), but for me personally, a striking example of "verbiage" is the fact that the share of technologically innovative companies in Russia is less than 1%, and only 10 industrial robot per 1 thousand workers versus 531 in South Korea, 176 in the USA and 49 in China", - noted in this connection economist Yuriy Pronko. / TV "Tsargrad", 09 October 2018 19: 51 /
            1. +3
              10 October 2018 10: 22
              So, I don’t want to be sad in the morning. So no, they will add sales not a lemon, but DURIAN to my bright mood .... and the morning was so good, the sun is shining, there is more than one cloud in the sky .... and here, hello. have arrived.
              Enta quote from not quite adequate person, divorced from this world. So watch old Georgian films about the watchmen, those who watch over the watchmen and those who watch over those who watch over the watchmen .... in the wine cellar !!! However, our people have no less accurate definitions. A thief sits on a thief and drives a thief !!!
              Thank you for your attention and understanding. soldier .... and the mood in the morning was so good sad
            2. 0
              12 October 2018 10: 29
              Quote from dsk
              One of the prime minister’s most striking conclusions is that the country lacks officials to help Russia conquer new digital and innovative heights.

              digital technologies are technologies for the development of logistics for large corporations. With the help of digital technologies, it will be immediately clear that, where how much is bought, the market capacity is calculated, and another "vital" shopping center is being built.
          2. +2
            10 October 2018 17: 56
            Quote: rocket757
            "RED FUCK"

            the red line of onanotechnology develops! laughing
            1. 0
              11 October 2018 10: 22
              Quote: aybolyt678
              the red line of onanotechnology develops!

              Develops ??? A very bold statement, sales for such super-needed technologies ....
              In short, we will not have such!
              1. 0
                12 October 2018 05: 26
                Quote: rocket757
                Quote: aybolyt678
                the red line of onanotechnology develops!

                Develops ??? A very bold statement, sales for such super-needed technologies ....
                In short, we will not have such!

                I actually Onanotechnology laughing
      2. +2
        10 October 2018 17: 55
        Skolkovo is pure profanation. "Sharashki" are needed.
      3. +1
        10 October 2018 21: 49
        Quote from dsk
        Quote: Andrey Yurievich
        here
        in the USSR, in the north of Moscow, the Zelenograd science city was built for the production of microelectronics components.
        Remind me what they were going to release? US products 75 years? The x86 processors only settled by 90, 15 years were needed on the simplest processor, and the Americans 386,486 released almost every year for the launch of 486 for about 30 years, and that was not a fact. Imagine the USSR did not fall apart, who would need 486 now?
        1. +1
          11 October 2018 10: 24
          What was, what was not and what could be ???
          We must go to the future, but do not forget the old mistakes ... let alone repeat them!
        2. +2
          12 October 2018 05: 32
          Quote: Imobile
          Remind me what they were going to release?

          Remember the clock 7 tunes ??? there were processors from there. These processors were purchased by China, Japan, and even America, according to unverified information. These processors were the cheapest in the world. The approach to the development of production let us down. there was such a time. Perestroika
          1. +1
            12 October 2018 09: 25
            Quote: aybolyt678
            The approach to the development of production let us down

            Unfortunately, the approach in our heads let us down!
    2. +1
      11 October 2018 15: 11
      At the same time, mass media are increasingly reporting on the detection of trojans in microchips.

      I read the topic and listened to the news. And again an accident, fortunately no casualties at the space launch! And even then thanks to the thoughtfulness of the initial designers of the Soyuz! The rescue system worked! It's not in vain that money and valuable kilograms are spent on it.
      But, why the accident ?! Has the microfeedback in the rocket control electronics worked here ?! Will this issue be considered or awaiting human casualties ?!
  2. +1
    10 October 2018 05: 38
    billions of dollars for thoughtless import substitution ... take the necessary measures to neutralize the threat

    Very interesting, especially about thoughtless import substitution ... Can you read more?
    And what measures, according to the author, need to be taken?
    1. +5
      10 October 2018 06: 01
      Quote: tasha
      billions of dollars for thoughtless import substitution ... take the necessary measures to neutralize the threat

