Military Review

Israel did not recognize the facts from the report of the Russian Ministry of Defense: "F-16 have already returned"

246
The Israeli military command does not agree with the conclusions of the Russian Ministry of Defense regarding the tragedy of the IL-20 video conferencing system of Russia, in fact rejecting objective monitoring data presented by the Russian Federation. The IDF continues to declare that at the time of the attack of the Syrian air defense C-200 air defense missile system, all Israeli aircraft were in Israeli airspace, leaving the zone of operations over the eastern part of the Mediterranean.


Israel did not recognize the facts from the report of the Russian Ministry of Defense: "F-16 have already returned"


From the material press service Israeli military department:
The IDF Air Force aircraft did not hide behind any other aircraft, as they were in Israeli airspace at the time when Syrian air defenses shot down Russian IL-20. The collapse of the Russian aircraft as a result of the actions of the Syrian air defense is a serious tragedy, and we share the grief of those who have lost relatives and friends, as well as the pain of all Russian citizens.


Such statements were published in the Twitter account of the Israeli military department after a briefing, which the day before the official representative of the department, Major General Igor Konashenkov, held in the Ministry of Defense.

One of the tweets states that the mechanism for preventing airborne conflicts was activated in the appropriate timeframe. Added that the mechanism worked for 2,5 years.

It is noted that the commander of the Israeli Air Force gave the Russian colleagues a detailed report on the events of that fateful day. The report states that the Syrian air defense forces’s C-200 was used "already after the Israeli F-16 had completed strikes against Hezbollah and the IRGC (Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps) in Syria."

In other words, the data of means of objective control of Israel is challenged by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, and the data of Russian means of objective control is challenged by Israel.
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  1. The leader of the Redskins
    The leader of the Redskins 24 September 2018 06: 54
    -16
    And I am afraid that it will not be possible to prove anything otherwise. The Ministry of Defense is such structures when at any moment one can declare that "this is already classified information."
    1. Bykov.
      Bykov. 24 September 2018 07: 27
      +26
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      And I am afraid that it will not be possible to prove anything otherwise. The Ministry of Defense is such structures when at any moment one can declare that "this is already classified information."

      And so it was clear that the Jews would dodge and unlock.
      1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
        Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 24 September 2018 07: 39
        -9
        I especially like the MO's argument about "just a minute warned." It's just like signing your own helplessness. Those. roughly speaking, they cannot track the situation in the sky. I thought that everything is modern and the S-400, but it turns out that everything is kept on the phone. Without him, the command at AB Khmeimim are blind as kittens and do not know what the incredibly smart and professional Syrian pvoshniki are doing.
        1. Detective
          Detective 24 September 2018 08: 03
          +18
          Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
          I especially like the MO's argument about "just a minute warned." It's just like signing your own helplessness. Those. roughly speaking, they cannot track the situation in the sky. I thought that everything is modern and the S-400, but it turns out that everything is kept on the phone. Without him, the command at AB Khmeimim are blind as kittens and do not know what the incredibly smart and professional Syrian pvoshniki are doing.


          It's just disgusting to read such posts - "but I thought ..." So you really would start thinking if, in fact, do not write such nonsense deliberately! Especially after our military has presented the most detailed data of objective CONTROL! Control is not a phone I tell you just in case! It was about a warning about striking. Those. use of force. There were agreements with Israel about this, which they deigned to violate treacherously. That's why I wrote - they were.
          1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
            Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 24 September 2018 08: 30
            -13
            Quote: Detective
            There were agreements about this with Israel, which they deigned to treacherously violate.

            Judging by the logic of the Ministry of Defense, of course, yes. Israel does not behave according to concepts, Russia allows the bombing of its allies, and the Jews of the Ministry of Defense did not call and notify. The command of AB Khmeimim was waiting for the call, and the Navy generally had a day off - well, you never know who flies overhead, it's dark. But why did our command send IL-20 to the firing zone? The Konashenkov diagram indicates that 4 Israeli F-16 fighters entered the GBU-39 planning bomb launch zone in 21: 39 at a distance of 90 km from the Syrian coast. Our IL-20 at that time flew over Syrian territory from north to south and was in no way able to camouflage Israeli aircraft. The defense ministry was informed at 21.39, and the Syrians began firing at 21.51. IL-20 they shot down in 22.03. So almost 25 minutes were not enough for Il to turn to the left of the danger zone in which the Syrian squadrons are shooting.
            1. Detective
              Detective 24 September 2018 09: 19
              +9
              I do not know how to explain to you in even more detail than Konashenkov. You have even been told that the Israelis' initial information about the attack was not true. Review the MO briefing again and more closely. If you like the position of the liberal media (I will not advertise the newspaper), who, as always, have taken the position "we are to blame for everything, we all lost, leave Syria, etc." and the Israeli command for which everyone around is to blame and "irresponsible Syrians and aggressive Iranians" is certainly a matter of your sympathies and preferences.
              Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
              But why did our command send IL-20 to the firing zone?

              Well, if you are guided by your opinions, the zone of the Israeli shelling is probably the whole region ?! We dodge poorly or do we need permission from the Jews to ask where we can fly while legally in Syria? Il just landed - that's it! We in Syria do not behave according to concepts, but until that moment we tried to negotiate with us, like, as well. Everything is changing. Now about the allies. In this region and in Syria in particular, there are a lot of players and all kinds of forces that have been at war with each other for a long time. The situation is more complicated than you are trying to imagine. Officially, Israel strikes against pro-Iranian formations in Syria acting against Israel or potentially being its opponents, convoys delivering weapons to these forces and storage areas. Russia took a position of emphasized non-interference in Iran - Israeli disassembly. On the one hand, refusing Israel to try to persuade Russia to expel Iran from Syria, on the other hand, Iran does not have constant requests to put modern air defense systems in Syria ... Until a certain time, believing that we have at least least normal relations ... Israel, its villainy, was the first to substitute. Still have some questions ?!
              1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
                Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 24 September 2018 09: 43
                -1
                Quote: Detective
                Il just landed - that's it!

                In 21.51 IL-20 being above AB Khmeimim receives a command to go in a straight line to the Tartus area and with a right-hand turn build an approach pattern. And at that time, Syrian air defense was already operating there, and IL-20 was sent to this zone.
                1. thrush
                  thrush 24 September 2018 10: 44
                  +3
                  Quote: Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
                  Quote: Detective
                  Il just landed - that's it!

                  In 21.51 IL-20 being above AB Khmeimim receives a command to go in a straight line to the Tartus area and with a right-hand turn build an approach pattern. And at that time, Syrian air defense was already operating there, and IL-20 was sent to this zone.


                  why are you modestly silent about the movement of F16 towards Il 20 ... when the entire link hangs at a distance and interferes ... explain this maneuver to me .. the version of recognizing the aircraft as a version has already been considered. and still a tiny nuance unannounced .. this fighter did this maneuver with the jamming system turned on or not ..
                  1. region58
                    region58 24 September 2018 12: 01
                    0
                    Quote: thrush
                    you are silent about the movement of F16 in the direction of IL 20 ... when the entire link is hanging out at a distance and interferes .. explain this maneuver to me ..

                    In your opinion, does this justify the launch of an air defense missile in the zone of IL-20? There are two options: either they didn’t know that our plane was there and shot, or they knew, and still shot ... In both cases the answers are ... inconvenient, let's say ...
              2. ender
                ender 24 September 2018 10: 32
                -7
                even as it is.
                Russia took a position of emphasized non-interference in Iran - Israeli disassembly.

                Israel its first villainy was the first.


                elementary question: - why is Israel substituted?
                1. thrush
                  thrush 24 September 2018 10: 57
                  +4
                  Quote: ender
                  even as it is.
                  Russia took a position of emphasized non-interference in Iran - Israeli disassembly.

                  Israel its first villainy was the first.


                  elementary question: - why is Israel substituted?


                  an elementary answer .. Israel is not an independent state ... without the support of the USA, you will be torn as a tazik a heating pad ... those who wish there are a dime a dozen ... so they were forced to substitute on the orders ... since including the same IL 20 oh how he annoyed to them in Idlib .. breaking plans ... so that the situation was calculated and worsened relations between Syria, Iran and Russia .. well, don’t glue the Turks yet .. only the allies, as usual, immediately said that we didn’t stick a finger at you ... sorry brother ... you have a lot of immigrants from Russia, you know how badly we are ... we have a good memory ..
                  1. ender
                    ender 24 September 2018 11: 18
                    -3
                    a brilliant answer without an answer and another accusation without evidence. as usual. Moreover, then the states indicate Israel, then Israel indicates the states .. you change your shoes just on the fly. Anyway. This means that Israel does not need this. Move on.
                    And what is the US benefit from this incident. specifically in what? and at the same time, is there a direct interest in Syria and Iran?

                    ps
                    we have a good memory ..
                    Turkey .. su-24 ..
                    1. thrush
                      thrush 24 September 2018 11: 23
                      -1
                      Quote: ender
                      ps
                      we have a good memory ..
                      Turkey .. su-24 ..


                      and where is Turkey now ...?

                      and don’t worry about Syria and Iran ... The Syrian crew has already been gutted completely stopudovo ... maybe their interest was to show their lack of professionalism and be strengthened by Russian crews .. how is this version ..?
                      1. ender
                        ender 24 September 2018 11: 57
                        -1
                        and where is Turkey now ...?


                        1. occupies the north of Syria
                        2. received the most profitable Russian economic projects and new Russian air defense systems and, moreover, for Russian money

                        what a terrible revenge ... Israel avenge the same?

                        how is that version ..?


                        from a global anti-Russian conspiracy to a pair of lazy Syrian soldiers? here it is storming, so stormy ..
                    2. Cheldon
                      Cheldon 24 September 2018 20: 00
                      +2
                      After our pilot Peshkov died (the kingdom be upon him), about 20 Turkish pilots perished from the terrorist attack of the Kurds (who had no business with the Turkish pilots before). If a number of Israeli pilots die from a Palestinian attack, I won’t be surprised
                2. ljoha_d
                  ljoha_d 25 September 2018 15: 25
                  0
                  Apparently due to a sense of impunity
          2. pru-pavel
            pru-pavel 24 September 2018 08: 35
            -9
            Quote: Detective
            Especially after our military presented the most detailed data of objective control!



            And what, in your understanding, is objective control data and to whom and by whom were it provided? Or cartoons from a briefing is this the data of objective control?
            1. FORS
              FORS 24 September 2018 09: 55
              +5
              "Cartoons" are made for clarity based on data from the target wiring cripples, screenshots of locators and other OK tools. If necessary, they will provide the originals of all the data of objective control with an indication of the time, recording of telephone conversations, radio exchange of Jewish F-16s.
              1. pru-pavel
                pru-pavel 24 September 2018 14: 20
                -1
                Well, we can’t verify that they are made on the basis of these data, or some other data, in fact this is the problem. In fact, we just take our word for it, and everyone decides who to believe and for what reasons.
            2. astepanov
              astepanov 24 September 2018 10: 16
              +4
              Quote: pru-pavel
              And what, in your understanding, is objective control data and to whom and by whom were it provided? Or cartoons from a briefing is this the data of objective control?
              Would you like to be personally provided with kilometer-long "sheets" of all records, printouts, etc.? Isn't there a lot of honor?
              But the situation is strange and dangerous. The President speaks of "a chain of fatal accidents." Israel insists that everything was smart, everyone was warned in time, and the crooked-handed Syrian air defense men are to blame, who smacked right and left after the F-16 was gone. Our military denies Israel's data and makes arguments that look very weighty. It is clear that at least two of these three are lying - if not all three, but we want to believe our military.
              This is not the first time the government is setting up the military - and is there a conflict between the Defense Ministry and the president's team? There are enough reasons for this: both the fact that the authorities ousted themselves for the murder of a Russian pilot in Turkey with the "tomato war" and wiped themselves out after the defeat of PMC Wagner (it is clear that there were military men there, and not paintball fans), and a very dubious arrangement of posts in the Ministry of Defense, when civil ignoramuses are entrusted with affairs in a department alien to them on the basis of "proximity to the body." I really would not like to end up with a putsch like Pinochetovsky, even from the best intentions.
            3. Yuyuka
              Yuyuka 24 September 2018 11: 38
              +1
              Quote: pru-pavel
              Quote: Detective
              Especially after our military presented the most detailed data of objective control!



