Military Review

The Last Days of the Soviet Union. Democracy instead of totalitarianism. 1 part

189



Probably, the countdown of the last days of the Soviet government can begin with the 1988 year, namely with the changes made to the control system of the USSR, and attempts to smooth transition from the totalitarian control system to the democratic one. In several articles we will tell about this failed attempt. Let's start with the main tool - the Congress of People's Deputies of the USSR or, more simply, the parliament.

The opening of the congress was preceded by the circumstances that determined the course of the state’s internal policy at that time. The initiative for the congress came from the leader of the Communist Party, MS Gorbachev, who in 1987 – 1988 chose democratization as one of the main styles of his leadership. The main element of democratization was to become a new legislative body of power - the Congress of People's Deputies of the USSR. The idea of ​​MS Gorbachev was to make the most smooth transition from the previous political system, in which the CPSU had an absolute monopoly on power in the country, to a new, and, as he thought, more democratic system of government.

Note that the goal of MS Gorbachev and those who worked with him to develop this scheme were fairly simple-minded and obvious: to create a national discussion platform in the form of a congress of people's deputies, which by its gigantism is unable to make consolidated decisions, but demonstrating democracy and pluralism of opinions. A carefully selected and consolidated by an obvious party majority of deputies (as it seemed to Gorbachev), and therefore a more controlled Supreme Council elected at the congress, will start pursuing a policy proposed by him, Gorbachev, without direct appeal to bureaucratic party structures.

In addition, the need to convene a congress was determined by the situation that had developed in the country by that time. By this time in the USSR for almost four years there was a "restructuring", which began in April 1985. The successes achieved in its course were mainly foreign policy. The situation inside the country was almost catastrophic:

- stagnation in economic development;
- lack of budget funds;
- empty store shelves, queues and coupons entered on industrial and food products.

In addition, there was a sharp drop in world oil prices, to 18,2 dollars per barrel, which put the country on the brink of hunger. It is not by chance that one of the delegates to the congress, Olympic champion, legendary weightlifter and writer Yu.P. Vlasov said in his speech: “People are fed up with promises of a better life and are resolutely demanding change.”

From the newspaper "Pravda"


All delegates to the congress are elected people. First time in stories Soviet state had to pass elections based on a free and alternative basis. Out of the total number of 2250 deputies, 1500 deputies were elected directly by the population in constituencies:

- 750 deputies were elected in territorial districts on the basis of equal suffrage;
- 750 deputies were elected in national-territorial districts and also on the basis of equal suffrage (by 32 from each union republic, by 11 from each autonomous republic, by 5 - from each autonomous region and by 1 - from each autonomous region);
- The remaining 750 deputies nominated from their ranks the CPSU, the Komsomol, the unions of writers, composers, cinematographers, etc., the USSR Academy of Sciences, trade unions, veterans and women’s associations. The 100 deputies directly represented the “social organization” at the head of the country - the Communist Party of the Soviet Union. Also on the 100 deputies nominated by trade unions and cooperative organizations, and on 75 - the rest of the above organizations.

Thus, the majority (66,0% of deputies) was elected democratically to the congress.

The congress of people's deputies received very broad powers, including the adoption of the USSR Constitution and the introduction of amendments to it, the election of about five hundred people from the congress deputies to the USSR Supreme Soviet.

In a country with a one-party leadership system, this was a significant event: for the first time in the history of the state, elections were announced to which not only selected representatives of the Communist Party and not only representatives of other organizations and associations, but also respected people of the country, nominated by the people themselves, were admitted.



The election campaign was very acute and at the same time quite unusual for a Soviet voter who was used to a different electoral system, involving him in real political activity. The unfolded pre-election struggle took even unexpected forms at the time: a wave of televised debates swept the country, numerous rallies were constantly held, and real public opinion polls began to be held. Describing the atmosphere prior to the congress, American journalist David Remnick wrote: “People who were given the right of political choice for the first time, behaved both confusedly and lively. Previously, they had no experience of participating in real debates, real elections - and immediately jumped at the opportunity. ”

The main goal of the congress was to develop a program for the modernization of the socio-economic and political life of the country. The meetings discussed projects of the state structure in the future, considered new principles of organization of political power, as well as prospects for economic development.

From the first minutes of its work, the congress opened was the scene of a sharp political struggle that flared up between representatives of the various groups present at it. Thousands of calls and telegrams, which were regularly read from the podium, were sent to the congress and individual deputies every day, and rallies boiled on the streets of the evening and night. In Moscow, Pushkin Square, the House of Cinema and Luzhniki became the centers of the rally polemic. Future famous politicians stood out among the street stands: V.I. Novodvorskaya, V.V. Zhirinovsky, V.V. Igrunov, A.K. Isaev.

The whole country froze at televisions, radios, fearing to miss at least a minute of live broadcast of meetings. People walking along the street with compact transistor receivers attached to their ears did not arouse the slightest surprise of passersby. It was clear to everyone: the person is listening to the congress.

Academician A.D. Sakharov


One of the most significant participants of the congress, Academician Andrei Dmitrievich Sakharov, managed to read the draft “Decree on Power”, which suggested:

- the abolition of the sixth article of the constitution, which defines the leading and guiding role of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union;
- to transfer officially the power in the country to the Soviets;
- make all elections competitive, and all key officials elected at the congress and accountable to it;
- the transition to a professional army and a new federation with the preservation of the former borders was determined as one of the important goals.

In his speech, A.D. Sakharov addressed all participants of the congress, as well as citizens of the whole country, with a direct appeal to support the “Decree”.

Also important was the issue of the sovereignty of the republics and territories belonging to the Soviet Union. The proposals received from the deputies of the Baltic republics were based on the articles on sovereignty included in the constitutions of these republics. The basis for the speeches of the representatives of the “people's fronts” of Latvia and Estonia, the Lithuanian “Sajudis” was the requirement to restore real sovereignty. In their appeal, it was stated: “We proceed from the fact that the Allied republics are primary and the Federation is a derivative. Only the republics can transfer to the Union or regain certain powers, and not vice versa. For the republics have created a union. ” Such statements were dictated by the requirement to consolidate in the ownership of the republics all union property located in their territories, including the subsoil, and to enact laws adopted within the framework of the Soviet Union only by ratifying them in the parliaments of the republics.

All this soon led to the emergence of demands for sovereignty already and autonomies and, accordingly, about the redistribution of existing borders, beyond which conflicts in Nagorno-Karabakh, Abkhazia, and the Fergana Valley began to erupt and flare up.

Another issue that has become important among all those discussed is the question of the further development of the country's economy. And above all, about the emerged, which has already become apparent, the contradiction between the state and the market economy.

M.S. Gorbachev and N.I. Ryzhkov


Elected by this time the head of government N.I. Ryzhkov was the first to reveal the real facts of economic collapse to the deputies and the whole country:

- at the beginning of 1989, there was more than one hundred billion budget deficit in the country;
- outward foreign debt;
- complete lack of inventory and money for import.

As noted in his report, “negative trends” in the country's economy grew gradually over the last three five-year plans, while official statistics and Soviet propaganda deliberately lied, hiding the real truth about the situation that developed in the economy.

Proposals received from deputies for the further development of the economy were very different and at the same time contradictory. For example, G.Kh. As an alternative, Popov, the future mayor of Moscow, proposed to leave no more than 50% of the economy in the public sector, while the rest should be transferred to cooperative and private ownership. In turn, state property was proposed to "decentralize", creating corporations and concerns instead of bureaucratic departments. In a speech by world-class economist N.P. Shmelev sounded a terrible warning: “If we do not stop the growing, like a snowball, inflation, the collapse of the consumer market, the monstrous budget deficit in the world (relative to GDP), we may face an economic collapse within two to three years.”

In those days, no one yet understood that this would be the beginning of the end. On the contrary, everyone believed in the unique possibility of a smooth transition from a totalitarian system to democracy. 1-th Congress of People's Deputies was to be the first and, probably, the most important step towards the creation of a democratic instrument that was supposed to lead a huge country forward, to a brighter future, about which so much was said at that congress.

Today, it is already too late to look for the right and the guilty in one of the greatest events of the 20th century - the catastrophe of the USSR. Today it is necessary to know and remember that in those distant days when the country collapsed, neither politicians (and, moreover, ordinary people) did not understand and did not represent the consequences of their decisions.
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  1. Grandfather
    Grandfather 12 June 2018 05: 23
    +40
    say holiday today ... well, then without clinking glasses, for the Union. remember, mourn.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 12 June 2018 08: 04
      +7
      While I read the comments from the bottom up and the end of the article ---- this is how the tablet opens. How late is it to look for the guilty? Putin’s phrase about the guilt of the CPSU suggests a continuation. And determining the degree of guilt of everyone. Yes, it would be good about liability. How is Stalin ---- where is the money?
      I’ll read the article from the beginning!
    2. Ehanatone
      Ehanatone 13 June 2018 04: 00
      -1
      Remember ...
      The devils returned - wrong - didn’t go anywhere ...
      PS. This is about the article.
  2. apro
    apro 12 June 2018 05: 24
    +11
    The article is liberal nonsense. We wanted the best as always. Democracy elections liberal economy. Collapse in the country ....
    1. Basil50
      Basil50 12 June 2018 07: 33
      +10
      What happened when then we can observe as in a mirror on the example of Ukraine. So is the seizure of power through the intrigues and omnipotence of the KGB and of course with the support of American and European democracy. First, state property was given away to foreign countries, and then the country was torn apart.
      The coup d'etat took place under the leadership of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union and the KGB.
      This became possible when both the KGB and the police aimed to protect * law and order *. And what kind of * law and order * will depend on ..... So they then covered up the seizure of power and the coup.
      So the revelry of * brothers * armed and having * a roof * from * law enforcement officers * was far from accidental. The bandits distracted from the real distribution of wealth of the Soviet Union.
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 12 June 2018 08: 17
        +25
        I read another piece ---- there was no collapse of the economy! There was a lie and wrecking. !!!!! Specially escalated: "" there is nothing, how will we live? There is nothing.""
        Without citing figures --- the proof from the "contrary" is such. Almost 30 years have passed, and we all hear the phrase that ““ we are eating the Soviet inheritance. ”” So, we’ve been eating, eating and not eating for 30 years. And how could the whole material side end in the 90s? And if you recall how much was total stolen (development) by other capitalist countries .... fed the states
        1. Opera
          Opera 12 June 2018 22: 39
          +5
          Quote: apro
          The article is liberal nonsense. They wanted the best as always

          More than a billion-dollar budget deficit and prohibitive external debt with a complete lack of inventory and money is nonsense ?! It is true and everyone who remembers these years felt this on themselves. I didn’t even feel, but felt deeply! Nonsense so govern the country!
          Quote: Vasily50
          So the revelry of * brothers * armed and having * a roof * from * law enforcement officers * was far from accidental. The bandits distracted from the real distribution of wealth of the Soviet Union.

          Wow, what kind of people do we have? Dvvvva and here you are to blame! Liberal delirium and the roof of law enforcement !!! Aw, well done! Do you know that in those very years all law enforcement agencies were generally thrown by the state into a half-starved existence ?! And all these gangs rooted in the cooperative movement of the 80s and the control of thieves in law, who then began to gain strength! They were not in poverty in previous years of the USSR, and especially in the caressed national outskirts! But law enforcement agencies precisely in these years simply hesitated with various reorganizations! These half-starved employees of the operational structures (mainly) of various law enforcement agencies took a massive blow to organized crime! I do not know the exact statistics of law enforcement officers who died in the 90s! I remember the children of the dead with whom I served by name. We helped their wives and children from our already meager salaries. I remember the death toll which was named by the head of one of the departments at an operational meeting in the mid-90s, it seems 1994 - more than a thousand per year! I also remember the words of Alexander Gurov, who spoke about 24-25 battalions of dead law enforcement officers during the real criminal war of the 90s and about 5 divisions of wounded and crippled employees, most of which were not in Chechnya, but in other regions of the country! And I can also call such a figure I also remembered for those times, by the mid-90s in Moscow, 15 old people had been killed because of apartments! I think this gives an idea of ​​the "situation on the fronts!"
          And Yeltsin never really was any liberal! This figure did not bother with such complex political configurations! The environment was liberal! You can call it democratic, I don’t see a difference! Yeltsin needed only power! Personal power and the more the merrier! Any way!
        2. badens1111
          badens1111 13 June 2018 14: 05
          +2
          Quote: Reptiloid
          So, we’ve been eating, eating and not eating for 30 years. And how could the whole material side end in the 90s? And if you recall how much was total stolen (development) by other capitalist countries .... fed the states

          So it was
          https://picturehistory.livejournal.com/3441594.ht
          m
          And this period of time fiercely does not see the linger of the "empire" They can’t do better, they have made sociology show a completely different picture — they don’t need any market
          https://ru.sputnik.md/society/20161020/9516505/mo
          ldova-sssr-naselenie.html
          But a lover of bast shoes and fairy tales about the kissel rivers and banks of gingerbread, which describes horror just below, stubbornly persistently tells us his pretty already suffocated tales ..
          https://inosmi.ru/moldova/20110118/165752730.html Кому поверим?
  3. Olgovich
    Olgovich 12 June 2018 05: 31
    +10
    We perfectly remember the Congress of People's Deputies. And if millions of crowds of naive non-reflecting Muscovites of "democratic Russia" supported "democracy" and "democrats" from the national republics of the USSR, then the Russian suburbs looked with horror at WHAT they were doing. It was on this line that the elections of deputies in Moldova took place: FOR the preservation of the country (against nationalism) and AGAINST, and not along the line of "democratization" And the communist writers-leaders became ... nationalists. Member of the USSR Air Force Lari called to wash the streets of cities-Russian blood! . "They were opposed by fragmented interventions betrayed by the Communist Party. But Muscovites did not see anything and enthusiastically went to a disaster ......
    N.I. Ryzhkov first discovered the real facts of economic collapse to people's deputies and the whole country:
    - at the beginning of 1989, there was more than one hundred billion budget deficit in the country;
    - outward foreign debt;
    - complete lack of inventory and money for import.
    As noted in his report, “negative trends” in the country's economy have been growing gradually over the past three five-year periods.

    Complete failure and failure of the system ....
    1. Phil77
      Phil77 12 June 2018 06: 30
      +12
      Quote: Olgovich
      We perfectly remember the Congress of People's Deputies. And if millions of crowds of naive non-reflecting Muscovites of "democratic Russia" supported "democracy" and "democrats" from the national republics of the USSR, then the Russian suburbs looked with horror at WHAT they were doing. It was on this line that the elections of deputies in Moldova took place: FOR the preservation of the country (against nationalism) and AGAINST, and not along the line of "democratization" And the communist writers-leaders became ... nationalists. Member of the USSR Air Force Lari called to wash the streets of cities-Russian blood! . "They were opposed by fragmented interventions betrayed by the Communist Party. But Muscovites did not see anything and enthusiastically went to a disaster ......
      N.I. Ryzhkov first discovered the real facts of economic collapse to people's deputies and the whole country:
      - at the beginning of 1989, there was more than one hundred billion budget deficit in the country;
      - outward foreign debt;
      - complete lack of inventory and money for import.
      As noted in his report, “negative trends” in the country's economy have been growing gradually over the past three five-year periods.

