Military Review

Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 5. Fifteen minutes left to fight

129
Comfortable and dangerous


Of course, there are no universal recipes for how to behave in battle in order to accomplish a combat mission and remain alive while there is no way. Every fight is unique and inimitable. In this article, we tried to accumulate the experience of special forces units that were caught up in an unusual situation in combat. Moreover, the experience is both positive and negative.



So, the scene is Afghanistan, 1987, the kishlak of Mazgin. Special Forces soldiers before the battle took the best position in the district. Note 1. The place that seems to be the most advantageous from the point of view of combat can be shot by your enemies in advance. They may not have occupied him solely because they “invited” you there. It is there in the battle that all the bullets will fly to the surprise, and missiles will fall. So in 1987, in the area of ​​the village of Mazgin, Lieutenant Evgeny Baryshev's reconnaissance group was ambushed. His position was comfortable, but pre-set by the Mujahideen. What brought later in battle to the lieutenant a lot of trouble. The same situation occurred in the same year in the area of ​​the village of Surubi, where, during an operation on a perfume-spotted unit, the soldiers of the 334 Special Forces detachment were in an ideal position to fight. It seems that the correct choice of position led to casualties in the detachment - for several hours slangmen smashed him precisely from all the barrels.

Conclusion: when planning ambushes or raids beware of places that seem to you the most convenient. They can be the most dangerous.

Maravarian tragedy

In 1987, in the maravara gorge, the fighters of the 334 squad of special forces, during the very first clash, somehow very easily killed the detachment of fighters on the bus for their faith. Residents of a non-peaceful village from afar heard the approach of “armor”. The spirits calmly got up, washed, had breakfast, got on the bus and drove right in the direction where the special forces were waiting in ambush. The bus was squeezed in a ravine and threw grenades. Dushmans lost 18 people. The special forces did not even have wounded. “Everything went like in a movie or in a picture,” the officers recalled. As a result, the fighters had an erroneous idea of ​​the "ease" of war. It then played a cruel joke with them.

Conclusion. Never relax. Especially in ambush or on the mission. Do not underestimate the enemy. If you easily scored some group, much more experienced fighters can come to rescue them (or avenge them). And they can come to you secretly, which is what happened in Maravara.

The special forces suffered heavy losses in the area of ​​the Dorida kishlak. The command received unconfirmed information that there is an American adviser in the village in the perfume group. The officers were eager to take him dead or alive. That was a mistake.

Conclusion. Do not believe "sweet prizes" if they come from an unconfirmed source. This may be a "zamanuha", an invitation to ambush or to be shot.

Before reconnaissance, the battalion commander with a group of officers climbed to one of the heights at the beginning of the gorge, where tasks were set. This was the second mistake. Perfume distinctly "sketched" officers. And they perfectly understood that they had to wait for the “guests”. Then carefully prepared for the meeting.

Conclusion. Remember to disguise well before the operation. Do not give the enemy a reason to prepare for the meeting in advance. Keep everything secret until the very last moment. Do not "shine".

By decision of the battalion commander, communications from different groups worked on the same frequency. This was another tragic mistake, because in the midst of the battle on the air there was complete chaos. Spirits piled on the detachment's detached groups, all the officers simultaneously shouted something different on the air, and nothing could be disassembled. No teams and orders were heard, and this led to unjustified sacrifices.

Conclusion. Think about communication. In battle, communication is the nerve of a unit, its life. No connection - no support in a critical situation. And this is death.

In that battle, proper interaction with the artillery battery at the disposal of the battalion commander was also not organized. And at a critical moment, the “gods of war” were never able to come to the aid of special forces.

Conclusion. Think bad too. Hope, but do not expect that the operation will cost you a little blood. And never neglect the help of the “god of war”. If something went wrong, artillery can pull you out of the most terrible cutter.

Having combed Dorids, the scouts saw that there were no spirits here, and began to leave the settlement. But the spirits were somewhere nearby - whether in the gorge, or in the ravine, or behind the mountain. They secretly "grazed" intelligence officers from afar. One group of Mujahideen sat on the tail of the soldiers when they left the village. Another bypassed the scouts from the flank and blocked their exit from Doridam. The bag slammed shut. It was a classic trap, and it was a success to the Afghans. Lieutenant Kuznetsov, regretting his fighters, remained to cover their departure. Humanly and as a man is very understandable act. And heroic. But ... There was no worthy replacement among the soldiers and sergeants Kuznetsov in the group. Without an officer, a small combat detachment turned into an unorganized group of people. As a result, they all died. Kuznetsov himself shot back to the last bullet. When the ammunition ran out, he blew himself up and the perfume with a grenade. His body was disfigured so that it was difficult to identify.

Conclusion. If the enemy in the village is not, it may be somewhere nearby. If possible, scan all the surroundings. Be especially attentive when departing. Sit on the tail of the group and block it - the favorite tactic of the enemy. Never leave your wards without a commander. The group should have the main to the last, in the most critical situation. This is her chance to escape. If, in a battle, I decided to remain in cover, prepare in advance for myself and all those departing a reliable replacement. You decided to die yourself, but the fighters must be saved. The group is alive while its commander is alive.

Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 5. Fifteen minutes left to fight


Do not touch the head watch ...

If you are secretly waiting for a caravan or a group of the enemy - skip the head patrol whenever possible, even if he suddenly started firing in your direction. Watch may just be stoned. Perfume can shoot and just for prevention. It is only necessary to kill them (or take them prisoner) when they have clearly found you. Fell them out of silent weapons (in Afghanistan, Stechkin's silent pistol was used for this). During an ambush in the village of Mazgin, one of the sappers, who were hiding in an abandoned duvala, at the time of approaching the completely stoned head patrol, simply out of curiosity, stuck his head out of a blown head, in order to glance at the shooting spirits with one eye. This curiosity cost him his life. A bullet fired at him hit him right in the head.

Conclusion. You cannot unmask yourself in an ambush even when they are shooting at you. This may not be a target fire. Control your emotions. The desire to live should be stronger than curiosity.

Do not relax if you have not found the head patrol. Behind him can go intermediate - for safety net. For the first time, scouts of the 334 Special Forces detachment near Kotagai kishlak encountered such a phenomenon in ambush. Later, the militants used intermediate patrols in both the first and second Chechen campaigns.

Do not chase after trophies ...

As you know, trophies are one of the main indicators of the effectiveness of a detachment's actions. Never hurry to get hold of a captured weapon from a dead enemy, if you are not sure that they will not graze him in battle. Maybe their sniper is just waiting for you to crawl to the victim. This is an old trick, valid from the time of the Great Patriotic War, but for some reason many people still buy it. Sometimes after a successful fight, it is simply impossible to take the captured trophies (from a deep gorge, crevices in the mountains, etc.). Then undermine them and quickly take away the legs. Take only weapons samples with you. This is also the result.

Conclusion. Do not chase after trophies. Just take a photo on their background, and then you will show the photo to the authorities. Do not believe - nothing terrible. The main thing is alive. And then you will get the enemy's weapon in another battle.

In Afghanistan, a dubious rule was in effect for a very long time: you couldn’t throw your equipment, even if it was torn up by mines, on the battlefield. The unit commanders were liable for it. Sometimes the evacuation of equipment, already unsuitable for use, took a lot of time, effort, and resulted in casualties. The first to abandon the troubled domestic "cars" and moved to captured off-road vehicles (for which no one was responsible before anyone) the fighters of the 370 squad of special forces working in Helmand province. The thought came from a rich and practically unharmed trophy - 9 Toyota cars loaded with drugs. The ambush was carried out successfully - only one of nine machines was holed. "Toyota" immediately took to his farm fighters maneuverable groups.

They were equipped strictly in Mojahedin. In the bodies of one set large-caliber machine guns, mostly captured DShK. Other machines equipped the machine gun "cliff" and automatic machine-gun grenade launchers. Boards veil bulletproof vests. The crew of each car consisted of the driver, the crew commander, two scouts, a signalman. The detachment was formed from three Toyotas and one Ural-4520 type truck (it was in the Registan desert, and the car was famous for its good maneuverability in the sands). "Urals", in turn, equipped with a machine gun Vladimirov, anti-aircraft installation and mortars "Cornflower". The sides of the truck were also closed with body armor, sandbags were placed on the bottom of the body in case of an explosion on a mine. Crews "Toyota" dressed in clothes of the Mujahideen. The detachment, moving across the desert to the area of ​​kishlak crossings, imitated the movement of a caravan. Toyota was ahead, followed by trucks two or three kilometers away.

As conceived by the scouts, the head patrol of the Mujahideen, expecting to meet the army's military equipment, was to be taken aback when confronted in the desert with their own kind. What happened.

The “long-awaited” meeting took place in the area of ​​the village of Bogat in January 1987. Even before dawn, observers noticed in the night vision devices glimmers of headlights of cars moving towards them. At dawn, a plume of dust appeared on the horizon - a sure sign of a caravan. A convoy of five Simurg cars flew by sail. She had to go about 10 kilometers to the intestinal zone, where they could hide from aviation. Scout cars rushed towards. The meeting took place on a flat area, at the bottom of a dry lake. There were no shelters nearby. Mujahideen noticed a column coming out of the dunes and stopped. Scout cars, increasing speed, began to loop, "showing" that they want to avoid a meeting. By this maneuver, the commander was able to reduce the distance and press the caravan to the ridge of sand dunes, where the Ural was in ambush with the soldiers.

Maneuver a success. The distance was reduced to 700 – 800 meters. The rising sun shone in the back of the group, blinding the Mujahideen. As soon as the cars got up for aiming, the Mujahideen suspected that something was wrong. But they were already covered with a firestorm. Two cars flashed at once, the third one caught fire on departure.

The Mujahideen opened fire from an ASC, several grenade launchers and more than a dozen machine guns. The fire duel was transient. In dushman earned machine gun "Rock". Calculation of DShK was quickly destroyed. Appearing from the flank "Ural", who worked on the spirits of KPVT, introduced an additional panic in their ranks. The Mujahideen began to retreat to the nearest shelters. But it was far from them. Nobody wanted to surrender to captivity, everyone shot to the end and were destroyed. Result: 26 dead Mujahideen, three cars, captured by 2 DShK, 3 RPG, near 30 machines. Group losses: three injured.