              And what, in your understanding, is objective control data and to whom and by whom were it provided? Or cartoons from a briefing is this the data of objective control?


              Well, everything is clear here - the motto of Israel in this situation is "everyone is to blame except us!" Nobody will reveal all the secrets, and what's the point? We would like to resolve the situation, we would not have behaved this way after the death of IL
          3. Stirbjorn
            Stirbjorn 24 September 2018 08: 59
            +1
            Quote: Detective
            It was about a strike warning. Those. use of force.

            And how to warn, if not by phone? What is the nonsense? So far, they are counting on warnings, agreements, etc., and will continue to bear losses. Neither the Turks, nor the Jews, nor the Yankees are bothering with this, but are counting, first of all, on their means of tracking. Therefore, their losses are not even close to ours.
            1. Detective
              Detective 24 September 2018 10: 16
              +1
              The nonsense is that the person here combines such positions as warning about intentions, i.e. about an impact and tracking the situation in the air. That is, according to the logic of things, from what he writes it turns out that if we were misled about the place of the strike and warned in a minute (which violated the previous agreements), then we did not know what was going on in the air. This is not true. If the comrades below have more reason to trust for one reason or another (I can’t know them) or just like that on the Israeli side than our military is their own business. I do not have the urge to persuade them.
          4. Roman Skomorokhov
            Roman Skomorokhov 24 September 2018 09: 23
            -4
            Quote: Detective
            Especially after our military presented the most detailed data of objective control!


            Where can you see them? Or is it "very secret"? And yes, where were all those S-400, Pantsirei, and ship operators?
            Yes, yes, those who "saw" the launches from the French ship, which were not there, but did not see the planes that successfully bombed.
            But yes, Israel is guilty of everything.
            1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
              Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 24 September 2018 09: 45
              -3
              Quote: Banshee
              But yes, Israel is guilty of everything.

              Novel hi Here the audience does not want to think critically and analyze. If there is no water in the tap ... Now the adherents of the press service of the Ministry of Defense of Russia will blame you for emotions.
              Quote: Banshee
              And yes, where were all those S-400, Pantsirei, and ship operators? Yes, yes, those who "saw" the launches from the French ship, which were not there, but did not see the planes that successfully bombed.

              "+" From me to you.
              1. The leader of the Redskins
                The leader of the Redskins 24 September 2018 21: 19
                -2
                But on the "-" it is clear how many particularly stubborn adherents of the sect "I believe MO and zombie!"))))
            2. BecmepH
              BecmepH 24 September 2018 11: 01
              +2
              Quote: Banshee
              launches from a French ship that were not there

              How do you know this? Or do you have your own informed sources?
            3. Nosgoth
              Nosgoth 25 September 2018 17: 03
              -1
              Quote: Banshee
              And where can I see them?

              Is the honor great? If there is any interest among representatives of the Ministry of Defense of other countries, their governments, investigation groups, etc., then they will be given. But no one will puzzle over how to convince you.

              Our MO at least showed something. What did the Israelites show? NOTHING. But the liberal-minded is always NOTHING from the West is always more convincing than any evidence of our side.
          5. KERMET
            KERMET 24 September 2018 11: 42
            +1
            Nitsche that the Israelis, according to the same Konashenkov, treacherously violated these agreements almost constantly (in the amount of 25 times!) And before this incident, our MoD silently demolished it and all expected some advance from the Israelis
        2. SGarnik
          SGarnik 24 September 2018 08: 12
          -6
          I thought that we had everything modern and the S-400, but it turns out that everything rests on the phone.

          I also crept in such a thought. I think ours, before sharing data with the Syrian air defense, are forced to receive good from our command.
        3. Boomandroid
          Boomandroid 24 September 2018 09: 23
          -3
          You’ll strain your head a little bit! Such situations were the sea! Just maybe they didn’t give a command, shoot down!
        4. Petrix
          Petrix 24 September 2018 10: 39
          -1
          Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
          I especially like the MO's argument about "just a minute warned"

          I am warning you. Israel will continue to strike. Call whoever you can and tell the MO that they will bomb this month and throughout the year and generally while there is war - they will bomb.
          Well, that’s it. Now the MOs have been warned for years to come! Now this excuse will not hide.
      2. Gray brother
        Gray brother 24 September 2018 07: 45
        +9
        Quote: Bulls.
        And so it was clear that the Jews would dodge and unlock.

        Classic hutspa.
        1. Aristarkh Lyudvigovich
          Aristarkh Lyudvigovich 24 September 2018 08: 00
          -14
          By the way, did any of you ever think that the Syrian military are armed with anti-ship systems? What if they mistakenly blasphemed the Bastion, for example, according to the French frigate FS "Auvergne" and drowned our TFR or BOD? Who would the Defense Ministry blame for this?
          1. New Year day
            New Year day 24 September 2018 09: 03
            +1
            Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
            What if they mistakenly blundered

            and if they shmalnuli not by mistake, but by intent? Has anyone ever had such a hypothesis?
            "Sanaa" writes - "finally Israel will pay for everything"
            1. Shahno
              Shahno 24 September 2018 10: 05
              -7
              Yes, if so, then yes ... it is not clear what they rejoice at.
              1. New Year day
                New Year day 24 September 2018 10: 07
                -4
                Quote: Shahno
                Yes, if so, then yes ...

                like Mulerman - "and not that" yes "", and not that "no"
          2. spektr9
            spektr9 24 September 2018 09: 39
            +2
            What if they mistakenly blasphemed the Bastion, for example, according to the French frigate FS "Auvergne"
            It is necessary to put nuclear weapons to them so that they would mistakenly fuck you in your Jewish state, and everything in the world will get better
          3. BecmepH
            BecmepH 24 September 2018 11: 04
            0
            Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
            drowned our TFR or BOD?

            The gut is thin. Everything is just a sneak ...
      3. Borets
        Borets 24 September 2018 08: 41
        +7
        Israel does not admit guilt that they were involved in the deaths. GUILTY! Because bombed the territory of a sovereign state! They had nothing to do there, if they hadn’t bombed Syria, they wouldn’t have shot down our plane!
      4. Maz
        Maz 24 September 2018 09: 59
        +8
        Oh shy, you would read the comments of the Russian Israelis in the articles of the Israeli media, where if you do not support the version of Israel, then at least you are an anti-Semite, then swearing, swearing, threats and a call to get out. The media are unequivocally on the side of those who turned it all over the Mediterranean. The journalist who first said that Israel is to blame for the deaths of the Russian military has long been out of earshot and is clogged with anti-Russian hysteria. Yes, Israel is not our friend twice now. But ours are also "good", have profited a single air defense system. Got it. They knew that Israel only cares about the United States and its own ears. Additional partners. 14 not boys, regular officers, not for hell. Israel would have already started the war. And no one would dare to condemn.
    2. Sergey Medvedev
      Sergey Medvedev 24 September 2018 08: 02
      +29
      Quote: Leader of the Redskins
      And I am afraid that it will not be possible to prove anything otherwise. The Ministry of Defense is such structures when at any moment one can declare that "this is already classified information."

      Secret information is Jane Psaki’s hobby, and ours have declassified a lot of things, for example, on a rocket in the wreckage of a Boeing.
      Answer Tsakhal is the same rotten excuse as our members of the forum, apparently, Israeli army officials graze here. Now compare the charges:
      1. Deception at the site of the strike F-16. West Syria instead of north. There is simply nothing to answer.
      2. The warning about striking in 1 minute the aerospace forces considers abnormal, Tsahal considers normal. I agree with ours.
      3. Tsahal still said that their planes were already the airspace of Israel. There is a specific contradiction with ours. I believe ours. After all, the Israelis did not conduct any briefing, did not present their objective control data, did not even draw a cartoon! Well, spruce-burns.
      And in general, here Konashenkov presented the position of the Ministry of Defense. And AOI has a faceless twitter account. There is no one even to present for a lie. And remove it for long, in which case.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. The comment was deleted.
          1. mvg
            mvg 24 September 2018 09: 49
            -4
            irrefutable evidence

            "Evidence" can be presented by Israel (EL / M-2080 "Green Pine"), and the United States, they have a sickly radar there (radar AN / TPY-2, in the Negev), the strongest on the BV.
            We don’t have such people there. And who will the world believe?
            1. Yuyuka
              Yuyuka 24 September 2018 10: 01
              +5
              Quote: mvg
              irrefutable evidence

              "Evidence" can be presented by Israel (EL / M-2080 "Green Pine"), and the United States, they have a sickly radar there (radar AN / TPY-2, in the Negev), the strongest on the BV.
              We don’t have such people there. And who will the world believe?


              If they could - they presented it ... And what proof is needed? What did they substitute - did not substitute? So the main thing is not this, there is a whole series of ", as they say mildly," unfriendly "steps. Directly or indirectly, they still led to a tragedy.

              The world is a very voluminous concept ... depending on what you mean by this meaning. If the "troika" is Coward, Goonies and Experienced (France, USA and England - you can assign the roles yourself laughing ), so it's not even half the world. This is a spoonful of shit (racy) in a barrel of world honey. Honey is just produced by the "third world" or developing countries.

              The world now "believes" in interference in elections, "newcomers", chemical attacks, before that the "occupation" of Crimea, a Malaysian liner, a psycho Rodchenkov, a test tube with anthrax ... but you never know "the Englishwoman will shit!"
              1. mvg
                mvg 24 September 2018 14: 27
                -2
                The world is a very voluminous concept ...

                Imagine, in this "voluminous world" there are NO countries that will stand up for us. From the word ALL. At best, they will remain silent. And China, and Belarus, and Kazakhstan and Serbia. And everyone doesn't care about Syria and Iran. From the word "bolt".
                1. Yuyuka
                  Yuyuka 24 September 2018 17: 54
                  0
                  Quote: mvg
                  The world is a very voluminous concept ...

                  Imagine, in this "voluminous world" there are NO countries that will stand up for us. From the word ALL. At best, they will remain silent. And China, and Belarus, and Kazakhstan and Serbia. And everyone doesn't care about Syria and Iran. From the word "bolt".


                  bye! also news to me ... and the hunt was such a gain ... Russia had two allies in the 19th century, now three - VKS were added, so it's time to come up with a horror story wassat

                  dog-dog. sense from the western coalition - for so many years zilch alone. No one really knows how many countries there are - it changed from 40 to 70! But the Bosko slaughtered - all over the world they showed! Russia has entered - everything, the kina is gone.
                  1. mvg
                    mvg 24 September 2018 18: 46
                    0
                    Russia has entered - everything, the kina is gone

                    Rare nonsense. She entered 3 years ago, once 5-6 they had already announced that DAISH was over, and they, the bastard, did not read the newspaper, so they were attacking right now, on all fronts ...
                    But the West is a drum to the peace of Syria and Russian interests ... But the turmoil in BV is just interesting
                    1. Gray brother
                      Gray brother 24 September 2018 19: 17
                      +1
                      Quote: mvg
                      announced that daesh end

                      I know one American president who said the same thing and hinted that the Russians did nothing - this is an American victory.
                      1. mvg
                        mvg 24 September 2018 19: 21
                        0
                        I know one American president

                        Tamara and I, we walk in pairs ... Well, the "redhead" only once said about Iraq ... Iraq is more or less calm. But in Syria there is a war, planes are falling. In Idlib, 30-40 thousand barmaley sit around, building up their muscles.
      2. Stirbjorn
        Stirbjorn 24 September 2018 09: 02
        +2
        Quote: Sergei Medvedev
        2. The warning about striking in 1 minute the aerospace forces considers abnormal, Tsahal considers normal. I agree with ours.

        I consider it abnormal to count on IDF warnings in the war zone. You have to be prepared for everything, including a direct hit on your objects
      3. NIKN
        NIKN 24 September 2018 09: 14
        +5
        Quote: Sergei Medvedev
        Answer Tsakhal is the same rotten excuse as our members of the forum, apparently, Israeli army officials graze here. Now compare the charges:
        1. Deception at the site of the strike F-16. West Syria instead of north. There is simply nothing to answer

        And the first well or zero in this list should probably be this:
        0. Israel strikes at a sovereign state justifying itself as in kindergarten "And they were the first to start ...."
      4. Vanek
        Vanek 24 September 2018 10: 46
        0
        Quote: Sergei Medvedev
        There is no one to even present for a lie


        Voooot. Here he can:

        Quote: Sergei Medvedev
        faceless twitter


        Quote: Sergei Medvedev
        didn’t even draw a cartoon! Well, spruce-burns.


