Military Review

Suffered for the faith. Part two. General from the cove

144
The first material on the content of the Penza Martirologist mainly dealt with male and nun clerics, who were often shot for distributing religious books and “agitation”, and in a country whose constitution did not prohibit freedom of conscience, but was allowed by law. However, people who had only an indirect relationship with the church got into the "Martyrology". They are not so many, but they are. For example, a person performed the duties of a church trustee and, moreover, was a sincere believer.


Suffered for the faith. Part two. General from the cove

V.N. Voyeikov

And now, looking through the "Martyrology", I found in it the name of a person of a truly amazing fate, so amazing that you can shoot or write a novel about him. Few know about him today. But in tsarist Russia, his name was at the hearing, and people with a position over him even laughed and called ... "the general of the co-hawkeri". We are talking about Vladimir Nikolayevich Voeikov, Major General, Commandant of the Suite of His Imperial Majesty, the statesman of Russia and ... the founder of the Kuvaka water bottling plant, which still operates in the Penza Region. So, for more than a hundred years we have been “drinking on” the inheritance of the Russian Empire. The country is now completely different, and [right] [/ right] here is the “Kuwak” as it flowed from the ground and flows. Here are just a commodity, it became precisely the efforts of General Voeikov ... About him today and our story goes.

He was born the next general in 1868 of 14 in August in St. Petersburg, where he spent his childhood. He belonged to an old noble family, known from the XIV century. Father - cavalry general Ober Chamberlain Chamber Dvor E.I.V. Voevik N.V., had a large estate in the Penza province, and V.V. Dolgorukov’s mother was also not a simple one, but the daughter of the Moscow Governor-General Prince V.A. Dolgorukov. He himself, in turn, was married to the daughter of the Minister of the Imperial Court and the Parcels, Adjutant General Count VB Fredericks Evgenia Vladimirovna Frederiks. And it was he who was the godfather of the holy martyr Tsarevich Alexei Nikolaevich Romanov.


Voeikov V.N. and Baron VB Fredericks.

His career was straight and traditional: 1882-1887. training in the Corps of Pages, whence with the rank of cornet was issued to the Cavalry Guard Regiment. In 1894, a business trip abroad as an orderly to the adjutant general, Admiral OK, followed. Kremer, whose task was to notify the accession to the throne of the emperor Nicholas II.

С1887, he served in the Horse Guards. But in 1897-1898. he worked as a clerk for the restructuring of the regimental church in the name of Sts. the righteous Zechariah and Elizabeth at the barracks of the Cavalry Guard Regiment in St. Petersburg, for which he personally raised funds, and then was appointed ktitor of this church.

In 1890, the year was recorded in the 6 part of the Noble Family Tree of the Penza Province and was elected an honorary citizen of Nizhny Lomov. From July 1900 to August 1905, he commanded a squadron of the Cavalry Regiment with the rank of captain.


Guard captain V.N. Voeikov in the costume of the archer Stremyannogo order from the time of Tsar Alexei Mikhailovich at a costume ball in 1903 g

During the years of the Russo-Japanese War 1904-1905. took part in the hostilities in Manchuria: as part of the Red Cross service evacuated the sick and wounded.

In the 1906 year, already in the rank of colonel, he was granted aide-de-camp, and from 1907 to 1911 the year was commanded by His Majesty's Life Guards Regiment. And not just commanded, but actively engaged in issues of physical education of the troops, and in 1910, he wrote the “Instruction for training troops in gymnastics”.


Kutuzov Embankment (French Embankment), d. No. 8, where General Voeikov lived.

In 1911, production followed to major generals. In 1912, General Voeikov heads the Russian Olympic Committee and leads the Russian delegation at the V Olympic Games in Stockholm.). Since June 1913 of the year, he ... Glavnomontraschiy for physical development of the population of the Russian Empire. That is, they were engaged in tsarist Russia and this ...


At his house in the estate in Kamenka with his comrades on the shelf.

24 December 1913 of the year Voyeikov was appointed commandant of the retinue of His Imperial Majesty, that is, he received one of the most responsible government positions, supervised the protection of the emperor and his family, and accompanying the sovereign on all of his travels in Russia, ensured their security. At the same time, in his estate near Penza, he organized the production and sale of Kuvaka mineral water. For many, it seemed strange at the time. Well, the general should not have bothered about some kind of pipes, ordering where to drill the earth, and then watch how this water is bottled. But ... he himself did not pay attention to the sidelong glances and whispers behind his back, and Nicholas II, when they reported to him about this, invariably answered that he was completely satisfied with the work of General Voeikov. Meanwhile, due to the development of production and agriculture in Kamenka, he literally raised the economic level of the village. As a result, his estate was one of the largest and most promising in the Penza province. He even advertised his water while he was abroad. Having taken a table in a Parisian restaurant and sitting behind him in his general's uniform, he demanded to give Kuvak water, and when it was not served, he was offended and promised that he would not come to this restaurant again. Naturally, the restaurant owners immediately ordered this water in Russia and ... gave her advertising. Gradually, the water was liked and ... "gone," bringing the Warrior a huge profit.


Here it is - Kuvaka Penza water!

However, he did not put it in the jug. For example, with the beginning of World War 1914, he opened an infirmary for the wounded in Kamenka.

In 1915, he was in correspondence with the archimandrite of the Nizhnelomovsky Kazan Monastery, Leonty (Khopersky), about sending Nicholas II to the headquarters of a copy of the Nizhnelomovsky icon of the Kazan Icon of the Mother of God and at the same time was a trustee of the Pokrovo-Nikolaevsky Monastery with s. Virga of Nizhnelomovsky district, which in 1916 alone was visited by more than 16 thousand pilgrims. And in 1916, for his godly works, he was awarded the archpastoral blessing for the improvement of this holy monastery.

The last time he visited Nizhnelomovsky district was in August 1916, and then he was under the sovereign emperor until his abdication, and, by the way, he strongly discouraged him from this step.

I saw the emperor for the last time on March 5 of the year in a bid in Mahilyow and wrote about this: “His Majesty expressed in a warm voice in warm expressions how he appreciates my sometimes difficult service, and expressed gratitude for his unfailing loyalty to him and the empress. Having embraced me for the last time with tears in his eyes, the sovereign left the office, leaving me with a painful feeling that this meeting is the last and that a terrible black abyss opens up before the tsar, as well as before Russia.


Mogilyov. Rate. General Voeikov and Tsarevich Alexei.

7 March 1917, when Voeikov left Mogilev for his Penza estate, to Kamenka, he was arrested at Vyazma station, Smolensk province, and sent to Moscow, where he was first interrogated, then for some reason transported to Petrograd in the Tauride Palace.

In March he was imprisoned in the Trubetzkoy Bastion of the Peter and Paul Fortress, where he learned about the defeat of his estate in Kamenka by the peasants, and where he was interrogated, and where he happened to experience hunger and cold. But there were some pleasant moments. So, one day after the Easter matins, soldiers came to his cell with breaking fast; thrice sang "Christ is Risen!" and, having risen with him, left.

In the fall of 1917, he managed to free himself from the Peter and Paul Fortress under the pretext of a nervous disease and was taken to a private clinic for mental and nervous patients, Dr. A.G. Konasevich. But he was very much afraid of a new arrest, and he fled and hid from her in different apartments.

He established contact with the royal family, who was in Tobolsk: and with his wife began to send them letters and parcels. He tried to flee to Finland, but could not cross the border. He returned to Petrograd, where he began to portray the insane, and for a while he found shelter in an insane asylum on the outskirts of the city. Upon learning of the arrest of his wife, he decided to leave Russia. Literally, by a miracle, I snuck into Belorussia, and then into Ukraine and Odessa. In 1919, he moved to Romania, then lived in Bucharest, Berlin, Danzig, Bern and Copenhagen. His wife, Eugene Frederiks, was taken hostage and held in a Moscow concentration camp, located in the Ivanovo monastery.

Upon arrival in Finland, Voeikov settled at the doctor's cottage in Terijoki, where in August 1925 came to his wife, Eugene, who finally received permission to leave the USSR with his father and sister.

In 1920, he received a residence permit in Finland, where he lived until the Soviet-Finnish (Winter) War in the resort town of Terioki on the shore of the Gulf of Finland (today Zelenogorsk).

In 1936, he wrote and published a book of memories about life at the Court "With King and without King."

When in November 1939 of the year there was a threat of capture of Vyborg by Soviet troops, Marshal KG Mannerheim immediately came to the aid of his comrade in the Cavalry Guard Regiment and sent several trucks on which his family was able to move to Helsinki.

In March 1940, Voeikov moved to Stockholm, Sweden, and then to his suburb Yursholm. In the year 1947, October 8, he died in Stockholm, but was buried in Helsinki in the grave of his father-in-law, Count VB Fredericks. There they later buried the wife of Voeikov. In his book, he wrote the following: “The end of my life cross will be the thought that I was powerless in the fight against the treachery surrounding the throne and could not save the life of the person from whom I, like all Russian people, saw only one good” * .


But what remains of his estate today ... But there could be a museum, a sanatorium, finally. But no! "Peace to the huts - war to the palaces."

Such a life in Russia and abroad was lived by the “general from the coaxis” V.N. Voeikov, who worked for her and his own good. He failed to save the king, but ... but he managed to save his own wife, which at that time and in those circumstances few succeeded. Well, we are happy to drink the open water of “Kuvak” today!

* V.N. Voyeikov. With the King and without the King. Memories of the last palace commandant. Minsk, 2002; Penza Encyclopedia, p. 93; Regional studies, 2001, p. 83-94.
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Articles from this series:
Suffered for the faith. Part one
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  1. Cat
    Cat 3 May 2018 05: 52
    +18
    Good morning Vyacheslav Olegovich, resolve the “stupid” question for which “faith” the general suffered from the “Kuwaker” V.N. Voeykov?
    The story that you elegantly presented above is something else than the story of "a servant to the king and father to the soldiers." If briefly in a nutshell, "rose to the rank of general - had a candle factory!" Sorry, but it’s not strange that the history is corrupted by the “local patriotism” of Voeikov, who was promoting his “business” at all costs (including hooligan tricks in restaurants). By the way, apparently he also “raised” agriculture on his estate, as a rule, peasants did not destroy what fed them.
    And finally, there have always been a sea of ​​such promoters of "popular good", and even now there are no less. But something like N.N. Dimidov, who was still a century and a half before the business of Voeikov, turned into organizing recreation "on mineral waters" in my native Lower Sergovs, we do not consider a benefactor. Although the showers were similar, and in the restaurants of the district Yekaterinburg, he had the property to demand a pump-room from the mineral water of his spill. For this he was known as a tyrant, not a benefactor.
    Vyacheslav Olegovich thanks for the article, but no offense.
    Sincerely, Kitty!
    1. Cat
      Cat 3 May 2018 06: 09
      +9

      Photo of the "candle factory" of the mineral hospital at the foot of the Hill Hill in Nizhny Serg at the beginning of the last century!
      1. Cat
        Cat 3 May 2018 08: 10
        +5
        Mount Scholm, not Hill! I apologize. hi
    2. Olgovich
      Olgovich 3 May 2018 06: 42
      +7
      Quote: Kotischa
      usually the peasants did not destroy what fed them.

