The cruiser "Varyag". Fight Chemulpo 27 January 1904 of the Year. CH 6. Across the oceans

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In this article, we will systematize information about the breakdowns of the power plant of the Varyag cruiser from the moment the cruiser left the Kramp factory and before it appeared in Port Arthur.

Let's start with the tests. For the first time the cruiser 16 came out on them in May 1900 was still unfinished, the first day went with the speed of 16-17 nodes and there were no problems. However, the next morning, when the vapor pressure was brought to 16-16,5 atm. and the runs with the speed of 21-22,5 knots were started. After an hour, the bearing of the connecting rod of the high-pressure cylinder (CVP) of the left-hand machine cranks up. It was cooled and tried to continue the tests at the same speed, but now the molten white metal from the crank bearing of the high-pressure cylinder of the right machine is in use. As a result, the tests had to be interrupted and returned for troubleshooting. A day later (May 19 1900) again went out to the ocean, where two hours went - there were no problems, apart from the red hot flue doors of the boilers.



Then it was time for official testing, and the 9 July 1900. The cruiser first made the transition in 400 miles to the Boston raid, in the 50 miles from which there was a measuring mile 10 miles long. The 12 July took place on it, the cruiser made three runs with a speed of 16 knots, and then two runs with a speed of 18, 21 and 23 knots. respectively. It was then, on the last run, the cruiser showed its record-breaking 24,59 ties, while the weather had become very bad by that time, heavy rain was falling, and the excitement reached 4-5 points.

The results of these tests could be regarded as a great success, especially as 9 and 12 in July, the Varyag machines and boilers worked perfectly. But alas, on July 15, during the 12-hour run with the speed of the 23 node, at the eighth hour knocked out the cover of the CVP, which, of course, completely damaged one of the cars (left). Naturally, the tests were interrupted.

The cylinder had to be made new, so the cruiser was able to exit the following tests only two months later, 16 September 1900 g. The first 24 hourly run with speed of 10 knots was completed without incident, and therefore, having made the necessary preparations and waited a two-day storm, September 21 “Varyag »Re-entered the main test - 12-hour run with speed 23 knots. On it, the cruiser demonstrated an average speed of 23,18 knots. Therefore, it was possible to say that the tests of the ship were successful. But there was one caveat - during the run of one of the boilers the tube broke, which caused the boiler to be decommissioned for an 3,5 hour. And some five hours later, after the completion of the tests, the right fridge flowed.


Cruiser on tests 16 September 1900 g.


But all this was still half the trouble - the problem was that after the tests, it was necessary to conduct a full audit of the power plant. And here she showed a very unattractive picture of the state of the ship:

1. A layer of scale and other "precipitation" was found in the tubes;

2. The tubes, which were located in the lower rows and, accordingly, were most susceptible to heating, sagged massively;

3. There was a "tearfulness" - the contact points of the tubes with the junction boxes lost tightness and leaked;

4. And vice versa, the nuts that held the clamping brackets (that is, the mechanism of fastening the tubes to the boiler), stuck together in mass order;

5. In one boiler, the junction box cracked - as it turned out, it was formed at the manufacturing plant, but was stained so successfully that the monitoring commission did not find it. However, now that the boilers had to work at full capacity, the crack spread further.

Of course, the tests for it is to identify various shortcomings of the ship. But attention is drawn to the fact that in both cases of long twelve-hour runs at full speed on the cruiser there were breakdowns, despite the fact that after the completion of the second run the condition of the boilers turned out to be such that they needed to be disassembled, cleaned and assembled, with which they managed to cope only towards the end October, that is, more than a month after sea trials.

As it is known, the cruiser Varyag left 10 March 1901 for Philadelphia, but already at noon March 11 stopped in front of the entrance to Delaware Bay near Lewis, where they waited until March 14 to test the steering drive in the bay. Then the cruiser made the transition to the Hampton raid - a full supply of coal was accepted, and finally, on March 25, the cruiser went into the ocean. Already on the first day of the journey a storm began, gusts reached 11 points. The cruiser’s cars had no breakdowns, but an increased consumption of coal came to light, which forced the 3 cruiser in April to enter the Azores, which was not supposed to do initially. Here we waited for the storm at anchor, having both vehicles of the cruiser in constant readiness, and on April 8 the Varyag again set sail.

14 April cruiser arrives at Cherbourg. As we see, the transition did not take much time - less than a day from the parking place to Lewis, then - a day to the Hampton raid, from which Varyag left only 25 in March, and 3 in April, after 9 days, he anchored from the Azores of the islands. The road from them to Cherbourg took 6 more days, and all, it turns out, the cruiser was in motion 17 days.

However, by the end of these 17 days, the Varyag power plant had come to such a state that the commander of the cruiser V.I. Baer was forced to leave the ship entrusted to him for a very long repair in Cherbourg - they sorted out mechanisms, opened the cylinders of the main machines. It was assumed that the team could handle this in two weeks, but finished in 11 days, and on April 25 the cruiser again went to sea. After 5 days, the "Varangian" arrived on the Revel raid, and from there on May 2 left for Kronstadt, where he arrived the next day without incident.

As a matter of fact, “Varyag” (with the possible exception of the only short-term exit to the sea) was located in Kronstadt until the very departure to the Far East. At this time, the cruiser was subjected to various kinds of modifications and corrections, as well as fine-tuning artillery. But it is of interest that it was in Kronstadt that damage to the hull was revealed - flora in the areas of 30-37; The 43-49 and 55-56 frames have a deflection arrow from 1,6 to 19 mm. The reasons for this were not identified, but the cruiser "survived" the docking without additional deformations, and it was decided to assume that all this was not dangerous. Perhaps this was indeed the case, and the hull was deformed, for example, during the launch of the ship into the water.

The cruiser "Varyag". Fight Chemulpo 27 January 1904 of the Year. CH 6. Across the oceans

Photo 28 May 1901 g - "Varyag" after leaving the dock


Varyag left Kronstadt only 5 in August 1901 g, and reached without breakdowns ... exactly to Tolbukhin lighthouse (2,8 miles from Kotlin Island, where Kronstadt is actually located), and there, at the cruiser, the stock spool of the CWD of the left car broke, the ship went further under one machine. A day later (August 7) they put a spare stock, but alas, as soon as they made a move, the latter broke again. So the cruiser came to Denmark on the same machine (this happened on August 9) and already there they found out and tried to eliminate the cause of the breakdown, while the parts had to be ordered at the Burmeister and Vine factory.

In principle, all this was not something supernatural, repairs could be completed fairly quickly, but Varyag went to sea only on August 28 for reasons of the protocol - the widowed sovereign-empress Maria Feodorovna waited for the visit, then the royal yacht “Standart” and marching with him armored cruiser "Svetlana". The next day, we met "Hohenzollern" and went to Danzig, where the meeting of the two emperors took place, and then "Standart" and "Svetlana" left. But "Varyag" could not follow them, and was forced to spend an extra two hours on the German roadstead. The reason is the breakage of the rolling machine, as a result of which the cruiser could not be removed from the anchor.

Without a doubt, this failure lies entirely on the conscience of Russian sailors - the investigation showed that it occurred because of the erroneous actions of the watch engineer-mechanic. But why was he wrong? The fact is that the preparation for the royal reviews is, of course, tedious and nervous, and the crew of the “Varyag” is just that. But the problem was also that already in Danzig (if not earlier), the mechanical engineers of the cruiser faced the necessity of another reassembling of mechanisms, more precisely - bearings of the right machine, and they were still repairing when the cruiser had to be removed from the anchor and left the raid ...

By the way, one should not think that the problems with the power plant were the only difficulties that the crew encountered - the electrical equipment was constantly breaking down, including the dynamo. As it turned out, the reason was that the shafts of the latter, according to the specifications, had to be forged, and were cast. Subsequently, the ITC issued a request to Charles C. Crump for their replacement.

“Varyag” continued to accompany “Shtandart” and “Svetlana” - on September 2 the cruiser was in Kiel, the next day - in Elbe, on September 5 - in Dunkirk. Here the ship once again began to prepare for the transition to the Far East. Including the consequences of the “Danzig error” were corrected, cars and boilers were once again checked.

From Dunkirk, the cruiser left 16 September 1901 in Cadiz, where he stayed 5 days, and then September 27 came to Algeria. At sea, the ship spent only 6 days after leaving Dunkirk, where the power plant was being repaired and inspected, but again stopped in Algeria for a complete bulkhead of machines, including low and medium pressure cylinders.

Varyag left Algeria on October 9, and October 23 entered the Salaminskaya bay, spending a total of days on the sea 9 (stood for four days in Palermo, and one day in the Court’s bay, where he was to undergo combat training for a month, however, the cruiser was recalled the very next day after arrival. The ship commander received an encryption, from which it followed that the plans had changed and the cruiser, instead of training in the Gulf of the Court, would have to go to the Persian Gulf to demonstrate the Russian flag for three weeks. A funny incident is connected with this episode. The encryption was completely secret, only two people knew about its content on the cruiser: the commander of the Varyag, V.I. Baer and senior officer E.K. Kraft. The latter, with great surprise, informed V.I. Baru, that the suppliers of supplies know very well who the cruiser will go to the Persian Gulf ...

So, V.I. Baru had to undergo a fairly serious transition, and then he had to represent Russian interests in low-income ports of the Persian Gulf for a long time. So, the commander is not so sure about the power plant of his ship that he asked to delay the output until November 6. The permission was obtained, and within two weeks the mechanical engineers again sorted out the main and auxiliary mechanisms of the cruiser, including refrigerators, because, in addition to other problems of machines and boilers, salt water was also added, the use of which led to the rapid withdrawal of the boilers out of service.

It seems that after such a repair everything should have been in order, but where it is - on the second day of leaving Salaminskaya Bay (held on November 6) salinity again appeared in 7 boilers. And the next day (November 8) flowed tubes in three boilers, which had to be urgently removed from the action. We tried to completely change the boiler water, for which we had to stay at Suez for two days - but just an hour after the Varyag entered the Suez Canal, the salinity reappeared. I had to stop the trip again for a day and “gut” my left fridge. It turned out that at least 400 of its pipes (after two weeks of repair in Salaminskaya Bay!) Are unreliable and had to be silenced.

