Military Review

Why does China buy the “outdated” C-400 from “backward” Russia?

In China, they are increasingly claiming the fatal lag of the Russian military-industrial complex from Chinese developments. According to the results of the recently exhibited in the Moscow region exhibition "Army 2018" appeared a very interesting and revealing article by a Chinese journalist Xi Yazhou, опубликованная in the authoritative edition of "Guancha".

Actually, the exhibition itself became for the journalist informational rather than the subject of analysis, on the basis of which the author concludes that, “despite the fact that the country has extensive experience in research and development, it still uses outdated software and hardware” and guided by the concept of "everything will correct itself." Since the subject of the author’s research was not so much the exhibits that serve more as a background for the narration, but rather the evolution of the Russian air defense systems of the “C” series.

Speaking about them, he brings the reader to the idea that "the so-called C-400 rocket system" (as in the text) is in fact a little modernized C-300, that the very introduction of the new name is just a marketing ploy, something like "restyling", the purpose of which is to create the potential illusion of potential buyers that the anti-aircraft missile system received a truly new characteristics.

Similarly, the author calls into question the fact that the third-generation rocket for the C-400 Triumph, 40H6, is radically different from the "predecessor" 48H6, which belongs to the second generation.

Why does China buy the “outdated” C-400 from “backward” Russia?

His conclusion, on the basis of which he “exposes” the alleged scam of Russian producers, is striking in its simplicity.

“Long-range anti-aircraft missiles must be large enough to have the necessary amount of energy to track targets and maneuver. Large rockets may have the ability to accelerate, and, consequently, better performance, ”writes Si Yazhou, explaining why“ the type of rocket larger than the 48H6E model became the only standard for identifying the 40H6 rocket ”.

At the same time, the model of the new rocket presented at the 2018 Army exhibition, writes the author of this article, “except that the maximum range of destruction of air targets increased to 380 kilometers, all other characteristics were like 48НХNUMXE6”.

As we can see, the Chinese specialist built his “exposure” solely on the appearance, or rather, on the dimensions of the device (another advertisement source available to the journalist was an advertising brochure presented by the manufacturer, which he calls into question).

As we can see, the material is not too rich for such conclusions. Obviously, Xi Yazhou himself understands this. And in order to look more convincing in the eyes of the audience, he clearly overloads a popular article with an abundance of indices, both Russian and Chinese, adopted during the development process and installed at the time of operation, as well as an abundance of minor details that do not carry a serious information load, but heightening doubt.

For example, "the test launch of rocket production was not smooth."

Even where it is impossible to avoid the use of positive ratings, the Chinese correspondent tries to soften them with the adverb “relatively” - “relatively convenient”, “relatively modern rocket”.

In the context of this, the question arises: why are Turkey and India by all means striving to get "these so-called C-400 missile systems," even at the risk of being sanctioned by the United States?

And Saudi Arabia, also interested in “Triumph”, threatened Qatar with war if he buys these air defense systems?

Are they all misled by the brilliant marketing specialists of Almaz-Antey?

The author does not concern at all these quite logical, but not very convenient questions for his construction.

However, he still had to explain why this “old” one was forced to buy the PRC to arm the PLA, despite the fact that the Chinese produce rocket complexes, which, according to him, are no worse, and even better than the Russian ones.

And this explanation was just great. According to Si Yazhou, the PLA has pushed unlimited trust in Russia towards an unnecessary purchase. "The Russian side will not brag? .. And only after receiving the technique, everyone understood:" It seems that our own developments are no worse ... "

After such explanations, the allegations that the Russian army is “backward” because they are modernizing old aircraft and “armored vehicles of twenty years ago” (and so do all the world's armies, including the US military, whose budget is ten times the Russian one), no longer cause astonishment.

Recall that not so long ago, the Chinese edition of Jinzhi Toutiao wrote that Russia can only envy, looking at the incredible achievements of the Chinese aircraft carrier fleet. But the comic of this statement is that the Chinese Navy has only two aircraft carriers (one of which has not yet been commissioned), one of which is a modernized old Soviet aircraft carrier “Varyag”, and the second, although it was built by the Chinese, is based on the same project. Maybe China, which has recently been very invested in the development of the fleet, will create its own unique aircraft carriers, but so far such statements sound strange.

Why and, most importantly, why do state-run media seem to be posting materials friendly to us in the spirit of Kiev propaganda?

Obviously, this is primarily a banal competition in the global arms market. Si Yazhou directly and frankly laments that "the whole world is not able to assess the real state of Russian military equipment, and even worse, continues to buy it." Instead of buying Chinese.

