Military Review

Tsushima is born in the minds

198
The methodological psychological treatment of the Russian population through the retransmission of terry anti-Russian propaganda continues non-stop and on a scale that threatens state security.




The next American “sensation” from the series “Russia is a complete crap!” Was published on the Russian-language Internet Smelling so bad that you want to hold your nose and immediately retire to a safe distance for your sense of smell. But where do you command me to flee if the publication, which is occupied with the distribution of such fakes in the Russian Federation, is “the most cited source in Russian-language blogs?” News”, And the number of citizens fed this way monthly reaches 20 million people? That is, nowhere to run. They’ll get it everywhere. And they are guaranteed to cover a gullible population with a concentrated information fire.



And now a brief instruction on how this is done, on a quite typical example of the aforementioned “sensation”. Let's start with the title: "Admiral Kuznetsov" is recognized as the worst aircraft carrier in the world stories". Written in such a way as to immediately inspire the reader: the verdict is final and not appealable.

But let the question! And who, strictly speaking, was honored to pass such sentences? Perhaps, this command of the Russian Navy, having conducted a colossal research work, came to such a bleak conclusion? Or, at worst, the US Department of Defense analyzed a bunch of intelligence and published its findings?

Nothing like! A certain American publication with a name that leaves no doubt who it serves (The National Interest), has decided to place Admiral Kuznetsov in the top five of the worst aircraft carriers in world history. Mockingly putting it on par with the first in the world aircraft carriers of the USA, France and Japan built in the twenties and thirties of the last century. With a clear hint that the Russians in the 21 century "float" on an equally antediluvian vessel.

But, maybe, in the publication, which is characterized as “an authoritative military-political magazine”, write so competent authors who have the moral right to render such verdicts?

We look. The author of the work is a certain Robert Farley. Even a slight touch of his biography leaves no doubt: he is a completely civilian from the university teaching environment, not directly related not only to Russian, but even to American the fleet, and indeed to military service.

And such a completely home-grown “expert” based on the gossip about the Russian aircraft carrier gathered on the Internet, such as the fact that it smokes the thick of everything in the world, makes a “fundamental conclusion” about its complete unsuitability for military service.

And it would be fine if this writings remained only home reading for the local (American) audience. Let them continue to drool from tenderness at the sight of such pictures that are spiritually lifting for them.

But after all, this game is instantly relayed by the largest Internet news publications on the territory of Russia and at the same time is served in the form of an indisputable fact established by supposedly world experts! And this is despite the fact that among 20 millions of monthly readers of only one of these repeaters, there are hardly a few thousand who are seriously aware of naval problems and are able to separate cutlets from flies. The main mass, especially the target audience - the youth, will surely swallow this bait, even without delving into how rotten the worm is hanging there.

Alas, this is how the human psyche is arranged, to influence which such demotivators are well trained. And then we will wonder how our people have such a persistent distrust of the capabilities of their own country? Why even the state document of the highest level of responsibility, the message of the president of the country, is perceived by many as a set of cartoons, for which there is absolutely nothing?

Yes, all because the same! The audience, which from morning to evening is fed by such foul-smelling "sensations", even with good intentions, cannot perceive reality differently than through the curved mirror of this omnipresent foreign agitprop promptly translated into Russian.

However, what else to expect from such translators, the fatal lack of literacy of which simply does not allow them to treat such writers with the necessary criticality, such as Farley mentioned. And this is not an empty slander on my part. These repeaters are not something that are not experts in the field, which are taken to convey to the Russian audience, they do not even know the English language! You can see for yourself by comparing the fragment. Original with his mechanical translation in Russian:

"Assigned to the Northern Fleet, she has been periodically deployed to the Mediterranean, usually with great fanfare."

"After that," Admiral Kuznetsov, "notes The National Interest," periodically traveled to the Mediterranean Sea, as a rule, with great fanfare. "

Any person who has at least a distant relationship to the fleet will surely die of laughter from the translation of the quite competent "deployed to the Mediterranean" (deployed in the Mediterranean) with the phrase about a ship that goes there like a bus with tourists. This is quite a baseboard level of general “literacy” of those who daily bombard a multi-million Russian audience with fakes like the above.

And now, briefly, on the merits. How "bad" aircraft carrier "Admiral Kuznetsov", can be judged by the following well-known facts. A ship of a similar project, Varyag, was acquired by China in an unfinished form in Ukraine after 20 years after construction began, completed in Dalian, the Chinese city, renamed Liaoning and is currently the flagship of the PLA Navy.

But what's more, the Chinese build the second aircraft carrier, already fully built, as an almost exact copy of the same “Varyag” - the brother of “Admiral Kuznetsov”! It is unlikely that the most economically successful power of the modern world, which registers today the largest number of patents in the world, would arrange for itself an eternal headache in the form of “old and worthless Russian aircraft carriers”.

Tsushima is born in the minds

The author of the article on the Russian “Varyag” leads to China. 2000 year

The Indian case is even more interesting. As is well known, the Hindus, with great desire and overpaying an extra billion dollars against the original price, bought out even more old-fashioned, than the Admiral Kuznetsov, aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov. And again, they proudly made it the flagship of their fleet!

But this is not the most interesting. Around the same time, the Americans were offering India for free (!) To get from them, although not a new, but classic, which incorporates all the experience of American shipbuilding and the fully combat-ready aircraft carrier Kitty Hawk. Provided that India will buy, already for money, deck Aviation for this monster. The Hindus figured, counted and ... chose a Russian aircraft cruiser.

This is, in fact, all that you need to know about the "most backward and worthless" Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov. Which, like any other large ship, of course, has problems. But they are not connected with the imaginary imperfection of its design, which supposedly makes it “the worst aircraft carrier in world history”, but with historical and political circumstances, to which the ship itself has no relation.

And in its class of combat units, heavy aircraft-carrying cruisers, subject to proper maintenance and operational load, it fully complies with all tactical and technical requirements imposed on such ships. That is why, by the way, it is now heavily repaired, and not dismantled for scrap.

But all these very unimportant “details” that make up the essence of the matter are unlikely to ever become the property of the multi-million audience of the above-mentioned factory of mechanical translation into Russian of dense American fakes. Just because such “factories” exist for solving specific tasks that have nothing to do with the education and objective information of the Russian population.
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  1. aszzz888
    aszzz888 April 7 2018 06: 16
    +8
    Some American publication with a title that leaves no doubt who exactly it serves (The National Interest),

    Well, is it worth it to pay attention to all sorts of The National Interests. You can’t get enough of such health. By their forest, by the forest. angry
    1. Vard
      Vard April 7 2018 06: 20
      +31
      Nevertheless, the need has ripened for the creation of a body that would also engage in propaganda ... And the contract is propaganda ... No censorship is needed ... But the ruble must be punished for publishing fakes and frankly anti-Russian information ...
      1. aszzz888
        aszzz888 April 7 2018 07: 03
        +9
        Vard Today, 06: 20 ↑
        Nevertheless, the need has ripened for the creation of an organ that would also engage in propaganda ...

        If we have something, it is obviously not enough and does not correspond to the present and the situation.
        1. Tatar 174
          Tatar 174 April 7 2018 07: 54
          +9
          Quote: aszzz888
          Well, is it worth it to pay attention to all sorts of The National Interests.

          Worth it. Because this is a very dangerous tendency and it can lead from an underestimation of our weapons by the adversary to hatred moods on their part to the unleashing by them of hostilities against us in their full confidence that they will very quickly destroy our defense and achieve a quick and easy victory over us . After all, there, unlike us, they believe that they write on different Twitter, Facebook and others, where they grind the idea that the Russians are behind, they are barbarians and aggressors and they must be destroyed in advance and immediately. And any military operations of any scale against us will lead to a retaliatory nuclear strike against them, and then an otvetka and an otvetka again and it will be a draw, because there will be no one to fight further.
          1. Pete mitchell
            Pete mitchell April 7 2018 21: 41
            +5
            Quote: Tatar 174
            there, unlike us, they believe that they write on different Twitter, Facebook and others, where they grind the idea of

            They believe that if we do not confront this infection in the territory of our country, we will get not only one “boy from Urengoy,” but an entire generation, for which the struggle is ideal. Will have to be chopped and on all fronts
      2. The comment was deleted.
        1. SPACE
          SPACE April 7 2018 09: 23
          +13
          Quote: Deck
          When an even stupid person comments on a dumb article

          Indeed, your comment is very ridiculous.
          1. The comment was deleted.
            1. SPACE
              SPACE April 7 2018 10: 37
              +10
              Quote: Deck
              The "self" style is the trademark of the "patriot" in VO. You have not gone far from Mr. Selivanov.

              Sorry, but your ridiculous comments do not even have a topic of conversation.
              1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 11: 44
                +19
                Quote: SPACE
                Sorry, but your ridiculous comments do not even have a topic of conversation.

                We have a ship that has big problems with the chassis, whose air group has not yet been formed, and the missile weapons have been destroyed as a result of an operational error. Therefore, let's do it easier and try to answer the question - which aircraft carrier today worse than Kuznetsov? Only Thai comes to my mind, and you?
                1. SPACE
                  SPACE April 7 2018 12: 21
                  +8
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  we have a ship that has big problems with the chassis, whose air group has not yet been formed, and the missile weapons have been destroyed as a result of an operational error

                  This is a question of proper operation, the author pointed to this. Then, according to your logic, it is necessary to compare Kuznetsov with any US aircraft carrier put out for repair, although Kuznetsov still manages to go somewhere. I know your position, by the way, against aircraft carriers, but Kuznetsov is the golden mean, and even you will someday, sooner or later, also understand this.
                  1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 12: 37
                    +8
                    Quote: SPACE
                    Then, according to your logic, it is necessary to compare Kuznetsov with any US aircraft carrier put out for repair

                    Below I compared it a little with the American only on the basis of design decisions. He does not pull close to the golden mean
                  2. yehat
                    yehat April 8 2018 09: 52
                    +2
                    Kuznetsov is not a middle ground, but a victim of compromises.
                    Because of this, there are many contradictions in the ship, sometimes ridiculous.
                    His fleet (Kuznetsov’s grouping) wanted to build not at all how it turned out.
                2. Boa kaa
                  Boa kaa April 7 2018 13: 03
                  +16
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  Only Thai comes to my mind, and you?

                  Is Charles Degol better for the French? But for some reason everyone forgot about him, as if on command. And the fact that the RK on Kuz ruined is the cost of troubled times. But would he be in service then, why not talk about the problems of missile weapons of the TAKRs? You already decide: Kuzya --Who? AVU or, after all, TAKR !? Well, then compare it with aircraft-carrying cruisers, and not with classic aircraft carriers. After all, it does not occur to you to compare the Japanese destroyer-helicopter carrier type "Izumo" with TAKR pr 1143.5
                  1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 13: 48
                    +5
                    Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                    Is Charles Degol better for the French? But for some reason everyone forgot about him, as if on command.

                    Why - forgot? And so - yes, still better.
                    Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                    You already decide: Kuzya --Who? AVU or, after all, TAKR !?

                    I have long been determined that the ship must be evaluated by its ability to fulfill the task assigned to it. From this point of view, Kuznetsov is an air defense carrier (his key functionality is to cover strike groups from a threat from the air), but he is able to solve this problem ... far from level.
                    1. Boa kaa
                      Boa kaa April 7 2018 14: 21
                      +14
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      Kuznetsov - an air defense carrier ...
                      Andrei, you are certainly a great scientist, but there are qualification features and the mission of the ship, recorded, if you remember, in the tactical form of the ship. This is 2 of such a heavy (with lead covers) folio with all kinds of diagrams and tables ...
                      So it was directly written there: "Designed to defeat large surface targets, protect naval formations from attacks by a potential enemy using aircraft carriers and a large number of submarines; it also has the task of supporting landing operations .." And on the Kiev board, it was written so : "Anti-submarine cruiser with aviation weapons, created by the will of the Soviet people to protect the sea borders of the Fatherland." So, as one wise guy wrote here: "Swam, we know!"
                      I don’t argue, 1143.5 has expanded tasks, but this does not boil down to solving air defense problems ...
                      Respectfully, to Admiral VO - Boa constrictor. soldier
                    2. Boa kaa
                      Boa kaa April 7 2018 14: 30
                      +10
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      I have long been determined that the ship must be evaluated by its ability to fulfill the task assigned to it.

                      I almost forgot!
                      But he can be assigned the task of landing a DRG in the rear of the enemy’s PDO ... And then what? Helicopters will not take off, because he is an air defense carrier? You need to be more careful with maxims when it comes to issues of principle ... the combat use of units ...
                      PS There is also such a modern interpretation (broad) of the purpose of 1143.5:
                      Designed to give combat stability to strategic missile submarines, surface ship groupings and naval missile-carrying aircraft in combat mission areas.
                      yes
                      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                        Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 14: 59
                        +4
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        Andrei, you are certainly a great scientist ..

                        In linguistics you are a great luminary.
                        Ah, I'm a simple Soviet prisoner
                        Not a communist, or even a Jew.
                        laughing hi drinks
                        Quote: BoA KAA
                        but there are qualification features and the mission of the ship, recorded, of course, if you remember, in the tactical form of the ship. This is 2 of such a heavy (with lead covers) folio with all kinds of diagrams and tables ...