Now V.I. Beru had to disassemble the 9 boilers of the feed group, which were fed from the left cooler, and it was not possible to do this with the help of the machine crew alone, and it was necessary to use the combatants in this work too. While Varyag was following the Red Sea, the 5 000 of the boiler, evaporation and circulation tubes were inside and out and cleaned, inside and out.

Did these measures help? Yes, not at all - on the contrary, the first, really serious accidents followed. So, November 14 broke the tubes in one boiler, November 15 - in two at once, and November 17 - in one more. Eight people were scalded, one very seriously. The most unpleasant thing was that the broken tubes were neither burned-out nor clogged - there were no defects or deposits of deposits on them. As a result, we had to stay in Aden for four days - in addition to loading coal and supplies, we again sorted out boilers.

All these, we are not afraid of this word, unprecedented efforts were crowned with “success” - the whole 13 running day cruiser “Varyag” did not have major accidents of its power plant and refrigerators. Five days, from 22 to 27 in November, the cruiser went along the Gulf of Aden to Muscat, then a three-day trip to Bushehr, a day to Kuwait and two to Ling ... in each of the above ports Varyag stopped for several days and received guests-local sheikhs and other public. But nothing good will last for a long time, and in Ling two days (13-14 December) again went to repair cars. Daily transfer to Bandar Abbas, a three-day stay there and a three-day transfer to Karachi. There, “Varyag” spent four days, taking 750 t coal and, of course, spending the prevention of machines and boilers.


Interestingly, in the tropics for loading coal VI. Baer preferred to hire the local people who were accustomed to the heat


25 December The cruiser left Karachi and after 6 days, December 31, arrived in Colombo. The Port Arthur squadron was within reach, and Petersburg demanded the earliest possible reunification with the squadron, but V.I. REM categorically does not want to attach an incompetent cruiser to the squadron, and requires a two-week stop to repair mechanisms, including: opening and reassembling the cylinders of the main machines, circulating and air pumps, spool boxes, inspection of bearings, gaskets and valves. In addition, many pipes in refrigerators should be replaced again, and they should be boiled down in soda.

This time was given, but the cruiser did not “come in order” - after leaving 15 from Colombo in January 1902 in the morning, in the evening it was necessary to slow down due to the warming up of the high-pressure cylinder bearings. A week later, on December 22, Varyag arrived in Singapore, loaded coal during the day and carried out preventive work for three more days. From December 26 - a week at sea, February 2 came to Hong Kong and stood up again for a week, doing a complete overhaul of mechanisms. By this time, the number of tubes replaced in boilers and refrigerators has already reached 1, 500! The ship remained 2 to Port Arthur - four days from Hong Kong to Nagasaki, and from there - three days to Port Arthur, but taking into account the parking in Nagasaki, only February 25 arrived in Arthur.

What can we say about the power plant "Varyag" on the basis of the foregoing? Sometimes, on the Internet, one has to read the version that while the commander of the cruiser was commanded by V.I. Rem, then everything was more or less in order with the cars and boilers, but VF came here. Rudnev - and everything collapsed ... Meanwhile, the facts show the opposite.

Without a doubt, the cruiser Varyag reached and even exceeded the contract speed at the tests. But in both cases, carrying them out by the 12-hour run at full speed, the Varyag power plant was damaged: in the first case the cylinder cover was torn off, and in the second one of the boilers failed, and at the end of the tests the cruisers boiled requiring factory repair. Then the cruiser made the transition first from Philadelphia to Kronstadt, and from there, passing through the Baltic Sea and escorting the royal yacht to Port Arthur, with a long stay in the Persian Gulf.

So, from the moment of leaving Philadelphia to the moment when the cruiser dropped anchor in Port Arthur, the Varyag spent 102 days on the go. But in order to provide him with these 102 days of progress, V.I. Rem had more than 73 days to repair the ship at various stops and in ports! We cannot specify the exact number, because we do not know how long Varyag was repaired in Denmark, and how much preventive maintenance of cars took in Dunkirk - accordingly, the author was forced to exclude the repair time in these ports completely. In addition, the days mentioned 73 did not take into account the repair work that the cruiser made on the move, as was done, for example, in the Red Sea. Again, when we talk about 102 running days, we mean the total time the cruiser was at sea, but not the time in which he was at least relatively healthy: for example, the 102 days included in the specified 4 days when the Varyag was traveling from Kronstadt to Denmark in one car, and the days of the accidents of its boilers when the cruiser was moving towards Aden. If we introduce these amendments, we get a completely horrifying picture impossible for a warship - in order to ensure that the newest ship 24 has an hour to sail, it took almost as much time to repair its power plant at anchor! And we must understand that during the transitions the cruiser almost always went at all to the economic speed of 10 knots, not at combat.

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But the situation with the machines, boilers and refrigerators "Varyag" was infinitely far from normal. And, having understood the schedule of repairs, it is very difficult to blame the crew for poor ship maintenance. Suppose the Russian machine team was made up of profane, but in this case how to explain the output of the material part during the test runs, where everything went by and under the control of plant specialists? But when accepting the Varyag, there was never a case when he went with the maximum speed to the 23 of the 12-hour unit and had nothing to do with it. On the way to Russia, the cruiser had to be delayed for 11 days due to the necessity of busting cars and boilers - no transport, or, especially, a passenger steamer demanded this, and the latter often went to the Atlantic even faster than the Varyag. It seems that at the time of entry into Kronstadt the cruiser was in order, but once he got out, the breakdown followed one after the other, the cars and boilers were constantly in need of repair. It is hard to imagine that the Russians in a matter of days at sea managed to break up the American equipment! But the version that the Varyag cars, boilers and refrigerators were simply not brought up to standard by C. Crump, in the above history The operation fits very well.

But back to V.I. To Bar, in his personal opinion, with the Varyag power plant everything was completely bad, and he regularly sent reports “upward”. One of his reports on the problems of "Varyag" with boilers in the Red Sea, Admiral PP Tyrtov ferried V.P. Verkhovsky with a very snide resolution: "to formulate opinions about the properties of the boilers of Nikloss". However, the Varyag team could not help it.

With a truly titanic effort, constantly repairing Varyag, V.I. Rem nevertheless led the cruiser where ordered. But in what condition? When the Varyag left Nagasaki for Port Arthur, the junior flagship of the squadron, Rear Admiral K.P., raised the flag on it. Kuzmich. He, of course, wanted to test the new ship, and arranged a series of checks on various systems of the ship, including its power plant. But when the cruiser tried to develop a full stroke, the bearings started to knock at 20,5 speed, and the speed had to be reduced to 10 nodes.

Further checks also did not inspire optimism. As we said earlier, Varyag arrived in Port Arthur 25 February 1902 r, and February 28 went out to sea and, after firing practice, tried again to get off the ground. The result is catastrophic, the rupture of several tubes, the knocking and heating of many bearings, while the speed never exceeded the 20 nodes. These two tests allow us to safely say that, despite all the efforts of the crew, the cruiser arrived in Port Arthur completely incompetent and demanded immediate repair.

The statement of work on the mechanisms, compiled by 28 February, included:

1. Inspection and repair of all bearings - 21 day;

2. Bulkhead spool drives and spools and checking them - 21 day;

3. Inspection of cylinder pistons and checking their movement - 14 days;

4. Leaching of refrigerators, replacing pipes with new ones, packing glands and hydraulic testing - 40 days;

5. Replacing the overhead valves of boilers and bottom-blowing valves - 68 days.

Some of these works could be done at the same time, and some (on the fifth point) could be postponed altogether, producing parts in capacity when there was time for this: nevertheless, the cruiser immediately needed two months of repairs, which could be done only with the full voltage of the machine crew.

Nothing like this happened with other ships arriving in the recruitment of our Pacific forces. Take the same "battleship cruiser" "Peresvet". An interesting opinion was expressed about him by the commander of the Pacific squadron, Vice-Admiral N.I. Skrydlov, who stated in a report to St. Petersburg: “There is no complete training at Peresvet, and the order of service on it leaves much to be desired.” Officers of the “battleship-cruiser” N.I. Skrydlov scolded in the presence of sailors (which, obviously, should not have been done). Grand Duke Kirill Vladimirovich described it this way: “In his opinion, which he laid out in the most non-parliamentary terms, neither we nor our ship were good enough. We were the most notorious and hopeless laymen who ever stepped aboard the ship, and the commander - the worst of all! ”. But despite such a derogatory assessment, the Peresvet power plant was in a relative order, and the ship on arrival was not sent to the reserve or for repair, but remained in the existing squadron to catch up on the “combat and political” training. In addition to Peresvet, minelayers Amur and Yenisei also came, their cars and boilers also worked fine and did not require repairs. At the same time, the Varyag needed to be immediately put in for repair, however the officers of this cruiser did not call N.I. Skrydlov no reproach.

It must be said that according to the results of the inspection of “Varyag” and “Peresvet”, oddly enough, N.I. Skrydlov spoke about the advantage of the ships of domestic construction. Of course, he noted that “Varyag” is not bad at all, and it would be nice to adopt a number of its decisions for our own ships. This concerned, for example, the placement of a dressing station under the armor deck, an extensive “network” of negotiation tubes, magnificent steam boats, considered the best throughout the squadron, etc. But at the same time N.I. Skrydlov noted that the construction of the cruiser "was of a market nature, and the desire of a private plant to save reflected unfavorably on the solidity of the hull and the finishing of parts."

But the admiral's comment on the Varyag cars was especially interesting:

"The cruiser mechanisms, designed successfully, were assembled, obviously, without due diligence and reconciliation, and after coming to the East they were so developed that they required a lengthy reassembly and reconciliation."


