Anniversary of the Kharkiv agreements: what the experts say

34
Anniversary of the Kharkiv agreements: what the experts say


The second anniversary of the signing of the Kharkiv agreements once again demonstrated the instability of bilateral relations between Ukraine and Russia. As elections are coming to Ukraine, statements on the revision of the Kharkiv agreements signed in 2010 are increasingly heard. The attitude of the Ukrainian side to Moscow is becoming increasingly confrontational. If last year even the slightest rumors about the possibility of revising these contracts were perceived as stupid, today the situation has changed dramatically: this topic is increasingly being raised in the Ukrainian corridors of power.

And the main reason for such changes is rather prosaic: Russian gas. In order to demonstrate to Russia its serious intentions and to express dissatisfaction with the conditions set forth in the contract, a demonstrative trial was held over the former Prime Minister of Ukraine, Yulia Tymoshenko. Now official Kiev is beginning to demand a reduction in the cost of blue fuel to the amount that it considers fair.

You should not think long to understand what exactly should become a “pawn” in this game. The Russian Black Sea Fleet is a kind of change, around which everything is spinning.

Opposition Ukrainian political forces are confident that everything that is happening clearly indicates that forecasts of that part of the population that were very skeptical of this kind of agreement are beginning to come true. The first unambiguous hints that Russia, even in its thoughts, does not have Ukraine as an equal partner, and also does not consider the desire of the Ukrainian side to build good neighborly relations, appeared a year after the signing of the Kharkov agreements. And this was expressed, first of all, in the refusal to help resolve the socio-economic problems that arose through the fault of the Black Sea fleet. Plus, political issues were added.

According to the opposition, despite the fact that Dmitry Medvedev has repeatedly stated that special social and economic assistance will be provided to Sevastopol, as the main base of the Russian Black Sea Fleet, this assistance has so far been expressed in a very specific form.

At the same time, they mention that the debt of the Russian Black Sea Fleet to the city budget of Sevastopol is about 20 million hryvnia, of which deductions to the pension fund amount to about 6990 thousand hryvnia, and the rest of the amount is tax arrears. In the Russian national currency, this amount is 92 million rubles. As a result, the staff of the Lazarevskiy Admiralty, which has been carrying out work to restore and maintain the technical condition of ships for several years, has not received the money earned. Currently, wage arrears are on the order of 4,3 million hryvnia.

In addition, the leadership of the Russian Black Sea Fleet is also responsible for one more debt - it has not yet paid off with local residents under the program of equity participation in the construction of an apartment building in Astana Kesaeva Street. Despite the investment, Sevastopol residents have been waiting for the promised housing for more than a year.

In the opinion of the opposition, the expectations of the local leadership regarding the growth of Russian businessmen’s contributions to the development of the city’s infrastructure are no less unrealistic even though the Russian side has announced that it has successfully overcome the effects of the economic crisis. In contrast, the level of investment compared with 2010 year, the previous year fell by a quarter.

Some Ukrainians believe that today the main feature of the development of the Kharkiv agreements is the emergence of problems of a political nature, in particular, gas relations. It is no secret to anyone that the Russian leadership is resorting to the gas issue in those cases when it is necessary to make Kiev more compliant in those issues that at one time or another are a priority for Moscow. But the Ukrainian leadership is not lagging behind its Russian colleagues, resorting to the issue of providing leases to the Russian Black Sea Fleet in the Crimea, when Moscow openly demands "obedience" and "concessions" in this or that matter. Thus, the policy of mutual pressure became the basis of the Kharkiv agreements and is maintained to this day.

Oppositionists also say that since the Ukrainian side made several mistakes in 2010 in the “rent-for-gas” relationship, it is clear that it had to look for new ways to persuade Russia to agree to provide additional discounts on this “product” . Moscow agreed, but demanded the participation of Ukraine in the Customs Union, which is under its direct control. In addition, another proposal was received: to consider taking part in a joint military-political alliance. And since Kiev has not yet given a definite answer, the Russian government has resumed attempts to keep the situation in Ukraine under its control.

So, in 2011, in the Crimea, two Russian military personnel (representatives of special services) made an attempt to acquire listening equipment, but did it through a worldwide network, obviously bearing in mind the enormous 2009 scandal of the year, when one of the Russian special services officers was detained on the Ukrainian-Russian border with similar equipment. But for some reason they ordered it directly to Ukraine, for which, strictly speaking, they paid for it: both of them received conclusions on 4,5.

In addition, some opposition politicians claim that the department of information-psychological struggle has resumed its activities in the Russian Black Sea Fleet. The distribution of propaganda materials has also been expanded. Thus, the circulation of the Flag of the Motherland newspaper, the creator of which is considered the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation, was increased. The publication of the newspaper “The Russian community of Sevastopol” was resumed. It is still being published in the printing house of the Black Sea Fleet. But the newspaper, there is nothing wrong with that, if it were not for one “but”, they say in the opposition: it promotes international discord, as well as repeated calls for the annexation of Sevastopol to Russia.

