Myths about the origin of Ukraine and the Ukrainians. Myth 3. Historically foreign flag of Ukraine

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History The Ukrainian flag, like all Ukrainians, is shrouded in myths and lies and is based on historical tricks and fantastic ravings. The main thesis of the created myth is that “the yellow-blue colors symbolized the Kiev state, ... eventually revived on the coat of arms of the Ukrainian cities, ... almost all the coats of arms of the cities of Kiev and Ukraine as a whole were framed by yellow-blue flowers, ... from the 18th century Cossack flags Zaporozhian troops are increasingly made of blue cloth ... "

Myths about the origin of Ukraine and the Ukrainians. Myth 3. Historically foreign flag of Ukraine




Officially, the meaning of the blue and yellow colors on the flag is traditionally interpreted as a combination of a clean, peaceful, cloudless sky over the yellow color of a grain field - a symbol of peaceful labor and well-being.

But even a superficial examination of this legend reveals the absurdity of pseudo-historical statements. Take at least Kievan Rus, although it has nothing to do with modern Ukraine. What color banners prevailed in the ancient Russian principalities?

In these principalities, the symbol of princely power was the banners, and from the 9th century on the lands now entering Ukraine, red, crimson, white always dominated in symbolism, less often blue and green, but not yellow-blue. For example, the Russian units that participated in the 1410 year in the Battle of Grunwald against the Teutonic Order, marched with banners of different colors. Yellow-blue color was peculiar only to Lviv, in the other detachments other colors of banners prevailed. So the lie about the dominance of the yellow-blue color of the banners in Kievan Rus is far-fetched.



If we take the Kazatchina period, then all the assertions about the yellow-blue Cossack flags are also a lie. The banners of the Little Russian Cossacks, who considered and called themselves Russians, were dominated by the historical colors of Russia. Bogdan Khmelnitsky went into battle with a white banner in his left hand, and was followed by two general cornets with loose purple and white banners.

Not a word about the yellow color and the Trident is present either on the prapors of the regiments and hundreds of left-bank hetman and on the flags of the regiments of Slobozhanshchina. To distinguish between Cossack regiments and hundreds of flags, flags were used in different colors. This was caused not by their national differences, but by the military necessity for determining the place in the battle of one or another regiment or hundreds. So, the attempts to keep the history of the Ukrainian flag from the flags of Cossack hundreds and regiments is the blatant ignorance of their authors.



Where did the yellow-blue flag come from in Ukraine? It turns out that this myth, like all “Ukrainian”, was born in Galicia at that time in Austria and has no relation to the history of Ukrainian lands. This flag is not so ancient and it appeared in the middle of the XIX century. The combination of yellow-blue color of the flags is characteristic of the provinces of the Austrian Habsburg Empire - Dolmatia, Lower Austria, Galicia and Lodomería, and Russia-Ruthenia. All these lands were Austrian provinces and had no relation to big Russia. Galician Ruthenians received such a flag from the hands of the Austrian royal family for their faithful service.



In 1848, a revolution broke out in Austria, and the emperor attracted to its suppression the Ruthenians of Galicia, who showed themselves well as punishers against the rebels. For the faithful service to Franz Joseph, they were honored by the last nickname “Tyroleans of the Middle East” and he granted them the yellow-blue flag as a symbol of the Galician regiment, and the Russian Council created by the Austrian authorities and loyal to them approved Galatians and called on the Ruthenians to support the emperor. According to one version, on the ribbon to the flag of the Rusins, the mother of the emperor, Archbishop Sophia, embroidered the slogan: “Loyalty leads to victory. Sophia, archknyaginya Austrian ".

As you can see, modern myth-makers are trying to make the symbol of loyalty to the Austrian throne a symbol of "independent Ukraine" and to hide the role of the Habsburgs in the history of its appearance. Cossacks with their regimental badges appeared as arguments much later, when the population of Little Russia had to invent a new story in which it would appear as a special non-Russian people on the outskirts of Poland.

On the territory of modern Ukraine, except Galicia, until 1914, this flag has never been some kind of symbol and, moreover, has not been used by any military, political, or social structures. Nobody knew anything about this flag on the territory of the Ukraine.

The yellow-blue flag reappears with Sich archers on the eve of the First World War. Under the Austrian command, units of the Ukrainian Sich Riflemen and other Galician formations are created, which the Austrian monarchy, under this flag, is preparing to conduct combat operations against the Russian army.

The emissaries of the archers under the leadership of Grushevsky are sent to Kiev to conduct subversive activities. They attract students from Kiev and organize a demonstration in March 1914 on the occasion of the celebration of Shevchenko, where they were held for the first time in the Ukraine under the yellow-blue flag. So the colors of the Habsburg Empire penetrated the territory of Little Russia and began to poison the life of the local population.

Sich Riflemen under this flag were defeated by Russian troops in 1915 on Mount Makovka. Ukrainian myth-makers try to present this defeat as a “great” victory of the Ukrainian weapons and instead of Victory Day, to celebrate 8 in May, the day of memory of the Sich Riflemen, teaching everyone to put on the graves of the fallen not carnations, but poppies.

The corps of the Sich Riflemen was eventually defeated by Russian troops, and many of the archers were captured, including Konovalets, the future head of the OUN. Immediately after the February Revolution, immigrants from Galicia establish a self-styled Central Council in Kiev, headed by Grushevsky (from 18 12 members were representatives of Galicia) and recruited former prisoners of the Sich Riflemen under the yellow-blue flag. Konovalets creates fighting units in Kiev in November 1917, which distinguished themselves by suppressing the Arsenal workers' uprising

When Hrushevsky was created in January 1918 of the Ukrainian People’s Republic, the flag of the Austrian province becomes the national flag of this operetta state. With the liquidation of the UNR, the flag passes to the hetman Skoropadsky, it changes colors on the contrary, but this does not help, and this regime has fallen. The next champion of separatism, Petliura, returned to the flag of the Ukrainian People's Republic on Polish bayonets, but the curse of Austrian flowers overtakes him, another pseudo-state has sunk into oblivion. In November, the 1918 of the year in Galicia is formed under this flag. The Ukrainian Galician Army, which befalls the same fate.



With the end of the civil war, the yellow-blue flag in the Ukrainian lands was almost forgotten; it was only used by the OUN fighters and in the foreign diaspora represented by people from Galicia. It re-emerges during the period of the Great Patriotic War and unites Ukrainian punishers and policemen.

Under this flag in the occupied Ukraine and Belarus, the punitive battalions "Nachtigall" and "Roland", the SS division "Galicia" and the ruthless beast of the UPA dealt with the civilian population. The yellow-blue flag fluttered beside the Hitler flag over all police stations and city councils and in the eyes of the population remained a symbol of betrayal and betrayal.

With the beginning of the next troubles at the end of 80's, the yellow-blue flag reappears, and not just anywhere, but at demonstrations in Galicia, in other regions, it was and remained an alien symbol. Gradually, under pressure from the Galician emissaries who flooded Kiev and the Supreme Soviet, this flag is being imposed as a symbol of independent Ukraine, and after the well-known events in Moscow in August 1991, on the wave of general permissiveness at the request of the RUH, it was raised above the building of the Supreme Soviet.