      Rushili was an opportunity to rob and enrich. It fed hired workers (landless peasants), and the peasants robbed the land who had and hoped to prune their land estates.
      Quote: Kotischa
      I’m not a benefactor in my native Lower Sergasrd

      "We" is Vladislav Kotische?
      Quote: Kotischa
      And finally, there have always been a sea of ​​such promoters of "popular good", and even now there are no less.

      What kind of "people's good" and where did Voeikov promise to "raise?" request

      The general was still lucky = lived his life to the end. Many of his comrades were not allowed to do this.
    3. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 3 May 2018 06: 44
      +10
      I agree with Vlad-Kotishch !!!!! ++++ I began to read with great interest to learn new things about the sufferings of the White Guard !!!!! And I didn’t know anything! Where is this suffering? Yes, even for faith? An article has been written for someone very suffering !!!!!!
      And Vyacheslav Olegovich himself laughed at this article over the victims described in the first article!
      1. dSK
        dSK 3 May 2018 07: 08
        +4
        Quote: Reptiloid
        about the suffering of the White Guard

        Found a "White Guard"! Masters wishful thinking.
      2. Cat
        Cat 3 May 2018 07: 18
        +9
        Hi Dmitry, I fully support you!
        Dear Olegovich, we are me and my cat. Although the latter agrees with everything in the Baroban while he eats the "barge" whiskas.
        As for the "wage workers", perhaps you are right. I have not specifically studied the historical experience of the communal peasantry. Although there were clashes on the Stone belt of serfs and no less serf workers, including during the years of the Pugachev uprising. For example, Serginsky and Staro-Utkinsky factories were defending themselves from the serfs that had become part of the whole world, the latter even used artillery. The prosperous Bilimbay, on the contrary, met Colonels Pugachev with bread and salt.
        Even today, for the older generation, the "Plant" is the ultimate authority in the worldview - worse than the god of God and sweeter than the bread carrier. Moreover, the "batog" in the first place.
        Seriously, the elderly of the Verkhneserginsky plant still remember who they planted the "goat" (ruined the blast furnace) under Pugachev! Just imagine, more than two and a half centuries have passed, and Ivashka the bastard (hereinafter referred to as a multi-story foul language with a twist) remember !!!
        So not everything is clear .......
        Sincerely, Kitty!
      3. kalibr
        3 May 2018 07: 21
        +6
        Dmitry, there is such a thing as a source of information. Written sources are created by people, with all their advantages and disadvantages. In the source I called, the photo of the pages of which you saw was a biography of this person. It seemed interesting to me. We don’t know much about the people of that era and their destinies. I didn’t insert it into the Mortyrologist. I rewrote it with a high level of novelty. Dignity is a book or a flaw, I do not presume to judge. I already wrote that there are not many such persons in the book. But they are. Wrote? What else do you need? But, as I also wrote above, this is a cast of the era with all its advantages and disadvantages. There were obviously more of the latter. Otherwise, the Russian Empire would have stood now.
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 3 May 2018 08: 04
          +3
          After the first article, the content of this article looks strange. Now, if on an increasing basis, it would probably be more correct from a literary point of view. First, there is such suffering, and then more severe. And the fact that you did not compose MORTIROLOGUS --- so I didn’t read it and I won’t read it, and I, as well as others, may identify this information with you. There is nothing to be done about it! These are the laws of PR !!!!
      4. Mikado
        Mikado 3 May 2018 19: 47
        +3
        I began to read with great interest to learn new things about the sufferings of the White Guard !!!!!

        read the materials of the "Commission on the investigation of the atrocities of the Bolsheviks in the South of Russia", you will learn even more. True, our so-called the "communists" immediately begin to yell, they say, there was nothing like that, Denikin personally sat down and invented everything. Funny, is not it? Dmitry, I deeply agree with the esteemed Vladislav Kotishche - there are no winners in any revolution, only losers. Why? Because any revolution is initially made by leaders and mob-lumpen. And Denikin did not invent anything. Because the mob is the mob. And when our "communists" begin to masturbate to the socialist revolution, I find it funny and not funny at the same time! Because in the event of a riot, they will be the first to slaughter you. And me. And many more. Start with the smart ones. You do not have enough examples before your eyes when “people wanted one thing”, but did you get “Somalia”? And on the national outskirts it will be even more interesting .... negative would call the "communists" cranks, but then a different set of words is required ....
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 3 May 2018 21: 39
          +1
          Hi Nikolay! I once wrote to you that I want to first identify my gaps by reading the articles on the site, and there by the degree of importance. And about the socialist revolution, I will personally write to you later, in the continuation of the previous conversations. Why not now .. Somehow I do not get enough sleep. Weeks will come in 2 days.
          1. Mikado
            Mikado 4 May 2018 00: 15
            +1
            Dmitry, I don’t get enough sleep either. request
            And about the socialist revolution

            she will not be. And all attempts to build a just society lead to huge sacrifices. Pol Pot as an example, as an extreme case. No, thanks.. stop No, maybe someday socialism will come. what But people of all nationalities, mentalities and faiths must first before him AT ONCE "grow"! hi Do you remember the example of a Maori and a peace-loving tribe? This tribe lived, like in island communism for hundreds of years, and then the Maori conquerors appeared and staged them genocide, and these teddy bears and surrenders do not know how to give! And now .. look at a well-fed Europe! Doesn't it remind? Obese in their "socialism" .. Grown with homosexuals, other "alternative aspirations" .. And then the Arabs with blacks appeared, and they wanted to spit on those who can not give change!
            Therefore .. already enough for socialism something to brainwash .. negative It's empty! You must work, multiply, be strong, keep your culture! Then everything will be really good! soldier
            1. Conserp
              Conserp 4 May 2018 15: 23
              +1
              Quote: Mikado
              And about the socialist revolution-it will not be.

              You simply do not know the meaning of this term and do not understand.
              1. Mikado
                Mikado 4 May 2018 15: 33
                +1
                I admit, I don’t understand much at all. Sometimes you go to the “opinions” and “analytics”, leave a comment, and every jumping cheering patriot, without getting up from the couch, will explain that you are nobody at all, in half with rudeness and spelling mistakes .. request and sometimes you think - is it worth understanding some terms if there are people who know them deeply. hi no, I'm not talking about you at all! just gave an example of why some things are becoming uninteresting! hi
                1. Conserp
                  Conserp 4 May 2018 19: 09
                  +3
                  Quote: Mikado
                  all attempts to build a just society lead to enormous sacrifices.

                  Just once slavery was abolished - and how many slaveholders lost their hard-earned property!

                  We will not forget, we will grow !!!

                  Quote: Mikado
                  Pol Pot as an example, as an extreme case.

                  Pol Pot is just a great example. The CIA provocateur, whom the United States appointed a dictator in the framework of the struggle against communism in Southeast Asia, as is customary with the CIA, was actively discrediting communism as a Trotskyist. In short, the False Flag is similar to Operation Gladio and the Red Brigades in Europe.

                  As a result, Pol Pot was overthrown by the Vietnamese communists, the real ones. The CIA regularly continued to pay him a salary (these salary sheets have already been declassified).

                  So you should not get up from the couch, jump and leave comments. Get off the smart one. Maybe.
                  1. Mikado
                    Mikado 4 May 2018 20: 02
                    +2
                    So you should not get up from the couch, jump and leave comments. Get off the smart one. Maybe.

                    it is an insult? I ask directly! Please answer!
                    1. Conserp
                      Conserp 4 May 2018 22: 45
                      +2
                      This is friendly advice.

                      Do not disgrace yourself when talking about things in which you don’t understand anything so much.
                      1. Mikado
                        Mikado 4 May 2018 23: 25
                        +3
                        Do not disgrace yourself when talking about things in which you don’t understand anything so much.

                        It YOU advise me? To the police captain, who never “took a paw”, who quit due to the fact that he sent the leadership because of a lie? CEO with two higher, whose people make good money? The author of four articles and many photographs, two of which were published today? I ASK AGAIN, this - YOU advise me ???????
                        Now I will advise you: masturbation is evil. Including, on the social phenomena about which you have no idea. Think for yourself. Increased self-esteem with natural arrogance is also evil. FRIENDLY ADVICE.....
            2. Alexander Greene
              Alexander Greene 4 May 2018 17: 09
              +1
              Quote: Mikado
              ... enough to brainwash socialism already. It's empty! You need to work, multiply, be strong, keep your culture ...

              . and take care of your oligarchs so that they do not become poor!
              1. Mikado
                Mikado 4 May 2018 17: 11
                +2
                .... and take care of their oligarchs so that they do not become poor ...

                if you feel like it, go make a revolution with millions of victims. So that the "revolutionary leaders" in a few years also become thick-necked oligarchs. hi
                1. Alexander Greene
                  Alexander Greene 4 May 2018 20: 37
                  0
                  Quote: Mikado
                  if you feel like it, go make a revolution with millions of victims.

                  What should we lose? The oligarchs in all republics rule so that millions have already died out everywhere.
                  1. Mikado
                    Mikado 4 May 2018 23: 56
                    +2
                    millions died out because of the "wise leadership of the party" that led the country to this. Maybe it’s enough to pour quotes from the damned Marx, as if something will change from this .... Hmm .. It's funny! Why Marx with a small letter? To explain? In Europe-Asia-Africa there are many streets of Dostoevsky-Tolstoy-Pushkin? AND? A lot of? NO! It was only our “idiotic communists” who came up with the names of streets and avenues in the name of an obscure but fashionable bearded figure of philosophy! And when it is not clear .. there is a dissonance! laughing should I be surprised at the renaming of these streets "in the former fraternal republics"? Which other figures are nicer?
                    1. Alexander Greene
                      Alexander Greene 5 May 2018 13: 45
                      +1
                      Quote: Mikado
                      stop cursing Marx with quotes,

                      This is he damned for you. But for us, for the workers, he is a great teacher, he taught how to free ourselves from centuries of exploitation. I understand that you have a “candle factory” and you may lose it as a result of the revolution, but the workers really have nothing to lose.
                      Quote: Mikado
                      Hmm .. funny! Why Marx with a small letter? To explain?