        Sergei. Well, what are the "fir-palas"? It's just an unprintable word.

        Sergei Ivanovich hi
      5. mvg
        mvg 24 September 2018 14: 30
        0
        Warning for striking for 1 minute, the VKS considers abnormal, Tsahal considers normal. I agree with ours.

        Only itio.ty warn about the impact XNUMX hours in advance, so that they are "greeted" with open arms. The main thing in an attack is surprise. Jews are not fools. And somehow they believe more than the RF Ministry of Defense, which contradicts itself. Sometimes they are guilty, sometimes they are not.
  2. Uncle lee
    Uncle lee 24 September 2018 06: 55
    +11
    Yes, he was always a debater
    If you stick to the wall, you will refuse!
  3. Andrey Yuryevich
    Andrey Yuryevich 24 September 2018 06: 56
    +2
    I don’t understand where the data of the means of objective control? What are they pouring into our ears? nobody already has faith.
    1. Bull Terrier
      Bull Terrier 24 September 2018 06: 59
      +6
      But who will put them on display then? Even if ours are open, Israel will not do it for sure. This will continue - they will be blamed, and they will say that the Syrians fired into the air like machine guns when they all left.
    2. GRF
      GRF 24 September 2018 07: 49
      -3
      Quote: Andrew Y.
      I don’t understand where the data of the means of objective control? What are they pouring into our ears? nobody already has faith.

      It’s just that you don’t know how to believe, or to try to learn how to believe others, and this and that is sad ...
  4. merkavaa
    merkavaa 24 September 2018 06: 57
    -25
    Someone in the Ministry of Defense does not want to be responsible for their mistakes, even at the cost of truth and relations with Israel.
    1. Tank hard
      Tank hard 24 September 2018 07: 02
      +30
      Quote: merkavaa
      even at the cost of truth and relations with Israel.

      You have already broken off your relationship with Russia, what do you care? Let's goodbye! laughing
    2. Volodin
      Volodin 24 September 2018 07: 02
      +36
      Indeed, no one in the Israeli Defense Ministry wants to answer for their mistakes, even at the cost of truth and relations with Russia.

      Did the Israeli aircraft interfere? Was it not Israeli aviation that "rubbed" at the Russian military base in Syria? I remember how, after the tragedy with the Il-20, Israel did not even recognize the presence of its F-16s there - it was silent for several days.
      1. The comment was deleted.
        1. igorbrsv
          igorbrsv 24 September 2018 07: 30
          +9
          And if you saw them that they had to bring down, so that there was evidence?
          1. Ncplc
            Ncplc 24 September 2018 07: 36
            -21
            But what about a single air defense system? Then they definitely should have known where the IL, and where F, why then did they shoot at all?
            1. merkavaa
              merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 45
              -19
              Quote: Ncplc
              But what about a single air defense system?

              They are silent about this, all the same, Israel is to blame.
              I do not exclude that with 400 it worked.

              In general, even the comical situation "we are not to blame for anything", tin of course. All breasts are in medals, but like children.
              1. andj61
                andj61 24 September 2018 10: 32
                +1
                Quote: merkavaa
                They are silent about this, all the same, Israel is to blame.

                Each ram should be suspended by its own ... ears.
                Israel is to blame - at least for violating the agreements. I warned about the blow not in advance, but a minute before; and the warning was, to put it mildly, unreliable - it is unlikely that Latakia can be fully considered "northern Syria" - it is always designated as western Syria.
                But the Syrians are also not without sin. If there is a Russian aircraft in the combat zone, and even without a "friend or foe" recognition system, then you don't even need to shoot. Moreover, the effectiveness of the Syrian S-200 firing against Israeli aircraft is extremely low.
                And Russia should not take into account the interests of all its "friends" in this tight region, and even those who are mutually exclusive. First of all, you need to ensure your security and your interests, and then think about the interests of Israel and Syria.
                Already over Latakia the sky can - technically - be covered up altogether without the participation of the Syrians. No one should be allowed to fly practically over our bases!
                I hope that the conclusions from this tragedy will be made correct.
        2. merkavaa
          merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 35
          -23
          Quote: Ncplc
          not a single S-200; 300: 400 saw them ??

          Somehow they want to "close the sky", if they don't know where anyone is shooting where, they don't see anyone.
          1. igorbrsv
            igorbrsv 24 September 2018 07: 40
            +2
            I think they see, but the conflict with the downing of f was not justified. By and large, I also think that the problems with the coordination of air defense of Syria and the Russian Federation
          2. The comment was deleted.
          3. Bull Terrier
            Bull Terrier 24 September 2018 08: 53
            +4
            Well, it’s better for God to be silent than to speak sometimes ... who said that they were not seen? There around forever someone flies, but do not strike. Are you able to understand this? They believed you, and simply did not react. You started to bomb. Some wildness is simple. It still does not reach the point that if you didn’t strike this blow, these 15 people would be alive. Do you understand? Alive!
            1. The comment was deleted.
              1. Kurare
                Kurare 24 September 2018 10: 03
                +6
                Quote: Ncplc
                The fact that they were not seen becomes clear from the report of MO No. 1 - it says there — they flew at a low height, shot back, covered themselves with IL and left, briefing

                How could they not be seen if they provided objective control data?
                Quote: Ncplc
                No. 2 - spun at an altitude of 10 km and an extension of 90 km from the base and for half an hour !!

                They also dropped GBU-39 before that. And they showed where. And further, that one of the F-16 "went out of order" and approached the Il-20, hiding behind it from the side of a possible attack by air defense means.

                You too underestimate the possibility of controlling the territory of Syria with Russian air defense systems. If you have not put everything on the table, this does not mean that there is no such information. It’s just not subject to disclosure. Oh, you, as an Israelite - it should be clear.
            2. Yuyuka
              Yuyuka 24 September 2018 09: 27
              +6
              Quote: Bull Terrier
              Well, it’s better for God to be silent than to speak sometimes ... who said that they were not seen? There around forever someone flies, but do not strike. Are you able to understand this? They believed you, and simply did not react. You started to bomb. Some wildness is simple. It still does not reach the point that if you didn’t strike this blow, these 15 people would be alive. Do you understand? Alive!


              It seems that we had too high an opinion about the moral character of the Israeli "comrades" ... and about the perception of reality - they confuse cause-and-effect relationships. The devil is in the details, they omit just one - what vegetable did they strike in this place ?? Everything else follows from this! But no, as zombie talk about like a mantra for different voices "we have the right, everyone is to blame, you do not love us, you are anti-Semites"
        3. Rurikovich
          Rurikovich 24 September 2018 08: 13
          +13
          Quote: Ncplc
          : 400 did not see them

          But sho, it was necessary to bring down the USB stick for proof? Would you then whine to the whole world, that Russia shot down a peacefully flying Israeli plane peacefully bombing Syrian targets ... Hypocrites ....
          1. mvg
            mvg 24 September 2018 09: 26
            -6
            you would whine then all over the world

            Did the Jews "whine" about Fu-16? And no earlier .. Only we and the Turks are capable of this .. And the Su-24 and Il-20 in the war. For this they sign a contract and pay money. When flying out on a combat mission, you always need to expect to be shot down. Even an ally or neutral ..
            "It's a pity for the guys," it's nothing that no one forced them to go there, but by Goodwill? Barmaley are fighting for denyuzhka and do not cry, but ours, how are they different?
          2. Yjt
            Yjt 24 September 2018 10: 54
            -8
            Whine the whole world is you in the face of your MO. When our plane was shot down, we immediately recognized that there was a mistake ours and the snot was not smeared, and we did not blame anyone, unlike your MO.
            Do not value your people!
        4. MKPU-115
          MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 32
          +3
          Quote: Ncplc
          Volodin — it would be better if your MO was silent than to say such a thing! He says Israeli planes at an altitude of 10 km and an extension of 90 km from the Russian base hung almost half an hour !!! And not one S-200; 300: 400 did not see them ?? So who will buy them from you after that?

          It's a hint? So you need to fill up a couple of F-35 Israel and the C-400 will diverge with a bang, nothing personal, just business. laughing
      2. The comment was deleted.
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        3. MoJloT
          MoJloT 24 September 2018 09: 47
          +3
          Before the dead is not even ashamed.
          Unscrupulous evil, lying herd of orcs, Israel, along with all the contents in the ban !!! Do you hear
    3. anjey
      anjey 24 September 2018 07: 10
      +28
      True and Israel is nonsense ...
    4. Cheldon
      Cheldon 24 September 2018 07: 55
      +10
      Quote: merkavaa
      Someone in the Ministry of Defense does not want to be responsible for their mistakes, even at the cost of truth and relations with Israel.

      At the briefing of the Ministry of Defense it was said that the IL-20 was flying in northern Syria, yours called and said that the raid would be carried out from the northern direction. IL-20 moved to the south, from where "valiantly", in the best traditions of the Luftwaffe, the meanness was carried out.
    5. ultra
      ultra 24 September 2018 08: 16
      +4
      Quote: merkavaa
      and relations with Israel.

      "Il" died precisely because of "relations" with Israel.
      1. igorbrsv
        igorbrsv 24 September 2018 08: 32
        0
        More likely because of the United States. It seems so to me. They are the "world policeman", they muddy the waters
    6. 1 Navigator
      1 Navigator 24 September 2018 08: 56
      -10
      Here, most commentators deny the real thing, and comment on and support the position of the guarantor and senior officials. If tomorrow the guarantor says to shit in bed, then 90% of commentators will say that this is correct.
    7. mirag2
      mirag2 24 September 2018 09: 10
      +5
      merkavaa That's right, accurate to the BEYOND: IDF does not want to be responsible for its mistakes, especially since relations with Russia for Israel are NOTHING.38billion from the USA, recognition as the capital of Jerusalem is yes !!! The rest of the spray and to Eretz Yisrael has nothing to do. In general.
      1. Andrey Panov
        Andrey Panov 24 September 2018 09: 35
        +2
        Why is it a mistake? It was clearly planned and carried out reconnaissance in battle! And somewhere nearby, the aircraft carrier is hanging around.
    8. shulgin
      shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 41
      -3
      Quote: merkavaa
      Someone in the Ministry of Defense does not want to be responsible for their mistakes, even at the cost of truth and relations with Israel.
      The fight for Putin’s legacy began, the course marked Iran. And this is what lies what is not - anyway. Israel must understand, the Russian Defense Ministry now speaks for Iran.
      1. Shahno
        Shahno 24 September 2018 10: 16
        -4
        Yes, we have already understood.
  5. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 24 September 2018 07: 00
    +26
    Trying to save face ... I trust the conclusions of our MO. The muddy fuss of four fighters - provoking shooting near the approach route ... What was that? At the same time, they interfered, they knew that "friend or foe" did not work, they saw our plane in the air ... The rest was "rotten excuses" ...
    1. 1 Navigator
      1 Navigator 24 September 2018 09: 04
      -4
      The trouble is that IL-20 was between f-16 and s-200 and why the RP, led by your wise command, did not direct the plane towards the ATS, but directed the plane towards the sea, in the direction where the Syrian air defense was grumbling. They got it completely, and now you tell tales. And not why hand out weapons to the Indians, the weapons of the Arabs - STICK.
      1. Andrey VOV
        Andrey VOV 24 September 2018 09: 39
        +3
        Dear, have you dug up the whole bulb? Go better dig .... and before you give out such pearls, find out where and where the plane flew and how ...
    2. shulgin
      shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 44
      -4
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      I trust the findings of our MO
      Trust, of course, one conclusion, your military does not know or do not understand what they are doing. According to the right for them to retrain, but to beg Israel for retraining so that they do to you. After all, even in your opinion they made you like kittens of the blind. And you cheated.
  6. GELEZNII_KAPUT
    GELEZNII_KAPUT 24 September 2018 07: 05
    +2
    Yes, in any case, this was done on purpose, but the United States, Israel and other "friends" of Syria do not have this, but we do it regularly, because everything goes down on the brakes ...
    1. GELEZNII_KAPUT
      GELEZNII_KAPUT 24 September 2018 08: 30
      +1
      Yes, in any case, this was done on purpose, but the United States, Israel and other "friends" of Syria do not have this, but we do it regularly, because everything goes down on the brakes ...