      Complete failure and failure of the system ....

      Well now it’s clear who destroyed the country, not the traitors above, but the enthusiastic and naive Muscovites! Thank you opened our eyes! am
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich 12 June 2018 06: 46
        +4
        Quote: Phil77
        Well now it’s clear who destroyed the country, not the traitors at the top, but the enthusiastic and naive Muscovites!

        Without the millions of crowds of enthusiastic houses of Democratic Russia, shy away from Moscow squares, the traitors were worth nothing from above.
        Quote: Phil77
        Thank you opened our eyes!

        To your health! Yes
        1. Phil77
          Phil77 12 June 2018 07: 12
          +11
          There were no millions of crowds. There were thousands of people, I agree. Only do you think there were Muscovites there? Do you want buses bringing people to these rallies from the provinces? As for the stupid, I would not say that about the citizens of our country. and naive, remember that time!
          1. Boris55
            Boris55 12 June 2018 08: 08
            +9
            Quote: Phil77
            Millions of crowds were not observed

            Photo documents of those times indicate the opposite:
            1. badens1111
              badens1111 12 June 2018 08: 24
              +22
              Quote: Boris55
              Photo documents of those times indicate the opposite:

              Are you glad about this?
              And in this case, do not want to put a photo from any cemetery where the grave rows of graves result from the insanity of 91 years? And then 93? Then 1994. Forget what you dislike, showing what you like?
              You don’t want to face the truth, which is the simplest-highest echelon of power, coupled with a part of the intelligentsia and crime. Just handed over the country, the government used the entire state machine of propaganda, the intelligentsia yelled about the Gulag, crime cleared up their affairs in cooperatives. Recall what the law on cooperatives turned into? The right to free trade in foreign countries?
              Remind me?
              So just in case, for asphalt peasants, out of almost 25 thousand collective farms, -1 (ONE) percent was unprofitable.
              GDP growth per year, even at the end of 3%, what now?
              1. Boris55
                Boris55 12 June 2018 08: 32
                +1
                Quote: badens1111
                Are you glad about this?

                Not. I am not happy about this, and yet I first voted for Yeltsin, not because he was “nice” to me, but because I got the CPSU.
                Remind me?

                Recall:
            2. Phil77
              Phil77 12 June 2018 08: 29
              +5
              Quote: Boris55
              Quote: Phil77
              Millions of crowds were not observed

              Photo documents of those times indicate the opposite:

              Boris! Once again I write that people brought buses to such rallies! Who? Think about who it was profitable for?! And they brought them from where? Decide for yourself!
              1. Boris55
                Boris55 12 June 2018 08: 44
                +1
                Quote: Phil77
                Once again I write that people brought buses to such meetings

                "Everyone, to the best of his understanding, works for himself, but to the best of his understanding, for the one who understands more."
                Willingly believe, but it does not matter. The picture was created. Conclusions about how we were used and how to prevent it in the future were not made by anyone (except BER), which means there is a high probability of using us again.
                1. Phil77
                  Phil77 12 June 2018 09: 14
                  +6
                  Well, this begs a simple thought, not to believe the authority that is trying to use us with you! hi
                  1. Boris55
                    Boris55 12 June 2018 09: 24
                    0
                    Quote: Phil77
                    Do not believe the power that is trying to use us with you!

                    This requires management knowledge that is freely available - this is DOTU (a fairly general theory of management), which must be taught at school and universities. If at the beginning of the last century there was an acute question with illiteracy, then at the beginning of this century the issue of universal MANAGEMENT literacy was equally acute.
                  2. Ruudi 34
                    Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 16: 42
                    0
                    Ahahah ... what are the criteria by which you determine that you are "not used." Your own feelings, I suppose?
                2. Ruudi 34
                  Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 16: 41
                  0
                  What does it mean to use? We have never been stopped "used" .. Power without some kind of "use of the people" is not Power ..
                  1. Boris55
                    Boris55 12 June 2018 18: 17
                    0
                    Quote: Rudi 34
                    What are the criteria by which you determine that you are "not used."

                    And the answer is:
                    Quote: Rudi 34
                    They never stopped using us.

                    As they say - no questions asked. laughing
                    1. Ruudi 34
                      Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 20: 20
                      0
                      A tax of 13% does your employer pay out of your miserable copecks, I suppose? Yes, and probably grumble on "again raised the price of gasoline .."? It’s not my fault that the word “use” is associated with “fuck sexually” ..
          2. Olgovich
            Olgovich 12 June 2018 08: 11
            +6
            Quote: Phil77
            Millions of crowds were not observed. The thousandth was

            February 4, 1990 Mr. even hit the Top world rallies
            Quote: Phil77
            As for the foolish, I would not say so about the citizens of our country with you. Rather deceived and naive,remember that timeI!

            Still not to remember: while the "deceived and naive" in Moscow fought for "democracy", already wise to rampant nationalism (the so-called "democracy") in the republics called, wrote to their Russian relatives, the authorities in Moscow, the Communist Party: " WHAT are you doing, uh? !! "
            The answer was simple: you don’t understand anything, it’s necessary!

            But exactly what was warned from the outskirts came true ...
            But if little has changed for the Russians, then for 26 million Russians cut off suburbs EVERYTHING has changed.
            And left them for today already 14 млн. Another 25 years and -all ...
            1. Phil77
              Phil77 12 June 2018 08: 17
              +14
              Well, you yourself think about 8-10 million people lived in Moscow then. And what every tenth rushed to the rally?!? Once again I assert the collapse occurred on the old square with the tacit approval of the Lubyanka! And even with the active participation!
            2. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 12 June 2018 09: 38
              +14
              27 years have passed since the collapse of the USSR and the Communists are not in power. But they all interfere with the Olegovites, all do not give normal life or work. And there is a suspicion that a hundred years later everything will be the same.
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 12 June 2018 11: 57
                +1
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                But they all interfere with the Olegovites, all do not give normal life or work.

                Well, what are you, dear Makar: they did not prevent me, thank God, from making money or living.
                "An advanced, 18 millionth detachment of hot hearts" self-liquidated in the blink of an eye .... request
                PS Fans of the Communist Party of the Communist Party had to live in Dushanbe, Bender, Dubossary, Baku, etc. at the end of the 80s and beginning of the 90s. etc., so that they personally saw the "triumph" and "insight" of its politics and admired it. Yes
                1. badens1111
                  badens1111 12 June 2018 12: 49
                  +7
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  to live in the late 80s and early 90s in Dushanbe, Bender, Dubossary, Baku, etc. etc., to see firsthand the "triumph" and "insight" of its policy

                  Your policy. Surnames yourself remember.
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 13 June 2018 06: 41
                    -1
                    Quote: badens1111
                    Your policy. Surnames yourself remember.

                    YOUR-kpssnoy.
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 13 June 2018 08: 38
                      +4
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      YOURS

                      Sobchak, Starovoitova-yours.
                      After their visits, from the Baltic states to Middle Asia, a massacre erupted. So you should be silent
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 13 June 2018 09: 57
                        -1
                        Quote: badens1111
                        Sobchak, Starovoitova-yours.

                        YOU were in power, not Starovoitovy.
                        Quote: badens1111
                        After their visits, from the Baltic to Middle Asia, a massacre erupted.

                        Burns where everything is ready for fire. You have implemented a national policy for 70, which led to the massacre, and not Starovoitova (although that is still a creature).
                        But what would be just a clowning, on prepared ground -flared up.
                        I saw it all with my own eyes: the betrayal of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union and its indulgence to the nationalists, whom she carefully nurtured for 50 years
                2. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 12 June 2018 19: 25
                  +4
                  What for? I'm just now observing what is happening in the world. And everything goes exactly as grandfather Lenin said.
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 13 June 2018 06: 43
                    -1
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    And all goes exactly like that as grandfather Lenin said.

                    Grandpa frowned at everything and completely.
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 13 June 2018 08: 39
                      +2
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      frowned

                      Well, let’s say, how you do not pull the colorful clothes of TISSUE on a lie, it does not become true from this.
      2. New Year day
        New Year day 12 June 2018 10: 04
        +7
        Quote: Phil77
        Well now it’s clear who destroyed the country, not the traitors at the top, but the enthusiastic and naive Muscovites!


        where is it?
      3. Ruudi 34
        Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 16: 30
        +2
        Yeah .. Moscow snickering ...
        1. Phil77
          Phil77 12 June 2018 20: 47
          +1
          Quote: Rudi 34
          Yeah .. Moscow snickering ...

          I’ve been waiting all day for this phrase to be heard! Yeah, I can’t get drunk at the most! There were no food stamps, there were no old people selling the latter, there were no people who had good professions, but they were forced to shuttle because of the cuts! It was, there were some of these "million" rallies !!! Well, snickering and they have nothing to do, so they ruined the country from boredom !!!! One word is Muscovites, what can I take from them ?!
          1. Ruudi 34
            Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 21: 23
            +1
            Phil, you answered sarcasm to sarcasm ... smile and believe me - it’s not me who started this “first”. (The dislike of "provinces" for "metropolitan" is known in many cultures.)
            1. Phil77
              Phil77 12 June 2018 21: 30
              +2
              Quote: Rudi 34
              Phil, you answered sarcasm to sarcasm ... smile and believe me - it’s not me who started this “first”.

              It is advisable not to confuse the power in the Kremlin and ordinary people living in Moscow. No sarcasm.
      4. Siberian 63
        Siberian 63 12 June 2018 19: 57
        +6
        enthusiastic and naive Muscovites, corrupt, as now, the country was destroyed. There were no performances in other cities.
        1. Phil77
          Phil77 12 June 2018 20: 49
          0
          Rich experience communicating with corrupt Muscovites?
          1. Duisenbay Sbankulov_2
            Duisenbay Sbankulov_2 13 June 2018 17: 32
            +1
            Fil77 I remember how Muscovites in those years decided to sell goods by registration, so to speak, the first stone to collapse ...
            1. Phil77
              Phil77 13 June 2018 18: 17
              0
              Quote: Duysenbay Sbankulov_2
              Fil77 I remember how Muscovites in those years decided to sell goods by registration, so to speak, the first stone to collapse ...

              But it doesn’t seem to you that it was a protective measure. Moreover, it was not only in Moscow.
    2. Same lech
      Same lech 12 June 2018 06: 34
      +15
      Complete failure and failure of the system ....

      Totally agree with you Andrew ...
      for me, the powerlessness of power became apparent when pogroms of Russians, Armenians, Azerbajans, Meskhetian Turks, etc. started on the periphery of the USSR .... massacres of people on a national basis were in full swing and at that time Gorbachev soared the brains of the whole people of the USSR about pluralism opinions, tolerance and other democratic rubbish ... can you imagine ... Russians are being slaughtered in GROZNY and all this hangs on his drum his noodles about perestroika to naive citizens.
      At that time, I still knew little about what was happening in the Caucasus ... and only with the advent of such a monster of terror as BASAYEV understood what demons of death the perestroika released in KREMLIN ...
      since then I do not trust the authorities in principle.
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich 12 June 2018 06: 58
        +7
        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        for me impotence it became obvious to the authorities when pogroms of Russians, Armenians, Azerbaijanis, Meskhetian Turks, etc. started on the periphery of the USSR .... massacres of people on a national basis were in full swing and at that time Gorbachev soared the brains of the entire people of the USSR about pluralism of opinion, tolerance and other democratic rubbish.

        All this was felt by the Russian suburbs in their own skin.
        It infuriated the complete betrayal of the Communist Party: the people themselves organized themselves in the Inter-Movement — without money, a base, or premises.
        And these ghouls pretended that their rampant nationalism is not concerned! And their leadership then led the national "movement" am !
      2. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 12 June 2018 08: 27
        +5
        Quote: The same Lech
        ..... for me, the powerlessness of power became apparent when pogroms began on the periphery of the USSR ..... I did not know much then what was happening in the Caucasus ....
        so not only you knew little. Little --- it’s quite a bit about that topic ------. When asking about that time, those events I often received answers ---- that there were no messages at all, or much later. Many only later found out and who did not believe, thought fakes.
      3. Serg65
        Serg65 12 June 2018 11: 58
        +6
        Welcome Alex! hi
        Quote: The same LYOKHA
        ethnic slaughter was in full swing

        The beginning of this was laid in Almaty on December 17 of the 1986 year, a year after the Gorbachev take-off!
    3. rkkasa xnumx
      rkkasa xnumx 12 June 2018 07: 16
      +17
      Quote: Olgovich
      N.I. Ryzhkov first discovered the real facts of economic collapse to people's deputies and the whole country:
      - at the beginning of 1989, there was more than one hundred billion budget deficit in the country;
      - outward foreign debt;
      - complete lack of inventory and money for import.
      As noted in his report, “negative trends” in the country's economy have been growing gradually over the past three five-year periods.
      Complete failure and failure of the system ....

      Just a few years of perestroika, the rejection of a socialist, planned economy - and immediately the most severe negative consequences.
      By the way - "Outrageous external debt", this :
      1985 VD - 28,3 billion dollars, percentage of GDP - 1,5.
      1989 VD - 53,9 billion dollars, percentage of GDP - 2,6.
      And the budget deficit appeared as a result of the actions of perestroika.
      PS About your beloved RI:
      - in 1904-1906, the budget deficit was 25-33%;
      - in 1914 - 39%;
      - in 1917 - 88%.
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich 12 June 2018 08: 43
        0
        Quote: rkkasa 81
        Just a few years of perestroika, the rejection of a socialist, planned economy - and immediately the most severe negative consequences.

        A fall in oil prices almost twice from 1980 to 1985 led to galloping coupons from the early 1980s. And to the total commodity shortage of everything and everything, rising prices on the black market.
        The system came to a standstill, therefore, the restructuring of Mecheny started, it was NECESSARY to change!
        But HOW he did this: no enemy would have come up with the worst!
        Quote: rkkasa 81
        About your favorite RI:

        My RI 1913 on food, clothing, housing, the townspeople you caught up only through forty years.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 12 June 2018 09: 51
          +9
          It remains only to recall how many of those townspeople who were lost in Russia and in the USSR. Well, other unfavorable factors, such as the civil war, the Great Patriotic War, all sorts of sanctions against the USSR, and finally it was necessary to drastically rebuild the country's economy into an industrial one. But these are trifles, right?
          1. Serg65
            Serg65 12 June 2018 12: 08
            +1
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            But these are trifles, right?

            smile and why compare it?
            Who ruined RI? Socialists at the head of the oligarchs! Who ruined the USSR? Communists at the head of party oligarchs! That’s the whole difference!
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 12 June 2018 19: 32
              +5
              But why not? You have some kind of eerie primitive look at these events. Are you not a student for an hour?
              1. Serg65
                Serg65 13 June 2018 06: 26
                +2
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                Are you not a student for an hour?