                      Don’t bother, I already know. This is not from a great mind. A smart man respects his enemy, but a petty person can pour water into a bed or put a brush (I hope you saw the movie "Viper"?)
                      1. Mikado
                        Mikado 5 May 2018 13: 52
                        +1
                        This is he damned for you. But for us, for the workers, he is a great teacher, he taught how to free ourselves from centuries of exploitation.

                        yeah, they got the opportunity to drink right from the lunch break and pee in the front doors, which they still do. Yes, Alexander, exactly! And yell under the windows at night, figuring out a relationship. And the people will not understand why the central street of the ancient Yam will be named after the obscure Marx, and the city itself will be named after the even more obscure Kingisepp.
                        This is not from a great mind. A smart person respects his enemy, and a petty person can pour water into a bed or put a brush

                        not you appreciate my mind. My mind will be appreciated by those who should, and they are appreciated. Briefly, I gave information about myself to the same one as you, six comments above. Have you written at least one article? Ah, creativity is enough for criticism? On the "Marx"? Well, well, everything is clear ....
                        https://topwar.ru/119690-krepost-yam-gorod-kingis
                        epp.html
                        please read, and then draw conclusions about the interlocutor. Although .. I already concluded about you .. hi not to you try to say something to me .... hi
                      2. Alexander Greene
                        Alexander Greene 5 May 2018 16: 34
                        +1
                        Quote: Mikado
                        My mind will be appreciated by those who should, and they are appreciated.

                        And you told them why you write the name of K. Marx with a small letter? Be sure to tell, they will certainly respect and appreciate even more.
                      3. Mikado
                        Mikado 5 May 2018 18: 04
                        +1
                        And you told them why you write the name of K. Marx with a small letter? Be sure to tell, they will certainly respect and appreciate even more.

                        I will pay them a bonus. And they live with dignity, through my efforts. WITHsilent envy, squatting squeezed to the sofa, in an embrace with a volume of "Capital". OR ARE YOU ABLE TO PAY FOR THEM? YOU ARE ABLE ????? I am worthy appreciate it. therefore they with me will live well. I’ll take it from myself - I’ll give it to them! Unlike you, hoping for a "good master" (Lenin, Stalin, Poroshenko, Lyashko - especially Lyashko!). Should I say "Ugh" again? They sit at the push, masturbate on communism! And they are waiting for justice! They also insult! A revolution will come, and they will become panes! Who will do it? in between masturbation?
                        Yes! ... dignity, intelligence and humanism not to you measure with me ..... negative I would like to say "goodbye" .. But, alas, it will not work! I promised that our miserable "communists" will receive their for idiocy in half with inactivity? hi Promised! Now, now have to admonish! And I'm not to blame .. request IT WASN’T WORTH ME
                        I repeat once again: I expect from you a report on my article read and a report on charity. Without it .. How do I respect the "communists"? For the slogans? And not for the mind and virtue?
    4. kalibr
      3 May 2018 07: 14
      +6
      This is the fate of a man from a book I know. All! Fate, in my opinion, is interesting. A cast from the life of that time.
      1. Cat
        Cat 3 May 2018 07: 56
        +6
        Vyacheslav Olegovich about (I repeat) a gorgeous story, no one argues with you! Your ability to express difficult and non-obvious in a modern and accessible language is not contested a priori!
        The argument was caused by the hero of the story itself !!!
        To be honest, with today's work you have uncovered a “deep wound of the irreversibility of our history with you,” and if he really would have paid less attention to “his candle factory”, “gymnasium” and “healthy lifestyle”, and more to his responsibilities on a replaced position. Maybe it happened and ...........?
        What would Russia be like - without a civil war, - without red and white, - without ...........
        A lot of "would" !!!
        Sincerely, Vladislav Kotische.
        P.S. "Chuyka" says that again I "spoiled" you. Two days kept from participating in the comments of your articles. Today I could not restrain myself ........ I sincerely apologize.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 3 May 2018 08: 16
          +3
          Quote: Kotischa
          if he really would have paid less attention to “his candle factory”, “gymnasium” and “healthy lifestyle”

          The construction of factories, a gymnasium and a healthy lifestyle are the basis of the welfare of the state.
          And his duties, according to the Emperor, he did well.
          1. Conserp
            Conserp 4 May 2018 15: 25
            +2
            Quote: Olgovich
            The construction of factories, a gymnasium and a healthy lifestyle are the basis of the welfare of the state.

            That is what the Bolsheviks were doing. Moreover, they took up even before the war unleashed against them ended.

            And these royal lackeys could only steal and bring everything down to the "wiles of the Jews."
            1. Olgovich
              Olgovich 5 May 2018 09: 06
              0
              Quote: Conserp
              That is what the Bolsheviks were doing. Moreover, they took up even before the war unleashed against them ended.

              First they are all destroyed. The number of students only 1927 g.
              Quote: Conserp
              Moreover, they took up even before the war unleashed against them ended.

              The Bolsheviks unleashed, attacking the VP on October 25 17. Forgot?
              Quote: Conserp
              And these royal lackeys could only steal and bring everything down to the "wiles of the Jews."

              Royal lackeys built the largest power in the world. Which the Bolsheviks halved in 70 years.
        2. kalibr
          3 May 2018 08: 35
          +3
          Kotische (Vladislav Kotische) Am I really angry with you? I agreed with your opinion that the personality for the victim is “spiritual” ... strange. That is, he suffered and certainly. But faith is on the side of the fire. But I repeat. I was interested in his fate, it is not quite ordinary. So I wrote about him. So write your comments further. Don't you see that I try to answer them in the most comprehensive way possible.
        3. BAI
          BAI 3 May 2018 12: 21
          +1
          and if he really would have paid less attention to “his candle factory”, “gymnasium” and “healthy lifestyle”, and more to his duties in the position he was filling. Maybe it happened and ...........?

          To be honest, the impression creeps in that nothing depended on anyone, many reasons overlapped each other - as a result, the origins of the conflict turned out to be so deep that even at first glance they were invisible:
          In fact, all the latest troubles of Russia are connected only with the fact that its sociocultural disintegration into a "city" and a "village" by the beginning of the XNUMXth century. It became painfully noticeable at the household level, and the war gave rise to soreness of this sensation. This factor, in turn, manifested itself particularly sharply in connection with the increased marginalization (falling out of the already collapsing class boundaries) of traditional societies.
          Buldakov V.P.
          Red trouble. The nature and consequences of revolutionary violence
          1. Vladimir 5
            Vladimir 5 4 May 2018 17: 48
            -1
            BAI. Here you need to determine more specifically. With the abolition of serfdom and a half-hearted solution, the village did not receive a level and development, the problems were constantly smoldering: land purchase for decades, impoverishment of former noble serfs, Stolypin accelerated the collapse of the community settlement, which also brought inconsistency and contradiction .... Therefore, it was constantly noble estates burned, especially in 1905 and other years .. According to the city workers, the proletarians were painted by the Bolsheviks — unskilled workers who were on the opposite side of the barricades .. There were Jewish problems with closed autonomous kahalas and surrounding tradesmen ... And everyone everyone was using this disorder, from Japanese agents (strikes for money in wartime with Japan) to German, British agents. when the contradictions with the protracted war went off scale, pouring kerosene from abroad, flooded the hot revolution in Russia ..
        4. Weyland
          Weyland 3 May 2018 14: 36
          +1
          Quote: Kotischa
          if he really would have paid less attention to “his candle factory”, “gymnasium” and “healthy lifestyle”, and more to his duties in the post he was being replaced.

          Cat You really do not understand that providing personal First Person Security and Countermeasures massive rioting different people (and often different agencies)?
      2. Olgovich
        Olgovich 3 May 2018 08: 35
        +3
        Quote: kalibr
        Fate, in my opinion, is interesting. A cast from the life of that time.

        Really interesting. With such strokes a portrait of the era is drawn.
    5. Monarchist
      Monarchist 3 May 2018 16: 55
      +3
      Kitten, allow you to scratch behind the ear: literally removed from the tongue. The story is interesting, like the others of V. O., but somehow it does not fit in well with the title. Voyeykov's restaurant trick stems from the gelatine "fuck a penny." Regarding: "usually the peasants did not steer that they were fed" it is debatable: psychology knows the "gregarious feeling" * when all restrictions have collapsed and it has become possible to drag everything that the peasant does not stand and think anymore .. Examples of the sea: "Red the devils "all robbed and some terry dragged away" Esmarch's mug ", and then he asked everyone:" flap, what the same? " She cared for him for centuries, but he was all tantz. F / m "Cement" when some worker was protecting a standing plant then the "lighters": the factory fed the workers but in the past, but at the moment it is standing, but the worker wants to eat, the agricultural enterprise of Voyeykov is also the most interesting
  2. rkkasa xnumx
    rkkasa xnumx 3 May 2018 06: 07
    +11
    The clever courtier, married favorably, had a commercial vein ... he seemed to have no other talents. And what, like, now we need to worry about the difficult fate of the royal bodyguard? This story, why is it at all, why is it told?
    In 1912, General Voeikov heads the Russian Olympic Committee and leads the Russian delegation at the V Olympic Games in Stockholm.).

    Successfully traveled, 16th place ...
    1. Cat
      Cat 3 May 2018 06: 14
      +7
      I’ll supplement, and I did not cope with my official duties. I understand he would have fallen protecting the royal family from adversaries, and so ....... eh.
      1. dSK
        dSK 3 May 2018 06: 45
        +4
        Quote: Kotischa
        and so ....... eh.

        Are you able to voluntarily accept "death on the cross"?
        1. Cat
          Cat 3 May 2018 07: 34
          +9
          Quote: dsk
          Are you able to voluntarily accept "death on the cross"?

          And I have a choice !?
          I have been wearing my epaulettes for more than two decades. So, if, as it will be, there is simply no choice!
          I understand - it sounds perhaps pathetic - duty, oath, Fatherland. But when you bring up these feelings with your subordinates for a dozen years, then you simply have no choice. You are both an example and an evil saying, and even the devil knows who and what. So if you take a step, then follow you, if you run then shoot in the back ....
          Such an evil irony!
          You can take me as a supporter of the progressive (evolutionary) development of society and the state, categorically without coups, Maidan, unrest and revolution. Why? I repeat that in civil wars there are no winners, but only losers!
          Regards, Chain Cat!
          By the way, this question was raised at one time by my fellow countryman V. Krapivin in the cycle of children's books "The Bronze Boy", read all three. Seriously you will not regret it.
          Respectfully, Your Cat!
          1. Mikado
            Mikado 3 May 2018 14: 38
            +4
            Regards, Chain Cat!