  7. Yak28
    Yak28 24 September 2018 07: 06
    -16
    How could Syrian air defense have fired on a Russian airplane? People there with a lack of intelligence manage the march there. We came up with some ridiculous nonsense that the Israeli pilots were hiding behind our plane, and the fact that the rucksack operator of the air defense complex is normal, that our military could not establish interaction with the Syrian air defense forces is also in the order of things.
    1. igorbrsv
      igorbrsv 24 September 2018 08: 37
      +3
      Here many disagree with you. But in fact, if a war happens, the excuse "covered by our plane" will sound even more stupid
  8. Tank hard
    Tank hard 24 September 2018 07: 06
    +11

    Israeli military command does not agree with the conclusions of the Russian Ministry of Defense

    And Baba Yaga is against it! laughing
    1. alexsipin
      alexsipin 24 September 2018 07: 17
      -28
      Quote: Tank Hard
      Israeli military command does not agree with the conclusions of the Russian Ministry of Defense
      And Baba Yaga is against it!

      Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews. You have everything by order. Weather vane.
      1. Tank hard
        Tank hard 24 September 2018 07: 28
        +10
        Quote: alexsipin
        Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews.

        True friends ... yes
        Quote: alexsipin
        You

        And in our apartment there is gas
        And you? tongue
        Quote: alexsipin
        Weathervane

        I’m your Yiddish not rozum, express yourself more clearly. request
        1. alexsipin
          alexsipin 24 September 2018 08: 49
          -12
          Quote: Tank Hard
          I’m your Yiddish not rozum, express yourself more clearly.

          You have everything by order, today they said on TV to hate - you will be languishing with hatred. Tomorrow they will order love - you will climb with love. Remember what tons of hatred poured on the Turks, and then literally in one day everything changed to usi-pusi with Turkey.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. alexsipin
              alexsipin 24 September 2018 09: 20
              -11
              Quote: Sirocco

              Do not judge by yourself all. For more than a century, Jews have been driven as lousy in a bathhouse, just about what your post is about,)))

              Found something to be proud of - pogroms.
              Quote: Sirocco

              And it’s not for you to corrupt immigrants to judge us and your homeland. Judas Izsoyuz))))

              Russian, who moved from the Asian republics to Russia - also write this way? The homeland of the Jews is Israel. The homeland of the Russians is Russia.
              1. Sirocco
                Sirocco 24 September 2018 09: 45
                +3
                Quote: alexsipin
                Found something to be proud of - pogroms.

                You see how it turns out that someone, out of kindness from the moderators, deleted my post, but thanks to you, he is alive, and your lies and provocation are still alive. As with IL 20. I did not write about pogroms, and this is your version))))) Well, they drove me, I think not just like that, just like that, even a boil does not happen.
                Quote: alexsipin
                Russian, who moved from the Asian republics to Russia - also write this way?

                Another provocation that the moderator does not respond to. There is nothing to pit the Russians with each other; in Syria, bullying against the Syrians did not work. came to work here? Why were they silent on the first day? and now the whole company is grazing here))))
                Quote: alexsipin
                The homeland of the Jews is Israel.

                Until the late 40s, there was not even a name for such a state, and the Jews did not have such a homeland.
                Each person has a homeland - this is the place where he was born and raised. It is impossible to choose a homeland, like parents, it is given once and for all at birth.
                So where is it with you? ))))) Where is the homeland of the Gypsies?
                Quote: alexsipin
                The homeland of the Russians is Russia.

                Captain evidence, thanks for reminding me))))) Although you should remember this !!!!
                1. alexsipin
                  alexsipin 24 September 2018 10: 14
                  -6
                  Quote: Sirocco
                  You see how it turns out that someone, out of kindness from the moderators, deleted my post, but thanks to you he is alive, and your lies and provocation are alive ..

                  It is nice when a person inciting ethnic hatred here considers himself the Holy Pope.

                  Quote: Sirocco

                  As with IL 20.

                  When you already understand that from the TV you are brazenly lying. Just as they lied under many other circumstances. Even so many of your people ask uncomfortable questions that the MoE has not answered.
                  Quote: Sirocco

                  I didn’t write about pogroms, and this is your version)))))

                  "For more than one century Jews have been chased as lousy in the bathhouse" - the pogroms means nothing to do with it. They are in the category "drove like lousy in the bath" - do not belong?

                  Quote: Sirocco

                  Well, they drove, I think not just like that, just like that, even the boil does not happen.

                  Russian in Chechnya, too, not just driven?
                  Jews they are not special, just in many countries they were an unprotected minority, which the authorities used as a lightning rod for "popular anger". Often this function was assigned to other minorities: Russians in Chechnya, Russians in Dushanbe, Azerbaijanis in Armenia, Armenians in Azerbaijan, Meskhetian Turks, Uzbeks in Kyrgyzstan, Kyrgyz in Uzbekistan, etc.
                2. alexsipin
                  alexsipin 24 September 2018 10: 29
                  -7
                  Quote: Sirocco
                  Until the late 40s, there was not even a name for such a state, and the Jews did not have such a homeland.

                  And if you look at the map of Europe and BV, then at least half of the countries on it formed / gained independence or at the end of the 19th century - Germany, the Balkan countries. Or after the First World War - after the collapse of the Austro-Hungarian and Russian empires. Or after World War II, including the current time. Israel gained independence in 1. Montenegro and Croatia, for example, got it generally in the 2s. So what? Do you want another story to measure like Ukrainians? Then ban the Bible - the book of the history of the Jewish people.
                  Quote: Sirocco
                  So where is it with you? ))))) Where is the homeland of the Gypsies?

                  Have gypsies and ask.
                  Quote: Sirocco
                  Captain evidence, thanks for reminding me))))) Although you should remember this !!!!

                  Well, at least agree on this. And then lit here demagoguery ...
              2. shulgin
                shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 46
                -5
                Quote: alexsipin
                Found something to be proud of - pogroms.
                They were always proud of it, to attack the unarmed to kill and rob, their real fun.
          2. Tank hard
            Tank hard 24 September 2018 09: 32
            +2
            Quote: alexsipin
            You have everything by order, today they said on TV to hate - you will be languishing with hatred. Tomorrow they will order love - you will climb with love. Remember what tons of hatred poured on the Turks, and then literally in one day everything changed

            Love you to give out wishful thinking. yes
          3. Yuyuka
            Yuyuka 24 September 2018 09: 44
            +1
            Quote: alexsipin
            Quote: Tank Hard
            I’m your Yiddish not rozum, express yourself more clearly.

            You have everything by order, today they said on TV to hate - you will be languishing with hatred. Tomorrow they will order love - you will climb with love. Remember what tons of hatred poured on the Turks, and then literally in one day everything changed to usi-pusi with Turkey.


            you have porridge in your head, moreover rotten even under the Soviet Union. Hatred is a sacred feeling, it does not apply to you ... rather, a feeling of disgust - I will clarify: not against Jews, against your behavior.
            Yes, and if you are even a little familiar with the Russian language, hatred in the Russian or Soviet people has never been directed against any nationality. You probably have a lot of friends from the former USSR? So ask them about great-grandfathers-great-grandfathers who fought against the Nazis, whom we hated — Germans or fascists ?!
            1. alexsipin
              alexsipin 24 September 2018 10: 35
              -8
              Quote: Yuyuka
              you have porridge in your head, moreover rotten even under the Soviet Union.

              You'd better look at yourself from the outside. You are like in that anecdote of the times of the USSR: "And if he hesitated, then only together with the general line of the party"
              Quote: Yuyuka
              Yes, and if you are even a little familiar with the Russian language, hatred in the Russian or Soviet people has never been directed against any nationality.

              You would ask other nationalities how you like to call them "nationals", how they feel about themselves from the "titular" nation. I'm sure you would be disappointed. Everything is not at all as pink as you think.
              1. Yuyuka
                Yuyuka 24 September 2018 11: 15
                +3
                You'd better look at yourself from the outside. You are like in that anecdote of the times of the USSR: "And if he hesitated, then only together with the general line of the party"

                why haven’t they added that I'm an ansemite? laughing I tell you about your current behavior, and you are in your own style - about "spots" in the sun, about a TV-monster that zombies everyone with hatred of everything!

                You would ask other nationalities how you like to call them "nationals", how they feel about themselves from the "titular" nation. I'm sure you would be disappointed. Everything is not at all as pink as you think. hi

                you are cheerful, albeit evil! look at KVN ... laugh heartily, and the porridge will fall out - there, besides the "title", who is not there! Especially on the jury winked your "joke of humor" would go to the final
                1. alexsipin
                  alexsipin 24 September 2018 12: 28
                  -3
                  Quote: Yuyuka
                  Why haven't they added that I am an Anitemite? I tell you about your current behavior, and you are in your own style - about "spots" in the sun, about a TV-monster that zombies everyone with hatred of everything!

                  There was no reason. I do not belong to the type of Jews who everywhere seek anti-Semites. Such thinking is the flip side of nationalism, very similar is not the thinking of some extreme personalities everywhere seeking a Jewish conspiracy.
                  Quote: Yuyuka
                  funny you

                  Here's a joke on the topic of Jews seeking anti-Semitism everywhere.
                  Two Jews meet at Ostankino.
                  “How are you, Abram?”
                  - P-p-goof.
                  - What is it?
                  - X-x-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-to-be-built-on-di-on-te-te-television.
                  - Well?
                  - No, no, no.
                  - Why not?
                  - Ska-ska-said-e-e-Jew.

                  Quote: Yuyuka
                  look at KVN ... laugh heartily, and the porridge will fall out - there, besides the "title", who is not there!

                  You have such a republic - Tuva. That's where the real KVN in relation to the Russians is going on. Although internationalism and friendship of peoples seem to be everywhere.
                  1. Yuyuka
                    Yuyuka 24 September 2018 12: 44
                    0
                    yes, there are enough idiots everywhere ... under the Soviet system, nationalist showdowns were strangled in the bud. As soon as they broke up, Karabakh broke out, then Abkhazia, Ossetia. I am generally silent about Ukraine. So this is not a national trait - to oppress "national minorities". And you yourself answered about Tuva - a local buy or a sultan came and rushed ... and I don’t believe in a Jewish conspiracy, but rather in a conspiracy of world capital, about which grandfather Marx quoted another comrade, forgot him, about a profit of 300% and any crime that capital is capable of hi
                    1. alexsipin
                      alexsipin 24 September 2018 12: 59
                      -2
                      Quote: Yuyuka
                      during the Soviet era, nationalistic squabbles strangled

                      Well, officially, friendship of peoples, internationalism and dances of the peoples of the USSR, but unofficially: chu..rki, w..da, ho ... ly, h..achi, bul..bashi.
                      Quote: Yuyuka
                      As soon as they broke up, so Karabakh flared up, then Abkhazia, Ossetia.

                      Well, so you catch the connection between unofficial relations with different nationalities and conflicts in the post-USSR
                      .
                      Quote: Yuyuka
                      And about Tyva you yourself answered - the local buy or sultan came and raced ...

                      I think that the local Russians don’t care if they came to Khan, Shah or Chinese Mandarin. I think they are more concerned about why the legislative system is so structured that discrimination of any nationality is generally possible in such a multinational state.
                      1. Yuyuka
                        Yuyuka 24 September 2018 13: 12
                        0
                        Well, officially - friendship of peoples, internationalism and dances of the peoples of the USSR

                        I traveled to the 80s in the Union - Kazakhstan, Central Asia - there were no problems in this regard
          4. MoJloT
            MoJloT 24 September 2018 09: 52
            +2
            everything changed to usi-pusi with Turkey
            By the will of the country's political leadership, it was decided to normalize relations with Turkey. People scored on the Turks, so does not change their minds. No more Turkey for normal citizens of the Russian Federation.
            1. alexsipin
              alexsipin 24 September 2018 10: 37
              -4
              Quote: MoJloT
              By the will of the country's political leadership, it was decided to normalize relations with Turkey. People scored on the Turks, so does not change their minds. No more Turkey for normal citizens of the Russian Federation.