                My friend, we are all schoolchildren in this life, only some interpret the teaching, while others cram and live on cribs!
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                You have some kind of eerie primitive look at these events

                Baby son came to his father, and asked the baby:
                - What is good and what is bad?
                So what is good and what is bad, buddy?
                1. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 13 June 2018 13: 58
                  +4
                  As I see it, essentially nothing to tell you. A stream of pathos stupidity and outright nonsense went.
                  1. Serg65
                    Serg65 13 June 2018 14: 05
                    -1
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    A stream of pathos stupidity and outright nonsense went.

                    laughing Well, rudeness and rudeness is a hallmark of neo-communists!
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    I see essentially nothing to tell you

                    what The degree of understanding you heard is unfortunately not in my competence!
                    1. IS-80_RVGK2
                      IS-80_RVGK2 13 June 2018 14: 18
                      +3
                      Do you have something to say essentially or will you write meaningless sets of letters?
                      1. Serg65
                        Serg65 13 June 2018 14: 28
                        0
                        My friend, I already told you that RI was not destroyed by the tsar, but by the oligarchs led by the socialists. The USSR was destroyed by the Secretary General at the head of the members of the Politburo of the Central Committee of the CPSU, the First Secretaries of the Regional Committees, the Kraycoms of the CPSU and the top of the KGB of the USSR! You do not catch the difference?
                      2. IS-80_RVGK2
                        IS-80_RVGK2 13 June 2018 14: 34
                        +5
                        Quote: Serg65
                        My friend, I already told you that RI was not destroyed by the tsar, but by the oligarchs led by the socialists. The USSR was destroyed by the Secretary General at the head of the members of the Politburo of the Central Committee of the CPSU, the First Secretaries of the Regional Committees, the Kraycoms of the CPSU and the top of the KGB of the USSR! You do not catch the difference?

                        Do you understand that everything has some reasons and prerequisites? That just so no one can come and ruin the state?
            2. badens1111
              badens1111 13 June 2018 14: 39
              +6
              Quote: Serg65
              Who ruined RI? Socialists at the head of the oligarchs!

              This is where such dregs were taught to you ???
              Since when, for example, have the Cadets become “socialists"? These are Kornilov, Alekseev and other ranks - "socialists" ????
              This is the ROC Synod, welcomed the abdication of Nicholas 2- "socialists" ??
              What are you talking about?
              Quote: Serg65
              Communists at the head of party oligarchs! That’s the whole difference!

              Is it Yeltsin, who threw out a party card, “communist” Or, for example, Prokhorov, Chubais and others?
              You see the picture, but do not understand the meaning.
          2. Olgovich
            Olgovich 12 June 2018 12: 12
            0
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            It remains only to recall how many of those city ​​dwellers It was in Russia and some lost in the USSR. Well, others unfavorable factors

            Oh, for you the number of citizens is an unfavorable factor? belay What, tell lol
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            Well, other unfavorable factors, such as the civil war, the Great Patriotic War, all sorts of sanctions against the USSR, and finally it was necessary to drastically rebuild the country's economy into an industrial one.

            The poor, the poor dancers... sad
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 12 June 2018 19: 21
              +9
              Do not pretend to be so stupid that you cannot sarcasm.
              Quote: Olgovich
              The poor, the poor dancers... sad

              Yeah, 27 years old have been dancing, but success is somehow not very.
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 13 June 2018 06: 52
                0
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                Do not pretend to be so stupid that you cannot sarcasm.

                Only an ignoramus who does not realize what sarcasm is can see sarcasm here:
                It remains only to recall how many of those citizens were in Russia
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                Yeah, 27 years old have been dancing, but success is somehow not very.

                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                Yeah, 27 years old have been dancing, but success is somehow not very.

                Yeah, for 70 years they danced and danced to grubbers (WITHOUT war!), The Russian Cross and the collapse of the state. fool
                1. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 13 June 2018 14: 16
                  +6
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  Only an ignoramus who does not realize what sarcasm is can see sarcasm here

                  Apparently still so.
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  Yeah, for 70 years they danced and danced to grubbers (WITHOUT war!), The Russian Cross and the collapse of the state.

                  I remember here recently in the press there were discussions about the possibility of introducing these same coupons, apparently from the fact that the people are rich to lack of faith. Tell me how is the struggle with the demographic problem now, have you won already? Here I also remember once the Rurikovich country was torn to pieces for the same reasons as the pseudo-communists of the late USSR. But you have never had this before, but it turns out that again.
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 14 June 2018 06: 52
                    -1
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    Apparently still so

                    I see that it didn’t come. Finally, learn WHAT the concept of sarcasm means: it has a DEFINITION which your chatter does not fit in any way.
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    I remember here recently in the press there were discussions about the possibility of introducing these same coupons, apparently from the fact that the people are rich to lack of faith.

                    belay fool
                    WHERE coupons? And you-introduced them-WITHOUT war!
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    Tell me how is the struggle with the demographic problem now, have you won already?

                    You arranged disaster since the 1930s in demography, which is almost impossible to fix.
                    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                    Here I also remember once the country of Rurikovich tore into pieces from the same considerations as the pseudo-communists of the late USSR.

                    What are the Ruriks to the USSR? fool
                    What's wrong with you?! belay
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 14 June 2018 07: 42
                      +6
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      You have made such a catastrophe since the 1930s in demography that it is almost impossible to fix it.

                      Again the otherworldly voices whispered?
                      But the reality is this.
                      The main “historical surprise” from Stalin: according to the Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR of August 25, 1946 (“On raising wages and building housing for workers and engineers in enterprises and construction sites located in the Urals, Siberia and the Far East”) , The Central Communal Bank pledged to “issue a loan in the amount of 8−10 thousand rubles. buying a two-room apartment building with a maturity of 10 years and 10−12 thousand rubles. buying a three-room apartment building with a repayment period of 12 years with a loan charge of 1% (one percent) per year. ” That is, the cost of the Stalinist "mortgage" was only 1%. Such an interest rate is unthinkable luxury even for such wealthy countries of Western Europe as Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg, where the cost of a mortgage starts at 3%. In Russia, today the most preferential offer on the market is 11,4%.
                      So for whom did they build, if, judging by your ritual, everyone died ???
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 34
                        -1
                        Quote: badens1111
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You have made such a catastrophe since the 1930s in demography that it is almost impossible to fix it.

                        Again the otherworldly voices whispered?
                        But the reality is this.
                        The main “historical surprise” from Stalin: according to the Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR of August 25, 1946 (“On raising wages and building housing for workers and engineers in enterprises and construction sites located in the Urals, Siberia and the Far East”) , The Central Communal Bank pledged to “issue a loan in the amount of 8−10 thousand rubles. buying a two-room apartment building with a maturity of 10 years and 10−12 thousand rubles. buying a three-room apartment building with a repayment period of 12 years with a loan charge of 1% (one percent) per year. ” That is, the cost of the Stalinist "mortgage" was only 1%. Such an interest rate is unthinkable luxury even for such wealthy countries of Western Europe as Belgium, the Netherlands and Luxembourg, where the cost of a mortgage starts at 3%. In Russia, today the most preferential offer on the market is 11,4%.
                        So for whom did they build, if, judging by your ritual, everyone died ???

                        Rat! lol
                        WHERE are these Millions of houses of the Stalinist mortgage in which they lived hundreds million happy fellow citizens? Huh? lol
                        Again pests prevented? Like the dancers? lol
                    2. IS-80_RVGK2
                      IS-80_RVGK2 14 June 2018 10: 39
                      +3
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      I see that it didn’t come. Finally, learn WHAT the concept of sarcasm means: it has a DEFINITION which your chatter does not fit in any way.

                      Let us take it as a fact that you are simply stupid and do not understand what sarcasm is and leave this subject.
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      WHERE coupons? And you-introduced them-WITHOUT war!

                      https://rg.ru/2018/05/15/minpromtorg-podgotovil-z
                      akonoproekt-o-prodovolstvennyh-kartochkah.html
                      And now we have a war?
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      You have made such a catastrophe since the 1930s in demography that it is almost impossible to fix it.

                      Why so? Who was screaming with foam at his mouth, what an awesome dancer was he? You and the people like you made a catastrophe who didn’t oversleep at the time when the scientific and technological revolution began and the west went into a sharp break. For that, as always, you had to pay a terrible price. And the 90s of your hands. Those people had nothing to do with the Communists except the sign, and even that was not always the case. And yes, you are lying, as always, you can fix it, but you greedy hypocritical scoundrels do not want to do this, because you are not profitable.
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      What are the Ruriks to the USSR?

                      You don’t have to blaspheme the Russian terrier, you remember very well from history how your Rurikovich broke the country into unitary principalities. The pseudo-communists of the late USSR did exactly the same. And for exactly the same reasons, they all wanted money and power, and they didn’t care about the people, as you now do. All your cries and snot if you drop the screen of patriotism concern only your feeding trough.
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 14 June 2018 11: 07
                        0
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Let us take it as a fact that you are simply stupid and do not understand what sarcasm is and leave this subject.

                        Let's take: just the exact opposite. In view of your ignorance of the Russian language.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        https://rg.ru/2018/05/15/minpromtorg-podgotovil-z
                        akonoproekt-o-prodovolstvennyh-kartochkah.html
                        And now we have a war?

                        No war now, no coupons. With you, there is no war, but there are EVERYTHING coupons and TOTAL deficit. Not getting it?
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Why so? Who was screaming with foam at his mouth, what an awesome dancer was he? Catastrophe you arranged for you and others like you who didn’t oversleep at that time when the scientific and technological revolution began and the west went into a sharp lead. For that, as always, you had to pay a terrible price.

                        a catastrophe, like a devastation, is in the heads of ANYTHING inconsistent either in the economy or in the management of a country of great age never working parasites who came after the Thief.
                        And the terrible price is the price of their LEARNING and clumsy primitive actions: the same building can be built competently and without loss, or you can by digging excavators in the foundation pit and ditching the installers on the frame. You are the second.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        And the 90s of your hands.

                        YOU ARE ONLY ONE in power 70 (!) Yearsand all the others are to blame ?! belay Conscience, not at all? fool
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        And yes you’re lying as always, you can fix it,

                        You broke through the knee, the cruel, demographic behavior of the people in FIVE years, when the number of births per woman from 7 fell almost twice by 1933. Since then, everything has rolled down, since 1964, only 47 years after the BOR -DEPOPULATION of the Russian people began! People overtaking the Chinese in terms of growth. Yes, you only for this .....
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        You don’t have to blaspheme the Russian terrier, you remember very well from history how your Rurikovich broke the country into unitary principalities. The pseudo-communists of the late USSR did exactly the same.

                        Compare princes with YOUR first-timers is FIVE! good lol
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        All your cries and snot if you drop the screen of patriotism concern only your feeding trough

                        chatter ...
                        And the hunt? request hi lol
                      2. IS-80_RVGK2
                        IS-80_RVGK2 14 June 2018 16: 46
                        +2
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        No war now, no coupons. With you, there is no war, but there are EVERYTHING coupons and TOTAL deficit. Not getting it?

                        Have you read what the article says? Is this also the fault of the Communists? Please comment.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        a catastrophe, like a devastation, is in the heads of ANYTHING inconsistent either in the economy or in the management of a country of great age never working parasites who came after the Thief.
                        And the terrible price is the price of their LEARNING and clumsy primitive actions: the same building can be built competently and without loss, or you can by digging excavators in the foundation pit and ditching the installers on the frame. You are the second.

                        This is said shamefully losing the war in small Japan and drowned the fleet in the Tsushima battle. Try to carry out industrialization in such a time frame in a backward poor peasant country. I'll see how you get this young talent. And then yes, to whistle not tossing bags. Fuck you with the hands of theoretician drivers. Try to create such an atomic industry as ours, but you have to thank the Communists for this alone. Because one nuclear weapon essentially prevents our country from disappearing into oblivion. It is not for nothing that Putin periodically recalls its presence in Russia with our friends from NATO. But you stupid anti-advisers still can not understand this, although it would seem that it’s easier than that your life has been constantly poking a snout at this fact.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You are the only one in power 70 (!) Years, and all others are to blame ?! Conscience, not at all?

                        You? Did she ever have a conscience? You are lying impudently at every step just to keep your trough to which you have reached.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You broke through the knee, the cruel, demographic behavior of the people in FIVE years, when the number of births per woman from 7 fell almost twice by 1933. Since then, everything has rolled down, since 1964, only 47 years after the BOR -DEPOPULATION of the Russian people began! People overtaking the Chinese in terms of growth. Yes, you only for this .....

                        Have you completely moved in your anti-Soviet roof? This is you for everything you need to the wall and from the filth machine gun. What did you bring the country to such a state with your full stupid idleness. Demographic behavior speak? And what should it be in an industrial urbanized society, and a cast-iron one?
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Compare princes with YOUR first-timers is FIVE!

                        Anti-Soviet stump that you do not understand? How else can I explain to you? Of course, I understand that it is difficult to think with your inter-ear ganglion, but you really should try.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        chatter
                        This is your constant trepidation with pulling an owl on the globe in an attempt to save the feeder.
                      3. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 15 June 2018 10: 04
                        -1
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Have you read what the article says? Is this also the fault of the Communists? Please comment.

                        He who is SINGLE-handedly rules is naturally and solely responsible, i.e. to blame.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        This is said shamefully losing the war little Japan and the drowned fleet in the battle of Tsushima.

                        Only a very ignorant person can call a "small" industrialized country, whose population was MORE than the population of Germany. By virtue of this ignorance, he is clearly not aware that the Russian people FIRST time entered the land of the future Vladivostok only FORTY FORTY years before the war! And before native Russia it was 8 thousand km of taiga, swamps and mountains. And Japan, to the theater of action, cross the strait.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Try to carry out industrialization in such a time frame in a backward poor peasant country. I'll see how you get this young talent. And then yes, to whistle not tossing bags. Fuck you with the hands of theoretician drivers.

                        NOBODY and NEVER "rescuers" did not authorize "save" the country, and even with such methods, millions of corpses from starvation, cannibalism and the Second Serfdom. Do not know how otherwise? DO NOT TAKE IT: THE WHOLE WORLD WAS ALREADY BUILDED
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Try to create such an atomic industry as ours, but you have to thank the Communists for this alone.

                        Atomic science was created by IMPERIAL scientists, tie a knot with an ax FOREVER: Vernadsky, Ioffe, Khlopin, Mysovsky, etc., became scientists before the thief, and Kurchatov associates are their students learned in imperial universities .. The same is true with space rockets.
                        Other countries became nuclear and flew into space WITHOUT you and Russia, which was before the Thief at the level of the future nuclear Faction, and without you it would have become nuclear. Advanced Russian science and the pace of development of the country spoke of this. Only the Russian population would be in hundred million more.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        But you stupid anti-advisers still can not understand this, although it would seem that it’s easier than that your life has been constantly poking a snout at this fact.

                        Forever, losers from the past do not understand that the Russian Cross, built by them in just 70 years, is opposite to the Russian people THOUSAND times than any enemies and no atomic bomb will save from its consequences.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        You? Did she ever have a conscience? You are lying impudently at every step just to keep your trough to which you have reached.

                        Once again: do you have enough conscience to say that the SINGLE rulers are not to blame for the collapse of their state?
                        If yes, then this is some kind of product, not a conscience lol
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Have you completely moved in your anti-Soviet roof? This is all you need for the wall and the machine gun scum. What did you bring the country to such a state with your full stupid idleness. Demographic behavior speak? And what should it be like in an industrial urbanized society, and cast iron head?

