Military Review

Not so they are inconspicuous. Su-30MKI of India tracked the Chinese "invisible"

153
The Indian Su-30MKI radar has detected and tracked fifth-generation Chinese fighters Chengdu J-20, which flew over Tibet, according to Indian Defense Research Wing.


Not so they are inconspicuous. Su-30MKI of India tracked the Chinese "invisible"


In January, Chinese airplanes deployed on airbases in the border areas of 2018 practiced flying over mountain areas with J-10 and J-11 fighters. Indian pilots on Russian Su-30MKI aircraft observed invisible aircraft maneuvers from their airspace

Radar "Dry" sees them. New Chinese planes are not so invisible. Their detection does not require any special technology, J-20 recognized and conventional radar
- noted the commander of the Indian Air Force Arup Shah.

The Chehgdu J-20 is a fifth-generation Chinese multipurpose fighter created using low-visibility technology. Many technical solutions of the aircraft are repeated by the American F-22 and F-35 fighters. The fighter was put into service in 2017 year, built 9 prototypes and two pre-production samples.

Su-30KI - a version of the Russian heavy fighter Su-30 created for India. The aircraft is equipped with engines with a deflectable thrust vector and radar H011 "Leopard" with a phased antenna array. The radar has a high resolution and performance, it can direct missiles at air and ground targets, highlight targets for slave fighters. The Indian Air Force has 240 aircraft of this type.
Photos used:
http://skyships.ru/
153 comments
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  1. Aaron Zawi
    Aaron Zawi 19 May 2018 13: 16
    +36
    The Chinese said this was crap and their cars didn’t even approach the specified area. And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know. request
    1. Logall
      Logall 19 May 2018 13: 20
      +61
      Or do I get along say the Chinese? Invisibility is Chinese! From Amer take an example ... Or from the Israelites ...
      1. maxim947
        maxim947 19 May 2018 13: 31
        +16
        The Chinese said this was crap and their cars didn’t even approach the specified area. And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know

        In your tone, causticity is visible, why would it? winked
        And so, the rivalry of radars, radar detectors, stealth technologies, etc. will be constant and their development will accordingly go parallel to each other, however, like much more.
        1. Thrall
          Thrall 19 May 2018 13: 49
          +21
          In any strange situation, start dancing smile
          1. Shurik70
            Shurik70 19 May 2018 20: 15
            +3
            From where could the Indians understand that they saw exactly the J-20? Did you see the telescope?
            I don’t know how it is with the Chinese invisibility, but in any case, China will not report where its airplane is flying. So the Indians were a bit lying.
          2. Mayor
            Mayor 19 May 2018 20: 29
            0
            With 100 women works ...
          3. S_Baykala
            S_Baykala 20 May 2018 15: 11
            0
            Quote: Thrall
            In any strange situation, start dancing smile


            "7: 40" (if they can) laughing
        2. The comment was deleted.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. Evgeny Strygin
              Evgeny Strygin 19 May 2018 20: 20
              0
              here I see Jews Jews only in the comments and teach
        3. VO3A
          VO3A 19 May 2018 15: 49
          +13
          I really like how the first comments usually lead the discussion in a non-constructive direction ... That's the debate about radars, replaces the topic of the main detection systems on board the invisible ... If the plane includes a radar for detection. he is already in a losing position .... Everyone sees him, but he just searches for the target, and may not find it, for example, if it is invisible .... Therefore, passive detection systems are used on 5th generation airplanes, and optical electronic .... And here our SU-57 is not the first, alas ... We have an option, but you don’t know it doesn’t work .... By the way, all 4th-generation aircraft can actively use electronic warfare, but in this case .that does not save them ... On 5-kM EW systems, they are turned on after detection to ensure flight .... This is for those EW fans who sculpt "deity" from them ... Well, they found out, but there is no more information - article fake with kookid ... Provocation for an exchange of views, what is beneficial to the site ... And the fact that it is empty and useless is the second ....
          1. Boa kaa
            Boa kaa 19 May 2018 16: 59
            +13
            Quote: VO3A
            On 5-kah electronic warfare systems are turned on after detection to ensure flight .... This is for those fans of electronic warfare who sculpt them into a "deity" ...

            This is something new in the tactics of combat use of aviation !!!
            Neither you masking, covering up, leading away interference ... just - turned it on and you are floundering! But what about jamming aircraft in the TG of strike aircraft? belay
            Well, damn it, and cutting you in your free judgments on the subject of BP Avug !!! But the main thing is peremptory !!! UH !!!! am
      2. Russia
        Russia 19 May 2018 13: 48
        +11
        Definitely, everyone knows everything, but they hide it from each other. And this awareness
        is part of classified information.
      3. Piramidon
        Piramidon 19 May 2018 13: 51
        +18
        Quote: Logall
        Or do I get along say the Chinese? Invisibility is Chinese! From Amer take an example ... Or from the Israelites ...

        And in general, all this crap with "invisibles" was developed in the bowels of the KGB-GRU of the USSR and thrown to the Yankees, who have thrown trillions of greenery into the development of this myth.
        1. jjj
          jjj 19 May 2018 14: 25
          +4
          Quote: Piramidon
          all this crap with "invisibles" was developed in the bowels of the KGB-GRU of the USSR

          And not only this one.
          A number sounded yesterday. The Americans have already spent a trillion dollars on the fifth generation fighter 1 project. We spent billions in dollars on the fifth generation fighter 6-7 project
          1. freddyk
            freddyk 19 May 2018 14: 38
            +5
            jjj, So yes, the only difference between us is that we count every penny. And Americans can afford not to count grandmothers at all. So who should laugh at whom?
          2. Sergey39
            Sergey39 19 May 2018 14: 47
            +12
            What we spent on the fifth generation is for looking away. Our UFOs fly around the world and no one can still catch them
            1. Peter Rusin
              Peter Rusin 20 May 2018 10: 33
              +1
              like submarines, they are looking for the whole world but they can’t find it))))))
              1. S_Baykala
                S_Baykala 20 May 2018 15: 16
                0
                Peter! hi
                They still cannot catch Losharik, but Poseidon is next in line (on duty?). soldier
        2. S_Baykala
          S_Baykala 20 May 2018 15: 31
          0
          Quote: Piramidon
          Quote: Logall
          Or do I get along say the Chinese? Invisibility is Chinese! From Amer take an example ... Or from the Israelites ...