But if it’s only a matter of competition, even if it’s not very clean, it’s still nothing. It is much worse if the Chinese, through such publications, want to convince the enemies of our country of its weaknesses and underdevelopment, in order to push them to more decisive actions against our country.

Or it can be assumed (which would be even nastier) that in this way in Chinese society they intend to form an idea of ​​Russia as a colossus on clay feet, which will easily collapse from the blow of a modern advanced army. What can already be regarded as information preparation, if not for war, then for confrontation with our country.

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  1. Alex_You
    Alex_You 13 September 2018 10: 12
    China has always had a craving for copying. I do not buy for that?
    1. KCA
      KCA 13 September 2018 10: 28
      So, based on an article by comrade Yazhou, the S-400 is worse than the Chinese air defense system, why copy it? :-)
      1. EnGenius
        EnGenius 13 September 2018 13: 09
        The main thing is not rockets, the main thing is the goal to detect and escort. I also read an article in translation, only on the second day I realized that they couldn’t understand this main thing, that they had similar rockets for their HQ-9, but for some reason they continued to buy an outdated S-300 modification from Russia! Soon they will write what they buy out of pity to help a neighbor)
    2. Chertt
      Chertt 13 September 2018 10: 28
      Even the late Brzezinski, noted the vital importance for the United States, not to allow good relations between Russia (USSR) and China. Therefore, a large number of articles, recently, in the Chinese media, with all kinds of criticism in areas of activity important for Russia, are provocations designed to cause mutual distrust and discontent. With one and a half billion yellow rabbits, Russia will have to (in due time) clash, But for now we must not be distracted from the main task - Together with China, topple the overseas "exclusive hegemon"
      1. bulvas
        bulvas 13 September 2018 11: 17
        Quote: Chertt
        But for now, one must not be distracted from the main task -Topple the overseas "exclusive hegemon" together with China

        It is doubtful that we need it - to dump one of the 2

        None of the three countries need a strong weakening or strengthening of one of the players (but two will not work right away)

        There used to be a two-pole balance, now (until the next strong player appears) there will be a three-pole

        I dare to suggest that this condition is also beneficial for us.
        It doesn’t calm down, but the government is forced to take measures to move and develop

        - "Until the thunder breaks out, the man does not cross himself"

        Russia cannot be without thunder, Russia always rose only in the need to survive and survive
      2. Alber
        Alber 13 September 2018 14: 09
        Quote: Chertt
        The late Brzezinski, noted the vital importance for the United States, to prevent good relations between Russia (USSR) and China. Therefore, a large number of articles, recently, in the Chinese media, with all kinds of criticism in areas of activity important to Russia, are provocations designed to cause mutual distrust and discontent.

        Definitely, the Chinas should not be trusted. These comrades — the worms and larvae — are all too voracious and omnivorous — they eat all kinds of larvae, they say in the places where they live on the Russian territory of the Far East and the toads have disappeared.
        But now we should not grapple with them (although then I feel and it will be completely impossible anymore).
        In general, they let themselves on the threshold of a crocodile on their own head ....
      3. air wolf
        air wolf 13 September 2018 19: 04
        Sorry, the real numbers of the Chinese population are 700-800 million. The data are obtained from the results of China's consumption of food products: wheat, etc. The Middle Kingdom specifically overestimates the population data to be considered. That's the whole story wassat
        1. Kasym
          Kasym 13 September 2018 19: 45
          Dmitry, hi, I read about the same analysis. Only from the point of view of electricity consumption and the number of people in cities (there is some proportion with the rural population, which needs to be fed urban). The result is the same, about 800 million Chinese, but not 1,3 billion.
          By the way, the Indians also commit this sin. Apparently, they have such tactics. The larger the population, the less likely it is to invade. hi
        2. cradle
          cradle 14 September 2018 02: 41
          well, even 5 times more ... what does it change? For a successful offensive, Nuno has 3x superiority.
      4. Kent0001
        Kent0001 17 September 2018 20: 54
        And I think that even now the goals for our ICBMs in China have not been canceled .... since those times they have not been canceled, and the Chinese know this. They were once told that don’t even try to open the hatch on the rocket mine .... I think they remember, but what they may have to clash with is definitely not tomorrow. They have other interests now ..
    3. Battle penguin
      Battle penguin 13 September 2018 19: 32
      Quote: Alex_You
      China has always had a craving for copying. I do not buy for that?