                        Your insults are funny to melol
                        On the topic: 1. Russian Cross is YOUR building.
                        2. Urbanization in Europe, where a hundred years ago it was 240 person / km2 (Belgium, e.g.) and in the USSR, where there was 9 person / km2- Different things .
                        There villages became cities. In your country, the villages DIED out, vast territories turned into a desert (half a million residential empty houses only in the Non-Earth Earth, 1985), and their population fled to cities from poverty and hopelessness. Instead of the rapid settlement-development of Siberia, the growth of Russian-Russian Cross. This is the verdict of your activity.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        Anti-soviet stump what do not you understand? How else can I explain to you? Of course I understand that your interaural ganglion. It’s hard to think, but you try.

                        Nothing to understand in rubbish.
                        Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                        This is your constant trepidation with pulling an owl on the globe in an attempt to save the feeder.

                        Against FACTS, no arguing! Yes laughing
              2. badens1111
                badens1111 13 June 2018 14: 42
                +3
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                , 27 years already dancing, but success is somehow not very.

                Entertaining gear.
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xy5FDPXwZX8
                Especially when it comes to privatization.
                Like it not, but through this journalist, the power is throwing in the thought of the inevitable and how much of it you don’t like it, not in vain the West and its heralds. Even so they yell, the Soviet is returning, even if it's just a subtle, quasi-Soviet flair.
          3. twviewer
            twviewer 12 June 2018 17: 59
            +7
            Olgovich continues to burn: it turns out there was no more money because dollars in the treasury disappeared, and this is in the USSR
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 13 June 2018 06: 54
              0
              Quote: twviewer
              Olgovich continues to burn: it turns out there was no more money because dollars in the treasury disappeared, and this is in the USSR

              Yes, there’s nothing to buy it from the damned West.
              But they themselves could not feed the people, not fattening over the battle for bread and the battle for garlic.
        2. rkkasa xnumx
          rkkasa xnumx 12 June 2018 10: 23
          +10
          Quote: Olgovich
          A fall in oil prices almost twice from 1980 to 1985 led to galloping coupons from the early 1980s. And to the total commodity deficit of everything and everything, rising prices on the black market

          The USSR was not so dependent on oil prices as some people think.
          In 1986, there was a sharp drop in world oil prices - the USSR received for export of oil and oil products only 5 billion foreign rubles instead of the previous 10-12 billion rubles a year. At the same time, the total amount of exports in the country in 1986 amounted to 68,3 billion rubles. That is, the volume of oil sales turned out to be slightly higher than 7% of the volume of all exported goods, in the best years it reached 15%.
          Quote: Olgovich
          My RI 1913 on food, clothing, housing, the townspeople only overtook forty years later

          You have a good Olgovich bulb, but no laughing
          1. Serg65
            Serg65 12 June 2018 12: 37
            +7
            Quote: rkkasa 81
            You have a good Olgovich bulb, but no

            Under the Union, in the 80 year, GDP was compared with the GDP of the 1913 year!
            Quote: rkkasa 81
            The USSR was not so dependent on oil prices as some people think.

            It's not about oil at all, you're right about that!
            Since the 1980 year, the artificial creation of a total deficit began, and with the advent of Gorbachev to power, store shelves were almost immediately empty. And in 87, the goods remaining on the shelves of state stores began to flow smoothly into the newly created cooperatives! In stores, mice were hung in protest, and shelves of cooperative stores were packed with goods released by Soviet industry, but ... at a price of three expensive! For five years of such a life, the Soviet people purposefully prepared for the Bialowieza Forest !!!!
            1. rkkasa xnumx
              rkkasa xnumx 12 June 2018 16: 03
              +4
              Quote: Serg65

              Under the Union, in the 80 year, GDP was compared with the GDP of the 1913 year!

              Perhaps they compared what was wrong with that?
              1. Serg65
                Serg65 13 June 2018 06: 48
                0
                Quote: rkkasa 81
                what is it about?

                Yes, in principle, nothing would happen, only you have a good bulb wink
                1. rkkasa xnumx
                  rkkasa xnumx 13 June 2018 19: 13
                  +2
                  Quote: Serg65
                  Yes, in principle, and nothing

                  Then what is your stupid flood?
            2. Olgovich
              Olgovich 13 June 2018 06: 56
              0
              Quote: Serg65
              Since 1980, the artificial creation of a total deficit began

              WHO created: names, organization, organization documents, memoirs and certificates, present.
              You can not, they are NOT.
              1. Serg65
                Serg65 13 June 2018 07: 32
                +2
                hi Greetings Andrew!
                Of course, I will not provide you with documents other than my observations and impressions! A poem appeared in 80, it was known throughout the USSR ...
                It was three, but it became five - still take it again!
                Even if it’s eight, we won’t stop drinking!
                Tell Ilyich - we’ve got ten on the shoulder,
                Well, if there is more, it will turn out like in Poland!
                Well, if - twenty-five - we’ll take Winter Winter again!

                The rise in price of vodka turned out to be a certain deficit, cunning comrades bought up vodka in boxes, so that after 22's they would sell it with "holes"! At the same time, sugar-brewers began to disappear from the shelves in a Stakhanovian way to answer the increase in the price of vodka and ordinary Soviet citizens (but not moonshine-riders) began to sell sugar by kilo in one hand! Brezhnev died, long live Andropov, landings, confiscations, raids on cinemas and pubs began, as an answer to this, gold disappeared in jewelry and the newlyweds, in order to buy the rings, should have brought a certificate that they were really newlyweds. Under Andropov, instant coffee disappeared from the shelves, but purely Soviet coffee made from the best Baltic coffee bean varieties appeared, this coffee was called "Baltic". Andropov is dead, long live Chernenko! And here it started! The industry operates in three shifts, the bases are crammed, but in the central lane and in Siberia the shops are almost empty, although it was more fun to enter the store on the outskirts. Well, when Gorbachev gave birth to a cooperative movement, then the devil himself allowed the pairing of trading bases and cooperators!
                hi
                1. Olgovich
                  Olgovich 13 June 2018 10: 10
                  0
                  Quote: Serg65
                  Of course, I will not provide you with documents other than my observations and impressions!

                  I welcome you, Sergey! hi
                  I would like to say that in order to organize something, and even nationwide (the same total deficit), and even “secretly” and against the official position of the authorities, a powerful organization is needed that will leave a lot of traces and executing witnesses. But they do not exist.
                  Quote: Serg65
                  newlyweds, in order to buy rings, had to bring a certificate of

                  I took this myself! Also, an "invitation" (coupons) for shoes, dress, etc.). And he had a non-alcoholic wedding in the military unit! Yes
                  Quote: Serg65
                  The industry operates in three shifts, the bases are clogged, but in the central lane and in Siberia the stores are almost empty

                  And where the goods disappeared, your explanation. Who gave the command to destroy, write off, pay, accept, on a national scale, for this was EVERYWHERE.
                  Quote: Serg65
                  Well, when Gorbachev gave birth to a cooperative movement, then the devil himself allowed the pairing of trading bases and cooperators!

                  And BEFORE this? request
                  Again, even though the intermediaries had to fill the market, this was not the case.
                  1. badens1111
                    badens1111 13 June 2018 10: 20
                    +7
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    I would like to say that in order to organize something, and even nationwide (the same total deficit), and even “secretly” and against the official position of the authorities, a powerful organization is needed that will leave a lot of traces and executing witnesses. But they do not exist.

                    Again a lie.
                    Evidence is needed, well, take it, since you yourself are so independent in finding information
                    The deficit was created artificially, and not at the production stage, but in the distribution sphere. The goal is to create social tension in the country. However, our generation remembers the program “600 seconds”. In 1990, convincing reports were shown in it about how sausages, butter, and other products that became scarce at that time were destroyed. In one of the publications, the former mayor, and now the adviser to the mayor G.Kh., admitted the facts of the destruction of food products in order to create a shortage in the capital. Popov. The press reported that all tobacco factories and enterprises for the production of washing powders were simultaneously stopped for repairs.
                    https://politikus.ru/articles/66442-kak-razvalili
                    -sssr-cherez-iskusstvenno-sozdavaemyy-deficit.htm
                    l
                    Yuri Prokofiev, in 1989-1991. - I-secretary of the Moscow City Committee of the CPSU: “There is a document: Popov’s speech at the Interregional Deputy Group, where he said that it is necessary to create such a situation with food so that the products are issued by coupons. So that this arouses indignation of the workers and their actions against the Soviet regime. ” And quite clearly: in the summer of 91, trains on the access roads to Moscow were full of butter, cheese, meat, and refrigerated trucks were not allowed into Moscow. But then economic power was no longer in the hands of party organizations. ”

                    And the power was already in your playful hands.
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    And where the goods disappeared, your explanation. Who gave the command to destroy, write off, pay, accept, on a national scale, for this was EVERYWHERE.

                    Surnames forgotten? G. Popov, B. Yeltsin, enough?
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    Again, even though the intermediaries had to fill the market, this was not the case.

                    Oh yes, of course ... right here the wind blew goods into stores, exactly on January 2, 1992, though the prices skyrocketed.
                    1. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 13 June 2018 13: 56
                      -1
                      Quote: badens1111
                      The deficit was created artificially, and not at the production stage, but in the distribution sphere. Goal - the creation of social tension in the country

                      WHO indicated this purpose, WHO indicated, WHERE letters, orders, archives (imagine), performers and verifiers of execution (and these are tens, hundreds of thousands of people).
                      You can not. You have never lol um, you can!
                      Quote: badens1111
                      And quite clearly: in the summer of 91, trains on the access roads to Moscow were full of butter, cheese, meat, and refrigerated trucks were not allowed into Moscow. But then economic power was no longer in the hands of party organizations. ”

                      Orders should not be allowed, the names of those who gave, the executors, where the goods are (600 seconds push back, yes, yes), acts of cancellation, destruction.
                      Not again? By the way, you indicated 91. BEFORE that? "Pests" of 37 rebelled from Butovo?
                      Quote: badens1111
                      Surnames forgotten? G. Popov, B. Yeltsin, enough?

                      No, of course: give the names of tens of thousands of EXECUTORS of the "order" and their testimony.
                      no, come on, bye! negative
                      Empty TRAP is not interesting
                      1. badens1111
                        badens1111 13 June 2018 19: 21
                        +2
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Empty TRAP is not interesting

                        Your yes.
                        But how do you look like Stankevich in your empty idle talk-directly reproduce from one training manual.
                        Soloviev cut Stankevich as God as a tortoise.
                        But what’s interesting is that you, just like Stankevich. Are telling tales here.
                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM0E9gFEl4k
                    2. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 14 June 2018 06: 56
                      0
                      Quote: badens1111
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      Empty TRAP is not interesting
                      Your yes.

                      Present DOCUMENTS, but not your empty CHAW!
                      You can’t, comrade powerless?
                      Come on, goodbye. lol
                      1. badens1111
                        badens1111 14 June 2018 11: 03
                        +3
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        PRESENT DOCUMENTS

                        Which one? Is the Poltoranin with his novel - a memory of the disaster, enough?
                        Or should you quote the words of G.Popov? Chubais?
                        For you to ventilate the musty corners of consciousness, bamaga will endure everything, the Internet remembers everything.
                        https://history.wikireading.ru/90936
                    3. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 15 June 2018 09: 07
                      -1
                      Quote: badens1111
                      What are you? Poltoranin with his a novel - a memory of the disaster, enough?
                      Or bring you words G.Popova? Chubais?


                      If you do not understand how DOCUMENTS differ from NOVELS and WORDS, then you- "to the garden! In Ssd !!" "WITH) lol hi
                      1. badens1111
                        badens1111 15 June 2018 11: 51
                        +2
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        DOCUMENTS FROM NOVELS AND WORDS, then you- "to the garden! To Ssd !!" "WITH)

                        Go and air out.
                        Poltoranin wrote everything strictly documented, but alas for you. You are not able to understand what is written.
                        You have many false words, the truth is not yours.
                        The words of Chubais and Gaidar and other priests are documented. You again sat down in a big puddle.
                  2. Serg65
                    Serg65 13 June 2018 11: 06
                    +3
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    and even "secretly" and against the official position of the authorities

                    In my opinion, the State Planning Commission was doing this under the strict guidance of some members of the Politburo. How can one explain the receipt at the Central Department Store of the city of Frunze of a large batch of felt boots and fur coats? We have a half-month winter, and then boots and fur coats + chainsaws. Friendship in PromTorg? Or suppose you have cheeses, you can buy from under the shelves in the store, although you know that dairy stuffs these cheeses in tons! The question is, where is the cheese? And so it was throughout the Union!
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    Who gave the command to destroy, write off, pay, accept, on a national scale, for this was EVERYWHERE.

                    Andrei, you essentially Aesopian language gave the answer to your question! If it was EVERYWHERE, then it was a planned phenomenon, wasn't it? And who was in power, who drove the flows of goods, who oversaw the steering flows of goods? Remember the "Fish business", how did it end? The deputy minister was shot, but the first secretary of the Kraycom was arrested and ALL! And the case of the Moscow deli number 1? Full zilch!
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    through intermediaries, the market was supposed to be filled, but this was not even mentioned.

                    Well, what about my friend? In a cooperative stall or in the same store you could buy everything !!! If only there was money! If there was 2 r 30 cop in the Doktorskaya grocery store and standing there for an hour you won’t get it or not, then in the nearest cooperative stall the same one, the same meat processing plant sausage cost 5 r per kilo, take as much as you like, and not a stick in one arms!
                    1. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 13 June 2018 14: 17
                      0
                      Quote: Serg65
                      In my opinion, the Gosplan was engaged in this under the strict guidance of some members of the Politburo.

                      Documents, except for words-NO. No one!
                      Quote: Serg65
                      Or suppose you have cheeses, you can buy from under the shelves in the store, although you know that dairy stuffs these cheeses in tons! The question is, where is the cheese?

                      Demand was much more than these tons, because there were a bunch of empty pieces of paper (unsecured rubles). So they sold at a more real price.
                      Quote: Serg65
                      If it was EVERYWHERE, then it was a planned phenomenon, wasn't it?

                      Not at all: it speaks not of the plannedness of the mess, but of the gloominess of the plannedness. As it was.
                      Quote: Serg65
                      Well, what about my friend? In a cooperative stall or in the same store you could buy everything !!! If only there was money! If there was 2 r 30 cop in the Doktorskaya grocery store and standing there for an hour you won’t get it or not, then in the nearest cooperative stall the same one, the same meat processing plant sausage cost 5 r per kilo, take as much as you like, and not a stick in one arms!

                      You could buy everything, but NOT ALL :! For not everyone had enough money for a cooperative stall.
                      When prices went up and goods began to lie on the windows, it wasn’t more of them (they were less!), But there was less money.
                      1. badens1111
                        badens1111 13 June 2018 14: 26
                        +4
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You could buy everything, but NOT ALL:

                        Complete nonsense. Not tired of lying?
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        When prices went up and goods began to lie on the windows, it wasn’t more of them (they were less!), But there was less money.

