Military Review

Modern pistols of the Steyr company

63
If you visit the site of any more or less well-known manufacturer weaponsthen in the catalog of products offered you can find a lot of various models for every taste and color. The catalog of the Steyr company cannot boast of such a variety of weapons. Strictly speaking, the title of the article is not entirely correct, since, at the moment, the Austrian company does not offer pistols, but, in fact, one pistol in various versions for size and ammunition. It is hard not to notice that recently the company Steyr Mannlicher does not please the consumer with new weapons, upgrading and selling the previously developed models. The same design of the surveyed pistol was developed in the 1999 year and slightly updated in the 2014. Obviously, since there is still demand for products and it is competitive, it means that it is not yet outdated and can be sold, which is quite reasonable, however, I would like to see something new from the manufacturer. In the meantime, get acquainted with the "old" pistols.


Various options for modern Steyr pistols

Work on the new weapon began in the mid-90s of the last century and already in 1999 the company introduced the M9 pistol chambered for 9x19 and 9x21. A little later, a variant of this weapon appeared already for ammunition .40 S&W - M40, and on its basis, by replacing the barrel, it was possible to make an M357 chambered for .357SIG. In parallel with the development of weapons for other cartridges, the company also created a compact weapon model designed for concealed carry, namely the Steyr S pistol, which was offered for 9x19 and .40S & W cartridges.



For all variants of M pistols, the barrel length is 101 millimeter with a total length of 176 millimeters. The weight of the gun BLNUMX is 9 grams without ammunition. It feeds this gun from stores with a capacity of 747, 10, 14 and 15 cartridges. The M17 pistols have a mass of 40 grams, and the M767 have 357 grams and use magazines with a capacity of 778 or 10 cartridges.

Dimensions and weight of compact pistols S are the same regardless of the munition used. The length of the barrel of the gun is equal to 91 millimeters with a total length of weapons 168 millimeters. The height of the gun is 117 millimeters, and its thickness is 30 millimeters. Weight without patrons 725 grams. Standard stores for this weapon have an 10 capacity of ammunition, but you can use more capacious ones, however, they will protrude outside the grip of the weapon.

In the 2014 year, the Steyr company had its weapons, during which ergonomics were improved, as well as the "durability" of the pistol when it was used in adverse conditions. In the design of the weapon, little has changed; visually, the gun before the upgrade and after can be distinguished by the handle, the seat for attaching various accessories and the shape of the safety clip. The main differences are not so noticeable and relate mainly to the processing of working surfaces of weapons and their coating.

In the process of modernization, the company expanded the range of pistols, in which the models of pistols C and L appeared. The model of pistol C occupies an intermediate place between S and M, in fact it is a pistol with a shortened barrel, but having a full-sized handle to hold. The model of the pistol L is positioned as a sport, differs from the model M by a longer barrel.

In the name of the weapon, the upgrade was reflected in the form of the addition of the A1 designation to any of the pistol variants.

Characteristics of pistols at this time more diverse, let's start with the most compact - S.



S pistols are available in three weapon variants S9-A1 and S40-A1. The first designation hides the models of pistols chambered for 9x19 and 9x21, the second designation, as you might guess, is assigned to the pistol version for .40S & W ammunition. The S9-A1 pistols have the following characteristics. Barrel length 92 millimeters with a pistol length of 166,5 millimeters. The height from the pistol grip to the rear sight is 123 millimeters. Thickness - 30 mm. The weight of the weapon without cartridges is 664 grams. The standard magazine is a magazine with a capacity of 10 rounds, but, as in the previous version, you can use more capacious magazines with a capacity of 14, 15 and 17 rounds, resigning to the fact that the magazine will stick out from the handle of the weapon.

The S40-A1 pistol has a slightly longer barrel - 96 millimeters. Accordingly, the total length of the weapon increased, which became equal to 170 millimeters. The height is the same as that of the nine-millimeter model - 123 millimeters. Weight increased slightly to 678 grams. The pistol is fed from magazines with a capacity of 10 rounds, but magazines with a capacity of 12 rounds .40S & W can also be used. There is no information that there is a version of this weapon chambered for .357SIG, but there is a kit for adapting the pistol to this cartridge. The kit includes a barrel and a return spring with a guide. With this adaptation, the shutter mirror and magazine will not have to be changed, since the .357SIG cartridge is based on the .40S & W.

As mentioned earlier, with the modernization of the pistol model C appeared, which took an intermediate place between the models S and M. This pistol, as well as the pistols S, is presented only in three versions with two designations. The С9-А1 model is offered in the version for 9x19 and 9x21 cartridges. It is worth noting that the option for ammunition 9x21 is available not only for Italy, but for everyone. The barrel length of the nine-millimeter weapon versions is equal to 92 of a millimeter, while the total length of the pistol is equal to 170 of millimeters. Height gun 132 millimeter, thickness 30 millimeters. Mass weapons without cartridges 766 grams. It feeds a pistol from magazines with a capacity of 15 or 17 cartridges, which can be “trimmed” to the capacity of 10 cartridges in accordance with local legislation.