      Very interesting, especially about thoughtless import substitution ... Can you read more?
      And what measures, according to the author, need to be taken?

      create your own element base. China was able to do it in a relatively short time, you need to think with your head, and not "tyrit trifle in your pockets."
      1. +3
        10 October 2018 06: 46
        The author writes about "thoughtless import substitution", he knows something, probably ...
        To create my elemental base on previous technologies is not catching up, as it seems to me. We need a transition to other principles, optics, quantum ...
        1. +6
          10 October 2018 07: 18
          Quote: tasha
          We need a transition to other principles, optics, quantum ...

          Who will do it - USE graduates? Ali Chubais? My uncle from Tagil, before retirement (UVZ), said - "There is no adequate change, there is really no one to work."
          1. +4
            10 October 2018 07: 43
            This is all because the lawyers and economists alone have thoughtlessly produced so many that they simply have nowhere to go, and the scientific and engineering school are experiencing serious staffing difficulties and have not yet received proper attention, what a decent change! ! An urgent change of priorities is needed, otherwise nothing will change.
            1. +1
              10 October 2018 11: 32
              Quote: sgrabik
              An urgent change of priorities is needed, otherwise nothing will change.

              You can do this ONLY at the state level, and with the installation you cannot get a competent consumer for any changes. hi
            2. 0
              10 October 2018 22: 19
              thoughtlessly spawned only lawyers and economists so much that they have nowhere to go
              Yes, only according to hh. There is a sharp shortage of highly qualified lawyers in the country. With economists, they are even worse than the lack of them, they are not there at all, even an average level. But there are enough engineers, only our companies are willing to find high-class for 70 tons, and foreigners are willing to pay from 150 - 400 thousand and more. Well, what have we done?
      2. +2
        10 October 2018 08: 10
        Well, suppose China got the basic technology from the USA and Japan. It was advantageous to transfer them to Southeast Asia because of the cheapness of the workforce.
        1. FID
          +3
          10 October 2018 10: 16
          Quote: kuz363
          Well, suppose China got the basic technology from the USA and Japan.

          Got??? And who gave them to him ??? USA, Japan ... Cheap power and technology slave .... Are you out of your mind?
          1. +2
            10 October 2018 10: 23
            Quote: SSI
            Got??? And who gave them to him ??? USA, Japan ...

            Ummm ... what's wrong?

            Moved production to China, along with "technology". And how Chinese people know how to steal is well known.

            They were not "given technology", they were given to steal technology Yes
          2. 0
            12 October 2018 16: 06
            Why not exclude the formation of Chinese companies together with American? Only the United States supplies technology and equipment, while China supplies labor? Everyone benefits. The United States receives finished products at a rate lower than what would be collected in the United States. I bought a Toshiba laptop in Canada at a supermarket back in 2007, 15 inches. So he was Chinese-made. Works like a clock so far. Intel processor dual-core.
    2. +1
      10 October 2018 18: 04
      Quote: tasha
      Can you read more?

      much more? What will they still check? a hammer? magnifying glass? maybe under a microscope? I took a smart watch at Aliexpress, they requested access to everything that is on the phone, and in principle they know everything about me - pressure, heart rate, temperature, how many calories I spent, where I am, how I slept .... After all, there was something in our history that we began to lag behind the 20-30 years of the last century, but we did not buy fordzones in America, we copied them! Stalin bought machines! is it really impossible to circumvent sanctions, purchase equipment for the production of processors, and copy and develop it! And do not take chips! am
      1. Alf
        0
        10 October 2018 20: 40
        Quote: aybolyt678
        is it really impossible to circumvent sanctions, purchase equipment for the production of processors, and copy and develop it!