They also note that Russian activists have a large arsenal of forms and methods for implementing Russian foreign policy towards Ukraine.

As for the opinions of experts, they also had different opinions about who was more advantageous about these agreements. Thus, according to V.Karasev, director of the Institute of Global Announcements, Russia’s Kharkiv contracts were beneficial in terms of strategy, since they allowed the extension of the Black Sea Fleet’s tenure to the year 2042, while according to previous agreements it had to leave Ukraine already in 2017 year For Ukraine, this is a tactical victory, since in this way an attempt was made to obtain a one-time discount in the gas issue. The analyst is confident that both parties have different opinions on the effectiveness of the agreements, since each of them pursued completely different goals.

In addition, the expert added that he was confident that Ukraine would soon see complaints about rent inconsistencies and similar nuances that are not legally regulated. At the same time, the political analyst believes that the signing of the Kharkiv agreements was necessary for both states, because it made it possible to somewhat stabilize relations between them.

According to the Ukrainian expert V. Bala, after the inauguration of the new Russian president, the parties can sit down at the negotiating table on the reduction of prices for natural gas. And on the part of Russia, it would be strategically correct to give up on the price issue if Ukraine agrees to support participation in the Customs Union, because only in this case will V. Putin’s plans to re-establish a powerful state within the Russian Federation (which used to be called the USSR and have a large influence on political and economic processes in the world).

The Russian expert M.Nenashev is a little more optimistic in his conclusions regarding the effectiveness of the agreements. He says that both parties benefited from signing contracts. It is worth remembering only the growth of commodity turnover between the two states, which reached 40 billion dollars. At the same time, he noted that the Russian government is concerned that the Ukrainian side in every way impedes the presence of the Russian Black Sea Fleet in the Crimea.

He also noted that the regime of Yanukovych did not become more favorable for Russian sailors in the Crimea than during the years of Yushchenko’s presidency. But, all those who supported the new forces somehow did not immediately notice that no one is going to repeal the laws that were signed under the previous regime, and in fact they greatly complicate the life of the Russian military. This, in particular, the rules of redeployment of equipment and personnel, did not resolve the issue of providing them with apartments that were built at the expense of the Moscow budget. In addition, the Ukrainian side to everything also requires a paid registration of every military man who arrives in the service in the Crimea.

From all that has been said, it is clearly seen that the new regime listens carefully and adopts the words of the opponents of the Russian Black Sea Fleet, the main argument “against” of which is the assertion that its content on Ukrainian territory does little, but Ukraine can lose a lot (here accidentally mentioned the possibility of the beginning of an armed conflict in Iran, into which Ukraine can be drawn, if it does not give up the Russian lease).

Both sides are well aware that the revision of the Kharkiv agreements is quite possible, especially if opposition forces come to power in Ukraine after the parliamentary elections. For Russia, such a development is hardly desirable, and certainly it will not contribute to the strengthening of relations. According to the head of the CIS Center of the Diplomatic Academy of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia S. Zhiltsov, the revision of contracts will have negative consequences. Very little time has passed since the date of signing. And if each time one or another treaty is revised, then a big cross can be put on the development of bilateral relations.

Therefore, in the current situation, both the Ukrainian and the Russian government should consider the problem of fulfilling their obligations under the Kharkiv agreements, since it is already clear that this will not be easy to do, especially in light of the change of power in the Russian Federation.
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  1. YARY
    +5
    April 30 2012 07: 47
    So much is spoken and spoken; about the fleet and Crimea, suffering from a corncob with a drunkard, about gas in Ukraine and what is (or will be) north bypass. I don’t think that in Ukraine they could reconsider anything. The agreement is there and that's it! angry
    1. Aleksey67
      +7
      April 30 2012 08: 48
      In general, the Ukrainian authorities are behaving strangely. On the one hand, they are "independent" and "Euro-tuned", but the gas price must be "fair" (a new economic term introduced by Yanukovych). laughing
      1. +8
        April 30 2012 09: 19
        Quote: Aleksey67
        On the one hand, they are "independent" and "Euro-tuned", but the gas price must be "fair" (a new economic term introduced by Yanukovych
        I welcome Alexei ... And it seems to me quite logical behavior ... Yushchenko’s game with a gas pipe is repeated ... Ukraine can’t really really earn even interest on loans now, and the stupid and short-sighted policy of its leaders at the time led not only to Russian , but also to Western loans ... And the West will not forgive non-repayment ... And everyone understands this ...
        Now the same card is being played out .. Only now the amounts have decreased by several orders of magnitude. But with a black sheep, even a tuft of wool ...
        1. Aleksey67
          +3
          April 30 2012 10: 03
          Quote: domokl
          .Ukraine now can’t really earn even interest on loans, and the stupid and short-sighted policies of its leaders at the time led not only to Russian, but also to Western loans ...