                        Open read
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        So it was directly written there: "It is intended to destroy large surface targets, protect naval formations from attacks by a potential enemy using aircraft carriers and a large number of submarines; it also has the task of supporting landing operations .."

                        Now let me ask you - what is the difference between this list and the tasks of the classic multi-purpose carrier? tongue (nothing that I show your tongue so impolite?)
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        I don’t argue, 1143.5 has expanded tasks, but this does not boil down to solving air defense problems ...

                        It does not come down. But I brazenly and arrogantly chose the air defense task as the TARK specialization, because otherwise, if we approach the matter from the position of the letter of the document, our TAKRs are no different from AV :) EMNIP for 1143 they sounded like this:
                        - cover of shipborne formations against air strikes, their anti-submarine and anti-hacking support;
                        - ensuring the military stability of strategic missile submarine cruisers in combat patrol areas;
                        - ensuring the deployment of submarines;
                        - cover for naval missile-carrying, anti-submarine and reconnaissance aircraft in the zone of reach of ship-based fighter aircraft;
                        - search and destruction of enemy missile submarines as part of groups of heterogeneous anti-submarine forces;
                        - defeat groups of surface ships of the enemy;
                        - ensuring the landing of amphibious assault forces.
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        Sincerely, Admiral VO - Boa constrictor

                        Here you go. Pogon - respect, but Andrei from Chelyabinsk - did not deserve crying
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        But he can be assigned the task of landing a DRG in the rear of the enemy’s PDO ...

                        Oooh, I see that - sixty thousand tons of steel creeps quietly in the darkness laughing
                        Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
                        And then what? Helicopters will not take off, because he is an air defense carrier? You need to be more careful with maxims when it comes to issues of principle ... the combat use of units ...

                        Kuznetsov can be assigned any task, because he, of course, is multifunctional, like most modern complex weapon systems. But I do not understand why you are writing about it now. Do you propose comparing the capabilities of Kuznetsov and other aircraft carriers to land DRGs in the rear of the PDO? Let's compare, although I honestly do not understand the advantages of Kuznetsov in this matter. But if you see him, then why not? :)))
                        I think it makes sense to compare precisely for the key tasks of technology, and not for the whole spectrum of what it can solve
                    3. The comment was deleted.
                      1. The comment was deleted.
                  2. Sewer krainiy
                    Sewer krainiy April 7 2018 15: 42
                    +7
                    Carriers are forbidden to pass through the Bosporus and Dardanelles. Therefore, all aircraft-carrying ships built in Nikolaev (Black Sea Fleet) were called TAKR (heavy aircraft-carrying cruiser). And to which class it really belongs - it's up to expert experts ...
                    Kuzya --Who? AVU or, after all, TAKR !?
                3. Setrac
                  Setrac April 7 2018 17: 43
                  +6
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  big problems with the chassis

                  I went to the Mediterranean Sea and returned without problems, what are the problems with the suspension?
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  whose air group has not yet been formed

                  This is not a "ship problem."
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  and missile weapons destroyed as a result of an operational error.

                  Why is it for an aircraft carrier?
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  Therefore, let's do it easier and try to answer the question - which aircraft carrier is worse than Kuznetsov today?

                  It’s easier to name those carriers that are better - Nimitz class carriers.
                4. Vladimir1155
                  Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 31
                  +2
                  Kuznetsov himself is an excellent ship, and the author is absolutely right, indicating that his copies were acquired by the vast majority of the largest powers that have aircraft carriers. India and China. Despite the fact that Russia’s aircraft carriers are not needed, it, as a missile cruiser with an air group, is a more productive solution than American English and French floating barges, airfields. Kuznetsov may well send the country 20-25 years, although on the basis of military doctrine we do not need aircraft carriers, destroyers and cruisers and new ones do not need to be built.
        2. Boa kaa
          Boa kaa April 7 2018 12: 49
          +16
          Quote: Deck
          When an even stupid person comments on a dumb article

          Your shoulder strap seems to be marine, but something I have not met your articles with the refutation of Majapur (or whatever expert from the National interest).
          Selivanov can be thanked only for one intention to resist the denigration of the Fleet. And you, who consider yourself to be a "naval bone", are trying to "lower it". Then the question is: who in this situation does a good deed for the fleet - you or Selevanov?
          1. Deck
            Deck April 7 2018 13: 09
            +8
            Mr. Selivanov, pulling out the magazine “Murzilka” (oh, sorry The National Interest) and commenting on it based on emotional expressions like “relaying terry anti-Russian propaganda” rather than technical facts and the history of the ship, lowers the level of discussion on the VO to the level of this “Murzilka”. Is this a good deed for our fleet? . I’m closer to the position of Andrei from Chelyabinsk and I understand his pain for the current state of the fleet.
            1. flicker
              flicker April 7 2018 13: 43
              +1
              What is the main function of a military airfield?
              1. novel66
                novel66 April 7 2018 17: 34
                +6
                try not to drown so that there is room for planes to land lol
                1. flicker
                  flicker April 7 2018 18: 30
                  +3
                  try not to drown so that there is room for planes to land
                  and take off before. So why is Kuzya bad, did planes take off and land from it, just like other aircraft carriers? Or are there any complaints about aircraft and pilot skill?
                  1. novel66
                    novel66 April 7 2018 18: 32
                    +6
                    it is bad, first of all, because every trip on it is a feat, and for stripes it’s just a job. something like this hi
                    1. flicker
                      flicker April 7 2018 19: 22
                      +2
                      Well, in general, we are not an island nation and ships are not the main means of transport. And if so, then we need aircraft carriers insofar as, accordingly, we especially did not go on campaigns.
                      every trip on it is a feat
                      Where did we go (except for the coast of Syria) and what is the feat (except military service - a feat)?
                      1. novel66
                        novel66 April 7 2018 19: 36
                        +4
                        however, they were awarded as if they had freed all of Syria .....
                      2. yehat
                        yehat April 8 2018 10: 00
                        +2
                        USSR aircraft carriers were needed when this same USSR had an ocean fleet, interests around the globe and had not the last merchant fleet.
                        and now the demand for Aviks is definitely lower, but the demand for UDC has grown due to the fact that there are a lot of conflicts and tension along the borders.
            2. Vladimir1155
              Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 37
              +3
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk is poorly versed in marine engineering, everyone knows that I haven’t seen the sea, I would have lived in St. Petersburg Vladivostok would have known, I’ll explain the technical side of the matter, any ship (car, tank) wears out during operation, various systems go out, now the time has come for KUznetsov’s repair (the ship is 29 years old), it will be repaired and everything will work again.
        3. sib.ataman
          sib.ataman April 8 2018 11: 44
          +1
          The rootless critic, who himself is guilty of everything in what he blames the other, looks even bolder and dumber.
      3. Amurets
        Amurets April 7 2018 10: 08
        +1
        Quote: Vard
        No censorship is necessary ..

        Just a committee on oversight of the press and the media to know the opinion and mood of the people.
      4. Rostislav
        Rostislav April 7 2018 10: 29
        +11
        And censorship would not hurt. When a woman or a child is insulted on the street, those who cannot answer themselves can you say nothing and pass by?
        Do you propose to watch in silence how the Homeland is being insulted by pouring slop on it?
        Okay, the small dirty guys from the island defecate, they have such a job - to harm Russia. But why let your provocateurs frolic?
      5. 210ox
        210ox April 7 2018 10: 58
        +3
        But the Constitution does not allow. We don’t have an ideology and that’s it. What we have laid for the children in the family is one thing. But something else is pouring into fragile minds ...
        Quote: Vard
        Nevertheless, the need has ripened for the creation of a body that would also engage in propaganda ... And the contract is propaganda ... No censorship is needed ... But the ruble must be punished for publishing fakes and frankly anti-Russian information ...
      6. _Sergei_
        _Sergei_ April 7 2018 12: 26
        +2
        Vard But the ruble for publishing fakes and frankly anti-Russian information should be punished ...

        Some commentators on VO go broke
      7. Boa kaa
        Boa kaa April 7 2018 12: 41
        +5
        Quote: Vard
        But the ruble for publishing fakes and frankly anti-Russian information should be punished ...

        This can only be done in court. And we have laws written by EBN under am. According to them, the publication cannot be brought to trial, because they refer to the source and do not make any other messages. Type: editorial opinion may not coincide with the opinion of the author of the publication. But we have no counter-propaganda. For there is no state ideology and Min cult / Min prop / Min image and others like them who and what writes about our armed forces and its systems are deeply purple. And for the RF Ministry of Defense - this will be perceived as inappropriate spending of budget funds. So take care after that of the moral readiness of the country's population to defend the Fatherland ...
        (Around enemies and colleagues! (C) yes
        1. jjj
          jjj April 7 2018 12: 55
          +2
          Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
          According to them, the publication cannot be brought to trial, because they refer to the source and do not make any other messages. Type: editorial opinion may not coincide with the opinion of the author of the publication

          Alexander, welcome!
          This only applies if the publication does not contain a certain kind of appeal, extremism, the justification of terrorism and the disclosure of secrets. And they can plant very willingly
      8. Secretparadox
        Secretparadox April 10 2018 22: 29
        0
        Such a body has long existed - a large part of Russian television.
        Quote: Vard
        Nevertheless, the need has ripened for the creation of a body that would also engage in propaganda ... And the contract is propaganda ... No censorship is needed ... But the ruble must be punished for publishing fakes and frankly anti-Russian information ...
    2. venik
      venik April 7 2018 09: 22
      +2
      Quote: aszzz888
      Well, is it worth it to pay attention to all sorts of The National Interests.

      ========
      And the attention - just not the National Interest - in the article (if you carefully read it), is just about "Lenta.ru" and similar "publications", proudly calling themselves "free" or "opposition" (depending on the desire of the owners ) .....
      1. Deck
        Deck April 7 2018 09: 34
        +3
        The owner of the united company “Poster-Rambler-SUP” oligarch Alexander Mamut is very oppositional. Almost carbonarium
    3. The comment was deleted.
    4. yuriyselivanov
      April 7 2018 15: 32
      +2
      On Lentu.ru with 20 million per month, duped Russians are also not worth it?
  2. Grandfather
    Grandfather April 7 2018 06: 26
    +9
    National Interest called "the worst aircraft carrier in history"
    According to the magazine, the top five worst aircraft carriers in world history are led by a Russian warship ....
    April 5 2018
    - this is VO. with a link like the "tape" on the National Interest .. how can I live with this? -
    : It’s simply because such “factories” exist to solve specific problems that have nothing to do with educating and objectively informing the Russian population.
    recourse article on VO scolding VO?
    1. Amurets
      Amurets April 7 2018 07: 26
      +4
      Quote: Dead Day
      article on VO scolding VO?

      Well, the rule applies on the site: "The opinion of the editors may not coincide with the opinion of the author."
      So everything is according to Gogol: "The non-commissioned officer widow carved herself."
      1. jjj
        jjj April 7 2018 12: 57
        +1
        Quote: Amurets
        So everything is according to Gogol: "The non-commissioned officer widow carved herself."

        Well, the widow didn’t whack herself. This is the character of Gogol so put it, to give the execution innocence
      2. Mikado
        Mikado April 7 2018 15: 15
        +4
        Well, the rule applies on the site: "The opinion of the editors may not coincide with the opinion of the author."

        Nikolay, that the article is an agitation, and the author has nothing to do on the site, fits into the rule? Ugh .. "opinions" and "analytics" turn into LiveJournal of emotional girls during the ripening period. I have the honor, the former police captain Mikhailov! am
        1. Amurets
          Amurets April 7 2018 16: 18
          +2
          Quote: Mikado
          Nikolay, that the article is an agitation, and the author has nothing to do on the site, fits into the rule? Ugh .. "opinions" and "analytics" turn into LiveJournal of emotional girls during the ripening period.

          Namesake. Greetings. Do not boil. Recently, all the media are like that. Look at news sites all on emotions. On the box is the same. So where do moderators get good and high-quality material? Where to get good analytics and opinions? My nephew works as an administrator on two thematic sites and he says that he is awaiting his duty with horror, as he cannot collect interesting news material.
          1. Mikado
            Mikado April 7 2018 18: 21
            +3
            Yes, I'm sorry, I turned the emotions. hi T.N. "article" of a certain Mr. Selivanov, deep thoughts, sucked from a finger, but for this exhaustion he regularly received a money! I wouldn’t pay. stop On the other hand, such "thoughts" have collected ninety comments at the moment - everyone has run to discuss. The law of the herd. I'm sorry about the site. What articles, such and discussion. I haven’t left comments on “analytics” and “opinions” for a long time (it’s not interesting! There is no one to discuss sensibly!), But then I decided to stick to yours. drinks
          2. Mikado
            Mikado April 7 2018 19: 40
            +2
            so that such articles do not appear in foreign magazines, and our "analysts" do not engage in thoughtful "analytics", there is only one means .. three, even. 1. Build ships, 2. develop industry and economy, 3. multiply Russian! Only in this way, and nothing else. I have the honor. soldier
            1. Amurets
              Amurets April 8 2018 02: 55
              +2
              Yes everything is correct. Not just VO like that. It’s worth visiting news sites and similar materials everywhere.
              1. Mikado
                Mikado April 8 2018 10: 57
                +4
                Yes, then that journalism fades. Instead of deeply developed articles, there are topics of the category "you will not believe!". Nicholas, Christ is risen! happy holiday! happiness and health to your family, all forum users and their loved ones! drinks
                1. Amurets
                  Amurets April 8 2018 12: 38
                  +4
                  Quote: Mikado
                  Nicholas, Christ is risen! happy holiday! happiness and health to your family, all forum users and their loved ones!