        What for ? We have no enemies, we have "partners" all around.
      2. 0
        11 October 2018 07: 21
        is it really impossible to circumvent sanctions, purchase equipment for the production of processors, and copy and develop it

        The USSR did something like that. As a result, we have what we have.
  3. +4
    10 October 2018 05: 59
    As far as I know, in the devices of the military, with the exception of perhaps the PC, our microcircuits were always installed, another point is that in our country they produced 180-90NM of those. The process, maybe now they have already finished the AMD factory exported from Germany and switched to 65NM. And as far as I know, they order microcircuits from a contract manufacturer in Asia, but again, masks for lithography are made under our control, and therefore you won’t get any bookmarks in there.
    1. +4
      10 October 2018 16: 58
      Quote: jonht
      maybe now they have already finished the AMD factory exported from Germany and switched to 65НМ.

      You have some outdated data. Not special, but I met Old that they already work with 18nm. 60X48 μ matrix with a dimension of 200X160 pixels, silicon.
      And the fact that only domestic ECB is on military equipment is 100% true.
      So, as in the Falklands, when the French disconnected the Exposet RCC from space in outer space, this will not happen. The author is an alarmist. But there is a problem and it is being solved. Not as fast as we would like, but solved.
      IMHO.
    2. 0
      16 October 2018 18: 12
      Open any domestic modern military radio station - you will see imported equipment
  4. +8
    10 October 2018 06: 14
    Isn’t it time for the heads of the competent departments and ministries, instead of spending billions of dollars on thoughtless import substitution
    - do not make me laugh! In the event of a mess, they will leave for the USA, or Israel ... Or maybe they have already left ... Until we start shooting, there will be no order.
  5. +4
    10 October 2018 06: 26
    Is it not time for the heads of the competent departments and ministries, instead of spending billions of dollars on thoughtless import substitution, to finally assess and realize the harsh reality
    ... They are aware, but it is necessary to build ... But it’s okay to build, someone will build .. And the equipment, and the specialists .., and smart scientific advisers, this is where to get ...
    1. +2
      10 October 2018 18: 10
      Quote: parusnik
      this is where to get ..

      Stalin hired seven thousand American engineers and scientists for six years. It cost less than feed a hundred million Chinese for 28 years, as we do, and obviously we will always continue.
  6. +1
    10 October 2018 06: 28
    Is it time for the heads of the competent departments and ministries ...
    It's time, it's time.
  7. +3
    10 October 2018 07: 00
    What is the difference between reports of Chinese spy microchips
    in amer. equipment, from American messages about
    hacks of this by Russian hackers?
    No different.
    And the goals of such messages are one and
    The same:
    internal, - it is better to overdo than not ...;
    external - send a signal to instructions to external readers.
    Begin to suspect and claim
    the same thing about myself (about the Chinese, about the Russians).
  8. +1
    10 October 2018 07: 36
    about 7-8% of them are irreproducible - who said that ?! It would be a desire. The celestials of the Gaidarokudrin formation are the only things that can replenish the budget by raising taxes on the poorest and increasing the retirement age. The owners do not order to develop their industry, and even more so the backbone of microelectronics - the elemental base.
    1. 0
      10 October 2018 08: 18
      Unfortunately this is the case. You just watch the movie how Intel processors are manufactured in the USA. And you will immediately understand the degree of lag in these technologies. At best, you can only buy equipment and technology from them, but it will be yesterday. And then, if they sell. In any case, their own Russian developments will copy their technologies and nothing else.
    2. +1
      10 October 2018 18: 12
      Quote: edeligor
      The owners do not order to develop their industry, and even more so the backbone of microelectronics - the elemental base.

      the most surprising thing is that Putin gave instructions to reduce the state’s share in the economy. How to develop it by state methods if the state’s share is reduced? Stupidity or something I do not understand?
      1. Alf
        +2
        10 October 2018 20: 43
        Quote: aybolyt678
        How to develop it by state methods if the state’s share is reduced? Stupidity or something I do not understand?