In this regard, the opinion of N.I. Skrydlova apparently echoes the results of studies of the Varyag mechanisms, undertaken by engineer I.I. Hippius. Thus, we see that the thesis that “When V.I. Bare with the Varyag boilers was all good, ”is not confirmed at all. Serious problems with the mechanisms pursued the cruiser from the very beginning of his service.

To be continued ...
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113 comments
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  1. +4
    10 July 2018 07: 44
    Interesting information, thanks)
  2. +2
    10 July 2018 10: 14
    The entire series is written great. interesting and competent - but ...! What does the fight at Chemulpo have to do with it?
    The task of Rudnev was not to boom and whistle to fly out of the bay and bullet at everything that was moving to hide behind the horizon at incredible speed, but to prevent landing in Chemulpo, for which the Korean was also given. And then the state of the steam engines did not play any roles, give 14 knots and excellent!
    1. +5
      10 July 2018 13: 00
      Not certainly in that way.
      Rudnev had a direct ban on interfering with the landing of Japanese troops before the declaration of war, although the blatant mistake of the Japanese, an attack on the Korean, allowed him to do this. But he did not use the gift of the Japanese.
      and as for "with a hoot and a whistle" - so if you believe Rudnev’s report, that’s what he was going to do laughing
  3. +9
    10 July 2018 10: 18
    Melnikov’s traditional detailed description of Varyag’s shortcomings, begun in modern Russian popular history, is quite characteristic smile The capitalists Kramp and Nikloss get what they deserve! wink
    Of course, the author writes interestingly, and is clearly one of the best authors at VO at the moment, and he clearly has a desire for an objective consideration of the issue, but, as I wrote earlier, in this cycle, in my opinion, he sometimes shows traditional approach - let's say the last article in the cycle was, in my opinion, much more balanced.
    Of course, the Varyag flaws had a place to be, but it was a problem of most ships of that time, especially during factory tests.
    This is how the tests of the model are described. wink Askold
    April 11, 1901 "Askold" first time went to sea. Factory tests of the ship’s mechanisms began. On this day, due to a malfunction of the feed pumps supplying water to the boilers, it was not possible to raise the vapor pressure above 14 atm, nevertheless, the cruiser developed a speed of 18,25 knots, which was not bad for the first exit. After 5 hours of testing, a decrease in water in the front and two rear boilers was noticed, and then one tube broke in each of these boilers; tests had to be interrupted and returned to Kiel. In order to avoid possible misunderstandings, Russian officers and the team did not participate in servicing the mechanisms. Supervisors of the building demanded to eliminate all the shortcomings seen in the test.

    In addition, a strong vibration made itself felt: the commander’s bridge trembled so that the needle of the magnetic compass darted in different directions. Work began on the reinforcement of the bridge, although the engineers of the company found the vibration not going beyond the limits characteristic of high-speed cruisers. May 23, the cruiser again went to factory tests. Representatives of the company hoped to achieve contracted speed at this exit, but the main machines worked with a knock, and Russian specialists demanded an end to the sea, a thorough inspection of the bearings and elimination of the causes of the knock. Compared to the first exit, the vibration of the hull has increased significantly, especially in the stern in the area of ​​the propellers.

    I note that Askold, unlike the Varangian, was not tested for 12 hours at full speed, his tests were two for six hours, spaced in time - which is far from the same thing.
    In any case, after the ultimate tests, repair and inspection are required
    The very description of the problems in Russian historiography, sometimes observed in this cycle of a respected author, is presented as some events that have no rational explanation, with broken cause and effect relationships.
    For example, as the author rightly points out, the breakdown of the shaft-turning machine happened due to the fault of the crew
    damage lies entirely on the conscience of Russian sailors
    , but immediately the crew’s excuse, contrary to this statement, is given.
    Many descriptions of breakdowns are traditionally in the literature (I understand that the author didn’t climb the archives himself, but used the available literature, so this is by no means a complaint to the author, who is not a techie) often without technical analysis of the reasons for this or that breakdowns and leave the field of free interpretation.
    For example, the five points of breakdown after the tests given by the author, in fact, have a simple explanation - they are connected precisely with problems with the refrigerator, and are a consequence of a leak in it, while salt water gets into the boiler, which leads to the formation of scale, and due to features of the Nikloss boilers, this leads to local overheating of the pipes, pressure drops and “teariness” of the compounds, and as a result, their sticking.
    Refrigerators in Varyag had to be monitored much more carefully than in other types of boilers, however, the commission in the Far East blamed the team for the problems of refrigerators.
    For domestic sources, a description is typical like “three pipes burst, scale and corrosion were not found,” but no reason for this is indicated - why did the tubes burst !? Only general phrases about "unsuitability of Nikloss boilers"
    Reliability theory knows running-in failures at the beginning of operation when defective elements are detected - this was the case with bursting tubes on Askold or Retvisan, for example.
    But on the Varangian tubes burst periods! Either burst, then do not burst, judging by the description, completely irrational, by the will of heaven. Or the fault of the stokers who did not provide uniform heat on the grate.
    And, by the way, there are no descriptions of bursting pipes either among the Japanese on the Varangian or the Russians after the transfer of the cruiser, with the same boilers.
    And this applies to so many cases of problem description.
    What does the quality of the metal of the dynamo shafts have to do with periodic breakdowns in them? If the shaft does not burst or is not deformed, the dynamo machine will work even with plastic. Crump, by the way, is remembered, refused to change them.
    Or here are the problems with the car. The PM of a high-speed cruiser optimized for high speeds is very sensitive to steam parameters, for example, at incomplete speeds - a decrease in steam pressure at the inlet of a steam engine leads to instability of their operation, vibration and increased wear of mechanisms - and the mechanics of the cruiser reduced pressure steam for fear of bursting tubes on safety valves.
    Cruiser service is generally a separate issue.
    Most of the workers were Chinese, the quality of work is appropriate.
    They contributed to the cruiser’s breakdowns and their kulibins, for example, replacing the metal of bearings provided by Kramp with “the new metal of General Fedosyev”, which led to fatal overheating of the bearings due to misalignment of the connecting rods.
    It got to the point that Rozhdestvensky forbade repairing the cruiser, rightly noting that after repairs his characteristics only worsen.
    I would like to see someday a technical analysis of the cruiser’s problems, rather than sets of general phrases that something was misaligned there.
    In any case, the aforementioned does not reduce the merits of the author both in his work at the HE in general, and in this cycle in particular, he is trying to correct the shortcomings of Russian historiography in terms of objective analysis as much as he can. good
    We will wait for the continuation smile
    1. 0
      10 July 2018 11: 41
      The field of free interpretation of accidents does not remain. It is enough to recall the experience of operating similar boilers at Retvisan and at the Varyag itself after Chemulpo.
      It definitely turns out that the accident due to the illiterate operation of the boilers led to fear of the service team against “spasmodic” niclosses and the limitation of the maximum steam pressure in the boilers, which in turn allowed us to quickly go around the car. The last one was also superimposed on illiterate machine repair afterwards.
      It’s strange that you write everything correctly, but try to whitewash the author of the post, which completely ignores both “Retvisan” and “Varyag” itself after Chemulpo, including the frank antilogy that the “scoundrel” Kramp is to blame for all the troubles of the “Varyag” CMU.
      1. +6
        10 July 2018 12: 16
        Quote: Jura 27
        It is enough to recall the experience of operating similar boilers at Retvisan and at the Varyag itself after Chemulpo.

        How can you recall what you do not know?
        1. +7
          10 July 2018 13: 48
          Yura27 knows EVERYTHING!
          And to you, Andrei, he is clearly not indifferent. He feels such personal dislike that he cannot eat.
          The chapter came out interesting and necessary, read with interest, thanks.
          1. +4
            10 July 2018 13: 53
            Quote: Comrade
            And to you, Andrei, he is clearly not indifferent. He feels such personal dislike that he cannot eat.

            I usually don’t quote tabloid literature, but it’s impossible to stay here
            I have some kind of unhealthy craving for you, and pulls you to hug your neck gently and hold it until you stop banging your legs ...

            (Bushkov, "Piranha") laughing
            1. +4
              10 July 2018 14: 39
              Maybe this is subjective, but it seems to me that Kolya Passerby is more adequate than Jura27.
              I will never forget how Jura27 argued that “Retvisan”, until it arrives at any Russian port, cannot be considered to have entered into service. The logic is simple - because they could sink it along the road.
              1. +3
                10 July 2018 19: 09
                Quote: Comrade
                Maybe this is subjective, but it seems to me that Kolya Passerby is more adequate than Jura27.

                Let me answer with a rhetorical question - who flies better, a whale or an elephant? :)))))
        2. -1
          11 July 2018 17: 11
          So tell us about the "Varyagovskaya" accident of boilers at Retvisan, or the frequency of accidents in the Japanese fleet of boilers of the ships under discussion, and at the same time compare the accident rate of Varyag boilers after March 1916 and until January 1904. I will be pleased to join the source of truth in your performance.
          And to the rhetorical question, there is a rhetorical answer: "Andrei flies best of all, in his fantasies on technical topics"
      2. +6
        10 July 2018 12: 52
        I like the whole as the author writes. His articles are favorably distinguished by sound elaboration, systematization, moderately saturated with details, and at least attempts to independently analyze the facts, even if I disagree with some.
        But, of course, he writes on secondary sources, and therefore one way or another it sometimes appears in some articles.
        In this case, when compared with the classic Melnikov, who always led to stigmatize the Niklosses and Trumps in detail for their boilers and cars (although there were no problems with them in a real battle), the author clearly tried to make the description more balanced than we see in in most cases on this topic, but the source material for the work is perforce manifested, and is observed in some articles of this cycle.
        And I approve of the fact that he reacts to constructive comments.
        And as for mistakes, the ideal does not exist. You just need to be more relaxed about the lack of work - we don’t share the cow in the end.
        I'm not talking about a comparison with some other articles of other authors based on the bikes of the 90s, like that when someone read how the Jews and Egyptians radar stolen and immediately wrote about how the USSR had a helicopter from the Americans, or how the Russian plane chopped off all the electronics on the American destroyer in one fell swoop, so that half of the crew was written off to the shore - and these inventions went for a walk around the expanses of Runet.
        1. +4
          10 July 2018 15: 00
          Quote: Avior
          And I approve of the fact that he reacts to constructive comments.

          hi Frankly, it’s difficult :))) When you write one thing, and you are rightly pointed out your mistakes, and you understand the whole depth of your errors :))))) But this makes the author smarter, which cannot but rejoice - first of all the author himself, of course :)
          1. +1
            10 July 2018 15: 14
            yes it’s understandable, you work, you work, and then some kind of criticism will fit :)
            write your article and criticize it! laughing
        2. -1
          11 July 2018 17: 34
          Quote: Avior
          I like the whole as the author writes. His articles are favorably distinguished by sound elaboration, systematization, moderately saturated with details, and at least attempts to independently analyze the facts, even if I disagree with some.
          But, of course, he writes on secondary sources, and therefore one way or another it sometimes appears in some articles.
          In this case, when compared with the classic Melnikov, who always led to stigmatize the Niklosses and Trumps in detail for their boilers and cars (although there were no problems with them in a real battle), the author clearly tried to make the description more balanced than we see in in most cases on this topic, but the source material for the work is perforce manifested, and is observed in some articles of this cycle.