              Turkish beaches filled with Russian tourists do not quite agree with you.
            2. Yjt
              Yjt 24 September 2018 11: 16
              -2
              Really, and scored? And those hundreds of thousands of Russian citizens on vacation to Turkey for "all inclusive", are they normal or not? And don't you choke on Turkish tomatoes?
      2. merkavaa
        merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 33
        -21
        Quote: alexsipin
        Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews

        You need to search for a new enemy constantly. Well, the Jews are the classic version, "if there is no water in the tap."
        So already a desperate situation.
        1. sogdy
          sogdy 24 September 2018 08: 02
          +6
          Quote: merkavaa
          You need to search for a new enemy constantly. Well, the Jews are the classic version, "if there is no water in the tap."
          So already a desperate situation.

          What time! And we thought you were not so bad ...
          1. alexsipin
            alexsipin 24 September 2018 08: 54
            -12
            Quote: sogdy
            What time! And we thought you were not so bad ...



            These are your people write from Russia.
            1. Tank hard
              Tank hard 24 September 2018 09: 36
              +5
              Quote: alexsipin
              These are your people write from Russia

              In Russia lived and live such as Makarevich, Novodvorskaya, Sobchak, Venediktov, Nemtsov and others like them, they will not say that, although, it's more your people than ours... wink
              1. alexsipin
                alexsipin 24 September 2018 09: 59
                -8
                Quote: Tank Hard
                it's more your people than ours ...

                Our people live in Israel.
                1. spektr9
                  spektr9 24 September 2018 13: 42
                  0
                  Our people live in Israel.
                  What then are they doing on the site in ru-segment, would go to their
                  1. alexsipin
                    alexsipin 24 September 2018 13: 57
                    +1
                    Quote: spektr9
                    What then are they doing on the site in ru-segment, would go to their

                    And what do your do on our sites? Or maybe just prohibit the Israelis from writing resource rules on it? Moreover, we were always driven as lousy in the bath ... You think and contact the administration.
            2. The comment was deleted.
            3. Yuyuka
              Yuyuka 24 September 2018 11: 24
              +3
              Quote: alexsipin
              Quote: sogdy
              What time! And we thought you were not so bad ...



              These are your people write from Russia.


              no, we finally have no sort!
              that's why the "poor" Swiss were shitting near the stadium in Rostov

              fool
      3. andj61
        andj61 24 September 2018 10: 47
        +1
        Quote: alexsipin
        Quote: Tank Hard
        Israeli military command does not agree with the conclusions of the Russian Ministry of Defense
        And Baba Yaga is against it!

        Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews. You have everything by order. Weather vane.

        Israel and Russia will understand all these misunderstandings - as they did with Turkey. But the sediment will remain. Until now, Russia, taking into account the interests of Israel, has distanced itself from the Israeli war with Hesbollah and Iran. Now - I hope - measures will be taken to prevent foreign aircraft from entering the zone of responsibility of Russia. It is in order to exclude such incidents.
        1. alexsipin
          alexsipin 24 September 2018 10: 55
          -8
          Quote: andj61
          Now - I hope - measures will be taken to prevent foreign aircraft from entering the zone of responsibility of Russia.

          Do you believe that yourself? Your soldiers were sent to fight in a foreign war. Not to the parade, but to the war. The story with Ilm is the clearest evidence of this. For us, this war is a direct defense of our homes from future shelling. For you, this war is an attempt to earn general awards.
          1. andj61
            andj61 24 September 2018 11: 27
            +2
            Quote: alexsipin
            Your soldiers were sent to fight in a foreign war. Not to the parade, but to the war. The story with Ilm is the clearest evidence of this. For us, this war is a direct defense of our homes from future shelling. For you, this war is an attempt to earn general awards.

            If for you this war would only be the protection of your homes from future shelling, then the Israeli military would have long sat down at the negotiating table with the Iranian mediated by Russia - and all questions would have been closed. The top leadership of Israel has some idiosyncrasy over Iran and Iranian interests - and in any case. You can always agree with the leadership of Israel - but not when it comes to Iran.
            You are talking about shelling, but the Iranians didn’t shell Israel in general - the sick people did the whole thing to the hesbollahs. Russia ensured their withdrawal from the Golan adjacent to the Israeli-controlled Golan - this could serve as the basis for the treaty. But Israel only intensified after this airstrikes against Iranians and hesbollahs. As a result, the situation is idiotic - the Iranians curse Israel, and Israel responds with air strikes. You really need to figure out what you need - to protect your homes or cause damage to the Iranians. If you protect your home, then Russia will help to come to an agreement, but if the second, then there’s nothing to talk about.
            1. alexsipin
              alexsipin 24 September 2018 12: 32
              -2
              Quote: andj61
              then the Israeli military would have long sat down at the negotiating table with the Iranian mediated by Russia - and all issues would have been closed

              For a wedding you need two. Find at least one press release in which the Iranian side is interested in such negotiations.
              And we treat the Iranians with sympathy, problems with the regime of Iran engaged in exporting the Islamic revolution
              https://youtu.be/7agK8MIJ3T0
              1. Tank hard
                Tank hard 24 September 2018 12: 51
                0
                Quote: alexsipin
                And we treat the Iranians quite sympathetically,

                Burning napalm. laughing
                1. alexsipin
                  alexsipin 24 September 2018 13: 04
                  -2
                  Quote: Tank Hard
                  Burning napalm.

                  only those who threaten us.
                  1. andj61
                    andj61 25 September 2018 12: 04
                    0
                    Quote: alexsipin
                    Quote: Tank Hard
                    Burning napalm.

                    only those who threaten us.

                    Not those who threaten, but those who theoretically can threaten! This is the idiosyncrasy to Iran!
          2. Andrey Panov
            Andrey Panov 24 September 2018 12: 40
            0
            She, not quite a stranger, this war gives me the opportunity to somehow go to the hospital, go to my mother on the normal road, my grandson to study for free. Gazprom steers!
      4. MKPU-115
        MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 44
        +1
        Quote: alexsipin
        Quote: Tank Hard
        Israeli military command does not agree with the conclusions of the Russian Ministry of Defense
        And Baba Yaga is against it!

        Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews. You have everything by order. Weather vane.

        Which weather vane? And yes, that's right:
        1. The Georgians - 2008 began military operations against our peacekeepers - this is a fact recognized around the world;
        2. The Turks shot down the SU-24 VKS of Russia - also a fact;
        3. Ukrainians - shot down a passenger Tu-154 over the Black Sea - a fact;
        4. Here are the Jews - what about Israel? A clearly planned operation to destroy the Russian side with 15 officers by the wrong hands, it’s clearly not profitable for them, but the United States. You will sort it out yourself, before it’s too late, it’s blazing in the region, you should die first.
  9. merkavaa
    merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 07
    -26
    Last year they wrote

    Russia and Syria have created a unified air defense system in the republic
    https://topwar.ru/123466-rossiya-i-siriya-sozdali-edinuyu-sistemu-pvo-na-territorii-respubliki.html

    "At present, a single integrated air defense system has been created on the territory of Syria. Information and technical interface between Russian and Syrian air reconnaissance assets has been ensured. All information about the air situation from Syrian radar stations is sent to the command posts of the Russian group of forces."
    1. merkavaa
      merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 08
      -23
      "All information about the air situation from Syrian radar stations goes to the command posts of the Russian group of forces."
      1. rum
        rum 24 September 2018 07: 15
        +16
        You see how you * drew * !! And what will happen when Iran has a C400 or an atomic weapon? laughing
        1. merkavaa
          merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 17
          -21
          Quote: Rum
          what will happen when Iran s400 appears or nuclear weapons?

          will also shoot in all directions
        2. MKPU-115
          MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 46
          +1
          Quote: Rum
          You see how you * drew * !! And what will happen when Iran has a C400 or an atomic weapon? laughing

          This is a terrible dream of Israel, they from one such thought tear down bricks.
      2. ANCIENT
        ANCIENT 24 September 2018 07: 20
        +10
        Merkava, you just need to honestly share information, you see, and this tragedy would not have happened for sure. negative
        1. merkavaa
          merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 21
          -19
          I gave a link to the air defense association, what do you say about this?
          1. igorbrsv
            igorbrsv 24 September 2018 07: 34
            0
            It is necessary to ask the one who sat at the remote control
            1. sogdy
              sogdy 24 September 2018 08: 05
              +4
              Quote: igorbrsv
              It is necessary to ask the one who sat at the remote control

              Igor, do not carry blizzards. Your level of competency is below the plinth.
    2. andj61
      andj61 24 September 2018 10: 56
      +1
      Quote: merkavaa
      Last year they wrote

      Russia and Syria have created a unified air defense system in the republic

      Quote: merkavaa
      "All information about the air situation from Syrian radar stations goes to the command posts of the Russian group of forces."

      I also thought it was true. But what kind of "integrated system" can there be if one of the parts of this system does not have equipment for identifying "friend or foe"? But somehow this identification still occurs, otherwise the Syrians would have fired on Russian planes more than once over these three years. But since identification is taking place, what, to put it mildly, did the Syrians shoot if there was a Russian plane in the firing zone?
      This is irrespective of the fact that the Israeli military, to put it mildly, untimely and unreliably warned the Russian military about the attack, and the pilots simply covered themselves with a Russian plane. I hope that the military together and in detail will analyze this tragic incident and will no longer allow its recurrence. And the Russian military will ensure the security of both our bases and our equipment.
    3. pru-pavel
      pru-pavel 25 September 2018 08: 06
      -1
      To get so many minuses for information, for which everything was wildly plus all the year ago. Extravaganza some sort
  10. Konstantin Shevchenko
    Konstantin Shevchenko 24 September 2018 07: 15
    +14
    F-16s have already returned, it became a meme as the dead creaked.
  11. ANCIENT
    ANCIENT 24 September 2018 07: 18
    +6
    what day we’re swearing on this topic on the site, it came to insults and personal identifications, and all that was needed was for the Israelis to make no statements about the incompetence of the Syrians and our specialists, with all the documents, not in a couple of days, but in a couple of hours to fly to Russia, and here it is HONEST to explain, but for a start it’s purely human, which wasn’t done right away, to express my condolences. I’m sure we’ll smooth out the sharp corners of communication, we’ll find common ground, but we’ll be in Syria for a long time, but it’s unpleasant the precipitate will remain, alas, for a long time, if not forever.
    1. merkavaa
      merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 22
      -26
      What can I say, your defense, your commanders, your plane.
      1. Volodin
        Volodin 24 September 2018 07: 36
        +25
        Quote: merkavaa
        What can I say, your defense, your commanders, your plane.

        And shit under the door - yours.

        Today, the IDF here, judging by the number of comments, has put you on combat duty. When is shifts?
        1. merkavaa
          merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 38
          -19
          Quote: Volodin
          shitting under the door - yours

          Your doors for 2 thousand km. Hmeimim should have seen his plane under his very nose.
          There is nothing to translate arrows.
          1. sogdy
            sogdy 24 September 2018 08: 09
            0
            Quote: merkavaa
            There is nothing to translate arrows.

            One can disagree with the fact that at noon the sun is in the south - since "here and there" it is in the north.
            What can I disagree with according to objective control?
          2. Volodin
            Volodin 24 September 2018 08: 17
            +11
            Damn burned, and in 8: 00, the shift change did not come ...

            Our doors are Chemim's base and MTO Tartus. And under these doors you and shit.

            Well, you have to worry so much about the planchik buried in the ground with ISIS to change the "bloody regime of Assad" ...
            1. Yjt
              Yjt 24 September 2018 11: 23
              -5
              Iran spoils you with your permission, arranging a terrorist viper under your doors in Syria
          3. GRF
            GRF 24 September 2018 08: 40
            -1
            We are earthlings, and the whole world our house is not only about the British and the Jews,
            Or in order to feel like that, is it necessary for everyone to impose their charters?
            We will put things in order, since anarchy is in the yard, and it will not necessarily be yours ...
          4. shulgin
            shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 49
            -5
            Quote: merkavaa
            There is nothing to translate arrows.
            And how do you recognize complete incompetence? How to recognize that?
      2. MKPU-115
        MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 48
        +2
        Quote: merkavaa
        What can I say, your defense, your commanders, your plane.