      It is unlikely that they will be able to fully copy .. There is most likely a feeling of safety of the sky (the Russians have filled this hand and are selling honestly)
      And also China located its mines of ICBMs near the borders with Russia (under our protection, actually air defense)
      In short, the United States will catch up together ..! bully
      1. dSK
        dSK 13 September 2018 22: 55
        Quote: War Penguin
        It is unlikely that they can fully copy.

        Yes, they are world leaders, super copy specialists. It’s good that they do not buy as Armenia on credit, for our loans, which they then write off.
    4. botanist
      botanist 27 September 2018 12: 02
      It is interesting that we will read here about China and Russia their weapons in 5-10 years. Which option will win by then.
  2. Loess
    Loess 13 September 2018 10: 24
    Why and, most importantly, why do state-run media seem to be posting materials friendly to us in the spirit of Kiev propaganda?
    An attempt to rid their own population of the inferiority complex regarding the Chinese military-industrial complex?
  3. bessmertniy
    bessmertniy 13 September 2018 10: 24
    Arms purchases are not determined by journalists. This is done by specialists. And in China today it is not customary to buy abroad what they themselves can do. In this regard, the purchase of the S-400 speaks for itself. hi
  4. zyzx
    zyzx 13 September 2018 10: 27
    Well, what is left for the Chinese? They are not even the level of the USSR of the 90th year, not only that they can surpass, but also really can not copy, if there are samples. The army of China, too, very illusory, has lurked and sits, sits, sits, has been on its territory for the past eleven years.
    1. yehat
      yehat 13 September 2018 10: 36
      tell it to India, Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan, Vietnam, South Korea, Japan, other neighbors and a number of African countries, how the Chinese army is "sitting". Even in Latin America, China has a supply base. Today, China has a functioning, well-equipped expeditionary force, comparable to the American one in numbers and equipment, and ALREADY relying on a number of overseas bases. The naval component of this force and the mass of the latest means to support the landing are being actively put into operation.
      1. Fungus
        Fungus 13 September 2018 10: 55
        I did not understand that the Chinese army is already in Kazakhstan?
        1. PSih2097
          PSih2097 13 September 2018 11: 35
          Quote: Fungus
          I did not understand that the Chinese army is already in Kazakhstan?

          what for??? there is a more pragmatic way out ...
          The main headache of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Kazakhstan is water, or, more precisely, the "problem of transboundary rivers." China has long and shamelessly taken water from the Black Irtysh and Ili rivers, threatening an environmental catastrophe not only to Kazakhstan, but also to Russia. (The Irtysh is the main tributary of the Ob. The Omsk region will still cry when the process goes too far.) Water Wars, which look fantastic in the latest James Bond film Quantum of Solace, has long been a ruthless reality. Close the water tap, leaving the country to die of thirst, it is now as easy as, for example, close the gas. But if it is still possible to survive without gas, then it is impossible without water.

          Over the past 50 years, Kazakhstan’s water resources have declined by 20 billion cubic meters, and the process is accelerating. “The Ili River does not give a drop in the direction of Kazakhstan,” says the famous Sinologist and the first ambassador of Kazakhstan to China, Murat Auezov. - All the Chinese farmers took it all apart. In the XUAR (Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region), China deliberately relocates the Han people (representatives of the main nation) to dilute local ethnic minorities. And the Han people are traditional farmers, they take water in huge quantities and, in addition, passion like to use herbicides. That water that gets to us comes already poisoned. And on the Black Irtysh River, the Chinese have built a huge reservoir: they can stop the flow of water to Kazakhstan at any time or give as much as they see fit. This is a real water blackmail. And it’s strange that Russia is also silent about this. ”

          XUAR is growing rapidly, in dire need of water not only for agriculture, but also for oil production. Environmentalists warn: the construction of the Chinese channel "Black Irtysh-Karamay" and the actual "turn" of the Irtysh will lead to the disappearance of the lakes Balkhash and Zaysan and the slow dying of Kazakhstan. “What can we do? - Kazakh officials shrug. - The Chinese took us by the throat, and there are no levers of pressure on them. China refused to accede to the International Convention on the Use of Transboundary Watercourses, and the water code of the PRC leaves the country with the right to decide on the use of water in favor of the Chinese side. Our people are sitting senselessly and uselessly in some kind of bilateral commissions, but the Chinese are deliberately delaying negotiations. Do not fight us with them! Our military specialists calculated that the Kazakh-Chinese war would last only 40 minutes. One can even be proud of this: to be honest, we did not expect more than 20 minutes».