What should be the national flag of Ukraine, no one has ever publicly discussed. Backstage under the leadership of Kravchuk by the decree of the Presidium of the Supreme Council in September 1991, it was used in official events. Under pressure from the leadership of the Supreme Council, deputies in January 1992 of the year approved it as the state flag. So, the yellow-blue donation, presented by the Austrian monarch to the Sich archers of Galicia for the faithful service of the Habsburg crown during the suppression of the Hungarian uprising, became the national flag of Ukraine.
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  1. +13
    19 September 2018 06: 12
    All right. But try to explain to the residents of Ukraine, even sane (those who are not Russophobes), that they live under the wrong flag and that they were Little Russians (Russians) a hundred years ago.
    They take offense: "How so? We have always been like this: both fathers and grandfathers!" Nobody knows about great-grandfathers ... request
    "Dragon's Teeth", sown 100 years ago and carefully fertilized all these years by the authorities, gave rich and strong seedlings, which have already healed an independent life ...
    1. +4
      19 September 2018 08: 38
      They really believe that they have always lived in these places. That there was no wild field. Not a single Ukrainian can explain that all these lands are newly inhabited ...
    2. 0
      19 September 2018 12: 07
      But try to explain to the inhabitants of Ukraine, even sane (these are those who are not Russophobes), that they live under someone else’s flag

      So they also live in a foreign land.
    3. 0
      19 September 2018 16: 10
      Quote: Olgovich
      But try to explain to the inhabitants of Ukraine, even sane

      You seem to be commenting on articles from the "Colorado cockroach"? is not a candidate?
    4. The comment was deleted.
    5. +1
      24 September 2018 04: 40
      The brains of the Little Russians are "banded".
  2. +5
    19 September 2018 07: 12
    And I thought it was a sinful thing that the so-called flag of Ukraine appeared during the time of Mazepa ... I thought that the colors of the Swedish flag are represented on the Ukrainian flag ... It turns out I was wrong ...
    1. +9
      19 September 2018 12: 18
      Quote: solzh
      thought that the so-called flag of Ukraine appeared during the time of Mazepa
      The Hetman flag of those times (before, during and after Mazepa) is white with a yellow (gold) pattern and inscriptions not in a fictional newspeak, called mova, but in Old Russian. It is stored in the Kharkov Historical Museum.
      Quote: Curious
      The fact is that with a combination of colors of the Austrians the All-Russian Emperor Alexander the First was ahead.
      In 1787, the Black Sea Cossack army was formed from parts of the Army of Faithful Cossacks, the basis of which were former Zaporozhye Cossacks. In 1792, the army was relocated to the Kuban. And in 1803, Emperor Alexander I granted the army such a banner.
      I wonder what considerations the imperial heraldists were guided by when fulfilling the king’s mission? Really consulted with the Austrian colleagues?
      Fake "historians" of fake Ukraine brazenly publish fakes on the pages of VO, i.e. an outright lie, chutzpu, which they - the biytsy infoviyny - are scraping the brains of the unfortunate Ukrainian schoolchildren.
      That's what really happened (about the image on the fake): "b.) BLACK SEA TROOPS.
      In 1803 - 12 were granted this army regimental banners in the form of badges with flowers: for 6 - top Orange, the bottom is blue, and for 6 on the contrary, the top is blue, the bottom Orange... In the middle of each banner is a red cross in a golden glow. The fringe around the banners is gold; silver cords and tassels; spears with the monogram name of Emperor Alexander, gilded; white shafts (Fig. No. 2505). "- Viskovatov A. V., Historical description of clothing and weapons of Russian troops, 1841-1862, v.18, p.63.
      But regimental badges, the color in which the ukrolzhetsy decided to change and pass these badges off as the banner of the entire Black Sea Cossack army, with the aim of the Pharisaic chutzpah and demagogy about "zhovtoblakitnoe", there were also small kuren banners and large military banners (there were several of them). The color of military banners is white, on the banner drawings and inscriptions are black or gold. See more details here: "Flags and Standards of the Cossack Troops of the Russian Empire" - https://forma-odezhda.ru/encyclopedia/flagi-i-shtandarty-kazachih-vojsk-imperatorskoj-rossii/
      1. -1
        19 September 2018 12: 37
        White flag of the Black Sea Cossack army (top left) and regimental / smoky banners of the Cossacks


        PS From the outskirts of Curious'a the historian is like a bullet from a substance laughing
        1. +5
          19 September 2018 12: 51
          Operator, be careful, do not drag fakes here from resources publishing the lies of Ukrainian grant-eaters and Infoviysk beaters. I just gave a link to the fact that Zhovtoblakitnyh regimental badges from the Black Sea Cossack army never existed. Here's what those icons actually looked like according to my links above:
          1. +2
            19 September 2018 12: 55
            I completely agree with you - not yellow, but orange (the so-called flame color).
      2. +1
        19 September 2018 13: 54
        Quote: Nikolai S.
        Fake "historians" of fake Ukraine brazenly publish fakes on the pages of VO, i.e. an outright lie, chutzpu, which they - the biytsy infoviyny - are scraping the brains of the unfortunate Ukrainian schoolchildren.

        And to be honest, I see no reason for such intense ideological battles on this issue. By and large, on the ideological plane, the question is only from whom in the 19th century. (!) the ancient Ukrainians (not to be confused with the people of Ukraine) received their current flag - from the Russian emperor or from the Austrian. In this and in another case, the age of their state symbols, to put it mildly, does not correspond to their ambitions. In addition, it is hardly more pleasant for Svidomo Nazis to recognize their flag as the creation of the Russian emperor, rather than the Austrian, with their burden of European integration ... laughing
        From the point of view of obtaining reliable knowledge for general development, the discussion is really interesting and I, as a non-specialist in this field, were interested in reading it, for which I thank its participants. hi
  3. +1
    19 September 2018 07: 20
    Thanks to the author for the article.
  4. -2
    19 September 2018 09: 09
    Again a torn record about Austria. The fact is that with a combination of colors of the Austrians the All-Russian Emperor Alexander the First was ahead.
    In 1787, the Black Sea Cossack army was formed from parts of the Army of Faithful Cossacks, the basis of which were former Zaporozhye Cossacks. In 1792, the army was relocated to the Kuban. And in 1803, Emperor Alexander I granted the army such a banner.