          This year, for the interest on loans, a huge amount must be paid. Vneshtorgbank has already "washed up" smile

          The Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine intends to refinance a loan of Russian Vneshtorgbank in the amount of $ 2 billion, the final repayment term of which ends in June this year. This was reported to the media by an anonymous source in the government.

          The Russians have agreed in principle to refinance the loan, according to the source, but two options are being considered. The first is that a new VTB loan of $ 1 billion for a period of 5 years with market interest will be involved in repayment, and securities will be issued for the second billion

          Credit of Russian Vneshtorgbank for 6 months in the amount of $ 2 billion to cover the state budget deficit at 6,7% per annum was received in 2010 year. The contract provided for the possibility of prolonging the term of the contract three times for a period of six months. All three government extensions were used..


          IMF will take money from the pockets of Ukrainians to repay debts
          THURSDAY, APRIL 26, 2012, 14:02

          The Prime Minister of Ukraine Mykola Azarov said that the IMF will repay the debt from the state budget.

          "We will return at the expense of our funds, because we will not take them from the pockets of those who squandered them. We will return from our pockets at the expense of the budget", - said Azarov.

          Note, by the end of the year Ukraine should return 3,1 billion dollars to the IMF. The previous portion of $ 575 million was paid in February. If the country fails to repay the loan on time, it will be declared a technical default.
          1. oiuy
            -11
            April 30 2012 13: 41
            Dear Russians finally understood the obvious thing - the Russian Black Sea Fleet in Ukraine is NOT WELL-WIFE! ONLY relocation to the territory of Russia can relieve the growing tension! Point. The opposition, which will definitely come to power in the Parliament of Ukraine in the fall, will turn the tide on this issue. Yanukovych drove himself into a corner, any agreements with Putin turn out to be abnormal in terms of civilized relations. All Ukraine has already understood the absolutely dumb situation with gas, when the price for Ukraine exceeds the German by almost 2! times. Brotherly laughing Russian gas blackmail has already tortured everyone and opened his eyes the last one in the armored train. Is this such a business in Moscow?
            1. Aleksey67
              +5
              April 30 2012 13: 54
              After the news about the gay parade which will be held in Kiev on May 20, 2012, it somehow becomes uncomfortable.

              US Ambassador to Ukraine John Tefft officially expressed his support for the Kiev gay pride parade

              The US ambassador to Ukraine, John F. Tefft, made an official statement on the embassy’s website in which he, on his own behalf and on behalf of the American state, expressed support for the participants in the first Ukrainian gay pride parade to be held in Kiev in the second half of May this year.


              “As the US Ambassador to Kiev, I would like to express my support and support to my country to everyone who will participate in the first Pride March of lesbians, gays, bisexuals and transgender people (LGBT) in Ukraine on May 20, 2012. I must sadly note that in many countries of the world, members of the LGBT community continue to suffer from violence, discrimination and harassment for their sexual orientation or gender identity, ”the ambassador said in a statement.

              According to him, according to US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, “gay rights are human rights and human rights are gay rights».

              “Therefore, by recognizing diversity, promoting tolerance and combating prejudice and discrimination, we strive to build a world in which everyone can fully enjoy fundamental human rights,” said Tefft. - I would like to thank the organizers of the Kiev Pride March and I hope that many, both gay and representatives of the traditional orientation, will join us during this event. I wish you all a successful and peaceful celebration. ”
            2. +2
              April 30 2012 17: 40
              Quote: oiuy
              The Russian Black Sea Fleet in Ukraine is NOT WELL-WIFE!

              You say it in Sevastopol on the street, preferably louder.
              Yes there was a time, there was a character at the helm in Russia. He not only pounded shoes on the UN rostrum, but also cut the zemlyotsok to his historical homeland.
            3. Odinplys
              0
              1 May 2012 14: 06
              oiuy,
              Dear Russians finally understood the obvious thing - the Russian Black Sea Fleet in Ukraine is NOT WELL-WIFE!