                  Nikolay! Mutually. And all forum users the same thing
  3. Sars
    Sars April 7 2018 06: 30
    +10
    The author of the article thinks that all the Russians, having learned that some experts called Kuzyu a piece ... iron, ran to drown?
    Yes, we are used to it already. We have the worst of everything: tanks, planes, we ourselves are wild alcoholics and parasites for them.
    Those. us their nonsense - to the bulb.
    1. Vard
      Vard April 7 2018 07: 30
      +3
      Well, let's say they drink in our second ten ...
  4. rotmistr60
    rotmistr60 April 7 2018 06: 31
    +6
    published another American "sensation" from the series "Russia - it sucks!"
    If only one "Lenta.ru" was engaged in the fact that with pleasure reprinted any crap Western "experts from McDonald's". Many are engaged in this, and some with sadistic pleasures are in a hurry to show "what is Russia like." I agree with the above that you need to beat the ruble first, and if you do not understand it, "cut to hell ..." (film "Pokrovsky Gate").
    1. Reptiloid
      Reptiloid April 7 2018 06: 40
      +3
      Quote: rotmistr60
      I agree with the above that you need to beat the ruble first, and if you do not understand it, "cut to hell ..." (film "Pokrovsky Gate").
      Beat the ruble ---- yes stronger, that would be remembered !!!!!!
      1. You Vlad
        You Vlad April 7 2018 06: 55
        +4
        Quote: Reptiloid
        Beat the ruble ---- yes stronger, that would be remembered !!!!!!

        It is unlikely that our ruble will defeat their dollar winked
        Here brains must be set, and some people should be taught to love their homeland.
  5. rkkasa xnumx
    rkkasa xnumx April 7 2018 07: 39
    +10
    Tsushima is born in the minds

    They argued about Tsushima for more than a hundred years, carried some garbage about ship-shells-armor-crews and so on. Fortunately, they finally established the truth, they blame the media for everything.
    1. Rurikovich
      Rurikovich April 7 2018 08: 55
      +5
      Tsushima is in this context a synonym for disaster in the head yes
      1. rkkasa xnumx
        rkkasa xnumx April 7 2018 09: 12
        +3
        Quote: Rurikovich
        Tsushima is in this context a synonym for disaster in the head

        In general, it turns out:
        Tsushima = catastrophe in the head. Then the headline is "A Holocaust in the Heads, Begins in the Heads."
    2. The comment was deleted.
  6. Rurikovich
    Rurikovich April 7 2018 08: 53
    +6
    Yes, the problem is not in what they write there, but in how we perceive it! And these are questions to the education and moral principles of society.
    There is an information war. Only a blind person will not see this. And the answer to how to withstand stuffing lies in plain sight - ideology. No matter how you scold this word, the author is right in some way - if we push ourselves into a corner on the articles of Western "analysts", then they have already won. USSR example request
    Personally, my opinion hi
    1. SPACE
      SPACE April 7 2018 09: 47
      +2
      Quote: Rurikovich
      Yes, the problem is not in what they write there, but in how we perceive it! And these are questions to the education and moral principles of society.

      Fine. Keywords! good hi
      Quote: Rurikovich
      And the answer to how to resist throws lies in sight - ideology

      Ideology, ideology, ideology, do you have an ideology? Not? Do you have a job, a car, a house, a wife? Or is everyone waiting for the power to find work for you and the snot to wipe? And what are they themselves? Or is ideology such a complicated thing that it is impossible to have it without leadership statements and a piece of paper with a seal, living in accordance with it and others to set the right path? Ideology should not be born above, not the supreme ruler should instill it in you, even if it will be the best, the problem is that but not eternal, its ideology will not be eternal either. But if the same ideology is born, individually in the brain of each of you and you will be the majority, this ideology will be eternal and not killed. And lousy goats, put in place and you look at the kingdom the right people will come.
  7. AlexS
    AlexS April 7 2018 09: 20
    +2
    Fight fire with fire. Professional bots and trolls, who are already fighting in the information war against Russia, officially work in the west in the army.
    1. AUL
      AUL April 7 2018 11: 24
      +3
      And our newly created information troops are not doing the same?
  8. thinker
    thinker April 7 2018 09: 42
    +3
    If there is at least some subject of conversation, comparison with the aircraft carrier, then what about yesterday’s “news” on a hundred sites, about the dismissal of eleven generals. Information crap. negative
  9. Antares
    Antares April 7 2018 10: 11
    +6
    It’s strange if Soviet / Russian weapons are at the top of the top in the West, it’s a confession, if not, it’s a hoax. But ratings are made for the sake of ratings (fostering interest, creating interest).
    Hatred in the Russian Federation is a rather serious form of dangerous patriotism, it is fueled not by the Western media, but it’s not just some Western article that called Kuzya the worst — and have no analogues, the best ones in the world to panic ... This is even worse than acknowledging Kuzi’s shortcomings.
    Yes, and the author certainly gave Mach, compares the complete alterations with the basis. It highlights the project, not the price, ease of delivery and, again, money.
    1. SPACE
      SPACE April 7 2018 11: 45
      +3
      Quote: Antares
      It’s strange if Soviet / Russian weapons are in the lead of some kind of top in the West, it’s recognition, if not, it’s a hoax. So the ratings are made for ratings (

      I don’t give a damn about it.
      Quote: Antares
      Hatred in the Russian Federation is a rather serious form of dangerous patriotism

      If you are from Moscow, then yes, but otherwise, the hat-takers are orders of magnitude harmless to round ideots and fans of foreign countries.
      Quote: Antares
      And it’s not just some Western article that called Kuzyu the worst

      Kuznetsov in his concept of creating the perfect aircraft carrier! Those who look to the west and the USA remind rabbits in front of a boa constrictor, Americans need a role model))) The shuttle may have been cool, but now they can’t send people into space and they buy rocket engines, that’s the standard!
      Quote: Antares
      and having no analogues, the best in the world, to be afraid

      But is it objectively not so? Many things have no analogues, and they fight mainly with Russian weapons.
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 12: 24
        +10
        Quote: SPACE
        Kuznetsov in his concept of creating the perfect aircraft carrier!

        laughing fool
        Where is it perfect? The fact that we do not have EW and AWACS aircraft, which halves the capabilities of fighters in aerial combat? Is his springboard outright losing the catapult in terms of ascending speed of the air group? The fact that in full combat Drying can take off from a single take-off position out of the three available? Is it that the number of aircraft that he is able to lift into the air is about half that of the United States AB?
        Or maybe it is ideal in that it carried 12 Granites (when, according to the calculations, it took 20 to break through the AUG air defense)? In that it does not have a nuclear installation, but does it have huge problems with a boiler turbine?
        Quote: SPACE
        The shuttle may have been cool

        That's just the shuttle was not cool, drank the dough in its purest form
        Quote: SPACE
        But is it objectively not so?

        Objectively - not so.
        Quote: SPACE
        Many things have no analogues, and they fight mainly with Russian weapons.

        ??
        1. SPACE
          SPACE April 7 2018 12: 54
          +2
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          Where is it perfect? The fact that we do not have EW and AWACS aircraft,

          laughing Have they ever come in handy for their intended purpose?
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          what half reduces the capabilities of fighters in aerial combat?

          In half laughing laughing Give an example, well, please, well, at least one lol
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          Is his springboard outright losing the catapult in terms of ascending speed of the air group?

          Speed wassat Do they have any AWACS aircraft? laughing Explain, expert, a situation in which you need such a speed? Maybe during the invasion of aliens? lol
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          The fact that in full combat Drying can take off from a single take-off position out of the three available? Is it that the number of aircraft that he is able to lift into the air is about half that of the United States AB?

          Oh yes this is a formidable argument, I wonder what they did not capture Vietnam, and in general he defeated someone, at least once? Xnumx aircraft is power laughing aren't you funny yourself?
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          Or maybe it’s ideal in carrying 12 Granites (when, according to calculations, 20 was needed to break through the AUG air defense)?

          Bring me the formula of Newton or Leibniz according to which it was considered, by the way, how many years ago they considered it, but a mathematician?
          Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
          In that it does not have a nuclear installation, but does it have huge problems with a boiler turbine?

          And what is he one of the boiler turbine? Other seas do not plow?
          And often, Americans drive their own, and the reactors in the parking lots are jammed?
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 13: 18
            +10
            Quote: SPACE
            Have they ever come in handy for their intended purpose?

            Naturally, moreover, in all cases of combat use of the AB.
            Quote: SPACE
            Half laughing laughing Give an example, well, please, well, at least one lol

            The examples are very simple - take any conflict of the last 50 years, find situations where fighters tried to resist the air power system built on the basis of AWACS aircraft, and so on and see the result. Take, for example, Storm in a Glass - in most cases, Iraqi pilots did not even know that they were being attacked. Take the attempts of the Yugoslav MiG-29 to do something in the air - they were found in the air and shot down, preventing them from entering into an air battle. Take the Arab-Israeli conflicts ...
            Quote: SPACE
            They hadsat speeds that there are no AWACS aircraft?

            "Excuse me, who was standing on whom? Take the trouble to state your thoughts more clearly."
            Quote: SPACE
            Explain, expert, a situation in which you need such a speed? Maybe during the invasion of aliens?

            TAKR is guarded by the KGB, its air patrol discovers a group of enemy aircraft, say, in 300 km from our warrant. You need to raise the air group, gain altitude, turn around for an air battle, and before the attack there are less than 15 minutes left.
            Quote: SPACE
            Oh yes, this is a formidable argument, I wonder what they did not capture Vietnam

            But nothing that the aircraft carrier, in fact, is not intended to capture a foreign country - this is the prerogative of the ground forces lol
            Quote: SPACE
            40 planes is the power of laughing yourself not funny?

            Who to laugh at, at you? I want to cry like that. Germany - in the Air Force 125 "Eurofighter" and 93 "Tornado". England - 141 Eurofighter, 76 Tornado. Do we have today modern Su-35 and Su-30 fighters of 200 pieces typed?
            40 aircraft that Nimitz can use in one operation, this is power?:)))
            Quote: SPACE
            Bring me the formula of Newton or Leibniz according to which it was considered, by the way, how many years ago they considered it, but a mathematician?

            All questions to the Commander-in-Chief of the Navy of Gorshkov :)))) He called these numbers and the ammunition of nuclear missile cruisers and nuclear submarines 949A were determined from his numbers.
            Quote: SPACE
            And what is he one of the boiler turbine? Other seas do not plow?

            Not one, of course. Who can not afford the atom - smokes the sky. But someone succeeds (with reliable running gear), and someone - not really
            1. SPACE
              SPACE April 7 2018 17: 49
              +1
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              Naturally, moreover, in all cases of combat use of the AB.

              Ok where? What is this sea battle?
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              Examples are very simple

              You brought on land operations is natural, but now bring the sea?
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              Excuse me, who was standing on whom? Take the trouble to make your thoughts clearer. "

              The presence of AWACS and the lifting speed of the air group seem to contradict each other. laughing
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              TAKR is guarded by the KGB, its air patrol discovers a group of enemy aircraft, say, in 300 km from our warrant. You need to raise the air group, gain altitude, turn around for an air battle, and before the attack there are less than 15 minutes left.

              What is the task of an enemy air group to drop bombs on an aircraft carrier? Or launch missiles at 150 kilometers? And what, Nimitz has time? This is already an air defense mission.laughing
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              40 aircraft that Nimitz can use in one operation, is it strength? :)))

              What, xnumx aircraft in one operation !! will be able to do in terms of counteraction, for example in Kamchatka? Probably just die heroically, or? How many aircraft were involved in Iraq?
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              All questions to the Commander-in-Chief of the Navy Gorshkov :)

              In short, you don’t know what these hypotheses are based on, it is especially interesting where in the ocean. 20 granites are very few, almost scanty, but probably Kuznetsov will not butted alone.
              Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
              Not one, of course. Who can not afford the atom - smokes the sky. But someone succeeds (with reliable running gear), and someone - not really

              60% of all electricity in the Russian Federation is generated at thermal power plants, all of them are boiler turbine.
              So far, there have been no conditions where an American expensive aircraft carrier could be used completely for theoretical purposes and probably will not. For aircraft carriers, there are no rational tasks in peacetime, and in war only hypothetically and then with an uncertain result.
              1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 18: 37
                +5
                Quote: SPACE
                You brought on land operations is natural, but now bring the sea?