                        Since 1992 there are a lot of “goods”, money has gone, the quality is lower than the plinth, enough fairy tales to tell already. If your chatter is aimed at boys aged 1-15 years, maybe they will believe your fairy tales about an Empire in which supposedly like “cheese in skated with oil "and about the" terrible "USSR in which refrigerators from food in houses burst ...
                        You are still talking about a comparison with the 13th year, you’re gnawing something, compare the level now in 1985, and even the 1990 comparison will not be of your use
                        https://cycyron.livejournal.com/5359772.html
                        Statistics is the only argument in a dispute with somewhat hysterical liberals. Although it may be useless.
                        Until 1985, the USSR developed economically faster than the leading capitalist countries, and this, as an answer to the main reason for its disappearance, suggests itself.
                      2. Serg65
                        Serg65 14 June 2018 06: 26
                        +1
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Documents, except for words-NO. No one!

                        laughing Andrey, why are you like a little, right word!
                        I have already mentioned the case of Yeleseyevsky, do you think that in reality the receipts of Galina Brezhneva, Viktor Vasilyevich Grishin, members of the Central Committee, ministers, deputy ministers exist in that they bought from Sokolov? Did the underground guilds hold invoices and invoices for raw materials received from state factories? At the end of the 80's, a whole series of ethnic clashes swept across the outskirts of the USSR, and they were all carbon-copyed, were there any drivers who brought village youth to protest rallies? In the hands of this youth immediately appeared exactly chopped reinforcement, do you think it possible to find consignment notes for the export of this reinforcement from the factory, work orders for those who cut this reinforcement? Although ... it’s quite possible to find documents for moving wagons with pork stew to Namangan, and it’s quite possible to find the acts of writing off the same stew in the Bukhara archive ..... but will this not satisfy you? Just as the mention of the railway traffic jam from the trains with wheat at the Mga station at the end of the 16 year is not satisfactory!
                        How many documents remained in state archives after cleaning 90's?
                    2. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 14 June 2018 08: 36
                      0
                      Quote: Serg65
                      Andrey, why are you like a little, right word!
                      I have already mentioned the case of Yeleseyevsky, do you think that in reality the receipts of Galina Brezhneva, Viktor Vasilyevich Grishin, members of the Central Committee, ministers, deputy ministers exist in that they bought from Sokolov? Did the underground guilds hold invoices and invoices for raw materials received from state factories? AT

                      Do you put on one board food packages for thieves and a supposedly existing system that organized a shortage and destruction of goods on a national scale?
                      Then you are a lover of conspiracy theology, or, more simply, fairy tales. For children.
                      Quote: Serg65
                      In the late 80s, a whole series of ethnic clashes swept across the outskirts of the USSR, and they were all like a carbon copy, were there drivers who brought village youth to protest rallies? In the hands of this youth immediately appeared exactly chopped reinforcement, do you think it possible to find consignment notes for the export of this reinforcement from the factory, work orders for those who cut this reinforcement?

                      Tell me: WHAT does this mean? About a mass organization from some kind of "center", I suppose? lol
                      Yes, everything was simpler: the country was falling apart, thanks to the "wise" national policy and the policy of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union in general, and the national cadres, who had grown up bold and cultivated by it, came out of it. And this, as I think, you saw it all with your own eyes: at first the most timid articles, then, seeing that everything can be rallies, Russophobic antics and-it happened ...
                      Quote: Serg65
                      Although ... it’s quite possible to find documents for moving wagons with pork stew to Namangan, and it’s quite possible to find the acts of writing off the same stew in the Bukhara archive ..... but will this not satisfy you?

                      If you haven’t sent in such volumes before, but then sent (and more than once, which could be an accident), it will satisfy. As a special case.
                      But there should be millions of such docks, as there should be ORDERS TO DO THAT exactly! But they are NOT!
                      Quote: Serg65
                      How many documents remained in state archives after cleaning 90's?

                      Orders for cleaning ("as well as" stuffing "fakes), performance reports, certificates of performers, customers, present.
                      By the way, WHAT should be cleaned, in what volumes, in what archives, what years, who determined all this (and this is a titanic work on assessment and volumes!)
                      Nonsense all this ..
                      PS
                      Less conspiracy theories are needed: it is incredibly difficult (always) to organize a good and legal business in the country: it turns out wrong, wrong, wrong, and with a huge creak of a bureaucratic machine.
                      And it’s brilliant to organize a merciless, secret for all, sabotage across the country according to the organization of deficit — it is impossible by definition. hi
        3. badens1111
          badens1111 12 June 2018 13: 23
          +8
          Quote: Olgovich
          My RI 1913 in food, clothing, housing, the townspeople caught up only after forty years.

          We believe, we believe Olgovich, you just don’t worry much .. We believe that Nikolai 2 was the first astronaut, we believe that he and Berlin took, we even believe that the potato crop with wheat was enormous, and even the production of bast shoes, 1913 your virtual empire was ahead of the rest, of course, we believe that as many as a billion BILLION bast shoes were produced a year, providing us with raw shoes ...
          1. Olgovich
            Olgovich 13 June 2018 08: 08
            0
            Quote: badens1111
            We believe, we believe Olgovich, you just don’t worry much .. We believe that Nikolai 2 was the first astronaut, we believe that he and Berlin took, we even believe that the potato crop with wheat was enormous, and even the production of bast shoes, 1913 your virtual empire was ahead of the rest, of course, we believe that as many as a billion BILLION bast shoes were produced a year, providing us with raw shoes ...

            It is not necessary to believe, because badads, this stupid habit from the forever bygone past, led to poor results.
            It is necessary to check and KNOW, including at least reporting documents of the USSR, which, with all their bias and postscripts, recognized what I cited.
            Quote: badens1111
            produced, providing us with orphan shoes ...

            You are even bast shoes failed to provide after 70 years of "successful" development. And this is without war, without attack ... fool
            Shame .......
            1. badens1111
              badens1111 13 June 2018 08: 43
              +5
              Quote: Olgovich
              Do not believe, t. Badads is a dumb habit

              From an excess of rudeness, are you trying to go on to discuss my nickname?
              Do not fool this society of your lie- "they could not provide after 70 years of" successful "development. And this is without war, without attack ... fool" -it has clear boundaries-1987 and beyond.
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 13 June 2018 10: 18
                0
                Quote: badens1111
                From an excess of rudeness, are you trying to go on to discuss my nickname?

                Ide? belay
                Quote: badens1111
                Do not fool this society of your lie- "they could not provide after 70 years of" successful "development. And this is without war, without attack ... fool" -it has clear boundaries-1987 and beyond.

                That's right, without war, in peace, you, after the "battles for bread", the battles for cabbage, "brought the country to .
                and coupons. Oh "" Invitations. "
                Shame .... negative
                1. badens1111
                  badens1111 13 June 2018 13: 46
                  +6
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  Disgrace

                  Yours? Of course.
                  It's you, not me. they greeted all this bedlam, they won the same for you as a result, so now you are making an amazed face and pretending to shed tears?
                  It’s not my heroes who wear Chubais, Gaidars and other yasins with grefs, but you do.
                  This is not me snickering viciously. About the rise in prices for fuels and lubricants, but you.You’ll find out your comment “Gasoline at 80 Russian rubles, with many times more expensive communal services and a lower salary, they are wonderful for Putin!”
                  Therefore, not for me but for you, it would be beneficial if the country was bad.
                  A liar from a decent person is distinguished by one quality. A decent person will find out the cause of an act., Action, then express his opinion.
                  But a liar will constantly dodge and stubbornly lie further, without taking into account any argument-YOU recognize yourself?
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 05
                    0
                    Quote: badens1111
                    Yours? Of course.

                    YOURS, T. BADENS, YOURS. it was YOU who ruled and - "regained" to coupons without war and the collapse of the country without war.
                    Quote: badens1111
                    It's you, not me. they greeted all this bedlam, they won the same for you as a result, so now you are making an amazed face and pretending to shed tears?

                    I looked with horror at your rulers from the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, stupidly and clumsily doing business before perestroika, during and after it.
                    Quote: badens1111
                    It’s not my heroes who wear Chubais, Gaidars and other yasins with grefs, but you

                    belay fool lol Gaidars - editors of the journal "Communist" - YOU grown disgusting breed, flesh from your flesh, as well as EBN-e-clean product YOUR total. organization. Thanks to YOU, they were born and took power.
                    But they are disgusting to me.
                    Quote: badens1111
                    It's not me giggling viciously. About the rise in the price of fuels and lubricants, but you will recognize your comment "Gasoline at 80 Russian rubles, with many times more expensive utility bills and a lower salary, it is wonderful to campaign for Putin!"

                    Where is the hee hee? belay fool A statement of much lower prices in Russia than in Moldova. And this indicates good governance.
                    And what did you dream of? belay
                    What is wrong with you man? lol
                    Quote: badens1111
                    Therefore, not for me but for you, it would be beneficial if the country was bad.

                    fool lol
                    Quote: badens1111
                    a man from a decent person is distinguished by one quality.honest man learns the cause of any act., actions, then expresses his opinion.
                    Liar will constantly dodge and stubbornly lie further, without taking into account any argument-you will recognize yourself?

                    Learn by Russian dictionaries the definitions of the words "decent," "lie," "opinion," and save, for God's sake, from your own -death, uninteresting, definitions Yes
                    1. badens1111
                      badens1111 14 June 2018 09: 17
                      +3
                      What is the difference between the opinion of Olgovich and the opinion of Stankevich?
                      Nothing, a set of the same words, myths, tales, lies.
                      Roughly speaking, Solovyov, Stankevich-Olgovich yesterday dipped to where they deserved.
                      It is difficult to suspect Solovyov of a special love for the Union, but it is obvious that your time has passed.
                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJ6HtlVbXHk
                      look from 1.25.10
                      By the way, it’s not for you to teach anyone, I already wrote to you how a decent person differs from a liar.
                      And your rudeness, only an indicator of your primitive lies, designed for not very educated people.
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 44
                        -1
                        Quote: badens1111
                        What is the difference between the opinion of Olgovich and the opinion of Stankevich?
                        Nothing, a set of the same words, myths, tales, lies.

                        Your ratings are uninteresting to me: remember, finally. .
                        Do not litter your comments with verbal garbage.
                        Quote: badens1111
                        It is difficult to suspect Solovyov of a special love for the Union, but it is obvious that your time has passed.

                        I don't give a damn about Solovyov’s spending time watching too? I won’t. Yes
                        Quote: badens1111
                        By the way, I don’t teach you anyone else, I already wrote to you how a decent person differs from a liar.

                        Didn’t get it? belay Alas! Then I repeat for the tanker:
                        Learn from the Dictionaries of the Russian language the definitions of the words "decent", "lie", "opinion" and save others, for God's sake, from their gods, uninteresting to anyone definitions of these concepts
                        hi lol
                      2. badens1111
                        badens1111 14 June 2018 09: 56
                        +2
                        Quote: Olgovich (Andrey)
                        Your ratings are uninteresting to me: remember, finally. .
                        Do not litter your comments with verbal garbage.

                        In this thread of discussion, apart from you, the prolific garbage collector and sprinkler, there are not very reliable data, no one else.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        I don't give a damn about Solovyov’s spending time watching too? I will not

                        You remind the current capercaillie, however, the video is not for you, the video is for those who will look and make a conclusion about the identity of the role of both Stankevich in reality and yours in INETA virtuality.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Alas!

                        Indeed, you are clearly not among the competent, decent, and not prone to visitors to the resource.
                        For your "questions", by who cares, including apartments, read
                        Decree of the Council of Ministers of the USSR of August 25, 1946 "On raising wages and building housing for workers and engineers in enterprises and construction sites located in the Urals, Siberia and the Far East."
                        http://forum.skunksworks.net/Forum3/HTML/001265.h
                        tml
                      3. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 14 June 2018 10: 46
                        -1
                        Quote: badens1111
                        Indeed, among the competent, decent and not prone to lying visitors to the resource,you obviously do not belong

                        FOR THE FIRST TIME I repeat: Your assessments do NOT interest me, nor anyone else. Leave them with you. Like ALL participants.
                        Do not litter! angry
                        Quote: badens1111
                        and the subject of your "questions", according to who cares, including about apartments, read

                        Where are these questions? fool lol
            2. Alexander Greene
              Alexander Greene 13 June 2018 17: 53
              +4
              Quote: Olgovich
              Shame .......

              But this is nice man I.V. Stalin left us, and this despite the war
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 11
                0
                Quote: Alexander Green
                Quote: Olgovich
                Shame .......

                But this is nice man I.V. Stalin left us, and this despite the war

                Yes, finally, they caught up with 1913. "Great" achievement for Fourty years fool lol !
                1. Alexander Greene
                  Alexander Greene 14 June 2018 22: 14
                  +2
                  Quote: Olgovich
                  Yes, finally, they caught up with 1913. Forty Years Achievement

                  You lack objectivity. Two wrecks of the national economy after the war, you do not take into account? The first time the White Guards robbed the country, the second -
                  the Nazis destroyed the entire European part.
                  1. The comment was deleted.
                    1. Alexander Greene
                      Alexander Greene 15 June 2018 20: 28
                      +2
                      Quote: Olgovich
                      You don’t have enough head to understand that if there hadn’t been you, there would have been neither the first ruin, nor the second.

                      Well, you would have prevented your ancestors and you from parasitizing on working people, you probably still dream today, as if a servant were walking behind you, wiping your ass, butlers standing behind, eating, gardeners cutting the garden, and peasants plowed in your fields . And you would only have mercy on them, or flogged at the stable, like a bar.
                      No, Mr. "good", my grandfathers were tired of serving yours and they threw you-backbones from their necks, but they didn’t finish them all, again they climbed out of the cracks with their dreams to dominate the common people.
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 16 June 2018 09: 40
                        0
                        Quote: Alexander Green
                        Well, they would have prevented your ancestors and you from parasitizing on the working people,

                        In caring for the working people, you have brought it to extinction.
                        Quote: Alexander Green
                        your only not all finished off,

                        No chokedfrom blood yet?
                        Already there is no people, and you are eager to kill all.
                        Other forms of relationships between people do not occur?
                        Although .... obviously nowhere come... lol
                      2. badens1111
                        badens1111 16 June 2018 09: 48
                        +2
                        Quote: Alexander Green
                        mister "good"

                        This user in his rage to lie on a particular period of the country's life, as it is completely lying. So he has the so-called Russian Cross, has shifted somewhere, although in time it is 1992. That he has something about blood .. but neither words about the loss of population without war from 1992 to the present at 18 million ..
                        But his glorification of today's bedlam, and at all ..
                        How can a working people relate to the "servant of the people" of all levels and all stripes who have bite into the back of raising the retirement age ??? Naturally - negatively !!! Someone who is caring for us, with their salaries and pensions, why not want to work and get their exorbitant salaries and their "modest" pensions until the last breath ??! I remember very well how the current Prime Minister publicly stated that HIM LIKES HIS WORK without asking: "The people of Russia are my people, are you satisfied with my work?"
                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3czifIkW3x4
                        In general, the profitroll of Olgovich goes into all serious ...
                      3. Alexander Greene
                        Alexander Greene 16 June 2018 16: 31
                        +3
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Other forms of relationships between people do not occur?