The version of the C40-A1 pistol, chambered for .40S & W, has a barrel length of 96 millimeters with a total weapon length of 175 millimeters. The height of the pistol is 132 millimeters. The mass of the pistol is 780 grams, excluding ammunition. The pistol is fed from magazines with a capacity of 10 or 12 rounds. There is also a kit for this variant of the weapon that allows it to be adapted for use with .357SIG cartridges.



In general, the niche of models with the designation C is not entirely clear, since the pistols S clearly cannot be attributed to the so-called subcompacts.
Model M after modernization was immediately presented by four models of weapons chambered for 9x19, 9x21, .40S & W and .357SIG. Subsequently, the model of a pistol chambered for .357SIG was replaced with a set that allows the use of these cartridges in weapons chambered for .40S & W, and the pistol can be ordered immediately adapted for these ammunition.



Pistols M9-A1 and M40-A1 differ in numbers only in weight and magazine capacity, the rest of their parameters are identical. So the barrel length of the weapon is 102 millimeters with a total pistol length of 176 millimeters. The height of the pistol is 136 millimeters, and the thickness is still the same 30 millimeters. The weight of the nine-millimeter weapon options is 766 grams without cartridges. The .40S & W version weighs 776 grams. Nine-millimeter pistols are fed from magazines with a capacity of 10, 14, 15 and 17 rounds. In the version chambered for .40S & W cartridges, power is supplied from magazines with a capacity of 10 or 12 rounds.



And finally, completing the tedious part of the material about Steyr pistols, the pistol variants marked with the letter L. These pistols are presented only in versions for 9x19 and .40S & W cartridges, but conversely there are kits for converting from one caliber to another. The manufacturer endowed the L9-A1 version of the weapon with a barrel length of 115 millimeters, the same barrel length for a pistol chambered for .40S & W. The length of both pistol variants is also the same and equal to 188,5 millimeters. The nine-millimeter pistol is 142 millimeters high, while its larger caliber version has a slightly lower height of 136 millimeters. Both pistols are 30 millimeters thick. The weight of the nine-millimeter pistol is 817 grams without cartridges. Food is provided from stores with a capacity of 17 rounds. The magazine can be "trimmed" to 10 rounds to meet the requirements for civilian weapons in individual countries. The pistol chambered for .40S & W has a mass of 838 grams and is powered by a magazine with a capacity of 12 rounds, the capacity of which can also be shredded.



It should be noted that within the framework of one weapon option, the transition between all the proposed ammunition can be carried out by replacing individual nodes. So the M9-A1 pistol, after replacing the magazine, barrel, casing and return spring, becomes the M40-A1 full-fledged, so in principle, within one weapon variant, division according to ammunition is rather arbitrary.

Appearance and ergonomics pistols

The appearance of modern Steyr pistols is quite interesting, and it is very difficult to confuse this weapon with something of the monotonous mass currently on the market. First of all, an unusual handle of a weapon catches the eye, which, despite its unusual appearance, turns out to be quite comfortable. But it should be noted that it is convenient only for those who have an average palm size, for people with large palms the thickness of the handle will be insufficient, and the gun does not have interchangeable linings that would at least partially compensate for this disadvantage.



The second thing that catches the eye is the lack of a safety switch, which is already the norm for modern pistols. The only thing that saves from an accidental shot is the automatic safety key on the trigger and the relatively heavy stroke of the trigger. You can also mention the lock located near the lever for disassembling weapons. This lock, in theory, should exclude the possibility of using weapons by children or in the event of a theft of a pistol. In fact, the device of this lock is so simple that you can open it using stationery without a special key.

Modern pistols of the Steyr company


Sights gun consist of an unregulated rear sight and front sight, which are mounted on the cover-bolt in dovetail mounts. The manufacturer itself offers a choice of several options sights, which can replace the standard. Conversely, it is already possible to purchase weapons from many dealers with completely replaced ones and a front sight.



If we talk about personal impressions, then this is one of the few pistols with which it was possible to meet in person. He left a very positive impression, especially in the process of shooting. Apparently, the low-set barrel of the pistol plays a significant role, since it feels like there are no weapons left on the aiming line when fired. In fact, the weapon certainly deviates from the line of sight, but very quickly returns to the starting point, which is facilitated by the pistol handle and the location of the barrel.