          I won’t say anything for it, but the last two are about cars and boilers: mindless rehashing of RMM, with attempts to independently analyze the level: Kramp made bad cars and boilers, because dynamo machines (!!!) constantly broke anchors and in general Kramp wanted to make it easier cruiser hull, by including in the work of a wooden deck deck. Those. complete technical nonsense of a person who does not understand what he is writing about.
    2. +2
      10 July 2018 12: 16
      Sergey, welcome! hi
      Quote: Avior
      And, by the way, there are no descriptions of bursting pipes either among the Japanese on the Varangian or the Russians after the transfer of the cruiser, with the same boilers.

      On the second day of the campaign (after Varyag left Vladivostok) 2 pipes of boiler No. 3 burst - several stokers were injured, one of them died.
      1. +3
        10 July 2018 12: 56
        Yeah, if the Japanese did not burst, but began to burst as soon as the Russian team hit the ship, what does that mean? wink
        But, I think, it’s still necessary to take into account that immediately before the transfer, the Japanese were unlikely to carefully monitor the condition of the cruiser, and it was not a new one.
        In any case, the bursting tube should have a specific explanation - a metal defect, corrosion, scale, overheating, etc. .... - then the reasons can be analyzed
        1. +4
          10 July 2018 13: 55
          Quote: Avior
          Yeah, if the Japanese did not burst, but began to burst as soon as the Russian team hit the ship, what does that mean?

          But who said that the Japanese did not burst? :)))))
          The problem is that we know about the Japanese simply godlessly little. And all we know for sure is that they VERY do not like to flaunt their own mistakes.
          Quote: Avior
          In any case, the bursting tube should have a specific explanation - a metal defect, corrosion, scale, overheating, etc. .... - then the reasons can be analyzed

          Honestly, I doubt very much that we could have complete information on this issue. I noted cases when the tubes failed, without any scale or burnout - but I doubt that some documents contain such an analysis for each failed tube
          1. +1
            10 July 2018 14: 10
            these cases are just interesting.
            If the tube defect, then it will manifest itself quickly, if not, then what is the reason?
        2. +1
          10 July 2018 18: 27
          Yeah, if the Japanese did not burst, but began to burst as soon as the Russian team hit the ship, what does that mean? wink
          But, I think, it’s still necessary to take into account that immediately before the transfer, the Japanese were unlikely to carefully monitor the condition of the cruiser, and it was not a new one.


          It's funny: "firstly, I didn’t take it, secondly it was already broken, thirdly I returned the whole"

          It is obvious that you do not see some of the shortcomings of your own "logic"
          1. 0
            10 July 2018 19: 49
            I'm fine with logic, I think the author - and I wrote to him - I understood
    3. 0
      10 July 2018 18: 22
      ...Christmas...

      Then you can not read
      1. +3
        10 July 2018 19: 54
        This you can not read further
        on the fields of the report, the chief of the general public health administration, Rear Admiral 3. P. Rozhestvensky, added at the end: “Before the full arrangement of the mechanisms in Port Arthur, the cruiser could give 20 knots for a short time, and 16 knots for a longer one. After the first bulkhead without harm to the machines, the speed limit was 17 knots. What will be this limit after the second bulkhead in Port Arthur? ”
        1. 0
          10 July 2018 22: 50
          You don’t even understand what it is about
          1. +2
            10 July 2018 23: 23
            I realized that I can still find typos, but talking to someone who is looking for them and from them makes any conclusions is not interesting to me.
            So is it available to you?
          2. +1
            12 July 2018 00: 35
            This is a very normal and common typo. For example, I write from a tablet and it automatically and without warning changes to Christmas. Moreover, I noticed this case far from the first time. So hurry up with conclusions ;-)
            1. 0
              12 July 2018 07: 16
              There and the rest is the same - completely "typos from the tablet"
              1. +1
                12 July 2018 09: 12
                Could it be more specific?
                1. 0
                  12 July 2018 22: 01
                  too lazy to come back, drove
                  well and generally right now in Prague
                  1. 0
                    13 July 2018 08: 32
                    clear, specifics - no request
                    1. 0
                      13 July 2018 09: 08
                      I am old enough not to take on weakly.
                      1. 0
                        13 July 2018 15: 24
                        And there was no thought request
    4. +4
      10 July 2018 18: 34
      Avior, you gave a very good comment. I, like you, consider Andrei, one of the best authors on the site
      1. 0
        12 July 2018 00: 48
        I would say - definitely the best. Only Sergey Linnik (Bongo) can argue with the quality of the materials, and the presentation style and language at the level of a serious writer than other constant VO authors unfortunately cannot boast of.
  4. +4
    10 July 2018 10: 37
    Interestingly, in the tropics for loading coal VI. Baer preferred to hire the local people who were accustomed to the heat

    An interesting person was Vladimir Iosifovich ... he really cared about his subordinates, although in his youth he was under arrest for scuffles, and the ships under his command were known as "hard labor".
  5. +2
    10 July 2018 10: 42
    Here I read, re-read and chew on article 6 about Varyag machines. And steadily, not really wanting it, I come to the conclusion what kind of American manufacturers freeloaders and hucksters, and the engineering culture, it turns out, were not so high in the advertised industrial America (yesterday, as a matter of fact, “collective farm”). I concluded for myself that our MTK simply could not believe for itself that in the States they could have made such a G ... Nikloss, not Nikloss, is not the point. The result is a battle-worthy cruiser, because for a cruiser, Speed, Time for transfer to a theater are the most important parameters. Even the caliber and the number of trunks - is secondary for working on trade communications.
    1. 0
      10 July 2018 12: 36
      You are being pushed to that conclusion since Melnikov — tsarism and foreign capitalists are to blame, but by no means a simple Russian sailor.
      At the request of the Russian side, the cruiser Varyag Kramp built the deadlines of one and a half to two years, but, for example, not a cruiser, but just the gunboat Brave with the same boilers Nikloss was built in the Republic of Ingushetia from 1991 to 1998, and what happened, read yourself
      https://topwar.ru/141924-kanonerskayaитайте о нем- -lodka-hrabryy-i-ee-kotly.html
      And the same Kramp built Retvisan- read about it
      http://www.navylib.su/ships/retvizan/21.htm
      http://www.navylib.su/ships/retvizan/
      1. +3
        10 July 2018 13: 19
        And then tsarism? - About tsarism was not said. Inquisitors of the bakers can relax. And here is a simple Russian sailor? - A simple sailor sat and did not break his hands breaking cars? In the household of the headmaster? - Again, neither to the star, nor to the Red Army. Kramp's greed is the only reason for everything. You can’t meet the deadlines - do not subscribe. And the fact that Nikloss boilers are “raw materials” as a technological product at that time was known to Kramp. Cutting the loot from the silver-footed, and vtyuhat what happens, - this is in Krapovskom. The rest is husk. In general, the States are the only ones of the time - it was simply a paradise for swindlers in all areas. Not a contractor contacted. not with that shipbuilding school. That’s the whole story.
        1. +3
          10 July 2018 13: 33
          You are reading inattentively.
          For example, in the problems of refrigerator breakdowns, the Russian commission found the team guilty.
          Maybe all the same it is worth reading the links?
          1. 0
            11 July 2018 13: 47
            I read carefully. Besides the refrigerators, what else is the team to blame? Just in the article there are a lot of references to other "surprises", starting with sea trials. And then say it is easier to blame on the crew. than to reveal a fundamental mistake of the bureaucrats of the admiralty.
        2. +3
          10 July 2018 14: 28
          Quote: andrew42
          A simple sailor was sitting and breaking his hands breaking cars? In the household of the headmaster?

          No, of course: a simple sailor served the boilers - the way he was taught. They just taught him on fire tube boilers.
          As a result, we even managed to kill Belleville boilers in the trash. The epic of "Victory" and "Fuck" is an example:
          Looking at the personal engine personnel on the fleet ships during factory delivery tests, I am simply amazed at the almost complete inconsistency with regard to such complex and expensive mechanisms that they have to operate. The weakness and inconsistency of these personnel is almost a universal fact on the ships of our fleet ... Due to a complete misunderstanding of the control of fire, water, donkeys, automatic feeders, etc ... [Victory boilers were brought into] an amazingly damaged, rusted and unfavorable state .
          © assistant chief of the Baltic Plant mechanical engineer I.P. Pavlov
        3. +2
          10 July 2018 18: 32
          And the fact that Nikloss boilers are “raw materials” as a technological product

          They are not "raw", they are simply worthless. A heavy tube suspended from one end .... Inevitable bending moment in the weakest node --- mount. Add overheating --- and everything is clear.