    I wonder what considerations the imperial heraldists were guided by when fulfilling the king’s mission? Really consulted with the Austrian colleagues?
    By the way, Austria is the author of not only the Ukrainian flag. In 1858, Alexander II approved black-yellow-white as the state flag of the Russian Empire.
    However, Russian society did not accept this new symbol of state power: in the minds of Russians, black and yellow colors were associated with Austria and the house of the Habsburgs ruling there. In the Empire, there were two parallel flags: black-yellow-white - national "de jure". and white-blue-red - the national "de facto".
    So the Austrian General Staff is a traditional defendant in "flag" issues.
    In general, when reading the article, the question arises - is it possible that the ranks of the fighters of the ideological front have thinned so much that such poor resources as the author are thrown into battle "against myths."
    And another moment illustrating the limitations and the nearness of the author is a mention of the flags under which the collaborators in the Second World War acted. Here, if you recall, it will turn out quite inconvenient.
    1. +1
      19 September 2018 09: 19
      Hello, Victor. A little bit ahead of me with a gift from Alexander I.))
      In general, in such articles "about debunking the myths" there is less and less "popcorn", which is so fond of today's readers. I now believe that if the author brought the roots of the Ukrainian flag to the flag of the province of Herrera in Panama or the principality of Dholpur, it would be much more "original and fresh"
      1. +3
        19 September 2018 11: 54
        That is, do you think that the yellow-blue colors were inherent in the banners / banners of Kievan Rus-Ukraine?
        1. +2
          19 September 2018 15: 00
          No, I don’t think, as well as the fact that Kievan Rus was Ukraine.
    2. +4
      19 September 2018 10: 38
      Indeed, the people did not like the so-called emblem of the black-yellow-white flag of Russia because of its color similarity with the flags of Austria and Prussia. But where does the Austrian General Staff? With all their wishes, neither Austria nor Prussia could influence the decision of Alexander II, guided by their own “aesthetic” considerations. But the Austrian "General Staff" could have an impact on Galicia, which is part of Austria!
      As for the Black Sea Cossack army, which became the late base of the Kuban army, it is completely unclear what relation it has to the state of Ukraine and the yellow-black “fighters for its independence” Grushevsky, Skropadsky, Petlyura, Bandera ...? There is no more in common between them than Ukraine and the state of Barbados, whose symbolism is also ridiculous: a yellow-blue flag with a black trident in the middle.
    3. +3
      19 September 2018 11: 47
      For the first time, the use of black, yellow and white appears under the Emperor Peter I, on his standard in 1709. Do you think all the same the Austrians?
      1. +1
        19 September 2018 17: 35
        Are you sure that yellow ??? Or maybe orange? So these are two BIG differences.
    4. +1
      19 September 2018 12: 20
      Quote: Curious
      And in 1803, the emperor Alexander I granted the army such a banner

      Viktor Nikolaevich, do you really see the fact of the historical continuity of the modern flag of Ukraine in relation to the flag granted by Alexander I to the Black Sea Cossack army? To me personally, despite the coincidence of the color range and the relative position of the yellow and blue fields, such continuity seems rather doubtful. At the same time, the same continuity with respect to the Galician flag, in my opinion, is beyond doubt.
      It seems that the similarity of the color scale is determined, rather, not by direct "inheritance", but, so to speak, by "common ancestor". Both the Russian and Austrian emperors used the same sources when choosing colors for new flags for their subjects and, most likely, such a source was the history of the Galicia-Volyn kingdom or principality, as you like.
      In the end, it is this and only this state entity, although it has existed for a relatively short time, that can really claim to be the forerunner of the Ukrainian state, albeit with a very big stretch. Therefore, it is not surprising that his heraldic colors have tried and continue to try to use them for certain political purposes.
      1. +3
        19 September 2018 14: 25
        "Viktor Nikolaevich, do you really see the fact of the historical continuity of the modern flag of Ukraine in relation to the flag bestowed by Alexander I to the Black Sea Cossack army? Personally, despite the coincidence of the color scheme and the mutual arrangement of the yellow and blue fields, such continuity seems very doubtful. the same time, the same continuity in relation to the Galician flag, in my opinion, is beyond doubt. "
        Hello, Michael. No, of course, there is no continuity between the modern flag of Ukraine and the flag of the Black Sea Cossacks. I cited this example solely as the fact that the combination of yellow and blue colors in the history of the Cossacks has been encountered for a long time and, obviously, was taken into account by the imperial heraldists in the preparation of the flag. Blue and yellow (gold) are classic heraldic colors, it is not surprising that they are found on various flags to this day, including among Cossacks. There are such banners in museums, in addition, just look at the flags and banners of the Cossacks of Russia to see this. However, Ukrainian historians also say that these flags are not the root of the origin of modern Ukrainian symbolism.
        As for the Ukrainian flag, it really is based on the coat of arms of the Lviv land and the Russian voivodeship within Poland. The humor of the situation is that the detailed history of the emergence of the Ukrainian flag is presented just on the Russian site "Excursion into Heraldry" under the heading "Vexillology" (http://www.excurs.ru/flags/Ukraine_flag.htm). But neither the "debunker of myths", nor the commentators with their cave chauvinism have ever looked there, and they have never heard of a concept such as vexillology. Therefore, the level of "revelations" is appropriate - caveman.
        1. -1
          19 September 2018 16: 28
          Quote: Curious
          Poland. The humor of the situation is that a detailed history of the emergence of the Ukrainian flag is presented just on the Russian site "Excursion into heraldry" in the heading "Vexillology"

          I went through your link, I read, I'm just happy. laughing
          Especially pleased
          And already at the meeting on May 18, it was decided to consider "the banner of the Russian land - the lion, and the flowers - yellow and blue"

          Just a song. Well, "Golovna Russka Rada" also warms the soul ... smile What is Ukraine, what are you talking about? Immediately I remembered:
          We, Ruski Galitski, are close to the great Russian people, who speak the same language and make fifteen million, for whom the best of the land of Galicia is mixed up

          This is an appeal of the same Council in the same year 1848. His need to hang over the doors of the Verkhovna Rada, under the yellow-blue flag, I think ... laughing
          1. +1
            19 September 2018 16: 57
            Michael, in the passage of the manifesto that you quoted, it is possible that this is not about the Great Russians. And about whom - I can only guess. The figure of 15 million is embarrassing. This is not the size of the Russian population. At first I thought that the Rusyns of Galicia called the Rusyns in general (nationalism and all that). And out of the pier, a total of half a million, citizens of Austria-Hungary. But Rusyns at the most generous calculation are estimated at 5 million in the bread years. Maybe you can explain or which of those present?
            1. -2
              19 September 2018 17: 18
              Quote: Nefarious skeptic
              Michael, in the passage of the manifesto you quoted, it is possible that this is not about the Great Russians.

              Certainly.
              I think that we are talking about the territory of Little Russia, i.e. Middle Dnieper.
              Although personally I was amazed exactly how these comrades self-identify themselves.
              1. 0
                19 September 2018 19: 00
                And they could not call themselves otherwise, only Rus, Russians. The ethnonym "Ukrainians" was not in circulation at that time outside a very limited circle of people. True, the ethnonym "Russians" then put a slightly different meaning, but they prefer not to mention this.
                1. +1
                  20 September 2018 13: 00
                  Quote: Curious
                  True, the ethnonym "Russians" then put a slightly different meaning, but they prefer not to mention this.