In the future, fighting maneuver groups using captured machines successfully continued until the withdrawal of the battalion to the Union.

Conclusion. Make the most of your captured equipment and weapons. This will give you precious seconds, which is enough to accomplish the combat mission and save life for yourself and your subordinates.

Take care of your ammo

In both Afghanistan and Chechnya, in the heat of battle, fighters often spent a significant portion of their wearable ammunition (800 – 1200 ammunition) in the first 15 – 20 minutes of combat. And the fight then dragged on for hours. And the situation became critical - especially if help could not come on time.

Conclusion. In battle, never lupi in white light, like a pretty penny. Bay only on the goal that you see. Take care of your ammunition. Otherwise, you can be alone with a joyful spirit, which, unlike you, has a full bra of cartridges. There are a million such examples. Feverish shooters in this world are enough without you. Do not increase their number.

Higher Order Concepts

In the mountains, there is an unshakable rule: “Who is taller is stronger”. But the practice and life of the last wars suggests that the most important rule that must always be remembered: "There are no rules at war." Ambush does not necessarily do in the mountains. You can attack the enemy from ravines, duvali, crevices, from the dunes, from the riverbed. As the special forces themselves are joking: “You were waiting for us from the sea on ships, and we were skiing from the mountain.” The main thing is creativity, fantasy, the use of the surprise factor. Can this be taught? I do not know…

And another case from real life. In the province of Kunar, the strangers "Stinger" shot down a helicopter carrying a mabutu (infantry). A burning car from two thousand meters began to fall to the ground. “To the crew - to jump!” - the air traffic controller ordered from the ground. “The infantry has no parachutes,” the airborne commander replied after a while. “Remember all of us ...”

... There are things that cannot be taught in any military school or in one article. These are concepts and feelings of a higher order. They either live in your heart or not. This is a personal matter. And in battle, everyone makes his choice - those with a parachute, and those without him.
Author:
Articles from this series:
Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 1
Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 2
Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 3
Participants in future wars. Instructions for survival. Part of 4. If you are betrayed
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  1. Grandfather
    Grandfather 7 August 2018 05: 38
    +24
    Conclusion: when planning ambushes or raids, beware of places that seem most convenient to you. They may be the most dangerous.
    in the government would hang a banner ... though, they do not care ...
  2. 2329 Carpenter
    2329 Carpenter 7 August 2018 06: 10
    +8
    Of course! And then Medvedev will thread the thread with a raid on Dvorkovich ... Or with an ambush on Gerasimov ...
    And on the topic of the article, what, Old, can you say?
  3. Vard
    Vard 7 August 2018 06: 17
    +11
    All this is so-called common truths ... I’ll add from myself ... Do not act on instincts ... Think ... But also to slow down ... And do not take off his helmet .... Her head is not breech ...
    1. Mairos
      Mairos 7 August 2018 11: 39
      +7
      Right Instincts are good during fire contact, especially at short distances. But in general - that impromptu is good, which is well thought out and prepared! )))
      1. Vladimir 5
        Vladimir 5 7 August 2018 13: 07
        +2
        You are right, instincts are good for a fighter, but the main thing is not to “substitute” a fighter, the main thing is systemicity: firstly, reconnaissance and possession of complete information about the enemy and about everything around the task (always prepare in advance and inform everyone). ., The second is communication and interaction with the mutual cover of all participating and attracted forces and means ... Development and provision of the offensive - withdrawal, with providing cover with sufficient forces and means, etc. - Without such shell support, modern military operations are not conducted (NATO, etc.) Of course there is a difference between the advancing battalion and the small reconnaissance group. But for the reconnaissance group, all the same is true, only the actions are fundamentally different: ambushes and withdrawals, reconnaissance, and no involvement in battles, only withdrawal according to several options outlined in advance, the fight should be conducted only with superiority in forces and means ... - the ABC of war .. Once taken into the pincers and destroyed the reconnaissance group, it means the planning and command of the operator is to blame, there is no provision, withdrawal and support, which has happened more than once in Afghanistan - experience on the blood ...
        1. Igoresha
          Igoresha 7 August 2018 15: 09
          0
          what kind of work - you will go to the right - you will lose a horse, you will go to the left ... etc.
    2. Cannonball
      Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 04
      +2
      Sometimes in battle, there’s simply no time to think, so you just don’t have to be afraid, don’t lose your head and act “as taught” - he hid, aimed, fired. Changed position, hid, aimed, fired.
      1. Dzungar
        Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 34
        +2
        "as taught" a little. It is necessary "to be taught" to fix it with many trainings, so that everything would be on the machine. And this is possible only with intelligence groups, Special Forces, airborne troops and infantry. As far as I know, artillerymen haven’t got such many shooting exercises ...
        1. Cannonball
          Cannonball 9 August 2018 22: 44
          +2
          We were not trained very much. We learned almost everything ourselves - more on instincts, on the fact that somewhere I saw or read something ...
          I didn’t have much shooting training either, but this didn’t prevent me from knocking out two eights and one seven with three rounds when firing while lying down from the Kalash at 100 meters. And this is not from "their" machine gun and without preliminary shooting.
          Not a sniper, of course, but I had better not get caught in the sight ...
      2. siemens7774
        siemens7774 11 August 2018 21: 41
        +1
        Cannonball. I taught my signalmen in dumb situations to start counting. And 22 and 23 and 24. And then they began to see the battle in a different situation. It really saved them drove them to the shooting range. 2 rounds on target and no more. In Karabakh 1988 It saved us. Before the collision, he quietly arranged with the artillery and paratroopers. Also with the aircraft. He distributed communication channels at different frequencies. He warned Moscow about the setup, through government communications. We were also insured by the KGB combat groups. And in no case didn’t talk with local geeks. This saved us. They broke off.
        1. Cannonball
          Cannonball 12 August 2018 09: 57
          +1
          Before going to Afghanistan, we were at the shooting range only ONE time! 3 rounds single plus 6 rounds. Plus two throws of the RGD-5, the first is training, the second is combat. They also imitated the ascent of height N (dune). Soldiers - training cadets, "spirits" - training sergeants, real machine guns, cartridges, grenades are not provided. Defeat the "enemy" with a loud cry "groin, groin, killed!" This is how we "prepared" for war.
          So the real training was, as they say, in real combat conditions and was held at the expense of their own ingenuity and natural ingenuity.
          So, I perceive Bondarchuk's "fairy tales" with his pre-Afghan training in the "9th company" with a sarcastic grin.
        2. Nikolay Fedorov
          Nikolay Fedorov 13 August 2018 18: 01
          0
          Quote: siemens7774
          ... In Karabakh, 1988, this saved us. Before the collision, he quietly arranged with the artillery and paratroopers. Also with the aircraft. He distributed communication channels at different frequencies. He warned Moscow about the setup and government communications. We were also insured by the KGB combat groups. ...

          I’m even afraid to ask you - what military rank were you in then - in 1988? Judging by the commentary, there is no less than a major general, and even that is probably not enough. And then what title do you have now - in 2018?
    3. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 22: 32
      -7
      Quote: Vard
      Thinking ... But also to slow down ... And do not take off the helmet .... Her head is not breech ...

      How often does a helmet rescue from "Kalash" and so on? Firearms? From a small fragment, yes, it will save. If there is no danger of using mortars and other artillery, then it’s easier to drop this “bucket”, because by dragging a “weight” on your head you won’t protect the rest from the same fragments and you will not die immediately from the wounds you received, but you will suffer yourself and you will cause death fighters carrying you.
      1. 72jora72
        72jora72 10 August 2018 18: 44
        +6

        How often does a helmet save from "Kalash" and other "firearms"?
        Saved from the "shooter" more than one hundred soldiers.
        1. Dull
          Dull 11 August 2018 15: 27
          -1
          Quote: 72jora72
          Saved from the "shooter" more than one hundred soldiers.

          Statistics in the studio, please. Somehow I do not believe your statements. To get the whole "clip" of F-1 into the body, even below the belt, and you will have a chance to survive? Unfortunately, there are many people buried because of such "smart guys". Glittering with a helmet you will not stop even an expansive bullet from AKM, fragments will cut many of your veins and you will simply die from them, even if they cut your legs. The helmet, in reality, saves only from stones and pieces of earth / concrete /, which can kill you without it. The chances that arise without her are much higher than with her because of the visibility and speed of progress. Practice proves that a helmet is a "useless" weapon in countering small arms up to 500 meters. hi
          1. your1970
            your1970 11 August 2018 23: 00
            +3
            Quote: Dumb
            Practice proves that a helmet is a "useless" weapon in countering small arms up to 500 meters.

            that is why it was dragged by all and sundry in WWI and WWII, and to whom it was lazy - they remained "in the steppe under a mound overgrown with weeds"
            1. Dull
              Dull 13 August 2018 21: 01
              0
              Quote: your1970
              Practice proves that a helmet is a "useless" weapon in countering small arms up to 500 meters.
              that is why it was dragged by all and sundry in WWI and WWII, and to whom it was lazy - they remained "in the steppe under a mound overgrown with weeds"

              Let's get statistics. We have an unfounded argument. There are facts, bring. I come from my experience. The Broniks, by the way, also left, although they saved a lot more often. About gas masks and their usefulness in Afghanistan, this is a separate topic ... hi
          2. 17085
            17085 12 August 2018 20: 43
            +2
            Quote: Dumb
            Practice proves that a helmet is a "useless" weapon in countering small arms up to 500 meters.

            Of course ... to be precise, 50 meters is the limit, you won’t throw it further. Only from something EVERYTHING, well, everything in kind, the armies of the world have a helmet on board. Yes, and it is not weapons but ammunition rather, although you can sniff like that ...
          3. Nikolay Fedorov
            Nikolay Fedorov 13 August 2018 18: 22
            0
            Quote: Dumb
            Quote: 72jora72
            Saved from the "shooter" more than one hundred soldiers.