          And in general, all this crap with "invisibles" was developed in the bowels of the KGB-GRU of the USSR and thrown to the Yankees, who have thrown trillions of greenery into the development of this myth.


          Stepan! hi
          Vague doubts torment me: this is actually the case. As in the 15-16 century (for example), in a collision in a field, first troops will win the battle in "camouflage" (just in "dirty clothes"), due to surprise (with proper use). But then (when everyone else knows what to look at), the effect of surprise is no longer there.
          And, given that in the same hypothetical case, the opponent may have a spyglass (due to good technical development), for the “innovator” there comes a generally sad “tryndets”.
      4. Solomon Kane
        Solomon Kane 19 May 2018 14: 03
        +5
        It's like with a Chinese EM engine, EmDrive ...
        Our and European scientists (Wh from Dresden University) have proved that the statement of the Chinese about creating an engine that violates the laws of physics is a fiction .... winked
        Alexander! hi
      5. Pirogov
        Pirogov 19 May 2018 14: 27
        +11
        Quote: Logall
        Or do I get along say the Chinese? Invisibility is Chinese! From Amer take an example ... Or from the Israelites ...

        Israel has the best FU 35, because it’s free ............)
        1. Piramidon
          Piramidon 19 May 2018 17: 06
          +4
          Quote: Pirogov
          Israel has the best FU 35, because it’s free ............)

          Now Aron will be drawn and will not leave stone upon stone from your comment. angry
      6. figwam
        figwam 19 May 2018 15: 20
        +7
        In peacetime, Luneberg lenses are installed on fifth-generation aircraft to increase the EPR. And on the J-5 it is also installed.
        1. Muvka
          Muvka 19 May 2018 15: 50
          0
          Where did you read that? And yes, is there a photo, not a render?
          1. figwam
            figwam 19 May 2018 16: 22
            +7
            Quote: Muvka
            Where did you read that? And yes, is there a photo, not a render?

            So it is known from the time of F-22. This was done so that the enemy could not recognize the real EPR of the aircraft and accordingly prepare for this.
            1. Muvka
              Muvka 19 May 2018 16: 49
              0
              Well, but judging by the way the Chinese are frostbite, that they say they were not there at all, this leads to certain thoughts. That these lenses were not there.
    2. Hire
      Hire 19 May 2018 13: 22
      +10
      How can the Chinese know this?
      The Sukhoi radar sees them. New Chinese planes are not so invisible.

      The Indians perked up. laughing
      1. svp67
        svp67 19 May 2018 14: 08
        +3
        Quote: Hire
        The Indians perked up.

        And doubted some of the statements of the Americans. Since they claim that this new "Chinese stealth" is more invisible than the Russian Su-57. And now the Indians can compare something, because when they created a joint aircraft with us, they got some information.
        1. Hire
          Hire 19 May 2018 16: 18
          +3
          Sergey, welcome hi
          Quote: svp67
          And doubted some of the statements of the Americans.

          smile Practice is the criterion of truth.
    3. Mountain shooter
      Mountain shooter 19 May 2018 13: 28
      +19
      There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
      Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
      The Chinese were led to the "American tales."
      1. Seaflame
        Seaflame 19 May 2018 13: 37
        +2
        Often, some objects, over a sufficiently long period of time, can be secretive and "invisible", for example, submarines. It is clear that the physical environment is different, but nevertheless, the desire for stealth for aviation, probably also makes sense.
        1. MPN
          MPN 19 May 2018 13: 59
          +7
          Surely it makes sense, only without fanaticism, not to put in the corner of the corner. The bottom line is who will quickly discover someone ..., an alternative to stealth is a good radar that sees invisibility before, so you should consider investing in stealth or in a radar ... you need some reasonable compromise. Well, really, an airplane has a certain reflection area there, for example 5-10 m2 ..., the technology temporarily allowed to hide this area, but it didn’t go anywhere ..., there will be other means that can see it ..., like the development of optical systems ... but a lot of things ...
      2. helmi8
        helmi8 19 May 2018 13: 53
        +2
        Quote: Mountain Shooter
        There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.

        True. good It all depends on the capabilities of the detection system.
      3. dauria
        dauria 19 May 2018 15: 57
        +3
        The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


        Why fairy tales? Or by the decree of the All-Union Central Council of Trade Unions abolished the basic equation of radar? To reduce the ESR by 16 times is real. In this case, the range with the same probability will decrease by 2 times. You can compensate by increasing the power by 16 times, or the directivity (KND) of the antenna by 16 times (that is, the diameter of the "mirror"), or the sensitivity. Or all these three parameters are 2 times with a ponytail. Try to do it, everything is squeezed out there anyway. And if it works out - the enemy will also have such a locator. And again, in a duel, your spear is half as long. Invisibility is the wrong term. It is just visible at a shorter distance.
        1. Awaz
          Awaz 19 May 2018 16: 27
          0
          the thing is that the Americans initially called the planes invisible, then realizing that this was crap, they began to call them "inconspicuous", now they are simply silent along the way. Each “stealth aircraft” in even the most ancient radar receives its designation and its signature is remembered, and upon repeated observation, the system will probably recognize it much sooner than the first time by some signature features ... I’m not talking about that radars will start working in a slightly different mode constructively to better display targets and their identification
    4. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 13: 29
      +1
      Do not give a damn which of them is lying, although most likely the Chinese ... This is in any case the “+” Su-30 MKI, especially now when the Indians have not yet decided on additional purchases for their Air Force ...
    5. Chertt
      Chertt 19 May 2018 13: 39
      +11
      Quote: Aron Zaavi
      . And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know

      Both deities are Indian. If you would like to indicate the Chinese god tolerantly, I recommend Yudi or Pangu wink
    6. Morosha
      Morosha 19 May 2018 13: 39
      0
      Hindus on elephant cakes can not be carried out, for a hundred versts they make, and therefore they want F-35.
      1. Aaron Zawi
        Aaron Zawi 19 May 2018 13: 47
        +5
        Quote: Morosha
        Hindus on elephant cakes can not be carried out, for a hundred versts they make, and therefore they want F-35.