                  It depends on who. In the same Galicia, the "Russophiles" considered themselves part of the large Russian people, along with the Great Russians.
                  1. -1
                    20 September 2018 13: 07
                    Galician Russophiles? The question is complex, and to that author, like Apukhtin, is simply overwhelming.
    5. +6
      19 September 2018 13: 02
      Well, about the Black Sea flag they answered you, now about the flag of Russia. Black-yellow (orange) -white heraldic colors of the Russian Empire have existed since at least the 18th century. It was of these colors that there was a military cockade, an officer scarf, and other heraldic objects. In the end, that’s why the St. George ribbon has just such colors. Such colors have been on the tsar’s banner since the 17th century, later on the regimental banners of the regiments - a gold (then black) eagle on a white background, and on the state emblem - a black (gold) eagle on a gold (white) background.
      In general, it must be understood that state flags usually repeat the colors of emblems, the emblem is primary.
      The same story with the Ukrainian flag is the color of the Lviv coat of arms - a golden lion on a blue background. Moreover, according to the rules of heraldry, the background color of the coat of arms is below, and the color of the figure below, which is why the Polish flag is white-red and Galician was yellow-blue. This was later turned upside down, as rightly indicated in the article.
      Incl. Once again, it can be stated that "Ukraine" is Galicia, which expanded to the lands of Little Russia and crushed it in idiological and cultural terms, bringing its name, language, national heroes, ideological guidelines
      1. +1
        19 September 2018 13: 28
        Yellow in heraldry symbolizes gold, and orange - flame.

        Therefore, yellow was used on the civil flag of the Galician province of the Austro-Hungarian Empire, and orange was used on the military flags of the Black Sea Cossack army of the Russian Empire.
        1. +6
          19 September 2018 13: 39
          In heraldry, there is no "orange" or "yellow" color. In heraldry there is: "In classical heraldry, two metals are recognized: gold and silver; five colors (enamels, enamels): scarlet, azure, green, niello and purple." Gold is depicted in yellow or orange. It's, like, one color. Just like in classical heraldry there is no "blue" and "blue", this is one color - "azure". Therefore, Gerd Lvov is a golden lion on an azure field.
          But on army badges, colors can be anything you like, and they, as a rule, do not mean anything at all, they do not obey the principles of heraldry.
          1. 0
            19 September 2018 17: 29
            Obey - orange ("fire") is used in the ribbon to the military order of St. George the Victorious.
            1. +1
              20 September 2018 13: 01
              The St. George ribbon uses Russian coat of arms - black and gold. The tape itself could be either black and yellow or black and orange.
  5. +2
    19 September 2018 09: 48
    Quote: Curious
    All-Russian Emperor Alexander First ahead of the Austrians

    But nothing, that the flag of the Black Sea Cossack army was three-colored, and the Galician flag (on your avatar) granted by the Austro-Hungarians was two-colored?

    And yes - contact your optometrist: "black-white-yellow" flag of the Austro-Hungarian Empire



    And so as not to get up twice - the flag of the house of Gasburgs



    1. +1
      19 September 2018 09: 53
      Why then immediately send a person to the optometrist? The man did not write about the flag of Austria-Hungary
      in the minds of Russians black and yellow colors associated with Austria and the ruling house of the Habsburgs

      1. +1
        19 September 2018 09: 59
        And what is the connection of the state flag with the dynastic? And is it that the Romanov’s house has three-color?

        You will do arithmetic at your leisure before you flog mu-mu.
        1. -3
          19 September 2018 10: 14
          Operator, we have long established that the level of your knowledge and your claims are diametrically opposite things. Read at your leisure the history of the Russian state flag. Just Rosman about the state symbols of Russia for children published a popular science book about fifteen years ago, just for your level. All the best and success in learning your own story.
          1. +3
            19 September 2018 17: 38
            I look. You are a story. You study on the tabloid books.
        2. +1
          19 September 2018 10: 22
          Did you notice the phrases in the quote in bold?
          And arithmetic? And the three-color flag of the Romanovs? What is the difference between state or dynastic (why didn’t you have a claim to the article in that case, that national flag modern countries of the Republic of Ukraine are looking for common and excellent with flags of military units?).
          It's about the perception of objects. A person seeing two of the three colors coinciding when the geometry of the pattern is similar, takes an object similar to another object with these colors and similar geometry of the pattern. At the same time, what is contained in the transport object as a whole is subconsciously transferred. Victor talked about this.
          1. 0
            19 September 2018 10: 26
            The outskirts of Viktor have a mess in his head - according to his logic, the flags of the Russian Federation, France, the USA and Britain coincide, since they contain the same colors laughing
            1. -2
              19 September 2018 10: 32
              Andrei, Victor didn’t even hint at this (just as I can’t draw such a conclusion) - these are only your fabrications (I will not use the word porridge).
              1. 0
                19 September 2018 10: 38
                I spoke only about Victor's borderline "logic".
      2. -4
        19 September 2018 10: 17
        Hello! Yes, you do not pay attention, this is the Operator. He generally has a Jewish history, only Klesov writes the truth. Let it buzz.
  6. +5
    19 September 2018 10: 17
    All country 404 loan:
    coat of arms - Khazar tamga;
    title name - the Polish word "outskirts";
    language - Polish-German-Jewish surzhik;
    flag - provincial Austro-Hungarian;
    most of the territory - Novorossia and Donbass, transferred in the 1922 year, Galicia, Bukovina and Transcarpathia, transferred in the 1939-40 years.

    Nevertheless, local "historians" foaming at the mouth assert that the inhabitants of the Okrug have been bearing the original name "Ukrainians" for 140 thousand years in a row laughing
    1. +7
      19 September 2018 17: 41
      you are absolutely right, this "gosudarstva" degenerated into 91-all borrowed, foreign. Stolen.
      1. +2
        19 September 2018 18: 06
        There was one thing that was not stolen - the name of the country "Rus" and, accordingly, the name of the titular nation "Russians", but the Little Russian mankurt themselves abandoned this in 1917.

        But before the entry of Little Russia into the Russian Kingdom, the hetman Vygovsky concluded an agreement with the Polish king’s proxies to create the Grand Duchy of Ruska within the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth (the Polish-Lithuanian Sejm refused to ratify the agreement) - it’s completely dark, you see, the hetman knew nothing about the existence of the Grand Duchy of Okrainsky and Okrainsky ethnos, and even used the wrong seal - Principality of Ruslaughing