        This is not stupid. This is called Article 64 treason in the form of subversive acts.
  9. +1
    10 October 2018 07: 56
    This is all the legacy of the policies of Gaidar and Chu.
    1. +1
      10 October 2018 08: 50
      Chu-Scarecrow, stuffed !!!
      Just consider that this is just a legacy, naive, it continues to be systematically implemented!
      It just hid under patriotic slogans.
      1. +2
        10 October 2018 09: 48
        So the beginning then was laid. Remember the words of Gaidar. We do not need production, we all buy my own. This is a direct betrayal.
        1. +2
          10 October 2018 10: 26
          Quote: Conductor
          So the beginning then was laid

          The background began a little earlier, the corn mailer tried .... and the beginning from the moment when we rendered the Great Country prosr ---- for sausage, cola, big-poppy and other nishtyaki from the west!
        2. 0
          10 October 2018 12: 46
          Betrayal is not to do anything to rectify the situation 20 years after Gaidar.
          1. 0
            10 October 2018 13: 53
            Myself, they did not betray their selfish interests, not at all!
            And try for the country ??? So are they in that team in which we, the rest of us, were former?
      2. +2
        10 October 2018 18: 14
        Quote: rocket757
        It just hid under patriotic slogans.

        in power a gigantic experience to hide under slogans. Perestroika also began under Lenin!
    2. Alf
      -1
      10 October 2018 20: 43
      Quote: Conductor
      This is all the legacy of the policies of Gaidar and Chu.

      And WHO continues this policy ...
      1. 0
        10 October 2018 22: 31
        Quote: Alf
        And WHO continues this policy ...

        Not a correct formulation of the question, unpromising because ....
        Let us ask a simpler question - And who DOESN'T CONTINUE this policy? - it will be easier to find such, because to search for such., we can not search. Among the center for sure.
        1. Alf
          +1
          10 October 2018 23: 11
          Quote: rocket757
          Not a correct formulation of the question, unpromising because ....

          No, the setting is correct. But the answer immediately leads to the "fierce patriot of Russia" who every time says that he is satisfied with the government's work.
          1. 0
            11 October 2018 10: 39
            Not everyone, but only when they DESERVE! Not true about "frantic patriot of Russia"! I'm a patriot Countries of the Soviets and the oath did not change.
            By the way, you seemed to think that I was pleased with the situation in the country and our government ???
            Without long explanations - I never voted for them and do not intend to - this power is evil, which we foolishly launched into our veins! Now the majority is shaking, certainly the whole working people .... shaking so, sho is not far from the agony!
            1. Alf
              -1
              11 October 2018 19: 51
              Quote: rocket757
              Not everyone, but only when they DESERVE! Not true about "frantic patriot of Russia"! I'm a patriot Countries of the Soviets and the oath did not change.
              By the way, you seemed to think that I was pleased with the situation in the country and our government ???
              Without long explanations - I never voted for them and do not intend to - this power is evil, which we foolishly launched into our veins! Now the majority is shaking, certainly the whole working people .... shaking so, sho is not far from the agony!

              In fact, Putin is called a frenzied patriot of Russia, he once said so to himself.
              1. 0
                11 October 2018 21: 15
                Patriot, does everything for the good of the state, its people ..... for the good of the state, I believe it, because they consider it their property, they try for themselves. For the good of the people - the capitalist will do this only when he puts a Faberge in a vice, and even then the risk of running into a masochist.
  10. 0
    10 October 2018 08: 10
    the government is waiting for manna from heaven, when failures go, imagine what a grand cut you can make on the next rush ... the thought of what it is fraught with for defense is not coming into your head-ass, those who generally suggested buying equipment over the hill
  11. 0
    10 October 2018 10: 45
    They like to scream about the Russian electronic warfare systems that have no analogues, which kill / blind / burn everyone.
    But it turns out they are working on imported electronic components and can easily contain bookmarks and go out silently at the right time.
    How so?
    1. +1
      10 October 2018 11: 13
      But no matter how, you should not believe everything that is printed in the media
    2. +1
      10 October 2018 16: 45
      With the right moment, everything is not so simple.
      So, speaking of bookmarks in general, it’s like a square horse in a vacuum.
  12. +1
    10 October 2018 11: 11
    Recently it became known that Chinese military intelligence installed spy microchips in motherboards