        Many want.
        1. ANCIENT
          ANCIENT 19 May 2018 13: 50
          +9
          Aaron hi - they still don’t want to spend tens of millions on this semi-finished product of pseudo-fifth generation! negative
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 19 May 2018 13: 57
            +5
            Quote: ANCIENT
            Aaron hi - they still don’t want to spend tens of millions on this semi-finished product of pseudo-fifth generation! negative

            Who does not want does not buy.
            1. kirgiz58
              kirgiz58 19 May 2018 14: 57
              +6
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              Who does not want does not buy.

              Who does not want to, they turn off the gas, .... etc. etc. But he who wants does not buy, but receives as a gift. tongue
              1. Shurik70
                Shurik70 19 May 2018 23: 51
                +2
                Israel is forced to buy the F-35, since this is a prerequisite for the provision of annual financial assistance from the United States. So there is no faith in the words of the Jews that the “F-35 is a good plane”. Jews have no choice.
                And I would like to compare. But only objectively. Because the Chinese and Russians will definitely praise their own.
            2. figwam
              figwam 19 May 2018 15: 09
              +1
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              Who does not want does not buy

              They force him and he buys.
            3. Piramidon
              Piramidon 19 May 2018 17: 13
              0
              Quote: Aron Zaavi
              Who does not want does not buy.

              It’s good for you to reason when you get it for free.
        2. Solomon Kane
          Solomon Kane 19 May 2018 14: 13
          +7
          Aron! Saving your presence.... hi C-300ПМУ1 will detect, recognize and "reassure" Ф-35 ....
          1. Aaron Zawi
            Aaron Zawi 19 May 2018 14: 18
            +5
            Quote: Solomon Kane
            Aron! Saving your presence.... hi C-300ПМУ1 will detect, recognize and "reassure" Ф-35 ....

            We will see the battle.
            1. Solomon Kane
              Solomon Kane 19 May 2018 14: 21
              +5
              You are so sure of talking about its inevitability ...
              Do you crave blood?
              1. Aaron Zawi
                Aaron Zawi 19 May 2018 18: 08
                +4
                Quote: Solomon Kane
                You are so sure of talking about its inevitability ...
                Do you crave blood?

                They will ask me a lot.
    7. Lord of the Sith
      Lord of the Sith 19 May 2018 13: 52
      +9
      And then such information immediately appears:

      HAL President Suvarna Raju said his association is ready to supply these 40 additional fighters at a cost of 4,25 billion rupees ($ 62,7 million) per aircraft (i.e., for a total of 170 billion rupees), while, according to him, , The Indian Air Force is now starting to purchase Dassault Rafale fighters at a price of 11,25 billion rupees ($ 166 million) per aircraft, without taking into account the purchase cost for Rafale weapons and technical support. The proposed 40 additional Su-30MKIs will be modified, in particular, for carrying a supersonic BrahMos A.
    8. sabakina
      sabakina 19 May 2018 14: 09
      +12
      Quote: Aaron Zawi
      The Chinese said this was crap and their cars didn’t even approach the specified area. And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know. request

      Aron, they all lie. And Israel is not an exception, but rather a rule.
    9. Slavs
      Slavs 19 May 2018 19: 13
      0
      Only Jehovah knows everything. Where is Buddha with Shiva.
    10. Machete
      Machete 19 May 2018 21: 34
      0
      If you were burned, then you start shouting the loudest that it’s crap. It has always been, is and will be.
  2. Mountain shooter
    Mountain shooter 19 May 2018 13: 21
    +2
    Hard! If this is true, Chinese specialists-designers will be tightly screwed. wassat
    1. Wiruz
      Wiruz 19 May 2018 14: 09
      +2
      It is a pity the author did not say the main thing - in which detection mode did the Indian Su-30s find them: active or passive? If active, then yes, the invisibility of the Chinese invisibility is being questioned. If in passive, then ... well ... stealth / not stealth ... he let himself be discovered request
  3. venik
    venik 19 May 2018 13: 25
    +7
    Everything is very simple - the radars of the “dryers” JUST did not know that the Chinese were “invisible” .........
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 13: 35
      +3
      I think it’s even simpler, all the invisibility of airplanes is mostly aimed at working against ground-based air defense, but here it is not ideal and land-based air defense still sees it, only detects it at a shorter distance, which makes it possible (theoretical) to strike a plane at air defense before it is discovered. And another plane sees its plane perfectly with its radar, again here the question is from what distance they spotted them, the main thing here is before they enter the affected area or in advance ...
  4. parusnik
    parusnik 19 May 2018 13: 26
    +1
    Radar H011 "Bars", as I understand it, is not created in the Chubais Nanocenter ...
    1. NEXUS
      NEXUS 19 May 2018 13: 36
      +3
      Quote: parusnik
      Radar H011 "Bars", as I understand it, is not created in the Chubais Nanocenter ...

      For many years now, there has been a debate about which radar is more effective than PFAR or AFAR. For me, PFAR is not inferior to AFAR ...
      1. impostor
        impostor 19 May 2018 13: 41
        +3
        quantum is more effective, but not the essence. The PLA has an S-400, and the Indians will campaign with the Patriots. This is flying.
      2. Muvka
        Muvka 19 May 2018 14: 27
        +1
        Quote: NEXUS
        Quote: parusnik
        Radar H011 "Bars", as I understand it, is not created in the Chubais Nanocenter ...

        For many years now, there has been a debate about which radar is more effective than PFAR or AFAR. For me, PFAR is not inferior to AFAR ...

        As for me, PFAR has only one drawback. When one element fails, the entire radar is destroyed. That's all. The rest is getting better.
        1. dvina71
          dvina71 19 May 2018 15: 24
          0
          Quote: Muvka
          When one element fails, the entire radar is destroyed. That's all. The rest is getting better.

          And afar and Pfar constructively consist of ... how to simplify .. cones. Loss of part of cones in both of them does not affect working capacity. Now, if a plane with Pfar loses an emitter, then only the passive mode remains. The main plus of afar before Pfar is compactness.
          1. Muvka
            Muvka 19 May 2018 15: 46
            0
            Quote: dvina71
            Quote: Muvka
            When one element fails, the entire radar is destroyed. That's all. The rest is getting better.