                And why didn’t you land? Are you ready to say that over the sea AWACS do not play the role that they play over land? :)))
                Quote: SPACE
                The presence of AWACS and the lifting speed of the air group seem to contradict each other. laughing

                ??? Where is it interesting to know? The Americans on their four-catapult AB did not always have time to raise aviation during the "games" with the Soviet Navy.
                Quote: SPACE
                What is the task of the enemy air group

                Destruction of our IBM
                Quote: SPACE
                And what, Nimitz has time?

                Will be in time. At least - the duty link. Ours ...
                Quote: SPACE
                What, xnumx aircraft in one operation !! will be able to do in terms of counteraction, for example in Kamchatka? Probably just die heroically, or?

                In this case, our air regiment in Yelizovo will have to die heroically, which will take battle at a ratio of one to two.
                Quote: SPACE
                In short, you don’t know what these hypotheses are based on, it is especially interesting where in the ocean.

                That is, the Commander-in-Chief of the Navy of the USSR is not your authority. Okay:)
                Quote: SPACE
                60% of all electricity in the Russian Federation is generated at thermal power plants, all of them are boiler turbine.

                And not one walks on the seas, which is characteristic
                1. SPACE
                  SPACE April 7 2018 19: 38
                  0
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  And why didn’t you land? Are you ready to say that over the sea AWACS do not play the role that they play over land? :)))

                  Be careful, reread the previous comments. We are talking about aircraft carriers, in particular, EW and AWACS aircraft carrier-based aircraft, as an integral part of the combat equipment of American aircraft carriers. Well, where were they used? In what military operations? Against whom at sea?
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  Where is it interesting to know? The Americans on their four-catapult AB did not always have time to raise aviation during the "games" with the Soviet Navy.

                  So their AWAC is threshing floor and what for then is it needed?
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  Destruction of our IBM

                  Well, of course, not with a greeting, what and how?
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  Will be in time. At least - the duty link. Ours.

                  An enemy aircraft at a distance of 150 kilometers, starting from Avik, no one will have time to intercept, nor before the launch of the anti-ship missiles.
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  In this case, our air regiment in Yelizovo will have to die heroically, which will take battle at a ratio of one to two.

                  This is if the boundaries of naval air defense and S-300 pass, which is unlikely.
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  That is, the Commander-in-Chief of the Navy of the USSR is not your authority. Okay:)

                  No, and by the way, you too, authority does not roll here.
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  And not one walks on the seas, which is characteristic

                  But there are no problems.
                  1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 20: 42
                    0
                    Quote: SPACE
                    Be careful, reread the previous comments. We are talking about aircraft carriers, in particular, EW and AWACS aircraft carrier-based aircraft, as an integral part of the combat equipment of American aircraft carriers. Well, where were they used? In what military operations?

                    Storm in a glass, Yugoslavia, for example.
                    Quote: SPACE
                    Against whom at sea?

                    Yes, against everyone with whom there were conflicts in which AB participated - Iraq, Iran, Yugoslavia, Libya and so on.
                    Do you want to say something, SPACE? :)))
                    Quote: SPACE
                    So their AWAC is threshing floor and what for then is it needed?

                    What nonsense is this? Damn, you will learn to begin with, why do you need a plane AWACS :)))
                    Quote: SPACE
                    An enemy aircraft at a distance of 150 kilometers, starting from Avik, no one will have time to intercept, nor before the launch of the anti-ship missiles.

                    At your leisure, teach the order of attack of warrants of Soviet ships by American carrier-based aircraft. With all the airspace clearing groups, the demonstration group, the EW suppression group, and the shock groups. About how and in what sequence they are displayed on the order, how and with what attack, etc. After that, you will be ashamed of babble about rockets from 150 km
                    Quote: SPACE
                    This is if the boundaries of naval air defense and S-300 pass, which is unlikely.

                    What? :)) What sea air defense? :))) SPACE, are you raving? What? :))) And the C-300 is never a prodigy, it’s an excellent air defense system, which, nevertheless, in conditions of numerical superiority of the enemy, is carried forward on foot, like any other weapon system
                    Quote: SPACE
                    But there are no problems.

                    well, put Kuznetsov at the pier - there will be no problems either
                    1. SPACE
                      SPACE April 7 2018 21: 42
                      +1
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      Storm in a glass, Yugoslavia, for example.

                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      Yes, against everyone with whom there were conflicts in which AB participated - Iraq, Iran, Yugoslavia, Libya and so on.
                      Do you want to say something, SPACE? :)))

                      In land operations, more efficient and powerful airborne electronic warfare and early warning airborne aircraft are used, including in coastal areas. So what's the point of small growlers? In the middle of the Atlantic? And against whom? Gulls to laugh?
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      What nonsense is this? Damn, you will learn to begin with, why do you need a plane AWACS :)))

                      DRLO of the Long-Range Radar Detection. But if it is really distant, then there is nothing unexpected and sudden that will require an urgent response of the air group to occur unnecessarily, respectively, and rush to launch.
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      After that, you will be ashamed of babble about rockets from 150 km

                      This is the launch range of the amertish Harpoon. Or do your planes fly closer? The warrant as part of Kuznetsov will have to fight off the anti-ship missiles with its own air defense systems, and at the far approaches the air group.
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      What? :)) What sea air defense? :))) SPACE, are you raving? What? :))) And C-300 - never a wunderwaffe, this is an excellent air defense system, which nevertheless, in conditions of numerical

                      Varyag air defense, BOD, Pacific Fleet forces. The remnants will finish with С300, Shell and Aviation Yelizovo. I do not see problems and difficulties. In the pre-threatening period, you can increase the grouping.
                      Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                      well, put Kuznetsov at the pier - there will be no problems either

                      Carriers mainly stand at the pier, including amercy ones. Well, do not patrol on aircraft carriers in peacetime, expensive. On Kuznetsov, even boilers can be stopped, and training such capacities is not required for take-off aircraft, but nuclear powered carriers are not so simple.
                      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                        Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 22: 14
                        +3
                        Quote: SPACE
                        In land operations, more efficient and powerful airborne electronic warfare and early warning airborne aircraft are used, including in coastal areas.

                        Ask, what does the "more powerful" aircraft have to do with it? We are talking about the fact that the aircraft were used by Hokai and Growlers in military operations - it was with their assistance and support that the Iraqi Navy was destroyed during the Storm in a Glass, deck aircraft performed strike functions along the coast, air control was established over the AB and in the coastal zone of Iraq, and finally, which is very important, the work of strategic US bombers was ensured, which covered just the deck aircraft.
                        Quote: SPACE
                        So what's the point of small growlers? In the middle of the Atlantic? And against whom? Gulls to laugh?

                        Tryndets. Is this Growler making fun of gulls? :)))) Listen, well ... did you try to learn the materiel? Do you even google at your leisure who and what tore at the pieces of ground-based air defense in the conflicts that you so love to refer to. For example, does a phrase like Wilde Weasle say something to you?
                        Quote: SPACE
                        DRLO of the Long-Range Radar Detection. But if it is really distant, then there is nothing unexpected and sudden that will require an urgent response of the air group to occur unnecessarily, respectively, and rush to launch.

                        Tryndets squared :)))
                        I will tell you a military secret - the main objective of the AWACS is not reconnaissance, but managing a group of aircraft in battle is a flying command center. Of course, he also takes part in intelligence, but not in the way you imagine. The standard US patrol is 1 AWACS, 1 Growler, 2-4 fighter. It moves forward to remove 300 km from the order in the direction of a potential threat. So, if air supremacy is not established, then it was Groler who played the main role in reconnaissance, carrying out passive reconnaissance, and AWAC serves for the EXPLORATION of the goals identified by passive means. Just because hacking a DRLO radar means announcing to everyone about kilometers so in 600 from the plane - HERE A DECK AIRCRAFT PATROL AND Aircraft carrier ALSO SOMEWHERE HERE!
                        At the same time, the target level of the fighter AWACS bomber will detect kilometers in 300, which means that being in 300 km from AB, it will reveal the attacking group in 600 km from AB only in the ideal case - i.e. if the route of the attacking group goes just through the position of the air patrol. And this happens far from always.
                        Quote: SPACE
                        This is the launch range of the amertish Harpoon.

                        Do you think that the attack is carried out by long-range missiles. What can I say? Kindergarten.
                        Quote: SPACE
                        Or do your planes fly closer?

                        I do not have airplanes, but I already offered you to study the materiel
                        Quote: SPACE
                        Air Defense Varyag

                        THAT is one cruiser on .. how many thousand kilometers of the coast?
                        Quote: SPACE
                        BOD,

                        fool COSMOS, did Google ban you? Do you know the performance characteristics of "Daggers"? By the way, the question of backfill is how many BOD are in the Pacific Fleet? :)))))))
                        Quote: SPACE
                        forces of Pacific Fleet. The remnants will finish with С300, Shell and Aviation Yelizovo. I do not see problems and difficulties.

                        Now I'm not surprised why. Ok live in illusions
              2. Vladimir1155
                Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 45
                +1
                I support, boilers are quite efficient, and more economical than diesel engines, people like to pay money, fuel oil is cheaper than solariums
          2. Vladimir1155
            Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 20: 19
            0
            in another branch, the experts proved that 9 missiles are enough to defeat the AUG and that the TAVKR is not designed to fight the AUG this is the case for TU22, TU160, Our TAVKR anti-submarine
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 13: 52
              +1
              Quote: vladimir1155
              in another branch, experts proved that 9 missiles are enough to defeat AUG

              Liar
              Quote: vladimir1155
              And that TAVKR is not intended to combat AUG this is the case for TU22, TU160, Our TAVKR anti-submarine

              With the best in the world anti-submarine Su-33 :))))
              1. Vladimir1155
                Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 15: 28
                0
                Andrey and forgot about helicopters? and they are the main weapons of Kuzi along with granites
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 15: 50
                  0
                  Quote: vladimir1155
                  Andrey and forgot about helicopters? and they are the main weapons of Kuzi along with granites

                  This is probably why sailors proposed to remove helicopters from Kuznetsov after the Mediterranean BS laughing Vladimir, you single-handedly replace me with a circus, stand-up and KVN, but alas, you don’t pull on Raikov. Your level - Petrosyan
                  1. The comment was deleted.
                  2. Vladimir1155
                    Vladimir1155 April 10 2018 08: 29
                    0
                    I have never been a State Duma deputy Raikov
      2. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 43
        +1
        I fully support, they are fighting with Russian weapons, it is the best, And our AB is better than the defenseless Amer barge for aircraft, it is not too bulky, the Amersz ports almost do not drop by. Ours has the main missile weapon
  10. Bastinda
    Bastinda April 7 2018 10: 23
    +3
    "Yes, we are these narrow-eyed, one left! God is with us!" hat-thinking mood in Russia after the beginning of the REV.
    "Yes, we will put the whole west on our knees! We can’t get used to it! Putin is with us!"
    At first I thought that the article was just on this topic ... laughing
  11. smart ass
    smart ass April 7 2018 10: 33
    +2
    Kuzi still has cheating p700 granite
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 11: 36
      +6
      Quote: Clever man
      Kuzi still has cheating p700 granite

      No. And for a long time already
      1. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 47
        0
        did you look into the mine, or did you stand with a candle? when were they pulled out? By the way, after all, VTG does not even propose replacing Granites with Caliber ..... you don’t understand why?
  12. SCHWERIN
    SCHWERIN April 7 2018 11: 17
    +3
    Our naval delegation, at the invitation of France in the 20s, visited the parade of the French fleet. The delegation included Academician Krylov.
    The Minister of the Navy of France proudly showed Krylov powerful cruisers, destroyers. After the parade, Krylov invited the French to see the real ships. Those were surprised and went to the backwater, where the RI ships survived, stolen there by Russian crews after the revolution. The sight was terrible, peeling paint, rusty sides .... The French were perplexed. To their silent question, Krylov conducted an excursion and led the TTD of the ships. The destroyer had a speed of 5 knots more than the new Frenchman, the autonomy of navigation and the number of torpedoes were also not in favor of the French. Next, examined the battleship. Krylov drew the attention of the owners to the case. It consisted of armor plates fitted so precisely that the needle did not enter the joint.
    The life of a destroyer in battle is short. So why make hulls heavy when it is better to increase the number of weapons, speed and autonomy of navigation, said the academician. The French left the back with a different mood.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 11: 37
      +4
      Excuse me, what kind of stormy fantasies are these?
      1. SCHWERIN
        SCHWERIN April 7 2018 13: 33
        +3
        It’s bad that you, respected with a marine avatar, don’t know the story and call my comment stormy such a fantasy. This is where Tsushima comes from.
        Academician A.N. Krylov, our outstanding mathematician and shipbuilder, visited France in 1924 in order to inspect the ships of the Russian Squadron in Bizert taken there by Wrangel, to tow them to the USSR.
        I have in St. Petersburg there is a Central Research Institute to them. A.N. Krylova. It used to be terribly secret. You do not have this in Chelyab, therefore, you don’t know .....
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 13: 52
          +3
          Quote: SCHWERIN
          Academician A.N. Krylov, our outstanding mathematician and shipbuilder, visited France in 1924 in order to inspect the ships of the Russian Squadron in Bizert taken there by Wrangel, to tow them to the USSR.