            Statistics in the studio, please. Somehow I do not believe your statements. To get the whole "clip" of F-1 into the body, even below the belt, and you will have a chance to survive? Unfortunately, there are many people buried because of such "smart guys". Glittering with a helmet you will not stop even an expansive bullet from AKM, fragments will cut many of your veins and you will simply die from them, even if they cut your legs. The helmet, in reality, saves only from stones and pieces of earth / concrete /, which can kill you without it. The chances that arise without her are much higher than with her because of the visibility and speed of progress. Practice proves that a helmet is a "useless" weapon in countering small arms up to 500 meters. hi

            My young fighters, who did not smell gunpowder, sometimes also eagerly, eagerly tried to prove to me their youthful theories about the dangers of wearing helmets, gas masks, as well as the correctness of wearing other trichometics on a bra. My polite officers' arguments, as a rule, did not work on the inflamed minds of the boys. I usually delegated the persuasion of these "connoisseurs" to experienced "oldies". By morning, there was no trace of these theories. Hard? But the main thing is not to die on the first battle, right?
          4. Vladimir 5
            Vladimir 5 13 August 2018 19: 15
            -2
            Incomprehensible - you don’t have to lie so purposefully (with what intent?), The helmet is the first necessity in combat conditions, you need to teach it like an everyday spoon, and more than one hundred heads saved from a often fatal wound ... Well, old SSh helmets 68 glisten in the sun, so yes, so the Germans in 1942 began to put on a camouflage cover, than ours neglected ... Today helmets are easier from artificial materials, so it is MANDATORY to wear. The Americans fined their soldiers in WWII if they were in a war zone without a helmet. And today, if a US soldier is injured without a helmet or body armor in the combat zone, he is not paid insurance - the Americans are not the most stupid and have the greatest combat experience today.
            1. Town Hall
              Town Hall 13 August 2018 19: 29
              0
              Quote: Vladimir 5
              And today, if a US soldier is injured without a helmet or body armor in the war zone, he is not paid insurance



              Can I find out the source of this popular runet tales?
              1. Dull
                Dull 13 August 2018 20: 57
                0
                Quote: Town Hall
                Quote: Vladimir 5
                And today, if a US soldier is injured without a helmet or body armor in the war zone, he is not paid insurance



                Can I find out the source of this popular runet tales?

                This is not a "bike". In Ireland, this is part of the standard contract. If you did not take all the necessary actions to protect yourself, provided to you by the state, then you acted at your own peril and risk.
    4. Yrec
      Yrec 10 August 2018 16: 04
      +7
      Too many controversial details in the material. Half are the mistakes of control officers who do not climb under bullets. There is no significant conclusion on the material - the work of the DRG in the area of ​​a settlement should be only with the support of agents in this settlement. Otherwise, a military operation. Saving ammo is a very slippery topic. In a sudden collision, you need to crush the enemy with fire, I would look at the one who at that moment decided to save. You can’t save at all in building, you need to constantly shoot openings / breaches and throw grenades to advance. Well, or shut up their bodies, as you like. In the search, it’s better not to shoot at all — to direct artillery and aircraft. In the rear of the enemy, a reconnaissance fighter until the first shot, after the shot he turns into an ordinary infantryman with all the consequences.
  4. Sadko88
    Sadko88 7 August 2018 06: 32
    +13
    Do not eat food a day - two before the task. Know and be able to apply the properties of gelatin smile
    1. Evil543
      Evil543 7 August 2018 08: 19
      +4
      It is possible and breadcrumbs, and chifira in a flask
    2. Moisey19631
      7 August 2018 10: 21
      +3
      THX. We will definitely write about this in the next article of the cycle.
      1. Evil543
        Evil543 7 August 2018 10: 47
        +5
        Be sure to write laughing when in an ambush you lie on a small one you can still go, but on a large one you’ll already strain
        1. Meshcheryak
          Meshcheryak 7 August 2018 11: 08
          +2
          When the spirit comes and for the most part go without straining laughing
          1. Evil543
            Evil543 7 August 2018 11: 16
            +6
            When he comes, remember about zada fuck
            1. Meshcheryak
              Meshcheryak 7 August 2018 11: 44
              +4
              "Bear disease" - there is such a phenomenon laughing But seriously, the topic of military medicine would also be nice to touch upon ...
              1. Evil543
                Evil543 7 August 2018 11: 52
                +7
                So that sydnocarb is used correctly, and how to get out of stress correctly, so as not to sleep
                1. Meshcheryak
                  Meshcheryak 7 August 2018 12: 08
                  +3
                  Quote: Evil543
                  So that the sydnocarb is used correctly, and how to get out

                  And psychostimulants and modern coagulants, this also needs to be able to use.
                2. Dzungar
                  Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 31
                  0
                  Sidnokarb should be used ONLY when you still have to go. If he was devoured when he came to his place, then the soldiers may have glitches. These glitches can lead to shooting, which will detect the group ....
              2. Moisey19631
                7 August 2018 16: 21
                +3
                "Bear disease" - there is such a phenomenon laughing And if it is serious, then the topic of military medicine would also not be bad to touch ...
                Are you in the subject? Can you add information? I am pleased to write ...
                1. Slavik Ivanov
                  Slavik Ivanov 11 August 2018 12: 40
                  -1
                  It’s interesting, but there are such means, without odor and side effects, in order to protect oneself from midges, all kinds of creeping reptiles, so that they feel and do not crawl and swarm over your equipment over you !? And then the fly will sit on the optics and start driving it away !?
                  Or for example, some drugs that will allow the scout to not move for a long time well and not feel minor inconveniences such as anesthetics, and that would not get hooked on them !? Maybe snipers have one !?
        2. 72jora72
          72jora72 10 August 2018 18: 49
          +1
          when in an ambush you lie on a small one you can still go, but on a large one you’ll already strain
          When you come under a sudden mortar or artillery bombardment, you won’t even notice that you’ve already gone under yourself .......
    3. Cannonball
      Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 05
      0
      You won’t get much hungry! Do not substitute your belly for bullets and you will be happy! laughing
    4. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 22: 36
      0
      Quote: Sadko88
      Do not eat food a day - two before the task. Know and be able to apply the properties of gelatin

      Pieces of refined, most. In order for there to be no problems with the stomach, take along with the bark or leaves / better by pairing / with water. If you take more fat! good
      1. Bad_santa
        Bad_santa 10 August 2018 19: 08
        +2
        Lard, crackers and sneakers
  5. Vanek
    Vanek 7 August 2018 06: 35
    +13
    As the commandos themselves joke: “You were waiting for us from the sea on ships, and we were skiing from the mountain.” The main thing is a creative approach, imagination, the use of the factor of surprise. Can this be taught?

    This is called savvy.

    When the Germans went around the swamps. We laid out the ghats and went to the rear, to the flanks.

    Learning this is impossible.
    1. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 23: 37
      0
      Quote: Vanek
      When the Germans went around the swamps. We laid out the ghats and went to the rear, to the flanks.
      Learning this is impossible.

      In 41? what
      Quote: Vanek
      Learning this is impossible.
      Let’s immediately, from the school bench, consider each recruit a “commando”? laughing
    2. gladcu2
      gladcu2 11 August 2018 20: 03
      +1
      Anticipating the actions of the enemy is possible. And to learn this is also possible.

      You just need to think about it constantly. And this is professionalism.

      The truck driver predicts the behavior of drivers in a joint stream with him even before the woman traveling in front turns on the right turn to turn left.

      An experienced player in tactical shooters predicts the behavior of others by building tactics.

      So the military can predict the actions of the enemy at 80%.

      And this article is an exchange of experience.
  6. loha
    loha 7 August 2018 07: 28
    +1
    To the author, "The detachment was formed of three Toyota and one truck of the Ural-4520 type." Ural-4520 does not exist, there is the Ural-5557 but it is a collective farm machine and not an army one.
    1. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 7 August 2018 08: 23
      +13
      Quote: loha
      "Ural-4520 doesn’t exist,

      4320 most likely.
      1. Mairos
        Mairos 7 August 2018 11: 41
        +3
        Namely - 4320 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ural-4320
      2. Cannonball
        Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 10
        +2
        Or the 375th. There were plenty of them in Afghanistan, as well as Krazov, Zilov and Shishig.
  7. Sadko88
    Sadko88 7 August 2018 07: 49
    +4
    Quote: loha
    To the author, "The detachment was formed of three Toyota and one truck of the Ural-4520 type." Ural-4520 does not exist, there is the Ural-5557 but it is a collective farm machine and not an army one.

    By the way. And from their get a high probability there is smile
    1. Walking
      Walking 8 August 2018 11: 22
      +2
      Quote: Sadko88
      Quote: loha
      To the author, "The detachment was formed of three Toyota and one truck of the Ural-4520 type." Ural-4520 does not exist, there is the Ural-5557 but it is a collective farm machine and not an army one.

      By the way. And from their get a high probability there is smile


      In order not to get from their own such a technique is used in the zone of responsibility of their squad.
  8. Warrior2015
    Warrior2015 7 August 2018 08: 35
    +10
    In my opinion, the most sensible, interesting and professional article from the cycle! Sergey, thank you very much!
    Only, of course, when using captured technology, the risk of getting hit by one’s own aviation is always high, you need precise inter-structured interaction, which previously was extremely difficult to achieve ...
    1. Meshcheryak
      Meshcheryak 7 August 2018 10: 54
      +1
      Quote: Warrior2015
      In my opinion, the most sensible, interesting and professional article from the cycle! Sergey, thank you very much!