Steyr pistol design

The basis for the Steyr pistols, now on the market, was the automation system with a short barrel stroke. The barrel is locked when the tide is above the chamber in the window for ejection of spent cartridges. The system is not new, used in many other models of weapons from different manufacturers, has established itself as optimal for short-barreled weapons, for fairly accurate shooting at distances up to 50 meters.



Shock trigger udnikovy with dovzvodom when you press the trigger. It is the dovzvod that determines the force of pressing on the trigger when shooting, which to some extent affects the accuracy, but ensures relative safety and the possibility of carrying a pistol with a cartridge in the chamber, which in turn makes it ready for immediate use immediately after removal. Another Austrian introduced a fashion for this trigger mechanism, and judging by the products of other companies, such a trigger is really justified and reliable with proper quality.

In general, in the design of Steyr pistols at the moment you can not find something unusual, all the solutions are familiar and already tested by time.

Conclusion

Recently, the company Steyr is often criticized, and the criticism is directed precisely to the fact that the arms company does not represent new products. Is it worth criticizing the fact that by creating a successful model of weapons the company continues to modernize and improve it, instead of creating dozens of other models that still do not know how to show themselves in operation. In addition, the company does not deal only with short-barreled weapons, from time to time it is possible to see new items from it, which, although they do not create noise around themselves, are always distinguished by quality and reliability.

If you go back to the Steyr pistols, they are not widely used because of a slightly higher cost than similar weapons from other manufacturers. Nevertheless, these pistols are quite actively used by law enforcement agencies of Austria, Germany, Georgia, Malaysia, Thailand, Turkey and the UK. These pistols received deservedly approving reviews in the US and European civilian markets.



It is very doubtful that the designers of Steyr do not conduct at the moment the development of a new weapon, because previously the designers of this company considered quite interesting solutions in the field of firearms. Most likely, that managers simply soberly look at things and are in no hurry to fill the market with their products, which would be inferior to the currently produced samples according to their characteristics. Even one mistake with a single weapon model can significantly affect the company's reputation, which in the future will be very difficult to restore. Moreover, if not the most successful weapon model enters the market, then it is followed by even less successful ones, which finally kills consumer confidence in the company, an example of which may be Remington, which still cannot take the lost place.

So Steyr for the fact that at the moment they offer, in fact, only one gun, is not worth scolding. Rather, it is even a plus for the company, since it is easier to monitor the quality of the products produced, and the consumer does not need to worry about the problem of choice if he stopped at the Steyr pistols.

Source: steyrarms.com
Author:
63 comments
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  1. RaptorF22
    RaptorF22 18 May 2018 15: 20
    +6
    I liked a good article. hi That’s what I understand. Everything that your heart desires. hi any caliber whatever the customer wants wink Alas, we have a normal cop as well as the market and laws do not give the opportunity to purchase even for big money request
    1. Curious
      Curious 18 May 2018 22: 13
      +3
      For "big money" - you can.
      1. AlexMark
        18 May 2018 23: 51
        +7
        laughing For BIG money, you can purchase several islands, organize your own state on them, with your own legislation loyal to civilian firearms. For a little less money, you can organize a private company engaged in the development and production of firearms. For an even smaller amount, you can move to relocate to another state, where it is possible to own a CS, even to non-citizens. For even less money, you can become an athlete and also the owner of the COP. Without money, you can become a law enforcement officer or replenish the ranks of the military, in the latter case, even the machine will give. And they say "it is impossible, it is impossible ...", there are so many options wink
        1. RaptorF22
          RaptorF22 19 May 2018 00: 08
          +4
          The Americans have more options, but what you offer people doesn’t roll, you need a normal arms market and not a corruption-oriented serf arms market wink
        2. Horse, people and soul
          Horse, people and soul 29 June 2018 18: 14
          0
          I will sell two Estonian islands of Saaremaa and Hiiumaa. If there is little money, I can offer Kihnu and Ruhnu.

          Shipment at own expense.