          This is engineering adventurism, such "inventive" boilers
          1. +1
            10 July 2018 19: 56
            Yah?
            From a technical point of view, the Retwisan squadron battleship was one of the best ships of its time. It was a well-balanced project, combining excellent booking, powerful (that is, meeting world standards) weapons, good seaworthiness and increased crew comfort. Perhaps the only drawback of the project was the choice of steam boilers. However, this mistake was not so tragic: the accident when moving from the USA to Russia forced the commander and mechanical engineers to more closely monitor the state of the power plant, and with proper care, the Nikloss boilers worked quite well. In any case, in Port Arthur, despite the difficult conditions of the blockade, not a single slightest serious refusal in the operation of the “Retvisan” boilers occurred.
            1. +4
              10 July 2018 20: 40
              Quote: Avior
              In any case, in Port Arthur, despite the difficult conditions of the blockade, not a single slightest serious refusal in the operation of the “Retvisan” boilers occurred.

              laughing good
              Now, count the number of exits to the Retvisan Sea after his arrival in PA :)))
              1. +4
                10 July 2018 23: 24
                to Port Arthur, Retwisan followed the same path as the Varangian, but the result is very different. smile
  6. +4
    10 July 2018 12: 09
    Good afternoon. First of all, let me thank you for the articles, very interesting. And I have a request for you, is it possible to have more numbers, more specifics. So that was something to compare with. What is the weight of the Nikloss boiler (in A.I., in an article about armadillos of the type Peresvet I read that the Belleville boiler with water weighed 22 tons, and then everywhere, including Melnikov’s common phrases, Kramp chose “Nikloss” because they lighter than "belleville" and steam production, and what is he winning in real life, guess it yourself.
    And therefore, reading about the Varangian, you imagine, the radish Kramp slipped a temple horse. But if he had put super boilers of Norman, Schulz-Tornicroft on Varyag, or at worst Yarrow, you would look and would have burst past Uriu at a speed. So, if it’s not difficult for you, lay out the weight of the boilers: Norman, Yarrow, Schulz-Tornicroft and the order of the already spat upon Nikloss. To compare the benefit in weight of one or another design, but without numbers, everything is quite vague and not clear. Thank you in advance.
    1. +1
      10 July 2018 12: 37
      look at the previous articles of the cycle - there are these numbers
      1. +1
        11 July 2018 17: 41
        I re-read the entire series of articles by Andrey from Chelyabinsk and gave the total weight of the machines according to Bogatyr and Askold, and not the weight of the boilers of different systems and their steam production, so that their advantages and disadvantages could be seen. Or Andrei from Chelyabinsk does not have these figures and he operates with a few generalized data. Although it may be, as an option, there is no desire to bother with the answer.
    2. +1
      10 July 2018 18: 35
      AK64 provided links to articles with comparative figures. But ... but it turns out there is no link.

      But there is a web: google yourself on ship steam boilers
      1. +1
        11 July 2018 17: 46
        Google, if only I dug it and would not ask, but this question to which I could not find an answer.
        1. 0
          11 July 2018 18: 18
          Well then, I'm sorry, I can’t teach Google.

          I gave links, but they were deleted. (It turns out you can't here)
          But finding these articles is really not difficult
  7. +2
    10 July 2018 14: 28
    It turned out that at least 400 of his pipes (after a two-week repair in Salaminsky Bay!) Were unreliable and had to be drowned.

    So the refrigerators were not repaired there - the result - I had to do it on the way :)
    This is a question for the machine team, how the refrigeration units in the Salaminsky Bay were audited, despite the fact that the reason lay on the surface - the pipes of the refrigerators are flowing.
  8. +3
    10 July 2018 14: 36
    There, "Varyag" spent four days, taking 750 tons of coal and, of course, carrying out the prevention of cars and boilers.


    Yes, it’s not a secret at all that when a ship is in port, the machine team is engaged in repair or revision of ... machines.
    Moreover, at the current level of technology, the team of modern ships is doing the same thing - checking, sorting cars. Modern mechanisms, of course, give high mileage to failure, they have repeatedly shown on Discovery as supercontainer carriers (such as MAERSK), on the fly they repair individual nozzles and cylinder machines (the design of modern machines allows).
    1. +1
      10 July 2018 14: 56
      Quote: DimerVladimer
      Yes, it’s not a secret at all that when a ship is in port, the machine team is engaged in repair or revision of ... machines.

      But she usually does not ask to stay in the port for a couple more weeks :))))
      1. +1
        10 July 2018 15: 33
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        But she usually doesn’t ask to stay at the port for a couple more weeks.


        Yes, but there was no rush either - not a super liner with passengers and not a transporter, where a forfeit money is dripping for a delay.
        Cruiser in solo sailing - could allow and defend at the transition.
        A new cruiser, why risk the failure of cars along the way, if they can be sorted out, according to the descriptions - the mechanics slammed the reason for the salinization of the boiler water (leaking refrigerator tubes) and had to repeatedly remove the pipes and rinse the boilers - the bad head does not give rest to your legs.
        The reason is the weakness of the engine crew and not the boilers. So you mixed in the repairs of machines and boilers and failures due to factory defects and due to poor preparation of the machine team

        Another thing is that with salinization of the pipes in the Belleville boilers, they could be purged, and the Niklosses had to clean the pipes - removing them from the boiler.

        Super careful commander - very carefully gained experience with new boilers.
        1. +1
          10 July 2018 15: 47
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          Yes, but there was no rush either

          Was at least twice.
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          Cruiser in solo sailing - could allow and defend at the transition.

          For some reason, other ships did not need it
          1. +1
            10 July 2018 16: 11
            Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
            For some reason, other ships did not need it


            I won’t go far - look at the statistics of TAVKR repairs) “Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov” - even without taking into account the lack of funding in the 90s, it stands in repairs with regular constancy and from zero:
            From 2001 to 2004 he was on a planned average repair. In 2004, as part of a group of nine ships of the Northern Fleet, including the Peter the Great heavy nuclear missile cruiser, the Marshal Ustinov missile cruiser, the Admiral Ushakov destroyer and support vessels, he participated in a monthly (!) Campaign in the North Atlantic, during which the flight design tests of the Su-27KUB were also carried out. In 2005-2007 he was in military service, two or three times a year went to sea(!)


            That is, if in 1895-1905 there was a rearmament of the Russian fleet and the order of modern ships and one of the very modern reconnaissance turned out to be not quite in accordance with the characteristics, this does not mean that there was horror, horror - as it sounds in your article :))

            Horror horror with the supply of the fleet - this is exactly from the 90s to now.
            1. +1
              10 July 2018 17: 05
              Quote: DimerVladimer
              I won’t go far - look at the statistics of TAVKR repairs) “Admiral of the Fleet of the Soviet Union Kuznetsov” - even without taking into account the lack of funding in the 90s, it stands in repairs with regular constancy and from zero:

              Look at Kuznetsov :))) How long was he in repairs? :))))) Count - you will be surprised.
              Quote: DimerVladimer
              and one of the very modern scouts turned out to be not quite appropriate

              Well, if it is now called "does not quite meet the characteristics" - then yes :)))
              1. +1
                11 July 2018 07: 36
                I would also add that we still need to calculate how much he MUST have spent on repairs and how much he spent.
            2. 0
              11 July 2018 18: 05
              You forgot such an aspect of repair as the quality of the work performed. At the beginning of the 35s, Kuzya stood at the XNUMXth plant in Rosta and the working people dragged everything that he could take away to receive the colormet. Salary delay you know.
              So, with such a repair, it’s good that he climbed into the sea.
              By the way, by the way, Kuzyu had examined it well — you drove into the hill, the car on the side of the road, and it’s under your palm.
      2. +5
        11 July 2018 09: 48
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        But she usually does not ask to stay in the port for a couple more weeks :))))


        Given the qualifications - for Baer it was an extreme voyage. He was supposed to hand over the ship to the new commander soon upon arrival in the PA - he "went out" of his qualification :).
        So why should he not linger in swimming - on a specious pretext?
        If you look at the repair sites - then they are all very comfortable ports - that is, they reached and did not accidentally get up to the "next scheduled repair".
        Paraphrasing the famous saying, in a marine way: - The ship is standing - qualification goes :)
        While the machine team sorts out the boiler tubes, the officers make secular visits and have fun in the port :))
        The parking places were chosen prudently - and all under a plausible pretext - in Hong Kong and I would have stayed a couple of weeks :))
        Like in a famous movie
        - How long does it take to repair?
        - Well, the day.
        ...
        - Can you do a week?
        - Well, you ask the master a task - here an assistant is needed .. :)
  9. +3
    10 July 2018 15: 21
    These two tests allow us to boldly assert that, despite all the efforts of the crew, the cruiser arrived in Port Arthur completely unworkable and required immediate repair.

    The guns didn't work either? Could the ship not move? A strange idea of ​​combat readiness.
    Did not give out contract speed - yes. This is a significant decrease in performance, but not combat effectiveness.
    1. +3
      10 July 2018 15: 46
      Quote: DimerVladimer
      The guns didn't work either? Could the ship not move? A strange idea of ​​combat readiness.

      At the mine blown up “Retvisan” all the guns worked, and he could move (in tow). Does that make him combat ready? :)
      The cruiser could not give 20 knots without problems in the chassis - what kind of combat capability are we talking about?
      1. +3
        10 July 2018 15: 56
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        The cruiser could not give 20 knots without problems in the chassis - what kind of combat capability are we talking about?


        Well, from this point of view, the fact that the armored detachment of the first TOE, which crawled 13-14 knots against the contract 18, is also called not combat ready :))

        There is a clear definition of heaven: there is no ammunition, the guns are not working, there is no progress, the crew is absent or unable or unwilling to fulfill its duties.
        Some battleships became floating batteries - and this does not mean that he is not a combatant, it means he is not able to operate as part of a squadron, or partially combat ready.