      Yes, I wanted to write the same thing) Sergey, thank you very much! We look forward to continuing.
  9. Alex_59
    Alex_59 7 August 2018 10: 36
    0
    Toyota crews changed into Mujahideen clothes. The detachment, moving through the desert to the area of ​​village crossings, imitated the movement of the caravan. Ahead were the Toyota, followed by trucks in two or three kilometers.
    In the memoirs of the "whistles" I read that such targets were wetted without any warning upon the discovery - immediately. Brave guys, commandos. Or their interaction with aviation was somehow especially well-established so that they would not be covered by their own.
    1. Walking
      Walking 8 August 2018 11: 29
      +1
      In the zone of responsibility of one detachment, groups from other detachments were not used precisely to prevent such situations.
      1. Cannonball
        Cannonball 8 August 2018 20: 29
        +4
        That’s all garbage. "Friendly fire" in the war is much more common than we would like. Especially when whole compounds are involved in the operation or by someone’s gouging, the actions of different units begin inconsistently.
        1. Dzungar
          Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 26
          0
          Leshy speaks about the area of ​​responsibility of the Special Forces detachment and the work there of the RSGPN and ROSpN ... And not about your military operations
          1. Cannonball
            Cannonball 9 August 2018 23: 03
            +5
            And in your opinion, only special forces will fight?
            The artillery infantry will be there. They also need to somehow survive in the war. The special forces are specially trained in survival and the advice of “couch experts” is not particularly necessary for him, but someone else’s survival experience will be useful to those who need to be mobilized in case of war. And they will participate precisely in military operations, and not in sabotage and intelligence raids.
            And what the hell is the "zone of responsibility of the Special Forces detachment"? Regular units have a zone of responsibility, for example, in our regiment the zone of responsibility was the Charikar-Jabal-Salang-Khinjan road and the “green” Charikar-Bagram-Mahmudraki-Panjshir-Jabal.
            Everyone worked in our zone, including landing with special forces.
            Sometimes we only covered them with fire, sometimes the regiment "worked" together with them. And more often the special forces worked where our other units did not exist.
    2. helmi8
      helmi8 11 August 2018 14: 31
      0
      Quote: Alex_59
      In the memoirs of the "whistles" I read that such targets were soaked without any warning upon detection - right away.

      Well, the "whistles" and whistled in the memoirs ... laughing For more than a year, they worked constantly with the 177th OOSpN in Ghazni. Almost daily, they flew to search and inspect caravans. So that "whistles" flew to caravans for "free hunting" - well, I have not heard that. They were called only to attack, and even then, only for reconnoitered targets.
  10. Blue fox
    Blue fox 7 August 2018 10: 53
    +3
    Much of the article has a place to be and is important, however, some things are still worth clarifying, namely:
    - communication on one frequency is not a sin and not a mistake, especially since it is not always possible to work simultaneously on several frequencies, in addition to the main and reserve, but violation of the rules for negotiating is another matter;
    - Do not destroy the head patrol, after it began to fire in an ambush, due to the fact that the enemy is most likely “under the substances” or paranoid is very dangerous, the probability of this option is minimal;
    - the use of captured weapons and equipment is a thing in itself, under the hand of their comrades it’s time to spit on getting there, for this there must be complete confidence in the opposite.
    In addition, the items listed require even more clarification when maintaining a database not against irregular formations, as in the above examples, but against regular units of modern armies.
  11. Hiller
    Hiller 7 August 2018 12: 51
    +4
    A template is always dangerous. And as they taught: "information from one source is unreliable, from two it is probably reliable. Of three or more it is reliable." Communication .... earlier on the control panel of the radio station there was a nameplate: "Remember! The enemy is eavesdropping!" And the fact that reconnaissance requires careful disguise and disinformation methods of the enemy is an axiom.
  12. tank66
    tank66 7 August 2018 15: 40
    +5
    Maybe he really knew whom he needed — he knew a “working” sniper so that he wouldn’t get into the mountains with food warming / smell of canned food, even with warmed dry alcohol — even a smoker dries out for 0.5 km /, carried glucose in ampoules and a syringe . Of course, not everyone gets so high, but you can live 5-6 days ... and by weight a little ..
    And from myself: if you need fire, and there are no matches with a lighter - we get a rifle cartridge with a tracer, extract a bullet, further options: if you have an anvil / tank, for example / and a hammer with pliers, then you have one skillful strike in hand a mini-folsherfer. If only stones - you have to knock for half a minute ...
    1. Warrior2015
      Warrior2015 7 August 2018 16: 37
      +4
      Quote: tank66
      And from myself: if you need fire, and there are no matches with a lighter - we get a rifle cartridge with a tracer, extract a bullet, further options: if you have an anvil / tank, for example / and a hammer with pliers, then you have one skillful strike in hand a mini-folsherfer. If only stones - you have to knock for half a minute ...

      And, after completely unmasking yourself, you can just go back home (well, if you have time, of course).
      1. NN52
        NN52 7 August 2018 19: 16
        +1
        So the question arose ... How could a crew jump from a falling Mi 8 helicopter?
        And what is an air traffic controller?
        1. helmi8
          helmi8 11 August 2018 14: 20
          +1
          Quote: NN52
          So the question arose ... How could a crew jump from a falling Mi 8 helicopter?

          Elementary. smile If only there was a reserve of height.

          Quote: NN52
          And what is an air traffic controller?

          This is the one who directs the air traffic.
      2. tank66
        tank66 7 August 2018 21: 31
        +2
        DO NOT unmask yourself traveling on a tank - it’s difficult ... I meant the case when you need fire and there are no matches ............ soldier
        floor warrior with number
        1. Evil543
          Evil543 7 August 2018 21: 51
          0
          Battery, two wires and gunpowder is not lighter?
          1. tank66
            tank66 7 August 2018 23: 08
            +1
            if there are wires - yes.
            even better lens + sun ..
            1. Dull
              Dull 13 August 2018 20: 45
              0
              Quote: tank66
              0
              if there are wires - yes.
              even better lens + sun.

              In the mountains, under the clouds, well, "Gagra" right! I fell asleep in a cloud, woke up in a fog. The laundry can be squeezed out after an hour. Or maybe light a fire with a lens? laughing
    2. Evil543
      Evil543 7 August 2018 19: 20
      +2
      And after 5 days, upon returning to the base, your body says thank you after the first meal, day 3 you vilify laughing that means 3 days you're not a combat unit ...
      Chocolate, refined sugar, crackers, chief, a can of beef stew per day for two, a can of condensed milk per day for four, Sydnocarb. The rest is pasture. Something like this hi
    3. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 23: 56
      +1
      Quote: tank66
      And from myself: if you need fire, and there are no matches with a lighter - we get a rifle cartridge with a tracer, extract a bullet, further options: if you have an anvil / tank, for example / and a hammer with pliers, then you have one skillful strike in hand a mini-folsherfer. If only stones - you have to knock for half a minute ...

      At any cartridge, throw a bullet, pour half the charge and plug the cartridge with a light wad and shoot a mixture of dust and moss ... What the hell is a tracer? request Even without weapons, elementary capsule initiate. My dear, what are you talking about? About the ambush? laughing
      1. your1970
        your1970 11 August 2018 23: 20
        0
        Quote: Dumb
        pour half the charge and plug the cartridge with a light wad and shots into a mixture of dust and moss.

        Quote: Dumb
        My dear, what are you talking about? About the ambush?

        what has become a contingent of fun in the VO - themselves over themselves make fun ..... still used a grenade in a barrel of gas would have suggested throwing ....
        1. Dull
          Dull 13 August 2018 20: 39
          0
          Quote: your1970
          pour half the charge and shut the cartridge with a light wad and shoot into the mixture of dust and moss.
          Quote: Dumb
          My dear, what are you talking about? About the ambush?
          what has become a contingent of fun in the VO - they make fun of themselves ..... I would also suggest throwing a grenade into a barrel of gasoline ...

          Are you talking about kindling a fire in combat or about a fire in an ambush in general? Simply, the "genius" offered to flatten the tracer and light a fire from it, if necessary. Apparently, he didn’t have enough intelligence from the flare. I suggested a quiet and discreet option. In an ambush, by the way, it is also suitable, if the ambush is not a one-day one. You will also have to go to the pot, as well as smoke and sip tea "for the stomach". If you do everything quietly and without smell, it will do. Banter, please keep it with you.
  13. Cannonball
    Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 01
    +2
    Where does the wearable ammunition in 800-1200 rounds come from? Standard wearable ammunition - 4 stores of 30 rounds. You just get sick of carrying it anymore. All that is more is transferred (transported) in "zinc" and cartridge boxes.
    1. Evil543
      Evil543 7 August 2018 20: 09
      +6
      Take 4 × 30, as on guard, then you are a corpse feel
      1. Cannonball
        Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 28
        +3
        As you can see, I am alive and correspond with you, although I have never carried more than 4 stores. And he didn’t even wear a grenade. What for? request When they can always be taken in a small armory, or in an armored personnel carrier, if on the road, or in a BRDM.

        By the way, what is 800-1200 rounds of portable ammunition?

        Cartridge "zinc" holds 36 packs of 30 rounds. Only 1080. Weight of "zinc" with cartridges 12 kg.

        Carry such a "canoe" - fire.
        1. Evil543
          Evil543 7 August 2018 20: 33
          +2
          And at the exit in green? Yes, and you need to run up to BTR and take it so that they don’t take it off, is it smeared up above? whatand where in the mountains to get a gun? belay
          1. Cannonball
            Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 44
            +3
            Firstly, no one just climbs into the "green". Only under the guise of tanks, artillery, MLRS, turntables and aircraft.
            Secondly, no one climbs into the "green", as there is a danger of falling not only into an ambush, but also under a "friendly fire".
            Thirdly, military operations are fleeting. There is also the possibility of castling units, which means that there is time to replenish the ammunition at the company’s ammunition supply points, or from ammunition boxes and "zinc" taken to platoon or to the department. Again, armored vehicles help you.
            And yet, as a rule, they don’t run especially in battle, but crawl more, so to "remove" the crawling one also needs to manage.
            1. Evil543
              Evil543 7 August 2018 21: 10
              0
              Yes, your strategic plans are in your ears, there would be no price for you as a commander.

              Only the families of the victims do not need to say this. 6 company remember for example?
              1. Cannonball
                Cannonball 7 August 2018 22: 45
                +5
                Maybe the 9th?
                It’s not my strategic plans, then the real facts of the military operations in the “Charikar zelenka”, as a result of large losses among our fighters with any other way of conducting military operations in the area.
                I could also die in battle, but as you can see, I survived. Because he didn’t do stupid things, didn’t climb in vain on the rampage, didn’t flaunt the goodwill. But he did not hide, did not sit out in the bunker. It is necessary to fight in such a way that both the combat mission is fulfilled, and you yourself remain alive, and your comrades, if you support and help out anything.
        2. Walking
          Walking 8 August 2018 11: 44
          0
          Quote: Cannonball
          As you can see, I am alive and correspond with you, although I have never carried more than 4 stores. And he didn’t even wear a grenade. What for? request When they can always be taken in a small armory, or in an armored personnel carrier, if on the road, or in a BRDM.