        The question is when, then, could a special border nation be formed if it didn’t have a spirit in the Kingdom of Rus and the Russian Empire?
  7. BAI
    +1
    19 September 2018 10: 17
    The flag is called "zhovto-blakitny" - yellow-blue (one can argue about the translation of the word "blakitny", but the first word is "yellow". Colors are counted from top to bottom (as the text is read) - that is, either the flag is turned upside down, or Ukraine is not Europe and reads (counts) in a special way.
    1. +2
      19 September 2018 10: 22
      Outskirts do everything backwards laughing
      1. Cat
        +6
        19 September 2018 20: 23
        No. I read the comments of the members of the forum, is it really a quasistation of existence - to smear the neighbors with mud and whitewash your loved ones?
        The question is, if "gizzard-blakitny" is in your throat, then what are you ready to offer your neighbors?
        With all due respect to the Author, the topic has not been disclosed! Dear and deeply respected Yuri, well, "there was not enough money for wide Ukrainians" and instead of a golden lion on a blue field, they received a flag that was soon sewn on a living thread. They want to believe in his 140000th birthday, their problems and headaches.
        I want to draw the attention of my colleagues to another question. Ukrainian sources derive their national flag from the free Zaporizhzhya Cossacks, and our historians indicate the succession of our tricolor from the banners of archers. Although, according to Byzantine sources, the Slavs went on campaigns under the scarlet banners, during the time of Christianity, under black cloths with the faces of saints filled in gold. Well, what will we tie the ancient Slavs and the USSR? However, you can dodge and pull the imperial eagle of Austria, or rather a hammer and sickle? Want a twist with a five-pointed star? No problem......
        The borrowing of heraldic symbols, colors and signs has both a causal-historical and a purely elemental character. In both cases, that of the neighbors that we had at the time of Peter had a spontaneous character when it was necessary yesterday, but this was remembered today ........
        C So I don’t see any reason to break my spears, I hope that the day will come when in the morning I will see a sufficient, comprehensive and balanced article on VO .. Sincerely, Kitty!
        1. +1
          20 September 2018 13: 08
          Quote: Kotischa
          The question is, if "gizzard-blakitny" is in your throat, then what are you ready to offer your neighbors?


          Let them use it is their business. Just do not lie about its origin.

          Quote: Kotischa
          so our historians indicate the succession of our tricolor from the banners of archers.


          I have never heard such nonsense. Russian tricolor from Peter lead, or from the time of his father.

          Quote: Kotischa
          Well, what will we tie the ancient Slavs and the USSR?


          What for? We will not.


          Quote: Kotischa
          C So I don’t see any reason to break my spears, I hope that the day will come when in the morning I will see a sufficient, comprehensive and balanced article on VO ..


          This article is quite adequate and balanced covers the history of the Ukrainian flag.
          1. +3
            20 September 2018 14: 06
            Quote: Gopnik
            This article is quite adequate and balanced covers the history of the Ukrainian flag.

            Somewhat biased and not deep enough.
            In particular, the author did not indicate the main, generally accepted version of the origin of the flag. Namely - the decision of the Golovnaya Russian Rada in 1848 to recognize the colors of the "Russian people" as blue and yellow. I myself found out about this only from the comments, but the author, who has taken up this topic, is not forgiven for not knowing this.
            Well, it would be nice if the author, having become interested in a purely historical question, left his polemical enthusiasm and threw off ideological blinders that prevent him from seeing the strict truth.
            In fact, we have not a study in front of us, but a failed attempt (you can thank the author for even one). The original purpose of the author (if such was) - to understand and convey the truth to us, was lost at an early stage of labor, buried under ideological clichés and polemical foam and, thus, was not achieved.
            The article, in my opinion, is dangerously balancing on the verge of "History" - "Opinions", that is, it can be referred to a section that discusses political, ideological and other topics that have nothing to do with historical science.
  8. 0
    19 September 2018 11: 37
    "a combination of a clear, peaceful cloudless sky over the yellow color of the grain field" ... And if Ukraine were not an agrarian country and geographically located in areas of the planet unsuitable for agriculture, then how would the yellow color be interpreted? Sand, gold ....? Are there any other options ?
    1. Cat
      +1
      19 September 2018 21: 36
      I wonder what else you can suggest? Seriously and without the "wallpaper of the color of children's surprise"?
      In most cases, "forms" are born first, and then content is attracted to them by the ears!
      This is well described by Dumas and Hugo, the first about the birth of the French tricolor, the second about the red flag.
      At one time, being a first grader, he answered what the red color of the flag, the sickle and the hammer mean. I asked a counter question, but what does a star mean? An intelligible answer was never received, but only something about the symbol of the Red Army, alas, that did not convince me then.
      So the excellent image-making PR actions of our rulers with coats of arms, both with an eagle and with the coat of arms of the USSR, are killed by the pragmatists of a-uval Peter I with the ideoma "so that it is better seen through a telescope" - yes, that's me about our tricolor! Although his standard is a crowned two-headed golden eagle on a black background, which holds in its paws the four key seas of Rossi, it is worth a lot. In fact, like the "chase" of Alexander Nevsky.
      1. 0
        20 September 2018 09: 26
        Vlad, are you sure that the word "chase" identifies at least 50% of the forum participants in the sense that you meant?
      2. 0
        20 September 2018 13: 12
        Quote: Kotischa
        I wonder what else you can suggest? Seriously and without the "wallpaper of the color of children's surprise"?


        The truth. These are the colors of the Lviv coat of arms, originally from Austro-Hungarian Galicia.

        Quote: Kotischa
        An intelligible answer was never received, but only something about the symbol of the Red Army, alas, that did not convince me then.


        And what is wrong? The red five-pointed star is de-no a symbol of the red army. And what is wrong?
      3. +1
        20 September 2018 14: 25
        Quote: Kotischa
        In fact, like the "chase" of Alexander Nevsky.

        Vladislav, you mean the seal of Alexander Nevsky, as I understand it?

        At present, it is not identified as a "pursuit", especially since, according to VL Yanin, the namesake saints of the owner of the seal and his father were depicted on the princes' seals. So the seal most likely depicts a certain holy warrior, in whose honor Alexander's baptismal name was chosen, for example, Alexander Bergamsky.
        By the way, recently I heard from Igor Danilevsky that it was possible that Alexander Yaroslavich also had two names, like all members of his family (father, for example, Yaroslav-Fedor, see the seal), just the two names were the same. One - baptismal - in honor of the saint, the second - home - in honor of Alexander of Macedon.
        1. +1
          20 September 2018 14: 32
          In any case, Alexander Nevsky could not have had a "chase", since in Russia no one called the image of a horseman that way, but in Lithuania the "chase" appeared later.
          1. +2
            20 September 2018 15: 04
            The earliest (XNUMXth century) stamps "rider on horseback" were found on the territory of the Kaliningrad region. Most likely, they were the coats of arms of the Rus tribe and their neighbors - the Prussians and Lithuanians.

            After the resettlement of the Rus tribe to the east, the "rider on horseback" became the coat of arms of the Rurik house, after the adoption of Christianity, he was depicted in the image of George the Victorious with a spear that slays the dragon.
            1. +1
              20 September 2018 15: 25
              But they were not called "chase" in Russia, therefore the term "chase of Alexander Nevsky" is incorrect.

              Quote: Operator
              after the adoption of Christianity, was portrayed in the image of St. George the Victorious with a spear that defeats the dragon.