            Caution! very angry cat chain! drinks Take care of the slippers and the contents of the food bag! good
          2. rkkasa xnumx
            rkkasa xnumx 3 May 2018 17: 42
            +2
            Quote: Kotischa
            I understand - it sounds perhaps pathetic - duty, oath, Fatherland. But when you bring up these feelings with your subordinates for a dozen years, then you simply have no choice.

            With all due respect to your pathos, those tsarist officers think he was no less. However, they had a choice, and they made it. Some went to fight for ours, while others went for whites.
            Quote: Kotischa
            You can take me as a supporter of the progressive (evolutionary) development of society and the state, categorically without coups, Maidan, unrest and revolution.

            Well there - in the land of elves?
            Quote: Kotischa
            I repeat that in civil wars there are no winners, but only losers!

            There are losers, there are winners.
          3. Conserp
            Conserp 4 May 2018 13: 51
            +2
            Quote: Kotischa
            You can take me as a supporter of the progressive (evolutionary) development of society and the state, categorically without coups, Maidan, unrest and revolution. Why? I repeat that in civil wars there are no winners, but only losers!

            Tell it to the Syrians or Russians from Donbass.

            No one will ask you whether you want a civil war or not. Just next "whiteworkers" will come to your house or in the same way the "victims of faith" Basmachi and they will kill your whole family.

            As for “no need for revolution,” for some reason I don’t see the turn of those who want to join serfs.
      2. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 3 May 2018 06: 49
        +8
        Yeah! I guessed! There is no king, but he lived well! This is suffering! Horror! So hurt!
        1. kalibr
          3 May 2018 07: 25
          +5
          More and more, Dmitry, I am inclined to the idea that your comments would be more appropriate in other sections of the site: in the news, in opinions. There are a lot of such statements and you would be right in your place. For the "story" they are somehow too ... superficial and ... emotional.
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 3 May 2018 07: 52
            +6
            From your words, Vyacheslav, I draw the correct conclusion that my comments are often true and there may be difficulties for the opponent. And this, perhaps, is the main thing.
            In addition, the comments of many of those present can be superficial and the reason for this you have indicated repeatedly and impolite. Like that you are kin, and others are nobody.
            What about emotions? After all, they are also inherent in you! Look how many times you expose, write bad words about the USSR. Often ---- very emotional.
            1. kalibr
              3 May 2018 08: 30
              +4
              Your trouble, not the fault, Dmitry, is that you have a basic university education for me. That is, at least a five-year, and not as it is now 4 years undergraduate program, then 2 years - a magistracy, I don’t even talk about 3 years in graduate school. Therefore, you simply cannot understand the meaning of these 8-9 years.
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 3 May 2018 21: 48
                0
                Each has its own situation. How would I work? Even if the boss, when he sends to the seminars, sighs? That is, you need to learn in order to work better. But it is impossible to combine study and work. A little distracted ---- left the race .....
                1. Alexander Greene
                  Alexander Greene 3 May 2018 23: 27
                  +1
                  Quote: Reptiloid
                  It is impossible to combine study and work.

                  Dmitry, do not listen to these educators. In today's universities, they still do not teach anything. Engage in self-education, study Marxism-Leninism, download Stalin's textbooks on philosophy, political economy and scientific socialism. Check out the link https://work-way.com/blog/. If you master the dialectical methodology, you can independently deal with any of the most difficult problems.
                  1. Reptiloid
                    Reptiloid 4 May 2018 05: 08
                    +1
                    Good morning, Alexander! I’m still sleeping, but I have to pack up. I looked for comment on Nicholas ---- I found yours. You see, I still assume that there will be a socialist revolution. From different places from the periphery of the message, one is collapsing, the other, the third ..... And where is it all, people who have not realized themselves at the place of residence? To Moscow, St. Petersburg? How many millions of visitors can accommodate and provide work for the capital? And housing and the possibility of a normal family? After all, once there was a similar situation ..... To what size can Big Moscow grow? Or Petersburg ....
                    Thank you for supporting such an uneducated and so emotional (as Vyacheslav Olegovich wrote somewhere nearby wrote) .... And by the way, how can I be emotional, or rather comments, if I don't use emotional faces? It’s still necessary to be able to!
                    About the list you proposed --- you know, I'm trying, but very hard. Sincerely.
              2. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 7 May 2018 05: 43
                +1
                Quote: kalibr
                ...... Therefore, you simply cannot understand the meaning of these 8-9 years.
                Of course I can’t. Fate is different ---- a 5-8 day seminar from time to time, another certificate and ---- until the next seminar. On the other hand, people with 2 higher ones can behave very strangely.
    2. baudolino
      baudolino 3 May 2018 07: 51
      +6
      "This story, why is it at all, why is it told?" - Why go to the "history" section at all, if everywhere you look only for politics?
      1. rkkasa xnumx
        rkkasa xnumx 3 May 2018 17: 55
        +3
        Quote: baudolino
        Why go to the "history" section at all, if everywhere you look only for politics?

        Quote: Kotischa
        Seriously, there are several methods (methods) to study historical events.
        One of them is from private to general. See the above article !!!

        What does the search for politics have to do with it?
        An article about an outstanding courtier. Favorably married, protected the king, laughed with some water, dumped over a hill, died. All.
        What have you learned a lot from this article?
    3. Olgovich
      Olgovich 3 May 2018 08: 24
      +6
      Quote: rkkasa 81
      Successfully traveled

      Given the fact that the USSR at the Games generally got only through 40 years-successfully ..
      1. Cat
        Cat 3 May 2018 10: 02
        +3
        Quote: baudolino
        "This story, why is it at all, why is it told?" - Why go to the "history" section at all, if everywhere you look only for politics?

        That's why it is history - because - Ours!
        Seriously, there are several methods (methods) to study historical events.
        One of them is from private to general. See the above article !!!
        Sincerely, Kitty!
        By the way, look for the meaning of the words "power, politics and history" in the TIiP dictionary. I am sure that you will not write more such comments.
      2. rkkasa xnumx
        rkkasa xnumx 3 May 2018 17: 35
        +2
        Quote: Olgovich
        Considering the fact that the USSR generally got to the Games only after 40 years

        And immediately took second place. 16th and second - the difference is significant.
        1. Olgovich
          Olgovich 4 May 2018 08: 21
          +1
          Quote: rkkasa 81
          And immediately took second place. 16th and second - the difference is significant.

          Forty years later ?! belay
          Yes, Russia would still have the FIRST place more than once.
    4. Mordvin 3
      Mordvin 3 3 May 2018 18: 11
      +2
      Quote: rkkasa 81
      16 place ...

      In! Our bentopods have someone to look up to.
  3. kalibr
    3 May 2018 07: 30
    +3
    Quote: Kotischa
    resolve the "stupid" question for which "faith" the general suffered from the "Kuwaker" V.N. Voeykov?

    You know, Vladislav, I also did not quite understand this by reading his biography. But ... she seemed interesting to me. And it was an interesting job: to write the material so that it retains the entire factual part, but at the same time would have a high level of novelty. And again, this is the fate of a man who managed to survive in difficult conditions. As for the looting of the estate ... They robbed everyone and everything. Both "good" and "bad." And without thinking about the consequences. I read in one of the Penza newspapers of that time that the peasants of some village wanted to -a destroy the school and b-cut down the lord's forest. What prevented them from both?
    1. Cat
      Cat 3 May 2018 08: 08
      +5
      At the end of the year before last in the Urals there was a movement of "defaulters." The ideological program of which “if on fingers” was interpreted: do not pay taxes, use the state’s natural resources for free and some of them advocated ....... return the benefits of serf workers? That is, I want to be in captivity, but leave the mowing old !!!
      Moreover, the neighboring Bashkir village of Akbash, in the middle of the second century, was massively sold with land to serfs to one of the Strogonovs, for ...... social guarantees in the form of a hospital, school and mosque. So I want to exclaim "about times, about morals"!
    2. Weyland
      Weyland 3 May 2018 14: 46
      +2
      Quote: kalibr
      the peasants of some village wanted to -– destroy the school and b-cut down the noble forest. What prevented them from both?

      School - it’s clear: nefig children for the sake of any useless bullshit am from agricultural work good Divert!
      And the forest is even clearer: sell wood - drink money good !
  4. bober1982
    bober1982 3 May 2018 07: 38
    +3
    The article aroused interest, from it I learned about the general’s estate in Kamenka, at the time (90s) the 953rd was relocated there from Belarus bomber regimentIt turns out the guys served (regiment then dispersed) in such a resort place.
    Immediately after the February Revolution, a new government created a commission to combat the "evil spirits" - just like that, no more and no less. The arrests of people close to the Sovereign began, interesting memories of investigator Rudnev remained.
    So Vladimir Nikolaevich came under the “distribution” of these fighters against the devilry, the piquancy of the situation was that these newly-fought fighters themselves were real ghouls.
  5. kalibr
    3 May 2018 08: 24
    +2
    Quote: Reptiloid
    These are the laws of PR !!!!

    Dmitry, you are something every time more and more amaze me. Or scare ... In any case, in PR there are no laws! This is a set of technologies. Otherwise, an academic degree would be awarded by PR. There is no candidate of turning sciences ... So it is here. And the material of the article is always identified with the author. And the fact that you do not read the Mortyrologist ... well, okay. He is fat and expensive. But now you saw photos from it and read the most diverse materials. Usually people receiving comprehensively submitted information are welcome. You yourself write all the time about bias. Here you are given from this side, and from the other - and everything is bad ... Strange.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 3 May 2018 08: 37
      +3
      I respect all people who have suffered for faith, as in the Biblical, other past times --- that in the Ancient World, that in the Middle Ages, regardless of territory. In the case of the USSR of the 20th century, I see more political rather than religious reasons. If the word laws is applied to PR --- pompous, then what else is there --- rules, principles, effects, axioms. Recently, there was something in this context about the defeated, you wrote. Now there will be a break until the evening.
      1. Weyland
        Weyland 3 May 2018 14: 54
        +3
        Quote: Reptiloid
        In the case of the USSR of the 20th century, I see more political rather than religious reasons.