        But to call a cruiser, which instead of the contract 23 knots, produces only 20, is a bust.
        All TOE1 is not combat ready on this basis?
        1. +2
          10 July 2018 16: 49
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          Well, from this point of view, the fact that the armored detachment of the first TOE, which crawled 13-14 knots against the contract 18, is also called not combat ready :))

          There the reasons are not technical, but tactical. Not worth it harness a horse and a trembling doe to one cart. smile
        2. +2
          10 July 2018 17: 07
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          Well, from this point of view, the fact that the armored detachment of the first TOE, which crawled 13-14 knots against the contract 18, is also called not combat ready :))

          I did not know that Sevastopol had a contract speed of 18 knots
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          But to call a cruiser, which instead of the contract 23 knots, produces only 20, is a bust.

          The Varangian did not give out 20 knots, since at 20 knots the condition of the boilers and machines either gave an accident or threatened with an immediate accident
        3. 0
          12 July 2018 01: 21
          "Varangian" was to become a scout at the squadron. And the Japanese squadron speed ~ 18 knots. So, with its 17 ~ 18 nodes, the "Varangian" could not fulfill the duties prescribed to him. Those. was sky-ready just like a reconnaissance cruiser.
          You, DimerVladimer rightly pointed out to Andrey his mistake about combat readiness "Varyag", but they themselves made a similar mistake by replacing the concepts "combat readiness" и "combat readiness". hi
          1. +1
            12 July 2018 16: 09
            Quote: pacific
            You, DimerVladimer quite rightly pointed out to Andrey his mistake regarding the Varyag’s combat readiness, but you yourself made a similar mistake by substituting the concepts of “fighting readiness” and “combat readiness”


            Thank you for your comment, I am aware of the difference in these terms.
  10. +4
    10 July 2018 15: 29
    The article is excellent - thanks! But I’ll still put in my 5 cents:
    The statement of work on the mechanisms, compiled by 28 February, included:
    1. Inspection and repair of all bearings - 21 day;
    2. Bulkhead spool drives and spools and checking them - 21 day;
    3. Inspection of cylinder pistons and checking their movement - 14 days;
    4. Leaching of refrigerators, replacing pipes with new ones, packing glands and hydraulic testing - 40 days;
    5. Replacing the overhead valves of boilers and bottom-blowing valves - 68 days.

    What’s interesting to me is who made up their statements there? Revision of ALL (!!!) bearings - 21 days; CPG audit + attachment / centering (ALL !!!) of the machines - 14 days, I’m silent about the refrigerators - but the Top-Bottom valve for more than 2 months (!!!!). Are they getting into the dock to replace valves ?? Boilers lifted from the foundations? Did bulkheads cut?
    1. +3
      10 July 2018 23: 12
      Quote: alsoclean
      5. Replacing the overhead valves of boilers and bottom-blowing valves - 68 days.

      And I’m even more interested in how they were going to purge Nikloss’s boilers. As far as I understood before, he (Nikloss) has no purge.
      1. 0
        11 July 2018 00: 17
        it turned out to be.
        but disassembling the tubes is more effective - the tubes are in parallel turned on, if the tube is heavily clogged with scale, it will not be cleaned
        besides, how do you clean the ducts to which the tubes are connected, clean without purging?
        1. +2
          12 July 2018 00: 15
          As far as I remember for water tube boilers, purging is a daily procedure. A cleaning, mechanical and alkali, at least after 500 hours of operation. But with N.'s boilers this is not clear. They are poorly blown and, in addition, they don’t really like the high salinity of the water (and the Varyag’s refrigerator is always flowing).

          Perhaps N. boilers objectively needed to be disassembled more often. Although at first it was not considered a disadvantage. But the complexity of the service they seem to be much higher than that of the same Belleville.
          1. 0
            12 July 2018 07: 29
            Perhaps N. boilers objectively needed to be disassembled more often. Although at first it was not considered a disadvantage. But the complexity of the service they seem to be much higher than that of the same Belleville.


            Especially when you consider that they were created as "labor-saving: to simplify the replacement of pipes" --- in theory, the pipe was replaced easily, on the one hand (other boilers required the pipe to be unfastened on both sides).
            So, for this completely mythical property (because in fact the replacement of the tubes was also no easier), I had to immediately pay much more frequent extraction of the tubes for almost daily maintenance.

            In general, I don’t understand why here to rest against the horns and discuss: the Nikloss boilers proved disgusting in all fleets, and were forgotten as a nightmare by everyone. It is surprising that someone used to use them at all, because all the flaws are obvious.
            And there is nothing to argue about at all.
            1. +2
              12 July 2018 09: 16
              Nikloss’s cauldrons proved disgusting in all fleets, and were forgotten as a nightmare by all.

              Not a refutation, but a clarification for: the Franks sculpted them even on their first dreadnoughts (Courbet), but ... what to take from them, Monsieur knows a lot about perversions. lol
              1. 0
                12 July 2018 22: 05
                Not a refutation, but a clarification for: the Franks sculpted them even on their first dreadnoughts (Courbet), but ... what to take from them, Monsieur knows a lot about perversions.


                Nikloss’s initial business success in itself is quite surprising to me. The reasons for this success are clearly not in the merits of the boilers --- the man was clearly a very good seller.
                (That is, he skillfully used "non-market methods of sales promotion", IMHO)
            2. 0
              12 July 2018 20: 07
              It's not about the merits of Nikloss's boilers, but about the influence of the choice of these particular boilers on the combat effectiveness of a particular ship, the Varyag. For example, I did not see problems because of the choice of boilers N. Yes, labor-intensive in maintenance, but there is no information about the boilers decommissioned. Here, on the contrary, high maintainability even outside the base in the presence of spare pipes. I see no reason to consider boilers as a bottleneck.
              1. 0
                12 July 2018 22: 09
                And it’s not you writing about “quickly, efficiently and inexpensively - choose any two”?
                Well, the Russians wanted to choose all three - but it doesn’t. That's all.
  11. +1
    10 July 2018 15: 54
    Nothing like this happened with the other ships that came to replenish our Pacific forces.


    It’s strange - almost half of the destroyers under repair on the eve of the war, more or less only destroyers built abroad.

    Nothing that the armored squad of the first Pacific squadron, went at a speed of 13-14 knots - in battle instead of 16-18 ... that is, nothing happened at all? Bearings on other ships were not heated at all, and they were not regularly sent for repairs?
    Here you have the extreme Andrey.
    This is contrary to the spirit of the fleet - if the ship is not at sea - it is under repair! :))
    1. +2
      10 July 2018 16: 48
      Quote: DimerVladimer
      Nothing that the armored detachment of the first Pacific squadron, went at a speed of 13-14 knots - in battle instead of 16-18 ...

      The detachment moves at the speed of the slowest ship, minus a couple more nodes. And in the armored detachment 1 of the TOE there were just three low-speed ships (Poltava, Petropavlovsk, Sevastopol), which, even during testing, yielded about 16 knots (and Seva - generally 15,3). So for them, 14 squadron units are in order.
      True, it turned out that the same “Relight” and “Victory”, with their 18,5 knots of maximum and 15,5-16 knots of long stroke, were forced to crawl at the speed of this trinity when placed in a line. sad
      1. +2
        10 July 2018 17: 12
        Quote: Alexey RA
        The detachment moves at the speed of the slowest ship, minus a couple more nodes. And in the armored detachment 1 of the TOE there were just three low-speed ships (Poltava, Petropavlovsk, Sevastopol), which, even during testing, yielded about 16 knots (and Seva - generally 15,3). So for them, 14 squadron units are in order.
        True, it turned out that the same “Relight” and “Victory”, with their 18,5 knots of maximum and 15,5-16 knots of long stroke, were forced to crawl at the speed of this trinity when placed in a line.


        Definitely Alexey.
        But 2-3 knots minus the contract speed is: fouling of the bottom, deterioration of cars, quality of coal.
        Overheating of bearings is not only a disease of the steam fleet - it is still the problem of all ships, without exception - despite a completely different level of construction and fitting of bearings.
        And in those days there was no centralized lubrication - the beginnings of drip lubrication, local grease nipples, or manually (!) Irrigation of eccentric or crank bearings - thats also acrobatics.
        Heating of central bearings at high speeds - is regularly happening now, despite the tricks in laser alignment (alignment) of bearings and the use of centralized lubrication.

        On the example of a steam engine of Liberty steamboats.
        1. +1
          11 July 2018 00: 52
          Quote: DimerVladimer
          And in those days there was no centralized lubrication - the beginnings of drip lubrication, local grease nipples, or manually (!) Irrigation of eccentric or crank bearings - thats also acrobatics.
          Melnikov wrote about this in the first edition of the book in 1975. To lubricate the mechanisms, vegetable rather than mineral oil was used, mainly coarse (rapeseed) oil. In the old days, raw rapeseed oil, which had a pronounced mustard taste and was therefore unsuitable for food, was used for lighting, and then, with the spread of steam engines, it was widely used as a lubricant because it adhered well to metal parts and was not washed off with water and steam. Agree that it is not compatible with a centralized lubrication system under pressure. Mineral oils were just trying to apply.
          1. +1
            11 July 2018 08: 57
            Quote: Amurets
            Melnikov wrote about this in the first edition of the book in 1975. To lubricate the mechanisms, vegetable rather than mineral oil was used, mainly coarse (rapeseed) oil. In the old days, raw rapeseed oil, which had a pronounced mustard taste and was therefore unsuitable for food, was used for lighting, and then, with the spread of steam engines, it was widely used as a lubricant because it adhered well to metal parts and was not washed off with water and steam. Agree that it is not compatible with a centralized lubrication system under pressure. Mineral oils were just trying to apply.