    Another bike, Americanans need absolution, so a bike with Chinese chips was invented.
    1. -1
      10 October 2018 12: 28
      It was in the Union that the gas pipelines that were controlled by purely American systems took off in recent years. Technique is a delicate matter.
  13. 0
    10 October 2018 12: 27
    In the Russian defense ministry, the issue of security monitoring of purchased chips is more than negligent.
    Careless? No, it's criminal!
  14. -1
    10 October 2018 13: 07
    It's no secret that, despite all the efforts and billions of dollars of financial injections, the Russian defense industry was not able to cope with the dependence on the foreign electronic component of the base
    In order for production to be cost-effective, an enterprise must produce military, industrial and domestic element bases. And our figures are drawn to highly specialized emissions that will never pay for themselves. Well, then again for subsidies. As a result, the money spent, and the result is zero point figures hundredths.
    1. 0
      10 October 2018 16: 29
      Elbrus, Baikal and Milandra products - are highly specialized emissions?
      About how much and what has been spent, I don’t even say. First you look at the data on tenders of the Ministry of Industry and Trade.
      Even if the costs for the aforementioned trinity will pay off, but rather will pay off, this is far from "fig hundredths."
      1. -1
        10 October 2018 17: 43
        Quote: Zaits
        Elbrus, Baikal and Milandra products - are highly specialized emissions?

        Quite right. Baikal uses P5600 cores of MIPS32 Release 5 architecture from Imagination Technologies. Another round of sanctions and there won't be any "Baikal". MCST generally re-wedged on "Linuhi", and the fact that a huge number of companies have installed "Vinada" with a set of software that does not work on "Lenuha" is not a narrow specialization. There is no talk at all about everyday use here. And where are the cell phones in which the Milandra element base is used? It is possible to raise the element base only by relying on three areas of military, civilian and domestic. Otherwise, apart from marking time, we will get nothing.
        1. -1
          10 October 2018 21: 48
          Quote: TOR2
          where did the cell phones in which the elemental base of Milander was used

          The market for cell phones is the latest place to go to Zelenograd and, in general, to domestic manufacturers. This market has long been rigidly divided, and it is oversaturated Yes

          Quote: TOR2
          Elemental base can be raised only by relying on three areas of military, civil and domestic

          Who told you that? And how, in your opinion, is “civil” different from “everyday”?

          Quote: Alf
          In which devices are these parts installed? Where can I buy them?

          The Internet is at your service ... and about "buy" - well, please tell me, why do you need the products of the same Milandra, for example?

          1. +1
            11 October 2018 03: 02
            Probably, the comrade meant by "everyday" the category of "mass production", in our opinion - "consumer goods". And he probably forgot that the category implies not only millions of output volumes, but also a small margin in the face of brutal competition.
            1. -2
              11 October 2018 06: 31
              Quote: Zaits
              the category implies not only millionth volumes of output, but also low margin in brutal competition

              In-in ... exactly Yes
        2. +1
          11 October 2018 01: 57
          - The license for the core is purchased, the topology is its own, now it is produced at the Taiwanese factory. And how will the sanctions affect Baikal? Will they put pressure on the Taiwanese? So this moment was initially taken into account. Problems may arise, but they can be solved. In any case, this does not in any way affect the quality of the product. An excellent processor for a wide range of "industrial" tasks.
          - If something happens, and you stupidly disconnect your "Windu". There may be other troubles. First of all, Elbrus is needed just in case of possible troubles. Well, no one canceled other solutions for this class of processor.
          - If someone in our country suffers from moronism, how does this affect the products of Milander? The company produces good processors for a wide range of tasks. Support and documentation at a very decent level.
          - And that's just not necessary about "consumer goods". A lot of companies around the world have not dealt with this segment at all, are not engaged in it and live well without it. It is necessary to do what is most in demand and at the same time feasible. And to fund future research. And having hit now in consumer goods, you can generally profuse everything and be left with nothing.
          1. -2
            22 December 2022 10: 42
            - The license for the core is purchased, the topology is its own, now it is produced at the Taiwanese factory. And how will the sanctions affect Baikal? Will they put pressure on the Taiwanese? So this moment was initially taken into account. Problems may arise, but they can be solved. In any case, this does not in any way affect the quality of the product. An excellent processor for a wide range of "industrial" tasks.