        You are deeply mistaken! The Antichrist Essence of the Communists am It is manifested precisely in the persecution of religion, which in the real world did not interfere with building socialism from the word "no way!" Why, for example, Fidel hi religion in no way prevented the building of socialism - which is characteristic, with a much more human face than ours? The foundations of Christian ethics (I won’t say about Protestants - their Christianity is very doubtful) are “camel and needle’s eye”, “everyone is equal before God”, so it is not surprising that all the communist movements of the Middle Ages (lollards, Anabaptists, etc.) went under religious slogans! And the author of Utopia, Thomas More, by the way, is a holy martyr among Catholics, and quite successful the experience of building communism took place in Jesuit reductions of Paraguay!
        1. Mikado
          Mikado 3 May 2018 15: 21
          +4
          and quite successful experience in building communism took place in the Jesuit reductions of Paraguay!

          bow down hi everything was very interesting there, back in the 16th century. Communities of "converts Indians" with monks at the head rebuffed "bounty hunters" and other lovers of quick profit. soldier
    2. Curious
      Curious 3 May 2018 09: 28
      +5
      "There is no candidate of turning sciences ..." There is. Only called "Ph.D."
      For example, the topic of the candidate for the KTN competition is: "Improving the efficiency of turning complex parts on CNC machines by assigning a functionally variable cutting mode."
      1. kalibr
        3 May 2018 10: 07
        +1
        Yes, and studying PR, too, in principle, you can get a degree, but only this is either history or sociology, or cultural studies. My adoptive parents had a theme: "The history of the formation of a public relations system in the Russian Federation in the late 90s, using the example of the Penza Saratov and Samara regions."
    3. Cat
      Cat 3 May 2018 10: 11
      +7
      Vyacheslav Olegovich, a big request to throw beat Dima for education. This is not fair in the first place. Well, just different conditions were in the USSR and in 00 in the Russian Federation for higher education. Someone has grown together, but Dima unfortunately does not.
      To be honest, this does not color you.
      And then from the side. Which professor will not prove that the student ........
      Sincerely, about the Balon education system, you are definitely right.
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 7 May 2018 05: 34
        0
        Just now I saw your comment, dear Vlad-Kotische! Thanks for your kind words. I will report to you. It was necessary to work. Settled. After some time, the organization paid for courses at one of the committees of the City Administration. 3 months. Since then, several times the organization, then I myself paid for courses, trainings, seminars, master classes, still in the big city, today, ---- the absence of higher education, it may be different than 30 years ago, in Penza . Thus, it turns out that I am a certified specialist. So not everything is so terrible. Thanks again.
  6. Curious
    Curious 3 May 2018 09: 10
    +9
    A martyrology is a collection of narratives of Christian torment, as well as a list of suffering or a list of innocent victims.
    Vladimir Nikolaevich Voeikov - the sufferer, of course, outstanding. He began to suffer from childhood, as he was born in an aristocratic family. Dad general and chief chamberlain, mother from the old clan Dolgorukovs. The grandfather of the Moscow general - the governor, great-grandmother - Varvara Vasilievna Dolgorukova - was known for a huge fortune. The fate of the sufferer was predetermined and having suffered 20 years in the cavalry guards, mainly in economic positions and never having sniffed gunpowder, he received the rank of parquet general. So he was tormented before the February Revolution on tsar's floors, pouring mineral vodka and doing "sports of the highest achievements" and carrying physical education to the masses.
    А “On March 7, 1917, when Voeikov went from Mogilev to his Penza estate, to Kamenka, he was arrested at the Vyazma station in the Smolensk province and sent to Moscow, where he was first questioned, and then for some reason was transferred to Petrograd to the Tauride Palace.” And who, do you think arrested him? The Extraordinary Investigation Commission to investigate the illegal actions of ex-ministers, chief executives and other senior officials of both civil and military and naval departments is an extraordinary investigative body established by the Provisional Government after the February Revolution. It was headed not at all by the "iron Felix" dropout, but Nikolai Konstantinovich Muravyov - a lawyer, lawyer and public figure in Tsarist Russia. And they accused Voeikov of completely prosaic affairs - careerism, embezzlement, soldering of the tsar. Several months in the Trubetskoy bastion of Petropavlovka ended happily in October 1917, when the "security" of 50 gold rubles was removed from the sufferer and allowed to visit the family. Well, then - through Ukraine, Romania and Germany to a colleague and friend of Mannerheim to Finland, then to Sweden, where he died alone in 000 at the age of 1947 years.
    So that is the place of Voeikov in the book "Olympic Stars of Penza". Or in a series of articles on VO "Sports Penza". Then he achieved really serious success.
    On June 7, 1913, V. N. Voeikov was appointed "the chief observer of the physical development of the population of the Russian Empire." To improve sports training for the 1916 Olympic Games and identify the country's most gifted athletes, in August 1913 the first Russian Olympiad was held in Kiev (an analogue of the Spartakiad of the Peoples of the USSR), and the second in 1914 in Riga. These competitions revealed a galaxy of young and gifted athletes. A young sprinter from Moscow Vasily Arkhipov ran the 100-meter in 10,4 seconds (an analogue of the standard “USSR Master of Sports”). Even then, the foundation was laid for future victories of Soviet sports. Many athletes who began their performances before the revolution became Honored Masters of Sports and Honored Coaches in the USSR, and the Butusov and Filippov football dynasties will go down in the history of Soviet sport.
    And his grandson, who did not change the name of his grandfather, worked for a long time in the Sports Committee of the USSR, in the publishing department. Almost a sports dynasty.
    1. Cat
      Cat 3 May 2018 09: 56
      +5
      Hm! If I seriously "applaud with all four paws and hit the tambourine with my tail" except for the lines of the poet, "the master will arrive - the master will judge us" no words!
      Victor Nikolayevich, oh yeah, young fellow !!!
      Taking off my hat!
    2. Conserp
      Conserp 3 May 2018 11: 07
      +1
      Quote: Curious
      Martyrology - a collection of stories about Christian torment

      A collection of fakes and fictions.

      These "martyrots" have already been dismantled by people who are not sitting on the State Department salary.
      1. bober1982
        bober1982 3 May 2018 11: 20
        +1
        Quote: Conserp
        A collection of fakes and fictions.

        Andrei Tarkovsky - author of the book Martyrology, diary entries, well now let us cling to this name, it’s difficult to call him a Christian martyr, and even this word Martyrology - Catholic, in our opinion it will be - Saints.
    3. Okolotochny
      Okolotochny 3 May 2018 17: 55
      +4
      Thank you, highlighted the "main suffering". And another interesting fact, while his wife was in a “concentration camp”, he “suffered” about her in a “hungry abroad”. Moreover, she was held hostage, they were waiting for him? So why, officerly, nobleman himself didn’t come? Was afraid
    4. Aviator_
      Aviator_ 3 May 2018 21: 35
      +2
      Well, this is a real informative article about Voeikov, and not what was presented above.
  7. bober1982
    bober1982 3 May 2018 10: 04
    +1
    You can have a different attitude to the personality of General Voeikov, there are a lot of documents about his work, a lot of personal characteristics, mostly not too flattering. But you can say with confidence that his life was amazing and interesting, as mentioned in the article, and that the person was precisely injured - due to the shameful actions of the chairman of the commission of inquiry Muravyov (he was a freemason), by the way the commission itself was called "Inspection of the activities of the dark forces"
    Quote from investigator Rudnev ......... I filed a report on the expulsion, in view of attempts by the chairman of the commission Muravyov to force me to obviously biased actions.
  8. Conserp
    Conserp 3 May 2018 11: 07
    +3
    Another Nazi propaganda slop about the "shot for faith", which in reality either did not exist at all, or no one shot, or shot for serious crimes.

    Such a wonderful person was a former slave-owning planter, friend and ally of the organizer of the blockade of Leningrad and the massacre of Russians.

    All such “victims of faith”, yes.




    As you know, Dudaev and Maskhadov also suffered for faith and for agitation.
    1. Conserp
      Conserp 3 May 2018 11: 19
      +2
      And most importantly, this generalka was so "tired" that he died not on the gallows, as expected, but with his death.

      It's time to rename the site in "Review of Nazi burps."
      1. BAI
        BAI 3 May 2018 12: 10
        +2
        this general is "suffering"

        Yes, it has nothing to do with faith, but still it’s impossible. In the end, he did nothing wrong with either Russia or the USSR. By sharply assessing innocent people in general, you reduce the value of your assessments where the sharpness is well deserved.
        1. Conserp
          Conserp 3 May 2018 16: 39
          +3
          Under Tsar Voyeykov there was a swindler and a thief.
          Under Hitler, he wrote books about the fact that in the USSR "Jews rule everything".
  9. BAI
    BAI 3 May 2018 11: 23
    +4
    Well, where is the suffering for faith?
    And anyway - where did he suffer? Yes, he died in exile, but because of his death the Cheka-NKVD had nothing to do with it.
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 3 May 2018 11: 38
      +2
      Quote: BAI
      And anyway - where did he suffer?

      When he was sitting in the Peter and Paul Fortress, then he suffered, by the way, and it is not clear why he was sitting.
      Ms. Vyrubova (the Empress’s friend) was sitting with him, the drunken guard scoffed at the young woman, stripped naked, beaten, and mocked. Isn't this suffering?
      All were later released, and Vyrubova, and Voeikov, and others. They were not found in connection with the other world.
      1. BAI
        BAI 3 May 2018 13: 01
        +5
        When he was sitting in the Peter and Paul Fortress, then he suffered, by the way, and it is not clear why he was sitting.


        And Mr. Curious (Victor) Today, 09:10 a little higher, he told everything in detail for what he was sitting and who was arresting.
        By the way, here there is also about the general - the sufferer counted 102 rivets on the bed and about Vyrubova - they threatened, yes. But there were no measures of physical violence. There was a medical examination.
        https://cyberleninka.ru/article/v/a-a-vyrubova-za
        klyuchenie-v-trubetskom-bastione-petropavlovskoy-
        kreposti-mart-iyul-1917-g
        The text is in a raster format, I have to read all the material, I can’t quote (I don’t have time to rewrite).
        1. BAI
          BAI 3 May 2018 13: 27
          +2
          In general, you raised a very interesting topic. Vyrubova is a much more interesting person than the general. In principle, in her memoirs, she writes that the violence was:
          When the soldiers tore the gold chain from the cross, they deeply hurt my neck. The cross and several images fell on my knees. I cried out in pain; then one of the soldiers hit me with his fist, and spitting in my facethey left, slamming the iron door behind them. Cold and hungry, I lay on my bare bed, covered myself with my coat, and from exhaustion and tears I began to fall asleep under the mockery and hooting of the soldiers gathered at the door and watching me through the window.