              So the fleet is on its own land ... Crimea is called ... And no one will listen to Khrushchev’s ravings
            4. biglow
              +1
              1 May 2012 15: 35
              go to ramstein, sweep the drunk on an american military base
  2. +4
    April 30 2012 07: 56
    Hmm, the closer Putin’s inauguration, the stronger the botalia in Ukraine, while thinking like a little more than a hundred dollars. I think the demotivator in the topic: http: //topwar.ru/uploads/images/2012/841/afhl692.jpg
  3. Redpartyzan
    +4
    April 30 2012 08: 42
    Exactly. Oh, what a mistake Nikita Sergeyevich made. Right now, probably in the grave turns upside down. In the meantime, the situation is unambiguous - if Ukraine refuses to join the Eurasian Union, this is regarded as building its foreign policy line contrary to Russia's interests. And then we will have to build a new base for the Black Sea Fleet gentlemen, because he cannot be a pawn in the gas game.
    1. +8
      April 30 2012 09: 21
      New bases have long been built and will continue to be built ... But Sevastopol is the mainstay of the fleet at the moment ...
    2. BAT
      +8
      April 30 2012 12: 13
      Ukraine will never be admitted to the European Union !!! They have enough free parasites in the form of Greece, Romania, Bulgaria, Iceland. Yanukovych also seems to be in no hurry to join the Eurasian Union ... Ukraine alone, under such leadership and in this state, will not last long. In debt, as in silk, but there is nothing to give. But the IMF is so simple, for beautiful eyes, I do not intend to write off debts. So, you need to be determined somehow.
      Until a strong, adequate, sane leader appears in Ukraine, there will be no sense. All past and current leaders of the country are populists, temporary workers and thieves.
      1. speedy
        +3
        April 30 2012 20: 45
        I agree with you - Europe does not need Ukraine, but the West does not intend to give Russia up to it - they will tease with carrots on a rope with associate membership, etc. But it is necessary to restore the historical TRIED Russia: Kiev is the mother of Russian cities, and Vladimir Rus is in Kiev baptized - we all came out of that font, it's time to collect stones. The authorities in Ukraine are now Donetsk and these guys have suffered greatly from the former in business (Akhmetov, for example, Krivorozhstal lost) and mentally, so emotions sometimes prevail ... But Russia needs to speak with the Ukrainian business elite and try to make it their own - not to Ukraine to go with investments, and also invite Akhmetov to invest in Eastern Siberia under nat. the project, so you see, and from a single economic space will cease to shy becoming themselves part of the Russian business elite ...
        1. +2
          April 30 2012 22: 38
          Quote: short-term
          not to go to Ukraine with investments, but also invite Akhmetov to invest in Eastern Siberia under nat. the project, so you see, and from a single economic space will cease to shy becoming themselves part of the Russian business elite ...

          Greetings, buddy. Very sensible words and common thoughts! I read about the same thing today in the internet, in the American newspaper American Conservative. There are lines that as long as America perceives Russia as an enemy, it is hardly worth waiting for fraternal feelings from Russia. And, as one of the ways to normalize relations between the United States and the Russian Federation, it is indicated that Russia is involved in joint projects with NATO as an equal partner. Almost the same as what YOU are talking about, but only in the sphere of military interests. For us, in this moment, the method of seeking mutual understanding is more interesting and important.
        2. +4
          April 30 2012 22: 55
          Quote: short-term
          I agree with you - Europe does not need Ukraine,


          As you bow down before her, gentlemen,
          You do not get recognition from Europe:
          In her eyes you will always
          Not servants of enlightenment, but slaves

          Fedor Ivanovich Tyutchev
          The myth of the pro-Russian orientation of the Ukrainian Party of Regions, whose leader is Viktor Yanukovych, the farther, the more it is dispelled. An attentive observer of Ukrainian politics knows that the Party of Regions has long drifted towards the “orange”
          In the minds of citizens, with the light hand of “experts,” the view was strengthened that the “Party of Regions” is oriented toward Russia, and not a single analyst told the public that since mid-2005, the top of the “Party of Regions” has been implementing an American project, which Viktor Yanukovych and Rinat have Akhmetov's trusted advisers are Americans. In addition, Russia did not discern that the "Party of Regions" has become a political cover (and an active participant) in the appropriation of state property. And that means that “Party of Regions” is a short-term project of using power to enrich one and a half thousand of its functionaries. They did not pay attention to their own experience when the primary oligarchs (and the leaders of the "Party of Regions" are such in Ukraine) showed unprecedented cynicism towards their people and the Fatherland.

          Party of Regions ”could not use any social electorate. The civilization electorate was dismantled. Western Ukrainian - by nationalist parties, Central Ukrainian - partially by nationalist parties, partially by small protest parties. Only the electorate of the south and east of Ukraine remained, resisting the straitening of Novorossia and Slobozhanshchina.
          One can imagine the despair of a Slobodian and a novoross when a language in which your mother sang a lullaby is expelled to you in your land, in your house. When your grandfather and great-grandfather, who defeated fascism, is declared the occupier of Ukraine. Russians who have experienced worldwide and all-round humiliation in the 90s from the outside can only partially imagine the humiliation of Slobodans and New Russians from within the country. It was this electorate that the “regionals" used to come to power, promising to preserve the integrity of the South Russian civilization. In fact, the top of their party was not going to fulfill their obligations. The swift enrichment, total cynicism and charms of the Western world set the vector for betraying the interests of voters and singing along to Yushchenko, Americans and Svidomites (from Ukrainian: Svidomo - conscious, true. ) ..