              The idea that the coat of arms of Moscow and coins depict George the Victorious appeared only in the 18th century, already strongly after the adoption of Christianity. Prior to this, it was believed that this was an image of a sovereign (not a saint, without a halo, but with a crown), and until the 16th century the horseman with a spear was on Novgorod coins, and in central Russia it was old-fashioned with a saber, like that of the Lithuanians.
              And the image of George traces its history, rather, from the south, from the "Thracian horseman".
              1. +1
                20 September 2018 17: 08
                Yes: in Russia such marks were called a horseman, from the moment a spear appeared in his hand - a spearman (coin a penny).

                The image of George with a spear hitting a dragon is in the coat of arms of the Principality of Moscow, then in the coat of arms of the Grand Duchy of Moscow, etc. Now this image is on the red flag of Moscow and on the coat of arms of the Russian Federation (on the chest of the heraldic eagle).

                The horseman with a saber is a Lithuanian modification of the coat of arms of the Ruriks (the Prussians were assimilated by the Germans).
  9. +5
    19 September 2018 23: 31
    The author and commentators supporting him think in feudal-feudal categories from the standpoint of great-power chauvinism. But, dear participants of the forum, you want or don’t want to, but there is Ukraine today and this must be taken into account, because this is an objective reality. Ukraine as well as Russia and Belarus is the successor of Kievan Rus, and this should also be reckoned with. This is our common story.

    About the flag. The current flag of Russia also has no significant historical symbols. It is known that Peter the Great proposed it for merchant ships as a commercial flag, so that they differed from warships.
    In the civil war under this flag, the white army, together with the interventionists, tormented Russia for almost 4 years. Vlasovites fought under this flag during the Great Patriotic War. So the story is that one that the other flag is practically no different. Therefore, it is necessary to stop these disputes leading to nothing.

    The only truly symbolic flag is the USSR flag - a red cloth with a sickle and a hammer, symbolizing the creative work and blood of the dead freedom fighters around the world.
    1. -1
      20 September 2018 06: 19
      Quote: Alexander Green
      The author and commentators supporting him think feudal serfdom categories from the standpoint of great-power chauvinism.

      List these "categories" fool lol .
      Quote: Alexander Green
      Ukraine as well as Russia and Belarus is heiress of Kievan Rus,

      Remember: there NEVER existed such a state as "Kiev" Rus
      Quote: Alexander Green
      In the civil war under this flag, the white army, together with the interventionists, tormented Russia for almost 4 years.

      Under this flag, Russia for 4 years selflessly fought in the usurpers of power, who gave the German occupiers FOREVER a third of the country and who even erased the name RUSSIA from the world map
      Quote: Alexander Green
      Vlasovites fought under this flag during the Great Patriotic War.

      You are also illiterate in this: the largest military group of owls. the traitors of the ROA. official flag was St. Andrew's flag
      Quote: Alexander Green
      The only truly symbolic flag is the flag of the USSR - a red cloth with a sickle and a hammer, symbolizing creative labor .

      And how does the color red "symbolize" .... "labor"? fool

      You, writing under the zhovto-blakitny flag, did not say anything ON THE TOPIC of the article: You support its use as the state flag of the so-called. "Ukraine"?
      1. 0
        20 September 2018 08: 54
        "You are illiterate in this: the largest military group of Soviet citizens, traitors to the ROA. The official flag was the St. Andrew's flag." You are right, Olgovich. Tricolor was used mainly by white emigrants, for example, the Russian National People's Army.
        1. 0
          20 September 2018 09: 21
          Come on! A miracle happened! laughing wassat
          1. 0
            20 September 2018 09: 55
            No miracle, just a coincidence. The man accidentally told the truth.
        2. 0
          20 September 2018 13: 16
          Quote: Curious
          Tricolor was used mainly by white emigrants, for example, the Russian National People's Army.


          Which is logical. And what other flag did they use? Only Russian national.
      2. 0
        20 September 2018 22: 08
        Quote: Olgovich
        List these "categories"

        Honor your like-minded people, at least a gopnik, and you will understand that he refuses even a "legacy" to poor Ukrainians, everything belongs to the suzerain ...

        Quote: Olgovich
        Remember: there NEVER existed such a state as "Kiev" Rus

        Indulging your whim, I make an amendment: “Ukraine is the same as Russia and Belarus
        is the heiress of the old Russian state. " What do you call him now?

        Quote: Olgovich
        Under this flag, Russia for 4 years selflessly fought in the usurpers of power,

        It was not Russia that fought, and your punishers tormented Russia, preventing the people from sowing or building.

        Quote: Olgovich
        You are also illiterate in this: the largest military group of owls. the traitors of the ROA. official flag was St. Andrew's flag

        Even bourgeois Wikipedia writes that “Russian collaborators also unofficially used individual collaborators [48], in particular, the use of the tricolor was documented in the frames of the parade 1st Guards Brigade ROA

        in Pskov on June 22, 1943 [49] and on Newsreel of the construction of Vlasovites in Münsingen»
        And how many cases were recorded? Who counted?

        Quote: Olgovich
        And how does the color red "symbolize" .... "labor"?

        Oh no no no! Not ashamed to cheat? They pulled out a part of the phrase and yernichat. I hope you will understand the Russian language, and understand that the red panel symbolizes the blood of the dead fighters, and the sickle and hammer symbolize labor. In the Soviet Union, this was even known in kindergarten.
        1. 0
          21 September 2018 09: 26
          Quote: Alexander Green
          Quote: Olgovich
          List these "categories"

          Honor your like-minded people, at least a gopnik, and you will understand that he refuses even the "inheritance" to poor Ukrainians, everything belongs to the suzerain ...

          Do not play with your head, but answer the question posed: WHAT "feudal-serf categories" did the author use?
          Or do you blurt out something that you yourself are not able to explain? lol
          Quote: Alexander Green
          Indulging your whim making an amendment: “Ukraine as well as Russia and Belarus
          is the heiress of the old Russian state. " What do you call him now?

          Maladets! But-Ukraine has REDACTED from the Russian name: wow "heir!
          Quote: Alexander Green
          in particular, the use of tricolor is documented in the frames of the shooting of the parade of the 1st Guards brigade of the ROA

          in Pskov on June 22, 1943 [49] and on the photo chronicle of the construction of the Vlasovites in Münsingen ”

          OFFICIALLY-not used, because was ANOTHER officer. flag. Are we talking about this?
          Quote: Alexander Green
          Oh no no no! Not ashamed to cheat? They pulled out a part of the phrase and yernichat. I hope you will understand the Russian language, and understand that the red panel symbolizes the blood of the dead fighters, and the sickle and hammer symbolize labor. In the Soviet Union, this was even known in kindergarten.

          Oh my god, and THIS declares ..... belay communist!
          Which one disgrace-Do not know the meaning of the BASIC state emblem of the USSR! am lol
          Chop up a bundle on your nose:
          Sickle and hammer (☭) - a symbol that personifies unity workers and peasants. It was the main state emblem of the Soviet Union

          Got it? Not "labor", but UNITY! Yes
          1. 0
            21 September 2018 17: 08
            Quote: Olgovich
            Do not play with your head, but answer the question posed: WHAT "feudal-serf categories" did the author use?