            And afar and Pfar constructively consist of ... how to simplify .. cones. Loss of part of cones in both of them does not affect working capacity. Now, if a plane with Pfar loses an emitter, then only the passive mode remains. The main plus of afar before Pfar is compactness.

            The fact of the matter is that with the loss of one cone, the AFAR continues to work, and the VFAR is completely covered until you replace it. In fact, AFAR is even more complicated that each element is individually connected, and VFAR is a chain of elements.
      3. dauria
        dauria 20 May 2018 01: 39
        0
        For me, PFAR is not inferior to AFAR ...


        Partly true. AFAR loses in efficiency and price, but it has prospects. It is easier to implement multi-range, antenna pieces spaced apart from the fuselage and wing, and a circular view. Yes, and digital processing immediately on the carrier in the elements does not promise just miracles, but completely new approaches in the review and maintenance. True, so far they only promise CAFAR. Do not worry. In microwave ovens, there will be ancient magnetrons for a long time, they are certainly not threatened with solid-state replacement because of the price.
        1. NEXUS
          NEXUS 20 May 2018 01: 51
          +1
          Quote: dauria
          True, so far they only promise CAFAR

          Digital AFAR is a good prospect, but I suppose in 3 years ROFAR will arrive in time, and this is a completely different story. hi
    2. Separ DNR
      Separ DNR 19 May 2018 13: 37
      +3
      Quote: parusnik
      Radar H011 "Bars", as I understand it, is not created in the Chubais Nanocenter ...

      Everything that came out of Chubais’s office is INVISIBLE.
      Something, of course, the Investigative Committee and the prosecutor could find, but who will let them into this red "property"?

      Anecdote:
      ... fox, hare and bear. The bear says: “We play strictly according to the rules, and if someone cheats, we’ll beat him in the face,on the arrogant red face! " ...
  5. Egorovich
    Egorovich 19 May 2018 13: 28
    +1
    The whistle is always audible to someone who has ears, but who whistled is very difficult to say. bully
  6. _Ugene_
    _Ugene_ 19 May 2018 13: 31
    +6
    it may well be true, at least on the side he has huge planes of several square meters with almost no slope, look -


    this can’t be fixed with a radio-absorbing coating, otherwise stealth could be made from any 4 generation
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 13: 38
      +3
      Any aircraft can be detected by radar and ground-based air defense and aircraft radar, the only question is from what distance.
      If they were all in a small radius, then there is nothing surprising at all ...
      1. _Ugene_
        _Ugene_ 19 May 2018 13: 42
        +4
        the question is just how far
        yes, only this is a very important issue, if the distance is several times different, then more noticeable planes are almost doomed
        1. Ratmir_Ryazan
          Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 13: 48
          +2
          Quote: _Ugene_
          the question is just how far
          yes, only this is a very important issue, if the distance is several times different, then more noticeable planes are almost doomed

          It’s not a matter of time, but whether an ordinary plane detects an invisible plane before entering its affected area ...
          There will be little sense if even the same Su-30 MKI detects a Chinese stealth only after it has already launched a rocket into it ...
          1. KCA
            KCA 19 May 2018 14: 08
            +3
            All this is in an ideal theory when somewhere far, far beyond the visibility of fighters, ground-based air defense and electronic warfare, a DRLO plane flies quietly for itself and, as a teacher, points to stealth with a pointer - you shoot right here, you shoot right there, in reality it can never to happen, the aircraft will have to turn on its radar, after that it doesn’t matter, it’s 2nd generation, 5th or 6th, at the range of its own radar it will be detected and fired
            1. Ratmir_Ryazan
              Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 13
              +1
              Quote: KCA
              All this is in an ideal theory when somewhere far, far beyond the visibility of fighters, ground-based air defense and electronic warfare, a DRLO plane flies quietly for itself and, as a teacher, points to stealth with a pointer - you shoot right here, you shoot right there, in reality it can never to happen, the aircraft will have to turn on its radar, after that it doesn’t matter, it’s 2nd generation, 5th or 6th, at the range of its own radar it will be detected and fired

              Wasn’t this already when the AWACS guided their fighters at enemy targets?
              1. KCA
                KCA 19 May 2018 15: 01
                +1
                And in the event of a conflict, hypothetical, between the Russian Federation and the United States (NATO), will AWACS not be goal number 1, for the sake of which they can also miss a couple of fighters? Wouldn't AWACS seek and destroy the MIG-31 at a range of 400 kilometers?
                1. Scalpel
                  Scalpel 20 May 2018 14: 53
                  0
                  You can use AWAX as a bait, by the way.
            2. _Ugene_
              _Ugene_ 19 May 2018 14: 17
              +3
              To do this, they work out different ligaments, for example, when only one plane is lit at a distance from the main group and transfers all the information to other planes
              1. KCA
                KCA 19 May 2018 15: 19
                +3
                How accurately will a bunch of fighters work for targeting one of them, and who will be this suicide bomber? One of the most important problems with the Fu-35 is just software, and it has not yet been treated (Windows95? :-))
            3. Boa kaa
              Boa kaa 19 May 2018 17: 26
              +1
              Quote: KCA
              A DRLO plane, and as a teacher, points to stealth with a pointer - you shoot right here, you shoot right there, in reality this can never happen, the plane will have to turn on its radar, after that it doesn’t matter if it’s 2, 5 or 6 e