          hi
      2. RaptorF22
        RaptorF22 19 May 2018 00: 11
        +2
        Big money does not help in any way if there is no normal legislation and the civilian arms market and the next 6 years will not
        1. AlexMark
          19 May 2018 05: 31
          +6
          I understand that I knock peas on the wall, but still smile Why do you need a COP?
          1. Self-defense from bipeds. With the current legislation, you can safely buy a gun illegally. In the case of use, it will still give a period for exceeding the limits, which will exceed the period for illegal storage, especially if everything is fatal.
          2. Entertaining shooting. For this, and now there are shooting galleries and it is quite possible to shoot them from the heart at normal targets, safely and without irritating others. More than confident that a trip to the shooting range would be preferable to searching for a deserted and remote place where you can also shoot at your pleasure. And in the process of finding a car you will get dirty, you will get stuck somewhere, you will look for a tractor ... Do you need it when there is a special place with convenient access and parking?
          3. Self-defense from the multi-legged. Many of the mushroom pickers would not mind taking a CS with them and they can be fully understood. But whatever one may say, a gun will be more effective when firing at a boar and a bear. And you can’t put a gun into a backpack, you want it or not, but it will be close at hand. The truth in the case of a meeting with the forester will need to be explained, but these are nuances.
          4. To the soul warmed and it was possible to disassemble it to collect. Buy MMG and rejoice.
          So it turns out that the COP is under the current legislation and is not needed at all))) Of course, it's nice to go to the same shooting range with YOUR pistol and ammunition. But if you are really interested in acquiring shooting skills, if you really like firearms, then you can always find an opportunity and explore it and shoot at your pleasure. request You can even say that the state saves from prison and spending money on weapons and ammunition, and you are unhappy laughing
          1. Curious
            Curious 19 May 2018 09: 54
            +1
            Why, when meeting a boar or a bear, shoot a gun?
            1. RaptorF22
              RaptorF22 19 May 2018 11: 32
              0
              If you are ready for me to wear a carabiner weighing 24 kg absolutely free 4 hours a day, then the question with cop can be removed wink And that I do not need a cop I have a man ready to wear his personal squire so to speak lol Moreover, it’s absolutely voluntary, because of my beliefs, that I don’t buy a cop all my life to transport and do all the work for me lol It’s not a question if I’m ready to remove the question from the cop, and the opponents of the cop will replace the cop at their own expense and their belief wink They apparently have no idea why Americans carry revolvers and pistols in nature much more often than rifles wink If you are ready to replace the cop with voluntarily and absolutely free of charge wink
            2. AlexMark
              19 May 2018 12: 45
              +1
              Also as an option laughing But in principle, the COP can help with such a meeting, something under the .50AE or a revolver for a rifle cartridge. Even among the common .45ACP there are a lot of interesting variants of cartridges, but at such a meeting I would still prefer to have a gun.
              1. RaptorF22
                RaptorF22 19 May 2018 13: 09
                0
                Here is for yourself and decide wink have a gun wink
                1. AlexMark
                  19 May 2018 13: 15
                  +1
                  That is, the answer is why YOU do not read the short-barreled weapon? By the way, with this question you need to start the procedure to receive any firearm. I could not clearly answer, hesitated - go think laughing
                2. tracer
                  tracer 19 May 2018 13: 36
                  0
                  "Piglet do you have a gun at home?"
            3. Horse, people and soul
              Horse, people and soul 29 June 2018 18: 19
              +1
              In Alaska, a revolver Ruger Alaskan .44 Magnum is worn against a bear.

              Survivors after the meeting say - enough. Not survivors - they say nothing.