          Dm.Zerkalov

          The young generation of Ukrainians fools around in an anti-Russian spirit every hour at school, in newspapers, on television. The grown up youth is already thinking of a joint three hundred year life as a kind of historical incident. And with a certain treatment, he will consider his ancestors unhappy people subjugated by the Russian colonialists. The Americans correctly calculated that the national bourgeoisie would not finance either pro-Russian or anti-Russian political forces and began to finance the anti-Russian forces themselves. And got your anti-Russian outpost right in front of Russia in the form of Ukrainian authorities for nothing.
          1. chukapabra
            0
            1 May 2012 20: 58
            Quote: Ascetic
            The myth of the pro-Russian orientation of the Ukrainian Party of Regions, whose leader is Viktor Yanukovych, the farther, the more it is dispelled. An attentive observer of Ukrainian politics knows that the Party of Regions has long drifted towards the “orange”

            Well, if this is so, it remains only to understand that Ukraine is lost for Russia. It is stupid and sad that politicians on both sides could not defeat their ambitions and agree.
      2. chukapabra
        +1
        1 May 2012 20: 54
        Quote: sichevik

        Ukraine will never be admitted to the European Union !!! They have enough free parasites in the form of Greece, Romania, Bulgaria, Iceland. Yanukovych also seems to be in no hurry to join the Eurasian Union ... Ukraine alone, under such leadership and in this state, will not last long. In debt, as in silk, but there is nothing to give. But the IMF is so simple, for beautiful eyes, I do not intend to write off debts. So, you need to be determined somehow.

        Let us recall that this has always been said under any president of Ukraine, in the hope that the next one will be adequate. Even Yan6ukovich, who was positioned as a clearly pro-Russian president, is already considered inadequate from the point of view of Russia. I think Russia should think about why this is happening. It is necessary that something be changed in relations between states. The young generation has been growing in Ukraine for over 15 years in clearly anti-Russian moods, this generation is already participating (in age) in elections and influences the country's politics both directly and indirectly. Russia is strong and helping brothers, this is not concession or weakness, but generosity towards brothers. Maybe reducing the cost of gas even to the price of deliveries to Germany would be the right step. And then, in Ukraine, they are asking a fair question, they fought together, all their lives together, and former enemies pay half the price. Not fraternally
  4. Vito
    +6
    April 30 2012 09: 06
    It is necessary to build on any new base, but it is impossible to surrender Sevastopol in any case! Otherwise, the Ukrainian partners will surrender it to the ships of the US Navy.
  5. +6
    April 30 2012 09: 23
    So the time comes for the Anschluss in relation to the Crimea. To start.
  6. +9
    April 30 2012 09: 32
    Well, let's say the contracts are revised, new ones are signed. Where is the guarantee that in a year we will not hear again that the contract is not fair?
    1. +6
      April 30 2012 09: 59
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      Where is the guarantee that in a year we will not hear again that the contract is not fair?

      Alexander, I greet you, buddy and your sober view of the problem! There are no guarantees! There is no politician who is more inconsistent in his actions than a politician cornered! And Yanukovych is just that. Of course, to a greater extent, he drove himself there. Ukraine is now "actively" supporting the EU-sponsored Trans-Caspian gas pipeline project. But this support is backed up by very "constructive" proposals from the Ukrainian leadership - "Give money for the pipe, and then we will pay off." And laughter and sin!
      Okay - Ukraine! Civilized Europeans stoop to a clear violation of early agreements! Yesterday, infa passed that the European regulators of "Nord Stream" violate the mechanism of the gas pipeline operation, forgetting about the prevailing financial contribution of Russia! Now on this issue, our leadership "is consulting" with foreign "partners", making eloquent hints that large foreign offices, the same, conduct their business on the territory of Russia and, so far, nothing prevents them in this! Quite an intelligible and eloquent hint!
      1. chukapabra
        +3
        1 May 2012 21: 05
        Quote: esaul
        Of course, to a greater extent, he drove himself there.