        Four F16 whose? Who bombed a foreign country ....
    2. aszzz888
      aszzz888 24 September 2018 09: 33
      +1
      ANCIENT (Sergey Vitalievich) Today, 07: 18
      , not in a couple of days, but in a couple of hours to fly to Russia, and here everything is HONESTLY explained, but for a start it’s purely human, which was not done right away, to express my condolences.

      ... maybe someone else - God forbid! I would have done so, but not this audience ...
  12. merkavaa
    merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 20
    -20
    After each attack, the Syrians say "the attack is repelled, everything is intercepted." means they are good at it.
  13. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 24 September 2018 07: 26
    +12
    But did anyone expect Israel to admit their guilt because of the pilots? Initially, it was clear that they would spin like in a frying pan blaming everyone, but not recognizing their mistakes. Even a certain one who suddenly appeared merkavaa, which day already clogs the site.
    1. merkavaa
      merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 29
      -18
      So where is the truth, you need to believe the Ministry of Defense from which year?
      Can you believe from 2017?
      https://topwar.ru/123466-rossiya-i-siriya-sozdali-edinuyu-sistemu-pvo-na-territorii-respubliki.html
      1. Andrey VOV
        Andrey VOV 24 September 2018 09: 42
        +2
        Did you get stuck on this post ?? bububub as a wound ... the same thing ...
        1. Yuyuka
          Yuyuka 24 September 2018 11: 31
          +1
          Quote: Andrey VOV
          Did you get stuck on this post ?? bububub as a wound ... the same thing ...


          in the theater on stage, when it is necessary to create the hubbub of the crowd, everyone says the same phrase "what to say when there is nothing to say?" this is now observed from the "guests" from Israel ... They no longer remember that our guys died because of their fault, just like a herd of sheep, in the discussion everyone goes in the same direction
    2. aszzz888
      aszzz888 24 September 2018 09: 26
      +1
      Online
      rotmistr60 (Gennady) Today, 07: 26
      Even a certain merkavaa suddenly appeared, which already day clogs the site.

      hi ! they have a shift method, as Comrade We_Smart (Igor) described below

      We_Smart (Igor) Today, 08:19
      +4
      Merkava, are you losing your watch? Now whose turn is it, Professors?


      ... and so on in a circle - compass brains ...
  14. igorbrsv
    igorbrsv 24 September 2018 07: 28
    +1
    Then the United States is to blame. They feed the barmaley. It is because of them that some people have disproportionate ambitions. If the United States had ceased to exist now, everyone would have sat "on their own shore" and would not boil
  15. merkavaa
    merkavaa 24 September 2018 07: 41
    -18
    Who should be informed if you are not there at all. You said the troops were withdrawn more than once)
    1. nPuBaTuP
      nPuBaTuP 24 September 2018 08: 47
      +5
      I’ve noticed here you are very lucky with links to our Moscow Region throwing .... and confirm your nuka
      they said the troops were withdrawn more than once)

      We did not deduce .... there were planned rotations and reductions ....
      but your boss striped took out ... and repeatedly ... and not only from Syria ...
    2. GRF
      GRF 24 September 2018 08: 52
      0
      The base works wonders ...
  16. Phoenix_L'vov
    Phoenix_L'vov 24 September 2018 07: 47
    +5
    Due to the rotary screws of the IL-20, and any propeller-driven aircraft, it looks completely different on the screen than a jet one - it cannot be confused with the F-16, which has a much smaller reflective surface.

    The Jews are lying, trying to make Syria guilty only that she specifically shot at the scout, Israel is lying, trying to drive a wedge between the allies, to split them.
    1. AlexanderK
      AlexanderK 24 September 2018 07: 56
      -15
      Quote: Phoenix_Lvov
      Due to the rotary screws of the IL-20, and any propeller-driven aircraft, it looks completely different on the screen than a jet one - it cannot be confused with the F-16, which has a much smaller reflective surface.


      Then why did the Syrians confuse and bring him down?

      Quote: Phoenix_Lvov
      Jews are lying, trying to make only Syria guilty, that it was she who specifically shot at the scout,


      Syria and Russia couldn’t see Israeli planes on their super duper radars and theirs and the Syrians shot at the Russian plane without seeing him and not receiving information that he was in the strike zone?

      Or did the Syrians donate to the Russians to strike at Israeli planes?
      1. Phoenix_L'vov
        Phoenix_L'vov 24 September 2018 08: 44
        +4
        Let me remind you that the Syrian S-200 radars are not new. S-20 radars worked in monochrome mode, when the target marks on the screen look like vertical stripes of different widths, the Jews knew this feature of the S-200 radar very well, and when their planes were in line with the radar, the target marks converged on the screen, after why the S-200 rocket automatically redirected to a brighter target - it was already above the Black Sea when the Ukrainian S-200 shot down the Tu-154, retargeting at it because its radio-reflecting surface was much larger than the training target.
        1. region58
          region58 24 September 2018 12: 33
          0
          Quote: Phoenix_Lvov
          Jews knew this feature of the S-200 radar

          Did the Syrians not know? This does not explain the very fact of the launch.
          Quote: Phoenix_Lvov
          S-200 automatically redirected

          if the ROC sees the target, but the GOS does not (Capture the GOS - in flight) .... Then only the MHI and it is impossible to switch after launch. Range is not determined. On "Vega" it seems like that ... They shot - and at that time the IL-20 appeared? 30 kilometers. Seconds. So they didn't know that he was there. Why? The superior command post should not have allowed launch.
      2. andj61
        andj61 24 September 2018 11: 16
        0
        Quote: AlexanderK
        Syria and Russia couldn’t see Israeli planes on their super duper radars and theirs and the Syrians shot at the Russian plane without seeing him and not receiving information that he was in the strike zone?

        The S-200 uses a target illumination radar to guide missiles. The IL-20 reflects the signal much better than the F-16. The homing head captured him - this is just about the fact that, most likely, the F-16s were somewhere nearby. And the Syrians tried to aim the missile at them. The unprofessionalism of the Syrians lies precisely in the fact that they did not properly identify the targets and allowed firing at our silt. On the indicator of the all-round view of the S-200 air defense system, all objects in the air are visible, it is not difficult to identify them - even if the Syrians do not have our "friend or foe" identification system. And then it turns out that they were shooting into the white light, like a pretty penny - more, I suppose, were glad that the homing head captured the target.
  17. stone
    stone 24 September 2018 07: 59
    +4
    And where is the analysis of the 40-page report of the Israeli Air Force Commander-in-Chief from the Russian Ministry of Defense indicating errors and inaccuracies !? Indeed, there, as I understand it, there is evidence of objective control.
    1. brigadier
      brigadier 24 September 2018 08: 48
      -13
      [/ quote] [quote = stone] And where is the analysis of the 40-page report of the Israeli Air Force Commander-in-Chief from the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, indicating errors and inaccuracies !? Indeed, there, as I understand it, there is evidence of objective control.

      Oh!
      And now, as far as Israel is ready to ruin relations with Russia. If ready, the data will be published. If not, then someday at a more appropriate moment. This is a decision at the political level.
  18. merkavaa
    merkavaa 24 September 2018 08: 05
    -16
    I give them facts and questions, and in return I have cons and accusations with insults))
    This is your business of course, but funny.
    It turns out that you and there are no commanders at all, such as cockroaches will scatter in different directions if something happens. You are weak.
    For about three years, you have already been bringing "super weapons" there, and point-blank near the base itself you do not see anything who is shooting at whom.
    The outdated f16 made a circle and you managed it at the very least I can, and no one is to blame. What tomahawks are you going to shoot down there or f35?
    Neither EW, nor other radars see anything. IL 20 generally what year the plane, but flying on it just like that is a crime, not to mention the combat mission. This is against those who have nothing but machine guns - maybe, but a normal army has more than a machine gun.
    I myself served in the army in Israel, we have the commander coming in front - soldiers behind him. Just keep in mind and think with your head and not with your emotions.
    I bring condolences.

    I do not excuse anyone, I just feel a warm relationship with Russia.


    everything, banya.
    1. We_smart
      We_smart 24 September 2018 08: 19
      +6
      Merkava, are you losing your watch? Now whose turn is it, Professors?
      1. aszzz888
        aszzz888 24 September 2018 09: 20
        +1

        We_Smart (Igor) Today, 08:19
        +4
        Merkava, are you losing your watch? Now whose turn is it, Professors?

        ... somewhere already at the door comes .. laughing now - "Post passed"! - I accepted the post! "And away we go ...
    2. Pavil144
      Pavil144 24 September 2018 08: 23
      +6
      The facts are as follows: if Israel would notify a minute and 30 minutes before the strike, there would be no disaster, they would say they would bomb the north, and hit the west, launch a rocket from 200 to f16 and the rocket chose a priority target i.e. silt 20. Where are the wines of Syria?
      1. AlexanderK
        AlexanderK 24 September 2018 08: 51
        -7
        Quote: Pavil144
        hit the west, launched a rocket from 200 to f16 and the rocket chose a priority target i.e. silt 20. Where are the wines of Syria?


        That is, the Russian and Syrian radars did not see that f16 and il20 are in the same square? lol

        Did they even see f16?

        Syrian troops launched a rocket knowing that there is not far il20?

        Here is the fault of both Russia and Syria - you need to turn on the radars and exchange information.

        It feels like the report was slabbed after and tailored to the facts needed by the MO.
        1. Pavil144
          Pavil144 24 September 2018 09: 45
          0
          When they started with 200 they weren’t in one square. After the launch of the air defense system on f16, he made a maneuver in the direction of silt 20; the rocket turned in that direction and captured silt 20
          1. AlexanderK
            AlexanderK 24 September 2018 10: 00
            -3
            Amazingly simple lol
            Isn’t it funny for you?


            Moreover, the level of the Ministry of Defense or the Russian Air Force can be seen by what Konashenkov said when he called, regarding those who spoke about their own system of someone else's "amateurish fantasies" and "the reasoning of pseudo-experts" and Bizhev, who was the deputy chief of the General Staff of the Forces, fell under such pseudo-experts Air Defense, First Deputy Chief of the Main Staff of the Russian Air Force, Deputy Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Air Force for the CIS Joint Air Defense System.
    3. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich 24 September 2018 08: 43
      +2
      Quote: merkavaa
      IL 20 generally what year the plane, but flying on it just like that is a crime, not to mention the combat mission.

      Ask your American teachers what year the B-52 is. wink
      Quote: merkavaa
      Neither EW, nor other radars see anything.

      They see and hear. Think with your head that no one will shine the combat systems to the right and to the left every day in order to reveal the signal parameters. Such a war with the Americans has been going on since the middle of the last century, they even organized provocations with the same Korean Boeing to open the air defense system. You were given a picture with the location of your planes, but you firmly repeat yours anyway. give your details, so we'll check. And I personally do not intend to believe, like a ram, the IDF only in words, unlike all of you Jewish patriots. I understand your feelings, but your stubbornness and the mantra "Israel is never to blame for anything" have already got everyone request
      Quote: merkavaa
      I myself served in the army in Israel, we have the commander coming in front - soldiers behind him. Just keep in mind and think with your head and not with your emotions.

      Oh, the Israeli army is also super-technological - there the commanders in front of the soldiers flee. Somehow wasteful in relation to the officers in whose training the state has invested. what
      Quote: merkavaa
      What tomahawks are you going to shoot down there or f35?

      Leonid, and you will attack directly at the base and see wink Russian anti-aircraft systems are guarding the base, not Syria. Yes, and about the general air defense system. A coordinated warning system - this does not mean that our S-400s will bullet any bird. Exchange information, help each other somewhere. Exactly the same with Russia. And this does not mean that in which case Russia will rush to cover us ...
      All your problem is that you all a priori believe in the honesty and infallibility of your army, and you cannot even admit a hint of an error on your part. If only one would think about why they lied in the direction of the blow and pointed north instead of the west. But no-all as one taldychite that Israel is not to blame for anything .... you yourself have become hostages of your views on the world around us. They told themselves that we have the right to protect ourselves and bomb everyone right and left, because you are a priori right. You, too, are all to blame, but not Israel ....
      Morality - you are no better than the Russian Defense Ministry hi
    4. huntsman650
      huntsman650 24 September 2018 08: 47
      0
      Wait grenades with ficalies fly .. And how and how much Mosul did you take (coalition) ??? rather, not weak, but naive and gullible. A super weapon is still small and it is raw, and there we bring it to mind. No doubt remotely fighting with NATO is better. Yes, and more people care about their own.
    5. Tank hard
      Tank hard 24 September 2018 09: 42
      +1
      Quote: merkavaa
      I do not excuse anyone, I just feel a warm relationship with Russia.