            So what do you think about your analytics?
      2. Alf
        0
        10 October 2018 20: 46
        Quote: Zaits
        Elbrus, Baikal and Milandra products - are highly specialized emissions?
        About how much and what has been spent, I don’t even say. First you look at the data on tenders of the Ministry of Industry and Trade.

        Can I find out in which devices these parts are installed? Where can I buy them?
    2. 0
      10 October 2018 18: 17
      Quote: TOR2
      To make production profitable

      for production to be cost-effective, conditions are needed. These conditions can be protective duties on electronics, quotas. Let all the money raised to develop their own. The only way.
      1. -1
        10 October 2018 19: 29
        Protective duties are also a good tool, but they must be applied very competently. In the absence of competition, their own producers tend to be "skittish". And this is happening not only in our country, but throughout the world. Not so long ago, a case was told. It was necessary to purchase ShRki for work in difficult conditions. So they broke such prices that buying in the west and bringing it turned out to be much cheaper. And it is necessary to deal with such grabbers too.
        1. 0
          10 October 2018 21: 35
          Quote: TOR2
          ShRki

          what it is????
  15. +2
    10 October 2018 16: 16
    Article from the series "I heard the ringing". I was especially amused by the story about "certification tests of foreign-made electronic component base intended for Iskander OTRK". Dear author, "searching for undocumented elements" and other struggle with bookmarks has nothing to do with certification tests of electronic components. And what they are related to is called differently. Anyway, this is the topic where you really need to be on the subject before throwing accusations and the like.
    Everyone knows about the situation with the use of imported electronic components, including our "partners". The foundation of this practice was laid back in the days of the USSR. Still, individual segments of the production of electronic components, especially in the part of VLSI, were failed even then, and the 90s only slightly exacerbated the situation. Attempts are being made to remedy this situation, and there are even some encouraging results. But in general, this process is not at all fast, expensive and very difficult to implement. In short, the topic of your own EEE can be discussed for a long time, but electronics must be done now.
    Given that the situation with the use of imported electronic components lasts more than a dozen years, we have learned something about the safety of imports. So, to all-crawlers and polymers, I would suggest drinking valerian and calm down. In fact, there are much more serious and global security issues regarding communication systems, energy, etc. And these questions concern far not only imports. And how it is there is far from obvious.
  16. +3
    10 October 2018 18: 09
    Quote: rocket757
    So, I don’t want to be sad in the morning. So no, they will add sales not a lemon, but DURIAN to my bright mood .... and the morning was so good, the sun is shining, there is more than one cloud in the sky .... and here, hello. have arrived.
    Enta quote from not quite adequate person, divorced from this world. So watch old Georgian films about the watchmen, those who watch over the watchmen and those who watch over those who watch over the watchmen .... in the wine cellar !!! However, our people have no less accurate definitions. A thief sits on a thief and drives a thief !!!
    Thank you for your attention and understanding. soldier .... and the mood in the morning was so good sad

    Now I will add "positive" to you! laughing Yesterday my friends visited to congratulate on the last day of "jam", they work (serve) at one of the enterprises of the military-industrial complex. There cuts, salaries "fell", bonuses have ceased to be paid, people are fleeing en masse. But this is a very serious enterprise, whose products are heard by everyone! I am writing these lines, and at this time, in the news release of the Zvezda TV channel, the TV presenter, and then the Minister of Defense, in cheerful voices report how many modern and modernized weapons and military equipment are being supplied to the troops ... sad
    1. -1
      11 October 2018 06: 42
      Quote: Radikal
      cuts, wages "fell", bonuses are no longer paid, people are fleeing en masse. But this very serious enterprisewhose products everyone is hearing