        I don’t understand, we feed Syria, we support Venisuela, there is still half the world there, but can’t we help our brothers? Well, Yanukovych will manage with his politics and? He will turn in the direction of Russia, no, but the West will feed him, buy up all assets and manage. Well, then, Russia will benefit from this, another tension on the border. We feed Lukashenko for 12 years and nothing, why not help Ukraine? At least with gas, I think it would be appreciated. And there is no greater merit, it seems to me, that on a holiday in some sort of drunken company, a crest would say for a 3rd bottle of vodka, if it weren’t for Russia, we would completely bend with our goats and raise a toast to Russia. That's what you need to achieve. drinks
  7. +8
    April 30 2012 10: 19
    Valera, the topic is much deeper, the EU regularly impedes business from Russia. Joining the customs union, as it will affect Russia, there may be pluses, or maybe .... Everything that happens today is a possible premeditated combination. But even if so, the economic situation in the EU will not allow dictating conditions. Russia is a big market, and who will put cancer to someone? As history shows, ultimately this Europe is in the pose of the zodiac sign
    1. +7
      April 30 2012 10: 34
      Quote: Alexander Romanov
      Joining the customs union, as it affects Russia, there may be pluses, maybe ....

      Sasha, you probably made a slip. Apparently, you meant - WTO. I agree, there may be pluses, there may be minuses. But, to shout with all his might (as do many anti-Putin guardians for Russia) that, with the entry into this "heap" of Russia, we will face an unavoidable collapse - this is, to put it mildly, premature, or rather - a political order. Russia still has a mechanism for evading the implementation of WTO norms in case of ignoring Russia's interests in the WTO. Communists and liberals prefer to keep silent about this, but to present the actions of our authorities through the prism of betraying the interests of the country is a sacred thing for them! The states are now, in fact, doing us a favor - by waking up the topic of the Magnitsky list. Such clues carry a mutually pretentious potential and, I think, Russia does not need to eloquently insist on "preventing" the adoption of this case by the US Senate - there will be a reason to change its conditions unilaterally. " Nothing personal just business!" wassat Sometimes it is necessary to "turn on the fool"! belay
      1. +1
        April 30 2012 20: 41
        Well, since you touched on the WTO as an "anti-Putin guardian for Russia" I want to ask you, as a Putin guardian, why enter into something that does not know what will bring. Guessing on a chamomile "there may be pluses, there may be minuses", sorry not the case, if you really limit your economic sovereignty, then at least know why. Now about the pros. Maybe you can outline them for me, preferably referring to the text of the signed agreement. By the way, why hasn't it been published for wide discussion? Or do you consider joining the WTO a tertiary event?
        And please do not assume that for our Homeland we have only Putinists, Communists and liberals, most people are just not subject to any isms. Why not ask the majority about the WTO.
        1. -1
          April 30 2012 20: 47
          Quote: Karabin
          Now about the pros.

          So far, only the export of metal and chemical products is clearly drawn and so far!
          In essence, those whose lobby was pushed by this entry.
          wink
  8. +3
    April 30 2012 10: 51
    In post-Soviet countries, including our Russia, people with inadequate education are in power to lead the country, they are imprisoned for plundering resources and don’t think of anything that’s bad about peoples, until they bite a roasted cock in the ass and while they poison people against each other, maybe a ride.
    1. ole
      ole
      0
      April 30 2012 23: 35
      You are wrong, there are literate people, but they are usually behind the scenes and serve someone's interests.
  9. +2
    April 30 2012 17: 51
    if each time one or another treaty is revised, then a big fat cross can be put on the development of bilateral relations.

    And as you want!
    It's a sweet word Freebie!
  10. Marat
    +7
    April 30 2012 19: 56
    One thing is clear, Ukraine must enter the fourth republic into our Common Economic Space and the Eurasian Union - and we all, citizens of Russia, Kazakhstan and Belarus, must do everything for our Ukrainian brothers to join us.

    We must fight back at all sites anti-Ukrainian rhetoric. Whatever happens there - you cannot escalate the negative - you must always support the MAIN - KIND of Russians and Ukrainians (this is our main and only trump card) - to promote the reunification of the Eurasian Union and Ukraine in every way
    1. +2
      April 30 2012 22: 40
      Quote: Marat
      We must fight back at all sites anti-Ukrainian rhetoric. Whatever happens there - you cannot escalate the negative - you must always support the MAIN - KIND of Russians and Ukrainians (this is our main and only trump card) - to promote the reunification of the Eurasian Union and Ukraine in every way

      Marat, welcome! I am pleased to support these words, but recently doubts have begun to creep in - will we be correctly understood by the Ukrainians themselves? recourse
      1. Cadet787
        0
        1 May 2012 19: 35
        Only this way and not otherwise.
    2. Num lock U.A.
      0
      7 May 2012 13: 35
      Quote: Marat
      We must fight back at all sites anti-Ukrainian rhetoric

      fatty plus
  11. -1
    April 30 2012 20: 39
    Quote: Marat
    We must fight back at all sites anti-Ukrainian rhetoric. No matter what happens, you cannot escalate the negative