            On the thinking of feudal-feudal categories What is incomprehensible to you here? In the Middle Ages, Poland forbade the use of the Ukrainian language, later already in the Russian Empire, Ukrainians were also forbidden to use the Ukrainian language.
            Compare this with the statement of your like-minded Darth 2027, who writes in the discussion of Part 2 of this article that Ukraine needs to be combined with Russia, the state language of the Russian language must be introduced, Ukrainian compulsory education must be abolished, and in a couple of generations everything will go by itself.
            Isn't that the Middle Ages? What do you call it differently?

            You ask where the author thinks of feudal serfdom categories. Is everything clear with him too? The author today examines Ukraine from the perspective of the Middle Ages, when the Ukrainian nationality was just emerging and did not recognize the recent events that led to the formation of Ukrainian nationality.

            The author was stuck in the Middle Ages, believing that there is no such Ukraine, no Ukrainians. He did not use a single modern category by which a nation is identified.
            The author writes: “We take historical documents. Starting from the X century, in the indisputably historical annals “The Truth of Russia” and the XI century, “The Tale of Bygone Years” refers to Russia, Russian land, and Prince Oleg ordered in 882 to consider Kiev “the mother of Russian cities”.
            And asks; "Where is Ukraine here?"
            Yes, it’s not even the Middle Ages, it’s ordinary rubbish, because, following the author’s “method”, one might as well ask; "Where is the Muscovite here? Where is the Russian Empire here?"

            Quote: Olgovich
            Got it? Not "labor", but UNITY!

            At the expense of characters. Dear, do you really think that I don’t know? Yes, you just do not understand that there are no single-valued characters. A symbol is a symbol because it reflects some deep essence of reality.
            Yes, a crossed sickle and hammer means the unity of workers and peasants, but this is on the surface, for this they could draw a worker and a peasant woman in an embrace. But they drew a sickle and a hammer, because in the first place they are symbols of labor, and I wrote about it. In the Soviet state, labor was in the first place, and the motto was “who does not work, he does not exist, therefore the bourgeoisie took up arms against these symbols, and in Ukraine they are not banned because the hammer and sickle symbolize the unity of workers and peasants, the bourgeoisie they don’t give a damn about it, they don’t like the hammer and sickle, as symbols of labor, that's why they chose an element from the lunch service for themselves.

            PS You, by your denial of Ukraine and the Ukrainian nation, have become like the satirist Zadorny who banned America, you even presented the globe with an empty place instead of America. You also order yourself such a globe, only without Ukraine, and play with it in your sandbox as much as you want, and do not fool people with their heads.
            1. 0
              22 September 2018 06: 59
              Quote: Alexander Green
              In the Middle Ages, Poland forbade the use of the Ukrainian language, later already in the Russian Empire, Ukrainians also forbade use ukrainian language.

              IS THIS a "serf" category? belay fool lol Open the Dictionaries and finally find out what it is-feudalism, serfdom and category. In order not to blurt out what does not belong to the place and what you have no idea about.
              Quote: Alexander Green
              the historical annals “Pravda Russkaya” and XI century “The Tale of Bygone Years” speaks of Russia, Russian land, and Prince Oleg ordered in 882 to consider Kiev “the mother of Russian cities”.
              And asks; "Where is Ukraine here?"

              Correctly asks: so only the word "RUSSIAN" - and -NO so-called. "Ukraine". What's not clear?
              Quote: Alexander Green
              following the author's "method", one can just as well ask; "Where is the Muscovite here? Where is the Russian Empire here?"

              If you were at least a little literate, you would not have asked such a stupid question, because you would have known that
              The Moscow state is the name by which the territory of the Grand Duchy of Moscow was designated in the XVI-XVII centuries inside the RUSSIAN kingdom. In parallel, the process of synonymizing this name with Russia as a whole, which lasted until the transfer of the capital to St. Petersburg and the proclamation Russian Empire at the beginning of the XVIII century.
              Quote: Alexander Green
              At the expense of characters. Dear, do you really think that I don’t know? .

              Of course, they did not know (now you know, I have enlightened you): "work" and "unity" are different concepts (see dictionaries)
              Quote: Alexander Green
              Yes, you just don’t understand that unambiguous there are no characters. A symbol is a symbol because it reflects some deep essence of reality.

              in our discussion, this symbol clearly showed your (ordinary, though) illiteracy
              Quote: Alexander Green
              for this could draw in hug worker and peasant woman.

              This is Playboy lol Interesting Associations with Unity
              Quote: Alexander Green
              PS You, by your denial of Ukraine and the Ukrainian nation, have become like the satirist Zadorny who banned America, you even presented the globe with an empty place instead of America. You also order yourself such a globe, only without Ukraine, and play with it in your sandbox as much as you want, and do not fool people with their heads.

              tn. "Ukraine", alas, is and this is reality: a terrible anti-Russian monster, carefully raised by Bolshevism: they grew national in form and socialist in content, and raised national in form and Nazi in content. As with everything else, I didn't have enough brains
              1. -1
                22 September 2018 18: 48
                Quote: Olgovich
                Like everything else, there weren’t enough brains

                Sorry, but this is something you don’t have enough to correctly understand historical processes, your thinking went in cycles at the level of the Middle Ages, it is not able to capture further historical development.

                Quote: Olgovich
                This is Playboy  Interesting associations with Unity

                With humor, you are also tense. And this is the clinic.
                1. -2
                  23 September 2018 09: 40
                  Quote: Alexander Green
                  Sorry, but this is something you don’t have enough to correctly understand historical processes

                  It is not for you losers to talk about what is right and what is not.
                  How is that bankrupt from debt - teaches business.
                  Quote: Alexander Green
                  With humor, you are also tense

                  Okay, okay, but you will list, nevertheless, the "serf-feudal categories" that you blurted out.
                  Tense, right? belay
                  Tense, yes! Yes lol
                  1. -1
                    23 September 2018 16: 43
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    Okay, okay, but you will list, nevertheless, the "serf-feudal categories" that you blurted out.

                    It is useless for you to explain anything, because of your limitations and blindness, you are not even able to perceive the phraseological constructions of the Russian language, not to mention the categories.

                    Categories are statements, judgments, concepts, in which the most general and essential properties, signs of communication and relations of objects and phenomena are displayed. Each science has its own categories, including history, therefore, in this case, historical categories are understood as the kinds (or types) of relations between the Ukrainian and Russian peoples in the Middle Ages and at the present time.

                    And since the state of phenomena and the relationship between them in the course of life develop, so the categories cannot be eternal and ossified. Therefore, the expression "think of feudal-feudal categories" should be understood as the use of concepts characterizing the existence of the Old Russian state and its nationalities to evaluate the current relations between the Russian and Ukrainian nations, ignoring all changes.

                    This approach is called metaphysical, it does not allow you to correctly assess the situation, so study historical materialism, which is based on the dialectical method, and which gives the only right solution.
                    1. 0
                      24 September 2018 09: 42
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      It’s useless for you to explain anything, by virtue of your limitations and blindness, you are not even able to perceive the phraseological constructions of the Russian language, not to mention the categories.

                      lol laughing
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      Categories are statements, judgments, concepts, in which the most general and essential properties, signs of communication and relations of objects and phenomena are displayed.