          I know that. Now tell us in all the chilling details that Krylov visited the parade of the latest ships of the French fleet and where did he drag the French afterwards, demonstrating to them the advantages of domestic shipbuilding? :)))))
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 14: 06
            +8
            In general, I do not expect an answer to this question from you, so I’ll briefly say it myself. There has never been a "sea parade". Krylov arrived to watch the Russian squadron in 1924 and told interested Frenchmen who accompanied him about the peculiarities of Russian ships - the legs of your bike seem to grow from here.
            Quote: SCHWERIN
            The destroyer had a speed on 5 knots more than the new Frenchman, the autonomy of navigation and the number of torpedoes were also not in favor of the French.

            In the Russian squadron there were EMs of the type Daring and Happy. The speed of the first is of the order of 31 knots, of the second is 34 knots. The torpedo tubes on the first one were 10 and on both, but small caliber (450 mm)
            None of the “newest French destroyers” at that time existed in nature - the first post-war French destroyers of the Burrask type were laid in 1923. By the way, they had 33 ties and 9 much more powerful 533-mm torpedoes. The last destroyers of military construction were laid in 1913 and were not suitable for the role of "newest"
          2. SCHWERIN
            SCHWERIN April 8 2018 10: 35
            +2
            Krylov A.N. "My Memoirs" p. 78-79. I read this book for a long time, being a cadet. I made a mistake in something, but on the whole I described it correctly. I did not find the book at home; I looked through the electronic version. By the way a very good book. Read ....
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 11: 49
              +1
              Answered below :)))))
        2. Vladimir1155
          Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 49
          0
          I myself read Krylov’s memoirs and confirm that it was all
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 20: 31
            0
            Quote: vladimir1155
            I myself read Krylov’s memoirs and confirm that it was all

            Liar
            1. SCHWERIN
              SCHWERIN April 8 2018 10: 49
              0
              “How,” Admiral Bui asked me, “have you achieved such a difference in the armament of destroyers?”
              “Take a look, admiral, on the deck: except for the stringer, in which the entire fortress, everything else, which is like a cover, has rusted almost through and through; pipes, their casings, cuttings, etc., are all worn out. Look at! YOUR! destroyer, everything on it is as good as new; True, our destroyer is six years old without leaving and without coloring, but this is not the main point. Your destroyer is built of ordinary steel and the calculated voltage of 7 kg per 1 mm2 is taken on it, as if it were a commercial ship that should last at least 24 years. Ours is built entirely of high-resistance steel, the voltage is allowed at 12 kg and more, in places up to 23 kg / mm2. The destroyer is built for 10-12 years, because during this time it manages to become so obsolete that it no longer represents true combat strength. The whole gain in the weight of the corps was used to strengthen military weapons, and you see that in an artillery battle our destroyer will smash at least four, i.e. your division, before they get closer to the firing range of their farts.
              - Comme c'est simple (how simple it is).
              1. Golovan Jack
                Golovan Jack April 8 2018 10: 55
                +6
                Quote: SCHWERIN
                ... your division ...

                Division, maybe?
              2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 11: 45
                +1
                Quote: SCHWERIN
                I made a mistake in something, but on the whole I described it correctly

                Sorry, but I don’t understand what “in general” means. The parade you described was not. There was no superiority of the Russian destroyer in speed. And ... maybe I'll upset you, but the dialogue you brought with Admiral Bui with a probability of 99% was not there either.
                You see, in the Russian squadron there was NO destroyer with the given Krylov characteristics. That is, there were ships of the "Ushakov" series, but they had 4 102-mm guns, and not 5 105-mm. To make matters worse - the French fleet did not have destroyers, with the technical characteristics which Krylov described :)))) Krylov writes
                Next to the last destroyer standing, it’s possible to say that board on board was a French destroyer of the same age and displacement (1350 t), like ours.

                The closest to the type described by Krylov is the French destroyers Aventurie. But they had 1250 tons of full displacement, and the Russian Fidonisi (only they had built torpedo tubes) - 1580 tons, i.e. were 310 tons heavier. But this is not such a beautiful explanation as the steel of the case, right? In addition, Fidonisi was laid in 1915 r, Adventure - in 1911 r, 4 years then meant a lot. By the way, France laid down the latest torpedo boats in 1913, the next series in 1923, so there were no peers by age of our Fidonisi in France
                In general, I must say that the Noviks were much more perfect than any French destroyers, but Krylov .... such Krylov :)))))))
                1. Amurets
                  Amurets April 8 2018 13: 02
                  +3
                  Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
                  That is, there were ships of the "Ushakov" series, but they had 4 102 mm guns, and not 5 105 mm.

                  5 102-mm destroyers Izyaslav, Pryamislav and Avtroil had, but they were Baltic destroyers and only Avtroil went abroad, but not to France, but to Peru.
                  1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 13: 50
                    +1
                    Quote: Amurets
                    According to 5, 102-mm destroyers Izyaslav, Pryamislav and Avtroil had, but these are Baltic destroyers

                    In-in, and they did not fall into the Russian squadron in Bizerte
                    1. Vladimir1155
                      Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 15: 30
                      0
                      Well, of course, Andrei the Great is much smarter than academician Admiral Krylov, he convicted the admiral of inaccuracy ... like me, I am in a pleasant company, I and Krylov are a force
                2. SCHWERIN
                  SCHWERIN April 8 2018 14: 44
                  +1
                  It discusses the ANC "Kuznetsov" as I understand it. Like boilers smoke and that is not so. So, referring to the visit of A.N. Krylov’s backwater with Russian ships, I wanted to show that smoking boilers are not a reason to rot a combat unit! Has he reached the goal? I got it. Delivered weapons and aircraft on board? Delivered. Returned back? He returned. Fulfilled the combat mission.
                  The new USS "Zumvalt" is also not without problems. But no one sprinkles ashes on his head.
                  Turning to the past. The lousy corn biplane "Fairey Swordfish" happened to fly, dropping a torpedo that brought fatal troubles to Bismarck
                  As for the destroyers, I somehow trust Krylov, who saw this ship with his own eyes, than he does not see him live otherwise.
                  And about a number of inaccuracies, he explained that he had read this book a long time ago, naturally a lot of things came out of his mind. Yes, there was no parade, but there was an inspection by the official delegation of the USSR and representatives of the French Navy.
                  1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                    Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 15: 42
                    0
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    It discusses ANK "Kuznetsov" as I understand it

                    That's right :)))
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    Like boilers smoke and that is not so.

                    Nope. The thing is that a foreign magazine recorded Kuznetsov in the worst aircraft carriers in history. This, of course, is nonsense (it’s not so bad), but in fact the ship is really very problematic, both in terms of design and in actual condition.
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    So, with a link to visit A.N. Krylov’s backwater with Russian ships, I wanted to show that smoking boilers are not a reason to rot a combat unit! Has he reached the goal? I got it. Delivered weapons and aircraft on board? Delivered. Returned back? He returned.

                    Yes, but it does not help in any way in comparison with aircraft carriers of other countries.
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    Fulfilled the combat mission.

                    I do not know. They didn’t tell me about his combat missions.
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    The new USS "Zumvalt" is also not without problems. But no one sprinkles ashes on his head.

                    Well, no one? This is not accepted in the United States, and we have repeatedly called Zamvolt a refuge, which, in essence, it is.
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    The lousy corn biplane "Fairey Swordfish" happened to fly, dropping a torpedo that brought fatal troubles to Bismarck

                    You are ... Actually, the pilots of swordfish are pros, and they didn’t throw torpedoes at random. And in order to attack the latest battleship on a biplane, generally speaking, it was not necessary to take courage. Pilots went all out on 200% and knocked out the battleship - but that doesn't make Swordfish better than he was
                    Quote: SCHWERIN
                    As for the destroyers, I somehow trust Krylov, who saw this ship with his own eyes, than he does not see him live otherwise.

                    A simple example is when you go out and see cars every day. Can you make a technical description of the car you saw? Or, in your opinion, Krylov weighed the French destroyer with pocket steelyard? And do not trust the reference books compiled according to French by people who had all the necessary documents ... Or fail to count the 102-mm guns of our destroyers at least in the photo of the ships ...
                    In general, as I understand it, the saying of military historians "Lies as an eyewitness" is not familiar to you.
  13. Altona
    Altona April 7 2018 11: 19
    +2
    Quote: You Vlad
    It is unlikely that our ruble will defeat their dollar

    -----------------------------
    Americans are a nation of hucksters who think that they can do anything. Accordingly, their behavior is such a brazen bazaar skirmish. The essence of huckster is to replicate goods and money. If you have a bunch of sheepskin coats and felt boots in the warehouse, this does not mean that you are warmly dressed. If your bar is clogged with alcohol, this does not mean that you are able to drink all of it, well, or in a short time. If you have a lot of money, this does not mean that everyone will run to work for you, let alone fight. If you have a huge arsenal of personal weapons, this does not mean that you are able to use it simultaneously. Also, Americans, it seems to them that they can do everything and they live in these illusions. I also read this article and also thought, with what fright did the aircraft-carrying cruiser enter the aircraft carriers? The ship wing of Kuzi is several times smaller than that of Nimitz, and his tasks are somewhat different, well, it is clearly not a systematic intimidation of the natives by a bunch of flying iron over their heads.
  14. lance
    lance April 7 2018 11: 30
    +4
    you just need to solve the problem with Kuzi boiler units, maybe even take an interest in liaolin. and the rest is 24 sea-based hummingbirds, if the fleet wishes, with a range of 1800 km and a mig-35, with the su-57 on the way. then to whom and what will this tank give way to
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 11: 40
      +6
      Quote: Lance
      then to whom and what will this tank give way to

      Everything, in general.
      1. lance
        lance April 7 2018 11: 43
        +2
        in general, the fleet is fighting, so more in detail.
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 12: 25
          +2
          And in more detail - above, I can’t copy-paste the same thing from a comment into a comment
      2. NN52
        NN52 April 7 2018 12: 17
        +5
        But Kitty Hawk didn’t know about the proposal of the amers to the Indians, for the first time I hear .. interesting. They wanted to hook them on a hook.

        And he himself has never been a sailor, but it is not clear why everyone calls Kuznetsov such a derogatory nickname - Kuzya, why and for what? In all topics ..
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 12: 36
          +4
          Quote: NN52
          But Kitty Hawk didn’t know about the offer of amers to the Indians, I’ve heard for the first time .. interesting.

          They wanted to. But Kitty Hawk by that time had exhausted the resource by 100%, that is, its further operation was practically unrealistic.
      3. albert
        albert April 7 2018 16: 43
        +1
        Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
        Everything, in general.

        And if you compare with the new English "Queen Elizabeth", for example?
    2. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 51
      0
      boilers must simply be operated correctly, and .... sometimes replaced, at least after 29 years of service
  15. turbris
    turbris April 7 2018 12: 13
    +3
    And no one even says that we have an aircraft carrier in the classical sense of the word, we have an aircraft carrier and these are very different concepts, so all sorts of comparisons are inappropriate here. It was created to provide air defense of the Kug in the far sea zone and provided for the presence on its board of the S-300F air defense system and exclusively air defense fighters - this purpose it now corresponds to. And the aircraft carrier with us only looms in the distant future and it is not clear what illiterate experts are comparing here.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 12: 28
      +3
      Quote: turbris
      And no one even says that we have an aircraft carrier in the classical sense of the word, we have an aircraft carrier and these are very different concepts,

      Oh yeah. One egg in full view, the second in profile.
      Quote: turbris
      It was created to provide air defense of the Kug in the far sea zone and provided for the presence on its board of the S-300F air defense system and exclusively air defense fighters - this purpose it now corresponds to.

      DRLO and EW - no, without it, fighter efficiency is minus 50% minimum, the speed of the air group is low (springboard), the air group itself is small (air regiment)
      Quote: turbris
      it was supposed to be on board the S-300F

      Never envisaged.
      1. turbris
        turbris April 7 2018 12: 55
        +3
        No, it was envisaged and not only an aircraft-carrying cruiser is participating in the air defense of the sea area, but also ships of the 1st and 2nd rank from the KUG. Of course, a DDRO deck aircraft would not be in the way, but its role was played by DRLO ships, which are in a long watch. EW funds are available on every ship of rank 1 or 2, so not so stupid people were those who planned the combat use of an aircraft-carrying cruiser in those years.
        1. turbris
          turbris April 7 2018 13: 00
          +2
          An aircraft carrier does not have its own weapons, and an aircraft carrier cruiser is equipped with both a naval strike and air defense systems, so this is not just one egg in full face and profile.
          1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
            Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 13: 27
            +1
            Quote: turbris
            An aircraft carrier does not have its own weapons, and an aircraft carrier cruiser is equipped with both a naval strike and air defense systems, so this is not just one egg in full face and profile.

            Sorry, but this is not serious. Both Nimitz and Kuznetsov in the last century (we take for comparison the time of their construction) had fighter weapons - roughly a fighter regiment. As a strike, Nimitz has the A-6E attack regiment, and ours has the 12 RCC Granite. Nimitz air defense was provided by Sea Sparrow and Volcano Phalanxes. Our TAKR - Daggers and ZRAK + metal cutting, that is, missiles and artillery complexes of similar purpose. THAT is our air defense is stronger, but Nimitz also has it
        2. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 13: 20
          +1
          Quote: turbris
          No, it was envisaged and not only an aircraft-carrying cruiser is participating in the air defense of the sea area, but also ships of the 1st and 2nd rank from the KUG.