          “China is blackmailing us with a human mass,” says journalist Andrei Shcherbakov. - Do you remember the events on Tiananmen Square? When the West was outraged at the observance of human rights, Deng Xiaoping clearly stated to them: “So, guys, I have forty million people sitting on their suitcases here, they want human rights. I will personally send them to you at my own expense, I will not regret the planes and trains. Want to?" And everyone shut up. So what kind of gestures do you want from us, poor Kazakhs? ”

        2. yehat
          yehat 13 September 2018 12: 11
          After the collapse of the USSR, Kazakhstan already 2 times lost some of its territories to China, half of the industry was bought by Chinese shareholders. Nearby is a very restless Shinjiang. Do you think that there is no Chinese army at all, which suppresses riots and protects the interests of the state and investors?
          1. Kasym
            Kasym 13 September 2018 19: 55
            Lost in the same way as the Russian Federation. The disputed territories were halved - that’s all. And they did it earlier than you.
            You're wrong. The Chinese are now building more (51 production - 6 have already been launched) than buying assets here - that is, they themselves create ... For example, out of 80 million tons of oil (of which we consume about 30 million tons of oil) extracted in KZ , 20 million go to ... Italy. About 2 million tons go to China, for comparison.
            So this Xinjian is the guarantor of non-aggression of the Chinese in the KZ and Central Asia, and maybe even in the Russian Federation. In this situation, we will immediately begin to arm the Uyghurs! Therefore, Beijing is interested in friendship with us, more so in the stability and prosperity of our countries. hi
            1. Mih1974
              Mih1974 13 September 2018 23: 42
              You are mistaken and critical - China devours you, slowly, but very purposefully !! negative And the Chinese are already responding to your "threat" to arm the Uighurs by diluting and thus "destroying" the Uighurs. But the raised topic of water - oops sad , we already raked from them on the Amur.
            2. yehat
              yehat 14 September 2018 12: 26
              Which territories may be controversial between Shinjiang and Kazakhstan?
              China was not there before - there is no where to make claims.
    2. aybolyt678
      aybolyt678 13 September 2018 10: 42
      Quote: zyzx
      China’s army, too, very illusory, hides and sits,