                      Finally, torn from the dictionary! But did you understand? Nope lol
                      Nukas, LIST the "feudal serfdom CATEGORIES (concepts in which the most common and essential properties are displayed) ": first, second, etc. Yes
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      therefore, in this case, historical categories are understood parturition
                      relationship Ukrainian and Russian peoples in the Middle Ages and at the present time.
                      Who is interested in Yours lol childbirth and concepts?
                      List the generally accepted categories.
                      By the way, no so-called. "Ukrainian" backgammon in the Middle Ages did NOT exist in principle and relations, respectively, between him and the Russian people, could not be.
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      And since the state of phenomena and the relationship between them in the course of life develop

                      And what is the "state" of the phenomena (that is expressions, evidence of something else) and how can they change? fool

                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      Therefore, the expression "think serf-feudal categories" should understand the use of concepts that characterize being the old Russian state and its nationalities

                      No, you should LIST them, otherwise it is not clear WHAT to understand? lol
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      What approach is called metaphysical

                      "This" approach is the fruit of your through the looking glass imaginationfool
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      allows you to correctly assess the situation, so study historical materialism, which is based on the dialectical method, and which gives only the right decision.

                      The right decision is WHAT? To whom?
                      fool
                      1. 0
                        28 September 2018 16: 39
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        The right decision is WHAT? To whom?

                        It’s useless to explain to you; you simply cannot understand all this.
        2. +1
          21 September 2018 11: 07
          Quote: Alexander Green
          at least a gopnik, and you will understand that he refuses even a "inheritance" to poor Ukrainians, everything belongs to the suzerain ...


          Do not lie. Such a state education as Ukraine cannot claim the inheritance of Russia. The Ukrainian people, is, to a large extent, a descendant of the Russian population of Russia, though it denied in the 20th century (with the advent of its state education) its historical name
    2. 0
      20 September 2018 13: 15
      Quote: Alexander Green
      Do you want or do not want, but Ukraine is today and this must be reckoned with, because this is an objective reality


      This is certain.

      Quote: Alexander Green
      Ukraine as well as Russia and Belarus is the successor of Kievan Rus, and this should also be reckoned with.


      Ukraine and Belarus cannot be the heirs of Russia, because such state education appeared only in the 20th century

      Quote: Alexander Green
      The current flag of Russia also has no significant historical symbols. It is known that Peter the Great proposed it for merchant ships as a commercial flag, so that they differed from warships.


      The fact that the Russian flag is more than 300 years old is, in itself, quite good and glorious
  10. +2
    20 September 2018 09: 21
    There can be no doubt. The history of the so-called Ukraine is a fake, like its flags, emblems and other crap. Unfortunately, this is the so-called. the state still exists. Of course, there are quite normal people in Ukraine, but most of the so-called. Ukrainians, incl. those who write here are not distinguished by either great intelligence or knowledge. And this is very typical for the modern population of Svidomo jumpers. I do not exclude that in the future the term "Ukrainians" or "Ukrainian" will mean the most vile human qualities and will be considered indecent.
    1. -2
      20 September 2018 09: 53
      It is indecent in the past, present and future, regardless of nationality, that is xenophobia and cave great-power chauvinism - the lot of people who are mostly poor both in mind and knowledge.
      1. -2
        20 September 2018 10: 12
        I do not agree. Xenophobia is the engine of progress; Cro-Magnons have it in the genome.
      2. 0
        20 September 2018 11: 07
        Is it so written in Ukrainian textbooks?) They forgot about tolerance! How is it without her? For ukrohaley this is a very necessary property). Who can’t stand it in the process of European integration! So the Ukrainian, indecent in the past, present and future is the declaration by mad creatures without clan and tribe of known truths that these creatures do not understand, do not observe and have nothing to do with them. Stop first being Ukrainians, maybe then something human will manifest in you. Shame on you! Have pity on your children, since they certainly didn’t deserve to be Ukrainians and sing all sorts of nastiness under a vile yellow rag!
        1. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
  11. +2
    20 September 2018 14: 00
    Quote: Curious
    Tricolor was used mainly by white emigrants

    After the elimination of the communist regime, the white-blue-red tricolor, introduced by Alexei I in the 1991 year and used until April 1674, again became the national flag of the RSFSR in December 1918.

    What does the parasitism on the state tricolor (and on the sea flag of St. Andrews) have collaborators in 1941-45?

    Creating an informational noise, you are trying to blur a simple question - why the flag of the Austro-Hungarian province of Galicia became the state flag of Ukraine in 1991 laughing

    Yes - and what is a "Ukrainian ethnos" if, before the reunification with the Kingdom of Rus'k, the former Polish province was called the Principality of Rus'k, and after that - Little Russia until 1917? It turns out that the "Ukrainian ethnos" is at least 101 years old - quite enough to eliminate it as an artificial communist entity.

    PS The oldest haplogroup, Homo Sapiens A, with an age of 220000 years, is represented exclusively by the Bushmen and Hottentots of South Africa, anatomically different from modern people (folds of fat in the perineum and on the buttocks, S-shaped spine, etc.). All other haplogroups from B to T are no more than 65000 years old. With which I congratulate all the "Ukrainians" with 140000 years of history - direct descendants of the Bushmen and Hottentots laughing

  12. -1
    20 September 2018 16: 34
    )) we are waiting for an article about the Russian tricolor)) and its foreign trace)
  13. +1
    21 September 2018 02: 18
    So proudly we will wave in response to our foreign tricolor! (Which Petrusha took from the Dutch, twirled the glasses for a long time like a monkey, finally hung it sideways. This is how the Russian "historical" flag appeared.)
    1. 0
      21 September 2018 11: 16
      Not "Petrusha", but his father, even before his birth. And the flag of Russia is different (to put it mildly) from the flag of the Netherlands.
  14. 0
    19 November 2018 21: 02
    This is how the yellow-blue flag presented by the Austrian monarch to Galichia’s secular archers for their faithful service to the Hapsburg crown while suppressing the Hungarian uprising became the state flag of Ukraine.

    To clarify a little: for the suppression of not the Hungarian uprising, but the uprising of the Polish gentry of Galicia in 1846. Those events were also called the "Galician Massacre". Here's a typical example (from Wikipedia):
    Peasants (Galicians) with particular cruelty killed their masters (Poles), including cutting off or sawing off their heads. The Austrians paid a reward for the killed landowners. Since the sums paid for the dead were 2 or more times higher than the payments for the wounded or crippled gentry, many people captured by the wounded were brought by bandits to Tarnow and killed on the threshold of the Austrian administration mansion in the city center. According to eyewitnesses, it was so massive that blood flowed like a river through the city streets.

    And so, a very true and useful article. There is still a version (legend) that the yellow-black ensign was adopted by the hetman Mazepa, so that the Swedish troops in battle would understand that his Cossacks were their own and would not shoot them, mistaking them for Russian troops.