            Totally agree.
            The metal quality of the large diameter bearings of those times left much to be desired, at high speeds, plastic deformation began at the slightest misalignment.
            And the appearance of mineral oil, simply reduced the cost of the product.
            For example, in bulldozers such as Catrpillar D7H D8 D9, the central gear is lubricated by the drip method - in fact, this is a tube above the gearing from which oil drips onto friction pairs - primitively, but efficiently. Mineral oil is prone to coking when heated and sometimes clogs these tubes, it is worth the machine operators to “miss” the level or skip the regular replacement, as these tubes become clogged and an expensive transmission fails.
            And as a rule - as long as the equipment is serviced by professionals - everything works great. As soon as the warranty period has ended, many stop servicing at the official - they "look through" the rules for changing the oil, pour cheaper oil and begin to "pour in" mechanisms whose resource is many times higher.
            So I completely admit that the human factor has a place to be in the case of the Varangian.
            1. +1
              11 July 2018 10: 55
              Quote: DimerVladimer
              The metal quality of the large diameter bearings of those times left much to be desired, at high speeds, plastic deformation began at the slightest misalignment.

              At that time, they were not yet able to perform centrifugal casting of large-diameter plain bearings, but I’m not talking about the alignment of bearings, the laying and alignment of shafts. In my practice, there was a case when the pockets of refrigerators were not correctly selected and the oil distribution grooves were incorrectly cut and the bearings stood nothing at all. And about warranty service, I'm not talking. For some reason, it is believed that repairs themselves are cheaper than then calculating losses from damage. So the human factor is necessarily present here.
  12. +1
    10 July 2018 16: 37
    I believe that so much time and research was given to the Varangian that more negative was accumulated on him than positive.
    Starting from construction:

    The management of the joint stock company considered the order for Russia as prestigious and for advertising purposes tried to build a cruiser faster and better than competitors. Therefore, work at the shipyard began on October 24, 1898, when the first batch of metal for ship structures arrived in Kiel from the steel mill in Essen, that is, before the detailed drawings were approved by the customer. The marine agent in Germany, Lieutenant A.K. Polis, informed the General Naval Headquarters that by November 1, the cruiser’s keel was already ready for the entire length, 1/3 of the frames were set up and assembly of the foundations of the machines started. Meanwhile, the MTK found many drawbacks in the drawings sent the month before, and there were no calculations of strength and stability in the project.

    And what is this cruiser? - handsome Askold with whom, too, when designing was not okay ...
    Maybe something in the MTK was not okay?

    It turned out that in the project, in comparison with the outline drawing, the number of transverse watertight bulkheads was reduced from 16 to 12 and the double bottom remained only in the engine rooms and boiler rooms. The double bottom was restored along the entire length of the ship, but the number of bulkheads was no longer possible to increase - would have had to re-plan all the interior spaces. Here, the MTK had to give in, but the committee nevertheless took revenge on a number of points; after stubborn resistance, the company agreed to onboard cheekbones, longitudinal bulkheads under the armored deck throughout the engine rooms and boiler rooms, the dispersal of 152-mm side guns, thickening of decks in some places, and a number of others. The Maritime Ministry had to pay an additional fee for the use of steel-nickel Krupp armor, as this was not included in the contract on time.

    Ay Ay - Askold’s story as with ... Varangian - it’s not smart producers who are to blame for not being able to draw up contracts?
    Further tests:
    1. +1
      10 July 2018 16: 50
      Tests cr. Askold
      Due to a malfunction of the feed pumps, it was not possible to raise the steam pressure above 14 atm, nevertheless, the cruiser reached a speed of 18.25 knots, which was not so bad for the first exit. The members of the observing commission drew attention to the strong vibration. At their request, work began to reinforce the bridge, although the engineers of the company considered the vibration not to go beyond the limits inherent in high-speed ships. On May 23, the cruiser again went to factory tests, on which they hoped to achieve contract speed. But the cars worked with a knock, the vibration intensified. I had to sort out the bearings and make a thorough inspection of the mechanisms. (Come on!) The next time, on June 9, the cars worked much better and the cruiser made its first passage along the Kiel Canal to Hamburg for docking and back to Kiel around the Jutland Peninsula. July 24, the selection committee officially began its work. Shooting from 152 mm guns revealed insufficient structural strength of bridges, cuttings, and superstructures that were damaged.
      September 6 Askold went on official trials for the Danzig measured mile. The plant provided for testing selected fresh Cardiff coal and the most experienced stokers ....
      http://oruzhie.info/voennie-korabli/873-askold-br
      onepalubnyj-krejser

      Further on operation:
      During operation, the "ease of construction" made itself felt by vibration and, as they said then, by the fact that the body "breathed" at high speed. In 1903, two flora burst in the stern and had to carry out additional reinforcements.
      Here it is nonsense - they also lightened the hull!
      But the design and workmanship of the mechanical installation of the cruiser were beyond praise. Boilers and machines have proven reliable and very economical.

      This is how Askold, for the better, differed from the Varangian - by boilers.

      Conclusion - you will not try - you will not know.
      Everything new is roulette. On one cruiser (Askold) the boilers turned out to be better, on the other (Varyag) significantly worse.
      1. 0
        10 July 2018 21: 25
        they shot on Askold much better, both in exercises and in battle.
        Do boilers seem to have nothing to do with this?
        1. +1
          11 July 2018 08: 58
          So if they shot better, so maybe the machine crew was better?
      2. +1
        10 July 2018 21: 35
        "On one cruiser (Askold) the boilers turned out to be better, on the other (Varyag (turned out to be worse"), but how then can it be explained that the Japanese did not change the boilers after raising the Varyag and they did not mourn them?
  13. +3
    10 July 2018 17: 27
    In addition to Peresvet, mine loaders Amur and Yenisei also came - their cars and boilers also worked perfectly and did not require repairs.

    And which of these ships could give at least 20 knots? They can not be compared on ship engines in principle.

    Is it possible to voice the repair time that was given to their cars before the war? What would be something to compare.
    Well, at least for cruisers with similar speed data?
    While the picture is emerging that it is bad with both boilers and cars, moreover, after the first sorting of cars in P-Arthur, it was recognized that the fault was the incompetence of the port staff ...
    At the end of June, apparently desperate in the success of the Varyag repair, Admiral E.I. Alekseev sends a lengthy report to the head of the Ministry of the Sea with a statement of all Varyag’s misfortunes and a message about the failure of the first bulkhead of the mechanisms by the port’s workshops, for which the cruiser's top speed decreased to 2 knots.
    According to the flagship mechanical engineer A. A. Lukyanov, who arrived at the Retvizan, the reason for the heating of the bearings was inattentive testing, fitting and assembly of machine parts. The representative of the Nevsky Plant, engineer I. I. Gippius, who led the assembly of destroyers delivered from St. Petersburg in Port Arthur, also agreed with this opinion.
  14. +1
    10 July 2018 18: 45
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    Quote: Avior
    And I approve of the fact that he reacts to constructive comments.

    hi Frankly, it’s difficult :))) When you write one thing, and you are rightly pointed out your mistakes, and you understand the whole depth of your errors :))))) But this makes the author smarter, which cannot but rejoice - first of all the author himself, of course :)

    It’s wonderful when the author admits his mistakes, otherwise he could say: “it’s so visible from my bell tower”.
  15. +1
    10 July 2018 21: 55
    The more I read about the Varangian, or the more I want to say: it was Satan himself who did not want him to serve Russia. But I was taught at school that behind all hardships should be "someone's hands": villains, hand-crafted mechanics, and so on. And here, apparently, a set of reasons
    1. 0
      13 July 2018 09: 04
      I hold the same opinion, this is a complex of reasons embodied in the public administration system. There are no villains and crank mechanics, had the armored Bayan or the Askold armored deck with even more decisive and dashing commanders replaced the situation, the situation would have changed minimally, and the difference is only in the number of newly acquired holes on the Asama.
      Problems in the mechanical part of the cruiser and its low driving performance are certainly not very good, but their impact on the outcome of this particular battle is minimal, one cruiser against the detachment will not survive for long - this is the time, and the second is the “armed reserve” in which the 1 TOE ships were constantly unlikely to have a beneficial effect on the training of the crew, both artillery service staff and machine crew. Luzhol’s micrometers instead of normal rangefinders and Perepelkin’s sights can also be attributed to them, by the way “Varyag” was one of the first to receive them in the RIF, although judging by the 1903 firing and the Chemulpo battle, they were either not installed on the guns or could not be used. .
  16. +4
    10 July 2018 23: 31
    commander of the cruiser V.I. Baer was forced to leave the ship entrusted to him for a very long repair in Cherbourg - they sorted out mechanisms, opened the cylinders of the main machines. The team was supposed to handle this in two weeks, but finished in 11 days,

    Well, what Russian commander, in his right mind, would refuse a two-week repair in France? :)

    From December 26 - a week at sea, on February 2 they came to Hong Kong and again got up for a week, doing a complete overhaul of the mechanisms. By this time, the number of replaced tubes in boilers and refrigerators has already reached 1!

    "Replaced" is it precisely the new ones inserted or rearranged from the top row to the bottom as Nickloss recommends this? If the second is maintenance.

    And if the first then where did they get so many pipes? As far as I remember, in one boiler N. there are about 300 pipes. They carried 5 boilers in reserve? Again, as I recall, the period between maintenance for thin-tube boilers is about 500-700 hours. This is approximately 20 days of work. Not so much for a hike.

    In general, there is a feeling that many of the work with mechanisms listed by a respected author should not take place under the repair item, but under the item scheduled maintenance of the mechanisms. Although in some cases, such as in the Red Sea, probably unscheduled maintenance was already required due to a malfunction that was not eliminated on time.
    1. +1
      11 July 2018 00: 20
      in boilers and refrigerators are very different tubes, and the information is given in bulk ....
      1. +1
        11 July 2018 01: 01
        Well .. in a crowd here everything is given at all, for example, all the repeatedly mentioned bulkheads of bearings and machines are an obvious MOT.
        1. +2
          11 July 2018 09: 30
          Quote: Saxahorse
          Well .. in a crowd here everything is given at all, for example, all the repeatedly mentioned bulkheads of bearings and machines are an obvious MOT.


          Maybe you're right.
          Usually disassembling machines and checking / reassembling bearings is almost a routine procedure at every opportunity - entering the port.