          By the way, what is 800-1200 rounds of portable ammunition?

          Cartridge "zinc" holds 36 packs of 30 rounds. Only 1080. Weight of "zinc" with cartridges 12 kg.
          Carry such a "canoe" - fire.


          For combat, in a raid into the mountains they took cartridges in packs or in bulk in bags in the taxiway and 2-4 grenades required. Judging by your statement, you probably either didn’t go out from the roadside or you were away only with a convoy. Rear end?
          1. Cannonball
            Cannonball 8 August 2018 20: 25
            +2
            Who walks into the mountains on raids? Only special forces, but this is a separate conversation.
            Even a reconnaissance company raided our BMP-2. And this means - there is no need to carry everything on yourself when you have an "iron horse" at your disposal. Again, raids a maximum of a couple of days with the subsequent return "to the base."
            Now take a normal combat operation. Who is involved in it? Landing forces, motorized rifles, armored vehicles, artillery. Again, everything on the tracks, but the wheels. Again, there is no particular need to carry everything on your hump when the entire belongings, including ammunition with grenades, can be loaded under the armor and used as necessary.
            You yourself think who is more comfortable to conduct the battle - the fighter to the maximum lightweight, free of weights, or loaded on "do not mess around" and moving a la penguin?
            In combat raids, as a rule, advanced under the protection of armor. In isolated cases - on turntables. But never peshkodralom. At least in our regiment.
            Did you climb mountains with "full ammunition" yourself? There you can’t climb much with empty hands - you will die of fatigue, especially in the heat.
            Am I a Rearman? Amusing reasoning!
            Did you know that both the rear and the “fighters” were in the same conditions and the bullet “catch” or mine “find” had approximately equal chances?
            Even the rear officers had such chances were much higher, since they constantly dangled along the roads, risking daily, or even several times a day, to run into an ambush or run into a land mine.
            No, I’m not a rear guard, I’m an artilleryman, a platoon of the division’s management, if that tells you anything.
            For your information, our artillery batteries were closer to the "spirits" than the infantry.
            And we went on raids along with motorized riflemen - we didn’t hide behind their backs, and our combat losses were not isolated.
            In the war before death, everyone is equal - and a clerk, and a cook, and a tankman, and an artilleryman and a paratroop commando. Anyone can be injured at any moment. It’s just that each of them, competently doing his job, brings the world closer to this earth, and of course his own demobilization.
            1. Walking
              Walking 8 August 2018 21: 14
              +2
              I climbed 1987-88. 350 Guards RAP. They advanced on technology, and then to a point in the mountains on foot with taxiways behind them, and besides their cargo additionally, either a tape to the gas station or the cliff. Artillery, a platoon of control, you yourself indicate your knowledge. We had different combat exits, you have cars under your ass and landing, the infantry in the mountains have what they carry on their hump.
              1. Cannonball
                Cannonball 9 August 2018 00: 03
                +4
                Everything is correct. Well, I say: "Who walks into the mountains on raids on foot? Only special forces, but this is a separate conversation." In this case, landing, special forces, reconnaissance - one field of the berry. However, this is only the tip of the iceberg. The “iceberg” itself is the pohhota, gunners, fuel oil and other valiant warriors of cotton and panama. It is on their shoulders that the strap of the war mainly stretches, but no offense will be said. They will have to fight, if that, because not everyone was born to be a paratrooper or commando. Landing with special forces is the military elite with all the consequences. However, if you think carefully, the combat training of the conscripts who were there was about the same, regardless of the type of troops. And they climbed the same mountains in the same mountains, and participated in almost the same operations, so to speak - shoulder to shoulder. Yes, and the tactics, in principle, were similar - first on the technology to the spot, then - in five, if required ...
                As for the control platoon, its functions include, inter alia, artillery reconnaissance and artillery fire adjustment if that. That is, "sit out in the rear" is not always obtained.
                By the way, I already somehow spoke with your fellow citizen in civilian life. Upon learning who and where I served, he thanked very much for the fact that our howitzers more than once helped out the landing during operations. He said that we put a lot of spirits then ... I myself did not see, but since I earned "thank you" from the paratrooper, it means they didn’t shoot in the "milk".
                Z.Y. I flew both the An-12 and the Il-76, unless I jumped with a parachute, but I climbed 3300 (landing on the armor). So the "knowledge" is quite reliable.
                1. kov123
                  kov123 9 August 2018 10: 31
                  +1
                  This is where the whole platoon of management went to the mountains for adjustment?
                  Usually - artillery officer + fighter with r / station
                  1. Cannonball
                    Cannonball 9 August 2018 19: 54
                    0
                    And who wrote about the whole platoon on the adjustment? The couple walked. Only without an officer.
                2. Dzungar
                  Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 19
                  0
                  We didn’t see statistics on Afghanistan, about the percentage in terms of the number of members of the GRU Special Forces, relative to the entire OKSVA, and about the percentage of its “production”, let’s say so, again regarding the entire result of the entire Contingent ...? Take an interest ... So much for the "iceberg itself" ....
                  1. Cannonball
                    Cannonball 9 August 2018 23: 25
                    +3
                    The maximum number of OKSVA in 120 000 people were in September 1986. Of them 108 800 people accounted for the personnel of the 40th combined arms army and more 11 000 - to the group of the Border troops of the KGB of the USSR.
                    Now about the GRU special forces.
                    By March 1985, the total staff of the GRU special forces in Afghanistan was about 5000 person. The number of servicemen of the 40th Army in the same 1985 is 97 344 person.
                    We know how to count? Will we argue?
        3. Dzungar
          Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 24
          +1
          Quote: Cannonball
          Carry such a "canoe" - fire.

          That is not all. I, in general, had or could have disposable borders, hand grenades, MON-50, POM-2R, RDG, RSP, Water, grub ..... Sleeping bag, warm clothes ....
          1. Cannonball
            Cannonball 9 August 2018 23: 32
            +3
            And we even refused bulletproof vests to make it easier to move around. And the guys from the reconnaissance raids generally went in sneakers or sneakers instead of berets. We did not have sleeping bags. They dressed for the season, they didn’t especially carry extra things. The water is always with me, the grub was almost always brought in, we almost never even used dry water.
            1. Dull
              Dull 13 August 2018 20: 27
              0
              Quote: Cannonball
              And we even refused bulletproof vests to make it easier to move around. And the guys from the reconnaissance raids generally went in sneakers or sneakers instead of berets. We did not have sleeping bags. They dressed for the season, they didn’t especially carry extra things. The water is always with me, the grub was almost always brought in, we almost never even used dry water.

              There was always a shortage of water, and you can almost always get some food. Water and ammunition are always the main cargo. You climb the mountains, your legs fall off and you are terribly thirsty. Moreover, the descent from the mountain "...." The stomach reduces hunger on the second day, but it can be soothed with water and broths. Refined sugar cost more than stew. With a wound in the stomach, the chances of survival are incredibly greater, and the calories are almost the same. Constipation, after reconnaissance, is easier to survive than pancreatitis.
      2. Hiller
        Hiller 9 August 2018 22: 39
        0
        On guard, sorry, only 2x30.
  14. Cannonball
    Cannonball 7 August 2018 20: 22
    +2
    Yes, by the way, I did not see something “Urals” with KPVT in Afghanistan. But with the ZSU-23-2 - like a sweet deal. Even he rolled on such a once.



    And if we talk about the “Urals” with a heavy machine gun, then it was more likely KPV-14,5, rather than KPVT.

    This is KPVT. I do not really imagine him in the back of the Urals


    And this is KPV-14,5, which looks more organically in the back of a truck.
  15. slowpokemonkey
    slowpokemonkey 7 August 2018 21: 15
    0
    There is an ethical request: "Is it possible to carry out the commands of the commander, if he has not established himself as a competent specialist?"
    if your task is Either to die with Polza, or to return home alive, then maybe for your survival it will be more useful to “lick” the commander, and there already by circumstances? if the boss showed himself to be incompetent in peacetime, too, would giving him the opportunity to ditch you in the database zone be a sabotage bordering on treason?
    during the military service, to put it mildly, I was not satisfied with the educational services provided to me by the Moscow Region (the task of the military service was “preparing a mobilization reserve for actions in case of the onset of the“ Special Period ”)
    The feeling of oneness with the Petrograd sailors or order 66 did not leave me the whole service
    1. Cannonball
      Cannonball 7 August 2018 22: 48
      +3
      Ethics is not a special place in war. There are other laws and regulations.
      A good commander will not send his fighters to certain death. Even if in a non-combat situation he is a so-so person. It’s more expensive for him to lose fighters, a special department will not give a descent for unjustified losses.
  16. petrol cutter
    petrol cutter 7 August 2018 22: 22
    +8
    . "" To the crew - to jump! " The air traffic controller ordered from the ground. "The infantry do not have parachutes," the airborne commander replied after some time. "Remember us all ..." "
    Honestly, I'm the same "crazy." I perfectly understand the commander of the "board" ... Respect for him is endless. Throwing people you are responsible for is how then to live?! .. It’s easier for me to die.
    1. gladcu2
      gladcu2 11 August 2018 21: 43
      0
      I think that you like loonies, 80% percent.

      Where are the statistics from? I live in Canada, the world has seen people.

      All think about the same.
  17. slowpokemonkey
    slowpokemonkey 7 August 2018 23: 26
    0
    Quote: Cannonball
    Ethics is not a special place in war. There are other laws and regulations.
    A good commander will not send his fighters to certain death. Even if in a non-combat situation he is a so-so person. It’s more expensive for him to lose fighters, a special department will not give a descent for unjustified losses.