              And why the "invisible" to turn on your radar !? According to link-16, he sees on his display a picture of the radar from the SARS, according to these data, and shoots. And to suggest (if there is such a need) can all the same operator with AWACS. But modern districts of VVBD are designed on the principle of "shot and forgot." The on-board equipment (with the 6 BTsEVM!) Itself does everything.
              So why would a STELS fighter turn on its own radar? What can he do with passive means (OLS, for example!)?
              1. KCA
                KCA 19 May 2018 17: 34
                +1
                So I wrote above that goal No. 1 is AWAC, when it disappears, what should I do? The F-35 does not have OLS, unlike the SU-30, 35 and 57, the use of the F-22 in long-range combat with fighters is well beyond the bounds of science fiction, they will all catch the TU-22, TU-95 and TU-160
                1. Mayor
                  Mayor 19 May 2018 17: 45
                  0
                  When the AWACS plane disappears, the goal (chaos in air defense systems) will already be achieved. One of the UAVs or f35 will be temporarily transferred to the zu function.
                  1. KCA
                    KCA 19 May 2018 17: 54
                    +1
                    3-4 MIG-31s ​​will be hunting for AWACS with a missile launch range of more than 400 km and their own speed of up to 3000 km / h, what can the F-35 or even F-22 counterpose to them? Launch a rocket in the back? So her fuel will run out sooner than catch up
                    1. Mayor
                      Mayor 19 May 2018 18: 09
                      +1
                      Well, yes. Well, if the missiles "don't go crazy." The AWACS machine has a rather high potential for suppressing gos and jamming in many ranges.
                      1. KCA
                        KCA 19 May 2018 18: 33
                        0
                        I think if RVV-DB missiles were developed to combat AWACS, then the GOS is there combined in many ways, just taking into account jamming, if one MIG flies 2 missiles, 2-4, 3-6, are they all deceived? Well, if I were a designer, I would add an option in case of loss of purpose, at least in the direction of the previous position of the target, to carry out self-detonation, 2-3 thousand pieces of tungsten of a fun configuration, and what if they fly
                    2. Korax71
                      Korax71 19 May 2018 18: 33
                      -2
                      Under 3k speed with almost empty tanks and no payload.
                      1. KCA
                        KCA 19 May 2018 20: 53
                        0
                        Actually, 3000 km / h there was a limit for the MIG-25 with 4 missiles and fuel tanks after take-off, 25 were braked due to the flashlight, and by 25 the flashlight was eventually made more heat-resistant, and there was nothing to discuss about 31, full ammunition of 3000 km / h, after firing missiles and 3300 is not a threshold, it depends on altitude, many data are no longer secret, glowed when 31 wanted to “convert” for satellite output
                    3. NEXUS
                      NEXUS 19 May 2018 23: 44
                      +1
                      Quote: KCA
                      3-4 MIG-31s ​​with a missile launch range of over 400km will hunt for AWACS

                      Where did it take you? To date, in the arsenal of the MIG-31, the most long-range air-to-air missile is the R-37, up to 300 km. As for KS-172, it is still, as far as I know, not accepted for service.
                    4. Scalpel
                      Scalpel 20 May 2018 15: 20
                      0
                      It is unlikely that someone will launch a rocket at maximum range, a miss is too likely. And a couple of hundred kilometers from AWACS, stealth can graze. And here the situation is not so simple.
                  2. KCA
                    KCA 19 May 2018 18: 19
                    0
                    What is the chaos in air defense systems? If we are talking about Russia, this is precisely the air defense system, the failure of one radar even on one isolated and devoid of communication with other SAM positions does not mean the failure of this position, the detection range, response speed, any other characteristics will decrease, but the SAM will have the ability to direct and fire, and if you take the entire complex, and not one position, then after the complete suppression and 70% of its components, 30% will continue to fire, even though you can imagine, for example, the structure of the air defense / air defense around Moscow? My friend served at the air defense control point, a simple soldier, his level was -70 meters, which is lower and how much lower he does not know
                    1. Fedalex
                      Fedalex 19 May 2018 18: 45
                      0
                      What is an air defense control point? wassat My friend served in the space and underwater space troops! Here he was telling me ... lol
                      1. KCA
                        KCA 20 May 2018 05: 42
                        0
                        The PU of the General Headquarters of Air Defense near Balashikha, is that a little clearer? Is there less relation to equestrian troops?
              2. NEXUS
                NEXUS 19 May 2018 23: 38
                +1
                Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                What can he do with passive means (OLS, for example!)?

                The pangolin, Sasha, has no OLS, as well as the F-35. hi And on the SU-57 OLS-50M has not yet shown itself.
          2. _Ugene_
            _Ugene_ 19 May 2018 14: 15
            0
            provided that both of them without the support of ground-based radars and drills
    2. Cellulitis
      Cellulitis 19 May 2018 19: 14
      0
      What stupidity ................... Detecting aircraft is in no way connected with your conclusions - you are not a specialist at all and not the person who can speak objectively! So - zilchopost))
  7. Sands Careers General
    Sands Careers General 19 May 2018 13: 45
    +4
    Outwardly ugly plane, ugly. One word, Made in China.
  8. gabonskijfront
    gabonskijfront 19 May 2018 13: 46
    +6
    Chinese technology is the most non-combatant in the world, no one knows what it is capable of, including the Chinese.
    1. Andrey Panov
      Andrey Panov 20 May 2018 14: 56
      0
      Well, judging by the tank biathlon ...
  9. Strips
    Strips 19 May 2018 13: 50
    +3
    .Many technical solutions of the aircraft are repeated by the American F-22 and F-35 fighters.


    Oh sure wassat
    Compare F-22 and F-35 regarding the materials that are used, and to many, with regard to stealth with the Chinese - just ridiculous.

    And the distance from which it was found is not indicated, unlike, for example, other aircraft, etc.
  10. Yak28
    Yak28 19 May 2018 13: 51
    +2
    Su-30MKI - a version of the Russian Su-30 heavy fighter designed for India; the Indian Air Force has 240 aircraft of this type.
    Wow, we have even less, Russia has such a territory, and airplanes with a gulkin nose.
    I’m certainly not an expert on invisibility, but it seems to me that their capabilities greatly exaggerate, I’m not sure that they will have significant advantages over 4-generation airplanes, with fresh modernization. F-15,16, Mig29, Su27 and so on, will be for a long time to come. I’m building, and most likely F-22 planes will be the first to retire
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 03
      +3
      I’m certainly not an expert on invisibility, but it seems to me that their capabilities greatly exaggerate, I’m not sure that they will have significant advantages over 4-generation airplanes, with fresh modernization. F-15,16, Mig29, Su27 and so on, will be for a long time to come. I’m building, and most likely F-22 planes will be the first to retire


      Here the question is more about tactics of application ... If an invisible aircraft can not only see the enemy, but also launch a missile on it before it is detected, then this is a significant advantage ...