          Moreover, all that can be done by a machine team - replacing bearings in those days was not considered something outstanding - their stock was constantly on ships - almost an expendable material.
          The fact that this is not written about Askold or another cruiser of those times - this means little research has been done on this issue.
          In general, the babbit bearings of that time depended strongly on the rotation speed (of course, on alignment).

          If, at high speeds of the machine, the oil layer could no longer cope with the task of separating the rubbing pairs, as evidenced by an increase in the temperature of the bearing, it is possible to adjust the bearing and in a specific design.
  17. 0
    11 July 2018 17: 23
    Quote: Comrade
    Maybe this is subjective, but it seems to me that Kolya Passerby is more adequate than Jura27.
    I will never forget how Jura27 argued that “Retvisan”, until it arrives at any Russian port, cannot be considered to have entered into service. The logic is simple - because they could sink it along the road.

    Well, tell me how you will be at war with the newly-launched Retvisan if you need to. Germany has declared war and its squadron is approaching Kronstadt, and the Retwisan is located in Philadelphia?
    1. +1
      12 July 2018 09: 21
      Eghm ... while the Germans are scooping up from the Kronstadt coastal batteries, the Retwisan may have a little frolic on the Atlantic lines. Then go to Arkhangelsk or to the Far East (simultaneously crushing the German colonies) or generally anywhere, say, to allied France.
      1. 0
        12 July 2018 12: 10
        It’s more likely that ancient battery guns will be raked from German armadillos.
        He can frolic, only this will not help in any way to protect St. Petersburg and Kronstadt, as well as the location of the EDB in Arkhangelsk or France.
        And which ones exactly, the German colonies “along the way” will get to “Retvisan”?
        1. +1
          12 July 2018 15: 54
          It’s more likely that ancient battery guns will be raked from German armadillos.

          In 1901 year? Jura, God be with you, the then German GK is only good for scaring fish. all the more so because the Brandenburgs at that time still at the Chinese station (like)
          And which ones exactly, the German colonies “along the way” will get to “Retvisan”?

          Well, since he is in the Atlantic, then coming in modern Namibia and Togo.
          In addition, the Franco-Russian alliance was not given anywhere, so your example is purely speculative interest.
          1. 0
            12 July 2018 16: 26
            Frightening fish is about the guns of the Kronstadt forts in 1901. About the Brandenburg at the Chinese station - can I read more?
            Are you sure that Namibia is on its way to Arkhangelsk from Philadelphia? Look at the globe - they say it helps some.
            Do you still hint that “Retvisan” in Philadelphia can repel German or English ships in an attack on Kronstadt / St. Petersburg? Or didn’t I understand you correctly and this can’t be done, despite the Retwisan coming into operation?
            1. 0
              13 July 2018 15: 19
              Frightening fish is about the guns of the Kronstadt forts in the 1901 year.

              Blessed is he who believes.
              About the Brandenburg at the Chinese station - can I read more?

              Alas - no details. Once I read that during a boxing uprising they were thrown to China and they were there for some time.
              Are you sure that Namibia is on its way to Arkhangelsk from Philadelphia? Look at the globe - they say it helps some.

              Colleague, you will not believe, but the ships are not tied to rails. And if something unforeseen happened, they could very well take a different route. And in wartime ...
              You are still hinting

              I specifically tell you that Germany attacked Russia in the 1901 year, this is a very thin owl, stretched over a very bold globe.
              You can repel German or English ships when attacking Kronstadt / St. Petersburg

              Uh ... the war will be limited only to this theater, and in the rest there will be "peace in men and goodwill in the air"?
              on the commissioned Retvizan

              Colleague, I don’t remember all the details of that online battle, but if you really think that a ship just needs to go to its port to enter service, this is obviously not the case. See the story about the purchase of our cruisers in America.
              1. 0
                13 July 2018 17: 06
                Only you believe, I just know.
                Details: Brandenburgs in Germany from 11.08.1901/1902/XNUMX, Retvisan was ready to go to Kronstadt at the end of April XNUMX.
                Ships can go on any route they want, but Namibia is not on the way to Arkhangelsk, and so much so that the coal at Retvisan can run out of steam before it reaches it, defeats the colony and reaches the port with coal.
                You simply confuse the EDB with the Kyrgyz Republic, the latter can be anywhere, because there is no benefit from them in countering the EDB.
                In the same way, there is no benefit from an EDB located in Philadelphia in a battle with an enemy EDB at Kronstadt, St. Petersburg or Port Arthur. The opposite can be said only by inadequate comrades of a certain kind, in which you want to get into quickly.
                1. +1
                  13 July 2018 17: 43
                  I just know.

                  What Germany was ready to start a war in 1901-02? Oh well.
                  that the Retvisan coal may run out before it reaches it, defeats the colony and reaches the port with coal.

                  I won’t know how Rozhestvensky reached Tsushima ...
                  You simply confuse the EDB with the Kyrgyz Republic, the latter can be anywhere, because there is no benefit from them in countering the EDB.

                  Of course, of course, a cruiser with a range of 4000 miles is possible, but an armadillo with 5000 is not at all. Although, of course, such a need would not have arisen. In the event of a war with Germany, the Franks would have been well visited there. But purely theoretically, would purcua not be pa?
                  there is no benefit from an EDB located in Philadelphia in a battle with an enemy EDB at Kronstadt

                  I never said that it would be useful specifically in this place :))
                  I said that if there is a war, then it goes everywhere, and not only in Kronstadt and any warship can find work. And the confrontation with the Germans in any situation will be decided on land.
                  The opposite can be said only by inadequate comrades of a certain kind, in which you want to get into quickly.

                  Do not hope, I will not join you. stop
                  1. 0
                    14 July 2018 15: 08
                    [/ quote] I never said that it would be useful specifically in this place :)) [quote]


                    Really came from ... the eleventh time? And at the end of the comment they said that do not join me, but it turns out they joined.
                    1. 0
                      14 July 2018 18: 38
                      Am I to you? fool
                      Artem is right ... Yes
  18. 0
    11 July 2018 17: 26
    Quote: Comrade
    Yura27 knows EVERYTHING!
    And to you, Andrei, he is clearly not indifferent. He feels such personal dislike that he cannot eat.

    How did you define this? Telepath?
  19. +1
    12 July 2018 00: 47
    In the early 2000s, I had an adventure: I had to repair the generator twice a week on a leased Ford minivan. Later it turned out that the manufacturer’s warranty for it is 3 years. The first failure occurred exactly after 3 years of operation. Day to day.
    Maybe Crump gave warranty periods for boilers and Varyag cars? And we do not know and indiscriminately hay "honest" entrepreneur?
    And a small remark on the passage of the "Varangian" across the Atlantic: in a dry cargo ship, we reached Guadeloupe and Ouessant in 20 days. To Cherbourg another + 12-16 hours. The cars were spinning in a 10-junction quiet water passage. It turns out that the average speed of the "Varyag" at the transition was about 8 knots?
  20. +2
    12 July 2018 14: 45
    As always, I read with great interest, but in this case there were certain doubts about the reliability of the material. Arguing to argue with a respected author I lack knowledge, but I’ll bring in my 5 cents.
    It follows from the text of the article that the Varyag steam ship required maintenance and repair costs at the level of a jet plane, which in my opinion should have definitely ended in a trial with the Kramp shipyard and the ship was returned to the manufacturer. Since this did not happen, and none of the many who wrote on this topic have published documents evidencing at least a discussion of this possibility, the conclusion suggests itself -
    either the sailors did not consider the "Varyag" to be poorly built, or they were completely sure that in the court, Crump would prove that the defects were caused not by the quality of the building, but by errors in ordering and / or improper operation. It seems to me that to close this topic it is now necessary at least to conduct a study of the same depth on the power plant of the battleship "Retvisan" and on any of the cruisers of the same era with Belleville boilers in order to obtain comparative information at least about the volume of maintenance. How then to establish an important level of professionalism of the machine team I do not know.
  21. 0
    14 July 2018 19: 59
    I will allow myself to show some impudence and draw a certain conclusion based on the materials of the article and discussions.

    Despite the abundance of interesting material, it is impossible to make an unambiguous decision regarding the accident rate of the Varyag cruiser mechanisms. The problem is the lack of any intelligible separation in this article between planned maintenance work on mechanisms and the same emergency work. Also, there is no clear description of the breakdowns and failures of vehicles and boilers of the ship.

    The author should have broken the time for servicing the Varyag mechanisms for a certain period, for example, 3-6 months, and compared it with the same works for other RI ships. It was also necessary to make a separate list of all real malfunctions and also compare their number with the number of failures on other ships of the fleet. By malfunction, I mean specific failures with replacement, such as replacing a burst tube, replacing a valve, reloading a bearing, and the like, real failures.

    In fact, the article obtained a consistent listing of all the work with the Varyag mechanisms without dividing them into the usual scheduled maintenance and emergency work related precisely to the shortcomings of the Varyag mechanisms. From here it is impossible to draw any conclusions about the reliability of Varyag machines.

    . Unfortunately, it is impossible to draw any conclusions useful for evaluating the battle of interest at Chemulpo from this article.

    Of course, this is solely my personal opinion. IMHO.
    1. 0
      17 July 2018 14: 00
      For a period of several months, sampling is useless. You can try for a campaign, but there are also nuances, there may be a different state at the beginning of the campaign. The most correct option is to take the entire period of operation and compare the mileage with the amount of work.
      1. 0
        17 July 2018 21: 49
        I had in mind several periods. To compare how many hours in 3 months. there were running, how many repair and how much was standing in reserve for example.
  22. 0
    15 July 2018 00: 12
    Many thanks to the author for this particular series of articles. I, as a child, heard "Upstairs you comrades ..." and watched a movie, so I still listen to this song. There is an interesting book of Doynikov "Varyag" in three parts. Here, just today I finished re-reading. This literature is fiction, but for lovers of alternative history it will certainly be interesting. I would like to know, Andrei, your opinion on this book. Not even in terms of her artistic merit, but rather in technical, combat simulation. Unless, of course, you consider it necessary to read it.

    With respect and hope for a speedy continuation of the cycle!

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