          So what? The Americans did it destroyers and cruisers with standards, only what does this have to do with the capabilities of an aircraft carrier?
          Quote: turbris
          EW funds are available on each ship of rank 1 or 2

          And how do they, interestingly, help in aerial combat?
          1. turbris
            turbris April 7 2018 20: 02
            0
            What kind of weak preparation you have, you compare U.S. aircraft carriers with Russian aircraft carriers and don’t understand the differences, start by studying the naval doctrines of the U.S. and Russia, then you will understand the difference in the goals and objectives of the construction and possible combat use of the U.S. and Russian navies. The goals and objectives are completely different, so your comparisons are absolutely inappropriate, and the electronic warfare systems installed on ships have the ability to suppress aircraft radar, which makes it impossible to use B-V class missiles with radar seeker over long distances - here’s your help in air the battle.
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 20: 26
              +1
              Quote: turbris
              What kind of weak preparation you have, you compare the U.S. aircraft carriers with the Russian aircraft carriers and don’t understand the differences, start by studying the naval doctrines of the U.S. and Russia, then you will understand the difference in the goals and objectives of the construction and possible combat use of the U.S. and Russian navies.

              You know, I really don't like being exposed to chicken. So please stop portraying the egg teaching me :))))
              Firstly, it should be understood that Kuznetsov was not built in Russia, but in the USSR. In accordance with the concepts of the Navy of the USSR. Secondly, the USSR TAKR concept is spelled out in a heap of sources, and if you had given yourself the trouble to study them, you would have seen that the key task of our TAKRs was to provide combat stability to the fleet’s strike forces — by ensuring their air defense. That is, our TAKR in its core task is an air defense carrier.
              If we approach the matter more formally, then the tasks of the TAKR were prescribed, as the respected Boa KAA prompts us
              Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
              Designed to defeat large surface targets, protect naval formations from attacks by a likely enemy using aircraft carriers and a large number of submarines; also has the task of supporting amphibious operations .. "

              It is from the perspective of these tasks that I am making the comparison. And if you would even bother to read at least something about our TAKR, except for the Murzilka magazine, then you would know that initially for the fulfillment of its tasks the fleet requested atomic ABs in 80 000 tons with fighter and strike aircraft in the image and likeness state, and to
              This conclusion came as a result of many years of research work "Order"
              Also, you would know that people who were neither sailors nor pilots interfered with the construction of the AB USSR.
              Quote: turbris
              and the electronic warfare systems installed on the ships have the ability to suppress the radar of aircraft, which makes it impossible to use class B-B missiles with radar seeker over long distances

              No comments :))) You know, you will first understand the basics, then we will talk about electronic warfare
              1. turbris
                turbris April 7 2018 20: 43
                +2
                I understand everything with you, I don’t comment on you anymore, continue to be clever and foolish not by professionals or the military, the rest will read you with admiration, success in your study on the Internet of the power of the US Navy and the worthlessness of the Russian Navy, you’re at least in the army served as a "sofa" expert?
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 22: 15
                  0
                  Quote: turbris
                  I understand everything with you, I don’t comment on you anymore

                  Thank you!
  16. dgonni
    dgonni April 7 2018 12: 35
    +2
    As for the Indians, the question was precisely in the acquisition of an air wing. about kuzi That there are problems and they are not today, but they began during the development period. The Union collapsed before it could create a grouping of TAKR and aircraft carriers. Although, in fact, they were no longer needed at the time. or paraphrasing. The transition to the state structure required prohibitive injections into the fleet, with a corresponding decrease in the combat effectiveness of the ground forces. Bolivar is not able to stand two. I am in the sense of economics.
  17. groks
    groks April 7 2018 13: 04
    +6
    The author has written a lot of things. In hat-making style. But from these scriptures the ship did not become better, and in general there were no more ships. Normal, not boats.
    The Soviet compromise experiment was wow at the time of creation. But time passed decently, disfigured him from that time, how unknowingly. There is no special meaning in it, since the Russian Federation is not the USSR and the carrier cruiser wandering alone will cause only regular bullying from all scribblers. Yes, even in this state.
    So the author would have better criticized the Kremlin people for the current state of the fleet. They will put things in order, and no one will bark. "No money, but you hold on"? Well then, read what everyone writes and keep quiet.
    So Tsushima is being prepared for us by our (our?) Leaders, just as they prepared the past. Cartoons have to indulge less, and put more order.
  18. Altona
    Altona April 7 2018 14: 15
    0
    Quote: groks
    So the author would have better criticized the Kremlin people for the current state of the fleet. They will put things in order, and no one will bark. "No money, but you hold on"? Well then, read what everyone writes and keep quiet.

    -------------------------------
    You really have an emotional comment. In general, I believe that if modern Russia builds 10 destroyer ships in normal time, it will even be very good. And then at the parade of the Navy it was somehow too uncomfortable to watch how very small surface ships and a vintage-looking monster represent a great country. And against their background, the modern Chinese destroyer looked favorably.
    1. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 19: 55
      0
      China has its own tasks, and Russia needs to fortify its defense, with undetached submarines, they’re not building ships for parades, Rosiii do not need destroyers and cruisers, although those that are, let them serve, China does not have such large cruisers as the Russian Federation.
  19. Abrascha
    Abrascha April 7 2018 15: 23
    +6
    Honestly, up to this point I did not suspect the existence of such a network publication as the tape ru.)))) Well, as a young Jew, I want to advise the Russians to get rid of such a national Russian disease as soon as possible (especially the Russian intelligentsia suffers from it)))) ), as giving too much importance to such bullshit as the opinion of the West and the desire to look white and fluffy in the eyes of the same West. I would venture to recall that it is precisely because of this that the Russians and your Empire were destroyed (by the way, my Motherland, which I still love as a mother) and betrayed your Russians and continue to betray. Believe me, the West has NEVER WANTED ANYTHING FOR YOU. RUSSIANS, finally learn to live your mind and be guided only by the interests of your nation. You have absolutely everything for this. Well, in conclusion, I add, if the Jews seriously attached at least some importance to the opinion of other countries and peoples, then no state of Israel would exist in principle. )))
  20. Boa kaa
    Boa kaa April 7 2018 15: 31
    +5
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    I brazenly and arrogantly chose the air defense task as the TARK specialization,

    Andrey, do not get into a rage! I am not an enemy, but a very boring kapraz! Therefore, get nuts and sign:
    1 TARK is an abbreviation of a heavy nuclear missile cruiser (pr 1144.3)
    2. TARK has the possibility of zonal air defense (covering TG in a remote area of ​​the sea), but not this chapter of it. task...
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    our TAKR are generally no different from AB :)
    Well, you obviously got excited! The main tasks of the AVM are assigned to the AVM, but the PLO is organized in its interests as AMG nuclei ... In our country, the TAVKR with Ka-27PL helicopters was more likely to solve the problem of combat stability of forces from enemy submarines ...
    But they also differed in the fact that during a storm more than 6 points could upset the adversary with their heavy anti-ship missiles ... but it was problematic to raise aviation in such GMUs ... Then, again, AVM did not have its own assets except for helicopters .. . So, there are nuances ... yes
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 15: 56
      +1
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      Andrey, do not get into a rage!

      How can I not enter it, if I never leave it? laughing
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      I am not an enemy

      I know, and, dear Boa KAA, I am always ready to listen to your words. But sometimes I can argue, despite the fact that I will NEVER see the enemy in you, even if I disagree with you in something and we do not agree. I’ll just know that on this issue you think differently than I do, and my respect for you from this well will not decrease by a gram. I will be happy if you can answer me the same, but I dare not insist.
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      and a very boring kapraz!

      Notice I didn’t say that! laughing
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      So get on the nuts and sign

      I sign in the wick, but I remain with my opinion laughing
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      TARK is the abbreviation of a heavy nuclear missile cruiser (pr 1144.3)

      I sprinkle ashes on my head and run for nuts. Pup. TAX, of course.
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      Well, you obviously got excited! The main tasks assigned to the AVM are

      You yourself quoted the list, and there the first task is the most shocking
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      Designed to engage large surface targetsProtecting naval formations from attacks by a likely adversary using aircraft carriers and a large number of submarines; also has the task of supporting amphibious operations.

      You do not think that you are boring! I assure you - tedious people like financial directors are still looking for, against their background kaprazy - absolutely, not at all boring! laughing
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      But they also differed in the fact that during a storm more than 6 points could upset the adversary with their heavy anti-ship missiles ... but it was problematic to raise aviation in such GMUs ...

      So RCC has a limitation of EMNIP of 7 points, isn’t it? And in principle, aircraft can fly to 7, only it’s very difficult, only the best crews. Again EMNIP.
      Quote: Boa constrictor KAA
      Then, again, the AVM did not have any other means of PLO except for helicopters ..

      So Kuznetsov does not have them, except for those two anti-torpedo bombers. hi
      1. NN52
        NN52 April 7 2018 16: 43
        +5
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Boa kaa

        Here you are hot Russian guys ...
        Spears are breaking ...
        Well, look at Kuznetsov on the other hand, not with a marine look, but with an aviation ...
        At this point in time, and probably 10 years ahead, the pilots of the decks have no other alternative but Kuznetsov ... Yeysk and Saki do not count, there are no real conditions for landing on a Thread that are when landing on Kuznetsov, on the water ..
        And it doesn’t matter, in fact, what his real purpose was and what purpose he was built for ...
        But what’s important is that by injecting money into its current modernization, Russia will keep the school of carrier-based aviation (pilot training) for the future ... For a new aircraft carrier ... Which we will have in the near future.
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 17: 02
          +4
          Quote: NN52
          But what’s important is that by injecting money into its current modernization, Russia will keep the school of carrier-based aviation (pilot training) for the future ...

          So it is undeniable. Actually, I also write that Kuznetsov is now not so much combat as training, but that he is necessary as such ...
          Anyway, it’s good, if you give him an EC, upgrade the equipment, work on it and bring to mind the MiG-29K, put some sort of AWACS, even Ka-31, so he can do something in combat. So I'm for two-handed modernization
      2. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 20: 14
        +2
        In general, Andrey Tsushima has had a head in his head for a long time, a constant sad look into the future, everything has disappeared, boss has disappeared, where are we going .... do not read modern newspapers especially at night, and do not judge the fleet by the tabloid press
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 15: 44
          0
          Quote: vladimir1155
          do not read modern newspapers especially at night, and do not judge the fleet by the tabloid press

          ... Listen to the narcotic nonsense of Vladimir1155 and you will be happy ...
  21. misti1973
    misti1973 April 7 2018 16: 26
    0
    Not so long ago, this publication was here in favor! And now they called things by their proper names. Kuznetsov is indeed a disgrace. Fact!
  22. albert
    albert April 7 2018 16: 38
    +1
    But both Varyag and Admiral Gorshkov would be very useful to our fleet now. We should wait for new aircraft carriers for a long time. And all because of the desire to cut the dough. Nobody thinks about the fleet.
  23. Mestny
    Mestny April 7 2018 17: 34
    0
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    try to answer the question - which aircraft carrier is worse than Kuznetsov today? Only Thai comes to my mind, and you?

    Here you are, dear colleagues, the clearest evidence of what the author writes about.
    This is already all properly washed in the head. and works strictly in the direction that the ideologists of this strategy need.
    There is no doubt about the main thing. And this miracle probably walks on the same land as the rest of the citizens of Russia.
    And how many of them.
    And most importantly - everyone understands everything. This moose pedal in all branches and topics blows in the same tune. Everyone sees it. We are moderators who accidentally came to the light.
    But nothing is being done.
    Then, when it starts, and such will come out of all the cellars - do not ask why it turned out so badly with us.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 18: 45
      +1
      Sergey, but weakly instead of this one here in the commentary, take it, and explain with reasoning what Andrey is wrong from Chelyabinsk? :))) Weakly, I myself know.
      1. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 20: 01
        +1
        I and others have repeatedly proved your wrong, on a number of issues
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 20: 43
          +1
          Quote: vladimir1155
          I and others have repeatedly proved your wrong, on a number of issues

          I was wrong only in one thing - when I started to communicate with you as an adequate person, but this will not happen again
          1. Vladimir1155
            Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 08: 03
            +1
            Andrey, you surrendered to the mercy of the winner as a Swede near Poltava
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 12: 43
              0
              Quote: vladimir1155
              Andrey, you surrendered to the mercy of the winner as a Swede near Poltava

              Yes, yes, the main thing is do not worry. Book out, read something
  24. andrej-shironov
    andrej-shironov April 7 2018 17: 58
    0
    The methodological psychological treatment of the Russian population through the retransmission of terry anti-Russian propaganda continues non-stop and on a scale that threatens state security.

    Is it threatening? But why doesn’t our government take measures? So maybe those and our power are just one berry field? And do one thing? Only from different ends.
  25. Xscorpion
    Xscorpion April 7 2018 18: 04
    +1
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    Quote: SPACE
    Sorry, but your ridiculous comments do not even have a topic of conversation.