      Then I laughed for a long time! laughing
    6. Andrey VOV
      Andrey VOV 24 September 2018 09: 45
      0
      Here you are restless .... he served in the army ... went forward ... where did you go forward, a mlyn walker against whom, warriors ... used to wet without Palestinian resistance ... nothing .. a judgment day will come .. .
      1. alexsipin
        alexsipin 24 September 2018 14: 57
        0
        Quote: Andrey VOV
        nothing .. the judgment day will come ...

        Do not forget. And Gd will not forget:
        “REMEMBER WHAT AMALEK MADE TO YOU ...”
    7. Antares
      Antares 24 September 2018 10: 47
      -3
      Quote: merkavaa
      I give them facts and questions, and in return I have cons and accusations with insults))
      This is your business of course, but funny.

      This is normal. People often (yes almost always) rule emotions. Do not pay attention. You know how we were in your place after 2014 ... however you are always found before 2014 and after. This is historically true. Remember the joke about Rabinovich and the all-powerful Jews? Better than wasting nerves.
      Despite the fact that people are sorry, and no one will return their lives,
      --I liked the position of Israel. It’s a pity ours don’t know how.
      "We have acted and are acting prudently and responsibly, and only in cases where we have no other choice. So nothing has changed and will not change. This is our policy," Lieberman said.
      "We will not allow Syria to be turned into an advanced Iranian base against the State of Israel. We continue to act ... and for this we have all the means and capabilities," he added.
      "Israel will continue operations in Syria, despite the incident with the Il-20"
  19. mlad
    mlad 24 September 2018 08: 07
    +4
    I think that the Israelis IL20 specifically did not hide behind, it’s all a matter of chance, but the rest is Israel’s fault, it’s time for Russia to help Syria to improve its air defense. I think that the C300 has better target selectivity and F16 would be shot down and not our IL
    1. shulgin
      shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 54
      -1
      Quote: mlad
      I think that the Israelis IL20 specifically did not hide behind, it’s all a matter of chance, but the rest is Israel’s fault, it’s time for Russia to help Syria to improve its air defense. I think that the C300 has better target selectivity and F16 would be shot down and not our IL
      Hooray !!! Is there no S-400 near there?
      1. FORS
        FORS 24 September 2018 10: 45
        +1
        Tama near the S-400 are to cover the Russian base. But when the Syria-delivered S-300s will cover the Syrian military and civilian facilities, then Urya will be for you ...!
        1. shulgin
          shulgin 24 September 2018 11: 57
          -3
          Quote: FORS
          then you will be Urya ...!
          Well, for now, then OURRYA is going to continue for you, 300, 400, 500.
          1. FORS
            FORS 24 September 2018 12: 55
            0
            We will count the chickens in mid-October.
            1. shulgin
              shulgin 24 September 2018 15: 39
              0
              Quote: FORS
              We will count the chickens in mid-October.
              Well, you are specialists in chickens, and yes in your planes, but for real weapons, do not leave a stone or a flower.
  20. ochakow703
    ochakow703 24 September 2018 08: 08
    -5
    It turns out that only loud statements about our power and modernity. But not the most difficult situation, and could not beat. All the vaunted air defense, along with the S-different! It’s even scary to imagine what will happen in a serious conflict with anyone. Again, everything will have to be transported to the infantry Van.
  21. rum
    rum 24 September 2018 08: 13
    +4
    Quote: merkavaa
    just experiencing a warm relationship with Russia.

    "Wisdom without kindness turns into malice, and kindness without wisdom turns into stupidity."
    Patriarch of Serbia Pavel
    1. brigadier
      brigadier 24 September 2018 09: 00
      -10
      Quote: Rum
      Quote: merkavaa
      just experiencing a warm relationship with Russia.

      "Wisdom without kindness turns into malice, and kindness without wisdom turns into stupidity."
      Patriarch of Serbia Pavel

      I read it several times. The second part of the phrase is still somehow understandable, but the first ....
      Explain with an example if not difficult.
      1. rum
        rum 24 September 2018 09: 25
        +3
        1 ... the second you understand is good
        2 Example --- you, half-Jews, consider yourself smart (you are far from wise) and everywhere you try to show your exclusivity and * Jewishness * - but you are not Good ... and therefore Evil ... By the way, you don’t even notice it doing very explicitly laughing I hope you understand?
        1. brigadier
          brigadier 24 September 2018 09: 32
          -8
          Not ... I don’t understand. Yes, you yourself did not understand what you wrote.
          1. rum
            rum 24 September 2018 09: 47
            +2
            OK, IN RUSSIAN I WRITE ... It seems to you that you are smart, kind and are here to prove that your country is white and fluffy .... And you think that you are Jewish and semi-Jewish ....
            Farther---Wisdom without kindness turns into malice You didn’t notice that half-Jews do not like you here, it’s in the soft expression of the word lol You are neither Good nor Wise .... You are just offended by everyone around you ... I treat Jews as normal as their attitude to the Arabs is their war ... But you, it’s you .... and not even Jews ..... I wrote without any sense to offend you personally, but what exactly I think .... The opinion of others may not coincide with mine
            1. brigadier
              brigadier 24 September 2018 11: 12
              -4
              Never argue with fools, they will drag you to their level and crush you with experience!
              Mark Twain.
            2. Yjt
              Yjt 24 September 2018 11: 45
              -4
              Bullshit!
              1. MKPU-115
                MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 55
                +2
                Quote: YJT
                Bullshit!

                This is an argument. good .
      2. Antares
        Antares 24 September 2018 10: 53
        -2
        Quote: brigadir
        Explain with an example if not difficult.

        If you are wise, but not good, you are an evil sage.
        (obviously the Patriarch saw the world only black and white, good or evil, but never neutral or unemotional)
        If you do good deeds without wisdom, then you do stupid things (indefatigable kindness is not valued, it borders on stupidity and even harm). In general, kindness must be reasonable, otherwise it is harmful.
        Here the Patriarch is indisputably right.
        1. brigadier
          brigadier 24 September 2018 11: 20
          -3
          Quote: Antares
          Quote: brigadir
          Explain with an example if not difficult.

          If you are wise, but not good, you are an evil sage.
          (obviously the Patriarch saw the world only black and white, good or evil, but never neutral or unemotional)
          If you do good deeds without wisdom, then you do stupid things (indefatigable kindness is not valued, it borders on stupidity and even harm). In general, kindness must be reasonable, otherwise it is harmful.
          Here the Patriarch is indisputably right.

          Good deeds must always be done. If you cure a sick dog, that’s a good thing. If she then bites a neighbor. Does this mean that it was not necessary to treat the dog?
          Dovrota cannot be evil by definition. Kindness cannot be harmful. We must proceed from the fact that one who does a good deed does not think that it can do much harm. Otherwise, he would not have done this good deed.
          In fact, it is not necessary to accept a phrase thrown by someone and then replicated as the ultimate truth. Especially if the phrase is ambiguous and requires additional comments.
  22. AlexanderK
    AlexanderK 24 September 2018 08: 16
    -8
    There is a clear feeling that there is no coordination between Syria and Russia, about which they wrote earlier.

    Russian radars are sleeping and do not see what is really happening, except after the event. It seems that in real time in Russia, radars do not work.

    It was not in vain that Konashenkov accused the Israelis of not indicating the exact location of the Israeli aircraft, as if the Russian army in Syria did not have modern radars to independently detect foreign aircraft ..

    The Syrians simply hollow out from C200 and they do not care or they do not have information that they could put a Russian plane under attack.

    First, the Russian, pro-Kremlin media officially issued referring to the MO statement that the connection with the plane had disappeared at about 23.00, then suddenly the MO announced at 22.07.

    Therefore, the MO version and the accusation of Israel cannot be trusted, but rather Israel is telling the truth and there were no Israeli planes there

    Moreover, it doesn’t sound plausible that Israel was hiding behind a Russian plane, since hundreds of flights, hundreds of Israeli strikes and never needed cover, good relations with Russia, good coordination, and here Israel takes and spoils everything for the sake of another routine strike? It’s ridiculous.

    An explicit attempt to hide the mistakes of the Russian and Syrian military in Syria, and for this they decided to substitute Israel. But Israel did not become silent, but did not go on the rampage and decided that it would say its word, but saw no reason because of this it was quarreling with Russia.
    1. DPN
      DPN 24 September 2018 08: 52
      +1
      we are pecking at the expense of yourself in the army? as taught and hollow.
  23. rocket757
    rocket757 24 September 2018 08: 19
    +1
    Everyone has a part of their guilt before the dead ..... the root causes are obvious, and everything else is layers from which a big lump of this crime was blinded.
  24. high
    high 24 September 2018 08: 21
    -10
    It is enough to see the principle of operation of the high-precision GBU-39 bomb, which Israel used to understand who is lying.
    The bomb does not have an engine, GBU-39 has wings spread out in the air, which significantly increases the range of destruction, up to 110 km from the target - the bomb is capable of planning.
    The initial horizontal speed of the GBU-39 is equal to the speed of the aircraft at the time of separation of the bomb from the aircraft, and the power of the bomb is proportional to the height of the aircraft.
    The maximum speed of the F-16 above the ground is 1432 km / h, and at an altitude of 12200 meters it is 2120 km / h - with such a speed and altitude, the GBU-39 bomb penetrates a 2-meter overlap.
    In addition to accuracy (5 .... 8 m.), The main advantage of GBU-39 is stealth: with a length of 1,8 m and a shell diameter of 0,19 m, the bomb has an EPR of about 0,015 m2, which makes it impossible to repulse a massive strike by such bombs themselves modern air defense systems ..
    It is on this feature of the GBU-39 (striking at a distance of 110 km from the target and a high flight altitude of up to 12 km.) That the Israeli Air Force counted on the elimination of exclusively Iranian military installations. Nothing threatened Russian objects on the ground and in the air.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SITjW7uF92g

    Israel has no interest in Syria. He does not care what kind of power there will be, and who will be in power there, even Assad, although, according to the Israelis, he is a cannibal.
    There is only one interest - that there should not be a military outpost of Iran.
    Iran is the main enemy, its goal is the destruction of Israel, and the ayatollahs and the IRGC perceive Syria as the most promising bridgehead for an attack on Israel.
    1. The comment was deleted.
    2. Ren
      Ren 24 September 2018 08: 39
      +6
      Quote: alta
      Israel has no interest in Syria.

      But what about those recognized by the entire world community Syrian Golan Heights (In official UN documents, the Israeli-controlled territory of the Golan is referred to as “occupied Syrian Golan"(Occupied Syrian Golan)).
      If there is no interest in Syria - follow the UN Security Council resolution (adopted unanimously by all members of the UN Security Council, including the United States, Britain, France) laughing there you really have nothing to do!
      1. AlexanderK
        AlexanderK 24 September 2018 08: 46
        -7
        Quote: Ren
        But what about the Syrian Golan Heights recognized by the entire international community (In official UN documents, the Israeli-controlled territory of the Golan is referred to as “occupied Syrian Golan” (occupied Syrian Golan)).


        What's wrong with them?

        Quote: Ren
        If there is no interest in Syria - follow the UN Security Council resolution (adopted unanimously by all members of the UN Security Council, including the United States, Britain, France) there really is nothing for you to do!


        Why should Israel comply with recommendatory resolutions?
        1. Ren
          Ren 24 September 2018 09: 23
          +3
          Quote: AlexanderK
          Why should Israel comply with recommendatory resolutions?

          This resolution (UN Security Council Resolution No. 497) is not advisory, but enforceable.
          1. AlexanderK
            AlexanderK 24 September 2018 10: 07
            -1
            Quote: Ren
            This resolution (UN Security Council Resolution No. 497) is not advisory, but enforceable.