          But these are words, against words.
          It should be noted that she was arrested for suspicion of Rasputin, so hatred of him extended to his alleged "mistress."
          Therefore, perhaps there was (and) fact (s) of assault. By the way, relations with the soldiers later improved.
          1. bober1982
            bober1982 3 May 2018 15: 33
            +1
            Quote: BAI
            arrested her for suspicion of Rasputin

            And on this basis, to arrange a so-called medical examination of a woman, it can’t even be called a mockery, by the way they determined that she was a virgin. This is probably the only thing that this curious commission, with such a curious name and an equally curious chairman, as Muravyov determined.
            Quote: BAI
            relations with the soldiers later improved.

            Vyrubova meekly, with true Christian humility, treated both the beatings and bullying.
            1. Monarchist
              Monarchist 3 May 2018 19: 50
              +5
              Beaver, it reminded me of how the sans-culottes treated Marie Antoinette, of course it was far from sugar, but HUMILIATE A WOMAN, and in the case of Vyrubova she is still disabled. It is so “courageous," and if the incredible happened and the restoration of the monarchy happened in a week, what then? I would give dear to see their faces when they "drown" each other and prove: I was then a magazine, and Vanka or Rafshan in my greatcoat were
        2. Curious
          Curious 3 May 2018 14: 57
          +3
          "And Mr. Curious ..." Why tease?
          1. Mikado
            Mikado 3 May 2018 15: 22
            +4
            Gentlemen are all in Paris! laughing (P.P. Sharikov) drinks
          2. BAI
            BAI 3 May 2018 18: 00
            +2
            Why tease?

            Well, somehow we live under capitalism. Accordingly - the capitalist manner of circulation. There are gentlemen (and you know them) on the site for the appeal "comrade" they will climb the face to beat. Perceived as a personal insult.
      2. Conserp
        Conserp 3 May 2018 13: 27
        +3
        Quote: bober1982
        When he was sitting in the Peter and Paul Fortress, then he suffered, by the way, and it is not clear why he was sitting.
        Ms. Vyrubova (the Empress’s friend) was sitting with him, the drunken guard scoffed at the young woman, stripped naked, beaten, and mocked. Isn't this suffering?

        Firstly, this is ridiculous nonsense.

        Secondly, all claims are against the bourgeois and the Orthodox, who threw off the tsar and imprisoned the “sufferer”. There were no Bolsheviks then.
        1. bober1982
          bober1982 3 May 2018 15: 36
          +2
          Quote: Conserp
          all claims are against bourgeois and Orthodox

          I didn’t like about the Orthodox - I didn’t understand, but about the bourgeoisie everything is correct (with reservations, of course), but I’m talking about it - the lawyer Mason Muravyov, the infamous bourgeois commission, and so on.
          1. Conserp
            Conserp 3 May 2018 17: 13
            +2
            Quote: bober1982
            I didn’t like about the Orthodox - I didn’t understand

            And what is there to not understand - the Orthodox Christians threw off the tsar, the Russian Orthodox Church itself rejoiced and took an active part in this matter.
            1. bober1982
              bober1982 3 May 2018 17: 27
              +1
              Quote: Conserp
              And what is there to not understand

              I will say more - in those turbulent times there were even concepts such as revolutionary monk, church strike ,rally of monksin short, the world has gone mad. How it all ended is well known, a universal massacre.
              In 1991, everything was repeated, now the Communists themselves demanded the dissolution of the Country of Soviets and the ban of the CPSU, the world went crazy again.
        2. Monarchist
          Monarchist 3 May 2018 19: 33
          +1
          Of course nonsense, they, together with the prisoners, dances
      3. Weyland
        Weyland 3 May 2018 14: 58
        +4
        Quote: bober1982
        drunken guards mocked a young woman, stripped naked, beaten, mocked.

        This is in addition to that. that after the railway accident (in 1915) she became disabled and could only move in a wheelchair or on crutches!
  10. Foul skeptic
    Foul skeptic 3 May 2018 13: 51
    +5
    But what remains of his estate today ... But there could be a museum, a sanatorium, finally. But no! "Peace to the huts - war to the palaces."

    1) after the revolution - the hospital
    2) during the Second World War - hospital
    3) in the 50s - a rest house for railway workers
    4) in the 80s - medical and labor dispensary
    But the fact that the picture is the beauty of the 90s.
    1. kalibr
      3 May 2018 14: 45
      +3
      It is bad when good is not maintained. It doesn’t matter which one - Soviet or tsarist. Good is always good. It must be maintained and developed.
      1. Foul skeptic
        Foul skeptic 3 May 2018 15: 48
        +5
        I agree, Vyacheslav, the good must be preserved. Bad when not saved.
        And do not be offended, but your cycle contributes to this. If you are interested in the opinion of readers, then my next one is that I consider this cycle to be biased.
        And if in the first article of the cycle this was not so clearly visible, then here my opinion has already been strengthened.
        Firstly, as most forum users have already noticed - a lot has been written, curiously, but is the topic really revealed?
        Well, maybe they just missed the article, it's okay, answer in the comments - for what faith and how did Voeikov suffer, what exactly did he get to take a place in your story? How a story-biography is acceptable, how a story-point of view is incomprehensible.
        And the second question I have relates to the excerpt from your text that I cited above.
        Why did you decide to use the expression "Peace to huts - war to palaces"?
    2. Conserp
      Conserp 3 May 2018 16: 06
      +3
      Quote: A vile skeptic
      "Peace to the huts - war to the palaces."

      But the fact that the picture is the beauty of the 90s.

      Not just the 90s, but the “saints” of the 90s.

      For the whitewarers to lie - how to breathe.
  11. kalibr
    3 May 2018 15: 34
    +2
    Quote: BAI
    In fact, all the latest troubles of Russia are connected only with the fact that its sociocultural disintegration into a "city" and a "village" by the beginning of the XNUMXth century. It became painfully noticeable at the household level, and the war gave rise to soreness of this sensation. This factor, in turn, manifested itself particularly sharply in connection with the increased marginalization (falling out of the already collapsing class boundaries) of traditional societies.
    Buldakov V.P.
    Red trouble. The nature and consequences of revolutionary violence

    Very well said, or rather written.
  12. kalibr
    3 May 2018 18: 24
    +2
    Quote: Nefarious skeptic
    Well, maybe they just missed the article, it's okay, answer in the comments - for what faith and how did Voeikov suffer, what exactly did he get to take a place in your story? How a story-biography is acceptable, how a story-point of view is incomprehensible.

    An interesting question, and you are right in asking it. But at the beginning of the article it is directly written that there are people in the Martyrology who have only an indirect relation to the persecution of religion, "they are few but they are." This is at the beginning of the article. The book is "thick", when reading it reached Voyeykov, then ... he was surprised. But his fate seemed interesting. That's all. But since the material is basically taken from the specified source, then ... why change the name of the series? I was sure that readers themselves would be able to figure out how interesting his fate was, and how much he suffered "precisely for faith." It seems to me that everything is simple. And "peace to the huts ...", well, we do not very often keep the heritage of the past, the shacks stand ... palaces are crumbling. It seems to me that the place. And in relation to the disclosure of the topic ... What to disclose? A book came out ... The book is big and expensive, it is clear that few people will buy it, but at least readers of VO are informed about its contents. That is the whole topic. It seems to me that there is nothing more to write about.
    1. Conserp
      Conserp 4 May 2018 16: 52
      +1
      Quote: kalibr
      But at the beginning of the article it is directly written that there are people in the Martyrology who have only an indirect relation to the persecution of religion, "they are few but they are."

      Yes Yes. In the list of KILLED FOR FAITH there are people whom no one chased for religion at all, and no one killed.

      What are you doing without hesitation openly admit.

      Shame on professional state bakery Russophobes on the State Department salary is not familiar.
  13. Monarchist
    Monarchist 3 May 2018 19: 11
    +2
    Voeikov ahead of his time: at that time, entrepreneurship among representatives of the military aristocracy was not held in high esteem. If any Eliseev, Ryabushinsky, or the same Demidov will bother about the "candle factory" is a normal phenomenon: then he is a merchant, and such as Voeikov is not to face. + Envy. Now NO ONE SURPRISE the era has somehow changed. Whether we like it or not, but EVERYWHERE: investment forums, entrepreneurship.
    Like most of us, I was formed in a different era and I do not have an entrepreneurial spirit, but I understand that it is difficult to RETURN to the PAST. I divide current entrepreneurs into two conditional categories: “COMPRADORS, or crooks, and“ PATRIOTS ”are some engaged in resale and it’s violet, where to live? How do others live? Is it Berezovsky and the former owner of Yukos and Chichvarkin or Mavrodi milien others? Remember. there are "PATRIOTS ie relatively decent: Derepaska, Prokhorov, Usmanov and some others. Yes, they take care of “their beloved”, but they promote domestic industry and for them the Fatherland is not an empty phrase. It seems to me that Voeikov would have been one of the latter. HOPE that such entrepreneurs and philanthropists as: Tretyakov, Mamontov, Ryabushinsky, Stroganov and others will be reborn. Sava Morozov this ambiguous person was
    1. kalibr
      3 May 2018 21: 07
      +2
      I also completely agree with you. I read that 3-4% of the population of an average European country have a propensity for entrepreneurship. Just in Russia,% is higher than -5-6% and it is clear that "grabbers" are the first very often to "orient" and ... "spoil the impression" of the business. But there are others who do a lot for themselves (why not ?!), but also for the country. So it was everywhere and Russia is no exception. Yes, it is difficult, and very, I tried. But those who are younger will do better!
    2. Conserp
      Conserp 3 May 2018 22: 49
      +2
      Why did this “patriot” not begin to serve the country and people (like Brusilov, Bonch-Bruevich and Slashchov-Crimean), but fled to the West and published Nazi propaganda there?

      Beacons are such beacons. Scrape the whitewater - you will always find a Bandera.
    3. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 4 May 2018 05: 38
      +3
      read your comment, Glory. Commentary with hope for the best. Will patrons appear? Time will tell.
      Here are just terrible suspicions - maybe someone is already writing books about Berezovsky and Mavrod. What were they suffering and untimely left.
  14. Monarchist
    Monarchist 3 May 2018 19: 14
    +2
    Quote: kalibr
    It is bad when good is not maintained. It doesn’t matter which one - Soviet or tsarist. Good is always good. It must be maintained and developed.