                        Why not come? Just come - communist, where man is friend to man, comrade and brother, where everyone is equal, where nobody exploits anyone. Only now you don’t want such relationships, you want to parasitize on others, therefore you sob on the royal
                        Of Russia. But in vain, the current nouveaux riches will not accept you anyway, even if they now come to the monarchy, as you were with them, you will remain and your destiny is to serve them so that they remain in power longer.
          2. Alexander Greene
            Alexander Greene 13 June 2018 18: 08
            +3
            Quote: Olgovich
            Shame .......

            It was at the turn of the 40-50s.
      2. karabas86
        karabas86 17 June 2018 16: 40
        +1
        Again gentlemen in a puddle .....
    4. Severski
      Severski 12 June 2018 09: 27
      +1
      It turns out to be guilty of the collapse of the USSR - Moldavians.
      And as far as I know, about Lari, this is the fruit of the propaganda of the Russian separatists. There are no video frames confirming this. This is from the field of Moldavian tanks and raped graduates.
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich 12 June 2018 13: 36
        +1
        Quote: Severski
        it is a fruit of propaganda Russian separatists.

        In how, the Russians who advocated the preservation of the Union are "separatists." And the Popular Front, which fought against the USSR, apparently non-separatists fool
        Quote: Severski
        And as far as I know, about Lari, this is the fruit of the propaganda of the Russian separatists.

        All lies, yes: to marry a MONUMENT Lari also did NOT go out, all the Russian separatists came up with lol laughing
        1. Severski
          Severski 12 June 2018 15: 57
          +5
          Union collapsed in Moscow. Moldavians, the Baltic states are second-rate phenomena.
          As for the lari, do not confuse tar and honey, I remember the so-called ceremony. But about washing the streets with blood, this is from the same opera as the crucified boy.
          1. Opera
            Opera 12 June 2018 23: 50
            +2
            Quote: Severski
            Union collapsed in Moscow. Moldavians, the Baltic states are second-rate phenomena.

            Yeah yeah! The Moldavians with the Balts were so sad, they were so sad ... They cried and stood on their knees - come to our senses Muscovites, we are the Balts and our Moldovan brothers for the Communist Party and the USSR! Long live the union of the indestructible republics of the free!))) Well, they laughed at night looking!
            1. Severski
              Severski 13 June 2018 09: 33
              +1
              Rejoiced, did not rejoice, they did not play a major role in the collapse of the union. I can be glad that your salary is small, but it’s not my fault that you are poor.
          2. Olgovich
            Olgovich 13 June 2018 08: 42
            0
            Quote: Severski
            Union collapsed in Moscow. Moldavians, the Baltic states are second-rate phenomena.

            What a "deep" thought! lol
            Quote: Severski
            As for the lari, don't be confused tar and honey, I remember the so-called ceremony.

            WHAT IS MIXED? belay There you can confuse only tar with core, but not with honey. lol
            Quote: Severski
            But what about wash the streets with blood it is from the same opera as the crucified boy.

            Yes? This is your Lari:
            "May I have arms elbows in the bloodbut I’ll throw the occupiers, aliens and mankurts beyond the Dniester, I’ll throw them out of Transnistria, and you, the Romanians, are the real owners of this long-suffering land, get their houses, their apartments, along with their furniture ... We will make them speak Romanian, respect our language, our culture ...
            Loved Russians, yes ...
            About the boy:

            Is this propaganda too?
            А Alley of angels in Donetsk, dedicated to the dead Your ideological allies- fighters with Russian separatists, the children of Donbass, too, a lie?
            1. Severski
              Severski 13 June 2018 09: 38
              +1
              It seems you are not aware that this is the tip of the Communist Party ruined the union? You have been stunted for 30 years.
              As for the lari, please tell me when she said this? At the same time, what school raped the graduates?
              1. Olgovich
                Olgovich 13 June 2018 10: 32
                0
                Quote: Severski
                It seems you are not aware that this is the tip of the Communist Party ruined the union? You have been stunted for 30 years.

                WHO denied this? What's wrong with you? And the system was vicious initially.
                Quote: Severski
                As for the lari, please tell me when she said this?
                In 1989, he held a campaign rally in the USSR Armed Forces.
                Quote: Severski
                At the same time, what school raped the graduates?

                Are you talking about? belay fool
                Do you deny the alley of the angel-children of Donbass killed by YOUR allies-authorities of the so-called "Ukraine"?
                Are you against the Russian separatists, yes?
                1. Severski
                  Severski 13 June 2018 20: 10
                  +1
                  Perhaps you are not native to Russian, so I repeat: I spoke about a certain crucified boy, not the children of Donbass, Grozny or Tskhinvali. Not others, but that one. Do you believe in him? https://youtu.be/kgfkWExDrUQ

                  More about Larry. I do not remember such words at rallies. This could not be said even in '91, and even more so in 89. Can you please video with her words from that rally? Or should I believe you a word?
                  About what they wrote in Russian-language newspapers of that time, I can recall the Moldovan tanks, which were not born in Moldova, or the raped class of graduates of which no one can find and it is not clear from which school.
                  1. Olgovich
                    Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 26
                    0
                    Quote: Severski
                    Perhaps you are not native to Russian, so I repeat: I spoke about a certain crucified boy, not the children of Donbass, Grozny or Tskhinvali. Not others, but that one. Do you believe in him?

                    And I tell you about the children of Donbass killed by YOUR allies-punishers.
                    Do you not believe in them?
                    Quote: Severski
                    More about Larry. I do not remember such words at rallies. Such nthey could not even speak in '91, and in 89 even more so. Can you please video with her words from that rally? Or should I believe you a word?

                    They could and spoke in 1989 and 1991. And lari and viera and dhabis with hodyrkami. Poke around in your Tara si Literatura si Arta. NOBODY of these words, except you - does not deny.
                    I repeat straight question:
                    Are you against the Russian separatists, yes / no?

                    Why bother? lol
                    1. Severski
                      Severski 14 June 2018 20: 23
                      0
                      Do you believe about the crucified boy?
                      And say, I’m Julia. You yourself wag. You cannot answer a simple question. So what are the questions, since you yourself cannot answer.
                      And to argue which children are more expensive, Grozny or Donbass, is blasphemy.
                      Waiting for a link to the video with the words of Larry. As a witness, I can add that the KGB watched the people's front very closely, so the statements were very cautious. In 89, there were requirements only about language and cultural revival. 90 demanded sovereignty. 91 demanded independence. So your words are worthless.
                      1. Olgovich
                        Olgovich 15 June 2018 08: 42
                        0
                        Quote: Severski
                        And about the crucified boy you believe?

                        I do not believe, I KNOW about HUNDREDs of children of Donbass killed by YOUR ukrusyuznikami. This is your childhood crucified.
                        Quote: Severski
                        And say, I’m Julia. You yourself wag. You cannot answer a simple question. So what are the questions, since you yourself cannot answer.

                        Crucified by your childhood Donbass is obvious to me.
                        Quote: Severski
                        А argue which children are more expensive, Grozny or Donbass, this is sacrilege.

                        Where are the children of Grozny mentioned, where is the argument? fool Wagging your head again? lol
                        Quote: Severski
                        Waiting for a link to the video with the words of Larry. .

                        Imagine ALL Larry’s speeches at the rallies in 1989 and prove that these words are not there. NONE of your brethren have NOT refuted them.
                        Quote: Severski
                        As a witness, I can add that the KGB watched the people's front very closely, so the statements were very cautious. In 89, there were requirements only about language and cultural revival.

                        There are a lot of witnesses and they remember very well these "cautious", hateful, "statements". Your testimony of a participant in Russophobic sabbaths of ghouls does not cost anything at all.
                        Tara si Literatura si arta, Timpul and others to help you. I’m not going to get dirty in these Russophobic smelly sewage and dirt, I disdain.
                        For what? To prove Russophobe that he is a Russophobe? This is how you proved it by declaring "Russian separatists."
                        By the way. THIRD TIME
                        Are you against the Russian separatists, yes / no?
                        Why bother?
    5. Opera
      Opera 12 June 2018 23: 46
      +4
      Quote: Olgovich
      But Muscovites did not see anything and enthusiastically went to a disaster ......

      Olgovich, well, you surprised me so surprised! Obviously not thought! Well, let me tell you, as a Muscovite will remind you of the various miners' delegates, hundreds of people wandering around Moscow in helmets screaming - you do not touch Yeltsin to us! Do you know that there are no mines in Moscow? I can still have a lot to tell about all kinds of obscure personalities inspired by democratic ideals by crowds gathering in Moscow from the regions ... Well, you were so surprised!
      1. Olgovich
        Olgovich 13 June 2018 09: 06
        0
        Quote: Oper
        Olgovich, well, you surprised me so surprised! Obviously not thought! Well, let me remind you as a Muscovite about various mining delegates in hundreds wandered around Moscow in helmets screaming-you do not touch Yeltsin to us! Do you know that there are no mines in Moscow? I can still have a lot to tell about all kinds of obscure personalities inspired by democratic ideals by crowds gathering in Moscow from the regions ... Well, you were so surprised!

        Greetings, Igor! hi
        Glad I surprised, why not?
        About hundreds miners and others personally from the provinces :: they did not constitute millions of demonstrations. And I know what I'm talking about: I have a bunch of cousins, aunts, uncles, etc. in Moscow. All-engineers, a couple of doctors.
        Almost all of them were for "democracy" in Yeltsin's style. To our comments that THAT the country is actually being destroyed, they answered: "You don’t understand anything there! It’s necessary! And everything will be fine!"
        OK".
        Here you are, Igor, if it’s not a secret, what did you advocate then?
  4. Gardamir
    Gardamir 12 June 2018 07: 38
    +10
    What kind of democracy is this when Gorbachev rewrote the constitution? Under the present constitution, no congress was provided for.
    That choice is a strong totalitarian country or democratic ruins.
  5. Adjutant
    Adjutant 12 June 2018 08: 09
    +13
    At the end of the Soviet Union, there was much more democracy than in Yeltsin Russia, and even more so than in today's Russia. It was the USSR in the late 80s that became a truly democratic, legal and social state (and not just on paper, as it is now).
    But 3 people in Bialowieza decided that you can trample the wishes of millions of people expressed in a referendum on the preservation of the USSR with a stroke of the pen. And now we have to talk about the latter as a dear deceased: "we love, remember, grieve."
    While about modern Russia-as in a Jewish joke.
    One was asked: how do you feel about modern power?
    He says: As to his wife.
    What is it like ??
    A little afraid, a little love, a little want another)) laughing
    1. Serg65
      Serg65 12 June 2018 12: 42
      +1
      Quote: Adjutant
      The USSR in the late 80's became a truly democratic, legal and social state

      laughing Yeah, especially gangs of brothers covered by cops with large epaulets, or the first secretaries!
      1. badens1111
        badens1111 12 June 2018 12: 57
        +4
        Quote: Serg65
        especially gangs of brothers covered by cops with large epaulets, or the first secretaries!

        Abramovich, Prokhorov ?? So they are yours, therefore who are you?
        Justify Yeltsin and K? No?
      2. Adjutant
        Adjutant 13 June 2018 00: 13
        +2
        It’s not gangs of brotherhood that matter, but how they fight and fight.
        Moreover, as I understand it, you confuse 80 with 90
        1. Serg65
          Serg65 13 June 2018 06: 45
          -1
          Quote: Adjutant
          Moreover, as I understand it, you confuse 80 with 90

          Why would I confuse? I hope you know the names of Gennady Kharkov, Vyacheslav Ivankov, Vladimir Bykov? Have you ever heard of the Kislovodsk Convention of the 1979 year?
  6. New Year day
    New Year day 12 June 2018 08: 30
    +13
    this is not a holiday for me! This is the day when the half-dead USSR Yeltsin sent to the morgue, but could be in intensive care. But so great was the desire for personal power and personal triumph!
  7. populist
    populist 12 June 2018 08: 48
    +7
    By this time, "perestroika" had begun in the USSR for almost four years, which began in April 1985.

    Controversial statement. In 1985-1986, they talked about acceleration. Restructuring began with the 1987 year.
  8. andrewkor
    andrewkor 12 June 2018 08: 49
    +8
    I didn’t even read the article, but immediately into comments! Until now, my soul hurts from “The most terrible geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century” !!!
    1. Severski
      Severski 12 June 2018 09: 42
      +3
      This is now all lively and screaming about the disaster, and then everyone was screaming - change and dreaming of life as in the Dallas series.
      1. andrewkor
        andrewkor 12 June 2018 10: 41
        +12
        I assure you that I, a simple hard worker, had enough freedom of mind in the USSR. And I listened to Voices from West and East and read Samizdat and went to Bulgaria. However, I did not change my shoes in the air, but did not go to the “barricades” in defense of the system , it's true.
      2. Ruudi 34
        Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 16: 34
        +4
        The fact ... It may be reminded to the "mourners" how many were yelling then: "Yeltsin is ours .. MUZHIK ..."
  9. KERMET
    KERMET 12 June 2018 09: 48
    +5
    Quote: Boris55
    Quote: Phil77
    Millions of crowds were not observed

    Photo documents of those times indicate the opposite:

    Pictured is an anti-government rally on Manezhnaya Square in Moscow. March 10, 1991 participated from 300 to 500 thousand people
    1. yawa63
      yawa63 12 June 2018 17: 03
      +4
      February 1989, Moscow Komsomolsky Prospekt - I'm going and wondering - some kind of demonstrations - I remember the speech - Enough for us comrades to think alike, Put forward Yeltsin and reject Brakov - yeah, it’s the people in my village who went to the demonstration))) It was the Muscovites who were the main driving force this !!!
  10. KERMET
    KERMET 12 June 2018 09: 58
    +2
    Quote: Olgovich
    Quote: rkkasa 81
    Just a few years of perestroika, the rejection of a socialist, planned economy - and immediately the most severe negative consequences.

    A fall in oil prices almost twice from 1980 to 1985 led to galloping coupons from the early 1980s. And to the total commodity shortage of everything and everything, rising prices on the black market.
    The system came to a standstill, therefore, the restructuring of Mecheny started, it was NECESSARY to change!
    But HOW he did this: no enemy would have come up with the worst!
    Quote: rkkasa 81
    About your favorite RI:

    My RI 1913 on food, clothing, housing, the townspeople you caught up only through forty years.

    share of revenue from fuel sales and power in the country's budget, even in the most “dependent” years, it did not exceed 10%, but most often it amounted to 7-8%.
    1. Olgovich
      Olgovich 12 June 2018 12: 46
      0
      Quote: KERMET
      the share of revenues from the sale of fuel and electricity in the country's budget, even in the most “dependent” years, did not exceed 10%, but most often it amounted to 7-8%.

      Yes, yes, and Leonid Utesov spoke well about this:
      “Hello, Hello, Gient, what news?”
      I haven’t been at home for a long time -
      Fifteen days, like I'm away,
      Well, how are we doing?