            No, study the mate part - all resolutions adopted regarding Israel in the UN Security Council are advisory in nature.
          2. Antares
            Antares 24 September 2018 11: 08
            -2
            Quote: Ren
            UN Security Council Resolution No. 497

            The Security Council in paragraph 2 "demands" that Israel cancel its decision.
            SB differ from GA. In the Security Council you can demand, but there is a veto.
            All these papers are not worth a penny. Only strength and economic power.
            Papers will not help you if force is used against you. Self-only / solid allies / economy
    3. huntsman650
      huntsman650 24 September 2018 08: 41
      +1
      And then it’s possible to work on the media, like nefig at such an altitude reach 300 and 400. In Syria, there is a limited contingent and is not designed to protect all of Syria. And the Arabs are still those warriors ...
      https://vk.com/syriantube что то возят.
    4. mlad
      mlad 24 September 2018 08: 45
      +2
      moreover, here Iran and planning bombs, here is the fact that Israel is bombing foreign territory and is bombing with impunity. now Russia will deliver Syria's C300 and sing in a completely different way, at least you will not bomb so arrogantly, since the C300 can get your planes right above your airfields
    5. Phoenix_L'vov
      Phoenix_L'vov 24 September 2018 08: 48
      0
      This bomb can be fired both from a lower height and from a shorter distance, so Israel’s lies are still obvious. In addition, you still did not materialize why you sent a warning about the attack TOTALLY MINUTE before the attack itself, it looks like a sophisticated mockery, and not a real warning, since in such a short period of time it would not have time to reach the personnel.
  25. Conductor
    Conductor 24 September 2018 08: 37
    +5
    Jews have not been trusted for more than 2000 years!
  26. Professor
    Professor 24 September 2018 08: 37
    -11
    Israel did not recognize data from the report of the Russian Ministry of Defense: "F-16 have already returned"

    No facts were presented. There were cartoons and chatter.

    It is noted that the commander of the Israeli Air Force gave the Russian colleagues a detailed report on the events of that fateful day. The report states that the Syrian air defense forces’s C-200 was used "already after the Israeli F-16 had completed strikes against Hezbollah and the IRGC (Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps) in Syria."

    During the briefing, as VO already reported, Major General Igor Konashenkov commented in detail on the Israeli detailed report on the events of that fateful day. He put everything on the shelves. All 40 report sheets. bully
    1. huntsman650
      huntsman650 24 September 2018 08: 53
      -2
      Yes, just a coincidence, and in the course of time they got your accurate selective strikes against the objects in Syria under our nose, or maybe Iran and Assad took our soldier for a show off like they don’t put you in anything. This incident is definitely against Israel. Wait, I’ll come up with something to counteract the blows.
    2. aszzz888
      aszzz888 24 September 2018 09: 14
      0
      professor (Oleg Sokolov) Today, 08:37 No facts were submitted. There were cartoons and chatter

      ... because for Israel - that God's dew, that another substance ....
  27. Altona
    Altona 24 September 2018 08: 46
    +3
    Quote: Aristarkh Ludwigovich
    AB Khmeimim command was waiting for a call

    -----------------------
    The fact is that you demand from the Moscow Region that it is unusual for it to make political decisions to bring down a particular air target, but this is not its competence and it’s not necessary to understand the tangle of multi-paths of the Supreme Commander and geopolitical layouts. To close the sky, so close completely to hell. And then here we are bombing, here we are not bombing, here are partners, there is an armed opposition, there is someone else. That way he’ll break a leg, Syria’s airspace is like a passage through the yard, they’re even entering our bases as if they were at home.
  28. bald
    bald 24 September 2018 08: 47
    +2
    Now they can claim anything (Israel). The question is whether we will continue to go to the various requests of Israel, or all the same we will decide (top) who is our friend and who is a dodgy enemy. Unless family ties interfere with this.
  29. DPN
    DPN 24 September 2018 08: 47
    +2
    In such a case can only admit. It’s a pity for our PILOTS, such is the concern of their fathers commanders, the F-16s carried out a combat maneuver and they won, it means they learned to fight in vain, so blaming them stupidly..And the fact that our vaunted S-400s didn’t destroy them is meanness and cowardice .Need Colonels BUDANOVA, and it seems that they are NOT eradicated in the country.
    There were those who can only make excuses.
    1. FORS
      FORS 24 September 2018 11: 00
      0
      "And the fact that our vaunted S-400 in pursuit did not destroy them is meanness and cowardice"

      And to write such garbage - provocation and stupidity. The IL-20 was shot down NOT by Israeli aircraft. The fact that the Jews hid behind our scout is meanness, not aggression.
  30. mlad
    mlad 24 September 2018 08: 54
    0
    I hope that the vaunted C400 is still effective and will show the Israelis what it can do
    1. huntsman650
      huntsman650 24 September 2018 08: 59
      -1
      With 400 it is an extreme measure.
      1. mlad
        mlad 24 September 2018 09: 01
        0
        probably we need to be more aggressive, to be respected and afraid of us mischief
        1. rocket757
          rocket757 24 September 2018 09: 42
          0
          Fighting back is not an obvious definition of aggressiveness! Although in our case, sales prevention will be just a method of preventing incidents!
  31. aszzz888
    aszzz888 24 September 2018 09: 12
    +2
    The IDF continues to state that at the time of the strike of the S-200 air defense system of Syrian air defense, all Israeli aircraft were in Israeli airspace, leaving the zone of operations over the eastern part of the Mediterranean.

    ... and do not care about the six-pointed ones, that there are facts of radar control .... we need to beat everything and bring flyers from heaven to earth, and there - to whom as you are lucky ... angry
  32. Alexey-74
    Alexey-74 24 September 2018 09: 26
    +1
    Israel has implemented its own plan, and despite the rather controversial situation in the opinion of Israel itself, Russia will not unfortunately prove to anyone right, and the United States giggles and rubbing its hands aside, made it with the wrong hands ... as always.
  33. Andrey VOV
    Andrey VOV 24 September 2018 09: 33
    +1
    Isael will never recognize those facts that are inconvenient for him, let’s say so .. NEVER ... and you need to get used to it
  34. shulgin
    shulgin 24 September 2018 09: 37
    -2
    Everything is according to the standard scheme, the Russians screwed up, the Arabs knocked down and the Jews were to blame, and for 50 years with this motto the USSR and the successor of Russia have been flying into tartars. The destination is assigned, we will accompany.
    1. MKPU-115
      MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 53
      +2
      Quote: shulgin
      Everything is according to the standard scheme, the Russians screwed up, the Arabs knocked down and the Jews were to blame, and for 50 years with this motto the USSR and the successor of Russia have been flying into tartars. The destination is assigned, we will accompany.

      Only after you Ukrainians. 404 first
      1. shulgin
        shulgin 24 September 2018 14: 26
        0
        Quote: MKPU-115
        Only after you Ukrainians.
        And why are you here Khokhlov began to throw? Managed yes others do it look for? Maybe it's you pirates, huh?
  35. rocket757
    rocket757 24 September 2018 09: 38
    +1
    Who does she need, TRUE, in the world then .... After all, we also only care about the consequence / consequences that will be!
    Although the consequences should prevent the occurrence of such incidents ....
    However, and whom in the world did the consequences stop ??? No one will arrange a radical truncation of violent heads, so wait
  36. Avior
    Avior 24 September 2018 09: 40
    -2
    Given the fact that Il was sent to the battlefield along the route of Israeli aircraft, from the south over the sea, the Syrians did not need to make a mistake, they just shot down an Israeli plane of the second wave of attack.
  37. spektr9
    spektr9 24 September 2018 09: 41
    +3
    That's what happens when our government maneuvers, they would say directly that the Israeli f16 pilot shot down our il20, and then he would see the Jews get out
    1. Avior
      Avior 24 September 2018 10: 23
      -4
      pilot Voloshin flew on his Su-25 and shot down - the official version of the UK.
  38. Yuyuka
    Yuyuka 24 September 2018 09: 47
    +1
    Quote: merkavaa
    Quote: alexsipin
    Georgians, Turks, Ukrainians, now Jews

    You need to search for a new enemy constantly. Well, the Jews are the classic version, "if there is no water in the tap."
    So already a desperate situation.


    You yourself showed the classic version - you "thanked" for all those deeds and the help that they provided for you. You have come up with a good excuse - to justify any meanness, any word against yourself to pass off as anti-Semitism! laughing
  39. fox_rudy
    fox_rudy 24 September 2018 10: 11
    0
    The situation is similar to the downed TU-154 Ukraine. 1. This cannot be, because, it can never be! 2. This cannot be, because, the distance does not allow, is too large. 3. This cannot be, because, we shot in the other direction. 4 ..... Well, ..that ... it happened ...
    1. Avior
      Avior 24 September 2018 10: 25
      -2
      your untruth.
      The downfall of the Tu-154 was never officially recognized.
      Later it turned out that the radar target illumination was turned off long before the disaster (recall, Ukrainians fired from a Russian firing range)
      1. fox_rudy
        fox_rudy 24 September 2018 11: 00
        +1
        Yes, you are right, it was not recognized at the official level, but compensation was paid. And the conclusions of the IAC were unambiguous. I, just from memory, reproduced the tone of the statements at that time. And Kuchma babbled about "a tragic accident.
  40. mlad
    mlad 24 September 2018 10: 41
    0
    Quote: shulgin
    Quote: mlad
    I think that the Israelis IL20 specifically did not hide behind, it’s all a matter of chance, but the rest is Israel’s fault, it’s time for Russia to help Syria to improve its air defense. I think that the C300 has better target selectivity and F16 would be shot down and not our IL
    Hooray !!! Is there no S-400 near there?

    The fact of the matter is that they stood near the C400, but they were not involved and not according to technical, but to political decisions
  41. NordUral
    NordUral 24 September 2018 10: 44
    0
    All the excuses of the Russian Defense Ministry that Israel did not warn them are not worth a damn. Having its own monitoring and detection tools, how could IL-20 be sent unaccompanied to the area where the Israeli fighters are, who arrived there without sprinkling daisies?
    So first of all you need to ask yourself.
  42. MKPU-115
    MKPU-115 24 September 2018 11: 52
    +1
    Quote: merkavaa



    everything, banya.


    No-eee, without the clown here is boring, stay.
  43. alexsipin
    alexsipin 24 September 2018 12: 41
    0
    Quote: andj61
    You are talking about shelling, but the Iranians didn’t shell Israel in general - the sick people did the whole thing to the hesbollahs.

    Hezbollah (spelled this way, since the second part of the word is the word "Allah") is funded, trained and armed from Iran. The difference between the Iranian Armed Forces and Hezbollah is purely nominal.

    Quote: andj61

    Russia ensured their withdrawal from the Golan adjacent to the Israeli-controlled Golan - this could serve as the basis for the treaty.

    What kind of contract are you talking about? Where is he? Which of the Iranian politicians spoke of a new treaty?
  44. Valent
    Valent 24 September 2018 13: 20
    0
    apparently this time everything was happening not according to the plan as it was before (Israel warned, arrived after some time and bombed). at some stage there was a * drain * of information and Hesbollan managed to take the weapon to a safe place.
  45. alexsipin
    alexsipin 24 September 2018 13: 21
    0

    Quote: Andrey Panov
    She, not quite a stranger, this war gives me the opportunity to somehow go to the hospital, go to my mother on the normal road, my grandson to study for free. Gazprom steers!

    And what about the loss of your troops in the war in Syria? Consumables? How is the cartridge in the printer?
  46. alexsipin
    alexsipin 24 September 2018 14: 01
    0
    Quote: Yuyuka
    I traveled to the 80s in the Union - Kazakhstan, Central Asia - there were no problems in this regard

    80s Kazakhstan? And about the Zheltoxan in Alma-Ata in 1986, do not remember?
    But until the end of the Soviet Union another 5 years remained.
  47. Gray brother
    Gray brother 24 September 2018 19: 32
    0
    mvg,
    You do not run into your president - he is elected by your people. And he said that America defeated everyone.
    I believe him.
  48. APASUS
    APASUS 24 September 2018 19: 50
    0
    Why didn’t Israel post a similar map with a per-minute situation during the attack on Syria? Recording from the locators is very accurate, it was possible to compare
  49. GTYCBJYTH2021
    GTYCBJYTH2021 25 September 2018 00: 13
    0
    Why suck the past, you need to work, act ..... The guys cannot be returned .......