    The fact of the matter is that good. And if not?
    How is this not in the Ethics War? without ethics, cannibalism and growth are possible. The excuse "I carried out the order" at the tribunal somehow does not really roll.
    1. Cannonball
      Cannonball 8 August 2018 21: 07
      0
      Ethics is morality, morality is a philosophical concept, very subjective. Ethics of peacetime in the war really does not belong, because its "digestion" and analysis takes away precious moments in battle. What could cost a life or a defeat. You can analyze morality and morality in the pauses between fights, unless of course there are forces left for this and there will be such a desire.
      The war has its own laws and its own morality, which often goes against the generally accepted. And for this, no one will arrange tribunals.
      In ordinary life, a lot of taboos are imposed on you - do not kill, do not destroy other people's property, do not touch with your hands, do not go on the lawns ... This is not forbidden in a war, albeit with reservations, albeit with restrictions, but practically everything is possible. Cannibalism? This is not ethics, this is a psychiatrist.
      1. gladcu2
        gladcu2 11 August 2018 21: 48
        -1
        I will correct it.

        Morality is a system of behavior caused by the conditions of survival in society.

        If society is different, then morality in society is different.

        For example, religion is a moral trading business. Religion brings control over moral values ​​and requires charitable donations. Business.

        Now religion is out of work. Her business was captured by the media.

        You teach me, and I teach you.

        And together we are a society.
        1. Cannonball
          Cannonball 12 August 2018 10: 12
          0
          Key words "system of behavior caused by conditions of survival".
          The hardest part of the war is to survive and not turn into a beast.

          It is important that the psychological state of the fighting spirit changes the system of moral values ​​in war. So the absolute inadmissibility of killing people in peacetime is replaced in battles by the obligation to kill enemies that threaten death with you, your colleagues and subordinates.

          War and peace are in many ways different and contradictory to one another state of human being. Legislative acts necessary in a war (combat manuals, orders, orders, etc.) differ from peacetime legislation. Neither to judge nor to praise combat actions from a peaceful position.

          Messages of journalists from the fields of any war and memoirs are always written taking into account the peaceful worldview and the rear moral code.

          Undisguised fighting reality can mentally injure civilians. This is cruel and not deserved. Front-line events can only be frankly assessed by the front-line soldiers themselves. War crimes can only be judged by military courts.

          In a war in insoluble conflict, people confront those who are forced to shoot at each other. On the opposite side of the front there is Truth, and in each case its own. This moral conflict is not always resolvable.

          Speaking about the "morality of war", in particular in the North Caucasus, we must remember how General Yermolov acted there in the XNUMXth century. Decisively, mercilessly he dealt with the fighting enemy. But those who were defeated in battle and surrendered to the mercy of the victors were guaranteed the life and safety of property. Moreover, the mountain commanders who crossed over to the Russian side were showered with honors and gifts. Ermolov’s officers treated the non-warring highlanders with respect, supported them economically, and protected them from bandits.

          So, the "moral of war", firstly, is to smash an implacable enemy, in whatever guise: both in combat and in the form of "civilian" residents, mining roads, shooting with sniper rifles.

          But it is very important that, secondly, it is necessary to convincingly guarantee the protection of life and every possible improvement to its civilian population and to those who have stopped fighting and sabotage.
  18. motorized rifle
    motorized rifle 8 August 2018 02: 15
    +13
    When defending a dissertation, an opponent was put in, after reading the article and comments, he thought something was wrong. It is necessary to oppose, Why? Just a very good opportunity to show that "not everything is so simple" (c). However, this is not criticism, but rather semi-criticism.
    But let's order.


    Convenient and dangerous.

    Actually, the lieutenant of the Soviet Army, this is such a sketch for the drawing, and not the Commander (in the true sense of the word), even special forces, well, by the way. The concept of a dowel, i.e. The key point of the position has been around for more than one hundred years since they learned how to define and use it. It turns out that this lieutenant was not able to think for the enemy, to calculate the elementary: what I see - the enemy also sees. Therefore, the smartest thing he needed to do was imitate taking a position that his opponent wanted so much, and place the main forces on the assumption that he did not have this position.
    So, what is the conclusion: think for the enemy and be able to determine the key points of the position.


    Maravarian tragedy

    Well, in order, although it’s rather difficult to reason without knowing the purpose of the operation, what forces it was carried out without a map of the area, but nonetheless.
    It’s not entirely clear where the relaxation of the fighters came from, because of the 18 killed militants? And how did it stop them? In addition, if we talk about fighters, it is not their fault that the commanders could not ensure proper reconnaissance and combat readiness, teach them radio communication or, more precisely, air discipline, and ensure interaction with artillery. And if the officers “caught fire” to take someone there, then it would be better for them to sit at home (as I am on the sofa), and not climb mountains.
    Conclusion: if your commanders such as A.V.Suvorov said "-You are gentlemen in the field with the regiment, and from the field with the battalion," then it remains only to sell your life more expensive.
    If the commander lost the initiative, as a rule the battle was lost, well, why did he remain to cover the departing (or running?) Group, in which, as I suppose, there were no seriously wounded? What. he did? He let his unit be broken up in pieces! And appoint, do not appoint commanders there (in the departing group), it would not give anything. Hence the conclusion: Do not help the enemy crushing your unit in parts, size matters. He would leave with the whole group with a movable rear guard, maybe he would leave.
    Again, this is a battalion (since there is a battalion commander) of special forces with artillery battery! And this is already 1987, and not 1983, or 1979 !!! I don’t know what can be learned here!


    Touch the head watch

    "If you wait ...) Who, you? Ordinary intelligence officer? Unit commander? If the head patrol is stoned and shoots at all the suspicious bushes, this is not a patrol! Here it’s more expensive to engage in a shootout and not because an intermediate patrol appears , and by the fact that the main forces made for battle (shooting can be heard) may appear, it will be more fun, but the command doesn’t know about it! Hence the conclusion: If you are an ordinary reconnaissance officer, you must first discover the enemy notify your commander Your position (and instructions) should allow you to either let the enemy go unnoticed, or give the opportunity to engage in a fire battle, and, if necessary, retreat to your own.
    If you are a commander, then your subordinates should not have questions about what they should do when meeting with the advanced units of the enemy, if this is not so, go and shoot yourself (just kidding).
    Generally some kind of surrealism! To destroy the advanced group from the silent Stechkin, so that no one picks (shoots), you can only point blank and it is desirable to have, if not superior in the number of trunks, then at least parity. If they go and shoot at the bushes, then you can not stand on ceremony, provided that the weapons sound the same.

    I won’t comment on trophies, I don’t have sensible thoughts on this subject, but I want to note two rules:
    1) Never take someone else's. The fact that it is not yours or your comrades cannot be touched - categorically. This is really dangerous.
    2) What is taken from the battle is holy. All that the enemy used in battle (namely in this particular battle), weapons, ammunition, medicines, etc., all this, in the heat of the heat, take it and use it boldly.


    Take care of your ammo

    Hmm, 800-1200 rounds, wearable (or carry?) BC, this is something. Obviously, you can’t do with less ammunition! As it is considered there: The basis for accurate shooting is the LEARNING arrow, the design features of weapons and ammunition, and the technical condition of weapons and ammunition (at the time of shooting). Here in the chapter about trophies 26 dead Mujahideen are mentioned, too lazy to look for ammunition consumption standards when firing from an AK-74 at a covered live target at 700-800 meters of distance, but even if we take fantastic 30 rounds, we will need to release 26 stores, this is 260 three-round bursts ! I don’t take machine guns into account. It’s clear that much more was spent, and yet the ammunition dress I brought up, as strange as it should be, should be enough. Well, can you really not get 1 person in ten bursts, even at 800 meters?
    Provided of course that you can shoot. If this is not so, then there is no learning how to go into battle with such a shootout, I can’t imagine. Learning is the commander’s direct duty; he may not sleep, do not eat, but he must teach the soldier, if not, then no spells to protect the cartridges will help. Only a trained shooter will shoot for sure when he has the opportunity to hit the target, and will not, when there is no possibility.
    Hence the conclusion: if you are private, learn to own weapons, think for yourself, ask others, otherwise you are a target, if you are a commander, teach a soldier to shoot, you can’t shoot (or teach) yourself, find one (or such) in the unit, regardless of the title, subordinate even higher ones to them, the main thing is that the process would begin quickly and not stop while you are a commander, a banal truth - it will be too late to learn in battle.


    Higher Order Concepts

    Strongly disagree with the fact that there are no rules in a war. All wars are waged according to the rules, but not everyone understands this, and indeed the very concept of "rule", many do not understand. Someone interprets them like that, some people referring to various charters and regulations, and the rule is always the same, as well as the principle of achieving victory.
    Main rule: First, the cause, then the effect. If you did everything (and a little more) to ensure victory, then as a result, it will come, and if not, you will have to perform a feat. Well, the principle of victory is also not a secret of the last several tens of millennia, we inherited it from the wild. Only the one who has the initiative wins. It is the struggle for her and her retention that brings success. Hence two conclusions:
    1) Prepare a victory ahead of time, spare no time and effort, think battle is a thought otherwise you have to perform a feat.
    2) The initiative in battle is all. It is different and often passes from one species to another, but it is necessary to fight for it by all means. This can and should be learned to understand and use.

    Well, the last.
    Of course, I may have misunderstood the main meaning of this series of articles, but I have a strong feeling that this cycle is a little crafty. About captivity, about fraud and betrayal, how to avoid this, etc. etc.
    If this is the case, then everything is very simple. Yes, you would not go to Vanyusha to the soldiers!
    How would it be advice and practical, about a grenade, for self-detonation, or disappearance (curious, but how, and where, to disappear to the ordinary if something happens?). It seems to me that since you went to war, either fight or it’s not for you. The whole philosophy of the military fits into one quote by V. I. Lenin: "Learn military affairs in real images." You can’t say better.
    The bottom line is two practical advice, for rank and file and commanders.
    For privates, no matter what kind of troops, you need to stupidly demand from the commanders that they would teach you to shoot. Do not laugh, it works! Here is the following pattern: Drag captain (you can not touch the lieutenant!), Major, colonel, general, I, our platoon, company, can’t shoot, order to organize studies !. And on the command up, there is such a right in the army. I went through this, to the maximum of the regiment commander (I reached the head of the missile and artillery division service) and the whole process begins to go. Of course, the commanders have no joy, they do not care about them, as if to attack me. And do not be shy, especially in war.
    It’s more difficult for commanders: you’ll regret the soldier, you won’t follow the order, others will lose, you won’t be sorry, you won’t follow the order either, you and others will have losses, so think 24 hours a day. That's all for the coming dream, thanks for reading.
    1. Warrior2015
      Warrior2015 9 August 2018 10: 17
      +3
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      The training is a direct duty of the commander, he can not sleep, not eat, but he is obliged to teach the soldier, if not, then no spells "take care of the cartridges" will not help.