              request
          2. RaptorF22
            RaptorF22 19 May 2018 11: 21
            +3
            I understand that I knock peas on the wall lol I offer you an extremely simple solution, you to all of us who provide security at your expense 24 hours a year, wherever we are wink Since then, at the expense of your personal time and life of money, you will serve our interests laughing And that you do not want a cop and do not lol But here for other people do not have to decide lol And then it may happen that there is another group of citizens who decides why this person should let the apartment live in a government building lol Why does he need a car? What if he sits behind a car tomorrow and will shoot down women and children like skittles winked Let the bus ride wink And why should this citizen give a cottage for 10 km? Let them take the cottage from the state and pay the amount of money that we decided for him winked And so for you people will decide who, in principle, doesn’t care why you need a car apartment wife children summer house personal life what kind of work do you want? How much do you have to relax? winked Do you want yourself such a life? Flag in your hands a drum around your neck and let them decide and think for you wink Want slavery for yourself ??? It’s not a question of living, just get rid of the bad habit of getting into other people's affairs with your nose, otherwise they can accidentally pincer lol
            1. Curious
              Curious 19 May 2018 12: 17
              +3
              I wonder how many people wrote this comment?
              1. RaptorF22
                RaptorF22 19 May 2018 12: 44
                0
                I wonder what the man who wrote about suicide thought? wink
                1. AlexMark
                  19 May 2018 13: 11
                  +3
                  Obviously about common sense. Even if you allow the COP, most people will get something under 9x19 or even under 9x18 in order to save. The result of shooting a bear or a boar with such weapons will not please you at all. That is what was meant, I think.
                  1. Curious
                    Curious 19 May 2018 13: 41
                    +1
                    The price of a revolver that is designed specifically for the "forest" type RUGER REDHAWK in the United States starts at $ 1100. It is unlikely that it will be cheaper in Russia, while Saiga 9 starts at $ 200.
                    1. RaptorF22
                      RaptorF22 19 May 2018 13: 51
                      +1
                      I definitely don’t need this Saiga after I saw that it was with the face of the owner of the saiga 9x19 when he had a double feed and the carbine went into the scrap
                      1. AlexMark
                        19 May 2018 14: 10
                        +2
                        So no question, buy MKE T94A2 for 3000-4000, not for 200 wink
                    2. AlexMark
                      19 May 2018 13: 54
                      +3
                      I am even more than sure that on the domestic market it will be even more expensive one and a half times, if not two times. After all, everyone wants to put something in the pocket of the cost of the weapon, and this is not at all 10 dollars. I do not quite understand why this revolver is positioned as a "forest" one, there are a lot of cheaper options for the same .44 Magnum. At S&W, you can pick up something up to 1000.
                      It's funny that a person cannot answer why he needs a COP, or rather not even funny, but strange.
                      1. Curious
                        Curious 19 May 2018 15: 58
                        +1
                        If you want to go hunting with your revolver, for example, in Zimbabwe, then your trunk should be at least 20 inches. Violation of local laws pulls for 12 years the local prison.
                2. Curious
                  Curious 19 May 2018 13: 25
                  +1
                  About how many people wrote a comment.
            2. AlexMark
              19 May 2018 12: 47
              +2
              You have not answered, why does the CS need you personally? Just because you want? You are so eager to have something short-barred, apparently there are adequate and reasoned reasons. Sound them please, taking into account what I wrote above. So far it turns out something like "I want it because I can't."
              1. RaptorF22
                RaptorF22 19 May 2018 13: 19
                0
                Tell me when you buy any car you want, you also zealously prove to everyone why you need a car and why you need it? wink And if there is a person who will climb to you and be interested in why and why you want to spend your money on this or that thing that you most need or liked wink You heard about the laws of the market wink demand creates supply if people are willing to buy and spend their money is their business wink They sell rifles of 12.7 caliber or 300 winmag, and people line up behind them wink It means that they will acquire a cop for their purposes wink
                1. AlexMark
                  19 May 2018 13: 34
                  +3
                  Do not believe it, but before buying a car, an adult first of all thinks about how much he needs it. On the costs that such a purchase entails in the future. People consult, are interested in the opinions of friends.
                  And yet, why specifically YOU short-arms?
                  I'll ask you this question often now laughing
          3. RaptorF22
            RaptorF22 19 May 2018 14: 13
            0
            The state protects people lolfunny well just awful laughing Do you really believe that? wink Well done great fun wink It is necessary to show those people who have already checked for themselves how it protects them lol Does anyone except very naive people believe that it saves us? I knew one kind pensioner who lived for himself, believed in a state that protects him and protects him, and they came to him and they children and brutally beat him No. the kingdom of heaven protects him so much that he was buried in a closed coffin, and six months before that we argued with him and he proved to me that everything is fine, we don’t need any weapons, but it will be like in America No. Unfortunately, he tested the theory on himself how the state protects him No. Another person with whom I once worked was gobbled up by a bear while fishing and all that was left was buried in a closed coffin, although I warned him that as a result of the brilliant policy of the appointed governor, the beast had been brought to a dangerous point and offered to buy him a gun or carbine but he but he listened to TV and there hoplofoby and prohibitionists almost jumped out of their pants and screamed how terribly they didn’t need a cop weapon and other nonsense; good people were in America people can buy a cop for their needs or whatever they need and thanks to us such bury-bank attitude of people in closed coffins
            1. AlexMark
              19 May 2018 14: 28
              +1
              Well, if you have not noticed, then there was a joke, but oh well.
              Let's specifically follow the two examples you give. And in the first and in the second case, the gun would be much preferable to the COP, even though in the first case there was a closed space.
              For self-defense on the street, so I will tell you that there is nothing to go where they can offer to buy a brick. This time. And two is simple math. How much cash do you carry and how much does your phone cost? Much more than a lawyer will cost you later with an unknown result? Do you think that if you put a gun on the crowd of “oni-children”, will they immediately respect you and fall down? It will be completely wrong, just run away, then they will watch you and at some point they will attach you to one of the quiet evenings in the back and take your pistol.
              The presence of a gun on the belt does not add to you absolutely nothing, except for absolutely not necessary self-confidence. When you begin to think soberly, weigh the pros and cons, scroll through a couple of scenarios in your head with the consequences of the application, it may come to you slowly and you will begin to understand that there are weapons, what advantages it gives and what responsibility it places.
              And again, why specifically YOU shortbore?
              1. RaptorF22
                RaptorF22 19 May 2018 14: 55
                0
                The pensioner was brutally beaten in his own house, they punched his head in the chest and after that they beat him with chairs and legs from the table am I personally saw his disfigured body so that he didn’t rob the mobile or he wanted money, but just for fun am In America, our grandfather could calmly shoot them since they violated his private property and not wait until they go into his house and start kicking a defenseless old man and beating his furniture about him over an unfortunate fisherman whose remains were collected for 3 days, a bear was bitten in one place but I dragged what was left of him in different places, I told him that I needed to take a gun or carbine with me, he answered me that carrying a gun or carbine is not very comfortable, heavy and clings to trees and bushes hoping for a chance and listening to our hoplophobes and forbids oil for all kinds of horseradish tv, unfortunately, and listened to it in America, he could buy himself what kind of comfortable cop he was and calmly carry at least one at least two, and thanks to our hoplophobes and prohibitions, it wasn’t even such an opportunity for us that these two people believed that the state protects them, it’s a pity that they tested this theory on their own, I hope now it’s clear why at least why personally I want to buy a cop? But people on the other side seem to very much believe that the state will surely save them as these two unfortunate No.
                1. AlexMark
                  19 May 2018 15: 20
                  +2
                  You are now trying to play on emotions, but in the first case, not the absence of the COP, but the lack of weapons in principle and questions about the law. In the second case, a convenient, that is, light and compact pistol or revolver would have been for an ineffective cartridge, and a weapon for really effective ammunition would be too burdensome for a fisherman to carry.
                  You are trying to solve a set of problems in one incomprehensible way - resolve the COP. Well, what's next? For those people who thought that he did not need a weapon now, he would not appear even after permission. Both situations would have remained with the same outcome, I assure you.
                  All these dances around permission, for the moment, are arranged only for a relatively small group of people to be able to buy what they want. And, as it turned out, clearly answer the question "why?" some can't.
                  1. RaptorF22
                    RaptorF22 19 May 2018 15: 50
                    0
                    Friend, I answered you, even gave a more than understandable and detailed answer fellow But if it’s incomprehensible to you, I repeat once more Americans wear a cop as a weapon of self-defense wink from the beast of a person it does not matter against whom they use it quite effectively and successfully, and they have a wide choice because they have adequate legislation and more than a large selection of any weapon wink There is a developed market, choose what you want wink for every taste and color and wallet winked Are we worse? I talked with people, business builders and so on and so forth, and most would like to buy and own, but only with rifled weapons you can carry it like a different firearm to keep in clubs they don’t want and this is their own business wink Perhaps everything said now I'm more attracted by the phrase about FREE SALE OF WEAPONS is a much more interesting discussion than ours hi
                    1. AlexMark
                      19 May 2018 16: 00
                      +2
                      Well, we are beginning to slowly come to the same conclusions, it’s not just necessary to allow, but to make changes in the legislation before that? laughing Progress - we enter the dialogue)))
          4. would
            would 23 May 2018 17: 08
            0
            It's funny that such a text was written by a man with the flag of Belarus where the cop is just the same legal for athletes right up to the right to "transport" in a holster. Bought more than real, no incredible requirements in the Russian Federation.