      Conventionally, the F-35, for example, sees the Su-30 with 250 km (and in the bundle in the AWACS aircraft even further), and with 180 can launch it with its missile, it doesn’t matter at all that the Su-30 itself sees the F-35 from 150 km and what excellent maneuverability he has there ... He cannot sneak up on the Su-30 to the F-35 ...

      And this is very very bad ...
      1. Muvka
        Muvka 19 May 2018 14: 30
        +1
        Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
        I’m certainly not an expert on invisibility, but it seems to me that their capabilities greatly exaggerate, I’m not sure that they will have significant advantages over 4-generation airplanes, with fresh modernization. F-15,16, Mig29, Su27 and so on, will be for a long time to come. I’m building, and most likely F-22 planes will be the first to retire


        Here the question is more about tactics of application ... If an invisible aircraft can not only see the enemy, but also launch a missile on it before it is detected, then this is a significant advantage ...

        Conventionally, the F-35, for example, sees the Su-30 with 250 km (and in the bundle in the AWACS aircraft even further), and with 180 can launch it with its missile, it doesn’t matter at all that the Su-30 itself sees the F-35 from 150 km and what excellent maneuverability he has there ... He cannot sneak up on the Su-30 to the F-35 ...

        And this is very very bad ...

        And how can the F-35 detect the Su-30 with the radar turned off for 250km?
        1. Ratmir_Ryazan
          Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 38
          +2
          And how can the F-35 detect the Su-30 with the radar turned off for 250km?


          If it is off, then F-35, it will be possible it will be guided by other radars, from another aircraft and not even necessarily by AWACS, ground or ship radars ...

          Is that really a problem? Previously, there were no radars at all on fighter jets ...
          1. Muvka
            Muvka 19 May 2018 15: 12
            +5
            Well then, let's take into account our ground-based air defense systems and the A-50. You compare the naked Su-30 with the whole complex ...
          2. figwam
            figwam 19 May 2018 15: 36
            +3
            Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
            If it is off, then F-35, it will be possible it will be guided by other radars, from another aircraft and not even necessarily by AWACS, ground or ship radars.

            Any included radar, even F-35, even AWACS will immediately give itself away and will be destroyed by the enemy.
      2. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa 19 May 2018 17: 42
        +4
        Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
        Conditionally, the F-35, for example, sees the Su-30 with 250 km (and in conjunction with the AWACS aircraft even further), and with 180 can launch it with its rocket, it doesn’t matter at all that the Su-30 itself sees F-35 with 150 km and what excellent maneuverability there is ...

        Great reasoning with huge assumptions !!!
        Answer, plz, to a simple question: How can the F-22 / 35 attack our SU-30 from such a distance ... After all, AIM-120 AMRAAM max shoots only at 120km! Two of them PUT IN THE WEAPONS COMPARTMENT. But this is a medium-range weapon. A large (more than 150km) must be placed on the external sling. And with the suspension - this is not STELS, but an aircraft with a specific set of performance characteristics.
  11. ANCIENT
    ANCIENT 19 May 2018 13: 52
    +4
    The plane allegedly amphibious, flying on our engines of the 4th generation! The Chinese themselves from their lies are not funny? ??
    1. Wiruz
      Wiruz 19 May 2018 14: 11
      +1
      And they don’t laugh. According to their (Chinese) classification, it is 4 ++
  12. Simon
    Simon 19 May 2018 13: 53
    +1
    Quote: Hire
    How can the Chinese know this?
    The Sukhoi radar sees them. New Chinese planes are not so invisible.

    The Indians perked up. laughing

    The most important thing for our devices is nothing invisible! wink
  13. Cheshire
    Cheshire 19 May 2018 13: 54
    +2
    This is obtained by the Indians ... the thirtieth sushki ... more than in our ranks?
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 06
      0
      Quote: Cheshire
      This is obtained by the Indians ... the thirtieth sushki ... more than in our ranks?

      We obviously can’t fight with India, they can be sold as many planes and other weapons as they like, especially since they really pay with currency for our weapons, and not like Belarus, supposedly as a friendship ...
    2. albert
      albert 19 May 2018 20: 48
      0
      Yes, we only have 120 cars so far.
  14. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 04
    0
    Quote: Aaron Zawi
    The Chinese said this was crap and their cars didn’t even approach the specified area. And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know. request


    Soon, the Indians will write that with such an ancient radar station they also spotted a UFO :)
  15. Thunderbolt
    Thunderbolt 19 May 2018 14: 09
    +8
    Finding a plane is fine, but the Chinese could also detect and accompany the Indians. Therefore, it is important who first discovered whom, from what distance. This is the whole point of “stealth”, and not as many people think --- the radar sees stealth, therefore stealth bullshit. Not even bullshit, imagine two snipers who decided to have a duel in the forest They come together, one in bright-acid-colored workouts whistles cheerfully, and the other in the suit of the “Goblin” is silent ...
    1. Wiruz
      Wiruz 19 May 2018 14: 13
      +3
      Greetings, sane! hi
      It’s nice to read such a comment. wink
  16. Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 09
    +1
    Quote: izja
    Quote: Aaron Zawi
    The Chinese said this was crap and their cars didn’t even approach the specified area. And whoever lies there only Buddha or Shiva know. request


    Soon, the Indians will write that with such an ancient radar station they also spotted a UFO :)

    And why did the Su-30MKI radar become ancient?
  17. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 10
    +3
    Quote: Mountain Shooter
    There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
    Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
    The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


    Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 15
      +5
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
      Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
      The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


      Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.

      Tell us nothing about the successes of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex? How is it with 5-generation aircraft, stealth and aircraft carriers?
    2. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 19 May 2018 18: 35
      +2
      Quote: izja
      China entered the 5 generation arms race later than all, but was able to get ahead of many of its competitors, including Russia.