      Oh well
    3. artemdjn
      artemdjn 13 September 2018 12: 33
      China already controls half of Africa to one degree or another. At the expense of the developments ... I'm afraid they don’t even breathe in the back burner, but have already overtaken the floor of the hull. In the CSG for sure. In the 90s and even in the 00s, we sold not only products but also KD completely. And gradually, China began to abandon purchases of either one incoming unit or another. In the end, they did it themselves and even modernized it. And I am generally silent about the test and control equipment. Even commonplace power supplies, and then Made in China.
  5. Terenin
    Terenin 13 September 2018 10: 35
    It is time for us to come to understand that foreigners, in the sphere of the country's image and foreign trade, have long been saying one thing and doing the other.
  6. Ros 56
    Ros 56 13 September 2018 11: 11
    Comrade Pu needs to ask Comrade X about this, and everything will fall into place.
  7. Santos
    Santos 13 September 2018 11: 22
    comrade yazhou, obviously we are not comrade. In the 90s, drives for electric motor drives were occupied by entire cabinets of two wing, and now the size of new drives is 6-8 times smaller. The size of computers does not have to say. 10-30 multiple reduction. I'm not talking about the composition of the powder charges of a rocket and mid-flight engines.
  8. iaroslav.mudryi
    iaroslav.mudryi 13 September 2018 11: 24
    Yesterday there was another episode of the Big Game program on the first, the topic: "Is a military-political alliance between Russia and China possible?" In principle, the entire program (50 min.) Is interesting, in short, the key moment from 22:30 - 23:20 - "the effect of the delayed union", i.e. when "a de facto union already exists, de jure may not be signed."
    [media = https: //]
  9. vkfriendly
    vkfriendly 13 September 2018 13: 25
    The Americans probably paid this Chinese, they are now trying in every way to undermine our sales and suck in their patriots and axes.
  10. Res_Ullus
    Res_Ullus 13 September 2018 14: 06
    Confrontation with China will be- DO NOT GO TO GRANDMOTHER !!! It's a question of time !
    1. meandr51
      meandr51 14 September 2018 18: 24
      Did you go to grandpa?
  11. tanit
    tanit 13 September 2018 14: 36
    And you can also add a photo to the article, with what the original-Chinese armored vehicles in "winter camouflage". Only the camouflage is not winter, but marine. But the Internet was - we will be captured this winter. laughing
    And you can quote Khramchikhin. I like about the IL-76 with the Chinese landing, sitting in the stadiums (upright, probably, but the sight is epic, however) laughing
    1. yehat
      yehat 14 September 2018 12: 29
      what's wrong with that? IL-76 can sit upright on the stadium. 1 time.
  12. AleksSandro
    AleksSandro 13 September 2018 16: 50
    Regarding "kind of like a friendly country to us" ... it's good that at least "kind of like", so as not to harbor unnecessary illusions. Yes, and "we have never had friendly countries, and never will. Neither in Europe, nor in Asia. And the Chinese have always been convinced that they are the most ancient great civilization, the" middle kingdoms "surrounded by wild tribes, the torch of world culture, are not the fact that the savages (Slavs or Germans, Turks or Arabs). In fact, their civilization took shape long before our era, only now they were all in the 19th and most of the 20th century in deep well ... The Anglo-Saxons turned them into the country of opium addicts, won 2 “opium wars.” The leading countries of Europe, as well as Russia and Japan, divided China into their spheres of influence, turning them into half-slaves of white people. foreigners (with the help of the USSR) .Then the 80s and the market reforms of Deng Xiaoping, only they had reforms, and not the collapse and plundering of the country, like ours. I won’t be surprised if very soon they really start to produce weapons better than ours , and it will be quite logical and p It is seasonal, because the basis of conditions for this is better for them than for us. First, there are 10 times more of them. Secondly, they have a higher percentage of workaholics and a lower percentage of drunks. Thirdly, they have a much higher level of discipline, to which they are taught with the help of tough measures all their lives. Well, as a consequence, the most important thing is that they have a more responsible government that thinks about their country, and does not hide stolen millions in Western banks, after all, corrupt officials are not given a suspended sentence of 9 years, they are not demoted or released on parole, reducing the term by 2-3 times, and publicly shot. And if we do not borrow their "advanced methods", then soon we will really find ourselves far behind from the same square
    1. meandr51
      meandr51 14 September 2018 18: 31
      Probably, due to the high discipline, Chinese cars roll in worse than ours. Nothing to say about tanks. China leads in the number of alcoholics per 1000 population. The Chinese command has no combat experience. Soldiers traditionally run at the same speed both forward and backward. They even crashed into the Vietnamese militia so that they quietly cleaned.
  13. Altona
    Altona 13 September 2018 17: 05
    If a rink breaks off on a Chinese tank, then there’s nothing more to say. The same can be said about Chinese aircraft. Despite the powerful set of their own research institutes, the Chinese were not too lazy to get a full set of documentation for the F-35 and make all the children's mistakes that were possible. With all due respect, for some reason, China still cannot create its own unique engineering schools in service.
    1. Mih1974
      Mih1974 14 September 2018 00: 25
      And they bought a WAGON of our engines to it)) How they then "married" all this - only Allah knows lol Well, the most convincing thing for debunking the "obsolescence" of our technology is the "requirement of the" Chinese "not to translate into Chinese" all our electronics, both "buttons" and "indications". belay bully good That is, it is easier to train "advanced" Chinese people to understand our indication than to adapt our "backward" technique to their "advanced" language level. tongue wassat
    2. meandr51
      meandr51 14 September 2018 18: 35
      Yes, ours under Stalin 10 years was enough to create their own schools. Hitler will not let lie.
  14. Conductor
    Conductor 13 September 2018 17: 14
    Sell ​​them With 125 of it, the same stealth in Yugoslavia was shot down.
  15. thinker
    thinker 13 September 2018 21: 00
    Well, what, a Chinese patriot praises Chinese weapons. Fine
    On the issue of supersonic speed, the American scientific community has already realized that China has taken the initiative and is leading in this area, while Russia takes a secondary position in this area
  16. Berg berg
    Berg berg 13 September 2018 22: 24
    A ridiculous title, because no one has it and it is unlikely to be soon. But copy, then only in a trimmed form, many tried.
  17. Tarasios
    Tarasios 14 September 2018 01: 36
    Many such experts were, are and will be, not even a match for this journalism.
    I'll just leave it here:
  18. popandopulo
    popandopulo 19 September 2018 20: 28
    Comrade Yazhou, in order to be a musician, skill is needed, and your ears are softer (i.e., your heads are more mature and your hands are smarter), and you, friends, do not sit down, everything is crooked with you.