    I agree a thousand times
  15. Monarchist
    Monarchist 3 May 2018 19: 31
    +2
    Quote: bober1982
    Quote: Conserp
    all claims are against bourgeois and Orthodox

    I didn’t like about the Orthodox - I didn’t understand, but about the bourgeoisie everything is correct (with reservations, of course), but I’m talking about it - the lawyer Mason Muravyov, the infamous bourgeois commission, and so on.

    This commission is something other than posturing and the pursuit of cheap authority: What are we dealing with the servants of the damned tsarism if the authorities had changed, what would they do?
    1. bober1982
      bober1982 3 May 2018 19: 43
      +1
      Quote: Monarchist
      This commission is nothing more than posturing and the pursuit of cheap authority.

      I do not agree with you, they were serious people, everything was carefully thought out, such a cheap authority is not required.
  16. Alexander Greene
    Alexander Greene 3 May 2018 23: 48
    +3
    What authors, such are their heroes.
    If readers had not learned anything about the "great labor feat" of the royal dignitary, who
    "... in 1897-1898 he worked as a clerk for the restructuring of the regimental church in the name of the holy righteous Zacharias and Elizabeth at the barracks of the Cavalier Guard regiment in St. Petersburg, for which he personally raised funds, and then was appointed a clerk of this church,"
    then I think they wouldn’t lose anything.
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid 4 May 2018 05: 26
      +2
      It seems like the Mortyrologist was compiled somehow strange. After all, the Orthodox drafters live in our country and can imagine the reaction of people to some specific individuals. At least to the aforementioned. It seems like Vyacheslav Olegovich informed us about this. He repeatedly emphasized that this was a retelling. And he could choose someone else, everything was in his power. After all, a book of a large volume, so think about it, if this fate is interesting, then how about the rest?
      In fact, fate is really interesting for its well-being.
      1. Conserp
        Conserp 4 May 2018 13: 54
        +3
        Quote: Reptiloid
        It seems like Mortyrology is made up somehow weird.

        They are all composed in a very ordinary way - from selected vile nonsense.

        Propaganda slops, exactly the same as Svidomo.
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 4 May 2018 16: 15
          +1
          Well, here it turns out there are several or many, but I didn’t know, because I didn’t know ..
          1. Conserp
            Conserp 4 May 2018 16: 38
            +2
            Their whole carriage. Each local cell of the whitewashed-Nazi organizations, such as the NTS and ROCOR, fabricates some kind of "martyrology of the victims of the liquid Bolsheviks."

            Only "priests executed for faith" counted several times more than they were in the entire Russian Empire. Despite the fact that even the Patriarch said that the special church commission could not find any such cases at all ...
            1. Alexander Greene
              Alexander Greene 4 May 2018 17: 17
              +2
              Quote: Conserp
              Their whole carriage. Each local cell of the whitewashed-Nazi organizations, such as the NTS and ROCOR, fabricates some kind of "martyrology of the victims of the liquid Bolsheviks."

              I confirm what has been said, in Ukraine, in one of the southern regions, the “Martyrology” of those who died from the “famine” was made, when they began to sort it out, it turned out that lists of current voters were included there. So everything needs to be checked.
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 4 May 2018 17: 35
                +1
                Quote: Alexander Green
                I confirm what has been said, in Ukraine, in one of the southern regions, the “Martyrology” of those who died from the “famine” was made, when they began to sort it out, it turned out that lists of current voters were included there. So everything needs to be checked.
                Horror !!! And on the other hand, they are the voters and are alive now. Till. What to make, time to spend, change the title and that's it. And then people will discuss, cry, write articles condolences. ....
  17. Alexander Greene
    Alexander Greene 5 May 2018 21: 17
    +1
    Quote: Mikado
    Yes! ... dignity, intelligence and humanism is not for you to measure with me .....

    After all your answers, I realized that I really can not compare with you ...
    Quote: Mikado
    I repeat once again: I expect from you a report on my article read and a report on charity. Without it .. How do I respect the "communists"? For the slogans? And not for the mind and virtue?

    I read your article, so-so, in the comments you were flattered more, so do not flatter yourself about this. But they can note one plus - it did not have nasty things, even about Kingisepp.
    And at the expense of the respect of the Communists, I do not know: can you respect them, their goal is the destruction of private property, and they do not hide it.
    1. Mikado
      Mikado 6 May 2018 07: 00
      +3
      I read your article, so-so, in the comments you were flattered more, so do not flatter yourself about this.

      oh, how glad I am to your opinion .. And how many articles do you have? Why aren't they? Only slogans know how to give birth, but to spoil the forum? So that is already completely ruined. Funny, others liked it .. I already mentioned the harm of masturbation ... but to each - his own. And I sincerely respect your choice! hi
      After all your answers, I realized that I really can not compare with you ...

      yes, not at all. Because activity, honor and goodwill are not aggressive reminders with a transition to personalities about the works of Marx, not arrogance and limitation in judgments, and not nagging about that "it would be nice when we would shoot all those who disagree"God forbid such people come to power. Although .. they won’t be able to .. The seat from the couch is too hard to tear too much .. On the other hand .. in one country loafers have already" jumped ".. anything can happen! request
      And at the expense of the respect of the Communists, I do not know: can you respect them, their goal is the destruction of private property, and they do not hide it.

      I am absolutely normal towards communism. Just communism should be with the head. I had a good childhood. But .. times have changed! Alexander, our "forum communists", with their whining in half with rudeness, did everything possible so that the word "communism" already had rejection. I repeat once again - the whole discussion they hold is extremely aggressive, intolerant, limited, with a transition to the individual with the slightest disagreement. Why should I respect such a discussion? hi
      1. Alexander Greene
        Alexander Greene 6 May 2018 13: 13
        +2
        Quote: Mikado
        Greene: After all your answers, I realized that I really can not compare with you ...

        Mikado: ... yes, not at all. Because activity, honor and goodwill are not aggressive reminders with a transition to personalities ...

        I actually didn’t mean it .... but you, as always, did not understand.
        Quote: Mikado
        our "forum communists", with their whining in half with rudeness, did everything possible so that the word "communism" would already be rejected. I will repeat once more - the whole discussion they hold is extremely aggressive, intolerant, limited, with a transition to individuals with the slightest disagreement ....

        Communism is rejected by those who have something to lose, they have adapted to the current regime by sticking to the working people, and they want it to be so forever. No, the laws of the development of society can not be repealed.
        And on the account of the transition to personality, this is natural. Each person is responsible for his words, and if he shamelessly lies, slanders, and distorts the facts, we have to find out: who benefits from this, and then we go out to the personality, because what is the personality - such are its judgments.
        1. Mikado
          Mikado 6 May 2018 23: 06
          +3
          Communism is rejected by those who have something to lose, they have adapted to the current regime by sticking to the working people, and they want it to be so forever. No, the laws of the development of society can not be repealed.

          to cancel! And in my personal opinion, society has not matured even before that. And as for the "sticking" I would argue, but .. empty.
          And on the account of the transition to personality, this is natural.

          Alexander, that’s exactly why you should not do this on the forum. But when every boor (I do not mean you at all!) Tries to explain that you are nobody, and to call you in any way, it .. It averts from the forum! And it kills constructive communication, replacing it with the clarification of personal relationships! we produce nonsense and slogans, instead of trying to unite ..request
          1. Reptiloid
            Reptiloid 7 May 2018 18: 50
            +1
            But I don’t understand why all the dissonant words about Green happened. So, I’m sitting quietly at home, in the sense of a country house, now nobody pulls, I read and don’t understand why Green. Or, like the last time, something seemed to someone, I thought, screams, screams, dissonant words ... ... and then an apology.
            And I don’t understand much. Here are the last 3 days or 4 and I was in the Southwest. On a variety of streets and in different houses. And in the old, which used to be the Leningrad region and in new ones. The houses are different, all of which are mentioned with a foul-smelling porch. Full glazing. If the house is new, then the concierge is programmed during construction,. And vidyushniki. All! Flowers in the porches. The problem. Where is this street where is this house? Or is it a different house and a different area? Saaavsem completely different. Crumbling? It is not clear, I doubt it.
            1. Mikado
              Mikado 7 May 2018 19: 40
              +1
              I honestly don’t know where you found at our house with concierges, Dmitry. Maybe you showed elite housing? So I live in an ordinary house. request
              Or, as last time, something seemed to someone, I thought, screams, screams, dissonant words ... And then an apology.

              I don’t remember me apologizing to anyone! Although it is worth paying tribute to Green, he behaved with dignity within the framework of his own convictions.
              And now I will explain to you if the last time, Dmitry, you did not understand! hi I will not allow myself to be rude. And it's not about education, and not about the articles that you so colorfully mentioned in half with my tantrum in the previous comments. The fact is that limited people are always rude first. I don’t like that.
              Let's continue. For two years in a row, I did just that, applying all my residual talents to diplomacy, to equalizing conflicts on a branch of history. Did you do it Did the "Communists" do this? No. They rushed with slogans, and they themselves were the first to be rude to everyone who disagrees with them. Up to the "shock of dirty linen" people did not like. Have I ever done this? No. Moreover, I have good relations with people from “many camps,” because I value it wisely and not by faith.
              The third. Do you have a dream - communism? (why should he .. You will be kicked out of the cottage! And they will be given to the nearest homeless person or “worker of the East” who bought citizenship and came here with a family of fifteen people! Joke, Shuuutka! laughing ) My dream was more marketable! Yes, more! I dreamed that on the branch of history the main participants would respect each other, despite the interests and differences of opinion. That did not happen. Because everyone quarreled precisely on the basis of communism (on Samsonov's articles), and the Communists with the right of the first rudeness were the ringleaders. fool
              And it's not about education, and not about the social role, Dmitry, not at all. The human mind, tact, goodwill does not depend on education. But when some “communist” was rude to me once again, an answer came.
              Think for yourself. I do not believe in communism. Only in the distant future - yes. Perhaps it will be so. But at the moment .. society has not matured. what
              Therefore, slogans and intolerance are empty. As well as obscure Marx in modern conditions. Think for yourself, to each - their own hi
              1. Reptiloid
                Reptiloid 7 May 2018 20: 08
                +1
                Honestly, I don’t remember who you put up with. Alexander, or the Doctor, they argued with Teterin or Olgovich. So you were not there. In those articles. But I don’t read everything. Samsonov's articles ----- STALIN FALCONS --- before you had it, there were no squabbles about the economy. About Hyperborea and the like, I do not read. Like many others. You say they argued there? I don’t know, I haven’t seen it. But it seems to me that Green was not in those articles. He doesn’t have much comments at all, I’m looking at them for whatever articles. But it didn’t occur to you that if people chose a problematic topic, then they just want a dispute? Trying to reconcile --- the dispute will intensify. You write that some kind of communist was rude, but why is Green's answer?
                There was an article, I’ll clarify V.O. Shpakovsky a few minutes later — there you flew into Green with dissonant words and I asked you, is that a public hara-kiri? And he said that we need you healthy with articles. After that, you --- to Green ..... I look now at your comments.
                1. Mikado
                  Mikado 7 May 2018 20: 19
                  +2
                  It is impossible to reconcile them. Trying to reconcile --- the dispute will intensify. You write that some kind of communist was rude, but why is Green's answer?