      Yah!! And men don’t know ... (c)
      Firewood also flies, and even "barrels" twirl, unless of course they are tightened up properly! Do not be mistaken about J-20 / 31 ... This is not F-22 / 35 or even SU-57. And the fact that they were put on stream with a dvigl from a partner is an indicator of how the Celestial Empire is torn into the club of the elite, and not the successes of their NIIT / R&D.
      Ours are not in a hurry to drag a raw product into the troops. Time allows you to work on bottlenecks, apparently there is something to do. But the potential of the SU-57 and J-20 is not comparable ... Amy, and even with envy look at our wunderwaffle, and you are trying to impart the unbeatable to us about hinchiks here!
      But.
  18. gabonskijfront
    gabonskijfront 19 May 2018 14: 11
    0
    India and China, these are two civilizations in which aggressiveness is not respected. They were constantly conquered, they did not gain laurels on the battlefield, but in the end the conquerors assimilated and all defeats were leveled over time. It is probably impossible to poison them seriously. Even the great provocateurs to the Americans.
  19. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 14
    +1
    Quote: NEXUS
    Quote: parusnik
    Radar H011 "Bars", as I understand it, is not created in the Chubais Nanocenter ...

    For many years now, there has been a debate about which radar is more effective than PFAR or AFAR. For me, PFAR is not inferior to AFAR ...


    Pfar is the last century, but what about your vaunted rofar? which by tradition has no analogues in the world? )
  20. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 16
    0
    Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
    Quote: izja
    Quote: Mountain Shooter
    There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
    Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
    The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


    Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.

    Tell us nothing about the successes of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex? How is it with 5-generation aircraft, stealth and aircraft carriers?


    You ask ukrov, but I am proud of our Air Force.
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 19
      0
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
      Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
      The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


      Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.

      Tell us nothing about the successes of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex? How is it with 5-generation aircraft, stealth and aircraft carriers?


      You ask ukrov, but I am proud of our Air Force.

      What are yours?
    2. Boa kaa
      Boa kaa 19 May 2018 18: 42
      +1
      Quote: izja
      and I'm proud of our Air Force.

      Really Israeli !? belay Apparently, it is difficult for a Jew to live in an independent one! recourse Isn’t it easier to hit the promised land and stop complexing about the host country? fellow
  21. Jack O'Neill
    Jack O'Neill 19 May 2018 14: 19
    +2
    And who said that J-20 should fly without Luneberg lenses? No one will shine their real EPR, neither the Chinese, nor we, nor the Americans, nor even Belarus. All these countries will not disclose the real EPR of their 5-Gn machines.
    1. Muvka
      Muvka 19 May 2018 15: 55
      0
      The Chinese said that they froze and said that their planes were not there at all.
  22. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 20
    0
    Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
    Quote: izja
    Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
    Quote: izja
    Quote: Mountain Shooter
    There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
    Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
    The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


    Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.

    Tell us nothing about the successes of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex? How is it with 5-generation aircraft, stealth and aircraft carriers?


    You ask ukrov, but I am proud of our Air Force.

    What are yours?


    Those who destroyed the shell and exterminate Iranian shoes.
  23. Ratmir_Ryazan
    Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 20
    0
    Quote: Jack O'Neill
    And who said that J-20 should fly without Luneberg lenses? No one will shine their real EPR, neither the Chinese, nor we, nor the Americans, nor even Belarus. All these countries will not disclose the real EPR of their 5-Gn machines.

    Luneberg lenses - what is it?
    1. srelock
      srelock 19 May 2018 15: 33
      +4
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Luneberg lenses - what is it?
      This is one of the options for a passive jammer. Specifically in Aviation, it is used to hide the true radar "portrait".
  24. izja
    izja 19 May 2018 14: 22
    +1
    Quote: Thunderbolt
    Finding a plane is fine, but the Chinese could also detect and accompany the Indians. Therefore, it is important who first discovered whom, from what distance. This is the whole point of “stealth”, and not as many people think --- the radar sees stealth, therefore stealth bullshit. Not even bullshit, imagine two snipers who decided to have a duel in the forest They come together, one in bright-acid-colored workouts whistles cheerfully, and the other in the suit of the “Goblin” is silent ...


    No one writes here that the Chinese could fly with the stealth turned off, no one knows what their goals were, what the purpose of the exercises was, what they worked out, or maybe the worm threw the Indians, the main thing is a beautiful headline, the rest will draw the imagination of the moron.
    1. Ratmir_Ryazan
      Ratmir_Ryazan 19 May 2018 14: 28
      +4
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Ratmir_Ryazan
      Quote: izja
      Quote: Mountain Shooter
      There are no invisible physical objects. Even if the reflected signal is greatly attenuated.
      Detection methods are improving very quickly, their sensitivity is growing. Even in radar. And there is also IR! And the aircraft’s own radio emission ...
      The Chinese were led to the "American tales."


      Russia was not able to achieve success in this industry (in stealth technologies). It’s good that in their time in the USSR they created su27 (which had excellent potential for modernization - su 30,35, even the same su 57 shows the same flanker under the moldings. The Chinese are not stupid and not fools, they invest a lot of money in the development of their aviation, Today you are mocking that they don’t have their own engines and manufacturing technology for the blades, tomorrow there will be a situation like with the fleet (the blacksmith is a bright representative of the Russian fleet). including Russia.

      Tell us nothing about the successes of the Ukrainian military-industrial complex? How is it with 5-generation aircraft, stealth and aircraft carriers?


      You ask ukrov, but I am proud of our Air Force.

      What are yours?


      Those who destroyed the shell and exterminate Iranian shoes.

      And these are those that the Syrian S-200 got ... "Heroes"? Is it now a hero to beat the Syrian army that is fighting ISIS?
      How can a language just turn around to say such a thing ... You are disgraceful fighting on the side of ISIS ...
      By the way, that shell will be restored, as well as Syria itself ... And your antics will still come back to you ...
      1. nikoliski
        nikoliski 19 May 2018 16: 46
        -1
        What a bunch of spam
    2. The comment was deleted.
    3. Orkraider
      Orkraider 19 May 2018 23: 31
      +2
      Quote: izja
      ...


      No one writes here that the Chinese could fly with the stealth turned off, no one knows what their goals were, what the purpose of the exercises was, what they worked out, or maybe the worm threw the Indians, the main thing is a beautiful headline, the rest will draw the imagination of the moron.