      - Everything is fine, beautiful marquise,
      Things go well and life is easy.
      No sad surprise
      According exclude a trifle.
      So, nonsense, an empty matter -
      Your mare is numb.
      And the rest, beautiful marquise,
      All is well, all is well!
      etc.
      Yes
      1. badens1111
        badens1111 12 June 2018 12: 51
        +7
        Quote: Olgovich
        All is well, all is well!

        Are you justifying your actions? For 27 years you have been singing this song, fake on every chord.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 13 June 2018 09: 08
          0
          Quote: badens1111
          Are you justifying your actions?

          70-year-old actions YOUR show.
          1. badens1111
            badens1111 13 June 2018 09: 38
            +6
            Quote: Olgovich
            70-year-old actions YOUR show.

            Of course, of course, you famously propagandize the fantasies of your foreign authorities and local talkers, and even cost them a penny. Even on the most generous market day.
            Let me remind you about the fuss of your authorities.
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzeZQ-uHwCk
            Well, this figure, in general, is your icon.
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HbHz68Xcq4
            The USSR, in comparison with the post-Soviet time, provided its citizens with a higher level of human development. According to this index (it is calculated at the UN taking into account average life expectancy, population literacy rate, GDP with regard to purchasing power parity in various countries), on the eve of collapse, in 1988, the USSR ranked 26th in the world, and the Russian Federation 1993 - 52nd, in 1996 - 72nd (it was the deepest fall). Subsequently, the situation somewhat improved, but not yet comparable with the 1988 figure: in 2010, Russia “pulled out” to 67th place, in 2011 it was 66th. At the end of the list of 182 countries are Sierra Leone, Afghanistan, Niger13.
            Continue to tell your colorful, but not true false lies. Even if you have Chubarya and Pikhoya, Sakharov and others to help you, along with figures from behind the Puddle.
            And this is the quintessence of the fact that people like you did in 90- "Leonid Kravchuk, the first president of Ukraine [1]:
            For the first time, we were able to carry out a coup d'etat of this scale peacefully. This is a unique phenomenon in world history. "The time will come, and people will understand how difficult it was, but how important it was and had historical consequences for Russia, Ukraine and the whole world."
            Continue, Mr. Russophobe pouring crocodile tears.
            And this is about “love for white”, 15 years after their defeat.
            http://istmat.info/node/57150
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 13 June 2018 10: 40
              0
              Quote: badens1111
              The USSR, in comparison with the post-Soviet time, provided its citizens with a higher level of human development

              Remember, remember:

              Development- good
              Quote: badens1111
              And this is the quintessence of the fact that people like you did in 90- "Leonid Kravchuk, the first president of Ukraine [1]:
              For the first time, we were able to carry out a coup d'etat of this scale peacefully. This is a unique phenomenon in world history. "The time will come, and people will understand how difficult it was, but how important it was and had historical consequences for Russia, Ukraine and the whole world."

              YOUR comrade, the purest extortion of YOUR party.
              That
              Quote: badens1111
              Continue, Mr. Russophobe pouring crocodile tears.

              YOURSELF nurtured, yourself and cry.
              1. Alexander Greene
                Alexander Greene 13 June 2018 17: 57
                +4
                Quote: Olgovich
                Remember, remember:

                And I also remember that. It was the same after Stalin, until socialism undeveloped enemies began to crush.
                1. Olgovich
                  Olgovich 14 June 2018 09: 56
                  0
                  Quote: Alexander Green
                  And I also remember that. It was the same after Stalin, while socialism unfinished enemies did not start to ruin.

                  What omnipotent, powerful insidious enemies! Well, all ruined!
                  And you, you where did you look? !! HOW admitted? !!am angry lol
                  1. Alexander Greene
                    Alexander Greene 14 June 2018 22: 28
                    +1
                    Quote: Olgovich
                    What omnipotent, powerful insidious enemies! Well, all ruined!
                    And you, where did you look? !! HOW admitted ?!

                    The bourgeoisie acts with a silent glanders, it is sneaking to power, try to recognize it. In addition, most of the real Bolsheviks died during the war and the party was led by the hidden Trotskyist Khrushev, who drove out all the political enemies of the Soviet regime from the camps, so they began the restoration of capitalism, and their children and disciples completed it and destroyed the USSR. Unfortunately, Beria did not have time to neutralize Khrushchev.
                    1. Olgovich
                      Olgovich 15 June 2018 09: 00
                      0
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      The bourgeoisie acts with a silent glanders, it is sneaking to power, try to recognize it.

                      “Sneaking”, “silent glanders” —and these are the reasons for the defeat of the “all-conquering” real Communists? Oh, I can’t!lol laughing
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      Besides most of the real Bolsheviks died during the war

                      Do you understand what you said? recourse You declare that the surviving communist soldiers, the victors in the Great Patriotic War, turned out to be Trotskyists ?! fool
                      By the way, why did the Trotskyists breed like rabbits, despite the fierce struggle against Trotskyism, but the real Bolsheviks, no?
                      Quote: Alexander Green
                      the party was led by a hidden Trotskyist Khrushev, who drove out all the political enemies of the Soviet regime from the camps, so they began the restoration of capitalism, and their children and disciples completed it and destroyed the USSR.

                      You real WHERE were ?! WHERE are your battles at congresses, at rallies, in the streets, why did you hide from the Trotskyists, and didn’t go into battle and did not die with honor ?? WHY there were so few of you and all of you have been beaten and deceived, like children? request
                      1. Alexander Greene
                        Alexander Greene 15 June 2018 21: 09
                        +3
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        Do you understand what you said? You declare that the surviving communist soldiers, the victors in the Great Patriotic War, turned out to be Trotskyists ?!

                        First, read the comments carefully, and secondly, do not come up with something that is not.
                        No one wrote that the Communist soldiers turned out to be Trotskyists. For the umpteenth time I am writing that during the war three members of the Bolshevik Party died. The real Communists who were Communists, not only because they had a party card, but because they were literate Marxists, had the experience of a class and ideological struggle against bourgeois ideology, perished.
                        They were replaced by heroes, but politically illiterate, because during the war, the seniority was almost completely absent, and they were victims of deceit by hidden Trotskyists led by Khrushchev.
                        Quote: Olgovich
                        You real WHERE were ?! WHERE are your battles at congresses, at rallies, in the streets, why did you hide from the Trotskyists, and didn’t go into battle and did not die with honor ?? WHY there were so few of you and all of you have been beaten and deceived, like children?

                        Why didn't you fight? Fought. Those who recognized the Khrushchev anti-Soviet essence were sent to prison, sent to exile, or even helped to die suddenly.
                        The working class went on strike at the time, but they also dealt harshly with it.
                        And by 1991, the Soviet people were ready to perceive the lies of Gorbachev, Yeltsin and others like them, since their consciousness was shifted towards petty-bourgeoisness.
                        Here you propose - go to battle. With whom? With a people who were drugged by bourgeois ideology? Are you so hungry for blood? We are not!
                        A return to socialism will be again when the majority of the people will be on its side, or at least sympathize with socialist ideas. And learn, finally: you cannot force socialism upon you. It is only in your training manual that they write so that the Bolsheviks came and forcibly drove Russia into socialism. That is your mistake, and hence the inevitability of your defeat. Perhaps you understand this, and therefore rage.
              2. Alexander Greene
                Alexander Greene 13 June 2018 18: 13
                +3
                Quote: Olgovich
                Remember remember

                We also remember the empty shelves, but even better remember who did it.

                And here is how we lived before perestroika.
  11. A. Privalov
    A. Privalov 12 June 2018 10: 16
    +5
    In those days, no one yet understood that this would be the beginning of the end. On the contrary, everyone believed in the unique possibility of a smooth transition from a totalitarian system to democracy.

    In those days I worked as a simple laborer at the factory - sharpened chops for balalaikas. Our youngest daughter has just been born. Suddenly, all the dairy kitchens closed. I rushed around the city in search of dry infant formula for babies ... Of course, I just needed "smooth transition"I realized that this is the one "unique opportunity" and began to collect suitcases ...
    A year later I left handing out sugar tickets to my 50 neighbors and as much again for butter.hi
    (When sugar and butter were declared a shortage, in housing offices began to issue coupons - 1 kg per family member per month. I, the wife and two children - 4, and mother-in-law diabetics with the father-in-law - still 2. Where are the 6 kg? the same with butter.)
    1. andrewkor
      andrewkor 12 June 2018 10: 47
      +5
      As I understand you, he is a hard worker himself, but there’s no way for a simple Russian person to go. By the way, the “process” in Uzbekistan went quite smoothly, and there were coupons and ersatz of the national revolution, but they survived and took root. The special services quickly added bright nationalists!
  12. Ural resident
    Ural resident 12 June 2018 10: 41
    +4
    All problems are all the same with the economy. Something had to be done, because the collapse of the CPSU had already reached the majority of the population. They gave freedom of speech and words from the kitchens flowed into the square. But nothing moved economically - there were no economists in the country who could really analyze and predict market mechanisms. It was necessary to slowly open markets for the population, to form, to teach entrepreneurship, you see, after 20 years, the Union would slowly be reorganized and funds in the budget would appear, but what happened, happened. In Russia, we don’t feed the people with bread:
    "We will destroy the whole world of violence
    To the bottom and then
    We are ours, we will build a new world,
    Who was nothing will become everything. "
    It is a pity that this happened. Our "wise men" who shouted from the stands turned out to be just dark people, but the sages did not appear in the power either, because they were selected there according to other principles.
  13. Baydak
    12 June 2018 10: 56
    0
    Quote: populist
    By this time, "perestroika" had begun in the USSR for almost four years, which began in April 1985.

    Controversial statement. In 1985-1986, they talked about acceleration. Restructuring began with the 1987 year.

    Officially, from the plenum of the Central Committee of the CPSU, around the end of April of the 1985 year, targeted measures were introduced, and a radical restructuring of the system began with the 1987 year.
  14. kunstkammer
    kunstkammer 12 June 2018 11: 36
    -1
    Quote: The same LYOKHA
    since then I do not trust the authorities in principle.

    I support! I have the same attitude towards power
  15. kunstkammer
    kunstkammer 12 June 2018 11: 57
    +7
    A little note by then.
    I come home after the service, and there a "delegation" meets me. Report: the general meeting of residents of the district I was nominated as a candidate for these same deputies! What?
    Well, put forward and put forward ... as "put forward" - and pushed. He reacted to this very calmly.
    However, the next day my immediate boss flees with bulging eyes and shouts - they demand me immediately to the highest boss, our lieutenant general from infantry.
    He ran to the higher authorities.
    The first five minutes the General heard tantrums while standing in a stupor - he had heard such obscene epithets from him before, but not in such a sophisticated form and not in his personal address. But then he began to vaguely guess - the boss was dissatisfied that without his knowledge I was nominated as a candidate for deputy. That's it!
    I reported to him, after being a little tired, that they put me forward without my knowledge and my consent .... and that today I’ll go and refuse!
    Then the chief died down, changed his anger to mercy and drove me out of the office!
    That's how I visited the candidates for this historic event ...
    Maybe in vain refused? Maybe right now they haven’t banned me on this site? Three times a day? And he ... by the power given to me by the people ... would take and ban them all ... for a while!
    Not forever, I'm not evil .... fellow
  16. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 12 June 2018 15: 15
    +1
    Transition from a fully state economy
    to private could not pass painlessly.
    Too different systems. But there was no civil war at least.
    Today to make the transition from semi-state-semi-oligarchic
    economy with elements of private industry and services
    to completely private - it will be much easier.
    1. A. Privalov
      A. Privalov 12 June 2018 15: 36
      +1
      Quote: voyaka uh
      Transition from a fully state economy
      to private could not pass painlessly.
      Too different systems. But there was no civil war at least.
      Today to make the transition from semi-state-semi-oligarchic
      economy with elements of private industry and services
      to completely private - it will be much easier.

      It is good to. However, judging by the mood of citizens, everything can turn in the direction of the other. Instead of engaging in the development of a private business, all kinds of “otnalsalschiki” and “dividers” - supporters of “dispossession” will appear. I'm not talking about crime, which will immediately raise its head. Where will all sorts of roof raisers and debtors of debt go? It is always easier to select than to work and accumulate.
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 13 June 2018 07: 38
        +4
        Quote: A. Privalov
        .... Instead of engaging in the development of a private business, all kinds of "otmalshchiki" and "dividers" - supporters of "dispossession" will appear. .... Where will today's all sorts of rooftop and debachers go? It is always easier to select than to work and accumulate.

        Yes Yes. Instead, capitalist otmalschiki and divisors of state property among their loved ones appeared to engage in the development of state property .... Yes, yes, it is easier to select.
        But what about today's kryshevateli and slayers? HERE whose fate must be taken care of!
        1. A. Privalov
          A. Privalov 13 June 2018 10: 32
          0
          Quote: Reptiloid
          Quote: A. Privalov
          .... Instead of engaging in the development of a private business, all kinds of "otmalshchiki" and "dividers" - supporters of "dispossession" will appear. .... Where will today's all sorts of rooftop and debachers go? It is always easier to select than to work and accumulate.

          Yes Yes. Instead, capitalist otmalschiki and divisors of state property among their loved ones appeared to engage in the development of state property .... Yes, yes, it is easier to select.
          But what about today's kryshevateli and slayers? HERE whose fate must be taken care of!

          Of course, it is necessary. Otherwise, they will spoil your whole party. You do not place accents correctly. In your opinion, it turns out that I am a supporter of "Kryshevatel" and "vybatel".
    2. apro
      apro 12 June 2018 16: 20
      +4
      Quote: voyaka uh
      Too different systems. But there was no civil war at least.

      Not a fact. An unnecessary population can be killed by changing living conditions. Lack of money. Alcohol. Drug. Criminal fall.
      e birth rate. The drop in the level of medicine. The demography of the period shows that.
      1. Ruudi 34
        Ruudi 34 12 June 2018 16: 38
        +2
        Bloodletting, you know, sometimes saves from an apoplexy blow .. Was it worth sparing the lives of some "servants of the people" and some of the people?
      2. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 12 June 2018 17: 12
        0
        There will be a generation for which private property -
        completely normal and familiar phenomenon. Both a private store or land / farm, and a private factory. And their owners will no longer be perceived as a criminal element. And this will be a starting point for the heyday of Russia.
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 13 June 2018 07: 40
          +3
          Quote: voyaka uh
          There will be a generation for which private property -
          completely normal and familiar phenomenon ....... And this will become a kind of starting position for the heyday of Russia.

          And how many generations will this generation appear? Tales for the brainless.
          1. voyaka uh
            voyaka uh 13 June 2018 12: 47
            0
            After about two generations, after 50 years.
            1. Reptiloid
              Reptiloid 13 June 2018 16: 08
              +3
              Quote: voyaka uh
              After about two generations, after 50 years.