                  I answered that. And you did not forget to mention my two highest. Finely, finely ... And Green .. Well, I can argue a lot with him, but I realized that it was empty. stop Yes, he behaved with dignity! hi
                  But it didn’t occur to you that if people chose a problematic topic, then they just want a dispute? It’s impossible to reconcile them.

                  And why, why is it needed? You have a bunch of examples before your eyes - the argument always goes into swearing. Moreover, it is certainly the Communists-patriots-hyperboreans who begin it. Brazenly, peremptorily, with a transition to personality and lack of logic! Well, they believe that they are right! fellow
                  Dmitry, how many have we lost because of this? Someone was banned, someone left. Due to disagreement in philosophy! Nonsense, right? And some still dream of national happiness! People argue come as you say spit on someone else's opinion. How will you unite? wink what idea? That we still live in a relatively one culture, and if in different?
                  But it didn’t occur to you that if people chose a problematic topic, then they want a dispute?

                  I still don’t understand who wants communism more ... negative Either I who wanted smooth communication and friendship within the framework of the site’s society, or “communist debaters” who were ready to throw feces at all those who disagree with Marx’s philosophy, and at the same time do nothing for the site and society! what
                  1. Reptiloid
                    Reptiloid 7 May 2018 20: 36
                    +1
                    I tell you once again that I have not been to those articles. Now, if I don’t want to argue for the sake of argument, I don’t go. The subject of Hyperborea is unproven to me. And I strongly doubt that the Communists are directly arguing with you? Maybe hyperboreans, or esotericists, or what are the proponents of cosmism? The theme is non-communist. But people have the right to get sick with both esotericism and Hyperborea. Do not impose your opinion on them, in my opinion, to cut everyone under one comb.
                    So, see your comments on March 24-25. This is an article from a series of feathers. There ---- to Green.
                    1. Reptiloid
                      Reptiloid 7 May 2018 21: 07
                      +2
                      I just laugh. I mentioned your education, and why not? How many times have you mentioned this in recent days? And your 4 articles? After all, this is some kind of absurdity. Look, you know everything about V.O.Shpakovsky. And Oleinikov? Doctor of historical sciences, author of many books, some of which have the recommendation of Starikov .. Articles. ANDREI IZ CHELYABINSKA. Did anyone act so tactlessly? Or do not you understand? HOW is it from the outside. And what does Green have to do with it? After all, if you, how do you think were rude there, why should I and others who are not there should read it here? Where is the point? Where is the logic? Or so you thought it would be interesting for the author here and in another article? You know, the situation is suspicious. It's a pity there is no Doctor. Serious smart person. Only wishing peace and friendship an adult person will write about gramophone needles .. many times ......
                      And how would you like it if I screamed ---- I am a certified specialist! I have 4 certificates! I have ---- dozens of certificates! I am a participant in city competitions! I am the Laureate of the Russian competition! All of you are far from me! Madhouse!
                      1. Mikado
                        Mikado 7 May 2018 21: 58
                        +3
                        Our Communists and "patriots" are arranging a madhouse on the forum, dreaming of wiping America off the face of the earth with a nuclear strike, but without getting up off the couch. hi I have already said that I practically leave no comments on “opinions” and “analytics”? what
                        I do not want to argue with you. If you want, you can continue, and sign it. hi
                        Moreover, I know my own worth. hi
                        And the last thing that started the whole fuss, Dmitry .. I would not want any of the Communists to be rude to me. If they have a painful self-esteem, they dream of taking and sharing everything, are able to be rude, consider their opinion to be the only one, and life has turned out unsuccessfully - this is their business. I have an adequate self-esteem. I created a lot from scratch. And next time I will not restrain myself. It’s easier for me to be banned, but once explain to the “opponent”, who just took it and rude me - that’s how he wanted it, self-esteem crushes - everything is popular, clear, accurate and on the topic. Do you know, Dmitry, what’s the most interesting? Here such a short-range boor on the site will remain, and will continue to carry nonsense, and I will not. Moreover, he absolutely will not feel remorse - intelligence will not allow it! yes what about idiocy of society, Dmitry? maybe it’s easier to give each such word? good
                        Dmitry, I just explained to you about the structure of society. So to speak, a short course. Think for yourself
                        That's why .. I communicate only with those who are interested in their thoughts and activities. I have the honor, Dmitry! hi good luck!
                      2. Reptiloid
                        Reptiloid 8 May 2018 05: 01
                        0
                        In your commentary, Nikolai, there is no answer to my question ----- what exactly are your claims to Green, why are the dissonant words to him.
                        Without water and essentially please.
  18. Reptiloid
    Reptiloid 7 May 2018 05: 11
    +1
    Alexander Green,
    Good morning! To everyone! But it turns out May 4 --- Karl Marx’s birthday and a new story appeared ---- WHY Marxism is on the rise again (Fursov, Pyzhikov and others), though he has not yet looked.
    1. kalibr
      7 May 2018 06: 37
      +1
      Because Dmitry, that 80% of people, to put it mildly, are unwise, lazy, poorly educated, conceived by drinking, fell under Chernobyl and Tesha, that is, as a result, they have only 20% of their wealth and also poorly adapt to a rapidly changing life. And they envy those 20% who with all this is OK. And they hope again to take everything away and share. But now it's over forever. Both those above and the “average” have become smarter.
      1. Reptiloid
        Reptiloid 7 May 2018 09: 30
        +1
        Vyacheslav Olegovich, is that really the only thing?
        Quote: kalibr
        Because Dmitry, that 80% of people, to put it mildly, are unwise, lazy, ill-mannered, conceived by drinking, fell under Chernobyl and Teshu, that is, as a result, they have only 20% of wealth and they also poorly adapt to a rapidly changing life. And they envy those 20% who with all this is OK. And they hope again to take everything away and share. But now it's over forever .....
        Indeed, just as the proletarians of all countries have not yet been united, so the bourgeoisie of all countries have not been united !!!!! NOT ALL, NOT ALL of them want unification. And others want unification, swallowing and letting the weaker in the world. And this suggests that everything will be repeated, there will be support for the proletariat.
        Yes, here, I wanted to repent that I condemned your authoritarianism ..........
        1. Reptiloid
          Reptiloid 7 May 2018 10: 30
          +1
          Quote: Reptiloid
          Yes, here, I wanted to repent that I condemned your authoritarianism ..........
          The authoritarianism was demonstrated to us by the author of 5 articles with two higher educations and. And if 7 articles? While you have thousands of articles. There used to be hysteria, I reassured him and he apologized to Green. And the last few days it was inconvenient for me to write, I was busy. I don’t think you would like that. He probably wanted to please you and defeat communism? Sincerely.
      2. Alexander Greene
        Alexander Greene 7 May 2018 18: 09
        +1
        Quote: kalibr
        And they hope again to take everything away and share.

        Well, why so primitive? Not to take away, but to return to the people what the oligarchs have appropriated to themselves, stole small and medium bourgeoisie after the destruction of the USSR, and not to divide, but to create a common monopoly, which will again work for the whole society, and this is called socialism.
  19. kalibr
    7 May 2018 06: 41
    +1
    Quote: Reptiloid
    But it is impossible to combine study and work.

    Here you wrote the most correct. What was also written by J. Orwell in 1984.
    1. Mikado
      Mikado 7 May 2018 20: 08
      +1
      You, Vyacheslav Olegovich, would very much go to work as a Preacher. While listening to you, others would definitely burst into tears, and someone would even believe! hi (in 80% I already believed for sure soldier ).
  20. Mikado
    Mikado 8 May 2018 20: 30
    +1
    Reptiloid,
    In your commentary, Nikolai, there is no answer to my question ----- what exactly are your claims to Green, why are the dissonant words to him.
    Without water and essentially please.

    and what are the “Communists” claims to all those who disagree with slogans and illusive dreams of universal happiness, why do they insult the first, Dmitry?
    1. Conserp
      Conserp 9 May 2018 11: 37
      +2
      What are you, Svidomo bombing.
      1. Mikado
        Mikado 9 May 2018 13: 23
        +2
        What are you, Svidomo bombing.

        I’m not bombed. It all began with your insult, most honorable one. hi I advise you not to use epithets and comparisons ("go smart") in relation to the interlocutor. Ugly, so to speak.
        I do not belong to Svidomo, I live in St. Petersburg, served 10 years. Stupid conflict .. One careless word can provoke it, and the most dirty and hated conflicts happen because of sheer trifles, believe the experience. Someone didn’t understand someone, someone didn’t react like that. Tied up - I suggest! hi
        Despite your inappropriate address on such a day - on the Day of the Great Victory personally for you and all members of the forum! Happiness and health to you and your family, peaceful sky and development to us all! drinks
        1. Conserp
          Conserp 9 May 2018 15: 58
          +1
          Quote: Mikado
          I’m not bombed.

          That is, you just spoiled the entire branch with Nazi agitation and Bandera slogans?

          Quote: Mikado
          Happy Great Victory Day

          No need to stick on.

          Everyone can read what you wrote on this page.
          1. 3x3zsave
            3x3zsave 9 May 2018 22: 06
            +1
            I will come for you!
          2. Mikado
            Mikado 9 May 2018 23: 09
            +2
            That is, you just spoiled the entire branch with Nazi agitation and Bandera slogans?

            What are the Bandera slogans? what agitation?
            Did you and I drink? Why on "you"?
            Yes, everything is bad .... Goodbye. There is nothing to talk about.
  21. EvilLion
    EvilLion 16 May 2018 08: 25
    0
    Does the author really believe that in the conditions of the civil war, priests did not campaign? In fact, they were led, and often even for the Bolsheviks, and for this White was shot. But it’s unpleasant to recall such crackers with a French bun. It destroys their cute little world from RCMP.