    We have a ship that has big problems with the chassis, whose air group has not yet been formed, and the missile weapons have been destroyed as a result of an operational error. Therefore, let's do it easier and try to answer the question - which aircraft carrier today worse than Kuznetsov? Only Thai comes to my mind, and you?


    Andrey, where did you get information about Granit's malfunction? OBS? Or is there any real evidence? Besides, this analytics of the malfunction is based on the fact that there have been no launches of these missiles for a long time. That's why I think it’s like in a joke. I won not the Volga, but Moskvich, and I didn’t win, but I lost. I have information that 2 air defense mines, and not Granitov, were flooded with fuel oil. And they eliminated everything a long time ago.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 18: 55
      +1
      Quote: Xscorpion
      Andrey, where did you get information about Granit's malfunction? OBS?

      Yeah, one woman said. From Severodvinsk :))))
      Quote: Xscorpion
      In addition, this analytics of the malfunction is based on the fact that for a long time there were no launches of these missiles.

      Yes, how to say? Unofficially there was an infa that they ruined the post of management of the Granites either at the end of the 90's or at the beginning of the 2000's. Since then, Kuznetsov did not shoot anti-ship missiles, there was no information about the repair of Granites.
      Quote: Xscorpion
      I have information that the 2 air defense mines, and not the Granites, were flooded with fuel oil.

      This is different, the air defense systems were also drowned
    2. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 20: 06
      0
      in general, Andrei declared the destroyer Ushakov sky-ready for the reason ...... that little is written about him in the press. (It’s just that when the cruiser is busy at the Pacific Fleet, the destroyer is illuminated and there are so many ships on the Northern Fleet that they don’t write about the destroyer) ... according to Andrei, the Navy is obliged to constantly launch live missiles and inform Andrei about all the malfunctions or performance of the ships ... otherwise Andrey put them in the list of faulty
      1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
        Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 7 2018 20: 30
        +1
        Quote: vladimir1155
        in general, Andrei declared the destroyer Ushakov sky-ready for the reason ...... that little is written about him in the press.

        Vladimir, you lie, but do not lie :))))
        1. Vladimir1155
          Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 08: 11
          0
          I quote https://topwar.ru/136720-voennyy-flot-rossii-grus
          tnyy-vzglyad-v-buduschee-otechetvennye-esmincy.ht
          ml "two destroyers of project 956 have limited combat effectiveness associated with a troubled power plant (Admiral Ushakov and the flagship of the Nastoyashchy Charity Fund), two missile defense projects of project 1155 and 1155.1 are in lengthy repair.
          Thus, to date, “ready for the campaign and battle,” we have as many as 8 destroyer-class ships, including the presumptive Shrewd, six Project 1155 BODs and the Pacific Fast, plus two more Project 2 “partially fit” destroyers. Four fleets, please note. "
          1. Vladimir1155
            Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 08: 13
            +1
            Andrei wrote "But it is noteworthy that all the exercises involving the" Admiral Ushakov "were held in the Barents Sea. That is, despite the huge need for warships capable of serving off the coast of Syria, send there the last northern destroyer of the project 956 did not find it possible, which indicates the unreliability of its power plant. "
            1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
              Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 11: 02
              +1
              That's right. Differences with
              Quote: vladimir1155
              Andrei declared the destroyer Ushakov sky-ready for the reason ...... that little is written about him in the press

              Unnoticed? :)))) However, what am I talking about :)))) And most importantly to whom :)))
              1. Vladimir1155
                Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 12: 53
                0
                noticeably ... by the way, despite the alleged "huge need", a huge number of naval combat-ready ships didn’t go to Syria, and not just EM
                1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
                  Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 14: 54
                  0
                  Quote: vladimir1155
                  By the way, despite the alleged "huge need", a huge number of Navy combat-ready ships did not descend into Syria

                  It tempts me to ask, "which ones?" In order to enjoy the fierce nonsense in your performance :))))
  26. shirkoled
    shirkoled April 7 2018 19: 13
    +1
    And tell me the sir, who dug in this "tape.ru"?
    1. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 7 2018 20: 06
      0
      enemies of the people dug in there
      1. Deck
        Deck April 7 2018 21: 25
        0
        The most notorious: editor-in-chief Alexei Sergeyevich Goreslavsky from Interax agency. Now for a good enemy job goes to the presidential administration
        1. seacap
          seacap April 7 2018 23: 36
          0
          Everyone who killed the country and destroyed its achievements is eating sweetly and sleeping softly, no one is sitting in the slaughter or on the porch in the porch.
        2. tihonmarine
          tihonmarine April 8 2018 08: 01
          0
          We also need to attach Venediktov!
  27. Boa kaa
    Boa kaa April 7 2018 19: 30
    +2
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    I sign in the wick, but I remain with my opinion

    It does you honor, sir! (Watch episode 13: 25 - 13: 50)
  28. flicker
    flicker April 7 2018 19: 52
    +1
    novel66,
    They were awarded not for the campaign, but for the performance of a combat mission.
  29. The comment was deleted.
  30. kan123
    kan123 April 7 2018 22: 52
    0
    The problem is not in us - for example I don’t care, the image of the Russian Federation in this world - the world - these are external concepts. E.g. I say - that this soldier sucks - he will let down the whole team of the GBR - he will leave, fall, - according to the law, he will have to select two fighters, carry him to the rear. Fighters 7, a man - a combat unit. Then one will fall like a horse, - two more - this is to save - this is minus three people. Four people remain from the detachment. One leader - he does not count - the second radio operator. Also not in the subject - and you run out of seven brave tailors and two come running. And lay there on the roads of war. This is a military site - here military people gathered. Well, like this math - seven ran out, two ran out. Two obeys. Therefore, there were no weak links, no, (I forgot about what there - I write blindly, after a bottle of vodka, and ran away for wine until it closed - Easter - peysakhf, etc.) - in general, the quick reaction group was completely killed, from one lagging behind - because everyone understands that it’s more important to complete a task than to save an ordinary soldier a. That is, the team ran out - one behind, and. . end. That is logical, because rescuers who are ambushed cannot lose their people. Like everything is clear. All males should be - even - tucked up a leg, - goodbye - we do not see. Goodbye friend. I forgot where I started (what will happen at the end). Well, there the image of the Russian Federation was, sort of, like that - yes. We need to maintain the image - and this is a difficult task - we are extremely low people, both in physical preparation and in moral condition. Sorry sight.
    1. tihonmarine
      tihonmarine April 8 2018 07: 59
      +1
      Something you sir mixed all together and scrambled eggs and cockroaches.
  31. seacap
    seacap April 7 2018 23: 15
    +1
    This bacchanalia will continue and increase until lies and slander go unpunished, as soon as it becomes expensive in material terms, threatens with a real term or deprivation of a license with confiscation, the level of such publications and statements by "experts" will tend to zero. And for this it is necessary that the government and bureaucracy be at least professional and be able to at least control something and at least somehow manage the processes in their units, and most importantly bear direct responsibility for the Addressing.
  32. tihonmarine
    tihonmarine April 8 2018 07: 56
    +2
    The fifth column in Russia worked with a bang in the Russian-Japanese war of the 1904 year and in the First World War as well, but nothing happened in the Second World War, Comrade Stalin exterminated most of the 5 columns, and if this is condoned now, their representative may soon become President of Russia (there was already an attempt).
  33. The comment was deleted.
  34. Vladimir1155
    Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 12: 50
    0
    novel66,
    Well, you have to reward sailors for something, in peacetime
  35. Xscorpion
    Xscorpion April 8 2018 12: 58
    +1
    Quote: Andrey from Chelyabinsk
    Quote: Xscorpion
    Andrey, where did you get information about Granit's malfunction? OBS?

    Yeah, one woman said. From Severodvinsk :))))
    Quote: Xscorpion
    In addition, this analytics of the malfunction is based on the fact that for a long time there were no launches of these missiles.

    Yes, how to say? Unofficially there was an infa that they ruined the post of management of the Granites either at the end of the 90's or at the beginning of the 2000's. Since then, Kuznetsov did not shoot anti-ship missiles, there was no information about the repair of Granites.
    Quote: Xscorpion
    I have information that the 2 air defense mines, and not the Granites, were flooded with fuel oil.

    This is different, the air defense systems were also drowned


    And the position of this "one woman" can be found? winked I won’t argue now, I’ll first ask my friends from there, maybe they will say something. It became interesting to myself. It’s just that at some forum I saw how one type proved that since Kuznetsov had not launched Granita for a long time, therefore they are faulty. could.
    And in the 90s, by the way, there were still launches. So if something broke, then later.
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 13: 48
      +1
      Quote: Xscorpion
      And the position of this "one woman" can be found?

      I will say briefly, the man from the Asterisk
  36. sib.ataman
    sib.ataman April 8 2018 13: 23
    +2
    Quote: vladimir1155
    Andrei from Chelyabinsk is poorly versed in marine engineering, everyone knows that I haven’t seen the sea, I would have lived in St. Petersburg Vladivostok would have known, I’ll explain the technical side of the matter, any ship (car, tank) wears out during operation, various systems go out, now the time has come for KUznetsov’s repair (the ship is 29 years old), it will be repaired and everything will work again.

    Fundamentally support! Andrei from Chelyabinsk is more watering Selivanov (is jealousy playing?), But not because a bad article, the author is incompetent, but just like that, he defends the Russian Navy, which, judging by the estimates of this Andrey, is worthless. So what better is this Andrei R. Farley? And on whose side is he criticizing?
    Now, according to Kuznetsov. The USSR built and operated AVK for about 20 years. Is this generally a term in world shipbuilding? It’s even funny to answer! Many readers of the USA and the Russian Federation have correctly pointed out different concepts in the use of AVK, although some methods of application are similar (does the composer have only 7 notes when writing an opera, criticize him for using the same notes?). Compare their aircraft carriers and our TAVKR, without taking into account the difference in concepts is generally not correct (this is, like, who will win: an elephant or a whale?). Such a straightforward approach to assessing, is, after all, harmful! However, the ideas embodied in TAVKR are revolutionary, in comparison with the global theory of using AVK. Another thing, to fully check in battle was not yet possible. So still to come! Well, it’s not in vain that our Defense Ministry ran so far with TAVKR! Or sofa GSH know better?
    1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
      Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 13: 47
      +2
      Quote: sib.ataman
      Andrey from Chelyabinsk is more watering Selivanov

      ???? Cite where I "poured" Selivanov
      Quote: sib.ataman
      (jealousy playing?)

      Eeeee .... I'm actually predisposed to women, so Selivanov is somehow not jealous of me :)))))
      Quote: sib.ataman
      but not because a bad article, the author is incompetent, but just like that, he defends the Russian Navy, which, judging by the estimates of this Andrei, is worthless

      According to Andrei’s estimates, our fleet suffered such losses in numbers without receiving updates that it cannot fulfill the tasks it faces.
      Quote: sib.ataman
      So what better is this Andrei R. Farley? And on whose side is he criticizing?

      The question is - on whose side are those who brought the fleet to such a state in your head, of course, could not come
      Quote: sib.ataman
      Now, according to Kuznetsov. The USSR built and operated AVK for about 20 years. Is this generally a term in world shipbuilding? It’s even funny to answer!

      What about learning mast? Then you would know that for shipbuilding 20 years is a very long time. In 1904, battleships fought in Russian-Japanese, and in 1916 dreadnought fleets converged. In the 1939, the USA built diesel submarines, after 20 years - nuclear SSBNs with ballistic missiles, etc.
      Quote: sib.ataman
      Compare their aircraft carriers and our TAVKR, without taking into account the difference in concepts is generally not correct

      Now open your eyes and read the discussion thread. It is not AB and TACR that is compared, but the ability of TACR to perform the tasks assigned to it is evaluated. I understand that it’s difficult for you, since childhood you learned the mantra “AB is not TAKR, you can’t compare them”, but are you really unable to understand how inappropriate it is here?
      Quote: sib.ataman
      However, the ideas embodied in TAVKR are revolutionary, in comparison with the global theory of using AVK

      Absolutely not. Piling an RCC ship instead of a strike aircraft regiment is not a revolution
      Quote: sib.ataman
      Well, it’s not in vain that our Defense Ministry ran so far with TAVKR!