            Maybe you would better study the legislation of your country, and only after you switch to Russian?
          5. CYM
            CYM 24 May 2018 22: 08
            0
            In addition, even if they allow the COP, then with numerous prohibitions on its wearing. As now with the OOP: it’s impossible to go to court, you can’t go to the subway, you can’t take part in cult events ... With such “wearing” chances to be at the right time with a miserable barrel. Self-defense completely agree. But shooting galleries and shooting ranges are not enough and the prices are horseback. sad
          6. Horse, people and soul
            Horse, people and soul 29 June 2018 18: 27
            0
            Under Estonian law, there are four categories for weapons:

            A) performance
            B) sports
            C) self-defense
            D) hunting

            There is still a collection where you can buy shells and machine guns that cannot be purchased in the above categories, but only to exhibit, brush like dust, wipe with oil, and you can’t shoot unless the weapons are authorized for these four categories.

            Fully automatic weapons - not.
    2. AlexMark
      18 May 2018 23: 38
      +2
      No, the article "weak" turned out, I myself feel recourse I have already told you that, as an athlete, you can buy a CS as you please) The path is dreary and not fast, but it exists)))
  2. bouncyhunter
    bouncyhunter 18 May 2018 17: 16
    +2
    Mark, thanks for the article! hi I read and involuntarily remembered the commercial failure of the Steyr TMP submachine gun, as a result of which all the documentation for it was sold to the Swiss Brugger und Thommet, which make it with minor changes under the MP9 marking.
    1. AlexMark
      18 May 2018 23: 40
      +3
      Welcome hi Thanks for the tip for the new material) Recently, you can not break your head about what to write, just read the comments smile
      1. bouncyhunter
        bouncyhunter 19 May 2018 00: 53
        +1
        Mark, I am always ready to provide all possible assistance. soldier
  3. alex-cn
    alex-cn 18 May 2018 19: 10
    +1
    I don’t see a problem in that, let’s say, one gun. unification of production and service technologies is also worth a lot. Yes, and the user is easier.
    1. AlexMark
      18 May 2018 23: 43
      +2
      I have always said that if something works and works well, then you need to use it to the maximum, until something better appears so that it is advisable to make a replacement. But this does not mean that you should not look for any new solutions, otherwise the best will never appear. smile
  4. RaptorF22
    RaptorF22 19 May 2018 14: 22
    0
    Why do I need him? When a buyer spends his money, thanks for your advice AlexMark,
    1. AlexMark
      19 May 2018 14: 32
      +2
      laughing Spite mom froze my ears? Well, the simple question is that there is nothing complicated in it and you will not reveal any secret to anyone. Just answer for yourself, why do you need a gun or a revolver?
      You do not take offense, but it is very strange when a person protects the legalization of short-barreled weapons so much, but he himself does not know what exactly he needs.
      1. RaptorF22
        RaptorF22 19 May 2018 15: 15
        0
        I already answered you read above wink If you do not want to protect your life and property, your business wink Continue to believe that the state will surely save and protect you winked But persuasive advice is not good for all people with their questions in their personal affairs wink And then they will think that they are planning something bad once they sniff out everywhere and delve into their lives winked And they can react and misinterpret your actions wink lol
        1. AlexMark
          19 May 2018 15: 58
          +2
          Number of times. You have not answered why you need the COP. Number two. You did not give a single example where the advantage of the COP would be obvious. Number three. I asked you only one question, why did you need the COP, I didn’t even think to dig in your life, I would have more shovel to clear my rubble laughing
          Under the current legislation, the use of firearms is already the most extreme measure, when the question is either you or you. If such a situation develops at home - there is a gun next to it, and even if such a coincidence has developed outside the house, then the result will be the same for you, what with a legal pistol, that with an illegal one. You need to start with the legal framework, and not with the requirements of "GIVE! GIVE !!!"
          At the moment, apart from your unreasonable desires, there are no reasons to give you permission personally, you cannot even explain clearly what the COP is for. And now think what opinion those who read all this disgrace is about those who simply crave to get a legal short-barreled weapon, if you cannot answer the question that is completely adequate and DOES NOT ABSOLUTELY YOUR PERSONAL LIFE.
          I understand that you are just trying to throw a certain substance on a fan, but as I noted for my short dwelling on a resource, here people are mostly adults and sensible people who are not loud enough for slogans, they need specific justifications, and not a chaotic story about their wishes mixed up with complaints "but they have."
          Do you want to contribute to the legalization of short-barreled weapons? Make at least an article on this issue, in which you clearly and reasonably determine why it is your opinion that you need legalization, which amendments should be made to the legislation. Describe the reasonable advantages and disadvantages of legalization, give examples of other countries, but not with the statistics as usual, but with the actual, taking into account how many times the CS was applied for the period of time, as well as the proportion of the presence of the CS during illegal actions.