      Enterprise something name it, do not be shy ... otherwise it turns out that you wrote ... on the fence wink
  17. 0
    10 October 2018 19: 12
    Who needs those who think and do business on this topic. The problem is old and I heard that 10 years ago. Ashes head nothing to sprinkle. And why are they afraid of the c300 and generally prevent the export of our air defense? And as for the article, I would write a special one, it’s clear that it’s 10% preoccupied with the problem and more like a note for the number of articles, it’s also like throwing a pebble into the water — and based on comments, try to fetch out pieces of information of interest — remember that the site is public and doesn’t it doesn’t solve problems, but comments help these little pieces of information about the enemy to learn what other conclusions to draw from other sources. A talker is a find for a spy.
  18. 0
    10 October 2018 21: 12
    Quote: evgen1221
    Who needs those who think and do business on this topic. The problem is old and I heard that 10 years ago. Ashes head nothing to sprinkle. And why are they afraid of the c300 and generally prevent the export of our air defense? And as for the article, I would write a special one, it’s clear that it’s 10% preoccupied with the problem and more like a note for the number of articles, it’s also like throwing a pebble into the water — and based on comments, try to fetch out pieces of information of interest — remember that the site is public and doesn’t it doesn’t solve problems, but comments help these little pieces of information about the enemy to learn what other conclusions to draw from other sources. A talker is a find for a spy.

    You are not teaching those vigilance, and apparently you yourself have little idea of ​​the process of protecting state secrets! lol
  19. 0
    11 October 2018 02: 34
    Quote: evgen1221
    ... And as for the article ... it’s more like a note for the number of articles as well as throwing a pebble into the water — and, based on comments, try to fish out pieces of information of interest ...

    No, it's just that the author suddenly discovered what any middle-aged developer knows.
    And for the secrets we still keep an eye out for specially trained people.
  20. 0
    11 October 2018 11: 14
    Quote: Golovan Jack
    Quote: Radikal
    cuts, wages "fell", bonuses are no longer paid, people are fleeing en masse. But this very serious enterprisewhose products everyone is hearing

    Enterprise something name it, do not be shy ... otherwise it turns out that you wrote ... on the fence wink

    Now, if here on the site ten times you meow - then I’ll name it. May be. lol wassat tongue
    1. 0
      11 October 2018 13: 39
      Well, you still take the trouble. At least so that your short story is not considered balabolstvo.
      Taki, on average in a hospital, things at the defense industry go far not so badly.
      Although, with individual enterprises, everything happens, but mainly because of the backstage games of individuals. And if there is something from a series of such muddy stories, it would also be interesting.
  21. +1
    11 October 2018 14: 07
    Quote: Zaits
    Well, you still take the trouble. At least so that your short story is not considered balabolstvo.
    Taki, on average in a hospital, things at the defense industry go far not so badly.
    Although, with individual enterprises, everything happens, but mainly because of the backstage games of individuals. And if there is something from a series of such muddy stories, it would also be interesting.

    I see no reason for two reasons. The first - even if I name the company - do you have operational opportunities to double-check my information? I will not indicate the second - perhaps you will guess. hi
  22. 0
    13 October 2018 00: 08
    Well, I, as always, to the "nodding analysis".
    Quote: aybolyt678
    ShRka, what is it ????
    In general, this is of course a slang expression. In the literature, this is called a plug.
    ShR are used to connect the harnesses on the connectors of the structures for passage through the walls of the hermetic compartments, in the places of installation of consumers and in other places where, according to the conditions of operation and repair, separation of devices and assemblies is required. ShR are mainly used for connecting wires with a cross section from 0,35 | to 50mm2 and allow connecting circuits of constant or alternating current systems with voltage up to 1000V and frequency up to 3000 Hz with current strength in contact pair up to 200 A.
    Quote: Golovan Jack
    And how, in your opinion, is “civil” different from “everyday”?

    The civil sector of the element base is divided into two parts: "industrial" and "household". The industrial one is primarily designed for operation in more severe conditions. The household one is essentially a very lightweight version of the industrial one, it does not need such a reserve of strength, and the temperature range revolves around room temperature.
  23. 0
    3 July 2020 02: 17
    The international aspect, thanks for the info