      What do you mean by the word "running in"? The fact that Kuznetsov was cut back on the volume of modernization, or what?
      1. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 8 2018 15: 46
        0
        in fact, the couch expert has already surpassed American liars in his chilling of the fleet, country, government and the Russian people (who supported President Putin and his government) who, in his words, “brought the fleet to such a state,” is a spit in the soul of all officers, midshipmen and sailors who carry hard and necessary service on the nuclear submarines on other ships. Providing peace and security on the planet. Now the government is earmarking huge budget funds for new equipment, missiles, tanks, planes, ships. If you need more missiles, then they’re not building large NKs, because their time is gone, but the submarines are doing in a continuous cycle, Aviation, Strategic Missile Forces, and other types of troops need to be updated and get it as much as possible.
        What are you noisy about, folk-like?
        Why anathema threaten you Russia?
        What angered you? lack of AB?
        Leave: this is a dispute between the Slavs,
        Home, old dispute, weighted by fate,
        A question that you will not solve.
        For a long time among themselves
        These tribes are at war;
        More than once bowed under a thunderstorm
        Theirs, then our side.
        Who will stand in an unequal dispute:
        Puffy Lyakh il faithful Ross?
        Will Slavic streams merge in the Russian sea?
        Will it run dry? here is the question.
        Leave us: you have not read
        These bloody tablets;
        It’s incomprehensible to you, alien to you
        This is a family feud;
        The Kremlin and Prague are silent for you;
        Pointlessly seduces you
        Fights of desperate courage -
        And you hate us ...
        For what? answer: for whether
        What is on the ruins of flaming Moscow
        We did not recognize the brazen will
        Who were you trembling under?
        For the fact that they plunged into the abyss
        We are idol over kingdoms
        And redeemed with our blood
        European liberty, honor and peace?
        You are formidable in words - try it in practice!
        Or the old hero, deceased on his bed,
        Unable to screw up your Izmail bayonet?
        Is the Russian tsar already powerless to speak?
        Or should we argue with Europe new?
        Il Russian weaned from victories?
        Or a little of us? Or from Perm to Tauris,
        From the Finnish cold rocks to the flaming Colchis,
        From the shocked Kremlin
        To the walls of immobile China,
        Shiny bristles,
        Will not the Russian land rise? ..
        So send us, vitias,
        His angry sons:
        There is a place for them in the fields of Russia,
        Among the coffins that are not theirs.
        So, I, together with all the adequate specialists from the forum users, with Academician Krylov, Admiral Makarov, and Pushkin, brought Andrey out into the open
        1. Andrei from Chelyabinsk
          Andrei from Chelyabinsk April 8 2018 15: 59
          +3
          That bombed! laughing
          Quote: vladimir1155
          So, I, together with all the adequate specialists from the forum users, with Academician Krylov, Admiral Makarov, and Pushkin, brought Andrey out into the open

          But it is necessary to tie up with hard drugs, so that the Makarovs and Krylovs do not imagine :))))
  37. Falcon5555
    Falcon5555 April 8 2018 21: 07
    0
    she has periodically deployed to the Mediterranean
    - translated by Yandex-translator is normal: "it is periodically deployed to the Mediterranean." (In English, female ships).
    And if you take the full sentence, "Assigned to the Northern Fleet, she has periodically deployed to the Mediterranean, usually with great fanfare", then the word "unfolds" is replaced by "re-roll" (but not "leave"). Interesting! So Yandex "artificial intelligence" somehow differently perceives "deployed" in this case. When the author wrote about the "mechanical translation", what did he mean - but this is a rhetorical question.
    But, in my opinion, there is a typo in the English phrase itself. Instead of "has" you need to "is".
    1. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 21: 41
      0
      has must be, everything is grammatically correct, then the perfect one turns out, the perfect look, "went camping", If is then there must be an ingov form, "was camping"
      1. Vladimir1155
        Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 21: 43
        0
        since he always successfully returned from campaigns, the more perfect view was
        1. Vladimir1155
          Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 21: 45
          0
          Translation of "to be deployed" in Russian
          See also: expected to be deployed
          which will be deployed which will be deployed should be deployed for deployment which will be deployed should be deployed which will be directed towards deployment to be deployed to be deployed planned to deploy planned to deploy deploy arrive expected
          1. Vladimir1155
            Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 21: 46
            0
            yet the British do not need to be taught to speak English, although we are fighting better
            1. Falcon5555
              Falcon5555 April 9 2018 23: 33
              0
              Are you an Englishman? I think no.
              has must be, everything is grammatically correct, then the perfect one turns out, the perfect look, "went camping", If is then there must be an ingov form, "was camping"

              Perfect forms are not used for periodically repeated actions, and the word "periodically" indicates periodicity. They indicate a completed action at a given moment, single. In addition, deploy is usually (though not always) used in a passive voice, that is, "is deployed".
              1. Vladimir1155
                Vladimir1155 April 10 2018 08: 26
                0
                The perfect form can be used for periodic actions, it is just a perfect verb, the imprefective form can be lasting (when it is important to pay attention that we are in the process of something) or simple (indefinite) which can refer to persistent actions. the simple form is without any is (deploy = expand deploy deploy deploy use deploy deploy deploy deploy install install deployment deployment deployment), your passive voice option is also possible (although you brought the present tense, and it’s in reton now they aren’t turning upside down) the author chose another warpian and he had the right to it, he made no mistakes.
                1. Falcon5555
                  Falcon5555 April 11 2018 20: 44
                  0
                  Yes, I was probably a little skidded - it is possible with also has.
  38. MadCat
    MadCat April 9 2018 00: 28
    +1
    Tsushima arises from an unshakable faith in the unexperienced wunderwaffe who is able to defeat all with one hat. But of course it is difficult to underestimate propaganda, cannon fodder must be confident in the presence of this very child prodigy ... One believer has already gone on a hike, I'm afraid that getting up from his knees after some defeat again at the fifth point does not give rest, it pulls on to war.
  39. kig
    kig April 9 2018 10: 50
    0
    I myself did not like this headline, other publications at least wrote like that: Kuznetsov was included in the list of the five most-most. But he will not get better from the fact that a certain Y. Selivanov was indignant at the headline? For the entire service life was in repairs, perhaps more time than at sea. The last trip with a smoke screen clearly showed that at least with the power plant he is far from all right. Even our admirals admit that yes, not the best. Well, since Yu, Selivanov wants it so much, let's add him to the list of "5 best aircraft carriers."
    1. Vladimir1155
      Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 18: 50
      0
      smoke is natural for fuel oil boilers, so everything is fine with the power one in the sense of smoke, although some of the boilers in the VTG process will be replaced, foreign ABs are also half the time in reconditions, this is a problem for all ABs because decks burn, too many complicated equipment, catapults there are all sorts of ....
      1. kig
        kig April 10 2018 11: 49
        +1
        Any ship mechanic will explain to you that a well-tuned ship boiler does not smoke at all. Smoke, of course, can escape briefly when the engine or boiler is started, when the operating mode changes (for example, if you need to sharply increase the speed), but to smoke at this pace all the way is deeply wrong.
        1. Vladimir1155
          Vladimir1155 April 10 2018 17: 19
          0
          I know that many modern mechanics didn’t work on fuel oil, high-ash naval fuel oils have an ash content of 0.12, 0.14 and this all flies into the pipe, and this is not a consequence of mechanical or chemical underburning as in ICE on light petroleum products
          1. kig
            kig April 11 2018 11: 38
            0
            Well, if you are a mechanic, then all the more so as to tell you. Like it or not, there is too much smoke.
          2. Deck
            Deck April 11 2018 18: 55
            0
            Most modern low-speed diesel engines on merchant ships operate on fuel oil, for example IFO-30 (an analogue of f-5), while there is no smoke. The point is not the ash content but the poor operation of fans, nozzles or automation
            1. Vladimir1155
              Vladimir1155 April 12 2018 09: 04
              0
              yes.? ......... only fuel oil varies in ash and price
  40. Snakebyte
    Snakebyte April 9 2018 15: 35
    0
    Apparently, the audience should listen exclusively to the lies of “talking heads” from the Moscow Region and the “experts” waving to them.
    Just yesterday, “talking heads” savored the atrocities of the Americans, who razed entire neighborhoods with their bombardment. Whether it’s a matter of domestic "point strikes" ...

    Who does not know, this is the official video of the MO about the first "targeted" attacks on the forces of terrorists in Syria. The lack of accuracy is more than offset by the power of the warhead.
    1. turbris
      turbris April 9 2018 16: 13
      +1
      And everything is visible on this video? And the lack of accuracy and the power of warheads, is this a confirmation of your conclusions? In this video, do you criticize "talking heads" from the Moscow Region? What then to do with your head? I would prefer that you have an “eternally silent head” and would not make people laugh in VO with your comments.
      1. Snakebyte
        Snakebyte April 9 2018 16: 44
        +1
        Maybe you should buy some glasses if you are not able to make out the video misses ~ 200 meters and the shock wave from the FAB-1000, covering the village? And, I note, this is the official video from the Moscow Region from the news saying "The Russian air group deployed at the Khmeimim Syrian airport has delivered the first targeted attacks on the objects of the international terrorist organization ISIS."
        Here is the source for unbelievers: http://syria.mil.ru/news/[email protected]
        ews
        So do not make people laugh yourself, and you can keep your preferences with you.
        1. Old stock lieutenant colonel
          Old stock lieutenant colonel April 9 2018 17: 40
          +1
          Stop fucking.
          1. Snakebyte
            Snakebyte April 10 2018 08: 05
            0
            Do you not believe the official reports of the Ministry of Defense? You do it right, they only do what they commit.
        2. Vladimir1155
          Vladimir1155 April 9 2018 18: 52
          0
          it was not a village but a nest of terrorists
        3. turbris
          turbris April 9 2018 19: 34
          +1
          Snakebyte - Well, if you do not want to make people laugh, then specify what ammunition was used (controlled or not), if not controlled, then what types and power of the fab, from which carriers, from what height. If the ammunition is guided, then which guided missiles were involved, by type, with which guidance system (laser, television, thermal imaging) and just having such a minimal set of data, you can be clever on the VO site and mock towards the “smart heads” of the Moscow Region. If you only have links to videos, it’s better to be silent so as not to expose yourself in all its glory.
          1. Snakebyte
            Snakebyte April 10 2018 08: 54
            0
            And why have such a "data set"?
            Shots are named point. This implies that the ammunition of the minimum required power is exactly on target, or with a minimum deviation, in order to minimize, and ideally, eliminate the associated damage. This is achieved by guided ammunition or accuracy characteristics of carrier guidance systems - not fundamentally.
            But, this is a point hit in the world. In the Russian understanding, a strike is considered to be a point strike in which “Aircraft of strike aircraft equipped with modern destruction systems” (from the news) compensate for misses of hundreds of meters with ammunition capacity.
            Characteristically, the MO in its press releases avoids describing the nomenclature of the ammunition used. However, in one of them (the fifth) the ammunition was indicated. And sat in a puddle.
            "A point-and-shoot concrete bomb from a Su-34 aircraft in the area of ​​RAKKA destroyed a protected command post and a warehouse of explosives of bandit formations"
            http://syria.mil.ru/news/[email protected]
            ews
            Already in the first second of the plot, exactly in the area of ​​the entrance to the “protected command post” three explosions occur. And in the second second, at the surface of the right side of the mountain, to the right of 3 developing centers of detonation, it is completely not spectacular, without noise and with a small amount of dust, as Betab should be, it falls native (highlighted with a white tick) ...

            Probably the terrorists were scared, and blew up their command post in advance ...
            And if you look closely, it turns out that this "command post" is the very goal that was "completely destroyed" in the first half of the video in the first press release.
            Quite impudent nonsense.
            1. turbris
              turbris April 10 2018 09: 09
              +1
              Yes, everything is much worse than I expected. You continue to cling to words in the press and watch the video, I tried to explain to you that this is just not necessary. This is not the data on the basis of which you can draw any conclusions, you do not get the analysis, but just gossip, and you are in no way different from the nonsense you mentioned above.
              1. Snakebyte
                Snakebyte April 10 2018 09: 15
                0
                What conclusions cannot be drawn from these data? Conclusions that the press service of the Moscow Region brazenly breshet live?
                The question here is not the accuracy of the blows, but the nonsense. After all, according to the author of the article, the media should not lie. Or is everything possible with your own?
  41. Old stock lieutenant colonel
    Old stock lieutenant colonel April 9 2018 17: 39
    +2
    According to their Russophobian echo-rain-voices, one can only hear: "Admiral Kuznetsov" - the worst aircraft carrier, a monument to a soldier in the Brest Fortress - the ugliest of all the monuments in the world, the Vlasov army saved Prague, Stalin did not understand anything about military strategy and generally ate babies, Putin is a bloodthirsty tyrant ... Highly paid nonsense. People, stop being carried on this nonsense. Our ships are the best. Our monuments are the most worthy! Our T-34 is the most beautiful tank in the world, and our armored train has returned to its place and - in pairs!
  42. Zakonnik
    Zakonnik April 10 2018 17: 34
    0
    The ship can be justified as much as you like. BUT. Two non-combat losses of two very expensive fighters can not be justified in any way.
    1. kig
      kig April 25 2018 02: 14
      0
      Lack of experience, comprehensive experience, starting from the latest messenger on Kuznetsov (or who has the lowest official position there) and ending with pilots (and all 3000 aircraft carrier people exist only to deliver a hundred pilots to the desired area). For this, they arranged a “trip over three seas”. Not for nothing that the “aircraft carrier” immediately got into the next repair. Yes, but is it possible to fix the uncorrupted?
  43. ivankirillov
    ivankirillov April 10 2018 23: 13
    +1
    less listen to this west
  44. intuzazist
    intuzazist April 11 2018 13: 10
    0
    From time to time I’ve been to the “Tape” in order to touch the local trolls! And yet this can be done using obscene language !!! And so already for a year this resource has become completely sucks ...........................
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