          If you do not play with facts, but speak as is. If you find a reasoned rationale for legalization, which will be difficult to challenge, then they will start supporting you. And “give because I want,” “give because others have, and we don’t” reminds how a small child asks for a toy, because he saw the same from another child.
          1. RaptorF22
            RaptorF22 19 May 2018 16: 56
            0
            I think you can not worry and not worry wink COP under Putin will definitely not be allowed winked Well, except for retirees of the Russian Guard on retirement read the hansa wink Such initiatives once again show who decides what in Russia wink So you can calmly wink On the other hand, this is an excellent indicator of how the state protects us. wink I think if those who are allowed by the COP will arrange a firing in order to prove who you are and who he is wink You surely even after that will not be against them ksa wink
            1. AlexMark
              19 May 2018 18: 03
              +2
              That is, in your opinion, the resolution of the CC will also eliminate class inequality?
              1. RaptorF22
                RaptorF22 19 May 2018 19: 06
                0
                Have you heard about justice? Our people can endure a lot wink But one thing he doesn’t like is definitely not justice about class inequality, this is not for me wink This question is best addressed to those who believe in a state that will protect and save wink I think and they will be able to explain how they protect us if on the one hand fat faces that do not fit into the TV and say thank you very much to you personally, and on the other hand people who are indignant with indifference to their lives who just want to live like people winked In general, the theme of the scary cop is sucked from the finger wink There are owners of smooth-bore rifled carbines and there will be owners of cops not really soon, but in 6 years 7 wink When will a president appear who understands that ignoring the interests of his voters is impossible and unacceptable winked
                1. AlexMark
                  19 May 2018 20: 13
                  +2
                  I will not continue the controversy regarding the policy of a neighboring state, this is not my business, but as I understand, you did not vote for the current president. Wherein
                  When will a president appear who understands that ignoring the interests of his voters is impossible and unacceptable
                  So the question is, you are not his voter, why would he take into account your interests? laughing
                  Justice ... for 85-90% if there is on a loaf of butter, then everything is already ok in this life and they meant justice and so on. Well, to happen something out of the ordinary, to ponder, discuss and forget.
                  1. RaptorF22
                    RaptorF22 20 May 2018 00: 23
                    0
                    You have a very interesting justice lol Bun with butter and for the rest do not care wink I think the outraged residents of Volokolamsk will not agree with you winked
                    1. AlexMark
                      20 May 2018 00: 39
                      +2
                      This is not my justice, but the observation of what is happening around.
  5. Lerych
    Lerych 19 May 2018 15: 51
    +2
    In Texas, a boy with a short barrel came to school. - 10 US citizens. The boy is alive. Not noticeably violent self-defense.
    1. AlexMark
      19 May 2018 16: 07
      +2
      This position is also not entirely correct, much more of these situations occur with long-wavelength. These are the two extremes of "allow everything", "ban everything". It is necessary to study the experience of other countries, it is necessary to form a legislative base accordingly, in parallel with this, to prepare the society (at least to open the same shooting galleries at schools everywhere), so that at least the majority understand that there are weapons, and were not familiar with it only by taking the oath. All this is done not in a year or two.
      1. RaptorF22
        RaptorF22 19 May 2018 17: 07
        0
        Friend is much easier to write winked Until Tsar the priest does not allow nothing will be wink So everything is fine wink 6 years of stability, everything is fine wink That's just how you are going to stop the boys with cops and even with connections if you are unarmed is a big question fellow They don’t care what you offer and write wink They will have their own truth, their unique view on and the experience of other countries. wink They just point the gun and popularly explain what and how to correctly wink
        1. AlexMark
          19 May 2018 18: 06
          +2
          laughing All can be explained to you in a popular way even without a trained gun.
    2. RaptorF22
      RaptorF22 19 May 2018 17: 00
      0
      Don’t worry, soon we’ll be allowed a cop for pensioners of the Russian Guard and such boys with connections only will clearly show who they are and who such a person without a cop is possible opponents of the cop will immediately understand what it is to be unarmed against an armed wink
      1. AlexMark
        19 May 2018 18: 09
        +2
        That is, are we going to fight with pensioners of Rossguardia and boys with connections? I'll tell you a baaaaaaa secret. Boys if they want, and now can have a fully-fledged pistol or revolver. And how, have you already spoken with a gun pointed at you?
    3. would
      would 23 May 2018 17: 11
      +1
      And where will violent self-defense come from where it is forbidden to carry weapons at the federal level? Schools are gan-free zones, that is, zones without weapons and no civilian has the right to bring weapons there. “There” is both inside the school and in the area of ​​1000 feet (304.8 meters) around it. Well, law-abiding Americans law-abiding did not bring weapons to where it is forbidden, unlike an illegitimate schoolboy. And they didn’t shoot back law-abidingly. The result is known.