              My answer-question had a share of sarcasm.
              I believe this can never be. Considering that 26 years after the Great October Socialist Revolution, the Soviet people defended the USSR, went to Victory. The new generation has already formed, while those who remembered RI were alive, that is, there was a planned result. What happened in 26 years of capitalism and where the promised result was. You yourself wrote about your fears of the return of socialism, which pleased me. True, it seemed to be at night, so, in an article about an economist. Class! So your words about the starting revival of Russia under capitalism cause homeric laughter !!!
              Okay, you ---- for info: at the turn of the century, my mother worked in administrative positions --- tourist and sports societies. Understood --- youth with money. What questions did she ask about life, about socialism? Is it true that under socialism there were no convenience stores? Is it true that alcohol is for a limited time? And they were horrified that this was not and rejoiced that now it is. But 3 ~~ 4 years ago (though only mother left tourism), young people have already started talking about socialism!
              About free education, about distribution. The impossibility of dismissing an employee in 1 day without explanation. On union permits and on children's vacations in accordance with state standards. Like this!
              1. voyaka uh
                voyaka uh 13 June 2018 16: 35
                0
                Socialism is economically uncompetitive in any case.
                compared to capitalism. I don’t worry about this side.
                My fears were that an attempt to restore socialism,
                stumbling upon the inevitable economic crisis, will pass
                in military adventures to distract the people from this crisis.
                And with atomic weapons, it is dangerous for all countries.
                What young people are asking now "witnesses of socialism",
                understandably. Therefore, 2, at least, generations are needed.
                Moses hanging out in the wilderness for 40 years (2 generations
                for those times) so that people who remembered slavery die
                ("and in prison now is dinner - pasta")
                1. badens1111
                  badens1111 13 June 2018 16: 39
                  +3
                  Quote: voyaka uh
                  Socialism is economically uncompetitive in any case.
                  compared to capitalism.

                  Blah blah blah.
                  Remind Stankevich in a dispute with Solovyov.
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xy5FDPXwZX8
                  1. voyaka uh
                    voyaka uh 13 June 2018 16: 43
                    0
                    I do not claim to be unique in my point of view.
                    There are always predecessors. fellow
                2. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 14 June 2018 22: 22
                  +1
                  Quote: voyaka uh
                  Socialism is economically uncompetitive in any case.
                  compared to capitalism.

                  But capitalism at one time competed with feudalism. And at first it didn’t work out very well either. Never tried to look at this issue from this point of view? Or is our template thinking all? Or do you completely stop thinking from memories of the shortcomings that were in the USSR?
                  Quote: voyaka uh
                  Moses hanging out in the wilderness for 40 years (2 generations
                  for those times) so that people who remembered slavery die

                  What does the Torah say so? Somehow I can’t believe that Moses was such a fool.
                  Quote: voyaka uh
                  What young people are asking now "witnesses of socialism",
                  clear.

                  But the witnesses of capitalism do not see and do not want to see what it really is. In this regard, the Jews in general cause wild amazement about how, due to soldering, one can forget the past and do not give a damn about it, the very one in which they became victims of fascism - the fierce generation of capitalism. Capitalism has organized two world wars in the fire of which tens of millions died and you defend it. Oh yes, he is now with a human face. It is true why, instead of a face, he has been demonstrating something else more and more often lately. But Putin is probably to blame, Russian hackers, international terrorists, insufficient development of green energy and minority rights.
      3. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 13 June 2018 07: 30
        +4
        Quote: apro
        Not a fact. An unnecessary population can be killed by changing living conditions. Lack of money. Alcohol. Drug. Criminal fall.
        e birth rate. The drop in the level of medicine. The demography of the period shows that.
        That is liberal repression. It was the whole Soviet classes that were exposed to them --- scientific workers, teachers, workers. And not only materially, but morally. It was such a liberal oprichnina. Namely class.
  17. Alexander Greene
    Alexander Greene 12 June 2018 23: 49
    +8
    On the destruction of the USSR
    The question of the causes of the death of the USSR is divided into two parts: the destruction of socialism in the USSR and the destruction of the USSR. These parts are interconnected, without the destruction of socialism there would be no destruction of the USSR. The destruction of socialism began immediately after the death of I.V. Stalin with the Khrushchev "thaw", and the destruction of the USSR - with Gorbachev perestroika.
    During perestroika, ethnic conflicts began to arise here and there, often resulting in open armed clashes that provoked the republican media, claiming “infringement” of the interests of such and such people.
    The central media also played a negative, destructive role. With the advent of Gorbachev, they were reborn before our eyes and turned into a means of manipulation and control of the Soviet people. Immediately the consciousness of the working masses began to change, in particular, on their attitude to the national question. Proletarian internationalism was thrown aside, bourgeois nationalism took its place, acting in his characteristic style of "nationwide" and "interests of the nation."
    The economic basis of this process has become market capitalist reforms planted everywhere hA property that has bred and divided people economically, and a powerful economic crisis that erupted in the country as a result of the actions of counter-revolutionaries. Before that, there were no crises in the USSR since the 20s
    In 1989, the economic crisis in the Soviet Union was officially announced. In the period 1989-1991. almost all the main types of goods disappeared from sale in state trade. Cards were introduced in the country.
    The counter-revolution across all the media convinced Soviet citizens of the unviability of the Soviet economy, which supposedly cannot provide its citizens with even the most necessary. In fact, the true cause of the economic crisis in the USSR was the actions of the bourgeois counterrevolutionaries themselves, who were enriching themselves in the new conditions while striving to destabilize the economic and social situation in the country in order to undermine the confidence of Soviet workers in a planned economy and socialism.
    All types of goods were produced by Soviet industry in huge quantities, no less than before, but they were either intensively exported by newly arrived merchants abroad, or destroyed, or sold at exorbitant prices on the black market. The newly-born class of the bourgeoisie intensively accumulated initial capital, while simultaneously pleasing and enriching their foreign brothers in the class.
    Could the USSR have been preserved? It is possible if private ownership of the means of production were not allowed. But since it was precisely the restoration of the institution of private property in the USSR and the simultaneous destruction of the public property of the counter-revolutionary bourgeoisie that political power was needed, the destruction of the USSR was a logical and inevitable process from the moment Gorbachev announced market reforms.
    The bourgeoisie of all Soviet republics, including the Russian one, began to demand “independence” and “sovereignty” from the competition to protect themselves in the market, by which it stupefied the working people of their republics, convincing them that living separately is better than living together big country. After this, the destruction of the USSR became inevitable.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 13 June 2018 07: 13
      +3
      Greetings, Alexander! I want to answer your comment from the bottom up, so to speak. It is the bourgeoisie of the national republics that initiates all sorts of renaming within the framework of de-Stalinization. It has no other way out, since it is untenable, and you can only preserve your privileges by blaming Russia.
      I read that in the 70s of the last century, some large enterprises of the USSR got the opportunity to enter the world platform and carry out their own transactions. That is, they, being state-owned enterprises, behaved as if they were private. And the directors, respectively, also got the opportunity to feel like owners, being at state-owned enterprises. So came the dream of owning a large property.
      1. voyaka uh
        voyaka uh 13 June 2018 12: 56
        0
        ... when someone told the grandfathers of the Politburo,
        that the Druzhba oil pipeline should be extended a little more - to Hamburg.
        And such a dust went! The living standards of Soviet people crawled
        up on petrodollars (and oil barters), and how did it creep up
        the standard of living of the communist nomenclature!
        Until the collapse of oil prices, and the collapse of the USSR economy with it
        (plus - race for military parity with America and Afghanistan, of course)
  18. iouris
    iouris 13 June 2018 00: 36
    +3
    Quote: "Today it is too late to look for the right and the guilty in one of the greatest events of the XNUMXth century - the disaster of the USSR." The end of the quote.
    Why? This is not an "event", but a crime that has no analogues. And who can be “right” if he became a traitor?
    The USSR did not "crash", but was systematically plundered. How this happened was largely established by the "high" London court during the dismantling of Berezovsky with Abramovich. Organizers and beneficiaries are well known.
    Totalitarianism and democracy are respectively the dictatorship of the proletariat and the dictatorship of the gang of beneficiaries. Power is a dictatorship. Dictatorship is power.
    Communism is built (mainly), but not for everyone, but only for the "chosen ones."
  19. Serg65
    Serg65 13 June 2018 14: 56
    0
    IS-80_RVGK2,
    Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
    That just so no one can come and ruin the state?

    Ooh, I understand that perfectly !!! The guy from the street is unlikely to ruin the state, but the guy from Wall Street will do it easily! what Although you are probably still confident in the words "The tops cannot, but the lower classes do not want"?
    1. IS-80_RVGK2
      IS-80_RVGK2 14 June 2018 22: 35
      +1
      What are you saying? Alone alone, like Superman? Maybe you still believe in Santa Claus? How many wrought-iron-headed you roams the planet. Hand face. Do not write more of this, you upset me with your stupidity.
  20. pogis
    pogis 13 June 2018 18: 41
    0
    Serg65,
    I do not see the logic. So RI did not collapse the king, but the king of the USSR ?! But in fact, the tragic decisive role in both events was played by the personality of the head of state, right ?!
    1. Serg65
      Serg65 14 June 2018 06: 33
      0
      Quote: pogis
      But in fact, the tragic decisive role in both events was played by the personality of the head of state

      I totally agree with you! If the soft character of Nicholas could be the character of Joseph, the empire could and for some time could resist the greed of Western bankers! Gorbachev would have had her own head on her shoulders, maybe the Union would still live!
      Quote: pogis
      So RI did not collapse the king, but the king of the USSR ?!

      Exactly so, do you have a different version?
      1. badens1111
        badens1111 14 June 2018 06: 41
        +2
        Quote: Serg65
        Exactly so, do you have a different version?

        There is. Unlike yours, it is not so primitive and empty.

        The USA defeated the USSR with the hybrid war methods that they currently use
        - the destruction of the ideology that unites society and supports the political system;
        - clouding the consciousness of the ruling elite, undermining the fundamental values ​​justifying its dominance;
        - the cultivation of a network of “agents of influence” in the highest echelons of power, working to destroy the existing management system through ideologically motivated reforms;
        - the substitution of concepts in the public mind and the discrediting of customary values ​​in order to replace them with false guidelines;
        - mass landing of provocateurs who, under the guise of friends and benevolent advisers, are rubbed into trust with the aim of imposing a policy that is suicidal for the country.
        1. IS-80_RVGK2
          IS-80_RVGK2 14 June 2018 22: 49
          0
          With this reasoning, you give all the cards in the hands of your opponents. Everything was a little different in my opinion. Although, of course, subversive activity played a role. One of the main reasons in particular is the inertia of public consciousness. Which so far has not really gotten rid of remnants of feudalism. And then, when the majority of the people were peasants, who had only been free for half a century, there was nothing to talk about. Of course, we tried to build socialism, but here we get such a mixture of feudalism and socialism. To which they later added the elements of capitalism without a clear understanding of what and how it all turned out very badly. The external situation, the losses in the Great Patriotic War, also played a role, after Stalin there were no normal leaders at the helm, only state managers. There were few productive forces and relations of production; public consciousness did not change as quickly as expected.
          1. badens1111
            badens1111 15 June 2018 00: 47
            +1
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            With this reasoning, you give all the cards in the hands of your opponents.

            These cards of them have already been opened, what else is there to open?
            And everything else in your reasoning, so to speak, is only a very small part of what actually happened. Tell in the wake of liberals of different stripes that socialism is akin to feudalism. Here it is for sure to play in their team ...
            Socialism in itself bears the traits of capitalism-learn in the end the theory.
            [
            Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
            There were few productive forces and relations of production; public consciousness did not change as quickly as expected.

            Do not write this tale to anyone else anymore. Better find a real Western assessment of the pace of development of the USSR and their assessment. What awaits them if you do not take measures.
            1. IS-80_RVGK2
              IS-80_RVGK2 15 June 2018 15: 08
              0
              Every day I observe this fairy tale all these remnants of feudal consciousness. And do not misinterpret me. I did not say that socialism is akin to feudalism. I said that due to objective reasons he carried vestiges of feudalism. And unfortunately this is a fact. You want to say that he did not carry anything from feudalism? Sorry, but this is nonsense. Yesterday's peasants cannot change their minds overnight. By the way, I did not say that I fully described and explained the processes that took place then. The growth rate of nichrome could not be done with wild bureaucracy and the estrangement of the people from power. But it’s easier to explain everything by conspiracy subversive activities and other agents of the State Department. Not understanding the real reasons, and you don’t understand them in many ways, we are doomed to ride the same rake with a new attempt to transfer to communism.
              1. badens1111
                badens1111 15 June 2018 16: 38
                +1
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                I observe all these vestiges of feudal consciousness.

                This is what has been planted in the country since the counter-revolution of 91 years.
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                The growth rate of nichrome could not be done with wild bureaucracy and the estrangement of the people from power.

                It would be fair to attribute this to the time of the accession of the corn Trotskyist and later.
                Quote: IS-80_RVGK2
                But it’s easier to explain everything by conspiracy subversive activities and other agents of the State Department. Not understanding the real reasons, and you don’t understand them in many ways, we are doomed to ride the same rake with a new attempt to transfer to communism.

                Jumping a rake ... if you follow the recipes for example the Trotskyists, then the races will end in general sadly. If you follow the recipes of some blanks, the result will be even sadder (blankists, this is not something that those who are embarrassed in the belief that Lenin's ancestor was some kind of cross )
                And the transition to communism, it’s more than one year. A decade ago, there were already enough corn fantasies, which, with its irrepressible cries, promised 80, communism, which inflicted a very, very detrimental blow to the country ..
                And finally, I do not understand and do not perceive a cry on the verge of ultrasound in some of the leftists who, in their irrepressible fuss, made contacts with the most marginal orange scum.
                1. IS-80_RVGK2
                  IS-80_RVGK2 15 June 2018 17: 14
                  +1
                  Quote: badens1111
                  This is what has been planted in the country since the counter-revolution of 91 years.

                  Sorry, but no it has been before. I lived a little in the USSR, talked a lot with my father, I see what is happening now and how people behave. All this is fawning over his superiors, his panicky fear, the psychology of lords and servants, an unwillingness to take responsibility. All this was and has not yet gone unfortunately.
                  Quote: badens1111
                  It would be fair to attribute this to the time of the accession of the corn Trotskyist and later.

                  He just made it worse. Stalin tried to fight it all, but it was extremely difficult, almost impossible, taking into account external circumstances, concentration of power was required, and taking into account internal circumstances it was impossible without restricting the institutions of democracy.
                  Quote: badens1111
                  And the transition to communism, it’s more than one year. A decade ago, there were already enough corn fantasies, which, with its irrepressible cries, promised 80, communism, which inflicted a very, very detrimental blow to the country ..

                  Exactly. Perhaps more.
                  Quote: badens1111
                  And finally, I do not understand and do not perceive a cry on the verge of ultrasound in some of the leftists who, in their irrepressible fuss, made contacts with the most marginal orange scum.

                  For me, they are either fools or frank opportunistic traders of leftist ideas, like those leftists who are currently sitting in the European Parliament. Or both taken together.
  21. Severski
    Severski 17 June 2018 08: 37
    0
    It's pointless to argue with you. Your words are worthless. You just throw words, but you cannot prove them.
    Waiting for a video with the words of Larry. Olgovich,
  22. Conductor
    Conductor 11 August 2018 02: 57
    +1
    HELL. Sakharov seemed insane, but this is my, subjective view.