    What is this?
    But he is a troll in Africa and a troll, it is supranational, and then what to do with elfing, if you can’t troll trolls?
    bully
  12. 0
    April 30 2012 22: 07
    I would like to write as they say now something politically correct. Therefore, I will thank the author of the article. A person has a desire and ability and expresses his opinion. I would also like to say a huge thank you to all sane residents of the territory called Ukraine. I hope that the project of dividing the people invented by the "democratic west" will be replaced by the project of Russian (Slavic) unity.
  13. +2
    April 30 2012 22: 35
    The Kharkiv agreements are a sad story that may continue. On the Ukrainian side, the agreements were signed by representatives of the Party of Regions. The PR positions itself as a force defending Ukrainian interests, and it is in these interests to normalize relations with Russia. as soon as Yanukovych came to power, he immediately "canceled" Euro-Atlantic integration (NATO), stopped or froze other projects regarded by Russia as anti-Russian (GUAM, military cooperation with Georgia). In Ukrainian politics, he made a whole series of Russian actions: the "abolition" of the heroism of Bandera and Shukhevych, the official status of the Russian language in the regions. well, the apotheosis of the apotheosis - Kharkov! In fact, Yanukovych tied Ukraine to Russia for several decades, because the base in Sevas is not a separate enclave of the Guantanamo type, but a conglomeration of military units scattered across Crimea (the remnants of the Soviet Black Sea Fleet). In principle, Yanukovych is also taking risks. Generally, for these agreements, he could be jailed, and what is better for Tymoshenko? Let me remind you that the stationing of foreign military personnel in Ukraine directly contradicts the Constitution of Ukraine. Nuuu and kaneshko Gaaaz! am Yanukovych was very pleased, and counted on a lot, hinting at verbal agreements. Well, as a result, we have what we have. Russia has had its interest, Yanukovych feels "thrown" ... In principle, Yanukovych overestimated his importance and Ukraine. Modern Russia does not need neutral neighbors, just as the USSR tolerated Finland, Austria, or partially Sweden. The Kremlin has given a clear signal - possible economic preferences in exchange for sovereignty. For the CU is an organization where the RF, as the largest economy, has a "controlling stake" in solving issues. Well, then let's see if the Yanukovych regime and the Ukrainian economy will survive. After all, despite the losses from the highest gas prices in Europe, and other economic wars, Ukraine is not "tied" to Russia, unlike the same Belarus. If Ukraine survives this war, then the situation is clear in the future. Black Sea Fleet of the Russian Federation will spread rot request Well, just as a "scapegoat", because the regionals no longer trust the Kremlin, and the pro-Western opposition and national democrats simply "love" it very much. After Kharkov, Russia tactically won, finally losing its supporters (except for the marginalized) in Ukraine, which means it strategically lost.
    1. Kievan
      +1
      April 30 2012 23: 59
      Quote: Aeneas
      After Kharkov, Russia tactically won, finally losing its supporters (except for the outcasts) in Ukraine, and therefore strategically lost.

      This is subject to the fact that Yanukovych will be replaced by some kind of positive leadership, and not everything will slide into Ruin, as it has already been many times in Ukrainian history. In terms of political Ukrainization of Donetsk, this is certainly positive as its time with the Dnepropetrovsk. Now all the major regional elites (may and may) are represented in Kiev, have been in power and politically mocked, but whether the economy will withstand this training is a big question.
  14. characterist
    +1
    1 May 2012 08: 10
    esaul,

    And why do you think that you can be misunderstood? You know, there is such an old approach to things - to look for the reasons for misunderstanding in yourself, not in those around you. For us, the Eurasian Economic Community is by no means a unifying idea, but even more polarizing society. We have our own task. society to unite. There is a good thought: "there are situations when you play, and there are situations when you play." And the relationship is because no one imposes it from above, it just is, by definition.

    Kievan,


    And this is the price that needs to be paid in order to get synergy for the renewal of the country, because the society will unite. Well, and if we can’t stand it, the Czech Republic and Slovakia are very likely.
    1. Odinplys
      +2
      1 May 2012 14: 13
      characterist,
      The Russian President will take office ... and there we will see ... what will happen ...
      Ukraine urgently needs to be saved ... By any means ... Our People are also there ...
  15. biglow
    +1
    1 May 2012 15: 41
    It is worth returning Crimea to Russia and the rest of Ukraine will catch up.
    1. Cadet787
      0
      1 May 2012 19: 43
      Ukraine is unlikely to go to the breaking of the Kharkov treaty, in response Russia can break the "Big Treaty", and in it the recognition of borders, then you can say goodbye to Crimea.
  16. characterist
    +2
    1 May 2012 19: 52
    Odinplys,


    And someone asked for help? It turns out like in a joke: they forge a horse, but a toad sticks its paw. These are our problems and they do not concern anyone but us, we will figure it out ourselves with our bastards, why do we still need your bastards. And any external " help "will lead to sharp centripetal tendencies (which already happened under Tuzla). And the chief integrator understands this very well - he thinks quickly.
    1. 0
      4 May 2012 18: 05
      Quote: Cadet787
      Russia can break the "Grand Treaty", and in it the recognition of borders, then you can say goodbye to Crimea.