      Gold words ! Generally, many thanks for such a great comment!
    2. Dzungar
      Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 09
      +3
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      when firing from an AK-74 at a sheltered live target at 700-800 meters

      Nichrome you will not get into anyone and will not kill at this distance from the AK-74 .... From the PKK still where it went. SVD, PC - yes ....
    3. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 22: 08
      +1
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      Well, the last.

      If you are a commander, then your subordinates should not have questions about what they should do when meeting with the advanced units of the enemy, if this is not so, go and shoot yourself (just kidding).
      Generally some kind of surrealism! Destroy the advance group from the silent Stechkin, so much so that no one picks (shoots), you can only point blank and it is desirable to have, if not superiority in the number of trunks, then at least parity. If they go and shoot at the bushes, then you can not stand on ceremony, provided that the weapons sound the same.

      Higher Order Concepts

      Strongly disagree with the fact that there are no rules in a war. All wars are waged according to the rules, but not everyone understands this, and indeed the very concept of "rule", many do not understand. Someone interprets them like that, some people referring to various charters and regulations, and the rule is always the same, as well as the principle of achieving victory.
      Main rule: First, the cause, then the effect. If you did everything (and a little more) to ensure victory, then as a result, it will come, and if not, you will have to perform a feat. Well, the principle of victory is also not a secret of the last several tens of millennia, we inherited it from the wild. Only the one who has the initiative wins. It is the struggle for her and her retention that brings success. Hence two conclusions:
      1) Prepare victory ahead of time, spare no time and energy, think, battle is a thought otherwise you have to perform a feat.
      2) The initiative in battle is all. It is different and often passes from one species to another, but it is necessary to fight for it by all means. This can and should be learned to understand and use.

      Well, the last.
      Of course, I may have misunderstood the main meaning of this series of articles, but I have a strong feeling that this cycle is a little crafty. About captivity, about fraud and betrayal, how to avoid this, etc. etc.

      For privates, no matter what kind of troops, you need to stupidly demand from the commanders that they would teach you to shoot. Do not laugh, it works! Here is the following pattern: Drag captain (you can not touch the lieutenant!), Major, colonel, general, I, our platoon, company, can’t shoot, order to organize studies !. And on the command up, there is such a right in the army. I went through this, to the maximum of the regiment commander (I reached the head of the missile and artillery division service) and the whole process begins to go. Of course, the commanders have no joy, they do not care about them, as if to attack me. And do not be shy, especially in war.
      It’s more difficult for commanders: you’ll regret the soldier, you won’t follow the order, others will lose, you won’t be sorry, you won’t follow the order either, you and others will have losses, so think 24 hours a day. That's all for the coming dream, thanks for reading.

      Quote: motorized infantryman
      When defending a dissertation, an opponent was put in, after reading the article and comments, he thought something was wrong. It is necessary to oppose, Why? Just a very good opportunity to show that "not everything is so simple" (c). However, this is not criticism, but rather semi-criticism.
      But let's order.


      Convenient and dangerous.

      Actually, the lieutenant of the Soviet Army, this is such a sketch for the drawing, and not the Commander (in the true sense of the word), even special forces, well, by the way. The concept of a dowel, i.e. The key point of the position has been around for more than one hundred years since they learned how to define and use it. It turns out that this lieutenant was not able to think for the enemy, to calculate the elementary: what I see - the enemy also sees. Therefore, the smartest thing he needed to do was imitate taking a position that his opponent wanted so much, and place the main forces on the assumption that he did not have this position.
      So, what is the conclusion: think for the enemy and be able to determine the key points of the position.











      The bottom line is two practical advice, for rank and file and commanders.
      For privates, no matter what kind of troops, you need to stupidly demand from the commanders that they would teach you to shoot. Do not laugh, it works! Here is the following pattern: Drag captain (you can not touch the lieutenant!), Major, colonel, general, I, our platoon, company, can’t shoot, order to organize studies !. And on the command up, there is such a right in the army. I went through this, to the maximum of the regiment commander (I reached the head of the missile and artillery division service) and the whole process begins to go. Of course, the commanders have no joy, they do not care about them, as if to attack me. And do not be shy, especially in war.
      It’s more difficult for commanders: you’ll regret the soldier, you won’t follow the order, others will lose, you won’t be sorry, you won’t follow the order either, you and others will have losses, so think 24 hours a day. That's all for the coming dream, thanks for reading.

      A lot of buccaff, however. Not many people understood what the Autor wants to tell us about.
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      The bottom line is two practical advice, for rank and file and commanders.
      For privates, no matter what kind of troops, you need to stupidly demand from the commanders that they would teach you to shoot. Do not laugh, it works! Here is the following pattern: Drag captain (you can not touch the lieutenant!), Major, colonel, general, I, our platoon, company, can’t shoot, order to organize studies !.

      At night, moving your two-tier iron beds to the shooting range, detaching trenches there to their full height and "shooting" from unloaded machine guns, in the morning you will continue the daily routine. And so, many times in a row, after your complaint. On the fourth day, your comrades will strangle you. You didn’t have to see about the punishment through the collective, not to mention military service. fool I emphasized your main "pearls", I hope that it will come. I recommend that you first try them out in practice. If you live, we’ll talk for a glass.
      1. Slavik Ivanov
        Slavik Ivanov 11 August 2018 18: 42
        -2
        Correctly the man said the commanders also need to beg to be taught. And after all, in Chechnya, there was just a "check" what commanders like you taught our children in the Army and nothing, the boys resisted as best they could with their own spirit and died in thousands and they had to endure the foolishness from commanders like you and fighting the enemy at the same time ...

        Many commanders disgraced the centuries-old experience of their ancestors, heh this mouse in a certain period of time could not cope with Caucasian youngsters, succumbing to their rams, then the whole country almost caught fire in an interethnic conflict because of spineless commanders I suppose to this day those who then framed Russia.
    4. Hiller
      Hiller 9 August 2018 22: 46
      +1
      I read it with pleasure and remembered it. Thank you, infantry. hi
      1. Dull
        Dull 9 August 2018 22: 51
        0
        Quote: hiller
        I read it with pleasure and remembered it. Thank you, infantry.

        Airborne, rather. laughing
        1. Hiller
          Hiller 9 August 2018 23: 03
          +1
          His nickname is “motorized gunner)”))
    5. slowpokemonkey
      slowpokemonkey 16 August 2018 13: 28
      0
      Thank you.
      sorry that I read this post after the "urgent"

      I have a very high hatred of the "barians", and it seems to me that I am not alone)))

      Oleg Divov has the phrase "90% of officers are people who do not really like their profession, they chose the army because it is easier, and in general, the service is measured, housing, rations, insurance to be provided by the state. and you can absolutely nothing think, but just stupidly follow orders. "

      I would not want to die because of someone else's incompetence and outright stupidity. the level of training of the personnel of my battalion, its officers, leaves no hope for any meaningful activity in the database zone.
  19. Cannonball
    Cannonball 8 August 2018 23: 27
    0
    Quote: Hiking
    350 Guards
    ABOUT! Neighbors! smile 177th SME 83-84. Together, spirits were taught to live!
  20. Dzungar
    Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 00
    +1
    In Chechnya, the golovnyak went light with spirits. Moreover, the smut was double. At first two or three. Then ten. All light. Then the rest of the crowd was laden .... One day we saw such two and then ten and did not bring them down. Then the crowd over about 60 harsa flooded ... And we are 13 ....
  21. Dzungar
    Dzungar 9 August 2018 21: 07
    +3
    They didn’t think of searching at all, if they killed anyone. Fell from the spot, otherwise the races will start .... The faces then told in detail - who and how much ... We went to work, to the BR, before that we brought it - there are 50 fighters BG. There is BG 100. There is finally 200 ... And we are 10-15 people .. The maximum is the whole company, people 45 ... The best option for an ambush is with mines. MON, OZM ... The first explosion, a pause ... Spirits who survived, shot. Calm down. We got up to help. There is a second blast. Everything, you can blame ...
    1. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 21: 48
      0
      Quote: Dzungar
      They didn’t think of searching at all, if they killed anyone. Fell from the spot, otherwise the races will start .... The faces then told in detail - who and how much ... We went to work, to the BR, before that we brought it - there are 50 fighters BG. There is BG 100. There is finally 200 ... And we are 10-15 people .. The maximum is the whole company, people 45 ... The best option for an ambush is with mines. MON, OZM ... The first explosion, a pause ... Spirits who survived, shot. Calm down. We got up to help. There is a second blast. Everything, you can blame ...

      I was not in Chechen. In Afghanistan, corpses and the place itself were mined. It is very important for muslims to bury a corpse before sunset ...
      1. siemens7774
        siemens7774 11 August 2018 22: 46
        0
        Incomprehensible, sometimes there was no time to mine in Karabakh. They sprinkled with pre-prepared pieces of bacon and took pictures. Then they sent them to the nearest villages. It was enough)))
  22. The comment was deleted.
  23. Dull
    Dull 9 August 2018 22: 46
    0
    Quote: Evil543
    Be sure to write when in an ambush you lie on a small one you can still go, but on a large one you’ll already strain

    On the sapper blade, and then, the training of throwing the "load" from the shovel! If under fire, then the "hitch" from the trench is the most. In an ambush, you need to remove any signs of presence. Urine in plastic bottles, feces in a pre-dug hole / urine from overfilled bottles there too /, smoke only in the “smoking room” (with strong winds from the enemy and never with weak winds), feces are buried immediately in the pit, call, flies-infection). Using diapers helps to survive two. If the ambush does not require subsequent quick or long movements, then it will do.
  24. motorized rifle
    motorized rifle 9 August 2018 22: 51
    -1
    Quote: Dzungar
    Quote: motorized infantryman
    when firing from an AK-74 at a sheltered live target at 700-800 meters

    Nichrome you will not get into anyone and will not kill at this distance from the AK-74 .... From the PKK still where it went. SVD, PC - yes ....