      And the most interesting is that most of these executions take place in the gan-free zones. It is not known whether this is a coincidence or not, but for example, a killer from Aurora drove past a movie theater where weapons are allowed and went to kill in a movie theater which is a free zone.

      Americans know this better than we do and entire states are protesting against the free zones and even at the federal level, the question of lifting this ban that protects the criminal is being discussed.
  6. DimerVladimer
    DimerVladimer 21 May 2018 14: 02
    0
    Obviously, since there is still a demand for products and they are competitive, it means that they are not out of date and can be sold, which is quite reasonable, however, I would like to see something new from the manufacturer. In the meantime, get acquainted with the "old" pistols.


    In general, this corresponds to the logic of business - if a product is in demand, why "kill it" by launching an even better product on the market - creating competition for itself?
    Mass production has been established, there is demand - everything is logical.
  7. John22
    John22 22 May 2018 20: 55
    0
    Good pistols, good designs, good options. It is difficult to come up with something fundamentally new and why drive the quantity if there is quality.
  8. NF68
    NF68 25 May 2018 15: 44
    0
    Beautiful "toys."
  9. Catfish
    Catfish 21 August 2018 13: 21
    +1
    Quote: AlexMark
    2 You did not answer why you need the COP.


    Why is it needed? Elementary Watson!
    "We have a simple answer to any of your questions. We have a" COP ", but you don't!"
    Quote, naturally. Just replaced "Maxim" with "KS". And, you know, oddly enough, I almost agree with all the disputants. And the whole question rests on only one thing: a normal and intelligible law on self-defense. And everyone knows this very well.

    Thank you, Mark, for the interesting article, as always. hi

    PS Raptor, buddy, don’t worry, we live in such a country. There are problems far more urgent than the permission to purchase a COP. request