      This about
      Quote: characterist
      These are our problems and they do not concern anyone except us,
  17. Ace Ventura
    +2
    3 May 2012 22: 55
    For the sake of fun, we would hold a referendum in Sevastopol a la which country is more inclined to you, whose news is more interested in, where are your relatives and friends? The overwhelming majority of our residents will agree to look in the eyes of the Ukrainian media as lousy, if only to be part of the Russian Federation again.
  18. characterist
    +1
    7 May 2012 13: 04
    Cynic,


    Well, this is very naive, the recognition of borders is not regulated at all by the "Big" treaty (the essence of which no one even remembers), but even if we admit such stupidity, then you can immediately recall the Budapest Protocol (and closed protocols to it), according to which protection and territorial integrity was guaranteed by Russia, including the United States, Great Britain, France, etc., i.e. almost the entire nuclear club. This is geopolitics, and by no means the relationship between two neighbors.

    Ace Ventura,

    For the sake of fun, such things don’t do - this is a direct path to a split and enormous stupidity.
    1. +1
      7 May 2012 17: 05
      Quote: characterist
      direct path to split

      Unfortunately, God forbid, if Ukraine is in danger of a split, then certainly not because of the Crimea.
      It's really right here, these are your internal now showdowns.
      By the way
      Quote: characterist
      including USA, UK, France

      Oh well .
      Do you believe in these guarantees?
      Throughout the foreseeable history, these countries acted as guarantors of only their interests.
      I will not resemble the phrase: I brought you peace !!!
      Just look at today's Europe. Your problems above the roof, wait, she will also solve strangers?
      And again to the word
      Think about why Europe invested in pipelines past Ukraine?
      You can come to very interesting conclusions.
      drinks
      1. Num lock U.A.
        0
        7 May 2012 17: 32
        Europe needs Ukraine only as a buffer
        guarantees are good, and your own strong army is even better
        that is why Swiss aircraft and aviation in particular? After all, a small, cozy country and money from almost the whole world is a much better guarantee than any of these guarantees.
    2. 0
      7 May 2012 18: 33
      All France, as a guarantor, can be crossed out!
      The president there is F. Hollande!
      No matter how the times of the SLA returned there!
  19. characterist
    +1
    7 May 2012 19: 49
    Cynic,

    What kind of manner do you have for poking at strangers? I understand that everyone will have their own manner, but I don’t impose my own on you and I don’t need yours. For guarantees, I knowingly brought the whole nuclear club with Russia, I made a special vote that Russia I signed together with everyone under joint responsibility, you sing the same songs again: about the crisis, etc. So that we live like they did during the crisis. And about or not, I don’t believe in church, so to believe, the main thing is that there is an obligation. And about gas pipelines in general a rotten map, you better carefully study yourself what money was invested there: a gas discount was made for Germany for the amount that went to Nord Stream, and no one else invested Yes, by the way, Sevpotok for Russian gas is only half open at the entrance to the Germans, according to the rules of the European Union, so that there is no monopoly, the other half is reserved for another supplier, i.e. in reality, no more than 27 billion cubic meters a year. This is not written in the Russian-language press, but it is well covered in the media of the European Union. Yes, and about the split: we have been voting for 50/50 for more than a year now, and this speaks about the fact that society is split and Crimea has nothing to do with it (its influence is scanty) and holding referenda in such a situation in any place is the greatest stupidity. No one in Ukraine really counts on anyone's help, nor the European Union, let alone Russia. Everything is fine They understand that they need to raise their living standards and this unites all people.
    1. 0
      8 May 2012 18: 53
      Quote: characterist
      What is your manner of poking at strangers?

      Thanks for the answer and clarification that you are no match.
  20. characterist
    +1
    7 May 2012 20: 41
    Num Lock UA,

    As a buffer today, nobody cares today, yesterday’s idea. Modern wars are fought across the oceans. Of course, your own strong army is much better, but this is not a matter of one year. And about Switzerland, this country has been supplying mercenaries to all theaters of war for centuries, that it’s natural for them, and it became far from one year old, but the decision to save money was ingenious, it allowed us to maintain independence in any conditions. I recommend reading it so that you don’t feel like a buffer
    http://cripo.com.ua/?sect_id=1&aid=135749