    You want to say that the Ak-74 does not allow for targeted shooting at 800m? Or specifically, I will not get? I do not want to brag and engage in posturing, but you would be able to do this if you had sufficient theoretical and practical training. In fairness, I don’t remember already whether I had to shoot from the AK-74 at 800m, but at 600m there were three three-round bursts and two hits, and not only from me. I think nevertheless, at 800m in ten lines at least one, two, there would have been hits. About to kill, here I agree, maybe it would not work, but the main thing is to get there.
    1. Dull
      Dull 9 August 2018 23: 12
      0
      [quote = motorized rifle] You want to say that the Ak-74 does not allow targeted shooting at 800m? [/ quote}
      I also claim this, based on practice. feel

      [quote = motorized rifle] I do not want to brag and engage in posturing, but you would be able to do this if you had sufficient theoretical and practical training. [/ quote]
      Do you need a diploma to confirm? laughing
      [quote = motorized rifle] In fairness, I don’t remember already whether I had to shoot from the AK-74 at 800m, but at 600m there are three three-round lines and two hits, and not only me. [/ quote] Tell me, where did you get the 600 meters target shooting during, as I understand it, the training camp? Still, it’s not Autumn? fool


      [quote = motorized rifle] I think nevertheless, at 800m in ten lines at least one, two, there would have been hits. [/ quote]
      It would be where? Holes? At 800 meters as well as at non-existent 600 meters? Who ever shot from AK any modifications about a bullet hole / hit / will not call a "hole". Mom has not banned all sites until 16? lol hi
  25. motorized rifle
    motorized rifle 9 August 2018 23: 20
    -1
    drinks [quote = Dull
    At night, moving your two-tier iron beds to the shooting range, detaching trenches there to their full height and "shooting" from unloaded machine guns, in the morning you will continue the daily routine. And so, many times in a row, after your complaint. On the fourth day, your comrades will strangle you. You didn’t have to see about the punishment through the collective, not to mention military service. fool I emphasized your main "pearls", I hope that it will come. I recommend that you first try them out in practice. If you live, we’ll talk for a glass. [/ Quote]
    Yes, I served in the army and about "through the team" in the course. You noticed that in the title of the main article there is a phrase: ",,, 15 minutes left before the battle ..." I would like to see that officer who can force you (no longer a salag - conscript) to carry bunk beds on the shelter and shoot "without bullets" And then you will "crush" your comrade who wants to increase your chances of survival. I'm afraid everything will be the other way around, no? So, what about the second? drinks
    1. siemens7774
      siemens7774 11 August 2018 22: 56
      0
      A motorized rifleman, everything is very simple. Three times a week of shooting. Two times at a shooting range, running for 6 km. For the third time they were delivered by cars. When the Moscow commission was passed, they shot perfectly with the whole company. Two rounds for each target. Also called Dushman company. And this is in the sergeant's training. Classes were 7 months. Also forced to work on moving targets. On cars, helicopters, armored vehicles.
    2. Dull
      Dull 12 August 2018 00: 08
      0
      [quote = motorized gunner]drinks [quote = Dull
      At night, moving your two-tier iron beds to the shooting range, detaching trenches there to their full height and "shooting" from unloaded machine guns, in the morning you will continue the daily routine. And so, many times in a row, after your complaint. On the fourth day, your comrades will strangle you. You didn’t have to see about the punishment through the collective, not to mention military service. fool I emphasized your main "pearls", I hope that it will come. I recommend that you first try them out in practice. If you live, we’ll talk for a glass. [/ Quote]
      Yes, I served in the army and about "through the collective" in the course. You noticed that the title of the main article contains the phrase: ",,, 15 minutes left before the battle ..." I would like to see that officer who can force you (no longer a salao - a conscript) to carry bunk beds to the shelter and shoot "without cartridges" And then you will "crush" your friend, who wants to increase your chances of survival. I'm afraid it's the opposite, no? So what about the second one? : drin
      You?
      1. Dull
        Dull 13 August 2018 19: 59
        0
        Quote: Dumb
        Yes, I served in the army and about "through the collective" in the course. You noticed that the title of the main article contains the phrase: ",,, 15 minutes left before the battle ..." I would like to see that officer who can force you (no longer a salao - a conscript) to carry bunk beds to the shelter and shoot "without cartridges" And then you will "crush" your friend, who wants to increase your chances of survival. I'm afraid it's the opposite, no? So what about the second one? : drin

        You were not in real combat conditions. They also carried beds in Afghanistan. Idiocy, unfortunately, will not be destroyed. About 15 minutes before the fight. Have you seen a "spirit" who would have warned you about "I'm going to you in an hour?" I don't want to offend you, but this is the first time I read such "nonsense". hi
    3. Dull
      Dull 13 August 2018 19: 51
      0
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      Yes, I served in the army and about "through the team" in the course. You noticed that in the title of the main article there is a phrase: ",,, 15 minutes left before the battle ..." I would like to see that officer who can force you (no longer a salag - conscript) to carry bunk beds on the shelter and shoot "without bullets" And then you will "crush" your comrade who wants to increase your chances of survival. I'm afraid everything will be the other way around, no? So, what about the second?

      Have you been to Afghanistan? Tell you about the idiocy in combat conditions and the patience of our soldiers? There was dembilism and simple stupidity of the officers, along with a "lordly" attitude towards the soldiers. Everything was. Even officers sold soldiers' lives. To deny it now is to betray them again. There were many good things, but the shortcomings should not be hidden. In Chechnya and after it, everything repeated itself. Corruption is our most painful problem. How many excellent officers remained after the Chechens in the army? They are the same "uncontrollable" and are supported by the love of the personnel. Smart, competent, but not "SUVs". They do not represent the "commission" awards for going to headquarters, they take care of the soldiers, they do not sell their own ...
  26. motorized rifle
    motorized rifle 9 August 2018 23: 59
    0
    Quote: Dumb



    Quote: motorized infantryman
    I think nevertheless, at 800m in ten lines at least one, two, there would have been hits.

    It would be where? Holes? At 800 meters as well as at non-existent 600 meters? Who ever shot from AK any modifications about a bullet hole / hit / will not call a "hole". Mom has not banned all sites until 16? lol hi

    No, Mom didn’t ban, I live separately.
    Whoever shot at least once is an expert.
    All the same, where are the holes when it comes to Sharapov?
    Where the target was provided, I won’t say, otherwise you will also require the key to the apartment.
    I don’t need a diploma, I take my word for it, especially from practice.
    According to the third drink, you have enough.
    1. Dull
      Dull 10 August 2018 23: 38
      -1
      Quote: motorized infantryman
      No, Mom didn’t ban, I live separately.

      Quote: motorized infantryman
      Quote: Dumb



      Quote: motorized infantryman
      I think nevertheless, at 800m in ten lines at least one, two, there would have been hits.

      It would be where? Holes? At 800 meters as well as at non-existent 600 meters? Who ever shot from AK any modifications about a bullet hole / hit / will not call a "hole". Mom has not banned all sites until 16? lol hi

      No, Mom didn’t ban, I live separately.
      Whoever shot at least once is an expert.
      All the same, where are the holes when it comes to Sharapov?

      Faith in your word that you are a "genius" falling within 800 meters! At 600 meters you amazed us! lol
      "Holes" is a mockery of a "genius", if it did not come ...
  27. health
    health 10 August 2018 01: 39
    +3
    according to S. Kasaurov - the most important conclusion - do not draw conclusions from the conclusions. A selection of failed operations. Where are they not? everyone imagines himself a strategist seeing a battle from the side ...
    the instruction (as in the header) seems very small. conclusions for 3 graders.
    sprinkled, and look for the number of comments and trudge. the article is about nothing.
    1. ExPert7,62
      ExPert7,62 10 August 2018 04: 39
      0
      At least one objectively reasonable thought)
  28. ExPert7,62
    ExPert7,62 10 August 2018 04: 38
    +2
    A lot of nonsense. The analysis of events is not very literate, and often just fitting the facts to your point of view. A lot of commonplace and outright demagogy. My experience is green spears on many graves. There is something to judge.
    1. Captain45
      Captain45 12 August 2018 15: 17
      +1
      Quote: ExPert7,62
      A lot of nonsense. The analysis of events is not very literate, and often just fitting the facts to your point of view. A lot of commonplace and outright demagogy. My experience is green spears on many graves. There is something to judge.

      My assessment of this article: a free retelling of S. Kozlov's collections "GRU Spetsnaz. Fifty Years of History, Twenty Years of War" and, more likely, according to the facts given, "GRU-2 Spetsnaz. The War Is Not Over. The History Continues." In these books, S. Kozlov, an officer of the GRU special forces, contains his personal memories and the memories of his colleagues from the GRU about all the wars in which they took part. Quite entertaining books for anyone interested in the topic.
  29. Jerk
    Jerk 10 August 2018 21: 45
    -1
    And in battle, everyone makes their choice - both those with a parachute and those without it.

    After the fight, by the way, too. And there is such a thing, it is absolutely rightly said that the head has no right to climb under the distribution first. But then it happens that he lost - a lot. Or all of them at all, but he survived, and even telling himself it doesn’t matter that they pulled out holes on the skin when they were already unconscious ... But I’m alive, and that’s all, no more ...
    Yes, and not a rare such thing, I remember a man, a hand-to-hand fighter from God. "And those who mutilated the nosyaru so?" Uh-huh. The wife, the widow or rather his castle, as it turned out, is a girl weighing 40 pounds
    1. Dull
      Dull 12 August 2018 00: 14
      0
      After the battle, we will count those who are hit in the head, then, we will throw away all those killed in the legs and body .... Someone else tell me? wassat
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  31. Dull
    Dull 13 August 2018 20: 07
    0
    Quote: siemens7774
    Incomprehensible, sometimes there was no time to mine in Karabakh. They sprinkled with pre-prepared pieces of bacon and took pictures. Then they sent them to the nearest villages. It was enough)))

    Also an option, but I prefer to eat lard, and not to scatter. The calorie content is off scale and the weight is minimal. Stored for a long time. It is a pity to give the "zhmurov". For mining 50 grams of plastid with pieces of any metal and a detonator. By the way, we learned from them. feel