      Yeah, I especially liked it. About turning off the stealth. Interesting ... lol
  25. Hole puncher
    Hole puncher 19 May 2018 14: 25
    +1
    Aircraft created using stealth technology usually fly with lenses for flight safety, and the real EPR of such machines is a secret and the longer you keep it, the better. Shining new planes in front of a potential enemy is stupid, this makes no sense, I do not consider the Chinese Air Force a bunch of cretins, so I am inclined to the Chinese version.
  26. Dezinto
    Dezinto 19 May 2018 15: 03
    0
    What is he so elongated?, He probably gets more bombs on him?
  27. Amateur
    Amateur 19 May 2018 15: 08
    0
    As soon as I see the inversion trace from the plane, I’m going to patent the way to detect stealth wunderwafes right away. But natural laziness still does not give.
  28. yaaazzz
    yaaazzz 19 May 2018 16: 25
    +2
    On dryers, a very good Bars locator. And its development "Irbis" which on the Su-35 sees the F-22 estimated at 90 km, which is enough to launch the latest medium-range missiles. The Su-57 took a step even further - combining stealth, electronic warfare, perfect aerodynamics, detection tools, etc.
  29. Vol4ara
    Vol4ara 19 May 2018 16: 28
    0
    How did these stupid people get ... From what distance did they track, from 10 km? ... and what not from 150? with 150 not visible ...?

    I won’t be surprised if the Chinese also flew with lenses
  30. nikoliski
    nikoliski 19 May 2018 16: 45
    -1
    Obviously, the rumors about the Chinese achieving the Stealth technology were greatly exaggerated (a copy of the Chinese golden eagle, like the golden eagle itself, are not invisible)
  31. Lena Petrova
    Lena Petrova 19 May 2018 17: 37
    0
    Quote: freddyk
    And Americans can afford not to count grandmothers at all.

    You can’t argue against the laws of economics. Well, they already occupy the third dozen trillions, since you can just print money and solve all the problems?
    1. alaarsen
      alaarsen 19 May 2018 22: 42
      0
      Well, borrow and not give - almost the same as just typing ..
      1. Lena Petrova
        Lena Petrova 20 May 2018 14: 46
        0
        You can take new loans in some banks for quite some time, paying off% in others. But the end of such a policy is clear and inevitable. Better live within our means. Safer.
        1. Scalpel
          Scalpel 20 May 2018 15: 16
          0
          Well, so far they are getting service. debt, pay interest is all that. I don’t think that the possible consequences are not calculated there.
  32. The comment was deleted.
    1. alaarsen
      alaarsen 19 May 2018 22: 40
      0
      Well, low visibility .. and if they were noticed from the usual distance and the usual radar ......
  33. 123456789
    123456789 19 May 2018 22: 09
    +1
    Su-30MKI of India tracked the Chinese "invisible"

    If they were American tracked ...
  34. alaarsen
    alaarsen 19 May 2018 22: 39
    0
    I personally am not interested .. in India, 240 Su -30 ... And how many do we have? Yes, and the 5th generation Indians were going to order clearly more than our MO .. I certainly understand, pilots, training and TD. But no one canceled the quantitative indicators ..
    1. Scalpel
      Scalpel 20 May 2018 15: 13
      0
      Yes, the Indians actually ordered this plane for themselves, and funded. Then ours from the Ministry of Defense flew and reported: urgently give us such cars, even for the sake of it we will learn English. So the Su-30SM appeared.
  35. voyaka uh
    voyaka uh 20 May 2018 00: 49
    0
    It is unlikely that the Chinese dangled near their borders, without putting on their stealth lenses, artificially raising the plane’s ESR to the usual 10-15 m2
  36. lopvlad
    lopvlad 20 May 2018 07: 08
    0
    Chinese planes are not so invisible


    Americans came up with the invisibility of the aircraft, but this invisibility has already been refuted by the destruction of their aircraft in Yugoslavia with relatively old weapons (the old radar of the 60s saw a closer look and the old missile shot down).
    Any new modification of the radar is able to defeat decades of "licking" the designers of the airframe to reduce visibility by a few percent.
    The future of strike aviation is aircraft speed, maneuverability and abandonment of man (unmanned aerial vehicles), since people are not able to withstand extreme loads with increasing speed and maneuverability.

    fifth generation Chinese fighters


    they themselves can’t release Kalashnikov without failure and what kind of fifth generation is there?
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 20 May 2018 12: 43
      0
      "the old radar of the 60s peering" ////
      The officer-operator looked closely at the optical device. When f-117 once again flew along the usual route. There was no smell of radar there.
    2. Scalpel
      Scalpel 20 May 2018 15: 10
      0
      Chinese Kalash fought mainly in Vietnam and Afghanistan. Soviet there was a rarity, only as a trophy.
  37. Dzafdet
    Dzafdet 20 May 2018 10: 07
    0
    Quote: Aaron Zawi
    Quote: Solomon Kane
    Aron! Saving your presence.... hi C-300ПМУ1 will detect, recognize and "reassure" Ф-35 ....

    We will see the battle.

    A couple of F-xx have already been planted and taken to Moscow for disassembly and study ... tongue tongue wassat wassat
  38. Dzafdet
    Dzafdet 20 May 2018 10: 09
    0
    Quote: voyaka uh
    It is unlikely that the Chinese dangled near their borders, without putting on their stealth lenses, artificially raising the plane’s ESR to the usual 10-15 m2

    Yes, okay, what’s there, write up to 100 meters .. wassat laughing tongue
    1. voyaka uh
      voyaka uh 20 May 2018 12: 39
      0
      100 m2 is a B-52 or Tu-95. A conventional 4th generation fighter like the F-15 or Su-27 has an EPR of approximately 20 m2. On semi-stealth like the F-18 Super-Hornet, reduce to 1-5 m2
      The leopard is imprisoned for at least 5 m2.
  39. Scalpel
    Scalpel 20 May 2018 14: 49
    0
    31st slower than 25th the car is heavier and the engines of the 31st behave worse at speeds above 2M. Now the speed of the 31st is limited to 2500 km / h.
  40. Mestny
    Mestny 20 May 2018 18: 21
    -2
    Quote: maxim947
    In your tone, causticity is visible, why would it?

    Well, why?
    From the meaning of the article it is clear that Russian fighters are better than Chinese.
    Of course, not a single representative of one well-known Russophobic nationality can go past this.
    For them, it is unacceptable to recognize something Russian as the best. and usually causes animal tantrum.
    Well, here. since, in principle, they don’t directly praise anything special about Russia, he limited himself to gnashing of teeth.